From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 00:01:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 00:01:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17003 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 00:01:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16999 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 00:01:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 00:01:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F32AC199EC; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:01:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0A7B51998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:00:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mekcqymhfibjmsyetjubqszxyt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:00:21 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mekcqymhfibjmsyetjubqszxyt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 1) happens on the T23 also. We haven't fixed it yet. 2) Gosh, I only see it replicated once. It doesn't happen if I use 8 bit depth instead of 16. You using 24? The problem is that the system resets the vga behind our backs, so to speak. I haven't tried to see if there's a way to fix this with the APM. There must be. Perhaps, jmk will have better insights. --upas-mekcqymhfibjmsyetjubqszxyt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Jun 30 10:54:26 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Jun 30 10:54:25 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 576BF199BF; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 10:54:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2850E1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 10:53:02 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020630145302.2850E1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 15:52:47 0100 There are two niggling display problems with Plan 9 on my T21 Thinkpad - do you see them on a T23 as well? 1. After rebooting with Ctrl-Alt-Delete or ^t^tr, the cga display comes up (usually but not every time) with "doubled" characters -- i.e. instead of PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs it says PPSS..PPaa rrmmBBll aass and so on. If you type on the keyboard, only every second character is echoed (twice). 2. In vga mode, if you close and reopen the cover, the display is replicated three times horizontally across the screen. -- Richard --upas-mekcqymhfibjmsyetjubqszxyt-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 00:16:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 00:16:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17130 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 00:16:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17126 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 00:16:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 00:16:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 92661199BB; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:16:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 23134199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 11:15:09 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020630151509.23134199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:14:54 0100 > It doesn't happen if I use > 8 bit depth instead of 16. You using 24? I normally use 1024x768x16. > The problem is that the > system resets the vga behind our backs, so to speak. I haven't > tried to see if there's a way to fix this with the APM. There > must be. I wouldn't mind just resetting it myself with aux/vga after opening the cover, but that's foiled by a "vga already configured" error. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 05:04:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 05:04:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19200 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 05:04:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19195 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 05:04:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 05:04:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28922199BC; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:04:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id ADE1C199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:03:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 37012 invoked by uid 18927); 30 Jun 2002 20:00:32 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 30 Jun 2002 20:00:32 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga In-Reply-To: <20020630145302.2850E1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020630135826.T37003-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:00:31 -0600 (MDT) On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Richard Miller wrote: > 1. After rebooting with Ctrl-Alt-Delete or ^t^tr, the cga display comes > up (usually but not every time) with "doubled" characters -- i.e. instead of > PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs > it says > PPSS..PPaa rrmmBBll aass > and so on. If you type on the keyboard, only every second character is > echoed (twice). > this seems to be general for all t21 and t23's i've seen... happens under freebsd also.. > 2. In vga mode, if you close and reopen the cover, the display is replicated > three times horizontally across the screen. > has happened only once under frreebsd (t21), not observed under p9... our solution to 1) is to power down on reboot and close the screen rarely.. andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 05:26:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 05:26:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19379 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 05:26:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19375 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 05:26:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 05:26:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 137EC199D5; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:26:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E6D819991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:25:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYJ0019DCQWC4@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:25:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g5UKSLh06819 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 20:28:21 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga In-reply-to: <20020630135826.T37003-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200206302028.g5UKSLh06819@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:28:21 -0400 (EDT) BTW - As for the eden thingy, I think I figured out what they want. Thanks for clarifying :-) - Dave andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Richard Miller wrote: > > > 1. After rebooting with Ctrl-Alt-Delete or ^t^tr, the cga display comes > > up (usually but not every time) with "doubled" characters -- i.e. instead of > > PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs > > it says > > PPSS..PPaa rrmmBBll aass > > and so on. If you type on the keyboard, only every second character is > > echoed (twice). > > > > this seems to be general for all t21 and t23's i've seen... happens under freebsd also.. > > > > 2. In vga mode, if you close and reopen the cover, the display is replicated > > three times horizontally across the screen. > > > > has happened only once under frreebsd (t21), not observed under p9... > > our solution to 1) is to power down on reboot and close the screen rarely.. > > andrey > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 05:33:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 05:33:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19422 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 05:33:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19418 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 05:33:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 05:33:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DDBB3199BF; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:33:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60C5619991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:32:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYJ008OMCZXET@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:31:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g5UKY0d06945 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 20:34:00 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga In-reply-to: <200206302028.g5UKSLh06819@dave2.dave.tj> from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200206302034.g5UKY0d06945@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:34:00 -0400 (EDT) LOL ... gotta love buggy elm :-( That message shouldn't've gone to this list. I was replying to a different message, but because a new message came while I was reading the other message before replying to it, message number silently became message number , creating this rather weird situation that I thought I'd figured out how to work around already several years ago. . . - Dave Dave wrote: > > BTW - As for the eden thingy, I think I figured out what they want. > Thanks for clarifying :-) > > - Dave > > > andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > > > On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Richard Miller wrote: > > > > > 1. After rebooting with Ctrl-Alt-Delete or ^t^tr, the cga display comes > > > up (usually but not every time) with "doubled" characters -- i.e. instead of > > > PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs > > > it says > > > PPSS..PPaa rrmmBBll aass > > > and so on. If you type on the keyboard, only every second character is > > > echoed (twice). > > > > > > > this seems to be general for all t21 and t23's i've seen... happens under freebsd also.. > > > > > > > 2. In vga mode, if you close and reopen the cover, the display is replicated > > > three times horizontally across the screen. > > > > > > > has happened only once under frreebsd (t21), not observed under p9... > > > > our solution to 1) is to power down on reboot and close the screen rarely.. > > > > andrey > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 08:30:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 08:30:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20596 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 08:30:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20592 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 08:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 08:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DA65199BF; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 19:30:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F2EDD19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 19:29:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jdhqxegmrfgzagmypubzsepymf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 19:29:49 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jdhqxegmrfgzagmypubzsepymf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i'd worked out how to deal with some of these problems, but didn't finish it off. i'll try to get back to it this week. --upas-jdhqxegmrfgzagmypubzsepymf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Jun 30 16:04:22 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Jun 30 16:04:21 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13136199BB; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:04:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id ADE1C199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 30 Jun 2002 16:03:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 37012 invoked by uid 18927); 30 Jun 2002 20:00:32 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 30 Jun 2002 20:00:32 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] aux/vga In-Reply-To: <20020630145302.2850E1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020630135826.T37003-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2002 14:00:31 -0600 (MDT) On Sun, 30 Jun 2002, Richard Miller wrote: > 1. After rebooting with Ctrl-Alt-Delete or ^t^tr, the cga display comes > up (usually but not every time) with "doubled" characters -- i.e. instead of > PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs > it says > PPSS..PPaa rrmmBBll aass > and so on. If you type on the keyboard, only every second character is > echoed (twice). > this seems to be general for all t21 and t23's i've seen... happens under freebsd also.. > 2. In vga mode, if you close and reopen the cover, the display is replicated > three times horizontally across the screen. > has happened only once under frreebsd (t21), not observed under p9... our solution to 1) is to power down on reboot and close the screen rarely.. andrey --upas-jdhqxegmrfgzagmypubzsepymf-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 16:34:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 16:34:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4199 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 16:34:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4194 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 16:34:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 16:34:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB236199B9; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 03:34:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 314A0199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 03:33:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17OvpO-0001ii-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 09:42:30 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020701094230.B6596@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] just pipe your img thru this ;-) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:42:30 +0200 Hi all, my first attempt to write sthg in native code ... just wanted to tell it to sb. Comments more than welcome!!! Cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz --OgqxwSJOaUobr8KG Content-Type: text/x-csrc; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="cnl.c" // cnl.c // extracts red (green, blue) channel from an image // first step to RG anaglyphs (stereo images) // heavily, and in a dirty(?) way, reuses code from resample.c // sorry, // Tue Jun 25 14:04:30 EDT 2002 #include #include #include #include #define ALPHA 3 #define RED 2 #define GREEN 1 #define BLUE 0 int color=RED; // default channel to extract void usage(void) { fprint(2, "usage: cnl [-r||-g|-b] [imagefile]\n"); fprint(2, " jpg -c testimg.jpg | cnl -r | page \n"); exits("usage"); } void extractchannel(uchar **in, int off, int iny, uchar **out, int outy, int n) { int y, i, k, z; z=off-n*(off/n); switch(n){ case 3: for(y=0; y b) return a; return b; } Memimage* resample(int xsize, int ysize, Memimage *m) { int i, j, bpl, nchan; Memimage *new; uchar **oscan, **nscan; new = allocmemimage(Rect(0, 0, xsize, ysize), m->chan); if(new == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate new image: %r"); oscan = malloc(Dy(m->r)*sizeof(uchar*)); nscan = malloc(max(ysize, Dy(m->r))*sizeof(uchar*)); if(oscan == nil || nscan == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); /* unload original image into scan lines */ bpl = bytesperline(m->r, m->depth); for(i=0; ir); i++){ oscan[i] = malloc(bpl); if(oscan[i] == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); j = unloadmemimage(m, Rect(m->r.min.x, m->r.min.y+i, m->r.max.x, m->r.min.y+i+1), oscan[i], bpl); if(j != bpl) sysfatal("unloadmemimage"); } /* allocate scan lines for destination. we do y first, so need at least Dy(m->r) lines */ bpl = bytesperline(Rect(0, 0, xsize, Dy(m->r)), m->depth); for(i=0; ir)); i++){ nscan[i] = malloc(bpl); if(nscan[i] == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); } nchan = m->depth/8; /* extract channel in Y direction*/ for(i=0; ir), nscan, ysize, nchan); /* pack data into destination */ bpl = bytesperline(new->r, m->depth); for(i=0; i 1) usage(); else if(argc == 1){ file = argv[0]; fd = open(file, OREAD); if(fd < 0) sysfatal("can't open %s: %r", file); } m = readmemimage(fd); if(m == nil) sysfatal("can't read %s: %r", file); xsize = Dx(m->r); ysize = Dy(m->r); new = nil; switch(m->chan){ case RGB24: case RGBA32: case ARGB32: case XRGB32: new = resample(xsize, ysize, m); break; case GREY1: case GREY2: case GREY4: case GREY8: case CMAP8: case RGB15: case RGB16: tchan = RGB24; goto Convert; Convert: /* use library to convert to byte-per-chan form, then convert back */ t1 = allocmemimage(m->r, tchan); if(t1 == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate temporary image: %r"); memimagedraw(t1, t1->r, m, m->r.min, nil, ZP); t2 = resample(xsize, ysize, t1); freememimage(t1); new = allocmemimage(Rect(0, 0, xsize, ysize), m->chan); if(new == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate new image: %r"); /* should do error diffusion here */ memimagedraw(new, new->r, t2, t2->r.min, nil, ZP); freememimage(t2); break; default: sysfatal("can't handle channel type %s", chantostr(tmp, m->chan)); } assert(new); if(writememimage(1, new) < 0) sysfatal("write error on output: %r"); exits(nil); } --OgqxwSJOaUobr8KG-- ----- End forwarded message ----- -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz ----- End forwarded message ----- -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:01:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:01:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8260 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8256 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:01:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82627199E3; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:01:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 528F0199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:00:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnr-00033B-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ralph Corderoy Message-ID: <13ec.3d1d9541.93430@blake.inputplus.co.uk> Organization: InputPlus Ltd. References: , <3D1C2D03.B288CC2B@strakt.com>, <3D1C6EBC.24AAE27E@null.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] dumb question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:46:47 GMT Hi Douglas, > But in general one might be processing files named by somebody else, > e.g. to move the last user off a mounted filesystem onto a new larger > one. And in general it's a serious problem: > > $ > 'funny file name; rm -rf /' > $ ls > funny file name; rm -rf / > $ find . -print | xargs echo > funny file name > panic -- essential files not found The shell doesn't necessarily get involved with xargs' processing though. Here's some actual output, rather than theorectical. $ ls h* hello; date $ ls h* | xargs echo hello; date I agree the problem exists, just that it doesn't always trigger. Cheers, Ralph. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:01:32 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:01:32 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8273 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8269 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:01:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9CAD1199ED; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:01:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2625E199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:00:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnq-00032t-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D1CD533.66D4470A@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <3d1c8409$1_6@news.teranews.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: rage 2 driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:46:07 GMT bigbinc wrote: > Since my monitor only supports 640x480x8, I am thinking that the card > or settings are set at a higher mode. How would I check that also. Certainly, if you have told it to drive the monitor beyond its capabilities you'll see strange artifacts and maybe some Magic Smoke. Check the plan9.ini file (in the installed Plan 9 filesystem, not the diskette nor DOS C: partition). It specifies the resolution to be used as well as the monitor type. This is explained in the installation guide (last time I looked). > Since plan9 works in vga mode, ... Not last I heard. Maybe it's using CGA mode for console text. Anyway, not bitmap graphics support in VGA mode. The reason was said to be lack of software cursor (which VGA would require). You can use Plan 9 in a rio-less (text) mode, but it won't be very satisfying, e.g. no "acme" environment. The text-mode editors are "ed" and "sam -d"; usually that's all you really need to fix things so that rio can be run. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:01:58 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:01:58 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8283 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8278 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:01:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:01:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E619019A00; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:01:16 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19FD0199BF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:00:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnp-00032n-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: bigbinc Message-ID: <3d1cab76$1_15@news.teranews.com> Organization: http://www.TeraNews.com - FREE NNTP Access References: Subject: [9fans] Re: rage 2 driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:45:56 GMT I am excercising my rights to free speech. I have two disks, one an install disk, the other a boot disk. The boot disk has nothing on it except PLAN9INI.BAK and some other big binary file. Maybe I need to put plan9.ini in the boot disk? My install disk has plan9.ini and vgadb and vgainfo.txt. I havent looked at my vgadb file on my hard drive, one I dont know how. And the plan9.ini file on hard drive, I can seem to find. Actually I do 'cat' in console mode but is there a 'less' or 'more'. Berlin Brown bigbinc@hotmail.com "bigbinc" wrote in message news:d1b33313.0206271852.44c96e9d@posting.google.com... > I am using ATI rage 2 driver and I got the install to work, but for > some reason the display is messed beyond usability. In the upper > right side of the screen, there is a flickering white line. When I > try to scroll the text over laps the existing text. On the left side > of the screen it is completely black. So basically I have what looks > like the plan9 gui, but it is messed up and unreadable. The funny > thing is that the screen was perfect! when I did the install. But > once I wanted to use the system every thing went to pieces? > > Question 1, what is the best card for plan9? > Question 2, do you think it is my monitor which is generic > 640x480(actually a hybrid mac monitor, dont ask) > Question 3, Why would the screen work for install mode from the floppy > but once I get to booting from the harddrive it doesnt work. > > Berlin Brown > bigbinc@hotmail.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:04:11 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:04:11 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8319 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:04:11 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8315 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:04:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:04:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5893B19A02; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:04:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDA68199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:03:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnp-00032h-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Jim Meier Message-ID: Organization: Shaw Residential Internet Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <2a2eafe278e8da0ed01bc7fd3ad6f3d9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] MIPS Support in Release 4 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:45:45 GMT On Fri, 28 Jun 2002 08:04:36 -0600, rob pike, esq. wrote: > Geoff is right. Despite repeated requests by a number of people, SGI > has never given us the right to distribute our kernel source for their > machines under an open source agreement. > > -rob That's too bad. Is there any way to obtain a binary-only kernel? Perhaps one from an older release? -Jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:04:38 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:04:38 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8332 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:04:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8328 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:04:37 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:04:37 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F24D319A0C; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:04:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9CA2619A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:03:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnq-00032z-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D1CD8C2.69D55612@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] back on line Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:46:24 GMT "rob pike, esq." wrote: > The distribution is back. Is that "Space Bunny" or what? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:05:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:05:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8343 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:05:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8339 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:05:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:05:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EAF319A26; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:04:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA783199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:03:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnq-000335-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: bigbinc Message-ID: <3d1cfc4a$1_13@news.teranews.com> Organization: http://www.TeraNews.com - FREE NNTP Access References: <3d1bfd63$1_1@news.teranews.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: ati card Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:46:36 GMT Ok, this is fun, my card is a mach64 not an rage2 so it should work at least that is what the bios says on boot up. Now, first off I am using lilo to boot plan9, probably a bad idea. Anyway, once I boot plan9 I get to a prompt that asks 'root is from: [local!stuff.../sd0/fs] I press enter and then it asks for user:[none] I type glenda and the rio system boots(all messed up of course), I manage to barely crawl to a command line prompt in one of the windows and find the /n/9fat directory but nothing is there. I assume that plan9.ini is supposed to be loaded and this is why my windowing system is screwed up. So I guess the question is how do mount '9fat:' at boot. Once again I dont know what ini file the system is booting off of? "bigbinc" wrote in message news:3d1bfd63$1_1@news.teranews.com... > I have another post coming on this, but I have to ask, my ati rage 2 pro > graphics card is doing some funny stuff once I boot off the hard drive. > When I am working with the installation disk, the vga is fine. My theory is > that the install program is under vga and once I get plan9 installed it is > running off the rage graphics driver and hence is screwy. Once I log in, > the screen is partially black and partially has some of the windows, it is > hard to describe but it is clearly messed up. The text overlaps whenever I > scroll. And there is a strange flickering white line in the upper right > hand corner of the screen. I want to play with plan9 so I will just get a > new card, but I thought I would mention it anyway. > > Berlin Brown > bigbinc@hotmail.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:05:58 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:05:58 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8365 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:05:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8361 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:05:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:05:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF44619A2A; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:04:19 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17BC619A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:03:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Oxnr-00033H-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Jul 2002 10:49:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Jim Meier Message-ID: Organization: Shaw Residential Internet Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: <2a2eafe278e8da0ed01bc7fd3ad6f3d9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] MIPS Support in Release 4 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 09:46:58 GMT On Fri, 28 Jun 2002 08:04:36 -0600, rob pike, esq. wrote: > Geoff is right. Despite repeated requests by a number of people, SGI > has never given us the right to distribute our kernel source for their > machines under an open source agreement. > > -rob That's too bad. Is there a binary-only kernel available? I assume it would have to be purchased, if it is even available.. -Jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 19:58:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 19:58:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9255 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 19:58:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9251 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 19:58:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 19:58:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7067A199EC; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:58:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 92A9C199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 06:57:18 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dumb question From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020701105718.92A9C199B3@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 12:03:02 +0100 > It strikes me that the arguments people are making against having > blanks in file names are the same arguments I heard against converting > Plan 9 to Unicode and UTF the benefits of converting to utf-8 throughout were obvious. does the ability to type ' ' rather than (say) ALT-' ' really confer comparable advantages? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 1 21:56:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 1 21:56:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10845 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Jul 2002 21:56:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10841 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2002 21:56:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Jul 2002 21:56:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FAD119A02; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 08:56:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9A8AE199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Jul 2002 08:55:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] MIPS Support in Release 4 From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Jul 2002 08:55:24 -0400 > That's too bad. Is there any way to obtain a binary-only kernel? Perhaps > one from an older release? The release terms would need to be negotiated, it probably wouldn't run on your hardware, and since it would be from an ancient version of the kernel - the only SGI machine we still have is a hulking Challenge - many binaries wouldn't work properly. ls, for one. I've spent too much time trying to get SGI to let us spring our kernel loose. I'm not spending any more. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 13:53:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 13:53:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27215 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 13:53:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27211 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 13:53:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 13:53:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1CAA199B6; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 00:53:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9479119980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 00:52:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17PFn2-0000B0-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 07:01:24 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020702070124.A657@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] anaglyph Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:01:24 +0200 Hi all who might be interested, a program for making anaglyphs (two-colour stereo images) from stereo pairs is available from the neXt (not NeXT ;-))) server at ftp://next.gli.cas.cz/plan9/native/anaglyph.tbz. Take a look at a sample anaglyph, an image of the skeleton of an extinct protist ca 400 million years old, at http://next.gli.cas.cz/anaglyph.ppm (you will need red -blue stereo glasses, e.g. from www.agarscientific.com; however, any pair of red&blue glass/film/acetate/transparency/etc.. will do as well). Enjoy a true 3D on Plan 9 ;-) ! Cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:04:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:04:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3878 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:04:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3874 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:04:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:04:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CE99199BB; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:04:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2247199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:03:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17PJQd-0000Lf-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 09:54:31 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <1e6326dfe312a98c50ff4120398af43c@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] * most USB audio devices Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 08:54:06 GMT Btw, what about USB keyboard support, and those fancy volume dials/buttons that come on most HP/Compaq keyboards? Any support for these in the works? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:05:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:05:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3904 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:05:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3900 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:05:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:05:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 204DA199BE; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:05:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20FB6199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:04:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17PJQc-0000LN-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 09:54:30 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Jack Johnson Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Venti: bad format in version string? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 08:53:28 GMT I've set up my first Venti server on a standalone workstation, and while it's still running through its first test, I've tried to access its Web server and I get a lone line in response: venti-02-libventi and a message from the server saying: not a clean exit: bad format in version string This message comes up whether I try to access it locally using hget or remotely using lynx or mozilla. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:06:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:06:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3942 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:06:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3938 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:06:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:06:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FF76199E4; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:05:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7331199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:04:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17PJQc-0000LT-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 09:54:30 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D20983F.E402CC72@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20020701105718.92A9C199B3@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] dumb question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 08:53:41 GMT rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > the benefits of converting to utf-8 throughout were obvious. does the > ability to type ' ' rather than (say) ALT-' ' really confer comparable > advantages? The benefits of any feature depend on whether you make use of them. People living in an ASCII world get no particular benefit from UTF8, and people with spaces in file names (e.g. on a Windows filesystem) get substantial benefit from having their files handled properly. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:07:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:07:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3972 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:07:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3968 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:07:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:07:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8492019A02; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:05:16 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E4BC199BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:04:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17PJQd-0000LZ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 09:54:31 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: bigbinc Message-ID: Organization: WEBUSENET.com References: Subject: [9fans] Re: rage 2 driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 08:53:51 GMT In case anybody is reading my personal thread, I finally went to a 3dfx card, works great. And I tried it on 3 different monitors. Now next step, learn how to use it. Berlin Brown bigbinc@hotmail.com "bigbinc" wrote in message news:d1b33313.0206271852.44c96e9d@posting.google.com... > I am using ATI rage 2 driver and I got the install to work, but for > some reason the display is messed beyond usability. In the upper > right side of the screen, there is a flickering white line. When I > try to scroll the text over laps the existing text. On the left side > of the screen it is completely black. So basically I have what looks > like the plan9 gui, but it is messed up and unreadable. The funny > thing is that the screen was perfect! when I did the install. But > once I wanted to use the system every thing went to pieces? > > Question 1, what is the best card for plan9? > Question 2, do you think it is my monitor which is generic > 640x480(actually a hybrid mac monitor, dont ask) > Question 3, Why would the screen work for install mode from the floppy > but once I get to booting from the harddrive it doesnt work. > > Berlin Brown > bigbinc@hotmail.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:20:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:20:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4310 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:20:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4306 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:20:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:20:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC6FD199EC; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:20:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail.snellwilcox.com (mail.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 72081199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:19:47 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Received: from ccMail by snellwilcox.com (ccMail Link to SMTP R8.52.01.1) id 817894786; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 10:21:27 +0100 Importance: normal Priority: normal Subject: Re:[9fans] anaglyph Message-Id: <817894786@snellwilcox.com> X-MIME-Engine: v0.90 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Id: <817894786-1@snellwilcox.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: steve.simon@snellwilcox.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 10:16:03 +0100 Good fun, Is the perceived depth axis inverted if you put the red and blue filters on the incorrect eyes (this image is of a hollow rather than an object) , or are we just fooling ourselves here? -Steve ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: [9fans] anaglyph Author: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: 02/07/02 06:01 Hi all who might be interested, a program for making anaglyphs (two-colour stereo images) from stereo pairs is available from the neXt (not NeXT ;-))) server at ftp://next.gli.cas.cz/plan9/native/anaglyph.tbz. Take a look at a sample anaglyph, an image of the skeleton of an extinct protist ca 400 million years old, at http://next.gli.cas.cz/anaglyph.ppm (you will need red -blue stereo glasses, e.g. from www.agarscientific.com; however, any pair of red&blue glass/film/acetate/transparency/etc.. will do as well). Enjoy a true 3D on Plan 9 ;-) ! Cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 18:54:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 18:54:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5098 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 18:54:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5092 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 18:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 18:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03DE5199DD; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:54:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4E53419992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 05:53:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] blanks in file names Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 11:53:14 +0200 After reading all the post about this, and thinking about it I think it's more clean to use different characters for space and blank within a file name — as someone said before. The reason why I think so is that it would simplify the library and at the same time avoid problems with quoting. For example, although replica uses %q, I ended up deleting a file name 'chk, because somehow replica got confussed. It's true that I could have tried to avoid the confussion and fix the bug; but I think this suggests that it's not so easy to quote things. On the other side, there're two places where file names get blanks in: - from foreign systems - locally created files On both places it'd be easy for the user to type Alt-spc, perhaps more simpler than it'd be to write 'blah blah'. Now, does anyone from the Labs think otherwise, and if so, what's the reason. I'd like to learn from this mistake, if my current view of the problem can be considered as so. In any case, I agree that blanks are here to stay and I'd like Plan 9 to handle then as nicely as it handles ☺ⁱ⁲. thanks ⁱ Why did ☺ get into unicode? ⁲ Why didn't :-( get in then? (Did they read TPOP?). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 20:09:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 20:09:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6319 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 20:09:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6315 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 20:09:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 20:09:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4F4B199BF; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:09:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F30EA19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:08:48 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 12:09:33 +0100 >>rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >> the benefits of converting to utf-8 throughout were obvious. does the >> ability to type ' ' rather than (say) ALT-' ' really confer comparable >> advantages? >The benefits of any feature depend on whether you make use of them. >People living in an ASCII world get no particular benefit from UTF8, >and people with spaces in file names (e.g. on a Windows filesystem) >get substantial benefit from having their files handled properly. no one is suggesting, least of all roger, that nothing be done to allow access to files between Plan 9 and systems that have spaces in names. the disagreement is about the scope, and the means. >>In any case, I agree that blanks are here to stay and I'd like Plan 9 >>to handle then as nicely as it handles . it's not just spaces. i have had to handle / as well, for instance. that might not be of interest to some, but it has occurred. from an end user's point of view, it seems perfectly reasonable to me. i'd also pick out something from a previous comment: >>Plan 9 to Unicode and UTF: too hard, too much code to change, too many >>symmetries broken. But there's no way this problem is as hard as that >>conversion, and we handled that one just fine. All that's missing is surely it was much easier to do once the problems of Unicode's original 8-bit representation pre-UTF had been dealt with: In August 1992, X-Open circulated a proposal for another UTF-like byte encoding of Unicode characters. Their major concern was that an embedded character in a file name (in particular a slash) could be part of an escape sequence in UTF and therefore confuse a traditional file system. that single change to UTF made it more straightforward to work out where the potential problems were, not least some older code could no longer fail (as it would have done with the earlier proposal): p = strrchr(filename, '/'); for instance. prior to that, each such instance needed to be tracked down and examined, assuming (on non-Plan9 systems) that source was available. of course, larger changes were required to tools that needed to support Unicode well (regexp, tr, wc, and so on). still, with many potential possibilities for mechanical confusion eliminated at a stroke, i'd say it instantly made the idea attractive. there were not as many problems to worry about. i do think the support for quoting is useful for many things (roger added support for quoting to Inferno's String module several years ago for just that reason), but i'm not sure myself it's the right or sufficient solution for file names. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 20:12:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 20:12:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6367 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 20:12:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6363 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 20:12:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 20:12:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B084199DD; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:12:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3EEC5199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:11:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 2 07:11:24 EDT 2002 Received: from research.bell-labs.com ([67.82.201.207]) by plan9; Tue Jul 2 07:11:23 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <3D218A5B.9B33D809@research.bell-labs.com> From: Sean Quinlan X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti: bad format in version string? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 07:11:23 -0400 somehow, you managed to connect to the port serving the the venti protocol rather than the http port. seanq Jack Johnson wrote: > > I've set up my first Venti server on a standalone workstation, and > while it's still running through its first test, I've tried to access > its Web server and I get a lone line in response: > > venti-02-libventi > > and a message from the server saying: > > not a clean exit: bad format in version string > > This message comes up whether I try to access it locally using hget or > remotely using lynx or mozilla. > > Any pointers would be greatly appreciated. > > -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 20:54:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 20:54:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6865 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 20:54:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6861 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 20:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 20:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5335199DD; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:54:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from pc1-dale5-0-cust136.not.cable.ntl.com (pc1-nott2-3-cust35.not.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 12FB5199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 07:53:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 68863 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 11:53:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO xpire) (matt@192.168.1.101) by 192.168.1.100 with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 11:53:09 -0000 Message-ID: <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 12:53:16 +0100 > it's not just spaces. i have had to handle / as well, for instance. > that might not be of interest to some, but it has occurred. Reserved characters in filename conventions seem to me to be archaic. I often use spaces in my filenames, they are human The directory separator for instance is in band signalling. If I can quote Douglas A Gwyn here * : "For example, I take it as one more example of the evil of stealing perfectly legitimate code values for in-band control purposes." Being unable to use / as part of a filename is burdensome when it comes to "interesting" file servers. For instance one of my daydreams is the IRC fileserver with the channel name as a directory but many many channels use / in their channel names. (In fact many people go out of their way to cram as many special characters into IRC channel names as possible). I've wondered if it was possible to define the path separator on a per process basis or something. Perhaps you can already? matt * http://groups.google.com/groups?q=in+band+group:comp.os.plan9&hl=en&lr=&ie=U TF-8&selm=3CCE1366.EAB27A38%40null.net&rnum=2 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 22:30:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 22:30:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7989 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 22:30:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7985 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 22:30:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 22:30:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3297C199DD; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 09:30:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30B55199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 09:29:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g62DTaMS014249 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 15:29:37 +0200 Message-ID: <3D21AAC0.D307E3AB@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts Organization: AB Strakt X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.17 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 15:29:36 +0200 Seems like GNU have a 'solution': NAME xargs - build and execute command lines from standard input SYNOPSIS xargs [-0prtx] [-e[eof-str]] [-i[replace-str]] [-l[max-lines]] [= -n max-args] [-s max-chars] [-P max-procs] [--null] [--eof[=3Deof-s= tr]] [--replace[=3Dreplace-str]] [--max-lines[=3Dmax-lines]] [--intera= ctive] [--max-chars=3Dmax-chars] [--verbose] [--exit] [--max-procs=3Dmax-= procs] [--max-args=3Dmax-args] [--no-run-if-empty] [--version] [--help] [= com=AD mand [initial-arguments]] DESCRIPTION This manual page documents the GNU version of xargs. xargs rea= ds arguments from the standard input, delimited by blanks (which can = be protected with double or single quotes or a backslash) or newline= s, and executes the command (default is /bin/echo) one or more tim= es with any initial-arguments followed by arguments read from standa= rd input. Blank lines on the standard input are ignored. xargs exits with the following status: 0 if it succeeds 123 if any invocation of the command exited with status 1-125 124 if the command exited with status 255 125 if the command is killed by a signal 126 if the command cannot be run 127 if the command is not found 1 if some other error occurred. Some characters were just not meant to be in filenames, which would avoid= the above. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 2 23:53:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 2 23:53:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9373 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Jul 2002 23:53:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9369 invoked from network); 2 Jul 2002 23:53:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Jul 2002 23:53:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DA8F199DD; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 10:53:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4CDB199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 10:52:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-19-61.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.19.61]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA16212 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 16:52:13 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-19-61.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.19.61] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> <3D21AAC0.D307E3AB@strakt.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 16:57:18 +0200 > > Some characters were just not meant to be in filenames, which would avoid the > above. But they are, even in my system there're many files with blanks on their names (and I never choose such names). Since IFAIK none of the authors have anything against the proposal that came out of 9fans (see my previous post, where I tried to summarize it), what if I change the source just to do it? - let Alt-spc generate our unicode blank character - change the system to translate blanks in file names to the same character. - change the quote library so it does not quote that character. I don't have much time right know and that's why I ask before changing the code. I'm willing to implement it if there's agreement, so please, don't ignore the proposal just becase there's no code attached by now, just let me know. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 00:19:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 00:19:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9654 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 00:19:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9650 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 00:19:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 00:19:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31D31199EE; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 11:19:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 247F9199DD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 11:18:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A1DE788C002A; Tue, 02 Jul 2002 08:08:14 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Tue Jul 02 08:08:13 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D21C460.9090606@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Venti: bad format in version string? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 08:18:56 -0700 Sean Quinlan wrote: > somehow, you managed to connect to the port serving the > the venti protocol rather than the http port. > > seanq >> >> I've set up my first Venti server on a standalone workstation, and >> while it's still running through its first test, I've tried to access >> its Web server and I get a lone line in response: >> >> venti-02-libventi Yes, I realized after posting that I'm a complete idiot. Here's the play-by-play: I set up venti, fired it up, shovelled some data, went to check it's internal Web server and noted the lack of response from port 80, so I portmapped it, found the open venti port, and connected to it. Thus my shameful explication of my inability to read documentation ("Help! I've fallen and I can't RTFM!"). For the record, though the man page says it will listen to tcp!*!http by default, I found that I had to use the -h option for the internal Web server to start. The likelihood that my workstation isn't well-configured is high, though. In a networked Plan 9 environment, are people running venti on a terminal? On a CPU server? I know fs is going through some revision, but it's clear that some people are using venti regularly, and I'd love to know how it's being used inside and outside the Labs. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 01:24:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 01:24:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10363 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 01:24:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10359 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 01:24:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 01:24:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 808B7199E8; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 12:24:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BE69199E8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 12:23:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g62GNXmk003403 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 18:23:34 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g62GNXQG003402 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 18:23:33 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020702182329.D2941@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> <3D21AAC0.D307E3AB@strakt.com> <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es>; from FJ Ballesteros on Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 04:57:18PM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 18:23:29 +0200 On Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 04:57:18PM +0200, FJ Ballesteros wrote: > > > > Some characters were just not meant to be in filenames, which would avoid the > > above. > > But they are, even in my system there're many files with blanks on their > names > (and I never choose such names). > I prefer the suggested option of an open(2) (openv?) that takes a strings vector instead of a slash-delimited path. It seems to me that such an approach is still viable as an objective and it would be expedient to keep it in mind and avoid developments that might defeat it. What I'm saying, is that I'd like to target a kernel that is entirely delimiter agnostic and promote each user application in the same direction as a long-term project. In the interim, constructs that cast delimiters in stone should be removed wherever possible. Of course, I may be talking about a completely different operating system, but it strikes me that Plan 9 is the most suitable foundation for such a thing and its developers' abilities certainly (in my opinion) unmatched, so why not start there? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 03:10:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 03:10:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11328 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 03:10:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11324 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 03:10:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 03:10:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6CC4199F2; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 14:10:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6B5F7199BF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 14:09:00 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020702180900.6B5F7199BF@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 19:14:46 +0100 > - change the system to translate blanks in file names to the > same character. it might be worth identifying the exact points that would need changing should such a scheme be chosen. /sys/src/cmd/dossrv /sys/src/cmd/9660srv /sys/src/cmd/tapefs /sys/src/cmd/unix/u9fs /sys/src/cmd/ftpfs convert "space char" to/from external actual space on create, walk, wstat, stat and directory reads. /sys/src/9/port/latin1.c make it possible to have a single character ALT sequence (if ALT-space is what's desired). > - change the quote library so it does not quote that character. it doesn't matter if it does... however various places would need to change back so they didn't quote chars (e.g. ls, pwd?) a suitable character would need to be chosen (e.g. 00A0), and it would be nice if most fonts displayed it in a reasonably consistent manner. perhaps a new function could be added to libc that does the conventional conversion from ' ' to the new space char so that programs with GUI entry boxes that know that a string is being typed in a filename context can trivially do the conversion. what have i missed? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 03:19:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 03:19:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11406 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 03:19:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11402 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 03:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 03:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9823319A08; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 14:19:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E580119A00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 14:18:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 603FE2794; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 13:28:47 -0500 (EST) From: plan9@sigint.cs.purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020702132847.A490@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire>; from matt@proweb.co.uk on Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 12:53:16PM +0100 X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2002 13:28:47 -0500 On Tue, Jul 02, 2002 at 12:53:16PM +0100, matt wrote: > > I often use spaces in my filenames, they are human Do they all go down to the Space Bar and get pounded after work? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 08:10:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 08:10:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13509 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 08:10:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13505 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 08:10:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 08:10:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 221B4199EC; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 19:10:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A020199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 19:09:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA02341 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Jul 2002 19:09:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207022309.TAA02341@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 02 Jul 2002 19:14:46 BST." <20020702180900.6B5F7199BF@mail.cse.psu.edu> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Jul 2002 19:08:59 -0400 > /sys/src/9/port/latin1.c Speaking of this.... Is there a good reason to leave latin1 in the kernel, and not pull it up into libc? I suggested this once before, and Russ didn't want to move it since it's most frequently used in the kernel. However, it seems silly to me that it's not in bitsy/keyboard, for one, and anyone who wants to write a keyboard-like application would want to avail themselves of it. For instance, I was working on a Targus keyboard driver, and had to copy it out of the kernel to link against. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 16:18:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 16:18:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28764 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 16:18:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28760 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 16:18:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 16:18:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5BAB199B3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 03:18:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6917519981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 03:17:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17PeXV-00009K-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 09:27:01 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re:[9fans] anaglyph Message-ID: <20020703092701.A571@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:27:01 +0200 ... yes, the perceived dept axis is inverted (convex is perceived as concave) when red and cyan glasses are interchanged. Most probably, *I* fooled you, because I do not have (yet) the original red/blue spectacles, so I chose left and right deliberately (and, probably, just opposite to the convention). I'll fix it as soon as I am sure which colour belongs to which eye, by convention. Many thanks for the feedback, and have a nice day! -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 17:01:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 17:01:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30320 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 17:01:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30316 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 17:01:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 17:01:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46F01199A3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:01:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A702219981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:00:56 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6b76d268c7227b6451a9cd533b0576a7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:00:55 +0200 rog@vitanuova.com : : /sys/src/cmd/dossrv : /sys/src/cmd/9660srv : /sys/src/cmd/tapefs : /sys/src/cmd/unix/u9fs : /sys/src/cmd/ftpfs : convert "space char" to/from external actual space on create, : walk, wstat, stat and directory reads. One crazy idea I had was to do that translation in the mount driver. That way the server would be happy to think that it uses space, and the client plan 9 program would be happy to see 00A0 or whatever without confussion with the space character. lucio@proxima.alt.za : : What I'm saying, is that I'd like to target a kernel that is entirely : delimiter agnostic and promote each user application in the same : direction as a long-term project. In the interim, constructs that : cast delimiters in stone should be removed wherever possible. IMHO, the problem is mostly the user programs and not the kernel. AFAIK, the kernel is fine if you don't use / and \0 as delimiters (which seems reasonable to me, although some guys might want to use it too). But the tradition that blanks separate arguments is deeply embedded in user programs, perhaps most notably the shell. Assume the kernel has changed to use openv[], what would the shell do to deal with spaces vs 00A0s ? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 17:44:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 17:44:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31526 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31522 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7812619992; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:44:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B30219995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:43:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17Pfsv-00003v-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 10:53:13 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020703105313.A223@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] wavelet compression Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:53:13 +0200 Hi, how do you like this 0.512bpp (0.064 bit) compressed image (1:16 greyscale) ? http://neXt.gli.cas.cz/al4096.gif This 256x256 compressed greyscale has 4kb. Compare quality with original http://neXt.gli.cas.cz/al.gif Get the Plan9 APE-ported software (wavelet image compression) from: ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e/EPWIC-1.tbz Enjoy! PS: it uses PGM (portable greymap) format on input/output. Anyone is going to write pgm/topgm for Plan 9??? ;) -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 17:58:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 17:58:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31802 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 17:58:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31798 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 17:58:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 17:58:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A57D2199B3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:58:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D99C219981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 04:57:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA09423 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:57:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g638vRe07835; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:57:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g638vSv03487 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:57:28 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207030857.g638vSv03487@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 10:57:28 +0200 I just found upasname using the source. Is it documented somewhere? (probably something to add to the wiki) When sending mail from a pop folder acme window, with upasname set to user@ISP the mails are not appended to outgoing. Before setting upasname mail did get appended to outgoing. What could I be doing wrong? Btw. could upas/smtp(d) deserve synopsis entries in mail(1) ? Thanks, Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:07:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:07:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32031 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:07:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32027 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:07:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:07:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B14E019992; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:07:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EA341998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:06:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17PgF6-00003R-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 11:16:08 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020703111607.A201@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Kj7319i9nmIyA2yE" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] ape port Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:16:07 +0200 --Kj7319i9nmIyA2yE Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline mk install (w/APE): /usr/pac/wrk/engine/source/./builtins.h:89[stdin:629] name not declared: free /* * Common functions, with no fancy init or dispose phases. */ // line 89: { "sin", calc_sin, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* Sine function */ see builtins.h appended Hand on heart, I don't understand how this table works... :-( Sorry. -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz --Kj7319i9nmIyA2yE Content-Type: text/x-chdr; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="builtins.h" #ifndef __built_in_h #define __built_in_h /* * builtins.h: Header file for builtins.c * * (c) 1994 Luis E. Mu#oz * TRUE Consulting - Caracas - Venezuela * * * * This code can be used for non-commercial uses. Commercial use of either * the enclosed code or any material produced with it is not permitted * without a consent from the authors. This notice must not be removed. * * lem@usb.ve * lem@true.net */ #include #include #include "slist.h" #include "ptree.h" /* * The associated types that can be returned by * each procedure. */ #define R_REAL 0 /* Real Number */ #define R_STRING 1 /* A quoted string */ #define R_COMP 2 /* Composite operation */ #define R_FUNC 3 /* Function */ #define R_IDENT 4 /* An Identifier (variable) */ #define R_NEG 5 /* Aritmetic negation */ #define R_MAP 6 /* Mapping */ #define R_NONE -1 /* No type */ #define MIN_BUF_LEN 64 #define STD_FREE free /* what to use to free default data */ typedef struct { int NumEntries; /* How many entries */ char **Entry; /* The actual entries */ } Map_Data; /* The primitive functions */ void *_plus (void *, listdesc, int *); void *_minus (void *, listdesc, int *); void *_neg (void *, listdesc, int *); void *_times (void *, listdesc, int *); void *_div (void *, listdesc, int *); /* Built inc functions */ void *calc_sin (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_cos (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_ifelse (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_lt (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_gt (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_eq (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_linear (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_pow (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_abs (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_accel (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_bound (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_smooth (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_mod (void *, listdesc, int *); void *calc_map (Map_Data *, listdesc, int *); void *map_alloc(listdesc); typedef struct { char *Token; void *(*Eval)(void*, listdesc, int *Type); void (*Free)(void *, listdesc); void *(*Alloc)(listdesc); int Type; } Table_Entry; #ifdef __BUILTIN_TABLE Table_Entry BuiltInFuncs[] = { /* * Common functions, with no fancy init or dispose phases. */ { "sin", calc_sin, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* Sine function */ { "cos", calc_cos, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* cosine function */ { "ifelse", calc_ifelse, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* if...else construct */ { "gt", calc_gt, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* greather than */ { "lt", calc_lt, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* lower than */ { "eq", calc_eq, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* equality */ { "linear", calc_linear, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* linear interpolation */ { "abs", calc_abs, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* abs val of a number */ { "pow", calc_pow, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* power of a number */ { "accel", calc_accel, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* acceleration func. */ { "bound", calc_bound, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* bound function */ { "smooth", calc_smooth, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* smooth interp */ { "mod", calc_mod, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* modulus */ /* * More complicated functions... */ { "map", calc_map, free, map_alloc, R_STRING }, /* mapping */ /* * End Of Table. */ { NULL, NULL, NULL, NULL, R_NONE } /* Marks the end of the table! */ }; #endif /* __BUILTIN_TABLE */ /* Some macros to ease the construction of built in functions and evaluators. */ #define DECLARES(VarName) \ double * VarName;\ int VarName##Type;\ TreeNode * VarName##Node;\ void (* VarName##Free)(void *, listdesc) #define NODE(VarName) VarName##Node #define TYPE(VarName) VarName##Type #define FREE(VarName) VarName##Free #define COPY(Dest, Source) \ TYPE(Dest) = TYPE(Source);\ NODE(Dest) = NODE(Source);\ FREE(Dest) = FREE(Source);\ Dest = Source; #define EVALUATE(VarName) \ TYPE(VarName) = Eval(NODE(VarName), &VarName, &FREE(VarName)) #define CHECK_TYPE(VarName, MyType, FuncName) \ if (TYPE(VarName) != MyType) \ {\ fprintf(stderr, "Wrong arguments passed to `" FuncName "'.\n");\ exit(1);\ } #define CHECK_TO_FREE(VarName) \ if (FREE(VarName)) \ (*FREE(VarName))(VarName, NODE(VarName)->Childs)\ #define SET_RESULTING_TYPE(Pointer, Type) \ if (Pointer) *(Pointer) = (Type) #define ALLOC(Pointer, Type, Msg) \ (Pointer) = malloc(sizeof(Type)); \ if (!(Pointer)) { \ fprintf(stderr, "Cannot alloc: %s\n", (Msg)); \ exit(1); }\ /* The definition of blanks in a `Map File' */ #define MAP_BLANK " \t,:" #endif /* __built_in_h*/ --Kj7319i9nmIyA2yE-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:12:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:12:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32108 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:12:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32104 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:12:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:12:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 957F319992; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:12:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A28719995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:11:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17PgJn-00003W-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 11:20:59 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020703112059.B201@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] png bug? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:20:59 +0200 Try this: term% cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.ppm | ppm -9 | topng | png #compare with cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.ppm | ppm term% cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.jpg | jpg -9 | topng | png png: header said 149 rows; data goes further -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:14:12 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:14:12 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32228 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:14:12 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32224 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:14:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:14:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D884199A3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:14:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FA1819980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:13:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g639Dnmk005775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:13:49 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g639DmdT005774 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:13:48 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ape port Message-ID: <20020703111346.M2941@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020703111607.A201@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20020703111607.A201@next.gli.cas.cz>; from Peter A. Cejchan on Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 11:16:07AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:13:47 +0200 On Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 11:16:07AM +0200, Peter A. Cejchan wrote: > > mk install (w/APE): > > /usr/pac/wrk/engine/source/./builtins.h:89[stdin:629] name not declared: free > Aren't you just missing a header file? comes to mind... ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:16:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:16:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32269 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:16:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32265 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:16:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:16:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A94F51998C; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:16:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from 9fs.org (cotswold.demon.co.uk [194.222.75.186]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9041F1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:15:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Received: from 194.32.96.107 ([194.32.96.107]) by 9fs.org; Wed Jul 3 10:15:53 BST 2002 From: "Nigel Roles" To: "9fans@cse.psu.edu" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Standard (2.20.2200) For Windows 2000 (5.0.2195;2) In-Reply-To: <20020703112059.B201@next.gli.cas.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [9fans] png bug? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "Nigel Roles" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 10:17:02 +0100 On Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:20:59 +0200, Peter A. Cejchan wrote: >Try this: > >term% cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.ppm | ppm -9 | topng | png >#compare with cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.ppm | ppm > > >term% cat /sys/src/cmd/gs/jpeg/testimg.jpg | jpg -9 | topng | png >png: header said 149 rows; data goes further > It doesn't read PNGs created by Photoshop properly either. I haven't had chance to investigate yet. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:16:30 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:16:30 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32283 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:16:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32276 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:16:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:16:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD1EC199BC; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:16:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13BA5199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:15:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g639FqMS025331 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:15:52 +0200 Message-ID: <3D22C0C8.EF481533@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts Organization: AB Strakt X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (X11; U; Linux 2.4.17 i686) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ape port References: <20020703111607.A201@next.gli.cas.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 11:15:52 +0200 "Peter A. Cejchan" wrote: > { "sin", calc_sin, free, NULL, R_REAL }, /* Sine function */ You'll need for free() From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 18:24:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 18:24:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32486 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 18:24:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32482 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 18:24:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 18:24:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0892199B3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:24:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7311419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 05:23:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17PgV4-00003p-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 11:32:38 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020703113238.A230@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] java/java compiler/j2C anyone? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:32:38 +0200 ... nce, there was a thread on java port that ceased with waiting on 9P2000 (long names). Is there any progress since? (Not that I love java so much, but there is a few pieces of sw I would like to see running) thanks, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 20:28:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 20:28:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2052 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 20:28:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2048 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 20:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 20:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C13519981; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 07:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 15CA219992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 07:27:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] source change to allow for Alt-space Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 13:27:39 +0200 Even if we never end up using ␣ instead of " ", I think this change is useful on its own. It allows one character sequences in /lib/keyboard, considering that the sequence " " is actually " ". Right now, I'm using "␣" as the rune for Alt-space, therefore I made no change to /lib/keyboard. diff /n/dump/2002/0703/sys/src/cmd/aux/mklatinkbd.c mklatinkbd.c 185c185 < if(inseq && p-seq >= 2) { --- > if(inseq && p-seq >= 1) { diff /n/dump/2002/0703/sys/src/9/port/latin1.c /sys/src/9/port/latin1.c 58a59,65 > if(l->ld[0] == '\0' && n == 1){ > for(p=l->si; *p!=0; p++) > if(*p == k[0]) > return l->so[p - l->si]; > return -1; > } > for(l=latintab; l->ld!=0; l++) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 21:00:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 21:00:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2626 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 21:00:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2622 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 21:00:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 21:00:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDB9B19995; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:00:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BF4A619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 07:59:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <47a0de0f777729f80b26b0a27004f9d2@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] upasname & acme's outgoing? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 07:59:41 -0400 On Wed Jul 3 04:58:17 EDT 2002, Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl wrote: > I just found upasname using the source. Is it documented somewhere? > (probably something to add to the wiki) > I'll add it, didn't realize I hadn't. > When sending mail from a pop folder acme window, with upasname set > to user@ISP the mails are not appended to outgoing. Before setting > upasname mail did get appended to outgoing. What could I be doing wrong? > What's outgoing? > > Btw. could upas/smtp(d) deserve synopsis entries in mail(1) ? They do, I'll addd them. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 21:01:12 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 21:01:12 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2660 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 21:01:12 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2656 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 21:01:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 21:01:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D100A199BF; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:01:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95BEF199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:00:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g63C0gmk006076 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 14:00:47 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g63C0cmm006075 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 14:00:38 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020703140033.A6013@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <6b76d268c7227b6451a9cd533b0576a7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <6b76d268c7227b6451a9cd533b0576a7@plan9.escet.urjc.es>; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 10:00:55AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 14:00:36 +0200 *** ramble alert! *** On Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 10:00:55AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > IMHO, the problem is mostly the user programs and not the kernel. > AFAIK, the kernel is fine if you don't use / and \0 as delimiters > (which seems reasonable to me, although some guys might want to use it too). > Yes, it would be convenient for the delimiter to be soft, for example. > But the tradition that blanks separate arguments is deeply embedded in > user programs, perhaps most notably the shell. > I certainly will not argue with this. > Assume the kernel has changed to use openv[], what would the shell > do to deal with spaces vs 00A0s ? > Well, it's not as if I'm the genius here :-) The command line (ignore the shell for a moment as its interpreter) is a very clear expression of the user's intent, in that there is a long tradition behind it and, eqaully important(ly), it is visually unambiguous (within human limits). The feature one often overlooks of spaces is that they can be repeated with no change of semantics or replaced by other whitespace with similar results (cf. sendmail's configuration file and its tab/space madness). So it would seem reasonable to retain the convention unchanged in the familiar contexts and seek alternatives in the new, graphical environments, for example. Is there perhaps an undiscovered technique to express a shell pipeline in a graphical format? If so, can new separator rules be brought to apply, escaping some of the limitations of the traditional approach? Maybe facetiously, I'd like to point out that the space is the absence of a character to the eye, if we used a typescript interface with pixel-dots in the character positions, drag-and-dropping command line parameters would be automatically quoted by the background pixel-dots. That is, until you want a pixel-dot character in an argument. Sigh. Still, a background of single quotes would work and be horrendously ugly, argument completion may become mandatory as the shell now no longer can provide that function as everything is quoted. In short, no, I do not have an answer for Nemo, but it seems to me that bending the conventional interface is not going to work well, we ought to be looking for new answers, not unlike the ingeniousness that brought us Plan 9 in the first place and acme as the most extreme example. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 21:41:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 21:41:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3301 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 21:41:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3297 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 21:41:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 21:41:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2933F19995; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:41:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 14031199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 08:40:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <350bf465a0f62c85d7044b3f504e4bf7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 14:40:27 +0200 This seems to do it. I'm using it as an experiment. BTW, is the UTF8 of 0x00a0 0xa0? I think so, but I'm not sure. One thing I dont like is that this diff makes devmnt to change the user supplied names. I think it would be better to do it at convS2M/convM2S, but that scares me. Any comment on this? If you hate applying diffs, the whole devmnt is at http://plan9.escet.urjc.es/who/nemo/devmnt.c Let me know if this convinces you or you're still dubious or there's a better way. hth diff /n/dump/2002/0703/sys/src/9/port/devmnt.c /sys/src/9/port/devmnt.c 77a78,79 > // Ugly, but where would it be better? Perhaps at convS2M/M2S? > // that would require a change to 9p. 78a81,122 > importname(char *s) > { > for(; *s; s++) > if (*s == ' ') > *s=0xa0; > } > > static void > exportname(char *s) > { > for(; *s; s++) > if (*s == 0xa0) > *s=' '; > } > > static void > exportstat(uchar *s) > { > int m; > > s += STATFIXLEN - 4 * BIT16SZ; // first string > m = GBIT16(s); > s += BIT16SZ; > for (; m > 0; m--, s++) > if (*s == 0xa0) > *s=' '; > } > > static void > importstat(uchar *s) > { > int m; > > s += STATFIXLEN - 4 * BIT16SZ; // first string > m = GBIT16(s); > s += BIT16SZ; > for (; m > 0; m--, s++) > if (*s == ' ') > *s=0xa0; > } > > static void 418a463,465 > // ␣ > for (i = 0; i < nname; i++) > exportname(name[i]); 421d467 < 486a533 > importstat(dp); // ␣ 510a558 > exportname(name); 628a677 > exportstat(dp); // ␣ 669a719 > importstat(p); // ␣ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 22:18:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 22:18:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3773 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 22:18:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3769 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 22:18:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 22:18:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 378DB19991; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:18:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5B75119991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:17:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7faf93b6c08754d2b3e72d26e2935184@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:17:13 -0400 /sys/man/1/mail updated to describe upasname and with synopses for smtp and smtpd. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 22:55:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 22:55:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4241 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 22:55:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4237 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 22:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 22:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 394F6199B7; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:55:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6DA4919991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 09:54:27 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> <20020702132847.A490@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Message-Id: <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:54:20 +0900 Hello, I prefer spaces are mapped simplly to underscores. Then term% touch 'some files' create some_files and term% rm 'some files' removes some_files However, I don't think these defects are practically important. I am rather afraid Plan9 loses simplicity. Kenji Arisawa E-mail: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:17:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:17:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4476 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:17:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4472 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E936A199BB; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:17:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C61B4199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:16:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.121.240.70 ([135.121.240.70]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 10:16:15 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <447280.1025709673@GOLD> In-Reply-To: <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> References: <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:21:14 -0400 Because file names come in places other than directories. You can't always get this right. If you translate them going into open(), you will be inconsistent with file names used other ways. It's similar to the problem with NAT boxes and hidden IP addresses. I'd say do nothing yet. There is no clear right answer. -rob --On Tuesday, July 02, 2002 4:57 PM +0200 FJ Ballesteros wrote: >> >> Some characters were just not meant to be in filenames, which would >> avoid the above. > > But they are, even in my system there're many files with blanks on their > names > (and I never choose such names). > > Since IFAIK none of the authors have anything against the proposal > that came out of 9fans (see my previous post, where I tried to summarize > it), > what if I change the source just to do it? > > - let Alt-spc generate our unicode blank character > - change the system to translate blanks in file names to the > same character. > - change the quote library so it does not quote that character. > > I don't have much time right know and that's why I ask before changing > the > code. I'm willing to implement it if there's agreement, so please, don't > ignore the proposal just becase there's no code attached by now, > just let me know. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:19:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:19:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4494 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:19:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4490 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19F32199F2; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:19:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB50F199E4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:18:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (213-0-201-115.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.201.115]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA25805 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:18:55 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 213-0-201-115.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.201.115] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D230900.47F9A746@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> <003d01c221bf$0dfd9d30$6501a8c0@xpire> <20020702132847.A490@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 16:24:00 +0200 I wouldn't say this change makes the system more complex, one thing I found after playing with this is that even though I made no change to the quote stuff in the C library, programs started to handle funny file names without relying on %q. This is the semantics for the thing I sent before: both touch 'a x' and touch 'a\0xa0x' would create a file named 'a x' Thus in both cases, ls would get 'a\0x00a0x' Besides, foreign systems would still see 'a x' (Im sorry, but don't know how to type Alt X 00A0 under windows, \x00a0 above should be read like our non-break space character). Regarding what you say about "_", I'd still like to be able to type "touch a_x.c". IMHO, the character of choice doesn't matter to much, but I think it would be better if it's not an already used character. arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp ha escrito: > > Hello, > > I prefer spaces are mapped simplly to underscores. > Then > term% touch 'some files' > create some_files > and > term% rm 'some files' > removes some_files > However, I don't think these defects are practically important. > I am rather afraid Plan9 loses simplicity. > > Kenji Arisawa > E-mail: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:27:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:27:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4574 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:27:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4570 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:27:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:27:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EE5719A05; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B09D199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:26:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (213-0-201-115.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.201.115]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA26240 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:26:48 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 213-0-201-115.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.201.115] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D230ADA.F3A4EDFE@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <3D21BF4E.9A3A6A39@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> <447280.1025709673@GOLD> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 16:31:54 +0200 Well, I agree, but since I got your mail after a tiny spare-time bucket, I already tried it and sent the diff. And now that I have been playing with it for a while, I have started to love it, sic. Regarding the inconsistence, I think that most of the cases are still handled by the side-effect that 'a x' is still understood as 'a x'. Although not fully consistent, I don't know a better way. "rob pike, esq." ha escrito: > > Because file names come in places other than directories. You > can't always get this right. If you translate them going into > open(), you will be inconsistent with file names used other ways. > It's similar to the problem with NAT boxes and hidden IP addresses. > > I'd say do nothing yet. There is no clear right answer. > > -rob > > --On Tuesday, July 02, 2002 4:57 PM +0200 FJ Ballesteros > wrote: > > >> > >> Some characters were just not meant to be in filenames, which would > >> avoid the above. > > > > But they are, even in my system there're many files with blanks on their > > names > > (and I never choose such names). > > > > Since IFAIK none of the authors have anything against the proposal > > that came out of 9fans (see my previous post, where I tried to summarize > > it), > > what if I change the source just to do it? > > > > - let Alt-spc generate our unicode blank character > > - change the system to translate blanks in file names to the > > same character. > > - change the quote library so it does not quote that character. > > > > I don't have much time right know and that's why I ask before changing > > the > > code. I'm willing to implement it if there's agreement, so please, don't > > ignore the proposal just becase there's no code attached by now, > > just let me know. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:35:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:35:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4660 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:35:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4656 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:35:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:35:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEA40199B3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:35:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5EED3199D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:34:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [135.121.240.71] ([135.121.240.71]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 10:34:06 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <1515958.1025710742@GOLD> In-Reply-To: <20020703140033.A6013@cackle.proxima.alt.za> References: <20020703140033.A6013@cackle.proxima.alt.za> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:39:03 -0400 You guys are all arguing about system stuff but it's the *user interface* that you're really arguing about, and breaking. You are opening a can of worms you will never get closed again. Change space! Change the file delimiter! The shell will never recover. The system will break. I will mourn. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:36:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:36:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4697 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:36:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4693 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:36:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:36:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13B0F199EC; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:36:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DD22E199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:35:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [135.121.240.71] ([135.121.240.71]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 10:35:30 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <1603408.1025710829@GOLD> In-Reply-To: <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> References: <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:40:30 -0400 You can't do that becaause if a file contains a genuine underscore, the outgoing software will think it's a space. -rob --On Wednesday, July 03, 2002 10:54 PM +0900 arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > Hello, > > I prefer spaces are mapped simplly to underscores. > Then > term% touch 'some files' > create some_files > and > term% rm 'some files' > removes some_files > However, I don't think these defects are practically important. > I am rather afraid Plan9 loses simplicity. > > Kenji Arisawa > E-mail: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:39:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:39:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4741 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:39:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4737 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:39:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:39:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB1B819A0B; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:39:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 38F3D199DD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:38:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [135.121.240.71] ([135.121.240.71]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 10:38:19 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces Message-ID: <1771288.1025710997@GOLD> In-Reply-To: <350bf465a0f62c85d7044b3f504e4bf7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> References: <350bf465a0f62c85d7044b3f504e4bf7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:43:19 -0400 You are changing the meaning of the space character. Think about what that means, the number of places it affects, the impossibility of getting it right everywhere. This is a terrible idea. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 3 23:46:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 3 23:46:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4831 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Jul 2002 23:46:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4827 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2002 23:46:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Jul 2002 23:46:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E56119A17; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:46:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF6B0199DD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 10:45:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g63Ejbmk006385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:45:38 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g63Ejamw006384 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:45:36 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces Message-ID: <20020703164533.D6107@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <350bf465a0f62c85d7044b3f504e4bf7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1771288.1025710997@GOLD> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <1771288.1025710997@GOLD>; from rob pike, esq. on Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 03:43:19PM -0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:45:33 +0200 On Wed, Jul 03, 2002 at 03:43:19PM -0400, rob pike, esq. wrote: > > You are changing the meaning of the space character. > Think about what that means, the number of places it > affects, the impossibility of getting it right > everywhere. This is a terrible idea. > I got it! Use   whenever you need a non-breaking space, it's a standard! % touch 'a x' will then create file 'a x'. Pity you still need quotes to escape the '&' and ';' ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 00:38:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 00:38:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5465 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 00:38:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5461 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 00:38:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 00:38:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A6D319A08; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:38:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74902199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:37:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-42-195.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.42.195]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id RAA29728 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:37:18 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-42-195.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.42.195] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D231B5E.36AD6B75@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces References: <350bf465a0f62c85d7044b3f504e4bf7@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1771288.1025710997@GOLD> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 17:42:22 +0200 I saw it more like using two different characters, and not like changing the meaning of space. I'll think about it, but I sincerelly think that 'a x' causes much more problems than a?x, since for example something like ls | dosomething would make dosomething think that a file name with spaces on it is '/a/b x' instead of /a/b x. In fact, I think that's what happen with the 'chk file I had to remove to avoid confussing replica. Perhaps I could see what I may be missing after gaining more experience with the changed/broken mount driver, or, if you happen to have some time, you could drop me a line with some of the bad effects you see. I just can't see them, sorry. "rob pike, esq." ha escrito: > > You are changing the meaning of the space character. > Think about what that means, the number of places it > affects, the impossibility of getting it right > everywhere. This is a terrible idea. > > -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 01:12:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 01:12:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5854 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 01:12:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5850 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 01:12:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 01:12:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B40619A04; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 12:12:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C5E6C199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 12:11:48 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020703161148.C5E6C199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] upas/token Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:11:33 0100 What is it for? I'm sure it should be obvious, but I can't see it. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 02:47:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 02:47:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6517 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 02:47:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6513 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 02:47:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 02:47:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8745E199DD; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 13:47:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EF02919A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 13:46:39 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020703174640.EF02919A1C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 18:52:25 +0100 nemo: > BTW, is the UTF8 of 0x00a0 0xa0? I think so, but I'm not sure. no rune above 127 has the same representation in utf8. (0xa0 is represented by [0xc2, 0x80]). that means your job is a little harder as you have to grow the messages. but i really don't think this is in the right place, as it affects *every* user-level implemented fileserver, and it's quite possible that a fileserver produces in a file names that have been created inside it. (e.g. think of upas/fs, "create mboxname"). however i still think it shouldn't be too bad if done at the boundaries of the system, where one is less likely to have such things going on, and where one is notionally crossing a language boundary anyway (e.g. one doesn't expect a Windows filesystem to have files containing filenames in plan 9 format). rob: > Change space! actually i thought i was on the side of *not* changing space! space in plan 9 was always a character that could be used to separate filenames unconditionally; now it's not, and that change affects many things. a few things that are affected: * filenames of the same length no longer take the same number of characters. * {ls | sort -f} no longer works. (in fact sort probably needs to understand quoting for its field separators, as probably do several other tools). * regexps for matching filenames become much more complex, and non-determinate, as we don't know which characters were inside or outside the quotes. acme right-button semantics can never work properly on quoted filenames. * greater potential for visual misidentification of distinct filenames: i think that it's more difficult to pick out the filenames in: 'A few very ''long file' names 'in the same ' place than in: A_few_very__'long_file names in_the_same__ place (substituting '_' for whatever the "space" char is), as there's an immediate indication of which spaces are separators and which are part of the filenames. * the fact that spaces run together visually provides great possibilities for ambiguities in filenames (not that that isn't an issue with unicode anyway :-]) * echo no longer works reliably as a convenient way of selecting filenames: e.g. % echo *.txt x.txt y.txt z.txt % ls -l --rw-rw-r-- M 32 rog rog 1 Jul 3 18:31 x.txt y.txt --rw-rw-r-- M 32 rog rog 1 Jul 3 18:31 z.txt oh well. rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 04:49:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 04:49:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7265 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 04:49:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7261 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 04:49:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 04:49:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9985D19A1C; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 15:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4757B19A26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 15:48:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <761b70db34a4c6ffa28563f2265ef944@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] upas/token MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-foykqkgsbonqnjzypsgsmfozju" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 15:48:04 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-foykqkgsbonqnjzypsgsmfozju Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My mail filter adds addresses to my list of acceptable senders if it finds a valid token in the subject line. To create a token that is a function of the string xyzzy and today's date. % upas/token xyzzy 2taC2 % To see if a token is one created in the last 10 days % echo some line containing 2taC2 > /tmp/quux % if ( upas/token xyzzy /tmp/quux ) echo hi hi % In /sys/src/cmd/upas/filterkit/pipeto.sample you'll find: # save and parse the mail file {sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /'; echo} > $TMP upas/fs -f $TMP # if we like the source # or if the subject contains a valid token # then deliver the mail and allow all the addresses ... if ( $BIN/token $KEY $D/subject ) { $BIN/deliver $RECIP $D/from $MBOX < $D/raw $BIN/list add $PF $D/from $D/to $D/cc $D/sender rm $TMP echo `{date} added $RECIP From `{cat $D/replyto} \ >> /mail/box/$USER/_bounced >[2] /dev/null exit 0 } The first bit just uses upas/fs to present the message to be filtered as a file system. The last part looks to see if a valid token exists in the Subject: line and if so adds the address to the list of patterns. Of course, there's no reason to use upas/token. You could just as easily have a single token that's good for all time. I just thought that would make it a little to easy for the spammers. --upas-foykqkgsbonqnjzypsgsmfozju Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 12:12:14 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 12:12:13 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1ECF8199E3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 12:12:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C5E6C199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 12:11:48 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020703161148.C5E6C199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] upas/token Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:11:33 0100 What is it for? I'm sure it should be obvious, but I can't see it. -- Richard --upas-foykqkgsbonqnjzypsgsmfozju-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 05:33:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 05:33:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7526 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 05:33:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7522 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 05:33:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 05:33:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FA5919A2A; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:33:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (unknown [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C33219A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 16:32:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-32-62.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.32.62]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id WAA07548 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:32:48 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-32-62.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.32.62] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D2360A2.B9F9DBA6@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces References: <20020703174640.EF02919A1C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 22:37:54 +0200 I hate to disagree with Rob, but after thinking more about it, I think that %q actually broke the system interface and that a better way is needed. The are many examples, most of them of form program_using_%q | program_using_' '_as_delimiter. IMHO, the can of worms is already open (rog gave even more examples) and we can either eat the worms (which was my first option, i.e. if you have problems with ' ', don't use ' '), or close the can again. I'd really love to see an example where the proposed change would actually break the system. I've tried as hard as I could to find one, but I found none. rog: > but i really don't think this is in the right place, as it affects > *every* user-level implemented fileserver, and it's quite possible > that a fileserver produces in a file names that have been created > inside it. (e.g. think of upas/fs, "create mboxname"). I've thought about that, but even in this case the system would still work properly: Let's say a file server creates a file with a line per file created on it. The line contains the created file name, just to follow your example. Say you create w\x0aw, the file server would write "w w\n" to the file with file names (that's the name it sees). If you later try to read and use those file names, they will work, becase "w w" is also understood by the system (the space is kept, and retains its meaning). Moreover, by doing the change in the kernel, you can replace the server software by a different program (using the same media) and it will still work (since the server still sees 'w w'. That would not happen if it was the server the one translating from Alt-spc to spc (because the other server could get confussed). What's the problem? Any of you must be aware of something I'm missing. I'd love any of you to prove me wrong so I could learn from this. Just give me an example if you don't have time to teach me. thanks a lot in any case. PS: One point where I think we were wrong is that the character should be one such that it's length be 1, to avoid changing name lengths, sic. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 06:33:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 06:33:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7910 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 06:33:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7906 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 06:33:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 06:33:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BAA87199E3; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:33:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7E3AD19A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:32:36 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] experimental change for devmnt to deal with spaces From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020703213236.7E3AD19A0D@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:38:24 +0100 > What's the problem? Any of you must be aware of something I'm missing. to continue with the upas/fs example, here's a function that opens a mailbox and returns a pathname that can be used to access the messages therein: void openmbox(char *path, char *name, char result[]) { fprint(open("/mail/fs/ctl", OWRITE), "open %q %q", path, name); sprint(result, "/mail/fs/%s", name); } imagine the function being called as follows: { char buf[65536]; openmbox("/mail/box/rog/mbox", "My\x00A0Mailbox", buf); } assuming upas/fs doesn't do the same character translation as the mount driver, any subsequent code that tries to use the returned path will fail, as the mailbox will have been created in upas/fs's internal data structures *with* the 0xa0 character; however the mount driver prevents that character from getting through. to my mind, the fact that a pure plan 9 program has to be aware of this convention to work correctly seems to indicate that the best solution is at the boundaries of the system - i.e. whereever a plan 9 fileserver interacts with an external name. that keeps internal invariants simple, and the potential for peril low. rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 07:12:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 07:12:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8183 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 07:12:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8179 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 07:12:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 07:12:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC27319995; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 18:12:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 15154199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 18:11:18 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> <1603408.1025710829@GOLD> Message-Id: <20020703221118.15154199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:10:55 +0900 Hello, >You can't do that becaause if a file contains a genuine >underscore, the outgoing software will think it's a space. the outgoing software will also think it's a underscaore. Is this important? Some OSs already map 'Windows' to 'WINDOWS'. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 11:44:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 11:44:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14289 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 11:44:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14284 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 11:44:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 11:44:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2F2199B9; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:44:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9B16B1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:43:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] * most USB audio devices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:43:47 -0400 On Fri Jun 28 09:32:22 EDT 2002, matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > any clues as to which ones have been tested? > > I don't want to find : > the_one_I_get < most < all > > the one's I've found obviously don't trumpet "now works with plan9" on the > box > > Matt I've successfully used the Xitel MD-Port DG2, which is a USB -> TOSLINK device, enabling you to send digital audio to MiniDisc players and other audio equipment with TOSLINK inputs. E.g. it's possible to copy a CD to MiniDisc with % usb/usbaudio % echo audio 100 >/dev/volume % cdfs % cd /mnt/cd % for(a in a???){ cp $a /dev/audio sleep 1 } % --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 15:35:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 15:35:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21104 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 15:35:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21100 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 15:35:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 15:35:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8595A199B7; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 02:35:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 33E661998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 02:33:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8c75ad56989c77def4ecb7b1f7cdb273@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-nprqlnpcdysfyahbmcmzrjjxhu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:34:25 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-nprqlnpcdysfyahbmcmzrjjxhu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the advantage of pushing stuff like this back to the boundaries, the points at which Plan 9 interacts with other systems and formats (often using 9P), rather than building it into the heart of Plan 9, is that at least the Plan 9 system itself can have straightforward internal rules. at the boundaries you're bound to be aware that there are differences (in practice). for instance, you can create names via dossrv that Windows itself cannot access properly (left as an exercise for the reader), but aren't prohibited by the FAT32 specification, or indeed, documented accurately anywhere. it's only a little better with 9660srv. the problem rob alluded to, by analogy with NAT, should not arise within the Plan 9 system. for instance, if i have a file of file names, can i read it in and be sure to access those names? if space is _ and _ is `boo!' it's anyone's guess. it's more understandable if, when problems do arise, they appear only at the boundaries with other systems, where there are necessarily some differences (remembering of course that any given difference might or might not be strictly `necessary'). so far, it seems to me: if Plan 9 allows space directly in the storage names, then space should be the character in the name, the quoting approach seems the only one that works properly, and we have some work to do to work out all the interactions with shell scanning (oh dear!), and changing (i suspect) the input conventions of quite a few commands, but still, it's a finite task. the possible scale of that task--even understanding all the implications-- can i think be underestimated, which is why i snarl a bit at people who are incredibly glib about it [which rob is not]. otherwise, Plan 9 should prohibit space in its file names, as previously, and the user interface can use something like U+00A0 to provide the functionality that at least some humans seem to think is essential. (computers don't give a dam whether names have spaces or not.) at the boundaries with Windows or Mac or Unix that character can be mapped to and fro, but there is already mapping of various sorts taking place there. (Windows itself has trouble enough with its conventions; another little exercise: what is a file name separator under Windows and how do you use it?) to return to the file name list example, it's less surprising that Plan 9 can't take a list of file in Windows style and access them directly. that wouldn't work whether space were allowed or not. Plan 9 already does translate at the boundaries between UTF-8 and whatever the other system uses. the latter approach handles not just space but also some other characters such as `/' that turn up at the boundaries, but cannot be handled by Plan 9. again, some are glib about the need for it, and i snarl again. even so, pragmatically there's no need to use one technique for everything if space is regarded as utterly different from all other such characters. space could be used as itself within the system and we can map `/' as and when we find it. it's also worth noting that having consistent quoting conventions to allow spaces in space-separated input is probably worthwhile on its own, so not all the work in Plan A will vanish. don't quit that editor just yet. --upas-nprqlnpcdysfyahbmcmzrjjxhu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1025734390:10:07734:3; Wed, 03 Jul 2002 22:13:10 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1107220; 3 Jul 2002 22:12 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC27319995; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 18:12:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 15154199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 18:11:18 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> <1603408.1025710829@GOLD> Message-Id: <20020703221118.15154199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:10:55 +0900 Hello, >You can't do that becaause if a file contains a genuine >underscore, the outgoing software will think it's a space. the outgoing software will also think it's a underscaore. Is this important? Some OSs already map 'Windows' to 'WINDOWS'. Kenji Arisawa --upas-nprqlnpcdysfyahbmcmzrjjxhu-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 15:48:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 15:48:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21632 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 15:48:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21628 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 15:48:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 15:48:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0A5619992; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 02:48:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BE3BF19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 02:47:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1b8fddb88743e230927ca086d93d4df2@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu subject: re: [9fans] blanks in names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:47:55 +0100 >>otherwise, Plan 9 should prohibit space in its file names, as >>previously, ... i ought to have said `and still', since /sys/src/fs/port/9p2.c still blocks it. perhaps just as well until it's sorted out! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 16:41:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 16:41:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23275 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 16:41:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23271 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 16:41:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 16:41:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03AB3199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:41:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DA5A1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:40:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g647e5mk008940 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:40:08 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g647e0FU008936 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:40:00 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020704093955.L6107@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <8c75ad56989c77def4ecb7b1f7cdb273@caldo.demon.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <8c75ad56989c77def4ecb7b1f7cdb273@caldo.demon.co.uk>; from forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk on Thu, Jul 04, 2002 at 07:34:25AM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:39:56 +0200 On Thu, Jul 04, 2002 at 07:34:25AM +0100, forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote: > > the problem rob alluded to, by analogy with NAT, should not > arise within the Plan 9 system. for instance, if i have a file > of file names, can i read it in and be sure to access those names? > if space is _ and _ is `boo!' it's anyone's guess. > I think we're going somewhere We already have shims between the conventional Plan 9 filesystem and foreign ones. These are our declared boundaries and it is fairly clear what translations are required at each of these boundaries. It seems to me that Nemo is - perhaps unintentionally, certainly not in an explicit fashion - creating an inner boundary that declares the core of Plan 9 much more liberal and a shim is therefore necessary so that the existing legacy applications can interact with it. I would vote for such a feature. The kernel and 9P would be freed of filename shackles, the shim would apply the existing rules. Imagine, for example, a shim that would enable a 2nd Edition application to access the 4th Edition filesystem. Mapping filenames to unique 27-character UTF8 strings with certain restrictions should be possible through such a shim. Even the choice of delimiter between path components would be available to those willing to produce the necessary shim. ++L PS: while checking the above, I was wondering where %q belongs in that model. I would think the shim must somehow provide the actual quote and dequote operations. Hm, maybe such a shim can also add descriptive names and, shudder, access control lists in a Plan 9 friendly form. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 16:49:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 16:49:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23511 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 16:49:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23507 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 16:49:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 16:49:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AB1C1999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9A39C19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:48:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0c9d487627fc0c8aec5d9660f18d6d6f@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:47:59 +0200 forsyth: : the problem rob alluded to, by analogy with NAT, should not : arise within the Plan 9 system. for instance, if i have a file : of file names, can i read it in and be sure to access those names? : if space is _ and _ is `boo!' it's anyone's guess. But space is not _, space is space. As I said in a previous mail, if you have a file of file names, you can still read and use it. AFAIK, you can be sure to access those names. Nevertheless, I can understand your arguments for doing it at boundaries and not at the kernel. : should be the character in the name, the quoting approach seems : the only one that works properly, and we have some work to do : to work out all the interactions with shell scanning (oh dear!), and changing But it's not just the shell, almost *any* program reading file names would have to deal with quoting. What has been a file name is changing after %q, before that, a program would expect something like [/]a/b/..., that's no longer the case. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 16:54:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 16:54:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23634 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 16:54:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23630 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 16:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 16:54:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C4CC199BF; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:54:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 263E6199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 03:53:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2b3984adccde890b1005e0b57e28cc01@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:53:00 +0200 That's important since I may have names like 'a b' and 'a_b', both legal, and your translation would get into throuble here. > Hello, > >>You can't do that becaause if a file contains a genuine >>underscore, the outgoing software will think it's a space. > the outgoing software will also think it's a underscaore. > Is this important? > Some OSs already map 'Windows' to 'WINDOWS'. > > Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:20:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:20:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24389 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:20:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24385 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:20:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:20:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CD5E199EE; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:20:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6FAEB199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:19:27 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] upas/token From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704081927.6FAEB199A3@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:19:12 0100 Thanks for the explanation. The example rejection message in /sys/src/cmd/upas/filterkit/pipeto.sample shows clearly what upas/token is useful for. I was going to suggest that mail(1) should contain a pointer to this sample file, but I see it already does. I should have RTFM more carefully. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:23:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:23:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24476 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:23:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24472 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:23:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:23:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DDD1D199ED; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B19F619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:22:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <739b151ea8420796e25d235fb6af992e@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 09:22:51 +0100 >>: should be the character in the name, the quoting approach seems >>: the only one that works properly, and we have some work to do >>: to work out all the interactions with shell scanning (oh dear!), and changing >>But it's not just the shell, almost *any* program reading file names would >>have to deal with quoting. What has been a file name is changing after %q, you stopped the quote just a little early: to work out all the interactions with shell scanning (oh dear!), and changing -> (i suspect) the input conventions of quite a few commands, but still, it's a finite task. but i ought to have said `the input [and output] conventions ...' it would be good to have some simple but consistent conventions for quoting data, not particularly file names. it's true that it would probably affect many commands (sort, sed, awk etc) but i think it might be worthwhile. it's something that XML can't do properly for instance. just amazing. all that effort for a revolution, and botched at the start. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:26:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:26:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24597 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:26:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24593 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:26:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:26:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25FE919A06; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:26:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2CBDF19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:25:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <20186626cdc2e02ec791f8123554c309@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] starting to agree with you about blanks Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:25:06 +0200 : I would vote for such a feature. The kernel and 9P would be freed : of filename shackles, the shim would apply the existing rules. : Imagine, for example, a shim that would enable a 2nd Edition : application to access the 4th Edition filesystem. Mapping filenames I see. I have to say it was never my aim to open the door for any other change. It'd be both horrible and a mess to get the kernel translate names. I think the blank stuff is horrible enough. : to continue with the upas/fs example, here's a function that opens a : mailbox and returns a pathname that can be used to access the messages : therein: ... : openmbox("/mail/box/rog/mbox", "My\x00A0Mailbox", buf); I now see how this would break. And agree that by doing it in the servers (in the boundaries as you say) it can be avoided. Do we agree that %q is also breaking this? Or am I mistaken? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:32:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:32:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24736 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:32:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24732 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:32:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:32:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D443B19A06; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:32:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 699D719980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:31:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <20db49d122a1888a341e3b830103d488@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:31:54 +0200 > it would be good to have some simple but consistent conventions for quoting data, > not particularly file names. it's true that it would probably affect many commands > (sort, sed, awk etc) but i think it might be worthwhile. I'd like the file names to be always the same. What I don't like about %q is that some times you get /a/b and other times you get '/a/b c'. This is a serious problem IMHO, since the "'" would make open fail. I'd like read(filename) open(filename) and read(filename) open(dirname + "/" + filename) to keep on working, which is no longer the case after %q. (Didn't check naming in the kernel recently, but I think these calls would fail). Perhaps all this discussion is a symptom that a different convention to name files is needed. For example, if file names were always quoted (need they to be or not), all programs could rely on a simple set of rules to handle file names. Is there agreement on this? Or is something else I'm also missing? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:46:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:46:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25067 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:46:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25063 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:46:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:46:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F4D4199D5; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:46:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B7231998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:45:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Q20W-0004xV-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 09:30:32 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ralph Corderoy Message-ID: <43d6.3d238548.88aca@blake.inputplus.co.uk> Organization: InputPlus Ltd. References: <20020702110848.F30EA19992@mail.cse.psu.edu>, <20020703135427.6DA4919991@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:30:11 GMT > term% rm 'some files' > removes some_files Hark! The scent of DWIM. http://www.tuxedo.org/~esr/jargon/html/entry/DWIM.html Ralph. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 17:47:11 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 17:47:11 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25086 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 17:47:11 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25082 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 17:47:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 17:47:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFAE3199ED; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:47:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B96C19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 04:46:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Q20W-0004xO-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 09:30:32 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207031328.109dede8@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020703105313.A223@next.gli.cas.cz> Subject: Re: [9fans] wavelet compression Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:29:58 GMT > Get the Plan9 APE-ported software (wavelet image compression) from: > ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e/EPWIC-1.tbz > File not found. Don From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 18:23:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 18:23:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25841 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 18:23:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25837 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 18:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 18:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD8CA199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 344EE19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:22:34 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704092234.344EE19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] replica Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:21:37 +0900 Don't laugh me even though I was much delayed to see replica(1). ^_^ Yeah! Replica is very nice interface to maintain and distribute solid trees of Plan 9. Thanks everyone who have worked for it. I have one request here. When I have some local change to a file, replica reports it without telling me what was changed in the replica server. Sometime, I want to know what was changed at Labs, because I have no such solid confidence to myself in many case. ;_; May I ask you to put the changed file of the replica server to my local disk with modifying the name, say such kenji.c to kenji.c.p9bell? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 18:27:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 18:27:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25928 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 18:27:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25924 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 18:27:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 18:27:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 704F7199B3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6108819981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:26:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 11:26:17 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I do a replica/pull -n to see the changes, then I use diff or acme to look at what changed if I'm not willing to pull them without looking first at them. perhaps this may achieve the effect you want. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 11:23:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD8CA199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 344EE19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:22:34 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704092234.344EE19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] replica Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:21:37 +0900 Don't laugh me even though I was much delayed to see replica(1). ^_^ Yeah! Replica is very nice interface to maintain and distribute solid trees of Plan 9. Thanks everyone who have worked for it. I have one request here. When I have some local change to a file, replica reports it without telling me what was changed in the replica server. Sometime, I want to know what was changed at Labs, because I have no such solid confidence to myself in many case. ;_; May I ask you to put the changed file of the replica server to my local disk with modifying the name, say such kenji.c to kenji.c.p9bell? Kenji --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 18:33:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 18:33:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26069 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 18:33:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26065 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 18:33:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 18:33:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 955DA1999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:33:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from otdel-1.org (draculina.otdel-1.org [195.230.89.101]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 002D019988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:32:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: by otdel-1.org (CommuniGate Pro PIPE 4.0b4) with PIPE id 1900130; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 13:32:55 +0400 From: Nikolai SAOUKH <9fans#nms@otdel-1.org> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020704093250.GA3622@otdel1.org> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <8c75ad56989c77def4ecb7b1f7cdb273@caldo.demon.co.uk> <20020704093955.L6107@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020704093955.L6107@cackle.proxima.alt.za> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i X-Mailer: CommuniGate Pro CLI mailer Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:32:50 +0400 On Thu, Jul 04, 2002 at 09:39:56AM +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: | Mapping filenames | to unique 27-character UTF8 strings with certain restrictions should | be possible through such a shim. 27-octet utf8 strings, to be precise. In characters it is much less :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 18:42:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 18:42:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26230 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 18:42:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26226 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 18:42:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 18:42:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A6BC199B7; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:42:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 966341998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:41:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <30a861a9c8a7a63c0e69d46049d70908@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:41:48 +0100 >>Is there agreement on this? Or is something else I'm also missing? not exactly. i think there's an implication though about the uniform implementation of quoting rules throughout the system so that read(filename) open(dirname + "/" + filename) would work because `filename' and `dirname' etc haven't any quotes, because lines read from standard input (say) have been parsed. some programs do so already but the conventions vary from place to place. essentially, strings inside programs are in their parsed form and strings read and written by a program are expected to be suitably quoted. thus ls | mumble would work because mumble will apply the standard rules (might be as simple as calling tokenize consistently) to each line of its input, and thus unquote it to reveal the original file names. i say it's not just file names particularly; for instance, input to a program might be fields when where howmuch why who allowing 15/9/1660 London 4d 'First Cup of Tea' 'Saml Pepys' and with suitable changes comm, sort, etc. could be applied in obvious ways. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 18:51:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 18:51:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26373 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 18:51:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26369 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 18:51:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 18:51:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5E0519980; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:51:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 40B6319988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:50:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <356360bf0b6124fb81bee23d3829d62e@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xqhphclwviplqtkjolhxekojmp" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 11:50:47 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xqhphclwviplqtkjolhxekojmp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So we need an uniform set of conventions, and make all the programs obey them. And that's not the case right now. That's all I was saying regarding %q. thanks --upas-xqhphclwviplqtkjolhxekojmp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 11:42:16 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A6BC199B7; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:42:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 966341998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:41:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <30a861a9c8a7a63c0e69d46049d70908@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:41:48 +0100 >>Is there agreement on this? Or is something else I'm also missing? not exactly. i think there's an implication though about the uniform implementation of quoting rules throughout the system so that read(filename) open(dirname + "/" + filename) would work because `filename' and `dirname' etc haven't any quotes, because lines read from standard input (say) have been parsed. some programs do so already but the conventions vary from place to place. essentially, strings inside programs are in their parsed form and strings read and written by a program are expected to be suitably quoted. thus ls | mumble would work because mumble will apply the standard rules (might be as simple as calling tokenize consistently) to each line of its input, and thus unquote it to reveal the original file names. i say it's not just file names particularly; for instance, input to a program might be fields when where howmuch why who allowing 15/9/1660 London 4d 'First Cup of Tea' 'Saml Pepys' and with suitable changes comm, sort, etc. could be applied in obvious ways. --upas-xqhphclwviplqtkjolhxekojmp-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 19:18:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 19:18:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26881 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 19:18:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26877 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 19:18:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 19:18:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 628FE19991; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:18:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AA93F19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:17:16 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm" Message-Id: <20020704101716.AA93F19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:16:26 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can replica/pull -n see the changes after I updated the changes? I updated too many files in a long time, so I came off the desk, and did other obligations I have for money. If I could have some backup files for locally changed ones, I can check it later, and give enough time to do that... Kenji --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Thu Jul 4 18:26:38 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA19024 for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:15:49 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id SAA17028 for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:27:15 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 704F7199B3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6108819981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:26:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: "Fco.J.Ballesteros" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 11:26:17 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I do a replica/pull -n to see the changes, then I use diff or acme to look at what changed if I'm not willing to pull them without looking first at them. perhaps this may achieve the effect you want. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 11:23:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD8CA199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 344EE19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:22:34 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704092234.344EE19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] replica Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:21:37 +0900 Don't laugh me even though I was much delayed to see replica(1). ^_^ Yeah! Replica is very nice interface to maintain and distribute solid trees of Plan 9. Thanks everyone who have worked for it. I have one request here. When I have some local change to a file, replica reports it without telling me what was changed in the replica server. Sometime, I want to know what was changed at Labs, because I have no such solid confidence to myself in many case. ;_; May I ask you to put the changed file of the replica server to my local disk with modifying the name, say such kenji.c to kenji.c.p9bell? Kenji --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq-- --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 19:21:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 19:21:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26927 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 19:21:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26923 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 19:21:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 19:21:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 865E41999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:21:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B29DC19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:20:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0e9186b1d13902861ddb7ea52055f2de@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pbwxcmrqzyqfknxwnoxixomlkd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:20:50 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pbwxcmrqzyqfknxwnoxixomlkd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think -sn would see them. (you tell it to use the server version to resolve conflicts, but not to update your files). --upas-pbwxcmrqzyqfknxwnoxixomlkd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 12:18:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 628FE19991; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:18:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AA93F19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 06:17:16 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm" Message-Id: <20020704101716.AA93F19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:16:26 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Can replica/pull -n see the changes after I updated the changes? I updated too many files in a long time, so I came off the desk, and did other obligations I have for money. If I could have some backup files for locally changed ones, I can check it later, and give enough time to do that... Kenji --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Thu Jul 4 18:26:38 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA19024 for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:15:49 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id SAA17028 for ; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:27:15 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 704F7199B3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6108819981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:26:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: "Fco.J.Ballesteros" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 11:26:17 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I do a replica/pull -n to see the changes, then I use diff or acme to look at what changed if I'm not willing to pull them without looking first at them. perhaps this may achieve the effect you want. --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 11:23:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD8CA199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 344EE19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 05:22:34 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704092234.344EE19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] replica Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:21:37 +0900 Don't laugh me even though I was much delayed to see replica(1). ^_^ Yeah! Replica is very nice interface to maintain and distribute solid trees of Plan 9. Thanks everyone who have worked for it. I have one request here. When I have some local change to a file, replica reports it without telling me what was changed in the replica server. Sometime, I want to know what was changed at Labs, because I have no such solid confidence to myself in many case. ;_; May I ask you to put the changed file of the replica server to my local disk with modifying the name, say such kenji.c to kenji.c.p9bell? Kenji --upas-ycwfhyryzgqwrmtopfkuuykxpq-- --upas-uxztzvdswqstllqxacnaecqicm-- --upas-pbwxcmrqzyqfknxwnoxixomlkd-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 20:31:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 20:31:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27900 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 20:31:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27896 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 20:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 20:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F8A5199A3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:31:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F14BF1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:30:53 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704113053.F14BF1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:36:41 +0100 > Perhaps all this discussion is a symptom that a different convention to > name files is needed. For example, if file names were always quoted > (need they to be or not), all programs could rely on a simple set of > rules to handle file names. > > Is there agreement on this? Or is something else I'm also missing? i don't think %q per se is a bad thing, but i don't think filenames should require it and hence i don't think tools like ls, pwd, etc should output filenames using it. then we're back to where we started (a comfortable place to be IMHO) except that we have a nice, easily available convention for serialising arguments containing spaces, and we can talk to alien filesystems that expect spaces in their names. rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 20:38:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 20:38:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28007 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 20:38:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28003 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 20:38:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 20:38:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10DD01999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:38:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0A49319980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 07:37:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <08d4634e33d07d36998f3c6f11e99ae1@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:37:19 +0200 : i don't think %q per se is a bad thing, but i don't think filenames : should require it and hence i don't think tools like ls, pwd, etc : should output filenames using it. agree From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 21:21:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 21:21:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28706 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 21:21:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28702 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 21:21:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 21:21:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CA5F19981; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:21:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 530FF19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:20:31 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704122031.530FF19981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:20:54 +0100 >>So we need an uniform set of conventions, and make all the programs >>obey them. And that's not the case right now. That's all I was saying >>regarding %q. yes, but to be fair, i believe that is the `making the effort' (if i remember the phrase correctly) that rob mentioned in a previous message! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 21:27:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 21:27:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28783 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 21:27:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28779 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 21:27:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 21:27:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4331119981; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:27:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1C33219981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:26:36 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hujvhbhzpadxmmkxgicoerjxkh" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 14:26:25 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hujvhbhzpadxmmkxgicoerjxkh Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm sorry if in any of my previous mails I did sound like `Rob did it wrong' or something like that. I didn't mean that at all, and apologize if that was what I actually wrote. I think we all now agree that -> translating in the mount driver is a bad idea. -> translating in the servers might work, but we're not sure. -> %q is a good thing, but, -> ls et al shouldn't use %q (unless other programs change their conventions to read file names and digest the quotes properly). I'm sorry my diff triggered this, but in any case I think we all are trying to find a way, and more discussions like this will probably follow. thanks you all; this has been instructive, at least for me. --upas-hujvhbhzpadxmmkxgicoerjxkh Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 4 14:21:15 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CA5F19981; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:21:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 530FF19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 08:20:31 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704122031.530FF19981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:20:54 +0100 >>So we need an uniform set of conventions, and make all the programs >>obey them. And that's not the case right now. That's all I was saying >>regarding %q. yes, but to be fair, i believe that is the `making the effort' (if i remember the phrase correctly) that rob mentioned in a previous message! --upas-hujvhbhzpadxmmkxgicoerjxkh-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 23:34:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 23:34:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30494 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 23:34:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30490 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:34:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:34:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C96A199B3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:34:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C304C19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:33:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] * most USB audio devices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xdvaxgsmslylrzzoktusequtod" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:33:40 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xdvaxgsmslylrzzoktusequtod Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ditto with XITEL HiFi-Link DG2. I use it to link via Toslink to my receiver. It's like the DG2 but has a slightly heftier LED to drive a 10 meter optical cable that comes with it. --upas-xdvaxgsmslylrzzoktusequtod Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 22:44:21 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Jul 3 22:44:20 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93B3319980; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:44:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9B16B1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:43:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] * most USB audio devices MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 22:43:47 -0400 On Fri Jun 28 09:32:22 EDT 2002, matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > any clues as to which ones have been tested? > > I don't want to find : > the_one_I_get < most < all > > the one's I've found obviously don't trumpet "now works with plan9" on the > box > > Matt I've successfully used the Xitel MD-Port DG2, which is a USB -> TOSLINK device, enabling you to send digital audio to MiniDisc players and other audio equipment with TOSLINK inputs. E.g. it's possible to copy a CD to MiniDisc with % usb/usbaudio % echo audio 100 >/dev/volume % cdfs % cd /mnt/cd % for(a in a???){ cp $a /dev/audio sleep 1 } % --jim --upas-xdvaxgsmslylrzzoktusequtod-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 23:37:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 23:37:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30538 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 23:37:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30534 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:37:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:37:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E706199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:37:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6346B19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:36:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.121.240.81 ([135.121.240.81]) by plan9; Thu Jul 4 10:36:42 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: re: [9fans] blanks in names Message-ID: <877850.1025797302@GOLD> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 15:41:42 -0400 It always will. The only reason spaces arrive in file names is that they are imported from outside. -rob --On Thursday, July 04, 2002 7:47 AM +0100 forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote: >>> otherwise, Plan 9 should prohibit space in its file names, as >>> previously, ... > > i ought to have said `and still', since /sys/src/fs/port/9p2.c still > blocks it. perhaps just as well until it's sorted out! > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 23:41:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 23:41:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30615 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 23:41:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30611 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:41:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:41:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 754EA19995; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:41:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7CAA419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:40:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.121.240.81 ([135.121.240.81]) by plan9; Thu Jul 4 10:40:33 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: re: [9fans] blanks in names Message-ID: <1110399.1025797535@GOLD> In-Reply-To: <1b8fddb88743e230927ca086d93d4df2@caldo.demon.co.uk> References: <1b8fddb88743e230927ca086d93d4df2@caldo.demon.co.uk> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 15:45:35 -0400 I have a simpler solution. If you don't like blanks in file names, prohibit them again. (It's the 'frog' array in /sys/src/9/port/chan.c that determines this.) Servers that give you blanks will get caught (although the failures will often be mysterious). Fix those that do by relabeling as Nemo suggests, although please not with a variant invisible blank. Something visible but rarely used, such as the 0x80 rune. I enabled blanks because they kept appearing, everyone else accepts them, and it seemed a challenge to find a good solution. I still prefer the quoting solution because it leaves the underlying stuff alone, but it's easier to just say no. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 23:49:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 23:49:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30693 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 23:49:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30689 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D68A7199B6; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1375119981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:48:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (213-0-221-216.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.221.216]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA31509 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:48:40 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 213-0-221-216.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.221.216] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D246179.80AAB64F@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 16:53:45 +0200 I may be going mad, but, isn't the space problem already solved? We know that 1 file names may contain spaces, thus ' ' is a legal file name char. 2 spaces are used both as delimiters in command lines and as part of file names. 1 just means that most programs using [^ \n\t]* as a regexp for a file name should just use [^\n\t]* instead. For example, I tried in acme to select "a b" and button-3 on it: nothing happen. Didn't look at the source but probably acme stopped at the blank. 2 means that file formats should consider that ambiguity. The shell, IMHO, is already happy with spaces (to my surprise). I tried with something like: touch x 'a b' a2 files=a* for (f in $files) echo $f script_that_prints_one_arg_per_line $files it all worked fine. Thus the shell is already aware that an already expanded name is just a name, and it doesn't matter if it contains a ' ' (yes, don't laught, I learned this today). The use of lists in rc is a good thing, now I know. So, isn't the answer just that 1. all programs must consider ' ' as a valid char while scanning for names (like the shell already seems to do). 2. [file] formats must be chosen so that they are not ambiguous if file names contained on them contain blanks. 3. programs not outputing commands don't need to quote the printed names 4. programs outputing commands need to quote the printed names. All this would require is just Rob's %q and a shell q command to do things like touch x 'a b' a2 files=a* for (f in $files) echo cp `{q $f} /other/place/`{q $f} [ But note that this other line works without requiring quoting: for (f in $files) cp $f /other/place/$f ] In case this solves the problem, we would only have to search for programs that don't handle ' ' within file names and fix them; then remove quoting from the output of programs that do not output commands; then add quoting to the output of programs that output commands. What do you say? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 4 23:52:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 4 23:52:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30748 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Jul 2002 23:52:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30744 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:52:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:52:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4AB2719988; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:52:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BAA6B19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:51:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (213-0-221-216.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.221.216]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id QAA31569 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:51:47 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 213-0-221-216.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.221.216] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D246235.40CCB6E9@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in names References: <1b8fddb88743e230927ca086d93d4df2@caldo.demon.co.uk> <1110399.1025797535@GOLD> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 16:56:53 +0200 "rob pike, esq." ha escrito: > I enabled blanks because they kept appearing, everyone else accepts > them, and it seemed a challenge to find a good solution. I still > prefer the quoting solution because it leaves the underlying stuff > alone, but it's easier to just say no. > > -rob Before you enabled them, I just said no. Now that I have been able to use external names, I wouldn't want to go back. I think you did a very good thing just by considering the problem and trying to solve it; please, don't look back :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 01:42:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 01:42:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31828 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 01:42:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31824 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 01:42:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 01:42:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 256C6199A3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:42:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from presto.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8041219988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:41:28 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: re: [9fans] blanks in names From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020704164128.8041219988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 17:47:18 +0100 > Fix those that do by relabeling as Nemo suggests, although please not > with a variant invisible blank. Something visible but rarely used, > such as the 0x80 rune. try typing it... :-) i agree that it should be visible; but i also think it should be visually distinguishable as a "spacer" character (i.e. not a peter face) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 01:42:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 01:42:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31839 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 01:42:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31835 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 01:42:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 01:42:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E137A199BB; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FB6419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:41:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Q9Gt-0000Iq-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 17:15:55 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Martin Faxer Message-ID: <4488d66c.0207040759.5e2cd9df@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] rtl8139 troubles and 2 questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:15:28 GMT hi. i'm trying to set up plan 9 on my computer, however i can't seem to get ethernet running. first i tried using an rtl8029 pci card, but it wouldn't show up at all, then i exchanged it for an rtl8139 card which at least shows up (with ether0=type=rtl8139), but i can't seem to get it working. 9load seems to probe it, and when i boot i get a line saying: "ether#0: rtl8139: port 0xE400 irq 11: 00C12602EA37" however, once rio starts up, if i cat /dev/*alloc it's not there, and i've got no entries in /net. bind -b '#l0' /net tells me: "no free devices" i have disabled everything that's not needed in the bios (usb, parallel port, serial ports, etc.) and the network card has got its own irq (ie. not shared with anything else.) if anybody has any ideas on how to fix this, i would be very grateful to hear them! a different question: is it possible to change the keymap? if so, how do i do it? and one more: if i run "mk && mk install" in /sys/src/boot/pc and then copy 9load to /n/9fat to replace my current one, it never wants to boot. i just get "PBS..." and then it hangs, even after things like only adding a print(). i suppose there's something i have to do that i'm missing... if anybody could help me out with this also, i'd be very grateful. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 02:02:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 02:02:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32006 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 02:02:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32002 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 02:02:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 02:02:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82AD2199A3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:02:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D4A919988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:01:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es ([217.124.44.132]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA03014 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:01:50 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host [217.124.44.132] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D2480B0.C7DF176B@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in names References: <20020704164128.8041219988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 19:06:56 +0200 If that's what we end up doing there is a "visible space" rune. Although, this afternoon I'm more in the mood of not eating worms and try to get the blank handled (still waiting for answers to my last post :-) ). rog@vitanuova.com ha escrito: > > > Fix those that do by relabeling as Nemo suggests, although please not > > with a variant invisible blank. Something visible but rarely used, > > such as the 0x80 rune. > > try typing it... :-) > > i agree that it should be visible; but i also think it should be > visually distinguishable as a "spacer" character (i.e. not a peter face) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 02:44:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 02:44:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 32420 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 02:44:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32416 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 02:44:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 02:44:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DBAF199A3; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:44:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1A3CB19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:43:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <63192ab47b5f7d2e0e411a5ac17f5c97@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rtl8139 troubles and 2 questions From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xznsrgbthykjrfpgvbbfxmxokn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:43:40 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xznsrgbthykjrfpgvbbfxmxokn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ether8139 possibly (probably) isn't configured in /sys/src/9/pc/^(pc pcdisk). --upas-xznsrgbthykjrfpgvbbfxmxokn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1025800953:10:09051:52; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 16:42:33 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1121191; 4 Jul 2002 16:42 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E137A199BB; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FB6419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 12:41:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Q9Gt-0000Iq-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 17:15:55 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <4488d66c.0207040759.5e2cd9df@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] rtl8139 troubles and 2 questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:15:28 GMT hi. i'm trying to set up plan 9 on my computer, however i can't seem to get ethernet running. first i tried using an rtl8029 pci card, but it wouldn't show up at all, then i exchanged it for an rtl8139 card which at least shows up (with ether0=type=rtl8139), but i can't seem to get it working. 9load seems to probe it, and when i boot i get a line saying: "ether#0: rtl8139: port 0xE400 irq 11: 00C12602EA37" however, once rio starts up, if i cat /dev/*alloc it's not there, and i've got no entries in /net. bind -b '#l0' /net tells me: "no free devices" i have disabled everything that's not needed in the bios (usb, parallel port, serial ports, etc.) and the network card has got its own irq (ie. not shared with anything else.) if anybody has any ideas on how to fix this, i would be very grateful to hear them! a different question: is it possible to change the keymap? if so, how do i do it? and one more: if i run "mk && mk install" in /sys/src/boot/pc and then copy 9load to /n/9fat to replace my current one, it never wants to boot. i just get "PBS..." and then it hangs, even after things like only adding a print(). i suppose there's something i have to do that i'm missing... if anybody could help me out with this also, i'd be very grateful. --upas-xznsrgbthykjrfpgvbbfxmxokn-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 04:37:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 04:37:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 756 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 04:37:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 752 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 04:37:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 04:37:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA74C1998C; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 15:37:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC04019988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 15:36:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-23-28.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.23.28]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id VAA06635 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 21:36:13 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-23-28.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.23.28] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D24A4E0.9D93DA49@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rtl8139 troubles and 2 questions References: <63192ab47b5f7d2e0e411a5ac17f5c97@caldo.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 21:41:20 +0200 You can change the keymap but not in the distributed keyboard driver. After you install your system, you can extract an alternate keyboard driver (including manual pages) from http://plan9.escet.urjc.es/export/kbd.tgz (I think it's kbd.tgz, but there's a link at http://plan9.escet.urjc.es in case it's not). Look at the extracted plan9.ini(8) to see how to select your default kbd map. If you have problems, let me know and I'll try to help. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 05:46:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 05:46:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1222 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 05:46:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1218 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 05:46:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 05:46:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E47E1999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:46:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83F261998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:45:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GYQ00LRNSBYN9@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Jul 2002 16:45:34 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <03c601c2239c$a7a0d180$64602e44@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <63192ab47b5f7d2e0e411a5ac17f5c97@caldo.demon.co.uk> <3D24A4E0.9D93DA49@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Subject: [9fans] WD hard disk not available in partdisk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 16:52:04 -0400 I tried to install 4th Edition on an old Western Digital AC2340 340 MB hard drive. The hard drive is recognized by the BIOS and works with DOS and Win95, but it does not appear in "partdisk" during the Plan 9 install. I also tried an old Seagate ST3243A 214 MB hard drive and "partdisk" recognizes it fine. I tried all master/slave combinations of the AC2340 and ST3243A, and in every case only the ST3243A is available in "partdisk". Here are snippets of what I get with the ST3243A as primary master and the AC2340 as primary slave. In every case the AC2340 appears to be recognized early in the boot process, but it is never available in "partdisk": ---- dev A0 port 1F0 config 045A capabilities 0000 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm 8 dev B0 port 1F0 config 427A capabilities 0100 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm 16 dev A0 port 170 config 8580 capabilities 0B00 mwdma 0003 dma 00000000 rwm 0 ---- The following disk devices were found. sdC0 - ST3243A * p1 0 1023 (1023 cylinders, 203.80 MB) FATHUGE empty 1023 1024 (1 cylinders, 204.00 KB) sdD0 - NEC CD-ROM DRIVE: 2523.18 ---- This system has an old Intel Plato (aka Premier/PCI II) motherboard (Pentium 90 w/ 430NX chipset). I also tried a 3rd Edition 9disk.9fd and had the same problem. Am I doing something dumb or is this a bug/feature? :-) John From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 07:30:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 07:30:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2025 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 07:30:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2021 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 07:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 07:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83B2B1998C; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:30:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D726119980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:29:38 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in names References: <20020704164128.8041219988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-Id: <20020704222938.D726119980@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 07:29:22 +0900 >i agree that it should be visible; but i also think it should be >visually distinguishable as a "spacer" character (i.e. not a peter >face) How about x7f ? However these discussions are meaningless if we quote file name whenever spaces are contained, Genuine space code is best for internal code. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 08:30:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 08:30:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2506 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 08:30:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2502 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 08:30:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 08:30:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBD501998C; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:30:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 98F4419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:29:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <163def7f5ee028605e6ccee38bc7c57f@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:29:15 -0700 > In case this solves the problem, we would only have to search for > programs that don't handle ' ' within file names and fix them; then > remove quoting from the output of programs that do not output > commands; then add quoting to the output of programs that output > commands. But this assumes that programs know when they are and aren't manipulating file names, which is not true in general (see Software Tools for a fuller exposition of this philosophy). sort and awk don't know if field 4 is a file name or not. Plus, as Charles observed, one might want to quote fields other than file names that contain blanks. In some ways, it seems that adopting a non-space delimiter might be the least painful of the alternatives to deal with file formats. While I'm here, this is the script I use to print hex values and glyphs (if we have any) of characters listed in /lib/unicode: #!/bin/rc # uniquery pattern... - print hex & glyph of any chars matching pattern # in /lib/unicode sts='' for (pat) { hexes = `{grep $pat /lib/unicode | column 1} if (~ $#hexes 0) { echo $0: no such unicode chars: $pat >[1=2] sts='no such chars' } if not for (hex in $hexes) unicode $hex-$hex } exit $sts You can replace "column 1" with "awk '{print $1}'". This is column: #!/bin/rc # column [-F sep] [n...]] - print n'th column(s) rfork e switch ($1) { case -F sep=-F^$2; shift 2 case -F?* sep=-F^`{echo $1 | sed 's/^-F//'}; shift } switch ($#*) { case 0 * = 1 case * if (! ~ $1 [0-9] [0-9][0-9] [0-9][0-9][0-9]) { echo usage: $0 '[-F sep] [n...]' >[1=2] exit usage } } arglist=`{echo $* | sed -e 's/[0-9]+/$&,/g' -e 's/,$//'} exec awk $sep '{print '^$"arglist^'}' Here's a sample use of uniquery: : cpu; uniquery space 0008 0020 00a0   2002   2003   2004   2005   2006   2007   2008   2009   200a   200b ​ 2408 ␈ 2420 ␠ 3000   303f 〿 feff  From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 08:32:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 08:32:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2545 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 08:32:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2541 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 08:32:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 08:32:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4EEDA19980; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:32:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (www.monitorbm.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8DF5F1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:31:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11638 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2002 23:31:25 -0000 Received: from mercury.mbmnz.co.nz (HELO MERCURY) (192.168.0.63) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 4 Jul 2002 23:31:25 -0000 From: "Andrew Simmons" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <3D258491.17320.32575B@localhost> Priority: normal In-reply-to: <20020703160003.27491.58783.Mailman@psuvax1.cse.psu.edu> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:35:45 +1200 > Change space! Change the file delimiter! > The shell will never recover. The system will break. > I will mourn. Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 08:40:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 08:40:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2652 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 08:40:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2648 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 08:40:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 08:40:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28F2D1999B; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:40:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BF9D19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:39:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g64Mgcl11377 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:42:38 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: <3D258491.17320.32575B@localhost> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:42:38 -0400 (EDT) Yeah, 5, 7, 5, iirc. Sam On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Andrew Simmons wrote: > > Change space! Change the file delimiter! > > The shell will never recover. The system will break. > > I will mourn. > > Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 08:42:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 08:42:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2685 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 08:42:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2681 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 08:42:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 08:42:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 651BB199B7; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:42:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E8FE19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:41:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g64Mi8l11385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:44:08 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 18:44:08 -0400 (EDT) Unless that was an attempt at levity, in which case I've just been caught responding to a thread I haven't been following. heh, sam On Thu, 4 Jul 2002, Sam wrote: > Yeah, 5, 7, 5, iirc. > > Sam > > On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, Andrew Simmons wrote: > > > > Change space! Change the file delimiter! > > > The shell will never recover. The system will break. > > > I will mourn. > > > > Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 10:23:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 10:23:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5639 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 10:23:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5635 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 10:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 10:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D838919992; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 21:23:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E5F6F19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 21:22:44 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020705012244.E5F6F19988@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 10:21:56 +0900 古池や蛙飛び込む水の音 furu ike ya kawazu tobikomu mizuno oto Hmmm, it seems to be too long than 17 characters. :-) Sorry ;_; Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 11:25:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 11:25:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7557 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 11:25:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7553 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 11:25:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 11:25:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E4CE199B7; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 22:25:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9F8341998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 22:24:31 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rtl8139 troubles and 2 questions From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020705022431.9F8341998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:23:42 +0900 I must say something here. I reported a problem of rtl8139 and Realtek 8100BL chip for release 3 Plan 9. However, it was proved that I used older version of ether8139.c driver, and am now using its most recent driver and has no problem. I'm now using AOpen's mother, AX4B Pro-533 with onboard Realtex 8100BL LAN chip (8139 actually) and Pen 4 1.6GHz for our Auth/CPU server. I have no problem so far. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 16:53:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 16:53:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17472 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 16:53:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17468 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 16:53:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 16:53:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E699199A3; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 03:53:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2E54B19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 03:52:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <887f8d1b34047ae49b20087db9b2f055@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-azfqrbkyukrzspnsjekytvgddo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 09:52:24 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-azfqrbkyukrzspnsjekytvgddo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit : > In case this solves the problem, we would only have to search for : > programs that don't handle ' ' within file names and fix them; then : > remove quoting from the output of programs that do not output : > commands; then add quoting to the output of programs that output : > commands. : : But this assumes that programs know when they are and aren't : manipulating file names, which is not true in general (see Software My argument doesn't imply that all programs know when they are handling file names... : Tools for a fuller exposition of this philosophy). sort and awk don't : know if field 4 is a file name or not. Plus, as Charles observed, one : might want to quote fields other than file names that contain blanks. ... because in cases like this, I'd say you have to use a sensible file format so that sort and awk could be used later on it. Only programs that know that are producing command lines (which include file names) would need to quote their output file names. Agreement on this? : In some ways, it seems that adopting a non-space delimiter might be : the least painful of the alternatives to deal with file formats. Exactly, as I said in my previous mail, if space is causing a problem within your file format, we could say just that it's not a good file format and it should be changed (If you want quoting you can still include that as part of your format, independently of file names). Any other problem with this approach? --upas-azfqrbkyukrzspnsjekytvgddo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Jul 5 01:30:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBD501998C; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:30:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 98F4419988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Jul 2002 19:29:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <163def7f5ee028605e6ccee38bc7c57f@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 16:29:15 -0700 > In case this solves the problem, we would only have to search for > programs that don't handle ' ' within file names and fix them; then > remove quoting from the output of programs that do not output > commands; then add quoting to the output of programs that output > commands. But this assumes that programs know when they are and aren't manipulating file names, which is not true in general (see Software Tools for a fuller exposition of this philosophy). sort and awk don't know if field 4 is a file name or not. Plus, as Charles observed, one might want to quote fields other than file names that contain blanks. In some ways, it seems that adopting a non-space delimiter might be the least painful of the alternatives to deal with file formats. While I'm here, this is the script I use to print hex values and glyphs (if we have any) of characters listed in /lib/unicode: #!/bin/rc # uniquery pattern... - print hex & glyph of any chars matching pattern # in /lib/unicode sts='' for (pat) { hexes = `{grep $pat /lib/unicode | column 1} if (~ $#hexes 0) { echo $0: no such unicode chars: $pat >[1=2] sts='no such chars' } if not for (hex in $hexes) unicode $hex-$hex } exit $sts You can replace "column 1" with "awk '{print $1}'". This is column: #!/bin/rc # column [-F sep] [n...]] - print n'th column(s) rfork e switch ($1) { case -F sep=-F^$2; shift 2 case -F?* sep=-F^`{echo $1 | sed 's/^-F//'}; shift } switch ($#*) { case 0 * = 1 case * if (! ~ $1 [0-9] [0-9][0-9] [0-9][0-9][0-9]) { echo usage: $0 '[-F sep] [n...]' >[1=2] exit usage } } arglist=`{echo $* | sed -e 's/[0-9]+/$&,/g' -e 's/,$//'} exec awk $sep '{print '^$"arglist^'}' Here's a sample use of uniquery: : cpu; uniquery space 0008 0020 00a0   2002   2003   2004   2005   2006   2007   2008   2009   200a   200b ​ 2408 ␈ 2420 ␠ 3000   303f 〿 feff  --upas-azfqrbkyukrzspnsjekytvgddo-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 17:15:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 17:15:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18209 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 17:15:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18205 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 17:15:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 17:15:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9838199B6; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 04:15:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BED1919992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 04:14:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 10:14:08 +0200 : > In case this solves the problem, we would only have to search for : > programs that don't handle ' ' within file names and fix them; then : > remove quoting from the output of programs that do not output : > commands; then add quoting to the output of programs that output : > commands. : : But this assumes that programs know when they are and aren't : manipulating file names, which is not true in general (see Software I think I misunderstood your comment. I'm not talking about letting programs recognize that ' ' is part of a field in a file (again, if your file format contains file names, it should probably be defined so that's not a problem). I'm talking about programs assuming that something is a file name and not considering ' ' as part of the name. For example, the regexps for file names in your lib/plumbing that do not include ' ' as a valid char, and similar pieces within C programs. PS: Sorry about attaching the post twice in my last mail, forgot to delete the Include line. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 18:03:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 18:03:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19128 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 18:03:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19124 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 18:03:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 18:03:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1E7D199A3; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:03:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E763019992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:02:47 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? References: Message-Id: <20020705090247.E763019992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 18:02:42 +0900 Hello, I am surprised. (or my shame?) # # Plan9 3ed # cpu% cat >'''' alice cpu% ls -l --rw-rw-r-- M 49654 arisawa arisawa 6 Jul 5 17:54 ' ... cpu% cat '''' alice cpu% # # Plan9 4ed # term% cat>'''' bob term% ls -l --rw-rw-rw- M 8 arisawa arisawa 4 Jul 5 17:59 '''' ... term% cat '''' bob term% Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 18:24:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 18:24:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19510 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 18:24:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19506 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 18:24:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 18:24:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BBDB199A3; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:24:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EFA2D1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:22:59 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks already handled properly? From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020705092259.EFA2D1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 18:22:06 +0900 ># ># Plan9 3ed ># >cpu% cat >'''' >alice >cpu% ls -l >--rw-rw-r-- M 49654 arisawa arisawa 6 Jul 5 17:54 ' I don't see this. My result is same as release 4. I don't know why though... Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 18:26:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 18:26:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19562 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 18:26:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19558 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 18:26:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 18:26:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C243199BB; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:26:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail3.freesurf.fr (bastille.freesurf.fr [212.43.206.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BCEA199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:25:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 335400 (du-207-107.nat.dialup.freesurf.fr [212.43.207.107]) by mail3.freesurf.fr (Postfix) with SMTP id AF64519023 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:25:40 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <001601c22406$cee0adf0$0100a8c0@335400> From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Subject: [9fans] Collecting POP3 while in travell Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:31:50 +0200 Imagine I need to grap messages from an external POP3 account : upas/fs -f /pop/mypopserver.com But now, what if the link is a dialup and I want to keep messages after disconnecting / rebooting ? Better, would it be possible to append those downloaded messages to /mail/box/$user/mbox ? If so, another question is how to get only new messages since the -f option leave a copy of any message on the remote server. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 18:29:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 18:29:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19618 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 18:29:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19614 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 18:29:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 18:29:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE334199DD; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:29:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD17919988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:28:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17QP5K-0007gF-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Jul 2002 10:09:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Maarit Maliniemi Message-ID: Organization: Telia Internet References: <3ba2a45af5c572e7280e465acb3a805a@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] dumb question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 09:07:52 GMT In article <3ba2a45af5c572e7280e465acb3a805a@plan9.bell-labs.com>, 9fans@cse.psu.edu wrote: > > Perhaps someone could explain why cp doesn't work recursively (without > > an option) when given a directory as a first argument. > > Because running cp that way would probably happen more often by mistake > than by intention, and it could damage a lot of files very fast before the > user noticed. > > -rob since the subject of damage has been raised i would like to mention that i have managed to damage tar files by using 'tar cf tarfile afile' (the intention was 'tar xf tarfile afile'). tar would be less dangerous if split into two. see inferno. i have also damaged whole file trees by doing 'tar cf adir - | {cd /missspelled/dir; tar xf -}' IMHO, it is less dangerous using 'cp -R'. bengt From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 18:45:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 18:45:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19875 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 18:45:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19871 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 18:45:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 18:45:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BB07199B7; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:45:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EF01D19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 05:44:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7e4c861d0e6e737cdef79daa6ba6f4a2@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dumb question From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 02:43:55 -0700 > i have also damaged whole file trees by doing > 'tar cf adir - | {cd /missspelled/dir; tar xf -}' I did too, a long time ago, and the lesson I drew is: you shouldn't use "cd directory; tar", you should write cd directory && tar . In shell scripts, the shell will generally exit if cd fails, but obviously interactive shells don't. On Plan 9 at least, you can avoid destroying the archive (at least by confusing "c" and "x") by not using the "f" key letter and letting tar read standard input and write standard output, thus: tar c >tarfile afile tar x " mixed up, which seems less likely. If it's that much of a problem, protect your archives ("chmod a-w tarfile"). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 5 22:27:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 5 22:27:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22522 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Jul 2002 22:27:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22518 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 22:27:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 22:27:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFEF21999B; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 09:27:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 526F21998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 09:26:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA28749 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:26:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g65DQOe08169; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:26:25 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g65DQMK13492 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:26:22 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207051326.g65DQMK13492@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Collecting POP3 while in travell In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 05 Jul 2002 11:31:50 +0200." <001601c22406$cee0adf0$0100a8c0@335400> References: <001601c22406$cee0adf0$0100a8c0@335400> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 15:26:22 +0200 I am trying to set something up for what you describe (external POP3 account, dialup access -- have this at home). I wrote some shell scripts to grab the messages; this seems to work. (for each message in /mail/fs served by upas/fs, get unixheader and raw) I think it is possible to remove the grabbed messages, either by deleting the message directory, or via commands to /mail/fs/ctl; I have not yet tried either of these. If there is a better way to do this I'm interested in hearing it. Axel. > Imagine I need to grap messages from an external POP3 account : > upas/fs -f /pop/mypopserver.com > > But now, what if the link is a dialup and I want to keep messages after > disconnecting / rebooting ? > > Better, would it be possible to append those downloaded messages to > /mail/box/$user/mbox ? > If so, another question is how to get only new messages since the > -f option leave a copy of any message on the remote server. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 00:21:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 00:21:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23711 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 00:21:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23707 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 00:21:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 00:21:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8DC061999B; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:21:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9287B19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:20:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] WD hard disk not available in partdisk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 11:20:21 -0400 A dumb bug, I fear, introduced between the 2nd and 3rd Edition, but I'd like confirmation from another party. I believe the code around line 590 of sdata.c has the 'current' and 'logical' sectors swapped and should be if(drive->info[Ivalid] & 0x0001){ drive->c = drive->info[Iccyl]; drive->h = drive->info[Ichead]; drive->s = drive->info[Icsec]; } else{ drive->c = drive->info[Ilcyl]; drive->h = drive->info[Ilhead]; drive->s = drive->info[Ilsec]; } Your old drive does not have LBA mode so this assignment becomes important. What puzzles me is that this hasn't caused problems before, as it can lead to division by zero later on. This applies to both the kernel and 9load. In the later ATA/ATAPI 'standards' all this was finessed away by stating that all drives will support LBA mode. I've tested this on a WD AC2120 (125MB, my disc is smaller than your disc). --jim On Thu Jul 4 16:46:16 EDT 2002, nu3e@arrl.net wrote: > I tried to install 4th Edition on an old Western Digital AC2340 340 MB hard > drive. The hard drive is recognized by the BIOS and works with DOS and > Win95, but it does not appear in "partdisk" during the Plan 9 install. I > also tried an old Seagate ST3243A 214 MB hard drive and "partdisk" > recognizes it fine. I tried all master/slave combinations of the AC2340 and > ST3243A, and in every case only the ST3243A is available in "partdisk". > > Here are snippets of what I get with the ST3243A as primary master and the > AC2340 as primary slave. In every case the AC2340 appears to be recognized > early in the boot process, but it is never available in "partdisk": > ---- > dev A0 port 1F0 config 045A capabilities 0000 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm > 8 > dev B0 port 1F0 config 427A capabilities 0100 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm > 16 > dev A0 port 170 config 8580 capabilities 0B00 mwdma 0003 dma 00000000 rwm > 0 > ---- > The following disk devices were found. > > sdC0 - ST3243A > * p1 0 1023 (1023 cylinders, 203.80 MB) FATHUGE > empty 1023 1024 (1 cylinders, 204.00 KB) > > sdD0 - NEC CD-ROM DRIVE: 2523.18 > ---- > This system has an old Intel Plato (aka Premier/PCI II) motherboard (Pentium > 90 w/ 430NX chipset). > > I also tried a 3rd Edition 9disk.9fd and had the same problem. > > Am I doing something dumb or is this a bug/feature? :-) > > John From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 03:24:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 03:24:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24975 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 03:24:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24971 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 03:24:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 03:24:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A78EF1999B; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:24:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AF1DD1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:23:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5b9aa2eb77aa5cfa895dcc73136b084e@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:23:19 -0400 >> Change space! Change the file delimiter! >> The shell will never recover. The system will break. >> I will mourn. > > Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? Some would dispute the imposition of such an absolute rule. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 03:27:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 03:27:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25011 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 03:27:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25007 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 03:27:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 03:27:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3702199B6; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:27:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 31D1C19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <666300b17e28c57d7c9f6aa88b890b7a@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Sape Mullender MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:26:09 -0400 >>> Change space! Change the file delimiter! >>> The shell will never recover. The system will break. >>> I will mourn. >> >> Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? > > Some would dispute the imposition of such an absolute rule. Is that why your message has only 16 syllables? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 04:22:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 04:22:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25343 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 04:22:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25339 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 04:22:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 04:22:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFA2E199A3; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:22:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 22EF919992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:21:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:21:16 -0400 >>>> Change space! Change the file delimiter! >>>> The shell will never recover. The system will break. >>>> I will mourn. >>> >>> Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? >> >> Some would dispute the imposition of such an absolute rule. > > Is that why your message has only 16 syllables? Word. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 04:49:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 04:49:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25482 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 04:49:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25478 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 04:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 04:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34093199B3; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:49:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from einstein.ssz.com (unknown [207.200.56.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1290B19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:48:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ravage@localhost) by einstein.ssz.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA12689 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:52:41 -0500 From: Jim Choate To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 14:52:39 -0500 (CDT) On Fri, 5 Jul 2002, David Gordon Hogan wrote: > >>>> Change space! Change the file delimiter! > >>>> The shell will never recover. The system will break. > >>>> I will mourn. > >>> > >>> Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? > >> > >> Some would dispute the imposition of such an absolute rule. > > > > Is that why your message has only 16 syllables? > > Word. Actually only one style of Hiaku uses 17 'syllables' in Japanese. Not the same thing as English 'syllables'. For an excellent discussion on this point, and how to compensate for it... The Haiku Handbook: How to write, share, and teach Haiku W.J. Higginson, P. Harter ISBN 4-7700-1430-9 $13 US Enjoy! -- ____________________________________________________________________ When I die, I would like to be born again as me. Hugh Hefner ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com jchoate@open-forge.org www.open-forge.org -------------------------------------------------------------------- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 04:58:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 04:58:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25546 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 04:58:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25542 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 04:58:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 04:58:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6283199B7; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:58:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from web11404.mail.yahoo.com (web11404.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.131.234]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8CA3B19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:57:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <20020705195706.13627.qmail@web11404.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [130.33.8.37] by web11404.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Jul 2002 12:57:06 PDT From: John DeGood Subject: Re: [9fans] WD hard disk not available in partdisk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: nu3e@arrl.net List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 12:57:06 -0700 (PDT) Based on reading the ATA-1 and ATA-2 specs (http://www.t13.org/project/d0791r4c.pdf and http://www.t13.org/project/d0948r4c.pdf) I agree that the if statement clauses in sdata.c appear to be reversed. FWIW, the ATA-6 draft (http://www.t13.org/project/d1410r3a.pdf) declares: ---- 8.15.26 Word 53: Field validity Bit 0 of word 53 is obsolete. ... 8.15.27 Word (58:54): Obsolete ---- Does this suggest that this code in sdata.c may cause problems in the future if it continues to always assume that the content of bit 0 of word 53 is valid? > I've tested this on a WD AC2120 (125MB, my disc is smaller than your disc). I'd try my ST225 (21.4 MB), but I don't think its controller is supported. :-) John --- jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > A dumb bug, I fear, introduced between the 2nd and 3rd Edition, but I'd like > confirmation from another party. I believe the code around line 590 of > sdata.c > has the 'current' and 'logical' sectors swapped and should be > > if(drive->info[Ivalid] & 0x0001){ > drive->c = drive->info[Iccyl]; > drive->h = drive->info[Ichead]; > drive->s = drive->info[Icsec]; > } > else{ > drive->c = drive->info[Ilcyl]; > drive->h = drive->info[Ilhead]; > drive->s = drive->info[Ilsec]; > } > > Your old drive does not have LBA mode so this assignment becomes important. > What puzzles me is that this hasn't caused problems before, as it can lead to > division by zero later on. This applies to both the kernel and 9load. > > In the later ATA/ATAPI 'standards' all this was finessed away by stating that > all drives will support LBA mode. > > I've tested this on a WD AC2120 (125MB, my disc is smaller than your disc). > > --jim > > > On Thu Jul 4 16:46:16 EDT 2002, nu3e@arrl.net wrote: > > I tried to install 4th Edition on an old Western Digital AC2340 340 MB hard > > drive. The hard drive is recognized by the BIOS and works with DOS and > > Win95, but it does not appear in "partdisk" during the Plan 9 install. I > > also tried an old Seagate ST3243A 214 MB hard drive and "partdisk" > > recognizes it fine. I tried all master/slave combinations of the AC2340 > and > > ST3243A, and in every case only the ST3243A is available in "partdisk". > > > > Here are snippets of what I get with the ST3243A as primary master and the > > AC2340 as primary slave. In every case the AC2340 appears to be recognized > > early in the boot process, but it is never available in "partdisk": > > ---- > > dev A0 port 1F0 config 045A capabilities 0000 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm > > 8 > > dev B0 port 1F0 config 427A capabilities 0100 mwdma 0000 dma 00000000 rwm > > 16 > > dev A0 port 170 config 8580 capabilities 0B00 mwdma 0003 dma 00000000 rwm > > 0 > > ---- > > The following disk devices were found. > > > > sdC0 - ST3243A > > * p1 0 1023 (1023 cylinders, 203.80 MB) FATHUGE > > empty 1023 1024 (1 cylinders, 204.00 KB) > > > > sdD0 - NEC CD-ROM DRIVE: 2523.18 > > ---- > > This system has an old Intel Plato (aka Premier/PCI II) motherboard > (Pentium > > 90 w/ 430NX chipset). > > > > I also tried a 3rd Edition 9disk.9fd and had the same problem. > > > > Am I doing something dumb or is this a bug/feature? :-) > > > > John > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Sign up for SBC Yahoo! Dial - First Month Free http://sbc.yahoo.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 05:09:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 05:09:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25634 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 05:09:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25630 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 05:09:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 05:09:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95876199B6; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:09:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from dialup01.markit.net (unknown [216.222.227.11]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 90B1F19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:08:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 26526 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2002 20:58:34 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO possum) (192.168.1.8) by dialup01.markit.net with SMTP; 5 Jul 2002 20:58:34 -0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: Mark Bitting To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02070516102502.00328@possum> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: mb3006@mindspring.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:10:25 -0400 On Friday 05 July 2002 15:21, you wrote: > >>>> Change space! Change the file delimiter! > >>>> The shell will never recover. The system will break. > >>>> I will mourn. > >>> > >>> Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? > >> > >> Some would dispute the imposition of such an absolute rule. > > > > Is that why your message has only 16 syllables? > > Word. To write a Haiku of exactly seventeen syllables is diff. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 05:51:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 05:51:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25888 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 05:51:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25884 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 05:51:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 05:51:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C37421999B; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:51:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6CDB81998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 16:50:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g65Jqhl13170 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:52:47 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Haiku maaaaadness! In-Reply-To: <02070516102502.00328@possum> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 15:52:43 -0400 (EDT) > > To write a Haiku > of exactly seventeen syllables > is diff. > Now surely you jest, Writing a decent haiku, is rather easy. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 06:34:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 06:34:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26139 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 06:34:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26135 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 06:34:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 06:34:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E338199B6; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 17:34:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3DF7D19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 17:33:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] WD hard disk not available in partdisk From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 17:33:17 -0400 John DeGood : Based on reading the ATA-1 and ATA-2 specs (http://www.t13.org/project/d0791r4c.pdf and http://www.t13.org/project/d0948r4c.pdf) I agree that the if statement clauses in sdata.c appear to be reversed. FWIW, the ATA-6 draft (http://www.t13.org/project/d1410r3a.pdf) declares: ---- 8.15.26 Word 53: Field validity Bit 0 of word 53 is obsolete. ... 8.15.27 Word (58:54): Obsolete ---- Does this suggest that this code in sdata.c may cause problems in the future if it continues to always assume that the content of bit 0 of word 53 is valid? Most likely this will eventually be a problem. > I've tested this on a WD AC2120 (125MB, my disc is smaller than your disc). I'd try my ST225 (21.4 MB), but I don't think its controller is supported. :-) John My 40MB Conner CP3000 seems to work with the changes too. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 10:31:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 10:31:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28752 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 10:31:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28747 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 10:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 10:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 455FB1999B; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 21:31:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E5B1A19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Jul 2002 21:30:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2652d36646a0af69a95ec20f19388af1@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /sys/src/9/pc/ether83815.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 02:30:43 +0100 the line reading des->bp = allocb(Rbsz); should read des->bp = iallocb(Rbsz); to avoid a panic owing to a rule now being enforced in allocb.c (allocb can't be called in reset functions) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 6 18:01:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 6 18:01:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2086 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Jul 2002 18:01:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2082 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2002 18:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Jul 2002 18:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4519D19992; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 05:01:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz (mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz [210.86.15.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C2F919980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 05:00:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [210.54.206.119] by mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20020706090029.CTKJ26147.mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz@[210.54.206.119]> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 21:00:29 +1200 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Subject: Re: [9fans] Haiku maaaaadness! From: "Andrew Simmons" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020706090029.CTKJ26147.mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz@[210.54.206.119]> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Jul 2002 21:01:49 +1200 Plan 9 is quite nice. Acme, plumbing, pipes, but no Spaces in file names. Spaces in file names, Do I care? I don't think so. I'm off to the pub. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 01:18:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 01:18:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5574 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 01:18:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5570 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 01:18:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 01:18:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F853199B3; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 12:18:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC17319980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 12:17:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (213-0-202-108.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.202.108]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id SAA16795 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 18:17:53 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 213-0-202-108.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [213.0.202.108] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D271964.48FB0D81@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] So, do you space or not? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Jul 2002 18:23:00 +0200 Just to know it, do you want to a) keep things as they are b) remove quoting from ls et al, add it to those that print commands, and fix those that don't cosider ' ' in file names. c) forbid space and rename blanks in servers d) Write poems e) None of the above Should you choose b or c, I may help. PS: Bad answers may discount points from your average. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 02:45:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 02:45:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6476 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 02:45:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6472 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 02:45:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 02:45:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC283199A3; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 13:45:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E63BB19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 13:44:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g66GlZl14343 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 12:47:35 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] So, do you space or not? In-Reply-To: <3D271964.48FB0D81@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 12:47:35 -0400 (EDT) Long winded e-mail follows. I've only just jumped onto this thread and since I didn't want to repeat anything, I googled up the chain that started this (back on may 30th!). I may have missed part of it, so if I'm restating anything or being terribly obvious, forgive me. Here's my 2 cents: I've become familiar with quoted arguments as in my CLIs the following is typical (where val is some value containing spaces). cli> set param 'val' I have a little function that breaks up the line into an argc & argv, similarly as I presume a shell would. Fairly simple, though I don't consider escape sequences or single quotes inside of an arg. I've been debating for some time whether to modify the input read routine such that when read in, cli> set param0 'set param1 \'set param2 \'val\'\'' the args will look like this: arg[0] == "set" arg[1] == "param0" arg[2] == "set param1 'set param2 \'val\''" ... essentially taking the outermost enclosed, escaped single quotes and unescaping them. It would obviously be fairly easy to do, but I've yet to run into a use for it. Also an avenue is unescaping all the quotes, as usual. I presume that option (b) in the replied to e-mail considers "fixing" programs such that if you output shell commands that require args containing spaces, we enclose the arg in quotes. Easy enough with %q. Since ' is a printable character, though, we run into inclusion problems ... right? What happens when we want to name files by ownership (ie: "Bob's file")? Does %q escape all ' inside the string it's enclosing? (online man page for print is still from 3E; no 4E for me just yet) If we're going to try changing these programs for this purpose, why not introduce a new format that outputs the string with spaces escaped? The shell should handle this just fine, right? ie (eg, z): print("%z", "This is a file name"); results in: This\ is\ a\ file\ name There would be caveats with this as well (suppose we want to print "this\ is\ a\ file\ name"), but is no more complex than the proposed ' solution. It just doesn't seem like we've arrived at a decent solution yet. Until we find one, I'm going to have to vote a (or perhaps d, if no one has tomatoes handy). Am I way off? Cheers, Sam On Sat, 6 Jul 2002, FJ Ballesteros wrote: > > Just to know it, do you want to > > a) keep things as they are > b) remove quoting from ls et al, add it to those that print commands, > and > fix those that don't cosider ' ' in file names. > c) forbid space and rename blanks in servers > d) Write poems > e) None of the above > > Should you choose b or c, I may help. > > PS: Bad answers may discount points from your average. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 08:05:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 08:05:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9706 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 08:05:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9702 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 08:05:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 08:05:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1349819992; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 19:05:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 76D911998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 19:04:30 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] So, do you space or not? References: <3D271964.48FB0D81@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Message-Id: <20020706230430.76D911998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 08:04:25 +0900 I prefer to continue discussion along (b) If a new command uq (unquote, and set ifs='\t' (tab)) is offered and default field separator of awk, sort, etc are set to the ifs, then we can do like the bellow: ls -l|uq|awk '{print $10}' Kenji Arisawa >Just to know it, do you want to > >a) keep things as they are >b) remove quoting from ls et al, add it to those that print commands, > and fix those that don't cosider ' ' in file names. >c) forbid space and rename blanks in servers >d) Write poems >e) None of the above From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 08:25:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 08:25:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9899 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 08:25:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9895 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 08:25:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 08:25:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C564C199B3; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 19:25:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 46E4E19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 19:24:28 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] So, do you space or not? References: <3D271964.48FB0D81@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> <20020706230430.76D911998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-Id: <20020706232428.46E4E19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 08:24:24 +0900 >then we can do like the bellow: >ls -l|uq|awk '{print $10}' I should say: then the bellow may work Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 13:00:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 13:00:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13206 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 13:00:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13202 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 13:00:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 13:00:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53B4E199B6; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 00:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.9]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7E5C1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Jul 2002 23:59:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYV00CM31REJX@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 06 Jul 2002 23:59:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6742Ch06066 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 04:02:12 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <1515958.1025710742@GOLD> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207070402.g6742Ch06066@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 00:02:10 -0400 (EDT) How about representing paths internally as connected structures (linked lists, if you will), each of which identifies a particular node. The method of representation of a given node can be quite flexible (allowing node completion - or as I would term it, cannonization - to be done by the kernel), and user programs could establish their own conventions for dealing with user input and user output (which seems logical to me, since the kernel really isn't intended to be a human user interface, only a program "user" interface). Here's an off-the-top-of-my-head example to illustrate what I mean. I'm sure we can come up with a much better system if we all think about this a bit, and figure out how it can be improved (or how it can be replaced with something even better - the purpose of this example is simply to get us thinking in a particular direction that I believe is quite promising): struct node_t { char* name; size_t name_l; /* the node name, and the length of the name */ /* An error should probably be returned by the kernel if hint is ambiguous. */ char* hint; /* a regexp that can be fed to attempt to "autocomplete" */ size_t inode; /* another unique identifier for a node - should we allow it? */ node_t* next_node; }; /* canonize(2) converts a node_t chain into its canonical form, expanding all * hints into the corresponding names. If there are any possible * canonizations and dst is not NULL, dst is filled with node_t chains * representing all the possible canonizations of the node_t chain given. * PARAMETERS * src is the node_t chain that you're attempting to canonize. It's probably * obtained by parsing the input to our shell, and deciding how to interpret * it. * On calling canonize(2), dst should point to a memory block large enough to * accomodate *dst_l node_t structs. canonize(2) will use the memory block to * store all the nodes of all the node_t chains it creates. * On return from canonize(2), dst_l will be changed to the number of node_t * chains representing possible canonizations (i.e., it's a value-result * parameter), and the first dst_l locations in dst will contain the starting * nodes of the node_t chains representing the possible canonizations. * RETURN VALUE * 0 on success * -1 on failure, with errno set appropriately * Multiple matches is counted as an error condition, since canonize(2) failed * to canonize the node_t chain. * If dst is too small, dst will be filled as much as possible, but an error * will still be returned. * NOTES * Having the self-referencing pointer in node_t refer to the previous node * instead of the next node would allow canonize(2) to save lots of buffer * space in dst for ambiguities that occur deep inside a long node_t chain. * However, I don't believe we should do that, since (a) ambiguities that * occur relatively early in a long node_t chain allow canonize(2) to save * lots of buffer space in dst in the current implementation; and more * importantly, (b) any other routine in the kernel that deals with node_t * chains will have to walk the entire linked list before processing anything * if we implement that change, since the pointer it'll see won't be to the * start of the "pathname," but rather to the end. */ int canonize (const node_t* src, node_t dst[], size_t* dst_l); int new_open (const node_t* path, int flags, int mode); /* The old open(2) can instead become open(3), with a rather trivial * implementation: * int open (const char* path, int flags, int mode) { * split path on unescaped '/' chars; * create a node_t for each of the components obtained above; * link the nodes together into a chain; * return openv(our_node_t_chain,flags,mode); * }; */ /* Here's one final example - the reason I resist the name openv(2): */ int new_execve (const node_t* path, char* const argv[], char* const envp[]); /* The "v" here refers to a different aspect of the function. I don't like * overloading the meaning, because we'd have to call our new execve(2) * execvev(2) or something, and that'd be a little insane, IMHO. That's why I * chose the "new_" prefix. * In reality, I'd much rather see the old open(2) be renamed to old_open(2), * and have the new_open(2) be renamed to just plain open(2), damning backward * compatibility (and likewise with the exec(2) family, as well as the stat(2) * call, etc.). Programs that expect open(2) to be the old open and don't feel * like asking their authors for a rewrite can simply use a runtime library to * rename old_open(2) to open(2) and hide our new open(2) entirely (since * they're obviously not going to use it, anyway). However, I'm afraid this * type of drastic change may catch some people off-guard. */ Dave Cohen rob pike, esq. wrote: > > You guys are all arguing about system stuff but it's the > *user interface* that you're really arguing about, and > breaking. You are opening a can of worms you will never > get closed again. Change space! Change the file delimiter! > The shell will never recover. The system will break. > I will mourn. > > -rob > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 14:18:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 14:18:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14203 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 14:18:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14199 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 14:18:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 14:18:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4FED199B7; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 01:18:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4D14119992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 01:17:19 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207070402.g6742Ch06066@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020707051719.4D14119992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 14:17:14 +0900 If '/' is prohibitted as an element of file name and directory name, then no change to open is required. Let's assume we accept '/' as an element of names, then how do you express path in rc? /bin/awk may be : 1. /bin/awk as it has been. 2. a file named "/bin/awk" in current directory. 3. a file named "bin/awk" in "/" 4. a file named "awk" in "/bin" and "/bin" is in current directory. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 14:37:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 14:37:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14465 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 14:37:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14461 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 14:37:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 14:37:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCF05199BC; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 01:37:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 92FAD199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 01:36:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYV00MCW68L52@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 01:36:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g675coR08830 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 05:38:50 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020707051719.4D14119992@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207070538.g675coR08830@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 01:38:49 -0400 (EDT) For userland programs, I'd probably vote to simply escape "interesting" characters that occur within filenames: 1) /bin/awk 2) \/bin\/awk 3) /bin\/awk 4) \/bin/awk We'd still have to annoy sed, awk, sort, etc. with this approach, but I don't think that's too bad. (If we really want, we can establish escape sequences that don't have these chars in them: e.g., \s for slash, \_ for space, etc.) Just my penny pair, Dave Cohen arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > If '/' is prohibitted as an element of file name and directory name, > then no change to open is required. > > Let's assume we accept '/' as an element of names, > then how do you express path in rc? > > /bin/awk may be : > 1. /bin/awk as it has been. > 2. a file named "/bin/awk" in current directory. > 3. a file named "bin/awk" in "/" > 4. a file named "awk" in "/bin" and "/bin" is in current directory. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 15:01:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 15:01:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14781 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 15:01:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14777 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 15:01:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 15:01:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E36EA199BC; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 02:01:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7E314199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 02:00:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <29e804dadceb3ec986adcfb90bd63bd3@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 22:59:57 -0700 I had thought that one of my sicker ideas was too ridiculous to suggest, but perhaps not, given the precedent: A pair of kernel devices (or a single device with an encode or decode indicator) to translate hURL-encoded file names into plan 9 file names, and vice versa. After translation, they are passed to namec. This lets you use all the glorious botches that have been invented for hURL (or is it URI?) encoding. #:dfile://localhost/my%20file and #:dmy%20file would map to "my file". In the presence of a file server that understands the encoded form, one could do the reverse mapping: "#:emy file" should probably map to my%20file A further benefit of using the encoded form of names in files is that programs can then guess fairly reliably which are file names: a field starting with "file://localhost/" is likely to be a file name. I'm not seriously suggesting using awful web syntax, but perhaps the general idea suggests a way forward. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 15:06:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 15:06:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14857 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 15:06:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14853 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 15:06:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 15:06:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E3E4199D5; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 02:06:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 639E6199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 02:05:02 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207070538.g675coR08830@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020707060502.639E6199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 15:04:58 +0900 Another escape may be a % of that is used in URI. % -> %25 / -> %2f space -> %20 and if open can accept these, new_open is not reqired. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 7 16:17:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 7 16:17:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15888 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Jul 2002 16:17:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15884 invoked from network); 7 Jul 2002 16:17:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Jul 2002 16:17:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C5C5199E4; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 03:17:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1F5D1199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 03:16:58 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207070538.g675coR08830@dave2.dave.tj> <20020707060502.639E6199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-Id: <20020707071658.1F5D1199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 16:16:53 +0900 >new_open is not reqired. I should have added: But I prefer new_open for kernel interface. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 01:10:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 01:10:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22468 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 01:10:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22464 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 01:10:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 01:10:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B4D4199BC; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 12:10:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0993F1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 12:09:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYV009OPZL4KU@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 12:10:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g67GBgP18236 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 16:11:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020707060502.639E6199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207071611.g67GBgP18236@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 12:11:41 -0400 (EDT) The idea behind our new open(2) is to create a cleaner representation for paths. If we want, we can patch the old open(2) - which could become a library function open2(3) - to support one or more of the userland naming conventions we were discussing. However, I don't think the kernel should meddle with userland naming conventions; having the kernel deal with binary data in linked lists is by far the cleanest approach proposed thus far, IMHO. It also opens the door to all sorts of neat possibilities for path manipulation without string manipulation. Finally, it gives us the capability of getting away from even the most elementary requirements in a filesystem (like inodes) at some point in the future without extensive code changes. Basically, it's all about flexibility, a long-time strength of the UNIX system which has only been improved upon in Plan 9. - Dave arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > Another escape may be a % of that is used in URI. > > % -> %25 > / -> %2f > space -> %20 > > and if open can accept these, new_open is not reqired. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 01:10:40 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 01:10:40 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22475 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 01:10:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22471 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 01:10:40 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 01:10:40 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C582D199E4; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 12:10:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1EF71998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 12:09:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYV008WUZKKDE@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 12:09:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g67GCNO18279 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 07 Jul 2002 16:12:23 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020707071658.1F5D1199B9@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207071612.g67GCNO18279@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 12:12:22 -0400 (EDT) Oops ... I guess I replied a little too early ;-/ - Dave arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > >new_open is not reqired. > I should have added: > But I prefer new_open for kernel interface. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 05:32:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 05:32:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24071 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 05:32:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24067 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 05:32:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 05:32:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA060199B9; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 16:32:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from rachel.entertainmentmail.net (unknown [193.110.136.20]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 945ED19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 16:31:43 -0400 (EDT) Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/html MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Stormpost-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu 1032031 4 X-List-Unsubscribe: To: "9fans@cse.psu.edu" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: "postmaster@entertainmentmail.net" X-X: )-"TQ,#,R,#,Q X-Mailer: StormPost 1.0 Message-Id: <20020707203143.945ED19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] Joke Of The Day Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "postmaster@entertainmentmail.net" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Jul 2002 19:43:32 UT Joke-A-Day


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From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 09:39:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 09:39:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26760 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 09:39:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26756 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 09:39:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 09:39:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01CEA1999B; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 20:39:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1BB9E1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Jul 2002 20:38:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 13505 invoked by uid 991); 8 Jul 2002 00:38:29 -0000 Message-ID: <20020708003829.13504.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2002 20:38:29 -0400 | If '/' is prohibitted as an element of file name and directory name, | then no change to open is required. | | Let's assume we accept '/' as an element of names, | then how do you express path in rc? cd (stl list/vector foo) I think this discussion is verging on reinventing lisp, where you have a well specified format for textually representing data, standard primatives for reading and writing it, and a set of datatypes to store it in. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 14:16:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 14:16:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4207 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 14:16:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4203 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 14:16:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 14:16:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7294619992; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:16:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 59D8919992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 01:15:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYW00D8DZXXJ1@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 01:15:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g685HiK29334 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 05:17:44 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] Joke Of The Day In-reply-to: <20020707203143.945ED19992@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"postmaster@entertainmentmail.net"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207080517.g685HiK29334@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 01:17:44 -0400 (EDT) Hmm ... now, there's an interesting way to send mass SPAM ... send it to a mailing list. . . - Dave postmaster@entertainmentmail.net wrote: > > Joke-A-Day


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> From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:00:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:00:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12230 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:00:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12226 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:00:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:00:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16BC419995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:00:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 95F6319995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 04:59:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 10:59:20 +0200 I think we've lost focus. I'm scared. The whole point was to handle characters which are allowed but may cause problems like ' ' and ''''. And AFAIK, the problem was that we get them from outside systems, and that people may be so used to them that they may even start to use them on native Plan 9 files. Don't you think that changing open, considering '/' in names, and similar stuff is just too much? I'm scared. That may be interesting, but it would lead to a very different system. Moreover, do you think that the system designers would ever consider '/' as a legitimate character within file names? Although I don't know, I'd bet they'll never do that (at least I have to say I would never do it, sorry). I think I'm just going to try option bⁱ myself and then send a diff in case it works out. But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. It's a very nice system and I wouldn't like to get N different ones nor to break it. -- ⁱ Option b was: remove quoting from ls et al, add it to those that print commands, and fix those that don't cosider ' ' in file names. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:05:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:05:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12333 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:05:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12329 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 049D1199B6; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:05:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BFA4219991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:04:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <333b0cc60394b501dc51077023f483c9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] So, do you space or not? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:04:42 +0200 I can't see the need for unquote. Isn't it easier just not to use %q in ls and run ls instead of ls -l|uq|awk '{print $10}' The rationale for q (quote) was that you still may want to get the name quoted to print a command that may be sent to rc, like in: echo rm `{q *.old} From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:05:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:05:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12341 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:05:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12337 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:05:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:05:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6E2F199B9; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:05:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C5D019999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:04:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17RUMI-0003rL-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D28750A.A792608A@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20020706090029.CTKJ26147.mta2-rme.xtra.co.nz@[210.54.206.119]> Subject: Re: [9fans] Haiku maaaaadness! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 08:56:47 GMT Andrew Simmons wrote: > Spaces in file names, > Do I care? I don't think so. > I'm off to the pub. This life is for squirrels! I'm off to the drugstore to whistle at girls. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:06:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:06:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12375 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:06:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12371 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:06:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:06:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D04A1199BE; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:06:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FD1919991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:05:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17RUMI-0003rR-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "peter a. cejchan" Message-ID: <71652467.0207072022.3a4d8058@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020703105313.A223@next.gli.cas.cz>, <8f6cf824.0207031328.109dede8@posting.google.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] wavelet compression Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 08:56:59 GMT Don wrote in message news:<8f6cf824.0207031328.109dede8@posting.google.com>... > > Get the Plan9 APE-ported software (wavelet image compression) from: > > ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e/EPWIC-1.tbz > > > File not found. > Don Fixed! Thanks for a notice! ++pac. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:17:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:17:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12643 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:17:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12639 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:17:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:17:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E362519999; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:17:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00E8419992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:16:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17RUUf-0004Cr-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 10:07:41 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Wladimir Mutel Message-ID: Organization: ISD References: Subject: [9fans] Re: dial-up connections Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 09:07:07 GMT Ben (): > For those of us who don't have ethernet networks, is there anyway to > connect to an ISP through modem dial-up? I notice that documentation > on this is almost nonexistant... Is there comething unclear in http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/8/ppp ? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:49:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:49:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13320 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:49:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13316 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:49:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:49:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D84FD1999B; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:49:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6809219991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:48:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g689mXMS002330 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:48:33 +0200 Message-ID: <3D295FF1.7040403@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020623 Debian/1.0.0-0.woody.1 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207070402.g6742Ch06066@dave2.dave.tj> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 11:48:33 +0200 Dave wrote: > The method of representation of a given node can be quite flexible > (allowing node completion - or as I would term it, cannonization > - to be done by the kernel), I thought the making of saints wasn't exactly in the kernel's job description. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 18:56:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 18:56:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13455 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 18:56:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13451 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 18:56:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 18:56:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8AA8199A3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:56:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 914B719992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 05:55:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17RVOU-00003O-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 12:05:22 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020708120521.A200@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] Now we have mpeg encoder... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:05:21 +0200 ... grab it from ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e/mpeg_encode-1.5b.tbz Enjoy! -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 19:07:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 19:07:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13615 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 19:07:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13611 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 19:07:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 19:07:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58500199B7; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 06:07:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8DC72199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 06:06:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17RVYp-000043-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 12:16:03 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020708121603.A244@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] volunteering Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:16:03 +0200 Hi, from time to time, I reach my skills limit when porting (APE) to Plan 9. I put the "frozen" code to ftp://next.gli.cas.cz/plan9/half-ported So, if there are any volunteers out there who could help me to push it farther... ;-) (If so, please use ftp://next.gli.cas.cz/incoming for feedback. Thanks!) ############ valid permanently ;-))) ############ -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 20:02:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 20:02:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14496 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 20:02:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14492 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 20:02:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 20:02:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8662199A3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 07:02:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F0FF19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 07:01:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17RW4k-000177-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 11:49:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Wladimir Mutel Message-ID: Organization: ISD References: <20020624224954.AE67C1999B@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Identity Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 10:47:59 GMT > // my wife would like to know how Amidala managed to fit > // quite so many changes of clothing into one small suitcase. > the suitcase was a physical venti: similar portions of the > various garments were only stored once. since storage and > retrieval time of a suitcase is seldom much of an issue, > the venti could be configured with a very small block > size, resulting in substantial savings. How small ? Not less than the length of SHA1 hash, or else savings would not be substantial . :> From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 21:19:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 21:19:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15525 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 21:19:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15513 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 21:19:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 21:19:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C01DD19999; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 08:19:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6F22219992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 08:18:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 13:18:08 +0100 >>Finally, it gives us the capability of getting away from even the most >>elementary requirements in a filesystem (like inodes) at some point in >>the future without extensive code changes. Basically, it's all about Plan 9 hasn't really got assumptions about inodes. 9P doesn't use them. (makes it tricky to do NFS, as it happens, though that's not Plan 9's fault this time.) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 22:31:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 22:31:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16593 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 22:31:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16589 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 22:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 22:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A3D8199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 09:31:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 327F419995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 09:30:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17RYjr-00003Q-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 15:39:39 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020708153939.A200@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] calculate molecular weights ... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 15:39:39 +0200 ... with masscalc grab it from ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 8 23:55:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 8 23:55:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17720 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Jul 2002 23:55:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17716 invoked from network); 8 Jul 2002 23:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Jul 2002 23:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71478199A3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 10:55:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DDAAA19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 10:54:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <037f0a35d7e0a3fffada61950c73786d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:54:24 +0200 Could we change the acme tag so that the file name is terminated by `|' and not by space? Otherwise I don't know how to let acme edit files that have blanks on their names (It would eat part of the name). Now the diffs. I had to make them to let my system handle blanks on file names; i.e. to - let the plumber config know of blanks - permit blanks in kfs - permit blanks in fs - permit blanks in acme tags (I don't include this one). /sys/lib/plumb/basic: - add space as a valid char for file names. eg. '[ a-zA-Z¡-￿0-9_\-./]+' instead of '[ a-zA-Z¡-￿0-9_\-./]+' Permit blanks in kfs servers: diff /n/dump/2002/0708/sys/src/cmd/disk/kfs/sub.c sub.c 382c382 < if(c <= 040) --- > if(c < 040) diff /n/dump/2002/0708/sys/src/cmd/disk/kfs/9p2.c 9p2.c 795c795 < if((*p & 0xFF) <= 040) --- > if((*p & 0xFF) < 040) Permit blanks in real file servers: diff ./port/9p2.c /sys/src/fs/port/9p2.c 155c155 < if((*p & 0xFF) <= 040) --- > if((*p & 0xFF) < 040) diff ./port/sub.c /sys/src/fs/port/sub.c 496c496 < if(c <= 040) --- > if(c < 040) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:07:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:07:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17884 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:07:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17880 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:07:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:07:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72E81199B7; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:07:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67A8B19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g68F5omk020614 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:05:53 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g68F5T8U020613 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:05:29 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020708170519.C20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <037f0a35d7e0a3fffada61950c73786d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <037f0a35d7e0a3fffada61950c73786d@plan9.escet.urjc.es>; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 04:54:24PM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:05:22 +0200 On Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 04:54:24PM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > Could we change the acme tag so that the file name is terminated by > `|' and not by space? Otherwise I don't know how to let acme edit > files that have blanks on their names (It would eat part of the name). > I'm not familiar with ACME's innards, but wouldn't it be more consistent to have ACME understand the "?" wild character in the tag? Of course this has other drawbacks, but it strikes me as a good starting point for discussion. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:11:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:11:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17912 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:11:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17908 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:11:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:11:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05770199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:11:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6C04D19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:10:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4bc593d1adcb46731fad6dcb7961b740@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:10:00 +0200 > I'm not familiar with ACME's innards, but wouldn't it be more > consistent to have ACME understand the "?" wild character in the > tag? Of course this has other drawbacks, but it strikes me as a good > starting point for discussion. ?? I would just like an acme window to be able to hold "/a/b x/d/e/f x" in its tag line. Currently, it would stop at the first blank and eat the rest of the file name. I'm not talking about metacharacters. I think that a couple of changes in wind.c could do the effect. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:17:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:17:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17978 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:17:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17974 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C126719991; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:17:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EE5DA19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:16:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <53a4b2914a2d14090c0f2bc46f48ce8a@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:16:57 -0400 You don't want blanks in native files, I promise you. The kfs changes (at least) are ill-advised. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:18:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:18:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17993 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:18:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17989 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:18:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:18:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E305199BE; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:18:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFA29199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:17:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g68FHAmk020644 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:17:12 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g68FH4uO020643 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:17:04 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020708171654.D20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <4bc593d1adcb46731fad6dcb7961b740@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <4bc593d1adcb46731fad6dcb7961b740@plan9.escet.urjc.es>; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 05:10:00PM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:16:56 +0200 On Mon, Jul 08, 2002 at 05:10:00PM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > ?? > > I would just like an acme window to be able to hold > "/a/b x/d/e/f x" > in its tag line. Currently, it would stop at the first > blank and eat the rest of the file name. I'm not talking > about metacharacters. > > I think that a couple of changes in wind.c could do the effect. It would seem more consistent, in the tag _name_ to use quoting . I was thinking of presenting the above as /a/b?x/d/e/f?x, but I wasn't considering the tag name, I was thinking of a specification in the tag tail. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:19:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:19:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18006 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:19:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18002 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:19:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFA18199DD; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:19:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A5368199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <32fe33281fdb9c0143dad98c40ff4894@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ohtnlbcgkpazbhtkcbtaxbtqij" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:18:48 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ohtnlbcgkpazbhtkcbtaxbtqij Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So all the effort to handle ' ' was just for foreign files? --upas-ohtnlbcgkpazbhtkcbtaxbtqij Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Jul 8 17:17:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C126719991; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:17:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EE5DA19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:16:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <53a4b2914a2d14090c0f2bc46f48ce8a@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:16:57 -0400 You don't want blanks in native files, I promise you. The kfs changes (at least) are ill-advised. -rob --upas-ohtnlbcgkpazbhtkcbtaxbtqij-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:43:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:43:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18213 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:43:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18209 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:43:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:43:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C57CF19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3190C19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:42:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7b9a9eaaf34e6773065104024b7696c2@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:42:05 -0400 > So all the effort to handle ' ' was just for foreign files? Yes. And that is the main reason I don't want to trash the system to support blanks in file names. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 00:52:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 00:52:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18334 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 00:52:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18330 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 00:52:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 00:52:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C67C9199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:52:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0699619995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:51:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4448dfbd9aca88d44f600a5d373bd6e0@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-crhvgkppmkomkymhonmcisxory" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 17:51:11 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-crhvgkppmkomkymhonmcisxory Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Glub! My first view of all this blank thing was just to forbid them and maybe rename them just to avoid them (They make things more complex for our programs). But then I (mis)understood that the plan for the system was to give them a chance; thus I tried to find a simple way to get them working. Now that I finally see that the agreement is on `blanks would mess up things', I think I'll just add them to isfrog and rename them in u9fs (the only place were I get blanks into the system). Thanks for your answer and sorry about the mess. --upas-crhvgkppmkomkymhonmcisxory Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Jul 8 17:43:19 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C57CF19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3190C19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:42:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7b9a9eaaf34e6773065104024b7696c2@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 11:42:05 -0400 > So all the effort to handle ' ' was just for foreign files? Yes. And that is the main reason I don't want to trash the system to support blanks in file names. -rob --upas-crhvgkppmkomkymhonmcisxory-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 01:01:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 01:01:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18436 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 01:01:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18432 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 01:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 01:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D95B19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:01:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7A9F519991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:09 -0400 > Glub! My first view of all this blank thing was just to forbid > them and maybe rename them just to avoid them (They make things more > complex for our programs). I encounter a dozen blank-containing names a day, but only from interacting with foreign systems. I find the current setup covers about 80% of what I need; fixing a few other simple things would probably get us to 99%. But upon reflection I don't think it's wise to push for blanks to be first-class citizens in file names. As long as we continue to use linguistic rather than graphical interfaces to most of our tools, that would be a mistake. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 01:06:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 01:06:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18476 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 01:06:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18472 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 01:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 01:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FE4C199BE; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:06:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C8D81199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:05:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8aeb5e383c12f6b44b043e969d203fb5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 18:05:03 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Renaming them would get us quickly up to 100%, with no need to fix anything. Am I wrong? --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Jul 8 18:01:23 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D95B19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:01:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7A9F519991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:09 -0400 > Glub! My first view of all this blank thing was just to forbid > them and maybe rename them just to avoid them (They make things more > complex for our programs). I encounter a dozen blank-containing names a day, but only from interacting with foreign systems. I find the current setup covers about 80% of what I need; fixing a few other simple things would probably get us to 99%. But upon reflection I don't think it's wise to push for blanks to be first-class citizens in file names. As long as we continue to use linguistic rather than graphical interfaces to most of our tools, that would be a mistake. -rob --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 01:08:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 01:08:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18485 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 01:08:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18481 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 01:08:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 01:08:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFE8919991; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:08:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D105F19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:07:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:07:05 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 99% only. You'd still have the problem of names that arrive surreptitiously, such as in tar files. -rob --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 12:06:16 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 12:06:15 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F994199BC; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:06:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C8D81199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:05:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8aeb5e383c12f6b44b043e969d203fb5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 18:05:03 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Renaming them would get us quickly up to 100%, with no need to fix anything. Am I wrong? --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Jul 8 18:01:23 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D95B19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:01:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7A9F519991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:09 -0400 > Glub! My first view of all this blank thing was just to forbid > them and maybe rename them just to avoid them (They make things more > complex for our programs). I encounter a dozen blank-containing names a day, but only from interacting with foreign systems. I find the current setup covers about 80% of what I need; fixing a few other simple things would probably get us to 99%. But upon reflection I don't think it's wise to push for blanks to be first-class citizens in file names. As long as we continue to use linguistic rather than graphical interfaces to most of our tools, that would be a mistake. -rob --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm-- --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 01:15:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 01:15:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18549 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 01:15:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18545 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 01:15:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 01:15:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6674199D5; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:15:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D03B8199BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6b2232a5c2aa06b7af75e8c1af20ba52@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:14:11 -0400 > 99% only. You'd still have the problem of names that arrive surreptitiously, > such as in tar files. Expanding a bit.... This is why I decided (mea maxima culpa) to admit blanks in file names. They show up, you don't know where from, and if the basic tools have ways of coping (as opposed to being graceful and perfect in handling them) you can get by without mystery error messages caused by the operating system rejecting them deep down. I think the setup is sufficient, and sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 01:18:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 01:18:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18581 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 01:18:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18577 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 01:18:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 01:18:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80CFB199ED; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:18:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B211319991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:17:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17RbAm-0003uA-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 17:15:36 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: ozan s yigit Message-ID: Organization: York University References: <20020703160003.27491.58783.Mailman@psuvax1.cse.psu.edu>, <3D258491.17320.32575B@localhost> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:14:55 GMT > Isn't a haiku supposed to have 17 syllables? if you are writing in english, not necessarily. yes if you are writing in japanese. in that case, it should have seventeen (five/seven/five) *onji* which is not a syllable, but a sound symbol. these sound symbols are shorter and more uniform than english syllables. this is is a roundabout way of saying something many translators and english haiku poets (as i have in reading and composing haiku for sometime now) found: english haiku needs only about ten to twelve syllables to have nearly the same duration and rhythm as a japanese haiku. so don't feel the need to pad a haiku if you find it sounds right to your ears in ten or thirteen syllables. remember haiku is unforced, without frills and literary flourishes. winter moonlight - little laptop warm with plan9. [oz/2002] oz --- Never let your job get in the way of your work. -- Sir Isaac Newton, Master of the Royal Mint From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 05:18:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 05:18:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20514 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 05:18:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20510 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 05:18:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 05:18:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C58D199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:18:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E68C19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00I8T5MSET@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:16:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68KIRo20092 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:18:27 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082018.g68KIRo20092@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:18:27 -0400 (EDT) Reply inline: - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > I think we've lost focus. I'm scared. > > The whole point was to handle characters which are allowed but may > cause problems like ' ' and ''''. And AFAIK, the problem was that we > get them from outside systems, and that people may be so used to them > that they may even start to use them on native Plan 9 files. The reason that UNIX is so good and continues to be successful even competing against the biggest software company in the world is that UNIX has never taken this approach to solving problems; UNIX solves problems in a fundamental way, and Plan 9 must, too, if it's to be a worthy successor to UNIX. AFAIK, changing open(2), execve(2), etc. is a requirement if we want a fundamental solution to the problem. IMHO, the kernel should have an even more fundamental solution (seperation of the path into nodes, each of which is identified by a structure), while applications (which require a plaintext representation of a path) will probably want to escape special characters (by whichever method they want - since the kernel needs no escaping within itself, apps are free to do whatever they want). > > Don't you think that changing open, considering '/' in names, and > similar stuff is just too much? I'm scared. That may be interesting, > but it would lead to a very different system. It won't lead to a very different system from the application programmer's point of view. It'll lead to a different system under the hood, which is exactly what we want, because what we currently have under the hood simply doesn't cut it. > > Moreover, do you think that the system designers would ever consider > '/' as a legitimate character within file names? Although I don't > know, I'd bet they'll never do that (at least I have to say I would > never do it, sorry). There's no reason not to allow the slash in node names, except that it confuses utilities. However, whitespace already confuses utilities in the same way, so we lose nothing by allowing slashes in node names. > > I think I'm just going to try option bⁱ myself and then send a diff > in case it works out. Option b is a userland option, not a kernel option. All you're doing is deferring the decision to change our kernel until a later time (by which point we'll hopefully have a clearer idea about how we want to change the kernel). > > But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my > local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. > It's a very nice system and I wouldn't like to get N different ones > nor to break it. Undoing kernel-level changes won't be easy, especially when people start coding programs using the kernel's new path representation; rewriting them using standard strings would (a) make the programs' logic a lot more complicated; and consequentally (b) make the programs a lot less efficient. > > > -- > ⁱ Option b was: remove quoting from ls et al, add it to those that > print commands, and fix those that don't cosider ' ' in file names. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 05:23:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 05:23:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20576 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 05:23:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20572 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 05:23:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 05:23:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E136719999; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:23:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A882B1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:22:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <108e7507893bab27df566b7cd0e795f0@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:22:06 -0400 > changing open(2), execve(2), etc. is > a requirement if we want a fundamental solution to the problem. Fundamental solutions should be applied only to fundamental problems. This is not a fundamental problem; far from it. The means should be proportionate to the ends. > > Don't you think that changing open, considering '/' in names, and > > similar stuff is just too much? Yes, it is, because to do so contradicts too many conventions that are integral to the system. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 05:41:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 05:41:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20701 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 05:41:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20697 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 05:41:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 05:41:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3851619992; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:41:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19A8F199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:40:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00LUH5RDRI@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68KMkW20430 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:22:46 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <3D295FF1.7040403@strakt.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082022.g68KMkW20430@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:22:45 -0400 (EDT) It's possible that cannonization should still be done by library routines, but I'd vote to let the kernel do it anyway for whatever optimizations it can make (since it's not restricted to the standard syscalls for file handling). - Dave Boyd Roberts wrote: > > Dave wrote: > > The method of representation of a given node can be quite flexible > > (allowing node completion - or as I would term it, cannonization > > - to be done by the kernel), > > I thought the making of saints wasn't exactly in the kernel's job > description. > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 05:41:32 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 05:41:32 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20708 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 05:41:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20704 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 05:41:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 05:41:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C640199DD; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:41:17 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2AE6199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:40:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00H9S6RGJC@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:40:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68Kgqv21906 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:42:52 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: from <"forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082042.g68Kgqv21906@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Plan 9 still has identifier numbers provided by the filesystem server. We can toss or change those at some point in the future (increasing the identifier's size, for instance, or adding a supplementary identifier) if we identify files using linked structures. - Dave forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote: > > >>Finally, it gives us the capability of getting away from even the most > >>elementary requirements in a filesystem (like inodes) at some point in > >>the future without extensive code changes. Basically, it's all about > > Plan 9 hasn't really got assumptions about inodes. 9P doesn't use them. > (makes it tricky to do NFS, as it happens, though that's not Plan 9's fault > this time.) > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 05:57:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 05:57:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20821 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20817 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D22801999B; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:57:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D487519992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:56:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY009DR7JHKO@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:57:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68Kwgi23131 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:58:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-reply-to: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082058.g68Kwgi23131@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 16:58:40 -0400 (EDT) ...not even ... if you s/ /_/g all incoming filenames, you'll have no way of distinguishing 'a b' from 'a_b' ... or am I wrong? - Dave rob pike, esq. wrote: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy > Content-Disposition: inline > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > 99% only. You'd still have the problem of names that arrive surreptitiously, > such as in tar files. > > -rob > > --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy > Content-Type: message/rfc822 > Content-Disposition: inline > > Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 12:06:16 EDT 2002 > Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 12:06:15 EDT 2002 > Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP > id 7F994199BC; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:06:08 -0400 (EDT) > Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C8D81199B9 > for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:05:05 -0400 (EDT) > Message-ID: <8aeb5e383c12f6b44b043e969d203fb5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> > From: Fco.J.Ballesteros > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: multipart/mixed; > boundary="upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm" > Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> > List-Archive: > Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 18:05:03 +0200 > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm > Content-Disposition: inline > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Renaming them would get us quickly up to 100%, with no need > to fix anything. Am I wrong? > --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm > Content-Type: message/rfc822 > Content-Disposition: inline > > Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Jul 8 18:01:23 MDT 2002 > Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP > id 1D95B19995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:01:13 -0400 (EDT) > Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7A9F519991 > for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:11 -0400 (EDT) > Message-ID: > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing > From: "rob pike, esq." > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> > List-Archive: > Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 12:00:09 -0400 > > > Glub! My first view of all this blank thing was just to forbid > > them and maybe rename them just to avoid them (They make things more > > complex for our programs). > > I encounter a dozen blank-containing names a day, but only from > interacting with foreign systems. I find the current setup covers about > 80% of what I need; fixing a few other simple things would probably > get us to 99%. But upon reflection I don't think it's wise to push for > blanks to be first-class citizens in file names. As long as we continue > to use linguistic rather than graphical interfaces to most of our tools, > that would be a mistake. > > -rob > > --upas-gtvahntgehtrsxxskbyfbulvvm-- > --upas-hysbwqswxskaflauqaypshypxy-- > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 07:19:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 07:19:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21364 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 07:19:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21360 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 07:19:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 07:19:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FF24199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 18:19:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D6A061998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 18:18:18 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: <200207082058.g68Kwgi23131@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020708221818.D6A061998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:18:13 +0900 >...not even ... if you s/ /_/g all incoming filenames, you'll have no >way of distinguishing 'a b' from 'a_b' ... or am I wrong? > - Dave You misunderstand something. We need not distinguishing 'a b' from 'a_b' because there are no files that contains ' ' in their names. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:07:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:07:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21796 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:07:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21792 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:07:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:07:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7550199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:07:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lyorn.kerch.com (dsl081-069-016.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net [64.81.69.16]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D616E19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:06:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from berry@localhost) by lyorn.kerch.com (8.12.0.Beta7/8.11.1) id g68N5xNs012898; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 16:05:59 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from berry@kerch.com) X-Authentication-Warning: lyorn.kerch.com: berry set sender to berry@kerch.com using -f To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207070402.g6742Ch06066@dave2.dave.tj> <3D295FF1.7040403@strakt.com> From: Berry Kercheval In-Reply-To: <3D295FF1.7040403@strakt.com> (Boyd Roberts's message of "Mon, 08 Jul 2002 11:48:33 +0200") Message-ID: Lines: 13 User-Agent: Gnus/5.090003 (Oort Gnus v0.03) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: 08 Jul 2002 16:05:58 -0700 Boyd Roberts writes: > Dave wrote: > > The method of representation of a given node can be quite flexible > > (allowing node completion - or as I would term it, cannonization > > - to be done by the kernel), > > I thought the making of saints wasn't exactly in the kernel's job > description. Naw, making saints is "canonization". Making artillery is a perfectly good kernel task. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:17:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:17:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21898 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:17:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21894 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:17:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 523B7199A3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:17:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB81219991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:16:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00ARB8GPTJ@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 17:17:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68LL9M24891 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 21:21:09 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <108e7507893bab27df566b7cd0e795f0@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082121.g68LL9M24891@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 17:21:08 -0400 (EDT) Okay, I see where you're going with this. I fear I'm very badly outnumbered here, and since I'm not about to implement the changes I suggest, nobody else is likely to. I guess we'll just have to keep blanks out of our filenames. . . - Dave BTW - If we change the system in a fundamental way once and for all, we'll have a system (and a new set of conventions) that won't have to be changed for another 50 years, with any luck. Somebody's going to want to encode full pathnames within nodes at some point in the future, and our decision to disallow that will force people to invent roundabout ways of doing so. rob pike, esq. wrote: > > > changing open(2), execve(2), etc. is > > a requirement if we want a fundamental solution to the problem. > > Fundamental solutions should be applied only to fundamental problems. > This is not a fundamental problem; far from it. The means should be > proportionate to the ends. > > > > Don't you think that changing open, considering '/' in names, and > > > similar stuff is just too much? > > Yes, it is, because to do so contradicts too many conventions that are > integral to the system. > > -rob > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:20:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:20:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21927 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:20:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21922 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:20:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:20:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4704D199BB; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:20:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F2DD2199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:19:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <17160b0459fc5a1e643e2118af298a48@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:19:24 -0400 >> I thought the making of saints wasn't exactly in the kernel's job >> description. > > Naw, making saints is "canonization". Making artillery is a perfectly > good kernel task. Such kernels may, however, be subject to export restrictions... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:28:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:28:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21995 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:28:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21991 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCC6D199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:28:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1B9519999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:27:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA15808 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:27:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207082327.TAA15808@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Jul 2002 17:21:08 EDT." <200207082121.g68LL9M24891@dave2.dave.tj> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:27:13 -0400 > BTW - If we change the system in a fundamental way once and for all, > we'll have a system (and a new set of conventions) that won't have to > be changed for another 50 years, with any luck. Somebody's going to > want to encode full pathnames within nodes at some point in the future, > and our decision to disallow that will force people to invent roundabout > ways of doing so. IBM did that with their match-mode mainframe operating system. Low and behold, it didn't change for 50 years. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:31:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:31:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22053 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:31:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22049 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2D44199A3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:31:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AB08199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:31:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id TAA16541 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:30:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207082330.TAA16541@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:27:13 EDT." <200207082327.TAA15808@math.psu.edu> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:30:59 -0400 > IBM did that with their match-mode mainframe operating system. Low and > behold, it didn't change for 50 years. Err, make that batch-mode. Whoops. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 08:50:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 08:50:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22300 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 08:50:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22296 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 08:50:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 08:50:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03A8B199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:50:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 552B419991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:49:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00LUIEJSD1@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:28:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g68NUon05150 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 23:30:50 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <17160b0459fc5a1e643e2118af298a48@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207082330.g68NUon05150@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:30:50 -0400 (EDT) I believe those types of cannons are spelled with two Ns. - Dave David Gordon Hogan wrote: > > >> I thought the making of saints wasn't exactly in the kernel's job > >> description. > > > > Naw, making saints is "canonization". Making artillery is a perfectly > > good kernel task. > > Such kernels may, however, be subject to export restrictions... > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 09:40:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 09:40:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23674 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 09:40:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23670 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 09:40:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 09:40:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 935B1199B6; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:40:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 580A719991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:39:15 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020709003915.580A719991@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:38:32 +0900 >I would just like an acme window to be able to hold >"/a/b x/d/e/f x" Why, nemo, are you so eager to permit blank as a file name? Does it come from European language nature? IMHO: our language, yes Japanese has no such blank as a delimiter of words, so I have no such interest to that. :-) Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 09:59:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 09:59:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24123 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 09:59:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24119 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 09:59:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 09:59:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29295199B6; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:59:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45189199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:58:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GYY00B7OIPE9J@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:58:27 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood Subject: Re: [9fans] Has anyone got a 2114x ethernet card working under 4th Edition? To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <010901c226e3$b3f1dfc0$1b02a8c0@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <005101c1fa80$94ab59a0$0100a8c0@landra.org> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:58:12 -0400 > From: "Russ Cox" > > What does > > pci > > print? The line I care about is the one > where the second field begins 02., as in > the three marked below. I know this is an old thread, but I just ran into this problem today with an SMC 9332DST card and thought my experience might help others. The broken detection message was: #l0: 2114x: 0 Mbps port 0xfc80 irq 10 c0f401000000 Note that the speed and EA are both bogus. Here's the interesting part: I tried a newer variant of the card, an SMC 9332BDT, and it works perfectly with the 2114x driver. The output from "pci" for *both* cards is identical: 0.15.0: 02.00.00 1011/0009 10 0:0000fc81 128 1:ffbefc00 128 The Tulip chips on the 2 cards have the following markings: 9332DST (doesn't work with 2114x driver): 21140 / DC1010BA / 21-40673-01 9332BDT (works with 2114x driver): 21140-AE / DC1064B / 21-43864-03 I suspect transceiver or EEPROM differences may be the significant driver issue in the case of these 2 cards rather than the variant of Tulip chip. FWIW, I note that Don Becker's Tulip driver for Linux has an entry in "eeprom_fixups[]" for the (broken in Plan 9) 9332DST, while I don't see anything similar in ether2114x.c John From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 10:10:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 10:10:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24392 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 10:10:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24388 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 10:10:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 10:10:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4E9319995; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 21:10:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3094A1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 21:09:19 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020709010919.3094A1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:08:38 +0900 >if you are writing in english, not necessarily. yes if you are writing in >japanese. in that case, it should have seventeen (five/seven/five) *onji* >which is not a syllable, but a sound symbol. Aa! Now, I understood the difference between 俳句 and Haiku. I'll show you a 俳句example, which is one of the most famous one written for this season by 芭蕉(Bashou) posted before. 古池や蛙とびこむ水の音 Abobe is written using Hiragana and Kanji, which is Japanese writing style heritaged from Heian-Ara invented by Japanese women..., anyway it should be read as ふるいけや かわず とびこむ みずのおと Now, you counts 5+7+5 hiraganas, which are the reading showtest units (syllable?) in Japanese. Here, I intentianlly put 'blank' between 5+7+5, but it not used formally. Another thing, in 俳句 we need some key word which implies a season when the author want to express. In the above example, it's 蛙(frog). Frogs apear to us from early summer. So, I felt that an English version of Haiku which someone showed here is not 俳句, but 川柳(senryu). Sorry making noise. Kenji -- Enjoying UTF-8 capability of Plan 9 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 10:50:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 10:50:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25653 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 10:50:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25649 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 10:50:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 10:50:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 889F6199B6; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 21:50:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3B503199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 21:49:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1197fc15c9c040aca74cd7c935c01bfa@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Has anyone got a 2114x ethernet card working under 4th Edition? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ubtmcgbqgrunutrblrawncikng" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 21:49:26 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ubtmcgbqgrunutrblrawncikng Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ether2114x.c has a facility similar to the 'fixup' code in the linux driver, look for the 'leaf21140' table. If you can compile the kernel with the 'DEBUG' flag on in the driver and bring the system up with the duff card as ether1, the debug messages on the console and the contents of the device 'ifstats' file (will give the SROM contents) would aid in patching the driver. --upas-ubtmcgbqgrunutrblrawncikng Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 20:59:15 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Mon Jul 8 20:59:14 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19715199B3; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:59:07 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45189199B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:58:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout02.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GYY00B7OIPE9J@mtaout02.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:58:27 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood Subject: Re: [9fans] Has anyone got a 2114x ethernet card working under 4th Edition? To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <010901c226e3$b3f1dfc0$1b02a8c0@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <005101c1fa80$94ab59a0$0100a8c0@landra.org> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 20:58:12 -0400 > From: "Russ Cox" > > What does > > pci > > print? The line I care about is the one > where the second field begins 02., as in > the three marked below. I know this is an old thread, but I just ran into this problem today with an SMC 9332DST card and thought my experience might help others. The broken detection message was: #l0: 2114x: 0 Mbps port 0xfc80 irq 10 c0f401000000 Note that the speed and EA are both bogus. Here's the interesting part: I tried a newer variant of the card, an SMC 9332BDT, and it works perfectly with the 2114x driver. The output from "pci" for *both* cards is identical: 0.15.0: 02.00.00 1011/0009 10 0:0000fc81 128 1:ffbefc00 128 The Tulip chips on the 2 cards have the following markings: 9332DST (doesn't work with 2114x driver): 21140 / DC1010BA / 21-40673-01 9332BDT (works with 2114x driver): 21140-AE / DC1064B / 21-43864-03 I suspect transceiver or EEPROM differences may be the significant driver issue in the case of these 2 cards rather than the variant of Tulip chip. FWIW, I note that Don Becker's Tulip driver for Linux has an entry in "eeprom_fixups[]" for the (broken in Plan 9) 9332DST, while I don't see anything similar in ether2114x.c John --upas-ubtmcgbqgrunutrblrawncikng-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 11:51:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 11:51:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27397 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 11:51:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27391 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 11:51:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 11:51:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7F41199BC; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:51:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from web40305.mail.yahoo.com (web40305.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 969C7199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:50:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <20020709025020.30612.qmail@web40305.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [61.0.70.147] by web40305.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 19:50:20 PDT From: Nitesh Garg To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-230778379-1026183020=:28935" Subject: [9fans] how to unsubscribe Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 19:50:20 -0700 (PDT) --0-230778379-1026183020=:28935 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I want to unsubscribe from this group pls tell me how ??????????????? --------------------------------- Do You Yahoo!? New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access --0-230778379-1026183020=:28935 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

I want to unsubscribe from this group

 

pls tell me how ???????????????



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New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access --0-230778379-1026183020=:28935-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 12:10:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 12:10:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27969 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 12:10:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27963 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 12:10:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 12:10:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E7EB199BF; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:10:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B502A199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:09:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g692C8l23377 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:12:13 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] how to unsubscribe In-Reply-To: <20020709025020.30612.qmail@web40305.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:12:08 -0400 (EDT) Was it the crappy web browser? Sam On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Nitesh Garg wrote: > > I want to unsubscribe from this group > > > > pls tell me how ??????????????? > > > > --------------------------------- > Do You Yahoo!? > New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 12:18:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 12:18:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28246 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 12:18:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28242 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 12:18:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 12:18:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFA4E1998C; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:18:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 47604199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:17:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 3806 invoked by uid 991); 9 Jul 2002 03:17:16 -0000 Message-ID: <20020709031716.3805.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how to unsubscribe In-Reply-To: Message from Sam of "Mon, 08 Jul 2002 22:12:08 EDT." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 23:17:16 -0400 | Nitesh Garg wrote: | > I want to unsubscribe from this group | > pls tell me how ??????????????? Sam: | Was it the crappy web browser? Yes, you need to use a crappy web browser, pointed at https://lists.cse.psu.edu/ . Follow the link to 9fans, go to the bottom of the page, to where it says "Edit Options". From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 12:31:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 12:31:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28596 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 12:31:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28592 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 12:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 12:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A0A0199E4; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:31:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD02B19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 23:30:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout01.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GYY008LDPQ7S8@mtaout01.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Jul 2002 23:30:07 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <014301c226f8$e4e2aa00$1b02a8c0@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: Subject: [9fans] Plan 9 incompatible with EZ-BIOS/EZ-Drive? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 23:29:54 -0400 1) I used Win98SE to create a bootable 512 MB FAT16 partition. 2) I installed Plan 9 4th edition, using Plan 9 fdisk to create a PLAN9 partition. Here is the output of fdisk: term% disk/fdisk /dev/sdC0/data cylinder = 2064384 bytes * p1 0 248 (248 cylinders, 488.25 MB) type 85 p2 248 496 (248 cylinders, 488.25 MB) PLAN9 empty 496 1023 (527 cylinders, 1.01 GB) Note that the reported size of the FAT16 partition is wrong! 3) If I run Windows fdisk after the Plan 9 installation, the PLAN9 partition does not appear. If I add a new partition using Windows fdisk it creates it right after the FAT16 partition, ignoring the PLAN9 partition. 4) I suspect the Plan 9 partition overlaps the FAT16 partition. Discussion: This system has an old Intel motherboard whose BIOS screws up the geometry for "large" IDE drives (like this 2.1 GB AC22100), so as a workaround the Western Digital-furnished EZ-BIOS (aka EZ-Drive) allows Windows to boot from this drive. "type 85" (0x55) is the partition ID for EZ-BIOS. From : 55 EZ-Drive EZ-Drive is another disk manager (by MicroHouse, 1992). Linux kernel versions older than 1.3.29 do not coexist with EZD. Hypothesis: It appears that Plan 9 4th Edition does not (yet) coexist with EZD? John From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 13:11:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 13:11:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29600 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 13:11:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29593 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 13:11:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 13:11:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50D7C199E4; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:11:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E897199D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:10:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYY00MCXRBJNY@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 00:04:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6945r527442 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 04:05:53 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] how to unsubscribe In-reply-to: <20020709031716.3805.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207090405.g6945r527442@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 00:05:52 -0400 (EDT) You can't just send a message with subject "unsubscribe" to 9fans-request@cse.psu.edu? - Dave Scott Schwartz wrote: > > | Nitesh Garg wrote: > | > I want to unsubscribe from this group > | > pls tell me how ??????????????? > > Sam: > | Was it the crappy web browser? > > Yes, you need to use a crappy web browser, pointed at > https://lists.cse.psu.edu/ . Follow the link to 9fans, go to the bottom > of the page, to where it says "Edit Options". > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 13:34:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 13:34:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30311 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 13:34:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30307 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 13:34:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 13:34:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71E72199EC; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:34:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (adsl-65-70-202-162.dsl.austtx.swbell.net [65.70.202.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9C8D199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:33:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 840FB5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:33:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael H.Collins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how to unsubscribe Message-Id: <20020709003355.7b515028.mike@linuxlink.com> In-Reply-To: References: <20020709025020.30612.qmail@web40305.mail.yahoo.com> Organization: Penguinista Navy X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.0 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i586-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: $+'5cps7A7Ayk+#{fcCr*u;U<2@xrrk"dv1@}fAtMG,%UOhDp_&@N>]!P[MMXQeR%_B+xUd :A3v20tyZ$0M==g|A.t6K1IBn>g-lNOnth^QB9'+-OMu}b9XGCw&9dnbT6cTg|MA;te;_Tfd jAz}t5I{#zjnE9]8FMUdnVPVz4|cX=6SF&Xha!qyYN`!Pa.gwUDEUF&IpnY{f:2E}+VvQQvHQJ;QTr &MID0QK.]TF Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 00:33:55 -0400 lol sorry for the breach of ettiquitte. On Mon, 8 Jul 2002 22:12:08 -0400 (EDT) Sam spewed into the bitstream: ~Was it the crappy web browser? ~ ~Sam ~ ~On Mon, 8 Jul 2002, Nitesh Garg wrote: ~ ~> ~> I want to unsubscribe from this group ~> ~> ~> ~> pls tell me how ??????????????? ~> ~> ~> ~> --------------------------------- ~> Do You Yahoo!? ~> New! SBC Yahoo! Dial - 1st Month Free & unlimited access ~ ~ -- (o_ //\ V_/_ Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://www.mdrconsult.com http://www.lrsehosting.com/ http://kpig.com http://rawdeal.org From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 16:47:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 16:47:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3489 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 16:47:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3484 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 16:47:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 16:47:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5365119980; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:47:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 28BF619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:46:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wogkjglcxqhnkadglmoqfujkpl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:46:41 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wogkjglcxqhnkadglmoqfujkpl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just to clarify, I'm no longer pursuing blanks on Plan 9. As a matter of fact, I never liked them. Now that I'm happy to see that Rob does not want them on native files I can just rename them in u9fs. --upas-wogkjglcxqhnkadglmoqfujkpl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 02:40:18 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 935B1199B6; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:40:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 580A719991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Jul 2002 20:39:15 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020709003915.580A719991@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:38:32 +0900 >I would just like an acme window to be able to hold >"/a/b x/d/e/f x" Why, nemo, are you so eager to permit blank as a file name? Does it come from European language nature? IMHO: our language, yes Japanese has no such blank as a delimiter of words, so I have no such interest to that. :-) Kenji --upas-wogkjglcxqhnkadglmoqfujkpl-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 16:51:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 16:51:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3590 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 16:51:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3586 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 16:51:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 16:51:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD356199BE; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:51:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0DFBC1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:50:10 +0200 > We need not distinguishing 'a b' from 'a_b' because there are > no files that contains ' ' in their names. I'm glad to be at home again ☺ Things are so easy now... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 16:55:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 16:55:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3735 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 16:55:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3731 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 16:55:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 16:55:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5843C199E3; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:55:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 817C6199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 03:54:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:54:26 +0200 >> But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my >> local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. ... > Undoing kernel-level changes won't be easy, especially when people start 9fs dump cp blah blah Sorry, couldn't resist. I just love this system :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:19:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:19:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4355 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:19:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4351 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:19:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:19:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F5AE19A00; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:19:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86C9D199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:16:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g698Fjmk023140 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:15:47 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g698Ff0u023139 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:15:42 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 09:50:10AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:15:38 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 09:50:10AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > We need not distinguishing 'a b' from 'a_b' because there are > > no files that contains ' ' in their names. > > I'm glad to be at home again ? > Things are so easy now... Wrong! What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign system? Back to the drawing board, everyone, the problem needs another, slightly more focussed iteration. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:23:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:23:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4462 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:23:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4458 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:23:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B195C199ED; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:23:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AB50B199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:22:18 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: Message-Id: <20020709082218.AB50B199EE@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:22:03 +0900 I guess that someone (probably nemo) has already fixed acme so that we can enter into '/n/c/My Document/' using mouse. Or already fixed in official update? Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:25:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:25:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4506 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:25:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4502 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:25:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:25:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A122319A02; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:25:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D82EA19A04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:24:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g698O1MS022102 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:24:01 +0200 Message-ID: <3D2A9DA1.60602@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020623 Debian/1.0.0-0.woody.1 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207082022.g68KMkW20430@dave2.dave.tj> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 10:24:01 +0200 Dave wrote: >It's possible that cannonization should still be done by library routines, > Yes, put it in libpope. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:41:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:41:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4858 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:41:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4854 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:41:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:41:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B26519A0C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:41:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 76CD01998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:40:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-oyjylzoltcokrlmjfaphjrqztf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:40:06 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-oyjylzoltcokrlmjfaphjrqztf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, but did an undo and will never redo it. Had enough blanks for the rest of my life. --upas-oyjylzoltcokrlmjfaphjrqztf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 10:23:17 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B195C199ED; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:23:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AB50B199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:22:18 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: Message-Id: <20020709082218.AB50B199EE@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:22:03 +0900 I guess that someone (probably nemo) has already fixed acme so that we can enter into '/n/c/My Document/' using mouse. Or already fixed in official update? Kenji Arisawa --upas-oyjylzoltcokrlmjfaphjrqztf-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:42:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:42:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4896 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:42:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4892 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:42:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:42:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F36C19A1C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:42:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1C95419A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:41:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] upas/fs -f/pop/... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:41:11 +0100 since a few people using Plan 9 also use Demon Internet, i'd thought i'd mention that when reading the source i noticed that (probably) the pop3 support in upas/fs won't work correctly with Demon Internet's pop3 service because that reorders and thus renumbers messages on each call. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:43:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:43:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4930 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:43:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4926 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:43:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:43:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B61C1998C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9080F19A04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:42:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 10:42:04 +0200 : Wrong! What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign : system? Back to the drawing board, everyone, the problem needs : another, slightly more focussed iteration. I'm renaming ' ' with ␣ in u9fs There's no problem doing that since there's no ␣ in outside file names. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 17:44:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 17:44:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4952 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4948 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 17:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99CBF199B7; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:44:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5515C19A17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 04:43:06 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Message-Id: <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:42:47 +0900 >What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign >system? Check before you copy, otherwise one is lost. This problem is always happen when one to one mapping is absent. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 18:24:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 18:24:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5943 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 18:24:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5939 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 18:24:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 18:24:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1051219A08; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:24:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F9AF19A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:23:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g699LRmk023250 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:30 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g699LOWH023249 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:24 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu>; from arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 05:42:47PM +0900 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:20 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 05:42:47PM +0900, arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > >What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign > >system? > Check before you copy, otherwise one is lost. > This problem is always happen when one to one mapping is > absent. > Well, for DOS and derivative works, "\" ought to be a perfect translation . For Unix, there doesn't seem to be a natural replacement for space. We could use the suggestion of using URL-style encoding, where % becomes reserved and _any_ special character can be represented as %XX. In fact, is there _any_ service for a foreign filesystem that would defeat such a scheme? Would such a shim need to be an option in "mount"? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 18:35:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 18:35:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6168 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 18:35:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6164 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 18:35:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 18:35:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C24C8199EC; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:35:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 848C4199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:31:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g699TCmk023268 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:29:15 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g699T6Ed023267 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:29:06 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020709112856.L20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 10:42:04AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:28:57 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 10:42:04AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > I'm renaming ' ' with ? in u9fs > There's no problem doing that since there's no ? > in outside file names. There could be: -rw-r--r-- 1 lucio staff 0 Jul 9 11:22 t?uch produced by "touch t\?uch" on my NetBSD host. This is from "man 2 intro" on NetBSD 1.5.2: File Name Names consisting of up to 255 (MAXNAMELEN) characters may be used to name an ordinary file, special file, or directory. These characters may be selected from the set of all ASCII char- acter excluding 0 (NUL) and the ASCII code for `/' (slash). (The parity bit, bit 7, must be 0.) Note that it is generally unwise to use `*', `?', `[' or `]' as part of file names because of the special meaning attached to these characters by the shell. It needn't be up to date, but it's a safe indicator. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 18:38:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 18:38:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6234 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 18:38:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6230 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 18:38:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 18:38:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 211FB19A29; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:38:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1903E199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:37:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <25ce3bf663718a1be86b527e95618430@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-yahtfvukwyxjglwwfpabynrhgd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:37:36 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-yahtfvukwyxjglwwfpabynrhgd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's ok if the name contains '?', it's just inconvenient but it's ok. It's like that inconvenient "'chk" name I had. --upas-yahtfvukwyxjglwwfpabynrhgd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 11:35:19 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C24C8199EC; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:35:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 848C4199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:31:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g699TCmk023268 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:29:15 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g699T6Ed023267 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:29:06 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020709112856.L20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 10:42:04AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:28:57 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 10:42:04AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > I'm renaming ' ' with ? in u9fs > There's no problem doing that since there's no ? > in outside file names. There could be: -rw-r--r-- 1 lucio staff 0 Jul 9 11:22 t?uch produced by "touch t\?uch" on my NetBSD host. This is from "man 2 intro" on NetBSD 1.5.2: File Name Names consisting of up to 255 (MAXNAMELEN) characters may be used to name an ordinary file, special file, or directory. These characters may be selected from the set of all ASCII char- acter excluding 0 (NUL) and the ASCII code for `/' (slash). (The parity bit, bit 7, must be 0.) Note that it is generally unwise to use `*', `?', `[' or `]' as part of file names because of the special meaning attached to these characters by the shell. It needn't be up to date, but it's a safe indicator. ++L --upas-yahtfvukwyxjglwwfpabynrhgd-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 18:44:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 18:44:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6368 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 18:44:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6363 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 18:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 18:44:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 687E919A2F; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:44:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9CACE199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:43:21 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Message-Id: <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:43:17 +0900 >For Unix, there doesn't seem to be a natural replacement for space. >We could use the suggestion of using URL-style encoding, where % >becomes reserved and _any_ special character can be represented as >%XX. In fact, is there _any_ service for a foreign filesystem that >would defeat such a scheme? URL-style encoding is powerfull enough and that is internet standard. I believe no system defeats such a scheme. I don't know why Plan9 rejects to accept this scheme, if we must (probably we must) deal with outside system, Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 18:58:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 18:58:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6614 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 18:58:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6610 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 18:58:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 18:58:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67D9B19A3F; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:58:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6492519A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA28694 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:57:47 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g699vme20194; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:57:48 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g699vkK17935 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:57:46 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207090957.g699vkK17935@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] PGP In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Apr 2002 09:43:10 +0100." <32fb0d38c707d0cba43c86806ec474d4@caldo.demon.co.uk> References: <32fb0d38c707d0cba43c86806ec474d4@caldo.demon.co.uk> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:57:46 +0200 (old thread :-) last friday we had a two year old user playing with our 'public' system in the coffee corner, currently (intended to be) used as music player(*). Our little tester (colleagues son) succeeded to delete the clock window and resize the stats bar, and type somewhere in the middle of rio windows, but did not break anything important. The sound control slider on sape's classicjuke kept him busy for quite a while. (openening another classicjuke on another machine in a different room, controlling the same sound made things even more interesting :-) Essentially, the system survived him (but crashed a bit later (after our little tester had already left) when I (I think) made it run out of memory). (*) in the past it kept an eye (webcam) on our coffee pot, and has been used for a while as mark-list for coffee and beer, using the acme edit scripts that I posted a while ago; the (diskless) system doubles as cpu (but not auth) server > >>that is, is anyone's wife or girlfriend or secretary using it? I'm trying to convince my wife that it can be nice to read mail via acme; the need to dial in makes things slightly more complicated. We'll see. Just some noise, Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 19:38:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 19:38:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7325 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 19:38:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7321 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 19:38:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 19:38:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83EF519A2D; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 06:38:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE44F199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 06:37:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g69Aaumk023421 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:36:59 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g69AalQb023420 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:36:47 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing Message-ID: <20020709123641.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu>; from arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 06:43:17PM +0900 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:36:42 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 06:43:17PM +0900, arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > >For Unix, there doesn't seem to be a natural replacement for space. > >We could use the suggestion of using URL-style encoding, where % > >becomes reserved and _any_ special character can be represented as > >%XX. In fact, is there _any_ service for a foreign filesystem that > >would defeat such a scheme? > URL-style encoding is powerfull enough and that is internet > standard. > I believe no system defeats such a scheme. > I don't know why Plan9 rejects to accept this scheme, > if we must (probably we must) deal with outside system, > There are only three characters from a foreign system that need translation: "%", "/" and " ". Long filenames are already catered for in 4ed, perhaps we can extend "lnfs" to deal, optionally, with this translation. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 19:55:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 19:55:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7519 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 19:55:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7515 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 19:55:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 19:55:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FA9419A0C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 06:55:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 471BA19A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 06:54:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020709105417.LJJQ2755.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:54:17 +0100 Message-ID: <020b01c22736$fc9d26f0$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709123641.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:54:21 +0100 > There are only three characters from a foreign system that need > translation: "%", "/" and " ". Long filenames are already catered > for in 4ed, perhaps we can extend "lnfs" to deal, optionally, with > this translation. is # a consideration? It's a valid filename char on FreeBSD From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 20:03:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 20:03:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7617 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 20:03:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7613 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 20:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 20:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 876721998C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:03:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D190199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:01:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g69B1kmk023468 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:01:50 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g69B1gbB023467 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:01:42 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Liberating the filename (Was: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing) Message-ID: <20020709130136.O20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709123641.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <020b01c22736$fc9d26f0$6501a8c0@xpire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <020b01c22736$fc9d26f0$6501a8c0@xpire>; from matt on Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 11:54:21AM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:01:38 +0200 On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 11:54:21AM +0100, matt wrote: > > is # a consideration? It's a valid filename char on FreeBSD I think it's valid in a Plan 9 filename, but if not, it's easy to expand the list to deal with it. Which reminds me, if we use fpath = (usr lucio fname) as a future description of a filepath, how do we designate the root? fpath = ('' usr lucio fname) perhaps? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 20:08:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 20:08:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7700 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 20:08:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7696 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 20:08:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 20:08:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0368619A3E; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:08:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 23FB2199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:07:30 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: Liberating the filename (Was: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing) References: <20020709101537.J20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709112119.K20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <20020709094321.9CACE199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20020709123641.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <020b01c22736$fc9d26f0$6501a8c0@xpire> <20020709130136.O20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Message-Id: <20020709110730.23FB2199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 20:07:25 +0900 >Which reminds me, if we use >fpath = (usr lucio fname) >as a future description of a filepath, how do we designate the >root? >fpath = ('' usr lucio fname) >perhaps? No, they should be: fpath = /usr/lucio/fname as it has been. No change is required for rc. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 20:28:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 20:28:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8001 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 20:28:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7997 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 20:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 20:28:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBAAD199E3; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:28:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 44833199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:27:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 66028 invoked by uid 18927); 9 Jul 2002 11:23:53 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 11:23:53 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-Reply-To: <20020709112856.L20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: <20020709051948.A66021-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 05:23:53 -0600 (MDT) umm, were you reading this from a unix machine? i think nemo meant that he's replacing ' ' with a non-ascii rune in p9 (maybe your font mistranslated it to '?' in the terminal?)... here's what the original looked like: I'm renaming ' ' with =E2^=D0=A3 in u9fs There's no problem doing that since there's no =E2^=D0=A3 in outside file names. andrey (who thinks nemo's solution looks quite ok) On Tue, 9 Jul 2002, Lucio De Re wrote: > On Tue, Jul 09, 2002 at 10:42:04AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > > I'm renaming ' ' with ? in u9fs > > There's no problem doing that since there's no ? > > in outside file names. > > There could be: > > -rw-r--r-- 1 lucio staff 0 Jul 9 11:22 t?uch > > produced by "touch t\?uch" on my NetBSD host. This is from > "man 2 intro" on NetBSD 1.5.2: > > File Name > Names consisting of up to 255 (MAXNAMELEN) characters may be= used > to name an ordinary file, special file, or directory. > > These characters may be selected from the set of all ASCII c= har- > acter excluding 0 (NUL) and the ASCII code for `/' (slash). = (The > parity bit, bit 7, must be 0.) > > Note that it is generally unwise to use `*', `?', `[' or `]'= as > part of file names because of the special meaning attached t= o > these characters by the shell. > > It needn't be up to date, but it's a safe indicator. > > ++L > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 20:38:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 20:38:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8139 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 20:38:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8135 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 20:38:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 20:38:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8BB219A29; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:38:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 60E941998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 07:37:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] any updated version of substfs? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:37:12 +0200 Someone sent me an early version of substfs. Is there an updated version of this? thanks From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 21:06:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 21:06:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8525 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 21:06:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8521 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 21:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 21:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E72E519A29; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:06:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (mta02-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.42]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44216199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:05:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020709120525.MFQS290.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:05:25 +0100 Message-ID: <022201c22740$ecbec270$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020709051948.A66021-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:05:30 +0100 >I'm renaming ' ' with ^У in u9fs >There's no problem doing that since there's no ^У >in outside file names. can't see them either but "there is no" could possibly become "oops now there is"? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 21:25:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 21:25:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8752 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 21:25:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8748 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 21:25:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 21:25:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71E4119A3F; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:25:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3F73C19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:24:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <33df334f48905ac986f6386fbc9a39c2@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vufapipuqycdfzdmefmjfzzaff" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:24:09 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vufapipuqycdfzdmefmjfzzaff Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The rune I was talking about is "open box, visible space" (0x2423) I'm sorry, but I thought all of us could accept utf mails. If there's ever such a rune being used in outside systems, you can always pick a different one (still unused). --upas-vufapipuqycdfzdmefmjfzzaff Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 14:06:18 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E72E519A29; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:06:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (mta02-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.42]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44216199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:05:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020709120525.MFQS290.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:05:25 +0100 Message-ID: <022201c22740$ecbec270$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020709051948.A66021-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 13:05:30 +0100 >I'm renaming ' ' with ^У in u9fs >There's no problem doing that since there's no ^У >in outside file names. can't see them either but "there is no" could possibly become "oops now there is"? --upas-vufapipuqycdfzdmefmjfzzaff-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 21:35:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 21:35:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8886 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 21:35:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8882 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 21:35:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 21:35:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3781319A4A; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:35:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7724F19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:34:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA03989 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:34:34 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g69CYZe07748; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:34:35 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g69CYWl18369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:34:32 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207091234.g69CYWl18369@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] any updated version of substfs? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Jul 2002 13:37:12 +0200." References: From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 14:34:32 +0200 This is a multipart MIME message. --==_Exmh_-12631520180 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Someone sent me an early version of substfs. > Is there an updated version of this? I did. No, I don't have anything newer. What you have is what I currently run. It is still 'unfinished, unpolished'. (see below) For those who missed my previous post about it, sort of a repost: What it does? It sits between 'us' and a (remote) file server. Its purpose is to do substitutions on file names in the 9p messages to and from the (remote) file server. Advantage of this approach: no need to adapt the (remote) file servers like u9fs), no need to adapt local stuff. Disadvantage: certainly some performance loss. Don't know whether the name substfs is correct, or whether something like substsrv would be better. For flexibility, to experiment, the substition rules are not built in. Instead, on its command line it is given the names of two programs that do back and forth translation. These translation programs just accept a filename on stdin and output the translation on stdout. The attached gzipped tar file contains the source and translation scripts I currently use. Inspiration and source code taken from multiple places (u9fs? 9pcon,... see my previous post) Status: it still contains memory leaks, which may be one of the reasons for the machine crash I mentioned in my earlier post of today, subject: Re: PGP) Also, translation is not yet done for all 9p messages that would need it, but that is easy enough to add. Main real problem is that it might loose directory entries, when reading directories, when translation of directory entry names extend these such that the result no longer fits in a single 9p message. Enjoy, Axel. --==_Exmh_-12631520180 Content-Type: application/octet-stream ; name="substfs.tgz" Content-Description: substfs.tgz Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="substfs.tgz" H4sIACvUKj0AA+0b23LbuDUPfaj4FYgTy9TNEuVbfJE7zdjOeiaX1kmnM+u4W5oEZdYkyCUh X5p4+gv9h/5ZX/oZ7TkHAEXJkmU12ey2I0wSkQfAueHcADD9QejzJz9tY4xtrq8z/GWsM/YL rbu+ydjWhtPd2HC2trYAstHpbj1hcxNatLlbPjjPZZCz1gH9idmPrJUzgCaCs5Zg0kufwuPT bRjD/VC2giyJ1ZNMGNtv+/yqLQZRxPZPuz3njFWtqSjldWJQwuM8KOcWa9HG2mr85Mmv4PfF v/79tye/HsL1Yq16j8Y0f3vY/7vOprMB/r++tbW5vkbPbGPL6S78/1u0Z6HwooHP2d5g9WLf Gr5G4bk3CjkPk1GAO5AXo5DAc6NoFCQvMu76o7DtFN+tQZSIfiXmee72eR7+lbMeO3733cHJ ++8bL5zt7q7lXbhZJZeuPB8Ep+Wus10rFBKDSuCrR4wfgQ8YWo4CSEhsBQAhlSTyt1MNGCDq eiW7AczFm1RvRPXwWtMNeHZ6BrOWzpP+IGcEZgq+BIivktC3BiiBjY8165NVCdIM6NndJlui nh1mYuLp6urqGWvn2VU759lV6HH2mbU85iVx7AofXwQTHMJjdun6fga6YacZjxPJu1EC2mX0 b1eBzj6KpdquVeE3ocxtRQsBd4qtusVjWI/Es0nTTBBz2MPqKbBeQWXoEQLxhIENoB7r1KxK Jb/NA1e6kb2khyxHfo0FbhjlS01mI8YazYp5nHNpp03WaTKCZFwOMsHSghOrzyXZhuDXNi5O 4DfZEQJYPfCaDEEX7hUnBvEl4gIZBIYQzPbZy+MPa933348y5rlCJDgzTbnYYcsZCj+ctWdm sWqVoRUKG+nSmjdwRNMMaBFx9rQ3ChgllgwiX6xIwsS01Q6JAsegzVc03yYSWqPYsdebLIAy KY1riKdVDFcoxnnXnU1UE3GNvyOI84skk/eZBFxeIq7edN8rFgnDEF3gGWyNyey6fnTL0FML BTB5m3K27BMNzd9p52xohFY6GF3669LayxtacW2emkMbFYlsvu++seVNk0nFailQ1GoTzLRY oCDJYldO4VDetPYRgqtT8lPtoDDoCJwKh+nlu85CyW1iWvOhVD6m8IJ4zsU96xj3gvsuQGpo t8tugv3oGx21cgINLyfnykE/aBLbaZz3h2YxqiHintk4eg9wMMAPBFhJ5OVBblYMRz/W1Ct3 Q8z3FwGlTwIWhBFniQAhpxleiVdlePdxzWVuDy0moAcmYBUwdoeeheZm+WGWut4lBm4K/6yu HAJNUeZNdhACqK4CuupH7VN3Dt0hGAL8gb8xCljHTCPCSBmNzNHlSRwdCzs4qF23KqwOysly WP8QVCUG8TnPUGNoCMgeoPYuuHfJ5AW/BW6SSxaFl9z0VUkfNNrN88QLXQnaySXI3s8Re9uq 5GggQLAi9C84hB3SMwvBGmSOvw2I/TW0iphRuHE2IVA2KII5m3YVFRuSYlEgpE5smQ4Qu0aG Bf2Vc7CTSzKhnNDio2g0yFZIHyF6jMxL+qCkrLRmMhBoBmVLAhtUXwNW8lz7IA4j7d5DoDUK uhIUMjhEPdSNys+FQoCKTSm+BqgabIwUauoLVKXMp14bUxmg3Aem2efPTJn+QUl3TaYYAfPJ KZwo/JUg4xzEJRxlmxoRu4IuCCyThiuFylHXepQQw6AT34Klq3Bh63iT3ZQiMFl6nfna9AWM LtIwLHsmAbV2EEjxdZ7iO4WjK+3ZGYTUJAigCBg6MU7UKuVRzlXwMdCstR+EfmsfSIET8Jvd 0RmqMDFqxYDtQ0BATAhPG0gPQpSQOPT6AkKNDXXLHuNpDTO9rVDtKVFIr9mVTikHkFKq/imN gHUAgXjaSs2SwbC9YoFHLTtFLaPEmlNt3SjVuDRAyuhNGk6Rb9aaIBOskolK1GX5yQ9YyhYp QoeezDOPgRiGJLQnp9NdP9PRHurd/Z6J9hMDYk75DKpQeFSxEU0w80gFKtchVaIHUQVKARt7 Gw4NmIHSTwTXSB8YTvsBGF0eiTAiTDFY+yYmpkfgKQliUhnqArj34tQmSRCOXqY1Y9wEhviD 1Daz7hgtqenMvN1SzlCrQ0tTLAkthB5u1k3tQ7QGl/BNVwCjiHB38jAitX8xiPBNI9J4yLkv YNMA5j/Jr8d3IoXmSgUZqE9vIcpVGu2qMLlOS6ujGMyyTxttihq95jisKIQ0KTmVVHnykI6J bRByeJZByDaFlHESgioNqHIPHPCEgLsE4sKNEUYg9hv9u8OW0izpZ24cQ1Im2NKQWAbZJQ8T MSWKHoV+miTIREqE//D+8MAOKLboVcputKQFRtxBf010UrreYxEe4TYwAB1Q+oUIBthx0Sma TSIzcX1gLPhi5CsXLObC048hpi+MdPAEIC9Kck5kyixfu9HlXAybGixUyZqVszUyL65xaeG9 0VDOjkCCQeZFhtDxyjBd0t6TFmOIPcSIqU3SG4hT0xF2gvLAJ7QO5tHXqMKQxGlBrOVgeB/V H8QqTKtT4zyqlfbq3NcudzfUeQK75bl03qM6dJD+XEbiQaiXk6PcdJZ/VrOmfPY4fmmf4Ruz FsUTGvhPq/4JQ0GmVQyXMP7GDDcw4xQlUPX3Hw6OT6aXG1AScU8m2e1TbYUVgdorbb3GKyK1 QaeaCTY72jfIzXvayUFDQ+eeQLVFyj8Fec9AigOSIkRcpjav4NOqSQCYaguAKgOw0C8VzUq5 TayQhf8I33v77r7cd1PjH5VcvwBnnOJ50UDMF59/IvbwwPOK30da8jgc8EtgdbImsWr7Wtxh yPC/kEv0ZLMvRZdD/pTzCfVYxdpTHYHXytsiNPui7kL2yyflU/Jei8TfGRlqPOMhZzLztBur eDDdl76mjr9EtxPZg3eRwBY89OvIwbCEhbqSdnsZVsL6hFTxSOwrDlQyQBHqLKDD+yAt1W7Y YSsKNeqEtdndpbUqam3CX6WqXm13IfJKebud1sYC6V7LHJwVo/UZfxVV2TEbNK0Y2OWu6hI7 U08Nx4Ddvoa6fQTl16GEAlUPI/Y8F1b/QxAN8oudkR236tA1N3UVBXgVdUK8qIL43iysq9UU qrBnj6fCWc9QRfTMOVhiqRlUw84cT5aM8HYbFLdK10iQCiHn0aUTIiL7nU24wKQtfuYMLPjU BCr9Zo5X9ZaaoWuvmXMwWZbEQ7nGxaOiaLZ4mBG1eJQcZ7OLSUpzS/nqEcxistjRXFHieGAO 7MPdQaRUXr7aE5ciuRbF0fSIz1RKQZKw4ml2+aanTOBuhkO29gvkUjtkeb9OlxOqR5X5MM+C 2C6gBvFiXx8zwFNxrpee4g2quvALU26nxVlu+ZhReyvEkkubztFIeS0HFVHiDvv1XgOP5U2l 94O+leQ33CMIze7gZDx0SU87Z+pyo/yujpkofgLEUQUbYojspfZ5KNqZB1pYUv+28F8Qq0lH w2OZByc9hqvS4hqy6j6huMU8pf3XcP8Uu6GggO1m/eJUrg4vV6W7glimkEPr+pJ3V6ld8cql fs0DX68Dji7Oes3FsHmHWeY8n5sz1d+evHp5+Or4rVmUlYMVkkAbkDoZNvalRuQ0Yoj8EHAc 2ermWh2zjY6PabzmbNZgT5EnTp373YK6Ffsj3SXta+SoaiB2+PZA2ScqGYzTqZWHQIKLZYiF CuQ1kL2JFTeAKE+Xet6onjgBOvd7j1bwaggeVZ+lvgbATYG+khi7T5MPdqtLLtBAtYprPMav 6qOjcTzyUsfRxkHRdrTVUTGEtweA4VNptB+6EQJj+izAzAA7Bxj6wnaQL9UoN3eMV+G1Dc02 1zTDmzXENrzPQ5plWpQkCgrvTg7+eDILYVK6gKdw1m6nSS5j3Mfl2ZVdpZIJnqB2UBbYZMpF 3pwc/u41zmq3lWsqX1YFKi1+r8fW1G6v+MZjXHc6UBSffIz3d88MXybige8VMW8oBnYVYqC4 iteaEh4lCny7EAD9F1ZtgjrUSLac63tKg0d7N5EHphUKxTyGl59h/eNLvKqd+7Ohudqs7z/X HKf4/nO9s4bffzkb64vvv75F22s/T87/gtV4W5mCZVkfIP729B7Hst4dHb8+fN/7aFXMt4LP 3320rO8U2LKesdfHL3tDNFF4jn+301XXenn8ttQD+dvaa4MVtvPMa4NzAslEAEXXw33U80+K 1M7y83e9ZYThTg+q5PoqvrDPrJ/xlLWu2Mqfrt1MhKK/wtg+w06rsvD//8r/iw9w57acxzeG 3r0x3f+dtY3C/zfX6PvPTcdZ+P+3aM+e6rLaeub1/vn3f1he78+fBiL0oGRinY7bubP8MuSm 23G27yx0y89Mejl+vNgK2IsXG9st57PM2ApbWQG3fO49962F//9v+L9M5rabedps/18f+j/+ XxC20d1a+P83aV/m/xn5ufF5HRBMNLAW/v/L9/+5DWbRFm3RFm3R/i/afwA3cipqADwAAA== --==_Exmh_-12631520180-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 21:42:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 21:42:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9010 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 21:42:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9006 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 21:42:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 21:42:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0696E1998C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:42:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 229D619A4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 08:41:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA04201 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:41:49 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g69Cfoe08617; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:41:50 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g69CflJ18428 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 14:41:47 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207091241.g69CflJ18428@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] any updated version of substfs? In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Jul 2002 14:34:32 +0200." <200207091234.g69CYWl18369@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <200207091234.g69CYWl18369@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 14:41:46 +0200 in addition to my previous message, minor addition to the guide file, to show usage (where one and two could be unix machines running u9fs) substfs -m q -s subone -n tcp!one!9fs edit-from edit-to >/dev/null >[2=1] & substfs -m q -s subtwo -n tcp!two!9fs edit-from edit-to >/dev/null >[2=1] & mount /srv/subone /n/one mount /srv/subtwo /n/two Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 9 22:30:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 9 22:30:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9626 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Jul 2002 22:30:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9622 invoked from network); 9 Jul 2002 22:30:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Jul 2002 22:30:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C33F19A58; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:30:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95ACF1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 09:29:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA05857 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:29:44 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g69DTje15330; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:29:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g69DTg018651 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 15:29:42 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207091329.g69DTg018651@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:29:42 +0200 After I replaced an ISA 10Mbit 3com 3c509(B?) ethernet card by a PCI one in my pcauth server, it seems that repeated (hot) booting (by ^P) toggles the PCI card from 'on' to 'off' to 'on' to etc., as shown by the link led on the switch at the other end of the UTP cable. The led on the PCI card is on even when the link is down (acc. to switch). Once I (finally) realized the alternating sequence, I did not try cold boots to see their effect. I had the impression an older pcdisk kernel works, but my observations of what worked and what not might be wrong if it really was alternating, since by accident I might just have tried the pcdisk kernel in the working state (and the pcauth in the not-working one). I tried going back to older kernels (built from older sources), without much result (but the problem is that I updated the sources so I don't know the exact relation between kernels I have and source files versions (dates) :-( I'm aware that the above is rather vague; if there is any particular information I could provide to help diagnose/debug, please just ask. (I thought of enabling debugging in the etherlink3 driver, but by the time I realized the alternating nature of the problem, and thus an 'easy' way to again have a 'working' system, real work started to kick in -- and I don't know exactely what I'm looking for -- but again, please ask for what can help to diagnose). in case it helps, below follows output of the pci command: (I can just look for the text on the card if that would help more) dorknoper# pci 0.0.0: 06.00.00 8086/122d 0 0.11.0: 03.00.00 5333/883d 11 0:f4000000 67108864 0.7.0: 06.01.00 8086/122e 0 0.7.1: 01.01.80 8086/1230 0 4:0000e801 16 0.9.0: 02.00.00 10b7/5900 10 0:0000e401 32 dorknoper# Thanks, Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:22:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:22:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11108 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11104 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E683A19A1C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:22:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 437E71998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 0.3 (built May 13 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ00FXXMNYMH@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:21:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FNP431828 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:23:25 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091523.g69FNP431828@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:23:25 -0400 (EDT) You're not going to do that every time you make a change to the filesystem. Besides, that won't undo all the "changes" to all the new programs that lack complexity because they don't have to reinvent the wheel. - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > >> But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my > >> local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. > ... > > Undoing kernel-level changes won't be easy, especially when people start > > 9fs dump > cp blah blah > > Sorry, couldn't resist. I just love this system :-) > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:24:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:24:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11186 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:24:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11182 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:24:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:24:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E16C19A2F; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:24:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA0A819A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:23:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ008Q2MQA18@mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:22:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FPLX32033 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:25:21 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <3D2A9DA1.60602@strakt.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091525.g69FPLX32033@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:25:21 -0400 (EDT) Whoops ... I misspelled that one. A more appropriate comment for you, though, would have been to put it in libarms ;-P - Dave Boyd Roberts wrote: > > Dave wrote: > > >It's possible that cannonization should still be done by library routines, > > > Yes, put it in libpope. > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:33:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:33:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11302 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:33:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11298 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:33:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:33:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F6B819A33; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:33:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F7BE19A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:32:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ00B04N1MKV@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:29:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FV9k32658 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:31:09 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-reply-to: <20020709084306.5515C19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091531.g69FV9k32658@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:31:09 -0400 (EDT) I think that'll do more to break current conventions than redoing the kernel to allow for analogues of our current conventions. - Dave arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > >What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign > >system? > Check before you copy, otherwise one is lost. > This problem is always happen when one to one mapping is > absent. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:34:14 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:34:14 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11325 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:34:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11321 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:34:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:34:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37E9E19A57; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:34:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5D81A19A57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:33:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <311b5345545f6855154e357171523baf@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 3com 3c509 PCI (B?) alternating boot link on/off problem MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:33:17 -0400 Some 3com cards don't so well when, for instance, you run some variant of MS Windows, Ctrl-Alt-Del and bring up another OS, the card is in a funny state. It may be to do with power management. What might be useful is the exact model of the card in question, and what the initial card configuration is in the EEPROM (there should be a 3Com diag. programme to that will tell you). It's also possible we should really shut the card down on ^P to prevent problems with lingering busmastering. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:35:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:35:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11344 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:35:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11340 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:35:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:35:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD10319A5A; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:35:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 269D319A5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:34:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id AFEFAD8D00FC; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 08:23:27 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Tue Jul 09 08:23:26 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2B0279.6050907@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how to unsubscribe References: <20020709031716.3805.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 08:34:17 -0700 Scott Schwartz wrote: > | Nitesh Garg wrote: > | > I want to unsubscribe from this group > | > pls tell me how ??????????????? > > Sam: > | Was it the crappy web browser? Speaking of crappy web browser, as a relative newcomer to Plan 9 I love the plumbing trick with acme. I tweaked both Rob and Micah's tips. Micah's didn't work for me out of the gate, because it was feeding 'image http://blah.blah.blah' as the URL to wurl2img, so instead I took Rob's match and mangled it to: '(https?|ftp|file|gopher|mailto|news|nntp|telnet|wais|prospero)://[a-zA-Z0-9_@\-]+([.:][a-zA-Z0-9_@\-]+)*/?[a-zA-Z0-9_?,%#~&/\-+=]+([:.][a-zA-Z0-9_?,%#~&/\-+=]+)*[.](gif|jpg|png)+' (which is probably wrong, but works) so that URLs for images will pop open a separate window, and other URLs fall back to htmlfmt. Most of this is also covered in plumb(6) for the edification of my fellow newbies. Hindsight is 20/20. Also on the newbie front, the Plan 9 wiki is insanely useful but I've noticed that the step-by-step guides are not always sequential. Are there any guidelines for submitting changes or are we encouraged to just go for it? -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 00:41:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 00:41:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11396 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 00:41:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11392 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 00:41:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 00:41:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42B8F19A58; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3818A19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:40:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ00D3UMV2XY@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:25:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FTj832499 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:29:45 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091529.g69FTj832499@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:29:45 -0400 (EDT) AFAIK, VFAT uses Unicode for its long file names, so I see no reason why ␣ shouldn't be allowed there. - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > : Wrong! What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign > : system? Back to the drawing board, everyone, the problem needs > : another, slightly more focussed iteration. > > I'm renaming ' ' with ␣ in u9fs > There's no problem doing that since there's no ␣ > in outside file names. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 01:03:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 01:03:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11606 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 01:03:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11602 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 01:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 01:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99F7519A5F; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:03:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3713519980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:02:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A693AF9400FC; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 08:51:47 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Tue Jul 09 08:51:46 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2B091D.4070209@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020709031716.3805.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Wahoo! (Warning: Blatant Newbie Bliss) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 09:02:37 -0700 I just want to say: FUN! In my little test bed I've got a 1GHz CPU/auth/fs server, a 100MHz terminal booting off the fs, and about 40GB of venti storage currently backing up my samba/netatalk shares via u9fs. I'm so thoroughly impressed by its usability and performance I can hardly contain myself. It's pretty slick having a terminal that's an order of magnitude slower than the CPU server and not worrying about it (or even noticing) in the least. Good video and Ethernet cards go a long way. Plus, less than a week of rc scripting has noticeably changed the way I now deal with bash. The experience has been invaluable. As a side note, I used to be an Oberon addict, and I became interested in Plan 9 years ago through Rob's work with acme. With the VMS/NeXT/Linux asides in the interim, in so many ways finally putting Plan 9 to work feels a lot more like coming home than a diversion. Thank you. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 01:16:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 01:16:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11770 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 01:16:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11766 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 01:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 01:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5731819A33; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:16:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4D60E199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 12:15:26 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] upas/fs -f/pop/... From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020709161526.4D60E199EC@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 17:15:09 0100 > since a few people using Plan 9 also use Demon Internet, i'd thought > i'd mention that when reading the source i noticed that (probably) the pop3 support in > upas/fs won't work correctly with Demon Internet's pop3 service > because that reorders and thus renumbers messages on each call. Confirmed. I had the same problem with the Inferno email program on my Philips IS2630 phone. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 07:16:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 07:16:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14429 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 07:16:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14425 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 07:16:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 07:16:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C52619A57; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:16:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 743B119A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 18:15:07 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing References: <200207091531.g69FV9k32658@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020709221507.743B119A08@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:15:01 +0900 Copy Restriction: Check before you copy, otherwise some of them may be lost Import Resrinction: Files containg spaces in name is harmful, so they may be lost. Export Restriction: Winland is against freedom, so some of files may be lost. >I think that'll do more to break current conventions than redoing the >kernel to allow for analogues of our current conventions. > > - Dave > > >arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: >> >> >What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign >> >system? >> Check before you copy, otherwise one is lost. >> This problem is always happen when one to one mapping is >> absent. >> >> Kenji Arisawa >> From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 14:13:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 14:13:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24157 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 14:13:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24153 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 14:13:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 14:13:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD19C19A57; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:13:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B5FD919A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:12:12 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710051212.B5FD919A02@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:11:30 +0900 Why perm parameter definitions for create(2) are changed? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 14:34:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 14:34:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24614 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 14:34:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24610 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 14:34:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 14:34:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 646DF19A58; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:34:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6465819A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:33:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9123643e5057a6228d67bf44da4eda7d@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:33:32 -0400 > Why perm parameter definitions for create(2) are changed? CHDIR is discontinued. It's now DMDIR for Dir.mode, and QTDIR for Qid.type. These are different values (due to Qid.type being a seperate 8 bit field) so they get different names. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 14:47:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 14:47:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24982 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 14:47:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24978 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 14:47:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 14:47:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD8DF19A63; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:47:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3E35019981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:46:18 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710054618.3E35019981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] afd in mount(2) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:45:40 +0900 What's the difference of authentication scheme between release 3 and 4? In release 3, if we can open connection to a file server, we don't need authetication every time, and just call mount() without afd. Why afd is neccessary in release 4's mount(2)? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 15:00:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 15:00:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25301 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 15:00:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25290 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 15:00:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 15:00:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AACFA19A62; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:00:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B330219A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:59:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-uluqanttmydxfhdmvlpgrbmnpm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:58:54 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-uluqanttmydxfhdmvlpgrbmnpm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i suspect: to help track down the previous uses (in Qid.path, for instance) that needed to be changed (indeed, removed and replaced by QTDIR in Qid.type). the new names also associates the bits more strongly, by a DM prefix, with the Dir Mode to which they belong. --upas-uluqanttmydxfhdmvlpgrbmnpm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026278004:10:00249:21; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 05:13:24 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1000295; 10 Jul 2002 5:13 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD19C19A57; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:13:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B5FD919A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:12:12 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710051212.B5FD919A02@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:11:30 +0900 Why perm parameter definitions for create(2) are changed? Kenji --upas-uluqanttmydxfhdmvlpgrbmnpm-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 15:05:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 15:05:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25420 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 15:05:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25416 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 15:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 15:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BF0A19A64; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:05:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9A02419981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:04:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5346454785f776204a85e45163bd1e1b@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] afd in mount(2) From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bstputvsudqyfgbjjneejepprp" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:04:29 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bstputvsudqyfgbjjneejepprp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it was done to remove all details of the authentication procedure from both protocol and kernel. see /sys/doc/auth.ps for more information. --upas-bstputvsudqyfgbjjneejepprp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026280044:10:25432:101; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 05:47:24 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id ab1128895; 10 Jul 2002 5:47 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD8DF19A63; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:47:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3E35019981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 01:46:18 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710054618.3E35019981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] afd in mount(2) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:45:40 +0900 What's the difference of authentication scheme between release 3 and 4? In release 3, if we can open connection to a file server, we don't need authetication every time, and just call mount() without afd. Why afd is neccessary in release 4's mount(2)? Kenji --upas-bstputvsudqyfgbjjneejepprp-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 15:30:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 15:30:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26029 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 15:30:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26025 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 15:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 15:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C18E19A65; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:30:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 97BD719A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:29:10 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] afd in mount(2) From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710062910.97BD719A08@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:28:32 +0900 >see /sys/doc/auth.ps for more information. Thanks a lot. I remind now someone also recommended to read this document. It'll take some more time to me to introduce new networked Plan 9 system here. factotum, venti, .. anything else? Kenji-- hate using anything beyond my comprehension :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 15:47:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 15:47:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26457 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 15:47:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26453 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 15:47:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 15:47:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F76F19A57; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:47:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 61CC819A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:46:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9e11ad93789992d30b783e65349806e8@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] afd in mount(2) From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-fsurikgcmncnxepviisskpbnus" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 07:46:21 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-fsurikgcmncnxepviisskpbnus Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit venti is currently optional--i don't use it yet myself--and factotum looks after itself (you'll see a few different prompts, but otherwise it doesn't require care and attention). one difference for authentication is that authdom= auth= pairs are needed in /lib/ndb/local for each authentication domain you need. auth=sources.cs.bell-labs.com authdom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com for instance. if you've written your own file servers, you'll have some work to do. there are big differences in the C libraries and programming interface. see /sys/doc/release4.ps and /sys/doc/prog4.ps to see where to start. the file server kernel source is a little more convenient for configuration compared to the previous release. --upas-fsurikgcmncnxepviisskpbnus Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026282650:10:00747:1; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:30:50 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115474; 10 Jul 2002 6:30 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C18E19A65; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:30:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 97BD719A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 02:29:10 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] afd in mount(2) From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710062910.97BD719A08@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:28:32 +0900 >see /sys/doc/auth.ps for more information. Thanks a lot. I remind now someone also recommended to read this document. It'll take some more time to me to introduce new networked Plan 9 system here. factotum, venti, .. anything else? Kenji-- hate using anything beyond my comprehension :-) --upas-fsurikgcmncnxepviisskpbnus-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 16:03:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 16:03:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26886 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 16:03:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26882 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 16:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 16:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D9D819A66; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 03:03:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 300D0199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 03:02:26 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] afd in mount(2) From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020710070226.300D0199EC@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:01:48 +0900 Thanks again. I'm now printing those ps files using your bsdlp program from partially connected kfs based Release 4 machine. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 16:58:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 16:58:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28215 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 16:58:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28211 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 16:58:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 16:58:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C09419981; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 03:58:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6E69C19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 03:57:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:57:03 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit There's no reason. I though of using ☺, but I think it's more usual in file names than ␣. --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 17:41:20 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42B8F19A58; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3818A19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:40:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ00D3UMV2XY@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:25:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FTj832499 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:29:45 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091529.g69FTj832499@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:29:45 -0400 (EDT) AFAIK, VFAT uses Unicode for its long file names, so I see no reason why ␣ shouldn't be allowed there. - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > : Wrong! What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign > : system? Back to the drawing board, everyone, the problem needs > : another, slightly more focussed iteration. > > I'm renaming ' ' with ␣ in u9fs > There's no problem doing that since there's no ␣ > in outside file names. > --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 17:01:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 17:01:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28264 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 17:01:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28260 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 17:01:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 17:01:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6F4119A64; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 04:01:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5D10419A63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 04:00:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <50c37649c99f29c8786d27573bb88627@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:00:48 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Really, I make changes now and then; many times after trying the resulting binaries I change my mind and use yesterday + cp to restore the source back to its previous state. Some other times I bind temporary directories on top of the sources and make the changes there. --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 17:22:23 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E683A19A1C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:22:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 437E71998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 0.3 (built May 13 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GYZ00FXXMNYMH@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:21:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g69FNP431828 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:23:25 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207091523.g69FNP431828@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:23:25 -0400 (EDT) You're not going to do that every time you make a change to the filesystem. Besides, that won't undo all the "changes" to all the new programs that lack complexity because they don't have to reinvent the wheel. - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > >> But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my > >> local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. > ... > > Undoing kernel-level changes won't be easy, especially when people start > > 9fs dump > cp blah blah > > Sorry, couldn't resist. I just love this system :-) > --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 21:55:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 21:55:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 554 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 21:55:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 550 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 21:55:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 21:55:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7674C19A69; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:55:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9D31819A68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 08:54:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 287158 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 06:54:42 -0600 Received: from snaresland.acl.lanl.gov (128.165.147.113) by acl.lanl.gov with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 06:54:42 -0600 Received: (qmail 19217 invoked by uid 3499); 10 Jul 2002 06:54:41 -0600 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 06:54:41 -0600 From: Ronald G Minnich X-X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR In-Reply-To: <9123643e5057a6228d67bf44da4eda7d@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 06:54:41 -0600 (MDT) stupid question but I tried to find a URL for the 9p2000 description and failed, anyone have one. Ron, who is Finally back to getting v9fs up ... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 22:05:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 22:05:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 718 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 22:05:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 714 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 22:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 22:05:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0080519A6B; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:05:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D593519A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:04:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <16af5ff0dd876e78909c288bfc606db1@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:05:05 -0400 > stupid question but I tried to find a URL for the 9p2000 description and > failed, anyone have one. The section 5 man pages are supposed to be definitive. We tried to make them accurate, complete and clear. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 22:08:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 22:08:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 773 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 22:08:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 769 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 22:08:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 22:08:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 719F719A6E; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:08:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51A2819A6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 09:07:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6AD7lmk026607 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:07:50 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6AD7h4M026606 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:07:43 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] CHDIR or DMDIR Message-ID: <20020710150736.B20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <9123643e5057a6228d67bf44da4eda7d@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Ronald G Minnich on Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 06:54:41AM -0600 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:07:38 +0200 On Wed, Jul 10, 2002 at 06:54:41AM -0600, Ronald G Minnich wrote: > > stupid question but I tried to find a URL for the 9p2000 description and > failed, anyone have one. > man 5 intro (I won't hazard a guess at the web entry at Bell Labs, but you can find your way there without much difficulty). ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 10 23:32:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 10 23:32:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1964 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Jul 2002 23:32:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1960 invoked from network); 10 Jul 2002 23:32:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Jul 2002 23:32:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31B1219A70; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:32:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9232E19A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 10:31:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17SIeA-00003S-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:40:50 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020710164050.A202@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] 3D reconstruction sw runs on Plan 9! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:40:50 +0200 Hi, you can grab nuages-2.6.tbz from the neXt archive ftp://neXt.gli.cas.cz/plan9/4e Learn more at its home http://www-sop.inria.fr/prisme/logiciel/nuages.html.en Enjoy (or not)! Cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 01:11:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 01:11:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3095 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 01:11:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3091 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 01:11:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 01:11:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F89019A69; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:11:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86A9E19A6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:10:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ1000ALIWD25@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:55:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6AFvUG12615 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 15:57:30 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing In-reply-to: from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207101557.g6AFvUG12615@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:57:30 -0400 (EDT) ...so clearly, there's no way to distinguish between a file 'a b' and a file 'a␣b' in a remote filesystem if we replace ' ' with '␣' upon importing to our system :-( - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv > Content-Disposition: inline > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > > There's no reason. > I though of using ☺, but I think it's more > usual in file names than ␣. > > --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv > Content-Type: message/rfc822 > Content-Disposition: inline > > Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 17:41:20 MDT 2002 > Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP > id 42B8F19A58; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:41:09 -0400 (EDT) > Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3818A19980 > for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:40:44 -0400 (EDT) > Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) > by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) > with ESMTP id <0GYZ00D3UMV2XY@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; > Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:25:50 -0400 (EDT) > Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) > id g69FTj832499 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:29:45 +0000 (GMT) > From: Dave > Subject: Re: [9fans] acme question + diffs for kfs, fs and plumbing > In-reply-to: from > > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Message-id: <200207091529.g69FTj832499@dave2.dave.tj> > MIME-version: 1.0 > X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] > Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 > Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT > Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> > List-Archive: > Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:29:45 -0400 (EDT) > > AFAIK, VFAT uses Unicode for its long file names, so I see no reason > why ␣ shouldn't be allowed there. > > - Dave > > > Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > > : Wrong! What if files 'a b' and 'a_b' both exist on the foreign > > : system? Back to the drawing board, everyone, the problem needs > > : another, slightly more focussed iteration. > > > > I'm renaming ' ' with ␣ in u9fs > > There's no problem doing that since there's no ␣ > > in outside file names. > > > > --upas-gyhymjcadgjxkouzirlpoqbniv-- > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 01:26:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 01:26:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3238 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 01:26:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3234 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 01:26:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 01:26:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40F9219A73; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:26:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97F1219A71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:25:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ100M7NJ3SKO@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 11:59:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6AG2CH12715 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:02:12 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <50c37649c99f29c8786d27573bb88627@plan9.escet.urjc.es> from To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207101602.g6AG2CH12715@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 12:02:12 -0400 (EDT) You're missing the point: With the changes I propose to our kernel, certain programs will be able to have much simpler logic. In addition to undoing the changes in the kernel, you'd have to rewrite the "offending" program - only manual recoding can accomplish that. - Dave Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu > Content-Disposition: inline > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Really, I make changes now and then; many times after > trying the resulting binaries I change my mind and > use yesterday + cp to restore the source back to its > previous state. Some other times I bind temporary directories > on top of the sources and make the changes there. > > > --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu > Content-Type: message/rfc822 > Content-Disposition: inline > > Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Jul 9 17:22:23 MDT 2002 > Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP > id E683A19A1C; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:22:09 -0400 (EDT) > Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.4]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 437E71998C > for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Jul 2002 11:21:03 -0400 (EDT) > Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) > by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net > (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 0.3 (built May 13 2002)) > with ESMTP id <0GYZ00FXXMNYMH@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; > Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:21:34 -0400 (EDT) > Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) > id g69FNP431828 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Jul 2002 15:23:25 +0000 (GMT) > From: Dave > Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names > In-reply-to: from > > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Message-id: <200207091523.g69FNP431828@dave2.dave.tj> > MIME-version: 1.0 > X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] > Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu > X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 > Precedence: bulk > Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> > List-Archive: > Date: Tue, 09 Jul 2002 11:23:25 -0400 (EDT) > > You're not going to do that every time you make a change to the > filesystem. Besides, that won't undo all the "changes" to all the > new programs that lack complexity because they don't have to reinvent > the wheel. > > - Dave > > > Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > > >> But above all, I will undo the changes made in this respect to my > > >> local system if you guys or the system designers choose a different way. > > ... > > > Undoing kernel-level changes won't be easy, especially when people start > > > > 9fs dump > > cp blah blah > > > > Sorry, couldn't resist. I just love this system :-) > > > > --upas-xuojoahyqverhjcrtrjsvosjtu-- > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 03:28:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 03:28:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4237 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 03:28:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4233 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 03:28:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 03:28:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19CE119A69; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:28:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B41FE19A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:27:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 14:27:38 -0400 Isn't this thread dead yet? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 05:55:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 05:55:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5190 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 05:55:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5186 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 05:55:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 05:55:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6903A19A63; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:55:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A76919981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:54:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-32-219.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.32.219]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id WAA23960 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:54:00 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-32-219.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.32.219] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D2CA01D.813CC8A4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207101602.g6AG2CH12715@dave2.dave.tj> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:59:09 +0200 Dave ha escrito: > > You're missing the point: With the changes I propose to our kernel, > certain programs will be able to have much simpler logic. In addition to > undoing the changes in the kernel, you'd have to rewrite the "offending" > program - only manual recoding can accomplish that. > No offending program if there's no native ' ' in file names. Just have to cope with those still seen from the outside world. I have a working trfs that deals with most cases here (still will miss names inside files). I'll send it tomorrow. Changing open just because of this would mean to rethink many tools and nobody knows (because there's no experience with your proposed system) if it would introduce other problems. So I'd vote no. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 05:57:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 05:57:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5221 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5217 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 05:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 425C019A72; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:57:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C0B6C19A77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 16:56:49 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: Message-Id: <20020710205649.C0B6C19A77@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:56:43 +0900 >Isn't this thread dead yet? It seems ... So I asked: Is it important? So I said: My preference is just s/ /_/g So I proposed: uq (unquote) Any way, I dislike ' ' in file name. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 06:01:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 06:01:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5251 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 06:01:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5247 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 06:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 06:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95CE919A7C; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:01:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (mta07-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B479019981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:00:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020710210023.QTFG19225.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:23 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c22854$d414ebe0$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020710164050.A202@next.gli.cas.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] ndb cluelessness & VGA trouble :) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:28 +0100 Trying to set a cpu/auth server I'm behind a NAT box. My external hostname is pc1-nott2-3-cust35.not.cable.ntl.com but that is subject to change with DHCP renewals I'm a bit stuck with choosing a correct authdom. All the examples I've seen have reversable internet domain names. Also is this tied to dns domain? ndb/local below extra points for getting my ati rage 2C to do erasing. xor highlighting works in acme but I get one screen of shell and then it overwites like a teletype It worked fine yesterday in 3rd Ed.*AND* in the install :( This is the same problem Berlin Brown reported on 28 Jun. http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=d1b333 13.0206271852.44c96e9d%40posting.google.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dati%2B group:comp.os.plan9%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3D d%26selm%3Dd1b33313.0206271852.44c96e9d%2540posting.google.com%26rnum%3D2 He bought a 3dfx card. My voodoo 5 fails the 3dfx test voodoo 5 vgainfo.txt attached I added these to vgadb vid=0x121A did=0x0009 # voodoo 5500 0xC0056="Voodoo5 5500 BIOS" # Voodoo5 5500 but on boot get aux/vga: 3dfx: unknown chip - DID 0009 M extract from my ndb/local sys=tiger ip=192.168.1.109 ether=00c0f0404d88 sys=gw ip=192.168.1.1 ether=002078C5EB1A ipnet=lucid ip=192.168.1.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=gw dns=194.168.4.100 dns=194.168.8.100 auth=tiger cpu=tiger authdom=??? dnsdomain=??? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 06:36:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 06:36:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5560 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 06:36:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5556 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 06:36:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 06:36:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 731B019A63; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:36:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3F82819A63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:35:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb cluelessness & VGA trouble :) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lfrbxpeeyeijbboeupqfilnoiq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:36:09 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lfrbxpeeyeijbboeupqfilnoiq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think if you add a new case to both /sys/src/9/pc/vga3dfx.c and /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/3dfx.c at the appropriate spot, i.e. case 0x0003: /* Banshee */ case 0x0005: /* Avenger (a.k.a. Voodoo3) */ case 0x0009: /* Voodoo5 */ it has a good chance of working. --upas-lfrbxpeeyeijbboeupqfilnoiq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Jul 10 17:01:38 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Jul 10 17:01:37 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 715D319A7B; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:01:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (mta07-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B479019981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:00:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020710210023.QTFG19225.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:23 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c22854$d414ebe0$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020710164050.A202@next.gli.cas.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] ndb cluelessness & VGA trouble :) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:28 +0100 Trying to set a cpu/auth server I'm behind a NAT box. My external hostname is pc1-nott2-3-cust35.not.cable.ntl.com but that is subject to change with DHCP renewals I'm a bit stuck with choosing a correct authdom. All the examples I've seen have reversable internet domain names. Also is this tied to dns domain? ndb/local below extra points for getting my ati rage 2C to do erasing. xor highlighting works in acme but I get one screen of shell and then it overwites like a teletype It worked fine yesterday in 3rd Ed.*AND* in the install :( This is the same problem Berlin Brown reported on 28 Jun. http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=d1b333 13.0206271852.44c96e9d%40posting.google.com&rnum=2&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dati%2B group:comp.os.plan9%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26scoring%3D d%26selm%3Dd1b33313.0206271852.44c96e9d%2540posting.google.com%26rnum%3D2 He bought a 3dfx card. My voodoo 5 fails the 3dfx test voodoo 5 vgainfo.txt attached I added these to vgadb vid=0x121A did=0x0009 # voodoo 5500 0xC0056="Voodoo5 5500 BIOS" # Voodoo5 5500 but on boot get aux/vga: 3dfx: unknown chip - DID 0009 M extract from my ndb/local sys=tiger ip=192.168.1.109 ether=00c0f0404d88 sys=gw ip=192.168.1.1 ether=002078C5EB1A ipnet=lucid ip=192.168.1.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=gw dns=194.168.4.100 dns=194.168.8.100 auth=tiger cpu=tiger authdom=??? dnsdomain=??? --upas-lfrbxpeeyeijbboeupqfilnoiq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 06:42:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 06:42:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5598 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 06:42:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5594 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 06:42:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 06:42:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AC5D19A72; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:42:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3436419A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:41:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5ad34eaf3625fb00e0770452a98f0904@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb cluelessness & VGA trouble :) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:42:08 -0400 The example I gave in the previous message was for /sys/src/9/pc/vga3dfx.c. The equivalent in /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/3dfx.c is case 0x0003: /* Banshee */ vga->f[1] = 270000000; break; case 0x0005: /* Avenger (a.k.a. Voodoo3) */ vga->f[1] = 300000000; break; case 0x0009: /* Voodoo5 */ vga->f[1] = 350000000; break; From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 06:49:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 06:49:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5670 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 06:49:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5666 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 06:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 06:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDBD019A80; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:49:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47D6219981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:48:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ100CKEZ7LBX@mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:47:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6ALp7c06267 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:51:07 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <3D2CA01D.813CC8A4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207102151.g6ALp7c06267@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:51:07 -0400 (EDT) The "offending" program in this case is the program that's so much simpler because it's using the new kernel interface rather than the old one. Nothing has to be rethought because all my proposed changes do is restore the strict seperation between nodes in a filename (something UNIX - and therefore Plan 9 - likes to rely on). There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty well documented, by now. - Dave FJ Ballesteros wrote: > > > > Dave ha escrito: > > > > You're missing the point: With the changes I propose to our kernel, > > certain programs will be able to have much simpler logic. In addition to > > undoing the changes in the kernel, you'd have to rewrite the "offending" > > program - only manual recoding can accomplish that. > > > > No offending program if there's no native ' ' in file names. Just > have to cope with those still seen from the outside world. > I have a working trfs that deals with most cases here (still will miss > names > inside files). I'll send it tomorrow. > > Changing open just because of this would mean to rethink many tools > and nobody knows (because there's no experience with your proposed > system) > if it would introduce other problems. So I'd vote no. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 06:58:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 06:58:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5747 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 06:58:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5743 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 06:58:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 06:58:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5ACD19A8A; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:58:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4EE319A80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:57:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 0.3 (built May 13 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ100CY2ZLTH3@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:56:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6ALw3s08063 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:58:03 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020710205649.C0B6C19A77@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207102158.g6ALw3s08063@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:58:02 -0400 (EDT) If I had to vote a priori, blanks would certainly be a no-go for filenames. However, the pressure cooker has already burst, and our chicken is headed straight towards the ceiling. Getting rid of spaces in filenames is not much of an option, if we want to be able to get along in the wide world of non-space-restricted systems. (One simple way to realize that s/ /anything/g isn't a very clean option is to note that different domains are going to require humans to determine how to do the conversion (and its inverse) and in what contexts to do each of the above. Maintaining an FTP mirror, for instance, is not going to be easy at all.) Rethinking our system to fully support blanks, IMHO, is the only way to keep our chicken from splattering all over the kitchen ;-/ - Dave arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > >Isn't this thread dead yet? > It seems ... > So I asked: Is it important? > So I said: My preference is just s/ /_/g > So I proposed: uq (unquote) > Any way, I dislike ' ' in file name. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 07:23:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 07:23:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5923 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 07:23:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5919 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 07:23:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 07:23:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60EC019A85; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:23:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D80F19A81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:22:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id SAA20812 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:22:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207102222.SAA20812@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:51:07 EDT." <200207102151.g6ALp7c06267@dave2.dave.tj> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:22:07 -0400 > The "offending" program in this case is the program that's so much simpler > because it's using the new kernel interface rather than the old one. I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with danger. > Nothing has to be rethought because all my proposed changes do is restore > the strict seperation between nodes in a filename (something UNIX - > and therefore Plan 9 - likes to rely on). But they change an already well-established interface. Have you thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > well documented, by now. It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the system. Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives you temporal mobility. He is right. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 07:38:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 07:38:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6050 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 07:38:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6046 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 07:38:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 07:38:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE7A819A8D; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:38:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from einstein.ssz.com (unknown [207.200.56.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 170B919A7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:37:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ravage@localhost) by einstein.ssz.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA25574; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:42:31 -0500 From: Jim Choate To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: hangar18-general@open-forge.org In-Reply-To: <200207102158.g6ALw3s08063@dave2.dave.tj> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] Re: blanks in file names Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 17:42:30 -0500 (CDT) On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > If I had to vote a priori, blanks would certainly be a no-go for > filenames. However, the pressure cooker has already burst, and our > chicken is headed straight towards the ceiling. Getting rid of spaces in > filenames is not much of an option, if we want to be able to get along > in the wide world of non-space-restricted systems. Um, strictly speaking for most OS'es (and logically in general) the 'string' that represents the filename canonicaly -should- be (usually) "" delimited. In other words, ls filename.foo should really be, ls "filename.foo" or perhaps, ls "file/"Bill/".foo" The fact that the OS allows one to drop them (assuming you don't use things like blanks in filenames) is really a courtesy of the shell implimentation. That's where it should stay. Why the filesystem would -ever- need the filename for internal operations would, at least to my mind, be a major error in implimentation. Other than in 'friendly name' situations (ie UI related) the system should be oblivious of the filename. If it's a valid character in the character set, it should be allowed in a string (except for logical issues - eg printing some non-printable) should print some sort of symbol allowing one to recognize this. This 'conversion' should also stay strictly in the UI related code. To do otherwise raises a host of issues about side effects and special cases w/ regard to sting handling libraries. To not allow spaces in filenames only makes the world more complicated. It also destroys a layer of generality, and that is -almost always- a BAD thing. With respect to filenames, it's a string of -reasonably- unique (re issues of location and such) 1's and 0's to the OS. It doesn't really 'mean' anything to the OS::File System. It's the User::UI that it matters to. User::UI::OS::File System Leave the problem where it belongs, in the cli/shell. -- ____________________________________________________________________ When I die, I would like to be born again as me. Hugh Hefner ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com jchoate@open-forge.org www.open-forge.org -------------------------------------------------------------------- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 07:39:13 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 07:39:13 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6060 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 07:39:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6056 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 07:39:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 07:39:13 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4238C19A92; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:39:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 44D7F19A7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:38:23 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207102158.g6ALw3s08063@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020710223823.44D7F19A7D@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 07:38:15 +0900 Dave wrote: >If I had to vote a priori, blanks would certainly be a no-go for >filenames. However, the pressure cooker has already burst, and our >... >keep our chicken from splattering all over the kitchen ;-/ Important or not? That is the problem. If we agree it is important, we must eat spaes. Then my chice is to cook spaces so that stomach is not broken. How to cook? I believe the first discussion should be forcussed to expression of path considering in future needs. I believe you and I share much opinion. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 08:57:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 08:57:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6767 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 08:57:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6763 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 08:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 08:57:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12A9819A90; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 19:57:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14B6219A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 19:56:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020710235647.RKDU28874.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:56:47 +0100 Message-ID: <005d01c2286d$7881bd30$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5ad34eaf3625fb00e0770452a98f0904@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] voodoo 5 5500 works (ish) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:56:53 +0100 I added the 0x0009 to 3dfx.c in 9/pc and cmd/aux and got a display no mouse cursor and it's slightly shimmery but that looks like refresh rate related I'll persevere tomorrow M From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 10:06:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 10:06:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8865 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 10:06:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8860 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 10:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 10:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4981A19A92; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:06:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4C3019A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:05:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ200HJO2IOCL@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 18:59:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6AN1UV00727 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:01:30 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <200207102222.SAA20812@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207102301.g6AN1UV00727@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 19:01:29 -0400 (EDT) Reply inline: - Dave Dan Cross wrote: > > > The "offending" program in this case is the program that's so much simpler > > because it's using the new kernel interface rather than the old one. > > I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more > complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an > object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do > canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with > danger. Manipulating text with all sorts of dynamic buffers is substantially more complicated than simply replacing a node in a linked list. The canonicalization is all being done by the kernel, or a library. > > > Nothing has to be rethought because all my proposed changes do is restore > > the strict seperation between nodes in a filename (something UNIX - > > and therefore Plan 9 - likes to rely on). > > But they change an already well-established interface. Have you > thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? > What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file > in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge > implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which > is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not > perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to > come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. Optimization for the common case is good, but creating a system where the uncommon case will cause major mayhem at the system level is evidence of a very unclean approach. (When you consider the reasoning behind the problem (namely, spaces and slashes in filenames kill our ability to seperate nodes easily), it makes perfect sense that our solution isn't very clean. The only clean solution is to restore the ancient UNIX ideal of being able to easily seperate nodes. In other words, either kill spaces altogether and damn interoperability, or promote spaces to full citizenship.) > > > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > > well documented, by now. > > It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. String manipulation is more complex than linked list manipulation. > > Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the > system. I don't dispute that point, but the interface I propose is most unlike any other interface currently known to man (not trying to conform to any external interface). I'm simply pointing out that failing to provide at least a 1-1 mapping with capabilities that are already widely used in external systems that must interoperate with ours *will* kill us. > > Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, > yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives > you temporal mobility. He is right. You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get involved in the functions that your OS should be doing automatically. Try running an FTP mirror to a busy site that way, though, and you'll quickly discover why automation is a good thing. The worst part about our system is that the "solution" you eventually find for an FTP mirror will be useless on an HTTP proxy. When "solutions" need to be modified for each individual application, you know that the system isn't clean. > > - Dan C. > - Dave C. :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 11:01:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 11:01:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10607 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 11:01:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10602 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 11:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 11:01:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A709B19A7B; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:01:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 825F619A63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id WAA26141 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207110200.WAA26141@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 10 Jul 2002 19:01:29 EDT." <200207102301.g6AN1UV00727@dave2.dave.tj> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:00:41 -0400 > > I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more > > complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an > > object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do > > canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with > > danger. > > Manipulating text with all sorts of dynamic buffers is substantially > more complicated than simply replacing a node in a linked list. > The canonicalization is all being done by the kernel, or a library. How could this possibly be in the kernel? After all, you're talking about changing the interface to open a file; I pass a file name via some mechanism to a user level application that wants to call open on it. What's it supposed to do? Does the shell now pass a linked list as an argument to main somehow? How does the system know that it's a file? Do we have to replace the argument vector with some more complex representation that encapsulates type information (e.g., this argument is a file, this next one is a string, etc)? Does the shell change to represent file names as lists? Does the user suffer the indignation of having to specify a list of path components to represent a file? Or do we provide a canonicalization library for shell arguments, in which case, you have the exact same problem as supporting spaces now, since most programs are going to expect to get file name arguments in the canonical representation? If you do that, who calls it? The shell or the library? I for one am going to be *very* unhappy if I have to type: cat ('' 'usr' 'cross' 'file') Instead of: cat /usr/cross/file Or do you make every program that wants to open a file call a function to canonicalize a filename into the internal format before it calls open? > > But they change an already well-established interface. Have you > > thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? > > What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file > > in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge > > implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which > > is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not > > perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to > > come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. > > Optimization for the common case is good, but creating a system where the > uncommon case will cause major mayhem at the system level is evidence > of a very unclean approach. (When you consider the reasoning behind > the problem (namely, spaces and slashes in filenames kill our ability > to seperate nodes easily), it makes perfect sense that our solution > isn't very clean. The only clean solution is to restore the ancient > UNIX ideal of being able to easily seperate nodes. In other words, > either kill spaces altogether and damn interoperability, or promote > spaces to full citizenship.) But Plan 9 can handle this. One of the beautiful things about Plan 9 is that it provides a solution that's workable with little effort. The various substitution file systems provide a workable solution without introducing any additional complexity. If you want a total--100% complete--solution, then a `urlifyfs' can be written that uses URL escaping as a canonical representation, or something similar. The system interface doesn't have to be changed, though. *That* is the mark of a clean system design. The Unix `ideal' was eliminated because it was overly complex, without a commensurate gain in functionality. Besides, the inode system didn't really fit in well with the idea of 9p. > > > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > > > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > > > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > > > well documented, by now. > > > > It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. > > String manipulation is more complex than linked list manipulation. No, it's really not. Consider passing a linked list as an argument to a function you're calling, versus passing an argument vector of strings. How do you do that? Do you muck with all the C startup code to make sure you get the linking and so right in such a way that the list is in a contiguous memory block so it doesn't get stomped by the image read by exec? Do you pass each node in the list to main as a seperate string in the argument vector? If so, how do you tell when a file name ends and another begins? Do we introduce some convention for delineating the beginning and ends of a filename in a list representation, effectively creating a protocol that every program has to follow to take a filename as an argument? Surely the former option is significantly easier.... Consider a possible canonicalization routine that might be used in a substitution FS: char * canonical(char *str) { char *p, *s, *t; if (str == nil || (p = malloc(2 * strlen(str) + 1)) == nil) { return(nil); } for (s = str, t = p; *s != '\0'; s++, t++) { if (isspace(*s)) { *t++ = '+'; /* Or whatever. */ *t = '2'; continue; } *t = *s; } if ((s = realloc(p, strlen(p) + 1)) == nil) { free(p); } return(s); } That's pretty straight-forward; just inserting into a linked list would be just as hard. Doing so in a contiguous memory block would be, I think harder (you'd have to step over the list, keep a count of how much memory you needed, then allocate the list, copy each node and set the links. That's a pain). > > Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the > > system. > > I don't dispute that point, but the interface I propose is most unlike > any other interface currently known to man (not trying to conform to any > external interface). I'm simply pointing out that failing to provide > at least a 1-1 mapping with capabilities that are already widely used > in external systems that must interoperate with ours *will* kill us. Well, if you *really* want 100% 1 to 1 mappings, use the URL encoding others have mentioned, or something similar. As it is, it seems that this mostly works; about 80% of what's needed is there. > > Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, > > yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives > > you temporal mobility. He is right. > > You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get involved in the > functions that your OS should be doing automatically. Try running an FTP > mirror to a busy site that way, though, and you'll quickly discover why > automation is a good thing. The worst part about our system is that the > "solution" you eventually find for an FTP mirror will be useless on an > HTTP proxy. When "solutions" need to be modified for each individual > application, you know that the system isn't clean. Yesterday is a wonderful tool, and can be scripted to do whatever you want. Eg, copying all files that changed on June 14th back to the cache isn't very diffcult. I don't see what running a big FTP mirror has to do with it. netlib is a big FTP site; it runs on Plan 9. Maybe it's not a mirror, but so what? I also don't see how you can't leverage whatever you did for FTP with HTTP. The substitution-style FS gives you a *lot* of flexibility in this area. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 11:02:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 11:02:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10632 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 11:02:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10628 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 11:02:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 11:02:12 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5371719A8B; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:02:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C82D119A63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:01:05 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020711020105.C82D119A63@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 21:41:17 -0400 on the "linked lists for paths instead of strings with /" topic: while i can see how this could be interesting to persue, from a systems architecture research point of view, i'm unclear on how exactly this helps us solve any of the problems people are talking about. maybe i'm just missing something; if so, please clue me in. but here's what i don't see: first, it seems your suggestion is primarialy aimed at allowing "/" in file names (perhaps some argument about generality or interoperation with DOS-derived systems and "\" could be made, as well). okay, i can see the theoretical benefit there (but it strikes me as a much more dubious gain than spaces in file names). but what would this system _look_ like, from a user's point of view? what would the output of `pwd' be? a list of strings? but how can i store a representation of that? wouldn't that involve lots of interaction with the shell, or whatever else was doing the interpretation (like $path does, although that's used is very few places, and is very function-specific, so isn't really much of an issue)? second, i'm just not seeing at all how this helps us address spaces in file names (and maybe it wasn't meant to; this thread has wandered a bit). the dificult part of the problem (perhaps the entirety of the problem) seems to lie in getting the various tools that need to communicate to understand the edges of file names: things like "grep `{ls} foo". i fail to see how any of the kernel changes (or library additions) you propose even talk to this realm of problem. third: want newline too? on another embedded thread, you wrote: // You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get // involved in the functions that your OS should be doing // automatically. Try running an FTP mirror to a busy site // that way, though, and you'll quickly discover... that you've completely missed what dan was saying? he (and Nemo before him) was talking about the ability of Plan 9's dump to back out changes to kernel, library, and utilitys uniformly. i don't have a clue what FTP or HTTP mirrors or "things your OS should do automatically" have to do with any of this. are we just having unrelated conversations at each other? ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 11:54:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 11:54:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12299 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 11:54:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12295 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 11:54:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 11:54:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACAED19A68; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:54:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 739E119A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 22:53:18 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020711025318.739E119A75@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] lnfs(1) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:52:39 +0900 I'm now using kfs system, and have a question on lnfs(1). term% cd /usr/sys term% mkdir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 can't create 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二: name too long Yes, I know it, then term% lnfs /usr/sys term% mkdir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 Ok!, good, I see 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 directory. term% cat .longnames 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 Then, term% rm 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 Ok, dir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 has been removed. However, term% cat .longnames 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 still shows the removed directory name. term% disk/ksync term% cat .longnames 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 then, I killed the lnfs process. Then, I cannot access /usr/sys directory anymore... What I did wrong? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 12:22:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 12:22:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13070 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 12:22:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13065 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 12:22:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 12:22:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB18119A8D; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:22:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B15FA19A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:21:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <152675e3de6a7d0fe4740c7855b3d9d5@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lnfs(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:22:03 -0400 On Wed Jul 10 22:54:41 EDT 2002, okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp wrote: > I'm now using kfs system, and have a question on lnfs(1). > > term% cd /usr/sys > term% mkdir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > can't create 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二: name too long > > Yes, I know it, then > term% lnfs /usr/sys > term% mkdir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > Ok!, good, I see 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 directory. > term% cat .longnames > 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > > Then, > term% rm 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > Ok, dir 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 has been removed. > However, > term% cat .longnames > 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > still shows the removed directory name. > > term% disk/ksync > term% cat .longnames > 大阪府大地学教室岡本健二 > > then, I killed the lnfs process. > Then, I cannot access /usr/sys directory anymore... > > What I did wrong? > > Kenji > Nothing ever gets removed from .longnames. However, removing the file does get rid of it and you won't see it in a subsequent ls. If you want to change lnfs to garbage collect the .longnames file, go right ahead. I didn't think it was worth is since its just a stopgap till seanq and jmk get the next file server working but if you're going to be using it heavily... In case you haven't looked at the code, .longnames is just a set of possible long names. When you try to open a long name under lnfs's mount point, .longnames doesn't even get used. lnfs just tries to open the real file whose name is the first 26 characters of the base64 encoding of the sha1 hash of the long name. .longnames just gets used to translate the names from sha1's to strings when you read a directory. If the possibility of an accidental hit in sha1 is ~ 2^80, then this will be ~ 2^32 since we are only encoding about 65 of the 160 bits. This assumes a linearity that I'm not sure exists in sha1. Not wonderful odds but fine for a stopgap. Also, in case you haven't noticed, it allows spaces in the names: % lnfs drafts % > drafts/'spaces in file names suck' % echo drafts/spa* drafts/spaces in file names suck % ls drafts/spa* 'drafts/spaces in file names suck' Hence, all mail threads fill the same well needed void. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 12:41:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 12:41:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13534 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 12:41:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13530 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 12:41:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 12:41:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 403D019A92; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:41:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C19EF19A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Jul 2002 23:40:21 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lnfs(1) From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020711034021.C19EF19A85@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:39:44 +0900 Thanks Dave. I'm just a newbie to release 4 Plan 9, and have no time to read codes yet, and now am just reading the papers. Facttum is quiet interesting approach, then, I decided to apdate our release 3 system to the new. Yes, I haven't done it before, because I've been satisfied in release 3. Factotum fashionated me to pay effort for it. ^_^ Ok, I got we can leave .longnames alone till we can see next real file server. What about the last lines I wrote? When I killed lnfs process after using it, I cannot access the whole directory which indicates the lnfs mountpoint. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 13:06:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 13:06:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14256 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 13:06:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14252 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 13:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 13:06:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8206D19A98; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:06:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EF77219A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:05:33 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lnfs(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020711040533.EF77219A85@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:03:51 -0400 // When I killed lnfs process after using [lnfs], I cannot // ccess the whole directory... i suspect you need to do something like "unmount /usr/sys" before killing the process (and the unmount may cause the process to exit, as 'rm /srv/9660' causes 9660srv to exit). otherwise you've got an entry in your mount table, but no process to actually service it. ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 13:21:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 13:21:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14721 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 13:21:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14717 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 13:21:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 13:21:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9111219A9B; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:21:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2519E19A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:20:00 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lnfs(1) From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tcmefzqryvmzviosqiztijpvno" Message-Id: <20020711042000.2519E19A8B@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:19:22 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tcmefzqryvmzviosqiztijpvno Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Yeah! I was fool enough to accept new concept! Yes, I should have done unmount /usr/sys, because I mounted long filename server on it! Thanks ア Kenji --upas-tcmefzqryvmzviosqiztijpvno Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Thu Jul 11 13:05:58 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA24692 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:54:07 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id NAA01070 for ; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:06:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8206D19A98; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:06:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EF77219A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:05:33 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lnfs(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-Id: <20020711040533.EF77219A85@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 00:03:51 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp id MAA24692 // When I killed lnfs process after using [lnfs], I cannot // ccess the whole directory... i suspect you need to do something like "unmount /usr/sys" before killing the process (and the unmount may cause the process to exit, as 'rm /srv/9660' causes 9660srv to exit). otherwise you've got an entry in your mount table, but no process to actually service it. =E3=82=A2 --upas-tcmefzqryvmzviosqiztijpvno-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 14:27:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 14:27:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16774 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 14:27:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16770 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 14:27:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 14:27:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 319DA19A98; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:27:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A056619A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:26:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ2008MAJIQTC@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6B58jI08996 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:08:45 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: blanks in file names In-reply-to: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207110508.g6B58jI08996@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:08:44 -0400 (EDT) If you're going to rewrite the UI programs (like ls) to print filenames in human-readable format, you'll need to make an option in each program that outputs filenames to make it output the names in human-readable or other-program-readable format ... yucky. . . - Dave Jim Choate wrote: > > > On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > > > If I had to vote a priori, blanks would certainly be a no-go for > > filenames. However, the pressure cooker has already burst, and our > > chicken is headed straight towards the ceiling. Getting rid of spaces in > > filenames is not much of an option, if we want to be able to get along > > in the wide world of non-space-restricted systems. > > Um, strictly speaking for most OS'es (and logically in general) the > 'string' that represents the filename canonicaly -should- be (usually) "" > delimited. > > In other words, > > ls filename.foo > > should really be, > > ls "filename.foo" > > or perhaps, > > ls "file/"Bill/".foo" > > The fact that the OS allows one to drop them (assuming you don't use > things like blanks in filenames) is really a courtesy of the shell > implimentation. That's where it should stay. Why the filesystem would > -ever- need the filename for internal operations would, at least to my > mind, be a major error in implimentation. Other than in 'friendly name' > situations (ie UI related) the system should be oblivious of the filename. > > If it's a valid character in the character set, it should be allowed in a > string (except for logical issues - eg printing some non-printable) should > print some sort of symbol allowing one to recognize this. This > 'conversion' should also stay strictly in the UI related code. To do > otherwise raises a host of issues about side effects and special cases w/ > regard to sting handling libraries. To not allow spaces in filenames only > makes the world more complicated. It also destroys a layer of generality, > and that is -almost always- a BAD thing. > > With respect to filenames, it's a string of -reasonably- unique (re issues > of location and such) 1's and 0's to the OS. It doesn't really 'mean' > anything to the OS::File System. It's the User::UI that it matters to. > > User::UI::OS::File System > > Leave the problem where it belongs, in the cli/shell. > > > -- > ____________________________________________________________________ > > When I die, I would like to be born again as me. > > Hugh Hefner > ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com > jchoate@open-forge.org www.open-forge.org > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 14:48:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 14:48:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17323 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 14:48:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17319 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 14:48:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 14:48:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7BF819A92; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:48:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CC5A19A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:47:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ20026IJMEY8@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:08:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6B5AxQ09299 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:10:59 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020710223823.44D7F19A7D@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207110510.g6B5AxQ09299@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:10:59 -0400 (EDT) Eh, I tire of the discussion ... let's just make a userland fix or whatever ... if it bugs me too much, I'll just patch up the kernel, or something. . . - Dave arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > Dave wrote: > >If I had to vote a priori, blanks would certainly be a no-go for > >filenames. However, the pressure cooker has already burst, and our > >... > >keep our chicken from splattering all over the kitchen ;-/ > > Important or not? That is the problem. > If we agree it is important, we must eat spaes. > Then my chice is to cook spaces so that stomach is not broken. > How to cook? > I believe the first discussion should be forcussed > to expression of path considering in future needs. > I believe you and I share much opinion. > > Kenji Arisawa > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 14:51:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 14:51:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17414 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 14:51:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17410 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 14:51:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 14:51:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2357E19A9B; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:51:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 19A5319A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:50:46 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020711055046.19A5319A6A@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:50:08 +0900 >Eh, I tire of the discussion Yes, indeed. We can refer to a statement from Rob times before. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 15:15:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 15:15:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18120 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 15:15:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18116 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 15:15:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 15:15:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6BBB19A9B; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:15:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.9]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3FFF19A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:14:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ2005JCMKYK0@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:12:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6B6ExM18574 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:14:59 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <200207110200.WAA26141@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:14:59 -0400 (EDT) Reply inline: - Dave Dan Cross wrote: > > > > I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more > > > complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an > > > object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do > > > canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with > > > danger. > > > > Manipulating text with all sorts of dynamic buffers is substantially > > more complicated than simply replacing a node in a linked list. > > The canonicalization is all being done by the kernel, or a library. > > How could this possibly be in the kernel? After all, you're talking > about changing the interface to open a file; I pass a file name via > some mechanism to a user level application that wants to call open on > it. What's it supposed to do? Does the shell now pass a linked list > as an argument to main somehow? How does the system know that it's a > file? Do we have to replace the argument vector with some more complex > representation that encapsulates type information (e.g., this argument > is a file, this next one is a string, etc)? Does the shell change to > represent file names as lists? Does the user suffer the indignation of > having to specify a list of path components to represent a file? Or do > we provide a canonicalization library for shell arguments, in which > case, you have the exact same problem as supporting spaces now, since > most programs are going to expect to get file name arguments in the > canonical representation? If you do that, who calls it? The shell or > the library? That's an interesting point I didn't quite consider ... we'll have to change the exec interface a lot more than I suspected at first glance. I wasn't planning that until much later, because it'll require very fundamental changes to the shell. (/me hates proposing incremental changes, because they invariably depend on other fundamental changes in order for people to see their utility.) > > I for one am going to be *very* unhappy if I have to type: > > cat ('' 'usr' 'cross' 'file') > > Instead of: > > cat /usr/cross/file > > Or do you make every program that wants to open a file call a function > to canonicalize a filename into the internal format before it calls > open? My image of a shell is a user interface. It should translate all output from programs into a format that's easy for a human to understand, and should offer to translate data entered by the user from an easy-for-a-human-to-input format into the machine format. If you want to print /"usr"/"cross"/"file", you should be able to type something like "cat /usr/cross/file" and have the shell translate that into the collection of lists (/usr/bin/cat and /usr/cross/file) required for the underlying system. The shell should also translate the output of the ls command, for instance, so it prints filenames in an easy-for-humans-to-understand format. The ls command, though, should only print filenames in an easy-for-machine-to-understand format. Basically, the shell is the bidirectional translator between computer-speak and human-speak. That's it's raison d'tre (spelling?). Getting the kernel away from plain text doesn't mean getting the shell away from plain text. The shell can choose to support any method(s) it wants to represent filenames in an "easy-for-machine-to-understand" format, since it'll be converting the filenames into linked lists for the kernel. Utilities like find or ls or whatever output filenames in a format that your shell can read. (I envision an rc file supplied by the shell to let other programs know what formats it supports.) > > > > But they change an already well-established interface. Have you > > > thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? > > > What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file > > > in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge > > > implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which > > > is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not > > > perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to > > > come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. > > > > Optimization for the common case is good, but creating a system where the > > uncommon case will cause major mayhem at the system level is evidence > > of a very unclean approach. (When you consider the reasoning behind > > the problem (namely, spaces and slashes in filenames kill our ability > > to seperate nodes easily), it makes perfect sense that our solution > > isn't very clean. The only clean solution is to restore the ancient > > UNIX ideal of being able to easily seperate nodes. In other words, > > either kill spaces altogether and damn interoperability, or promote > > spaces to full citizenship.) > > But Plan 9 can handle this. > > One of the beautiful things about Plan 9 is that it provides a solution > that's workable with little effort. The various substitution file > systems provide a workable solution without introducing any additional > complexity. If you want a total--100% complete--solution, then a > `urlifyfs' can be written that uses URL escaping as a canonical > representation, or something similar. The system interface doesn't > have to be changed, though. *That* is the mark of a clean system > design. The only way to have the urlifyfs concept providing a 100% complete solution is to use it as the default filesystem for your own stuff. The reason? imagine downloading a file "blah%apos;" from an FTP server; now, you download a file "blah'" from an FTP server (which your urlifyfs faithfully translates into "blah%apos;" without realizing that it's destroying a different file). Guess what? You've just clobbered your original. Now, if you're going to use urlifyfs for your own stuff on your Plan 9 system, you're going to have to deal with the same shell-interaction issues that my system has to deal with. The only difference is that my system doesn't break if somebody forgets to use urlifyfs on a new filesystem, because my system moves text representation of filenames over to the shell, where it belongs, rather than dumping that burden on a filesystem translation hack. > > The Unix `ideal' was eliminated because it was overly complex, without > a commensurate gain in functionality. Besides, the inode system didn't > really fit in well with the idea of 9p. > > > > > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > > > > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > > > > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > > > > well documented, by now. > > > > > > It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. > > > > String manipulation is more complex than linked list manipulation. > > No, it's really not. Consider passing a linked list as an argument to > a function you're calling, versus passing an argument vector of > strings. How do you do that? Do you muck with all the C startup code > to make sure you get the linking and so right in such a way that the > list is in a contiguous memory block so it doesn't get stomped by the > image read by exec? Do you pass each node in the list to main as a > seperate string in the argument vector? If so, how do you tell when > a file name ends and another begins? Do we introduce some convention > for delineating the beginning and ends of a filename in a list > representation, effectively creating a protocol that every program has > to follow to take a filename as an argument? Surely the former option > is significantly easier.... This is only true with our current exec family, which has been essentially carried over unchanged from UNIX. It's based on strings, not on lists. IMHO, arguments should be objects. Those objects can be filenames, options with or without arguments of their own, subcommands, just plain strings, etc. This makes arguments a lot more representitive of what they actually are, and eliminates the need for complex argument-handling libraries. Obviously, this whole change can be totally transparent to the user, because his shell is doing the necessary translations back and forth. However, you get an extremely powerful system as the payoff, a system that makes it rather easy to reimplement all our current syscalls as tiny library functions, possibly in an emulation library. > > Consider a possible canonicalization routine that might be used in > a substitution FS: > > char * > canonical(char *str) > { > char *p, *s, *t; > > if (str == nil || (p = malloc(2 * strlen(str) + 1)) == nil) { > return(nil); > } > for (s = str, t = p; *s != '\0'; s++, t++) { > if (isspace(*s)) { > *t++ = '+'; /* Or whatever. */ > *t = '2'; > continue; > } > *t = *s; > } > if ((s = realloc(p, strlen(p) + 1)) == nil) { > free(p); > } > > return(s); > } > > That's pretty straight-forward; just inserting into a linked list > would be just as hard. Doing so in a contiguous memory block would > be, I think harder (you'd have to step over the list, keep a count > of how much memory you needed, then allocate the list, copy each > node and set the links. That's a pain). strlen() is an expensive operation. realloc() sucks in a multithreaded environment. To top it all off, that algorithm doesn't take into account the expansion which is ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY in order to achieve 100% coverage. (If you're not going to achieve a 1-1 mapping, it's silly to even bother with this.) Also, I'd like to mention again that I'm not asking the kernel to allocate memory. The userland program provides a block of memory, and the kernel manipulates that block, returning an error if the block is too small. > > > > Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the > > > system. > > > > I don't dispute that point, but the interface I propose is most unlike > > any other interface currently known to man (not trying to conform to any > > external interface). I'm simply pointing out that failing to provide > > at least a 1-1 mapping with capabilities that are already widely used > > in external systems that must interoperate with ours *will* kill us. > > Well, if you *really* want 100% 1 to 1 mappings, use the URL encoding > others have mentioned, or something similar. As it is, it seems that > this mostly works; about 80% of what's needed is there. URL encoding _will_ work if it's implemented right (except for the uncleanliness I mentioned above, and some more problems I mention below). However, using URL encoding makes the resulting system just as ugly as the one I'm proposing from the user's perspective, but much much uglier from a system perspective. > > > > Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, > > > yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives > > > you temporal mobility. He is right. > > > > You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get involved in the > > functions that your OS should be doing automatically. Try running an FTP > > mirror to a busy site that way, though, and you'll quickly discover why > > automation is a good thing. The worst part about our system is that the > > "solution" you eventually find for an FTP mirror will be useless on an > > HTTP proxy. When "solutions" need to be modified for each individual > > application, you know that the system isn't clean. > > Yesterday is a wonderful tool, and can be scripted to do whatever you > want. Eg, copying all files that changed on June 14th back to the > cache isn't very diffcult. Yesterday can't be used to update the relative references in all the README files in the FTP archives to the urlified versions. > > I don't see what running a big FTP mirror has to do with it. netlib is > a big FTP site; it runs on Plan 9. Maybe it's not a mirror, but so what? Since it's not a mirror, it doesn't have to contend with all the spaceful filenames you find in the non-Plan9 world. > I also don't see how you can't leverage whatever you did for FTP with > HTTP. The substitution-style FS gives you a *lot* of flexibility in this > area. What you did in FTP was scanning the README files for references. What you do in HTTP is updating all the href and src attributes in HTML files (and hope none of the JAVA programs have embedded URLs that you can't change at all), so you don't get broken links everywhere. ...unless you want to implement the transformation/detransformation code in the FTP and HTTP servers, as well ... in which case your system becomes one step worse than my system, because you have transformation/detransformation code in two places on your system :-( > > - Dan C. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 15:39:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 15:39:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18867 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 15:39:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18863 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 15:39:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 15:39:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8683519A9E; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:39:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83D2219A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:38:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6B6cfmk029082 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:38:43 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6B6cdif029081 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:38:39 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names Message-ID: <20020711083834.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <200207110200.WAA26141@math.psu.edu> <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj>; from Dave on Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 02:14:59AM -0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:38:36 +0200 On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 02:14:59AM -0400, Dave wrote: > > Reply inline: > You make some valid points, but I think they are well in excess of present requirements. Not to say that a future OS/GUI will not (have to) take them into consideration. You do however confuse URI and HTML and you really shouldn't: > The only way to have the urlifyfs concept providing a 100% complete > solution is to use it as the default filesystem for your own stuff. > The reason? imagine downloading a file "blah%apos;" from an FTP server; > now, you download a file "blah'" from an FTP server (which your urlifyfs > faithfully translates into "blah%apos;" without realizing that it's > destroying a different file). Guess what? You've just clobbered your > original. Now, if you're going to use urlifyfs for your own stuff URI: blah%apos; -> blah%25pos%3b ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 15:45:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 15:45:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19056 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 15:45:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19052 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 15:45:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 15:45:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0372219AA4; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:45:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.9]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5374E19A9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:45:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ2008ULO2SKU@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:44:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6B6lI923214 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:47:18 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020711020105.C82D119A63@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"anothy@cosym.net"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207110647.g6B6lI923214@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:47:18 -0400 (EDT) Reply inline: - Dave anothy@cosym.net wrote: > > on the "linked lists for paths instead of strings with /" topic: > while i can see how this could be interesting to persue, from a > systems architecture research point of view, i'm unclear on how > exactly this helps us solve any of the problems people are > talking about. maybe i'm just missing something; if so, please > clue me in. but here's what i don't see: This won't directly solve any userland problems, because it's a kernel level change. However, it _will_ provide the foundation necessary for a real makeover for our shell, so it becomes a true translator between the kernel and the user (what it was always meant to be). > > first, it seems your suggestion is primarialy aimed at allowing > "/" in file names (perhaps some argument about generality or > interoperation with DOS-derived systems and "\" could be made, > as well). okay, i can see the theoretical benefit there (but it > strikes me as a much more dubious gain than spaces in file > names). but what would this system _look_ like, from a user's > point of view? what would the output of `pwd' be? a list of > strings? but how can i store a representation of that? wouldn't > that involve lots of interaction with the shell, or whatever > else was doing the interpretation (like $path does, although > that's used is very few places, and is very function-specific, > so isn't really much of an issue)? I remarked in a couple of my previous posts about the subject, but let me show some examples of what I mean: Let's say we have a shell that uses C-style encoding, and we're in a directory called (using a C-syntax string) "/usr/\/\\\n\'blah": crazysh> pwd /usr//\ 'blah crazysh> pwd --unambiguous /usr/\/\\\n\'blah crazysh> ls What's wrong with you? You don't want to know what's in this directory ;-/ crazysh> ls --unambiguous What\'s wrong with you\? \0\0\0 You don\'t want to know what\'s in this directory ;-\/ crazysh> exit You'll notice that the initial pwd command prints the directory in easy-for-human-to-read format - what it was "meant" to look like. The second command runs the same program as the first command, but the _shell_ (not the pwd command!) is given the --unambiguous option so it prints the resulting path in its native (C-style encoding) format. (Programs don't produce "text" as output; they produce "objects," which - as I remarked in a previous post - may be filenames, strings, etc.) The third command prints a directory listing in easy-for-human-to-read format, and the fourth tells the shell to print ls' output filenames in C-style rather than raw form (where you'll notice a file consisting of nothing but NULLs suddenly appears - a neat trick that can make users of other OSs quite jealous). Obviously, a user may opt for a shell using URL encoding as its default encoding, or even replace the "raw" encoding with URL/C/etc. encoding. It's all a matter of personal preference, and the kernel isn't involved at all ... nor is any filesystem code. > > second, i'm just not seeing at all how this helps us address > spaces in file names (and maybe it wasn't meant to; this > thread has wandered a bit). the dificult part of the problem > (perhaps the entirety of the problem) seems to lie in getting > the various tools that need to communicate to understand the > edges of file names: things like "grep `{ls} foo". i fail to > see how any of the kernel changes (or library additions) you > propose even talk to this realm of problem. Well, if you're using C-style syntax, filename edges are simply newlines. If you're using url encoding, spaces seperate filenames. If you're using Base64 (which I believe any human would have to be crazy to do, but I see no reason for the system to stop crazy people), you'd have plenty of choices for filename edges. You just have to make sure the both sides of the pipe are working with the same encoding. (e.g., "crazysh> program-outputting-in-url | program-expecting-in-c" ain't gonna work, but most of your userland programs would probably ship with your shell or offer optionss to support your shell's encoding (or if your shell uses an uncommon encoding, it might provide programs to convert to/from more common encodings).) > > third: want newline too? A general solution should handle all cases. I see no reason not to handle newlines, too. (In fact, my example above illustrated a lot more than mere newlines being encoded.) > > on another embedded thread, you wrote: > // You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get > // involved in the functions that your OS should be doing > // automatically. Try running an FTP mirror to a busy site > // that way, though, and you'll quickly discover... > > that you've completely missed what dan was saying? he (and > Nemo before him) was talking about the ability of Plan 9's > dump to back out changes to kernel, library, and utilitys > uniformly. i don't have a clue what FTP or HTTP mirrors or > "things your OS should do automatically" have to do with > any of this. are we just having unrelated conversations at > each other? I was pointing out that yesterday doesn't even attempt to address the problem I was referring to (keeping an FTP mirror up-to-date). I (thought I) understood that he was proposing to run a filter on files he's mirroring. My answer was quite simply that doing so is unfeasible on a large scale. I hope that clarifies a bit :-) > ア > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 17:40:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 17:40:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22504 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 17:40:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22500 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 17:40:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 17:40:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2D6719AA1; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:40:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id ADA8C19A9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9e269d17ee7ea1cd7ecd77a8a58705ff@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 01:39:07 -0700 dave@dave.tj, Have you actually used Plan 9 or even read its manual? I ask because you've made a succession of odd statements: > strlen() is an expensive operation. No, it's not terribly expensive. Even if it were, most strings are short, so it's not much of an issue. DES encryption is expensive. > realloc() sucks in a multithreaded environment. You don't define ``sucks'', but the whole malloc family use internal locks on Plan 9 so that they *do* work well (or at least don't corrupt memory) in multiprocess or multithread programs. > Also, I'd like to mention again that I'm not asking the kernel to > allocate memory. The kernel already allocates memory, including string memory. What's the big deal? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 17:50:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 17:50:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22782 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 17:50:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22778 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 17:50:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 17:50:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DC7519AA5; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:50:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 02DD419AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:49:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 71164 invoked by uid 18927); 11 Jul 2002 08:46:12 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 08:46:12 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020711024452.G71152-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] xscreensaver ports Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:46:12 -0600 (MDT) finally got around to transferrign all the hacks i've ported from my laptop to an internet-enabled machine: http://www.acl.lanl.gov/plan9/xscreensaver/ more to come, subject to time constraints :) andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 17:54:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 17:54:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22880 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 17:54:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22876 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 17:54:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 17:54:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 130D219AA8; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:54:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 09A7E19AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 04:53:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pwnfahbmdnrgafohimcduppeaq" Subject: [9fans] trfs Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:53:10 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pwnfahbmdnrgafohimcduppeaq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is what I'm using to rename files. All I do is trfs -n tcp!foreign mount -c /srv/tcp!foreign /n/remote BTW, It's also useful to debug 9p connections just by giving the -v option. Manual page included. enjoy --upas-pwnfahbmdnrgafohimcduppeaq Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=trfs Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit .TH TRFS 4 .SH NAME trfs \- translate spaces in file names file system .SH SYNOPSIS .B trfs [ .B -Dv ] [ .B -\fIRune\fP ] [ .B -s .I srvfile ] [ .B -n .I addr ] .I servename .SH DESCRIPTION .I Trfs translates 9P requests exchanged between a client and a file server. The translation replaces spaces seen in remote file names to a different rune. .PP By default .I trfs translates spaces within file names to open box runes (0x2423) "␣". A different rune can be selected by specifying it as an option. .PP .I Trfs reaches the server through the .I servename file or through a network connection to the .I addr address given to the .B -n option. The client mounts the file posted by .I trfs in .IR srv (4). The file posted is named .B /srv/trfs by default, but it can be .B /srv/\fIsrvfile\fP when the option .B -s is used, and also .B /srv/\fIaddr\fP when the option .B -n is given. .PP Option .B -v instructs .I trfs to print to standard error a human readable copy of messages exchanged. This makes .I trfs useful to debug file servers. The .B -D option enables debug messages. .SH EXAMPLE These examples dial a foreign system, start .IR trfs , and mount it at .B /n/remote. Names like .B "/n/remote/music/alan parsons" that contaning blanks would be renamed to names like .B "/n/remote/music/alan␣parsons." .PP .EX srv tcp!foreign trfs -s foreign.tr /srv/tcp!foreign mount -c /srv/foreign.tr /n/remote trfs -n tcp!foreign mount -c /srv/tcp!foreign /n/remote .EE .SH SOURCE .B /sys/src/cmd/trfs.c .SH BUGS Spaces in remote file names are not caught when found inside file names or other media. The rune used instead of space might be used in remote file names leading to confussion. --upas-pwnfahbmdnrgafohimcduppeaq Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=trfs.c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit #include #include #include #include #include <9p.h> enum { Maxmsglen = IOHDRSZ + 8 * 1024, // Max message size Nnames = 128, // Max # of names in a message OBRune = L'␣', // translate spc into this }; #define dprint if(debug)print Rune altspc = OBRune; int debug; int verbose; uchar rxbuf[Maxmsglen]; uchar txbuf[Maxmsglen]; char statbuf[Maxmsglen]; char dirbuf[2*Maxmsglen]; Fidpool*fidpool; static void usage(void) { fprint(2, "usage: %s [-Dv] [-RUNE] [-s srvfile] [-n addr] servename\n", argv0); exits("usage"); } static ulong getaux(Fid* fp) { assert(sizeof(ulong) <= sizeof(fp->aux)); return (ulong)fp->aux; } static void setaux(Fid* fp, ulong aux) { assert(sizeof(ulong) <= sizeof(fp->aux)); fp->aux = (void*) aux; } static char* emalloc(int l) { char* r; r = malloc(l); if (r == nil) sysfatal("not enough memory"); return r; } int nnames; char* names[Nnames]; void cleannames(void) { int i; for (i = 0; i < nnames; i++) free(names[i]); nnames = 0; } /* From Plan 9 to Unix */ char* exportname(char* name) { Rune r; int nr; char *uxname; char *up; if (name == 0 || utfrune(name, altspc) == 0) return name; up = uxname = emalloc(strlen(name) + 1); names[nnames++] = uxname; while(*name != 0){ nr = chartorune(&r, name); if (r == altspc) r = ' '; up += runetochar(up, &r); name += nr; } *up = 0; return uxname; } /* From Unix to Plan 9 */ char* importname(char* name) { Rune r; int nr; char *up; char *p9name; if (name == 0 || strchr(name, ' ') == 0) return name; p9name = emalloc(strlen(name) * 3 + 1); // worst case: all blanks + 0 up = p9name; names[nnames++] = p9name; while (*name != 0){ nr = chartorune(&r, name); if (r == ' ') r = altspc; up += runetochar(up, &r); name += nr; } *up = 0; return p9name; } static int isfdir(Fcall* f, Fid **fpp) { Fid* fp; int r; fp = lookupfid(fidpool, f->fid); if (fp == nil) return 0; r = (fp->qid.type&QTDIR); if (r) *fpp = fp; else closefid(fp); return r; } static int getfcall(int fd, Fcall* f) { int r; r = read9pmsg(fd, rxbuf, sizeof(rxbuf)); if (r <= 0) return 0; if (convM2S(rxbuf, sizeof(rxbuf), f) == 0) return -1; return 1; } static int putfcall(int fd, Fcall* f) { int n; n = convS2M(f, txbuf, sizeof(txbuf)); if (n == 0) return -1; if (write(fd, txbuf, n) != n) return -1; } static void twalk(Fcall* f) { int i; cleannames(); for (i = 0; i < f->nwname; i++) f->wname[i] = exportname(f->wname[i]); } static void tcreate(Fcall* f) { cleannames(); f->name = exportname(f->name); } // Dir read is tricky. // We have to change the user supplied offset to match the sizes // seen by the server. Sizes seen by client are greater than those // seen by server since the change from ' ' to '␣' adds 2 bytes. static void tread(Fcall* f) { Fid* fp; fp = nil; if (!isfdir(f, &fp)) return; f->count /= 3; // sizes will grow upon return. if (fp == nil) sysfatal("can't find fid\n"); if (f->offset == 0) setaux(fp, 0); f->offset -= getaux(fp); // cumulative size delta closefid(fp); } static void rread(Fcall* f) { ulong n, rn, nn, delta; Dir d; Fid* fp; if (!isfdir(f, &fp)) return; if (f->count == 0) goto done; cleannames(); for (n = nn = 0; n < f->count; n += rn){ rn = convM2D((uchar*)f->data + n, f->count - n, &d, statbuf); if (rn <= BIT16SZ) break; d.name = importname(d.name); //dprint("⇒ %D\n", &d); nn += convD2M(&d, (uchar*)dirbuf + nn, sizeof(dirbuf) - nn); } delta = nn - n; setaux(fp, getaux(fp) + delta); f->count = nn; f->data = dirbuf; done: closefid(fp); } static void twstat(Fcall* f) { Dir d; cleannames(); if (convM2D(f->stat, f->nstat, &d, statbuf) <= BIT16SZ) return; d.name = exportname(d.name); f->nstat = convD2M(&d, (uchar*)dirbuf, sizeof(dirbuf)); f->stat = (uchar*)dirbuf; if (statcheck(f->stat, f->nstat) < 0) dprint("stat fails\n"); } static void rstat(Fcall* f) { Dir d; cleannames(); convM2D(f->stat, f->nstat, &d, statbuf); d.name = importname(d.name); f->nstat = convD2M(&d, (uchar*)dirbuf, sizeof(dirbuf)); f->stat = (uchar*)dirbuf; if (statcheck(f->stat, f->nstat) < 0) dprint("stat fails\n"); } void nop(Fid*) { } static void service(int cfd, int sfd, int dfd) { Fcall f; int r; Fid* fp; fidpool = allocfidpool(nop); for(;;){ fp = nil; r = getfcall(cfd, &f); if (r <= 0) break; if(verbose) fprint(dfd , "c→s %F\n", &f); switch(f.type){ case Tclunk: case Tremove: // BUG in lib9p? removefid leaks fid. // is that what it should do? fp = lookupfid(fidpool, f.fid); if (fp != nil){ removefid(fidpool, f.fid); closefid(fp); closefid(fp); fp = nil; } break; case Tcreate: tcreate(&f); // and also... case Topen: fp = allocfid(fidpool, f.fid); fp->aux = 0; break; case Tread: tread(&f); break; case Twalk: twalk(&f); break; case Twstat: twstat(&f); break; } if(verbose && debug) fprint(dfd , "c→s %F\n", &f); putfcall(sfd, &f); r = getfcall(sfd, &f); if (r <= 0) break; if (verbose) fprint(dfd, "c←s %F\n", &f); switch(f.type){ case Ropen: case Rcreate: fp->qid = f.qid; break; case Rread: rread(&f); break; case Rstat: rstat(&f); break; } if(verbose && debug) fprint(dfd , "c←s %F\n", &f); putfcall(cfd, &f); if (fp != nil) closefid(fp); } } void main(int argc, char* argv[]) { char* srv = nil; char* sname = nil; char* addr = nil; int fd; int p[2]; ARGBEGIN{ case 'D': debug = 1; break; case 'n': addr = EARGF(usage()); break; case 'v': verbose = 1; break; case 's': sname = EARGF(usage()); break; default: altspc = ARGC(); }ARGEND; if (addr == nil){ if (argc < 1) usage(); srv = *argv; argc--; } if (argc > 0) usage(); if (sname == nil) sname = (addr != nil) ? addr : "trfs"; fmtinstall('D', dirfmt); fmtinstall('M', dirmodefmt); fmtinstall('F', fcallfmt); if (addr == nil) fd = open(srv, ORDWR); else fd = dial(netmkaddr(addr, "net", "9fs"), 0, 0, 0); if (fd < 0 || pipe(p) < 0) sysfatal("can't connect to server %s: %r\n", (addr?addr:srv)); if (postfd(sname, p[0]) < 0) sysfatal("can't post srv: %r\n"); close(p[0]); switch(rfork(RFPROC)){ case 0: service(p[1], fd, 2); break; case -1: sysfatal("can't fork server: %r\n"); break; } exits(nil); } --upas-pwnfahbmdnrgafohimcduppeaq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 18:03:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 18:03:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23094 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 18:03:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23090 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 18:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 18:03:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87A4519AAA; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:03:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B5B6719AA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:02:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <924676a5ae7dc067876e9c8726751d7d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] removefid() question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:02:28 +0200 If I call removefid() without holding a reference to the Fid involved, AFAIK, it should unref the Fid and it should be deleted. Is this correct? My removefid() seems not to do so, so I had to allocfid() ... lookupfid() removefid() closefid() // for alloc closefid() // for remove I didn't change removefid() because I'm not sure it's a bug and I may be missing something. What's the right way? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 18:47:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 18:47:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23851 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 18:47:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23847 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 18:47:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 18:47:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 560B819AAB; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:47:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5D2FD19AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 05:46:17 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] xscreensaver ports From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020711094617.5D2FD19AA0@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 18:45:39 +0900 >more to come, subject to time constraints :) I'm using galaxy.c to show students how we can write very short graphic program in Plan 9. Thanks a lot! Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 21:29:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 21:29:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26893 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 21:29:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26889 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 21:29:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 21:29:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D85C19AAC; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:29:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B945C19A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 08:28:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020711122818.YVAH23840.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:28:18 +0100 Message-ID: <004801c228d6$74c316d0$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020711094617.5D2FD19AA0@mail.cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] authdom still Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 13:28:25 +0100 Okay I'm not getting something here here's my current /lib/ndb/local but I still get the dreaded authentication failure:auth server protocol botch /me giving up :( sys=tiger dom=tiger.punx ip=192.168.1.109 ether=00c0f0404d88 sys=gw dom=gw.punx ip=192.168.1.1 ether=002078C5EB1A ipnet=lucid ip=192.168.1.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=gw dns=194.168.4.100 # my isp dns=194.168.8.100 # my isp dnsdomain=punx auth=tiger authdom=punx cpu=tiger From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 22:15:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 22:15:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27575 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 22:15:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27570 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 22:15:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 22:15:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A50F319AB0; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:15:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 459BD19AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020711131413.459BD19AAB@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:14:09 +0900 Hello, > One of the beautiful things about Plan 9 is that it provides a solution > that's workable with little effort. The various substitution file > systems provide a workable solution without introducing any additional > complexity. If you want a total--100% complete--solution, then a > `urlifyfs' can be written that uses URL escaping as a canonical > representation, or something similar. The system interface doesn't > have to be changed, though. *That* is the mark of a clean system > design. The idea was born from the discussion between Dave and I. Dave proposed '\' escape. Until that time, I had been tied to quoting strategy. %XX looks ugly as Dave says, but it works cleanly. That is the beauty. We must be patient with this ugliness because we are in textual environment. Full GUI environment, I believe Plan9 also have it in future, will remove this ugliness. Thanks Dave. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 11 23:37:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 11 23:37:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28673 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Jul 2002 23:37:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28667 invoked from network); 11 Jul 2002 23:37:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Jul 2002 23:37:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CDE319AB4; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:37:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from pali.cps.cmich.edu (pali.cps.cmich.edu [141.209.131.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED6A819A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 10:36:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ishwar@localhost) by pali.cps.cmich.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6BAhpU16369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:43:51 -0400 From: Ish Rattan To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: <200207102301.g6AN1UV00727@dave2.dave.tj> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 06:43:50 -0400 (EDT) Probably it is time for this thread to go away. An OS design is a reflection of what the designer considers important -- who gives a hoot if it not a clean design. My response: if you do not like it either desgin your "own" OR use one that you consider a clean OS!! -ishwar On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > Reply inline: > > - Dave > > Dan Cross wrote: > > > > > The "offending" program in this case is the program that's so much simpler > > > because it's using the new kernel interface rather than the old one. > > > > I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more > > complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an > > object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do > > canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with > > danger. > Manipulating text with all sorts of dynamic buffers is substantially > more complicated than simply replacing a node in a linked list. > The canonicalization is all being done by the kernel, or a library. > > > > > > Nothing has to be rethought because all my proposed changes do is restore > > > the strict seperation between nodes in a filename (something UNIX - > > > and therefore Plan 9 - likes to rely on). > > > > But they change an already well-established interface. Have you > > thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? > > What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file > > in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge > > implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which > > is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not > > perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to > > come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. > Optimization for the common case is good, but creating a system where the > uncommon case will cause major mayhem at the system level is evidence > of a very unclean approach. (When you consider the reasoning behind > the problem (namely, spaces and slashes in filenames kill our ability > to seperate nodes easily), it makes perfect sense that our solution > isn't very clean. The only clean solution is to restore the ancient > UNIX ideal of being able to easily seperate nodes. In other words, > either kill spaces altogether and damn interoperability, or promote > spaces to full citizenship.) > > > > > > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > > > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > > > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > > > well documented, by now. > > > > It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. > String manipulation is more complex than linked list manipulation. > > > > > Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the > > system. > I don't dispute that point, but the interface I propose is most unlike > any other interface currently known to man (not trying to conform to any > external interface). I'm simply pointing out that failing to provide > at least a 1-1 mapping with capabilities that are already widely used > in external systems that must interoperate with ours *will* kill us. > > > > > Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, > > yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives > > you temporal mobility. He is right. > You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get involved in the > functions that your OS should be doing automatically. Try running an FTP > mirror to a busy site that way, though, and you'll quickly discover why > automation is a good thing. The worst part about our system is that the > "solution" you eventually find for an FTP mirror will be useless on an > HTTP proxy. When "solutions" need to be modified for each individual > application, you know that the system isn't clean. > > > > > - Dan C. > > > - Dave C. :-) > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 00:02:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 00:02:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29018 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 00:02:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29013 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 00:02:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 00:02:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95B7719A1C; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:02:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AA6F19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 11:01:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17SfOd-0002mq-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 15:58:19 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D2D94BB.CFB25CCE@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <20020709110730.23FB2199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: Liberating the filename (Was: [9fans] acme question + diffs forkfs, Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 14:57:31 GMT arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > [Lucio De Re wrote:] > >Which reminds me, if we use > >fpath = (usr lucio fname) > >as a future description of a filepath, how do we designate the > >root? > >fpath = ('' usr lucio fname) > >perhaps? > No, they should be: > fpath = /usr/lucio/fname > as it has been. > No change is required for rc. Wrong! If we use lists instead of embedded / characters, as stipulated. The '' member (without quotes in the actual list member, which has 0 characters) would certainly be analogous to the current method of differentiating between relative and absolute paths. Is there some way of getting rid of absolute paths? What if first member "bin" or "dev" etc. were bound to "float" to the current dir.? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 01:21:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 01:21:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30013 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 01:21:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30007 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 01:21:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 01:21:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F24119AB5; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:21:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 771EE19A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:20:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id ADBD8F0D0110; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:09:33 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Thu Jul 11 09:09:32 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2DB04B.8070207@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] authdom still References: <20020711094617.5D2FD19AA0@mail.cse.psu.edu> <004801c228d6$74c316d0$6501a8c0@xpire> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 09:20:27 -0700 matt wrote: > but I still get the dreaded > authentication failure:auth server protocol botch > > /me giving up :( > > sys=tiger dom=tiger.punx ip=192.168.1.109 ether=00c0f0404d88 > > sys=gw dom=gw.punx ip=192.168.1.1 ether=002078C5EB1A > > ipnet=lucid ip=192.168.1.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 > ipgw=gw > dns=194.168.4.100 # my isp > dns=194.168.8.100 # my isp > dnsdomain=punx > auth=tiger authdom=punx > cpu=tiger Hi Matt, I'm new at this, too, so take this all with a grain of salt. The man pages say that the configuration should walk the IP path, but I found that I had to specify the auth and authdom for the specific host as well. It may be different if your CPU server is also your DHCP server, I'm not sure. So, something to try is changing your /lib/ndb/local entry for tiger to: sys=tiger dom=tiger.punx ip=192.168.1.109 ether=00c0f0404d88 auth=tiger authdom=punx In my environment, my CPU server is not my DHCP server, and configured similarly to what you have going on currently, ndb/ipquery would not return auth or authdom values for hosts in the ipnet. For instance, I'm guessing using your current config that if you try: ndb/ipquery ip 192.168.1.109 auth you'll get a blank response, even though the documentation seems to say otherwise. The way I read it, 'ndb/ipquery ip 192.168.1.anything auth' *should* report auth=tiger but I haven't been able to replicate that with any success (yet). Someone please correct me if I'm wrong. If you do get the correct auth response from the above command, a couple of other things you could check (speaking from experience) is to ensure that include=/lib/ndb/auth is in your /lib/ndb/local (if that's where you made the change suggested in the wiki), make sure the information and password you entered when the nvram checksum failed is the same that you entered for bootes using auth/changeuser. One allows passwords of a different length than the other, so choose wisely. Other than that, good luck! -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 01:24:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 01:24:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30078 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 01:24:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30074 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 01:24:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 01:24:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A01F419AB8; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:24:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D5C419AAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:23:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id MAA23465 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:23:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207111623.MAA23465@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 11 Jul 2002 02:14:59 EDT." <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 12:23:31 -0400 I want to let this thread die, but I just have one last thing to say: > Getting the kernel away from plain text doesn't mean getting the shell But.... It took 20 years to get the kernel to plain text. I don't want to go back. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 08:58:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 08:58:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1508 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 08:58:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1504 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 08:58:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 08:58:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02F4419A78; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:58:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F371719A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 19:57:01 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020711235701.F371719A6A@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:56:20 +0900 >The idea was born from the discussion between Dave and I. >Dave proposed '\' escape. No, both are completely misunderstanding the point which Rob pointed. You can read once more his and nemo's remarks before. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 11:09:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 11:09:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5703 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 11:09:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5699 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 11:09:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 11:09:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8679219A73; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:09:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 559A419A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:08:04 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712020804.559A419A1C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:07:28 +0900 This is not so important, I know. However it annoyes me offen, particularly when I need to explain it to newbies. I remember some discussions were undertaken here before, but I don't see the difference in the new release. I suppose none did not pay attention so much to this. :-) /n is for mount points of file trees from network. /mnt is for mount points of user level file severs. Then, where can we put local floppy(a:, b: etc.) or disks other than kfs filesystem? If we could have another directory such as /media or just /m, we can push out all the local stuffs into it. Even if those are imported from network, the name of m or media will not suffer from unmatched naming. Then, we don't need /mnt/cd, either. This does not deny to have those names under /n, of course. However it may annoy many of newbies. Then, /m could have directories of 9 9fat a: b: c: d: cd tapefs boot kfs What is for a, b, c, by the way? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 11:22:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 11:22:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6089 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 11:22:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6085 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 11:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 11:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FC0519A7A; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 76E6B19A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:21:02 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020712022102.76E6B19A75@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:17:02 -0400 // /mnt is for mount points of user level file severs. [and then later] // ...where can we put local floppy... ...or disks other than // kfs filesystem? to answer this question, i'd simply point out that "local disks" already show up in /dev - since they're devices. interpreting their contents, like turning bits on a disk into a file system, is done by (you guesed it) a user level file server (okay, i guess things like kfs sometimes show up in the kernel, but that's the exception). so i say put 'em all in /mnt. yes, i do suggest moving things like /n/a: to /mnt/a: for the sake of consistency and clarity. ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 11:49:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 11:49:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7101 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 11:49:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7096 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 11:49:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 11:49:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C262319A86; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:49:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E6EAB19A83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:48:13 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712024813.E6EAB19A83@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:47:38 +0900 Yes, put all those in /mnt may be one choice. This is beacuse those are the mounting points of one of user level file servers, too. I thought in this line an example of /mnt/cd, (probably put by Russ?). Here, he may thought it has a particular function not only for files, but also make sounds, then, it should be onto /mnt file sever point. Most importantly, it could not imported from another machine. Of in that case, sounds are coming from another machine. ^_^ But I'm not Russ, anyway. I supposed the reason why a: or 9fans etc are put in /n is that they shows just file trees as others imported from network. However, files under /mnt have some function to do, and usually for the file server running on the machine. In Plan 9 all the resources are files, yes, it's true. However... This is the reason why I proposed to make /m or /media directory. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 11:57:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 11:57:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7425 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 11:57:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7416 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 11:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 11:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75B6619A7D; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:57:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E862719981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:56:14 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] trfs From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020712025614.E862719981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:55:39 +0900 >translates spaces within file names to open box runes (0x2423) >"␣". A different rune can be selected by specifying it as an option. :-) Kenji - I don't reject your efforts, of course From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 16:41:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 16:41:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16075 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 16:41:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16071 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 16:41:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 16:41:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1517B19A90; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:41:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1D71319A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:40:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7c3bc4b0201dd89d5d793bfb98a5573a@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:40:07 +0200 From namespace(4): /mnt A directory containing mount points for appli- cations. /mnt/factotum Mount point for factotum(4). /n A directory containing mount points for file trees imported from remote systems. Thus I think /n/a: is the right place, since the media can be considered as a `remote system'. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 16:45:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 16:45:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16186 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 16:45:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16182 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 16:45:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 16:45:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3945D19AA1; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:45:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4119919AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:44:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <1f122e12c32d723a45c4641fa9278002@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] 9p(2) != /sys/src/lib9p Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:44:01 +0200 There's a discrepancy between the manual page and the code in lib9p. Most notably, I found that srv() argument list changed and that some of them are found now in the Srv struct. I could guess from the code what are they doing, but perhaps it'd be better to update the manual page. I didn't update the man page and send a diff because I'm not 100% sure of how to define the added fields in srv, sorry. hth From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 16:59:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 16:59:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16570 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 16:59:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16566 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 16:59:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 16:59:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C78B19AA4; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:59:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A483F19A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 03:57:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:57:58 +0200 Files there seem to be missing from sources, as well as the man page if there was any. Could some kind sould give me a copy of this? thanks From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 18:23:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 18:23:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18862 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 18:23:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18858 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 18:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 18:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE49C19AB1; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 05:23:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E85A119A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 05:22:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17SwLJ-0004br-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:04:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207112308.1330ebdd@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020712020804.559A419A1C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:03:24 GMT Who cares. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 19:16:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 19:16:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19904 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 19:16:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19900 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 19:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 19:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3599619AAB; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:16:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0118519AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:15:38 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712101539.0118519AAB@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 19:15:02 +0900 >since the media can be considered >as a `remote system'. /rc/bin/termrc says: for(i in f t m L S A) /bin/bind -a '#'^$i /dev >/dev/null >[2= So, you mean kernel devices are also 'remote systemes'? Media, of course, can be imported from remote system. How do you explain this to your students? kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 19:22:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 19:22:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19992 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 19:22:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19988 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 19:22:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 19:22:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E571E19AB9; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:22:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2DEAB19AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:21:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cpfskkdyyvwdzezfxrjfbunjfj" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:20:42 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cpfskkdyyvwdzezfxrjfbunjfj Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is what I tell my students: Anything serviced by the mount driver is actually a remote file system. This includes servers reached through /srv mostly. The only local file systems are those of the kernel drivers. Thus, you can see file trees from your disks and other machines as remote things that you can import to your system. --upas-cpfskkdyyvwdzezfxrjfbunjfj Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Jul 12 12:16:21 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3599619AAB; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:16:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0118519AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:15:38 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712101539.0118519AAB@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 19:15:02 +0900 >since the media can be considered >as a `remote system'. /rc/bin/termrc says: for(i in f t m L S A) /bin/bind -a '#'^$i /dev >/dev/null >[2= So, you mean kernel devices are also 'remote systemes'? Media, of course, can be imported from remote system. How do you explain this to your students? kenji --upas-cpfskkdyyvwdzezfxrjfbunjfj-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 19:34:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 19:34:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20141 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 19:34:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20137 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 19:34:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 19:34:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE43A19ABD; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:34:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8B28D19AAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:33:04 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712103304.8B28D19AAC@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 19:32:29 +0900 According to my understanding, we can use bind(1) when old file or directory is already there . So, they are there in the kernel. Am I wrong? kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 19:38:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 19:38:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20190 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 19:38:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20186 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 19:38:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 19:38:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAC4819AC0; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:38:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7680D19A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:37:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <36c5ff4bd62b6ef1e792bc2b4dd846e5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:37:06 +0200 Yes, but where did the old file come from? If it was remote, it's still remote when bound. In any case, all this probably depends on the point of view. What matters is that you can be happy no matter the location of the file. The /n vs /mnt thing is just a convention. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 19:46:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 19:46:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20299 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 19:46:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20295 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 19:46:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 19:46:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B00A19AC3; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:46:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E915319AB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 06:45:32 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712104532.E915319AB8@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 19:44:57 +0900 >The /n vs /mnt thing is just a convention. Yes, I know it. However, it's not easy to explain this to my naive students. You, probably many others?, don't want to have many directory in /, don't you? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 20:50:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 20:50:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21086 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 20:50:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21082 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 20:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 20:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD3D519AC7; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:50:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail1.panix.com (mail1.panix.com [166.84.1.72]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE17D19AC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panix1.panix.com (panix1.panix.com [166.84.1.1]) by mail1.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DDF8487C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from markp@localhost) by panix1.panix.com (8.11.3nb1/8.8.8/PanixN1.0) id g6CBnIS05160 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Message-Id: <200207121149.g6CBnIS05160@panix1.panix.com> X-Mailer: mailx (AT&T/BSD) 9.8 2001-04-01 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) hi, on one standalone 4ed system, when I first open a mailbox with nedmail or acme Mail, and when I open a message, the screen fills with wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: ...etc... I'm guessing that it's related to upas/fs opening messages, that is, box with lots of messages = lots of lines of errors, box with only a few messages = only a few errors, empty box = no errors. other than that, mail *works* fine, but the messages disrupt the screen and make it nigh impossible to read. anyone know what's up? ---mp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 21:29:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 21:29:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21543 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 21:29:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21535 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 21:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 21:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74B0D19AC0; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:29:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D624B19ABD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:28:20 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207110614.g6B6ExM18574@dave2.dave.tj> <20020711131413.459BD19AAB@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-Id: <20020712122820.D624B19ABD@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 21:28:15 +0900 Hello, I should have added to my previous thread: I think `urlifyfs' or similar stuff is good idea. I didn't have that idea. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 21:36:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 21:36:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21640 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 21:36:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21636 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 21:36:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 21:36:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01A9C19AC6; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:36:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 89BAC19AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:35:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9287a4b42d2c3c0fb9166e6efdabbc1e@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wbdeaavwgeuivkrkiflvheufoq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 13:34:53 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wbdeaavwgeuivkrkiflvheufoq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the kfs file system is complaining that it is getting errors from the read system call that is reading the device holding the file system (eg, IDE or SCSI). it might just be that there's a bad block number somewhere because of a shut down without sync (eg, by a crash). in any case, you probably should sort it out because you might get growing corruption otherwise. --upas-wbdeaavwgeuivkrkiflvheufoq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026474638:10:05944:44; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:50:38 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1005771; 12 Jul 2002 11:50 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD3D519AC7; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:50:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail1.panix.com (mail1.panix.com [166.84.1.72]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE17D19AC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panix1.panix.com (panix1.panix.com [166.84.1.1]) by mail1.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DDF8487C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from markp@localhost) by panix1.panix.com (8.11.3nb1/8.8.8/PanixN1.0) id g6CBnIS05160 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Message-Id: <200207121149.g6CBnIS05160@panix1.panix.com> X-Mailer: mailx (AT&T/BSD) 9.8 2001-04-01 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:49:18 -0400 (EDT) hi, on one standalone 4ed system, when I first open a mailbox with nedmail or acme Mail, and when I open a message, the screen fills with wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: wrenread failed: ...etc... I'm guessing that it's related to upas/fs opening messages, that is, box with lots of messages = lots of lines of errors, box with only a few messages = only a few errors, empty box = no errors. other than that, mail *works* fine, but the messages disrupt the screen and make it nigh impossible to read. anyone know what's up? ---mp --upas-wbdeaavwgeuivkrkiflvheufoq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 22:00:33 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 22:00:33 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21946 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 22:00:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21942 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 22:00:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 22:00:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 160AD19AAD; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:00:25 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B089619A8F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:59:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6CCx1mk005158 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:59:03 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6CCwwWx005157 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:58:58 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020712145852.L4660@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us Subject: [9fans] POV-Ray Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:58:53 +0200 I see 3.5 has been released and I seem to recall a previous version had been ported to Plan 9. What is the likelyhood of being able to run POV-Ray on 4th Edition? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 12 22:29:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 12 22:29:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22328 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Jul 2002 22:29:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22324 invoked from network); 12 Jul 2002 22:29:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Jul 2002 22:29:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AC5419AC8; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:29:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 933FF19AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 09:28:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <69e32cc3984fe16abfd49c04a60b0c6c@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:28:17 +0100 >>in any case, you probably should sort it out because >>you might get growing corruption otherwise. more helpfully, see the check command in kfscmd(8). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 00:04:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 00:04:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23360 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 00:04:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23356 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 00:04:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 00:04:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DCE619A78; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:04:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C059819A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:03:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id AD3B64F4013A; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 07:52:43 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Fri Jul 12 07:52:42 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D2EEFCA.2070104@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail References: <9287a4b42d2c3c0fb9166e6efdabbc1e@caldo.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:03:38 -0700 forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote: > because of a shut down without sync (eg, by a crash). > in any case, you probably should sort it out because > you might get growing corruption otherwise. Aha! So if we sync our politicians before their sessions are over.... I like where you're going with this. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 00:22:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 00:22:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23546 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23542 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 00:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D1AD19ACD; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8128019ACA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:21:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6CEOw202509 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:24:58 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] booting issue Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 10:24:58 -0400 (EDT) Hello gang, It's time to update our cpu/fs here to 4e and while reading over Forsyth's wiki "upgrade roadmap" if you will, I realize I need a kfs system running 4e. I've had a 4e install on my disk for some time, but it wouldn't boot and I haven't had time to poke at it. Now is the time. Here's the problem: The system is a IBM TP 600E, with a 10GB disk. It currently boots windoze (for dvds) & linux. The partitions are laid out as follows: [root@9top sah]# /sbin/fdisk -l /dev/hda Disk /dev/hda: 240 heads, 63 sectors, 1299 cylinders Units = cylinders of 15120 * 512 bytes Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System /dev/hda1 * 1 272 2056288+ 6 FAT16 /dev/hda2 273 681 3092040 83 Linux /dev/hda3 682 752 536760 5 Extended /dev/hda4 753 1299 4135320 39 Plan 9 /dev/hda5 682 752 536728+ 82 Linux swap ... so my question is, when I boot plan9 from lilo using the line: other=/dev/hda4 label=plan9 table=/dev/hda as has been suggested in the archives, why do I get this on boot (roughly): Loading Plan9 PBS ... Bad format or I/O error Press a key to reboot and if common, how do I make it stop doing this? Cheers, Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 00:23:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 00:23:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23564 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 00:23:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23560 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 00:23:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 00:23:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6633F19ACF; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:23:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail3.panix.com (mail3.panix.com [166.84.1.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E609E19ACE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panix1.panix.com (panix1.panix.com [166.84.1.1]) by mail3.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3194A98366 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from markp@localhost) by panix1.panix.com (8.11.3nb1/8.8.8/PanixN1.0) id g6CFMBx13267 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:22:11 -0400 (EDT) From: Message-Id: <200207121522.g6CFMBx13267@panix1.panix.com> X-Mailer: mailx (AT&T/BSD) 9.8 2001-04-01 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'wrenread failed' in mail Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:22:11 -0400 (EDT) | more helpfully, see the check command in kfscmd(8). yup, disk/kfscmd 'check rfdt' seems to have cured it. thanks. cheers, ---mp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 01:16:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 01:16:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24001 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 01:16:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23997 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 01:16:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 01:16:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D928C19ACB; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:16:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6F68C19AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:15:24 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] POV-Ray MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020712161524.6F68C19AA4@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:12:38 -0400 i (as well as others, all independantly) ported older versions of POV-ray, using APE. it was a pretty easy job. unless the newer versions have changed the code structure significantly, i imagine it'd take only a few hours to get running. of course, i've not looked at the new code, so i could well be talking out of places i shouldn't be talking out of. ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 01:27:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 01:27:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24094 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 01:27:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24090 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 01:27:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 01:27:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5893019A90; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:27:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7A28919AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:26:20 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020712162620.7A28919AA4@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:16:26 -0400 your re-definition of "remote" to make things like floppys and tapes fit there is interesting. but my issues is rather with "systems" - i tend strongly to think that's refering to, y'know, systems. boxes. computers. i imagine an entry in /n for each box on the network you care about reaching, and that's it. everything else i'd probably put in /mnt. this use of /n also matches my understanding of its historical origin - am i correct on this? and for those of you who're wondering why any of this matters... well, it's questionable whether it does. but there certainly is value to having the file system as cleanly organized as possible. there are other places that could use cleaning up, too: /lib vs. /sys/lib, source for acme programs under /acme (or maybe just /acme itself)... but i doubt any of these are really worth spending much time on unless the folks at the Labs express some interest (which i doubt - they've got day jobs and better things to be doing, thankfully). ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 01:43:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 01:43:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24229 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 01:43:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24225 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 01:43:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 01:43:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D719819ACC; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:43:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEC1F19AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 12:42:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6CFkF202688 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:46:15 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] booting issue In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:46:15 -0400 (EDT) Moreover, it looks like everyone who encountered this problem just gave up. There's a handful of unanswered posts about this problem in the archives. My guess is the unwillingness to open the 9load box? Cheers, Sam On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Sam wrote: > Hello gang, > > It's time to update our cpu/fs here to 4e and while reading over > Forsyth's wiki "upgrade roadmap" if you will, I realize I need > a kfs system running 4e. > > I've had a 4e install on my disk for some time, but it wouldn't > boot and I haven't had time to poke at it. Now is the time. Here's > the problem: > > The system is a IBM TP 600E, with a 10GB disk. It currently > boots windoze (for dvds) & linux. The partitions are laid out as follows: > > [root@9top sah]# /sbin/fdisk -l /dev/hda > > Disk /dev/hda: 240 heads, 63 sectors, 1299 cylinders > Units = cylinders of 15120 * 512 bytes > > Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System > /dev/hda1 * 1 272 2056288+ 6 FAT16 > /dev/hda2 273 681 3092040 83 Linux > /dev/hda3 682 752 536760 5 Extended > /dev/hda4 753 1299 4135320 39 Plan 9 > /dev/hda5 682 752 536728+ 82 Linux swap > > ... so my question is, when I boot plan9 from lilo using the > line: > > other=/dev/hda4 > label=plan9 > table=/dev/hda > > as has been suggested in the archives, why do I get this on boot > (roughly): > > Loading Plan9 > PBS ... Bad format or I/O error > Press a key to reboot > > and if common, how do I make it stop doing this? > > Cheers, > > Sam > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 03:28:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 03:28:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25103 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 03:28:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25099 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 03:28:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 03:28:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE7A619ACE; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:28:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B61619AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 14:27:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6CHVE202879 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Jul 2002 13:31:15 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] booting issue Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 13:31:14 -0400 (EDT) pbslba did the trick. I updated the wiki - my very first experience - to reflect the quick solution. May I give a giant *huzzah* for the wiki? Very cool. Cheers, Sam On Fri, 12 Jul 2002, Sam wrote: > Hello gang, > > It's time to update our cpu/fs here to 4e and while reading over > Forsyth's wiki "upgrade roadmap" if you will, I realize I need > a kfs system running 4e. > > I've had a 4e install on my disk for some time, but it wouldn't > boot and I haven't had time to poke at it. Now is the time. Here's > the problem: > > The system is a IBM TP 600E, with a 10GB disk. It currently > boots windoze (for dvds) & linux. The partitions are laid out as follows: > > [root@9top sah]# /sbin/fdisk -l /dev/hda > > Disk /dev/hda: 240 heads, 63 sectors, 1299 cylinders > Units = cylinders of 15120 * 512 bytes > > Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System > /dev/hda1 * 1 272 2056288+ 6 FAT16 > /dev/hda2 273 681 3092040 83 Linux > /dev/hda3 682 752 536760 5 Extended > /dev/hda4 753 1299 4135320 39 Plan 9 > /dev/hda5 682 752 536728+ 82 Linux swap > > ... so my question is, when I boot plan9 from lilo using the > line: > > other=/dev/hda4 > label=plan9 > table=/dev/hda > > as has been suggested in the archives, why do I get this on boot > (roughly): > > Loading Plan9 > PBS ... Bad format or I/O error > Press a key to reboot > > and if common, how do I make it stop doing this? > > Cheers, > > Sam > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 13 17:50:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 13 17:50:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3324 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Jul 2002 17:50:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3320 invoked from network); 13 Jul 2002 17:50:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 17:50:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24D3D19A76; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 04:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 80A7C19A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Jul 2002 04:49:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 76693 invoked by uid 18927); 13 Jul 2002 08:45:44 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 13 Jul 2002 08:45:44 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] POV-Ray In-Reply-To: <20020712161524.6F68C19AA4@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020713024129.C76674-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 02:45:44 -0600 (MDT) On Fri, 12 Jul 2002 anothy@cosym.net wrote: > of course, i've not looked at the new code, so i could > well be talking out of places i shouldn't be talking > out of. same here. and unfortunately i'm having a hard time transferring things to my p9 laptop, so i can't be of any help right now. in case anyone decides to give it a go, the following may be of use: http://www.acl.lanl.gov/plan9/povray/index.html andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 14 15:18:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 14 15:18:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18282 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Jul 2002 15:18:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18278 invoked from network); 14 Jul 2002 15:18:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Jul 2002 15:18:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E15CB199BF; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 02:18:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.230.134.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 645EA1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 02:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@kp.km.ua [217.196.174.2]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.5/8.12.5/ic) with ESMTP id g6E6H8Ut058794 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 09:17:14 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup09.kp.km.ua [217.196.174.24]) by kp.km.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA67642 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 09:17:02 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <20020713024129.C76674-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> In-Reply-To: <20020713024129.C76674-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02071321520600.00595@localhost.localdomain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 21:52:06 -0400 hello, I want to create and configure dial-up modem Internet connection on a standalone Plan 9 machine, but ip/ppp prints: ppp: couldn't open /fd/0 what that mean? May be I fall something? Another question: is there in Plan 9 a terminal programm? thanks, -ask From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 00:21:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 00:21:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25592 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 00:21:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25588 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 00:21:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 00:21:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA795199B6; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 11:21:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 73A091999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 11:20:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <462446dae54685ebf5693bd2516bfbd7@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: plan9@kp.km.ua, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-raonnlfqmnewuwclgmwixhpsii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 11:20:18 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-raonnlfqmnewuwclgmwixhpsii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If you need to login by hand: % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} If ppp will do authentiation: % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} -s : --upas-raonnlfqmnewuwclgmwixhpsii Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Jul 14 02:18:41 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Jul 14 02:18:40 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB77E1999B; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 02:18:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.230.134.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 645EA1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 02:17:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@kp.km.ua [217.196.174.2]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.5/8.12.5/ic) with ESMTP id g6E6H8Ut058794 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 09:17:14 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup09.kp.km.ua [217.196.174.24]) by kp.km.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA67642 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 09:17:02 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <20020713024129.C76674-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> In-Reply-To: <20020713024129.C76674-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02071321520600.00595@localhost.localdomain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 21:52:06 -0400 hello, I want to create and configure dial-up modem Internet connection on a standalone Plan 9 machine, but ip/ppp prints: ppp: couldn't open /fd/0 what that mean? May be I fall something? Another question: is there in Plan 9 a terminal programm? thanks, -ask --upas-raonnlfqmnewuwclgmwixhpsii-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 02:31:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 02:31:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26431 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 02:31:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26427 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 02:31:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 02:31:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 59160199A3; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:31:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.230.134.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F18E1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@kp.km.ua [217.196.174.2]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.5/8.12.5/ic) with ESMTP id g6EHUSUt033367 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:35 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup08.kp.km.ua [217.196.174.23]) by kp.km.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA92979 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:18 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02071420283700.00539@localhost.localdomain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:03 -0400 where i can indicate telephone and address of ISP? > If you need to login by hand: > > % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} > > If ppp will do authentiation: > > % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} -s : From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 02:39:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 02:39:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26480 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 02:39:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26476 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 02:39:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 02:39:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49E82199E3; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:39:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7AC43199D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:38:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: plan9@kp.km.ua, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kapitugfsjaokbvjgejlhkxkig" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:38:43 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kapitugfsjaokbvjgejlhkxkig Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It gets addresses from the other end. The telno, you have to dial yourself. After ppp starts it takes input from the keyboard (actually stdin) until you hit ^D. The typical thing to do it type atdt^M to get the dialer to call. If you're real trusting, you can add that onto the command line with the -t option. --upas-kapitugfsjaokbvjgejlhkxkig Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Jul 14 13:31:37 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Jul 14 13:31:36 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D99619995; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:31:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.230.134.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F18E1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@kp.km.ua [217.196.174.2]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.5/8.12.5/ic) with ESMTP id g6EHUSUt033367 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:35 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup08.kp.km.ua [217.196.174.23]) by kp.km.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id UAA92979 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:18 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02071420283700.00539@localhost.localdomain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:30:03 -0400 where i can indicate telephone and address of ISP? > If you need to login by hand: > > % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} > > If ppp will do authentiation: > > % ip/ppp -fub 115200 -p /dev/eia{0 or 1} -s : --upas-kapitugfsjaokbvjgejlhkxkig-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 02:55:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 02:55:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26584 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 02:55:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26580 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 02:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 02:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFD34199E8; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:55:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 553F2199DD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:54:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 5870 invoked by uid 991); 14 Jul 2002 17:54:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20020714175407.5869.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other In-Reply-To: Message from presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com of "Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:38:43 EDT." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:54:07 -0400 In previous editions the telco fileserver was the nicest way to dial the modem. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 02:59:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 02:59:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26624 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 02:59:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26620 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 02:59:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 02:59:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52FDB19A06; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:59:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.9]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EDE719A00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:58:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ90086J39GCY@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:58:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6EI0gG25786 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:00:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020711083834.M20312@cackle.proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207141800.g6EI0gG25786@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:00:42 -0400 (EDT) Lucio De Re wrote: > > On Thu, Jul 11, 2002 at 02:14:59AM -0400, Dave wrote: > > > > Reply inline: > > > You make some valid points, but I think they are well in excess of > present requirements. Not to say that a future OS/GUI will not (have > to) take them into consideration. Okay, fair enough ... I'll just wait a few more years until some OS agrees to go out on a limb with me (Release 5, maybe?) ;-) > > You do however confuse URI and HTML and you really shouldn't: > > > > The only way to have the urlifyfs concept providing a 100% complete > > solution is to use it as the default filesystem for your own stuff. > > The reason? imagine downloading a file "blah%apos;" from an FTP server; > > now, you download a file "blah'" from an FTP server (which your urlifyfs > > faithfully translates into "blah%apos;" without realizing that it's > > destroying a different file). Guess what? You've just clobbered your > > original. Now, if you're going to use urlifyfs for your own stuff > > URI: blah%apos; -> blah%25pos%3b Whoopsies ... my brain must've been half mush when I typed that :-( > > ++L > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:16:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:16:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26737 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:16:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26733 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A38019A0B; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:16:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9EF9199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:15:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ9001MN3VHOV@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:11:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6EIDmw28998 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:13:48 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <9e269d17ee7ea1cd7ecd77a8a58705ff@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207141813.g6EIDmw28998@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:13:47 -0400 (EDT) Reply inline: - Dave Geoff Collyer wrote: > > dave@dave.tj, > > Have you actually used Plan 9 or even read its manual? I ask because > you've made a succession of odd statements: Yup, I had Release 3 on an old system (which I tried to upgrade to Release 4, to no avail), although I must admit that it wasn't my preferred platform. Everything from the directory structure to the process of trying to compile standard UNIX-compatible software was extremely awkward. I was hoping to give Release 4 a try, but until I can get the Millenium (or the Blade 3D, my only other card) to work with Release 4, I'm out of luck. As for the manual, no way ... I never read the manual until I run into trouble ;-P > > > strlen() is an expensive operation. > > No, it's not terribly expensive. Even if it were, most strings are > short, so it's not much of an issue. DES encryption is expensive. It must examine every byte in the array, and that's an expensive operation. DES must examine every byte multiple times, so it's a very expensive operation. The structure method doesn't require access to every byte in the array, since the length is counted. > > > realloc() sucks in a multithreaded environment. > > You don't define ``sucks'', but the whole malloc family use internal > locks on Plan 9 so that they *do* work well (or at least don't corrupt > memory) in multiprocess or multithread programs. Yup, I should've defined "sucks" - here goes: suck - v. being rediculously inefficient, due to the need to move the realloc(3)ed chunk almost constantly, because realloc(3) isn't smart enough to know that another realloc(3) in another thread is also growing a block, and realloc(3) hates stepping on other realloc(3)s' toes (BTW - realloc(3) can also suck in a single-threaded environment (two arrays that are growing in the same thread), but it's more common for it to be used in a way that causes it to suck in multi-threaded environments.) > > > Also, I'd like to mention again that I'm not asking the kernel to > > allocate memory. > > The kernel already allocates memory, including string memory. What's > the big deal? AFAIK, the kernel does _not_ allocate userland memory with anything but the brk(2) call - which is only called by malloc(3), realloc(3), and operator new(). Please correct me if I'm wrong. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:29:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:29:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26841 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:29:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26837 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:29:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:29:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 336F2199ED; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:29:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CD7CA19A0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:28:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:28:18 -0400 > > strlen() is an expensive operation. > > No, it's not terribly expensive. The strlen() of this thread is certainly an expensive operation. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:30:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:30:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26857 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:30:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26853 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:30:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:30:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFBDA19A2A; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:30:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24A4519A17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:29:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ9003114NAQI@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:28:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6EIW3R00831 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:32:03 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <20020711131413.459BD19AAB@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207141832.g6EIW3R00831@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:32:03 -0400 (EDT) /me shudders at the thought that GUIs might someday take over the world :-( - Dave BTW - The point I was trying to make is that if the kernel doesn't use any particular filename-rewriting rule, then user programs and libraries are free to use URL, HTML, quoting, C-style escaping, or any other system that suits the application at hand, without having to rewrite their versions into whatever rewriting rule the kernel decides to use. (I guess you can say I'm "pro choice.") arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > Hello, > > > One of the beautiful things about Plan 9 is that it provides a > solution > > that's workable with little effort. The various substitution file > > systems provide a workable solution without introducing any > additional > > complexity. If you want a total--100% complete--solution, then a > > `urlifyfs' can be written that uses URL escaping as a canonical > > representation, or something similar. The system interface > doesn't > > have to be changed, though. *That* is the mark of a clean system > > design. > The idea was born from the discussion between Dave and I. > Dave proposed '\' escape. > Until that time, I had been tied to quoting strategy. > %XX looks ugly as Dave says, but it works cleanly. > That is the beauty. > We must be patient with this ugliness because we are in textual > environment. Full GUI environment, I believe Plan9 also have it > in future, will remove this ugliness. > Thanks Dave. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:45:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:45:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26941 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:45:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26937 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:45:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:45:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0B9419A2C; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:45:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from einstein.ssz.com (unknown [207.200.56.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9B7B19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:44:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (ravage@localhost) by einstein.ssz.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA09008 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:51:17 -0500 From: Jim Choate To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-Reply-To: <200207141832.g6EIW3R00831@dave2.dave.tj> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:51:17 -0500 (CDT) On Sun, 14 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > /me shudders at the thought that GUIs might someday take over the > world :-( I also, it means that mankind will have missed the entire point of computing. -- ____________________________________________________________________ When I die, I would like to be born again as me. Hugh Hefner ravage@ssz.com www.ssz.com jchoate@open-forge.org www.open-forge.org -------------------------------------------------------------------- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:49:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:49:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26973 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:49:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26969 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:49:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:49:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC8F819A3F; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:49:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D377519A3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:48:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZ9002DN5G04T@mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:45:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6EInJh05106 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:49:19 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207141849.g6EInJh05106@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:49:18 -0400 (EDT) Okay, I think we might have enough votes to finally kill the thread ;-) - Dave Ish Rattan wrote: > > Probably it is time for this thread to go away. > > An OS design is a reflection of what the designer considers > important -- who gives a hoot if it not a clean design. My > response: if you do not like it either desgin your "own" OR > use one that you consider a clean OS!! > > -ishwar > > On Wed, 10 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > > > Reply inline: > > > > - Dave > > > > Dan Cross wrote: > > > > > > > The "offending" program in this case is the program that's so much simpler > > > > because it's using the new kernel interface rather than the old one. > > > > > > I don't think it would be simpler; I think it would be more > > > complicated. You're replacing a simple, textual representation of an > > > object with a binary representation; you have to have some way to do > > > canonicalization in the common case, but even that path is thrwat with > > > danger. > > Manipulating text with all sorts of dynamic buffers is substantially > > more complicated than simply replacing a node in a linked list. > > The canonicalization is all being done by the kernel, or a library. > > > > > > > > > Nothing has to be rethought because all my proposed changes do is restore > > > > the strict seperation between nodes in a filename (something UNIX - > > > > and therefore Plan 9 - likes to rely on). > > > > > > But they change an already well-established interface. Have you > > > thought through the implications of this, in all their macabre glory? > > > What you propose--changing the most basic interface for opening a file > > > in a system where everything looks more or less like a file--has huge > > > implications. And all this just to support a strange edge-case, which > > > is adequately solved by substitutions in the filename. Sure, it's not > > > perfect in some weird pathological case, but how often is this going to > > > come up in practice? Remember: Optimize for the common case. > > Optimization for the common case is good, but creating a system where the > > uncommon case will cause major mayhem at the system level is evidence > > of a very unclean approach. (When you consider the reasoning behind > > the problem (namely, spaces and slashes in filenames kill our ability > > to seperate nodes easily), it makes perfect sense that our solution > > isn't very clean. The only clean solution is to restore the ancient > > UNIX ideal of being able to easily seperate nodes. In other words, > > either kill spaces altogether and damn interoperability, or promote > > spaces to full citizenship.) > > > > > > > > > There's plenty of experience with other systems working on linked lists > > > > (including a huge amount of kernel code in my Linux box that I'm typing > > > > from, ATM). Most of the problems with linked lists have been pretty > > > > well documented, by now. > > > > > > It's the huge amount of kernel code that Plan 9 is trying to avoid. > > String manipulation is more complex than linked list manipulation. > > > > > > > > Being forced to conform to a lot of external interfaces *will* kill the > > > system. > > I don't dispute that point, but the interface I propose is most unlike > > any other interface currently known to man (not trying to conform to any > > external interface). I'm simply pointing out that failing to provide > > at least a 1-1 mapping with capabilities that are already widely used > > in external systems that must interoperate with ours *will* kill us. > > > > > > > > Besides, the point Nemo was trying to make umpteen posts ago was that, > > > yes, you can roll back changes using the dump filesystem, which gives > > > you temporal mobility. He is right. > > You can do a lot of things if you're prepared to get involved in the > > functions that your OS should be doing automatically. Try running an FTP > > mirror to a busy site that way, though, and you'll quickly discover why > > automation is a good thing. The worst part about our system is that the > > "solution" you eventually find for an FTP mirror will be useless on an > > HTTP proxy. When "solutions" need to be modified for each individual > > application, you know that the system isn't clean. > > > > > > > > - Dan C. > > > > > - Dave C. :-) > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 03:58:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 03:58:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27031 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 03:58:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27027 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 03:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 03:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EF2F19A73; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:58:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (mta06-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90BE519A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:57:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020714185757.UDPX4119.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:57:57 +0100 Message-ID: <007c01c22b68$600293d0$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20020711094617.5D2FD19AA0@mail.cse.psu.edu> <004801c228d6$74c316d0$6501a8c0@xpire> <3D2DB04B.8070207@nas.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] authdom - working MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:57:59 +0100 > If you do get the correct auth response from the above command, a couple > of other things you could check (speaking from experience) is to ensure > that include=/lib/ndb/auth is in your /lib/ndb/local added that I'd also skipped over cd /rc/bin/service.auth mv authsrv.il566 il566 mv authsrv.tcp567 tcp567 but still no workee it was then connecting but failing to authenticate the 4th ed prompts secstore key: and password : not knowing what secstore key was I'd put a dummy value in for both. The password was really bootes password wasn't it? Well I made it the same as the one i'd set for auth/changeuser bootes and then I added the stuff for cpu & FS disk/kfscmd 'listen il!*!17008' echo '#!/bin/cpu -R' >/rc/bin/service/il17010 echo '#!/bin/cpu -R' >/rc/bin/service/tcp17010 and next boot it worked end of fiddling ah, welcome back plan9, it's been too long away. M From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 07:16:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 07:16:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28326 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 07:16:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28322 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 07:16:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 07:16:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD139199B7; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:16:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (mta02-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.42]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C80E719992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 18:15:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xpire ([80.4.204.35]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020714221528.BCJS290.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@xpire> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 23:15:28 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01c22b83$f7c68d50$6501a8c0@xpire> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] drawterm - upas/fs fails & auth/fgui kills it Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 23:15:29 +0100 trying to use upas/fs from drawterm I get upas/fs: opening mailbox: no usable keys found when trying to use upas/fs in a drawterm window I get upas/fs: opening mailbox: no usable keys found and on the cpu console I get "matt doesn't have permission to use bootes keys" (or similar, can't see the cpu screen now, it's headless atm.) I was developing a remote mail -> local mail script along the lines of #!/bin/rc { box = `{read} echo $box(2) $box(3) > $home/tmp/p3p upas/fs -f/pop/$box(1) < $home/tmp/p3p for (msg in /mail/fs/mbox/*/raw) cat $msg | upas/send -r -b $box(4) } < $home/pop3 which mounts the remote mail and them re-sends them to me using the local smtp server It was working pretty well until I got the auth problems. I was using a file $home/pop3 with each pop3 as "host username password localusername" There was a snag actually. After the initial upas/fs connection where one is asked for details the un/pw combination is stored with factotum. All well and good but it seems to be on a 1 user per protocol per domain. I have 5 pop3 mailboxes I need to mount and collect from all on the same domain name. I didn't get the chance to play with factotum and set it to ask for un/pw for those domains. An additional problem is that auth/fgui dies in a drawterm too : auth/fgui: opening /mnt/factotum/confirm: permission denied auth/fgui: opening /mnt/factotum/needkey: permission denied and then drawterm locks up M From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 08:31:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 08:31:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28923 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 08:31:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28919 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 08:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 08:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA4D119A05; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:31:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 87F88199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:30:04 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <200207141832.g6EIW3R00831@dave2.dave.tj> Message-Id: <20020714233004.87F88199BC@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 08:27:50 +0900 Hello, Dave, you should be aware that you started from wrong place. As I said, your new_open is not required. You speek too much about that is not required. And I am surprised to see: >then user programs and libraries >are free to use URL, HTML, quoting, C-style escaping, >or any other system that suits the application at hand Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 13:02:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 13:02:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4134 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 13:02:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4129 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 13:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 13:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D6AB1999B; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:02:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.fywss.com (gate.nevex.com [207.245.2.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A3701999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:01:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from steve@localhost) by smtp.fywss.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g6F413U15093 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:01:03 -0400 From: Steve Kotsopoulos Message-Id: <200207150401.g6F413U15093@smtp.fywss.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] [reminder] pointer to Plan 9 FAQ Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:01:03 -0400 The Plan 9 faq is posted to comp.os.plan9 at the beginning of each month. It is also at news.answers archive sites, look for comp-os/plan9-faq The latest hypertext version of the faq is available at url http://www.fywss.com/plan9/plan9faq.html From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 13:04:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 13:04:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4225 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 13:04:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4221 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 13:04:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 13:04:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19687199E4; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:04:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0EC47199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:03:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <61fc59076e43ac52fe96127834dadbe8@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 21:03:12 -0700 My apologies for dragging this out, but I think this gets to the heart of the matter. The cost of strlen doesn't matter, it really doesn't matter. I can't recall seeing a real-life program where the cost of strlen was more than trivia. A quick comparison on Plan 9 shows that strlen runs at 19 times the speed of DES, using the same 64-byte string as input each time, which is almost certainly longer than the average string. DES is really slow, by design; it's not just a question of a few more memory accesses; it's just hard to do the bit-swizzling quickly in software (though it can be done relatively quickly in hardware). One of the big achievements of Unix was to get people to stop worrying about the microseconds and look at the slightly larger picture of what could be done if your first concern were not microseconds, and that was a quarter-century ago! With processor cycles being so cheap and available now, it's generally not worth worrying about expenses until they cause a real (measurable, reproducible) problem. Proposals based on supposedly greater efficiency for a new open(2) interface are not worth considering, particularly when open's efficiency isn't currently a problem, and the new interface is ugly, incompatible with the existing clean and simple one, and purports to solve non-problems like allowing NUL and slash in file name components. One downside of APE is that it's made some people think of Plan 9 as Just Another Goddamned Unix Implementation. If you're not interested in exploring what's new in Plan 9, and are offended that realloc isn't provably optimal or that GNU configure doesn't just run out the box, why are you using Plan 9? FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD and Linux are all available at no monetary cost. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:44:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:44:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15574 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:44:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15570 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:44:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:44:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 672D219A2F; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:44:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6A681998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:43:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17U2Wm-00003d-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:52:24 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020715115223.A218@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] POV-Ray Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:52:23 +0200 from POVray home: The source code for v3.5 is not yet available. We have only just released this version (on 8 July). We are preparing the source for release and expect to make it available on 1 August. I'm eager to have a look at it ... -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:48:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:48:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15652 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:48:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15648 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:48:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:48:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1415A19A3E; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 579F4199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:47:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17U2bS-00003h-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:14 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020715115714.B218@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] running prog in rio window from within acme Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:14 +0200 Dear, how do i run a (graphic) program in a separate rio window from within Acme? I mean I want to start that prog from an acme window, or tagline, and force its output to a rio window, much like .jpg images find their way to 'page' run in a rio window. TIA, cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:49:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:49:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15676 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:49:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15671 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:49:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84C8E19A4A; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DC731998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F1-0002TD-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Andreas Wiese Message-ID: <62bpga.6n5.ln@ID-86102.user.dfncis.de> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Subject: [9fans] Panic when booting for setup Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:31:37 GMT Hello, I think the first thing I should say is that I've never seen Plan9 before. I've got the ISO-image of the actual Plan9 release from the Plan9 homepage and now tried to install it under VMware (Linux 2.4.18). Therefore I configured VMware to use the ISOimage as CD-ROM drive, mounted the image as loop device and configured VMware to use 'bootdisk.img' from the CD's root as floppy disk. In VMware's 'BIOS' I switched Floppy A: to '2.88MB 3 1/2"', but when booting I get the following message: ,---------------------------------------------------. | PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs | | ELCR: 0200 | | apm ax=f000 cx=f000 dx=40 di=ffff ebx=4c72 esi=-1 | | FLAGS=246 TRAP=e ECODE=2 PC=80029ddc | | x, nmiesc=0x80311000 | | SI 00cef000 DI 81000000 BP 80311000 | | CS 0010 DS 0008 ES 0008 FS 0008 GS 0008 | | CR0 80000011 CR2 81000000 CR3 0000c000 | | panic: exception/interrupt 14 | `---------------------------------------------------' And VMware stops doing anything :( Is there any way to install this nice OS or can anybody say, what's the reason for this message? TIA Regards, awiese -- --- \|/ ______ \|/ Andreas Wiese "@' / , . \ `@" awiese.mephisto@t-online.de /__| \____/ |__\ http://www.root-for-everybody.de.vu \___U__/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:50:15 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:50:15 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15722 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:50:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15718 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:50:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:50:14 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2BA019A59; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:18 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8F95199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F0-0002T5-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Saroj Mahapatra Message-ID: <6d3220b4.0207121744.4fc802e6@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] bug in fmtfmt Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:31:24 GMT There is a bug in fmtfmt. for (p=knownfmt; p->c; p++) if (p->c == c) { fmtinstanll(p->c, p->fmt); while (p->fmt == nil) <--------- BUG ; The pointer 'p' is walking through 'knownfmt'; so p->fmt can not be nil there, becuase 'fmtinstall' only changes 'fmtalloc' array. There is also locking issue between 'fmtinstall' and 'fmtfmt' accessing 'fmtalloc' array simultaneously. Please take a look at this. I wish I had more time to explain this thoroughly at this moment. Thanks, Saroj Mahapatra From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:51:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:51:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15795 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:51:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15790 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 778C419A61; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:27 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84CE61998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2Ez-0002Sj-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:30:46 GMT > Anything serviced by the mount driver is actually a remote file > system. This includes servers reached through /srv mostly. > The only local file systems are those of the kernel drivers. > I agree, as technically, one should be able to mount HD's and maybe even floppies from other systems, and use them the same as if they were part of the computer the user is sitting at. It would become confusing (and not very Plan 9-like) to have to remember that /n/c: is a remote HD and /mnt/c: is local, etc. It seems that just using union directories, one could bind both a remote and local HD onto /n/c:, and everything is more transparent, to both programs and the user. Not to mention it's just plain easier to remember! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:52:12 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:52:12 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15814 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:52:12 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15810 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:52:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:52:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13B0419A7D; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:36 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24EE319A28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2Ez-0002Ss-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:30:58 GMT nemo@plan9.escet.urjc.es (Fco.J.Ballesteros) wrote in message news:... > Files there seem to be missing from sources, as well as the > man page if there was any. Could some kind sould give me a copy of > this? > > thanks I have been looking for Mothra (which is the native Plan 9 web browser from 2nd Ed.) since I learned of it some time ago, and screaming for the Bell-labs guys to release it. What I've learned is that it is still covered by the 2nd Edition license, so not everyone can pass it around. I found someone who has a version modified to run under 4th Ed., and is willing to send the code, etc., to anyone who can prove they have a 2nd Ed. license. Unfortunately, I don't, or I'd be using it right now... for the stuff, contact: Richard Miller miller@hamnavoe.demon.co.uk I don't know how one would prove they have a 2nd Ed. license, though... (Know how one would get one today?) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:52:58 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:52:58 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15835 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:52:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15831 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:52:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:52:57 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F86019A9B; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:44 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D5E219A31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F0-0002Sy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Saroj Mahapatra Message-ID: <6d3220b4.0207121733.71e58889@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] bug in enc64 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:31:13 GMT A bug in enc64: if (out + 5 >= e) should change to: if (out + 4 >= e) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:53:39 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:53:39 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15850 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:53:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15846 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:53:38 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:53:38 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DB67199BC; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:53 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A41D19A28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F1-0002TJ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207140228.6c17ce13@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Default Ident Server Protocol Fix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:31:49 GMT Heyas, Just implemented a very basic fix this morning for the default ident server in /rc/bin/service/tcp113. The default script fails to parse whitespace, thereby breaking protocol when generating a response string. A diff is at: http://www.chocolate.no-ip.info/tcp113.diff Don From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:54:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:54:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15859 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:54:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15855 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:54:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:54:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E27119AB3; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:50:01 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF3BD19A31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F1-0002TP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: , <20020714175407.5869.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:32:09 GMT I can tell that the Bell-Labs guys don't use PPP dialup much. Not a very refined interface for PPP...(no offense intended) Shouldn't it at least use a configuration file to specify phone number, username, password, baud rate, etc. then one could simply use something like: ip/ppp where a seperate config file could be used per host? (Similar to BSD's ppp command) It's much easier that way than specifying that many command switches! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:56:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:56:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15899 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:56:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15895 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:56:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:56:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87B3519AC4; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:56:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D0DF619AC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:55:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:55:32 +0200 Why don't you just create a script to run ppp as you wish? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 18:58:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 18:58:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15989 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 18:58:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15985 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 18:58:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 18:58:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07A7319AD0; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:58:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D49519AB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:57:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA06408 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:54 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g6F9vsj02878; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:55 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g6F9vr115426 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:53 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207150957.g6F9vr115426@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:55:32 +0200." References: From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:57:53 +0200 I use a guide file from which I copy and paste the ppp command and the phone numbers that I use... Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 19:12:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 19:12:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16331 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 19:12:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16327 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 19:12:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 19:12:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BEC419AC2; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:12:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C1D4E19AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:11:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xunezooorxjccryokymwjfsrny" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:11:04 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xunezooorxjccryokymwjfsrny Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit why not put the parametrised ppp command line in a file and run that? much easier than having yet another configuration file. don't forget to make it mode 700 if it has got passwords in it. --upas-xunezooorxjccryokymwjfsrny Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026726865:20:25189:3; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:54:25 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2102926; 15 Jul 2002 9:54 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E27119AB3; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:50:01 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF3BD19A31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F1-0002TP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: , <20020714175407.5869.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:32:09 GMT I can tell that the Bell-Labs guys don't use PPP dialup much. Not a very refined interface for PPP...(no offense intended) Shouldn't it at least use a configuration file to specify phone number, username, password, baud rate, etc. then one could simply use something like: ip/ppp where a seperate config file could be used per host? (Similar to BSD's ppp command) It's much easier that way than specifying that many command switches! --upas-xunezooorxjccryokymwjfsrny-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 19:16:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 19:16:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16414 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 19:16:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16410 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 19:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 19:16:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F04819AD5; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:16:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B4FBB19A92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 06:15:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 85320 invoked by uid 18927); 15 Jul 2002 10:11:18 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 10:11:18 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20020715041040.O85308-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 04:11:18 -0600 (MDT) no, that'd be too simple ;) andrey 'can't resist' mirtchovski On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk wrote: > why not put the parametrised ppp command line in a file and run that? > much easier than having yet another configuration file. > don't forget to make it mode 700 if it has got passwords in it. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 20:06:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 20:06:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17215 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 20:06:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17211 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 20:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 20:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC06019A5A; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 07:06:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 555A319A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 07:05:22 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020715110522.555A319A0D@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:05:04 0100 > I have been looking for Mothra (which is the native Plan 9 web browser > from 2nd Ed.) since I learned of it some time ago, and screaming for > the Bell-labs guys to release it. They've released it: look in /contrib/mothra on sources.cs.bell-labs.com Be aware, though, that this is a very old and simple browser with no support for many "features" like tables, frames, cookies, and client-side scripting. I personally find this is often an advantage rather than a limitation, because it eliminates much of the distracting "entertainment" and advertising clutter. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 22:16:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 22:16:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19000 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 22:16:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18996 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 22:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 22:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F34A19A33; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:16:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5B70019980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:15:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5f964fb42d28ddeea1dda63d3ba44bc7@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bug in enc64 From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zgyeagiwmgvzlonjscpmozoapn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:15:33 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zgyeagiwmgvzlonjscpmozoapn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks. Fixed on sources. -rob --upas-zgyeagiwmgvzlonjscpmozoapn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Jul 15 05:52:43 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Mon Jul 15 05:52:42 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9198719A92; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:49:43 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D5E219A31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 05:48:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17U2F0-0002Sy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:34:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Saroj Mahapatra Message-ID: <6d3220b4.0207121733.71e58889@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] bug in enc64 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:31:13 GMT A bug in enc64: if (out + 5 >= e) should change to: if (out + 4 >= e) --upas-zgyeagiwmgvzlonjscpmozoapn-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 23:09:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 23:09:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19591 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 23:09:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19587 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 23:09:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 23:09:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D34719A62; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:09:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (adsl-65-67-63-82.dsl.austtx.swbell.net [65.67.63.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A2E61998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:08:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 203F55C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:08:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Michael H.Collins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other Message-Id: <20020715100823.7727ee37.mike@mdrconsult.com> In-Reply-To: References: <20020714175407.5869.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> Organization: Penguinista Navy X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.0 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i586-pc-linux-gnu) X-Face: $+'5cps7A7Ayk+#{fcCr*u;U<2@xrrk"dv1@}fAtMG,%UOhDp_&@N>]!P[MMXQeR%_B+xUd :A3v20tyZ$0M==g|A.t6K1IBn>g-lNOnth^QB9'+-OMu}b9XGCw&9dnbT6cTg|MA;te;_Tfd jAz}t5I{#zjnE9]8FMUdnVPVz4|cX=6SF&Xha!qyYN`!Pa.gwUDEUF&IpnY{f:2E}+VvQQvHQJ;QTr &MID0QK.]TF Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:08:23 -0400 Sounds like we have a volunteer for writing a ppp interface. LOL have fun. On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 09:32:09 GMT Ben spewed into the bitstream: ~I can tell that the Bell-Labs guys don't use PPP dialup much. Not a ~very refined interface for PPP...(no offense intended) Shouldn't it ~at least use a configuration file to specify phone number, username, ~password, baud rate, etc. then one could simply use something like: ~ip/ppp where a seperate config file could be used per ~host? (Similar to BSD's ppp command) It's much easier that way than ~specifying that many command switches! ~ -- (o_ //\ V_/_ Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://www.mdrconsult.com http://www.lrsehosting.com/ http://kpig.com http://rawdeal.org From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 15 23:54:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 15 23:54:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20151 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Jul 2002 23:54:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20147 invoked from network); 15 Jul 2002 23:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Jul 2002 23:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7337619A57; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:54:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94C8B19A28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 10:53:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id AF693A8B0124; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 07:42:49 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Mon Jul 15 07:42:48 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D32E1FC.4060600@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names References: <61fc59076e43ac52fe96127834dadbe8@collyer.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 07:53:48 -0700 Geoff Collyer wrote: > One downside of APE is that it's made some people think of Plan 9 as > Just Another Goddamned Unix Implementation. Is this what Dave meant when he wrote: > /me shudders at the thought that GUIs might someday take over the > world :-( ? For the record, I think Plan 9 is a textual GUI. Though you could probably swing it with a bare rc shell, unless you can run it on a braille term (or hear it through your speakers) it's probably safest to call it a GUI. At this point, I guess I'm thankful that there are no Olfactory User Interfaces (though paradoxically I've seen a few that stank). I did read somewhere that there's a braille term that can draw out window regions. A variation of acme on something like that could be interesting. Mouse actions would take some serious rethought, though. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 00:49:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 00:49:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20731 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 00:49:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20727 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 00:49:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 00:49:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 073F319980; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:49:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from insiq6.insuranceiq.com (unknown [65.217.159.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2810A19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:48:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail pickup service by insiq6.insuranceiq.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:44:01 -0400 From: "Legal IQ" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_F32BF_01C22BEF.C7428A00" X-Mailer: Microsoft CDO for Windows 2000 Thread-Index: AcIsEU5RDLr3gD9pR4yhqdy9TQ68+g== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Jul 2002 15:44:01.0531 (UTC) FILETIME=[70ED7CB0:01C22C16] Subject: [9fans] ADV:Protect Your Legal Rights... 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------=_NextPart_000_F32BF_01C22BEF.C7428A00-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 01:25:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 01:25:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21023 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 01:25:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21019 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 01:25:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 01:25:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA4FD19AA0; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:25:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.230.134.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6784219A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:24:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@kp.km.ua [217.196.174.2]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.5/8.12.5/ic) with ESMTP id g6FGOJUt029873 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 19:24:23 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup08.kp.km.ua [217.196.174.23]) by kp.km.ua (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id TAA66070 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 19:24:17 +0300 (EEST) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re:[9fans] ppp and other X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <02071518312800.00562@localhost.localdomain> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 19:24:05 -0400 good day all, why telco fails when i type: telco /dev/eia1 con -l telco!62111 with printing ``Jul 15 18:06:08 mount failed: interrupted''? thanks, -ask From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 01:40:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 01:40:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21143 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 01:40:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21139 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 01:40:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 01:40:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CDBF19AAC; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:40:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8E0B619A58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:39:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 17:45:38 +0100 > >The /n vs /mnt thing is just a convention. > > Yes, I know it. However, it's not easy to explain this to my naive > students. > You, probably many others?, don't want to have many directory > in /, don't you? personally, i'd like to get rid of /mnt entirely. i much prefer it when things are in /n, mainly because it's so much easier to type! i recently knocked up a little filesystem as in inferno as an experiment (it was actually to test a new library interface), which acts as a kind of auto mountpoint directory. in this directory, a walk to any name will succeed, and will walk to an empty directory of that name. a read of the original will now show the new name. thus, having done: autodir /n you can do, say: mount /srv/factotum /n/bletheridoo and it will work - the destination mount point is created on demand (and deleted when there are no more references to it). i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; perhaps there's a place for something like this under plan 9? (it's only a couple of hours work). cheers, rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 01:54:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 01:54:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21280 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 01:54:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21276 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 01:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 01:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1001419A6E; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF31B1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:53:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6FGqvmk010008 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 18:52:58 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6FGqvRw010007 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 18:52:57 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Message-ID: <20020715185257.D9944@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from rog@vitanuova.com on Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 05:45:38PM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 18:52:57 +0200 On Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 05:45:38PM +0100, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > thus, having done: > > autodir /n > > you can do, say: > > mount /srv/factotum /n/bletheridoo > > and it will work - the destination mount point is created on demand > (and deleted when there are no more references to it). > This ceryainly has _my_ vote. > i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural > to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; > perhaps there's a place for something like this under plan 9? > (it's only a couple of hours work). > Brilliant, if only because I was considering the problem and didn't have the perspicacity to see such an elegant solution! ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 02:00:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 02:00:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21321 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 02:00:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21317 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 02:00:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 02:00:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B315E19AB4; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3BFF19AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:59:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6FG2k211791 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:02:46 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 12:02:46 -0400 (EDT) I'll second this. Very neat. On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > >The /n vs /mnt thing is just a convention. > > > > Yes, I know it. However, it's not easy to explain this to my naive > > students. > > You, probably many others?, don't want to have many directory > > in /, don't you? > > personally, i'd like to get rid of /mnt entirely. i much prefer it > when things are in /n, mainly because it's so much easier to type! > > i recently knocked up a little filesystem as in inferno as an > experiment (it was actually to test a new library interface), which > acts as a kind of auto mountpoint directory. > > in this directory, a walk to any name will succeed, and will walk to > an empty directory of that name. a read of the original will now show > the new name. > > thus, having done: > > autodir /n > > you can do, say: > > mount /srv/factotum /n/bletheridoo > > and it will work - the destination mount point is created on demand > (and deleted when there are no more references to it). > > i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural > to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; > perhaps there's a place for something like this under plan 9? > (it's only a couple of hours work). > > cheers, > rog. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 02:38:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 02:38:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21630 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 02:38:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21626 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 02:38:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 02:38:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D317719A58; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:38:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2538119A58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:37:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <38522fb943530ffce6d7a741c8ffb49d@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: north_@www.7f.no-ip.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Default Ident Server Protocol Fix MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 13:38:08 -0400 Thanks, we'll stick it in. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 03:56:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 03:56:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22159 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 03:56:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22155 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 03:56:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 03:56:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E989B1998C; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:56:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 40CC419A28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:55:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <011d2d3398b7dc63c4ba13066bb463b3@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bug in fmtfmt From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:55:13 -0400 > There is a bug in fmtfmt. Indeed there was. I was being clever and then getting it wrong. I have rewritten it to be less clever and more likely to be right. Updated /sys/src/libc/fmt/fmt.c and /386/lib/libc.a on sources. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 04:22:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 04:22:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22370 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 04:22:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22366 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 04:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 04:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 231E319AC0; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DC70A19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:21:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 4347 invoked by uid 991); 15 Jul 2002 19:21:10 -0000 From: Scott Schwartz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Message-ID: <20020715192110.GC4194@bio.cse.psu.edu> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:21:10 -0400 On Mon, Jul 15, 2002 at 05:45:38PM +0100, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural > to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; Any process that wanted a mount point in /n could just create it, execpt that you don't want to reinvent mode 0777 /tmp. In that light, /n might make sense if it was the union of /mnt/n and $home/mnt/n. As an added bonus, I've just invented a reason to keep /mnt! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 11:11:32 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 11:11:32 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30025 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 11:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30021 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 11:11:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 11:11:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13A7819A72; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:11:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F0AF619A6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:10:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5c5a31c58ba3439a1b184d401e1e8e58@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 01:33:24 +0900 Hi rog! I'm very very glad to see your solution to my problem. I like this mailing-list, because someone always can invent something new idea when it is neccessary. 'auto mountpoint directory', yeah!, it's that I wanted! So, we can wipe out difficult explanation to our newbies. I also like Scott's union directory of /n. Thanks all, and I'll wait those ideas will be incorporated to the sources. At last, summer vacation season is comming here.☺ Thnaks all! Kenji --now testing Release 4 mail system from our new network... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 11:50:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 11:50:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31273 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 11:50:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31269 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 11:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 11:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55CFF19A28; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B863D19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:49:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Jul 15 22:49:59 EDT 2002 Received: from [192.168.1.102] ([67.81.143.128]) by plan9; Mon Jul 15 22:49:58 EDT 2002 From: "rob pike, esq." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] running prog in rio window from within acme Message-ID: <3268955.1026791698@[192.168.1.102]> In-Reply-To: <20020715115714.B218@next.gli.cas.cz> References: <20020715115714.B218@next.gli.cas.cz> X-Mailer: Mulberry/2.2.0 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 03:54:58 -0400 run, e.g. window sam file ... see window(1). --On Monday, July 15, 2002 11:57 AM +0200 "Peter A. Cejchan" wrote: > Dear, > > how do i run a (graphic) program in a separate rio window from within > Acme? I mean I want to start that prog from an acme window, or tagline, > and force its output to a rio window, much like .jpg images find their > way to 'page' run in a rio window. > > TIA, > cheers, > -- > ++pac. > > Peter A. Cejchan > Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ > > [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 11:59:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 11:59:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31552 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 11:59:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31548 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 11:59:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 11:59:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9151219A7F; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 934AE199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:58:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <73f5d3410cc615100e7aba9a31218420@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] time to accept swap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 02:56:05 +0900 I noticed that neccessary time to authentication is somewhat long, several seconds in our case, when attach the swap area from other file system on the file server. Is this a normal behaviour? Our network: Auth/CPU server: 1.6 GHz Pen 4, RTL8100BL nic chip File server: 200MHz AMD K6, Intel i82557 nic chip Terminals: many, most with nvidia graphic cards, and i82557 + 2114x nic chip Thanks Mirtchovski updating nvidia driver. I cannot live without those two files over 1024x768x8 resolutions, even MX 200 etc. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 16:40:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 16:40:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6758 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 16:40:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6753 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 16:40:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 16:40:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43B0B19991; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 03:40:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 64185199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 03:39:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 09:39:07 +0200 > and it will work - the destination mount point is created on demand > (and deleted when there are no more references to it). That's great. It would be a neat companion to the automatic mounts I'm using these days, because right now I'm mounting resources advertised at prearranged mount points, but it'd be better to keep them also at /n. Anyone implementing autodir? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 17:59:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 17:59:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8751 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 17:59:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8747 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 17:59:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 17:59:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 621F919A79; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 04:59:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D794A19A67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 04:58:19 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <69c0bc11b75703468171eb698a635ec5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xkhgrtcaofjdqwjgvuvukobvbj" Subject: [9fans] autofs Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:58:18 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xkhgrtcaofjdqwjgvuvukobvbj Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I loved the idea so much, that I couldn't wait. Enjoy. --upas-xkhgrtcaofjdqwjgvuvukobvbj Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=autofs Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit .TH AUTOFS 4 .SH NAME autofs \- automatically supply mount points for file systems .SH SYNOPSIS .B autofs [ .I mnt ] .SH DESCRIPTION .I Autofs implements a single directory that creates inner directories on demand, when referenced. It is intended to supply mount points automatically. .PP By default .I autofs mounts itself at .B /n unless a .I mnt mount point is specified. .SH SOURCE .B /sys/src/cmd/autofs.c --upas-xkhgrtcaofjdqwjgvuvukobvbj Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=autofs.c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #include #include #include #include #include <9p.h> enum { Qroot = ~0, }; static void aopen(Req*); static void aread(Req*); static void astat(Req*); static void awstat(Req*); static char* awalk1(Fid* fid, char *name, Qid *qid); static void aattach(Req*); char** names; int nnames; Srv asrv = { .tree = nil, .attach = aattach, .auth = nil, .open = aopen, .create = nil, .read = aread, .write = nil, .remove = nil, .flush = nil, .stat = astat, .wstat = awstat, .walk = nil, .walk1 = awalk1, .clone = nil, .destroyfid = nil, .destroyreq = nil, .end = nil, .aux = nil, .infd = -1, .outfd = -1, .nopipe = 0, .srvfd = -1, }; static void usage(void) { fprint(2, "usage: %s [mnt]\n", argv0); exits("usage"); } static void aattach(Req* r) { Qid q; q.type = QTDIR; q.path = Qroot; q.vers = 0; r->fid->qid = q; r->ofcall.qid = q; respond(r, nil); } static void aopen(Req* r) { respond(r, nil); } static int agen(int n, Dir *dir, void* a) { if (a == nil || n < 0 || n >= nnames) return -1; dir->qid.type = QTDIR; dir->qid.path = n; dir->qid.vers = 0; dir->name = estrdup9p(names[n]); dir->uid = estrdup9p("sys"); dir->gid = estrdup9p("sys"); dir->mode= 0555|DMDIR; dir->length= 0; return 0; } static void aread(Req* r) { Qid q; q = r->fid->qid; if (q.path < 0 || q.path >= nnames && q.path != Qroot) respond(r, "bug: bad qid"); if (q.path == Qroot) dirread9p(r, agen, names); else dirread9p(r, agen, nil); respond(r, nil); } static void astat(Req* r) { Qid q; q = r->fid->qid; if (q.path < 0 || q.path >= nnames && q.path != Qroot) respond(r, "bug: bad qid"); r->d.qid = q; if (q.path == Qroot) r->d.name = estrdup9p("/"); else r->d.name = estrdup9p(names[q.path]); r->d.uid = estrdup9p("sys"); r->d.gid = estrdup9p("sys"); r->d.length= 0; r->d.mode= 0555|DMDIR; respond(r, nil); } static void awstat(Req* r) { respond(r, "wstat not allowed"); } static char* awalk1(Fid* fid, char *name, Qid *qid) { int i; if (fid->qid.path != Qroot) return "no such name"; for (i = 0; i < nnames; i++) if (strcmp(name, names[i]) == 0) break; if (i == nnames){ if ((nnames % 100) == 0) names = realloc(names, (nnames+100)*sizeof(char*)); names[nnames++] = strdup(name); } qid->path = i; qid->type = QTDIR; qid->vers = 0; fid->qid = *qid; return nil; } void main(int argc, char* argv[]) { char* mnt; ARGBEGIN{ default: usage(); }ARGEND; if (argc > 1) usage(); if (argc == 0) mnt = "/n"; else mnt = *argv; postmountsrv(&asrv, nil, mnt, MREPL); exits(nil); } --upas-xkhgrtcaofjdqwjgvuvukobvbj-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 21:09:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 21:09:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11250 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 21:09:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11246 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 21:09:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 21:09:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57E4019A88; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:09:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from aol.com (unknown [211.110.9.13]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 436CE19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:08:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <007e01d37b6b$4435d4d0$8de21bb1@fbemks> From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MiME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 Importance: Normal Subject: [9fans] Is SNORING Keeping You Awake At Night?? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 0102 18:45:21 -0700 ***SNORING KEEPING YOU FROM A GOOD NIGHT SLEEP ?*** This product has been featured on National TV.Does snoring keep you up at night? Tired of having to sleep in separate rooms because of snoring? Tired of hearing how your snoring kept someone up all night? Just Tired of being tired because of someone's snoring? There is a safe, natural solution to your snoring problem - Works first time, every time - All natural product -No side effects - Guaranteed results For more information visit our site : http://www.img-marketing.com/znore3/ To be removed from our mailing list simply click the link below and type remove in the subject line. Please make sure remove is in the subject line. mailto:snoreremove@excite.com?subject=Remove From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 21:18:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 21:18:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11335 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 21:18:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11331 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 21:18:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 21:18:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4588619A8D; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 135C219A8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:17:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <152377f48470da984ce494ebe56ed076@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] autofs From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:23:58 +0100 it's better, i think, if the directories are refcounted and disappear when not referenced, otherwise the directory tends to fill up with garbage. (e.g. try: autofs cd /n sdfvgsdf ls -l ) that was the most tricky thing about the original implementation (remember to account for walk to "..") i *think* i preferred autodir as a name (after all, it only automatically creates directories, not files) but that's just a matter of taste. maybe "autodirfs"...? the other thing is perhaps it should by default bind itself *after* the usual contents of /n. this means it doesn't obscure any currently mounted stuff; also, there's a potential performance hit from using it (an additional interaction with a user-level program when walking to directories through /n), so perhaps one should continue to allow the old statically created /n directories too where that might be an issue. cheers, rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 21:23:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 21:23:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11457 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 21:23:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11453 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 21:23:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 21:23:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0466719A96; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:23:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail4.svr.pol.co.uk (mail4.svr.pol.co.uk [195.92.193.211]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21E3119A96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:22:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [195.92.168.141] (helo=tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk) by mail4.svr.pol.co.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17URLb-0001w5-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:22:31 +0100 Received: from modem-273.beedrill.dialup.pol.co.uk ([217.135.33.17] helo=agni) by tmailb1.svr.pol.co.uk with smtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17URLb-0002Ft-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:22:31 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Message-Id: <20020716132609.5d4dfcba.martin@mca-ltd.com> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Mission Critical Applications Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: martin@mca-ltd.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:26:09 +0100 On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 17:45:38 +0100 rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >.. > i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural > to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; > perhaps there's a place for something like this under plan 9? > (it's only a couple of hours work). > > cheers, > rog. > I assume that this is much of the reason why resources are usually union-bound to /net or /dev (for example), when they might more logically have been mounted directly on to /dev/X, or /net/Y? Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@mca-ltd.com Mission Critical Applications Ltd, U.K. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 21:40:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 21:40:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11693 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 21:40:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11689 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 21:40:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 21:40:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C40819A9A; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:40:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A5CA19A98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:39:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GBgc213864 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 07:42:38 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] autofs In-Reply-To: <152377f48470da984ce494ebe56ed076@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 07:42:38 -0400 (EDT) > i *think* i preferred autodir as a name (after all, it only > automatically creates directories, not files) but that's just a matter > of taste. maybe "autodirfs"...? Personally, I prefer automountsrv-devtodirfs. ... 'Second the notion for autodir. Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 22:03:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 22:03:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11969 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 22:03:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11965 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 22:03:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 22:03:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E40019A9F; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 09:03:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 092B519A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 09:02:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17URuv-0007NO-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Martin Maciaszek Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] no luck for plan9 on compaq deskpro 2000? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:56:03 GMT I tried installing plan9 on an old Compaq Deskpro 2000. The first problem was easily solved. Even though plan9 supports the Cirrus Logic GD 5436 the integrated graphics adapter didn't get recognized. After entering the vendor id and device id into the vgadb (vid=0x1013 did=0x00ac) I got the setup running smoothly. Until I encountered the "no physical memory" problem. I read the FAQ about this problem and tried to fiddle with some settings in the computer setup (those machines don't have a built in bios setup. You have to boot a setup diskette) but couldn't solve this problem. Is there any chance to get Plan9 working on this machine? (I've got 4 identical machines which would be a nice cluster) Cheers Martin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 16 22:29:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 16 22:29:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12269 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Jul 2002 22:29:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12265 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 22:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 22:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1900119AB9; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 09:29:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6092E19AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 09:28:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <07032038068eb2473dd63c7a4e51d270@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:34:54 +0100 > Any process that wanted a mount point in /n could just create it, > execpt that you don't want to reinvent mode 0777 /tmp. In that light, > /n might make sense if it was the union of /mnt/n and $home/mnt/n. > As an added bonus, I've just invented a reason to keep /mnt! the difference between mode 0777 /tmp and /n is that in /n clashes don't matter! (all you want is a name, so it doesn't matter who created it). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 00:09:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 00:09:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13660 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 00:09:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13656 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 00:09:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 00:09:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C37A19AB6; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:09:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F18FF19AA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:08:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GECD214235 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:12:19 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:12:13 -0400 (EDT) I find myself and others occasionally doing the following: for(i=0; i; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:19:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 8021 invoked by uid 991); 16 Jul 2002 15:19:10 -0000 Message-ID: <20020716151910.8020.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point In-Reply-To: Message from rog@vitanuova.com of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:34:54 BST." <07032038068eb2473dd63c7a4e51d270@vitanuova.com> From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:19:10 -0400 | the difference between mode 0777 /tmp and /n is that in /n clashes | don't matter! (all you want is a name, so it doesn't matter who | created it). But it does matter if someone fills it up with big files. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 00:23:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 00:23:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13802 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 00:23:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13798 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 00:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 00:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BD1A19ADE; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:23:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2EA5119ADC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:22:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A7B8376A0128; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:11:52 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Tue Jul 16 08:11:51 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D343A4A.5080709@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no luck for plan9 on compaq deskpro 2000? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 08:22:50 -0700 Martin Maciaszek wrote: > Is there any chance to get Plan9 working on this machine? (I've got 4 > identical machines which would be a nice cluster) I had the same issue on a Dell OptiPlex GL5100, but interestingly only during installation. My workaround was to do the install on a separate machine and move the hard drive over. Everything worked like a charm. Also, now that it boots off the fileserver, it's just not an issue at all. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 00:30:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 00:30:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13873 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 00:30:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13869 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 00:30:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 00:30:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B02B219AE1; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:30:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 20ACC19AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:29:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:35:48 +0100 > But it does matter if someone fills it up with big files. but you're not filling it up with big files... you're just using it for a mount point! unless i'm misunderstanding something horribly. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 00:40:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 00:40:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13971 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 00:40:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13967 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 00:40:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 00:40:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28EA519AE4; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:40:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0781719AD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:39:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 8389 invoked by uid 991); 16 Jul 2002 15:39:07 -0000 Message-ID: <20020716153907.8388.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point In-Reply-To: Message from rog@vitanuova.com of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:35:48 BST." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:39:07 -0400 If you make a directory mode 0777 they you have no say about what silly users will put in it (or take out of it), but you can be sure (by hypothesis) that you won't like it. That's why Plan 9 doesn't have a world writable /tmp. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 00:54:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 00:54:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14182 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 00:54:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14178 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 00:54:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 00:54:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E0C519AB2; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4B0F519AB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:53:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5ff07d2088162d2d72ccf9afc2a4d708@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:53:48 -0400 Saves you, what, 5 keystrokes? Not too convincing. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:03:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:03:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14248 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:03:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14244 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:03:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:03:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C224F19AEA; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:03:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43DA819AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:02:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GF5w214339 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:05:58 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <5ff07d2088162d2d72ccf9afc2a4d708@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:05:58 -0400 (EDT) You're right, and the capability to do: struct type { int a; int b; }; struct type2 { type; int c; int d; }; saves so many more strokes in itself *and must* be more efficient. Suppose I'm not saying "why," but "why not." IMO it's cleaner and quite possibly more efficient (without getting into a usec argument, please). Do you disagree? Sam On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, rob pike, esq. wrote: > Saves you, what, 5 keystrokes? Not too convincing. > > -rob > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:03:55 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:03:55 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14255 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:03:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14251 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:03:54 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:03:54 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 115C319AEC; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:03:23 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3156219AE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:02:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:09:02 +0100 > If you make a directory mode 0777 they you have no say about what > silly users will put in it (or take out of it), but you can be sure > (by hypothesis) that you won't like it. That's why Plan 9 doesn't have > a world writable /tmp. oh i see. you are assuming, however, that /n is implemented on a file server. on some systems, i've seen it implemented as part of #/ (i.e. read only - requires a kernel build to add to it). i quite like the garbage-collected nature of autodir; between them /n and /mnt have 52 entries in them on this system and, checking in a rio window, only 7 are in use. being able to ls /n and see what mountpoints have been used in this session seems quite useful; and it means i'd feel no compunction about doing something like: for (i in $manyftpservers) { ftpfs -a me@home -m /n/ftp.$i $i } oh yes, autodir also means i don't have to worry about doing the mkdir first, which means i can just run the usual programs and they can blithely mount themselves. that's possibly its main advantage. cheers, rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:09:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:09:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14308 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:09:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14304 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:09:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:09:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CD8019AEE; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:09:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 165D419AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:08:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <624e56d4bc299dc1b5658d3a56c32c25@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:08:32 -0400 > Suppose I'm not saying "why," but "why not." IMO it's cleaner and > quite possibly more efficient (without getting into a usec argument, > please). Do you disagree? Yes. The benefit is minor, too small to justify changing the language. You're trying to formalize an idiom; just using the idiom suits me fine. The type inclusion feature, I think, did a lot more, since it trigged type conversion and promotion: a much bigger deal. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:25:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:25:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14438 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:25:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14434 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:25:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:25:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D347319ADB; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:25:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCF8A19AAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:24:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GEgr214285 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:42:54 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 10:42:53 -0400 (EDT) I was wondering about this post too. If autodir mounts into the per process namespace, it'd be awful difficult for "someone" to fill it up, unless that someone is the mounter, eh? Sam On Tue, 16 Jul 2002 rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > But it does matter if someone fills it up with big files. > > but you're not filling it up with big files... you're just > using it for a mount point! > > unless i'm misunderstanding something horribly. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:29:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:29:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14472 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:29:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14468 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A5A319AB0; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:29:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6074819AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:28:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GFVf214402 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:31:41 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <624e56d4bc299dc1b5658d3a56c32c25@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:31:41 -0400 (EDT) Ok, I'll bite and play devil's advocate. What about the promotion of a structure from itself to one of its members in a function call simply because it makes locking a structure easier? Surely passing in a pointer to a function and having the in-func pointer completely different violates some standard of programming languages. Why was it worthwhile to change the language in this respect, for the idiom of "always having to make sure the lock is the first item in the structure for pointer coersion is a pain?" Sam On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, rob pike, esq. wrote: > > Suppose I'm not saying "why," but "why not." IMO it's cleaner and > > quite possibly more efficient (without getting into a usec argument, > > please). Do you disagree? > > Yes. The benefit is minor, too small to justify changing the language. > You're trying to formalize an idiom; just using the idiom suits me fine. > > The type inclusion feature, I think, did a lot more, since it trigged type > conversion and promotion: a much bigger deal. > > -rob > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:31:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:31:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14502 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:31:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14498 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:31:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 605A619AF2; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:31:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E18F919AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:30:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g6GGUAMS012592 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:30:10 +0200 Message-ID: <3D344A12.5000503@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020623 Debian/1.0.0-0.woody.1 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:30:10 +0200 Sam wrote: >just equates to > >for(...) { > >} atend > ; > python lets you do this: for v in ...: if v == ...: break else: atend So the else part is executed should the loop terminate normally (no break is executed or the loop body is never entered). It can be applied to while loops too. I'm not sure whether it's a great idea but it did save a 'match' variable when I was trying to match one 'condition' in a list of 'conditions'. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:50:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:50:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14633 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:50:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14629 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2542D19A71; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7883219A6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:49:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:50:04 -0400 > What about the promotion of a structure from itself > to one of its members in a function call simply because > it makes locking a structure easier? Surely passing in > a pointer to a function and having the in-func pointer completely > different violates some standard of programming languages. It's called inheritance. > Why was it worthwhile to change the language in this respect, > for the idiom of "always having to make sure the lock is the > first item in the structure for pointer coersion is a pain?" Yes. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 01:57:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 01:57:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14717 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 01:57:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14713 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 01:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 01:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C117A19AD8; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:57:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA11319AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:56:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GFxo214445 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:59:50 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:59:50 -0400 (EDT) You're going to have to do better than that. Simply pulling the 'ole "I'm overly negative and as a result most people avoid confrontation with me" isn't going to cut it. Anyone else have an opinion on this ... specifically the guys/gals at the labs, since without their consent tool changes doubtfully become realised? Sam On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, rob pike, esq. wrote: > > What about the promotion of a structure from itself > > to one of its members in a function call simply because > > it makes locking a structure easier? Surely passing in > > a pointer to a function and having the in-func pointer completely > > different violates some standard of programming languages. > > It's called inheritance. > > > Why was it worthwhile to change the language in this respect, > > for the idiom of "always having to make sure the lock is the > > first item in the structure for pointer coersion is a pain?" > > Yes. > > -rob > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:03:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:03:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14770 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:03:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14766 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:03:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:03:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEB2919AB7; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:03:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 85D6F199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:02:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:01:58 +0100 >>Why was it worthwhile to change the language in this respect, >>for the idiom of "always having to make sure the lock is the >>first item in the structure for pointer coersion is a pain?" because with ken's extension, it needn't be the first element, and it provides type checking that would be suppressed by the explicit cast required for the `first item' approach. in the case of Lock, it's easy to see that we could do without: typedef struct Thing Thing; struct Thing{ int a; Lock l; }; just requires lock(&t->l); instead of lock(t); as in Plan 9. the advantage of the latter, however, is that it is clear and readable, not that it saves typing. in fact it does save typing, but that's a side effect. it's also a little more subtle in the case of bio (say). in fact, C provides just what you want to save the ugly extra comparison: functions with early return. >>You're going to have to do better than that. Simply >>pulling the 'ole "I'm overly negative and as a result most >>people avoid confrontation with me" isn't going to cut it. overly negative? surely no one negative and pessimistic would bother to start thinking about writing a system, let alone actually doing it. surely doing something constructive is a truly positive act! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:05:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:05:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14795 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:05:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14791 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:05:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:05:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08D34199B9; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DFA3619AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:04:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.104.53.191 ([135.104.53.191]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 13:04:29 EDT 2002 From: "Howard Trickey" To: "Sam" , <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <000401c22cea$cd7cc1f0$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:04:10 -0400 > Anyone else have an opinion on this ... specifically the guys/gals > at the labs, since without their consent tool changes doubtfully > become realised? OK, you asked for it. I'm completely in agreement with Rob. There should be a high bar for adding language extensions (each one makes it harder to port code that uses them). The "atend" thing is very far below the bar. It is arguable whether the anonymous type thing was above the bar, but it was certainly a lot higher. The latter lets the compiler do type checking for you in a common situation (one where you might be using inheritance in another language, as Rob pointed out). - Howard Trickey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:18:33 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:18:33 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14888 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:18:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14884 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:18:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:18:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24DE919A99; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:18:21 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E04A19A7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:17:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GGKY214517 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:20:55 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <000401c22cea$cd7cc1f0$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:20:34 -0400 (EDT) > OK, you asked for it. In fact, I decidedly did. > > I'm completely in agreement with Rob. > There should be a high bar for adding language extensions > (each one makes it harder to port code that uses them). > The "atend" thing is very far below the bar. > It is arguable whether the anonymous type thing was above > the bar, but it was certainly a lot higher. The latter > lets the compiler do type checking for you in a common > situation (one where you might be using inheritance in > another language, as Rob pointed out). > Which I agree with. I was looking for an answer, much like the offspring who gets frustrated with the parent's "because I said so." Thanks for the "input" vs. the "offput." Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:20:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:20:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14903 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:20:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14899 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:20:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:20:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E64019AE5; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:20:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8071B19A9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:19:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-22-123.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.22.123]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA05438 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:19:51 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-22-123.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.22.123] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <624e56d4bc299dc1b5658d3a56c32c25@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] more extensions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:24:58 +0200 Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using Limbo. The extension would probably be not too complex, also. I don't have time to implement this during this semester, but would be willing to do so in the future if people from the Labs agree. Is there agreement on this? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:24:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:24:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14931 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:24:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14927 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:24:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:24:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E676519AED; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:24:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD2BD19A7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:23:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GGQR214538 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:26:28 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions In-Reply-To: <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:26:27 -0400 (EDT) My next thought, but I figured I'd used all my contribution credits today. Sam On Tue, 16 Jul 2002, FJ Ballesteros wrote: > > Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would > simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using > Limbo. > > The extension would probably be not too complex, also. > > I don't have time to implement this during this semester, but would > be willing to do so in the future if people from the Labs agree. > > Is there agreement on this? > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:29:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:29:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14981 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:29:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14977 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:29:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3443F19A93; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:29:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2D95119AE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:28:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.104.53.191 ([135.104.53.191]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 13:28:26 EDT 2002 From: "Howard Trickey" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] more extensions Message-ID: <000501c22cee$2608e170$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:28:07 -0400 This is tempting. Tuples are one of my favorite things about Limbo. However, I'm biased, as I was the one that pushed for tuples in Limbo, I think. But adding them to C's already delicate grammar might be harder than it appears. And there comes a point where an extension changes the flavor of a language a little too much, and I think this one might be over that line. - Howard Trickey > Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would > simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using > Limbo. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 02:31:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 02:31:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15006 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 02:31:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15002 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 02:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 02:31:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C63819AF1; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:31:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9ADCD19AF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:30:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6333e0a01e113662f55923372089278a@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:31:01 -0400 > You're going to have to do better than that. Simply > pulling the 'ole "I'm overly negative and as a result most > people avoid confrontation with me" isn't going to cut it. > The unnamed types and inheritance are indeed syntactic sugar. It did have the useful side effect of reducing typing. If any of you remember BSD, you'ld remember cruft like #define sa_len sa_union.sa_generic.sa_len2 #define sa_family sa_union.sa_generic.sa_family2 #define sa_data sa_union.sa_generic.sa_data2 from /usr/include/sys/socket to avoid typing infinitely long names. The unnamed types saves us a lot more than a few characters here and there. It saves us from such #defines which have a bad habit of getting out of sync with the things they're working around. The added inheritance saves a fair amount, though not all, of the casts and void*'s that we used to live with. These blind conversions are very error prone. I'ld rather the compiler catch my errors than go at it during run time. > > Anyone else have an opinion on this ... specifically the guys/gals > at the labs, since without their consent tool changes doubtfully > become realised? `atend' does have the advantage of catching some mistakes. However, it doesn't really catch any errors that I typically make so I'm less sanguine about changing the language for it. > Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would > simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using > Limbo. This I wouldn't mind seeing. I really miss limbo tuples. Of course, I miss garbage collection too. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 03:06:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 03:06:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15259 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 03:06:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15255 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 03:06:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 03:06:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9EF319AF3; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:06:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73DCA19A8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:05:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GH9D214598 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:09:14 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <000501c22cee$2608e170$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] New language? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:09:13 -0400 (EDT) > be harder than it appears. And there comes a point > where an extension changes the flavor of a language > a little too much, and I think this one might be over > that line. Too true. What then, a new language based on C pulling the yummy stuff out of limbo? One that's not interpreted, without a garbage collector, and no atend >:), but that has tuples, array bounds checking, etc? At this point should we just considering loosening up Oberon a little and making a few additions? I'd be willing to help so long as we fix the BCPL inherited '&' precedence. Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 03:24:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 03:24:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15372 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 03:24:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15368 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 03:24:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 03:24:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4ECC619AF9; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:24:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EED7F19AE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:23:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 9314 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 18:23:25 -0000 Received: from roke.cse.psu.edu (HELO bio.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.12.14) by galapagos.cse.psu.edu with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 18:23:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 875 invoked by uid 991); 16 Jul 2002 18:23:25 -0000 Message-ID: <20020716182325.874.qmail@f.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions In-Reply-To: Message from FJ Ballesteros of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:24:58 +0200." <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:23:25 -0400 | Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would | simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using | Limbo. Yeah, but limbo has bounds checked arrays, which are even more useful. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 03:44:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 03:44:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15501 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 03:44:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15497 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 03:44:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 03:44:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB52019AA8; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:44:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2325C19AFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:43:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-44-182.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.44.182]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id UAA08706 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:43:00 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-44-182.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.44.182] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D346A4F.B17ED6A3@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------7D1C3E3DF8E2779B822DC017" Subject: [9fans] autodirfs Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:47:43 +0200 Este es un mensaje de varias partes en formato MIME. --------------7D1C3E3DF8E2779B822DC017 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hope this time it's ok. Refs, rename to autodirfs, and MAFTER all in place. PS: The files are autodirfs and autodirfs.c --------------7D1C3E3DF8E2779B822DC017 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="afs" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="afs" .TH AUTODIRFS 4 .SH NAME autodirfs \- automatically supply mount points for file systems .SH SYNOPSIS .B autodirfs [ .I mnt ] .SH DESCRIPTION .I Autodirfs implements a single directory that creates inner directories on demand, when referenced. It is intended to supply mount points automatically. .PP By default .I autodirfs mounts itself at .B /n unless a .I mnt mount point is specified. .SH SOURCE .B /sys/src/cmd/autodirfs.c --------------7D1C3E3DF8E2779B822DC017 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; name="afs.c" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="afs.c" #include #include #include #include #include <9p.h> typedef struct Name Name; enum { Qroot = ~0, }; struct Name { Ref; // one per fid in use. char* s; }; static void aopen(Req*); static void aread(Req*); static void astat(Req*); static void awstat(Req*); static char* awalk1(Fid* fid, char *name, Qid *qid); static char* aclone(Fid*, Fid*); static void aattach(Req*); static void aclunk(Fid*); Name** names; int nnames; Srv asrv = { .tree = nil, .attach = aattach, .auth = nil, .open = aopen, .create = nil, .read = aread, .write = nil, .remove = nil, .flush = nil, .stat = astat, .wstat = awstat, .walk = nil, .walk1 = awalk1, .clone = aclone, .destroyfid = aclunk, .destroyreq = nil, .end = nil, .aux = nil, .infd = -1, .outfd = -1, .nopipe = 0, .srvfd = -1, }; static void usage(void) { fprint(2, "usage: %s [mnt]\n", argv0); exits("usage"); } static Name* newname(char* name) { Name* n; if ((nnames % 100) == 0) names = realloc(names, (nnames+100)*sizeof(Name*)); n = names[nnames++] = malloc(sizeof(Name)); n->s = strdup(name); n->ref = 1; return n; } static void closename(int i) { assert (i >= 0 && i < nnames && names[i] != nil); if (decref(names[i]) <= 0){ free(names[i]->s); free(names[i]); names[i] = nil; // never reused; qids are unique } } static int n2i(int n) { int i; for (i = 0; n >= 0 && i < nnames; i++) if (names[i] != nil) n--; return (i == nnames) ? -1 : i-1; } static int agen(int n, Dir *dir, void* a) { int i; i = n2i(n); if (a == nil || i < 0) return -1; dir->qid.type = QTDIR; dir->qid.path = i; dir->qid.vers = 0; dir->name = estrdup9p(names[i]->s); dir->uid = estrdup9p("sys"); dir->gid = estrdup9p("sys"); dir->mode= 0555|DMDIR; dir->length= 0; return 0; } static void aattach(Req* r) { Qid q; q.type = QTDIR; q.path = Qroot; q.vers = 0; r->fid->qid = q; r->ofcall.qid = q; respond(r, nil); } static void aopen(Req* r) { respond(r, nil); } static void aread(Req* r) { Qid q; q = r->fid->qid; if (q.path < 0 || q.path >= nnames && q.path != Qroot) respond(r, "bug: bad qid"); if (q.path == Qroot) dirread9p(r, agen, names); else dirread9p(r, agen, nil); respond(r, nil); } static void astat(Req* r) { Qid q; q = r->fid->qid; if (q.path < 0 || q.path >= nnames && q.path != Qroot) respond(r, "bug: bad qid"); r->d.qid = q; if (q.path == Qroot) r->d.name = estrdup9p("/"); else r->d.name = estrdup9p(names[q.path]->s); r->d.uid = estrdup9p("sys"); r->d.gid = estrdup9p("sys"); r->d.length= 0; r->d.mode= 0555|DMDIR; respond(r, nil); } static void awstat(Req* r) { respond(r, "wstat not allowed"); } static char* awalk1(Fid* fid, char *name, Qid *qid) { int i, oldi; oldi = fid->qid.path; if (strcmp(name, "..") == 0){ i = Qroot; goto done; } if (fid->qid.path != Qroot) return "no such name"; for (i = 0; i < nnames; i++) if (names[i] != nil && strcmp(name, names[i]->s) == 0){ incref(names[i]); break; } if (i == nnames) newname(name); done: if (oldi >=0 && oldi < nnames) closename(oldi); qid->path = i; qid->type = QTDIR; qid->vers = 0; fid->qid = *qid; return nil; } static char* aclone(Fid* old, Fid*) { int i; i = old->qid.path; if (i >= 0 && i < nnames) incref(names[i]); return nil; } static void aclunk(Fid* fid) { int i; i = fid->qid.path; if (i >= 0 && i < nnames) closename(i); } void main(int argc, char* argv[]) { char* mnt; ARGBEGIN{ default: usage(); }ARGEND; if (argc > 1) usage(); if (argc == 0) mnt = "/n"; else mnt = *argv; postmountsrv(&asrv, nil, mnt, MAFTER); exits(nil); } --------------7D1C3E3DF8E2779B822DC017-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 03:45:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 03:45:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15522 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 03:45:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15518 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 03:45:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 03:45:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0660219AFB; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:45:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6D91819AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:44:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hgxarsmqszhvxwjiqabunkyhmf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:44:26 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hgxarsmqszhvxwjiqabunkyhmf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I love tuples, just love them, but I think C is not the place to do language hacking any more. A case could even be made that it wasn't the right place when Ken hacked it around 1988, although a number of the changes were valuable and did make it into the standard (e.g. indexed initializations). -rob --upas-hgxarsmqszhvxwjiqabunkyhmf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 13:20:34 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 13:20:33 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB88219AE0; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:20:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8071B19A9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:19:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (217-124-22-123.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.22.123]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id TAA05438 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:19:51 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 217-124-22-123.dialup.nuria.telefonica-data.net [217.124.22.123] claimed to be gsyc.escet.urjc.es Message-ID: <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> From: FJ Ballesteros X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [es] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: es MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <624e56d4bc299dc1b5658d3a56c32c25@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] more extensions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:24:58 +0200 Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using Limbo. The extension would probably be not too complex, also. I don't have time to implement this during this semester, but would be willing to do so in the future if people from the Labs agree. Is there agreement on this? --upas-hgxarsmqszhvxwjiqabunkyhmf-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 03:48:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 03:48:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15551 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 03:48:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15547 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 03:48:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 03:48:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E13D19AFE; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:48:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE69819AFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:47:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA07072 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:47:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207161847.OAA07072@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:23:25 EDT." <20020716182325.874.qmail@f.bio.cse.psu.edu> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:47:27 -0400 > | Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would > | simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using > | Limbo. > > Yeah, but limbo has bounds checked arrays, which are even more useful. Has anyone ever wondered, ``why not just port limbo?'' Surely the runtime environment provided by Dis can be emulated using a library. Not in response to Scott's comment, but in general, I'm not a big fan of changing C; C is what C is. If you want something else, use something else, but don't try to morph C into another language. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 04:06:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 04:06:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15732 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 04:06:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15728 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 04:06:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 04:06:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A262019AF8; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:06:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from jsnader.netwolvesrd.com (sl-netwolves-1-0.sprintlink.net [160.81.242.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F092199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:05:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from jcs@localhost) by jsnader.netwolvesrd.com (8.11.3/8.11.3) id g6GJ5O472325 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:05:24 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from jsnader@ix.netcom.com) X-Authentication-Warning: jsnader.netwolvesrd.com: jcs set sender to jsnader@ix.netcom.com using -f From: Jon Snader To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions Message-ID: <20020716190524.GA72309@ix.netcom.com> Mail-Followup-To: Jon Snader , 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020716182325.874.qmail@f.bio.cse.psu.edu> <200207161847.OAA07072@math.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200207161847.OAA07072@math.psu.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.25i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:05:24 -0400 On Tue, Jul 16, 2002 at 02:47:27PM -0400, Dan Cross wrote: > > Not in response to Scott's comment, but in general, I'm not a big fan > of changing C; C is what C is. If you want something else, use > something else, but don't try to morph C into another language. > As a wise man once said (sort of): ``If you want limbo, you know where to get it.'' From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 04:12:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 04:12:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15838 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 04:12:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15834 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 04:12:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 04:12:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A7B219B02; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:12:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from workbench.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4763319AE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:11:12 -0400 (EDT) From: bwc@coraid.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wrwhpdxdbybnajrkwvbbgnmlak" Message-Id: <20020716191112.4763319AE9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:15:27 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wrwhpdxdbybnajrkwvbbgnmlak Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll amen Howard here. I'm just now getting used to function prototypes! (that was a joke) Brantley --upas-wrwhpdxdbybnajrkwvbbgnmlak Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by edsac; Tue Jul 16 13:33:56 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE52719AE9; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:29:09 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2D95119AE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:28:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.104.53.191 ([135.104.53.191]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 13:28:26 EDT 2002 From: "Howard Trickey" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] more extensions Message-ID: <000501c22cee$2608e170$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 In-Reply-To: <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:28:07 -0400 This is tempting. Tuples are one of my favorite things about Limbo. However, I'm biased, as I was the one that pushed for tuples in Limbo, I think. But adding them to C's already delicate grammar might be harder than it appears. And there comes a point where an extension changes the flavor of a language a little too much, and I think this one might be over that line. - Howard Trickey > Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would > simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using > Limbo. --upas-wrwhpdxdbybnajrkwvbbgnmlak-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 04:22:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 04:22:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15997 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 04:22:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15993 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 04:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 04:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E80E019B0B; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:22:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BCCE019AFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:21:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:21:39 -0400 I exploded the man page for mail into a bunch of man pages to make it easier to use. The relevant new/changed files are: /sys/man/1/mail /sys/man/1/filter /sys/man/1/marshal /sys/man/1/mlmgr /sys/man/4/upasfs /sys/man/8/aliasmail /sys/man/8/pop3 /sys/man/8/send /sys/man/8/smtp /sys/man/8/ipserv Rsc's scan should pick them up as updated in its next on the half hour scan. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 04:30:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 04:30:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16054 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 04:30:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16050 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 04:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 04:30:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E9A119B03; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:30:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2C8919AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:29:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6GJTBqk005450 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:29:11 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com ([172.21.104.107]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6GJTIMB017995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:29:18 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716123814.0323e448@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions In-Reply-To: <20020716191112.4763319AE9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 12:46:19 -0700 That reminds me of a million dollar idea I had the other day. As we are all nearing retirement, it would be interesting to consider retirement homes equipped with old machines that only understand old dialects of C, FORTRAN, etc. I'm telling you the retiring software developer generation is a gold mine. The keyboards would have to be drool proofed though. (also a joke) At 03:15 PM 7/16/2002 -0400, bwc@coraid.com wrote: >I'll amen Howard here. I'm just now getting used to function prototypes! > >(that was a joke) > > Brantley From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 04:50:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 04:50:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16158 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 04:50:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16154 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 04:50:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 04:50:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7814019B01; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 31CBC19AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:49:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0113a037afb5d6a94f6fb107a4fadb28@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] kernel updates Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:49:54 -0400 I've copied a scad of changes onto the sources machine. In particular - I've hacked the hell out of TCP to get rid of all the anomalies I could find. > The problem LANL was having with throughput dropping off drasticly with write size is gone. > we no longer do lots of needless retransmissions > IP CPU overhead is down (took out some high rollers) - I've added SYN attack defenses. I used the low state model rather than the SYN cookie one. - a defense for NAPTHA DOS attacks from Dong Lin. I don't think I've picked up any works in progress. I still want to add scalable TCP windows but ran out of time. I'll do it in a few weeks. It might help with GB ethernet. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 05:16:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 05:16:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16352 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 05:16:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16348 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 05:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 05:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DB6219B06; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:16:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from acl.lanl.gov (plan9.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.177]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BC7CE19B06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:15:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <72354dc2466bf11cc511be388574f5f6@acl.lanl.gov> To: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kernel updates From: dpx@acl.lanl.gov MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vendjddkbrvtpendetzecpcers" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 14:14:14 -0600 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vendjddkbrvtpendetzecpcers Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Excellent, Thank you! I started on window scale option, but never got very far before getting side tracked. It would be really great to have. -dp --upas-vendjddkbrvtpendetzecpcers Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from acl.lanl.gov ([128.165.147.1]) by acl.lanl.gov; Tue Jul 16 13:50:20 MDT 2002 Received: (qmail 760726 invoked by uid 2345); 16 Jul 2002 13:50:20 -0600 Delivered-To: dpx@acl.lanl.gov Received: (qmail 755428 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 13:50:18 -0600 Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (128.165.4.101) by acl.lanl.gov with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 13:50:18 -0600 Received: from mailproxy1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id g6GJo1aI007376; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:50:02 -0600 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mailproxy1.lanl.gov (8.12.3/8.12.3/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id g6GJoIKR004040; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 13:50:18 -0600 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7814019B01; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 31CBC19AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:49:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0113a037afb5d6a94f6fb107a4fadb28@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] kernel updates Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 15:49:54 -0400 I've copied a scad of changes onto the sources machine. In particular - I've hacked the hell out of TCP to get rid of all the anomalies I could find. > The problem LANL was having with throughput dropping off drasticly with write size is gone. > we no longer do lots of needless retransmissions > IP CPU overhead is down (took out some high rollers) - I've added SYN attack defenses. I used the low state model rather than the SYN cookie one. - a defense for NAPTHA DOS attacks from Dong Lin. I don't think I've picked up any works in progress. I still want to add scalable TCP windows but ran out of time. I'll do it in a few weeks. It might help with GB ethernet. --upas-vendjddkbrvtpendetzecpcers-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 06:49:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 06:49:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16879 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 06:49:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16875 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 06:49:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 06:49:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67B5919AA9; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:49:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.90]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89FF119A29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:48:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from whitecrow.demon.co.uk ([194.222.126.246] helo=localhost.localdomain) by anchor-post-32.mail.demon.net with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 17UaB1-000G6R-0W for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:48:14 +0100 Received: from whitecrow (IDENT:steve@whitecrow [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.localdomain (8.9.3/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA00952; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:29:43 +0100 Message-Id: <200207162129.WAA00952@localhost.localdomain> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.1.1 10/15/1999 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: steve@localhost.localdomain Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: Message from Sam of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:05:58 EDT." Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Steve Kilbane Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:29:42 +0100 > Suppose I'm not saying "why," but "why not." IMO it's cleaner I disagree. It's considerably more ambiguous. Your loop continuation condition (i and > quite possibly more efficient The pros and cons have already been discussed. I'd just like to note that there's no particularly compelling reason why it would generate different code from that which used the idiom. A good optimiser would render them into the same internal form anyway. "A good optimiser" is a subjective term, and Plan 9's C optimising has already been discussed recent (Summary: it's good enough that there are more important/interesting/useful things to work on), but the point stands. steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 07:21:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 07:21:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17135 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 07:21:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17131 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 07:21:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 07:21:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 444C019AF6; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:21:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (www.monitorbm.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C800319A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:20:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 16187 invoked from network); 16 Jul 2002 22:20:31 -0000 Received: from mercury.mbmnz.co.nz (HELO MERCURY) (192.168.0.63) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 16 Jul 2002 22:20:31 -0000 From: "Andrew Simmons" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <3D3545FC.10379.47021A0@localhost> Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v4.01) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-description: Mail message body Subject: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 10:25:00 +1200 Two unrelated queries: 1) Is there a simple way to access files on my hard drive from a Plan9 virtual machine running under VMware under Windows 2000? 2) Is there an implementation of anything like Acme for Windows? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 07:40:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 07:40:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17239 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 07:40:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17235 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 07:40:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 07:40:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D62A19B10; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:40:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from orthanc.ab.ca (orthanc.ab.ca [216.123.203.186]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7875A19B0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:39:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from orthanc.ab.ca (localhost.orthanc.ab.ca [127.0.0.1]) by orthanc.ab.ca (8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id g6GMd9D4001309 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:39:09 -0600 (MDT) (envelope-from lyndon@orthanc.ab.ca) Message-Id: <200207162239.g6GMd9D4001309@orthanc.ab.ca> From: Lyndon Nerenberg Organization: The Frobozz Magic Homing Pigeon Company To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 17 Jul 2002 10:25:00 +1200." <3D3545FC.10379.47021A0@localhost> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 16:39:09 -0600 > 2) Is there an implementation of anything like Acme for Windows? wily (the Unix acme clone) builds out of the box under Cygwin. As do the Unix versions of rc and sam. --lyndon (part-time inmate of the Windows hell) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 07:59:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 07:59:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17441 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 07:59:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17437 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 07:59:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 07:59:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B12CE19B0F; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:59:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6470419A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:58:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6GM1q215072 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:01:52 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query In-Reply-To: <3D3545FC.10379.47021A0@localhost> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 18:01:52 -0400 (EDT) > 2) Is there an implementation of anything like Acme for Windows? > The Inferno hosted binaries will give you acme in windows (effectively). Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 08:22:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 08:22:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17630 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 08:22:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17626 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 08:22:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 08:22:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D3EE19B13; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:22:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from imr3.srv.uk.deuba.com (imr3.srv.uk.deuba.com [194.205.246.144]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42B9E19B07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:21:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from bmr1-e1.srv.uk.deuba.com by imr3.srv.uk.deuba.com id g6GNLXOe003156; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 00:21:33 +0100 (BST) Received: from pi.aus.deuba.com by bmr1-e1.srv.uk.deuba.com id g6GNLV4t005635; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 00:21:32 +0100 (BST) Received: (qmail 2856 invoked by uid 325); 16 Jul 2002 23:21:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20020716232152.2854.qmail@pi.aus.deuba.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Russell Davies Subject: [9fans] ms2html for unix? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:21:52 +1000 Can anybody direct me to a version of ms2html[1] for a generic unix? (specifically linux) thanks, r. [1] - http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/ms2html From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 08:28:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 08:28:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17669 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 08:28:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17665 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 08:28:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 08:28:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F32319B16; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:28:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9D70319B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:27:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 19:27:51 -0400 > wily (the Unix acme clone) builds out of the box under Cygwin. Not a clone, really, more of a cousin. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 09:05:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 09:05:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18339 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 09:05:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18335 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 09:05:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 09:05:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF15019B19; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A355619B08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:04:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6H03xqk029934 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:03:59 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com ([172.21.104.107]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6H03vMB032660 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:03:57 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020716171447.03541b88@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:20:58 -0700 Cousin by marriage (actually, shotgun marriage) At 07:27 PM 7/16/2002 -0400, rob pike, esq. wrote: >Not a clone, really, more of a cousin. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 09:08:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 09:08:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18419 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 09:08:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18415 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 09:08:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 09:08:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA0319B1C; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:08:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from math.psu.edu (leibniz.math.psu.edu [146.186.130.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DD7119B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:07:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from augusta.math.psu.edu (augusta.math.psu.edu [146.186.132.2]) by math.psu.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA28580 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:07:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <200207170007.UAA28580@math.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 16 Jul 2002 17:20:58 PDT." <5.1.0.14.2.20020716171447.03541b88@mail.real.com> From: Dan Cross Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:07:16 -0400 > Cousin by marriage (actually, shotgun marriage) Offspring of married cousins, perhaps? No, that's unkind; I don't think wily is that bad. I rather like it under Unix, though I prefer acme. - Dan C. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 09:16:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 09:16:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18678 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 09:16:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18674 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 09:16:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 09:16:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B58C19B20; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:16:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B50C419B11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:15:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware query / Acme query From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:15:30 -0400 > Cousin by marriage (actually, shotgun marriage) In truth, it's based on an early version of Acme and, by necessity, its interface to external applications is quite different. Mail under Wily is nothing like mail under Acme, at least as I last saw Wily (quite a while ago now). -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 09:43:37 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 09:43:37 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19627 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 09:43:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19616 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 09:43:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 09:43:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D0F819B24; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:43:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 14A4119B1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:42:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 11398 invoked by uid 991); 17 Jul 2002 00:42:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20020717004215.11397.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ms2html for unix? In-Reply-To: Message from Russell Davies of "Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:21:52 +1000." <20020716232152.2854.qmail@pi.aus.deuba.com> From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 20:42:15 -0400 | Can anybody direct me to a version of ms2html[1] for a generic | unix? (specifically linux) How about groff -gms -Thtml From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 11:53:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 11:53:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24132 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 11:53:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24128 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 11:53:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 11:53:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8925519B25; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:53:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D8F019B1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:52:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout06.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GZD00DF4HAMQ5@mtaout06.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:51:58 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <010501c22d3c$f96f3de0$1b02a8c0@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <200207150401.g6F413U15093@smtp.fywss.com> Subject: [9fans] patch: serial mouse middle button emulation Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:52:21 -0400 Code is present in /sys/src/9/port/devmouse.c to support middle button emulation for serial mice, but the "mouseshifted" variable is never set. Adding 3 lines to /sys/src/9/pc/kbd.c (marked with "+" below) fixes the problem: /sys/src/9/pc/kbd.c ---- static Lock i8042lock; static uchar ccc; static void (*auxputc)(int, int); + extern int mouseshifted; ---- case Shift: shift = 0; + mouseshifted = 0; break; ---- case Shift: shift = 1; + mouseshifted = 1; return; ---- John From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 14:36:30 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 14:36:30 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29428 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 14:36:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29424 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 14:36:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 14:36:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3274D19A8B; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:36:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fed1mtao03.cox.net (fed1mtao03.cox.net [68.6.19.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E822C19A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:35:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cox.net ([68.6.200.25]) by fed1mtao03.cox.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20020717053550.OXHF1378.fed1mtao03.cox.net@cox.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 01:35:50 -0400 Message-ID: <3D35045E.1090000@cox.net> From: GBA User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:0.9.4.1) Gecko/20020508 Netscape6/6.2.3 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] New language? References: <000501c22cee$2608e170$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:45:02 -0700 Don't know much about Limbo, but have you seen this? http://www.digitalmars.com/d/index.html > Too true. What then, a new language based on C pulling the > yummy stuff out of limbo? One that's not interpreted, without > a garbage collector, and no atend >:), but that has tuples, array bounds > checking, etc? At this point should we just considering loosening up > Oberon a little and making a few additions? > > I'd be willing to help so long as we fix the BCPL inherited '&' > precedence. > > Sam > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 15:24:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 15:24:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30984 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 15:24:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30980 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 15:24:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 15:24:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB6AD19B28; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 02:24:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 81EC119A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 02:23:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6H6NNmk013089 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:23:24 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6H6NMDs013088 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:23:22 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] New language? Message-ID: <20020717082321.I12824@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <000501c22cee$2608e170$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> <3D35045E.1090000@cox.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <3D35045E.1090000@cox.net>; from GBA on Tue, Jul 16, 2002 at 10:45:02PM -0700 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:23:21 +0200 On Tue, Jul 16, 2002 at 10:45:02PM -0700, GBA wrote: > > Don't know much about Limbo, but have you seen this? > > http://www.digitalmars.com/d/index.html > What, no tuples?! More seriously, I'm happy to work further on Alef, but I have long ago accepted Bell Labs' view that maintaing the libraries is a disaster. I see the "D" people mention "versioning". I'm insufficiently knowledgeable to decide whether that is something I would appreciate or despise. I know NetBSD is hooked on it (in the sense that meat hangs from hooks in refrigerators, sadly) because of their use of dynamic libraries. I guess that makes it a useful solution, if you can't get rid of the problem in the first place. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 16:34:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 16:34:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 689 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 16:34:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 685 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 16:34:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 16:34:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C570019A68; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 03:34:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D94DA19A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 03:33:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4597f71f211fce7a20ffe79ce0b55785@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] New language? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:33:55 +0200 > More seriously, I'm happy to work further on Alef, but I have long > ago accepted Bell Labs' view that maintaing the libraries is a > disaster. Is there any way to generate them automatically or to permit Alef to bind to C ones somehow? Does it use different conventions in the object files? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 16:38:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 16:38:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 875 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 16:38:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 871 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 16:38:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 16:38:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0250619B2E; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 03:38:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36CED19B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 03:37:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17UjW4-00003N-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:46:32 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020717094631.A201@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="oyUTqETQ0mS9luUI" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] Pls. help 2 catch a bug Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:46:31 +0200 --oyUTqETQ0mS9luUI Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Hi, the attached code compiles fine, but commits suicide when run :-( (the failure point is indicated) I would be most happy if someone could put his/her hands on it... TIA, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz --oyUTqETQ0mS9luUI Content-Type: text/x-csrc; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="sharpen.c" // equalize.c // makes a new RGB image by sharpening the old one // heavily, and in a dirty(?) way, reuses code from resample.c // and from sharpen.c,v 1.32 2002/05/25 18:10:04 image filter plug-in for The Gimp image // manipulation program, by Michael Sweet (mike@easysw.com) // sorry, and thanks! // Wed Jul 17 09:23:27 EDT 2002 // License: GPL // Version 1.00 //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// // Please, search for "NOT REACHED" to see the probable location of the bug //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// #include #include #include #include #define ALPHA 3 // dirty defines: quick hack #define guchar uchar #define intneg int #define intpos int #define gint int #define dst nscan #define sel_width xsize #define img_bpp nchan #define sel_y1 0 #define sel_y2 ysize #define sel_height ysize // Globals... static int pos_lut[256]; /* Positive coefficient LUT */ static int neg_lut[256]; /* Negative coefficient LUT */ static int sharpen_percent=85; static int nchan; static int img_bpp=3; static int xsize, ysize; static uchar **oscan, **nscan; static void gray_filter (int width, guchar *src, guchar *dst, intneg *neg0, intneg *neg1, intneg *neg2); static void graya_filter (int width, guchar *src, guchar *dst, intneg *neg0, intneg *neg1, intneg *neg2); static void rgb_filter (int width, guchar *src, guchar *dst, intneg *neg0, intneg *neg1, intneg *neg2); static void rgba_filter (int width, guchar *src, guchar *dst, intneg *neg0, intneg *neg1, intneg *neg2); // Funcs... void usage(void) { fprint(2, "usage:\n\sharpen [imagefile]\n"); exits("usage"); } static void compute_luts (void) { gint i; /* Looping var */ gint fact; /* 1 - sharpness */ fact = 100 - sharpen_percent; if (fact < 1) fact = 1; for (i = 0; i < 256; i ++) { pos_lut[i] = 800 * i / fact; neg_lut[i] = (4 + pos_lut[i] - (i << 3)) >> 3; }; } /* * 'sharpen()' - Sharpen an image using a convolution filter. */ static void sharpen (int xsize, int ysize) { guchar *src_rows[4], /* Source pixel rows */ *src_ptr, /* Current source pixel */ *dst_row; /* Destination pixel row */ intneg *neg_rows[4], /* Negative coefficient rows */ *neg_ptr; /* Current negative coefficient */ gint i, /* Looping vars */ y, /* Current location in image */ row, /* Current row in src_rows */ count, /* Current number of filled src_rows */ width; /* Byte width of the image */ void (*filter)(int, guchar *, guchar *, intneg *, intneg *, intneg *); filter = nil; /* * Setup for filter... */ compute_luts (); width = sel_width * img_bpp; for (row = 0; row < 4; row ++) { neg_rows[row] = malloc(xsize*sizeof(int*)); }; /* * Pre-load the first row for the filter... */ src_rows[0]=oscan[0]; dst_row = nscan[0]; for (i = width, src_ptr = src_rows[0], neg_ptr = neg_rows[0]; i > 0; i --, src_ptr ++, neg_ptr ++) *neg_ptr = neg_lut[*src_ptr]; row = 1; count = 1; /* * Select the filter... */ switch (img_bpp) { case 1 : filter = gray_filter; break; case 2 : filter = graya_filter; break; case 3 : filter = rgb_filter; break; case 4 : filter = rgba_filter; break; }; /* * Sharpen... */ for (y = sel_y1; y < sel_y2; y ++) { /* * Load the next pixel row... */ if ((y + 1) < sel_y2) { /* * Check to see if our src_rows[] array is overflowing yet... */ if (count >= 3) count --; /* * Grab the next row... */ src_rows[row]=oscan[row]; for (i = width, src_ptr = src_rows[row], neg_ptr = neg_rows[row]; i > 0; i --, src_ptr ++, neg_ptr ++) *neg_ptr = neg_lut[*src_ptr]; count ++; row = (row + 1) & 3; } else { /* * No more pixels at the bottom... Drop the oldest samples... */ count --; }; /* * Now sharpen pixels and save the results... */ dst_row=nscan[y]; if (count == 3) { (* filter) (sel_width, src_rows[(row + 2) & 3], dst_row, neg_rows[(row + 1) & 3] + img_bpp, neg_rows[(row + 2) & 3] + img_bpp, neg_rows[(row + 3) & 3] + img_bpp); /* * Set the row... */ } else if (count == 2) { if (y == sel_y1) /* first row */ for(i=0; i 0) { pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-1] - neg0[0] - neg0[1] - neg1[-1] - neg1[1] - neg2[-1] - neg2[0] - neg2[1]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; neg0 ++; neg1 ++; neg2 ++; width --; }; *dst++ = *src++; } /* * 'graya_filter()' - Sharpen grayscale+alpha pixels. */ static void graya_filter (gint width, /* I - Width of line in pixels */ guchar *src, /* I - Source line */ guchar *dst, /* O - Destination line */ intneg *neg0, /* I - Top negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg1, /* I - Middle negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg2) /* I - Bottom negative coefficient line */ { intpos pixel; /* New pixel value */ *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; width -= 2; while (width > 0) { pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-2] - neg0[0] - neg0[2] - neg1[-2] - neg1[2] - neg2[-2] - neg2[0] - neg2[2]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; *dst++ = *src++; neg0 += 2; neg1 += 2; neg2 += 2; width --; }; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; } /* * 'rgb_filter()' - Sharpen RGB pixels. */ static void rgb_filter (gint width, /* I - Width of line in pixels */ guchar *src, /* I - Source line */ guchar *dst, /* O - Destination line */ intneg *neg0, /* I - Top negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg1, /* I - Middle negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg2) /* I - Bottom negative coefficient line */ { intpos pixel; /* New pixel value */ *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; width -= 2; while (width > 0) { pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-3] - neg0[0] - neg0[3] - neg1[-3] - neg1[3] - neg2[-3] - neg2[0] - neg2[3]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-2] - neg0[1] - neg0[4] - neg1[-2] - neg1[4] - neg2[-2] - neg2[1] - neg2[4]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-1] - neg0[2] - neg0[5] - neg1[-1] - neg1[5] - neg2[-1] - neg2[2] - neg2[5]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; neg0 += 3; neg1 += 3; neg2 += 3; width --; }; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; } /* * 'rgba_filter()' - Sharpen RGBA pixels. */ static void rgba_filter (gint width, /* I - Width of line in pixels */ guchar *src, /* I - Source line */ guchar *dst, /* O - Destination line */ intneg *neg0, /* I - Top negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg1, /* I - Middle negative coefficient line */ intneg *neg2) /* I - Bottom negative coefficient line */ { intpos pixel; /* New pixel value */ *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; width -= 2; while (width > 0) { pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-4] - neg0[0] - neg0[4] - neg1[-4] - neg1[4] - neg2[-4] - neg2[0] - neg2[4]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-3] - neg0[1] - neg0[5] - neg1[-3] - neg1[5] - neg2[-3] - neg2[1] - neg2[5]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; pixel = (pos_lut[*src++] - neg0[-2] - neg0[2] - neg0[6] - neg1[-2] - neg1[6] - neg2[-2] - neg2[2] - neg2[6]); pixel = (pixel + 4) >> 3; if (pixel < 0) *dst++ = 0; else if (pixel < 255) *dst++ = pixel; else *dst++ = 255; *dst++ = *src++; neg0 += 4; neg1 += 4; neg2 += 4; width --; }; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; *dst++ = *src++; } int max(int a, int b) { if(a > b) return a; return b; } Memimage* mknewimg(int xsize, int ysize, Memimage *m) { int i, j, bpl, nchan; Memimage *new; new = allocmemimage(Rect(0, 0, xsize, ysize), m->chan); if(new == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate new image: %r"); oscan = malloc(Dy(m->r)*sizeof(uchar*)); nscan = malloc(max(ysize, Dy(m->r))*sizeof(uchar*)); if(oscan == nil || nscan == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); /* unload original image into scan lines */ bpl = bytesperline(m->r, m->depth); for(i=0; ir); i++){ oscan[i] = malloc(bpl); if(oscan[i] == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); j = unloadmemimage(m, Rect(m->r.min.x, m->r.min.y+i, m->r.max.x, m->r.min.y+i+1), oscan[i], bpl); if(j != bpl) sysfatal("unloadmemimage"); } /* allocate scan lines for destination. we do y first, so need at least Dy(m->r) lines */ bpl = bytesperline(Rect(0, 0, xsize, Dy(m->r)), m->depth); for(i=0; ir)); i++){ nscan[i] = malloc(bpl); if(nscan[i] == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate: %r"); } nchan = m->depth/8; sharpen(xsize, ysize); /* pack data into destination */ bpl = bytesperline(new->r, m->depth); for(i=0; ir); ysize = Dy(m->r); new = nil; switch(m->chan){ case RGB24: case RGBA32: case ARGB32: case XRGB32: new = mknewimg(xsize, ysize, m); break; case GREY1: case GREY2: case GREY4: case GREY8: case CMAP8: case RGB15: case RGB16: tchan = RGB24; goto Convert; Convert: /* use library to convert to byte-per-chan form, then convert back */ t1 = allocmemimage(m->r, tchan); if(t1 == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate temporary image: %r"); memimagedraw(t1, t1->r, m, m->r.min, nil, ZP); t2 = mknewimg(xsize, ysize, t1); freememimage(t1); new = allocmemimage(Rect(0, 0, xsize, ysize), m->chan); if(new == nil) sysfatal("can't allocate new image: %r"); /* should do error diffusion here */ memimagedraw(new, new->r, t2, t2->r.min, nil, ZP); freememimage(t2); break; default: sysfatal("can't handle channel type %s", chantostr(tmp, m->chan)); } assert(new); // print("LAST POINT"); if(writememimage(1, new) < 0) sysfatal("write error on output: %r"); // print("NOT REACHED"); exits(nil); } --oyUTqETQ0mS9luUI-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 17:23:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 17:23:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2347 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 17:23:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2343 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 17:23:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 17:23:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BFEA19B27; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 04:23:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8DE5A19B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 04:22:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6H8Lomk013262 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 10:21:51 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6H8LnA8013261 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 10:21:49 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] New language? Message-ID: <20020717102148.L12824@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <4597f71f211fce7a20ffe79ce0b55785@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <4597f71f211fce7a20ffe79ce0b55785@plan9.escet.urjc.es>; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 09:33:55AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 10:21:48 +0200 On Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 09:33:55AM +0200, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > More seriously, I'm happy to work further on Alef, but I have long > > ago accepted Bell Labs' view that maintaing the libraries is a > > disaster. > > Is there any way to generate them automatically or to permit > Alef to bind to C ones somehow? Does it use different conventions > in the object files? > I assume that Bell Labs have looked at this, although not all their decisions have been entirely flawless. As I read it, it's a bitch because the procedure call interface is different from "C". I haven't looked at the internal details, and I'm less than confident that I would get very far. If forsyth chose to get involved (or rog, perhaps) we'd have a strong chance. But if things settle down, it may well be worth it. In addition, Alef is still experimental, it can pick up quite a lot from Limbo, if the interest exists (I didn't realise how many features of Alef I had overlooked in my initial study of it - some of them are probably obsolete, even, others may be extremely useful). If the interest is there, I'm happy to put some effort towards keeping Alef alive. I am not sufficiently up to date, in an academic sense, to drive language-based changes, though. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:03:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:03:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3329 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:03:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3325 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:03:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:03:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8212919A70; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:03:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE2E219A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:02:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17UkeE-0002Ew-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D34F3B6.F76FF816@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:54 GMT "rob pike, esq." wrote: > ... I think C is not the place to do language hacking any more. I largely agree, although there are some places in C where programmers really could use some help. The C language is not very "clean" due to having accumulated features rather than having features redesigned (which would of course have caused major problems for important existing code). Any really substantial changes would be done better in a new language. Maybe language designers could learn from history and avoid many of the bigger mistakes, mainly overloading single constructs with several conceptually non-identical meanings. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:03:44 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:03:44 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3355 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:03:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3350 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:03:43 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:03:43 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 846BE19B2F; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:03:23 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 181CF19A9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:02:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17UkeE-0002Ep-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D34F280.CD984120@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <6333e0a01e113662f55923372089278a@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:40 GMT presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > #define sa_len sa_union.sa_generic.sa_len2 A lot of that kind of thing was due to changing an interface to be more general but wanting to avoid having to edit existing code that was written before the data type changed. This kind of thing dates back to 7th Edition Unix time functions, where the &l in the 7th Edition function interface corresponds to 6th Edition's pointer to an array of two ints. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:04:16 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:04:16 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3365 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:04:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3361 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:04:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:04:15 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C77D19B33; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:03:34 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 416A919A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:02:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17UkeD-0002EV-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: William Josephson Message-ID: Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, Massachusetts References: <6333e0a01e113662f55923372089278a@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:08 GMT In article <6333e0a01e113662f55923372089278a@plan9.bell-labs.com>, presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: >> Including tuples (perhaps as an instance of nameless structs) would >> simplify many interfaces, right? that's one thing I learned using >> Limbo. > > This I wouldn't mind seeing. I really miss limbo tuples. Of course, > I miss garbage collection too. Tuples are one of the things I miss most in C, too. But garbage collection for dns is a close second :-/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:11:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:11:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3520 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:11:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3515 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:11:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:11:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECC3B19B36; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:11:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5F8619B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:10:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17UkeD-0002Eb-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207161941.7bee38b0@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <0113a037afb5d6a94f6fb107a4fadb28@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] kernel updates Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:18 GMT > - I've added SYN attack defenses. I used the low > state model rather than the SYN cookie one. > Thanks, I was actually going to mention something about this. I was attacked with two SYN floods yesterday! :-) Don From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:11:43 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:11:43 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3529 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:11:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3525 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:11:43 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:11:43 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9452619B3A; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:11:22 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 782F419B34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:10:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17UkeE-0002Eh-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D34F013.2DBAADAF@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <624e56d4bc299dc1b5658d3a56c32c25@plan9.bell-labs.com>, <3D3456EA.4B0BC1D4@gsyc.escet.urjc.es> Subject: Re: [9fans] more extensions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:29 GMT FJ Ballesteros wrote: > Including tuples ... Tuples are truly useful. There are some syntactic issues to solve when adding them to C, but assuming they're dealt with I would welcome this experiment. It would provide some leverage in arguing for standardization of the feature for C0x. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:12:12 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:12:12 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3544 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:12:12 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3540 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:12:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:12:11 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DBCE19B3E; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:11:33 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0701619B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:10:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Ukf9-0002Gw-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:59:59 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D34F176.53D8BD00@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:59:04 GMT forsyth@vitanuova.com wrote: > in the case of Lock, it's easy to see that we could do without: > just requires > lock(&t->l); > instead of > lock(t); > as in Plan 9. > the advantage of the latter, however, is that it is clear and readable, > not that it saves typing. Indeed, when I was trying to track down a bug in floppy booting (with mixed drive types), I wasted some time thinking I had found the bug in one such instance, having temporarily forgotten about that Plan 9 C extension. I personally prefer the &t->l as saying exactly what is meant, instead of invoking some behind-the-scene mapping. But I think it was an interesting experiment anyway. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 18:58:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 18:58:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4449 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 18:58:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4445 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 18:58:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 18:58:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74B9319B35; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:58:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from themail.com (unknown [61.171.129.217]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BB5B119A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 05:57:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "work at home" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020717095753.BB5B119A7E@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] E-Work at Home Using Your Computer Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:52:33 +0800 E-Work at Home Using Your Computer Turn a one time $25.into $500,000. NO BULL Dear Friends & Future Millionaire: AS SEEN ON NATIONAL TV: Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months from your home for an investment of only $25 U.S. Dollars expense one time 'THANK'S TO THE COMPUTER AGE AND THE INTERNET ! BE A MILLIONAIRE LIKE OTHERS WITHIN A YEAR!!! Before you say ''Bull'', please read the following. This is the letter you have been hearing about on the news lately. Due to the popularity of this letter on the Internet, a national weekly news program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of this program described below, to see if it really can make people money. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved once and for all that there are ''absolutely NO Laws prohibiting the participation in the program and if people can -follow the simple instructions, they are bound to make some mega bucks with only $25 out of pocket cost''. DUE TO THE RECENT INCREASE OF POPULARITY & RESPECT THIS PROGRAM HAS ATTAINED, IT IS CURRENTLY WORKING BETTER THAN EVER. This is what one had to say: ''Thanks to this profitable opportunity. I was approached many times before, but each time I passed on it. I am so glad I finally joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I received a total of $610,470.00 in 21 weeks, with money still coming in." Pam Hedland, Fort Lee, New Jersey. Here is another testimonial: "This program has been around for a long time but I never believed in it. But one day when I received this again in the mail I decided to spend my $25 on it. I followed the simple instructions and walaa ..... 3 weeks later the money started to come in. My first month I only made $240.00 but the next 2 months after that I made a total of $290,000.00. So far, in the past 8 months by re-entering the program, I have made over $710,000.00 and I am playing it again. The key to success in this program is to follow the simple steps and NOT change anything.'' More testimonials later but first, PRINT THIS NOW FOR YOUR FUTURE REFERENCE $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If you would like to make at least $500,000 every 4 to 5 months easily and comfortably, please read the following...THEN READ IT AGAIN and AGAIN!!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ FOLLOW THE SIMPLE INSTRUCTION BELOW AND YOUR FINANCIAL DREAMS WILL COME TRUE, GUARANTEED! INSTRUCTIONS: Order all 5 reports shown on the list below. For each report, send $5 CASH, THE NAME & NUMBER OF THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING and YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS to the person whose name appears ON THAT LIST next to the report. MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE TOP LEFT CORNER in case of any mail problems. When you place your order, make sure you order each of the 5 reports.You will need all 5 reports so that you can save them on your computer and resell them. YOUR TOTAL COST $5 X 5 = $25.00. Within a few days you will receive, vie e-mail, each of the 5 reports from these 5 different individuals. Save them on your computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the 1,000's of people who will order them from you. Also make a floppy of these reports and keep it on your desk in case something happen to your computer. IMPORTANT - DO NOT alter the names of the people who are listed next to each report, or their sequence on the list, in any way other than what is instructed below in step '' 1 through 6 '' or you will loose out on majority of your profits. Once you understand the way this works, you will also see how it does not work if you change it. Remember, this method has been tested, and if you alter it in any way, it will NOT work !!! People have tried to put their friends/relatives names on all five thinking they could get all the money. But it does not work this way. Believe us, we all have tried to be greedy and then nothing happened. So Do Not try to change anything other than what is instructed. Because if you do, it will not work for you. Remember, honesty reaps the reward!!! 1. After you have ordered all 5 reports, take this advertisement and REMOVE the name & address of the person in REPORT # 5. This person has made it through the cycle and is no doubt counting their fortune. 2.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 4 down TO REPORT # 5. 3.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 3 down TO REPORT # 4. 4.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 2 down TO REPORT # 3. 5.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 1 down TO REPORT # 2 6.... Insert YOUR name & address in the REPORT # 1 Position. PLEASE MAKE SURE you copy every name & address ACCURATELY! **** Take this entire letter, with the modified list of names, and save it on your computer. DO NOT MAKE ANY OTHER CHANGES. Save this on a disk as well just in case if you loose any data. To assist you with marketing your business on the internet, the 5 reports you purchase will provide you with invaluable marketing information which includes how to send bulk e-mails legally, where to find thousands of free classified ads and much more. There are 2 Primary methods to get this venture going: METHOD # 1: BY SENDING BULK E-MAIL LEGALLY Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it goes, and we will assume You and those involved send out only 5,000 e-mails each. Let's also assume that the mailing receive only a 0.2% response (the response could be much better but lets just say it is only 0.2%. Also many people will send out hundreds of thousands e-mails instead of only 5,000 each). 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GET A PENCIL & PAPER AND FIGUREOUT THE WORST POSSIBLE RESPONSES AND NO MATTER HOW YOU CALCULATE IT, YOU WILL STILL MAKE A LOT OF MONEY ! REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING ONLY 10 PEOPLE ORDERING OUT OF 5,000 YOU MAILEDTO. Dare to think for a moment what would happen if everyone or half or even one/4th of those people mailed 100,000e-mails each or more? There are over 150 million people on the Internet worldwide and counting. Believe me,many people will do just that, and more! METHOD # 2 : BY PLACING FREE ADS ON THE INTERNET. Advertising on the net is very very inexpensive and there are hundreds of FREE places to advertise. Placing a lot of free ads on the Internet will easily get a larger response. We strongly suggest you start with Method # 1 then add METHOD # 2 as you go along. For every $5 you receive, all you must do is e-mail them the Report they ordered. That's it. Always provide same day service on all orders if possible. This will guarantee that the e-mail they send out, with your name and address on it, will be prompt because they can not advertise until they receive the report. AVAILABLE REPORTS!!! ORDER EACH REPORT BY ITS NUMBER & NAME ONLY. Notes: Always send $5 cash (U.S. CURRENCY) for each Report. Checks NOT accepted. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least 2 sheets of paper. On one of those sheets of paper, Write the NUMBER & the NAME of the Report you are ordering, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and your name and postal address. PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THESE REPORTS NOW : REPORTS # 1: The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Net Order Report #1 from: George Hu Re:200205-04 16 Ragazzi Lane Staten Island, NY 10305 U.S.A. ________________________________________________________ REPORT # 2: The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk e-mail on the Net Order Report # 2 from: Peter Huang 365 Roncesvalles Ave. Suite 182 Toronto,On M6R 2M8 Canada _________________________________________________________________ REPORT # 3: Secret to Multilevel marketing on the net Order Report # 3 from : Ann Bietau 105 Goodhill Rd. Weston, CT 06883 USA ____________________________________________________________ REPORT # 4: "How to Become a Millionaire Utilizing MLM & the Net" Order Report # 4 from: Xun Qi 240 Donald Ave. Apt#2 Toronto,On M6M 1K6 Canada ____________________________________________________________ REPORT #5: "How to Send Out 0ne Million e-mails for Free" Order Report # 5 from: Julie Kang P.O.Box 182 Station C Toronto,On M6J3M9 Canada _____________________________________________________________ $$$$$$$$$ YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES $$$$$$$$$$$ Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: If you do not receive at least 10 orders for Report #1 within 2 weeks, continue sending e-mails until you do. After you have received 10 orders, 2 to 3 weeks after that you should receive 100 orders or more for REPORT # 2. If you did not, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. Once you have received 100 or more orders for Report # 2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you, and the cash will continue to roll in ! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a Different report. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which report people are ordering from you. IF YOU WANT TO GENERATE MORE INCOME SEND OUT ANOTHER BATCH OF E-MAILS AND START THE WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN. There is NO LIMIT to the income you can generate from this business. FOLLOWING IS A NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS PROGRAM: You have just received information that can give you financial freedom for the rest of your life, with NO RISK and JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT. You can make more money in the next few weeks and months than you have ever imagined. Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do Not change it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting report after you have put your name and address in Report #1 and moved others to #2 ........# 5 as instructed above. One of the people you send this out to may send out 100,000 or more e-mails and your name will be on every one of them. Remember though, the more you send out the more potential customers you will reach. So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, materials and opportunity to become financially independent. IT IS UP TO YOU NOW MORE TESTIMONIALS!!! "My name is Mitchell. My wife, Jody and I live in Chicago. I am an accountant with a major U.S. Corporation and I make pretty good money. When I received this program I grumbled to Jody about receiving junk mail''. I made fun of the whole thing,spouting my knowledge of the population and percentages involved. I ''knew'' it wouldn't work. Jody totally ignored my supposed intelligence and a few days later she jumped in with both feet. I made merciless fun of her, and was ready to lay the old '' I told you so'' on her when the thing didn't work. Well, the laugh was on me! Within 3 weeks she had received 50 responses. Within the next 45 days she had received a total of $ 147,200.00 all cash! I was shocked. I have joined Jody in her ''hobby''. Mitchell Wolf M.D., Chicago, Illinois ''Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that I am, I decided that the initial investment was so little that there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least get my money back''. '' I was surprised when I found my medium size post office box crammed with orders. I made $319,210.00 in the first 12 weeks. The nice thing about this deal is that it does not matter where people live. There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return and so big." Dan Sondstrom, Alberta, Canada I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I wondered if I should have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e-mailed again by someone else.........11 months passed then it luckily came again.....I did not delete this one! I made more than $490,000 on my first try and all the money came within 22 weeks." Susan De Suza, New York, N.Y. ''It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money with little cost to you. I followed the simple instructions carefully and within 10 days the money started to come in. My first month I made $20,560.00 and by the end of the third month my total cash count was $362,840.00. Life is beautiful, Thanx to internet.". Fred Dellaca, Westport, New Zealand ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON 'YOUR' ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM ! If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Washington, D.C. Thanks for your time and good sailing. To be removed,reply this email with 'remove' in the subject line. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 21:47:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 21:47:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6515 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 21:47:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6511 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 21:47:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 21:47:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CFCC19B18; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:47:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 15C8819AC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:46:05 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] patch: serial mouse middle button emulation MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bcrkgymwvshijyspafrlxpxwjy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:46:22 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bcrkgymwvshijyspafrlxpxwjy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit done, sources updated. I'm not sure why we took it out; seems to have disappeared in oct 1999. Maybe we got tired of 2 button mice because it's impossible to do acme chording with them even with the shift key. --upas-bcrkgymwvshijyspafrlxpxwjy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 22:53:41 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Jul 16 22:53:40 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46F2A19B23; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:53:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from smtp.comcast.net (smtp.comcast.net [24.153.64.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D8F019B1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:52:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cg938416a (pcp085155pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net [68.46.96.100]) by mtaout06.icomcast.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 HotFix 0.8 (built May 13 2002)) with SMTP id <0GZD00DF4HAMQ5@mtaout06.icomcast.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:51:58 -0400 (EDT) From: John DeGood To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <010501c22d3c$f96f3de0$1b02a8c0@arnysm01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4807.1700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4807.1700 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <200207150401.g6F413U15093@smtp.fywss.com> Subject: [9fans] patch: serial mouse middle button emulation Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Jul 2002 22:52:21 -0400 Code is present in /sys/src/9/port/devmouse.c to support middle button emulation for serial mice, but the "mouseshifted" variable is never set. Adding 3 lines to /sys/src/9/pc/kbd.c (marked with "+" below) fixes the problem: /sys/src/9/pc/kbd.c ---- static Lock i8042lock; static uchar ccc; static void (*auxputc)(int, int); + extern int mouseshifted; ---- case Shift: shift = 0; + mouseshifted = 0; break; ---- case Shift: shift = 1; + mouseshifted = 1; return; ---- John --upas-bcrkgymwvshijyspafrlxpxwjy-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 21:58:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 21:58:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6635 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 21:58:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6631 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 21:58:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 21:58:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29FED19ABE; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:58:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from minster.cs.york.ac.uk (minster.cs.york.ac.uk [144.32.40.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 017A019AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:57:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pc095 ([144.32.41.96] ident=ianb) by minster.cs.york.ac.uk with smtp (Exim 3.22 #9) id 17UoEz-0001h6-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 13:49:13 +0100 From: Ian Broster To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-Id: <20020717134908.6cd4fcdb.spam@broster.co.uk> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.5claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i686-pc-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 13:49:08 +0100 > for(i=0; i // do some stuff > } > atend .. I'm sure someone must have done something obfuscated with a #define before? How about: ;-) #define forend(init,cond,inc,block,cont) for(init; cond || (cont,0) ;inc) block forend (i=0, i<5, i++, { printf("%d\n",i); }, printf("Loop terminated\n")) which gives: for(i=0; i<5 || ( printf("Loop terminated\n") ,0); i++){ printf("%d\n",i); } ;-) ian From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 22:09:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 22:09:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6754 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 22:09:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6749 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 22:09:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 22:09:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A778819B39; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:09:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21C4319A8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:08:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HCCE216225 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:12:14 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <20020717134908.6cd4fcdb.spam@broster.co.uk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:12:14 -0400 (EDT) > #define forend(init,cond,inc,block,cont) for(init; cond || (cont,0) ;inc) block > > forend (i=0, i<5, i++, { > printf("%d\n",i); > }, printf("Loop terminated\n")) Dear. Lord. Methinks we can let this poor atend be. We've beaten it enough ... he'll be sore for weeks. Not only is it not worth modifying *any* language for, it's not worth putting into a new one. I'm still glad I brought it up; this has been a good thread. So, back to spaces in filenames ... :-X Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 22:35:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 22:35:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7108 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 22:35:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7104 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 22:35:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 22:35:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B867119B31; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:35:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5D0719AAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:34:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6HDXvmk013664 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:33:58 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6HDXsuW013663 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:33:54 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020717153351.D13546@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020717134908.6cd4fcdb.spam@broster.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from Sam on Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 08:12:14AM -0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:33:52 +0200 On Wed, Jul 17, 2002 at 08:12:14AM -0400, Sam wrote: > > Methinks we can let this poor atend be. We've beaten it > enough ... he'll be sore for weeks. Not only is it not > worth modifying *any* language for, it's not worth putting > into a new one. I'm still glad I brought it up; this > has been a good thread. > Just as I was getting brave enough to suggest: for (x = 1 => { /* initialisation */ }; x < num => { /* termination */ }; x++ => { /* body */ }; ); (syntactic spices to taste) ... ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 17 22:37:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 17 22:37:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7154 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Jul 2002 22:37:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7150 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 22:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 22:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D05519B45; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:37:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3979719B3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:36:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <20196a2a24e211c38232f4a62a39b116@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:36:54 -0400 for(what i want){ do(what is right); }until(all is done); Then goto start; and begin again. Now *that's* a good language. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 00:56:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 00:56:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8591 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 00:56:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8587 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 00:56:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 00:56:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77EB619AC8; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 11:56:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FACB19B44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 11:55:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6HFtKqk003885 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:55:20 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com (pppoe0438.gh.centurytel.net [209.206.249.221]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6HFtJMB028239 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 08:55:19 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717085952.035b24c8@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <20020717153351.D13546@cackle.proxima.alt.za> References: <20020717134908.6cd4fcdb.spam@broster.co.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 09:12:27 -0700 In a strange twist, there is a C like language called Pike that has experimented with all sorts of things like this. It has all kinds of neat and quirky things; like for example defining inline functions right in the parameter list of a function call. That might be a good place for these types of experiments. I was intrigued by it, but then Limbo came along. BTW, the Roxen web server is written in Pike. At 03:33 PM 7/17/2002 +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: >Just as I was getting brave enough to suggest: > > for (x = 1 => { /* initialisation */ }; > x < num => { /* termination */ }; > x++ => { /* body */ }; > ); > >(syntactic spices to taste) ... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:14:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:14:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11247 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:14:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11243 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:14:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:14:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05E0919AA2; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:14:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A99E419A86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:13:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HLH0217140 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:17:07 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] drawterm Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:17:00 -0400 (EDT) Do we have a drawterm for linux and if so can someone send me the source (or a URL to it)? Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:19:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:19:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11274 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:19:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11270 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:19:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:19:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21BF619AC6; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:19:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 45C7919AB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:18:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5f5dce4aa49c687fc74ef6508d461cb3@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:18:38 -0400 > Do we have a drawterm for linux and if so can someone send me > the source (or a URL to it)? /sys/src/cmd/unix/drawterm -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:22:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:22:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11305 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:22:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11300 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:22:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1974419B14; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:22:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE61419ACB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:21:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HLPJ217156 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:25:20 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:25:19 -0400 (EDT) nm that. I should have thought to check the man pages. I didn't have a terminal up and for some reason using the cpu server escaped me. Long days will do that to you, I suppose. Sam On Wed, 17 Jul 2002, Sam wrote: > Do we have a drawterm for linux and if so can someone send me > the source (or a URL to it)? > > Sam > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:23:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:23:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11322 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:23:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11318 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9ED219B1E; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:23:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7C97C19ACF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:22:00 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? References: <20020717134908.6cd4fcdb.spam@broster.co.uk> <5.1.0.14.2.20020717085952.035b24c8@mail.real.com> Message-Id: <20020717222200.7C97C19ACF@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:21:54 +0900 Hello, > for (x = 1 => { /* initialisation */ }; > x < num => { /* termination */ }; > x++ => { /* body */ }; > ); > Why not ?: x=1; while(x; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 42582 invoked from network); 17 Jul 2002 16:28:04 -0600 Received: from snaresland.acl.lanl.gov (128.165.147.113) by acl.lanl.gov with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 16:28:04 -0600 Received: (qmail 10858 invoked by uid 3499); 17 Jul 2002 16:28:04 -0600 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Jul 2002 16:28:04 -0600 From: Ronald G Minnich X-X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <20020717222200.7C97C19ACF@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:28:04 -0600 (MDT) On Thu, 18 Jul 2002 arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > Is it unavoidable machine codes in stack are executable? your architecture has to support r,w,x on segments. then the OS has to actually make that work. Most OSes I've seen always set x on all segments, including stack. It's not even possible to do things otherwise on many of them. Does plan9 have x-only and r-only and rw-only segments in the VM system? I was pretty sure it did not. I got into fruitless argument with an architecture guy about the value of x bits in the VM system. His argument was that it was a bad idea for performance. I doubt even in the x86 that it is solid and well-tested, but who knows. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:50:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:50:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11551 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:50:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11547 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:50:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:50:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA0B519B08; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:50:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA0ED19AB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:49:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6HMnoqk010413 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:49:50 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com (pppoe0438.gh.centurytel.net [209.206.249.221]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6HMnmMB027713 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 15:49:48 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717160343.01b6aee8@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: [9fans] pico Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 16:06:50 -0700 is there anything like it in Plan9? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 07:54:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 07:54:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11607 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 07:54:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11603 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 07:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 07:54:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7280919B3B; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28AAD19B30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:53:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HLvF217193 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:57:15 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] pico In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717160343.01b6aee8@mail.real.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:57:15 -0400 (EDT) On Wed, 17 Jul 2002, Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian wrote: > is there anything like it in Plan9? > Does ed(1) count? (no, there isn't) Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 08:43:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 08:43:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12021 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 08:43:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12016 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 08:43:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 08:43:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99C6E19AC7; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:43:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B3C319A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HMkE217283 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:46:14 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] Pico (again) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 18:46:14 -0400 (EDT) Of course, now that I've thought about it if you're looking for an editor with the "simplicity" of pico you can always use the rio window buffer and snarf it into a file when you're done. Rob mentions this in his 8 1/2 paper (The editing, not the snarfing, iirc). Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 09:12:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 09:12:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12463 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 09:12:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12459 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 09:12:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 09:12:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 401CC19AAD; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:12:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBFC719A7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:11:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6I0BFqk017630 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:11:15 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com (pppoe0438.gh.centurytel.net [209.206.249.221]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6I0BDMB022224; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:11:14 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717172506.0502a630@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:28:15 -0700 wait. I meant the other pico. I thought in this list at least the other one would be more famous. There is a link on this page to the original source; it is guaranteed not to compile on any modern machines. http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/gerard/ At 06:46 PM 7/17/2002 -0400, Sam wrote: >Of course, now that I've thought about it if you're >looking for an editor with the "simplicity" of >pico you can always use the rio window buffer >and snarf it into a file when you're done. > >Rob mentions this in his 8 1/2 paper (The editing, >not the snarfing, iirc). > >Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 09:16:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 09:16:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12749 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 09:16:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12744 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 09:16:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 09:16:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF0EA19ABC; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:16:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFDB219A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:15:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6HNJ7217322 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:19:07 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717172506.0502a630@mail.real.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 19:19:07 -0400 (EDT) There's my age showing again. Sorry about that. Sam On Wed, 17 Jul 2002, Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian wrote: > wait. I meant the other pico. I thought in this list at least the > other one would be more famous. > > There is a link on this page to the original source; it is guaranteed not to compile > on any modern machines. > http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/gerard/ > > At 06:46 PM 7/17/2002 -0400, Sam wrote: > >Of course, now that I've thought about it if you're > >looking for an editor with the "simplicity" of > >pico you can always use the rio window buffer > >and snarf it into a file when you're done. > > > >Rob mentions this in his 8 1/2 paper (The editing, > >not the snarfing, iirc). > > > >Sam > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 09:19:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 09:19:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12814 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 09:19:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12809 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 09:19:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 09:19:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70A0719B3D; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:19:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6955B19B2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:18:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6I0Iaqk018289 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:18:36 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com (pppoe0438.gh.centurytel.net [209.206.249.221]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6I0IYMB027552 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:18:34 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717173437.037595e0@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) In-Reply-To: References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020717172506.0502a630@mail.real.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 17:35:36 -0700 You were talking about the dark ages, and I only meant the middle ages. At 07:19 PM 7/17/2002 -0400, Sam wrote: >There's my age showing again. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 12:24:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 12:24:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18396 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 12:24:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18392 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 12:24:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 12:24:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A504F19A9D; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:24:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 762A719A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:23:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <723315de1376d3aa7b828f93a205fe5b@collyer.net> From: Geoff Collyer To: 9fans@collyer.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] no job control; thank you! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 20:23:40 -0700 I'd like to thank all the Plan 9 developers for keeping job control out of Plan 9. I've just had a close encounter with job control after many years away from Unix (hey, somebody has to clean the sewers), and the complexity and botched implementation(s) of that bad idea are mind-boggling. I finally gave up. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 12:49:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 12:49:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19076 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 12:49:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19072 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 12:49:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 12:49:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD82D19AC9; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:49:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 05CBF19A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:48:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 23:49:15 -0400 > I'd like to thank all the Plan 9 developers for keeping job control > out of Plan 9. I've just had a close encounter with job control after > many years away from Unix (hey, somebody has to clean the sewers), and > the complexity and botched implementation(s) of that bad idea are > mind-boggling. I finally gave up. I never liked job control; it seemed like the wrong answer to the problem of managing multiple processes. When I first saw windows, even though the system they were on didn't have processes, a light bulb went off in my head: *that* is the right answer. And it was. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 17:18:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 17:18:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28299 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 17:18:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28295 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 17:18:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 17:18:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC46A19AE6; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3DB9D19A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:17:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8cde00c19f5546701e2f71796c5ecf8e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:40:42 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I dispatch 'cpu' command, it takes about a minute to authenticate. I must be doing something bad, but how am I? Authentication itself is done correctly... Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Tue Jul 16 11:59:15 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA28992 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:46:38 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id LAA19049 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:59:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9151219A7F; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 934AE199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:58:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <73f5d3410cc615100e7aba9a31218420@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] time to accept swap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 02:56:05 +0900 I noticed that neccessary time to authentication is somewhat long, several seconds in our case, when attach the swap area from other file system on the file server. Is this a normal behaviour? Our network: Auth/CPU server: 1.6 GHz Pen 4, RTL8100BL nic chip File server: 200MHz AMD K6, Intel i82557 nic chip Terminals: many, most with nvidia graphic cards, and i82557 + 2114x nic chip Thanks Mirtchovski updating nvidia driver. I cannot live without those two files over 1024x768x8 resolutions, even MX 200 etc. Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 17:54:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 17:54:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29198 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 17:54:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29194 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 17:54:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 17:54:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9CAE19B42; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:54:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail.swlocal (mail.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 28A2319B15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:53:32 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Received: from ccMail by snellwilcox.com (ccMail Link to SMTP R8.52.01.1) id 3158981379; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:53:25 +0100 Importance: normal Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] Pico (again) Message-Id: <3158981379@snellwilcox.com> X-MIME-Engine: v0.90 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Id: <3158981379-1@snellwilcox.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: steve.simon@snellwilcox.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:53:13 +0100 Hi, Pico was a JIT compiler for expressions mapping one image onto another. The compiler was written only for the VAX. There are several versions available in c.s.u starting with a cut down, interpreted version called popi released by Gerard Holzman later versions had JIT compilers added by Byron Rakitzis of Unix RC fame. Some time ago I had grand ideas of producing something similar for processing data streams of video but I'm afraid it fell at the hurdle of my lack of understanding of process networks generation. The original interpreted popi should run fine on Plan9 under pcc. Sorry if any of this is inaccurate, its from memory. -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 18:15:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 18:15:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29721 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 18:15:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29717 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 18:15:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 18:15:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12E8719B48; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:15:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9B92719A86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:14:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5533a2148d4e7850cee134ab8f32dc1e@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:12:56 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit is it possible it's attempting to connect to the wrong authentication server address? --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026980357:10:08733:20; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:19:17 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007539; 18 Jul 2002 8:18 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC46A19AE6; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3DB9D19A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:17:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8cde00c19f5546701e2f71796c5ecf8e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:40:42 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I dispatch 'cpu' command, it takes about a minute to authenticate. I must be doing something bad, but how am I? Authentication itself is done correctly... Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Tue Jul 16 11:59:15 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA28992 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:46:38 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id LAA19049 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:59:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9151219A7F; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 934AE199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:58:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <73f5d3410cc615100e7aba9a31218420@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] time to accept swap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 02:56:05 +0900 I noticed that neccessary time to authentication is somewhat long, several seconds in our case, when attach the swap area from other file system on the file server. Is this a normal behaviour? Our network: Auth/CPU server: 1.6 GHz Pen 4, RTL8100BL nic chip File server: 200MHz AMD K6, Intel i82557 nic chip Terminals: many, most with nvidia graphic cards, and i82557 + 2114x nic chip Thanks Mirtchovski updating nvidia driver. I cannot live without those two files over 1024x768x8 resolutions, even MX 200 etc. Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn-- --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 18:51:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 18:51:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30426 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 18:51:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30422 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 18:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 18:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 756B519B37; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:51:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E34CA19A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:50:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:14:13 +0900 >is it possible it's attempting to connect to the wrong authentication server address? When I put explicit name to cpu command, say term% cpu -h diabase I got the same result. /env/cpu says it's diabase, and it's correct. I suppose this may be connected to the slow authentication when mounting other filesystem. (?) Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:03:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:03:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30661 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:03:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30657 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:03:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:03:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA9F019B4A; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:03:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE99C19ABB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:02:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17V7wh-0006BK-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:51:39 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: William Josephson Message-ID: Organization: Harvard University, Cambridge, Massachusetts References: , <5.1.0.14.2.20020717172506.0502a630@mail.real.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:51:28 GMT In article, Fariborz Skip Tavakkolian wrote: > wait. I meant the other pico. I thought in this list at least the > other one would be more famous. > > http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/gerard/ I don't know if rsc did pico, but he did have a little graphics compiler for the x86 at one point. I doubt he handed it out to anyone. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:04:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:04:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30675 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:04:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30671 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:04:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:04:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B54D19B4D; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:04:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E23DA19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:03:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17V7wg-0006B3-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:51:38 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020715110522.555A319A0D@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:51:03 GMT miller@hamnavoe.demon.co.uk (Richard Miller) wrote in message news:<20020715110522.555A319A0D@mail.cse.psu.edu>... > > I have been looking for Mothra (which is the native Plan 9 web browser > > from 2nd Ed.) since I learned of it some time ago, and screaming for > > the Bell-labs guys to release it. > > They've released it: look in /contrib/mothra on sources.cs.bell-labs.com > > Be aware, though, that this is a very old and simple browser with no support > for many "features" like tables, frames, cookies, and client-side scripting. > I personally find this is often an advantage rather than a limitation, because > it eliminates much of the distracting "entertainment" and advertising clutter. > > -- Richard Is there any way to access sources.cs.bell-labs.com from the web or ftp? I know about the update account stuff, but still can't dial out from my Plan 9 box because of my stupid WinModem. So for now, I'm stuck using Windoze to access the net. Thanks for the pointer! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:12:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:12:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30814 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:12:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30810 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:12:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:12:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6184819B4C; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:12:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B370A19B4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:11:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17V7w9-00069U-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:51:05 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <07032038068eb2473dd63c7a4e51d270@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:50:52 GMT >i recently knocked up a little filesystem as in inferno as an >experiment (it was actually to test a new library interface), which >acts as a kind of auto mountpoint directory. > >in this directory, a walk to any name will succeed, and will walk to >an empty directory of that name. a read of the original will now show >the new name. > >thus, having done: > > autodir /n > >you can do, say: > > mount /srv/factotum /n/bletheridoo > >and it will work - the destination mount point is created on demand >(and deleted when there are no more references to it). > >i haven't used it in earnest, but it always seemed a bit unnatural >to have to pre-create mount points for all future services; >perhaps there's a place for something like this under plan 9? >(it's only a couple of hours work). > > cheers, > rog. > Care to share your code with us? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:15:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:15:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30840 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:15:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30836 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:15:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:15:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A182119B50; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:15:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84BCC19B50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:14:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17V7wg-0006B9-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:51:38 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D35FBEB.359CA14A@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <20020717222200.7C97C19ACF@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:51:14 GMT arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > By the way, GNU C compiler allows nested function definition. > To do that, some of machine codes are put into stack. > It may cause security problem to be executed machine codes > in statck. How is that a security problem? The stack is accessible only under program control, and a programmer can do whatever he wants anyway. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:15:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:15:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30853 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:15:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30849 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:15:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:15:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64D2E19B4F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:15:23 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 361D519B4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:14:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17V7xN-0006CP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:52:21 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Saroj Mahapatra Message-ID: <6d3220b4.0207171717.353fc14f@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] OREAD and other macros Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:51:39 GMT I notice that Plan 9 usually uses enums instead of macros (e.g. Beof). Why was that practice not followed for OREAD and other macros? Thank you, Saroj Mahapatra From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:20:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:20:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30942 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:20:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30938 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:20:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:20:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02E6519B5E; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:20:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97E9A19B59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:19:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IAJcmk015392 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:19:40 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IAJYph015391 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:19:34 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: , <20020717222200.7C97C19ACF@mail.cse.psu.edu> <3D35FBEB.359CA14A@null.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <3D35FBEB.359CA14A@null.net>; from Douglas A. Gwyn on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 09:51:14AM +0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:19:31 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 09:51:14AM +0000, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote: > > arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > > By the way, GNU C compiler allows nested function definition. > > To do that, some of machine codes are put into stack. > > It may cause security problem to be executed machine codes > > in statck. > > How is that a security problem? The stack is accessible only > under program control, and a programmer can do whatever he > wants anyway. The usual buffer overflow problem: override the stack limits, wreck the return address, execute the remainder (by returning to it). ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:30:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:30:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31097 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:30:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31093 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:30:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:30:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F33519B5F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:30:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C9EC19ACD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:29:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IAStmk015422 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:28:57 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IASpPe015421 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:28:51 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020718122844.M14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: , <20020717222200.7C97C19ACF@mail.cse.psu.edu> <3D35FBEB.359CA14A@null.net> <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za>; from Lucio De Re on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 12:19:31PM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:28:47 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 12:19:31PM +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > > > How is that a security problem? The stack is accessible only > > under program control, and a programmer can do whatever he > > wants anyway. > > The usual buffer overflow problem: override the stack limits, wreck > the return address, execute the remainder (by returning to it). > I neglected to mention that locking the stack against execution is a way of locking the barn door, programmers _ought_ to know better, but the tools to _do_ better haven't been available until recently. One wonders if one should be grateful for script kiddies :-) ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 19:44:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 19:44:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31320 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 19:44:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31316 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 19:44:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 19:44:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABB9319ACD; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:44:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8405B19B44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 06:43:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <45b944e74bb49cf9b670fbb127178e3f@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xlvfikqnmvtzgmjpqimonnehms" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:42:31 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xlvfikqnmvtzgmjpqimonnehms Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sorry, i meant attemting to connect to the wrong address to authenticate the connection, not connecting to the wrong server for the cpu. have you got auth and authdom settings in /lib/ndb/local? --upas-xlvfikqnmvtzgmjpqimonnehms Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@vitanuova.com id 1026985897:10:09080:55; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:51:37 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1009296; 18 Jul 2002 9:51 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C36119B0A; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:51:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E34CA19A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:50:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:14:13 +0900 >is it possible it's attempting to connect to the wrong authentication server address? When I put explicit name to cpu command, say term% cpu -h diabase I got the same result. /env/cpu says it's diabase, and it's correct. I suppose this may be connected to the slow authentication when mounting other filesystem. (?) Kenji --upas-xlvfikqnmvtzgmjpqimonnehms-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 20:14:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 20:14:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31742 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 20:14:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31738 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 20:14:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 20:14:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36E85199E3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:14:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6D9C4199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:13:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0f792b91b09d76e24a48e6763d389ed6@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jmwetthwxelpmvglmjhxuvqhiq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:19:48 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jmwetthwxelpmvglmjhxuvqhiq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >i recently knocked up a little filesystem as in inferno as an [...] > Care to share your code with us? sure. it won't do you much good though, as the support modules don't exist under the current version of inferno (and aren't compatible either). still, it might be of interest to some. attached. rog. --upas-jmwetthwxelpmvglmjhxuvqhiq Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=autodir.b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit implement Tst; include "sys.m"; sys: Sys; include "draw.m"; include "styx.m"; Rmsg: import Styx; include "styxservers.m"; styxservers: Styxservers; Ebadfid, Enotfound, Eexists, Eperm: import Styxservers; Styxserver, Filetree, readbytes: import styxservers; include "simplefs.m"; simplefs: SimpleFS; Fs: import simplefs; Tst: module { init: fn(nil: ref Draw->Context, argv: list of string); }; Qroot: con big 16rfffffff; badmodule(p: string) { sys->fprint(sys->fildes(2), "cannot load %s: %r\n", p); sys->raise("fail:bad module"); } DEBUG: con 0; refcounts := array[10] of int; init(nil: ref Draw->Context, nil: list of string) { sys = load Sys Sys->PATH; styxservers = load Styxservers Styxservers->PATH; if (styxservers == nil) badmodule(Styxservers->PATH); styxservers->init(); simplefs = load SimpleFS SimpleFS->PATH; if (simplefs == nil) badmodule(SimpleFS->PATH); simplefs->init(); (fs, fsop) := simplefs->start(); (tchan, srv) := Styxserver.new(sys->fildes(0), Filetree.new(fsop), Qroot); fs.create(Qroot, dir(".", Sys->DMDIR | 8r555, Qroot)); for (;;) { gm := <-tchan; if (gm == nil) { fs.quit(); exit; } e := handlemsg(gm, srv, fs); if (e != nil) srv.reply(ref Rmsg.Error(gm.tag, e)); } } handlemsg(gm: ref Styx->Tmsg, srv: ref Styxserver, fs: ref Fs): string { pick m := gm { Walk => # allow walk to any name from root, otherwise nothing. # if name did not already exist, we create it and refcount it. if (m.name == "..") { c := srv.getfid(m.fid); if (c != nil && c.qid != Qroot) decref(c.qid, fs); srv.walk(m); return nil; } c := srv.getfid(m.fid); if (c == nil) return Ebadfid; if (c.qid != Qroot) return Enotfound; (d, nil) := srv.t.walk(Qroot, m.name); if (d == nil) d = addentry(m.name, fs); else incref(c.qid); c.isdir = d.qid.qtype & Sys->QTDIR; c.qid = d.qid.path; srv.reply(ref Rmsg.Walk(m.tag, m.fid, d.qid)); Clone => c := srv.clone(m); if (c != nil && c.qid != Qroot) incref(c.qid); Clunk => c := srv.clunk(m); if (c != nil && c.qid != Qroot) decref(c.qid, fs); * => srv.default(gm); } return nil; } addentry(name: string, fs: ref Fs): ref Sys->Dir { for (i := 0; i < len refcounts; i++) if (refcounts[i] == 0) break; if (i == len refcounts) { refcounts = (array[len refcounts * 2] of int)[0:] = refcounts; for (j := i; j < len refcounts; j++) refcounts[j] = 0; } d := dir(name, Sys->DMDIR|8r555, big i); fs.create(Qroot, d); refcounts[i] = 1; return ref d; } incref(q: big) { id := int q; if (id >= 0 && id < len refcounts) refcounts[id]++; } decref(q: big, fs: ref Fs) { id := int q; if (id >= 0 && id < len refcounts) if (--refcounts[id] == 0) fs.remove(big id); } Blankdir: Sys->Dir; dir(name: string, perm: int, qid: big): Sys->Dir { d := Blankdir; d.name = name; d.uid = "me"; d.gid = "me"; d.qid.path = qid; if (perm & Sys->DMDIR) d.qid.qtype = Sys->QTDIR; else d.qid.qtype = Sys->QTFILE; d.mode = perm; return d; } --upas-jmwetthwxelpmvglmjhxuvqhiq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 21:50:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 21:50:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 809 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 21:50:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 805 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 21:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 21:50:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C42E199BF; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta04bw.bigpond.com (mta04bw.bigpond.com [139.134.6.87]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05466199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:49:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.0.3] ([144.135.24.75]) by mta04bw.bigpond.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 mta04bw May 23 2002 23:53:28) with SMTP id GZG3LL00.9ZO for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:48:57 +1000 Received: from CPE-203-51-5-137.nsw.bigpond.net.au ([203.51.5.137]) by bwmam03.mailsvc.email.bigpond.com(MailRouter V3.0n 20/12141439); 18 Jul 2002 22:48:57 From: Nicholas Waples X-X-Sender: nickw@debian To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] nvidia driver fix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:48:57 +1000 Just updated my system from the net and my Geforce 2 MX no longer worked. The following changes fixed it. % diff nvidia.c nvidia.c.orig 41c41 < 0x19, 0x1A, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, -1 --- > 0x19, 0x1A, 0x21, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, 0x53, 0x54, -1 255a256,258 > vga->crt[0x21] = 0xFA; > vga->crt[0x53] = 0; > vga->crt[0x54] = 0; 499,501d501 < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x21, 0xFA); < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x53, 0); < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x54, 0); From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 21:56:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 21:56:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 913 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 21:56:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 909 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 21:56:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 21:56:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1223A199ED; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:56:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D68F5199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:55:15 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020718125515.D68F5199E3@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:54:56 0100 > for(what i want){ > do(what is right); > }until(all is done); > > Then > goto start; > and begin again. > > Now *that's* a good language. > > -rob Once again Rob's satire underestimates the horror of the real world. See, for example, the COBOL "PERFORM" statement: http://www.helsinki.fi/atk/unix/dec_manuals/cobv27ua/6296-88.gif -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 21:58:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 21:58:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 940 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 21:58:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 936 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 21:58:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 21:58:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D96C19A28; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:58:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from hamnavoe (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3B29D1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:57:35 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra From: Richard Miller MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020718125735.3B29D1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:57:16 0100 Sorry, I think it's been deliberately set up as an importable file system to be a showcase of the 4th edition Plan 9 security mechanisms. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 22:22:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 22:22:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1279 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 22:22:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1275 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 22:22:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 22:22:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2267419A0B; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:22:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1D0BA19A2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:21:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hrokrqpdfeymuonvktmzyufeyl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:22:00 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hrokrqpdfeymuonvktmzyufeyl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Do the following: % ndb/csquery > net!$auth!ticket See what the result is. Then try conning to each one in turn and see if that's what's slow. The typical problem is to try a protocol first that the other side isn't listening on. --upas-hrokrqpdfeymuonvktmzyufeyl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Jul 18 05:15:38 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Jul 18 05:15:36 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C964719B44; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:15:10 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9B92719A86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 05:14:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5533a2148d4e7850cee134ab8f32dc1e@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:12:56 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit is it possible it's attempting to connect to the wrong authentication server address? --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1026980357:10:08733:20; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:19:17 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1007539; 18 Jul 2002 8:18 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC46A19AE6; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:18:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3DB9D19A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 04:17:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8cde00c19f5546701e2f71796c5ecf8e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:40:42 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I dispatch 'cpu' command, it takes about a minute to authenticate. I must be doing something bad, but how am I? Authentication itself is done correctly... Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Tue Jul 16 11:59:15 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id LAA28992 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:46:38 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id LAA19049 for ; Tue, 16 Jul 2002 11:59:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9151219A7F; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 934AE199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Jul 2002 22:58:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <73f5d3410cc615100e7aba9a31218420@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] time to accept swap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 02:56:05 +0900 I noticed that neccessary time to authentication is somewhat long, several seconds in our case, when attach the swap area from other file system on the file server. Is this a normal behaviour? Our network: Auth/CPU server: 1.6 GHz Pen 4, RTL8100BL nic chip File server: 200MHz AMD K6, Intel i82557 nic chip Terminals: many, most with nvidia graphic cards, and i82557 + 2114x nic chip Thanks Mirtchovski updating nvidia driver. I cannot live without those two files over 1024x768x8 resolutions, even MX 200 etc. Kenji --upas-occrcilomtvfdhnstgdvzyekrn-- --upas-xoympwnnfslxgcjyhnylkgtdcm-- --upas-hrokrqpdfeymuonvktmzyufeyl-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:02:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:02:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1770 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:02:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1766 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:02:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:02:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3004719A2F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:02:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F311119A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:01:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <7b6581cee06f494aed62b27ee084ae3f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] nvidia driver fix MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:01:47 -0400 i'm not disputing there is a problem with the addition of the lcd code, but your fix is confusing. unless you are using a flat panel, the path through the orig code and your fixed code should be the same, with the exception that the orig code reads crt registers 0x21, 0x53 and 0x54. there's only the xfree86 code to go on here, and that doesn't read those registers and only sets them if it's a flat panel; that might be the right answer. in what way didn't it work? On Thu Jul 18 08:50:48 EDT 2002, nickw@pobox.com wrote: > > Just updated my system from the net and my Geforce 2 MX no longer worked. > The following changes fixed it. > > > % diff nvidia.c nvidia.c.orig > 41c41 > < 0x19, 0x1A, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, -1 > --- > > 0x19, 0x1A, 0x21, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, 0x53, 0x54, -1 > 255a256,258 > > vga->crt[0x21] = 0xFA; > > vga->crt[0x53] = 0; > > vga->crt[0x54] = 0; > 499,501d501 > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x21, 0xFA); > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x53, 0); > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x54, 0); > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:15:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:15:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 1916 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:15:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1912 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:15:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:15:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02DE619A3E; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:15:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3434B19A3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:14:36 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020718141436.3434B19A3E@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:14:21 -0400 just out of curiosity, i grabbed the popi stuff from holzmann's page and gave it a shot. popi, the portable pico, popi, compiles fine out of the box, although it runs into the buffered IO issue common to most unix command line programs on Plan 9. i've not checked to see that it does sensable things with images, though, mainly because i don't know what to do with popi's output. the compiled version of pico available from holzmann's page doesn't compile. i put no effort into figuring out why. the notes on holzmann's page are not encouraging in this regard. i was not able to pull the version of pico described in Rakitzis' message, so it's untested. anyone got anything to deal with pico (v10 picfile(5)) images? ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:31:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:31:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2138 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:31:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2134 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:31:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:31:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31EC219A57; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:31:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mandic.com.br (unknown [200.181.49.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 49DC619A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:30:19 -0400 (EDT) From: "".USA " Domain Names Now Available" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020718143019.49DC619A2F@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] ".USA" Domain Names Now Available Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "".USA " Domain Names Now Available" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Jul 2002 11:37:53 -0300 NEW DOMAIN NAMES: ".USA " and ".US States" now available YOU CAN HAVE A DOMAIN NAME LIKE: "www . yourname . USA " or "www . yourname . NY" or "www . yourname . TEXAS" (or any US state) SEARCH FOR THESE NEW DOMAIN NAMES AT: http://www.dotworlds.net If you wish to unsubscribe from this list please send a blank e-mail to: unsubscribe@dotworlds.net From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:33:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:33:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2161 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:33:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2157 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:33:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:33:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0616119A59; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:33:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CA35199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:32:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17VCAb-0006qy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:22:17 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D36CA0C.E29E8FBE@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:21:17 GMT "rob pike, esq." wrote: > I never liked job control; it seemed like the wrong answer to the > problem of managing multiple processes. "Job control" a la csh is certainly messy; we added job control to the BRL Bourne shell and while I leave it enabled, I almost never use it, while I do use multiple windows.. However, they're not really the same thing. Suppose you start some long-running task but soon realize that it's going to run out of disk space. It is very useful to be able to temporarily stop the task, rearrange files on the disks to make room, then resume the task. Some form of control over an executing process is required for such things. Systems like TOPS-10 had a nifty feature whereby one could start a job on one terminal, detach the terminal, and log in elsewhere and reconnect to the detached job. Not "job control", but in the same vein. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:33:56 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:33:56 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2212 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:33:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2208 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:33:55 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:33:55 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5086D19A7F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:33:24 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4346199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:32:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17VC9c-0006nx-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:21:16 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D36CB17.D4FEC4C0@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:21:07 GMT Lucio De Re wrote: > The usual buffer overflow problem: override the stack limits, wreck > the return address, execute the remainder (by returning to it). But that is independent of whether the original program generated code on the stack. It's merely a matter of whether the stack lies in an address space compatible with instruction space. On a split I/D-space system, or one where pages do support X bits, code cannot run on the stack. Anyway, buffer overruns would be a security problem anyway, even if one could not add code, because state variables can be changed in unplanned ways. One of the early such exploits merely set the "password was valid" flag. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:51:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:51:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2482 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:51:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2478 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7DDB19A58; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:51:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ducky.net (ducky.net [199.26.172.91]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BC52199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:50:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ducky.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IEoS1s023182 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:50:28 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@ducky.net) Received: (from mike@localhost) by ducky.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IEoSsJ023181 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:50:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Haertel Message-Id: <200207181450.g6IEoSsJ023181@ducky.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <20020718122844.M14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 07:50:28 -0700 (PDT) >I neglected to mention that locking the stack against execution is a >way of locking the barn door, programmers _ought_ to know better, but >the tools to _do_ better haven't been available until recently. Nope. All you have to do is overwrite return addresses and data in the stack. Many programs have code that can be twisted to your own ends if you just call it with the right parameters. Admittedly this requires doing a little more homework than just putting executable code in the stack. But making the stack non-executable is not a way of "locking the barn door" by any means. It's more like just closing the barn door and hoping nobody will notice the padlock is missing. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:55:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:55:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2516 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:55:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2512 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 455EB19A70; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:55:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A52C719A70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:54:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:53:34 +0100 >>Systems like TOPS-10 had a nifty feature whereby one could start >>a job on one terminal, detach the terminal, and log in elsewhere >>and reconnect to the detached job. Not "job control", but in the >>same vein. it was a long time ago, but i vaguely recall that particular feature was precisely the one that was adapted to form `job control' on `unix', which also explains why `job control' was the term used in a system that had no `jobs'. it was probably designated by Mrs Malaprop. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:56:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:56:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2547 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:56:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2543 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:56:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:56:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 836B619A72; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:56:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 328D119A79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:55:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IEtRmk015754 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:55:27 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IEtRBu015753 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:55:27 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020718165525.R14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: , <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <3D36CB17.D4FEC4C0@null.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <3D36CB17.D4FEC4C0@null.net>; from Douglas A. Gwyn on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 02:21:07PM +0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:55:26 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 02:21:07PM +0000, Douglas A. Gwyn wrote: > > Anyway, buffer overruns would be a security problem anyway, even > if one could not add code, because state variables can be changed > in unplanned ways. One of the early such exploits merely set the > "password was valid" flag. A valid point (it's sendmail you seem to be referring to). I've often given only superficial attention to these issues and I'm pleased to pick up a little more understanding about them (and, yes, I do label myself a "security consultant" :-) ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:57:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:57:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2559 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:57:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2554 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:57:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:57:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B8F619A79; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:57:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0F34F19A79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:56:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2bcd7eda708abfabe83b034959559f58@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:02:45 +0100 > Suppose you start some long-running task but soon realize that it's > going to run out of disk space. It is very useful to be able to > temporarily stop the task, rearrange files on the disks to make room, > then resume the task. Some form of control over an executing process > is required for such things. is there any reason one couldn't send a "stop" message to a rio window just as an "interrupt" message is sent currently? > Systems like TOPS-10 had a nifty feature whereby one could start > a job on one terminal, detach the terminal, and log in elsewhere > and reconnect to the detached job. Not "job control", but in the > same vein. there's no essential reason why you couldn't do that under plan 9, i think. just put a level of indirection above the draw device. i used to like that feature of "screen" - i could keep several programs going in one session and remain logged in for days despite logging in from several different terminal rooms. acme dump is ok, but has certain lacks. i think rob's got some ideas on this... rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 18 23:58:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 18 23:58:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2569 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Jul 2002 23:58:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2565 invoked from network); 18 Jul 2002 23:58:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Jul 2002 23:58:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA92A19A9F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:58:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA5A419A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:57:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IEutmk015775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:56:55 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IEutN4015774 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:56:55 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020718165654.S14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20020718122844.M14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <200207181450.g6IEoSsJ023181@ducky.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <200207181450.g6IEoSsJ023181@ducky.net>; from Mike Haertel on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 07:50:28AM -0700 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:56:54 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 07:50:28AM -0700, Mike Haertel wrote: > > Nope. All you have to do is overwrite return addresses and > data in the stack. Many programs have code that can be twisted > to your own ends if you just call it with the right parameters. > Admittedly this requires doing a little more homework than > just putting executable code in the stack. But making the > stack non-executable is not a way of "locking the barn door" > by any means. It's more like just closing the barn door and > hoping nobody will notice the padlock is missing. That's where Microsoft's "security by obscurity" argument would acquire validity, isn't it? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 00:04:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 00:04:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2645 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 00:04:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2641 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 00:04:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 00:04:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77A6919A9B; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:04:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 85AC519A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:03:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <952dbd2b992f9f807f09fb725e0fadd7@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rtbtqyexyvkfadcsizalwwroof" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:02:25 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rtbtqyexyvkfadcsizalwwroof Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit actually, the thing i don't understand is why nested procedures required putting code on the stack. i've implemented them a few times, even with closures, and i didn't need to do that. where did i do wrong? perhaps it was just a display of technical prowess, or does gcc also not do that, really. --upas-rtbtqyexyvkfadcsizalwwroof Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-2.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@vitanuova.com id 1027002823:20:13866:54; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:33:43 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-2.mail.demon.net id aa2120795; 18 Jul 2002 14:33 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4476A19A7D; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:33:23 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4346199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:32:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17VC9c-0006nx-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:21:16 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D36CB17.D4FEC4C0@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <20020718121930.K14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:21:07 GMT Lucio De Re wrote: > The usual buffer overflow problem: override the stack limits, wreck > the return address, execute the remainder (by returning to it). But that is independent of whether the original program generated code on the stack. It's merely a matter of whether the stack lies in an address space compatible with instruction space. On a split I/D-space system, or one where pages do support X bits, code cannot run on the stack. Anyway, buffer overruns would be a security problem anyway, even if one could not add code, because state variables can be changed in unplanned ways. One of the early such exploits merely set the "password was valid" flag. --upas-rtbtqyexyvkfadcsizalwwroof-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 00:11:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 00:11:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2722 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 00:11:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2718 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 00:11:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 00:11:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBA2B19AA9; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:11:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A11919A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:10:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6IEDf218678 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:13:42 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! In-Reply-To: <2bcd7eda708abfabe83b034959559f58@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:13:41 -0400 (EDT) > > Suppose you start some long-running task but soon realize that it's > > going to run out of disk space. It is very useful to be able to > > temporarily stop the task, rearrange files on the disks to make room, > > then resume the task. Some form of control over an executing process > > is required for such things. > It sure would be nice to have this control built into one of the mouse button menus similar to how the backdrop shows hidden windows. I can't imagine it being very clean without mouse submenus, though. Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 00:42:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 00:42:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 2999 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 00:42:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2995 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 00:42:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 00:42:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65F4D19A62; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:42:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9D8419A62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:41:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZG003TKBKGTB@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:41:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6IFh1F21297 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:43:01 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] ".USA" Domain Names Now Available In-reply-to: <20020718143019.49DC619A2F@mail.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207181543.g6IFh1F21297@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:43:00 -0400 (EDT) Gotta love SPAM to mailing lists. . . - Dave "\"\".USA \" Domain Names Now Available\"" wrote: > > NEW DOMAIN NAMES: ".USA " and ".US States" now available > > YOU CAN HAVE A DOMAIN NAME LIKE: > > "www . yourname . USA " > or > "www . yourname . NY" > or > "www . yourname . TEXAS" (or any US state) > > > > SEARCH FOR THESE NEW DOMAIN NAMES AT: http://www.dotworlds.net > > > > > > > > If you wish to unsubscribe from this list please send > a blank e-mail to: unsubscribe@dotworlds.net > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 01:07:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 01:07:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3196 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 01:07:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3192 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 01:07:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 01:07:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C36C819AA9; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:07:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64D7919A3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:06:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A4E55C8F00F4; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 08:55:17 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Thu Jul 18 08:55:17 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D36E77C.9070102@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point References: <07032038068eb2473dd63c7a4e51d270@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 09:06:20 -0700 >>thus, having done: >> >> autodir /n >> >>you can do, say: >> >> mount /srv/factotum /n/bletheridoo I was thinking about this last night on the drive home. Though I realize things will probably change with the new fileserver, I was thinking about how to get dump functionality from venti as-is. It occurred to me that one should be able to do something like: vac -svf $home/vac/`{date -n} -h ventiserver /n/hullabaloo run via cron, then have a variation on autodirfs that rebuilds the directory trees dump-style (or some custom style: 2002/Feb/20) based on the contents of $home/vac, and calls vacfs when traversing to the appropriate date. (tangent ahead -- leave while you can) My mind then started wandering to a coat-check style Web service where you'd post a file or set of files and vac would return a "ticket" so you could retrieve it later. Maybe your resume that you only use once a decade, or some file you'd like to share with friends that lies somewhere in between needing security and being public information. It also reminded me of the work done at PARC with small handheld devices called PARCTABs that have minimal storage, running much like a Plan 9 terminal. One thing I remember reading about them is that they were designed so people could treat them as if they had storage, so you could drag documents to the Tab, walk down the hall and copy them to another workstation, workboard, etc. In reality, the data never moved, but the representation of the data behaved as if it did, just like icons for files on a local hard drive. The part that makes me smile the most in Sean's paper is where he says, "For a user, it appears that vac compresses any amount of data down to 45 bytes." I think my wristwatch will hold 45 bytes. I can only imagine how many vac fingerprints a cell phone could hold. Where vac fingerprints are more powerful than PARCTABs, in my opinion, is that they're not tied to the network, per se. Fingerprints can be stored on flash media and popped in a pocket, written on a 3x5 index card and dropped in the mail, kept on a USB keychain, sent via pager, etc. With a vacfs port to Inferno and the Inferno IE plug-in (or vacfs support like WebDAV), you might be able to utilize vac URLs like vac://hullabaloo/64daefaecc4df4b5cb48a368b361ef56012a4f46. I think it would/will be fun to experiment with vac fingerprints as tickets for data using extremely small, cheap devices or Web interfaces or combinations of the two, along the same lines as Sean's idea of implementing SFSRO on top of venti. All of this, of course, for read-only data. I also wonder if there might be a convenient way to do chaffing and winnowing using a venti archive, given the amalgam of blocks. Sorry for the blather. I'm prone to it. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 01:20:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 01:20:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3316 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 01:20:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3311 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 01:20:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 01:20:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D057019AA8; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:20:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (mta07-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FF2E19A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:19:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020718161905.YOFZ19225.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:19:05 +0100 Message-ID: <00cd01c22e76$da078620$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <2bcd7eda708abfabe83b034959559f58@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:19:09 +0100 > there's no essential reason why you couldn't do that under plan 9, > i think. just put a level of indirection above the draw device. I have been mulling something over and this seems the appropriate time to mention it. I notice that plan9 now has the vncserver: vncs One useful attribute of vnc on unix is that it can act as a XFree display. You don't need a VGA card configured to run X at all. You run vncserver and connect with a vncviewer and a new XFree session is waiting, log off and it's still running. log back in later and it's how you left it. I was thinking that this would make a very useful addition to plan9. By opting for vnc-vga one can avoid vga hell to get an auth/cpu server up and running. One of the set-up problems is that you might need two computers so that you can edit plan9.ini or edit/compile the $vga_driver.c I was thinking that a pseudo VGA driver would pretend that there was VGA hardware running and running vncs would expose it. Downside is the lack of authentication possible if one continued to use the system in such a state but at least you would / could be using it. M From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 01:35:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 01:35:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3442 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3438 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBE5819AAD; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:35:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FB2119A62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 12:34:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6IGYNmk015904 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:34:23 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IGYMoR015903 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:34:22 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! Message-ID: <20020718183421.T14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <2bcd7eda708abfabe83b034959559f58@vitanuova.com> <00cd01c22e76$da078620$6501a8c0@KIKE> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <00cd01c22e76$da078620$6501a8c0@KIKE>; from matt on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 05:19:09PM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:34:22 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 05:19:09PM +0100, matt wrote: > > I was thinking that this would make a very useful addition to plan9. By > opting for vnc-vga one can avoid vga hell to get an auth/cpu server up and > running. One of the set-up problems is that you might need two computers so > that you can edit plan9.ini or edit/compile the $vga_driver.c > Yes, that's certainly an interesting and intriguing option. I haven't really looked at vncs yet, but the possibility ought to exist... > I was thinking that a pseudo VGA driver would pretend that there was VGA > hardware running and running vncs would expose it. > A VMware-like VGA device, hiding behind the framebuffer, hiding behind the VNC protocol. Where do we sneak in the fileserver? > Downside is the lack of authentication possible if one continued to use the > system in such a state but at least you would / could be using it. > Authentication can be promoted to factotum, I'm sure; if memory serves, the VNC protocol is extensible. It would be nice to be able to pick your session by user id, if the system is willing to collaborate. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 02:35:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 02:35:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3846 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 02:35:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3842 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 02:35:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 02:35:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 986A119AAC; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:35:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47F9119AAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:34:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17VEud-00058m-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:17:59 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Victor_LeNettoyeur_=99?= Message-ID: Organization: mail2news@dizum.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:17:45 GMT I'm a hobbyist who has a spare computer. This particular machine looks ideal to install the latest distribution of Plan9 on. Is Plan9 worthwhile as a workstation? I'm specifically interested in whether there is binary compatibility with UNIX. For example: will I be able to install my Applixware (for FreeBSD) atop it? Thanks in advance for tolerating such newbie questions. Any pointers to FAQ's or web pages which might be helpful are greatly appreciated. [Moderator's note: the plan9 FAQ at: http://www.fywss.com/plan9/plan9faq.html may be a useful starting point.] -- Victor LeNettoyeur "The notion that a radical is one who hates his country is naive and usually idiotic. He is, more likely, one who likes his country more than the rest of us, and is thus more disturbed than the rest of us when he sees it debauched. He is not a bad citizen turning to crime; he is a good citizen driven to despair." - Henry Louis Mencken From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 02:45:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 02:45:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3922 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 02:45:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3918 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 02:45:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 02:45:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13F6319A33; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:45:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A750C19AAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:44:42 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Question From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:43:22 +0100 >>Is Plan9 worthwhile as a workstation? I'm specifically interested in whether there is >>binary compatibility with UNIX. For example: will I be able to install my Applixware >>(for FreeBSD) atop it? with Unix on what? don't worry, it doesn't matter. there isn't any binary compatibility with any version of Unix on anything. >>Is Plan9 worthwhile as a workstation? I'm specifically interested in whether there is there isn't really an objective answer to that. best is to take the time to try it and see. it's best if you enjoy programming (because you'll probably need to). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 02:51:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 02:51:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3983 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 02:51:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3979 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 02:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 02:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9524E19AB9; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:51:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4204E19AB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:50:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6IHnqqk001815 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:49:52 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com ([172.21.104.107]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6IHnqMB015049; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 10:49:53 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020718105900.0367a648@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) In-Reply-To: <20020718141436.3434B19A3E@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=====================_6443545==_" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 11:07:01 -0700 --=====================_6443545==_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I've attached my cheesy C version of display.bas that is in the package. You can use it view the faces. It uses libXg that came with 9libs-1.0, so the graphics model is understandable by a human being. I've got popi running on Plan9 also. I guess I should have ask the more direct question: Why isn't a tool like pico available now? not chic anymore? At 10:14 AM 7/18/2002 -0400, anothy@cosym.net wrote: >just out of curiosity, i grabbed the popi stuff from holzmann's >page and gave it a shot. popi, the portable pico, popi, compiles >fine out of the box, although it runs into the buffered IO issue >common to most unix command line programs on Plan 9. i've not >checked to see that it does sensable things with images, though, >mainly because i don't know what to do with popi's output.=20 > >the compiled version of pico available from holzmann's page >doesn't compile. i put no effort into figuring out why. the notes >on holzmann's page are not encouraging in this regard. > >i was not able to pull the version of pico described in Rakitzis' >message, so it's untested. > >anyone got anything to deal with pico (v10 picfile(5)) images? >=E3=82=A2 --=====================_6443545==_ Content-Type: text/plain; name="disp.c"; x-mac-type="42494E41"; x-mac-creator="74747874" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="disp.c" I2luY2x1ZGUJPHUuaD4KI2luY2x1ZGUJPGxpYmMuaD4KI2luY2x1ZGUJPGxpYmcuaD4KCiNkZWZp bmUgcmVzIDgKCmludCB0aHJlc2hvbGRbcmVzXVtyZXNdID0gewoJeyAwLDEyOCwzMiwxNjAsOCwx MzYsNDAsMTY4fSwgCgl7IDE5Miw2NCwyMjQsOTYsMjAwLDcyLDIzMiwxMDQgfSwKCXsgNDgsMTc2 LDE2LDE0NCw1NiwxODQsMjQsMTUyIH0sCgl7IDI0MCwxMTIsMjA4LDgwLDI0OCwxMjAsMjE2LDg4 IH0sCgl7IDEyLDE0MCw0NCwxNzIsNCwxMzIsMzYsMTY0IH0sCgl7IDIwNCw3NiwyMzYsMTA4LDE5 Niw2OCwyMjgsMTAwIH0sCgl7IDYwLDE4OCwyOCwxNTYsNTIsMTgwLDIwLDE0OCB9LAoJeyAyNTIs MTI0LDIyMCw5MiwyNDQsMTE2LDIxMiw4NCB9Cn07CgptYWluKGludCBhYywgY2hhciAqKmF2KQp7 CglGSUxFICppbmZpbGU7CglQb2ludCBwOwoJRXZlbnQgZXY7CglyZWdpc3RlciBpbnQgeCwgeTsK CglpZiAoYWMgPCAyKSB7CgkJZnByaW50ZihzdGRlcnIsICJ1c2FnZTogJXMgZmlsZW5hbWVcbiIs ICphdik7CgkJZXhpdCgxKTsKCX0KCWlmICghIChpbmZpbGUgPSBmb3BlbigqKGF2KzEpLCAiciIp KSkgewoJCWZwcmludGYoc3RkZXJyLCAiY2FuJ3Qgb3BlbiAlc1xuIiwgKihhdisxKSk7CgkJZXhp dCgxKTsKCX0KCWFjLS07CglhdisrOwoKCXh0YmluaXQoMCwwLCAmYWMsIGF2LCAwKTsKCWVpbml0 KEVrZXlib2FyZHxFbW91c2UpOwoKCWZvciAoeCA9IDA7IHggPCAyNDg7IHgrKykKCQlmb3IgKHkg PSAwOyB5IDwgMjQ4OyB5KyspIHsKCQkJaW50IGM7CgkJCXAgPSBhZGQoc2NyZWVuLnIubWluLCBQ dCh5LHgpKTsKCQkJaWYgKChjID0gZ2V0YyhpbmZpbGUpKSA9PSBFT0YpCgkJCQlicmVhazsKCQkJ aWYgKGMgPD0gdGhyZXNob2xkW3glcmVzXVt5JXJlc10pCgkJCQlwb2ludCgmc2NyZWVuLCBwLCB+ MCwgUyk7CgkJfQoKCXdoaWxlKGV2ZW50KCZldikgIT0gRWtleWJvYXJkKQoJCWNvbnRpbnVlOwoK CWV4aXQoMCk7Cn0KCnZvaWQKZXJlc2hhcGVkKFJlY3RhbmdsZSByKQp7Cn0K --=====================_6443545==_-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 03:31:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 03:31:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4245 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 03:31:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4241 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 03:31:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 03:31:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C4AE19AB3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:31:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nike.ins.cwru.edu (nike.INS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.8.219]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A09D19A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:30:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nike.ins.cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by nike.ins.cwru.edu with ESMTP (8.12.3/CWRU-2.9-fbsd) id g6IIUvZV060626; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:30:57 -0400 (EDT) (from chet@nike.ins.cwru.edu for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>) Received: (from chet@localhost) by nike.ins.cwru.edu (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6IIUmMd060625; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:30:48 -0400 (EDT) From: Chet Ramey Message-Id: <200207181830.g6IIUmMd060625@nike.ins.cwru.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! Newsgroups: comp.os.plan9 In-Reply-To: <723315de1376d3aa7b828f93a205fe5b@collyer.net> Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, Ohio, USA Cc: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:30:48 -0400 (EDT) In article <723315de1376d3aa7b828f93a205fe5b@collyer.net> you write: >I'd like to thank all the Plan 9 developers for keeping job control >out of Plan 9. I've just had a close encounter with job control after >many years away from Unix (hey, somebody has to clean the sewers), and >the complexity and botched implementation(s) of that bad idea are >mind-boggling. I finally gave up. What were you looking at? Chet -- ``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer ( ``Discere est Dolere'' -- chet ) Chet Ramey, CWRU chet@po.CWRU.Edu http://cnswww.cns.cwru.edu/~chet/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 03:57:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 03:57:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4407 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 03:57:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4403 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 03:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 03:57:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10DAD19AC0; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:57:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2C6519AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 14:56:00 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6IHxG219115 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:59:21 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] quirk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 13:59:16 -0400 (EDT) 4e question. What would cause /dev/draw/... to not appear on boot? I ask, because I decided to try a trackball serial mouse with my TP 600E 9top; I changed mouseport=serial in the .ini, rebooted, and it's not there. Thusly, no frame buffer. I went back and forth one more time to make certain I wasn't seeing things. It works using the keypad ps2; set it to serial: no frame buffer. Thoughts? Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 04:25:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 04:25:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4635 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 04:25:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4631 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 04:25:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 04:25:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AED1619AA8; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:25:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B3E3E19A25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:24:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 15:24:33 -0400 > That's where Microsoft's "security by obscurity" argument would > acquire validity, isn't it? I think they're banking on evolutionary pressure against smart people eventually wiping out all of the potential hackers. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 05:05:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 05:05:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4910 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 05:05:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4906 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 05:05:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 05:05:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF2FB19AC2; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:05:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A614019AA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:04:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <95414a5f3f924034494ca5f157b1f411@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: Dennis Ritchie To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:04:35 -0400 I retrieved some of the pico-processed images that were in the 10th edition manual: http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/10thEdMan/v2pix.html Dennis From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 06:39:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 06:39:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5556 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 06:39:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5552 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 06:39:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 06:39:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FBB519AC9; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta04ps.bigpond.com (mta04ps.bigpond.com [144.135.25.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E5B019AC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:38:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [192.168.0.3] ([144.135.25.78]) by mta04ps.bigpond.com (Netscape Messaging Server 4.15 mta04ps May 23 2002 23:53:28) with SMTP id GZGS4A00.1SE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 07:38:34 +1000 Received: from CPE-144-137-124-227.nsw.bigpond.net.au ([144.137.124.227]) by PSMAM04.mailsvc.email.bigpond.com(MailRouter V3.0n 92/9293309); 19 Jul 2002 07:38:34 From: Nicholas Waples X-X-Sender: nickw@debian To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] nvidia driver fix In-Reply-To: <7b6581cee06f494aed62b27ee084ae3f@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 07:38:33 +1000 On Thu, 18 Jul 2002 jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > i'm not disputing there is a problem with the addition of the lcd > code, but your fix is confusing. unless you are using a flat panel, > the path through the orig code and your fixed code should be the same, > with the exception that the orig code reads crt registers 0x21, 0x53 > and 0x54. there's only the xfree86 code to go on here, and that doesn't > read those registers and only sets them if it's a flat panel; that > might be the right answer. Thats confusing because thats what I thought I did (set the registers only if its a lcd). Unless Im working off a different version of the source file. > in what way didn't it work? It didnt like those registers being set. > On Thu Jul 18 08:50:48 EDT 2002, nickw@pobox.com wrote: > > > > Just updated my system from the net and my Geforce 2 MX no longer worked. > > The following changes fixed it. > > > > > > % diff nvidia.c nvidia.c.orig > > 41c41 > > < 0x19, 0x1A, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, -1 > > --- > > > 0x19, 0x1A, 0x21, 0x25, 0x28, 0x2D, 0x30, 0x31, 0x53, 0x54, -1 > > 255a256,258 > > > vga->crt[0x21] = 0xFA; > > > vga->crt[0x53] = 0; > > > vga->crt[0x54] = 0; > > 499,501d501 > > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x21, 0xFA); > > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x53, 0); > > < vgaxo(Crtx, 0x54, 0); > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 06:41:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 06:41:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5586 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 06:41:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5582 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 06:41:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 06:41:16 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3521A19AC4; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:41:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from anchor-post-35.mail.demon.net (anchor-post-35.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.85]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5882C19AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 17:40:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cjl1.demon.co.uk ([194.222.72.34] helo=falken) by anchor-post-35.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 17VJ0E-0000pz-0U for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:40:02 +0100 Message-ID: <003801c22ea3$71bdb440$2248dec2@falken> From: "Chris Hollis-Locke" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <2bcd7eda708abfabe83b034959559f58@vitanuova.com> <00cd01c22e76$da078620$6501a8c0@KIKE> <20020718183421.T14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:37:54 +0100 I have an Inferno app that monitors /dev/draw and remembers enough state to reproduce the display (actively) on the /dev/draw of any client that connects to it on a network port. The clients can connect at any time. It does need a real local /dev/draw to do the grunge and maintain the images. Having a draw device with a plain memory (as opposed to video adapter) based frame buffer, you could have a real thin-client / perpetual desktop server. Also many clients can attach to the server at the same time - quite useful for collaboration. Interposing at the /dev/draw level tends to result in less bandwidth than shipping frame buffer updates around, which is what would be required if you interposed at the VGA adapter level. There is an initial cost at connection, certain images have to be shipped across to the client, using standard /dev/draw operators. After that the server just has to re-write image ids in the draw messages. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 07:21:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 07:21:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5928 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 07:21:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5924 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 07:21:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 07:21:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A766319ACD; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:21:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from garlic.apnic.net (ietf-wireless-dhcp-79-239.dyn.ietf54.wide.ad.jp [133.93.79.239]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBD6919AB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 18:20:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from garlic.apnic.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by garlic.apnic.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6J8J2M00540 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:19:05 GMT X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with nmh-1.0.4 From: ggm@apnic.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:04:35 -0400." <95414a5f3f924034494ca5f157b1f411@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <538.1027066742@garlic.apnic.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:19:02 +0000 I always used to imagine Algorists gathering in a dusty college chamber, glasses of Gluhwine warming in their hands (or alternately snifters of brandy) as they discuss the relative merits of non-terminating iterative functions as sources of near-random data. > I retrieved some of the pico-processed images that > were in the 10th edition manual: > > http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/10thEdMan/v2pix.html > > > Dennis But now I've been reminded of these images I realise it was probably more like a mix of an acid test, combined with a nitrous oxide jag. Of course that some of them are actually quite beautiful, and would not have offended Rene Magritte or more plausibly Angus Bean or Man Ray (actually, I think all of them would have pissed off Cecil Beaton or Karsh) only makes it better. Thanks for posting them. Didn't some of these also wind up on a tee-shirt for a USENIX or AUUG? -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 08:08:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 08:08:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6221 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 08:08:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6216 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 08:08:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 08:08:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52D9319AD5; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 19:08:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cnm-vra.com (unknown [208.21.241.30]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86ABE19AC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 19:07:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from micah by cnm-vra.com with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17VKMl-00013S-00; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:07:23 -0700 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) Message-ID: <20020718160723.A3485@cnm-vra.com> References: <20020718141436.3434B19A3E@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20020718141436.3434B19A3E@mail.cse.psu.edu>; from anothy@cosym.net on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 10:14:21AM -0400 From: Micah Stetson Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 16:07:23 -0700 --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline > common to most unix command line programs on Plan 9. i've not > checked to see that it does sensable things with images, though, > mainly because i don't know what to do with popi's output. Here is a program that takes popi's output and makes a plan9 image from it. It isn't anything amazing, but maybe it will save you a few seconds. Micah --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G Content-Type: text/x-csrc; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="popi2image.c" #include #include #include #include #define DEF_X 248 /* image width */ #define DEF_Y 248 /* image height */ void main(void) { int i; uchar *pix; Memimage *img; memimageinit(); pix = (uchar*)malloc(DEF_X * DEF_Y); for (i = 0; i < DEF_Y; i++) if(readn(0, pix+i*DEF_X, DEF_X) != DEF_X) { fprint(2, "popi2image: read error\n", i); exits("read"); } img = allocmemimage(Rect(0,0,DEF_X,DEF_Y), GREY8); loadmemimage(img, Rect(0,0,DEF_X,DEF_Y), pix, DEF_X*DEF_Y); writememimage(1, img); exits(0); } --k1lZvvs/B4yU6o8G-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 08:58:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 08:58:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6815 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 08:58:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6811 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 08:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 08:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8CCB19ADB; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 19:58:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6E7BC19AC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 19:57:53 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? References: <952dbd2b992f9f807f09fb725e0fadd7@vitanuova.com> Message-Id: <20020718235753.6E7BC19AC9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:57:47 +0900 Hello, >or does gcc also not do that, really. Look bellow: [arisawa@vega tmp]$ cat>a.c #include int foo(){;} int bar(){ int i; int g(){;} int h; printf("foo=%x\n",foo); printf("bar=%x\n",bar); printf("i=%x\n",&i); printf("g=%x\n",g); printf("h=%x\n",&h); } int main(){ bar(); } [arisawa@vega tmp]$ gcc a.c [arisawa@vega tmp]$ ./a.out foo=80483c8 bar=80483dc i=bffffc8c g=bffffc7c h=bffffc88 [arisawa@vega tmp]$ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 09:53:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 09:53:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8497 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 09:53:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8493 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 09:53:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 09:53:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A34F619A3E; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:53:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6700719A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:52:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <06b78404a549aa66986788bcb976b339@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:52:21 -0400 >>or does gcc also not do that, really. > Look bellow: Interesting. My guess is that it's creating a trampoline on the stack, which calls the real g(), which nm tells me is at: 080485a6 t g.0 Unfortunately gdb on the Linux server is unable to show me the instructions: Reading symbols from a.out...Dwarf Error: Cannot handle DW_FORM_strp in DWARF reader. But a quick grep for "tramp" in the gcc source finds such beauties as: libgcc2.c:1639: /* Make stack executable so we can call trampolines on stack. and (in function.c): /* Return the address of the trampoline for entering nested fn FUNCTION. If necessary, allocate a trampoline (in the stack frame) and emit rtl to initialize its contents (at entry to this function). */ ...and that's about all that I have the stomach for right now... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 09:55:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 09:55:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8547 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 09:55:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8543 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 09:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 09:55:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B07A2199A3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:55:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 39794199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:54:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 00:52:20 +0900 >% ndb/csquery >> net!$auth!ticket term% net!$auth!ticket > net!$auth!ticket /net/tcp/clone 192,.168.1.11!567 I see no problem from this answer??? By the way, from the hints by Charles and Dave, I re-examined my /lib/ndb/local file, and found a line auth=diabase. authdom= where should be read replaced by something. Then, I changed the line to auth=diabase authdom= Now, the slow authentication problem is gone. Thanks all! Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 10:00:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 10:00:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8728 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 10:00:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8724 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 10:00:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 10:00:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA50E19A76; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 21:00:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8FE1B19A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:59:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9a84accd92e39e74d64ef19c5e27f86f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:59:33 -0400 New /sys/src/9/pc/apic.c on sources. Fixes a bug that I inserted in April causing multiprocessors to get way too many clock interrupts. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 10:16:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 10:16:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9209 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 10:16:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9203 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 10:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 10:16:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2DA819A76; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 21:16:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 73E191998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 21:15:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 12287 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 01:17:16 -0000 Received: from vc2.net.titech.ac.jp (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 01:17:16 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 01:21:33 -0000 Received: from p9t by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id g6J1FX122303; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:15:33 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200207190115.g6J1FX122303@mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] `Look' upward in acme? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:15:51 0900 How can I search a string upward in acme? Do I have to add something like `RLook' to sources? -- YAMANASHI Takeshi From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 11:46:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 11:46:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12260 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 11:46:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12256 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 11:46:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 11:46:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A73C19A2F; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:46:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9AB4D199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:45:02 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] `Look' upward in acme? References: <200207190115.g6J1FX122303@mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp> Message-Id: <20020719024502.9AB4D199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:44:47 +0900 >How can I search a string upward in acme? Execute: Edit ?something? in one-line input field of acme. For details, see acme(1). Edit commond is powerful. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 11:49:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 11:49:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12328 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 11:49:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12323 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 11:49:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 11:49:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EAA119A4A; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:49:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BDBDC1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:48:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <87bc6df48e6abf12cd3387bc2c6637ab@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] `Look' upward in acme? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Jul 2002 22:48:27 -0400 >>How can I search a string upward in acme? > Execute: > Edit ?something? > in one-line input field of acme. Even simpler, select with the right button :-/something -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 12:26:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 12:26:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13597 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 12:26:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13593 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 12:26:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 12:26:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A8B4199A3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 23:26:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (mta06-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BA3A19A2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 23:25:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020719032546.OIZT4119.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:25:46 +0100 Message-ID: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:25:51 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've been playing with httpd this evening and done what I think is a useful script. What it does is take the command line options and HTTP headers and put them all in environment variables. I did this to facilitate shell scripted web pages. It works by adding : rfork E /bin/ip/httpd/populate_environment.rc $* to the top of any web serving scripts and then the HTTP Headers etc. can be accessed through /env the example script uses html_encode.sed, which is a very low quality cut and pasted html entity encoder (supplied) I'm also including url_encode.awk which is nothing to do with this but useful all the same For as long as I am on this IP address you can see it in action at http://pc1-nott2-3-cust35.not.cable.ntl.com/magic/http_info.rc suggestions / criticisms welcome Matt ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="html_encode.sed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="html_encode.sed" s/&/&/g=0A= s/"/"/g=0A= s//\>/g=0A= s/=E2=80=9E/\ä/g=0A= s/=C5=BD/\Ä/g=0A= s/=E2=80=9D/\ö/g=0A= s/=E2=84=A2/\Ö/g=0A= s/=C2=81/\ü/g=0A= s/=C5=A1/\Ü/g=0A= s/=C3=A1/\ß/g=0A= ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="http_info.rc" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="http_info.rc" #!/bin/rc=0A= # this is a demo of populate_environment.rc=0A= # both files need to go in wherever your httpd/magic directory is=0A= #=0A= # DEPENDENCY : to make the output nicer I've used html_encode.sed=0A= # which is a pretty lame sed script for turning ascii into html entities=0A= # binary data still gets through, it only subs about 6 elements, I need = a better one=0A= # You can happily remove it, just watch out for a < in your POST requests=0A= #=0A= # matt@proweb.co.uk 19 July 2002=0A= =0A= # IMPORTANT, without the rfork the environment would be shared by all = httpd threads=0A= # if that ruins your day you need to need to do some proper programming=0A= =0A= echo HTTP/1.1 200 FOUND=0A= echo Date: `{date}=0A= echo Server: plan9=0A= echo Content-Type: text/html=0A= echo =0A= =0A= rfork E=0A= /bin/ip/httpd/populate_environment.rc $*=0A= # that's it=0A= # the rest of this code just outputs an example=0A= =0A= echo 'EnviroThe environment variables set by = this request :'=0A= for (e in `{ls /env/HTTP_*}) {=0A= echo -n ''=0A= }=0A= echo '
' $e ''=0A= cat $e | sed -f /bin/ip/httpd/html_encode.sed | awk ' { print $0 = "
\n" } '=0A= echo '
'=0A= =0A= ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="populate_environment.rc" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="populate_environment.rc" #!/bin/rc=0A= =0A= # this script loads the environment with the parameters of the HTTP = request=0A= # to facilitate shell scripted web serving=0A= # matt@proweb.co.uk 19 July 2002=0A= #=0A= while(~ $1 -*) {=0A= switch($1) {=0A= case -d=0A= shift=0A= echo $1 > /env/HTTP_Domain=0A= case -w=0A= shift=0A= echo $1 > /env/HTTP_Document_Root=0A= case -r=0A= shift=0A= echo $1> /env/HTTP_Remote_IP=0A= case -N=0A= shift=0A= echo $1 > /env/HTTP_Netdir=0A= case -b=0A= shift=0A= echo $1 | sed 's/^r //' > /env/HTTP_Raw=0A= case -R=0A= shift=0A= echo $1 | awk '{print $1}' > /env/HTTP_Method=0A= echo $1 | awk '{print $2}' > /env/HTTP_Query_String=0A= echo $1 | awk '{print $3}' > /env/HTTP_Version=0A= }=0A= shift=0A= }=0A= =0A= eval `{awk '=0A= BEGIN { =0A= body=3D0;=0A= }=0A= =0A= { =0A= i =3D index($0, ": ");=0A= if (i > 0) {=0A= env =3D substr($0, 1, i-1);=0A= val =3D substr($0, i+2);=0A= val =3D substr(val, 1, length(val) -1);=0A= gsub("''", "''''", val);=0A= printf("echo ''%s'' > /env/HTTP_%s;", val , env);=0A= } else {=0A= exit=0A= }=0A= =0A= }=0A= =0A= ' /env/HTTP_Raw}=0A= =0A= ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="url_encode.awk" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="url_encode.awk" BEGIN {=0A= # We assume an awk implementation that is just plain dumb.=0A= # We will convert an character to its ASCII value with the=0A= # table ord[], and produce two-digit hexadecimal output=0A= # without the printf("%02X") feature.=0A= =0A= urlencode_EOL =3D "%0A" # "end of line" string (encoded)=0A= split ("1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A B C D E F", urlencode_hextab, " ")=0A= urlencode_hextab [0] =3D 0=0A= for ( urlencode_i=3D1; urlencode_i<=3D255; ++urlencode_i ) ord [ = sprintf ("%c", urlencode_i) "" ] =3Durlencode_i + 0=0A= urlencode_EncodeEOL =3D 1=0A= urlencode_encoded_line =3D ""=0A= }=0A= =0A= function url_encode_string(s) {=0A= encoded_string =3D ""=0A= for ( i=3D1; i<=3Dlength (s); ++i ) {=0A= encoded_string =3D encoded_string url_encode_char(substr ($0, i, 1))=0A= }=0A= return encoded_string=0A= }=0A= =0A= function url_encode_char(c) {=0A= if ( c ~ /[a-zA-Z0-9.-]/ ) { # safe character=0A= return c=0A= }=0A= if ( c =3D=3D " " ) {=0A= return "+" # special handling=0A= }=0A= # unsafe character, encode it as a two-digit hex-number=0A= lo =3D ord [c] % 16=0A= hi =3D int (ord [c] / 16);=0A= return "%" urlencode_hextab [hi] urlencode_hextab [lo]=0A= }=0A= =0A= {=0A= print url_encode_string($0)=0A= } ------=_NextPart_000_015A_01C22EDC.5D6BE4B0-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 12:40:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 12:40:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14009 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 12:40:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14004 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 12:40:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 12:40:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E0E419A76; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 23:40:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (mta07-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C873A19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 23:39:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020719033925.XVBG19225.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:39:25 +0100 Message-ID: <017401c22ed5$e4bd05e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> Subject: Re: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:39:30 +0100 :) I was just lying in bed and remembered that there's an eval in that script which I was going to take out once the code was working tomorrow m From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 13:23:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 13:23:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15145 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 13:23:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15141 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 13:23:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 13:23:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAE3719A2A; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:23:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10BFA199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:22:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6J4M5mk016616 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 06:22:06 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6J4M598016615 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 06:22:05 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Message-ID: <20020719062204.U14964@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: ; from David Gordon Hogan on Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 03:24:33PM -0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 06:22:04 +0200 On Thu, Jul 18, 2002 at 03:24:33PM -0400, David Gordon Hogan wrote: > > > That's where Microsoft's "security by obscurity" argument would > > acquire validity, isn't it? > > I think they're banking on evolutionary pressure against smart > people eventually wiping out all of the potential hackers. Don't fool yourself. They're _applying_ social engineering techniques to supplement any weakness in evolutionary pressure. Presenting compelling arguments against publication of source and demonising published source as contributing to terrorism is one way of producing uneducated acolytes. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 13:39:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 13:39:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15543 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 13:39:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15538 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 13:39:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 13:39:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E84019A75; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B835119A68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:38:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 29670 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 04:39:53 -0000 Received: from vc2.net.titech.ac.jp (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 04:39:53 -0000 Received: from localhost (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 04:44:09 -0000 Received: from p9t by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id g6J4c8114421; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:38:08 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200207190438.g6J4c8114421@mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] `Look' upward in acme? From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:38:28 0900 > Edit ?something? or > :-/something Oh, seems like bitten by a certain bad habit. I stopped thinking when :?something failed. Thank you all. -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 14:25:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 14:25:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 16900 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 14:25:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16896 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 14:25:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 14:25:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B07219A2F; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:25:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5ED601998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:24:06 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? References: <200207181450.g6IEoSsJ023181@ducky.net> Message-Id: <20020719052406.5ED601998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:23:56 +0900 >Nope. All you have to do is overwrite return addresses and >data in the stack. Many programs have code that can be twisted >to your own ends if you just call it with the right parameters. Hmm... I have some questions. (1) Is the following program one of `Many programs'? #include int main(){ char buf[BUFSIZ]; gets(buf); puts(buf); } (2) Does your strategy require source or binary code of the target to execute execl() ? (I cannot imagine how to find the location of execl()) Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 14:36:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 14:36:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17389 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 14:36:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17381 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 14:36:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 14:36:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEC1119A76; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:36:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 28FF819A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:35:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2a9d01e11925ce299e50451d7275090c@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 06:34:03 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit yes, it was doing a DNS query to try to resolve the invented domain. you could make /lib/ndb/local authoritative for that domain, and then you could use the domain as you like. it has been years since i last had to do ndb from scratch, but i think dom= soa will do it. --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1027040125:10:00879:13; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:55:25 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1000841; 19 Jul 2002 0:55 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B07A2199A3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:55:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 39794199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:54:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 00:52:20 +0900 >% ndb/csquery >> net!$auth!ticket term% net!$auth!ticket > net!$auth!ticket /net/tcp/clone 192,.168.1.11!567 I see no problem from this answer??? By the way, from the hints by Charles and Dave, I re-examined my /lib/ndb/local file, and found a line auth=diabase. authdom= where should be read replaced by something. Then, I changed the line to auth=diabase authdom= Now, the slow authentication problem is gone. Thanks all! Kenji --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 15:51:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 15:51:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19774 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 15:51:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19769 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 15:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 15:51:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E6B219A33; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 02:51:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4F14919A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 02:50:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <581d7c5933b9878dcc88b7379828b84c@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 07:48:49 +0100 >>or does gcc also not do that, really. >Look bellow: with the help of the Usenix paper about it, i understand now. oh dear! he was trying to add it subject to a particular implementation constraint: that void* could accept a function pointer and still be one word. he missed a way of implementing one of the techniques that he does mention (but only in passing), and so goes to all that acrobatic effort. Dijkstra rules! unless of course, i've missed something. well, Dijkstra still rules. on the other hand, what do i know about AI? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 16:24:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 16:24:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21014 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 16:24:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21010 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 16:24:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 16:24:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2745D19A8B; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 03:24:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7895019A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 03:23:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <15c3022dbbd61d179f48bc5c7a90edba@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ndgphudjqswrzjvovvujppevac" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 07:20:20 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ndgphudjqswrzjvovvujppevac Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > dom= soa >will do it. I already have this line in my /lib/ndb/local, but it doen't allow me to use auth=diabase. authdom= instead of auth=diabase authdom= Kenji --just returned from the jouney ^_^ getting dual Pen2 motherboard. :-) --upas-ndgphudjqswrzjvovvujppevac Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Fri Jul 19 14:36:19 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA31295 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:23:16 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id OAA09578 for ; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:36:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEC1119A76; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:36:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 28FF819A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 01:35:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2a9d01e11925ce299e50451d7275090c@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 06:34:03 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit yes, it was doing a DNS query to try to resolve the invented domain. you could make /lib/ndb/local authoritative for that domain, and then you could use the domain as you like. it has been years since i last had to do ndb from scratch, but i think dom= soa will do it. --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1027040125:10:00879:13; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 00:55:25 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1000841; 19 Jul 2002 0:55 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B07A2199A3; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:55:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 39794199A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Jul 2002 20:54:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 00:52:20 +0900 >% ndb/csquery >> net!$auth!ticket term% net!$auth!ticket > net!$auth!ticket /net/tcp/clone 192,.168.1.11!567 I see no problem from this answer??? By the way, from the hints by Charles and Dave, I re-examined my /lib/ndb/local file, and found a line auth=diabase. authdom= where should be read replaced by something. Then, I changed the line to auth=diabase authdom= Now, the slow authentication problem is gone. Thanks all! Kenji --upas-snvoglrgkjulvkcijiquucbrpd-- --upas-ndgphudjqswrzjvovvujppevac-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 16:43:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 16:43:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21675 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 16:43:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21670 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 16:43:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 16:43:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0EEB19A8D; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 03:43:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mxzilla1.xs4all.nl (mxzilla1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAA6519A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 03:42:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xs1.xs4all.nl (xs1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.80]) by mxzilla1.xs4all.nl (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6J7gr8i051957 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 09:42:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from wstan@localhost) by xs1.xs4all.nl (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g6J7gra53093 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 09:42:53 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wstan) From: "William S." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts Message-ID: <20020719074253.GB51270@xs4all.nl> References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: wilby98@yahoo.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 09:42:53 +0200 Is httpd ported to Plan9? Is that what you are using? Just curious. Right now I have been doing things with php under Slackware but would prefer Plan9. On Fri, Jul 19, 2002 at 04:25:51AM +0100, matt wrote: > I've been playing with httpd this evening and done what I think is a useful > script. > -- Bill Amsterdam, NL From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 17:08:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 17:08:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22386 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 17:08:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22382 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 17:08:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 17:08:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E25A319A4A; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:08:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2AADF19A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 04:07:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2e12645fd16ac52ac0efa5d2c2a49c50@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2001 08:04:55 +0900 I saw some very charming PCs today, those are named as KCF-S868 or KCF-S767 barebone system, the former of which is for Pen 4 and the latter for AMD (~1.1GHz). The chipset is VIA/P4M266 and SIS 740, respectively. The most atrractive point to me is their box size, very small and massive, 215(W)x310(D)x200(H). They can have a HDD, aCD/DVD-ROM and a floppy with integrated nic chip. They have also one PCI and AGP(P4 version) slots. I'd like to use one of them for our file server with Tekram scsi card and external scsi drives. Does Pen 4 can run file server? Another one, is there any advantage to use dual Pentium system for file server? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 18:17:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 18:17:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24153 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 18:17:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24149 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 18:17:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 18:17:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F4BA19A2F; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA5E81998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:16:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020719091609.UQYT23840.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:16:09 +0100 Message-ID: <019401c22f04$eb570ac0$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> <20020719074253.GB51270@xs4all.nl> Subject: Re: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 10:16:07 +0100 > Is httpd ported to Plan9? Is that what you are using? > Just curious. Right now I have been doing things with > php under Slackware but would prefer Plan9. no, ip/httpd is it's own thing not Apache, no PHP here man 8 httpd or http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/8/httpd From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 18:43:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 18:43:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24793 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 18:43:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24789 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 18:43:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 18:43:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4BDB19AB0; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:43:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A6DFC1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 05:42:33 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> <20020719074253.GB51270@xs4all.nl> <019401c22f04$eb570ac0$6501a8c0@KIKE> Message-Id: <20020719094233.A6DFC1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 18:42:25 +0900 >> Is httpd ported to Plan9? Is that what you are using? >> Just curious. Right now I have been doing things with >> php under Slackware but would prefer Plan9. > >no, ip/httpd is it's own thing not Apache, no PHP here >man 8 httpd >or >http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/8/httpd You have another option: Look http://plan9.aichi-u.ac.jp/pegasus/eman-1.0/ I am afraid that document is poor. Writing English is hard work for me. To download: http://plan9.aichi-u.ac.jp/netlib/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 19 21:55:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 19 21:55:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27117 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Jul 2002 21:55:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27113 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2002 21:55:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Jul 2002 21:55:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7084C19A9B; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (cthulhu.dircon.co.uk [194.112.45.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7890D19A86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:54:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from digbyt@localhost) by cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id NAA06845 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:53:31 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207191253.NAA06845@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <06b78404a549aa66986788bcb976b339@plan9.bell-labs.com> from David Gordon Hogan at "Jul 18, 2002 08:52:21 pm" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Digby Tarvin X-Face: &(//%&/WHJk7>_lW'@YYeED-qsdBV8&h3_Hpn/0.9_=}vTk}5u/2l=Mx&rX!\.i9X{(S@nk[we'a|IX#|?jmh`(j}a+\C5/> %DpYTPd<7jF2V b[Z.TjttL[FMm_$Z$^#qd62A:T.qw7}0S\o.Or_|I 2t~t0D=eCU"S?ls%(Ro X-Pgp-Key-Fingerprint: 61 E7 39 FE 4A F4 CA F3 F5 5E BB 45 26 EC 36 3C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL70 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: digbyt@acm.org (Digby Tarvin) List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:53:30 +0100 (GMT/BST) > Interesting. My guess is that it's creating a > trampoline on the stack, which calls the real > g(), which nm tells me is at: > > 080485a6 t g.0 > Unfortunately gdb on the Linux server is unable to show > me the instructions: > Why not just get the compiler to generate the assembly language for you. It is interesting that the current compiler lets you do it (my old BSD system won't swallow it) but I can't see any attempt to actually execute any code on the stack. For instance, adding code to actually call the function: int bar(){ int i; int g(){;} int h; printf("foo=%x\n",foo); printf("bar=%x\n",bar); printf("i=%x\n",&i); printf("g=%x\n",g); printf("h=%x\n",&h); g(); } generates . . call printf addl $16,%esp movl %ebp,%ecx call g.6 .L3: movl %ebp,%esp popl %ebp ret where g.6 is in the code segment: g.6: pushl %ebp movl %esp,%ebp subl $24,%esp movl %ecx,-4(%ebp) .L4: movl %ebp,%esp popl %ebp ret and the address of the function is put on the stack, but not used in the call: bar: pushl %ebp movl %esp,%ebp subl $56,%esp leal -36(%ebp),%edx leal 15(%edx),%eax andb $240,%al movl $g.6,%edx leal 10(%eax),%ecx subl %ecx,%edx movb $185,(%eax) movl %ebp,1(%eax) movb $233,5(%eax) movl %edx,6(%eax) addl $-8,%esp pushl $foo pushl $.LC0 call printf . . This is assuming I am reading the Intel code correctly. I am much more at home with Motorola or DEC assembly language, but I think these code fragments seem pretty clear. I don't really understand the need to have a pointer to the function on the stack, but I am sure there is a good reason for it. Thre restricted scope of the function name, which I guess could be useful, does not seem to depend on it. Regards, DigbyT -- Digby R. S. Tarvin digbyt@acm.org http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 00:17:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 00:17:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28672 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 00:17:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28668 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 00:17:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 00:17:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 008E419A98; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:17:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B19FD19A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:16:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <134a1c844a8343c74b1e3bb833af00c6@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:16:50 -0400 On Fri Jul 19 04:08:39 EDT 2002, okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp wrote: > I saw some very charming PCs today, those are named as KCF-S868 > or KCF-S767 barebone system, the former of which is for Pen 4 and > the latter for AMD (~1.1GHz). The chipset is VIA/P4M266 and SIS 740, > respectively. The most atrractive point to me is their box size, very > small and massive, 215(W)x310(D)x200(H). They can have a HDD, > aCD/DVD-ROM and a floppy with integrated nic chip. They have also > one PCI and AGP(P4 version) slots. > > I'd like to use one of them for our file server with Tekram scsi card > and external scsi drives. Does Pen 4 can run file server? > > Another one, is there any advantage to use dual Pentium system for > file server? > > Kenji Yes, Plan 9 will work with the P4 (if you have a chip faster than 2.2GHz make sure you have the current updates installed or the chip speed will be incorrectly determined and weird things happen). I believe there are hardware issues with the P4 and TLB flushing in SMP mode we'd have to put fixes in for, but we don't have such a system to try it out on. The current filesystem code makes makes no use of extra CPUs on Intel platforms. However, the new filesystem stuff we are working on will. --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 00:42:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 00:42:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28893 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 00:42:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28889 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 00:42:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 00:42:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63ABF19A4A; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ducky.net (ducky.net [199.26.172.91]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E94619A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:41:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ducky.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ducky.net (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6JFfX1s025117 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:41:33 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from mike@ducky.net) Received: (from mike@localhost) by ducky.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6JFfXMN025116 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:41:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike Haertel Message-Id: <200207191541.g6JFfXMN025116@ducky.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <200207191253.NAA06845@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:41:33 -0700 (PDT) >I don't really understand the need to have a pointer to the function >on the stack, but I am sure there is a good reason for it. Thre restricted >scope of the function name, which I guess could be useful, does not seem >to depend on it. In order to call a lexically scoped nested function, a caller needs two pieces of information: 1. the actual address address of the code 2. a pointer to the stack frame for the containing function, sometimes called the static chain pointer. A traditional C "pointer to function" is just (1) since there is no containing function. In order to make "pointer to nested function" have the same representation as "pointer to top level function", GCC creates a small bit of trampline code on the stack that sets up (2), then jumps to (1). Then when a pointer to the nested function is actually needed, GCC passes out the pointer to the trampoline code. The trampoline isn't needed when the call to the nested function is a direct call within the scope of the parent function--it's only needed when the nested function is being called via a function pointer from an unknown scope. So if you never take the address of a nested function, GCC shouldn't generate any trampoline code. The alternative to the trampoline would be for "pointer to function" to become a two-word object, or a pointer to a two-word object, with a changed calling sequence in either case. This would be fine, the C standard would certainly allow it, but it would be binary incompatible with existing calling conventions in most systems. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 00:47:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 00:47:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28941 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 00:47:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28937 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 00:47:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 00:47:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2589119AB0; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:47:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5217B19AA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:46:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 16:45:14 +0100 it only uses the trampoline code when you call g indirectly through a function pointer. if you call it directly it can provide the static link itself without that fuss. when you create a function pointer to g, as in the call to printf, it does generate code onto the stack that loads the static link register then enters g. leal -16(%ebp),%eax movl $g.9-10,%edx movb $185,(%eax) movl %ebp,1(%eax) movb $233,5(%eax) subl %eax,%edx movl %edx,6(%eax) that's the generation on the fly of the trampoline code. note the movl %ebp,1(%eax), which stores the current frame pointer as a literal in the generated code. the `function pointer' that is later passed to printf is the address of -16(%ebp) [offsets might be different in your case], which when called will load the literal, and enter g with a pc-relative reference (i think that's about right). you'd need to flush the cache(s) on some architectures, which is tricky when it's a privileged operation. the problem it is trying to solve is to get the right value for the static link register, without passing the required value along with the function pointer as a pair. providing the right value for the static link register is easiest to do if it doesn't exist. there are several approaches to implementing displays, and one of them allows nested function pointers as a single word but without this crud. all these implementations of nested functions in C go sadly wrong if you call a nested function indirectly when it has gone out of scope. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 00:55:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 00:55:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28998 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 00:55:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28994 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 00:55:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 00:55:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F09619AC5; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:55:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6CBC19A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:54:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A39D332F011A; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:43:25 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Fri Jul 19 08:43:25 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D383636.3020802@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? References: <134a1c844a8343c74b1e3bb833af00c6@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:54:30 -0700 jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > The current filesystem code makes makes no use of extra CPUs on Intel > platforms. However, the new filesystem stuff we are working on will. Could you go into a little more detail about that? In my limited experience, file service tends not to be bound by CPU (unless you're running Microsoft software), but by disk I/O and network throughput. Unless you're trying to saturate Gigabit Ethernet, I suppose. But even then, by my estimation a 1.6GHz P4 should be able to handle that (assuming the various busses can keep up, and I'd shudder to think what you spent on disk to sustain that). Multiprocessor support could be very nice for older hardware, though. -Jack From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 00:58:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 00:58:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29045 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 00:58:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29041 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 00:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 00:58:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B44A19AC9; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:58:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from workbench.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 425A61998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:57:21 -0400 (EDT) From: bwc@coraid.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gdgormgauuolemxadyactvyjra" Message-Id: <20020719155721.425A61998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:01:38 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gdgormgauuolemxadyactvyjra Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Has anyone saturated a Gigabit Ethernet with PCI? --upas-gdgormgauuolemxadyactvyjra Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by edsac; Fri Jul 19 12:00:57 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE9F719AC0; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:55:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6CBC19A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:54:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A39D332F011A; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:43:25 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Fri Jul 19 08:43:25 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D383636.3020802@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? References: <134a1c844a8343c74b1e3bb833af00c6@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 08:54:30 -0700 jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > The current filesystem code makes makes no use of extra CPUs on Intel > platforms. However, the new filesystem stuff we are working on will. Could you go into a little more detail about that? In my limited experience, file service tends not to be bound by CPU (unless you're running Microsoft software), but by disk I/O and network throughput. Unless you're trying to saturate Gigabit Ethernet, I suppose. But even then, by my estimation a 1.6GHz P4 should be able to handle that (assuming the various busses can keep up, and I'd shudder to think what you spent on disk to sustain that). Multiprocessor support could be very nice for older hardware, though. -Jack --upas-gdgormgauuolemxadyactvyjra-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 01:09:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 01:09:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29142 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 01:09:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29138 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 01:09:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 01:09:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D3C419AD5; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:09:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from atilla.mdrconsult.com (mdrconsult.com [24.242.136.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4509919AB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:08:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from george.home.org (cs6669202-179.austin.rr.com [66.69.202.179]) by atilla.mdrconsult.com (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g6JG88o07955 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:08:09 -0500 Received: from doc (helo=localhost) by george.home.org with local-esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17VaIf-0003Tk-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:08:13 -0500 From: Doc Shipley To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? In-Reply-To: <20020719155721.425A61998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:08:13 -0500 (CDT) On Fri, 19 Jul 2002 bwc@coraid.com wrote: > Has anyone saturated a Gigabit Ethernet with PCI? Not on Intel/x86 platforms. I've heard, but can't substantiate, that the 64bit PCI on some of the IBM Power4s will. But if I'm not mistaken, the gigE is built into that bus. Doc From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 01:35:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 01:35:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29362 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29358 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 01:35:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB13219A33; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:35:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from charentes.fr.clara.net (charentes.fr.clara.net [212.43.194.76]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C29019A4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:34:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 335400 (du-201-8.nat.dialup.freesurf.fr [212.43.201.8]) by charentes.fr.clara.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 7FD2959232 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 18:34:48 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <002e01c22f43$122a6dc0$0100a8c0@335400> From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> <017401c22ed5$e4bd05e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6700 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Subject: [9fans] UTF-8 support with Mothra Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 18:41:01 +0200 Will mothra support UTF-8 soon ? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 01:37:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 01:37:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29398 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 01:37:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29394 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 01:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 01:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4934219AD8; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:37:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C090919AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:36:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <724ddada05d9bb9643865ae2030bd664@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:36:50 -0400 The new fileserver stuff is (currently) built on top of the 'normal' Plan 9 kernel so you get the SMP stuff for free. Yes, you can saturate a PCI GbE from an Intel x86 system, just 'dd' into the ether data file. But with TCP/IP, not at the moment. Our best minds are working on it, though. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 01:55:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 01:55:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29563 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 01:55:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29559 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 01:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 01:55:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A53F19AA8; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:55:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from atilla.mdrconsult.com (mdrconsult.com [24.242.136.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA51619A98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 12:54:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from george.home.org (cs6669202-179.austin.rr.com [66.69.202.179]) by atilla.mdrconsult.com (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g6JGsio08205 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:54:44 -0500 Received: from doc (helo=localhost) by george.home.org with local-esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17Vb1l-0003XV-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:54:49 -0500 From: Doc Shipley To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? In-Reply-To: <724ddada05d9bb9643865ae2030bd664@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 11:54:49 -0500 (CDT) On Fri, 19 Jul 2002 jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > The new fileserver stuff is (currently) built on top of the 'normal' Plan 9 > kernel so you get the SMP stuff for free. > > Yes, you can saturate a PCI GbE from an Intel x86 system, just 'dd' into the ether data file. Are you sure you're saturating the ethernet adapter and not the PCI bus? A full 64-bit, 33MHz PCI bus gives something on the order of 275 MB, or 2200 Mb. That's _total_ available bandwidth. Even in a totally unloaded setup, I can't see getting a gigabit through it without knocking the box on its nose. Never mind the bus overhead when you start moving bits from disk instead of the, um, ether. Mind, I'm not claiming you're wrong, I just really want to know what hardware will do that. I may hear my next system calling. > But with TCP/IP, not at the moment. Our best minds are working on it, though. That's a true fact. Doc From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 02:09:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 02:09:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29671 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 02:09:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29667 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 02:09:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 02:09:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4356B19AE5; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:09:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mxzilla3.xs4all.nl (mxzilla3.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.49]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04EF919AE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:08:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from xs1.xs4all.nl (xs1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.80]) by mxzilla3.xs4all.nl (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6JH8LhZ088805 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:08:21 +0200 (CEST) Received: (from wstan@localhost) by xs1.xs4all.nl (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g6JH8LG73515 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:08:21 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from wstan) From: "William S." To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] httpd utilities / scripts Message-ID: <20020719170821.GA72996@xs4all.nl> References: <015d01c22ed3$fcc596e0$6501a8c0@KIKE> <20020719074253.GB51270@xs4all.nl> <019401c22f04$eb570ac0$6501a8c0@KIKE> <20020719094233.A6DFC1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020719094233.A6DFC1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: wilby98@yahoo.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:08:21 +0200 Your English looks and reads clear to me. Nice job setting it up. It will take me a while to take it all in. My reason for using php and Sablotron is to present web pages dynamically and keep content (XML) separate from style (XSL). Here is a link to a web site I have set up to experiment and learn with. Sorry that this does not directly pertain to Plan9 now but as I said, if I can find a way to accomplish the same thing with Plan9 I will give it a go. http://213.84.71.105/ On Fri, Jul 19, 2002 at 06:42:25PM +0900, arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > >> Is httpd ported to Plan9? Is that what you are using? > >> Just curious. Right now I have been doing things with > >> php under Slackware but would prefer Plan9. > > > >no, ip/httpd is it's own thing not Apache, no PHP here > >man 8 httpd > >or > >http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/8/httpd > > You have another option: > Look http://plan9.aichi-u.ac.jp/pegasus/eman-1.0/ > I am afraid that document is poor. > Writing English is hard work for me. > > To download: http://plan9.aichi-u.ac.jp/netlib/ -- Bill Amsterdam, NL From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 02:41:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 02:41:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29930 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 02:41:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29926 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 02:41:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 02:41:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48AB419AF1; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:41:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0397819AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:40:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from 135.104.53.191 ([135.104.53.191]) by plan9; Fri Jul 19 13:41:07 EDT 2002 From: "Howard Trickey" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <004201c22f4b$6b5aca40$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <002e01c22f43$122a6dc0$0100a8c0@335400> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Subject: [9fans] The "i" browser Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:40:48 -0400 I did a port of the inferno browser (charon) to plan 9, and called it "i". Unfortunately, other obligations have prevented me from getting all of the bugs out. Does anyone out there want to take up the guantlet and finish the job? I put the sources in the public source tree, under contrib/i , and would be happy to correspond with, and lightly collaborate with, anyone willing to solidify the port. The current state is that it often works, but there is some kind of bug in the table layout code (and doubtless, other bugs). And perhaps the biggest problem, for a modern browser, is that it doesn't do javascript at all. The port was done before Javascript support got added to charon. - Howard Trickey howard@research.bell-labs.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:14:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:14:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30148 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:14:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30144 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:14:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:14:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C4D019AC6; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0EE8019ADE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:13:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0797aba6f37ea6db21b1fa5b791d2e1e@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:13:15 -0400 On Fri Jul 19 12:55:36 EDT 2002, doc@mdrconsult.com wrote: > ... > Are you sure you're saturating the ethernet adapter and not the PCI > bus? A full 64-bit, 33MHz PCI bus gives something on the order of 275 > MB, or 2200 Mb. That's _total_ available bandwidth. Even in a totally > unloaded setup, I can't see getting a gigabit through it without > knocking the box on its nose. > Never mind the bus overhead when you start moving bits from disk > instead of the, um, ether. > ... Maybe I'm misremembering, but was sure I did it. Of course, I no longer have that hardware available. The only hardware I do have will only manage 850Mb/s (933MHz PIII, 64-bit/66MHz PCI, Netgear GA620T CAT-5 GbE card, PC133 SDRAM - none of it recent hardware, but that's the best a beleaguered telecomms company can do...). --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:14:36 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:14:36 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30155 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:14:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30151 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:14:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:14:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D46F419AEA; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:14:24 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wintermute.cse.psu.edu (unknown [130.203.18.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51F7B199D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:13:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (cthulhu.dircon.co.uk [194.112.45.202]) by wintermute.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id D9AAB73C99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:13:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from digbyt@localhost) by cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA08184 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:09:47 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207191809.TAA08184@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <200207191541.g6JFfXMN025116@ducky.net> from Mike Haertel at "Jul 19, 2002 08:41:33 am" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Digby Tarvin X-Face: &(//%&/WHJk7>_lW'@YYeED-qsdBV8&h3_Hpn/0.9_=}vTk}5u/2l=Mx&rX!\.i9X{(S@nk[we'a|IX#|?jmh`(j}a+\C5/> %DpYTPd<7jF2V b[Z.TjttL[FMm_$Z$^#qd62A:T.qw7}0S\o.Or_|I 2t~t0D=eCU"S?ls%(Ro X-Pgp-Key-Fingerprint: 61 E7 39 FE 4A F4 CA F3 F5 5E BB 45 26 EC 36 3C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL70 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: digbyt@acm.org (Digby Tarvin) List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:09:47 +0100 (GMT/BST) Ah - I see! It hadn't realised that the scope rules now included that sort of nesting. When did that happen? I guess I am going to have to trade in my much loved, dog eared K&R for a book on standard C one of these days... Presumably I need something along the lines of #include int foo(int (*f)()) { (*f)(); } int main() { int g(){; } foo(g); } To see it used, producing: foo: pushl %ebp movl %esp,%ebp subl $20,%esp pushl %ebx movl 8(%ebp),%ebx call *%ebx .L2: movl -24(%ebp),%ebx movl %ebp,%esp popl %ebp ret Presumably %esp is the stack pointer, %ebp is the frame pointer, and %ebx is the a scratch register used for parameter passing and jumping through to get to the trampoline. Makes me curious about what the 'e' stands for - like I said, I am not an x86 expert... This seems to require the somewhat less than transparent calling sequence: main: pushl %ebp movl %esp,%ebp subl $40,%esp leal -28(%ebp),%edx leal 15(%edx),%eax andb $240,%al movl $g.6,%edx leal 10(%eax),%ecx subl %ecx,%edx movb $185,(%eax) movl %ebp,1(%eax) movb $233,5(%eax) movl %edx,6(%eax) addl $-12,%esp leal -28(%ebp),%edx leal 15(%edx),%eax andb $240,%al pushl %eax call foo addl $16,%esp .L3: movl %ebp,%esp popl %ebp ret Presumably $185 generates the instruction to load the frame pointer, and $233 creates the jump to the actual function. Thanks for the explanation. The level of knowledge on this list never ceases to impress me... Regards, DigbyT > In order to call a lexically scoped nested function, a caller needs > two pieces of information: > > 1. the actual address address of the code > > 2. a pointer to the stack frame for the containing function, > sometimes called the static chain pointer. > > A traditional C "pointer to function" is just (1) since there is no > containing function. > > In order to make "pointer to nested function" have the same > representation as "pointer to top level function", GCC creates a > small bit of trampline code on the stack that sets up (2), then > jumps to (1). Then when a pointer to the nested function is actually > needed, GCC passes out the pointer to the trampoline code. > > The trampoline isn't needed when the call to the nested function is a > direct call within the scope of the parent function--it's only needed > when the nested function is being called via a function pointer from an > unknown scope. So if you never take the address of a nested function, > GCC shouldn't generate any trampoline code. > > The alternative to the trampoline would be for "pointer to function" > to become a two-word object, or a pointer to a two-word object, with a > changed calling sequence in either case. This would be fine, the C > standard would certainly allow it, but it would be binary incompatible > with existing calling conventions in most systems. > -- Digby R. S. Tarvin digbyt@acm.org http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:18:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:18:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30181 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:18:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30177 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:18:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:18:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A3B019AF1; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:18:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0CFAE19AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:17:50 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:18:06 -0400 > [...] but that's the best a beleaguered > telecomms company can do...). Hey I thought we were embittered! Or was that embattled? :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:20:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:20:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30190 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:20:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30186 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:20:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:20:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9302619AF2; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:20:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mailhost2.dircon.co.uk (mailhost2.dircon.co.uk [194.112.32.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA16719AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:19:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (cthulhu.dircon.co.uk [194.112.45.202]) by mailhost2.dircon.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00BD563122 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:19:46 +0100 (BST) Received: (from digbyt@localhost) by cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA08286 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:19:43 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207191819.TAA08286@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: from "forsyth@vitanuova.com" at "Jul 19, 2002 04:45:14 pm" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Digby Tarvin X-Face: &(//%&/WHJk7>_lW'@YYeED-qsdBV8&h3_Hpn/0.9_=}vTk}5u/2l=Mx&rX!\.i9X{(S@nk[we'a|IX#|?jmh`(j}a+\C5/> %DpYTPd<7jF2V b[Z.TjttL[FMm_$Z$^#qd62A:T.qw7}0S\o.Or_|I 2t~t0D=eCU"S?ls%(Ro X-Pgp-Key-Fingerprint: 61 E7 39 FE 4A F4 CA F3 F5 5E BB 45 26 EC 36 3C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL70 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: digbyt@acm.org (Digby Tarvin) List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:19:43 +0100 (GMT/BST) Thanks - I guess that confirms it does what I thought. Are there any good papers on this sort of stuff, or does one just have to wade through the source code? Any recomendations on a worthy successor to the K&R book as a good reference on the current state of the art of the language...? Regards, DigbyT > it only uses the trampoline code when you call g indirectly through > a function pointer. if you call it directly it can provide the static link > itself without that fuss. when you create a function pointer to g, > as in the call to printf, it does generate code onto the stack that > loads the static link register then enters g. > leal -16(%ebp),%eax > movl $g.9-10,%edx > movb $185,(%eax) > movl %ebp,1(%eax) > movb $233,5(%eax) > subl %eax,%edx > movl %edx,6(%eax) > that's the generation on the fly of the trampoline code. > note the movl %ebp,1(%eax), which stores the current frame pointer > as a literal in the generated code. > the `function pointer' that is later passed to printf is the address of > -16(%ebp) [offsets might be different in your case], which when > called will load the literal, and enter g with a pc-relative reference > (i think that's about right). > > you'd need to flush the cache(s) on some architectures, which is > tricky when it's a privileged operation. > > the problem it is trying to solve is to get the right value for the static link register, > without passing the required value along with the function pointer as a pair. > providing the right value for the static link register is > easiest to do if it doesn't exist. there are several > approaches to implementing displays, and one of them allows nested > function pointers as a single word but without this crud. > > all these implementations of nested functions in C go sadly wrong if > you call a nested function indirectly when it has gone out of scope. > > -- Digby R. S. Tarvin digbyt@acm.org http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:23:17 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:23:17 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30236 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:23:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30232 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:23:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08EEA19AF6; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:23:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D486819AA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:22:00 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <979deae73cfef9ae533f1d3d39e81f2e@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:22:17 -0400 > Why not just get the compiler to generate the assembly language > for you. My heart wasn't into it. > It is interesting that the current compiler lets you do it (my old > BSD system won't swallow it) but I can't see any attempt to actually > execute any code on the stack. Yeah, I'm running the ast-optimiser-branch gcc by default, and it does use trampolines. I think it's quasi- based on gcc 3.0. Before I go on another wild goose chase, what version specifically do you mean by "current"? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:34:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:34:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30284 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:34:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30280 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:34:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:34:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D6C019AF1; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:34:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8119719AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:33:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:33:18 -0400 > Ah - I see! It hadn't realised that the scope rules now included > that sort of nesting. When did that happen? I guess I am going to > have to trade in my much loved, dog eared K&R for a book on > standard C one of these days... Nested functions are a GNU extension. I'd recommend pretending that they don't exist as much as feasibly possible. I don't have that option, due to the work that I'm doing. But, if you're writing new code, just don't use them and everything will be fine... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:36:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:36:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30310 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:36:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30306 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:36:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:36:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F106419A17; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:36:11 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DAF4519AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:35:24 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <2ef20a5d8d01e853c7228345391e04f7@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:35:42 -0400 >> [...] but that's the best a beleaguered >> telecomms company can do...). > > Hey I thought we were embittered! > > Or was that embattled? :-) the most recent adjective used in the press is 'struggling'. i'm sure there will be more next week when earning are announced. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:37:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:37:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30317 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:37:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30313 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:37:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 520BD19AF8; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:37:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mailhost1.dircon.co.uk (mailhost1.dircon.co.uk [194.112.32.65]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EF3219B08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:36:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (cthulhu.dircon.co.uk [194.112.45.202]) by mailhost1.dircon.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 523B857404 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:36:46 +0100 (BST) Received: (from digbyt@localhost) by cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id TAA08412 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:36:44 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207191836.TAA08412@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <979deae73cfef9ae533f1d3d39e81f2e@plan9.bell-labs.com> from David Gordon Hogan at "Jul 19, 2002 02:22:17 pm" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Digby Tarvin X-Face: &(//%&/WHJk7>_lW'@YYeED-qsdBV8&h3_Hpn/0.9_=}vTk}5u/2l=Mx&rX!\.i9X{(S@nk[we'a|IX#|?jmh`(j}a+\C5/> %DpYTPd<7jF2V b[Z.TjttL[FMm_$Z$^#qd62A:T.qw7}0S\o.Or_|I 2t~t0D=eCU"S?ls%(Ro X-Pgp-Key-Fingerprint: 61 E7 39 FE 4A F4 CA F3 F5 5E BB 45 26 EC 36 3C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL70 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: digbyt@acm.org (Digby Tarvin) List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:36:43 +0100 (GMT/BST) > > Why not just get the compiler to generate the assembly language > > for you. > > My heart wasn't into it. > > > It is interesting that the current compiler lets you do it (my old > > BSD system won't swallow it) but I can't see any attempt to actually > > execute any code on the stack. > > Yeah, I'm running the ast-optimiser-branch gcc by default, and it does > use trampolines. I think it's quasi- based on gcc 3.0. > > Before I go on another wild goose chase, what version specifically > do you mean by "current"? > Sorry - I should really have said 'more current' or 'recent'. It was SuSE Linux 7.3, which comes with gcc-2.95.3-124 As I have since learned, a call to the nested function via a pointer does indeed generate the jump to code on the stack.... Regards, DigbyT -- Digby R. S. Tarvin digbyt@acm.org http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:38:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:38:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30324 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:38:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30320 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:38:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:38:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7D8719B13; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:38:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 716F919B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:37:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <8eec1f5d6d08659ae6c574f2c6fe581b@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:35:48 +0100 >>Ah - I see! It hadn't realised that the scope rules now included >>that sort of nesting. When did that happen? I guess I am going to >>have to trade in my much loved, dog eared K&R for a book on >>standard C one of these days... it's a gcc-specific extension (certainly implemented THAT way). >>Presumably $185 generates the instruction to load the frame pointer, >>and $233 creates the jump to the actual function. it's not the normal frame pointer but a static link pointer that allows the nested function's code to find the right frame instance for accessing variables in the lexically-containing function. it's because the implementation uses a static link that it has a problem. there is another technique that wouldn't. the dragon book has a reasonable discussion of the alternatives but doesn't actually discuss the variant that could have been used here to avoid the need for the trampoline crud (although it mentions it in a throwaway remark). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 03:39:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 03:39:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30336 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 03:39:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30332 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 03:39:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 03:39:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 241D819B11; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:39:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2855F19B11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:38:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 19556 invoked by uid 991); 19 Jul 2002 18:38:39 -0000 Message-ID: <20020719183839.19555.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: Message from Digby Tarvin of "Fri, 19 Jul 2002 19:09:47 BST." <200207191809.TAA08184@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 14:38:39 -0400 | Ah - I see! It hadn't realised that the scope rules now included | that sort of nesting. When did that happen? Never, it's a totally nonstandard gnu extension. :) It's darn annoying that the actual C standard isn't freely available, the way the corresponding Ada and Common Lisp standards are. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 04:08:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 04:08:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30535 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 04:08:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30531 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 04:08:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 04:08:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCE5E19AA8; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 15:08:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mailhost2.dircon.co.uk (mailhost2.dircon.co.uk [194.112.32.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C795719A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 15:07:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (cthulhu.dircon.co.uk [194.112.45.202]) by mailhost2.dircon.co.uk (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91FF862D59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 20:07:38 +0100 (BST) Received: (from digbyt@localhost) by cthulhu.dircon.co.uk (8.8.5/8.8.5) id UAA08528 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 20:07:36 +0100 (GMT/BST) Message-Id: <200207191907.UAA08528@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? In-Reply-To: <20020719183839.19555.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> from Scott Schwartz at "Jul 19, 2002 02:38:39 pm" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Digby Tarvin X-Face: &(//%&/WHJk7>_lW'@YYeED-qsdBV8&h3_Hpn/0.9_=}vTk}5u/2l=Mx&rX!\.i9X{(S@nk[we'a|IX#|?jmh`(j}a+\C5/> %DpYTPd<7jF2V b[Z.TjttL[FMm_$Z$^#qd62A:T.qw7}0S\o.Or_|I 2t~t0D=eCU"S?ls%(Ro X-Pgp-Key-Fingerprint: 61 E7 39 FE 4A F4 CA F3 F5 5E BB 45 26 EC 36 3C X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL70 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: digbyt@acm.org (Digby Tarvin) List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 20:07:35 +0100 (GMT/BST) > | Ah - I see! It hadn't realised that the scope rules now included > | that sort of nesting. When did that happen? > > Never, it's a totally nonstandard gnu extension. :) > In that case, I don't feel so bad about overlooking it. > It's darn annoying that the actual C standard isn't freely available, > the way the corresponding Ada and Common Lisp standards are. Yes, that is a pain. DigbyT -- Digby R. S. Tarvin digbyt@acm.org http://www.cthulhu.dircon.co.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 05:35:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 05:35:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 31192 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 05:35:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31188 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 05:35:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 05:35:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FBCC19AB0; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 16:35:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from 196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net (196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net [12.99.91.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1036A199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Jul 2002 16:34:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 10377 invoked by uid 1000); 19 Jul 2002 20:28:07 -0000 From: cnielsen@pobox.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] small boxed PC and dual CPU file server? Message-ID: <20020719202807.GW42736@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <724ddada05d9bb9643865ae2030bd664@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Jul 2002 13:28:07 -0700 On Fri, Jul 19, 2002 at 11:54:49AM -0500, Doc Shipley wrote: > > Are you sure you're saturating the ethernet adapter and not the PCI > bus? A full 64-bit, 33MHz PCI bus gives something on the order of 275 > MB, or 2200 Mb. That's _total_ available bandwidth. Even in a totally > unloaded setup, I can't see getting a gigabit through it without > knocking the box on its nose. > Never mind the bus overhead when you start moving bits from disk > instead of the, um, ether. 64-bit, 66MHz PCI should be able to handle it, in theory. you get 4224Mbps for the PCI bus, so it's less likely you're going to saturate the bus. at that point it becomes a game of chase the bottleneck. from my limited testing with hardware similar to what jmk currently has, i see about what he does. part of that may be due to the 620Ts having only 1M SRAM onboard. iirc, the SysKonnect cards have 2M SRAM and perform better as a result. i have an SK-9821 kicking around. i just need to sit down and write a p9 driver for it. :-) -- Christopher Nielsen - Metal-wielding pyro techie "Those who are willing to trade freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 14:58:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 14:58:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4399 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 14:58:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4395 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 14:58:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 14:58:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6779199F2; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 01:58:06 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from email124 (unknown [211.116.59.124]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6BAE9199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 01:57:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "dan aims" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Message-Id: <20020720055702.6BAE9199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] Ancient bread recipe actually helps you lose weight! 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From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 20 15:02:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 20 15:02:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4491 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Jul 2002 15:02:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4487 invoked from network); 20 Jul 2002 15:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Jul 2002 15:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 058E219A68; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:02:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 572D119999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 02:01:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <115fc11247976420e094d1488fa36403@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 06:59:44 +0100 in some email, mike haertel pointed out that i was probably making an extra assumption that gcc was not, namely that my compiler was compiling all the code in the system, and thus had control over all the interfaces, and he's right, i was. of course, i then considered some exotic ways round that but things were getting out of hand, so i stopped. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 21 02:41:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 21 02:41:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10915 invoked by uid 1020); 21 Jul 2002 02:41:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10911 invoked from network); 21 Jul 2002 02:41:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 21 Jul 2002 02:41:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 985CA19995; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:41:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta1p.ttcn.ne.jp (mta1.ttcn.ne.jp [210.188.175.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF628199BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:40:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from isabella ([61.215.38.85]) by mta1p.ttcn.ne.jp with SMTP id <20020720174005.DXYF929.mta1p@isabella> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 02:40:05 +0900 From: kazumi iwane To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Datula version 1.51.08 for Windows Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <20020720174005.DXYF929.mta1p@isabella> Subject: [9fans] acid library files Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 02:40:49 +0900 Hello 9fans, A couple of acid library files are missing in the distribution. term% acid -l thread -l pool 2207 /proc/2207/text:386 plan 9 executable /sys/lib/acid/port /sys/lib/acid/thread:1: (error) pushfile: /sys/src/libthread/sched.acid: '/sys/src/libthread/sched.acid' does not exist /sys/lib/acid/pool:1: (error) pushfile: /sys/src/libc/port/pool.acid: '/sys/src/libc/port/pool.acid' does not exist /sys/lib/acid/386 ... Is it correct to do term% 8c -FVw -a sched.c >sched.acid to create these files? - kazumi From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 21 02:44:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 21 02:44:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10950 invoked by uid 1020); 21 Jul 2002 02:44:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10946 invoked from network); 21 Jul 2002 02:44:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 21 Jul 2002 02:44:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A4F419A31; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:44:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 68136199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:43:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4703fd776285de42f5964faac182c812@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acid library files From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Jul 2002 13:44:05 -0400 > Hello 9fans, > > A couple of acid library files are missing in the distribution. > > Is it correct to do > > term% 8c -FVw -a sched.c >sched.acid > > to create these files? > > - kazumi There is a default .acid rule defined in the mkfile templates, so you could say mk pool.acid or mk sched.acid The mkfile in /sys/src/libthread will build sched.acid automatically. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 21 21:11:32 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 21 21:11:32 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24150 invoked by uid 1020); 21 Jul 2002 21:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24146 invoked from network); 21 Jul 2002 21:11:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 21 Jul 2002 21:11:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11AA419A55; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 08:11:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from yangg.net (unknown [218.2.159.107]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3E96E199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 08:10:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "zoufu@yangg.net" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Message-Id: <20020721121024.3E96E199BB@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] ɽ췢,Ͼؼ۱ѡ Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 20:10:23 +0800 ɽ췢 http://www.njchina.com/skttf.htm Ͼؼ۱ѡ http://www.njchina.com/bgmc.htm ؿ졢ѡ http://www.njchina.com/qwltgc.htm ȤζţͼIJò http://www.njchina.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 02:01:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 02:01:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27349 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 02:01:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27345 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 02:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 02:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABC3819A60; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 13:01:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2FC119A2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 13:00:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 0.3 (built May 13 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZL00ACEZ99MI@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 13:00:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6LH1tw13417 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 17:01:55 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] Ancient bread recipe actually helps you lose weight! In-reply-to: <20020720055702.6BAE9199F2@mail.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207211701.g6LH1tw13417@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 13:01:55 -0400 (EDT) ...but I bet the Hunzas don't use Plan 9 ... what boring dudes :-( - Dave dan aims wrote: > > > > > > > Hunza Bread > > > >

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> > > > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 04:47:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 04:47:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28160 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 04:47:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28156 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 04:47:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 04:47:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7592019A65; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:47:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B125419A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:46:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZM002FP6X0DS@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:46:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6LJlvv14281 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 19:47:57 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <61fc59076e43ac52fe96127834dadbe8@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207211947.g6LJlvv14281@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:47:57 -0400 (EDT) I just noticed that there were a few more messages in this thread that got lost in my email (and I can't really blame elm this time, either) :-( I know we'd all like to kill this thread, but I can't look at this post without replying; it's just too misguided to ignore. The reason I want a new open is _not_ that the current open isn't efficient enough for my tastes. The reason I want a new open is that the current one was lifted straight out of the old UNIX design, and miserably fails to accomodate the modular approach that UNIX no longer provides, but Plan 9 has found some brilliant ways of recreating (which is why I got my original Plan9 installation in the first place). The fact that the new open happens to be more efficient than the old one for many applications is merely a neat side effect, one that I only brought up when I was accused of making open _less_ efficient (and I didn't see you pipe up then to complain that cost doesn't matter). In UNIX, paths never became real objects in the sense that Plan 9 has promoted them to, because UNIX has very primitive filesystem serving. In Plan 9, it becomes a lot more interesting to have commands simply create temporary filesystems and populate them with the results (e.g., ls creating a directory with each file being one of the entries requested, and the contents of each of those files being information about the entry). UNIX tried to make everything a file, but it got bogged down with plain-text IO. Plan 9 aligned itself squarely with the file philosophy, and I see no reason to stop short when filenames are concerned. - Dave BTW - I don't know if it's worth noting that while strlen (sequential memory accesses) is an order of magnitude faster than DES (repeated computations + sequential memory accesses), simply getting the length from a structure (direct memory access) is an order of magnitude faster than strlen. Geoff Collyer wrote: > > My apologies for dragging this out, but I think this gets to the heart > of the matter. > > The cost of strlen doesn't matter, it really doesn't matter. I can't > recall seeing a real-life program where the cost of strlen was more > than trivia. > > A quick comparison on Plan 9 shows that strlen runs at 19 times the > speed of DES, using the same 64-byte string as input each time, which > is almost certainly longer than the average string. DES is really > slow, by design; it's not just a question of a few more memory > accesses; it's just hard to do the bit-swizzling quickly in software > (though it can be done relatively quickly in hardware). > > One of the big achievements of Unix was to get people to stop worrying > about the microseconds and look at the slightly larger picture of what > could be done if your first concern were not microseconds, and that > was a quarter-century ago! With processor cycles being so cheap and > available now, it's generally not worth worrying about expenses until > they cause a real (measurable, reproducible) problem. Proposals based > on supposedly greater efficiency for a new open(2) interface are not > worth considering, particularly when open's efficiency isn't currently > a problem, and the new interface is ugly, incompatible with the > existing clean and simple one, and purports to solve non-problems like > allowing NUL and slash in file name components. > > > One downside of APE is that it's made some people think of Plan 9 as > Just Another Goddamned Unix Implementation. If you're not interested > in exploring what's new in Plan 9, and are offended that realloc isn't > provably optimal or that GNU configure doesn't just run out the box, > why are you using Plan 9? FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD and Linux are all > available at no monetary cost. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 04:55:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 04:55:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28190 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 04:55:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28186 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 04:55:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 04:55:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1937C19A80; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:55:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA0B419A6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:54:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZM00AFU7422H@mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:50:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6LJqEu14344 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 19:52:14 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] blanks in file names In-reply-to: <3D32E1FC.4060600@nas.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207211952.g6LJqEu14344@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:52:14 -0400 (EDT) I happen to dislike much about rio, but that's not a fundamental part of the OS; it's simply a shell (and a very good one, too, which is why you're not likely to see me rushing to replace it). FWIW, though, I can easily imagine a vi-like or emacs-like environment with a framebuffer back-end doing the job just fine, without rodents, and without losing any functionality. - Dave Jack Johnson wrote: > > Geoff Collyer wrote: > > One downside of APE is that it's made some people think of Plan 9 as > > Just Another Goddamned Unix Implementation. > > Is this what Dave meant when he wrote: > > /me shudders at the thought that GUIs might someday take over the > > world :-( > > ? > > For the record, I think Plan 9 is a textual GUI. Though you could > probably swing it with a bare rc shell, unless you can run it on a > braille term (or hear it through your speakers) it's probably safest to > call it a GUI. > > At this point, I guess I'm thankful that there are no Olfactory User > Interfaces (though paradoxically I've seen a few that stank). > > I did read somewhere that there's a braille term that can draw out > window regions. A variation of acme on something like that could be > interesting. Mouse actions would take some serious rethought, though. > > -Jack > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 05:10:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 05:10:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28264 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 05:10:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28260 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 05:10:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 05:10:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9139119A31; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:10:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.5.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D16A519A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:09:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dave2.dave.tj (ool-4351482a.dyn.optonline.net [67.81.72.42]) by mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 (built Feb 21 2002)) with ESMTP id <0GZM001DL7ZVTY@mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:09:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from dave@localhost) by dave2.dave.tj (8.10.2/8.10.2) id g6LKBJE14588 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 20:11:19 +0000 (GMT) From: Dave Subject: Re: [9fans] =?UNKNOWN?B?u8bJvcLD087M7Mzst6IsxM++qczYvNux9rndyM7E49Gh?= In-reply-to: <20020721121024.3E96E199BB@mail.cse.psu.edu> from <"zoufu@yangg.net"@Jul> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200207212011.g6LKBJE14588@dave2.dave.tj> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.5 PL3] Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:11:19 -0400 (EDT) Are we getting Chinese SPAM now, too??? - Dave zoufu@yangg.net wrote: > > ɽ췢 http://www.njchina.com/skttf.htm > > Ͼؼ۱ѡ http://www.njchina.com/bgmc.htm > > ؿ졢ѡ http://www.njchina.com/qwltgc.htm > > ȤζţͼIJò http://www.njchina.com > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 05:32:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 05:32:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28383 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 05:32:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28379 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 05:32:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 05:32:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B189719A84; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:32:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4046719A81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:31:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g6LJYc228270 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:34:38 -0400 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] =?UNKNOWN?B?u8bJvcLD087M7Mzst6IsxM++qczYvNux9rndyM7E49Gh?= In-Reply-To: <200207212011.g6LKBJE14588@dave2.dave.tj> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 15:34:38 -0400 (EDT) I, too, was at first mesmerized by the very real 'global' nature of the internet. I can assure you the fascination will pass. Be patient. Sam On Sun, 21 Jul 2002, Dave wrote: > Are we getting Chinese SPAM now, too??? > > - Dave > > > zoufu@yangg.net wrote: > > > > ɽ췢 http://www.njchina.com/skttf.htm > > > > Ͼؼ۱ѡ http://www.njchina.com/bgmc.htm > > > > ؿ졢ѡ http://www.njchina.com/qwltgc.htm > > > > ȤζţͼIJò http://www.njchina.com > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 05:41:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 05:41:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28439 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 05:41:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28435 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 05:41:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 05:41:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD1CF19A8A; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:41:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A600B19A89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:40:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 28589 invoked by uid 991); 21 Jul 2002 20:40:15 -0000 Message-ID: <20020721204015.28588.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] =?UNKNOWN?B?u8bJvcLD087M7Mzst6IsxM++qczYvNux9rndyM7E49Gh?= In-Reply-To: Message from Dave of "Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:11:19 EDT." <200207212011.g6LKBJE14588@dave2.dave.tj> From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Jul 2002 16:40:15 -0400 > Are we getting Chinese SPAM now, too??? Kids, please don't follow up about this stuff. We want less of it, not more. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 22 20:36:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 22 20:36:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 14787 invoked by uid 1020); 22 Jul 2002 20:36:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14783 invoked from network); 22 Jul 2002 20:36:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 22 Jul 2002 20:36:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A305619A02; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 07:36:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC1AC19A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 07:35:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020722113503.PHPQ23840.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 12:35:03 +0100 Message-ID: <00ae01c23173$d3f53de0$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A9_01C2317C.34817400" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] pop3 collector Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 12:35:04 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A9_01C2317C.34817400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here's the first "working" script that mounts a remote mail system and then transfers the mail from there to the local mail system. It uses a control file with the username and passwords to use in the form proto domain user password at the moment the only supported proto is pop the default location for this file is /usr/$user/mailcollector.boxes the mail is injected from $user I've only run this for a day or so but no problems so far. of course YMMV usage : mailcollector [-f mailboxfile] [-k] -f = use non-default mailbox info file -k = leave messages on the server It uses and abuses factotum but as far as I could tell factotum will only store one un/pw per service per domain which fails you when you have multiple pop boxs on the same domain. M ------=_NextPart_000_00A9_01C2317C.34817400 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="mailcollector" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="mailcollector" #!/bin/rc=0A= =0A= # This script utilises the upas/fs mounted mail system to mount a remote = mailbox and then =0A= # transfer the messages using the local smtp process.=0A= =0A= # matt@proweb.co.uk=0A= # 16/7/2002=0A= =0A= =0A= # run our own copy of factotum so we dont use the current process's one=0A= auth/factotum=0A= =0A= # we're going to need a clean mail too=0A= upas/fs=0A= =0A= # read the parameters from /usr/$user/pop3=0A= # the format of which is line separated records of space or tab = separated fields :=0A= # protocol domain username password=0A= # Example :=0A= # pop pop3.aol.om connie secret=0A= # =0A= # $key(1) $key(2) $key(3) $key(4)=0A= # =0A= =0A= pwfile =3D /usr/$user/mailcollector.boxes=0A= keep =3D 0=0A= # -f pwfile <- use a different pw file=0A= while(~ $1 -*){=0A= switch($1){=0A= case -f:=0A= shift=0A= pwfile =3D $1=0A= case -k:=0A= keep =3D '1'=0A= }=0A= shift=0A= }=0A= =0A= {=0A= key =3D `{read}=0A= num_msgs =3D 0=0A= while(test $#key '!=3D' '0') { # die when null/blank line=0A= switch($key(1)) {=0A= # made it a switch for expansion and comments =0A= case pop :=0A= # tell stdout what we're doing=0A= echo $key(3) at $key(2)=0A= =0A= # insert a key into the local factotum =0A= echo 'key proto=3Dpass service=3D' ^$key(1) ^' dom=3D' ^$key(2) ^' = user=3D' ^$key(3) ^' !password=3D' ^$key(4) > /mnt/factotum/ctl=0A= =0A= # open the mailbox, it get's mounted as /mail/fs/$key(3) =0A= echo 'open /pop/'^$key(2) ^' ' ^$key(3) > /mail/fs/ctl=0A= =0A= =0A= msgs =3D /mail/fs/$key(3)=0A= if (test -d $msgs) { # make sure it's a directory (to skip = ctl)=0A= for (msg in `{ls $msgs}) { # get the message list=0A= if (test -d $msg) { # if message is directory=0A= cat $msg/raw | upas/send -r -b $user # get upas to send it to = $user from $user=0A= =0A= num_msgs =3D `{echo $num_msgs + 1 | bc}=0A= echo From: `{cat $msg/from} # Tell stdout=0A= echo Subject : `{cat $msg/subject}=0A= if (test $keep '=3D' '0')=0A= rm $msg # delete message from the remote server=0A= }=0A= =0A= }=0A= } =0A= if not {=0A= echo no mail # poor you, at least you got no spam=0A= }=0A= echo 'close ' ^$key(3) > /mail/fs/ctl # close the mailbox=0A= =0A= # delete the key from factotum so that we can process multiple pop3 = boxes on the same domain=0A= echo 'delkey proto=3Dpass service=3D' ^$key(1) ^' dom=3D' ^$key(2) ^' = user=3D' ^$key(3) > /mnt/factotum/ctl=0A= }=0A= key =3D `{read}=0A= }=0A= =0A= } < $pwfile=0A= =0A= echo $num_msgs mails processed.=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= ------=_NextPart_000_00A9_01C2317C.34817400-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 05:01:38 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 05:01:38 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19215 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 05:01:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19211 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 05:01:37 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 05:01:37 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FA96199B9; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 16:01:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from 196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net (196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net [12.99.91.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 83BC819999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 16:00:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 34172 invoked by uid 1000); 22 Jul 2002 19:53:37 -0000 From: Christopher Nielsen To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020722195337.GS42736@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i Subject: [9fans] new device Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 12:53:37 -0700 I started working on a device driver for myrinet night before last. I have no idea when it will be done, so please don't ask just yet. I'll keep everyone posted on the progress. I need a device character for the driver. Is it as simple as selecting one not in use and letting you guys know? A registry of device characters in use would be useful. The wiki would be a good place for that. I'll compile a list from the source and post it to the wiki, if no one objects too loudly. -- Christopher Nielsen - Metal-wielding pyro techie "Those who are willing to trade freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 11:13:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 11:13:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 24941 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 11:13:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24937 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 11:13:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 11:13:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2E1199E4; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 22:13:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cosym.net (peter.sys.9srv.net [64.7.3.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7F8FA19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 22:12:58 -0400 (EDT) From: anothy@cosym.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] new device MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020723021258.7F8FA19981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 22:11:35 -0400 i believe /sys/src/9/port/master is the theoretical repository, but i also believe it's at least somewhat out of date (that's from memory, though; i've not checked recently). ア From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 11:36:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 11:36:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25644 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 11:36:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25640 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 11:36:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 11:36:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07EA219A04; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 22:36:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from 196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net (196.mudb.snfc.snfccafj.dsl.att.net [12.99.91.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1657E199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Jul 2002 22:35:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 36341 invoked by uid 1000); 23 Jul 2002 02:29:05 -0000 From: Christopher Nielsen To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] new device Message-ID: <20020723022905.GR42736@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <20020723021258.7F8FA19981@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20020723021258.7F8FA19981@mail.cse.psu.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Jul 2002 19:29:05 -0700 On Mon, Jul 22, 2002 at 10:11:35PM -0400, anothy@cosym.net wrote: > i believe /sys/src/9/port/master is the theoretical > repository, but i also believe it's at least somewhat > out of date (that's from memory, though; i've not > checked recently). jmk replied privately pointing me at that file. thanks for the info! also, i wrote a script that will automagically generate the list from the source. based on the results of my script, /sys/src/9/port/master is only missing the cap device. -- Christopher Nielsen - Metal-wielding pyro techie "Those who are willing to trade freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 13:32:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 13:32:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29153 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 13:32:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29149 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 13:32:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 13:32:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 78D7019A29; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:32:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6F5E219A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:31:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <890667787da841204aca0ed9983b69e5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:07:40 +0900 I'm now having two different sets of include files, such as /sys/include and /3e/sys/include. When I'm in the /3e/sys/include directory, I cannot plumb say thread.h. How about to change the line of the /sys/lib/plumb/basic file from arg isfile /sys/include/$1 to arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1. I knwo this is a trivial thing, but changing the line so does not have any side effect, I believe. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 13:38:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 13:38:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29315 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 13:38:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29311 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 13:38:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 13:38:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07CBA19A2F; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:38:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5938419A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:37:23 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3f873c4c8f97a53b4fff3b2b8bcc6751@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wvuqnpojfkcxjsxsxmnmvlvidz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:37:40 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wvuqnpojfkcxjsxsxmnmvlvidz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't understand the problem. Are you saying you have two files thread.h, in /sys/include and /3e/sys/include? And that if you plumb when you're in one directory, you want to get the other? Because I tried the following: cd /usr/rob date>thread.h plumb thread.h and the file in /usr/rob appeared in Acme, which I think is correct behavior and is the behavior I think you ask for when you request arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 Please explain what you expect to happen. -rob --upas-wvuqnpojfkcxjsxsxmnmvlvidz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 23 00:32:41 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Jul 23 00:32:40 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E265C19A28; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:32:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6F5E219A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 00:31:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <890667787da841204aca0ed9983b69e5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:07:40 +0900 I'm now having two different sets of include files, such as /sys/include and /3e/sys/include. When I'm in the /3e/sys/include directory, I cannot plumb say thread.h. How about to change the line of the /sys/lib/plumb/basic file from arg isfile /sys/include/$1 to arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1. I knwo this is a trivial thing, but changing the line so does not have any side effect, I believe. Kenji --upas-wvuqnpojfkcxjsxsxmnmvlvidz-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 15:50:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 15:50:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 383 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 15:50:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 379 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 15:50:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 15:50:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67EDE19A2C; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:50:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 83A0D19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:24:53 +0900 >Are you saying you have two files >thread.h, in /sys/include and /3e/sys/include? yes. >And that if you plumb > when you're in one directory, you want to get the other? No, I wnat the thread.h under the directory where I'm now liveing. I have two thread.h files in two directories, /sys/include and /3e/sys/include, the latter of which is actually binded from /n/dioriteother/3e. Under the /3e/sys/include in acme's window , I pressed button 3 on the thread.h string, then, I got /sys/include/thread.h, but I wanted to get /3e/sys/include/thread.h. I also checked cd /3e/sys/include plumb thread.h and I got /sys/include/thread.h instead of /3e/sys/include/thread.h. Then, I changed the line to arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 , and killed the plumber processes, and restarted it. Then, I got the expected result. Kenji --sorry my vague English (anytime ;_;) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 15:59:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 15:59:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 664 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 15:59:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 660 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 15:59:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 15:59:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 899F419A3F; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 235C719A3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:58:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6N6wBmk021423 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:12 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6N6w9s7021419 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:09 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic Message-ID: <20020723085804.W19813@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp>; from okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp on Tue, Jul 23, 2002 at 03:24:53PM +0900 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:05 +0200 On Tue, Jul 23, 2002 at 03:24:53PM +0900, okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp wrote: > > Then, I changed the line to > arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 > , and killed the plumber processes, and restarted it. > Then, I got the expected result. > > Kenji --sorry my vague English (anytime ;_;) I think the idea is not to have both trees available simultaneously: bind /3e/sys /sys at least in some of the windows, and the plumbing rules will take care of themselves. You could just start a new plumber in the new namespace, but I would feel more comfortable with a new rio, I think. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 16:02:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 16:02:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 772 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 16:02:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 768 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 16:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 16:02:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC8AC19A57; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 03:02:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AB63A19A56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 03:01:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <5734436b598e22af8932a4668e5ede3c@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:37:27 +0900 > arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 This makes damege to the rule, I now understand. How we can make it work as follows: 1) if there is thread.h in /3e/sys/include, then catch it first. 2) if not, catch /sys/include/thread.h Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 16:06:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 16:06:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 896 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 16:06:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 891 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 16:06:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 16:06:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A231F19A59; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 03:06:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7737919A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 03:05:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0333b8db493f8e2204c99f0fbc2e76c3@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vyahpboknmztdravshlbrcvrpd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:41:41 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vyahpboknmztdravshlbrcvrpd Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No, I don't like it, because too much cumbersome. :-) Kenji PS. Why redrawing the acme window is so slow on dual pentium termianl + nvidia card? Of course, I'm using AGP... --upas-vyahpboknmztdravshlbrcvrpd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Tue Jul 23 15:59:28 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA02531 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:45:52 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id PAA07189 for ; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:59:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 899F419A3F; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:59:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 235C719A3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:58:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6N6wBmk021423 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:12 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6N6w9s7021419 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:09 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic Message-ID: <20020723085804.W19813@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp>; from okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp on Tue, Jul 23, 2002 at 03:24:53PM +0900 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:58:05 +0200 On Tue, Jul 23, 2002 at 03:24:53PM +0900, okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp wrote: > > Then, I changed the line to > arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 > , and killed the plumber processes, and restarted it. > Then, I got the expected result. > > Kenji --sorry my vague English (anytime ;_;) I think the idea is not to have both trees available simultaneously: bind /3e/sys /sys at least in some of the windows, and the plumbing rules will take care of themselves. You could just start a new plumber in the new namespace, but I would feel more comfortable with a new rio, I think. ++L --upas-vyahpboknmztdravshlbrcvrpd-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 20:12:35 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 20:12:35 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6316 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 20:12:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6312 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 20:12:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 20:12:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F32A19A2F; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 07:12:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (mta03-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.43]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 576C4199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 07:11:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta03-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020723111109.SORL23840.mta03-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:11:09 +0100 Message-ID: <009201c23239$a8591410$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Cc: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] Re: mailcollector Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:11:11 +0100 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" To: Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2002 11:45 AM Subject: Re: mailcollector > Thanks > > There's one thing I saw just looking at the source (didn't try it yet) > IMHO, if the local upas/send fails, the script would delete the mail > from the remote folder. This looks dangerous. Is this right? yes I suppose checking $status after cat $msg/raw | upas/send -r -b $user is called for that is why I added the -k option actually Problem with that though is that the same messages are retrieved next time I suppose grep /mail/fs/mbox/*/Message-ID `{cat /mail/fs/$key(3)} would fix that but strikes me as a bit expensive From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 20:43:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 20:43:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 6766 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 20:43:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6762 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 20:43:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 20:43:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2168E19A2C; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 07:43:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 330A519A3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 07:42:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA19269 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:42:24 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g6NBgMs19237; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:42:22 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g6NBgMe25096 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:42:22 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207231142.g6NBgMe25096@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:42:22 +0200 mentioned in scribble(2), not on sources. Axel. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 21:27:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 21:27:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7165 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 21:27:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7161 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 21:27:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 21:27:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5594219A2F; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D1DBD19A55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:26:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0aa03dacafd6501b9aaae7f75a2da681@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:09 -0400 > mentioned in scribble(2), not on sources. > > Axel. Not included because it was scanned from Palm documents and is copyrighted. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 21:30:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 21:30:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7183 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 21:30:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7179 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 21:30:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 21:30:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A055E19A55; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:30:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 65A7419A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:29:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <75f6a01d3ac5694d3149f6aeb88351bc@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qxlbewuxvjekgblhckimtnpigs" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:29:34 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qxlbewuxvjekgblhckimtnpigs Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If I do what you say, it does what you want, since the plumb rule for /sys/include is tried only after the file is not found in the local directory. I suspect your problem lies here: > the latter of which is actually binded from /n/dioriteother/3e. Does the plumber have the same name space as you? Did you do the bind after plumber was started? -rob --upas-qxlbewuxvjekgblhckimtnpigs Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 23 02:50:40 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Jul 23 02:50:39 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3ABCC19A2A; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:50:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 83A0D19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 02:49:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <658fdbf77e9ca6b11a693826350c0029@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 15:24:53 +0900 >Are you saying you have two files >thread.h, in /sys/include and /3e/sys/include? yes. >And that if you plumb > when you're in one directory, you want to get the other? No, I wnat the thread.h under the directory where I'm now liveing. I have two thread.h files in two directories, /sys/include and /3e/sys/include, the latter of which is actually binded from /n/dioriteother/3e. Under the /3e/sys/include in acme's window , I pressed button 3 on the thread.h string, then, I got /sys/include/thread.h, but I wanted to get /3e/sys/include/thread.h. I also checked cd /3e/sys/include plumb thread.h and I got /sys/include/thread.h instead of /3e/sys/include/thread.h. Then, I changed the line to arg isfile ./$1 /sys/include/$1 , and killed the plumber processes, and restarted it. Then, I got the expected result. Kenji --sorry my vague English (anytime ;_;) --upas-qxlbewuxvjekgblhckimtnpigs-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 23 21:38:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 23 21:38:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7265 invoked by uid 1020); 23 Jul 2002 21:38:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7261 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2002 21:38:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Jul 2002 21:38:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1219019A65; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:38:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CF8BA19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:37:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6d2f22afe5451bb41ca6ae3ae6106394@vitanuova.com> From: forsyth@vitanuova.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:39:47 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the set of scribble classifiers plan 9 uses is the same as compaq's linux, and i don't think the characters are quite the same as Palm's. i use the same set in Inferno, and i've got some .bit images drawn from the vectors in the classifier examples that i'll now put on our web site. --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@vitanuova.com id 1027427269:10:00353:57; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:27:49 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115399; 23 Jul 2002 12:27 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28DD919A59; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D1DBD19A55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:26:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0aa03dacafd6501b9aaae7f75a2da681@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:09 -0400 > mentioned in scribble(2), not on sources. > > Axel. Not included because it was scanned from Palm documents and is copyrighted. -rob --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 01:08:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 01:08:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9829 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 01:08:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9825 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 01:08:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 01:08:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0263A19A65; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:08:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 560D319A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:07:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020723160729.QGDY28874.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 17:07:29 +0100 Message-ID: <015b01c23263$0e2804d0$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] Lucent Technologies - the telecoms equipment outfit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 17:07:32 +0100 a lofty promotion from struggling but not good news I'm afraid Lucent slashes 7,000 jobs http://theregister.co.uk/content/7/26332.html The job cuts - designed to save the company $700m a year - will reduce the company's headcount from 53,000 to 46,000. The company also reported a $7.91bn loss for the quarter, compared to a loss of $3.24bn in the same quarter a year ago. Said Lucent chief exec, Patricia Russo: "The market continues to be very challenging. .... M :( From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 01:55:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 01:55:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10198 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 01:55:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10194 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 01:55:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 01:55:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50D1319A71; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:55:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wullbinkle.real.com (wullbinkle.real.com [207.188.22.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CCD319A04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:54:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from real.com (murrow2k1.real.com [207.188.7.41]) by wullbinkle.real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6NGsZqk028651 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 09:54:35 -0700 Received: from skipt.real.com ([172.21.104.107]) by real.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6NGsaMB032114; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 09:54:36 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020723100316.035d1ea0@mail.real.com> X-Sender: skipt@mail.real.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: "Fariborz (Skip) Tavakkolian" Subject: Re: [9fans] Lucent Technologies - the telecoms equipment outfit In-Reply-To: <015b01c23263$0e2804d0$6501a8c0@KIKE> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 10:12:00 -0700 I wonder how much of this is Worldcon debt write-off. At 05:07 PM 7/23/2002 +0100, matt wrote: > The company also reported a $7.91bn loss for the quarter, compared to a >loss of $3.24bn in the same quarter a year ago. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 02:19:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 02:19:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10527 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 02:19:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10522 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 02:19:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 02:19:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BECF19A7C; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:19:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 83F1C19A78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:18:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Lucent Technologies - the telecoms equipment outfit MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:18:00 -0400 On Tue Jul 23 12:55:40 EDT 2002, skipt@real.com wrote: > I wonder how much of this is Worldcon debt write-off. > > At 05:07 PM 7/23/2002 +0100, matt wrote: > > The company also reported a $7.91bn loss for the quarter, compared to a > >loss of $3.24bn in the same quarter a year ago. When WorldCom hit the headlines a few weeks ago we were told that Lucent had very little exposure. $5.8bn of the loss is a non-cash charge to account for a valuation allowance for deferred tax assets. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 02:37:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 02:37:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10709 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 02:37:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10705 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 02:37:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 02:37:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C4F419A65; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:37:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69CDF19A04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:36:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from tractor.meridian.wednet.edu [164.116.190.5] by tractor.meridian.wednet.edu (SMTPD32-6.06) id A186273002A; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 10:25:26 -0700 Received: FROM nas.com BY tractor.meridian.wednet.edu ; Tue Jul 23 10:25:26 2002 -0700 Message-ID: <3D3D9424.2040902@nas.com> From: Jack Johnson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; WinNT4.0; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020530 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Beating the dead horse: blanks in filenames Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 10:36:36 -0700 I was forwarding part of the previous thread on to a friend who studies Japanese in his spare time, regarding onji and haiku, and spaces in language in general. I'm guessing in most languages, not having spaces in filenames is probably not such a big deal. Are there any common languages anyone can think of where it might be a huge deal, or at least as troublesome as typing filenames left-to-right instead of right-to-left (without doing a little coding)? -Jack (alternate daily aside) http://www.unicode.org/pending/phaistos/Phaistos.pdf Not accepted by the UTC, so there goes my Phaistos Disk Turing Machine. I was really looking forward to doing the CD labels, too. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 07:14:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 07:14:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 12662 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 07:14:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12658 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 07:14:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 07:14:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5845419A80; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 18:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from lavoro.home.cs.york.ac.uk (public1-york1-5-cust17.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1742619A7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 18:13:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3a2cc8308a6d2e25d480e6c6770dbfc5@caldo.demon.co.uk> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? From: forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gieyfknullubqsjmbcjtkucqbe" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 23:12:02 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gieyfknullubqsjmbcjtkucqbe Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it is http://www.caldo.demon.co.uk/plan9/strokes/ --upas-gieyfknullubqsjmbcjtkucqbe Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@caldo.demon.co.uk id 1027427933:10:16429:15; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:38:53 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1015901; 23 Jul 2002 12:38 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1219019A65; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:38:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CF8BA19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:37:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6d2f22afe5451bb41ca6ae3ae6106394@vitanuova.com> From: forsyth@vitanuova.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 13:39:47 +0100 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the set of scribble classifiers plan 9 uses is the same as compaq's linux, and i don't think the characters are quite the same as Palm's. i use the same set in Inferno, and i've got some .bit images drawn from the vectors in the classifier examples that i'll now put on our web site. --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net by mailstore for forsyth@vitanuova.com id 1027427269:10:00353:57; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 12:27:49 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa1115399; 23 Jul 2002 12:27 GMT Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28DD919A59; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D1DBD19A55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:26:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <0aa03dacafd6501b9aaae7f75a2da681@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/src/libscribble/quickref.gif missing in distribution? From: "rob pike, esq." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Jul 2002 08:27:09 -0400 > mentioned in scribble(2), not on sources. > > Axel. Not included because it was scanned from Palm documents and is copyrighted. -rob --upas-zzqqwgjdrnlfcztvxanppsixpc-- --upas-gieyfknullubqsjmbcjtkucqbe-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 24 19:19:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 24 19:19:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 30492 invoked by uid 1020); 24 Jul 2002 19:19:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30488 invoked from network); 24 Jul 2002 19:19:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 24 Jul 2002 19:19:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9C1419A88; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 06:19:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4CDE619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 06:18:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <897e8f04d8f1edba0c7ee0c851ba29ac@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/plumb/basic From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 09:40:44 +0900 >> the latter of which is actually binded from /n/dioriteother/3e. > >Does the plumber have the same name space as you? Did you do >the bind after plumber was started? Yes, you are right. I dispatched plumber in my lib/profile file before binding /n/dioriteother/3e to /3e. I changed the file, and the problem has gone. Thanks a lot Kenji --namespace, it is the question :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 05:35:30 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 05:35:30 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3991 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 05:35:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3986 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 05:35:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 05:35:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2389199A3; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:35:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from INSIQ9.insuranceiq.com (unknown [65.217.159.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C91AA19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:34:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail pickup service by INSIQ9.insuranceiq.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 16:30:00 -0400 From: "National Life" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_DF36F_01C2332B.9A2E2180" X-Mailer: Microsoft CDO for Windows 2000 Thread-Index: AcIzTSEZxYv3v86/Tm6/vJiyoASqNg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6700 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message X-OriginalArrivalTime: 24 Jul 2002 20:30:00.0843 (UTC) FILETIME=[E26475B0:01C23350] Subject: [9fans] The "Non-Death" Life Policy! 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------=_NextPart_000_DF36F_01C2332B.9A2E2180-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 10:49:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 10:49:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9009 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 10:49:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9005 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 10:49:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 10:49:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA233199B9; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 21:49:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 170B619991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 21:48:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9ddb596b212ad3a7fea4d865385f5429@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] last update got strange acme behaviour Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:47:55 +0900 I got last update (July 24) from plan9 sources using replica/pull. I recompiled all the things by the new source trees after that pull. Now I have a strange behaviour of win command in acme. In an acme window, 'win rc' command runs smoothly, and makes another acme window with the prompt of term% Then, I dispatched the command ls at the window, and got error as rc: note: '0x0e' '0x0e' means so control code. I'd be glad if someone could give me where I should search the problem. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 11:12:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 11:12:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9704 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 11:12:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9700 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 11:12:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 11:12:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BE1E199BF; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 22:12:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from imf13bis.bellsouth.net (mail213.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.58.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEBD119991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 22:11:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Blake-laptop.integra-online.com ([209.214.115.87]) by imf13bis.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.04.19 201-253-122-122-119-20020516) with ESMTP id <20020725021256.KHIH1218.imf13bis.bellsouth.net@Blake-laptop.integra-online.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 22:12:56 -0400 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020724221018.04e66008@207.191.101.83> X-Sender: blake@207.191.101.83 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Blake McBride Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [9fans] Announcement: Dynace Object Oriented Extension to C Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2002 22:11:03 -0500 Announcing the Open Source release of the Dynace Object Oriented Extension to C Additionally, this release includes an additional port to the Plan 9 OS. Dynace is a preprocessor, include files and a library which extends the C and C++ languages with advanced object oriented capabilities, automatic garbage collection and multiple threads. Dynace is designed to solve many of the problems associated with C++ while being easier to learn and containing more flexable object oriented facilities. Dynace is able to add facilities previously only available in languages such as Smalltalk and CLOS without all the overhead normally associated with those environments. Dynace is well tested, stable, well supported, and used professionally by several companies. It is portable to Windows, Linux, Unix, Plan 9, Macintosh, Sun, DOS, and the Dec Alpha. See: http://algorithms.us Blake McBride blake@algorithms.us From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 15:24:30 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 15:24:30 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17276 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 15:24:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17272 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 15:24:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 15:24:29 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5D64199D5; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 02:24:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DAC8D199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 02:23:41 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 (NeXT Mail 3.3ciscupdate v148.2.1) From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@nx.aichi-u.ac.jp Message-Id: <20020725062341.DAC8D199B6@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] replica/changes Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:23:34 +0900 Hello, Manual says: To see a list of changes made to the local file system since installation, run replica/changes /dist/replica/network However term% replica/changes /dist/replica/network /dist/replica/network does not set $clientproto What wrong? Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 16:44:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 16:44:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19742 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 16:44:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19738 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 16:44:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 16:44:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2619199B9; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 03:44:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B014619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 03:43:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <976604dd42baa1aa2000207474bb8aef@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] last update got strange acme behaviour From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-nzoghqqwqabonnzpjykzxxujlf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 16:42:38 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-nzoghqqwqabonnzpjykzxxujlf Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I searched once more the reason of this. There is a two version of acme win program, one works fine, and the other does not. The first is that one before I fetched many patches and recompiled; ls -l /n/dump/2002/0723/acme/bin/386/win --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 174975 Apr 2 01:42 /n/dump/2002/0723/acme/bin/386/win and the second is that after I recomplied: ls -l /acme/bin/386/win --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 175343 Jul 24 16:48 /acme/bin/386/win As there is no difference between these sources, I suppose this reflect the difference between the lower libraries, probably libc (?). Kenji --upas-nzoghqqwqabonnzpjykzxxujlf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Thu Jul 25 10:49:35 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA03652 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:35:41 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id KAA05371 for ; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:49:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA233199B9; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 21:49:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 170B619991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Jul 2002 21:48:31 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9ddb596b212ad3a7fea4d865385f5429@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] last update got strange acme behaviour Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:47:55 +0900 I got last update (July 24) from plan9 sources using replica/pull. I recompiled all the things by the new source trees after that pull. Now I have a strange behaviour of win command in acme. In an acme window, 'win rc' command runs smoothly, and makes another acme window with the prompt of term% Then, I dispatched the command ls at the window, and got error as rc: note: '0x0e' '0x0e' means so control code. I'd be glad if someone could give me where I should search the problem. Kenji --upas-nzoghqqwqabonnzpjykzxxujlf-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 17:15:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 17:15:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20715 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 17:15:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20711 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 17:15:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 17:15:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30ED6199D5; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:15:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B4F4199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:14:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17XduQ-00003q-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:23:42 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020725102342.A229@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] Q: cd 4 acme's 'win' window Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:23:42 +0200 Hi, could you tell me, please, how to redefine a 'cd' command to use with acme's 'win' window, i.e., it should modify the tag to show the current directory. (Once I saw such a script somewhere, but I can't recall... :-( ) TIA, cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 17:24:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 17:24:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20997 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 17:24:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20993 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 17:24:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 17:24:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A50D199E3; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:24:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03636199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:23:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17Xe3Y-00003v-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:33:08 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020725103308.B229@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] Q: acme taglines redefinition Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:33:08 +0200 Hi, is there any (easy) way to redefine acme's main window's , and columns', default taglines? (Would like to put more commands there... 'Dump' does not work for these...) BTW, what happened to /acme/edit/? It seems not to be present on my box (OK, or system corrupt?) TIA, cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 17:33:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 17:33:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21265 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 17:33:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21261 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 17:33:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 17:33:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B472199E3; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:33:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DBE91998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:32:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA14365 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:32:53 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.10.2+Sun/csrelay-Sol1.4/RB) id g6P8Wqs10264; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:32:52 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.6+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id g6P8Wrk03216 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:32:53 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200207250832.g6P8Wrk03216@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.5 07/13/2001 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Q: cd 4 acme's 'win' window In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:23:42 +0200." <20020725102342.A229@next.gli.cas.cz> References: <20020725102342.A229@next.gli.cas.cz> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:32:53 +0200 Haven't used it so far but found the following in acme(1) : Awd loads the tag line of its window with the directory in which it's running, suffixed -label (default rc); it is intended to be executed by a cd function for use in win win- dows. An example definition is fn cd { builtin cd $1 && awd $sysname } Axel. > could you tell me, please, how to redefine a 'cd' command to use with acme's > 'win' window, i.e., it should modify the tag to show the current directory. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 17:51:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 17:51:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 21728 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 17:51:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21724 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 17:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 17:51:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C425199E3; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:51:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7B4311998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:50:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6eba021cd03a76f7186b923e1604d61b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Q: acme taglines redefinition MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qtsbthenfjqvpujhtsfbowchia" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:50:47 +0200 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qtsbthenfjqvpujhtsfbowchia Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Rob suggested to use acme Dump for this, that's probably the best way (put your commands somewhere else). Alternatively, I could send you a diff that adds both an Ignore command to acme (get rid of unwanted names in dir windows) and an honors an acmetag environment variable to do what you want. --upas-qtsbthenfjqvpujhtsfbowchia Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Jul 25 10:24:22 MDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A50D199E3; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:24:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from next.gli.cas.cz (cejchan.gli.cas.cz [147.231.139.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03636199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 04:23:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from pac by next.gli.cas.cz with local (Exim 3.12 #1 (Debian)) id 17Xe3Y-00003v-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:33:08 +0200 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20020725103308.B229@next.gli.cas.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i From: "Peter A. Cejchan" Subject: [9fans] Q: acme taglines redefinition Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 10:33:08 +0200 Hi, is there any (easy) way to redefine acme's main window's , and columns', default taglines? (Would like to put more commands there... 'Dump' does not work for these...) BTW, what happened to /acme/edit/? It seems not to be present on my box (OK, or system corrupt?) TIA, cheers, -- ++pac. Peter A. Cejchan Paleobiology Lab, GLU Acad. Sci. CZ [http | ftp]://next.gli.cas.cz --upas-qtsbthenfjqvpujhtsfbowchia-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 20:25:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 20:25:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23914 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 20:25:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23910 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 20:25:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 20:25:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1ABB6199E3; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 07:25:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 98CAA199D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 07:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <842f69885313146f019957b655d3fd7c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] anyone using tls for imap? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 12:44:39 +0200 I've some questions but wouldn't like to increase noise in the list. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 20:26:01 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 20:26:01 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23940 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 20:26:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23934 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 20:26:00 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 20:26:00 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B4D619A00; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 07:25:27 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from nautilus.escet.urjc.es (nautilus.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7F970199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 07:24:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3f008a3f24882550e3db422441800eab@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] upas/fs/imap4 fix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 13:24:00 +0200 The line that says imap4cmd(imap, "LOGIN %s %s", up->user, up->passwd); should be changed to imap4cmd(imap, "LOGIN %s \"%s\"", up->user, up->passwd); Or the server will complaint about bad login syntax (perhaps this has to do with my password being weird). I'll update the wiki about how to use imap to include detailed instructions for imap4 + tls setup. I'm a security impaired man. Thanks god^H^H^H for factotum. Thanks for secstore too. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Thu Jul 25 22:02:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Jul 25 22:02:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25114 invoked by uid 1020); 25 Jul 2002 22:02:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25110 invoked from network); 25 Jul 2002 22:02:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Jul 2002 22:02:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D30E7199E4; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:02:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from bootes.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4CFB1199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:01:10 -0400 (EDT) From: sah@coraid.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020725130110.4CFB1199B7@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] ermrc Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 09:05:35 -0400 Could someone please mail me a 4e /rc/bin/termrc? I'm not quite certain how it happened, but mine managed to lose the last half of itself. Probably user error. tia, Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 26 04:47:33 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 26 04:47:33 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29398 invoked by uid 1020); 26 Jul 2002 04:47:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29394 invoked from network); 26 Jul 2002 04:47:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 26 Jul 2002 04:47:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5028199B7; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:47:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mail3.panix.com (mail3.panix.com [166.84.1.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0DB5199F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:46:35 -0400 (EDT) Received: from panix1.panix.com (panix1.panix.com [166.84.1.1]) by mail3.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38CF6982E7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:44:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from markp@localhost) by panix1.panix.com (8.11.3nb1/8.8.8/PanixN1.0) id g6PJi1H04545 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:44:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Message-Id: <200207251944.g6PJi1H04545@panix1.panix.com> X-Mailer: mailx (AT&T/BSD) 9.8 2001-04-01 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Q: acme taglines redefinition Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 15:44:01 -0400 (EDT) pac writes... | is there any (easy) way to redefine acme's main window's , and | columns', default taglines? (Would like to put more commands | there... 'Dump' does not work for these...) wily does this with environment variables. that could be hacked into acme, I suppose, but it seems like overkill. I just keep 'tag lines' in a guide file and cut & paste them into place as I need them. | BTW, what happened to /acme/edit/? It seems not to be present on my | box (OK, or system corrupt?) it seems to be really gone; the Edit command pretty much obviates it. ---mp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Fri Jul 26 15:04:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Jul 26 15:04:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11004 invoked by uid 1020); 26 Jul 2002 15:04:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10999 invoked from network); 26 Jul 2002 15:04:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 26 Jul 2002 15:04:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 343F6199B7; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 02:04:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net (pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00F11199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 02:03:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from user-vcautp3.dsl.mindspring.com ([216.175.119.35] helo=rakitzis.com) by pintail.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17XyCC-0004vT-00; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 23:03:24 -0700 Received: (from byron@localhost) by rakitzis.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id g6Q635w02976; Thu, 25 Jul 2002 23:03:05 -0700 From: Byron Rakitzis Message-Id: <200207260603.g6Q635w02976@rakitzis.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Jul 2002 23:03:05 -0700 >Hi, > >Pico was a JIT compiler for expressions mapping one image onto another. >The compiler was written only for the VAX. > >There are several versions available in c.s.u starting with a cut down, >interpreted >version called popi released by Gerard Holzman later versions had JIT compilers >added by Byron Rakitzis of Unix RC fame. Hm... I did code generators for SPARC and MIPS roughly 10 years ago. Later on I added a code generator for Alpha which was adapted from the MIPS code, but which became much more exciting ultimately because I added floating point, polar coordinates, trig functions, etc. I did make a quick Java JIT for x86 in 1995 which I bolted into the then brand-new Sun interpreted runtime. I imagine it would be possible to adapt those macros to make an x86 pico (for what else do people use these days but x86s??), but I haven't spent time on pico in years and years. I hardly participate in 9fans and I don't know where to post the code these days. If someone would like a bundle of my pico directory with the three above-mentioned code generators (SPARC/MIPS/Alpha), let me know. Byron. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 27 11:44:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 27 11:44:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29940 invoked by uid 1020); 27 Jul 2002 11:44:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29936 invoked from network); 27 Jul 2002 11:44:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 27 Jul 2002 11:44:30 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D20619A17; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:44:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3595D19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:43:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from user-vcautp3.dsl.mindspring.com ([216.175.119.35] helo=rakitzis.com) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17YHYL-0001YY-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:33 -0700 Received: (from byron@localhost) by rakitzis.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id g6R2hMc04796 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:22 -0700 From: Byron Rakitzis Message-Id: <200207270243.g6R2hMc04796@rakitzis.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bug or a feature? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:22 -0700 >i'm happiest with > > if foo > bar > if not > baz Maybe someone can settle this for me. I found "if not" an atrocity because it's not something lexically scoped. This is apparently legal rc according to the grammar: if not foo if not bar if not baz It's up to the interpreter to flag it as an error. Granted there are many "runtime" as opposed to "parse" errors which rc will flag for you, but it strikes me as singularly awful that the control structure of the language should be one of those things. Also, without thinking really hard about it, I'm not sure how if not would work for nested ifs. Does this work the way you would expect? if (foo) { stuff if (bar) { more stuff } } if not { !foo stuff } A peek at the plan9 rc source suggests there is a global variable called "ifnot" which makes me very, very nervous. But I don't run plan9 at home so I can't test this code sample. What if foo is true and bar is false? TD was justifiably proud of rc's yacc grammar -- I suppose I felt I was doing it one better by bringing "if .. else" under that umbrella also. Byron. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sat Jul 27 21:11:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Jul 27 21:11:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3764 invoked by uid 1020); 27 Jul 2002 21:11:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3760 invoked from network); 27 Jul 2002 21:11:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 27 Jul 2002 21:11:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12EB219A3E; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 08:11:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 87A0919A27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 08:10:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6e3e309b1e44a3d737f3271614aef222@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bug or a feature? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-maynnyhcvayqufuguwxgmikgwp" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 08:10:44 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-maynnyhcvayqufuguwxgmikgwp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Running if(test -e /){ echo musthappen if(test -e /notthere) echo wonthappen } if not{ echo canthappen } yields just 'musthappen' You were perhaps afraid it would also print canthappen? Looks like td sets the variable to true before the comparison and to false on the way out of an if body (see Xwastrue and where its emitted). No reason to have a stack. --upas-maynnyhcvayqufuguwxgmikgwp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Jul 26 22:44:44 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Jul 26 22:44:42 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F9B219A08; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:44:12 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net (gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3595D19988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 22:43:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from user-vcautp3.dsl.mindspring.com ([216.175.119.35] helo=rakitzis.com) by gull.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17YHYL-0001YY-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:33 -0700 Received: (from byron@localhost) by rakitzis.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id g6R2hMc04796 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:22 -0700 From: Byron Rakitzis Message-Id: <200207270243.g6R2hMc04796@rakitzis.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bug or a feature? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2002 19:43:22 -0700 >i'm happiest with > > if foo > bar > if not > baz Maybe someone can settle this for me. I found "if not" an atrocity because it's not something lexically scoped. This is apparently legal rc according to the grammar: if not foo if not bar if not baz It's up to the interpreter to flag it as an error. Granted there are many "runtime" as opposed to "parse" errors which rc will flag for you, but it strikes me as singularly awful that the control structure of the language should be one of those things. Also, without thinking really hard about it, I'm not sure how if not would work for nested ifs. Does this work the way you would expect? if (foo) { stuff if (bar) { more stuff } } if not { !foo stuff } A peek at the plan9 rc source suggests there is a global variable called "ifnot" which makes me very, very nervous. But I don't run plan9 at home so I can't test this code sample. What if foo is true and bar is false? TD was justifiably proud of rc's yacc grammar -- I suppose I felt I was doing it one better by bringing "if .. else" under that umbrella also. Byron. --upas-maynnyhcvayqufuguwxgmikgwp-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 28 08:11:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 28 08:11:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10258 invoked by uid 1020); 28 Jul 2002 08:11:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10254 invoked from network); 28 Jul 2002 08:11:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 28 Jul 2002 08:11:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FCB819A54; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 19:11:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net (badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.20]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A7A919A4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 19:10:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net (hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.22]) by badboy.mail.pas.earthlink.net (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6RKVZN06596 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 13:31:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from user-vcautp3.dsl.mindspring.com ([216.175.119.35] helo=rakitzis.com) by hawk.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 17YYCv-00060Z-00; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 13:30:33 -0700 Received: (from byron@localhost) by rakitzis.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) id g6RKUQJ06160; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 13:30:26 -0700 From: Byron Rakitzis Message-Id: <200207272030.g6RKUQJ06160@rakitzis.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com Subject: Re: [9fans] bug or a feature? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Jul 2002 13:30:26 -0700 >No reason to have a stack. Ok, I see how the code generator works now! Byron. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Sun Jul 28 09:00:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Jul 28 09:00:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 10774 invoked by uid 1020); 28 Jul 2002 09:00:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10770 invoked from network); 28 Jul 2002 09:00:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 28 Jul 2002 09:00:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 032F019A5F; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 20:00:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from wintermute.cse.psu.edu (unknown [130.203.6.5]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BE4919A59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 19:59:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mail1.artmarket.com (mail1.artmarket.com [194.242.43.184]) by wintermute.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 35D7873CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Jul 2002 15:03:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Artprice.com To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-Id: <20020727190326.35D7873CAF@wintermute.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] How much are your art pieces worth? 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From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 04:04:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 04:04:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 23591 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 04:04:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23587 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 04:04:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 04:04:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D4B819A1C; Sun, 28 Jul 2002 15:04:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from donjig.net (unknown [218.2.163.239]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CC1219A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Jul 2002 15:03:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "monh@donjig.net" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain;charset="GB2312" X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: FoxMail 3.11 Release [cn] Message-Id: <20020728190345.7CC1219A08@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] =?GB2312?B?u8bJvcLD087M7Mzst6IsxM++qczYvNux9rndyM7E49Gh?= Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: monh@donjig.net List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 03:01:02 +0800 ɽ췢 http://www.njchina.com/skttf.htm Ͼؼ۱ѡ http://www.njchina.com/bgmc.htm ؿ졢ѡ http://www.njchina.com/qwltgc.htm ȤζţͼIJò http://www.njchina.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 09:14:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 09:14:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25644 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 09:14:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25640 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 09:14:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 09:14:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 885EA19A1C; Sun, 28 Jul 2002 20:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7110199ED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Jul 2002 20:13:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020729001259.FARE16050.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 01:12:59 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c23694$b3502930$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [9fans] error in man 2 9p Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 01:12:59 +0100 it's only a little thing but then manual says write should attempt to write the r->ifcall.n bytes of r->ifcall.data to offset r->ifcall.offset of the file it's not r->ifcall.n but r->ifcall.count m From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 17:58:35 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 17:58:35 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 9766 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 17:58:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9762 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 17:58:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 17:58:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7233B19A2A; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 04:58:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from yjhaa.com (unknown [218.2.159.235]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E89F19A17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 04:56:51 -0400 (EDT) From: "xamimi@yjhaa.com" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain;charset="GB2312" X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 Message-Id: <20020729085651.1E89F19A17@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] =?GB2312?B?u8bJvcLD087M7Mzst6IsxM++qczYvNux9rndyM7E49Gh?= Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: xamimi@yjhaa.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:54:13 +0800 ɽ췢 http://www.njchina.com/skttf.htm Ͼؼ۱ѡ http://www.njchina.com/bgmc.htm ؿ졢ѡ http://www.njchina.com/qwltgc.htm ȤζţͼIJò http://www.njchina.com From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 20:15:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 20:15:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11715 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 20:15:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11711 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 20:15:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 20:15:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 506D219A2C; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 07:15:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from gsyc.escet.urjc.es (gsyc064.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D594419A28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 07:14:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nanonic.hilbert.space (80-26-99-12.uc.nombres.ttd.es [80.26.99.12]) by gsyc.escet.urjc.es (8.9.3/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-21) with ESMTP id NAA09528 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 13:14:08 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: gsyc.escet.urjc.es: Host 80-26-99-12.uc.nombres.ttd.es [80.26.99.12] claimed to be nanonic.hilbert.space Received: from paurea by nanonic.hilbert.space with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 17Z8T3-0000KA-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 13:13:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15685.9057.72875.389455@nanonic.hilbert.space> From: paurea@gsyc.escet.urjc.es To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: VM 7.03 under Emacs 21.2.1 Subject: [9fans] shared memory Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 13:13:37 +0200 I am writing (or trying to :-)) the driver for the sis630 vga card. It uses shared memory, i.e. the video memory comes from the normal ram of the computer. At first it seemed to me I had to reserve memory for it like a dma buffer, but after looking more closely to the linux driver, it seems to me that something hardware is going on and that the memory is reserved some way by the bios works as normal video memory. Does anybody know how this should be treated?. Any pointers to info?. -- Saludos, Gorka "Curiosity sKilled the cat" From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 22:57:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 22:57:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13889 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 22:57:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13885 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 22:57:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 22:57:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82BC519A3E; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:57:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A2A9619A2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:56:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 794738 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 07:56:57 -0600 Received: from snaresland.acl.lanl.gov (128.165.147.113) by acl.lanl.gov with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 07:56:57 -0600 Received: (qmail 4719 invoked by uid 3499); 29 Jul 2002 07:56:57 -0600 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 07:56:57 -0600 From: Ronald G Minnich X-X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] shared memory In-Reply-To: <15685.9057.72875.389455@nanonic.hilbert.space> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 07:56:57 -0600 (MDT) On Mon, 29 Jul 2002 paurea@gsyc.escet.urjc.es wrote: > I am writing (or trying to :-)) the driver for the sis630 vga card. It > uses shared memory, i.e. the video memory comes from the normal ram of > the computer. At first it seemed to me I had to reserve memory for it > like a dma buffer, but after looking more closely to the linux driver, > it seems to me that something hardware is going on and that the memory > is reserved some way by the bios works as normal video memory. Does > anybody know how this should be treated?. Any pointers to info?. sis 630 vga card? don't you mean a motherboard with an sis630 chipset? Anyway, the sis630 integrated vga uses part of main memory for graphics memory, called SMA (Shared Memory something). You have to see if it is enabled (always true with normal bios) and then see how big it is. Also the SMA can be supplied by any of the DIMM slots. Here is the linuxbios code for this. /* find the device */ if ((pcidev = pci_find_device(PCI_VENDOR_ID_SI, PCI_DEVICE_ID_SI_630, NULL)) == NULL) return 0; /* see which banks are enabledd */ pci_read_config_byte(pcidev, SIS630_BANKENABLE, &dram_status); dimm_status = dram_status & 0x7; /* see if shared memory with integrated vga is enabled */ sma_enable = dram_status & 0x80; /* see which dimm is being used for the shared memory */ pci_read_config_byte(pcidev, SIS630_DIMM_LOCATION_FOR_SMA, &sma_location); sma_location &= 0x03; /* compute Shared Menory Area (SMA) size in Mega Bytes */ sma_size_bits = (dram_status >> 4) & 0x7; if (sma_size_bits > 5) // this is invalid! sma_size = 0; else { sma_size = (2 << sma_size_bits); } at the end of this code fragment sma (an int) has the shared memory sized in MB. let me know if you get this going, we're interested here -- I have a fair number of these motherboards. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Mon Jul 29 23:00:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Jul 29 23:00:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 13916 invoked by uid 1020); 29 Jul 2002 23:00:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13911 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 23:00:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 23:00:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 035F619A33; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 10:00:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from acl.lanl.gov (acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6681019A26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 09:59:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 794576 invoked from network); 29 Jul 2002 07:59:35 -0600 Received: from snaresland.acl.lanl.gov (128.165.147.113) by acl.lanl.gov with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 07:59:35 -0600 Received: (qmail 4727 invoked by uid 3499); 29 Jul 2002 07:59:35 -0600 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 29 Jul 2002 07:59:35 -0600 From: Ronald G Minnich X-X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] shared memory In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 07:59:35 -0600 (MDT) I realized that a lot of code I sent you don't really need. On Mon, 29 Jul 2002, Ronald G Minnich wrote: struct pci_device pcidev; int sma_size_bits; int sma_size_mbytes; > > /* find the device */ > if ((pcidev = pci_find_device(PCI_VENDOR_ID_SI, > PCI_DEVICE_ID_SI_630, NULL)) == NULL) > return 0; > > /* see which banks are enabledd */ > pci_read_config_byte(pcidev, SIS630_BANKENABLE, &dram_status); > dimm_status = dram_status & 0x7; > > /* see if shared memory with integrated vga is enabled */ > sma_enable = dram_status & 0x80; > > /* compute Shared Menory Area (SMA) size in Mega Bytes */ > sma_size_bits = (dram_status >> 4) & 0x7; > if (sma_size_bits > 5) > // this is invalid! > sma_size = 0; > else { > sma_size = (2 << sma_size_bits); > } > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:04:26 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:04:26 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15241 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:04:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15237 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:04:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:04:25 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 667F319A57; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C507019999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:03:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCxL-0005ch-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:01:11 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <002e01c22f43$122a6dc0$0100a8c0@335400>, <004201c22f4b$6b5aca40$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] The "i" browser Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:00:56 GMT howard@research.bell-labs.com (Howard Trickey) wrote in message news:<004201c22f4b$6b5aca40$bf356887@bl.belllabs.com>... > I did a port of the inferno browser (charon) to > plan 9, and called it "i". Unfortunately, other > obligations have prevented me from getting all > of the bugs out. > > Does anyone out there want to take up the guantlet > and finish the job? I put the sources in > the public source tree, under contrib/i , and > would be happy to correspond with, and lightly > collaborate with, anyone willing to solidify the port. > > The current state is that it often works, but > there is some kind of bug in the table layout code > (and doubtless, other bugs). And perhaps the biggest > problem, for a modern browser, is that it doesn't > do javascript at all. The port was done before > Javascript support got added to charon. > > - Howard Trickey > howard@research.bell-labs.com I'm very interested. I've you've read any of my other posts, you'll have noticed that I'm looking for a good browser under Plan 9. Unfortunately, I can't access the public source tree, as I can't dial out (for now). (Any latest development on the Lucent WinModem drivers?) Anyway, would you be so kind as to e-mail me a copy of the sources? Thanks much! Ben Followup-To: Distribution: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Keywords: Cc: -- Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK D.H.Davis@bath.ac.uk From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:04:49 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:04:49 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15250 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:04:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15246 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:04:48 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:04:48 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E6D419A5A; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:27 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DFE1199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:03:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCxK-0005cb-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:01:10 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] missing compilers? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:00:31 GMT I read in the 2c manual page that there should be a compiler for the AT&T 3210, but cannot find it anywhere, in source or binary form. Does it still exist? Also, (I'm probably mistaken...) I read somewhere something about a compiler for the Hobbit processors... Anyway, should the 3210 part be removed from the manual page, or should the compiler still be available? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:05:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:05:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15262 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:05:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15258 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:05:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:05:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2D5619A60; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:39 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3A4019999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:03:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCxK-0005cV-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:01:10 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207190102.5b11f5bf@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Plan 9 Advisory Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:00:09 GMT An advisory for Plan 9 edition 3 has been released to the public by 7f Research and Development. The vulnerability, specific to edition 3, is fixed in edition 4. Now that all Plan 9 users have had sufficient time to upgrade, the vulnerability is being made public. Comments, questions and other interests should be directed to: north_@www.7f.no-ip.com 7f Advisories will be hosted on the Chocolate Scientist website until further notice. http://www.chocolate.no-ip.info/ Don From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:06:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:06:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15288 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:06:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15284 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:06:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:06:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4063D19A61; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:52 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FE56199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:03:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCvG-0005aM-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:59:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Don Message-ID: <8f6cf824.0207181707.56cd7022@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] time to accept swap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:58:21 GMT I had this same problem on a Thinkpad 760L I installed as an auth server. Logins would take forever waiting to be authenticated. As soon as I remembered to turn on swap (by adding 'swap /dev/sdC0/swap' in my cpurc) this problem disappeared. At the same time lagged logins started to appear the console would stop responding to keys typed on the keyboard. However CTRL+ALT+DEL would still HUP the machine. I never got around to figuring out why any of this happened since swap fixed the issue. Don From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:07:07 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:07:07 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15295 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:07:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15291 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:07:06 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:07:06 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D738019A68; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:05:04 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFC3D19999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:03:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCvF-0005aG-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020718125735.3B29D1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] /sys/lib/mothra Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:58:10 GMT miller@hamnavoe.demon.co.uk (Richard Miller) wrote in message news:<20020718125735.3B29D1998C@mail.cse.psu.edu>... > Sorry, I think it's been deliberately set up as an importable file system > to be a showcase of the 4th edition Plan 9 security mechanisms. > > -- Richard Is there some way I could use drawterm-win? If not, would you be so kind as to e-mail the sources to me? Or is that illegal? (Yes, I have 3rd & 4th edition licenses, if that means anything!) Thanks much! Ben From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:07:53 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:07:53 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15320 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:07:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15316 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:07:52 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:07:52 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1E6119A6B; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:06:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63D37199EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCvF-0005a4-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D36FE1C.50676A22@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20020718141436.3434B19A3E@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:57:45 GMT anothy@cosym.net wrote: > anyone got anything to deal with pico (v10 picfile(5)) images? Somewhere in my archives I have 5620/630 code. IIRC, it is a simple format similar to .BMP and so it should be easy to reformat it into any frame-buffer device. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:08:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:08:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15327 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:08:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15323 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:08:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:08:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 115D019A64; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:06:26 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AED5819A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:04:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCyb-0005ef-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:02:29 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ralph Corderoy Message-ID: <3659.3d3887d9.c4bf1@blake.inputplus.co.uk> Organization: InputPlus Ltd. References: <200207191253.NAA06845@cthulhu.dircon.co.uk>, <200207191541.g6JFfXMN025116@ducky.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:01:13 GMT Hi Mike, > The alternative to the trampoline would be for "pointer to function" > to become a two-word object, or a pointer to a two-word object, with a > changed calling sequence in either case. This would be fine, the C > standard would certainly allow it, but it would be binary incompatible > with existing calling conventions in most systems. Under IBM's AIX a pointer to function is the address of three words. Entry point of function's code. Address of module's Table of Contents. Used by some languages' implementations, OCS Ada for one IIRC. So they went for the `function pointer fits into long' solution to avoid breakage. Cheers, Ralph. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:09:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:09:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15340 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:09:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15336 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:09:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:09:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB04819A76; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:09:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C5A119A74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:08:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCvF-0005aA-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:59:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D3738D6.BB18C13F@null.net> Organization: U.S. Army Research Laboratory Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <95414a5f3f924034494ca5f157b1f411@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Pico (again) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:57:55 GMT Dennis Ritchie wrote: > http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/10thEdMan/v2pix.html Any prizes for guessing what the transformation formulae were? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:09:54 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:09:54 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15348 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:09:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15344 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:09:53 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:09:53 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8CBC19A74; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:09:25 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 765C019A74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:08:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZCxJ-0005cO-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:01:09 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <3D37A0C3.D4CFD654@null.net> Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <952dbd2b992f9f807f09fb725e0fadd7@vitanuova.com>, <20020718235753.6E7BC19AC9@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] useful language extension, or no? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 15:59:35 GMT arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > g=bffffc7c Well, yeah, it obviously has to be allocated on either the stack or the heap. Heap allocation requires cleanup a la C++ destructor while the stack cleanup is automatic. Note that GNU seems to like to use alloca also, perhaps for a similar reason. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:11:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:11:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15379 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:11:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15375 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:11:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:11:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 941DF19A82; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:11:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C9C8819A77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:10:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <9a470ba715ce4e59a38ecf35d194c23e@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] missing compilers? From: forsyth@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:07:32 +0100 >>somewhere something about a compiler for the Hobbit processors... the hobbits were hobbled years ago. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:19:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:19:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15442 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:19:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15438 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:19:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:19:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E59719A7C; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:19:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B280119A7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:18:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZD2U-0005nc-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:06:30 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "peter a. cejchan" Message-ID: <71652467.0207252032.368cdbf4@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20020725102342.A229@next.gli.cas.cz>, <200207250832.g6P8Wrk03216@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Subject: Re: [9fans] Q: cd 4 acme's 'win' window Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:05:48 GMT Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl (Axel Belinfante) wrote in message news:<200207250832.g6P8Wrk03216@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl>... > Haven't used it so far but found the following in acme(1) : > > Awd loads the tag line of its window with the directory in > which it's running, suffixed -label (default rc); it is > intended to be executed by a cd function for use in win win- > dows. An example definition is > fn cd { builtin cd $1 && awd $sysname } > > Axel. > > > could you tell me, please, how to redefine a 'cd' command to use with acme's > > 'win' window, i.e., it should modify the tag to show the current directory. That's just what I was looking for (I browsed through the acme.ps, not acme(1), though... :-((( Thanks, Axel! ++pac. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:19:35 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:19:35 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15449 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:19:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15445 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:19:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:19:34 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F18519A86; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:19:25 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0B8C19A83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:18:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZD1o-0005m3-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:05:48 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Blake McBride Message-ID: Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Subject: [9fans] ANNOUNCEMENT: Dynace Object Oriented Extension to C Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:05:24 GMT Announcing the open source release of the Dynace Object Oriented Extension to C Additionally, this release includes an additional port to the Plan 9 OS. Dynace is a preprocessor, include files and a library which extends the C and C++ languages with advanced object oriented capabilities, automatic garbage collection and multiple threads. Dynace is designed to solve many of the problems associated with C++ while being easier to learn and containing more flexable object oriented facilities. Dynace is able to add facilities previously only available in languages such as Smalltalk and CLOS without all the overhead normally associated with those environments. Dynace is well tested, stable, well supported, and used professionally by several companies. It is portable to Windows, Linux, Unix, Plan 9, Macintosh, Sun, DOS, and the Dec Alpha. See: http://algorithms.us Blake McBride blake@algorithms.us From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:20:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:20:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15458 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:20:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15454 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:20:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:20:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50E9819A87; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:20:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EAD019A6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:19:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZD1n-0005lx-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:05:47 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Alex Walker Message-ID: <3D3D9B93.30805@usenix.org> Organization: USENIX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] USENIX Conference on File and Storage Technologies (FAST '03) submissions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: alex@usenix.org List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:05:09 GMT The Conference on File and Storage Technologies (FAST '03) Program Committee invites you to contribute your ideas, proposals and papers for the invited talks program, refereed papers track, and Work-in-Progress Reports. We welcome submissions that address any and all issues relating to File and Storage Systems. FAST brings together the top storage systems researchers and practitioners, providing a premier forum for discussing the design, implementation, and uses of storage systems. It aims to bring together the best work in file and storage systems in one venue. Submissions are due September 3, 2002. The Call for Papers with submission guidelines and suggested topics is now available at: http://www.usenix.org/events/fast/cfp/ FAST '03 March 31 - April 2, 2003 San Jose, California, USA The conference will consist of two and a half days of technical presentations, including refereed papers, invited talks, and an introductory keynote address. A session of work-in-progress presentations is planned, and informal Birds-of-a-Feather sessions may be organized by attendees. Refereed papers will be published in the Proceedings. We look forward to receiving your submissions! Sincerely, Jeff Chase, Duke University FAST 2003 Program Chair From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:30:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:30:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15552 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:30:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15548 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:30:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:30:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E496B19A8D; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:30:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from galapagos.cse.psu.edu (galapagos.cse.psu.edu [130.203.12.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3A8AF19A8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:29:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 23817 invoked by uid 991); 29 Jul 2002 16:29:31 -0000 Message-ID: <20020729162931.23816.qmail@g.bio.cse.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] missing compilers? From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:29:30 -0400 Speaking of compilers, what's the status of the PowerPC? (In particular, the G4 Macintosh.) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 01:35:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 01:35:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 15593 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 01:35:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15589 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 01:35:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 01:35:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63CA019A8F; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:35:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E46D919A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 12:34:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZDOH-0006Hw-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 17:29:01 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Sascha Wildner Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Subject: [9fans] Spam on comp.os.plan9 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:26:55 GMT Hello everyone, there have been several spam mails sent to 9fans in the last few weeks. How comes that these mails are not filtered out by the moderators of comp.os.plan9 (Icarus Sparry & Tim Goodwin, according to the charter) when the 9fans mails are gatewayed to the newsgroup? [Moderator's Note: The 9fans email is injected straight into the Newsgroup. There is no attempt to moderate this email. Only articles posted to the Newsgroup are moderated. I expect the 9fans email could be "sanitised" by processing it with software such as: http://www.algebra.com/~ichudov/stump/ However this hasn't been investigated.] A mail to plan9mod-request@bath.ac.uk has been unanswered for a week now. [Moderator's Note: The relevant staff were on holiday.] Regards, Sascha From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 05:45:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 05:45:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 17598 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 05:45:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17594 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 05:45:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 05:45:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42FFA19A7B; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:45:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from collyer.net (adsl-63-192-14-226.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E167E19A73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Jul 2002 16:44:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <45427616dfeeac8239866d30aed7d071@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] missing compilers? From: Geoff Collyer MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Jul 2002 13:44:28 -0700 The powerpc compiler is there but no binary is supplied, so you need to compile qc, qa and ql yourself. I have inferno running on OS X. It's still got some quirks and seems to work better on 10.2 than 10.1. A Plan 9 port needs at least a driver for the relevant Ethernet controller (Apple's GMAC is built in to the Power Mac, as I recall). For pre-VGA console access, it appears that one needs to use Open FirmWare's console get and put routines since recent Macs don't seem to have an accessible serial port. Keyboard and mouse are normally USB, which sounds like a pain. It looks like there is a z8530 DUART connected to a modem chipset, but the only external connector is a phone jack. I'm not sure which interrupt controller and MMU are used, but all this information should be available in the Darwin or OpenBSD sources. The supplied VGA is usually ATI or Nvidia. Disks and CD-ROMS are normally IDE. On the other hand, the Power Macs at least have several PCI slots, so one could perhaps get an initial port running quickly by inserting cards that already work on the PC, for example Intel i82557 Ethernet or Mylex SCSI. One can substitute Wavelan PCMCIA cards for Airport cards. The Open FirmWare boot loader can load AIX XCOFF binaries, which it appears ql can generate. As far as I know, qc doesn't exploit Altivec instructions, so you probably won't see much advantage with a G4 as compared to a G3. 3rd edition contains an mpc port and 4th edition contains an mtx port. One of them is probably a reasonable base to start from, depending mainly on MMU and interrupt controller. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 14:12:34 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 14:12:34 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27756 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 14:12:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27752 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 14:12:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 14:12:33 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 749D619A58; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:12:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EDF6A19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:11:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:11:35 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:11:33 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <5080bc86afd41cf809c1a0e2a9c31dc5@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:11:30 -0400 > I have an Inferno app that monitors /dev/draw and remembers enough state > to reproduce the display (actively) on the /dev/draw of any client that connects > to it on a network port. The clients can connect at any time. > It does need a real local /dev/draw to do the grunge and maintain the images. post it! i've wanted that for plan 9 for a while. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 14:14:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 14:14:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27788 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 14:14:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27784 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 14:14:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 14:14:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B833E19A78; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:14:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6EAE919A56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:13:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:14:06 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:14:05 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] quirk From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:14:02 -0400 > What would cause /dev/draw/... to not appear on boot? /rc/bin/termrc switch($mouseport){ case ps2 ps2intellimouse 0 1 2 aux/mouse $mouseport # parse vgasize into fields vgasize=`{echo $vgasize} if(! ~ $"monitor '' && ! ~ `{cat /dev/user} none) aux/vga -l $vgasize if(~ $accupoint 1) pipefile -dr /bin/aux/accupoint /dev/mouse } > I ask, because I decided to try a trackball serial mouse with > my TP 600E 9top; I changed mouseport=serial in the .ini, rebooted, > and it's not there. Thusly, no frame buffer. > > I went back and forth one more time to make certain I > wasn't seeing things. It works using the keypad ps2; set it to > serial: no frame buffer. > > Thoughts? use mouseport=0 russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 14:28:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 14:28:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28193 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 14:28:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28189 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 14:28:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 14:28:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E45BD19A8C; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:28:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5601419A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:27:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6U5Qwx8003430; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:26:59 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6U5Qu91003429; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:26:56 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: Russ Cox Cc: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Ha! (Was: [9fans] no job control; thank you!) Message-ID: <20020730072654.S888@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: Russ Cox , 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <5080bc86afd41cf809c1a0e2a9c31dc5@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <5080bc86afd41cf809c1a0e2a9c31dc5@plan9.bell-labs.com>; from Russ Cox on Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 01:11:30AM -0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:26:55 +0200 On Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 01:11:30AM -0400, Russ Cox wrote: > > post it! i've wanted that for plan 9 for a while. > I see you're back. If it's OK with you, I'd like some help with the PCnet driver. I have it working OK for the 79c960 even under 4ed, but under VMware it is more than a little shaky. I'll be back in my office from Thursday, then I'll be able to refresh my memory. I recall thinking that the symptoms would strike you as much more meaningful than to me. I think it had to do with not getting the interrupt from VMware, but I'll be a lot clearer once I've taken a good look. ++L PS: I have reworked the whole thing into (a) a single source file (heretical as it may be) and (b) with the indirect function calls you added for 16- and 32-bit operation. PPS: Of course, if you aren't going to be able to help, I'll bounce it all off the mailing list, but I thought the whole issue could wait until you had a chance to let me know. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 14:32:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 14:32:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28288 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 14:32:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28282 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 14:32:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 14:32:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7447E19A8E; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:32:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E79F419A92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:31:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6U5V5x8003447 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:31:05 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6U5V4DX003446 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:31:04 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: Ha! (Was: [9fans] no job control; thank you!) Message-ID: <20020730073103.T888@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <5080bc86afd41cf809c1a0e2a9c31dc5@plan9.bell-labs.com> <20020730072654.S888@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20020730072654.S888@cackle.proxima.alt.za>; from Lucio De Re on Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 07:26:55AM +0200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:31:04 +0200 On Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 07:26:55AM +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > On Tue, Jul 30, 2002 at 01:11:30AM -0400, Russ Cox wrote: > > > > post it! i've wanted that for plan 9 for a while. > > > I see you're back. If it's OK with you, I'd like some help with > the PCnet driver. I have it working OK for the 79c960 even under > 4ed, but under VMware it is more than a little shaky. > ... and other embarrassing details :-( Sorry, all. Mutt asked me if it should include the mailing list, and I explicitly answered "no". I didn't think of actually checking. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 14:32:33 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 14:32:33 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 28301 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 14:32:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28297 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 14:32:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 14:32:32 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8FC719A9C; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:32:27 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1653619A90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:31:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:31:43 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 01:31:40 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <6673cfcf0fbf61fd62eefd7913c55e13@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: Ha! (Was: [9fans] no job control; thank you!) From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 01:31:37 -0400 there's a bug in vmware's virtual ether card. did you catch this in the current driver's reset function? while(!(ctlr->ior(ctlr, Rdp) & Idon)) ; /* * We used to set CSR0 to Idon|Stop here, and then * in attach change it to Iena|Strt. Apparently the simulated * 79C970 in VMware never enables after a write of Idon|Stop, * so we enable the device here now. */ ctlr->iow(ctlr, Rdp, Iena|Strt); ctlr->init = 0; iunlock(ctlr); /* * Linkage to the generic ethernet driver. */ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 20:35:28 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 20:35:28 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 3871 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 20:35:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3867 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 20:35:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 20:35:27 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C11B019A31; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:35:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F0F9F19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:34:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:34:25 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:34:23 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <449ec4835a7a3c9912f335420d4912af@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:34:27 -0400 this is what scripts are for, admiral. cat >/bin/ip/easyppp <; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:36:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:37:12 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:37:11 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Panic when booting for setup From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:37:16 -0400 > I've got the ISO-image of the actual Plan9 release from the Plan9 > homepage and now tried to install it under VMware (Linux 2.4.18). > Therefore I configured VMware to use the ISOimage as CD-ROM drive, > mounted the image as loop device and configured VMware to use > 'bootdisk.img' from the CD's root as floppy disk. In VMware's 'BIOS' I Boot the CD directly instead. > switched Floppy A: to '2.88MB 3 1/2"', but when booting I get the > following message: > > ,---------------------------------------------------. > | PBS...Plan 9 from Bell Labs | > | ELCR: 0200 | > | apm ax=f000 cx=f000 dx=40 di=ffff ebx=4c72 esi=-1 | > | FLAGS=246 TRAP=e ECODE=2 PC=80029ddc | > | x, nmiesc=0x80311000 | > | SI 00cef000 DI 81000000 BP 80311000 | > | CS 0010 DS 0008 ES 0008 FS 0008 GS 0008 | > | CR0 80000011 CR2 81000000 CR3 0000c000 | > | panic: exception/interrupt 14 | > `---------------------------------------------------' VMware does not boot 2.88MB floppy images from the floppy drive. 2.88MB images only boot as part of a CD boot. > Is there any way to install this nice OS or can anybody say, what's the > reason for this message? Sure, go to the additional software page and download the preinstalled VMware disk images. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 20:45:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 20:45:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4035 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 20:45:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4031 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 20:45:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 20:45:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE1B319980; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:45:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8B56619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:44:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:45:17 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:45:16 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <40501cc48dccb5d90f0d11371bf63d48@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vhkonvtteebuqyegxzdocetnur" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:45:18 -0400 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vhkonvtteebuqyegxzdocetnur Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > What is for a, b, c, by the way? Sorry to prolong this, but I don't see an answer to this part of the message. /n/a, /n/b, and /n/c are used by a:, b:, and c:, which now mount on both /n/_: and /n/_. the colon-less mountpoint is easier for acme and the plumber. --upas-vhkonvtteebuqyegxzdocetnur Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Jul 11 22:09:36 EDT 2002 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Jul 11 22:09:35 EDT 2002 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74F5319A69; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:09:08 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 559A419A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Jul 2002 22:08:04 -0400 (EDT) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20020712020804.559A419A1C@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] cdrom floppy tape etc, media mount point Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Jul 2002 11:07:28 +0900 This is not so important, I know. However it annoyes me offen, particularly when I need to explain it to newbies. I remember some discussions were undertaken here before, but I don't see the difference in the new release. I suppose none did not pay attention so much to this. :-) /n is for mount points of file trees from network. /mnt is for mount points of user level file severs. Then, where can we put local floppy(a:, b: etc.) or disks other than kfs filesystem? If we could have another directory such as /media or just /m, we can push out all the local stuffs into it. Even if those are imported from network, the name of m or media will not suffer from unmatched naming. Then, we don't need /mnt/cd, either. This does not deny to have those names under /n, of course. However it may annoy many of newbies. Then, /m could have directories of 9 9fat a: b: c: d: cd tapefs boot kfs What is for a, b, c, by the way? Kenji --upas-vhkonvtteebuqyegxzdocetnur-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 20:50:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 20:50:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4104 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 20:50:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4100 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 20:50:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 20:50:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 481C119A94; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:50:16 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (ampl.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 26E7E199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:49:15 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:49:33 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 07:49:32 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] removefid() question From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 07:49:32 -0400 > If I call removefid() without holding a reference to the Fid > involved, AFAIK, it should unref the Fid and it should be deleted. > Is this correct? > > My removefid() seems not to do so, so I had to > allocfid() > ... > lookupfid() > removefid() > closefid() // for alloc > closefid() // for remove > > I didn't change removefid() because I'm not sure it's a bug and > I may be missing something. > > What's the right way? Removefid returns the fid it removed, if any. So the right way is allocfid() closefid() // for allocfid ... lookupfid() closefid() // for lookup closefid(removefid()) it bothers me that this is one more closefid than you mentioned. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 21:01:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 21:01:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4254 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 21:01:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4250 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 21:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 21:01:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23FEF19A9D; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:01:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EC44A19A6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:00:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 08:00:55 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 08:00:53 EDT 2002 Message-ID: <39adcb0c58f289be9c04f5a840e7cf5d@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] upas/fs -f/pop/... From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:00:54 -0400 > since a few people using Plan 9 also use Demon Internet, i'd thought > i'd mention that when reading the source i noticed that (probably) the pop3 support in > upas/fs won't work correctly with Demon Internet's pop3 service > because that reorders and thus renumbers messages on each call. the numbers are irrelevant, but yes, the pop3 source assumes that the messages are ordered chronologically. sigh. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 21:16:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 21:16:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 4466 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 21:16:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4462 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 21:16:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 21:16:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96F9819AA9; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:16:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9727319A9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:15:37 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 08:15:55 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 08:15:54 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] replica From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 08:15:52 -0400 > When I have some local change to a file, replica reports it without telling me > what was changed in the replica server. Sometime, I want to know what was > changed at Labs, because I have no such solid confidence to myself in many > case. ;_; > > May I ask you to put the changed file of the replica server to my local disk > with modifying the name, say such kenji.c to kenji.c.p9bell? i really don't want to start copying random files around when there are conflicts. i don't care about most of them and don't want to spend the time downloading. you could use this script though. g% cat /bin/updiff #!/bin/rc rfork e path = (/bin/) d = /n/sources/plan9 if(! test -e $d) 9fs sources for(i in $*){ echo '=====' $i '=====' ls -lmd $i switch($i){ case /* diff -n $d/$i $i case * i = `{cleanname -d `{pwd} $i} diff -n $d/$i $i } } g% cd /sys/src/cmd g% updiff tar.c ===== tar.c ===== [] --rw-rw-r-- M 8 glenda sys 12030 Feb 28 15:04 tar.c /n/sources/plan9//sys/src/cmd/tar.c:268,269 c /sys/src/cmd/tar.c:268 < /* the mode test is ugly but sometimes necessary */ < if (dblock.dbuf.linkflag == '5' || (sp->mode&0170000) == 040000) { --- > if(dblock.dbuf.linkflag == '5') /n/sources/plan9//sys/src/cmd/tar.c:271,272 d /sys/src/cmd/tar.c:269 < sp->mode |= DMDIR; < } g% From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 22:14:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 22:14:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5166 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 22:14:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5162 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 22:14:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 22:14:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A78BD19AA2; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:14:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from harvest.rutgers.edu (harvest.rutgers.edu [128.6.198.71]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53FA3199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:13:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (bhancock@localhost) by harvest.rutgers.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6UDDN402592 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:13:23 -0400 From: Brian Hancock To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] DHCP in version 4 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:13:23 -0400 (EDT) I upgraded to version 4 from 3 but find that DHCP is not started on boot like version 3. The ethernet card is seen: #l0: elnk3: 100Mbps port 0xD400 irq: 11: 000102EB8BE4 I've also noticed that when I try to start the httpd, I get the message: access permission denied even though I've disk/kfscmd allow. When I drop back to version 3 everything works. Have I missed something. Thanks, Brian From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 22:23:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 22:23:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5260 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 22:23:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5256 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 22:23:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 22:23:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C88A19AA5; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:23:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (mta02-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.42]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE82E19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:22:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta02-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020730132205.DCRY290.mta02-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 14:22:05 +0100 Message-ID: <011401c237cc$1a07a580$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] DHCP in version 4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 14:22:05 +0100 > I upgraded to version 4 from 3 but find that DHCP is not started on boot > like version 3. The ethernet card is seen: > #l0: elnk3: 100Mbps port 0xD400 irq: 11: 000102EB8BE4 > I've also noticed that when I try to start the httpd, I get the message: > access permission denied even though I've disk/kfscmd allow. > When I drop back to version 3 everything works. > Have I missed something. Thanks, > Brian > > it's not ip/httpd its ip/httpd/httpd From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 22:31:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 22:31:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5354 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 22:31:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5350 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 22:31:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 22:31:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D81CE19AAB; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:31:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 537D9199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:30:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: "Russ Cox" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] DHCP in version 4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:30:19 -0400 uncomment the line ip/ipconfig in /rc/bin/termrc to start a dhcp client at boot time. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Tue Jul 30 22:42:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Jul 30 22:42:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 5484 invoked by uid 1020); 30 Jul 2002 22:42:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5480 invoked from network); 30 Jul 2002 22:42:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 30 Jul 2002 22:42:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 718F019AAD; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:42:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from harvest.rutgers.edu (harvest.rutgers.edu [128.6.198.71]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1886B199EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:41:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (bhancock@localhost) by harvest.rutgers.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6UDeYP02626 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:40:34 -0400 From: Brian Hancock To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] DHCP in version 4 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 09:40:34 -0400 (EDT) Thanks to everyone who responded so quickly. A silly mistake about ip/httpd/httpd sorry. Everything's working now. Regards, Brian On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, Russ Cox wrote: > uncomment the line > > ip/ipconfig > > in /rc/bin/termrc to start a dhcp client > at boot time. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 01:19:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 01:19:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7519 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 01:19:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7515 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 01:19:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 01:19:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A904A19A7B; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:19:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A3452199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:18:20 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] no job control; thank you! From: David Gordon Hogan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:18:36 -0400 >> I have an Inferno app that monitors /dev/draw and remembers enough state >> to reproduce the display (actively) on the /dev/draw of any client that connects >> to it on a network port. The clients can connect at any time. >> It does need a real local /dev/draw to do the grunge and maintain the images. > > post it! i've wanted that for plan 9 for a while. This sounds similar in spirit to what consolefs does... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 01:36:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 01:36:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 7661 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 01:36:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7657 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 01:36:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 01:36:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EFE919A8F; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:36:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 865D619980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 12:35:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6UGZGx8004375 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:35:17 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6UGZGmj004374 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:35:16 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020730183515.G888@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us Subject: [9fans] A quickie, please Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 18:35:16 +0200 Russ Cox posted a short script to (apparently) add the actual fonts to the postscript version of the man pages so they would print correctly on most postscript printers. I don't have that script handy, and would very much like it right now, when I have access to a QMS printer. If someone could post the script or equivalent (and maybe a formula to avoid generating postscript from man pages _without_ the fonts), I would dearly appreciate it. I won't be here long, so rather mail me than repost to the list. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 03:38:31 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 03:38:31 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 8783 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 03:38:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8779 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 03:38:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 03:38:31 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4153E19A6B; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 14:38:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5E35A19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 14:37:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 14:37:29 EDT 2002 Received: from 18.24.6.230 ([18.24.6.230]) by plan9; Tue Jul 30 14:37:28 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] error in man 2 9p From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2002 14:37:33 -0400 > it's only a little thing but then manual says > > write should attempt to write the r->ifcall.n bytes of r->ifcall.data to > offset r->ifcall.offset of the file > > it's not r->ifcall.n but r->ifcall.count and in the next half of the sentence (not quoted) it's not r->ofcall.offset but r->ofcall.count. both are fixed on sources now. thanks. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 08:46:25 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 08:46:25 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 11381 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 08:46:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11377 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 08:46:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 08:46:24 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.30.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61A6419A58; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:46:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (mta05-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.45]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD0BA19A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Jul 2002 19:45:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from KIKE ([80.4.204.35]) by mta05-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.27 201-229-121-127-20010626) with SMTP id <20020730234503.NMBF28874.mta05-svc.ntlworld.com@KIKE> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:45:03 +0100 Message-ID: <019001c23823$2190e530$6501a8c0@KIKE> From: "matt" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] DHCP in version 4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:45:03 +0100 > Thanks to everyone who responded so quickly. A silly mistake about > ip/httpd/httpd sorry. I think the quick response it's testament to the ease at typing ip/httpd and recognising that disk/kfscmd allow didn't cure mine either both times :) M From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 13:07:27 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 13:07:27 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 18715 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 13:07:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18711 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 13:07:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 13:07:26 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6BF219A6B; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:07:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9BA9A1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:05:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] rxmitproc Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:08:12 +0900 At booting Plan 9, after the message of root is from[il[il]): console says arp rxmitproc started ^^^^^^^^ What does this mean? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 13:26:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 13:26:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 19188 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 13:26:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19184 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 13:26:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 13:26:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31F7419A76; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8FA1419A74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:25:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Jul 31 00:25:45 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Wed Jul 31 00:25:44 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rxmitproc From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:25:41 -0400 it means the arp retransmit proc has been started. it's a debugging print from the ipv6 transition, i believe. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 13:45:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 13:45:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 20384 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 13:45:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20380 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 13:45:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 13:45:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A96CE19A7C; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:45:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCBC619A5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:44:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id g6V4iFx8006285 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:44:15 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.3/8.12.3/Submit) id g6V4iEJB006284 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:44:14 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20020731064414.K888@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us Subject: [9fans] fontify Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:44:14 +0200 Geoff Collyer kindly replied to my request for a procedure to add fonts to a postscript file. My thanks to Geoff for this. I propose to add the details to the wiki unless someone beats me to it. I'd like to compare notes with the version Russ Cox published before and add a short usage/purpose description, which I'll knock up in the next day or two. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 15:12:24 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 15:12:24 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 22696 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 15:12:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22691 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 15:12:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 15:12:23 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D3A319A87; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 02:12:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6B23619A78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 02:11:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <6492492abd91c67eedabeee6cf9ccf05@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rxmitproc From: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-conlzyritdlmkjpgpxcmbjijkx" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 15:13:39 +0900 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-conlzyritdlmkjpgpxcmbjijkx Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks Russ. Now, I got the position of rxmitproc in the huge namespace of Plan 9. :-) Contorl(2) was also revised, and I'm getting in trouble... Anyway, it's too hot these days! (over 36 ℃!!!) Kenji --upas-conlzyritdlmkjpgpxcmbjijkx Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Wed Jul 31 13:26:45 JST 2002 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id NAA08486 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:12:02 +0900 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3/3.7W-02040219) with ESMTP id NAA07388 for ; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:26:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.16.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31F7419A76; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:26:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8FA1419A74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:25:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Jul 31 00:25:45 EDT 2002 Received: from 141.154.230.114 ([141.154.230.114]) by plan9; Wed Jul 31 00:25:44 EDT 2002 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rxmitproc From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 00:25:41 -0400 it means the arp retransmit proc has been started. it's a debugging print from the ipv6 transition, i believe. russ --upas-conlzyritdlmkjpgpxcmbjijkx-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 17:32:22 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 17:32:22 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25786 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 17:32:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25782 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 17:32:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 17:32:21 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.8.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEFA919A8C; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 04:32:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from 9fs.org (cotswold.demon.co.uk [194.222.75.186]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 64E8C199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 04:31:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Received: from 62.189.36.28 ([62.189.36.28]) by 9fs.org; Wed Jul 31 09:32:51 BST 2002 From: "Nigel Roles" To: "9fans@cse.psu.edu" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Priority: Normal X-Mailer: PMMail 2000 Standard (2.20.2200) For Windows 2000 (5.0.2195;2) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Managing without a floppy disk drive Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "Nigel Roles" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:31:16 +0100 Say I had a PC motherboard without a floppy disk drive connector. It's got IDE, USB, parallel, ethernet, PCI. However, the ethernet is unsupported (yet). How would I develop the ethernet driver for 9load/9pcdisk? It does occur to me that I could plug a supported ethernet card into the PCI socket, then develop the kernel driver by booting it over the ether. I've not paid attention to how USB floppy based systems (e.g. Sony Vaio) are booted. How is this done? Any other suggestions appreciated. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 17:40:21 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 17:40:21 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 25931 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 17:40:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25927 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 17:40:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 17:40:20 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5190319A8F; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 04:40:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (closedmind.org [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 16464199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 04:39:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Managing without a floppy disk drive MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 04:39:20 -0400 On Wed Jul 31 04:32:45 EDT 2002, nigel@9fs.org wrote: > Say I had a PC motherboard without a floppy disk drive connector. > It's got IDE, USB, parallel, ethernet, PCI. However, the ethernet is > unsupported (yet). > > How would I develop the ethernet driver for 9load/9pcdisk? > > It does occur to me that I could plug a supported ethernet card > into the PCI socket, then develop the kernel driver by booting > it over the ether. > > I've not paid attention to how USB floppy based systems (e.g. > Sony Vaio) are booted. How is this done? > > Any other suggestions appreciated. Plugging a supported ethernet card into the PCI is the easiest option. Boot from a CD. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 18:12:20 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 18:12:20 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 26557 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 18:12:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26553 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 18:12:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 18:12:19 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.6.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22FEE19A8D; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 05:12:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from theraft.strakt.com (theraft.strakt.com [62.13.29.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7C3219A94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 05:11:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from strakt.com (boyd@zode.strakt.com [62.13.29.39]) by theraft.strakt.com (8.12.2/8.12.2/Debian -5) with ESMTP id g6V9BSMS016830 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 11:11:28 +0200 Message-ID: <3D47A9C0.6090803@strakt.com> From: Boyd Roberts User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.0) Gecko/20020623 Debian/1.0.0-0.woody.1 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Managing without a floppy disk drive References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 11:11:28 +0200 Nigel Roles wrote: >I've not paid attention to how USB floppy based systems (e.g. >Sony Vaio) are booted. How is this done? > This trickery is done by getting the BIOS to boot the floppy and then to get plan 9 to use a copy of the floppy on c: Look at: http://home.fr.inter.net/boyd/code/plan9/usbflop.html But I don't think it'll help you in your case. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 19:05:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 19:05:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27407 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 19:05:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27402 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 19:05:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 19:05:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AA2619A8D; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:05:15 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BA3E19A6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:04:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17Zptx-00065L-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 10:36:17 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <02071518312800.00562@localhost.localdomain> Subject: Re: [9fans] ppp and other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:35:57 GMT plan9@kp.km.ua (Andrey S. Kukhar) wrote in message news:<02071518312800.00562@localhost.localdomain>... > good day all, > why telco fails when i type: > telco /dev/eia1 > con -l telco!62111 > with printing ``Jul 15 18:06:08 mount failed: interrupted''? > thanks, > > -ask I have the same problem. I'm guessing that it's because I'm using an older modem (Still good for faxes!) that uses 7 bits no parity and won't accept anything else. Same story for you? As far as I can tell, there's no way to set those options. Am I wrong? Thanks! Ben From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 19:06:19 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 19:06:19 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 27441 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 19:06:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27437 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 19:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 19:06:18 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BD0019A9C; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:06:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2002D1999B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:05:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 17ZptO-00060o-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 10:35:42 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Ben Message-ID: Organization: http://groups.google.com/ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <45427616dfeeac8239866d30aed7d071@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] missing compilers? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 09:35:35 GMT As long as we're talking about Plan 9 on Apple hardware, what about the Motorola 68x based macs? Shouldn't one be able to port it to one of these machines, or does Plan 9 require the PowerPC stuff? Also, I see you mentioned Inferno under OS X. For those of us who haven't upgraded yet, would it be possible to port it to the classic Mac os's? I know that it'd be difficult because of all the resource stuff, plus there's no command line-like place for output. (There's always MPW's Worksheet, but I'm guessing that not many people use it anymore.) Anyway, has anyone even looked at this? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 21:31:29 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 21:31:29 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29097 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 21:31:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29092 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 21:31:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 21:31:28 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.23.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F26F719A9D; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:31:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from crufty.research.bell-labs.com (ns2.research.bell-labs.com [204.178.16.49]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1F2619A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:30:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from grubby.research.bell-labs.com (H-135-104-2-9.research.bell-labs.com [135.104.2.9]) by crufty.research.bell-labs.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6VCUtCT050000 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:30:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nslocum.cs.bell-labs.com (nslocum.cs.bell-labs.com [135.104.8.38]) by grubby.research.bell-labs.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g6VCUmo17757 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from research.bell-labs.com ([135.104.66.236]) by nslocum.cs.bell-labs.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g6VCUmjq84124872 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:30:48 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3D47DEC4.CAA8EFFB@research.bell-labs.com> From: "Lakshman N. Yagati" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rxmitproc References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:57:40 -0400 Russ is right. I left the message by accident. It has been removed. - ynl Russ Cox wrote: > it means the arp retransmit proc has been started. > it's a debugging print from the ipv6 transition, i believe. > > russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 21:33:18 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 21:33:18 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29116 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 21:33:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29112 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 21:33:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 21:33:17 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79C6519AA2; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:33:13 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 02C2D19A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:32:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] missing compilers? From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 13:38:42 +0100 > Also, I see you mentioned Inferno under OS X. For those of us who > haven't upgraded yet, would it be possible to port it to the classic > Mac os's? I know that it'd be difficult because of all the resource > stuff, plus there's no command line-like place for output. (There's > always MPW's Worksheet, but I'm guessing that not many people use it > anymore.) Anyway, has anyone even looked at this? it would be very difficult as classic macos doesn't have proper processes, which inferno relies on. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-admin Wed Jul 31 21:59:23 JST 2002 remote from ar Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Jul 31 21:59:23 JST 2002 Received: (qmail 29391 invoked by uid 1020); 31 Jul 2002 21:59:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29387 invoked from network); 31 Jul 2002 21:59:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (130.203.4.6) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 21:59:22 +0900 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.18.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8FF619AA9; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:59:14 -0400 (EDT) Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from fbsd.acl.lanl.gov (fbsd.acl.lanl.gov [128.165.147.119]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4AB4919AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Jul 2002 08:58:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: (qmail 35495 invoked by uid 18927); 31 Jul 2002 12:52:37 -0000 Received: from localhost (sendmail-bs@127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 31 Jul 2002 12:52:37 -0000 From: andrey mirtchovski X-X-Sender: andrey@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] shared memory In-Reply-To: <15685.9057.72875.389455@nanonic.hilbert.space> Message-ID: <20020731065115.J35477-100000@fbsd.acl.lanl.gov> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Jul 2002 06:52:37 -0600 (MDT) the real problem with the sis630 is that it lacks hardware cursor... i have some ocde that will attempt to get the sis630 going but when i finally figured out the 'no HW cursor' part i gave up... andrey On Mon, 29 Jul 2002 paurea@gsyc.escet.urjc.es wrote: > I am writing (or trying to :-)) the driver for the sis630 vga card. It > uses shared memory, i.e. the video memory comes from the normal ram of > the computer. At first it seemed to me I had to reserve memory for it > like a dma buffer, but after looking more closely to the linux driver, > it seems to me that something hardware is going on and that the memory > is reserved some way by the bios works as normal video memory. Does > anybody know how this should be treated?. Any pointers to info?. > -- > Saludos, > Gorka > > "Curiosity sKilled the cat" >