From cis-pervc-bounces@listserver.njit.edu Mon Mar 1 08:23:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 00:38:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23174 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 00:38:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23170 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 00:38:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 00:38:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84CDF19DE9; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:38:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85A7C19BBD; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:38:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0BDDE19BD0; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail-shield1.njit.edu (mail-shield1.njit.edu [128.235.251.171]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC38A19B99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by mail-shield1.njit.edu (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i1TFbes22476 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from nodnsquery(128.235.251.32) by mail-shield1.njit.edu via csmap (V4.1) id srcAAA9_aq5R; Sun, 29 Feb 04 10:37:39 -0500 Received: from listserver.njit.edu (listserver.njit.edu [128.235.251.42]) by mail-gw4.njit.edu (8.12.10/8.12.4) with ESMTP id i1TFbdpN008157 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from listserver.njit.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by listserver.njit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A9321C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:38 -0500 (EST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: cis-pervc-bounces@listserver.njit.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: cis-pervc@listserver.njit.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.3 X-List-Administrivia: yes Subject: [9fans] Your message to Cis-pervc awaits moderator approval Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:37:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Your mail to 'Cis-pervc' with the subject Jessica Is being held until the list moderator can review it for approval. The reason it is being held: Post by non-member to a members-only list Either the message will get posted to the list, or you will receive notification of the moderator's decision. If you would like to cancel this posting, please visit the following URL: http://listserver.njit.edu/mailman/confirm/cis-pervc/38e72cfbb650d8660c89b4d73e47d92d3ce89876 From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 1 08:23:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 01:24:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26847 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 01:24:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26843 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 01:24:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 01:24:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF06D19DFB; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:24:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A285619DC9; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:24:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4512E19DDB; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:23:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C8B419DC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:23:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3d5c5b0a3fb8d0c9fb504edc9ced67d7@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] install without rio From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 09:23:34 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > One can now change the wiki using the acme interface. The hope is that > at people screwing with the wiki will at least have to be using our > protocols. If you can't dissuade them, enlighten them... I like it! From swasey@cs.cmu.edu Mon Mar 1 08:23:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 01:26:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26919 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 01:26:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26909 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 01:26:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 01:26:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D95D19DE8; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:26:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A65D119B81; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:26:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A80119DAD; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:25:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 372EC19BD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:25:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from patton.home (c-24-3-55-90.client.comcast.net[24.3.55.90]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <200402291625530150049bqne>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 16:25:53 +0000 Message-ID: <8d3aa4d58bde7cdc6b4d39c21684bff4@cs.cmu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: David Swasey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] dvips Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:25:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The first time dvips sees a "new" font, it generates some file it needs and saves the generated file for subsequent runs. This memoization did not work because the program mktexupd was failing to record that the generated file exists. The patch below fixes mktexupd and significantly speeds up dvips. (The old code either confused APE's sh or was broken. Sed saw the filename '"/sys/lib/texmf/ls-R"' rather than '/sys/lib/texmf/ls-R'.) -dave diff /n/dump/2004/0229/sys/lib/texmf/web2c/mktexupd /sys/lib/texmf/web2c/mktexupd 41,42c41,43 < test "x`sed 1q \"$db_file\"`" = "x$ls_R_magic" \ < || test "x`sed 1q \"$db_file\"`" = "x$old_ls_R_magic" \ --- > found_magic=`sed 1q "$db_file"` > test "x$found_magic" = "x$ls_R_magic" \ > || test "x$found_magic" = "x$old_ls_R_magic" \ From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 1 08:23:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 02:44:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30005 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 02:44:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30001 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 02:44:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 02:44:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3F8B19E0B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AACBE19E09; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:44:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6083B19D54; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:43:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29F0319D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:43:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1THhd0V003472 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:39 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3/Submit) id i1THhcaN003471 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:39 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us Organization: Proxima Research & Development Subject: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:38 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It seems to me that imap4d and Outlook disagree on the interpretation of dates. As displayed, the year and day are interchanged. The fact that changing the date representation in the regional settings (NT-4, Settings/Regional Settings/Date) causes Outlook to crash rather dramatically (maybe it can't cope with the representation of an inverted date) does nothing to reassure me that the problem is in imap4d. But it doesn't hurt to ask. I have very little intention of reading the IMAP RFCs, if you'll forgive me. ++L PS: If it helps, I _can_ try Mozilla's mailer as comparison, but not immediately. From davel@anvil.com Mon Mar 1 08:23:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 02:57:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30487 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 02:57:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30483 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 02:57:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 02:57:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12A8619E06; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:57:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A2A419E08; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:57:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75BA519D54; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:56:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9179B19ADB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:56:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 49FBA43B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:55:29 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67431438; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:55:28 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA11064; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:56:26 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook From: Dave Lukes To: Lucio De Re Cc: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> References: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078077689.18041.30.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:01:29 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: L, If you can wait until tomorrow morning, I can at least save you wasting a barf-bag: I've been Poking at Post-offices with Python for the previous few weeks, so it won't take me long to find the answer. IIRC, it's RFC822-like, so it'll have all sorts of evil muck like timezone offsets in it. Dave. On Sun, 2004-02-29 at 17:43, Lucio De Re wrote: > It seems to me that imap4d and Outlook disagree on the interpretation > of dates. As displayed, the year and day are interchanged. > > The fact that changing the date representation in the regional > settings (NT-4, Settings/Regional Settings/Date) causes Outlook to > crash rather dramatically (maybe it can't cope with the representation > of an inverted date) does nothing to reassure me that the problem > is in imap4d. > > But it doesn't hurt to ask. I have very little intention of reading > the IMAP RFCs, if you'll forgive me. > > ++L > > PS: If it helps, I _can_ try Mozilla's mailer as comparison, but > not immediately. From matthias@mteege.de Mon Mar 1 08:23:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 03:01:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30614 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 03:01:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30609 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 03:01:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 03:01:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8731B19B81; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:01:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7E7719E09; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:01:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D36D319D54; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:00:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [81.2.131.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 930F019ADB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 79240 invoked by uid 66); 29 Feb 2004 18:00:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 10732 invoked from network); 29 Feb 2004 17:56:27 -0000 Received: from gic.mteege.de (HELO mteege.de) (192.168.153.10) by 0 with SMTP; 29 Feb 2004 17:56:27 -0000 Received: (qmail 46797 invoked from network); 29 Feb 2004 17:56:26 -0000 Received: from loco.mteege.de (HELO loco) (192.168.153.22) by 0 with SMTP; 29 Feb 2004 17:56:26 -0000 Message-ID: From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] start network file service on boot Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 17:55:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Moin, I want to serve a directory tree from an externel (FreeBSD) server which runs u9fs via httpd(8). I can start the file service with srv -m tcp!ipaddr name /n/name Is it possible to run this command at boottime on the CPU server? What ist the best place for that? Matthias From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 1 08:23:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 03:08:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30934 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 03:08:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30930 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 03:08:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 03:08:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 937F419E19; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:08:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C355219E13; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:08:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 555A619E14; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:07:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF97319D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:07:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9485e6fb1d46820a16d0988621e941a8@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] start network file service on boot From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 10:11:12 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Moin, > > I want to serve a directory tree from an externel (FreeBSD) server which > runs u9fs via httpd(8). I can start the file service with > > srv -m tcp!ipaddr name /n/name > > Is it possible to run this command at boottime on the CPU server? What > ist the best place for that? > > Matthias /rc/bin/cpurc :) From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 08:23:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 04:15:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1172 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 04:15:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1168 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 04:15:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 04:15:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E29BF19D82; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:15:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1375E19BFF; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:15:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3405119DC8; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:14:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27B9C19B8F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:12:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i1TJA6ki053696 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:10:06 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i1TJA6UC053695 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:10:06 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200402291910.i1TJA6UC053695@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] drawterm+sam Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:10:06 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: drawterm built from current sources, FreeBSD; sam puts blanks instead of glyphs (that is, no text, just spaces). Other programs (acme) work as expected. Where to look? From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 1 08:23:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 04:28:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1995 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 04:28:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1985 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 04:28:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 04:28:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E82F19AAA; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:28:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9859E19E22; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:28:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CDD219E2A; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA5A719AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:26:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7984b3be2b7f45e5110d2998a117eb57@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm+sam From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200402291910.i1TJA6UC053695@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:31:00 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > drawterm built from current sources, FreeBSD; sam puts blanks instead of glyphs > (that is, no text, just spaces). Other programs (acme) work as expected. Where > to look? it's a race in drawterm resulting it no text being shown on terminals. you can either look back through the archives for others' suggestions or just resize the window until the text appears. starting acme does it for me. you won't get that with vnc, and if you aren't using acme then you won't miss the cursor repositioning that vnc doesn't implement. From jbarham@jbarham.com Mon Mar 1 08:23:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 05:06:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3695 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 05:06:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3691 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 05:06:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 05:06:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4045019E37; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D02A19A05; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:06:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF35819E2B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:05:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd5mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8946019A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:05:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd3mr1so.prod.shaw.ca (pd3mr1so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.177]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTV00HFJ3K2Q4@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:00:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml10so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml10so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.80]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTV00K2M3K2KI@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:00:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from hpn5415 (h24-87-250-11.vc.shawcable.net [24.87.250.11]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTV00F4U3K2S1@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 13:00:02 -0700 (MST) From: "John E. Barham" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Subject: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 11:59:48 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm working w/ a system that stores 10's of thousands of high-definition images per project (think movies). Storing all of the files on a single file server is not feasible (even w/ 3 x 1.8 TB arrays per Linux file server) and even if it were possible would be sub-optimal from a network standpoint since literally hundreds of image processing nodes could be hitting the server simultaneously. Keeping track of where the files for a particular project are physically stored is a nuisance and it can be time-consuming to track down the location of a particular file, esp. for some of the less technically minded users (e.g., artists). Our solution is to develop a virtual mapping service that maps logical URLs (e.g., /project/shot/frame010000.tiff) to physical location (e.g., /server10/home/user/project/shot/frame010000.tiff), but this requires adding support to client applications to work properly. Cumbersome but still a lot cheaper than buying high-end dedicated storage solutions, and even then we'd run out of space. (We considered using HTTP redirection but couldn't see how to make this work efficiently for PUT operations.) It occurred to me that Plan 9 has already solved this problem by being able to (securely) mount remote filesystems and do a union on directories. (Correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC creating a file in a unioned folder would add the file to the original folder location.) Even something as seemingly simple as collecting stats on drive usage per server is a pain on Linux. For the moment we're running du over ssh using an expect style module in Python. Again, Plan 9 would make that trivial either by mounting the remote file server directly, or possibly running the script after doing a cpu connection. Anyway, it's a truism that the more powerful hardware gets (in both CPU power and storage capacity) the more ways we find to use it to capacity, so mechanisms that Plan 9 provides to present a seamless view of distributed resources are becoming more necessary, not less. John P.S. Forgive me if I'm hazy on the details of the Plan 9 commands, but the website appears to be down at the moment... From jas@corpus-callosum.com Mon Mar 1 08:23:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 05:27:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4660 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 05:27:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4656 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 05:27:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 05:27:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DCED819E42; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:27:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C9D519C05; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:27:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A089B19E23; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:26:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72EC619B04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:26:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i1TKQcfK078802 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:26:38 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> References: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <90923238-6AF5-11D8-829B-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:26:33 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Feb 29, 2004, at 1:59 PM, John E. Barham wrote: ... > (securely) mount remote filesystems and do a union on directories. > (Correct > me if I'm wrong, but IIRC creating a file in a unioned folder would > add the > file to the original folder location.) > ... When you can look at the web pages again: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/bind If for some reason you can't go with a Plan 9 solution, you might want to check out The Handle System (http://www.handle.net/). Come to think of it, adding hdl support to Plan 9 might be a nice project on it's own. jas From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 1 08:23:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 05:35:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4957 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 05:35:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4952 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 05:35:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 05:35:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E51BF19E23; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 751C219A23; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:35:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4E8A19E2A; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:34:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF57419C05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 15:34:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5eb036eb621fc8ca01d2b10665ad4e7d@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:38:51 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It's not that you can't do it in Lunix -- look at Globus' Replica Location Service or MDS (Metasomething Discovery Service, they keep changing the name) for just a few of the options for handling replication, there are others specifically tailored to clusters too. They are all crufty, don't play well with each other, require their own clients and a pain in the proverbial to administer, but that's a consequence of the multiple layers of abstraction they're built upon to avoid admitting that UNIX simply lacks a decent mechanism for importing remote resources. Binding remote exports in a union directory is so trivial in Plan 9 that it's really a non-issue (you'll spend much more time tracking which files are stored where, especially if they move). The show stoppers are the clients -- what will you be using on the client side? Will you require users to be running Plan 9 to access the service, or are you prepared to spend some time developing a way to bring it to their environment (by, say, implementing a 9p client suitable for the task, something like v9fs)... Plan 9 lets you do something elegantly, bringing the result to the outside world may be a bit trickier :) my $0.02: andrey From rsc@swtch.com Mon Mar 1 08:23:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 08:20:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12319 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 08:20:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12315 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 08:20:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 08:20:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E18E19E31; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14A9A19DE3; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:20:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F40219DEB; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:19:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AD8419DCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:19:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AxaDZ-000EHO-RD for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:19:29 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <54892.1078096767.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Subject: [9fans] os x box with compilers, x11 libraries, and ssh login? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:19:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'd like to try to get my acme port running on OS X, but I need access to an OS X box with compilers and X11 libraries. If anyone has such a box attached to the internet and is willing to give me an account for using ssh for such purposes, please email me. Thanks. Russ From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:07:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14506 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:07:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14502 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:07:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:07:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8F45719E50; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15A7819E3A; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FB8E19DE3; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5120719E05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334589-12153>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:45 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c3ff18$959df180$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <9d7db04bb484d8fc08e87e8d50dd7206@9srv.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] pathetic MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:11:47 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > my bet is about 3.5 weeks before election day. i'm about to swaps hats [baseball caps] to ENIGMA. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:08:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14533 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:08:08 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14529 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:08:08 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:08:08 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1D6219E64; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:08:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8589019E21; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D8BD19E05; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE1F919E21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334536-12144>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:45 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c3ff18$950fe250$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:10:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i think it was rob, but i'm not sure, who said: linear is programming is hard enough, but concurrent programming is beyond the 'average' programmer. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:08:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14580 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:08:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14575 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:08:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:08:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B4C8219E7D; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:08:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF9F119E21; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:08:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 379E319E3B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E3BA19A6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334336-12153>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:35 -0500 Message-ID: <000201c3ff18$8f705eb0$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <0d7bea785d989cd275b7ca67cfa6cdeb@yourdomain.dom> <006201c3fdde$a6339030$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:59:39 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.7 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_PAST_03_06 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i had trouble believing that the screeds of banter were from linus. > maybe he has a ghost writer. this is the bigest kernel (sic) in the southern hemisphere. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:09:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14661 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:09:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14657 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:09:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:09:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B18B819E7E; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:09:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0EE419DE0; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:09:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6215319E64; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E939219E5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334928-12147>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:49 -0500 Message-ID: <000d01c3ff18$97aa1530$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, References: <0374a3982e4b359e09ce2a3be9192f06@yourdomain.dom> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:17:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Wrong. You have zero basis for your assertion, and it's simply bogus. the 'everything is a file' (invented 30? years ago) is a plan. unlike that hideous lunix /proc [yeah, we had that 1984]. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:10:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14701 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:10:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14697 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:10:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:10:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B47B19DE0; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:10:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBA6319E6B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:09:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 682FD19E5E; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06D0419E5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:07:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334870-12150>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:06:49 -0500 Message-ID: <000c01c3ff18$96f14c80$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:14:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I believe the shortsightedness of not imposing a strict type created > too many possibilities. This creates a bigger problem when dealing > with libraries imported into a system with no defined interface, and > you end up with the desire for one. limbo does this right. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:19:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15454 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:19:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15450 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:19:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:19:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 58C3819E43; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:19:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91BDE19E72; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:19:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 15E5419E59; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A81C419E43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <328514-12537>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:17:19 -0500 Message-ID: <00b701c3ff1a$0ecb8f80$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200402290935.i1T9ZsbV013642@ratthing-b246.strakt.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] re: spam MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:16:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: "Laura Creighton" hey pal, my 'non-use' is up soon ... From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:29:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16062 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:29:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16058 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:29:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:29:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDBE219B59; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:29:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 746A319BD1; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:29:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D96D019E6F; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:28:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24B0B19E5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:28:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <479550-21553>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:27:12 -0500 Message-ID: <014201c3ff1b$7066c8d0$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:26:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It seems to me that imap4d and Outlook disagree on the interpretation > of dates. As displayed, the year and day are interchanged. ol' 'gaijin' crispin screwed up, big time. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:32:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16316 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:32:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16312 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:32:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:32:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E388C19E81; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:32:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36A3C19E3B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:32:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DB8519E54; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:31:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BC0A19B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:31:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <329386-12538>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:30:13 -0500 Message-ID: <015e01c3ff1b$dc67dce0$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <1078077689.18041.30.camel@rea> Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:29:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > IIRC, it's RFC822-like, so it'll have all sorts of evil muck > like timezone offsets in it. walk in the park. mace knows how to do it. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 10:10:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 09:35:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16491 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 09:35:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16487 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 09:35:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 09:35:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D47F19E5F; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F0D519E7C; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:35:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 492DF19E5F; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:34:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4D2B19B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:34:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([135.196.95.21]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3696071-22734>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:33:42 -0500 Message-ID: <019901c3ff1c$595c8a70$26fea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5eb036eb621fc8ca01d2b10665ad4e7d@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 00:32:49 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It's not that you can't do it in Lunix -- look at Globus' Replica > Location Service or MDS (Metasomething Discovery Service, they keep > changing the name) ... Meta Drongo Service From jhorey@cs.unm.edu Mon Mar 1 14:02:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 11:57:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21629 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 10:57:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21625 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 10:57:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 10:57:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6706E19BDE; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:57:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C25019BDE; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:57:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79CF519D4F; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain (bgp01387375bgs.brodwy01.nm.comcast.net [68.35.130.208]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D72CE19BD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: by localhost.localdomain (Postfix, from userid 1000) id A4739206066; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:56:35 -0700 (MST) From: James Horey To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux User-Agent: KMail/1.5.4 References: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> In-Reply-To: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200402291856.34935.jhorey@cs.unm.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: horeyjl@mercury.hendrix.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:56:34 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** > occurred to me that Plan 9 has already solved this problem by being able to > (securely) mount remote filesystems and do a union on directories. > (Correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC creating a file in a unioned folder > would add the file to the original folder location.) If I remember my reading of the documentation, I thought that when adding a file to a unioned directory, that file is placed within the first directory that was unioned and is writable. Otherwise the write fails completely. Am I wrong on this or not up to date? If I am wrong, is it now possible to select which directory you want to place your file into? -James Horey From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 1 14:02:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 12:01:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21753 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 11:01:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21749 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 11:00:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 11:00:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D6B119DED; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6933619DE8; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E1FA19DD9; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7A5519BD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <27b7658f4e965a8acfe73430e3f4d269@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook In-Reply-To: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lqakpytdmlhprlmzdekqcornoo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:00:18 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lqakpytdmlhprlmzdekqcornoo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I use outlook with our imap4d all the time and haven't noticed such a swap. Perhaps its because both are using US style dates? --upas-lqakpytdmlhprlmzdekqcornoo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Feb 29 12:44:38 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Feb 29 12:44:35 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7998E19E10; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:44:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39DFE19E04; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:44:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6083B19D54; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:43:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29F0319D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 12:43:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i1THhd0V003472 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:39 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3/Submit) id i1THhcaN003471 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:39 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans mailing list <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us Organization: Proxima Research & Development Subject: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 19:43:38 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It seems to me that imap4d and Outlook disagree on the interpretation of dates. As displayed, the year and day are interchanged. The fact that changing the date representation in the regional settings (NT-4, Settings/Regional Settings/Date) causes Outlook to crash rather dramatically (maybe it can't cope with the representation of an inverted date) does nothing to reassure me that the problem is in imap4d. But it doesn't hurt to ask. I have very little intention of reading the IMAP RFCs, if you'll forgive me. ++L PS: If it helps, I _can_ try Mozilla's mailer as comparison, but not immediately. --upas-lqakpytdmlhprlmzdekqcornoo-- From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 1 14:02:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 12:05:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21984 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 11:05:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21980 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 11:05:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 11:05:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23BA819E3F; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:05:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B31619E06; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:05:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B065819DF6; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:04:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8693019DD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:04:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <94ee7f2940524eb398c1e19ff3f9526f@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200402291856.34935.jhorey@cs.unm.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 18:04:34 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: files are created in the first directory in the union that's creatable (i.e. was bound with -c). if that attempt fails, the create fails. From rminnich@lanl.gov Mon Mar 1 14:02:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 12:41:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28688 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 12:41:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28684 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 12:41:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 12:41:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F65219C61; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:41:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8039819E23; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:41:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84B1A19E23; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:40:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 213F719C61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 22:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i213eVeF028448 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:40:31 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i213eVYj012314 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:40:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i213eVfQ009713 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:40:31 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb/cs pcauth pcf In-Reply-To: <200402282259.i1SMxMMT048349@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 20:40:30 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Here's what I finally did for setting sysname on my 9grid cluster, with 9 nodes and a frontend all of which run cpurc. sysname=`{ndb/query ether `{cat /net/ether0/addr} sys} I forget but probably stole this one from Andrey. ron From rminnich@lanl.gov Mon Mar 1 14:02:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 13:17:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31216 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 13:17:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31212 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 13:17:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 13:17:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CD24819DE8; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:17:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66DF219B4B; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:17:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C3A719C62; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:16:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3279319A1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i214GreF029632 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:16:53 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i214GqYj015483 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:16:52 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i214GqfQ010678 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:16:52 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Subject: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:16:52 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think I sent this before, but it's so nice I am sending it again. Scenario: an EPIA with linuxbios and plan 9 in flash. cpu is named cpu50. You want to muck with the kernel and debug it. Easy. . bind_test_namespace cd /sys/src/9/pc mk 'CONF=whatever' cpu -h cpu50 echo 'reboot /path/to/9whatever' > /dev/reboot boom. 9 boots 9. takes 5 seconds. If it blows up, cpu is back in 10 seconds. Add this to the 20 seconds build time (MAX!) for plan 9, and kernel hackery is now as easy as normal program hackery -- almost. Very very nice. Hats off to /dev/reboot. ron From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 1 14:02:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 13:37:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 376 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 13:37:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 371 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 13:37:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 13:37:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A422019E47; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:37:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77DD419D55; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:37:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EAC919D55; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 149A919B4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:36:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7cc63f70971c9a63a8d3810b269c7a25@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ghostscript From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ljjgnimzgwskmfttfskwrrrphu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:36:49 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ljjgnimzgwskmfttfskwrrrphu Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit AFPL Ghostscript-8.13 can be find on our web site: http://basalt.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp/plan9/gs-8.13.tgz http://basalt.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp/plan9/gs-data.tgz. Why they were removed from sources? Because none is maintaining it anymore. As you know Russ has been doing it, but he is a graduate student at MIT which means he must be very busy for his own Ph.D thema etc. Furthermore, maintaining Ghostscript is not any creative work which is neccessary to those students. We need Ghostscript for every day use of Plan 9, and that's all. Ghostscript is not in the main stream of Plan 9 design way, it uses UTF-8, but Ghostscript(8.x) uses CID-keyd character etc. To maintain Ghostscript is easy enough even for like me, which don't need Russ, Dave, Jim, Sape, and of course Rob. I think that's the reason. Kenji --upas-ljjgnimzgwskmfttfskwrrrphu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([157.16.103.2]) by diabase; Sun Feb 29 01:18:18 JST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3p2+/3.7W-03092514) with ESMTP id BAA08410 for ; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 01:15:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E102419A06; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:15:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E86221999B; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:15:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B2D519CC6; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93AB119A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:14:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-68-21-43-189.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [68.21.43.189]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i1SGEL3l077242 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:14:22 -0500 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: dbailey27@ameritech.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] ghostscript Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:08:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Morning, all Does anyone know what happened to the 8.x ghostscript stuff on the labs fs? I'm looking to upgrade so I can view files from unicode.org. The ghostscript/. directory on the Labs 9fs is empty, and there is no gs package in contrib or extra. Don (north_) --upas-ljjgnimzgwskmfttfskwrrrphu-- From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 1 14:02:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 13:41:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 590 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 13:41:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 586 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 13:41:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 13:41:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5863019E3C; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:41:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3876819D55; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:41:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D846419D55; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:40:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BDBA19CAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:40:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9d0e94efc0d0ebb3c2f2031cd8be4ac6@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <000c01c3ff18$96f14c80$26fea8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:40:51 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: By the way, it took half a day for me to read plenty of mails during these three days while I was knocked down by flu... Yeah, it was interesting to read those. Kenji From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 1 14:02:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 13:44:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 828 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 13:44:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 824 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 13:44:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 13:44:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A322219E11; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:44:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 573E319CA3; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:44:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D544319CAC; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:43:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4A3B19B4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 29 Feb 2004 23:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i214h90V007246 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:43:10 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3/Submit) id i214h8Iq007245 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:43:08 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook Message-ID: <20040301064307.B29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <27b7658f4e965a8acfe73430e3f4d269@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <27b7658f4e965a8acfe73430e3f4d269@plan9.bell-labs.com>; from David Presotto on Sun, Feb 29, 2004 at 09:00:18PM -0500 Organization: Proxima Research & Development Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:43:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, Feb 29, 2004 at 09:00:18PM -0500, David Presotto wrote: > > I use outlook with our imap4d all the time and haven't noticed such > a swap. Perhaps its because both are using US style dates? More likely because of the locality, South Africa. I only picked it up because I could not get the messages in a sensible date sequence. As I mentioned, if I adjust the date display settings, I crash Outlook, presumably because of some invalid date value, so it's hard to tell. It seemed such an obvious fault, I thought someone else would have picked on it. I'll try and find some time to dig deeper. ++L From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 1 18:28:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 16:32:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13252 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 16:32:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13248 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 16:32:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 16:32:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 072E619E37; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:32:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C876319BB7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:32:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A67E219BB7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:31:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4313819B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:31:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f1cfb1c472682d588bb1dba6f1379dd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ghostscript From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <7cc63f70971c9a63a8d3810b269c7a25@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:32:45 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > To maintain Ghostscript is easy enough even > for like me, which don't need Russ, Dave, Jim, Sape, and of course Rob. I meant they should use their power for more basic ones of Plan 9. Kenji From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:20:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16809 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:20:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16804 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:20:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:20:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A85719E48; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B9C919CA6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBCF419E3E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:19:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B73E19E36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:19:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <000901c3ff18$950fe250$26fea8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:19:16 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** >>i think it was rob, but i'm not sure, who said: > linear is programming is hard enough, but > concurrent programming is beyond the > 'average' programmer. actually, i'd say that programming generally is hard enough, and not just for the average programmer, and concurrent programming is just a special case within that. more seriously, some things are more clearly expressed and more easily implemented using concurrent processes or perhaps coroutines, so concurrency ought to be taught, and learned, and well. in contrast to the quote above, in an ancient usenet article, in the context of concurrent programming, i am reasonably certain that rob made the observation that as a discipline, we can learn. he used the example of fork(), which was considered `difficult' when it first appeared, compared to existing notions such as `jobs', but after being studied and taught in advanced programming for a time, it become familiar enough that it was suitable to be taught/used much earlier. that seems to me to be a better quote to use. i'd say from my experience that unless people insist on pronouncing themselves `full' and incapable of accepting any new ideas, which certainly does happen, they can typically learn. (otherwise, they end up saying things such as ``in every other X i've ever seen i could always do Y in this particular way''.) i think in many ways concurrent programming is more general than (say) object-oriented programming, and certainly the language constructions can be much simpler than some object-oriented ones. in other words: if you're capable of understanding `finalised virtual hyperstationary factory class', remembering the Java class hierarchy, and all the details of the Java Media Framework, you are (a) a better man than i am (b) capable of filling your mind with large chunks of complexity, so concurrent programming should be simple by comparison. go for it. ps. i made up the hyperstationary, but then again, it's probably a design pattern. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:21:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16931 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:21:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16927 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:21:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:21:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 022E219E4F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:21:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE8EA19C50; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:21:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E744519E48; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 659D419C50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:49 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i218RLZb009207 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:27:21 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] ndb/cs pcauth pcf X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056161@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] ndb/cs pcauth pcf Thread-Index: AcP/PzbO4h470c2uQi66Y207pV05fAAJJASg From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:20:50 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > sysname=3D`{ndb/query ether `{cat /net/ether0/addr} sys} cs ought to do this automagically. I ran into this one last November and there was some discussion on the list (look for "ndb & cs"). >Basically, what I found out was that >After setting up venti, cs stopped recognising my sysname. >It was because the loopback interface got up first on boot, >and because cs looks first by ip address. Now, I had two alternative ways to deal with it: >1) Poke around in /sys/src/cmd/ndb/cs.c and edit it to look >by the ethernet address when by ip it did not succeed.=20 >I did it. >2) Write the ip I get from the dhcp server into /lib/ndb/local. >I did it too. From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:46:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19001 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:46:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18997 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:46:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:46:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 87A1019C50; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:46:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A60919C50; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:46:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 936C219E49; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:45:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 019D319BEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:44:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7e3049782c9b96bdd8a5ba0caf4e4b38@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <000a01c3fd8a$f102c2b0$26fea8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:44:57 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> I'm saying that you CANNOT "message pass" a hash table. > > you can. i've done it. I told him, but he them said that calling a function was also message passing, which is not. Passing a fn pointer through a pointer, which IMHO he missed, of course is. IMHO, he should read the source of acme. I did learn a lot by doing so (after decades of doing concurrent programs). From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:48:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19161 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:48:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19157 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:48:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:48:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4FEC219E77; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:48:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 759F819E5B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:48:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D6AF19E5B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65DEE19BEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:47:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] novice question -- how to stop 9load from asking questions? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <7412d465acc712b8a1333d2591e99ff1@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:47:35 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > there's a 'nobootprompt=' plan9.ini(8) variable you can use. > > as for the username the only way i can think of is a hack -- boot a > pccpu kernel which will remember the user information and store it in Well, you have the user= variable, but of course you'd have to type a password as soon as you want to user resources (unless you do what mirtchov suggests and start a cpuserver instead). From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:49:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19371 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:49:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19367 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:49:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:49:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BD3919BA9; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:49:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91F9919BEA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:49:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6EDEB19ABF; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:48:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0106119AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:48:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c9eb75468dd84f2f3ccdd91ac97f572@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <7e3049782c9b96bdd8a5ba0caf4e4b38@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:48:47 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I told him, but he them said that calling a function was also > message passing, which is not. Passing a fn pointer through > a pointer, which IMHO he missed, of course is. IMHO, he should > read the source of acme. I did learn a lot by doing so (after decades > of doing concurrent programs). I meant this, sorry, not enough coffee yet... I told him, but he then said that calling a function was also message passing, which is not. Passing a fn pointer through a channel, which IMHO he missed, of course is. IMHO, he should read the source of acme. I did learn a lot by doing so (after decades of doing concurrent programs). From dbailey27@ameritech.net Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 17:52:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19631 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 17:52:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19623 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:52:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:52:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2532819E9E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B6C819E2F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:52:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D309A19E6E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:51:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 466E619E2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:51:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-68-21-43-189.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [68.21.43.189]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i218pQ3l088224; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:51:26 -0500 Message-ID: To: forsyth@terzarima.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rahzlhhsjvyzwuvpuvxfehhtxc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:46:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.3 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rahzlhhsjvyzwuvpuvxfehhtxc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nice --upas-rahzlhhsjvyzwuvpuvxfehhtxc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Apparently-To: dbailey27@ameritech.net via web80506.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 00:20:15 -0800 Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mx1-milwwi.milwwi.ameritech.net (65.43.19.28) by mta825.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 00:20:14 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [130.203.4.6] Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mx1-milwwi.milwwi.ameritech.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i218KC2d026323 for ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 02:20:13 -0600 (CST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDB7719E40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE77B19CA6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:20:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBCF419E3E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:19:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B73E19E36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:19:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <000901c3ff18$950fe250$26fea8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:19:16 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** >>i think it was rob, but i'm not sure, who said: > linear is programming is hard enough, but > concurrent programming is beyond the > 'average' programmer. actually, i'd say that programming generally is hard enough, and not just for the average programmer, and concurrent programming is just a special case within that. more seriously, some things are more clearly expressed and more easily implemented using concurrent processes or perhaps coroutines, so concurrency ought to be taught, and learned, and well. in contrast to the quote above, in an ancient usenet article, in the context of concurrent programming, i am reasonably certain that rob made the observation that as a discipline, we can learn. he used the example of fork(), which was considered `difficult' when it first appeared, compared to existing notions such as `jobs', but after being studied and taught in advanced programming for a time, it become familiar enough that it was suitable to be taught/used much earlier. that seems to me to be a better quote to use. i'd say from my experience that unless people insist on pronouncing themselves `full' and incapable of accepting any new ideas, which certainly does happen, they can typically learn. (otherwise, they end up saying things such as ``in every other X i've ever seen i could always do Y in this particular way''.) i think in many ways concurrent programming is more general than (say) object-oriented programming, and certainly the language constructions can be much simpler than some object-oriented ones. in other words: if you're capable of understanding `finalised virtual hyperstationary factory class', remembering the Java class hierarchy, and all the details of the Java Media Framework, you are (a) a better man than i am (b) capable of filling your mind with large chunks of complexity, so concurrent programming should be simple by comparison. go for it. ps. i made up the hyperstationary, but then again, it's probably a design pattern. --upas-rahzlhhsjvyzwuvpuvxfehhtxc-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:00:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20108 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:00:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20104 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:00:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:00:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DE9019EA4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:00:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B66F119E84; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:00:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 947B519E7E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E61E19BA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:59:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i218xn0V008693 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:59:49 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3/Submit) id i218xneq008692 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:59:49 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301105948.C29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <7e3049782c9b96bdd8a5ba0caf4e4b38@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <4c9eb75468dd84f2f3ccdd91ac97f572@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <4c9eb75468dd84f2f3ccdd91ac97f572@plan9.escet.urjc.es>; from Fco.J.Ballesteros on Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 09:48:47AM +0100 Organization: Proxima Research & Development Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:59:48 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 09:48:47AM +0100, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > I told him, but he then said that calling a function was also > message passing, which is not. Passing a fn pointer through > a channel, which IMHO he missed, of course is. IMHO, he should > read the source of acme. I did learn a lot by doing so (after decades > of doing concurrent programs). Surely message passing differs from pointer passing by the mere addition of synchronisation?! In which case I fail to see how Torvalds could consider himself a kernel designer and not recognise the chasm between them. ++L From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 18:28:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:01:17 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20227 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:01:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20218 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:01:16 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:01:16 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A13D019EAB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:01:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B2DA19EA4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:01:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 52E9F19EA5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:00:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BDE919E7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:00:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0345e8cd87c2b025a4d973acbee93add@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] group Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:00:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I pushed a new version of ip/httpd/group to sources/nemo. To help with locale, I placed the strings seen in the html near the begin of group.c; it should suffice to change them. I've also placed xample template html files under usr/web/groups/dso hth From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 18:28:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:05:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20465 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:05:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20461 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:05:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:05:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1909F19EBC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:05:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D54B19B4B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:05:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61F5119EAB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:04:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BEFE19EA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:04:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040301105948.C29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:04:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Surely message passing differs from pointer passing by the mere > addition of synchronisation?! Maybe you don't even need that: msg = mallocmsg(...); sendp(chan, msg); Is it a pointer? Sure. Is it a message? Sure. Do we need locks if we transfer ownership (which is an abstract concept)? Not sure. IMHO, Linus really needs to read /sys/src/cmd/acme/xfid.c From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 1 18:28:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:16:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21167 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:16:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21162 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:16:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:16:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2403619DB6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:16:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A233619EBC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:16:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1C4219B92; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:15:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5458319DB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:15:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:16:10 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > IMHO, Linus really needs to read /sys/src/cmd/acme/xfid.c One of the most difficult source to me.☺ Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 1 18:28:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:19:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21310 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:19:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21305 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:19:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:19:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5492A19EA8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:19:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C89619EA1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:19:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1462919EA8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:18:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A713D19EA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:18:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a983eb34bd29c877f26eacf2a7a4c8a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:19:25 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> IMHO, Linus really needs to read /sys/src/cmd/acme/xfid.c > > One of the most difficult source to me.☺ I meant clear and difficult. Kenji From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:17 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:37:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22151 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:37:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22147 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:37:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:37:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 358D319ED4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:37:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 227BE19EC9; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:37:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0793819E6E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:36:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.ca [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB8DE19C50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:36:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <31f3fe5ee597c87b85abb3d60af56a90@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 01:36:49 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think the original quote Boyd was looking for is this, from the 8½ paper: As discussed in a previous paper [Pike89] I prefer to free applications from event-based programming. Unfortunately, though, I see no easy way to achieve this in single-threaded C programs, and am unwilling to require all programmers to master concurrent programming. Fair enough. Such a sentiment may seem old-fashioned nowadays when everybody seems to want to write multi-threaded, hyper-threaded, multi-tasking programs (it's faster, you know); just look at the links browser. One of the services most operating systems provide is to convert asynchrony (notably activity on other processors and interrupts) into something more manageable. I find that enthusiasm for writing multi-threaded, multi-process programs fades after finding and fixing a few kernel race conditions on multi-processor systems. Finally, from a fortune file: Von Neumann's greatest gift was to get us OUT of parallel processors. -E. Miya From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:17 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:37:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22161 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:37:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22156 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:37:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:37:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F266E19ED8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:37:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6BDF19ED2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:37:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2942E19E6E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:36:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6F9319C50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:36:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i219YNki064853 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:34:23 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i219YNhh064852 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:34:23 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403010934.i219YNhh064852@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:34:23 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > in other words: if you're capable of understanding `finalised virtual hyperstationary factory class', > remembering the Java class hierarchy, and all the details of the Java Media Framework, In fact, there is no such thing as 'virtual' in Java, it is from other languages. Finalised cannot be a feature of a class in a hierarchy, since finalized is a state of an object after it was deleted and it is only needed to define the semantics of the language, not to program in it; remembering all the details of Java Media Framework is no more necessary than remembering all the details of PDF 1.5 specification -- unless you earn money by winning contests on writing multimedia java applets or checking PDF generators for conformance. Factory in Java is a simple concept, one more level of indirection. Think of it as something similar to 'bind' in Plan9. In general, Java is very close to Plan9 in many things. It is built to provide a cleaner and smaller alternative to C++; it offers very few concepts to learn -- and the extensive libraries are not meant to learn -- there are javadocs for them. The core language and system design is small and logical. It bears many ideas from Oberon (the system acme took its interface and interaction design), including the language design and the idea of embedded applets. Parallel programming in Java is easy and natural, as easy and natural as in other language or system or even easier, dare I say it. You just use threads, and use basic language features, such as variable scopes, to have shared and private thread resources. No additional flags and bits to remember; everything is easy and straightforward. I think that the major objection against Java is its closedness, but Plan9 has this problem too -- and it is being solved for both designs. David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:17 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 18:39:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22307 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 18:39:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22303 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 18:39:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 18:39:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C4E319ECD; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EBB119BB7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:39:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 920D919DAC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:38:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73BC519ED8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 04:37:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i219ZWki064864 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:35:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i219ZWMh064863 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:35:32 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403010935.i219ZWMh064863@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] novice question -- how to stop 9load from asking questions? In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:35:32 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Well, you have the user= variable, but of course you'd have to > type a password as soon as you want to user resources (unless you > do what mirtchov suggests and start a cpuserver instead). I have in fact set up a cpu server. That's what I wanted. David From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 19:03:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24571 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:03:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24566 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:03:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:03:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E98D19ECD; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:03:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13AC619EB2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:03:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EE2919EC9; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:02:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECB0519E69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:02:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <09df9b2e5f6c9f2e600201fc413ad12e@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403010934.i219YNhh064852@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:02:34 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** >>languages. Finalised cannot be a feature of a class in a hierarchy, >>since finalized is a state of an object after it was deleted and it >>is only needed to define the semantics of the language, not to ``[the programmer has] the ability to declare classes or methods as "final". [they cannot be overriden in a subclass]. The language guarantees that the actual method invoked on the object is the {finalised method} [my {}] which was written for that class...'' it was that sense i meant, not object destruction. From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 1 21:42:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 19:15:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25213 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:15:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25209 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:15:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:15:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DD94C19BEB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:15:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1111D19AE8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:15:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2475A19AE8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:14:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (cackle.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.141]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E7F119B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:14:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from cackle.proxima.alt.za (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3) with ESMTP id i21AEm0V009203 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:14:48 +0200 (SAST) Received: (from lucio@localhost) by cackle.proxima.alt.za (8.12.8/8.12.3/Submit) id i21AElc9009202 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:14:47 +0200 (SAST) From: Lucio De Re To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] imap4d and Outlook Message-ID: <20040301121446.D29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20040229194337.A29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> <27b7658f4e965a8acfe73430e3f4d269@plan9.bell-labs.com> <20040301064307.B29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 0.95.4us In-Reply-To: <20040301064307.B29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za>; from Lucio De Re on Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 06:43:08AM +0200 Organization: Proxima Research & Development Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:14:47 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 06:43:08AM +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > It seemed such an obvious fault, I thought someone else would have > picked on it. I'll try and find some time to dig deeper. > Curiously, the year is either 1 or 2, I have seen many 1s and very few 2s. The day of the month has little bearing on the dates applicable in the actual message, but I presume Outlook's idea of a "received" time stamp comes from some other source? ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 19:15:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25223 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:15:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25219 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:15:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:15:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8FF2D19BFB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:15:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70B1819BFB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:15:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A65B819B15; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:14:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36BB819AE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:14:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21ACVki065008 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:12:31 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21ACV3l065007 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:12:31 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403011012.i21ACV3l065007@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <09df9b2e5f6c9f2e600201fc413ad12e@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:12:31 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>since finalized is a state of an object after it was deleted and it > >>is only needed to define the semantics of the language, not to > > ``[the programmer has] the ability to declare classes or methods as "final". [they cannot > be overriden in a subclass]. The language guarantees that the actual method invoked on > the object is the {finalised method} [my {}] which was written for that class...'' > > it was that sense i meant, not object destruction. Isn't it like bind without -c? From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:29:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27275 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:02:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27271 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:02:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:02:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 235F819C40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:02:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBFE819B40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:02:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A3E8A19C27; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (mail.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E0CF19B40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:01:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a1a8800d83f4e8b7967fd88c3af1d2a@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:01:12 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: from a fortune file: The steady state of disks is full. --Ken Thompson I believe it was Mike O'Dell who asked (approximately) `Why is it that despite processors getting faster, there never seems to be any additional cycles available to me?'. His answer was window systems and networks, among others. From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:31:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28653 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:31:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28649 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:30:57 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:30:57 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C72319D21; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 228EC19CE3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:30:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FC0419C46; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DDA819C46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:29:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21BRXki065349 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:27:33 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21BRXFA065348 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:27:33 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403011127.i21BRXFA065348@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] /n/kfs? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:27:33 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Novice question: extra images are relying on /n/kfs. At which point /n/kfs is supposed to be mounted? (I did it manually, but when it should be done)? David From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:33:10 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27402 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:06:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27398 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:06:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:06:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74C6119CE2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:06:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D4B419CBD; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:06:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B154B19C90; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:05:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (mail.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BDBC19BC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:05:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan 9 over Linux? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <196f381b.0402281054.64590cad@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 03:05:24 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Plan 9 isn't Unix, it's a distributed system built from the ground up to run over varied networks, to provide good fast graphics capability, to provide permanent storage with daily views available, and to exploit shared-memory multiprocessors, all unlike Unix. See http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/~rsc/plan9.html for a longer answer. From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:36:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26297 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:36:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26293 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:36:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:36:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FAE319CA8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D7A819C72; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E2E919C2F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A61E19C2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AxklR-0002ty-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:09 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1077899988.21772.196.camel@zevon>, Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:34:56 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Linus Torvalds wrote: ...deleted > > Methinks you have read a few too many papers about microkernels, without > actually seeing the real world. do not forget that applications running on microkernels are faster than on monolithic kernels. see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/exo bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). 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From a_serkov@list.ru Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:36:55 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26304 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:36:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26300 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:36:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:36:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3950819D10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C68D119C72; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C82519C30; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29BCB19C21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AxklS-0002u4-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:10 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Alexander Serkov Message-ID: <503d4a23.0402280147.7b53534e@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Problems booting Plan9 CD Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:35:07 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've my old PC and wish to use it as Plan9 Box I've read supported hardware and it seems it should work: Intel Celeron 366 VIA Apollo Pro chipset 3Com 3c905b ethernet card S3 Savage4 vidio Ultra DMA 33 IDE drive. But when CD from 20040227 starts booting kernel it hangs after the following message: pcirouting: BIOS workaround: PCI.0.7.2 at pin 4 link 5 irq9 -> 10 Can abybody sujest me something? From vin@theworld.com Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:37:05 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26314 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:37:04 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26310 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:37:04 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:37:04 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C636119D7D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B77519C30; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:36:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA3F619C40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5141919C21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:35:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AxklR-0002ts-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:09 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Vin McLellan Message-ID: <1f85b7d9.0402271411.f477f42@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: , <20040227013823.0c2ba797@garlic> Subject: Re: [9fans] pathetic Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:34:44 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ron Minnich asked: >What I want to know is, what was Mr. Bill holding in his hand? http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/biztech/02/25/microsoft.rsa.ap/index.html >It sure got the journalists excited -- that picture was everywhere. The AP photo slug described it an "encrypted tag" -- whatever that is -- but Ron said "it looked like a USB dongle." George Michaelson reported: .> Its SecureID re-worked into a smaller format from what I read .> elsewhere. Close but not quite accurate. It's the classic RSA SecurID key fob, the same size as its been for the past six or seven years. Maybe like many things -- markets, competitors, nations -- SecurIDs look smaller when they are lie in the palm of Bill G;-) RSA's SecurID, for those who don't know, is a hand-held authentication token that uses the AES cipher to hash "Current Time," and a 128-bit secret, to generate (and continuously display in a small LCD) a series of 6-8 digit pseudo-random tokencodes that flip over every 60 seconds. (One-time passwords like this are typically used as evidence of "something held," and are paired with a user-memorized PIN or password, "something known," for two-factor authentication -- the classical definition of "strong authentication.") The key fob has been the most popular form-factor for the SecurID for years, but many people -- including perhaps the AP photo editor -- still picture the SecurID as the credit card-size device that was its most common "form-factor" through the late 1980s and early 1990s. Today, however, there are 7 or 8 different SecurID form-factors, including the SecurID card and key fob, but also including software modules that can be downloaded for Palm Pilots, Pocket PCs, Blackberries, Nokia and Sony/Ericsson mobile phones, as well as desktop PCs (where the physical security justifies the added risk.) There is a whole spectrum of greater and lesser security associated with the implementations in these various form factors, obviously, but market demand continues to push SecurID functionality into devices the user already carries, and the SecurID's trustworthiness ultimately boils down to RSA's cryptographic grip on the 128-bit seed, the AES-protected shared secret. I'll be surprised if RSA, for which I am a consultant, doesn't finally deliver, in '04, the SecurID wristwatch that SecurID inventor Ken Weiss was talking about in '87. Guessing that the SecurID is shrinking was smart, George -- but the SecurID widget Bill G was waving around was just a standard SecurID fob. You guys are obviously correct to note that increased the rigor of the user authentication mechanism won't preclude attacks on the underlying Windows infrastructure, but -- by extending SecurID to the off-line PCs (a la S/key), and installing ACE/Agents (to demand two-factor authentication) at the domain controllers and terminal servers -- MS will greatly enhance the grandularity of the IT audit record. In a marketplace increasingly shaped by HIPAA, Sarbane Oxley, and world-wide privacy regs, that itself has high value in corporate IT. Suerte, _Vin From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:41:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26426 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:41:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26422 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:41:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:41:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EF1119C90; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:41:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1F4A19C40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:41:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7575319C90; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:40:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B584519C40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:40:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403010934.i219YNhh064852@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:40:16 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** my point was just that programmers, presumably `average' ones as well, often need to come to grips with a fair number of non-trivial things, and they are often rather specific (as with the JMF). it seems to me that if programmers can deal with things such as those (not just those particular things), there's a reasonable chance that at least a good percentage can indeed deal with something that is more fundamental, and more general. of course part of what is discovered, taught and learnt, is what discipline to follow to avoid trouble (as in structured programming), and even when concurrency is best avoided. of course talents will vary, but even so. >>remembering all the details >>of Java Media Framework is no more necessary than remembering all i chose it as an example of a moderately complex interface only because i was on the JMF email list years ago and still retain the following e-mail message from that list, as an example of how one can produce fairly intricate interfaces (that did get in the way). my favourite part is the last paragraph, which reminds me of the sketch in the Life of Brian: ``the people's liberation army of judea'', ``the judean people's liberation army'', ... . splitters! Subject: DataSource and Player coupling ... I'm writing a java.media.content.reliable.DataSource implementation for use with Intels Java Media implementation. I'm not sure how to get the framework to use my DataSource without resorting to writing my own Player implementation (or instantiating an undocumented internal Player implementation) I could use a unique protocol (e.g. softcom:) and implement a java.media.protocol.softcom.PlayerFinder which somehow determines the MIME type and then calls java.media.content.reliable..PlayerFinder.createPlayer() passing an instance of my DataSource implementation. Or I could create an instance of my DataSource and create an instance of the correct content PlayerFinder directly, e.g.: DataSource ds = new MyDataSource(url); java.media.content.reliable.PlayerFactory pf = new java.media.content.reliable.video.mpeg.PlayerFinder(); m_jmPlayer = pf.createPlayer(ds); I would still need to determine the MIME type of the source URL in order to locate the PlayerFinder. ... DataSource and Player implementations seem tightly bound together in the framework. I would think they should be independent so I can mix and match DataSources with Player implementations. Also, it seems strange that the DataSource is in a content specific package, e.g. java.media.content.reliable..DataSource. The DataSource doesn't need to know anything about the content - it just reads raw bytes - why does it care if they are MPEG, AVI, WAV etc.? It would seem more sensible to tie the DataSource to the protocol, e.g. java.media.protocol..DataSource. In fact, why are the reliable and streaming packages tied to content type (java.media.content.reliable and java.media.content.streaming)? It's the protocol that is reliable or streaming, not the content (is MPEG reliable or streaming? it depends on the protocol). Shouldn't these packages be named java.media.protocol.reliable and java.media.protocol.streaming? From viro@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:51:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30020 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:51:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30015 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:51:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:51:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2335C19D6C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:51:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EB8819CC6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:51:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB0C419D3B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:50:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from www.linux.org.uk (parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk [195.92.249.252]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC16119CC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:50:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from viro by www.linux.org.uk with local (Exim 4.22) id 1AxlwI-0003F3-86 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 11:50:26 +0000 From: viro@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301115026.GM16357@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk> References: <20040228185347.GE16357@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk> <5a05620eae26919c3e145b7cb21bf9e5@terzarima.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <5a05620eae26919c3e145b7cb21bf9e5@terzarima.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:50:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sat, Feb 28, 2004 at 07:44:31PM +0000, Charles Forsyth wrote: > >>For Linux such experiments had been done and results were very clear - > >>price of TLB flushes was considerable and that's aside of the complexity > >>of supporting a lot of mappings with partial VM sharing. For Plan 9 the > > were those real applications or a synthetic test? i'm curious what it actually did. > sorry, wrong question. can you please point me to the paper and/or file that might answer them? Hmm... Probably Ingo Molnar would have all details. IIRC, that was on real applications, but back then I was dealing with filesystem side of things and not much else, so that's second-hand information. I can ask him for details if you want them; I certainly agree that e.g. presense of shared libraries changes the picture, so those results do not apply directly to Plan 9 and if somebody really cares they should try and compare for normal Plan 9 workloads. From DAGwyn@null.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:51:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26934 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:51:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26930 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:51:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:51:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B791619C53; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F3AA19B4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACDEE19C34; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B3E319BBB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AxkmU-0002wt-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:36:14 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040228144033.1227.qmail@mail.dirac.net>, <2e53d0b955987afff06292756dc7e4c9@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] spam (was "pathetic") Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:35:54 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Geoff Collyer wrote: > One reason you get so much paper spam (junk mail) is that the post > office (at least in the US and I believe Canada) *subsidises* the > spammers: they get lower postal rates for bulk spamming. But by presorting they lower processing cost. Last time I heard a Postmaster explain this, he said that actually the bulk-rate mail paid its way while first-class did not. That was before several increases in first-class postal rates, however, so perhaps now they both do. From jjk3@msstate.edu Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:51:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26966 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:51:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26962 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:51:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:51:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3877919CB4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E65519C71; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB0CA19BBB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73BEC19B45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AxkmU-0002wn-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:36:14 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Joel Konkle-Parker Message-ID: <196f381b.0402281054.64590cad@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Plan 9 over Linux? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:35:43 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Admittedly, I haven't tried Plan9 (other than the installer), but I've read a lot on the website. But I'm still somewhat confused: what is the benefit of Plan 9 over, say, Linux? What's different? I've read that everything's a file... ok, that's great, but what's the benefit in that? Is that the only improvement? -- Joel Konkle-Parker Webmaster [Ballsome.com] E-mail [jjk3@msstate.edu] From DAGwyn@null.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:52:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26987 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:52:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26983 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:52:12 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:52:12 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44FF519D43; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2496719B40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B89919C4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48E4F19C34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Axkly-0002vD-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:42 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <6-idnevZ5fB1K93dRVn-jA@comcast.com> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040228105025.1a94f714.martin@parvat.com>, <000d01c3fddf$72cc45b0$2bdcfea9@blue> Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:35:19 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Nigel Roles wrote: > The performance argument may well still be regarded by Linus as > stronger, but there are other differences. One is that the stack > used by the clone, being allocated on the heap, is fixed in size, > and unprotected from overflow. That would be a serious flaw on a system with a small address space. It's problematic anyway in its inefficient use of PTEs for the process, since far more table entries are needed (extra stack for each thread). However, overflow detection can in principle be achieved by mapping all pages of each thread's private stack region except for the last page, which allows the MMU to flag any overflow. From DAGwyn@null.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:54:06 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26980 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 19:52:04 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26976 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 19:52:04 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 19:52:04 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19A7E19CCD; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4817D19CC6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:51:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CFE719B45; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E04F19B4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 05:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Axkly-0002vJ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:42 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <000d01c3fddf$72cc45b0$2bdcfea9@blue>, <00c801c3fdff$414b7d60$26fea8c0@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:35:31 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: > get real, we're no longer using 1 MIP VAXes, where TLB flushes > etc were a real problem. 128 users on an 11/780, anyone? There are a large number of platforms where there are important constraints imposed by the MMU architecture. Consider what it means when an OS requires such resources that it cannot feasibly be implemented on a VAX, yet does almost nothing more than could have readily been done (with a different design) on a VAX. It's nearly as bad as a 1GHz machine getting so bogged down with GUI code and poor interface design that some common tasks take longer to accomplish than on a 1MHz PDP-11 running Unix. (Whose "Law" was it that said that file storage always expands to fill whatever disk resources are available? The same thing seems to apply to CPU cycles.) From dbailey27@ameritech.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:55:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30265 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:55:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30261 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:55:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:55:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D8CF819D73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:55:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E35F19D40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:55:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5881219D40; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:54:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EBD2C19D4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:54:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-68-21-43-189.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [68.21.43.189]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i21BsR3l240908; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:54:27 -0500 Message-ID: <63247fd2ce66c84bd14cc224ba6fd70b@yourdomain.dom> To: viro@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <20040301115026.GM16357@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:49:02 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > Hmm... Probably Ingo Molnar would have all details. IIRC, that was on real > applications, but back then I was dealing with filesystem side of things and > not much else, so that's second-hand information. I can ask him for details > if you want them; Yes, please. Don From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 20:59:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30554 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 20:59:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30550 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 20:59:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 20:59:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96F5819DAC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:59:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3BF619D73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:59:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F01619D64; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:58:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E33919D89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:58:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21Bu1ki065528 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:56:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21Bu1Mr065527 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:56:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403011156.i21Bu1Mr065527@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:56:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i chose it as an example of a moderately complex interface only > because i was on the JMF email list years ago and still Yes, it was a good example. Do you think limbo is better for learning/teaching parallel programming ideas than C+rfork? David Tolpin From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 21:08:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 375 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 21:08:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 359 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 21:08:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 21:08:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 66EC219DD6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:08:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A412319D73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:08:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70DA119D89; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:07:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams018.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n18.valueweb.net [216.219.253.56]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CD2919D7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:07:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <430077-25051>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:06:28 -0500 References: <31f3fe5ee597c87b85abb3d60af56a90@collyer.net> In-Reply-To: <31f3fe5ee597c87b85abb3d60af56a90@collyer.net> From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.070628-0500_est.430077-25051+15078@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 07:06:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Geoff Collyer writes: > I find that enthusiasm > for writing multi-threaded, multi-process programs fades after finding > and fixing a few kernel race conditions on multi-processor systems. yes, ... From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 21:42:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 21:20:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3834 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 21:20:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3830 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 21:20:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 21:20:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F3B719DEA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:20:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5579119DAC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:20:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D6C919D73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:19:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams008.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n08.valueweb.net [216.219.253.156]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEDA419BAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <387693-24448>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:18:58 -0500 References: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> In-Reply-To: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.071858-0500_est.387693-24448+36064@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 07:18:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Charles Forsyth writes: > ps. i made up the hyperstationary, but then again, it's probably a design pattern. ROTFLMAO From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 1 23:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 22:30:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8247 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 22:30:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8243 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 22:30:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 22:30:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1131119E1B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4619B19DF0; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:30:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C858E19DF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:29:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F246019DE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:29:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4eaf2935c987231f4b35511b0259108c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <04Mar1.071858-0500_est.387693-24448+36064@ams.ftl.affinity.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-eqloczgnlzdtxpgkkrakpknlpu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:29:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-eqloczgnlzdtxpgkkrakpknlpu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ROTFLMAO ?? --upas-eqloczgnlzdtxpgkkrakpknlpu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 1 13:20:30 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C895D19DD3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:20:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5579119DAC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:20:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D6C919D73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:19:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams008.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n08.valueweb.net [216.219.253.156]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEDA419BAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <387693-24448>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:18:58 -0500 References: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> In-Reply-To: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.071858-0500_est.387693-24448+36064@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 07:18:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Charles Forsyth writes: > ps. i made up the hyperstationary, but then again, it's probably a design pattern. ROTFLMAO --upas-eqloczgnlzdtxpgkkrakpknlpu-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 1 23:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 22:36:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8698 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 22:36:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8694 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 22:36:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 22:36:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9946E19B28; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:36:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEDB819C53; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:36:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5101519B8F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:35:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F55519B28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:35:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i21DUnW12464 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:31:02 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <4eaf2935c987231f4b35511b0259108c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:33:57 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ROTFLMAO ?? Roll on the floor laughing my arse off! ++L From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 1 23:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 22:57:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9883 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 22:57:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9879 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 22:57:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 22:57:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2812419E1B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:57:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7616119B58; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:57:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80D3319DD6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3042619C82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <315756-10376>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:55:30 -0500 References: <4eaf2935c987231f4b35511b0259108c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> In-Reply-To: <4eaf2935c987231f4b35511b0259108c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.085530-0500_est.315756-10376+2021@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 08:55:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu writes: > ROTFLMAO ?? Rolling On The Floor Laughing My Arse Off From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 2 10:03:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 23:38:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12554 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 23:38:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12550 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 23:38:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 23:38:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0AE3F19C82; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:38:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B1EF19C76; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:38:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8711719C71; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:37:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF5FB19B58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i21EbOCi018925 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:37:24 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i21EbNai029204 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:37:23 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i21EbNd20123 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:37:23 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403011437.i21EbNd20123@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] spam (was "pathetic") In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:35:54 +0000." References: <20040228144033.1227.qmail@mail.dirac.net>, <2e53d0b955987afff06292756dc7e4c9@collyer.net> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 15:37:23 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Doug replied: > Geoff Collyer wrote: > > One reason you get so much paper spam (junk mail) is that the post > > office (at least in the US and I believe Canada) *subsidises* the > > spammers: they get lower postal rates for bulk spamming. > > But by presorting they lower processing cost. Last time > I heard a Postmaster explain this, he said that actually > the bulk-rate mail paid its way while first-class did not. > That was before several increases in first-class postal > rates, however, so perhaps now they both do. Here in the netherlands we also have a reduced price for 'bulk' (> 250 items?) postings, which also have to be offered in a presorted way -- and at the time (10 years ago?) I was involved in sending out some post this way, you were given a nice small booklet with the sorting rules, and you could buy from the post a program that would help you to get the 'bundle' info for easier sorting on your address labels. The program was pretty expensive, something like euro 350 or so. When I made a remark about that when handing in my presorted bundles, like 'presorting makes your job easier, giving us the program makes it easier for us to comply to the presorting rules' the post man told me that basically they (he?) did not care too much about the (my) presorting anyway because their automatic sorters could do that job just as easily anyway... (ok, we were a very small client, some 250 items every two months) With respect to paper spam avoidance: here in the netherlands we have two kind of official labels you can put on your mailbox: Ja - Nee (yes to unscubscribed house-to-house ditributed newspapers, no to non-addressed advertisements), and Nee - Nee (No to both of them) They work well - only occasionally something unwanted slips though. Axel. From rsc@pdos.lcs.mit.edu Tue Mar 2 10:03:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 23:41:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12612 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 23:41:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12608 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 23:41:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 23:41:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C6B819C8A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:41:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF4F819C76; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:41:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6646419CB2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:40:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6957E19B7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:40:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1Axob2-000HhP-BC for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 09:40:40 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:34:56 GMT." From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <68037.1078152038.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 09:40:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > do not forget that applications running on microkernels are faster than > on monolithic kernels. see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/exo no. applications running on a kernel tailored to the benchmark are faster than applications running on a generic kernel. exokernel != microkernel. - rsc@pdos.lcs.mit.edu From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 10:03:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 1 23:56:16 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13406 invoked by uid 1020); 1 Mar 2004 23:56:16 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13402 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 23:56:16 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 23:56:16 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1237019ABF; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 689F719B06; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:56:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 046B1199F6; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:55:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E24CC199E1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:55:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <775a59e829ab84dbe26122f7effedbc7@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <04Mar1.070628-0500_est.430077-25051+15078@ams.ftl.affinity.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:55:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Its like anything else, once you get used to it, you make less mistakes. From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 2 10:03:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 00:08:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14051 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 00:08:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14047 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 00:08:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 00:08:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 73A1119CB4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:08:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EACEE19D5F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:08:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA23019B55; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DB8E19AAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:07:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i21F7CCi022074 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i21F7Cai012846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i21F7Cl20360 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:12 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403011507.i21F7Cl20360@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] spam (was "pathetic") In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 01 Mar 2004 15:37:23 +0100." <200403011437.i21EbNd20123@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <20040228144033.1227.qmail@mail.dirac.net>, <2e53d0b955987afff06292756dc7e4c9@collyer.net> <200403011437.i21EbNd20123@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 16:07:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: to continue OT, I wrote: > With respect to paper spam avoidance in the netherlands [there is an official avoidance scheme withe labels on mailboxes] > They work well - only occasionally something unwanted slips though. And maybe that's the reason (combined with low effectiveness of even 'well targeted' direct mail?) that we nowadays get those unsolicited phone calls 'do you have a minute?'. they are _really_ annoying. and when I suggest 'whatever you have to say, why don't you stuff it in an envelope and mail it to me' they say: 'no, out of principle, we never send something...'. oh well.. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 00:19:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14548 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 00:19:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14544 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 00:19:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 00:19:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D1C919CE3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:19:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB4AF19CE3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:19:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F14B199F9; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:18:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams001.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n01.valueweb.net [216.219.253.85]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D6DE19D48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:18:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <322744-23975>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:17:15 -0500 References: In-Reply-To: From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.101715-0500_est.322744-23975+2739@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:17:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Russ Cox writes: > exokernel != microkernel. Correct! -- Justin Hawkins, The Darkness. From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 00:48:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15917 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 00:48:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15913 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 00:48:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 00:48:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 704D219DDA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:48:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15DDE19C64; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:48:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D97919C50; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9BF4199C0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:47:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FlJb5012924 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:47:19 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FlIWE012293 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:47:19 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FlIfQ029926 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:47:18 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040301105948.C29577@cackle.proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:47:18 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Lucio De Re wrote: > Surely message passing differs from pointer passing by the mere addition > of synchronisation?! In which case I fail to see how Torvalds could > consider himself a kernel designer and not recognise the chasm between > them. In most people's minds message passing passing usually means 'move the data from this hole here to that hole there'. Of course in any optimized situation (shared memory) this can be done with pointer hacks. And even in the optimized situations, message passing libraries as measured are at least one or two orders of magnitude slower than simple 'hand the pointer around', esp. on shared-memory and CC-NUMA systems -- I can give you references, if you wish, or you can google Jim Taft's work at NASA AMES. There's a hardware reason for the performance difference. Do people care about that difference? Yes! If you just dropped $10-20M on a computer, do you want to get $500K worth of performance out of it, or would you rather get more like $10-20M out of it? Your call. Better yet, assume your job rests on the decision, then make the decision :-) Point to Linus on this one, I think. Sorry. On another note, the Linux guys are not kernel designers in many senses of that word. From my point of view Linux is an extremely competent implementation of some really good and some really bad OS ideas -- ranging from V6 Unix syscall interface to later ideas such as VFS. And, like it or not, it works very very well for many people, including the several thousand systems we have here that run it for high performance computing. Credit where credit is due. And, that said, I'm still gradually moving my existence over to Plan 9. ron From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 00:57:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16442 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 00:57:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16438 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 00:57:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 00:57:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 00C1119DF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:57:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9969F19C64; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:57:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5376919D48; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:56:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18FF619C64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 10:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FuBb5016150 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:11 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FuAWE016809 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:10 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21FuAfQ030307 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:10 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 08:56:09 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > > > > Methinks you have read a few too many papers about microkernels, without > > actually seeing the real world. > > do not forget that applications running on microkernels are faster than > on monolithic kernels. see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/exo so I assume you are running this on your machines? ron From rasputnik@hellooperator.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:10:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16973 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:10:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16967 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:10:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:10:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA61819CD2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:10:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C551419BBC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:10:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DDDC19C4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:10:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from idoru.mine.nu (cpc3-cdif2-3-0-cust202.cdif.cable.ntl.com [81.103.32.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A280719C1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.4.0.6] (helo=hellooperator.net) by idoru.mine.nu with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AxpzH-0003Jg-20 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 16:09:47 +0000 Message-ID: <4043604A.6000605@hellooperator.net> From: Dick Davies User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 16:09:46 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.6 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** ron minnich wrote: > I think I sent this before, but it's so nice I am sending it again. > > Scenario: an EPIA with linuxbios and plan 9 in flash. cpu is named cpu50. > You want to muck with the kernel and debug it. Easy. > > . bind_test_namespace > cd /sys/src/9/pc > mk 'CONF=whatever' > cpu -h cpu50 > echo 'reboot /path/to/9whatever' > /dev/reboot > > boom. 9 boots 9. takes 5 seconds. If it blows up, cpu is back in 10 > seconds. Nice - this is the 9grid cluster, right? Do you have a howto anywhere for your linuxbios voodoo? From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:18:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17511 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:18:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17507 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:18:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:18:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1BEF19CBD; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:18:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 583AD19BBC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:18:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF4B319C1B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:17:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7027119B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:17:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21GHPb5024860 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:17:25 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21GHPWE029035 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:17:25 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21GHOfQ031284 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:17:24 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff In-Reply-To: <4043604A.6000605@hellooperator.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:17:24 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Dick Davies wrote: > Nice - this is the 9grid cluster, right? > Do you have a howto anywhere for your linuxbios voodoo? I have to update the wiki ... andrey was talking about finding a way to provide ituners pre-loaded, we'll see. Now andrey can get mad at me for letting cat out of bag. ron From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 10:03:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:25:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17940 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:25:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17936 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:25:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:25:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 868B519DD3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24AC519DE8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:25:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84D0F19C76; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:24:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E60219C50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:24:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i21GKPW17615 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:20:26 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <180eecfedf4d332edb744c24b27bc9ed@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:23:33 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > In most people's minds message passing passing usually means 'move the > data from this hole here to that hole there'. Of course in any optimized > situation (shared memory) this can be done with pointer hacks. And even in > the optimized situations, message passing libraries as measured are at > least one or two orders of magnitude slower than simple 'hand the pointer > around', esp. on shared-memory and CC-NUMA systems -- I can give you > references, if you wish, or you can google Jim Taft's work at NASA AMES. > There's a hardware reason for the performance difference. > I don't understand what is being measured in this case. Surely one doesn't go to Linus Torvalds to get specifications for the design of on operating system for a specialised piece of equipment? Ever since before Unix, the emphasis has been on portability, OS design has sacrificed performance to the objective of being able to continue using applications on the newer, faster hardware. At least, that is how it seems to me. > Do people care about that difference? Yes! If you just dropped $10-20M on > a computer, do you want to get $500K worth of performance out of it, or > would you rather get more like $10-20M out of it? Your call. Better yet, > assume your job rests on the decision, then make the decision :-) > Sure. But then did the price include optimised software, or do you expect to run some off-the-street operating software on your performance host? By the time you spend money in that order of magnitude, you can afford to employ the few software architects that still understand low-level programming and get them to squeeze every bit of performance out of your horse. Or would you ask Torvalds to drive the next generation of Grand Prix Ferrari to win the racing season? > Point to Linus on this one, I think. Sorry. > No ways, it's a mismatch. Torvalds just organically grew an OS from Minix, for the Intel architecture. The Great Barrier Reef likewise grew organically, but is unlikely to be recommended as the dam wall for the Yellow River. > On another note, the Linux guys are not kernel designers in many senses of > that word. From my point of view Linux is an extremely competent > implementation of some really good and some really bad OS ideas -- ranging > from V6 Unix syscall interface to later ideas such as VFS. And, like it > or not, it works very very well for many people, including the several > thousand systems we have here that run it for high performance computing. > Credit where credit is due. > One can't hold against Torvalds the decision to stick to the Unix paradigm, no one else had much of a better choice at the time. But to defend it in the face of obvious obsolescence is unforgivable. And to suggest that performance is a significant factor in the design of a generic operating system is laughable. > And, that said, I'm still gradually moving my existence over to Plan 9. > Which makes you a lot more practical than Torvalds. Presumably microoptimisations are not saving you millions of dollars. Nor me :-) ++L From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:34:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18464 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:34:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18459 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:34:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:34:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BCDEF19E17; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D7C819DF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:34:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 48A0C19C82; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:33:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23DCB19D5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:33:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 09:33:14 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Now andrey can get mad at me for letting cat out of bag. 1. you buy the ituner 2. we send you a linuxbios image to flash the bios with 3. we send you a linuxbios-enabled cpu kernel to boot 4. ??? 5. profit! but seriously, nobody (i think) is going to attempt selling plan9-certified hardware unless you can use it as terminals, which we can't do with the ituners yet... andrey From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:39:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19017 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:39:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19013 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:39:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:39:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B252419E17; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:39:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C956C19DE8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:39:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 965B819DD3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:39:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23E0219AAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:38:57 -0500 (EST) Received: by ams.ftl.affinity.com id <321558-10371>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:37:21 -0500 References: In-Reply-To: From: boyd@insultant.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <04Mar1.113721-0500_est.321558-10371+3181@ams.ftl.affinity.com> Subject: [9fans] Re: a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 11:37:21 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Now andrey can get mad at me for letting cat out of bag. > > 1. you buy the ituner > 2. we send you a linuxbios image to flash the bios with > 3. we send you a linuxbios-enabled cpu kernel to boot > 4. ??? > 5. profit! send me one. From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:41:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19203 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:41:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19199 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:41:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:41:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABE8419E12; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:41:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2386319E11; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:41:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6929519DD3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3341F19D48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:40:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i21GaPW17790 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:36:25 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <16af215d3298eb9bb68f7ea3e8d376eb@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:39:32 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > but seriously, nobody (i think) is going to attempt selling > plan9-certified hardware unless you can use it as terminals, which we > can't do with the ituners yet... > I dunno, maybe you can sell them as hosted servers. I'm currently looking at installing a server at a hosting site, with a WAN link to my office/network. I'm not convinced that with a bit of local disk (10GB of 3½" drive, say) a Plan 9 ituner would not be a serious contender. Specially if two of them can fit into a 1U bracket. Just a thought. ++L From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 01:53:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19889 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19885 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5AFCA19C51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AE8819B4F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:53:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A28C319C51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:52:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39E9619AC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:52:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <478ff31bb839756a4b2facfb0c05cd7e@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] spam (was "pathetic") In-Reply-To: <200403011507.i21F7Cl20360@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:55:13 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.9 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** OT but the UK "do not call list" has worked for me http://www.tpsonline.org.uk I've had 1 sales call since Sept. 2002 when I joined, down from 1 per week beforehand. m From matthias@mteege.de Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 02:06:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20666 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 02:06:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20661 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:06:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:06:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75C8F19C81; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:06:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B45419C7E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:06:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F99019CD2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:05:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [81.2.131.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 369CE19C51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:05:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 95069 invoked by uid 66); 1 Mar 2004 17:05:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 19159 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:01:54 -0000 Received: from gic.mteege.de (HELO mteege.de) (192.168.153.10) by 0 with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:01:54 -0000 Received: (qmail 39046 invoked from network); 1 Mar 2004 17:01:53 -0000 Received: from loco.mteege.de (HELO loco) (192.168.153.22) by 0 with SMTP; 1 Mar 2004 17:01:53 -0000 Message-ID: <84184c6c418797592330467960962e7b@mteege.de> From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] a sure easy way to try out kernel stuff In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:01:07 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon Mar 1 16:41:47 GMT 2004, mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca wrote: > plan9-certified hardware unless you can use it as terminals, which we Small terminal would be cool. Matthias From jbarham@jbarham.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 02:22:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21378 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 02:22:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21374 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:22:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:22:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8318019DA3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:22:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D2B219BEC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:22:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2C7719C81; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd4mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72E5719B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:21:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd3mr2so.prod.shaw.ca (pd3mr2so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.178]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW003MYQK92B@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:14:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml10so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml10so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.80]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW00M8ZQK9Z3@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:14:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from hpn5415 (h24-87-250-11.vc.shawcable.net [24.87.250.11]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTW00JAFQK9LN@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:14:33 -0700 (MST) From: "John E. Barham" Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <041d01c3ffb0$a2c8a010$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> <90923238-6AF5-11D8-829B-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 09:14:20 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If for some reason you can't go with a Plan 9 solution, you might want > to check out The Handle System (http://www.handle.net/). Come to think > of it, adding hdl support to Plan 9 might be a nice project on it's > own. Well, at this point using Plan 9 is really not feasible since we already have a substantial production system in place w/ dependencies that Plan 9 doesn't provide. The Handle System looks pretty close to what we need. My major concern would be that it runs on Java (e.g., that "What do I do if I get a Java out-of-memory error?" is a FAQ does not inspire confidence...) John From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 02:25:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21508 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 02:25:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21504 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:25:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:25:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 38B4719AD7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:25:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 483C7199B3; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:25:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81A1319CB4; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:24:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF3C119B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:23:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403011156.i21Bu1Mr065527@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:29:18 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Do you think limbo is better for learning/teaching parallel programming > ideas than C+rfork? having been through a few years of doing C programming workshops, i'd love to use Limbo as a teaching language. parallel programming is not the only reason (although it's a good one); just the overall cleanliness, the general modularity (no sprawling class hierarchy to deal with), and the straightforward syntax. From jbarham@jbarham.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 02:32:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22010 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 02:32:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22006 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:32:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:32:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 35B1E19DE1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:32:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE26519B56; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:32:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6861219AAA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:31:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd3mo1so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54BAE19B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:31:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd2mr1so.prod.shaw.ca (pd2mr1so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.110]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW0070WR6L7Y@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:27:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml1so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml1so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.145]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW0054VR6L9L@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:27:57 -0700 (MST) Received: from hpn5415 (h24-87-250-11.vc.shawcable.net [24.87.250.11]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTW00IL8R6KFF@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 10:27:57 -0700 (MST) From: "John E. Barham" Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <043401c3ffb2$7ff48a20$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> <5eb036eb621fc8ca01d2b10665ad4e7d@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 09:27:40 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It's not that you can't do it in Lunix -- look at Globus' Replica > Location Service or MDS (Metasomething Discovery Service, they keep > changing the name) for just a few of the options for handling > replication, there are others specifically tailored to clusters too. Look interesting. It would be nice to avoid reinventing another wheel... > They are all crufty, don't play well with each other, require their > own clients and a pain in the proverbial to administer, but that's a > consequence of the multiple layers of abstraction they're built > upon to avoid admitting that UNIX simply lacks a decent > mechanism for importing remote resources. Yeah, the major disadvantage vis a vis Plan 9 is that they still requirement integration w/ our client software. > Binding remote exports in a union directory is so trivial in Plan 9 > that it's really a non-issue (you'll spend much more time tracking > which files are stored where, especially if they move). The show > stoppers are the clients -- what will you be using on the client side? Our clients operating systems are OS X, Windows and Linux. Client-side languages are C/C++ and Python. > Will you require users to be running Plan 9 to access the service, or > are you prepared to spend some time developing a way to bring it to > their environment (by, say, implementing a 9p client suitable for the > task, something like v9fs)... At this point nobody is running Plan 9, and there are too many dependencies client-side to consider P9 there. But running P9 on the file servers and headless image processing nodes (Mac G5s, BTW) might be worth considering at some point. John From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 02:35:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22183 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 02:35:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22179 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:35:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:35:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D91DC19CCA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:35:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4C9919AAA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:35:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 14EE819AAA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:35:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B562119AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:34:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <33c750f587189dcfaf9b67aa46ab0365@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux In-Reply-To: <043401c3ffb2$7ff48a20$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:37:18 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.9 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_DYNABLOCK, RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** I have quite a bit of 9p (client & server) done in python if that interests anyone m From viro@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 03:05:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23983 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 03:05:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23979 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 03:05:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 03:05:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7753519BCE; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:05:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E4DA19C27; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:05:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B496C19BEC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:04:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from www.linux.org.uk (parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk [195.92.249.252]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E03119BCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:04:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from viro by www.linux.org.uk with local (Exim 4.22) id 1AxrmK-00044t-91 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 18:04:32 +0000 From: viro@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301180432.GN16357@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk> References: <180eecfedf4d332edb744c24b27bc9ed@proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <180eecfedf4d332edb744c24b27bc9ed@proxima.alt.za> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:04:32 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 06:23:33PM +0200, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > No ways, it's a mismatch. Torvalds just organically grew an OS from > Minix, for the Intel architecture. The Great Barrier Reef likewise > grew organically, but is unlikely to be recommended as the dam wall > for the Yellow River. Oh, for crying out loud... Have you ever read either kernel? Yes or no? Or Plan 9 one, for that matter... From jas@corpus-callosum.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 03:27:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25812 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 03:27:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25808 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 03:27:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 03:27:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3648919DE1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:27:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5208A19B58; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:27:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C68C19B56; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6ECA519C65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i21IQ8fK081229 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:26:08 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <041d01c3ffb0$a2c8a010$6539a8c0@hpn5415> References: <029c01c3fefe$95f0a430$6539a8c0@hpn5415> <90923238-6AF5-11D8-829B-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> <041d01c3ffb0$a2c8a010$6539a8c0@hpn5415> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:26:03 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mar 1, 2004, at 11:14 AM, John E. Barham wrote: > > The Handle System looks pretty close to what we need. My major concern > would be that it runs on Java (e.g., that "What do I do if I get a Java > out-of-memory error?" is a FAQ does not inspire confidence...) Yikes, CNRI went all Java with the Handle System server software--at least the client libraries are still C. I remember early versions that were Python based, but alas they too have been lulled into Java on the server. It seems that CNRI has slowly been purging itself of all the Python source that had been developed there (could be one of the reasons Guido lef). From taj.khattra@pobox.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:03:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28204 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:03:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28200 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:03:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:03:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6EC5C19CD2; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:03:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F26B319C18; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:03:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7B1919C65; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:02:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from priv-edtnes27.telusplanet.net (outbound04.telus.net [199.185.220.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2021119C18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:02:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([142.179.32.16]) by priv-edtnes27.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.6.00.05.02 201-2115-109-103-20031105) with ESMTP id <20040301190203.GIXH22284.priv-edtnes27.telusplanet.net@localhost.localdomain> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:02:03 -0700 Received: (qmail 18731 invoked by uid 500); 1 Mar 2004 19:02:15 -0000 From: Taj Khattra To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301190215.GA18554@localhost.localdomain> References: <200403010934.i219YNhh064852@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403010934.i219YNhh064852@adat.davidashen.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 11:02:15 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Factory in Java is a simple concept, one more level of indirection. almost every concept in computing is about one or more levels of indirection. > It is built to provide a cleaner and smaller alternative to C++; yes, but that's not saying much - almost every language in existence provides a cleaner and smaller alternative to c++. > it offers very few concepts to learn i guess that's why the language spec alone is a svelte 500 pages. > -- and the extensive libraries are not meant > to learn -- there are javadocs for them. The core language and system not meant to learn? do javadocs have an ESP mechanism built into them? > Parallel programming in Java is easy and natural, as easy and natural > as in other language or system or even easier, dare I say it. You > just use threads, and use basic language features, such as variable > scopes, to have shared and private thread resources. No additional > flags and bits to remember; everything is easy and straightforward. no it isn't. it's nowhere near as easy and natural as the limbo, alef, erlang etc. model for concurrent programming. otoh, once you get used to it, everything looks easy and straightforward. > I think that the major objection against Java is its closedness, no, that's the major objection only for a few groups. From jbarham@jbarham.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:10:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28981 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:10:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28977 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:10:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:10:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19CD219D5F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:10:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9116319E21; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:10:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6B0419C80; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:09:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd3mo2so.prod.shaw.ca (shawidc-mo1.cg.shawcable.net [24.71.223.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B123819C56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from pd3mr3so.prod.shaw.ca (pd3mr3so-ser.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.141.179]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW00CHDVJKPY@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 12:02:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from pn2ml7so.prod.shaw.ca (pn2ml7so-qfe0.prod.shaw.ca [10.0.121.151]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HTW00KZ2VJJG1@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 12:02:07 -0700 (MST) Received: from hpn5415 (h24-87-250-11.vc.shawcable.net [24.87.250.11]) by l-daemon (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.18 (built Jul 28 2003)) with SMTP id <0HTW0019KVJJYC@l-daemon> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 01 Mar 2004 12:02:07 -0700 (MST) From: "John E. Barham" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <052e01c3ffbf$a42a0700$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Subject: [9fans] VMware & Plan 9 on Dell Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 11:01:44 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_SORBS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've ordered a Dell 5100 laptop (2.8 GHz P4, 512 MB RAM). XP is my default environment but I'll probably be running Mandrake Linux under VMware as well. Any reason why I can't run Plan 9 (although not necessarily concurrently w/ Mandrake) under VMware too? From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:19:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29821 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:19:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29817 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:19:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:19:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B62B19DC7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:19:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AA9519C80; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:19:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4FE2819C80; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:18:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F00A19BE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21JFwki068108 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:15:58 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21JFw0P068107 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:15:58 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403011915.i21JFw0P068107@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040301190215.GA18554@localhost.localdomain> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:15:58 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Factory in Java is a simple concept, one more level of indirection. > > almost every concept in computing is about one or more levels of > indirection. Most concepts are more levels of indirections than one. > > > It is built to provide a cleaner and smaller alternative to C++; > > yes, but that's not saying much - almost every language in existence provides > a cleaner and smaller alternative to c++. Not every language is built to provide a smaller and cleaner alternative to a successful one, and is successful. I would be glad to see limbo or Alef widely used. They are not. > > > it offers very few concepts to learn > > i guess that's why the language spec alone is a svelte 500 pages. No. It is because the spec is written by people who come from culture of detailed specifications; and it is because a part of the specification is dedicated to binary compatibility, which few other languages provide. Still yet, the specification for Java, 504 pages, is SMALLER than specification for ANSI/ISO C, which 554 pages. > > -- and the extensive libraries are not meant to learn -- there are javadocs > > for them. The core language and system > > not meant to learn? do javadocs have an ESP mechanism built into them? I do not know what is ESP. > > > Parallel programming in Java is easy and natural, as easy and natural > > as in other language or system or even easier, dare I say it. You > > just use threads, and use basic language features, such as variable > > scopes, to have shared and private thread resources. No additional > > flags and bits to remember; everything is easy and straightforward. > > no it isn't. it's nowhere near as easy and natural as the limbo, alef, > erlang etc. model for concurrent programming. otoh, once you get used > to it, everything looks easy and straightforward. I wrote many thousands lines of code in C, Java, Perl, Scheme and Oberon. I used to do parallel programming in Modula-2. Parallel programming in model is natural and straightforward, and it is an achievement of language designers to come up with the model. It is strange how often other systems are criticized for various features on this list. Is it a part of plan9 culture? Is there a garbage-collecting language with concepts for parallel programming born in Plan9 environment which can be used with Plan9 to try out? David From salomo3@cooper.edu Tue Mar 2 10:03:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:23:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30089 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:23:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30084 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:23:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:23:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F05719D77; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:23:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FDBC19D48; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:23:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E9FB19CCE; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (wish.cooper.edu [199.98.16.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BAD319BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:39 -0500 (EST) Received: by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix, from userid 94) id 3DE363939; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:13:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id BC1613937 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:13:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from verb.ee.cooper.edu ([199.98.20.228]) (SquirrelMail authenticated user salomo3) by wish.cooper.edu with HTTP; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:13:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4609.199.98.20.228.1078168427.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> In-Reply-To: References: <000d01c3fddf$72cc45b0$2bdcfea9@blue>, <00c801c3fdff$414b7d60$26fea8c0@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: "Joel Salomon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:13:47 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=PRIORITY_NO_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Douglas A. Gwyn said: > (Whose "Law" was it that said that file storage always > expands to fill whatever disk resources are available? > The same thing seems to apply to CPU cycles.) I've seen it quoted: "Intel giveth, Microsoft taketh away." Is interesting to look at various open-source projects and see which ones get larger & slower with newer versions (gcc, KDE, linux gets larger, but if Linus is to be believed, they *are* getting faster) and those that *decrease* in size -- any examples, anyone? Gnome, I *think*, but that's just because they started of with infinite bloat, nowhere to go but smaller/faster ;-) --Joel From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 2 10:03:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:30:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30368 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:30:59 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30364 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:30:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:30:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C5CF619DFA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7139A19D48; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:30:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A57A19D58; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:29:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43B1619D75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:29:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5b98fb3f6c9729bb1d0545547dd1a572@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware & Plan 9 on Dell From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <052e01c3ffbf$a42a0700$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 12:29:41 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I've ordered a Dell 5100 laptop (2.8 GHz P4, 512 MB RAM). XP is my default > environment but I'll probably be running Mandrake Linux under VMware as > well. Any reason why I can't run Plan 9 (although not necessarily > concurrently w/ Mandrake) under VMware too? besides the expensive license or preference for "free" alternatives -- no. you may have to install from the cd instead of using the vmware image. people have reported problems with 4.x and the vmware image. installing p9 from the cd should be fine. i'm using p9 daily as a terminal running under vmware 3.x. the speed is very reasonable when running locally, with cfs it's acceptable when running over dsl lines. andrey From salomo3@cooper.edu Tue Mar 2 10:03:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:32:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30458 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:32:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30454 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:32:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:32:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4FADD19E17; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:32:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D33A19CF1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:32:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F9C419DE8; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:31:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (wish.cooper.edu [199.98.16.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36F3A19BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:31:47 -0500 (EST) Received: by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix, from userid 94) id 529AE393A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id D57443937 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from verb.ee.cooper.edu ([199.98.20.228]) (SquirrelMail authenticated user salomo3) by wish.cooper.edu with HTTP; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4617.199.98.20.228.1078168977.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> In-Reply-To: <200403011915.i21JFw0P068107@adat.davidashen.net> References: <20040301190215.GA18554@localhost.localdomain> <200403011915.i21JFw0P068107@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: "Joel Salomon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:22:57 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=PRIORITY_NO_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin said: > I do not know what is ESP. Extra-Sensory Preception i.e. psychic powers. > Is there a garbage-collecting > language with concepts for parallel programming born in Plan9 environment > which can be used with Plan9 to try out? > Limbo/Inferno has been mentioned in this thread. Alef is dead, and cannot be brought back (licencing issues with SGI iirc) -- was it GC, though? Then there's Newsqueak, but I think that's just a proof-of-concept toy, and not very useable. But limbo is alive and available, and can be tried out under Windows, plan9, linux, mac (I think). --Joel From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 04:46:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31256 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 04:46:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31252 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 04:46:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 04:46:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 168D919D5F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:46:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C54119C65; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:46:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 427F019CF1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:45:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 796D719C65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:45:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21Jh1ki068204 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:43:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21Jh12q068203 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:43:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403011943.i21Jh12q068203@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <4617.199.98.20.228.1078168977.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:43:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I do not know what is ESP. > > Extra-Sensory Preception i.e. psychic powers. No javadoc does not have ESP. But one can always browse the documentation and see what interfaces are available. The javadoc generated documentation is hyperlinked in its basic format, which is very useful too. > But limbo is alive and available, and can be tried out under Windows, > plan9, linux, mac (I think). Yes, I have Inferno installed under FreeBSD. The problem with limbo for me is that it is much more 'a box in a box' than Java. This is not a language available in Plan 9. It is a language of Inferno, a different system that happens to have common roots with Plan 9. And, under FreeBSD, I cannot type in anything but English (that is, I need Russian, Armenian and Hebrew keyboard input on daily basis) without patching the kernel, I think. I am not saying I cannot live without limbo/Java/whatever. I am very happy with C, I've just compiled SCM under Plan9 and am going to bring system interfaces in, and there is hugs ported. But I would love to see something like limbo among basic tools of Plan9. Or like Java. Or, even better, both. And compare how good they go in the same environment. David From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 05:30:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1415 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 05:30:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1411 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 05:30:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 05:30:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A0A6619DC1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:30:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE72E19DC7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:30:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4086019B57; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:30:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8DBD19B60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21KRbki068425 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:27:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21KRbXZ068424 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:27:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012027.i21KRbXZ068424@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] indenting source? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:27:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, many sources in libc are written with four characters indent. What editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? David From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 05:38:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1971 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 05:38:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1967 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 05:38:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 05:38:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D54C19E30; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:38:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2227719DFA; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:38:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A17B19DE1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:37:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 050DB19B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:37:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9593ae2174b94077e514cccc76fa050b@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403012027.i21KRbXZ068424@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:37:50 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Hi, > > many sources in libc are written with four characters indent. What > editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to > input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? > > David which libraries are those? i haven't seen anything but tabs for indentation. if you edit using acme(1) you can set $tabstop to whatever you like, but the source will still have tabs. andrey From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 05:48:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2474 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 05:48:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2470 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 05:48:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 05:48:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 00AD319E21; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:48:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6945819C59; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:48:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 387FA19E12; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:47:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5365719C51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:47:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403012027.i21KRbXZ068424@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:52:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > many sources in libc are written with four characters indent. % cd /sys/src/libc % grep '^ +[^*]' */*.c gives just the following lines of code for me: port/pow.c: zreturn: port/strtoul.c: if(base<2 || 36; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:48:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21KkEki068516 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:46:14 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21KkE3w068515 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:46:14 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012046.i21KkE3w068515@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <9593ae2174b94077e514cccc76fa050b@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:46:14 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > many sources in libc are written with four characters indent. What > > editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to > > input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? > > > > David > > which libraries are those? i haven't seen anything but tabs for > indentation. > > if you edit using acme(1) you can set $tabstop to whatever you like, > but the source will still have tabs. You are right. There are tabs there. I just cat /sys/src/libc/port/abs.c and saw 4 positions indent in term. Under examination, there are tabs there, and they show as 8 characters indents in sam. Can it be controlled somehow in window? From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 05:50:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2554 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 05:50:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2550 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 05:50:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 05:50:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6C18219E12; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:50:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6933819A9C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:50:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05A7319C51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:49:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (mta01-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.41]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 575F619C59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from spindrift ([81.111.117.88]) by mta01-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20040301204749.EIQK15439.mta01-svc.ntlworld.com@spindrift> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:47:49 +0000 Message-ID: <002d01c3ffce$60665190$58756f51@ntlworld.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200402290104.i1T14kCr049567@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] iTuner Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:47:11 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Had a look at the iTuner - is it really $400? Thats expensive for a mini ITX these days (or am I being Naive?). -Steve From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 05:54:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2746 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 05:54:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2741 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 05:54:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 05:54:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6184E19D5F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:54:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A550119E36; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:54:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0F3DE19D5F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:53:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5B5619E21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:53:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21Krob5029007 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:53:50 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21Kropk025120 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:53:50 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21KrofQ011722 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:53:50 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <002d01c3ffce$60665190$58756f51@ntlworld.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 13:53:49 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Steve Simon wrote: > Had a look at the iTuner - is it really $400? Thats expensive for a > mini ITX these days (or am I being Naive?). naive. Yeah the mini itx is cheap. Wrap it up in reasonable sheet metal, with that expenso 12V adapter supply, and add in the other junk, and ca. $400 is about what you'll pay from anyone. It's on the low end. Check out those oh-so-fancy british boxes with no fan and brushed metal -- $1200. ron From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:02:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3023 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:02:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3019 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:02:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:02:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 66BEA19A1C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D715E19A14; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:02:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 160CD19E2D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:01:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9DA019A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:01:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:03:26 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>oh-so-fancy british boxes with no fan and brushed metal -- $1200. they're for the export market. From dfawcus@cisco.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:08:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3253 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:08:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3249 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:08:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:08:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0077B19E38; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:08:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70E4C19E12; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:08:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFB2E19A31; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-5.cisco.com (sj-iport-5.cisco.com [171.68.10.87]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80CC819E11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 01 Mar 2004 13:07:25 -0800 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i21L6u0a014347 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:06:56 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id VAA26018 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:07:20 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <4617.199.98.20.228.1078168977.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> <200403011943.i21Jh12q068203@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200403011943.i21Jh12q068203@adat.davidashen.net>; from dvd@davidashen.net on Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 11:43:01PM +0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:07:19 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 11:43:01PM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > Yes, I have Inferno installed under FreeBSD. The problem with limbo > for me is that it is much more 'a box in a box' than Java. But wasn't that supposed to be the aim of Java? An identical virtual machine running on all systems, such that code could be written once? At least in concept, then inferno/limbo would seem to be "java done right". DF From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:14:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3422 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:14:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3418 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:14:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:14:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D45B19E69; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0422819E4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 269B119A31; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:13:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E91B19DC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:13:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-aeavkhztwmgklzzvytgahqwosz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:15:13 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-aeavkhztwmgklzzvytgahqwosz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you're telling me. nevertheless, there is more that could and no doubt will be done to make it less obtrusive and more intrusive. --upas-aeavkhztwmgklzzvytgahqwosz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 1 21:08:23 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFD7919E42; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:08:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0C5119E11; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:08:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFB2E19A31; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-5.cisco.com (sj-iport-5.cisco.com [171.68.10.87]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80CC819E11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:07:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 01 Mar 2004 13:07:25 -0800 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i21L6u0a014347 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:06:56 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id VAA26018 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:07:20 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <4617.199.98.20.228.1078168977.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> <200403011943.i21Jh12q068203@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200403011943.i21Jh12q068203@adat.davidashen.net>; from dvd@davidashen.net on Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 11:43:01PM +0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:07:19 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 11:43:01PM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > Yes, I have Inferno installed under FreeBSD. The problem with limbo > for me is that it is much more 'a box in a box' than Java. But wasn't that supposed to be the aim of Java? An identical virtual machine running on all systems, such that code could be written once? At least in concept, then inferno/limbo would seem to be "java done right". DF --upas-aeavkhztwmgklzzvytgahqwosz-- From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:15:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3470 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:15:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3466 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:15:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:15:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C464119E66; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F412019E4E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:15:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC41F19E4E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F45919E49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <69a285530f09c7b04a4293cb7a50c390@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:20:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But wasn't that supposed to be the aim of Java? An identical virtual > machine running on all systems, such that code could be written once? > > At least in concept, then inferno/limbo would seem to be "java done right". i think the real problem people have with it is the visual one: there really is a box (window) on screen that holds all your inferno windows. the new inferno window manager allows one to break out of this box, in principle (i've done such a thing for rio, except later changes broke it; charles suggested a fix which i should implement sometime). under other systems, it would need a change in the draw device to allow multiple windows (it's not entirely clear what the base abstraction should be), but that shouldn't be too hard, it's just setting the time aside to do it! From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:15:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3485 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:15:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3481 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:15:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:15:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 978C219E78; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:15:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC50D19E36; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:15:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 07C1D19E49; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:15:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 712E619DC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21LCXki068638 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:12:33 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21LCX5E068637 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:12:33 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:12:33 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 11:43:01PM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > Yes, I have Inferno installed under FreeBSD. The problem with limbo > > for me is that it is much more 'a box in a box' than Java. > > But wasn't that supposed to be the aim of Java? An identical virtual > machine running on all systems, such that code could be written once? > > At least in concept, then inferno/limbo would seem to be "java done right". Java is done right in concept. In reality, inferno is no more right than Java. Unfortunately. I can do system programming and command-line apps with Java. How am I supposed with Inferno on FreeBSD to do that? David From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:27:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3986 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:27:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3981 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:27:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:27:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 34FDE19E50; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBE1419B8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB7ED19E10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED3C419B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21LO1ki068718 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21LO1IS068717 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <002d01c3ffce$60665190$58756f51@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Had a look at the iTuner? How am I supposed to install plan9 on iTuner -- copy it to CF elsewhere? I'm sorry if it is a stupid question. David From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:29:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4074 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:29:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4070 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:29:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:29:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6C6B819E5B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:29:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5508D19E49; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:29:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7095319E10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:28:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D913B19B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:28:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <56bab4eff0cccaa8e93a41ca587306f7@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:30:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that's what i've done before with other devices, using either Plan 9 or Inferno on an existing device to prepare the CF for the new device. --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 1 21:27:14 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FF1B19E29; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C34919B8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB7ED19E10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED3C419B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21LO1ki068718 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21LO1IS068717 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <002d01c3ffce$60665190$58756f51@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Had a look at the iTuner? How am I supposed to install plan9 on iTuner -- copy it to CF elsewhere? I'm sorry if it is a stupid question. David --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:41:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4674 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:41:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4670 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:41:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:41:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9DD8F19E4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:41:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33F0819E3F; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:41:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D69BF19DC7; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:40:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85C1419C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:40:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LeOb5010301 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:40:27 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LeNdc010491 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:40:24 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LeNfQ014115 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:40:23 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:40:23 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, David Tolpin wrote: > How am I supposed to install plan9 on iTuner -- > copy it to CF elsewhere? I'm sorry if it is a > stupid question. yeah, you make a cf bootable just as you would an ide drive. ron From bwc@borf.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:42:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4736 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:42:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4732 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:42:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:42:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5DA3419E5E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23DD919E4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:42:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D620719E36; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:41:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB16F19B25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:41:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <56bab4eff0cccaa8e93a41ca587306f7@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dsethzhajhnixggwgcxrpudnjz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:38:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dsethzhajhnixggwgcxrpudnjz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Speaking of sticking something on a CF, what are you guys using to do this? I'm just now fiddling with the usb stuff to talk to my CF reader. Brantley --upas-dsethzhajhnixggwgcxrpudnjz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from relay.borf.com ([205.185.197.204]) by edsac; Mon Mar 1 16:29:28 EST 2004 Received: from [130.203.4.6] by borf.com ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:25:39 -0400 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0FB519E51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:29:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7808D19E29; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:29:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7095319E10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:28:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D913B19B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:28:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <56bab4eff0cccaa8e93a41ca587306f7@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:30:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that's what i've done before with other devices, using either Plan 9 or Inferno on an existing device to prepare the CF for the new device. --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 1 21:27:14 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FF1B19E29; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C34919B8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:27:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB7ED19E10; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED3C419B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i21LO1ki068718 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i21LO1IS068717 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403012124.i21LO1IS068717@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <002d01c3ffce$60665190$58756f51@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:24:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Had a look at the iTuner? How am I supposed to install plan9 on iTuner -- copy it to CF elsewhere? I'm sorry if it is a stupid question. David --upas-qidjmxcjbgvwxrncpmwfucpaue-- --upas-dsethzhajhnixggwgcxrpudnjz-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 06:44:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4840 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 06:44:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4835 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 06:44:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 06:44:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA6DC19E4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:44:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 832C819E4C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:44:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A027519E5E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CF1819E49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:43:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGb5011234 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGpk018811 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGfQ014271 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:15 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Brantley Coile wrote: > Speaking of sticking something on a CF, what are you > guys using to do this? I'm just now fiddling with > the usb stuff to talk to my CF reader. Linux ... ron From bwc@borf.com Tue Mar 2 10:03:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 07:52:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8023 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 07:52:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8019 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 07:52:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 07:52:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1A7A19E51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:52:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DAFD19DC1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:52:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B16A819DC1; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:51:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C58319B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:51:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2ffc0f359bf00f823758b54b22cd170a@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cdwjhjmchcdgwirawaskwlpodb" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:44:59 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cdwjhjmchcdgwirawaskwlpodb Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yeah, that's what I'm doing now. I need to move this operation to Plan 9. Is it just a matter of writing SCSI commands into the ep1data and reading the responses from ep2data? Brantley --upas-cdwjhjmchcdgwirawaskwlpodb Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from relay.borf.com ([205.185.197.204]) by edsac; Mon Mar 1 16:44:48 EST 2004 Received: from [130.203.4.6] by borf.com ; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:40:37 -0400 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F3CF19E67; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:44:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24BCD19E49; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:44:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A027519E5E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CF1819E49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:43:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGb5011234 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGpk018811 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i21LhGfQ014271 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:16 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 14:43:15 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Brantley Coile wrote: > Speaking of sticking something on a CF, what are you > guys using to do this? I'm just now fiddling with > the usb stuff to talk to my CF reader. Linux ... ron --upas-cdwjhjmchcdgwirawaskwlpodb-- From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 2 10:03:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 08:09:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8761 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 08:09:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8757 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 08:09:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 08:09:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE44519B0A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:09:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EA3419E2D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:09:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D7EA19DC0; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEE9F19B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:08:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5f2452b782334756dee75e28d677f1b5@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:08:23 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I boot Plan 9 off floppy to initialise the CF on an IDE interface. From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 10:03:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 09:22:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13400 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 09:22:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13165 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 09:20:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 09:20:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D42319E5D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:20:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8444F19CBB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:20:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D215C19C8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:19:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FCC119E2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i220JQb5028396 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:19:27 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i220JQpk028931 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:19:26 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i220JQfQ021859 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:19:26 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] server configuration In-Reply-To: <1ea06dc44ac1c0de11fec6300f6bfb13@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:19:26 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: well I just fixed my problem with server configuration. I was unable to drawterm from my linux laptop to my plan 9 laptop. Error was the obscure '?AS: protocol botch: file does not exist' which is not so obvious when you can't find any files that don't exist :-) Turns out the file /rc/bin/service.auth/tcp567 was a directory, more or less, except it was a file and was full of junk -- kind of looked like it had the contents of /rc/bin/service.auth in the file tcp567. Clearly not what was intended. Of course it has to have #!/bin/rc /bin/auth/authsrv $3 Don't know how this one got smashed. Happy now, can cpu again to my T21. ron From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 2 10:03:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 09:58:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16876 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 09:58:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16872 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 09:58:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 09:58:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E827719DF0; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:58:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0233D19CBB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:58:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B5FB419CBB; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:57:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 527DD19B43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 19:57:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Java Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:59:33 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Inferno can't do administration in the native OS? Poppycock! emu -d -r'/home/www/logs' '/usr/matt/process_logs.dis' (I think that's the correct syntax, I don't have one at hand to test but I did used to run it like that) Inferno is perfectly capable of running as a single program You can even put it in inetd if you were kinky enough or just run it as it's own listener. m From r@geekmail.cc Tue Mar 2 11:14:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 10:42:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20976 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 10:42:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20972 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 10:42:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 10:42:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A95319E6D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6650E19E4A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:42:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1D4519E2D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:41:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33F3C19CBB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:41:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i221erX6015172 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:40:53 -0800 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <7e3049782c9b96bdd8a5ba0caf4e4b38@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:40:53 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Passing a fn pointer through > a pointer, which IMHO he missed, of course is. IMHO, he should > read the source of acme. I did learn a lot by doing so (after decades > of doing concurrent programs). philw was sitting at the next terminal when i wrote that code, which was originally in alef. i showed it to him and he was surprised that it even worked. no faith in his own language. but the language worked and so did the program. -rob From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 2 11:56:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 11:17:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24195 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 11:17:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24190 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 11:17:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 11:17:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 279B419E2D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:17:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44C0719E69; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:17:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4721519E5D; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:16:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB54719E51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:16:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <319554-25629>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:15:09 -0500 Message-ID: <011b01c3fffc$0a802e80$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403012027.i21KRbXZ068424@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:13:59 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From: "David Tolpin" > editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to > input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? pauvre cherie From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 2 11:56:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 11:28:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25047 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 11:28:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25043 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 11:28:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 11:28:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A18CF19E73; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:28:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1F4419E51; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:28:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4061519C9B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:27:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 259F219E51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:27:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9736 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 02:27:30 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 02:27:30 -0000 Message-ID: <049401c3fffe$14023190$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] need a microdrive? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:02:50 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: novel way to get a microdrive ... http://www.studio2f.com/archives/000438.php From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 2 11:56:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 11:49:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26707 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 11:49:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26703 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 11:49:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 11:49:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CD1019B74; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6FD619E7C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBB2319E76; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B89C719E74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <319753-10375>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:47:37 -0500 Message-ID: <014401c40000$916ee360$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:46:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From: "David Tolpin" > Java is done right in concept. In reality, inferno is no more right > than Java. bullshit From salomo3@cooper.edu Tue Mar 2 12:49:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 11:57:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27369 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 11:57:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27365 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 11:57:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 11:57:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0AE8E19DF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:57:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A199A19B12; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:57:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C0EF919DF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (wish.cooper.edu [199.98.16.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE6F619DF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix, from userid 94) id 8387E393A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id 0A77F3937 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from verb.ee.cooper.edu ([199.98.20.228]) (SquirrelMail authenticated user salomo3) by wish.cooper.edu with HTTP; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2659.199.98.20.228.1078195680.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> In-Reply-To: <69a285530f09c7b04a4293cb7a50c390@vitanuova.com> References: <20040301210719.B10993@edinburgh.cisco.com> <69a285530f09c7b04a4293cb7a50c390@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: "Joel Salomon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:48:00 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=PRIORITY_NO_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rog@vitanuova.com said: > the new inferno window manager allows one to break out of this box, in > principle (i've done such a thing for rio, except later changes broke > it; charles suggested a fix which i should implement sometime). > Two questions about integrating inferno/limbo into plan9: 1) is there any way to make dis programs "runnable" like shell scripts are? eg %dis/charon rather than %emu /bin/dis/charon 2) could the inferno system be made to serve its /prog to the machine's /proc? this would blur the borders between the host plan9 and the inferno subsystem, which might be a good thing or a terrible idea. --Joel From martin@parvat.com Tue Mar 2 14:11:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:14:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1722 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:14:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1718 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:14:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:14:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9EC8B19B74; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:14:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E99519B01; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:14:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5648B19B47; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:13:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.176]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 954A919AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:13:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.162] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ay1I0-0004Cy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:13:52 +0100 Received: from [203.101.54.247] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ay1Hy-0000Bz-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:13:51 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux Message-Id: <20040302094053.0e2f265a.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <33c750f587189dcfaf9b67aa46ab0365@juice.thebigchoice.com> References: <043401c3ffb2$7ff48a20$6539a8c0@hpn5415> <33c750f587189dcfaf9b67aa46ab0365@juice.thebigchoice.com> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:40:53 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004 17:37:18 0000 matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > I have quite a bit of 9p (client & server) done in python if that interests anyone > > m > I've got Russ' 9p Python code. It was very nice, but it would be interesting to see some other approaches to compare... Thanks, Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From taj.khattra@pobox.com Tue Mar 2 14:11:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:22:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2347 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:22:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2342 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:22:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:22:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D2EB19BCC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:22:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4034C19B47; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:22:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54B9B19BBC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:21:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net (outbound05.telus.net [199.185.220.224]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF8FB19B47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:20:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([142.179.32.16]) by priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.6.00.05.02 201-2115-109-103-20031105) with ESMTP id <20040302042058.MZFO22898.priv-edtnes40.telusplanet.net@localhost.localdomain> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:20:58 -0700 Received: (qmail 20879 invoked by uid 500); 2 Mar 2004 04:13:09 -0000 From: Taj Khattra To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> References: <000901c3ff18$950fe250$26fea8c0@SOMA> <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:13:09 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > in contrast to the quote above, in an ancient usenet article, > in the context of concurrent programming, i am reasonably certain that > rob made the observation that as a discipline, we can learn. he http://groups.google.ca/groups?q=ie=UTF-8&selm=13fi7tINNk1i%40darkstar.UCSC.EDU&rnum=1 > that seems to me to be a better quote to use. i like this line from todd proebsting: ``Concurrency models many applications better than objects, yet the world is mired in OO religion.'' of course, joe armstrong has been preaching this for many years too. From rvs@sun.com Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:35:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3426 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:35:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3422 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:35:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:35:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3EDD19BF5; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:35:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA62E19B83; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:35:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 031B119B7A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:34:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from nwkea-mail-1.sun.com (nwkea-mail-1.sun.com [192.18.42.13]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AFEF19991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:34:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.42]) by nwkea-mail-1.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i224YQ0J023836 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:34:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from submarine.sfbay.sun.com (submarine.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.78.138]) by sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id i224YQXd002626 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:34:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rs76089@localhost) by submarine.sfbay.sun.com (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id i224YQS01095 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:34:26 -0800 (PST) From: Roman Shaposhnick To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040302043425.GB1080@submarine> References: <000901c3ff18$950fe250$26fea8c0@SOMA> <757a63de546942340d005e0e4fcc471e@terzarima.net> <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 20:34:26 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What do you guys think of OpenMP extension for C/C++ (http://www.openmp.org) ? Of course, it's nothing radical, but still being able to write: #pragma omp for for (i=0; i<1000; i++) { do_something; } and not having to worry about nuts'n'bolts of the implementation is pretty neat. Plus there's a bonus of worry-free synchronization (at least in it's simplest form of a barrier). I do realize, that OpenMP is mostly suited for a domain with short-lived fire-and-forget sort of threads, but still, the fact that it's integrated with the language should be appealing enough. Thanks, Roman. On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 08:13:09PM -0800, Taj Khattra wrote: > > in contrast to the quote above, in an ancient usenet article, > > in the context of concurrent programming, i am reasonably certain that > > rob made the observation that as a discipline, we can learn. he > > http://groups.google.ca/groups?q=ie=UTF-8&selm=13fi7tINNk1i%40darkstar.UCSC.EDU&rnum=1 > > > that seems to me to be a better quote to use. > > i like this line from todd proebsting: ``Concurrency models many > applications better than objects, yet the world is mired in OO > religion.'' of course, joe armstrong has been preaching this for > many years too. From vdharani@infernopark.com Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:43:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4163 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:43:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4159 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:43:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:43:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3349D19C4A; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:43:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BE8619BCC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:43:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6881F19BCC; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:42:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (unknown [216.127.72.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFD6319AEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:42:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from infernopark.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i22782615761; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:08:02 -0500 Received: from 67.85.61.176 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:08:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <32830.67.85.61.176.1078211282.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Cc: X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.5) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:08:02 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_NJABL, RCVD_IN_NJABL_RELAY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * hi, >> Had a look at the iTuner - is it really $400? Thats expensive for a >> mini ITX these days (or am I being Naive?). > > naive. > > Yeah the mini itx is cheap. Wrap it up in reasonable sheet metal, with > that expenso 12V adapter supply, and add in the other junk, and ca. > $400 is about what you'll pay from anyone. It's on the low end. Check > out those oh-so-fancy british boxes with no fan and brushed metal -- > $1200. i decided to spend some money and build a system consisting of a couple of small machines and try some grid stuff. given that my budget is not too high (about $500 at best), i was thinking of linksys (wrt54g) or ituner box. though i like wrt54g, i am hesitating because a) i am not sure how easy it is to put inferno in it b) i am not sure if i can turn off the wifi part c) i cant do plan9 grid. now, i am leaning towards ituner stuff because, hopefully, i can try both plan9 grid and inferno grid. the board i prefer should be CPU/>=64MB/ethernet/VGA(?). i am thinking of 2+boards. how much would it cost with and without the box? and how easy or how tough is it to get the first kernel loaded? i think once i build and load the kernel, i can proceed from there. if someone can help me, please let me know. once i know the parts, i can order them. i like the ones i see in 9grid page and i will be happy if i can do a similar setup to play with. btw, wouldnt it be nice if 9fans (of similar interest) stick one model like ituner box? that way, we could have better device support eventually. any help appreciated. thanks dharani From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:48:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4596 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:48:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4572 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:48:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:48:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF19D19C52; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:48:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFD0219C2B; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:48:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D79F19C52; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:47:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB9B519AEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:47:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224l3b5019829 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:47:03 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224l3dc010181 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:47:03 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224l2fQ030940 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:47:02 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040302043425.GB1080@submarine> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:47:01 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Roman Shaposhnick wrote: > What do you guys think of OpenMP extension for C/C++ > (http://www.openmp.org) ? And to think I just ate. Too bad. Too bad! ron From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:50:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4853 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:50:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4849 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:50:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:50:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7D1C19C34; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:50:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 038A319B15; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:50:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 961E819B15; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:49:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21DA819B17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:49:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224nnb5020080 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:49 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224nmdc010566; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:48 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224nmfQ031100; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:48 -0700 From: ron minnich To: vdharani@infernopark.com Cc: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner In-Reply-To: <32830.67.85.61.176.1078211282.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:49:47 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 vdharani@infernopark.com wrote: > the board i prefer should be CPU/>=64MB/ethernet/VGA(?). i am thinking of > 2+boards. how much would it cost with and without the box? you need a PS per board. If you want to be compact you get those 12V PSes. They will cost you $129. Or get cheap PC power supplies for $20 each. But then it is a space hog. There are no good choices. You can save lotsa money but then you don't get something small. I have found small boxes for (believe it or not!) $12 with PS included that you could put the EPIA in. but they are ... ugly and big. > and how easy or how tough is it to get the first kernel loaded? i think > once i build and load the kernel, i can proceed from there. if someone can > help me, please let me know. once i know the parts, i can order them. It's just not hard. > btw, wouldnt it be nice if 9fans (of similar interest) stick one model > like ituner box? that way, we could have better device support > eventually. We'd still like to sell plan 9 boxes that just come up and work. It's meeting everyone's needs that is tough. ron From martin@parvat.com Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:52:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5072 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:52:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5059 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:52:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:52:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 331DE19B8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C3A919B8E; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:52:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 515D219B15; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:51:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6D9819B8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:51:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.161] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ay1s6-0003U5-00; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:51:10 +0100 Received: from [203.101.54.247] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ay1s5-0002Op-00; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:51:09 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: Linus Torvalds Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-Id: <20040302101812.35190293.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:18:12 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 01:30:57 -0800 (PST) Linus Torvalds wrote: >... > The "clone()" system call in Linux just creates a new such "context of >... > The bits you can control the context copy with are: >... > CLONE_NEWNS /* New namespace group? */ >... Does this mean "namespace" in the Plan 9 sense? Is it implemented yet, or was this file written in the "future optimistic" tense? :-) BTW: the definition isn't listed in my man page for clone(2), or my Debian woody header files, however, see below... I heard that Al Viro was doing something in this area some time back, but don't know what happened to his work. (Sure enough, it does seem to do something in 2.4.24 - is this a "best kept secret"? If it works, why aren't we all using it?) Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 14:11:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 13:57:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5787 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 13:57:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5723 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 13:57:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 13:57:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2D3319C7C; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:57:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F11F19C37; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:57:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B15819BCF; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:56:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5FC319B15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:56:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224uhb5020323 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:43 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224uhdc011323; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:43 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i224ugfQ031571; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:42 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: Linus Torvalds Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040302101812.35190293.martin@parvat.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:56:41 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Martin C.Atkins wrote: > Does this mean "namespace" in the Plan 9 sense? Is it implemented > yet, or was this file written in the "future optimistic" tense? :-) in many ways. We exploit this new stuff for v9fs. It has allowed us to have private name space mounts on the 1024 node cluster. It's pretty nice. > I heard that Al Viro was doing something in this area some time > back, but don't know what happened to his work. (Sure enough, it > does seem to do something in 2.4.24 - is this a "best kept secret"? > If it works, why aren't we all using it?) It works. I don't know why we're not all using it. ron From 9nut@9netics.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 14:38:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9908 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 14:38:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9900 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 14:38:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 14:38:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CB4519BF5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:38:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B257619BA2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:38:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1B1C19BA4; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:37:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2B2119A00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:37:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:38:09 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > which reminds me of the sketch > in the Life of Brian: ``the people's liberation army of judea'', > ``the judean people's liberation army'', ... . splitters! "Judean People's Front" and "People's Front of Judea." Brilliantly funny! http://www.mwscomp.com/movies/brian/brian-07.htm From rvs@sun.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 14:54:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11587 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 14:54:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11583 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 14:54:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 14:54:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4C2A19B39; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:54:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB3DD19B39; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:54:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8BBA19BA4; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:53:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from brmea-mail-3.sun.com (brmea-mail-3.Sun.COM [192.18.98.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74BC919B26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.42]) by brmea-mail-3.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i225rFi5006037 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:53:15 -0700 (MST) Received: from submarine.sfbay.sun.com (submarine.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.78.138]) by sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id i225rEXd019936 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:53:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rs76089@localhost) by submarine.sfbay.sun.com (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id i225rEs01148 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:53:14 -0800 (PST) From: Roman Shaposhnick To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-ID: <20040302055314.GA1142@submarine> References: <20040302043425.GB1080@submarine> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 21:53:14 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 01, 2004 at 09:47:01PM -0700, ron minnich wrote: > On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Roman Shaposhnick wrote: > > > What do you guys think of OpenMP extension for C/C++ > > (http://www.openmp.org) ? > > And to think I just ate. Hungry or not, what *do* you think ? Thanks, Roman. From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 2 20:26:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 14:59:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12048 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 14:59:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12018 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 14:59:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 14:59:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D45D719C81; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:59:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE71119BA4; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:59:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6D92319BAE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:58:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 301B319BA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:58:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i225w8b5022742 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:58:08 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i225w8dc018695 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:58:08 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i225w8fQ001423 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:58:08 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <20040302055314.GA1142@submarine> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 22:58:07 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Roman Shaposhnick wrote: > > And to think I just ate. > > Hungry or not, what *do* you think ? openmp is a bad idea. ron From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 15:04:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12558 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 15:04:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12554 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 15:04:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 15:04:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 40FC219CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:04:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3383419C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:04:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 053A319C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:03:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A30819BA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:03:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2260mki070668 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:00:48 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2260mYk070667 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:00:48 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020600.i2260mYk070667@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <011b01c3fffc$0a802e80$67844051@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:00:48 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to > > input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? > > pauvre cherie > I don't know what is that 'cherie' that is poor, but please how can I make my text windows in rio show indents in increments of 8 for tabs, and not of 4? Please use English. David From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 15:05:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12708 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 15:05:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12704 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 15:05:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 15:05:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0D0319CAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:05:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EBE919CA6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:05:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C0BB19CAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:04:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 649F719BAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:04:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2262Oki070675 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:02:24 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2262OJu070674 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:02:24 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020602.i2262OJu070674@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <014401c40000$916ee360$67844051@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:02:24 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: "David Tolpin" > > Java is done right in concept. In reality, inferno is no more right > > than Java. > > bullshit In particular, what part of limbo in reality is better than Java in such a way that reminded you bull's excrements? David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 15:59:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17961 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 15:59:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17948 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 15:59:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 15:59:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94B1419BC8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:59:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96E6919BD9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:59:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C95E19BD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:58:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA33419BB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:57:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i226tUki070927 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:55:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i226tUPh070926 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:55:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020655.i226tUPh070926@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:55:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > how can I make my text windows in rio show indents in increments of 8 > > for tabs, and not of 4? > > > % tabstops=4 In acme and samterm, it is tabstop, not tabstops. > is all sam needs to adjust to 4 spaces to the tab. > Acme does it by > default, but it also obeys $tabstops. Learn acme in preference to > sam, it will astonish you. Yes, I know how to use acme for editing, and had learned it before acme had been written. In 1991, I think. > I keep using sam by habit, and it seems to > me to be a bad habit. I don't think sam is a bad habit. It is a different editor, less integrated into Plan9/rio, but I use it not just in Plan 9. The question, however, was not how to do 4 spaces per tab in sam. It was the opposite. I was asking how to make window show 8 spaces per tab. I've looked into the sources. It turns out that I cannot do it for one window, I have to set tabstop and run rio. It can be obvious for you, but it was not for me, untill I looked at what /bin/window is. The code in acme.c appears to be copy'n'pasted from the same source as code in rio.c, with independent default value for maxtab. Why it is needed? Is acme supposed to run without rio? David Tolpin From 9nut@9netics.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:00:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18113 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:00:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18109 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:00:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:00:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 89C5619C28; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B3AF19BFE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A75A19C26; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B0C819BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a26f30be56f60f683a5f03e05cfc083@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] VMware & Plan 9 on Dell From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <052e01c3ffbf$a42a0700$6539a8c0@hpn5415> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 00:00:22 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I've ordered a Dell 5100 laptop (2.8 GHz P4, 512 MB RAM). XP is my default > environment but I'll probably be running Mandrake Linux under VMware as > well. Any reason why I can't run Plan 9 (although not necessarily > concurrently w/ Mandrake) under VMware too? I have a similar setup (2.4GHz cpu) and routinely run Plan9 term on VMware 4.0. At times (during testing) I run another instance. As Andrey mentioned, will have to do a cd install with VMWare 4, and check previous posts regarding "legacy mode" for CD drive setting. From r@geekmail.cc Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:01:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18215 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:01:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18211 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:01:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:01:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C4D419CA6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:01:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE78C19BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:01:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 214F119BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D64F419BFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2270rbk019506 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:00:53 -0800 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:00:53 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. -rob From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:02:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18236 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:02:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18232 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:02:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:02:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E0D719980; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:01:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FF8F19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:01:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 68F1019BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D949819BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i226w3ki070942 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:58:03 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i226w3An070941 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:58:03 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020658.i226w3An070941@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:58:03 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The Inferno/Java paper (somewhere on the web site, but likely also in > the Plan 9 distribution) covers it rather nicely. Google brings inexistent link. Object not found The object /inferno/infernojava.html does not exist on this server. I've found an article on similar subject, namely http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/rob/hotchips.html The only claim I have found is that reference counting + coloring is better than mark'n'sweep. Given that Java's GC is not mark'n'sweep for a long time already, and the performance problems related to memory management are insignificant since the release of HotSpot, are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? Besides, are there measured comparisons of Java and Limbo in the area of memory usage and GC performance? My experience with implementing GC in virtual machines is that reference-counting+graph coloring can easily result in slower execution than mark'n'sweep. David Tolpin From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:07:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18864 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:07:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18860 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:07:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:07:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6567A19BFE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:07:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D2AC19BFE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:07:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1FD619BEE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:06:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EB8E19A12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:06:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403020658.i226w3An070941@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:06:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? Sure, the language. Just try to write a program in both and compare. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:11:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19266 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:11:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19262 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:11:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:11:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B91B319C7C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:11:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DD8C19C2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:11:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB1AC19C2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:10:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6782419BEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22787ki071039 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22787H3071038 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020708.i22787H3071038@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? > > Sure, the language. > Just try to write a program in both and compare. I did. Am I missing something? How closures are expressed in limbo? From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:14:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19517 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:14:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19513 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:14:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:14:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7816819CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:14:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 544FE19C7B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:14:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C4D8E19C37; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:13:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A26E19C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:13:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c7e9500b91e41843971dcc981312e7f@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <5f2452b782334756dee75e28d677f1b5@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-njuqyrllutznefhvnuwaihfzwi" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:15:37 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-njuqyrllutznefhvnuwaihfzwi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i used a PCMCIA to CF adapter --upas-njuqyrllutznefhvnuwaihfzwi Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 1 23:09:18 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A210519E30; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA3E19E17; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:09:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D7EA19DC0; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEE9F19B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:08:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5f2452b782334756dee75e28d677f1b5@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:08:23 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I boot Plan 9 off floppy to initialise the CF on an IDE interface. --upas-njuqyrllutznefhvnuwaihfzwi-- From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:15:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19581 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:15:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19577 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:15:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:15:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 988FC19CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:15:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9F0019CA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:15:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 515D219CA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:14:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A202019C7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:14:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <58c9a09539806ad0e5d6c0b07b3c7c89@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403020708.i22787H3071038@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wnhsuxmevnxalosrzknrqrlrqq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:14:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wnhsuxmevnxalosrzknrqrlrqq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You did for a real program? Or for a simple example? I started to feel the difference only after doing my first real limbo program. But just to tell you what I mean, I feel that limbo lacks those features that make Java a complex laguage, yet it retains those that make it easy to reuse code. That's arguable, of course. --upas-wnhsuxmevnxalosrzknrqrlrqq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 2 08:11:29 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC08819C7D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:11:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DD8C19C2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:11:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB1AC19C2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:10:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6782419BEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22787ki071039 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22787H3071038 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020708.i22787H3071038@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:07 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? > > Sure, the language. > Just try to write a program in both and compare. I did. Am I missing something? How closures are expressed in limbo? --upas-wnhsuxmevnxalosrzknrqrlrqq-- From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:33:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21544 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:33:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21540 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:33:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:33:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2616519CC3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:33:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24AE819C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:33:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7758019C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:32:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C62A619C40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:32:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i227U2ki071219 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:02 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i227U1tg071218 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020730.i227U1tg071218@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <58c9a09539806ad0e5d6c0b07b3c7c89@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But just to tell you what I mean, I feel that limbo lacks those > features that make Java a complex laguage, yet it retains > those that make it easy to reuse code. That's arguable, of course. But Java is a SIMPLER language than limbo. It has fewer basic structures and orthogonal notions in the language. It does not use ugly idea of separating module interfaces from module implementations. It does not use kludges like 'cyclic' to compensate for deficiencies of the underlying virtual machine. Yet it is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while either not possible or inconvenient in limbo. David From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:39:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22019 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:39:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22015 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:39:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:39:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D661619C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:39:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B11CC19BD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:39:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 35A2E19BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:38:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AFAF19BC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:38:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4cac3ee48455c3c5f48149771bba4f03@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403020730.i227U1tg071218@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-nigtcjtdtxabwzubqzivfpumec" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:37:59 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-nigtcjtdtxabwzubqzivfpumec Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Are you including all the plethora (eg. Thread) in the discussion? Have you considered how threads merge with synchronized? I don't agree that it's simpler. Thus, probably we won't agree in the result of comparing both of them. But it's nice to have several languages so that we could choose. BTW, for closures and polymorphism you'd use module pointers in Limbo; I forgot to reply to this earlier. --upas-nigtcjtdtxabwzubqzivfpumec Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 2 08:33:31 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4326D19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:33:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24AE819C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:33:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7758019C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:32:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C62A619C40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:32:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i227U2ki071219 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:02 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i227U1tg071218 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020730.i227U1tg071218@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <58c9a09539806ad0e5d6c0b07b3c7c89@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But just to tell you what I mean, I feel that limbo lacks those > features that make Java a complex laguage, yet it retains > those that make it easy to reuse code. That's arguable, of course. But Java is a SIMPLER language than limbo. It has fewer basic structures and orthogonal notions in the language. It does not use ugly idea of separating module interfaces from module implementations. It does not use kludges like 'cyclic' to compensate for deficiencies of the underlying virtual machine. Yet it is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while either not possible or inconvenient in limbo. David --upas-nigtcjtdtxabwzubqzivfpumec-- From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:51:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23021 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:51:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23017 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:51:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:51:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 589A019C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:51:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C60B19AAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:51:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 779DB19BC5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5ABC19AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i227mLki071342 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:48:21 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i227mLxn071341 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:48:21 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020748.i227mLxn071341@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <4cac3ee48455c3c5f48149771bba4f03@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:48:21 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Are you including all the plethora (eg. Thread) in the > discussion? Have you considered how threads merge with > synchronized? Class Thread is not a part of the language. 'synchronized' is. What's wrong with Java synchronization? Can you please bring an example in Java and limbo where Java's synchronization is bad while limbo's approach is right? > BTW, for closures and polymorphism you'd use module pointers > in Limbo; I forgot to reply to this earlier. How exactly are closures expressed with module pointers? Can a module be created dynamically? David Tolpin From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:52:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23073 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:52:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23069 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:52:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:52:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A7FD19BFE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:52:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D88919A89; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:52:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 457A719C52; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:51:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDDF619BF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:51:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i227krW19748 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:46:55 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <7d0c2d03cf49fc0835ab54c2f203c90b@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403020658.i226w3An070941@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:50:05 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> The Inferno/Java paper (somewhere on the web site, but likely also in >> the Plan 9 distribution) covers it rather nicely. > > Google brings inexistent link. > Hm, maybe forsyth can help you with a copy, I'd have to search for one myself. If you want to wait, I must have one on the old Inferno CD. > The only claim I have found is that reference counting + coloring > is better than mark'n'sweep. Given that Java's GC is not mark'n'sweep > for a long time already, and the performance problems related to > memory management are insignificant since the release of HotSpot, > are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? > No, at that level of detail I'm really neither competent nor really likely to be persuaded that computer languages can be meaningfully compared. When you start going that deep into the architecture, you may as well resort to assembler. At least, I would, largely because I enjoy assmebler programming unless the host architecture is positively foul. > Besides, are there measured comparisons of Java and Limbo in the > area of memory usage and GC performance? My experience with implementing > GC in virtual machines is that reference-counting+graph coloring can > easily result in slower execution than mark'n'sweep. > Again, too detailed to be interesting, in my opinion. Programming languages are notations to express algorithms: the efficiency must lie in the algorithms, not the translators (also, in my opinion). ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 16:59:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23618 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 16:59:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23614 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 16:59:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 16:59:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83A7D19C8B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:59:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5A2419BC5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:59:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 014BB19BC5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:58:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 492D419AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i227uEki071389 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:56:14 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i227uE08071388 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:56:14 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020756.i227uE08071388@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <7d0c2d03cf49fc0835ab54c2f203c90b@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:56:14 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > The only claim I have found is that reference counting + coloring > > is better than mark'n'sweep. Given that Java's GC is not mark'n'sweep > > for a long time already, and the performance problems related to > > memory management are insignificant since the release of HotSpot, > > are there any other advantages of limbo over Java? > > > No, at that level of detail I'm really neither competent nor really > likely to be persuaded that computer languages can be meaningfully > compared. When you start going that deep into the architecture, you > may as well resort to assembler. At least, I would, largely because I > enjoy assmebler programming unless the host architecture is positively > foul. Unfortunately. limbo the language contains a fix for the reference-counting garbage collector. It uses keyword cyclic because garbage collector needs it. > > Besides, are there measured comparisons of Java and Limbo in the > > area of memory usage and GC performance? My experience with implementing > > GC in virtual machines is that reference-counting+graph coloring can > > easily result in slower execution than mark'n'sweep. > > > Again, too detailed to be interesting, in my opinion. Programming > languages are notations to express algorithms: the efficiency must lie > in the algorithms, not the translators (also, in my opinion). But the efficiency issue of GC technique was the only advantage of limbo over Java mentioned in the article. If it cannot be used, then what are other advantages? Are there code examples in limbo and Java which can convince someone that limbo is more convenient? David From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:03:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23922 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:03:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23918 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:03:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:03:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 173CF19BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:03:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A4CA19AD7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:03:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9276C19BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:02:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7969819AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:02:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:02:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0 tests=DRASTIC_REDUCED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * On the topic of garbage collectors, one of the main reasons for reference counting objects and immediately releasing them when they become unreachable was to use garbage collection to allow control not only of memory but also resources memory represents. The typical example given is one of windows that go away as soon as the last reference to them (actually the object representing them) goes away. Also, the reference counting had a distinct advantage of being fixed time. We had a terrible time with java systems of the time going away for long periods, both because of the garbage collector going off and because of the odd interactions in finalize routines in various classes. Over the years since limbo appeared, java garbage collection has changed radicly and often, drasticly reducing the 'time to take a coffee break' garbage collection runs. By the 1.4.1 jdk, java included 6 or more gabage collection strategies and all sorts of tuning parameters. Along the way all sorts of user code was written to avoid tickling the collectors at the wrong time or to get things done before they went off. That's a hell of a lot of effort to avoid the small differences advertised by the proponents of m&s and generational gc over reference counting. Of course, limbo isn't immune from odd timings. However, they do require reference loops and those seem not very common amongst limbo programmers. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:11:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24663 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:11:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24659 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:11:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:11:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12E6D19B10; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:11:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D767A19BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:11:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A0D319AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:10:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE77D19B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:10:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2bd2a38e5c4e46d0eb327141cdd2bb97@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403020756.i227uE08071388@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:12:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>Unfortunately. limbo the language contains a fix for the reference-counting >>garbage collector. It uses keyword cyclic because garbage collector >>needs it. no, absolutely not. it has no effect at run-time and does not appear in the dis files or anywhere else at run-time. all it does is suppress a diagnostic at compile-time, so that a programmer who is anxious to avoid creating cyclic data (if only by accident) can have that checked at compile time, and it provides a similar cue for a reader. on the other hand, the presence of cyclic does not mean it will necessarily be cyclic, just that the compiler cannot determine it will not. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:16:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25148 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:16:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25144 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:16:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:16:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C41CE19BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:16:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3468B19AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:16:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 26C0119B93; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:15:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2871D19AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:15:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i228Ciki071470 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:12:44 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i228CiXH071469 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:12:44 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020812.i228CiXH071469@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <2bd2a38e5c4e46d0eb327141cdd2bb97@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:12:44 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>garbage collector. It uses keyword cyclic because garbage collector > >>needs it. > > no, absolutely not. it has no effect at run-time and does not appear in the > dis files or anywhere else at run-time. all it does is suppress a diagnostic > at compile-time, so that a programmer who is anxious to avoid creating > cyclic data (if only by accident) can have that checked at compile time, and > it provides a similar cue for a reader. on the other hand, the presence > of cyclic does not mean it will necessarily be cyclic, just that the compiler > cannot determine it will not. Is there any other reason for a programmer to be anxious to avoid creating cyclic data than reference-counting garbage collection? From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:22 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:24:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25962 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:24:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25958 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:24:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:24:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 833CF19CA6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:24:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BDF419BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:24:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5250019BF2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:23:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87FDD19B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:22:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i228Kdki071532 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:20:39 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i228Kd1D071531 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:20:39 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020820.i228Kd1D071531@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:20:39 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0 tests=DRASTIC_REDUCED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > From 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Tue Mar 2 12:02:21 2004 > Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo > From: David Presotto > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:02:46 -0500 > > On the topic of garbage collectors, one of the main reasons for reference > counting objects and immediately releasing them when they become unreachable > was to use garbage collection to allow control not only of memory but also > resources memory represents. The typical example given is one of windows > that go away as soon as the last reference to them (actually the object representing > them) goes away. Does that mean that designers of Inferno windowing system were required to avoid using cyclic references in window structures? That is, a window does not know who its creator is? It's a decision. But a limiting one. Influenced by an implementation. Just running garbage collector with limited scope would do it without limitations. > Also, the reference counting had a distinct advantage of > being fixed time. We had a terrible time with java systems of the time > going away for long periods, both because of the garbage collector going > off and because of the odd interactions in finalize routines in various > classes. It was not a tradeoff of normal garbage collection. Fixed-time garbage collection techniques existed long before java. It was just an early implementation to make it running. > Over the years since limbo appeared, java garbage collection has changed > radicly and often, drasticly reducing the 'time to take a coffee break' > garbage collection runs. By the 1.4.1 jdk, java included 6 or more > gabage collection strategies and all sorts of tuning parameters. Along > the way all sorts of user code was written to avoid tickling the collectors > at the wrong time or to get things done before they went off. That's > a hell of a lot of effort to avoid the small differences advertised by > the proponents of m&s and generational gc over reference counting. Among 61864 lines of tight Java code I have been involved in writing during last two years there is not a single line which was written to avoid tickling the collector at the wrong time. It just works. > Of course, limbo isn't immune from odd timings. However, they do require > reference loops and those seem not very common amongst limbo programmers. > Is there any other reason reference loops are not very common amongs limbo programmers besides limitations of the garbage collector? David From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:22 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:40:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27857 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:40:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27853 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:40:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:40:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD58E19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:40:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95BF519C37; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:40:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D7EC19BF5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:39:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6277C19C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:39:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i228bAki071611 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:37:10 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i228bAv4071610 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:37:10 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020837.i228bAv4071610@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <918d202b192f1bcb8dd969285010a329@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:37:10 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Are there code examples in limbo and Java which can convince someone > > that limbo is more convenient? > > > ... you're edging closer to a religious topic. There are > philosophical differences between Limbo and Java that can only be > considered, not explained. Like there are between Pascal and C. Can > you convincingly state that C is _better_ than Pascal without > resorting to some untestable philosophical principle? I know I > cannot, in either direction. C and Pascal where created for different programming applications. Pascal had never been thought of as a language for systems programming. I'd consider philosophically comparing C and Oberon, but it's another issue. Going back to limbo, I see one advantage that would overweigh all the drawbacks. If limbo could be integrated into an OS other than Inferno (e.g. Plan 9) better than perl is (that is, if one can and does rewrite acme in limbo for Plan 9, for example), then it is a difference big enough to win. Right now, Java and limbo are in the same position of external tools artificially brought in. > Where I think Limbo has the edge, is that it is not the product of a > marketing organisation that has discovered yet another marketable > product, but that it grew from a desire to get things done to a clear > philosophical direction. What is the philosophical direction? From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:22 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:44:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28266 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:44:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28262 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:44:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:44:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75C6E19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:44:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29E1D19C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:44:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D8E7A19BC5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:43:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7605819B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:43:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <412645f8ec82b5c83ff0eee114c5cadf@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403020812.i228CiXH071469@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:45:42 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: one of the reasons that Limbo runs in much smaller spaces than any Java i've ever seen is that most storage is reclaimed by the reference counter, because many common structures are not, in fact, cyclic. DAGs by definition are not cyclic. when programming (even on large machines) it is good discipline (as Wirth observed) not to create the garbage in the first place. that also means that the incremental garbage collector can be less obtrusive. >>is there any other reason reference loops are not very common amongs >>limbo programmers besides limitations of the garbage collector? oh for heaven's sake. i must not be explaining this very well. there is no [inherent] `limitation of the garbage collector'. it garbage collects arbitrary rubbish just fine. the reference counted side does, however, reclaim storage the very instant the data becomes rubbish, which must certainly yield a smaller working set than any garbage collector scheme that has one always trundling along later. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:22 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:55:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29116 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:55:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29112 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:55:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:55:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE5BA19CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:55:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6AE219C7B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:55:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 149E419C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:54:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0D9419BED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i228plki071684 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:51:48 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i228plJa071683 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:51:47 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020851.i228plJa071683@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <412645f8ec82b5c83ff0eee114c5cadf@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:51:47 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > any Java i've ever seen is that most storage is reclaimed by Are there any comparable programs that can show that limbo takes much less memory than Java? > the reference counter, because many common structures > are not, in fact, cyclic. DAGs by definition are not cyclic. > when programming (even on large machines) > it is good discipline (as Wirth observed) not to create the > garbage in the first place. that also means that the incremental > garbage collector can be less obtrusive. In Wirth's source codes of Oberon System there are many cyclic structures relying on mark'n'sweep garbage collector implemented in the system. And windows are closed timely. > >>is there any other reason reference loops are not very common amongs > >>limbo programmers besides limitations of the garbage collector? > > oh for heaven's sake. i must not be explaining this very well. > there is no [inherent] `limitation of the garbage collector'. > it garbage collects arbitrary rubbish just fine. How are resources (time, space and delay) compared for cyclic and acyclic structures? For example, a cyclic and acyclic list with the same data? > the reference counted > side does, however, reclaim storage the very instant the data becomes rubbish, > which must certainly yield a smaller working set than any garbage collector > scheme that has one always trundling along later. It is a wrong assumption that mark'n'sweep requires staged garbage collection. Why don't you just use propagating markers? It is marginally complex algorithmically, instantly throws away rubbish and does not make a difference between cyclic and acyclic data structures. David From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:22 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 17:56:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29223 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 17:56:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29219 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 17:56:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 17:56:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3DC8A19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:56:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E931319BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:56:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8EFCC19BED; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:55:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74FFE19C33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:55:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <200403020820.i228Kd1D071531@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 03:55:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Does that mean that designers of Inferno windowing system were > required to avoid using cyclic references in window structures? > That is, a window does not know who its creator is? Yup, as long as something had a reference to the window, the window stayed around. If the reference is in cyclic struct that becomes unreachable, it will get collected. However the immediacy that users expect is lost. > It's a decision. But a limiting one. Influenced by an implementation. > Just running garbage collector with limited scope would do it > without limitations. All decisions are limiting. You pay extra for limited scope just as you do for reference counting. If you limit the scope small enough that you release things as quickly, then you have the equivalent of reference counting with higher cost. > It was not a tradeoff of normal garbage collection. Fixed-time garbage > collection techniques existed long before java. It was just an early > implementation to make it running. We lived with this 'just to make it running' for several years. The jdk's now contain multiple gc techniques including fixed time ones. From outside the VM the two are indistinguishable unless you care when the memory is freed, i.e., if when the freeing is visible. That happens both in java and in limbo if the finalize routines can have extrernally visible effects. > Is there any other reason reference loops are not very common amongs > limbo programmers besides limitations of the garbage collector? The garbage collector has little influence on our programming of cyclic structs, expecially since the gc correctly collects those cycles when they are freed. However, people seem to understand dags better then cyclic structures and make less mistakes manipulating them, so they use them more often. From rob@mightycheese.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:06:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30355 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:06:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30351 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:06:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:06:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 995C619CE2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:06:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4EA119CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:06:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80FF719CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:05:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F6A119C8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:05:56 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-1-185.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.1.185]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2295q9g029962 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:05:53 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <200403020600.i2260mYk070667@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403020600.i2260mYk070667@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:06:14 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I don't know what is that 'cherie' that is poor, but please > how can I make my text windows in rio show indents in increments of 8 > for tabs, and not of 4? > > Please use English. > how about using shell? tabstop=8 rio -rob From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:07:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30402 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:07:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30398 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:07:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:07:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54BB219CB6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:07:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CCF719CAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:07:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A028E19CB6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:06:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DE8019B01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:06:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <197c245cd830d9ea21caa61e67d26169@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <200403020851.i228plJa071683@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:06:55 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It is a wrong assumption that mark'n'sweep requires staged garbage > collection. Why don't you just use propagating markers? It is marginally > complex algorithmically, instantly throws away rubbish and does not > make a difference between cyclic and acyclic data structures. I don't know about this. Could you provide a reference? From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:10:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30718 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:10:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30714 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:10:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:10:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 399AC19CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:10:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8760C19CB6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:10:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79D9E19CB2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:09:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D0B119CB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:09:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2297Hki071782 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:07:17 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2297HpN071781 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:07:17 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020907.i2297HpN071781@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:07:17 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Right now, Java and limbo are in the same position of external > > tools artificially brought in. > > > I'm not the only one to believe that this is intentional, touted as an > advantage in both instances. Or do you use the GNU Java compiler for > your development (don't shoot me, I know precious little about it)? No, I don't think it is an advantage, as it is a feature of many other languages as well. GNU Java compiler does not make any difference. I don't mean compiling limbo into object code. I mean making *VM a part of the system. I want it to be loaded once and retain state. I want it to be a service, not an application. > > if you're still curious. Yes, thank you, I am reading it. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:18:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31363 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:18:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31355 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:18:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:18:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA18119CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:18:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 152F619C81; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:18:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E0AC19CAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:17:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BA3B19C7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:17:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229Euki071806 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:14:56 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229EuBt071805 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:14:56 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020914.i229EuBt071805@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <197c245cd830d9ea21caa61e67d26169@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:14:56 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > It is a wrong assumption that mark'n'sweep requires staged garbage > > collection. Why don't you just use propagating markers? It is marginally > > complex algorithmically, instantly throws away rubbish and does not > > make a difference between cyclic and acyclic data structures. > > I don't know about this. Could you provide a reference? > I'll try to find; I used to implement it according to a paper from a conference but I don't have the exact link. The idea is that you maintain and update marks (as in mark'n'sweep) instantly. Adding or deleting a reference induces modifications in a subgraph of the marked graph. Nodes which were marked and become unmarked can be deleted and it is almost equivalent in response time to reference counting. Graph updates must be synchronized on reference modifications, and nowhere else. Or is it what the paper on limbo calls 'graph coloring'? From rob@mightycheese.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:21:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31618 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:21:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31614 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:21:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:21:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF78D19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:21:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B864B19C4A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:21:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 778BA19CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE4AD19CDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:20:20 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-1-185.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.1.185]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i229KG9g030249 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:20:17 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <200403020820.i228Kd1D071531@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403020820.i228Kd1D071531@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:20:38 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there any other reason reference loops are not very common amongs > limbo programmers besides limitations of the garbage collector? what limitations? seriously, you should read again what presotto wrote. using reference counting coupled with a cyclic collector means that most of the time you have complete control over the timing of your loops. also, the memory footprint of your program can be exactly what it needs; no requirement to have a large arena to make the collection efficient. these issues are critical for the sort of embedded applications limbo was created for. it just happened that they're also useful for general programming. the real story though is this: for the last few days, every time a criticism is raised about some piece of software, the arguments are always of the form "but zzz can do it" for some value of zzz, yet what's really being compared is some modern or idealized version of zzz vs. an earlier, functional piece of plan 9 or inferno code. yes, java *can* do good GC. yes, linux threads *can* create local storage. and so on and so on. but the point is: they could *not* do them when the programs (inferno, limbo, plan 9 threads, etc. etc.) you are criticizing were written. we're writing about historical systems here and people are carping that they are no better than what you can get today. well, perhaps, but so what? oh, to hell with it, i'll rephrase. linux is perfect. java is perfect. there is no better way to think than to accept what hordes of students believe is the one true way. no correct thought was every achieved by anyone over 18. i will never again write a thought that could possibly deviate from the official plans to be recorded in some upcoming software release from some open source organization. sorry for wasting your time. -rob From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:22:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31705 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:22:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31700 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:22:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:22:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D242819D1D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:22:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C992C19CDA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:22:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A10219CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:21:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFFFC19CDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:21:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229JRki071839 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:19:27 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229JRPt071838 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:19:27 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020919.i229JRPt071838@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:19:27 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > > I don't know what is that 'cherie' that is poor, but please > > how can I make my text windows in rio show indents in increments of 8 > > for tabs, and not of 4? > > > > Please use English. > > > > how about using shell? > tabstop=8 rio Yes, I used grep to find that I must restart rio, not just open a window, for the setting to take effect. It is obvious when you know how it is working, but neither the page on 'window' says anything about it, nor man rio mentions tabstop. Besides, I also wondered in a followup, why acme repeats the code in rio to figure out the value for tabstop? Is it intended to run outside of rio? The code seems to be just copied from rio.c. The confusion has come from the fact that by default sam uses 8 spaces per tab, rio uses 4 spaces for tab. And nowhere in the documentation (besides the sources) could I easily find how to affect it. From rm@hamnavoe.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:24:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31859 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:24:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31855 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:24:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:24:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D920419CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:24:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D35E19CB2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:24:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B954119CDA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:23:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F1C219C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:23:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] iTuner From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <2ffc0f359bf00f823758b54b22cd170a@borf.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:23:03 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Speaking of sticking something on a CF, what are you > guys using to do this? ... > Is it just a matter of writing SCSI commands into the ep1data and > reading the responses from ep2data? Not quite - there's an extra layer of protocol above the scsi commands. Actually two alternative layers: bulk-only or command-bulk-interrupt. I've written a driver which supports (so far) only the first -- I'll take the liberty of emailing you a copy to try. -- Richard From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:25:17 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31924 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:25:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31920 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:25:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:25:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2232319CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:25:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9CA219CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:25:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 919DC19D1D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:24:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29C5A19CB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:24:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8836052d86f844f4c345aa4157f86c1a@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403020914.i229EuBt071805@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:26:29 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>Or is it what the paper on limbo calls 'graph coloring'? the basis of the garbage collector is described in a paper by huelsbergen and winterbottom that you should be able to find via google/citeseer given those names and "real-time garbage". the actual implementation differs in various ways but that gives some of the background. From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:27:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32126 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:27:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32122 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:27:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:27:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B1AF19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:27:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07A4D19CDA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:27:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C194B19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:26:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA53119CB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:26:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9892bbf9e20d9932558e62cdaba32abf@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <200403020919.i229JRPt071838@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:26:45 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: several people do indeed run acme instead of rio. Rio just offers an interface within each window that looks like what you get from the OS itself, i.e., rio's windows are to a certain extent screen/mouse/keyboard VM's. If you start up acme first, you can live witout rio. For that matter, you could start up sam instead of rio and do everything from there. Just type a ! in the command window for running commands. Might seem a bit limiting though. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:30:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32461 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:30:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32457 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:30:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:30:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0BB019CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FC3819CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:30:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 794CE19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:29:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A05019CE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:29:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01706fdc23bcb6298928d8e807109f5b@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <9892bbf9e20d9932558e62cdaba32abf@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:31:38 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>The confusion has come from the fact that by default sam uses 8 spaces >>per tab, rio uses 4 spaces for tab. And nowhere in the documentation (besides >>the sources) could I easily find how to affect it. For historical reasons, sam uses a tab stop setting of 8 spaces, while the other editors and window systems use 4 spaces. These defaults can be overridden by setting the value of the environment variable $tabstop to the desired number of spaces per tab. from intro(1) which are the first manual pages you see when you open the book! From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:33:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 364 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:33:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 359 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:33:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:33:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F192219CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA17E19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 554C219A90; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:32:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 481F819A64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:32:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229USki071923 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:30:28 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229USqA071922 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:30:28 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020930.i229USqA071922@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <9892bbf9e20d9932558e62cdaba32abf@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:30:28 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > several people do indeed run acme instead of rio. Rio just offers an interface within > each window that looks like what you get from the OS itself, i.e., rio's windows are > to a certain extent screen/mouse/keyboard VM's. If you start up acme first, you > can live witout rio. Thank you, I did not realize that. So I can launch a Plan 9 based 'kiosk' with Acme as its only interface? Great. That's what I need. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:34:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 480 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:34:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 476 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:34:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:34:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C19519CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E40219AC0; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9179D19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D96D119AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229VUki071930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229VUgi071929 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020931.i229VUgi071929@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <01706fdc23bcb6298928d8e807109f5b@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > from intro(1) which are the first manual pages you see when you open the book! Thank you. I don't have the book, just read recommended articles and man whatever when I have a question. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:41:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1225 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:41:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1221 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:41:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:41:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF40D19CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:41:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6D7119BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:41:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C39AA19CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:40:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2314B19AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:40:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403020931.i229VUgi071929@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:43:03 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit well, to be fair then, one might consider grep'ing /sys/man/?/* before complaining that something is undocumented. not that there aren't indeed things, even important things, that are not documented. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Tue Mar 2 09:34:11 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACE2A19CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9293C19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9179D19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D96D119AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229VUki071930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229VUgi071929 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020931.i229VUgi071929@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <01706fdc23bcb6298928d8e807109f5b@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > from intro(1) which are the first manual pages you see when you open the book! Thank you. I don't have the book, just read recommended articles and man whatever when I have a question. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr-- From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:45:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1593 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:45:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1589 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:45:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:45:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DBE3D19D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:45:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E8AE19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:45:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FF0D19CE3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:44:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE47C19AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:44:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0378eb3466a9c90fc322d1f94ce360f8@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kxdhyswhmobdqavonhfaypbqxq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:44:29 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kxdhyswhmobdqavonhfaypbqxq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit lookman helps too. It is apropos BSD's apropos. --upas-kxdhyswhmobdqavonhfaypbqxq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 2 04:41:24 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 2 04:41:21 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A3EE219D1D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:41:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 235E319CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:41:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C39AA19CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:40:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2314B19AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:40:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403020931.i229VUgi071929@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:43:03 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit well, to be fair then, one might consider grep'ing /sys/man/?/* before complaining that something is undocumented. not that there aren't indeed things, even important things, that are not documented. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Tue Mar 2 09:34:11 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACE2A19CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9293C19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:34:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9179D19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D96D119AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:33:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229VUki071930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229VUgi071929 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020931.i229VUgi071929@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <01706fdc23bcb6298928d8e807109f5b@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:31:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > from intro(1) which are the first manual pages you see when you open the book! Thank you. I don't have the book, just read recommended articles and man whatever when I have a question. --upas-ihwssbfnewdseqbojaozyrpvbr-- --upas-kxdhyswhmobdqavonhfaypbqxq-- From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:46:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1676 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:46:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1672 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:46:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:46:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 35E3319D65; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:46:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3790C19BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:46:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EEA8C19CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:45:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9B9F19D4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:45:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <90832c7637a49eda25f426d06218bc7f@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 01:45:37 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You don't even have to do that; you can just type lookman word Thus `lookman tabstop' yields: man 1 0intro # 0intro(1) man 1 acme # acme(1) man 2 html # html(2) From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:51:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2126 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:51:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2122 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:51:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:51:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B23A19CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 405F919C28; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3F1319C52; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B56219BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Mf-0002BV-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:39:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <200403012027.i21KRbXZ068424@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:36:48 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin wrote: > many sources in libc are written with four characters indent. What > editor have they been written with? sam is rather incovenient to > input text with indents other than one tab, or am I missing something? 8-character tab stops were standard in the world of DEC, nicely fitting the 6-character identifier size. Unix inherited this.. As to handling other tab settings, my "retab" utility is by far the most flexible I have seen, and it works nicely with sam's | command. You're welcome to a copy; just send e-mail (that doesn't look like spam). From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:51:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2168 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:51:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2163 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:51:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:51:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AB68219CC3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9874719C28; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EFBD019CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82E7819C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Q6-0002IX-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:42:34 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040302101812.35190293.martin@parvat.com>, Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:42:31 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ron minnich wrote: > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Martin C.Atkins wrote: > ...deleted >>back, but don't know what happened to his work. (Sure enough, it >>does seem to do something in 2.4.24 - is this a "best kept secret"? >>If it works, why aren't we all using it?) > > > It works. I don't know why we're not all using it. the same reason that so few people switched to plan9 when so many switched to linux. resistance to change. bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you believe this message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission and delete the message without disclosing it. Thank you. E-mail including attachments is susceptible to data corruption, interruption, unauthorized amendment, tampering and viruses, and we only send and receive e-mails on the basis that we are not liable for any such corruption, interception, amendment, tampering or viruses or any consequences thereof. From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:52:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2203 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2199 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:01 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:52:01 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE41219D71; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AAC019D54; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC8AA19CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64C8919C28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Q5-0002IR-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:42:33 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:42:20 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ron minnich wrote: > On Mon, 1 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > > >>>Methinks you have read a few too many papers about microkernels, without >>>actually seeing the real world. >> >>do not forget that applications running on microkernels are faster than >>on monolithic kernels. see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/exo > > > so I assume you are running this on your machines? afaik no exokernel version available meets the neccessary criteria. one of which is that it is supported by ''HP user support for Ericsson'' otherwise i am sure i would. bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you believe this message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission and delete the message without disclosing it. Thank you. E-mail including attachments is susceptible to data corruption, interruption, unauthorized amendment, tampering and viruses, and we only send and receive e-mails on the basis that we are not liable for any such corruption, interception, amendment, tampering or viruses or any consequences thereof. From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:52:13 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2215 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2211 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:13 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:52:13 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 063F419D7D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD77619D38; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19D5F19CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C51C19C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Q5-0002IL-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:42:33 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:42:07 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Russ Cox wrote: >>do not forget that applications running on microkernels are faster than >>on monolithic kernels. see http://www.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/exo > > > no. applications running on a kernel tailored to the benchmark > are faster than applications running on a generic kernel. > exokernel != microkernel. i thought that the idea with an micro kernel is that it makes it _possible_ to tailor the application interface towards many different applications. a monolithic kernel has only one interface. how does one distinguish between a micro kernel (like l4) and the exokernel? bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you believe this message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission and delete the message without disclosing it. Thank you. E-mail including attachments is susceptible to data corruption, interruption, unauthorized amendment, tampering and viruses, and we only send and receive e-mails on the basis that we are not liable for any such corruption, interception, amendment, tampering or viruses or any consequences thereof. From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:52:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2248 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2244 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:52:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B0F5519D8C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:52:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2ABF119D54; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:51:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3407E19CC3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19A4419BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403020748.i227mLxn071341@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:50:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Class Thread is not a part of the language. 'synchronized' > is. What's wrong with Java synchronization? Can you please > bring an example in Java and limbo where Java's synchronization > is bad while limbo's approach is right? It is, if it's the only means I have to write concurrent programs in java. Regarding sync, you can pretty easily get deadlocks. They did admit that they did concurrency wrong IIRC, you don't have monitors nor any other clean mechanism. > How exactly are closures expressed with module pointers? > Can a module be created dynamically? It can be loaded dynamically. I think that suffices. From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:52:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2275 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2270 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:52:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA42719D95; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:52:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A14EC19D85; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:52:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 77BF819BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3296719C52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Mg-0002Bb-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:39:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , <180eecfedf4d332edb744c24b27bc9ed@proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:37:00 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > And to > suggest that performance is a significant factor in the design of a > generic operating system is laughable. Not entirely: If an OS design *precludes* efficient operation on any architecture, surely that is bad design. From lanchaval@freesurf.fr Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:52:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2308 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2304 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:52:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:52:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16FD719D9D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:52:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4224119CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:52:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 822A519CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1903B19C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:50:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ay6Mf-0002BP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 09:39:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Lanch Message-ID: <69d13c56.0403011356.6f06d6b3@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] GUI development Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:36:34 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi all, I recently downloaded the last Inferno. Does anyone know why it has no GUI development tool ? The man pages are refering tktester(1) but I can't see it !!! (http://www.vitanuova.com/inferno/man/1/tktester.html) Thanks, Franck From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:54:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2400 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:54:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2395 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:54:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:54:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 588C819D38; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27C0F19C7B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50A5F19C52; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAD0019CAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229okki072069 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229ok5f072068 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020950.i229ok5f072068@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <90832c7637a49eda25f426d06218bc7f@collyer.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You don't even have to do that; you can just type > > lookman word > > Thus `lookman tabstop' yields: > > man 1 0intro # 0intro(1) > man 1 acme # acme(1) > man 2 html # html(2) The problem is that I did not know that I must look for 'tabstop' until I looked into the source and then I didn't need the man. I tried man rio man sam man window read the pages through and didn't find a single mention of the way tab widths can be adjusted. I realize now that grep'ing /sys/man/*/* with '[^a-z]tab' would bring the answer, but I realize it only when I know already what to look for. I didn't have the right question before I knew the answer. David From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 18:54:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2446 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 18:54:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2442 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 18:54:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 18:54:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0064219D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C2C719D09; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5AD5419C7B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EFA319C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:53:21 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > how does one distinguish between a micro kernel (like l4) and the exokernel? The µkernel has abstractions. From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:00:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2927 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:00:59 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2923 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:00:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:00:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7CB0819CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0421F19D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:00:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8FF3F19CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:00:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3C8319C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:00:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0462e5df2c61951b0697729f0c70a975@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403020950.i229ok5f072068@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gnhelmhhzmgghuvllslusssilo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:00:12 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gnhelmhhzmgghuvllslusssilo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit `man acme' might have been a good guess. `lookman tab stop' would also have led you to the right pages. Even `lookman tab width' would have led you to acme(1). --upas-gnhelmhhzmgghuvllslusssilo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.3]) by collyer.net; Tue Mar 2 01:54:28 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Tue Mar 2 01:54:28 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0793F19C52; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6C6819CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:54:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50A5F19C52; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAD0019CAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 04:53:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i229okki072069 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i229ok5f072068 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403020950.i229ok5f072068@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <90832c7637a49eda25f426d06218bc7f@collyer.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:50:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You don't even have to do that; you can just type > > lookman word > > Thus `lookman tabstop' yields: > > man 1 0intro # 0intro(1) > man 1 acme # acme(1) > man 2 html # html(2) The problem is that I did not know that I must look for 'tabstop' until I looked into the source and then I didn't need the man. I tried man rio man sam man window read the pages through and didn't find a single mention of the way tab widths can be adjusted. I realize now that grep'ing /sys/man/*/* with '[^a-z]tab' would bring the answer, but I realize it only when I know already what to look for. I didn't have the right question before I knew the answer. David --upas-gnhelmhhzmgghuvllslusssilo-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:06:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3302 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:06:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3298 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:06:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:06:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 41F4719D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:06:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB9EB19A9C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:06:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94D8E19B17; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:05:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AE6619A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:05:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i22A1YW26784 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:01:34 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403020907.i2297HpN071781@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:04:46 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> > Right now, Java and limbo are in the same position of external >> > tools artificially brought in. >> > >> I'm not the only one to believe that this is intentional, touted as an >> advantage in both instances. Or do you use the GNU Java compiler for >> your development (don't shoot me, I know precious little about it)? > > No, I don't think it is an advantage, as it is a feature of > many other languages as well. GNU Java compiler does not make > any difference. I don't mean compiling limbo into object code. > I mean making *VM a part of the system. I want it to > be loaded once and retain state. I want it to be a service, > not an application. > Abstracting the language from the operating system is critical to portability. And portability has yet to be knocked (the way object-oriented paradigm and multithreading have been) as a bad thing. As for running the VM as a service, you have to choose between the namespace being something the VM inherits or something the VM manipulates. Where the namespace is the most critical resources in the Plan 9 environment and is largely what sets Inferno apart from the neutral environment the Java VM supplies (and, in my opinion, unsuccessfully attempts to enhance with crippling security "features"). It seems to me that on this forum the consensus is that the ability to manipulate the namespace is something special Plan 9 and Inferno do and none of us would consider sacrificing it without just cause. The Inferno environment itself may not be perfect, but access to the sources allows one to configure it to one's tastes. The same is never going to apply to the Java VM because it always depends on the underlying platform. Now, perhaps I ought to ask you to explain why you'd prefer the Inferno VM to be different from its present form and how you'd prefer it to be or, to be nasty, what's stopping you from shaping it to your requirements. ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:08:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3512 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:08:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3508 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:08:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:08:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4DDF219CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:08:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AE0019B17; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:08:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C8E019CA6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:07:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 265E419B17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:07:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22A5Iki072199 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:18 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22A5IEs072198 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:18 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021005.i22A5IEs072198@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <0462e5df2c61951b0697729f0c70a975@collyer.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:18 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > `man acme' might have been a good guess. `lookman tab stop' would > also have led you to the right pages. Even `lookman tab width' would > have led you to acme(1). But I was not interested in doing it in acme. My question was how to set tabstop to 8 in rio, actually, in a window. I naively tried tabstop=8 window Didn't work, man rio says nothing. I then supposed that window is just a shell script that triggers opening of a new window, and went to the source tree to see where in rio getenv is called. I understand it is all obvious for anyone who knows. From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:09:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3588 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:09:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3584 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:09:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:09:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2517219D7A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:09:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25A4B19CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:09:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05D9819B17; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:08:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5A1019D65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:08:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <180b9a95176fbbc9aac7daf959c85ea9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:43 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The Inferno environment itself may not be perfect, but access to the > sources allows one to configure it to one's tastes. The same is never > going to apply to the Java VM because it always depends on the > underlying platform. Exactly, Java is not portable, as my students (and other profs.) find out here now and then; the differences in the libraries always byte them in the end; not to talk about how to do (or how to use) non-portable services and supply them in a portable way. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:12:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3900 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:12:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3895 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:12:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:12:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D9EE019D7D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07D4A19CE2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2848119CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8A3019BE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22A8fki072217 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:41 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22A8eJv072216 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021008.i22A8eJv072216@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] limbo's GC Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have read the article and I am convinced. It is an algorithm different from that I had in mind, but is efficient enough to support general-purpose garbage collection. I have been misled by limbo's papers and manual. Can I rephrase it as that I can use arbitrary data structures exactly as I would with lisp or ML or any other language with automatic memory management. And that I can rely on instant deallocation of resources if the data structures behind resources are acyclic? David From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:12:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3921 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:12:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3917 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:12:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:12:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B3E319D95; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 809FD19CE2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE7D319CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 973E419A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i22A72W27032 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:07:02 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <8ed10c6e2fa7d22bd0e90b2b6421d357@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403020930.i229USqA071922@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:10:14 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Thank you, I did not realize that. So I can launch a Plan 9 based 'kiosk' > with Acme as its only interface? > > Great. That's what I need. Sure, but don't expect it to act as a prison. It is only a little less powerful than rio (as regards graphics) and has its own powerful features. But maybe by "kiosk" you intend something less conventional than a restricting environment? Of course, the private namespace allows you to apply restrictions, but that applies to rio as well. ++L From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:18:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4318 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:18:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4314 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:18:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:18:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D4FD19D76; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C50CF19D75; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:18:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BF5719D7D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:17:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B63319CD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:17:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from foible.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i22ADWW27632 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:13:32 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <6889d6d1d154888210847ad8ccb127d5@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:16:44 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: >> And to >> suggest that performance is a significant factor in the design of a >> generic operating system is laughable. > > Not entirely: If an OS design *precludes* efficient > operation on any architecture, surely that is bad design. OK, so I have to be more careful in the way I phrase things. Let's say that performance isn't going to be the most significant criterion and that it would take intent to "preclude" efficient operation on any architecture, specially when one might be speculating about the architecture in the first place. Plan 9 and NetBSD are sufficient examples that portable design is unlikely to be intentionally inefficient. ++L From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:20:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4404 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:20:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4400 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:20:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:20:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74C3A19D8C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:20:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93D8519D7D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:20:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6B2819D75; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:19:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C97F19CD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:19:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] limbo's GC From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403021008.i22A8eJv072216@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kkthhxidwfiusewbautvhmeixc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:21:46 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kkthhxidwfiusewbautvhmeixc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit yes. >>that I can rely on instant deallocation of resources if the data structures >>behind resources are acyclic? yes. actually, that's one slight difference with Java (as i knew it, anyhow). a Java implementation might deallocate acyclic things immediately but the language doesn't guarantee it. Limbo does. --upas-kkthhxidwfiusewbautvhmeixc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Tue Mar 2 10:12:14 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 554DF19D72; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9D4219BE4; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:12:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2848119CC9; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8A3019BE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:11:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22A8fki072217 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:41 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22A8eJv072216 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021008.i22A8eJv072216@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] limbo's GC Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have read the article and I am convinced. It is an algorithm different from that I had in mind, but is efficient enough to support general-purpose garbage collection. I have been misled by limbo's papers and manual. Can I rephrase it as that I can use arbitrary data structures exactly as I would with lisp or ML or any other language with automatic memory management. And that I can rely on instant deallocation of resources if the data structures behind resources are acyclic? David --upas-kkthhxidwfiusewbautvhmeixc-- From Joseph.Diamond@msnyuhealth.org Tue Mar 2 20:26:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:24:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4527 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:24:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4523 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:24:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:24:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC98219CC3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:24:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5624119A67; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:24:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 15AE519ADE; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:23:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from excebw2k03.msnyuhealth.org (excebw2k03.msnyuhealth.org [63.160.186.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F1D0119A67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:23:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from 10.0.134.34 by excebw2k03.msnyuhealth.org (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:23:09 -0500 Received: from excebw2k11.msnyuhealth.org ([10.0.23.45]) by excebw2k06.msnyuhealth.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:23:08 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.4712.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <916126FB43F38D4EA332720F092278DB49E906@excebw2k11.msnyuhealth.org> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Re: Thanks! Thread-Index: AcQAQFsqQCh0uNcWTYaMAGi+e9NYQgAAABnE From: "Diamond, Joseph" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Mar 2004 10:23:09.0123 (UTC) FILETIME=[5BCC2930:01C40040] Subject: [9fans] Out of Office AutoReply: Thanks! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:23:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Please note new E-mail address as of Feb 1 2002:=20 jdiamond@lij.edu=20 From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 19:37:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5565 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 19:37:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5561 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 19:37:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 19:37:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 45E9219D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:37:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 595A219CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:37:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4899519CC3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:36:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1414119C7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:36:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <51d18a38f7dffd0385bf6a99939c95b7@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403021005.i22A5IEs072198@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 02:36:05 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: But as I said, `lookman tab stop' would have led you to 0intro(1). A little probing with lookman is always worth trying when in doubt. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 2 20:26:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 20:01:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7251 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 20:01:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7247 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 20:01:00 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 20:01:00 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0D6819BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5A8619B56; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91EA519BEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:59:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFD1E19B26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 05:59:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22Aucki072429 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:56:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22AucHA072428 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:56:38 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021056.i22AucHA072428@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? In-Reply-To: <8ed10c6e2fa7d22bd0e90b2b6421d357@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:56:38 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Thank you, I did not realize that. So I can launch a Plan 9 based 'kiosk' > > with Acme as its only interface? > > > > Great. That's what I need. > > Sure, but don't expect it to act as a prison. It is only a little > less powerful than rio (as regards graphics) and has its own powerful > features. But maybe by "kiosk" you intend something less conventional > than a restricting environment? I did not mean restricting, 'kiosk' was the wrong word. I need to establish a workplace for a particular workflow; instead of providing a conventional environment, I would prefer to go with acme (I did similar thing with Oberon and it was very successful, except for some limitations of the underlying system). From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 2 22:06:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 20:33:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9243 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 20:33:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9239 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 20:33:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 20:33:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA3CD19C7C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:33:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8F9E19C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:33:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 46BA819C33; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:32:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0209519AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 06:32:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5b983650e241a210e3b376bf76366fd8@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <180b9a95176fbbc9aac7daf959c85ea9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:35:14 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > byte them you've been in CS too long Mr Nemo From rasputnik@hellooperator.net Tue Mar 2 22:06:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 21:20:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12390 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 21:20:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12386 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 21:20:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 21:20:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 244CA19D09; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:20:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BF4719CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:20:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C8C919B15; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from idoru.mine.nu (cpc3-cdif2-3-0-cust202.cdif.cable.ntl.com [81.103.32.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E43919B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:19:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.4.0.6] (helo=hellooperator.net) by idoru.mine.nu with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1Ay8rs-0002qa-LX for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 12:19:24 +0000 Message-ID: <40447BCC.4000006@hellooperator.net> From: Dick Davies User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel References: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 12:19:24 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin wrote: > Java is done right in concept. wtf? [ Let me start by saying I don't speak for any of these guys, I can't even get their OS to run a GUI.] Java is better than C++, but as others have mentioned that's like saying toothache is better than herpes. It's just C without pointer arithmetic. Leaving aside actual implementation bugs, it : * runs on less platforms than any other language I've ever used, * wimped out of having numeric types implemented as objects, then bolted on 'containers' for them in 1.1 *has changed its GUI twice and *still* doesn't do it right, * it's thread model is essential to its operation but differs widely between VMs even on the same platform * the same it true for its garbage collector. * The APIs are huge and inconsistent. * it *finally* - in 1.4 - has a regex API (which is unusably complex). * it's native code bindings are absolutely the worst I've ever seen, even Perl does a better job And don't forget m5 current personal favourite - its pointlessly restrictive type system. Type is stored in the *pointer*, not the object. So I have to hold the VMs hand each time I pass an argument. I'm not allowed to reuse a variable to point to an List and a Vector, even if I'm going to call a method with the same name on both. And then to really piss in my chips, 90% of the Collections API which lets me store these objects and actually *do* something with them only lets me pull them out as Object. I HAVE TO CAST THEM. So when I get an object 'dynamically' - via RMI or out of a Vector or whatever, I have to know what it is in advance. The poor frigging object doesn't know (no, don't get me started on the abomination that is the reflection API, people are already starting to stare). And this is a dynamic language. KERR-RIST. None of this matters of course, because "it's better than C++". And IT managers think the Sun shines out of its ass. Java is the f*cking COBOL of the 90s and future generations of geeks are going to fly back from Mars to piss on our graves for inflicting it on them. > Unfortunately. I can do system programming and command-line > apps with Java. Sure. If you don't mind a fifteen second delay while the VM drags itself up from the bottom of the sea each time you run a command line app. Or should that '.' be a ',' ? From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 2 22:06:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 21:52:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14176 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14172 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 21:52:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9BA3C19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA6B519AA3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2E1719CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8B3EB19C59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31432 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 12:51:40 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 12:51:40 -0000 Message-ID: <013a01c40055$45bb27d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403020602.i2262OJu070674@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:31:54 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i'll answer wrecklessly, 'cause i haven't read the zillions of e-mails after this one. java sux. it's syntax and semantics are abominable because it was not designed ... it is bundle of failed sun projects that sold a lot of books. limbo? i could write a 20 page ref manual, which i think was the requirement for modula-2, and let someone else spazz it out to a 500 page doc. good evening, brucee > In particular, what part of limbo in reality is better than Java > in such a way that reminded you bull's excrements? > > David Tolpin From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 2 22:06:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 21:52:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14184 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14180 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 21:52:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B912D19D2E; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A30C819D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 509A019D05; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3A06619C59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31537 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 12:51:42 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 12:51:42 -0000 Message-ID: <013b01c40055$46ccbee0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403020658.i226w3An070941@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:39:43 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You had a bad experience. The Inferno GC, well after philw let me fix the bugs, is fantastic. And it's difficult to explain to a client that the reason their machine freezes is because they are running java in a window and it's having a jolly good time at marking and sweeping, thrashing like hell 'cause it's so bloated and ... have a beer and it will be all right in a few minutes. > Besides, are there measured comparisons of Java and Limbo in the > area of memory usage and GC performance? My experience with implementing > GC in virtual machines is that reference-counting+graph coloring can > easily result in slower execution than mark'n'sweep. > > David Tolpin From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 2 22:06:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 21:52:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14193 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14189 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 21:52:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 21:52:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6FB4919D65; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA10A19D54; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:52:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 33EAE19CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id ECECF19C59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31709 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 12:51:44 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 12:51:44 -0000 Message-ID: <013c01c40055$47e13c20$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403020730.i227U1tg071218@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:44:01 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I feel like boyd, throwing off more than one message in a hit. >> It does not use kludges like 'cyclic' to compensate for deficiencies >>of the underlying virtual machine. Absolutley wrong. Cyclic is only in the language for diagnostic purposes. It has no effect on the code generated. The VM is not faulty. Read some code. regards brucee From michael@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 00:17:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 22:51:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17930 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 22:51:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17926 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 22:51:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 22:51:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85EBE19C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F15BF19C59; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:51:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E2D9119B66; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:50:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B420819B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:50:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AyAGb-0006y0-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 13:49:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Michael Jeffrey Message-ID: Organization: ntl Business News Service References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Java Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:46:37 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: wrote in message news:d5515dc7e461baf6037b28de26efc6ed@juice.thebigchoice.com... > Inferno is perfectly capable of running as a single program > > You can even put it in inetd if you were kinky enough or just run it as it's own listener. And not just on Linux and UNIX platforms. Vita Nuova have a collection of Limbo applications that can orchestrate the execution of programs across a computational grid consisting of UNIX, Linux and Windows machines. A recent customer of ours has connected >250 of their Windows PCs (2000, NT and XP) into a grid. Inferno manages the execution of the host OS application (Win32 app in this case) and the harvesting of the results. In this example Inferno runs as a Windows Service on each client. The scheduler, another Inferno application, happens to be running on Red Hat Linux. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 00:17:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:19:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19849 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:19:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19833 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:19:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:19:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D67F19CE2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:19:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D7A119BBC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:19:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5212019BD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:18:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6370C19B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:18:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22EFvki073685 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:15:57 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22EFvs9073684 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:15:57 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021415.i22EFvs9073684@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] kfs performance Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:15:57 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It takes three times more time to write a file under Plan9 than under FreeBSD on the same computer (bunzip2 cdinstall.iso.bz2 , 200 Mb unzipped). Is there something wrong with my setup, or is it normal? David From gdiaz@online.ie Wed Mar 3 00:17:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:24:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20045 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:24:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20041 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:24:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:24:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 67C9119C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A25F319C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:24:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B00319C59; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:23:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from pollo.casanet (157.Red-80-37-161.pooles.rima-tde.net [80.37.161.157]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F07D419B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:23:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1b9eecc489e4aeb8e5be3b1dc2470d4d@ipsoluciones.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance From: gdiaz@online.ie In-Reply-To: <200403021415.i22EFvs9073684@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:34:11 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello, I think there are threads on 9fan arhives about that topic, maybe it helps you. Take a look at groups.google.com ;),if i remeber correctly you can add tunning parameters to increase performance (not sure about that). BTW, i prefer to use fossil/venti as my thinkpad fileserver. gabi > It takes three times more time to write a file under Plan9 > than under FreeBSD on the same computer (bunzip2 cdinstall.iso.bz2 > , 200 Mb unzipped). > > Is there something wrong with my setup, or is it normal? > > David From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 00:17:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:26:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20207 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:26:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20203 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:26:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:26:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 36D2019D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:26:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2A3519C27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:26:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1EF9E19C27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFC9019BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:25:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: <200403021415.i22EFvs9073684@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:27:38 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sounds normal for kfs m From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 00:17:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:31:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20405 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:31:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20401 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:31:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:31:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3F1819C27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:30:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2FA119CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:30:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3CF1119CE6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:29:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF4E519C27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:29:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1a556bc7b9ed8b5dd759815aeef7c37f@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] kfs speed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:31:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I must stop deleting mail anyway, is DMA turned on? That could make a difference echo 'dma on' > /dev/sdC0/ctl (or whichever controller) m From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 00:17:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:38:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21044 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:38:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21040 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:38:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:38:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BBA519D27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:38:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6473219D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:38:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D423B19CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:37:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14C5A19CDC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:37:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22EZVki073789 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:35:31 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22EZVha073788 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:35:31 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021435.i22EZVha073788@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs speed In-Reply-To: <1a556bc7b9ed8b5dd759815aeef7c37f@juice.thebigchoice.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:35:31 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > anyway, is DMA turned on? Yes, it is, as far as I can judge. From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 00:17:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:52:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22056 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:52:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22052 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:52:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:52:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F0F519BD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E550819B56; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:52:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B1C619BBC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:51:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D958D19B56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:51:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22Ephb5026151 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:43 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22Epdpk012659 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:40 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22EpcfQ016771 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:38 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:51:37 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > i thought that the idea with an micro kernel is that it makes it > _possible_ to tailor the application interface towards many different > applications. a monolithic kernel has only one interface. no, I recall Rashid saying this about Mach 3.0: microkernels are not small, they just don't do much. This in response to the complaints that this low-capability "micro kernel" was about 3 Mbytes in size. I wish I had saved the exact email :-) you get way more ability to tailor etc. with Plan 9 than I was every able to figure out with Mach. ron p.s. why do all your short emails have a 20-line disclaimer? From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 00:17:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:56:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22241 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:56:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22237 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:56:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:56:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C40BD19ABD; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:56:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D772A19B85; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:56:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BB2119BBC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:55:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B6DB19ABD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:55:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22Etlb5027225 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:55:47 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22EtkWE010184 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:55:46 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22EtkfQ016915 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:55:46 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: <200403021415.i22EFvs9073684@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 07:55:45 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, David Tolpin wrote: > > It takes three times more time to write a file under Plan9 > than under FreeBSD on the same computer (bunzip2 cdinstall.iso.bz2 > , 200 Mb unzipped). > > Is there something wrong with my setup, or is it normal? are you sure you have dma on in plan 9? ron From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 00:17:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 2 23:58:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22344 invoked by uid 1020); 2 Mar 2004 23:58:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22340 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 23:58:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 23:58:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 827BF19D2E; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:58:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CC8F19BD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:58:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3778119C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:57:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C53F19BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:57:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:03:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Class Thread is not a part of the language. 'synchronized' > is. What's wrong with Java synchronization? Can you please > bring an example in Java and limbo where Java's synchronization > is bad while limbo's approach is right? a selection from Allen Holub's "Taming Java Threads": : The "synchronised" keyword has several flaws: : : 1. You cannot specify a timeout value. : 2. You cannot interrupt a thread that is waiting to acquire a lock. : 3. You cannot safely acquire multiple locks. : [...] : : The wait()/notify() system also has problems: : 1. There is no way to detect whether wait() has returned normally : or because of a timeout. : 2. There is no way to implement a traditional condition variable : that remains in a "signalled" state. : 3. Nested-monitor lockout can happen too easily. : : [...] : : More facilities should be added to the language to support inter-thread : communication. Right now, the PipedInputStream and PipedOutputStream : classes can be used for this purpose, but they are much too inefficient for : most applications. : : [...] : : Access to partially constructed objects should be illegal. : The JLS currently permits access to a partially constructed object. : For example, a thread created within a constructor can access the object : being constructed, even though that object might not be fully : constructed. : : [...] : : The lack of good access control makes threading more : difficult than necessary. Often, methods don't have to : be thread safe if you can guarantee that they be called : only from synchronised subsystems. : : [...] : : The notion of immutability [...] is invaluable in multithreaded : situations since read-only access to immutable objects doesn't : have to be synchronised. Java's implementation of immutability : isn't tight enough for two reasons: : : 1. It is possible for an immutable object to be accessed before it's : fully created and this access might yield an incorrect value : for some field. : 2. The definition of immutable [...] is too loose: Objects addressed by : final references can indeed change state, even though the reference : itself cannot change state. : : [...] : : There is also the problem that both class-level (static) and instance (non-static) : methods can directly access class-level (static) fields. This access is : dangerous because synchronising the instance method doesn't : grab the class-level lock, so a synchronised static method can : access the class field at the same time as a synchronised instance : method. : : [...] : : The singleton-destruction problem discussed in Chapter 7 is a serious one. : [in chapter 7:] : There is a serious impediment to the correct implementation of Singleton: : How do you get rid of the thing? The Singleton object is created on : first use, but what if global resources like temporary files or database : connections are created by the Singleton's constructor? How do you : get rid of the temporary file or close the database connection in an : orderly way? [...] Though I hate to end this section on a pessimistic note, : I don't have an ideal solution to this problem. If you do, please write to me. : : [...] : : Daemon threads are shut down abruptly when all the non-daemon : threads terminate. This is a problen when the daemon has created : some sort of global resource (such as a database connection or a temporary : file), but hasn't closed or destroyed that resource when it is terminated. : : [...] : : The suspend() and resume() methods should just be put back into : Java. They're useful, and I don't like being treated like a kindergartener: : Removing them simply because they are potentially dangerous - a thread : can be holding a lock when suspended - is insulting. Let me decide : whether or not I want to use them. : : [...] : : You should be able to interrupt any blocking operation, not just : wait() and sleep(). [...] Right now, the only way to interrupt a blocking : I/O operation on a socket is to close the socket, and there's no : way to interrupt a blocking I/O operation on a file. with all of these issues, Limbo either ducks the issue (by not pretending to solve a problem it can't solve properly) or does things right. From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 00:17:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 00:00:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22739 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 00:00:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22735 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 00:00:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 00:00:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DB5D19D56; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3772D19C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:00:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 713F619D21; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:59:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2DA519BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 09:59:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403020756.i227uE08071388@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:04:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yet [Java] is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures > or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while > either not possible or inconvenient in limbo. re: closures: cheap and easy threads provide a more than adequate substitute in many cases. a channel can represent a connection to a remote procedure with its attached data. for instance, a trivial example: getop(s: string): chan of (string, chan of string) { c := chan of (string, chan of string); spawn append(s, c); return c; } append(s: string, c: chan of (string, chan of string)) { for(;;){ (t, reply) := <-c; reply <-= s + t; } } in this example, the channel returned by getop(s) is functionally equivalent to λt.(s + t). the generic operator would look like: op(s: string, c: chan of (string, chan of string)): string { reply := chan of string; c <-= (s, reply); return <-reply; } of course in this case the amount of code compared with its actual function is considerable, but for less trivial applications this is often viable (moreover, it's considerably more powerful, as the channel represents an ongoing continuation rather than just a closure). re: message polymorphism. strings are often used for this kind of thing in limbo, as they're easy to use, by-value (yet locally mutable) and it's trivial to transfer them externally. generally, Limbo programs tend to avoid polymorphism (although the latest version does have parametric polymorphism) in favour of a simple, direct style of coding. channels i mentioned earlier in this respect. dynamically loaded modules mean that you can have several dynamically loaded pieces of code each complying to the same interface. i've used this to pleasing effect in some limbo programs. for example, a piece of "grid" software i did recently allows one to farm out pieces of work to multiple clients and reliably collect them. the module that actually splits up the work and marshals the results is separately implemented. its interface is entirely specified by the following self-contained module definition: Taskgenerator: module { init: fn(jobid: string, state: string, args: list of string): string; taskcount: fn(): int; state: fn(): string; start: fn(id: string, tries: int, spec: ref Clientspec, read: chan of (int, chan of array of byte, chan of int), write: chan of (array of byte, chan of string, chan of int), finish: chan of (int, big, chan of string)): (int, string); reconnect: fn(id: string, read: chan of (int, chan of array of byte, chan of int), write: chan of (array of byte, chan of string, chan of int), finish: chan of (int, big, chan of string)): int; complete: fn(); quit: fn(); Clientspec: adt { addr: string; attrs: list of (string, string); nodeattrs: list of (string, string); }; Started, Error, Nomore: con iota; }; this uses the above mentioned forms of polymorphism in several ways: multiple different implementations of Taskgenerator modules coexist concurrently, each with its own unrelated state. calling start() asks the task generator to start a new task; it returns some channels that can then be used by the core software to communicate with an instance of that task (usually a thread will be started). the interface is straightforward, and both sides of the software can be written in a straightforward manner. strings are used to hold arbitrary data (attribute-value pairs, arbitrary client-created identifiers). implementation is almost completely divorced from interface, making the whole thing highly modular. i can replace task generator modules at run time with no hassle (and often do). of course, it's no magic bullet, but the features of Limbo do seem to me to work in synergy to produce a language that spurs creativity rather than inviting perplexity. cheers, rog. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 00:17:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 00:16:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23537 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 00:16:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23533 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 00:16:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 00:16:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C06CF19D46; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C1C919C59; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:16:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C70FE19C7F; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:15:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33CEE19BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:14:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22FCUki073982 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:12:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22FCUwP073981 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:12:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021512.i22FCUwP073981@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:12:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > re: closures: cheap and easy threads provide a more than adequate > re: message polymorphism. Rog, thanks a lot. Very informative. I am motivated. David From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 00:53:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26029 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 00:53:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26025 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 00:53:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 00:53:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFD0E19CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:53:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9740419BBC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:53:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFCE319C26; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:52:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99D3D19BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3710415-22744>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:51:05 -0500 Message-ID: <002501c4006e$0627f120$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:49:58 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > And to think I just ate. fortunately, i was sleeping. From forsyth@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 09:02:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 00:58:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26265 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 00:58:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26261 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 00:58:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 00:58:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B46AB19D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9C6919CE3; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:58:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 305E219CA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:57:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EEF019BF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:57:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:03:00 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yet [Java] is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures > or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while Java has closures? From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:09:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26672 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:09:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26668 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:09:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:09:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 60E2819D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DB0819D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:09:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C200819D38; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9CB0A19D36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:08:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320539-29869>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:06:19 -0500 Message-ID: <005c01c40070$26069800$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403020600.i2260mYk070667@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:05:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Please use English. please think From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:10:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26709 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:10:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26704 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:10:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:10:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19E5219D6D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:10:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE36E19D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:10:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 567E519D43; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:09:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD65F19D3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:09:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22G6wki074245 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:06:58 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22G6vl9074244 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:06:57 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021606.i22G6vl9074244@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:06:57 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: C H Forsyth > > > Yet [Java] is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures > > or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while > > Java has closures? > Of course it does. interface Appl {Object f(Object o);} interface List {void foreach(Appl a);} class test { void do(List l) { String s="element: "; l.foreach(new Appl() { String t=s; Object f(Object o) { System.out.println(t+o); } }); } } Untested, but the idea is simple: foreach is passed a dynamic closure with variable s inherited from the context. t=s is to show how a local binding can be explicitely created, one could simply write l.foreach(new Appl() { Object f(Object o) { System.out.println(s+o); } ... David From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:28:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27609 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:28:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27605 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:28:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:28:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6EF8919CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:28:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CEF019CA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:28:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6D6619BCD; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:27:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACF1C19BA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:27:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i22GOPki074339 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:24:25 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i22GOPCi074338 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:24:25 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403021624.i22GOPCi074338@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <200403021606.i22G6vl9074244@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:24:25 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > Yet [Java] is more powerful in expressing algorithms. Things like closures > > > or message polymorphism are natural and easy to express in Java, while > > > > Java has closures? > > > > Of course it does. > > interface Appl {Object f(Object o);} > > interface List {void foreach(Appl a);} > > class test { > void do(List l) { But I am convinced that cheap threads are good for the purpose. From forsyth@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 09:02:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:31:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27892 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:31:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27888 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:31:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:31:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2F3319CDC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:31:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B897D19BA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:31:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD52019CA8; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CC8B19AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:30:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <896aa9d6a6c4ace1f98c2762498dfdd9@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403021606.i22G6vl9074244@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:35:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Java has closures? >Of course it does. sorry, once i worked through that i realised we weren't talking about the same thing. my fault. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:37:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28254 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:37:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28250 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:37:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:37:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F20C619D65; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:37:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D2BB19BCD; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABAF719CAB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:36:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36EE119BA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:36:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <324678-29861>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:35:35 -0500 Message-ID: <015301c40074$3b5c7d60$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403021005.i22A5IEs072198@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:34:25 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: oh i understand now. i admit, i know nothing. i can't even find the tab key on my keyboard. back to normal programming ... From rm@hamnavoe.com Wed Mar 3 09:02:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 01:45:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28605 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 01:45:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28601 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 01:45:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 01:45:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8727E19AAA; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:45:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02B3C19A14; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:45:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E0A419D65; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:44:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA6AF19CAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 11:44:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] indenting source? From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <015301c40074$3b5c7d60$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:44:33 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i can't even find the tab > key on my keyboard. Tab keys are for wimps. Ctrl-i does the job for me. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 3 09:02:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 02:19:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30643 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 02:19:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30634 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 02:19:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 02:19:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A994419D95; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:19:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 892D719AEC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:19:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1294B19D72; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:18:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1F9919AEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 12:18:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0cf4f752ba17d491cf64634ce958df58@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <7d0c2d03cf49fc0835ab54c2f203c90b@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 10:18:44 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>> The Inferno/Java paper (somewhere on the web site, but likely also in >>> the Plan 9 distribution) covers it rather nicely. >> >> Google brings inexistent link. >> > Hm, maybe forsyth can help you with a copy, I'd have to search for one > myself. If you want to wait, I must have one on the old Inferno CD. > maybe this paper would help too: http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/bwk/interps/pap.html "Timing Trials and Trials of Timing: Experiments with Scripting and User-Interface Languages" contains comparisons between Awk, Perl, Tcl/Tk, Java, VB and Limbo. it's rather old but worth a read, especially when nowadays you see people benchmarking a language by making it run a multiplication a few hundred times and calling it quits. plumb-ready link: http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/bwk/interps/paper.ps andrey From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 03:43:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3497 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 03:43:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3493 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 03:43:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 03:43:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0631C19B0A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BF2119CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:43:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9787919CF1; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:43:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D614A19B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:42:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322813-29864>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:41:29 -0500 Message-ID: <01ac01c40085$cc666710$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> <40447BCC.4000006@hellooperator.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:40:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Java is done right in concept. > > wtf? the story goes that Sun had a group developing that junk with no plan and then the web came along and they bolted it on. ref: the project group themselves. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 03:49:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3685 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 03:49:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3681 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 03:49:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 03:49:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 67C1219D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:49:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B57AA19D71; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:49:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9396919D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:48:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49A0119D46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:48:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <508306-21550>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:47:28 -0500 Message-ID: <01c401c40086$a1f8eec0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403020602.i2262OJu070674@adat.davidashen.net> <013a01c40055$45bb27d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:46:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > good evening, yeah it was. brucee played worms and i coded a pop3 client over a few beers. after being beaten into doing it and then having done it, i was sold. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 03:52:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3928 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 03:52:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3923 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 03:52:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 03:52:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C4A219D82; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8A2719D46; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:52:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75A4E19D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F1F019D21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:51:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <376272-14992>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:39:46 -0500 Message-ID: <019d01c40085$8ed5e790$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5b983650e241a210e3b376bf76366fd8@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:38:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ... Mr Nemo mr no-one [latin], right? From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 04:04:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4648 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 04:04:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4643 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 04:04:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 04:04:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A750B19D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:04:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E82119AC4; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:04:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2886C19AFC; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:03:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46D7C19A11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:03:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <019d01c40085$8ed5e790$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zlvxluttypkvrrfnyzqakiggyl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:03:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zlvxluttypkvrrfnyzqakiggyl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Right. I'm glad you know. In fact, no-one uses Plan 9, right? ☺ --upas-zlvxluttypkvrrfnyzqakiggyl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 2 19:52:33 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 864D119D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8A2719D46; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:52:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75A4E19D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F1F019D21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:51:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <376272-14992>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:39:46 -0500 Message-ID: <019d01c40085$8ed5e790$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5b983650e241a210e3b376bf76366fd8@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:38:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ... Mr Nemo mr no-one [latin], right? --upas-zlvxluttypkvrrfnyzqakiggyl-- From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 04:06:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4764 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 04:06:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4760 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 04:06:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 04:06:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C71E19D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:06:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B893F19B27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:06:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7A7B19AB5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2426D19A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <543e651e9d4add46d78ca6f47dd52193@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:10:48 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > ... Mr Nemo > > mr no-one [latin], right? just call him captain. From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 09:02:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 04:09:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4920 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 04:09:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4915 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 04:09:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 04:09:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3186B19D2B; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF23519B27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:09:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47DD819B26; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0C6F19A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:08:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <543e651e9d4add46d78ca6f47dd52193@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bbmxxzqvqmtbybmmovsbvtqrjl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:08:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bbmxxzqvqmtbybmmovsbvtqrjl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit But only while onboard. --upas-bbmxxzqvqmtbybmmovsbvtqrjl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 2 20:06:19 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7B2D519D46; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:06:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B893F19B27; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:06:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7A7B19AB5; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2426D19A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:05:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <543e651e9d4add46d78ca6f47dd52193@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:10:48 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > ... Mr Nemo > > mr no-one [latin], right? just call him captain. --upas-bbmxxzqvqmtbybmmovsbvtqrjl-- From andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 05:50:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10377 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 05:50:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10373 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 05:50:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 05:50:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE28019AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:50:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DEE219AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:50:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D419519ACF; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (frontdoor.monitorbm.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C4A9119ADF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:49:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18679 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 20:49:37 -0000 Received: from mercury.mbmnz.co.nz (HELO MERCURY.monitorbm.co.nz) (192.168.0.63) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 20:49:37 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20040303094018.00aa5fe8@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> X-Sender: andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz@pop.monitorbm.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Andrew Simmons Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <200403020748.i227mLxn071341@adat.davidashen.net> References: <4cac3ee48455c3c5f48149771bba4f03@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:50:51 +1300 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >Class Thread is not a part of the language. 'synchronized' >is. What's wrong with Java synchronization? Can you please >bring an example in Java and limbo where Java's synchronization >is bad while limbo's approach is right? Brinch Hansen's paper "Java's Insecure Parallelism" is worth a read. There have been at least a couple of attempts at welding a CSP style framework on top of Java threads - eg: http://www.cs.kent.ac.uk/projects/ofa/jcsp/ but the syntax looks fairly brutal. From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 05:54:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10484 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 05:54:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10480 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 05:54:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 05:54:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3716619ADF; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:54:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F264519ACF; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:54:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7622319AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:53:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC45919ACF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:53:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8748b7def795d0b2bf301591243968d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20040303094018.00aa5fe8@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:56:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: No offense to anyone, and I'm guilty too, but Java, do we really care? It's so OT m From andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 05:57:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10661 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 05:57:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10657 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 05:57:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 05:57:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F88819B0C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E79F19B6C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:57:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A5DD19B63; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:56:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (frontdoor.monitorbm.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5623D19B0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:56:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18766 invoked from network); 2 Mar 2004 20:56:34 -0000 Received: from mercury.mbmnz.co.nz (HELO MERCURY.monitorbm.co.nz) (192.168.0.63) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 2 Mar 2004 20:56:34 -0000 Message-Id: <5.1.1.6.0.20040303095749.00ab5e10@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> X-Sender: andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz@pop.monitorbm.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Andrew Simmons Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: References: <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:58:35 +1300 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. Would you care to expand on that? From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 05:58:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10694 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 05:58:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10690 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 05:58:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 05:58:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6A2419CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29A6A19980; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:58:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30C2319BA6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:57:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBE6019980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 15:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22KvWb5028715 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:57:32 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22KvVWE012571 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:57:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i22KvVfQ001394 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:57:31 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo In-Reply-To: <8748b7def795d0b2bf301591243968d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:57:31 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004 matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > No offense to anyone, and I'm guilty too, but Java, do we really care? I don't. I hate java. ron From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 06:27:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12079 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 06:27:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12075 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 06:27:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 06:27:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 800AB19B0C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:27:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5088E19AFB; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:27:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 783C619B0C; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:26:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2731119A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:26:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314949-29867>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:24:57 -0500 Message-ID: <030c01c4009c$9a6ed730$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040302041309.GA20695@localhost.localdomain> <5.1.1.6.0.20040303095749.00ab5e10@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 22:23:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. > > Would you care to expand on that? should be made a fortune. From kjn9@citizenearth.com Wed Mar 3 09:02:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 06:59:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15059 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 06:59:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15055 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 06:59:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 06:59:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EC8419B61; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:59:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 078F419AF0; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:59:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 00CA719AF0; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:58:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.dirac.net (195-97-240-22.onyx.net [195.97.240.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0BD0C19AD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:58:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15046 invoked by uid 60001); 2 Mar 2004 21:59:36 -0000 Message-ID: <20040302215936.15045.qmail@mail.dirac.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Keith Nash Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: 2 Mar 2004 21:59:36 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tuesday 02 March 2004 04:56, ron minnich wrote: > ... v9fs ... > > It works. I don't know why we're not all using it. > > ron Can you do a tarball release? The last one was in 2002. Most of the sf site (except CVS?) is out of date. Keith. From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 09:38:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 09:30:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26687 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 09:30:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26683 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 09:30:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 09:30:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5142F19D36; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:30:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A95E419CF7; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:30:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E33C619D09; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:29:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F75619CE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 19:29:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i230TMXS031035 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:29:22 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i230TLq4030884 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:29:21 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i230TLfQ011131 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:29:21 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Subject: [9fans] another possible board Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:29:20 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: check out the MOPS 520. It's a nice fanless low power board, which could be stacked and put in a can. I'll try it out with a kernel this or next week. I keep wanting a 'backpack cluster', don't know why, but I don't want to have to have a 15-lb BFB to power it. ron From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 10:59:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 10:36:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 385 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 10:36:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 381 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 10:36:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 10:36:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7995919D7A; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:36:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B31F919D6D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:36:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C06819D72; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A093D19D65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:35:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <010fa86872547f4d8ec90228c5305940@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:36:15 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > And, that said, I'm still gradually moving my existence over to Plan 9. Because some people loves art over everyday life. Kenji From rsc@swtch.com Wed Mar 3 11:49:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 11:20:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3675 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 11:20:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3671 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 11:20:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 11:20:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10C5619D4E; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:20:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B58E719D75; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:20:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A85B19CD2; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:19:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5ADF19AE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:19:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AyLzG-000DO5-LD for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 02 Mar 2004 21:19:54 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 02 Mar 2004 18:15:57 +0400." <200403021415.i22EFvs9073684@adat.davidashen.net> From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <51463.1078280392.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 21:19:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It takes three times more time to write a file under Plan9 > than under FreeBSD on the same computer (bunzip2 cdinstall.iso.bz2 > , 200 Mb unzipped). > > Is there something wrong with my setup, or is it normal? this is pretty normal. kfs isn't batching disk writes or paying attention to disk layout, so you get what you get. i bet that freebsd is a bit more clever with its disk. i'm surprised it's only a factor of three. fossil isn't any better in this regard, although it does buffer more. disk file system speed is one area where i do wish plan 9 was zippier (as opposed to context switches betwen threads). russ From jas@corpus-callosum.com Wed Mar 3 11:49:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 11:32:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4731 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 11:32:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4727 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 11:32:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 11:32:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4FF1A19D91; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:32:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD45419D82; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:32:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEF2D19D5D; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:31:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 789AE19BEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 21:31:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i232VQfK084712 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:31:26 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 20:31:21 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mar 2, 2004, at 8:19 PM, Russ Cox wrote: > > disk file system speed is one area where i do wish plan 9 was > zippier (as opposed to context switches betwen threads). Well, if you know of a grad program, preferably around Chicago, that would be willing to grant someone a degree for working on a particular improvement, I'd be glad to hear of it. jas From martin@parvat.com Wed Mar 3 13:27:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 13:02:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12016 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 13:02:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12012 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 13:02:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 13:02:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 64E1119DD6; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:02:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FA4319D76; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:02:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2F6019D76; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:01:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.177]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9941819C32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:01:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.205] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AyNZr-0007F2-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 05:01:47 +0100 Received: from [203.101.54.205] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AyNZq-00038b-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 05:01:47 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-Id: <20040303092849.635b69f5.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <200403011915.i21JFw0P068107@adat.davidashen.net> References: <20040301190215.GA18554@localhost.localdomain> <200403011915.i21JFw0P068107@adat.davidashen.net> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:28:49 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, 1 Mar 2004 23:15:58 +0400 (AMT) David Tolpin wrote: >... > No. It is because the spec is written by people who come from culture of > detailed specifications; and it is because a part of the specification is > dedicated to binary compatibility, which few other languages provide. Still > yet, the specification for Java, 504 pages, is SMALLER than specification for > ANSI/ISO C, which 554 pages. No. The Revised^5 report on Scheme is only 50 pages - and that includes a full denotation semantics for the language - almost by definition, nothing can be more "detailed" than that! OK, so maybe Scheme is a "smaller" language - whatever that means - but not 10 times smaller (and perhaps being smaller is a good thing, not a bad thing!). Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 14:22:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 14:11:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19338 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 14:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19333 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 14:11:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 14:11:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BFBF19B52; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:11:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61A4819D64; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:11:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85A8219C2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:10:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1842819B52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:10:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <54a5d2b7c9943cc97e6216deb310b2a1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20040303095749.00ab5e10@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:11:43 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. > > Would you care to expand on that? Just from my guess, it looks fancier to someone, however, it solves no essencial problem. ☺ Kenji From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 17:08:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 14:33:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22364 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 14:33:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22360 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 14:33:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 14:33:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6957719A2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:33:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB1BE19C3A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:33:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E08219A7B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:32:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5B1019A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:32:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <413182-14980>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 00:27:24 -0500 Message-ID: <009a01c400e0$073a6bc0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <54a5d2b7c9943cc97e6216deb310b2a1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:26:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Just from my guess, it looks fancier to someone, however, it solves no > essencial problem. ☺ roman numerals were all very fine for writing down numbers, but were a nightmare to do mathematics with. this was due to their awful representation. brucee did once add roman numbers to csh. you could: set roman and it would spit roman numerals where it thought it needed to spit numbers. iirc, history was one example. From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 3 17:08:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 15:56:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30324 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 15:56:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30320 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 15:56:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 15:56:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CFDC19C39; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:56:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4797C19C29; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EFC2119C6E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:55:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36D5C19C2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:55:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.0.20040303095749.00ab5e10@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 23:55:20 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. Definitely one for the fortune file. > Would you care to expand on that? You have something against tersely eloquent, and expressive statements? ☺ How I interpret it, and what my experience tells me is that OO doesn't scale up (or down) and is the wrong model for a lot of things. Java's issues are not just with the language. It is also the fact that it insists on (ordained to) representing EVERYTHING in an object abstraction. Java suffers from the modern illusion that if a little of something is good, more of it must be better. From anastas@ceid.upatras.gr Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:06:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31341 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:06:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31337 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:06:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:06:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A87D19DDD; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:06:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBA7919C84; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:06:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9186519C4F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:05:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr (diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr [150.140.141.181]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D423F19C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 22113 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 07:05:21 -0000 Received: from zenon.ceid.upatras.gr (150.140.141.182) by diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:05:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 27296 invoked by uid 1556); 3 Mar 2004 07:05:20 -0000 From: Anastasopoulos S To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: <030c01c4009c$9a6ed730$67844051@SOMA> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:05:20 +0200 (EET) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > >object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. > > > > Would you care to expand on that? > > should be made a fortune. > > There is an post post from Rob Pike on OO. Search groups.google.com for Rob Pike The emperor's new O-O O.S Spyros From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:22:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 365 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:22:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 361 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:22:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:22:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7554619DE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E06319DDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:22:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB5BE19C1C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:21:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DF21C19D7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:21:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16988 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 07:21:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:21:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:21:54 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i237Lr8209947; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:21:53 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:21:49 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > In fact, no-one uses Plan 9, right? Surely, none uses Plan 9 a lot. -- From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:29:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1241 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:29:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1237 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:29:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:29:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE10E19C9A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:29:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BDCC19A89; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:29:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5BD619DDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:28:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04BFF19D76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:28:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2634710e02fcf79214797eebbc2741b2@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:29:14 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> In fact, no-one uses Plan 9, right? > > Surely, none uses Plan 9 a lot. or just hoping to steal some ideas. ☺ Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:31:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1375 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:31:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1364 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:31:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:31:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 09F2219C96; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:31:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2E0A19AB0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:31:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A30F19B2E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:30:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0304C19AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:30:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <2634710e02fcf79214797eebbc2741b2@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:31:25 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > or just hoping to steal some ideas. ☺ Ohh--o! I wanted to say leaning and stealing is a quite different thing, even no resemble to each other... Kenji From t.lankots@aprote.ee Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:34:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1759 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:34:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1754 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:34:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:34:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7B1A619B2E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 534A619C96; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:34:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1E81819ACF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:33:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F66619A93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i237eaDu005252 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:40:36 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D26@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo Thread-Index: AcQA8U42OMm5k9PmRkWcYbZH13jwqQAABx5Q From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:33:34 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: PiA+PiBJbiBmYWN0LCBuby1vbmUgdXNlcyBQbGFuIDksIHJpZ2h0Pw0KPiA+IA0KPiA+IFN1cmVs eSwgbm9uZSB1c2VzIFBsYW4gOSBhIGxvdC4NCg0KKDEpIExpbnVzIHNheXMgdGhhdCBQbGFuLTkg aXMgZXZpbC4NCigyKSBUaGVyZWZvcmUsIG5vLW9uZSB1c2VzIFBsYW4gOS4NCg0KVGlpdCwgaW5z aXByZWQgYnkgaHR0cDovL2ZhY3RzNGdvZC5mYWl0aHdlYi5jb20vdGhlbGlzdC5odG1sDQo= From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:38:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2132 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:38:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2113 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:38:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:38:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A3BDE19DDD; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:38:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB78B19A93; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:38:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 36B6819B2E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:37:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6DD2719A93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 20596 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 07:37:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:37:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:37:20 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i237bK8210805; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:37:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <863eb8249b7a225354cc16f300bbf235@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:37:15 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 3 16:34:28 JST 2004, Tiit Lankots wrote: > (2) Therefore, no-one uses Plan 9. no, no. I meant none *positively* uses Plan 9 a lot. :) ex. cpu% ps | grep none none 31 0:00 0:13 1384K Open httpd none 33 0:00 0:04 156K Sleep listen none 36 0:01 0:05 156K Await listen none 41 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 42 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 43 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 44 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 45 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 46 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 47 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 48 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 49 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 50 0:00 0:03 156K Open listen none 51 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 52 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 53 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 54 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 55 0:00 0:00 156K Open listen none 30737 0:00 0:00 120K Pread tcp17010 none 30748 0:00 0:00 184K Rendez exportfs -- From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:43:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2565 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:43:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2559 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:43:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:43:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2B5519DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:43:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C25DB19DDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:43:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C37919C96; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:42:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2C7C19B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:42:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] change to mk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:42:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've sent a patch (which should be in /n/sources/patch IIRC) to make mk use $MKFILE as its mkfile when there is no mkfile in the current directory. I've done this after discovering that I had lots of mkfiles which just had < $home/lib/skel/mkrules inside. Now I can't leave without it, since I can go to a directory with a .ms and run mk without creating such a silly mkfile there. hth From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:48:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3025 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:48:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3021 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:48:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:48:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BE3819DF1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:48:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6AD419C54; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:48:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C0CEE19C6A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:47:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9ACB719B3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:47:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 22581 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 07:47:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:47:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:47:00 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i237l08211483; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:47:00 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Distributed filesystems: Plan 9 vs. Linux From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:46:57 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm thinking if this can be called a distributed filesystem? 1: import file storages from multiple servers. 2: create arena files on each imported file storage. 3: start a venti/fossil using the imported arena files. Thus, you can create a single filesystem exploiting multiple disk storages on multiple servers. -- From anastas@ceid.upatras.gr Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:51:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3240 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:51:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3236 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:51:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:51:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6CFB819DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEEE719DBE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:51:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F00919C6C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:50:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr (diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr [150.140.141.181]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id EC1C319AB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:50:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9289 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 07:50:55 -0000 Received: from zenon.ceid.upatras.gr (150.140.141.182) by diogenis.ceid.upatras.gr with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 07:50:55 -0000 Received: (qmail 2835 invoked by uid 1556); 3 Mar 2004 07:50:54 -0000 From: Anastasopoulos S To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] change to mk In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:50:54 +0200 (EET) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > I've sent a patch (which should be in /n/sources/patch IIRC) to make > mk use $MKFILE as its mkfile when there is no mkfile in the current > directory. > > I've done this after discovering that I had lots of mkfiles which just had > < $home/lib/skel/mkrules > inside. Now I can't leave without it, since I can go to a directory with a .ms > and run mk without creating such a silly mkfile there. > > hth > > Why you changed the source of mk and didn't use a script like if test -f mkfile mk if not mk $MKFILE call it mk and put it in your /bin? Spyros From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 17:08:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 16:57:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3928 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 16:57:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3922 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 16:57:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 16:57:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3180819DF3; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9EC519C6C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:57:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D6CDF19DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:56:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C56319DE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:56:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0258b6fcaf62e956776b3b93545b53c9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] change to mk From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:56:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Why you changed the source of mk and didn't use a script like > > if test -f mkfile > mk > if not > mk $MKFILE > > call it mk and put it in your /bin? I do such wrappers when I feel that the change is useful just for my preferences. However, I tend to modify the original program when I think that both the change does not break or clutter the program and that most of our local users would like it too. Of course, if in the future nobody but me is using that, I'll revert to the orginal program and use a wrapper instead. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 17:08:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:01:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4212 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:01:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4208 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:01:13 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:01:13 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0303319E05; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:00:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 664A119DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:00:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D845719DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 861A719C6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:59:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i237v1ki097381 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i237v1Sr097380 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030757.i237v1Sr097380@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, after a power failure, I'm getting repeating lines with I/O error: wrenwrite The file system is kfs. After reboot from the installation CD, fshalt and c-a-d, everything is working. Is it normal? David From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 17:08:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:07:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5454 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:07:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5448 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:07:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:07:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA7C419E0A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:07:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AB8D19DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:07:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 48FBA19C92; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:06:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C6D219C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:06:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1bd7003f9145bbd201061285adb27b6b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403030757.i237v1Sr097380@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lblyssanihfkztlwxvczvqxwdo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:06:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lblyssanihfkztlwxvczvqxwdo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to about-to-fail disks. But don't know if that's your case. It was long ago. --upas-lblyssanihfkztlwxvczvqxwdo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Wed Mar 3 09:01:16 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EEB519DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:00:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 664A119DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:00:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D845719DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 861A719C6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 02:59:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i237v1ki097381 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i237v1Sr097380 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030757.i237v1Sr097380@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:57:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, after a power failure, I'm getting repeating lines with I/O error: wrenwrite The file system is kfs. After reboot from the installation CD, fshalt and c-a-d, everything is working. Is it normal? David --upas-lblyssanihfkztlwxvczvqxwdo-- From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:13:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6305 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:13:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6301 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:13:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:13:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B25419E07; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3ED0F19C92; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:13:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3A5F19C92; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:12:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAD8619C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:12:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i238AFki097442 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i238AFrb097441 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030810.i238AFrb097441@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <1bd7003f9145bbd201061285adb27b6b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to > about-to-fail disks. But don't know if that's your case. It was long > ago. > Unlikely. FreeBSD runs for several hours under fs stress test without any slightest sign of a problem. On the same hardware. From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 23:47:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:16:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6612 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:16:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6561 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:16:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:16:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E25A019DC2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13B0C19DE1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:16:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B49D19DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:15:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79F4919DC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:15:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4e035119ed6c194eb5874df3b305f9db@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403030810.i238AFrb097441@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qumewvehwfxstkehqgbzilsmxe" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:15:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qumewvehwfxstkehqgbzilsmxe Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Perhaps your disk recovered your bad blocks using spare ones and now there's no problem at all. --upas-qumewvehwfxstkehqgbzilsmxe Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Wed Mar 3 09:13:30 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A0FD519DFE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3ED0F19C92; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:13:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3A5F19C92; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:12:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAD8619C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:12:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i238AFki097442 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i238AFrb097441 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030810.i238AFrb097441@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <1bd7003f9145bbd201061285adb27b6b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:10:15 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to > about-to-fail disks. But don't know if that's your case. It was long > ago. > Unlikely. FreeBSD runs for several hours under fs stress test without any slightest sign of a problem. On the same hardware. --upas-qumewvehwfxstkehqgbzilsmxe-- From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:26:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7651 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:26:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7647 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:26:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:26:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 32BA619DE1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:26:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B851A19C75; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:26:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6FF8F19C75; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:25:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D01FA19B82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:25:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i238MZki097481 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i238MZBg097480 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030822.i238MZBg097480@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <4e035119ed6c194eb5874df3b305f9db@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Perhaps your disk recovered your bad blocks using spare ones and > now there's no problem at all. > 1) what exactly does the word mean? 2) how it depends on rebooting it from a different media? 3) among the messages displayed last time there was one that it cannot open /adm/timezone/local. After the reboot, /adm/timezone/local is where it should and unchanged (that is, my timezone as I put it there). Can it be something with controller state not properly initialized? How exactly should I report my hardware configuration? Why it only happens after a power failure and not during normal work, if it is a hardware problem? I am not a hardware expert. I am just trying to port some programs to Plan9, and use it as a platform -- it was said to be 'finished', that is, usable for work, and I hope it is mature indeed. David Tolpin From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 23:47:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:35:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9016 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:35:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9012 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:35:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:35:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8721A19CC4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:35:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE31D19AEB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:35:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B47A19CBC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:34:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFFC419CA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:34:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <503d190cb9a4472806f90bd0fdde7772@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403030822.i238MZBg097480@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mrbgjelipencdglctconwipsyf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:34:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mrbgjelipencdglctconwipsyf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am not a hardware expert either. Wren was the name for the disk device in fs(8), and I think kfs inherited the name. It refers to a rw disk or partition. The messages can be understood AFAIK as I/O errors, which usually correspond to broken hardware. Regarding 2, I don't know how that may be. Regarding 3, I know disks that do automatically what time ago you did by hand (declaring some blocks as defects and instructing the disk to use other spare ones instead). The only reason I may find for this is that your disk detected an error and was able to correct it; but I'm not a hardware expert either. A power failure may cause all this depending on the disk you use, because it may lead to broken disks (although I admit I've not seen this since long ago). We use Plan 9 here for daily work: It runs a lab for students, our accounts, we write programs and documents on it, read mail, etc. I indeed can say that it's more reliable than Linux, according to my experience (that can be different for others, of course). So I'd not be scared to use plan 9 for daily work; I'd be to switch back to what I used before. If I may help somehow, let me know. --upas-mrbgjelipencdglctconwipsyf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Wed Mar 3 09:26:33 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AEBA019C83; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:26:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B851A19C75; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:26:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6FF8F19C75; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:25:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D01FA19B82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:25:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i238MZki097481 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i238MZBg097480 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030822.i238MZBg097480@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <4e035119ed6c194eb5874df3b305f9db@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Perhaps your disk recovered your bad blocks using spare ones and > now there's no problem at all. > 1) what exactly does the word mean? 2) how it depends on rebooting it from a different media? 3) among the messages displayed last time there was one that it cannot open /adm/timezone/local. After the reboot, /adm/timezone/local is where it should and unchanged (that is, my timezone as I put it there). Can it be something with controller state not properly initialized? How exactly should I report my hardware configuration? Why it only happens after a power failure and not during normal work, if it is a hardware problem? I am not a hardware expert. I am just trying to port some programs to Plan9, and use it as a platform -- it was said to be 'finished', that is, usable for work, and I hope it is mature indeed. David Tolpin --upas-mrbgjelipencdglctconwipsyf-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 17:54:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10622 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 17:54:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10618 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 17:54:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 17:54:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FFA719D7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:54:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A67319CC4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:54:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D137019CA5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B23819C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 03:53:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <72f57bf60029eba0ac90b0d179e174a9@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:52:46 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: be sure that rwm is on too as well as dma. >>freebsd is a bit more clever with its disk. i'm surprised it's only >>a factor of three. fossil isn't any better in this regard, although >>it does buffer more. i'm not sure about current BSD or Linux come to that but in the past i found that performance differences were often affected by the following as well: - not actually writing to the storage until much later - using most of memory as a big cache the former isn't so good if you suddenly halt the machine (soft updates or no) and the latter isn't so good if you need the memory for something else. i suspect BSD does both. of course, NOT doing them is unhelpful if you're trying to write quickly. furthermore, if you stop the machine suddenly, clearly unwritten material won't be there regardless whether you buffer a lot or a little (unless it has got heaps of NVRAM). on PCs, i'd add `using the hardware effectively', which plan 9 makes optional, presumably because rwm and dma might be touchy on some chipsets(?). don't know. cache only helps reads? not entirely: it means it can buffer that much more before actually writing. kfs is more diligent than the /sys/src/fs about forcing writes through to disc. that includes indirect blocks, i think, so all in all it will be doing much more writing than either fs or BSD. as rsc suggests that will also be in relatively small amounts, although i'm not sure there's much difference with BSD there. you could try switching that off to see what difference it makes. to speed things up generally, you might also try increasing the kfs cache if you've got lots of physical memory. it uses 10% by default. the -B option controls it. bigger blocks help too. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:03:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11588 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:03:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11584 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:03:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:03:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0633E19DF2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:03:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B118B19CA5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:03:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AA8F19C97; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:02:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCC7519E07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:02:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i238xTki097597 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:59:29 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i238xTtx097596 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:59:29 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030859.i238xTtx097596@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <503d190cb9a4472806f90bd0fdde7772@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:59:29 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: How to boot from CD and check filesystem? That is, to mount? I've tried but somehow cannot figure out how to. From rm@hamnavoe.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:16:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12613 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:16:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12609 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:16:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:16:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDD5819E0E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:16:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0E9E19DFA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:16:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E0B119E0A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:15:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B191D19DFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:15:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <1bd7003f9145bbd201061285adb27b6b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:15:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to > about-to-fail disks. An "i/o error" report from wrenwrite is not necessarily a hardware problem. It may be a failed seek because a block address in the filesystem has been corrupted. This should be repairable (with some loss of data) by kfscmd chk. -- Richard From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:22:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13253 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:22:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13243 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:22:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:22:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C164619E28; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:22:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BC8C19AC0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:22:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABBC019DFA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AC0919AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:21:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i239Ihki097685 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:18:43 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i239IhWc097684 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:18:43 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030918.i239IhWc097684@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:18:43 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to > > about-to-fail disks. > > An "i/o error" report from wrenwrite is not necessarily a hardware > problem. It may be a failed seek because a block address in the > filesystem has been corrupted. This should be repairable (with some > loss of data) by kfscmd chk. I don't get a chance to run kfscmd check since wrenwrite are endlessly repeating each time I reboot system. And when I just reboot from CD, and then c-a-d to boot from the hard disk, everything is normal. I can reproduce it easily by pressing power button. It is something to do with the state of hardware not properly initialized. Is there a way to get more debugging information? David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:32:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17222 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:32:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15386 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:27:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:27:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5548719DFA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:27:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04D8F19B52; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:27:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54FB919E0E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:26:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B140C19E07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:26:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i239Nski097715 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:23:54 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i239NsmW097714 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:23:54 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030923.i239NsmW097714@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: <72f57bf60029eba0ac90b0d179e174a9@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:23:54 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > to speed things up generally, you might also try Yes, thank you, very useful. To clarify, I am not going to race with FreeBSD or Linux; I was just checking whether everything was ok with my setup or it was a sign of a problem. As far as it is expected, I do not care; it is fast enough. David From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:36:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18201 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:36:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18197 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:36:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:36:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44D8619E30; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:36:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC3DC19CA5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:36:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6275119E0A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:35:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4F5319CA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:35:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AySlO-0004G0-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:34:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:33:35 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ron minnich wrote: > On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > > >>i thought that the idea with an micro kernel is that it makes it >>_possible_ to tailor the application interface towards many different >>applications. a monolithic kernel has only one interface. > > > no, I recall Rashid saying this about Mach 3.0: microkernels are not > small, they just don't do much. This in response to the complaints that > this low-capability "micro kernel" was about 3 Mbytes in size. I wish I > had saved the exact email :-) so different micro kernels have different ideas behind them. i like speed, and therefore prefer the ones that have faster applications as their idea. > you get way more ability to tailor etc. with Plan 9 than I was every able > to figure out with Mach. please consider using a modern micro kernel as example of a micro kernel. you would not want me to use multics as the one true monolithic kernel, would you :-) > ron > p.s. why do all your short emails have a 20-line disclaimer? the disclaimer is added by the mail server for outgoing email. bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you believe this message has been sent to you in error, please notify the sender by replying to this transmission and delete the message without disclosing it. Thank you. E-mail including attachments is susceptible to data corruption, interruption, unauthorized amendment, tampering and viruses, and we only send and receive e-mails on the basis that we are not liable for any such corruption, interception, amendment, tampering or viruses or any consequences thereof. From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 23:47:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:47:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19214 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:47:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19210 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:47:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:47:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 427C619E1D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:47:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A8D519D4C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:47:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9237419D20; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:46:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC6FD19CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:46:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <418ebcba5700419ea957ef3bf7392b19@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:48:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: freebsd is also probably running ufs with soft updates turned on "For metadata intensive benchmarks this improves performance by more than a factor of two when compared to the conventional syncronous write approach" see hget http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~ganger/papers/CSE-TR-254-95/CSE-TR-254-95.ps | page m From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:52:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19747 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:52:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19715 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:52:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:52:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 40C0619E36; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:52:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0CA319D4C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:52:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B86319D4C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:51:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (p9auth.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B720B19CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:51:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <503d190cb9a4472806f90bd0fdde7772@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 01:51:52 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: There's no great mystery to the name `wren'; there was a line of SCSI disks at the time (ca. 1990) called Wren I, Wren II, Wren III, etc., I think made by Fujitsu, who earlier made the Eagle, Super-Eagle (a.k.a. the Super-Turkey), Swallow, etc. So `wren' just denotes a SCSI disk. Is your machine on a UPS? If not, all bets are off after a power failure; if so, it shouldn't even notice a short power failure. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:55:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19865 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:55:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19860 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:55:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:55:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF9D019E32; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:55:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 241E419E23; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:55:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DBEC19D4C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:54:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38D8819CDB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:54:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i239pPki097877 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:51:25 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i239pPr5097876 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:51:25 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030951.i239pPr5097876@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: <418ebcba5700419ea957ef3bf7392b19@juice.thebigchoice.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:51:25 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > freebsd is also probably running ufs with soft updates turned on No, it is not probable. I was testing with soft updates turned off. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:57:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19966 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:57:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19962 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:57:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:57:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6732419E1B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B67E19E34; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 574D219E1B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCA9419CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:56:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i239s1ki097893 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:54:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i239s1Lc097892 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:54:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403030954.i239s1Lc097892@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:54:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Is your machine on a UPS? If not, all bets are off after a power > failure; if so, it shouldn't even notice a short power failure. > My machine is on UPS, but the power was off for more than UPS could hold. Here in Armenia, it is not a rare occasion. But if I just turn it off with power button, FreeBSD comes up just fine after intensive disk writes just before poweroff; and Plan9 always shows the same behaviour -- endless wrenwrite messages on console, untill I reboot from CD and do nothing. This has something to do with the hardware state not properly initialized. From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:58:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20021 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:58:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20017 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:58:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:58:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7FD8719E47; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:58:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F183419E2B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:58:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7277719E42; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0334119E23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4147 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 09:57:16 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 09:57:16 -0000 Message-ID: <00ce01c40106$141f8ca0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <54a5d2b7c9943cc97e6216deb310b2a1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:42:23 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: wise man ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kenji Okamoto" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel > >>object-oriented design is the roman numerals of computing. > > > > Would you care to expand on that? > > Just from my guess, it looks fancier to someone, however, it solves no > essencial problem. ☺ > > Kenji From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:59:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20069 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:59:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20065 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:59:01 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:59:01 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 614C219E2B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:58:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60A1B19E48; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:58:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA4E919E23; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CC1CC19E23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4232 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 09:57:18 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 09:57:18 -0000 Message-ID: <00cf01c40106$154b1450$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <54a5d2b7c9943cc97e6216deb310b2a1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <009a01c400e0$073a6bc0$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:49:03 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: actually ir was an april fools thing. if you set english ... then you would get stylish pids Four hundred and fourteen. tho i think some of the 'vi' messages were funnier. must have been the nine schooners. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 4:26 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel > > Just from my guess, it looks fancier to someone, however, it solves no > > essencial problem. ☺ > > roman numerals were all very fine for writing down numbers, but were > a nightmare to do mathematics with. this was due to their awful > representation. > > brucee did once add roman numbers to csh. you could: > > set roman > > and it would spit roman numerals where it thought it needed > to spit numbers. iirc, history was one example. From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 18:59:15 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20085 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 18:59:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20081 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 18:59:14 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 18:59:14 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D63B519E38; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:59:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 334FC19E59; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:58:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A35719E46; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C345A19E2B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 04:57:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4298 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 09:57:20 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 09:57:20 -0000 Message-ID: <00d001c40106$166efae0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403030810.i238AFrb097441@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:55:56 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i would love to have an OS that doesn't tell you that the disk is crook as rookie. but call me young and willing. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tolpin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2004 7:10 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > > > When I've seen wrenwrite complaints, it has always been due to > > about-to-fail disks. But don't know if that's your case. It was long > > ago. > > > > Unlikely. FreeBSD runs for several hours under fs stress test > without any slightest sign of a problem. On the same hardware From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 19:04:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20404 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 19:04:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20400 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 19:04:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 19:04:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DC8A19E5C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:04:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9ED519E45; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:04:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92D2319E3E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4566619E45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:03:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23A0pki097957 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:00:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23A0pYN097956 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:00:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031000.i23A0pYN097956@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <00d001c40106$166efae0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:00:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i would love to have an OS that doesn't tell you that > the disk is crook as rookie. but call me young > and willing. FreeBSD does report any failures with the disk, but all reports are about filesystem inconsistencies, none about hw failures. Plan9 is not telling that the disk has a failure. It falls in an endless loop leaving me no chance to take an action. I am just asking what can I do to pin the bug down. From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 19:34:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23594 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 19:34:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23581 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 19:34:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 19:34:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94FC019E66; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:34:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6504219E5F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:34:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A48919E4B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80C4619E42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:33:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2e632effdb0f17afeb68ae013ca57c67@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: <72f57bf60029eba0ac90b0d179e174a9@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:35:52 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > presumably because rwm and dma might be touchy on some chipsets(?) I have a controller that doesn't like 'dma on' in my old pentium m From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 19:38:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23763 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 19:38:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23758 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 19:38:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 19:38:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9469819E52; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:38:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82EA819E5B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:38:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E2CE619E59; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:37:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 631DF19E4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:37:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <200403030954.i239s1Lc097892@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:39:24 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But if I just turn it off with power button, FreeBSD comes up just fine after intensive disk writes just before poweroff; I wouldn't rely on that feature if I were you. m From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 19:46:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24252 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 19:46:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24248 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 19:46:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 19:46:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 587BF19E67; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:46:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BADC219E5B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:46:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC35219E67; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:45:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDE7119E69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:45:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23Ah5ki098973 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:43:05 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23Ah5dT098972 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:43:05 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031043.i23Ah5dT098972@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:43:05 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > But if I just turn it off with power button, FreeBSD comes up just fine after intensive disk writes just before poweroff; > > I wouldn't rely on that feature if I were you. > I do not rely on this feature. I properly do shutdown on all my servers and terminals, and my file server's uptime is more than year now at home. But I cannot allocate a 2KWh UPS to every computer; and sometimes computers loose power. After this accident, I must be able to repair the file system, either automatically, or manually,. Plan9 has a bug that puts it into endless loop on my hardware after reboot without fshalt. I am asking where to look at to fix the bug. David Tolpin From rm@hamnavoe.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 19:48:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24322 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 19:48:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24318 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 19:48:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 19:48:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B0C819E7D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:48:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3722419E76; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:48:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8EC3A19E7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:47:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E907319E73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:47:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00388ef15ab403f2399f0563164fa422@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <200403031000.i23A0pYN097956@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 10:47:02 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > How to boot from CD and check filesystem? If you've booted Plan 9 from the Plan 9 distribution CD, you should be able to do: disk/kfs -f/dev/sdC0/fs disk/kfscmd 'check r' Replace "sdC0" with the name of your kfs disk device. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 20:22:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26763 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 20:22:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26759 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 20:22:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 20:22:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFFE319E82; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:22:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED82719E6F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:22:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2995019E81; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4966E19BB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23BJ0ki099130 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:19:00 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23BJ0bY099129 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:19:00 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031119.i23BJ0bY099129@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <00388ef15ab403f2399f0563164fa422@hamnavoe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:19:00 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > How to boot from CD and check filesystem? > > If you've booted Plan 9 from the Plan 9 distribution CD, you should > be able to do: > > disk/kfs -f/dev/sdC0/fs > disk/kfscmd 'check r' I had tried that before, and probably misspelled something. Worked this time. Does not report any errors, just finishes smoothly. Powercycling -> endless wrenwrite i/o error messages -> booting from CD -> 'check r' no errors rebooting from sdC0 normal. Just booting from CD and immediately rebooting helps as well. What can be the cause? From lucio@proxima.alt.za Wed Mar 3 23:47:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 20:28:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27048 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 20:28:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27043 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 20:28:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 20:28:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDB9919E8D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:28:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4961419E88; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:28:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D7D3419E84; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:27:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B3EB19DF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:27:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i23BMYW20036 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:22:38 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <86d7c718c6dadec0e726d6af0614d49c@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403031119.i23BJ0bY099129@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:25:51 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What can be the cause? You'll have to tell us something about your hardware. As you have no doubt gathered by now, no one here has experienced the exact problem you encountered. In my experience, the best person to deal with it is Jim McKie (sp?) . But it may be something simple or something, once investigated, that others with knowledge of the hardware understand better. Would it be SCSI drives you're dealing with? ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 20:38:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27843 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 20:38:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27839 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 20:38:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 20:38:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AEC2E19E95; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:38:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56B6319DF3; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:38:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C72819E8F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:37:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1964919E8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:37:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23BYcki099221 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:34:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23BYcZq099220 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:34:38 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031134.i23BYcZq099220@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <86d7c718c6dadec0e726d6af0614d49c@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:34:38 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Jim McKie (sp?) . But it may be something > simple or something, once investigated, that others with knowledge of > the hardware understand better. > > Would it be SCSI drives you're dealing with? No. It is IDE. cpu% cat /dev/sdC0/ctl inquiry IBM-DTLA-307015 config 045A capabilities 2F00 dma 00550020 dmactl 00550020 rwm 16 rwmctl 16 geometry 29336832 512 16383 16 63 cpu% cat /dev/kmesg cpu0: 798MHz GenuineIntel PentiumIII/Xeon (cpuid: AX 0x0683 DX 0x383FBFF) ELCR: 0C20 #l0: i82557: 10Mbps port 0x1400 irq 5: 0002A5561D54 Turning dma or rwm on or off before powercycling does not change the picture. David From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 20:39:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27927 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 20:39:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27919 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 20:39:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 20:39:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E9DF19E9A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:39:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B30519C1C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:39:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47A0819E8C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:38:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8F8619DF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:38:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9bd008d2b84df83f80ad7c7c35867818@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <200403031043.i23Ah5dT098972@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:37:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>Plan9 has a bug that puts it into endless loop on my hardware >>after reboot without fshalt. I am asking where to look at to >>fix the bug. quite right. if you can recompile a kernel while the system is up, and run that, you could try adding code to /sys/src/9/pc/sdata.c to atainterrupt (say) to help diagnose the i/o error more precisely. "i/o error" isn't much help as you've discovered. there might already be debugging code that can be switched on. (i did have a very quick look at it myself but i didn't see anything just right for this case, but i might easily have missed it.) round about here, say: if(status & Err) drive->error = inb(cmdport+Error); i suspect the error might happen much earlier, before it gets to generate an interrupt, but that should become apparent if you see no error output from that point. just a print() of the status might do. i suspect the controller ends up in a state where its registers don't look right to the driver, or indeed where the controller needs a bit of a whack from the driver after the power cycling, in which case it probably can't generate IO at all and it's (perhaps) timing out the command. it's interesting that it's apparently only wrenwrite not wrenread that generates errors (or i missed something). that in itself might help pinpoint the problem. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:28:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32161 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:28:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32157 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:28:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:28:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3224019EC9; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:28:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BAAA019EC0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:28:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C112719EA7; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:27:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DEB819EAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <488850-1079>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:27:19 -0500 Message-ID: <00e101c4011a$9b442b50$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:25:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i was out at Bletchley Park on sunday [2nd visit] and took some 50 shots. if anyone's interested: http://www.insultant.net/uk/BP2004 -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:33:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32702 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:33:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32697 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:33:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:33:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C552A19CA5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0261419CC6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:33:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 434B219E8C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:32:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2069E19CC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:32:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3692933-4726>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:31:36 -0500 Message-ID: <010301c4011b$34a415d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <863eb8249b7a225354cc16f300bbf235@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: advantages of limbo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:29:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > no, no. I meant none *positively* uses Plan 9 a lot. :) i wondered if there was a pun in there ;) From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:35:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 416 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:35:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 410 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:35:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:35:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D16F19D3C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:35:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C6BE19EBE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:35:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 852F319D3C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:34:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6508D19C3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311591-11415>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:33:51 -0500 Message-ID: <010c01c4011b$84bbc720$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403030757.i237v1Sr097380@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:31:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > after a power failure, I'm getting repeating lines with > I/O error: wrenwrite http://www.insultant.net/uk/BP2004/DSC00558.JPG btw: the BP shots are un-retouched, just rotated. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:44:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1161 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:44:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1157 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:44:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:44:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 567F019ED2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:44:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3532C19EC7; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:44:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CDF9019EC5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABF8F19EBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:43:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3703047-4724>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:42:59 -0500 Message-ID: <017701c4011c$ca7565e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <54a5d2b7c9943cc97e6216deb310b2a1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <009a01c400e0$073a6bc0$67844051@SOMA> <00cf01c40106$154b1450$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:41:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > must have been the nine schooners. yeah, probably those IX beverages. careful man, there's a beverage here -- the dude From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:45:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1246 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:45:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1242 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:45:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:45:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F8E719EA0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:45:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C221D19E6F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:45:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D91419EC6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:44:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4255519EC8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:44:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23CJtki099328 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:19:55 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23CJtpW099327 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:19:55 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031219.i23CJtpW099327@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <9bd008d2b84df83f80ad7c7c35867818@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:19:55 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > round about here, say: > if(status & Err) > drive->error = inb(cmdport+Error); > > i suspect the error might happen much earlier, before it gets to > generate an interrupt, but that should become apparent if you > see no error output from that point. just a print() of the status > might do. i suspect the controller ends up in a state where its > registers don't look right to the driver, or indeed where the > controller needs a bit of a whack from the driver after the power cycling, > in which case it probably can't generate IO at all and it's (perhaps) 1) I have added print("status=%d\n",status) which during normal boot displays status=81 occasionally. During wrenwrite loop the point is not reached. 2) I then added a call to print("atainterrupt\n") at the top of atainterrupt(). The result has been that the computer boots with this kernel (after a few minutes of course) and does not with kernel without that 'brake'. Does it mean it is something about timeouts? I'll continute investigating. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:47:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1497 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:47:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1492 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:47:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:47:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2C55C19ED7; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:47:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 327B019E6E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:47:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69AE819E6F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:46:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 342E819C1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:46:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311739-11410>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:46:02 -0500 Message-ID: <018d01c4011d$37c05f10$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:44:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I wouldn't rely on that feature if I were you. if it's the FFS (apart from the appalling design) there's redundancy and no doubt bad block mapping. it only took 'em 10 years to get it right ... for some value of 'right'. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 21:50:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1639 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 21:50:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1635 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 21:50:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 21:50:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B677F19EDE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:50:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F9F119E6E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:50:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3988719E6F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:49:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03F3D19C1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:49:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311356-11411>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:48:33 -0500 Message-ID: <019601c4011d$91acd940$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403031043.i23Ah5dT098972@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:46:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i have a cunning plan, my lord: a screwdriver, sticky tape, adb, dd and a magtape From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 23:47:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:00:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2794 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:00:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2790 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:00:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:00:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F224119EE3; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0327B19EDC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:00:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B1F519ED1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:59:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D17A19E6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:59:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxVXS011981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:31 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxVq4007209 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxUfQ032562 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:30 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:30 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > please consider using a modern micro kernel as example of a micro > kernel. you would not want me to use multics as the one true monolithic > kernel, would you :-) example? I have not seen that much fundamental change in the idea. I'll pick a modern one if you want. ron From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:06:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3274 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3270 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8240719EE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3043919E65; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:06:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D12819EDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:05:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23DE119E9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:05:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23D5eXS013780 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:05:40 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23D5dtQ029131 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:05:40 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23D5dfQ032754 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:05:39 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Subject: [9fans] microkernels Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:05:39 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: are they the O-O of the OS world? Always the promises ... ron From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:11:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3649 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3642 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:11:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:11:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6982119E55; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C75619E55; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:11:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 06E2519EE2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:10:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12B7919E55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:10:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bdeffmjbfdaiwcvmtqqspmmcbq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:10:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bdeffmjbfdaiwcvmtqqspmmcbq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit L4 --upas-bdeffmjbfdaiwcvmtqqspmmcbq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Wed Mar 3 14:00:51 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3891319EE0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:00:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0327B19EDC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:00:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B1F519ED1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:59:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D17A19E6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 07:59:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxVXS011981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:31 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxVq4007209 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23CxUfQ032562 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:30 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 05:59:30 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Bengt Kleberg wrote: > please consider using a modern micro kernel as example of a micro > kernel. you would not want me to use multics as the one true monolithic > kernel, would you :-) example? I have not seen that much fundamental change in the idea. I'll pick a modern one if you want. ron --upas-bdeffmjbfdaiwcvmtqqspmmcbq-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:22:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4347 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:22:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4343 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:22:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:22:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12FB319EE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:22:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A82819EC6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:22:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE4DD19EC7; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:21:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79BE919EC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:21:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23DLPXS016655 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:25 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23DLPq4010977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:25 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i23DLPfQ000717 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:25 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 06:21:24 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > L4 thanks. Looks interesting, although I note that what people run on top of it in one case is ... Linux. But the single address space os thing looks interesting. Nice to see one of them again (Data General AOS/VS did this in the early 80s). ron From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:34:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5357 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:34:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5352 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:34:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:34:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 684A919EF7; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:34:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6524D19EE6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:34:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3171619EED; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:33:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7ED1C19ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:33:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:38:42 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: this paper goes well with the benchmarking paper referred to earlier, i think: http://i30www.ira.uka.de/research/documents/l4ka/irreproducible-benchmarks.pdf From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:42:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5820 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:42:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5816 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:42:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:42:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27F4B19E83; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B66719F04; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:42:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 932C119F31; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:41:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 864F519F0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:41:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <200403031119.i23BJ0bY099129@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:41:39 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 3 06:22:36 EST 2004, dvd@davidashen.net wrote: > > > How to boot from CD and check filesystem? > > > > If you've booted Plan 9 from the Plan 9 distribution CD, you should > > be able to do: > > > > disk/kfs -f/dev/sdC0/fs > > disk/kfscmd 'check r' > > I had tried that before, and probably misspelled something. Worked > this time. Does not report any errors, just finishes smoothly. > > Powercycling -> endless wrenwrite i/o error messages -> > booting from CD -> 'check r' no errors > rebooting from sdC0 normal. > > Just booting from CD and immediately rebooting helps as well. > > What can be the cause? What type of discs are they, ATA, SCSI, etc? Are they set to spin up automatically when power is applied? From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:49:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6083 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:49:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6079 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:49:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:49:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0541319EF0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:49:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89C5319EDF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:49:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E067919EDF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:48:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 899D519AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:47:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23DjNki099746 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:45:23 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23DjNmG099745 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:45:23 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031345.i23DjNmG099745@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:45:23 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > What type of discs are they, ATA, SCSI, etc? ATA. cpu% cat /dev/sdC0/ctl inquiry IBM-DTLA-307015 config 045A capabilities 2F00 dma 00550020 dmactl 00550020 rwm 16 rwmctl 16 geometry 29336832 512 16383 16 63 > Are they set to spin up automatically when power is applied? I do not know. What are other options if I boot from it? I am booting, see kfs...version...time... and then wrenwrite: i/o error many times. If I put enough debugging output into the kernel's atainterrupt, the kernel is able to boot. David From forsyth@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 22:54:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6585 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 22:54:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6575 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 22:54:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 22:54:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B42B119EC6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:54:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33A3B19DFC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:54:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 594F819EE2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:53:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4229719EC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:53:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6790eed7dc818630a41741d19d179dff@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403031345.i23DjNmG099745@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:58:52 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Are they set to spin up automatically when power is applied? >I do not know. What are other options if I boot from it? it's usually selected by a jumper on the drive itself. From lucio@proxima.alt.za Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:00:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7171 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:00:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7166 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:00:57 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:00:57 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF8EF19EEF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BF6319DFC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:00:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3844C19EDF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:59:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2082619CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:59:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i23Dt7W26272 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:55:08 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <6790eed7dc818630a41741d19d179dff@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:58:24 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>> Are they set to spin up automatically when power is applied? >>I do not know. What are other options if I boot from it? > > it's usually selected by a jumper on the drive itself. But not the avarage ATA, at least not the ones I'm familiar with. Plus David makes it clear the system has booted at the time the error occurs, so unless the drive is actual _spun_down_... I imagine though it's the first write, although, again, you won't get the progress messages in that sequence unless the disk has been checked and, in the case of a power failure, it usually takes a while to get past the "check". ++L From forsyth@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:03:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7473 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:03:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7469 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:03:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:03:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 00E3919F01; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:03:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C223B19EF6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:03:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D517019EFC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:02:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B86F19CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:02:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:07:28 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>But not the avarage ATA, at least not the ones I'm familiar with. sorry, my mistake. i work too much with SCSI drives ... From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:08:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8024 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:08:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8020 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:08:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:08:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19EEA19F0B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:08:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E01519EFF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:08:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 87A8419EF6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:07:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7665419EFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:07:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23E4cki099961 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:04:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23E4cxN099960 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:04:38 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031404.i23E4cxN099960@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:04:38 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>But not the avarage ATA, at least not the ones I'm familiar with. > > sorry, my mistake. i work too much with SCSI drives ... > That was my thought too. SCSI drives can be started by a command; but ATA drives start when powered, aren't way? But in assumption that I am wrong I've opened the box, unplugged the data cable and turned power on. It started instantly. David From lucio@proxima.alt.za Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:16:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8499 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:16:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8495 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:16:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:16:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1BE719EFC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:16:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 892F419E4B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:16:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94C0419B20; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:15:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE61B19A07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i23EApW26994 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:10:52 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <77eaf89537588bed0b74536050530ebc@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403031404.i23E4cxN099960@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:14:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > That was my thought too. SCSI drives can be started by a command; > but ATA drives start when powered, aren't way? But in assumption > that I am wrong I've opened the box, unplugged the data cable and > turned power on. It started instantly. There is power-saving mode, and they do stop turning. So I presume there is a command to start them up again. But I don't think that's it. I think you should dump as much of the status of the drive controller as the device driver allows at the first encounter with the error, somebody here may (Christopher Nielsen, I seem to remember, did the 48-bit extensions to ATA) be able to identify what is going out of kilter. What might also hep would be to try an old kernel, say a year old, see if it has the same symptoms. ++L From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:24:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8919 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:24:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8915 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:24:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:24:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4385B19F12; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:24:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C4C119ED0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:24:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23D2919EF2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:23:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C74419EA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:23:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <77eaf89537588bed0b74536050530ebc@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:23:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you're putting in debugging code, try putting it in port/devsd.c:sdbio() to figure out which of the Eio's is the problem. There's code there for dealing with initial drive conditions, etc. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 3 23:47:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:28:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9334 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:28:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9324 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:28:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:28:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9DF4519F10; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7B9719F08; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:28:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3157019EFF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:27:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D36F19ED0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:27:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23EOlki000233 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:24:47 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23EOlox000232 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:24:47 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031424.i23EOlox000232@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:24:47 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If you're putting in debugging code, try putting it in port/devsd.c:sdbio() > to figure out which of the Eio's is the problem. There's code there for dealing > with initial drive conditions, etc. > I'll do, many thanks. I a few hours, have to go. The problem is that I need more time to understand how the parts are interrelated in the kernel. The problem goes away when debugging slows down the process, so I cannot just dump everything. David From dfawcus@cisco.com Wed Mar 3 23:47:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 3 23:42:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10505 invoked by uid 1020); 3 Mar 2004 23:42:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10500 invoked from network); 3 Mar 2004 23:42:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 3 Mar 2004 23:42:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A13A319F15; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:42:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5353519F02; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:42:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0DBEA19EDF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:41:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E13319EB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:41:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 03 Mar 2004 06:48:21 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i23Ef51v018318 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:41:06 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id OAA11804 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:41:32 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Message-ID: <20040303144132.A24781@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <200403031404.i23E4cxN099960@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200403031404.i23E4cxN099960@adat.davidashen.net>; from dvd@davidashen.net on Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 06:04:38PM +0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:41:32 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 06:04:38PM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > That was my thought too. SCSI drives can be started by a command; > but ATA drives start when powered, aren't way? I believe there is a config option (command) that will change ATA disks such that they subsequently require a command to start. i.e. they power up in the powersave mode, and need the normal 'leave power save mode' command to get them going. Though I also believe the command (feature set subset if I recall) is optional anyway. (I spent too long working on ATA disk drivers ~ 8 years ago) DF From martin@parvat.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 01:12:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17764 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 01:12:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17760 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 01:12:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 01:12:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 20CCF19F09; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A48A319C68; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:12:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63EC919F04; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:11:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.183]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40FD919EF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:11:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.205] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AyYxc-0000m8-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 17:11:04 +0100 Received: from [219.65.134.240] (helo=vayu) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AyYxb-0005lv-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 17:11:04 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-Id: <20040303171048.47dabcb9.martin@parvat.com> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Subject: [9fans] Another neat box? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:10:48 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Does anyone know anything more about the new Linksys "network disk controller" mentioned on: http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/69/35887.html ? Supposedly, it has a 10/100/1000 Ethernet interface, 2 USB ports (for disks), and runs Linux - all for 80 pounds. Linksys have, I believe, been fairly open about some other devices, so I wonder if the Linux bit could be changed? It seems too good for the price quoted, although I don't see, in principle, why this price level shouldn't be achievable for a device made in consumer quantities. The other devices are also interesting, but less obviously re-targetable. Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited http://www.parvat.com From panik@miniclip.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 01:29:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19525 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 01:29:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19521 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 01:29:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 01:29:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D375319E27; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:29:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04E1B19E81; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:29:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7437719B41; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:28:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (cpc1-hink1-4-0-cust116.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.5.201.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C1BA719AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:28:10 -0500 (EST) From: panik@miniclip.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="31158444" Message-Id: <20040303162810.C1BA719AB6@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] stolen Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:28:07 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.4 required=5.0 tests=MICROSOFT_EXECUTABLE, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --31158444 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) Found virus WORM_NETSKY.B in file ranking.txt.pif The uncleanable file ranking.txt.pif is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virG1mUSV. If you have questions, contact administrator. --------------------------------------------------------- --31158444 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit see you --31158444 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) ranking.txt.pif is removed from here because it contains a virus. --------------------------------------------------------- --31158444-- From forsyth@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 01:34:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20017 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 01:34:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20012 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 01:34:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 01:34:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7FCDD19CFE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEAF119C69; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A50BB19EA9; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39D6D19C69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:33:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4aacec18de3514edaa36912c2409d27d@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Another neat box? From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: <20040303171048.47dabcb9.martin@parvat.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:38:24 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the nice thing about each new device running linux is that it's another device on which one could run something else. sometimes, though, there are binary drivers. From lucho@ionkov.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:35 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 01:35:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20031 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 01:35:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20027 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 01:35:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 01:35:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6041E19EFF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:35:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B8F1919EF4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:35:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F83719C3B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C38119EAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <200403031634280130058dkbe>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:34:29 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id E4CAF4622BF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Hi, I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the BIOS has panel information defined. I didn't test it for resolutions different than the default for the display. I am attaching the two files that are changed. You need the rest from http://mapage.noos.fr/phillipe.anel/plan9rxxx.html. The driver does not support DFP panels, only LCD. I don't have DFP, so I didn't bother to add support for something that I can't test. BTW, is there any reason for this driver to not be included in the distribution? Thanks, Lucho --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="radeon.c" #include #include #include #include "pci.h" #include "vga.h" #include "radeon.h" #include "radeon_pciids.h" static int debug = 0; #define DBGPRINT if (debug) print /* *********************************************** */ enum { Kilo = 1024, Mega = (Kilo*Kilo), }; enum { DISPLAY_NONE, DISPLAY_CRT, DISPLAY_FP, DISPLAY_LCD, }; /* *********************************************** */ typedef struct Radeon Radeon; struct Radeon { ulong mmio; Pcidev* pci; uchar* bios; ulong fbsize; int display_type; ulong ovr_clr; ulong ovr_wid_top_bottom; ulong ovr_wid_left_right; ulong ov0_scale_cntl; ulong subpic_cntl; ulong viph_control; ulong i2c_cntl_1; ulong rbbm_soft_reset; ulong cap0_trig_cntl; ulong cap1_trig_cntl; ulong gen_int_cntl; ulong bus_cntl; ulong crtc_gen_cntl; ulong crtc_ext_cntl; ulong dac_cntl; ulong crtc_h_total_disp; ulong crtc_h_sync_strt_wid; ulong crtc_v_total_disp; ulong crtc_v_sync_strt_wid; ulong crtc_pitch; ulong crtc_offset; ulong crtc_offset_cntl; ulong htotal_cntl; ulong surface_cntl; int type; ulong fp_horz_stretch; ulong fp_vert_stretch; ulong fp_crtc_h_total_disp; ulong fp_crtc_v_total_disp; ulong fp_h_sync_strt_wid; ulong fp_v_sync_strt_wid; ulong fp_gen_cntl; ulong lvds_gen_cntl; // inited from rom ushort reference_freq, reference_div, xclk; ulong max_pll_freq, min_pll_freq; ulong pll_output_freq; ulong feedback_div; ulong dot_clock_freq; ulong post_div; ulong ppll_ref_div; ulong ppll_div_3; // panel info int xres, yres; int valid; int clock; int hOver_plus, hSync_width, hblank; int vOver_plus, vSync_width, vblank; int pwr_delay; int use_bios_dividers; int ref_divider; int post_divider; int fbk_divider; int hAct_high, vAct_high; }; /* from io.c */ extern char* readbios(long len, long offset); /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon300_workaround(Radeon* radeon); static void radeon_get_bios_panel_info(Radeon* radeon); static void OUTREG8(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, uchar val) { ((uchar*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0] = val; } static void OUTREG(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val) { ((ulong*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0] = val; } static ulong INREG(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset) { ulong data; data = ((ulong*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0]; return data; } static void OUTREGP(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val, ulong mask) { ulong tmp; tmp = INREG(radeon, offset); tmp &= mask; tmp |= val; OUTREG(radeon, offset, tmp); } static void OUTPLL(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val) { uchar tmp; tmp = (offset & 0x3f) | RADEON_PLL_WR_EN; OUTREG8(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, tmp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA, val); } static ulong INPLL(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset) { ulong data; OUTREG8(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, offset & 0x3f); data = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA); if (radeon->type & ATI_R300) radeon300_workaround(radeon); return data; } static void OUTPLLP(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val, ulong mask) { ulong tmp; tmp = INPLL(radeon, offset); tmp &= mask; tmp |= val; OUTPLL(radeon, offset, tmp); } static void radeon300_workaround(Radeon* radeon) { ulong save, tmp; save = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX); tmp = save & ~(0x3f | RADEON_PLL_WR_EN); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, tmp); tmp = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, save); USED(tmp); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_getbiosparams(Radeon* radeon) { ushort offset; ulong addr; uchar* bios; ushort pib; radeon->bios = nil; addr = 0xC0000; bios = (uchar*)readbios(0x10000, addr); if (bios[0] != 0x55 || bios[1] != 0xAA) { addr = 0xE0000; bios = (uchar*)readbios(0x10000, addr); if (bios[0] != 0x55 || bios[1] != 0xAA) { print("radeon: bios not found\n"); return; } } radeon->bios = bios; offset = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, RADEON_BIOS_START); pib = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, offset+0x30); radeon->reference_freq = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x0e); radeon->reference_div = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x10); radeon->min_pll_freq = RADEON_BIOS32(radeon, pib+0x12); radeon->max_pll_freq = RADEON_BIOS32(radeon, pib+0x16); radeon->xclk = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x08); DBGPRINT("radeon: bios=0x%08ulx offset=0x%ux\n", addr, offset); DBGPRINT("radeon: pll_info_block: 0x%ux\n", pib); DBGPRINT("radeon: reference_freq: %ud\n", radeon->reference_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: reference_div: %ud\n", radeon->reference_div); DBGPRINT("radeon: min_pll_freq: %uld\n", radeon->min_pll_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: max_pll_freq: %uld\n", radeon->max_pll_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: xclk: %ud\n", radeon->xclk); if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_LCD) { radeon_get_bios_panel_info(radeon); } } static void radeon_get_bios_panel_info(Radeon* radeon) { int fp_bios_start = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, 0x48); int fpofs = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fp_bios_start + 0x40); int i; if (!fpofs) { radeon->xres = radeon->yres = 0; return; } radeon->xres = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 25); radeon->yres = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 27); radeon->pwr_delay = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 44); if (radeon->pwr_delay>2000 || radeon->pwr_delay<=0) { radeon->pwr_delay = 2000; } radeon->ref_divider = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 46); radeon->post_divider = RADEON_BIOS8(radeon, fpofs + 48); radeon->fbk_divider = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 49); if (radeon->ref_divider != 0 && radeon->fbk_divider > 3) { radeon->use_bios_dividers = 1; } DBGPRINT("radeon: panel size: %dx%d\n", radeon->xres, radeon->yres); DBGPRINT("radeon: power delay: %d\n", radeon->pwr_delay); for(i = 0; i < 32; i++) { int x, y; int ofs = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 64 + i * 2); if (ofs == 0) { break; } x = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs); y = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs + 2); if (x==radeon->xres && y==radeon->yres) { radeon->hblank = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+17) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs + 19)) * 8; radeon->hOver_plus = ((RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+21) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+19) -1) * 8) & 0x7FFF; radeon->hSync_width = RADEON_BIOS8(radeon, ofs+23) * 8; radeon->vblank = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+24) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+26); radeon->vOver_plus = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+28) & 0x7ff) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+26); radeon->vSync_width = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+28) & 0xf800) >> 11; radeon->clock = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+9); radeon->hAct_high = 1; radeon->vAct_high = 1; return; } } radeon->xres = radeon->yres = 0; } /* *********************************************** */ static Pcidev* radeonpci(int* type) { static Pcidev *p = nil; struct pciids *ids; if (p != nil) return p; DBGPRINT("radeon: ATI Technologies Inc. " "Radeon [789]xxx drivers (v0.1)\n"); p = pcimatch(nil, ATI_PCIVID, 0); if (p == nil) return nil; for (ids = radeon_pciids; ids->did; ids++) { if (ids->did == p->did) { DBGPRINT("radeon: Found %s\n", ids->name); DBGPRINT("radeon: did:%04ux rid:%02ux\n", p->did, p->rid); if (type) *type = ids->type; return p; } } DBGPRINT("radeon: not found!\n"); return p = nil; } /* *********************************************** */ static void vga_disable(Vga* vga) { Ctlr* c; for(c = vga->link; c; c = c->link) if (strncmp(c->name, "vga", 3) == 0) { c->load = nil; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_snarf(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon *radeon; Pcidev *p; ulong mmio, tmp; int type; if (vga->private == nil) { vga_disable(vga); vga->private = alloc(sizeof(Radeon)); radeon = vga->private; p = radeonpci(&type); if (p == nil) error("%s: not found\n", ctlr->name); vgactlw("type", ctlr->name); mmio = segattach(0, "radeonmmio", 0, p->mem[2].size); if (mmio == ~0) error("%s: can't attach mmio segment\n", ctlr->name); DBGPRINT("radeon: mmio address: 0x%08ulx [size=0x%x]\n", mmio, p->mem[2].size); radeon->pci = p; radeon->type = type; radeon->mmio = mmio; } radeon = vga->private; radeon->fbsize = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CONFIG_MEMSIZE); vga->vmz = radeon->fbsize; DBGPRINT("radeon: frame buffer size=%uld [%uldMB]\n", radeon->fbsize, radeon->fbsize/Mega); tmp = INREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL); if (tmp & RADEON_FP_EN_TMDS) radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_FP; if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_NONE && radeon->type > ATI_MOBILITY) { if (INREG(radeon, RADEON_BIOS_4_SCRATCH) & 4 || INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL) & RADEON_LVDS_ON) { radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_LCD; } } if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_NONE) { radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_CRT; } DBGPRINT("radeon: display type: %d\n", radeon->display_type); radeon_getbiosparams(radeon); radeon->bus_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_BUS_CNTL); DBGPRINT("radeon: PPLL_CNTL=0x%08ulx\n", INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL)); if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT && radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_LCD) error("unsupported FP Display\n"); if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_LCD && radeon->xres == 0) { error("cannot find panel information\n"); } ctlr->flag |= Fsnarf; } /* *********************************************** */ static void options(Vga*, Ctlr* ctlr) { ctlr->flag |= Hlinear|Foptions; } /* *********************************************** */ static int radeondiv(int n, int d) { return (n + (d / 2)) / d; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_common_registers(Radeon* radeon) { radeon->ovr_clr = 0; radeon->ovr_wid_left_right = 0; radeon->ovr_wid_top_bottom = 0; radeon->ov0_scale_cntl = 0; radeon->subpic_cntl = 0; radeon->viph_control = 0; radeon->i2c_cntl_1 = 0; radeon->rbbm_soft_reset = 0; radeon->cap0_trig_cntl = 0; radeon->cap1_trig_cntl = 0; if (radeon->bus_cntl & RADEON_BUS_READ_BURST) radeon->bus_cntl |= RADEON_BUS_RD_DISCARD_EN; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_crtc_registers(Radeon* radeon, Mode* mode) { int format, dac6bit; int hsync_wid, vsync_wid; int hsync_start; int hTotal, hSyncStart, hSyncEnd, h_sync_pol; int vTotal, vSyncStart, vSyncEnd, v_sync_pol; int hsync_fudge, bpp; int hsync_fudge_crt[] = { 0x00, 0x12, 0x09, 0x09, 0x06, 0x05 }; int hsync_fudge_fp[] = { 2, 2, 0, 0, 5, 5, }; format = 0; bpp = 0; dac6bit = 0; switch (mode->z) { case 6: format = 2; dac6bit = 1; bpp = 8; break; case 8: format = 2; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 8; break; case 15: format = 3; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 16; break; case 16: format = 4; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 16; break; case 24: format = 5; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 24; break; case 32: format = 6; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 32; break; default: error("radeon: unsupported mode depth %d\n", mode->z); } if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { hsync_fudge = hsync_fudge_crt[format - 1]; } else { hsync_fudge = hsync_fudge_fp[format - 1]; } DBGPRINT("mode->z = %d (format = %d, bpp = %d, dac6bit = %s)\n", mode->z, format, bpp, dac6bit ? "true" : "false"); radeon->crtc_gen_cntl = RADEON_CRTC_EN | RADEON_CRTC_EXT_DISP_EN | (format << 8); radeon->crtc_ext_cntl = RADEON_VGA_ATI_LINEAR | RADEON_XCRT_CNT_EN; if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon->crtc_ext_cntl |= RADEON_CRTC_CRT_ON; radeon->crtc_gen_cntl |= mode->interlace ? RADEON_CRTC_INTERLACE_EN : 0; } else { radeon->crtc_gen_cntl &= ~(RADEON_CRTC_DBL_SCAN_EN | RADEON_CRTC_INTERLACE_EN); } radeon->dac_cntl = RADEON_DAC_MASK_ALL | RADEON_DAC_VGA_ADR_EN | (dac6bit ? 0 : RADEON_DAC_8BIT_EN); // ----------------------------------------------------------- if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { hTotal = mode->ht; hSyncStart = mode->shb; hSyncEnd = mode->ehb; h_sync_pol = mode->hsync; vTotal = mode->vt; vSyncStart = mode->vrs; vSyncEnd = mode->vre; v_sync_pol = mode->vsync; } else { hTotal = mode->x + radeon->hblank; hSyncStart = mode->x + radeon->hOver_plus; hSyncEnd = mode->x + radeon->hSync_width; h_sync_pol = !radeon->hAct_high; vTotal = mode->y + radeon->vblank; vSyncStart = mode->y + radeon->vOver_plus; vSyncEnd = mode->y + radeon->vSync_width; v_sync_pol = !radeon->vAct_high; mode->frequency = radeon->clock; // hack } radeon->crtc_h_total_disp = ((((hTotal / 8) - 1) & 0x3ff) | ((((mode->x / 8) - 1) & 0x1ff) << 16)); hsync_wid = (hSyncEnd - hSyncStart) / 8; if (! hsync_wid) hsync_wid = 1; if (hsync_wid > 0x3F) hsync_wid = 0x3F; hsync_start = hSyncStart - 8 + hsync_fudge; DBGPRINT("hsync_start=%d hsync_wid=%d hsync_fudge=%d\n", hsync_start, hsync_wid, hsync_fudge); radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid = ( (hsync_start & 0x1fff) | ((hsync_wid & 0x3f) << 16) | (h_sync_pol ? RADEON_CRTC_H_SYNC_POL : 0)); // ----------------------------------------------------------- radeon->crtc_v_total_disp = (((vTotal - 1) & 0xffff) | ((mode->y - 1) << 16)); vsync_wid = vSyncEnd - vSyncStart; if (! vsync_wid) vsync_wid = 1; radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid = ( ((mode->vrs - 1) & 0xfff) | ((vsync_wid & 0x1f) << 16) | (v_sync_pol ? RADEON_CRTC_V_SYNC_POL : 0)); // ----------------------------------------------------------- radeon->crtc_offset = 0; radeon->crtc_offset_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET_CNTL); radeon->crtc_pitch = ((mode->x * bpp) + ((bpp * 8) - 1)) / (bpp * 8); radeon->crtc_pitch |= radeon->crtc_pitch << 16; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_pll_registers(Radeon* radeon, ulong freq) { struct { int divider; int bitvalue; } *post_div, post_divs[] = { { 1, 0 }, { 2, 1 }, { 4, 2 }, { 8, 3 }, { 3, 4 }, { 16, 5 }, { 6, 6 }, { 12, 7 }, { 0, 0 } }; DBGPRINT("radeon: initpll: freq=%uld\n", freq); if (freq > radeon->max_pll_freq) freq = radeon->max_pll_freq; if (freq * 12 < radeon->min_pll_freq) freq = radeon->min_pll_freq / 12; for (post_div = &post_divs[0]; post_div->divider; ++post_div) { radeon->pll_output_freq = post_div->divider * freq; if (radeon->pll_output_freq >= radeon->min_pll_freq && radeon->pll_output_freq <= radeon->max_pll_freq) break; } radeon->dot_clock_freq = freq; radeon->feedback_div = radeondiv(radeon->reference_div * radeon->pll_output_freq, radeon->reference_freq); radeon->post_div = post_div->divider; DBGPRINT("dc=%uld, of=%uld, fd=%uld, pd=%uld\n", radeon->dot_clock_freq, radeon->pll_output_freq, radeon->feedback_div, radeon->post_div); if (radeon->use_bios_dividers) { radeon->ppll_ref_div = radeon->ref_divider; radeon->ppll_div_3 = radeon->fbk_divider | (radeon->post_divider << 16); } else { radeon->ppll_ref_div = radeon->reference_div; radeon->ppll_div_3 = (radeon->feedback_div | (post_div->bitvalue << 16)); } radeon->htotal_cntl = 0; radeon->surface_cntl = 0; } static void radeon_init_fp_registers(Radeon* radeon, Mode* mode) { int x = mode->x; int y = mode->y; if (x > radeon->xres) { x = radeon->xres; } if (y > radeon->yres) { y = radeon->yres; } radeon->fp_horz_stretch = ((radeon->xres - 1) / 8) << RADEON_HORZ_PANEL_SHIFT; radeon->fp_vert_stretch = (radeon->yres - 1) << RADEON_VERT_PANEL_SHIFT; if (x != radeon->xres) { unsigned int hRatio = radeondiv(x * RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_RATIO_MAX, radeon->xres); radeon->fp_horz_stretch = (((((unsigned long)hRatio) & RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_RATIO_MASK)) | (radeon->fp_horz_stretch & (RADEON_HORZ_PANEL_SIZE | RADEON_HORZ_FP_LOOP_STRETCH | RADEON_HORZ_AUTO_RATIO_INC))); radeon->fp_horz_stretch |= (RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_BLEND | RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_ENABLE); } radeon->fp_horz_stretch &= ~RADEON_HORZ_AUTO_RATIO; if (y != radeon->yres) { unsigned int vRatio = radeondiv(y * RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RATIO_MAX, radeon->yres); radeon->fp_vert_stretch = (((((unsigned long)vRatio) & RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RATIO_MASK)) | (radeon->fp_vert_stretch & (RADEON_VERT_PANEL_SIZE | RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RESERVED))); radeon->fp_vert_stretch |= (RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_BLEND | RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_ENABLE); } radeon->fp_vert_stretch &= ~RADEON_VERT_AUTO_RATIO_EN; radeon->fp_crtc_h_total_disp = (((radeon->hblank / 8) & 0x3ff) | (((x / 8) - 1) << 16)); radeon->fp_crtc_v_total_disp = (radeon->vblank & 0xffff) | ((y - 1) << 16); radeon->fp_h_sync_strt_wid = radeon->hOver_plus & 0x1fff | (radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid & (~ 0x1fff)); radeon->fp_v_sync_strt_wid = ((radeon->vOver_plus & 0xfff) | (radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid & (0xfff))); radeon->fp_gen_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL) & ~(RADEON_FP_SEL_CRTC2 | RADEON_FP_RMX_HVSYNC_CONTROL_EN | RADEON_FP_DFP_SYNC_SEL | RADEON_FP_CRT_SYNC_SEL | RADEON_FP_CRTC_LOCK_8DOT | RADEON_FP_USE_SHADOW_EN | RADEON_FP_CRTC_USE_SHADOW_VEND | RADEON_FP_CRT_SYNC_ALT); radeon->fp_gen_cntl |= (RADEON_FP_CRTC_DONT_SHADOW_VPAR | RADEON_FP_CRTC_DONT_SHADOW_HEND); radeon->fp_gen_cntl &= ~(RADEON_FP_FPON | RADEON_FP_TMDS_EN); radeon->lvds_gen_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL) | (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon* radeon; Mode* mode; radeon = vga->private; mode = vga->mode; DBGPRINT("radeon: monitor type = '%s'\n", mode->type); DBGPRINT("radeon: size = '%s'\n", mode->size); DBGPRINT("radeon: chan = '%s'\n", mode->chan); DBGPRINT("radeon: freq=%d deffreq=%d x=%d y=%d z=%d\n", mode->frequency, mode->deffrequency, mode->x, mode->y, mode->z); DBGPRINT("radeon: ht=%d shb=%d ehb=%d shs=%d ehs=%d hsync='%c'\n", mode->ht, mode->shb, mode->ehb, mode->shs, mode->ehs, mode->hsync ? mode->hsync : ' '); DBGPRINT("radeon: vt=%d vrs=%d vre=%d vsync='%c'\n", mode->vt, mode->vrs, mode->vre, mode->vsync ? mode->vsync : ' '); radeon_init_common_registers(radeon); radeon_init_crtc_registers(radeon, mode); if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon_init_fp_registers(radeon, mode); } radeon_init_pll_registers(radeon, mode->frequency / 10000); ctlr->flag |= (Finit|Ulinear); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_blank(Radeon* radeon) { switch (radeon->display_type) { case DISPLAY_LCD: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS, ~RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS); case DISPLAY_CRT: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS, ~(RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS)); break; } } static void radeon_unblank(Radeon* radeon) { switch (radeon->display_type) { case DISPLAY_LCD: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, 0, ~RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS); case DISPLAY_CRT: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, RADEON_CRTC_CRT_ON, ~(RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS)); break; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_common_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_CLR, radeon->ovr_clr); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_WID_LEFT_RIGHT, radeon->ovr_wid_left_right); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_WID_TOP_BOTTOM, radeon->ovr_wid_top_bottom); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OV0_SCALE_CNTL, radeon->ov0_scale_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_SUBPIC_CNTL, radeon->subpic_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_VIPH_CONTROL, radeon->viph_control); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_I2C_CNTL_1, radeon->i2c_cntl_1); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_GEN_INT_CNTL, radeon->gen_int_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CAP0_TRIG_CNTL, radeon->cap0_trig_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CAP1_TRIG_CNTL, radeon->cap1_trig_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_BUS_CNTL, radeon->bus_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_SURFACE_CNTL, radeon->surface_cntl); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_crtc_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_GEN_CNTL, radeon->crtc_gen_cntl); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, radeon->crtc_ext_cntl, ~(RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS)); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_DAC_CNTL, radeon->dac_cntl, RADEON_DAC_RANGE_CNTL | RADEON_DAC_BLANKING); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_H_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->crtc_h_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_H_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_V_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->crtc_v_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_V_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET, radeon->crtc_offset); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET_CNTL, radeon->crtc_offset_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_PITCH, radeon->crtc_pitch); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_pllwaitupd(Radeon* radeon) { int i; for (i = 0; i < 10000; i++) { ulong pllreg; pllreg = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV); if ((pllreg & RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_R) == 0) break; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_pllwriteupd(Radeon* radeon) { while (1) { ulong pllreg; pllreg = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV); if ((pllreg & RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_R) == 0) break; } OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_W, ~RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_W); } static void radeon_load_fp_registers(Radeon* radeon) { unsigned long lctl; OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_CRTC_H_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->fp_crtc_h_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_CRTC_V_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->fp_crtc_v_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_H_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->fp_h_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_V_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->fp_v_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_HORZ_STRETCH, radeon->fp_horz_stretch); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_VERT_STRETCH, radeon->fp_vert_stretch); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL, radeon->fp_gen_cntl); lctl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL); if ((lctl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON)) == (radeon->lvds_gen_cntl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON))) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl); } else { unsigned long pctl = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL, 0, ~RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL); if (! (lctl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON))) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl | RADEON_LVDS_BLON); } sleep(radeon->pwr_delay); // ms OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl); if (pctl) { OUTPLL(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL, pctl); } } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_pll_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_VCLK_ECP_CNTL, RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_CPUCLK, ~RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_MASK); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL, RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN, ~(RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN)); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, RADEON_PLL_DIV_SEL, ~RADEON_PLL_DIV_SEL); if (radeon->type & ATI_R300) { DBGPRINT("r300_workaround\n"); if (radeon->ppll_ref_div & R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_MASK) { /* When restoring console mode, use saved PPLL_REF_DIV * setting. */ OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, radeon->ppll_ref_div, 0); } else { /* R300 uses ref_div_acc field as real ref divider */ OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, (radeon->ppll_ref_div << R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_SHIFT), ~R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_MASK); } } else { OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, radeon->ppll_ref_div, ~RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV_MASK); } OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_DIV_3, radeon->ppll_div_3, ~RADEON_PPLL_FB3_DIV_MASK); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_DIV_3, radeon->ppll_div_3, ~RADEON_PPLL_POST3_DIV_MASK); radeon_pllwriteupd(radeon); radeon_pllwaitupd(radeon); OUTPLL(radeon, RADEON_HTOTAL_CNTL, radeon->htotal_cntl); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL, 0, ~(RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_SLEEP | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN)); if (debug) { Bprint(&stdout, "Wrote: 0x%08ulx 0x%08ulx 0x%08ulx (0x%08ulx)\n", radeon->ppll_ref_div, radeon->ppll_div_3, radeon->htotal_cntl, INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL)); Bprint(&stdout, "Wrote: rd=%uld, fd=%uld, pd=%uld\n", radeon->ppll_ref_div & RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV_MASK, radeon->ppll_div_3 & RADEON_PPLL_FB3_DIV_MASK, (radeon->ppll_div_3 & RADEON_PPLL_POST3_DIV_MASK) >> 16); } /* Let the clock to lock */ sleep(5); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_VCLK_ECP_CNTL, RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_PPLLCLK, ~RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_MASK); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon* radeon; radeon = (Radeon*) vga->private; radeon_blank(radeon); radeon_load_common_registers(radeon); radeon_load_crtc_registers(radeon); // if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon_load_fp_registers(radeon); // } radeon_load_pll_registers(radeon); radeon_unblank(radeon); // init palette [gamma] if (vga->mode->z > 8) { int i; OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_PALETTE_INDEX, 0); for (i = 0; i < 256; i++) OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_PALETTE_DATA, (i<<16)|(i<<8)|i); } ctlr->flag |= Fload; } /* *********************************************** */ static void dump(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon * radeon; USED(ctlr); radeon = (Radeon*) vga->private; USED(radeon); } /* *********************************************** */ Ctlr radeon = { "radeon", /* name */ radeon_snarf, /* snarf */ options, /* options */ radeon_init, /* init */ radeon_load, /* load */ dump, /* dump */ }; /* *********************************************** */ Ctlr radeonhwgc = { "radeonhwgc", /* name */ 0, /* snarf */ 0, /* options */ 0, /* init */ 0, /* load */ 0, /* dump */ }; --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="radeon_pciids.h" // ATI Technologies Inc #define ATI_PCIVID 0x1002 struct pciids { ushort did; int type; char* name; }; enum { ATI_R300, ATI_RV250, ATI_R250, ATI_RV200, ATI_R200, ATI_RV100, ATI_R100, ATI_MOBILITY, ATI_M6, ATI_M7, ATI_M9, }; struct pciids radeon_pciids[] = { // ATI_M6, LY // ATI_M6, LZ 0x4c57, ATI_M7, "Radeon Mobility M7 LW [Radeon Mobility 7500]", 0x4c58, ATI_M7, "Radeon RV200 LX [Mobility FireGL 7800 M7]", 0x4c59, ATI_M6, "Radeon Mobility M6 LY", 0x4c64, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Ld [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c65, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Le [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c66, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Lf [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c67, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Lg [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x5159, ATI_RV100, "Radeon RV100 QY [Radeon 7000/VE]", 0x515a, ATI_RV100, "Radeon RV100 QZ [Radeon 7000/VE]", 0x5144, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QD [Radeon 7200]", 0x5145, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QE", 0x5146, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QF", 0x5147, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QG", 0x5148, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QH [Radeon 8500]", 0x5149, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QI", 0x514a, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QJ", 0x514b, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QK", 0x514c, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QL [Radeon 8500 LE]", 0x514d, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QM [Radeon 9100]", 0x514e, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QN [Radeon 8500LE]", 0x514f, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QO [Radeon 8500LE]", 0x5168, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qh", 0x5169, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qi", 0x516a, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qj", 0x516b, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qk", 0x516c, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Ql", 0x5157, ATI_RV200, "Radeon RV200 QW [Radeon 7500]", 0x5158, ATI_RV200, "Radeon RV200 QX [Radeon 7500]", 0x4964, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Id [Radeon 9000]", 0x4965, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Ie [Radeon 9000]", 0x4966, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 If [Radeon 9000]", 0x4967, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Ig [Radeon 9000]", 0x4144, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AD [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4145, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AE [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4146, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AF [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4147, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AG [FireGL Z1/X1]", 0x4e44, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 ND [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e45, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NE [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e46, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NF [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e47, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NG [FireGL X1]", 0x4e64, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700 Pro] (Secondary)", 0x4e65, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700] (Secondary)", 0x4e66, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700] (Secondary)", 0x4e67, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [FireGL X1] (Secondary)", 0 }; --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6-- From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 4 08:02:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 01:37:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20204 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 01:37:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20200 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 01:37:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 01:37:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4BF619EF4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:37:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F15619EAF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6595319EB1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:36:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8FFD19C3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:36:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <56c387640b40367df37159745f4683e6@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:36:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Cool We'll add it to our local setup. thanks a lot. 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From contactkalister@spinfinder.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 02:27:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22837 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 02:27:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22833 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 02:27:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 02:27:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F25D119A31; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:27:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 593F619C54; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:27:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A300419B79; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:26:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 405F819A31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:26:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from spinfinder243.com (node1f6b2.a2000.nl [24.132.246.178]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with SMTP id 538E41B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:24:46 -0500 (EST) From: KALISTER MAUNDA [MISS] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="0c7a1093-c650-4657-9478-5bcda9910ff3" Message-Id: <20040303172446.538E41B54@neuromancer.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] Call Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: contactkalister@spinfinder.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 18:25:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=4.6 required=5.0 tests=MIME_BOUND_MANY_HEX, MSGID_FROM_MTA_BACKUP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: **** This is a multi-part message in MIME format --0c7a1093-c650-4657-9478-5bcda9910ff3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable KALISTER MAUNDA [MISS] EMAIL: infokalister_maunda@spinfinder.com DATE: 03 - 03 - 04 Greetings, How are you? 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Kindly delete if the content of the mail is not of interest to you. --0c7a1093-c650-4657-9478-5bcda9910ff3-- From a@9srv.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 02:58:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24518 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 02:58:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24514 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 02:58:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 02:58:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8729F19CBA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:58:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7660C19C17; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:58:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACE7B19C17; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:57:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.MCLNVA23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7688C19C84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:57:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9205ca16871eab803d2d34a76a347595@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:57:35 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: L7? "You made my..." ア From philo@privacy.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 03:21:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25659 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 03:21:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25654 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 03:21:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 03:21:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC4D019C9A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B600E19CAD; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:21:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2318519C83; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7E7119C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:20:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Ayayg-0005vD-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 18:20:18 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Subject: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:19:55 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. Got it installed and running (locally) yesterday... what next? (I don't feel like spending $150 for the manual) Philo From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 03:34:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26456 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 03:34:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26452 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 03:34:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 03:34:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CCC1919C66; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:34:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D1C119C2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:34:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B26919C4F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:33:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E6F519C66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:33:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0aa6967633c05fb51ab4f6473f5e734f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:33:06 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. > > Got it installed and running (locally) yesterday... > > what next? (I don't feel like spending $150 for the manual) > > Philo browse the web, play some music, watch a movie or two, play some games... :) From sah@softcardsystems.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 03:50:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27644 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 03:50:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27640 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 03:50:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 03:50:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D77619C9E; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:50:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9482C19BAA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:50:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7032919C3C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31A7119AAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23Ioqro002553 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:50:52 -0500 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:50:52 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 1) Right click on background and select new. 2) Click and hold right mouse button at top left of screen. 3) Sweep down to bottom right of screen. 4) Release right mouse button. 5) Type: man intro 6) Press enter. 7) read. 8) press down arrow. 9) goto 7 Further instructions upon completion. As proof of such, I will expect you to tell me where the 'copies of papers referenced in this manual' are stored in the filesystem. Yes, the quote is a hint. Oh - be careful not to get stuck in the endless loop above. Good luck, Sam On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, philo wrote: > I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. > > Got it installed and running (locally) yesterday... > > what next? (I don't feel like spending $150 for the manual) > > Philo > From g.pavelcak@comcast.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 04:01:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28183 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 04:01:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28179 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:01:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 04:01:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC3BA19CBC; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08FF019BAA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFEA919CE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:59:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19DE619CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:59:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from bsd.my.domain (h004005b2f1be.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.62.113.60]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004030318593501300dc91be>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:59:35 +0000 Received: from bsd.my.domain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i23IwPCJ001189 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:58:27 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp@bsd.my.domain) Received: (from gp@localhost) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id i23IwOLT001188 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:58:24 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp) From: Greg Pavelcak To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Message-ID: <20040303185823.GA1129@bsd.my.domain> Mail-Followup-To: Greg Pavelcak , 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.6i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:58:23 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 06:19:55PM +0000, philo wrote: > I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. > > Got it installed and running (locally) yesterday... > > what next? (I don't feel like spending $150 for the manual) > > Philo > Hello fellow newbie. Go into /sys/doc and start reading. Some of the Plan 9 docs are pretty esoteric, but they still make a good read. Frequent the Plan 9 web page. I don't have the address, but if you google for plan9 you'll get there. Once there, explore every link. Especially do frequent googling of comp.os.plan9 as questions arise. I hope I'll soon be knowledgeable enough to answer questions beyond pointing to docs, but there's a start. I think you'll find Plan 9 addictive. I am a long time FreeBSD user, in particular vi (well vim) and several different window managers, mostly icewm; but once I tried Plan 9, I kept finding myself myseriously drawn back to it. Acme does that to you. And, even though I'm not a programmer either, I just have a sense that it's a more elegant system. Finally, you've obviously already found this list. I've found the people here quite helpful. A little quirky, but helpful. One of the things that drew me to FreeBSD in the first place was that when I, an ordinary user, posted questions, I found I was getting answers from people who are actually writing the code! That's true here too. Good luck. Greg From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 04:12:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29067 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 04:12:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29063 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:12:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 04:12:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DF1719D2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E56D19D2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:12:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96EBB19CF0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:11:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 793A419CE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:11:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d19c138e3efdc1ffa7d0950dcae4ace@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20040303185823.GA1129@bsd.my.domain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:11:24 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > mostly icewm; but once I tried Plan 9, I kept finding myself > myseriously drawn back to it. Acme does that to you. And, even > though I'm not a programmer either, I just have a sense that it's a > more elegant system. it's rio's color palette that does it -- scientifically proven to put you in a more relaxed, zen state. things like web browsing, movies, music and IM can be abstracted (when and if they arrive) in a rio window and not impair the overall feel of the system. just keep the window small. there's a reason why links stores its configuration files in /tmp. andrey From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 04:16:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29415 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 04:16:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29400 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:16:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 04:16:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B1A819DF5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:16:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B96E19CF5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:16:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 303EF19D7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (24-6-182.wireless.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.6.182]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01D0B19CCF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:15:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1Aybpo-000Fug-UQ for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 14:15:12 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:48:56." <418ebcba5700419ea957ef3bf7392b19@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <61172.1078341308.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 14:15:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > "For metadata intensive benchmarks this improves performance by more than a f > actor of two when compared to the conventional syncronous write approach" > > hget http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~ganger/papers/CSE-TR-254-95/CSE-TR-254-95.ps except that extracting a 200MB file is anything but metadata intensive. From forsyth@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 4 08:02:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 04:24:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30015 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 04:24:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30011 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:24:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 04:24:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4DF3219D8C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:24:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89D9219CCB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:24:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D5F2B19CD1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:23:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0401D19C68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:23:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <04f8bb6e3856172ac18045959432989d@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ugfihjbxvofecckedihahwstve" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:28:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ugfihjbxvofecckedihahwstve Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit direct and indirect block pointers count as Bimm metadata to kfs, so those writes are synchronous and as slow as the device. --upas-ugfihjbxvofecckedihahwstve Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Wed Mar 3 19:21:17 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 71AD819DF2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D456219DD1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:16:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 303EF19D7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (24-6-182.wireless.lcs.mit.edu [18.24.6.182]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01D0B19CCF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:15:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1Aybpo-000Fug-UQ for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 14:15:12 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs performance In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 03 Mar 2004 09:48:56." <418ebcba5700419ea957ef3bf7392b19@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <61172.1078341308.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 14:15:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > "For metadata intensive benchmarks this improves performance by more than a f > actor of two when compared to the conventional syncronous write approach" > > hget http://www.ece.cmu.edu/~ganger/papers/CSE-TR-254-95/CSE-TR-254-95.ps except that extracting a 200MB file is anything but metadata intensive. --upas-ugfihjbxvofecckedihahwstve-- From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 04:49:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31601 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 04:49:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31597 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 04:49:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 04:49:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2294B19D1D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3653119C96; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:49:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0BAC19CE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:48:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D63F19C17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:48:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23JjVki053050 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:45:31 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23JjVpk053049 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:45:31 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403031945.i23JjVpk053049@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:45:31 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I have been able to compile dot from graphviz (and make it pass most tests); I hope neato will work too. Is it of general interest? What is the accepted way to deliver ports? David From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:00:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32312 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:00:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32308 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:00:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:00:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6416B19C91; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:00:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40F6D19CE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:00:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D01C119CCB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B25B19C84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 14:59:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e613fb4c42ebe7817a54975b41da43b@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403031945.i23JjVpk053049@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 12:59:50 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What is the accepted way to deliver ports? donate a hard drive to BL so they can put it on sources and create a /ports replica that we can all pull from. make sure it's all mkfiles and doesn't require ape/psh to be run just to get 'make' going (rewriting makefiles into mkfiles is an exercise in how things can be done right in one OS and wrong in another). andrey From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:12:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 446 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:12:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 441 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:12:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:12:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84A6319D64; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E764919CCB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:12:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7AF919CE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D02A19CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 18865CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:35 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Message-ID: <20040303201135.GA5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <86d7c718c6dadec0e726d6af0614d49c@proxima.alt.za> <200403031134.i23BYcZq099220@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403031134.i23BYcZq099220@adat.davidashen.net> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:35 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 03:34:38PM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > cpu% cat /dev/sdC0/ctl > inquiry IBM-DTLA-307015 > config 045A capabilities 2F00 dma 00550020 dmactl 00550020 rwm 16 rwmctl 16 > geometry 29336832 512 16383 16 63 Oh my, the dread Deathstar 75GXP. Before you go any further, I'd recommend downloading Hitachi's (formerly IBM's) Drive Fitness Test floppy image and run its "advanced" drive test a few times. Your disk may be about to go toes-up. http://www.hgst.com/hdd/support/download.htm (I understand that it's not giving you trouble under FreeBSD, but it could be that FreeBSD is masking or oblivious to a drive problem.) From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:12:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 454 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:12:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 449 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:12:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:12:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AD6919DF2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A93819D4C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:12:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F34019CCB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A3F719A97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:11:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23K8qki053151 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:08:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23K8qEd053150 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:08:52 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403032008.i23K8qEd053150@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz In-Reply-To: <1e613fb4c42ebe7817a54975b41da43b@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:08:52 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > donate a hard drive to BL so they can put it on sources and create a > /ports replica that we can all pull from. This is doable. > make sure it's all mkfiles and doesn't require ape/psh to be run just > to get 'make' going (rewriting makefiles into mkfiles is an exercise > in how things can be done right in one OS and wrong in another). It will take longer, and does not make much sense for graphviz, I am afraid. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:16:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 638 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:16:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 634 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:16:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:16:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 089FF19DE4; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:16:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04B5C19CE8; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:16:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AEB4219CD2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:15:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 697B219A97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:15:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <88a386cc922f703f432afb566ed42a38@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403032008.i23K8qEd053150@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:15:48 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It will take longer, and does not make much sense for graphviz, > I am afraid. it doesn't makes sense to rewrite it into something more sensible? puzzled. From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:26:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1138 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:26:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1134 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:26:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:26:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B083E19E0D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:26:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A93AE19C96; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:26:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D57B19CF0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:25:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BFE219A97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23KMhki053242 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:22:43 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23KMgR3053241 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:22:42 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403032022.i23KMgR3053241@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz In-Reply-To: <88a386cc922f703f432afb566ed42a38@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:22:42 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > It will take longer, and does not make much sense for graphviz, > > I am afraid. > > it doesn't makes sense to rewrite it into something more sensible? > > puzzled. Right now, graphviz is distributed by AT&T with autoconf's configure script, and (with few modifications to the result) it is used to compile it under APE. Changes to the source code are localized and the patches will hopefully be applicable to new releases too. Looking at the diff, I think it would make sense to incorporate the changes into the main distribution. Removing vowels from make would be a good excercise, but would require continuous maintenance of the port. Unless a different environment is written around the same algorithmic core to fit into Plan9 environment, it does not make much sense, I think. It's just a tool to draw graphs. It will not begin to draw better graphs when compiled with mk instead of make. David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:29:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1290 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:29:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1280 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:29:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:29:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7E5D19C24; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:29:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1A8F19E10; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:29:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7495019CD2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:28:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC8E919C24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:28:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23KPbki053271 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:25:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23KPb4Z053270 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:25:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403032025.i23KPb4Z053270@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite In-Reply-To: <20040303201135.GA5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:25:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Oh my, the dread Deathstar 75GXP. > > Before you go any further, I'd recommend downloading Hitachi's (formerly > IBM's) Drive Fitness Test floppy image and run its "advanced" drive test > a few times. Your disk may be about to go toes-up. > > http://www.hgst.com/hdd/support/download.htm Thank you, of course I will. But for me the problem is not the disk fails (in case it does); but that the diagnostics is problematic. Anyway, I am going to test the disk and debug the kernel. From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:36:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1595 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:36:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1591 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:36:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:36:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2B4719DFE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:36:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB56219CD1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:36:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 67BFC19CF0; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:35:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83C8019BAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:35:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 2D015CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:35:19 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Message-ID: <20040303203519.GB5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <503d190cb9a4472806f90bd0fdde7772@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:35:19 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 01:51:52AM -0800, Geoff Collyer wrote: > There's no great mystery to the name `wren'; there was a line of SCSI > disks at the time (ca. 1990) called Wren I, Wren II, Wren III, etc., > I think made by Fujitsu Nope, CDC. Later spun off into Imprimis, which was still later bought by Seagate. At one point my home box (OEM 12-slot VME crate that my wife painted a lovely green) had three Wren IVs, one from each company. Hell of a way to get 1GB of storage, but cheap. Later replaced the lot with one Wren 7. None of them ever gave me a day's trouble (unlike the pile of Deathstars we've replaced this year), so I appreciate Plan 9's little "homage". From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 05:38:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1782 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 05:38:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1772 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 05:38:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 05:38:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B700C19CE9; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:38:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B96219DDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:38:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 71A1819BAA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:37:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 769D219CE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:37:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 2B342CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:37:08 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park Message-ID: <20040303203708.GC5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <00e101c4011a$9b442b50$67844051@SOMA> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <00e101c4011a$9b442b50$67844051@SOMA> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 15:37:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 01:25:22PM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > i was out at Bletchley Park on sunday [2nd visit] and took some 50 shots. > if anyone's interested: > > http://www.insultant.net/uk/BP2004 Do they sell inflatable Enigmas in the gift shop? From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:00:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3006 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:00:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3002 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:00:52 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:00:52 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4C2819DDB; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F6DC19C95; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2681919A19; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B333D19A64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:16 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 69D56CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:16 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz Message-ID: <20040303210016.GD5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <88a386cc922f703f432afb566ed42a38@plan9.ucalgary.ca> <200403032022.i23KMgR3053241@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403032022.i23KMgR3053241@adat.davidashen.net> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:00:16 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 12:22:42AM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > It's just a tool to draw graphs. It will not begin to draw > better graphs when compiled with mk instead of make. I'll thank you not to distract me from my navel-gazing with your animal pragmatism. From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:11:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3563 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:11:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3558 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:11:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:11:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F16619DDA; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:11:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4A1E19D47; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:11:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFE0C19D0F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:10:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30B3719C95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:10:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23L86ki053477 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:08:06 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23L86gi053476 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:08:06 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403032108.i23L86gi053476@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz In-Reply-To: <20040303210016.GD5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:08:06 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > It's just a tool to draw graphs. It will not begin to draw > > better graphs when compiled with mk instead of make. > > I'll thank you not to distract me from my navel-gazing with your animal > pragmatism. I only meant that in order to actually make it draw better graphs it must be rewritten without #if and with normal string libraries instead of POSIX mess. From geoff@collyer.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:26:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4435 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:26:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4431 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:26:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:26:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E4E619DD1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3FF419C75; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:26:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92EAA19CF5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:25:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2DEF19BE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:25:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7ffdd3e8f53da6370ee8c4a9d21ca667@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <20040303203519.GB5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 13:25:29 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: CDC, right! Thanks for the history; I knew Fujitsu didn't sound right, but it's been a long time. From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:38:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5132 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:38:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5128 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:38:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:38:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D124219DE1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:38:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6357D19B14; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:38:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C148919C68; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:37:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC1BC19B41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:37:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i23LYkki053566; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:34:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i23LYibs053565; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:34:44 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403032134.i23LYibs053565@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Exact Eios Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Cc: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:34:44 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The exact places where Eio is reported in sdbio are almost all occurences: devsd.c:800 l = unit->dev->ifc->bio(unit, 0, 0, b, nb, bno); if(l < 0) { error(Eio); few occurences: devsd.c:820 l = unit->dev->ifc->bio(unit, 0, 1, b, nb, bno); if(l < 0) { error(Eio); Is it a disk failure? The Hitachi's test suite says the disk is good. Would it make sense to make error reporting more detailed? David Tolpin From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:43:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5461 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:43:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5451 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:43:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:43:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B511D19D7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:43:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2485519B20; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:43:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83BC919D76; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6400A19CE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id B0965CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:08 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz Message-ID: <20040303214208.GE5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20040303210016.GD5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <200403032108.i23L86gi053476@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403032108.i23L86gi053476@adat.davidashen.net> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 01:08:06AM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > > It's just a tool to draw graphs. It will not begin to draw > > > better graphs when compiled with mk instead of make. > > > > I'll thank you not to distract me from my navel-gazing with your animal > > pragmatism. > > I only meant that in order to actually make it draw better graphs > it must be rewritten without #if and with normal string libraries > instead of POSIX mess. I think the graphs would really stand out if you just recoded the whole thing in Limbo. From splite@purdue.edu Thu Mar 4 08:02:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 06:43:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5470 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 06:43:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5466 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 06:43:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 06:43:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0188D19E07; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A00419E10; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:43:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA43019D47; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBA6E19CE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 8D869CDCE; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:36 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite Message-ID: <20040303214236.GF5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20040303203519.GB5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <7ffdd3e8f53da6370ee8c4a9d21ca667@collyer.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7ffdd3e8f53da6370ee8c4a9d21ca667@collyer.net> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:42:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 01:25:29PM -0800, Geoff Collyer wrote: > CDC, right! Thanks for the history; I knew Fujitsu didn't sound > right, but it's been a long time. Yeah, I was only, ummm, three or four back then. It was actually my dad's computer. He got it from his dad. I just, like, googled on "wren" while jamming to Eamon on my iPod and doing my, like, social studies homework so I'd sound all like l33t and stuff. CUL8R From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 07:33:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9360 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 07:33:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9356 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 07:33:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 07:33:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A5B6219E14; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06D1B19D06; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:33:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 40D3119D76; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:32:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9B1719CF0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:32:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3721844-4719>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:30:54 -0500 Message-ID: <031501c4016e$f2ecc4d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403032008.i23K8qEd053150@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:29:00 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i thought this was 9fans, not the samaritains i must have missed a meeting ... From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 07:46:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9934 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 07:46:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9930 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 07:46:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 07:46:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3254719E1A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:46:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E871719CFF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:46:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DBEF619CFF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:45:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7741C19C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:45:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314279-20502>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:44:07 -0500 Message-ID: <033a01c40170$cb819a90$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <00e101c4011a$9b442b50$67844051@SOMA> <20040303203708.GC5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:42:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Do they sell inflatable Enigmas in the gift shop? with a soldering iron and 99 GBP you can by a DIY kit. the girl in the gift shop was quite cute too ;) i have these shots from 2000 too: http://www.insultant.net/uk/BP From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 4 08:02:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 07:52:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10218 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 07:52:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10214 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 07:52:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 07:52:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF2F319E2D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCAE619CD2; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:52:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A93119C7A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:51:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32A1319CD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:51:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <432439-14982>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 17:50:06 -0500 Message-ID: <035c01c40171$a129a610$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040303203519.GB5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <7ffdd3e8f53da6370ee8c4a9d21ca667@collyer.net> <20040303214236.GF5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] i/o error: wrenwrite MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:48:14 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yeah, I was only, ummm, three or four back then. It was actually my dad's > computer. ... http://www.insultant.net/uk/BP2004/DSC00556.JPG From dustimakowskimeyb@aol.ca Thu Mar 4 11:13:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 09:06:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15265 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 09:06:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15240 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 09:06:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 09:06:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16EBD19D28; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77C1119D13; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:06:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44B3619D24; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:05:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from aol.ca (unknown [218.234.97.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 125E719D1F; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:05:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2dfa01c40173$b9ecfec0$14551e34@dustimakowskimeyb> From: "Jeremy Behn" To: "Brent" <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, "Cleta" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1158 Subject: [9fans] sheep permission Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "Jeremy Behn" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 04:03:22 +0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.4 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET, RCVD_IN_DSBL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** Your invited, It makes sense that online casinos has increased payouts then regular gambling facilities? Don't waste your money on low payout VLTs. Come get your unrestricted two hundred and fifty dollars of gaming credit at the website below: http://www.in-box-offers.org/AidDownload.php?affid=830 From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 4 11:13:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 09:37:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18257 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 09:37:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18252 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 09:37:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 09:37:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E330319E42; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:37:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C14819C0D; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:37:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0605919BE6; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:36:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B308119B65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:36:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2f2b01a2ecb2ee8c2714a0a03c276eec@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] USB snooping Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:39:07 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: potentially silly question but ... Is it possible to snoop USB? either in some sort of promiscuous mode or by connecting Windows <> plan9 <> device and passing the packets through I see so many USB devices that only come with Windows drivers. I'm willing to spend the time snooping if I thought it would yield results. Anybody know before I embark in my quest for knowledge ? m From adam@lazur.org Thu Mar 4 11:13:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 09:44:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18944 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 09:44:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18940 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 09:44:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 09:44:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2F9319E5A; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:44:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23F1419C54; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:44:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 091DB19D23; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:43:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ninjak.clustermonkey.org (ninjak.clustermonkey.org [66.139.79.169]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2FCF19C42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:43:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ninjak.clustermonkey.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64BC154722 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:43:10 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ninjak.clustermonkey.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (ninjak.clustermonkey.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16950-07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:43:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by ninjak.clustermonkey.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 6432D5471E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:43:09 +0000 (UTC) From: Adam Lazur To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040304004309.GI19052@ninjak.clustermonkey.org> References: <2f2b01a2ecb2ee8c2714a0a03c276eec@juice.thebigchoice.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2f2b01a2ecb2ee8c2714a0a03c276eec@juice.thebigchoice.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.5.1+cvs20040112i Subject: [9fans] Re: USB snooping Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:43:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: matt@proweb.co.uk (matt@proweb.co.uk) said: > potentially silly question but ... > > Is it possible to snoop USB? either in some sort of promiscuous mode > > or by connecting Windows <> plan9 <> device and passing the packets through > > I see so many USB devices that only come with Windows drivers. I'm willing to spend the time snooping if I thought it would yield results. > > Anybody know before I embark in my quest for knowledge ? Windows sniffing software: http://www.wingmanteam.com/usbsnoopy/ You could also fork over a pile of cash for a CATC sniffer. -- Adam Lazur, Cluster Monkey From dfawcus@cisco.com Thu Mar 4 11:13:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 10:45:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25326 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 10:45:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25322 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 10:45:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 10:45:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1D9A19E8C; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:45:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0DC419E4B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:45:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D74E619CE5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:44:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FD2319A94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 20:44:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 03 Mar 2004 17:51:12 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i241hl1v023241 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:43:48 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id BAA16171 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:44:10 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: USB snooping Message-ID: <20040304014410.C24781@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <2f2b01a2ecb2ee8c2714a0a03c276eec@juice.thebigchoice.com> <20040304004309.GI19052@ninjak.clustermonkey.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20040304004309.GI19052@ninjak.clustermonkey.org>; from adam@lazur.org on Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 07:43:09PM -0500 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:44:10 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 07:43:09PM -0500, Adam Lazur wrote: > Windows sniffing software: > http://www.wingmanteam.com/usbsnoopy/ I happened to run across this today: http://benoit.papillault.free.fr/usbsnoop/doc.en.php DF From martin@parvat.com Thu Mar 4 17:17:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 12:57:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4118 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 12:57:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4107 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 12:57:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 12:57:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E26CD19BAD; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:57:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8471219AB1; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:57:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ECAFE19EC5; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:56:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.171]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7F5819E9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:56:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.209] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ayjxq-0008WE-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 04:56:02 +0100 Received: from [203.101.52.134] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1Ayjxq-0004YN-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 04:56:02 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Message-Id: <20040304092255.173cfd2e.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <40447BCC.4000006@hellooperator.net> References: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net> <40447BCC.4000006@hellooperator.net> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:22:55 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 02 Mar 2004 12:19:24 +0000 Dick Davies wrote: >... > And then to really piss in my chips, 90% of the Collections API > which lets me store these objects and actually *do* something with them > only lets me pull them out as Object. > > I HAVE TO CAST THEM. So when I get an object 'dynamically' - via RMI or >... C# seems to have duplicated the same mistake, although at least *they* seem to realise it was a mistake, and intend to add 'generics'. It's a pity that means they have to migrate all the existing code... (Java generic types are not, AFAIK, official, in any sense - will they ever be?) BTW: does anyone know if C# duplicated all Java's mistakes in multi-treading, as summarised in Roj's excerpts of Holub's book? Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 17:17:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 15:07:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18369 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 15:07:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18365 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 15:07:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 15:07:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A45819ED8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E787E19EC0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:07:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8AA4F19EC0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:06:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0ACD119EB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:06:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:06:58 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the > BIOS has panel information defined. What are the actual notebook models for this driver? I'm now thinking whether to buy one or not. Kenji From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 4 17:17:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 15:19:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19572 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 15:19:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19568 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 15:19:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 15:19:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F3F819EE7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:19:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B19119ECA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:19:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 759D119ECB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:18:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 398A319E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:18:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:22:04 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the >> BIOS has panel information defined. > > What are the actual notebook models for this driver? > I'm now thinking whether to buy one or not. > > Kenji go to www.ibm.com and click on products, then notebooks.. all the T and R series laptops have a Radeon 7500 or 9000 (they are the more expensive ones), the G and X ones have an 'Intel Extreme'. i have a T30 which is reasonable, just saw a T41 yesterday -- a better display, thinner and lighter. three button on each one, so no need for extra mouse... andrey From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 17:17:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 15:25:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20183 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 15:25:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20178 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 15:25:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 15:25:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05BB719EE2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:25:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E95C619C75; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:25:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 212FA19ECB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:24:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EC3B19E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:24:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:25:30 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i have a T30 which is reasonable, just saw a T41 yesterday -- a better > display, thinner and lighter. So, the T30 worked fine? I've thought this driver is for HP series which has a damn mousepad.☺ I looked IBM just for G (too heavy model!) and X series (expensive ones). Kenji From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 4 17:17:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 15:40:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21648 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 15:40:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21644 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 15:40:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 15:40:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A40AF19F2D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:40:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C09AD19F24; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:40:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD3BC19EE0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:39:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4379C19ECB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:39:02 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i246kKb3020173 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:46:21 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D27@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Thread-Index: AcQBsZuFo7+mHVpaTfqQTopGgsvZVgAAaXwQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:39:01 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: PiBJIGxvb2tlZCBJQk0ganVzdCBmb3IgRyAodG9vIGhlYXZ5IG1vZGVsISkgYW5kIFggc2VyaWVz IA0KDQpHIC0gRy1mb3JjZXMNClggLSBlWHBlbnNpdmUgDQo= From andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz Thu Mar 4 17:17:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 15:49:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22703 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 15:49:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22699 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 15:49:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 15:49:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2B6419EEB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9D9419ECB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:49:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E226D19ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:48:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta205-rme.xtra.co.nz (mta205-rme.xtra.co.nz [210.86.15.187]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 588AA19C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz ([210.86.15.186]) by mta205-rme.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20040304064838.OKAC5435.mta205-rme.xtra.co.nz@mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:48:38 +1300 Received: from [210.54.117.69] by mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz with ESMTP id <20040304064837.XEQC9271.mta1-rme.xtra.co.nz@[210.54.117.69]> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:48:37 +1300 User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022 Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Andrew Simmons To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:43:44 +1300 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >You have something against tersely eloquent, and expressive >statements? Yes. I'm too stupid to understand them. I couldn't even understand what that blind guy in "Kung Fu" was talking about. From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 4 17:17:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 16:44:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28427 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 16:44:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28423 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 16:44:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 16:44:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 602BB19BFA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:44:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38F3519C75; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:44:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7840F19BFA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:43:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 771BF19C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:42:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <85045dda04ff8bb77dd5d794b57891b8@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] sources dump? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:42:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I know that can be done locally at each of our sites, but, wouldn't it be good to have the sources fs archived so that anyone could mount sources/archive and see what a previous official distribution was? I've been missing that, although I just keep a local copy of that part that we have changed locally. But I think that could be a nice tool for those that are used to make local changes. Just a thought. From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 4 17:17:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 16:52:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29027 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 16:52:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29022 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 16:52:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 16:52:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B5C7719EEA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F00419C75; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:52:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F2B919D4D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:51:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4E8F19C42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:51:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0c880f126036ccf5149dc5e04035901c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <18335250743f714bba76213eba1a47ec@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:51:43 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm an idiot. our rc/bin/9fs didn't have sourcesdump; It seems that I didn't notice a conflict in a pull from sources for that file. Thanks a lot to Lucio, who let me know. From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 17:17:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 16:58:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29569 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 16:58:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29565 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 16:58:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 16:58:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 413C319EFB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:58:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7420E19EF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:58:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF24B19EF2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:57:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4767419ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:57:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <0c880f126036ccf5149dc5e04035901c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:58:14 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > our rc/bin/9fs didn't have sourcesdump; It seems that > I didn't notice a conflict in a pull from sources for that file. In our case, Local import peridotite /net.alt Local srv /net.alt/tcp!plan9.bell-labs.com!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki and then Wiki /mnt/wiki Kenji From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 4 17:17:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 17:01:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29933 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 17:01:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29929 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 17:01:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 17:01:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C419B19EF8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:00:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FC2619EF5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:00:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0843219EF3; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FBAE19EE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:00:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0415f600cc0d273b35a0c1d0526a5bdb@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dpzqhkbwnxuialmxkkzdgsfhmy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:00:09 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dpzqhkbwnxuialmxkkzdgsfhmy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I deserve that ;-) I'll reread the wiki more frequently. --upas-dpzqhkbwnxuialmxkkzdgsfhmy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Mar 4 08:58:31 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 29D1719EFD; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:58:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7420E19EF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:58:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF24B19EF2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:57:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4767419ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 02:57:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <0c880f126036ccf5149dc5e04035901c@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:58:14 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > our rc/bin/9fs didn't have sourcesdump; It seems that > I didn't notice a conflict in a pull from sources for that file. In our case, Local import peridotite /net.alt Local srv /net.alt/tcp!plan9.bell-labs.com!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki and then Wiki /mnt/wiki Kenji --upas-dpzqhkbwnxuialmxkkzdgsfhmy-- From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 17:17:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 17:04:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30186 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 17:04:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30177 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 17:04:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 17:04:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B95D619F00; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:04:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BB3919EF3; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:04:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 04C3F19ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:03:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7241419C42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:03:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7e3fcec96a76d3e40c19db4ffbebb2bc@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <0415f600cc0d273b35a0c1d0526a5bdb@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:04:05 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I deserve that ;-) > I'll reread the wiki more frequently. No, it's not for you. There are some newbies here recently, and I thought this might help them to get images how Plan 9 works differently from Unices. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 20:49:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 17:27:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31938 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 17:27:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31934 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 17:27:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 17:27:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6610519EE0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:27:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8713619ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:27:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A024B19CFF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24D4A19C04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:26:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5849b0813561ef7f18e49c9770ca5d09@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <7e3fcec96a76d3e40c19db4ffbebb2bc@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:27:11 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: By the way, the syntax of Wiki page has been changed? I see such as [what's new | http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/what's_new/] phrases many times. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Thu Mar 4 20:49:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 17:40:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 824 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 17:40:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 820 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 17:40:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 17:40:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1D0019ACC; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:40:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5871019BF1; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:40:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF5F519ED4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:39:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC80719EC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:39:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <5849b0813561ef7f18e49c9770ca5d09@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-llqabyhjyokkptudrppveusxjt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:40:12 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-llqabyhjyokkptudrppveusxjt Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There are also many junks other than under sandbox. What's going on? Kenji --upas-llqabyhjyokkptudrppveusxjt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([157.16.103.2]) by diabase; Thu Mar 4 17:30:08 JST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3p2+/3.7W-03092514) with ESMTP id RAA28339 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:27:32 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6610519EE0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:27:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8713619ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:27:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A024B19CFF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24D4A19C04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 03:26:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5849b0813561ef7f18e49c9770ca5d09@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] sources dump? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <7e3fcec96a76d3e40c19db4ffbebb2bc@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:27:11 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: By the way, the syntax of Wiki page has been changed? I see such as [what's new | http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/what's_new/] phrases many times. Kenji --upas-llqabyhjyokkptudrppveusxjt-- From brucee@chunder.com Thu Mar 4 20:49:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 18:10:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3045 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 18:10:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3041 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 18:10:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 18:10:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 160AF19EF9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:10:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D005A19EC5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:10:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0195419D4D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:09:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AA3CD19BF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:09:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31456 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 09:09:19 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 09:09:19 -0000 Message-ID: <009e01c401c8$8cb47460$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403012112.i21LCX5E068637@adat.davidashen.net><40447BCC.4000006@hellooperator.net> <20040304092255.173cfd2e.martin@parvat.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:07:31 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: not all of them, but they threw in a few more. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin C.Atkins" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 2:52 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel ... > BTW: does anyone know if C# duplicated all Java's mistakes in multi-treading, > as summarised in Roj's excerpts of Holub's book? From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 4 20:49:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 18:20:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3508 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 18:20:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3504 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 18:20:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 18:20:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D63719ECD; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:20:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E442619EDF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:20:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84BC119ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:19:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C8F119C15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 04:19:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: USB snooping In-Reply-To: <20040304004309.GI19052@ninjak.clustermonkey.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:22:10 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: thanks and thank you Derek the CATC must be expensive, none of the sites seemed to carry the price m From vangoh12@singnet.com.sg Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:07:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7209 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:07:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7205 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:07:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:07:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90FEA19D4D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 223D219C1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4316B19D1F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B71819BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Aypeh-0001LR-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:00:39 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Yi Li Message-ID: Organization: Singapore Telecommunications Ltd References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:00:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: "ron minnich" wrote in message news:Pine.LNX.4.44.0403030620180.24778-100000@maxroach.lanl.gov... > On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > L4 > > thanks. > > Looks interesting, although I note that what people run on top of it in > one case is ... Linux. > And I suspect that the design philosophy of L4 has a certain degree of impact on Linux. No proof, just a guess. E From komadori@myrealbox.com Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:07:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7285 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:07:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7255 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:07:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:07:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C80A19EF3; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43C7319EC5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91C6919BB4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2273C19C02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Aype5-0001KF-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:00:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Robin KAY Message-ID: <1078357658.99323.0@dyke.uk.clara.net> Organization: www.gekkou.co.uk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040303210016.GD5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu>, <20040303214208.GE5853@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:59:56 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: splite@purdue.edu wrote: > On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 01:08:06AM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > >>>> It's just a tool to draw graphs. It will not begin to draw >>>> better graphs when compiled with mk instead of make. >>> >>> I'll thank you not to distract me from my navel-gazing with your animal >>> pragmatism. >> >> I only meant that in order to actually make it draw better graphs >> it must be rewritten without #if and with normal string libraries >> instead of POSIX mess. > > I think the graphs would really stand out if you just recoded the whole > thing in Limbo. How can anyone even think about running such an ideologically impure program on Plan 9? Clearly the program needs to rewritten to expose its functionality as a file system ^_^'. -- Wishing you good fortune, --Robin Kay-- (komadori) . From philo@privacy.net Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:22:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8599 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8595 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:22:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 941AF19EE5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B085319B6A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5430519BC6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09BB819B65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AypwU-0001Y1-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:19:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:15:00 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * "Sam" wrote in message news:Pine.LNX.4.30.0403031332300.1865-100000@athena... > 1) Right click on background and select new. > 2) Click and hold right mouse button at top left of screen. > 3) Sweep down to bottom right of screen. > 4) Release right mouse button. > 5) Type: man intro > 6) Press enter. > 7) read. > 8) press down arrow. > 9) goto 7 > > Further instructions upon completion. As proof of > such, I will expect you to tell me where the 'copies > of papers referenced in this manual' are stored > in the filesystem. Yes, the quote is a hint. > > thanks for the reply... and the intro sure looks like a good place to start... but i don't know what you mean by "copies of papers referenced in this manual" means section 7 merely said: introduction to data bases or did you mean that you wanted me to tell your that "man" was found in /sys ???? i have worked a little bit with linux... but this looks like a whole new world to me Philo From philo@privacy.net Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:22:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8610 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8606 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:22:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85EE519F05; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 840BE19EC5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B17319C1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E53A319BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AypwU-0001YD-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:19:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: <20040303185823.GA1129@bsd.my.domain>, <7d19c138e3efdc1ffa7d0950dcae4ace@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:15:23 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * "andrey mirtchovski" wrote in message news:7d19c138e3efdc1ffa7d0950dcae4ace@plan9.ucalgary.ca... > > mostly icewm; but once I tried Plan 9, I kept finding myself > > myseriously drawn back to it. Acme does that to you. And, even > > though I'm not a programmer either, I just have a sense that it's a > > more elegant system. > > it's rio's color palette that does it -- scientifically proven to put > you in a more relaxed, zen state. > > things like web browsing, movies, music and IM can be abstracted (when > and if they arrive) in a rio window and not impair the overall feel of > the system. just keep the window small. there's a reason why links > stores its configuration files in /tmp. > > andrey > well i;ve gotten to rio but am just running Plan 9 locally... i guess i need to figure out what to do to put it "on-line" thanks Philo From philo@privacy.net Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:22:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8625 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8621 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:22:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:22:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F157819F0E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 936AC19EC5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B5B619EC5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBAE619B6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AypwU-0001Y7-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:19:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: , <20040303185823.GA1129@bsd.my.domain> Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:15:13 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * "Greg Pavelcak" wrote in message news:20040303185823.GA1129@bsd.my.domain... > On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 06:19:55PM +0000, philo wrote: > > I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. > > > > Got it installed and running (locally) yesterday... > > > > what next? (I don't feel like spending $150 for the manual) > > > > Philo > > > Hello fellow newbie. > > Go into /sys/doc and start reading. Some of the Plan 9 docs are > pretty esoteric, but they still make a good read. > > Frequent the Plan 9 web page. I don't have the address, but if you > google for plan9 you'll get there. > > Once there, explore every link. Especially do frequent googling of > comp.os.plan9 as questions arise. > > I hope I'll soon be knowledgeable enough to answer questions beyond > pointing to docs, but there's a start. > > I think you'll find Plan 9 addictive. I am a long time FreeBSD user, > in particular vi (well vim) and several different window managers, > mostly icewm; but once I tried Plan 9, I kept finding myself > myseriously drawn back to it. Acme does that to you. And, even > though I'm not a programmer either, I just have a sense that it's a > more elegant system. > > Finally, you've obviously already found this list. I've found the > people here quite helpful. A little quirky, but helpful. One of the > things that drew me to FreeBSD in the first place was that when I, > an ordinary user, posted questions, I found I was getting answers > from people who are actually writing the code! That's true here too. > > Good luck. > > Greg Thanks for the reply...and yes.... I know where the web page is... but I will have to start reading the docs... I am a late comer to the world of computers but have been trying to make up for it by at least seeing what there is to all the OS's out there. I've got a whole shelf full of removable drives and have fooled around with Linux and FreeBSD...plus os/2 & ECS... but have only just within the past couple of days found out about Plan 9 so expect it will take me a while to figure out the first 0.1% of it all! From philo@privacy.net Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:23:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8648 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8644 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9808E19F1C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38FF619F1A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:22:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E528519B65; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B138319BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:21:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AypwT-0001Xv-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:19:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: <104d37hpl6ogld2@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com References: Subject: [9fans] Re: Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:14:50 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > I'm not a programmer...just an experimenter. > I made a few replies earlier...but non have showed up. at any rate i did find the intro /sys/man/ and between that and what's on the web pages i will have a lot to read... but so far have not actually gotten Plan 9 "on line" i'll keep poking around with it thanks Philo From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:42:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10901 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:42:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10882 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:42:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:42:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B44C19ECF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:42:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E31E19EF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:42:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E30119C1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEC1D19A8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:41:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <087abf162263318959c849b3c9015e9d@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Newbie In-Reply-To: <104d37hpl6ogld2@corp.supernews.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:43:45 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hello and welcome try this one http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Network_configuration/index.html m From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:49:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11557 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:49:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11553 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:49:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:49:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B816619F1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:49:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14AA319EF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:49:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9039919F04; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD12119D1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:48:18 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i24Atcje023050 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:55:39 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: scrollbar Thread-Index: AcQB1jHgWMAoRg8PSZymAoeTV40wtg== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] scrollbar Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:48:18 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Windows/MacOS constantly place the scrollbar on right. X/Plan9 constantly place it on left. Is there some reasoning behind this logic? Tiit@curious From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:53:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11789 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:53:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11785 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:53:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:53:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80A2819AC9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:53:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A23CB19A20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:53:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 646F919F03; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:52:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F85B19EF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:52:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <396546843d3f017a85b66e40fefff7e9@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:54:23 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: yeah, Windows/Mac is shite From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 4 20:49:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 19:58:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12188 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 19:58:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12184 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 19:58:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 19:58:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7FDAB19F24; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:58:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9084919AC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:58:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E19D19F1F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:57:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFC6619B6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:57:06 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i24B4SEE023143 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:04:28 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] scrollbar X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D2B@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] scrollbar Thread-Index: AcQB1w6HE0rOQe+xRvu2cVqClY2OJwAAE5nQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > yeah, Windows/Mac is shite err, except religious arguments=20 From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 4 20:49:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 20:04:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12557 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 20:04:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12553 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 20:04:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 20:04:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A889719F20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:04:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BE5419F04; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:04:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC0CA19F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:03:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F14D19A40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:03:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] scrollbar In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D2B@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:05:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > yeah, Windows/Mac is shite err, except religious arguments for left-right text, scroll bars on the right are generally furthest away from the mouse pointer click file .. click a recent file ... move mouse pointer 1000 pixels to the scroll bar ... scroll From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 4 20:49:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 20:16:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13274 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 20:16:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13270 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 20:16:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 20:16:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 439D719F28; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:16:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BC0E19BDA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:16:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 46F5219D06; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:15:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A317119BBF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:15:10 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i24BMWaY023310 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:22:32 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] scrollbar X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D2C@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] scrollbar Thread-Index: AcQB2JtM5AwWcOyoRHOeIBiLrW4vhwAAN5aQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:15:11 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > for left-right text, scroll bars on the right are generally=20 > furthest away from the mouse pointer I've noticed that I tend to move the mouse pointer to far=20 right as I read/write something. Maybe so that it doesn't obscure the text. Maybe it's just a habit formed by the environment. From plan9@blueyonder.co.uk Thu Mar 4 20:49:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 20:18:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13531 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 20:18:19 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13527 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 20:18:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 20:18:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A2BA19F31; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:18:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C51419F0C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:18:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C793D19F0C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:17:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-200-130.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.200.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9598A19BDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:17:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <73353f6181f6a98dc4432ad0a0e0decb@tombob.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] scrollbar From: plan9@blueyonder.co.uk In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D2B@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:17:26 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: When writing text in left-to-right languages like english, you are more likely to be focussing your attention on the left side of your window. Cursor positioning is therefore also more likely to be nearer to the left edge of the window. So, your mouse pointer is more likely to be closer to the left edge of your window. Robby From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 4 20:49:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 20:23:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13828 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 20:23:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13824 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 20:23:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 20:23:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A865C19F2E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:23:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65ACE19F2A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:23:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B53419F0C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:22:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3281919BDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:22:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0265d55e51ecbc45b2e17f94df45c3f5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-igrzifkqexkqqkfedzqfoxudet" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:22:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-igrzifkqexkqqkfedzqfoxudet Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I don't think so. The claim of L4 is that µkernels are non-portable (which makes sense) and that they must be coded in a non-portable way, The orignial one was assembly, and then fiasco is a reimplementation of L4 in C (mostly). Linux is UNIX, mostly, if we forget about its bloat. --upas-igrzifkqexkqqkfedzqfoxudet Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Mar 4 11:07:37 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5BA1D19ED4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 223D219C1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:07:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4316B19D1F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B71819BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 05:06:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1Aypeh-0001LR-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 04 Mar 2004 10:00:39 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Yi Li Message-ID: Organization: Singapore Telecommunications Ltd References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:00:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: "ron minnich" wrote in message news:Pine.LNX.4.44.0403030620180.24778-100000@maxroach.lanl.gov... > On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: > > > L4 > > thanks. > > Looks interesting, although I note that what people run on top of it in > one case is ... Linux. > And I suspect that the design philosophy of L4 has a certain degree of impact on Linux. No proof, just a guess. E --upas-igrzifkqexkqqkfedzqfoxudet-- From lucho@ionkov.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 21:36:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19158 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 21:36:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19154 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 21:36:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 21:36:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B2F219F0C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:36:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E34019ED4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:36:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A535319EF5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EC7B19ED1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:35:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004030412354601300j7j51e>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:35:46 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 1B95D4622BF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:35:53 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Message-ID: <20040304123552.GA18253@ionkov.net> References: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:35:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 03:06:58PM +0900, Kenji Okamoto said: > > I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the > > BIOS has panel information defined. > > What are the actual notebook models for this driver? > I'm now thinking whether to buy one or not. I tested it on IBM X31 (Radeon M6 LY). Thanks, Lucho From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 21:58:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20718 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 21:58:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20709 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 21:58:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 21:58:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA4C219F22; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8A6019F19; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9340D19F0F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B891619F1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:55:27 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24EXvZK003840 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:33:58 GMT Message-ID: <96a186836235a978d537b0f0e2b656e3@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:32 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, How are meta names (in this case $smtp) resolved in plan9? I kinda expected ndb/csquery to accept names of the form net!$smtp but it doesn't. I want to expand a metaname into a FQDN in c. Specificialy I specify my smtp relay in my /lib/ndb/local, however, if I do this factotum is passed server=$smtp which isn't helpfull in chosing which key to provide. -Steve From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 22:09:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21949 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 22:09:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21945 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 22:09:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 22:09:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B32F19F2F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16F0719ED4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:09:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96AEA19ED4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0430619AFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:08:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2716f65b09cc60600584288e13d8a141@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <96a186836235a978d537b0f0e2b656e3@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rrfubfpglgbhvtrqxkiqoemgku" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:06:22 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rrfubfpglgbhvtrqxkiqoemgku Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit try net!$smtp!smtp with csquery --upas-rrfubfpglgbhvtrqxkiqoemgku Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Thu Mar 4 12:58:09 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5397819F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DFD019F19; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9340D19F0F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B891619F1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:55:27 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24EXvZK003840 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:33:58 GMT Message-ID: <96a186836235a978d537b0f0e2b656e3@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:32 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, How are meta names (in this case $smtp) resolved in plan9? I kinda expected ndb/csquery to accept names of the form net!$smtp but it doesn't. I want to expand a metaname into a FQDN in c. Specificialy I specify my smtp relay in my /lib/ndb/local, however, if I do this factotum is passed server=$smtp which isn't helpfull in chosing which key to provide. -Steve --upas-rrfubfpglgbhvtrqxkiqoemgku-- From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 22:41:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24056 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 22:41:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24052 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 22:41:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 22:41:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0739519C20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54D1C19C20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BE5E19B8B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:40:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F2AAE19B20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:40:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:38:49 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24FHKZK003930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:17:20 GMT Message-ID: <2e3e9bb59b68dcb49e5c716ff50fef5e@snellwilcox.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution In-Reply-To: <2716f65b09cc60600584288e13d8a141@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:40:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Thanks, that gives me the IP address. Do I really have to do a reverse DNS lookup to get the machine name? What I'am after can be done in shell script as: if ( ~ $addr 'net!$smtp' ) addr=`{ndb/query dom `{ndb/query sys $sysname dom} smtp} NB: My DHCP client gives me the domain, the smtp entry comes from /lib/ndb/local. I was just hoping to do it in C. -Steve From a@9srv.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 22:42:20 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24130 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 22:42:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24126 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 22:42:19 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 22:42:19 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5480C19F37; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:42:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D71719F0F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:42:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3ACD219B8B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.MCLNVA23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2083819B20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:06:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: // i have worked a little bit with linux... // but this looks like a whole new world to me well, that's a good start then! it *is* a whole new world. there's an initial learning cliff that can be rough, but i certainly think it's worth it. the system really starts getting more interesting when you can get on a network, as you no doubt suspect. ftpfs is the canonical example of the power of namespaces and user-level file systems, but it's become somewhat ho-hum (from a user's point of view) since unix and win32 have thing that are (functionally) very similar. instead, maybe take a look at /n/sources (`cat /bin/9fs` to see what's going on) and the dumps as a nice alternative to CVS for live code distribution. look at running rio inside a rio window, and compare with xnest. take a walk around /rc/bin and cat some things - that can be very educational. read some of the papers in /sys/doc. all are good in their way, but i've found 9, acme, auth, names, net, plumb, port, and utf to be particularly informative while still being accessable to new users. the big things that hooked me on the system, coming from the unix world, were dumps and /lib/ndb. then rc and cpu. ア From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 22:42:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24161 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 22:42:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24157 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 22:42:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 22:42:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A973919F38; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:42:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8516319F3C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:42:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 17DF619C20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5B9119B20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:41:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <486908-1079>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:40:10 -0500 Message-ID: <054101c401ed$f2fefa90$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:38:15 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Windows/MacOS constantly place the scrollbar on right. they got it wrong. > Is there some reasoning behind this logic? my logic is that if you write left to right the scroll bar should be on the left. and vice versa. it minimises mouse movement. i don't know why X or plan 9 or 8th ed chose this. From gdiaz@online.ie Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 22:48:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24652 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 22:48:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24648 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 22:48:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 22:48:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3FB9C19F04; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:48:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C925919F33; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:48:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6689019F04; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:47:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.online.ie (mail.online.ie [213.159.130.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CD2219BC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 08:47:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from web2.www.online.ie (eth0.web2.www.online.ie [10.10.0.33]) by mail.online.ie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85022A89F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:47:28 +0000 (GMT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by web2.www.online.ie with id i24DlSF23312 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:47:28 GMT Received: from 62.81.241.2 ( [62.81.241.2]) as user gdiaz@online.ie@mail.online.ie by mail.online.ie with HTTP; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:47:27 +0100 Message-ID: <1078408047.4047336fb0285@mail.online.ie> From: gdiaz@online.ie To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver References: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> <20040304123552.GA18253@ionkov.net> In-Reply-To: <20040304123552.GA18253@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1-cvs X-Originating-IP: 62.81.241.2 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:47:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, IBM T30 (M7) and VAIO V505 (M6) works too gabi. Quoting Latchesar Ionkov : > On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 03:06:58PM +0900, Kenji Okamoto said: > > > I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if > the > > > BIOS has panel information defined. > > > > What are the actual notebook models for this driver? > > I'm now thinking whether to buy one or not. > > I tested it on IBM X31 (Radeon M6 LY). > > Thanks, > Lucho > From davel@anvil.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 4 23:00:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25187 invoked by uid 1020); 4 Mar 2004 23:00:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25183 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 23:00:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 23:00:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C949019B4A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:00:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A010519B72; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D44CD19F19; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:00:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1E4619B4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 2D4CA38E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:58:49 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47E7738B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:58:48 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA26551 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:59:50 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: USB snooping From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <20040304014410.C24781@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <2f2b01a2ecb2ee8c2714a0a03c276eec@juice.thebigchoice.com> <20040304004309.GI19052@ninjak.clustermonkey.org> <20040304014410.C24781@edinburgh.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078408723.10951.78.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:58:43 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I did consider working out how to run bochs, just so I could spy on my favourite usb/parport/other-manky-device-interface under Windoze, but I wimped out after reading bits of the code ... Although I know that timing is going to rear it's ugly head, it would be exceedingly nice (long term) to be able to do some sort of usb event peeking/poking from plan9, so you could just plug in a device and prod it at least enough to work out the IDs etc. Dave. On Thu, 2004-03-04 at 01:44, Derek Fawcus wrote: > On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 07:43:09PM -0500, Adam Lazur wrote: > > Windows sniffing software: > > http://www.wingmanteam.com/usbsnoopy/ > > I happened to run across this today: > > http://benoit.papillault.free.fr/usbsnoop/doc.en.php > > DF From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 00:07:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29453 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 00:07:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29449 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 00:07:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 00:07:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C498F19EED; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:07:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 073F319D33; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:07:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1854619D33; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:06:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E267819C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:06:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 04 Mar 2004 15:04:38 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24GhAZK004035 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:43:10 GMT Message-ID: <8175eb98c8ef6a55e671aee1fda192d2@snellwilcox.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] meta expansion, the answer Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:06:43 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, To answer my own question: Look at the wiki, Charles wrote a nice section on ndb lookups. There will be pointed to ndb/ipquery the source of which will enlighten. RTFM grasshopper, RTFM. -Steve From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 09:44:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 00:42:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31862 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 00:42:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31858 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 00:42:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 00:42:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 202ED19C5B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3CFF19BD7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:42:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6CCA19BB4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:41:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 135E619BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:41:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution In-Reply-To: <96a186836235a978d537b0f0e2b656e3@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vbxffwjpbbvptpygdavbzdozoc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:41:00 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vbxffwjpbbvptpygdavbzdozoc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You got the answer, i.e., csquery uses a full path network!host!service. If you want to resolve any of the meta names with ndb/csquery, just tack on a service. If you think there's something else I should be doing, suggest it. --upas-vbxffwjpbbvptpygdavbzdozoc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 07:58:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 07:58:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E48CB19F26; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96DA119F0F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:58:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9340D19F0F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B891619F1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:55:27 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24EXvZK003840 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:33:58 GMT Message-ID: <96a186836235a978d537b0f0e2b656e3@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] dial meta-name resolution Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:32 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, How are meta names (in this case $smtp) resolved in plan9? I kinda expected ndb/csquery to accept names of the form net!$smtp but it doesn't. I want to expand a metaname into a FQDN in c. Specificialy I specify my smtp relay in my /lib/ndb/local, however, if I do this factotum is passed server=$smtp which isn't helpfull in chosing which key to provide. -Steve --upas-vbxffwjpbbvptpygdavbzdozoc-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 01:51:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3397 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 01:51:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3391 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 01:51:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 01:51:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6194219F27; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:51:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0646E19F36; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:51:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 019FA19F27; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99FF019CA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:50:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoQXS013450 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:26 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoP4v017664 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoPfQ029349 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: <033a01c40170$cb819a90$67844051@SOMA> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > with a soldering iron and 99 GBP you can by a DIY kit. you're serious? build an enigma kit? Where do I order again? ron From rob@mightycheese.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:15:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5010 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:15:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5006 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:15:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:15:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6467319F3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:15:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A039519C15; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:15:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5756A19E4D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:14:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E22A19B51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:14:47 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-23-167.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.23.167]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i24HEiFp003110 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:14:45 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:15:07 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Windows/MacOS constantly place the scrollbar on right. > X/Plan9 constantly place it on left. > > Is there some reasoning behind this logic? when i wrote my first scroll bar, back around 1980, i'd only seen them on the left because that's where xerox put them. later, when they started appearing on the right, i wondered why, since it was obvious that with a left-to-right language the odds are the mouse is closer to the left edge than the right. (as i type this, the entire left half of my window is blank.) so you'll have to ask the windows and apple guys why they reversed the smalltalk decision. -rob From rob@mightycheese.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:23:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5493 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:23:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5489 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:23:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:23:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4846A19F45; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A18B19B51; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:23:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E1C8F19C15; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:22:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C4C219B20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:22:17 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-23-167.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.23.167]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i24HMDFp003357 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:22:16 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <8823C143-6E00-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:22:37 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > (as i type this, the entire > left half of my window is blank.) as i typed that, i was very sleepy. i meant to say that the right side was blank, as it is again in this window. yawn.... -rob From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:34:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6262 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:34:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6258 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:34:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:34:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B60D19F4B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:34:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E90319F44; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:34:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B90CB19F3A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F20F119B72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:33:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-sivkldtnmbdcfnncyymzpmurzb" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:33:44 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-sivkldtnmbdcfnncyymzpmurzb Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 --upas-sivkldtnmbdcfnncyymzpmurzb Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 11:51:33 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 11:51:31 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4093719E4D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:51:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1B1219F35; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:51:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 019FA19F27; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99FF019CA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:50:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoQXS013450 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:26 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoP4v017664 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24GoPfQ029349 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: <033a01c40170$cb819a90$67844051@SOMA> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > with a soldering iron and 99 GBP you can by a DIY kit. you're serious? build an enigma kit? Where do I order again? ron --upas-sivkldtnmbdcfnncyymzpmurzb-- From rog@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:39:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6510 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:39:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6505 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:39:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:39:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 317E019F4C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:39:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DDED19F3E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:39:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B3A219F3E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:38:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 445B519F3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:38:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:43:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the only plausible reason i can come up with is that if you're drawing the scrollbar only when you need to and you add the scrollbar on the left, then all the text will jump rightwards. it's interesting (ok, ok, it's deadly dull, but i'll continue anyway) that when steve jobs did nextstep (post leaving apple) he put the scrollbars on the left; when nextstep became macos X, the scrollbars were moved to the right. From davel@anvil.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:57:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7803 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:57:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7799 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E452B19F3E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2076E19CC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F11F19CC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:56:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80BB319AC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:56:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 7D0BE3BC; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:55:06 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EDCC3B8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:55:05 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA19322 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:56:10 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078422902.10951.98.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 17:55:02 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, 2004-03-04 at 17:33, David Presotto wrote: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 The Amateur Radio Museum: http://www.jancorver.org/ have it slightly cheaper:-). Cheers, Dave. ________________________________________________________________________ > From: ron minnich > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park > Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 09:50:25 -0700 > > On Wed, 3 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > > > with a soldering iron and 99 GBP you can by a DIY kit. > > you're serious? build an enigma kit? > > Where do I order again? > > ron From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 02:58:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7880 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 02:58:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7876 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 02:58:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 02:58:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BAB9819F51; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:58:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0852E19C40; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:58:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B32A19CC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77EE719B6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <62b78fce86359459c58a2bb2319d9810@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-sixockelpyfcjbkjydehvspaqs" Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:57:02 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-sixockelpyfcjbkjydehvspaqs Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Costs if you're in the us. prices are in pounds, not euros: Order Details: 1 x (ENIG050) Enigma-E @ 119.99 = 119.99 1500 x (POST) Postal charge @ 0.01 = 15.00 Total Cost: 134.99 --upas-sixockelpyfcjbkjydehvspaqs Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 12:54:52 EST 2004 Received: from milkshake.totalweb.net.uk ([195.206.160.254]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 12:54:50 EST 2004 Received: from beancurd (beancurd.totalweb.net.uk [195.206.160.22]) by milkshake.totalweb.net.uk (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id RAA24645 for ; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:54:49 GMT Message-Id: <200403041754.RAA24645@milkshake.totalweb.net.uk> To: p.enigma@closedmind.org From: shop@bletchleypark.org.uk Subject: BletchleyPark SECURE ORDER 79595 Reply-To: shop@bletchleypark.org.uk Date: 04 March 2004 X-Mailer: ABMailer, ActiveX Mailman ver 1.0, by Andy Blanchard This is an automatic email to confirm your recent order. SECURE BASKET ORDER - Number : 79595 04/03/04 18:03:54 Name : david presotto Postal Address : 3b beech ave berkeley heights new jersey 07922 Gift aid : Not given or not applicable eMail : p.enigma@closedmind.org Order Details: 1 x (ENIG050) Enigma-E @ €119.99 = €119.99 1500 x (POST) Postal charge @ €0.01 = €15.00 Total Cost: €134.99 If you have any questions regarding your order, please do not hesitate to contact Bletchley Park by emailing shop@bletchleypark.org.uk or telephoning on +44 (0)1908 640404 quoting the Secure Basket Order Number above. Please never quote your credit card in any email communication with Bletchley Park. Thank you for ordering from Bletchley Park. --upas-sixockelpyfcjbkjydehvspaqs-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:11:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8942 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8938 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05CFC19F54; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEC1A19C74; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:11:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D682819F48; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:10:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADE5119CC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:10:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24IA8jt013148 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:10:08 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24IA8dU005815 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:10:08 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i24IA8fQ001339 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:10:08 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 11:10:07 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: oh shoot, it's electronic. Maybe worthwhile, but mechanical would be so much more fun. ron From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:15:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9187 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:15:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9181 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:15:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:15:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2857E19AF2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:15:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5A2F19D06; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:15:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5492019F52; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:14:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9B4119AF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:14:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <62b78fce86359459c58a2bb2319d9810@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:12:14 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: couldn't you include the credit card details with that? From davel@anvil.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:24:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9582 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:24:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9577 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:24:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:24:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BBF719C38; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:24:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AB1A19AF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:24:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4323D19A1C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C9EE199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:23:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 13DFE3BC; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C2DC3B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:01 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA22463 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:23:05 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078424518.10951.104.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 18:21:58 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hey, he gave you his home address so you could burgle him: what more do you want? On Thu, 2004-03-04 at 18:12, Charles Forsyth wrote: > couldn't you include the credit card details with that? > From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:29:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9837 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:29:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9833 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:29:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:29:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E079F19B6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:29:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99E6319F18; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:29:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10C2219E85; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:28:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87D6119CE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:28:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24IPbki058570 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:25:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24IPbgF058569 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:25:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403041825.i24IPbgF058569@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:25:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I am getting 'fp: stack overfow' on a pretty simple code from graphviz building Bezier curves. The code literally just computes a mean of two numbers t=(high+low)/2.0 , and when t is about to become 0.9375, it dies with fp: stack overflow. Of course, it is not reproducable on simpler tests. Any thoughts? David From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:32:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9967 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:32:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9963 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:32:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:32:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 60F8819F5F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:32:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9BA219F18; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:32:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7AD9019F44; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:31:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C45A619E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:31:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5c940df105cfce678fd0d7a88e9e801c@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <1078424518.10951.104.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ylasfsdfcsrlclsanztyikdvvc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:29:05 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ylasfsdfcsrlclsanztyikdvvc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that reminds me that i saw a web service that provided a fancy on-line diary with links to hairdressers, dentists and the like, so that you could make and track your appointments from anywhere in the world. trouble is, so could the company running the service. i thought it ought to have been called burglars-r-us.com, but it wasn't. --upas-ylasfsdfcsrlclsanztyikdvvc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Thu Mar 4 18:23:59 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFD2519A99; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:24:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F1F219A99; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:24:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4323D19A1C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C9EE199B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:23:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 13DFE3BC; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C2DC3B7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:01 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA22463 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:23:05 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078424518.10951.104.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 18:21:58 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hey, he gave you his home address so you could burgle him: what more do you want? On Thu, 2004-03-04 at 18:12, Charles Forsyth wrote: > couldn't you include the credit card details with that? > --upas-ylasfsdfcsrlclsanztyikdvvc-- From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:34:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10062 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:34:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10058 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:34:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:34:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2402D19F62; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:34:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FF6D19F18; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:34:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C87B719F44; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:33:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD5F219E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:33:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4e56bfb32c4ad2613181e26e3dbfdb58@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <200403041825.i24IPbgF058569@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:33:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Are you using notes that might be interrupting in the middle of a floating point expression and then doing more floating point in the note handler? Other than that, it just sounds like a bug. Staring at the assembly language (acid it and asm() the routine) would probably tell you what's wrong. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:39:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10262 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:39:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10258 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:39:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:39:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CEFF19F67; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:39:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4703E19F5D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:39:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA4CC19F5B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:38:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1FCF19E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:38:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24IZQki058630 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:26 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24IZPTZ058629 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:25 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403041835.i24IZPTZ058629@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <4e56bfb32c4ad2613181e26e3dbfdb58@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:25 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Are you using notes that might be interrupting in the middle of a > floating point expression and then doing more floating point in the > note handler? Other than that, it just sounds like a bug. Staring > at the assembly language (acid it and asm() the routine) would > probably tell you what's wrong. It's a working code from graphviz, used on many platforms; the rest works (that is, I can just comment this part out and get a graph with straight lines instead of splines), and the floating point numbers are only introduced inside the function. I'll try to debug the assembly code. From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:41:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10317 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:41:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10313 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:41:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:41:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27BF719CC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:41:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0BA419F66; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:41:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 155F619F5B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:40:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C15F319CB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:40:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <200403041835.i24IZPTZ058629@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zinjhyllosqszcdptszagmbscv" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:40:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zinjhyllosqszcdptszagmbscv Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I said bug, I meant in our compiler not the graphviz code... --upas-zinjhyllosqszcdptszagmbscv Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 13:39:26 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 13:39:24 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6769E19F64; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:39:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BEFE19F44; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:39:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA4CC19F5B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:38:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1FCF19E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:38:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24IZQki058630 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:26 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24IZPTZ058629 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:25 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403041835.i24IZPTZ058629@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <4e56bfb32c4ad2613181e26e3dbfdb58@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:35:25 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Are you using notes that might be interrupting in the middle of a > floating point expression and then doing more floating point in the > note handler? Other than that, it just sounds like a bug. Staring > at the assembly language (acid it and asm() the routine) would > probably tell you what's wrong. It's a working code from graphviz, used on many platforms; the rest works (that is, I can just comment this part out and get a graph with straight lines instead of splines), and the floating point numbers are only introduced inside the function. I'll try to debug the assembly code. --upas-zinjhyllosqszcdptszagmbscv-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 03:43:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10391 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 03:43:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10387 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 03:43:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 03:43:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDA8419F6C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:43:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E74B19F6A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:43:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99D1D19F6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:42:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 544A619F69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:42:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <52f9c7bb60481d1c2f85c7e455ddd165@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403041835.i24IZPTZ058629@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:39:57 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the compiler might be miscalculating the depth of the FP stack, allowing it to overflow at run-time. (alternatively, it might just be missing a pop variant in a particular case.) either way it would be helpful to see if you can isolate the expression(s) that cause the trouble. From splite@purdue.edu Fri Mar 5 09:44:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 04:05:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11405 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 04:05:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11401 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 04:05:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 04:05:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A94519F6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:05:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A08019F43; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:05:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62D5A19F6A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58F4E19F43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:04:58 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id E75A7CDCE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:04:57 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar Message-ID: <20040304190457.GA11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056164@black.aprote.com> <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:04:57 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 09:15:07AM -0800, Rob Pike wrote: > >Windows/MacOS constantly place the scrollbar on right. > >X/Plan9 constantly place it on left. > > > >Is there some reasoning behind this logic? > > when i wrote my first scroll bar, back around 1980, i'd only seen > them on the left because that's where xerox put them. later, when > they started appearing on the right, i wondered why, since it was > obvious that with a left-to-right language the odds are the mouse > is closer to the left edge than the right. (as i type this, the entire > left half of my window is blank.) so you'll have to ask the windows > and apple guys why they reversed the smalltalk decision. Why ask the Windows guys? They likely just copied the Apple guys. My guess would be rightie aesthetics. As someone mentioned, having the cursor hotspot on the left edge means that the cursor will usually obstruct some text with a left-side scrollbar. They could have used a right-pointing cursor instead, but that looks and feels odd to a right-handed mouse user. There's also the feeling (at least for righties) that you're "reaching over" the window contents to get to the scrollbar. Further, precisely because most (Western) text is left-justified, the mostly empty right side of the window helps the scrollbar stand out as a distinct target, rather than being subsumed in the left-side clutter. If the mouse is already in the window, it's also easier for righties to hit a right-side scrollbar as the hand can position the mouse more precisely when the fingers and thumb are curling in toward the palm. Personally, I find it less distracting when reading text to have the scrollbar out of the way on the right. My eyes seldom have to traverse the window all the way to the right edge, but they're constantly refocusing on the left edge, which is easier when it's uniform. (Sorry to go all Tognazzini on y'all.) From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 04:10:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11603 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 04:10:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11599 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 04:10:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 04:10:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A5ABF19F7C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:10:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDFF619F75; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:10:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D466619F74; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:09:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DF1F19F75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:09:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8176186076c3a63714cca9cdef46577d@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <20040304190457.GA11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:07:15 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>Personally, I find it less distracting when reading text to have the >>scrollbar out of the way on the right. My eyes seldom have to traverse i find it less distracting to have a less distracting scrollbar, without all the distracting bits and bobs, and then it can stay on the left! i hardly notice it under plan 9 until i need it. it also seems to make more sense, or perhaps look better, i'd say, in acme for the scrollbar to sit on the right, since it can also marks the frame edge. From rog@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 04:10:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11628 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 04:10:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11624 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 04:10:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 04:10:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EA5819F85; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:10:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8053719F7D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:10:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 583AE19F73; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:10:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0FB719F75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:09:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <237641cacfecc9570bd05d826e0f938b@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <20040304190457.GA11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:15:18 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sorry, this is veering sharply off-topic, but i have to say the thing that annoys me most about scrollbars on the right is that it forces me to have the entire window on screen - i can't read the text if the left hand side is off screen, and i can't scroll it if the right hand side is (and often if you resize it smaller, a horizontal scrollbar, that bane of humanity, appears to make things even worse) From rog@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 04:12:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11687 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 04:12:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11683 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 04:12:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 04:12:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 102FA19F86; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA7E519F74; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:12:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 889DA19F82; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:11:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C00119F74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:11:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9e7e4c9c83f013f1c8475682eda42b0b@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <8176186076c3a63714cca9cdef46577d@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:17:05 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it also seems to make more sense, or perhaps > look better, i'd say, in acme for the scrollbar > to sit on the right, since it can also marks the frame edge. you mean the left, i presume? From splite@purdue.edu Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 05:22:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15327 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 05:22:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15323 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 05:22:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 05:22:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7125619F46; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:22:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FABA19BB4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E9C2E19BB4; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:21:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF60719CEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:21:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 4BAB9CDCE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:21:07 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar Message-ID: <20040304202107.GB11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <7C36814D-6DFF-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:21:07 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 05:43:54PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > the only plausible reason i can come up with is that if you're drawing > the scrollbar only when you need to and you add the scrollbar on the > left, then all the text will jump rightwards. Not an issue for Apple; Mac OS scrollbars were always drawn in the active window, even if all the content was visible. Inactive windows still had the scrollbar space allocated, but the controls weren't drawn in. http://toastytech.com/guis/moremacwrd1desk.gif > it's interesting (ok, ok, it's deadly dull, but i'll continue anyway) > that when steve jobs did nextstep (post leaving apple) he put the > scrollbars on the left; when nextstep became macos X, the scrollbars > were moved to the right. The Dock was enough to confuse Mac OS users without moving the scrollbars too. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 05:26:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15448 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 05:26:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15444 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 05:26:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 05:26:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 706BE19CEA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:26:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B033719BE2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:26:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7591E19CA2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4778919BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:25:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24KMCki059010 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:22:12 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24KMCUO059009 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:22:12 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042022.i24KMCUO059009@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <52f9c7bb60481d1c2f85c7e455ddd165@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:22:12 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > the compiler might be miscalculating the depth of the FP > stack, allowing it to overflow at run-time. > (alternatively, it might just be missing a pop variant in a particular case.) > either way it would be helpful to see if you can isolate the expression(s) > that cause the trouble. > The trouble is moving all around the floating point code if I am trying to isolate it. The expressions are moderately complex, such as Vtemp[i][j].x = (1.0 - t) * Vtemp[i-1][j].x + t * Vtemp[i-1][j+1].x but the problem moves to another expression in another function or another part of the library (or just to a later invocation of the same function) if I simpify them. I must admit that I do not remember the x86 assembler well enough to debug. But it looks to me like FP stack is unbalanced, and gets overflowed due to missing pops (or are they called folds?) David From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 05:34:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15747 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 05:34:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15742 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 05:34:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 05:34:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96F3A19F7B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:34:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C486619F70; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:34:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CECB19CEA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A70A619BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:33:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24KUaki059053 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:30:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24KUaCD059052 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:30:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042030.i24KUaCD059052@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' In-Reply-To: <200403042022.i24KMCUO059009@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:30:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I am getting stack overflow on eigth call to Bezier on any input file. I'm recalling that there are eight FP registers, so if it is off by one in the FP code generator, then it should be filled in eight calls. However, my knowledge of the assembler is very bad, and to actually find where one register is lost I will have to re-learn it. If anyone is willing to help me, I am ready to provide all I have. David From splite@purdue.edu Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 05:57:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16445 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 05:57:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16441 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 05:57:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 05:57:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3845719DDA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:57:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEF4819A69; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:57:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75A3519CC8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:56:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6460819A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:56:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 118BFCDCE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:56:09 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar Message-ID: <20040304205609.GC11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20040304190457.GA11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> <237641cacfecc9570bd05d826e0f938b@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <237641cacfecc9570bd05d826e0f938b@vitanuova.com> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:56:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 07:15:18PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > sorry, this is veering sharply off-topic, but i have Oh, I dunno. I think Comparative GUIology is relevant, especially where Plan 9 diverges from every "major" platform. > to say the thing that annoys me most about scrollbars > on the right is that it forces me to have the entire > window on screen - i can't read the text if the left hand > side is off screen, and i can't scroll it if the right hand side is > (and often if you resize it smaller, a horizontal scrollbar, > that bane of humanity, appears to make things even worse) I considered that before but decided the argument was bogus. If you have unused window area on the right, make the window narrower. If not, why cover up the right side of the window? If you truly don't care about the right-side content, then what do you lose by making the window narrower? You won't have need to scroll horizontally anyway. I realize that some might move windows partially off the right side of the screen as a space-saving measure, but that seems more like an argument for better window management than against right-side scrollbars. I'm really not advocating for right-side scrollbars; I was just guessing as to why Apple might have put them there. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 06:02:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16654 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 06:02:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16650 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 06:02:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 06:02:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DD07B19CDE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAADC19CA9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:02:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6700219CFA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:01:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C276A19CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24KwKki059226 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:20 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24KwJB3059225 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:19 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042058.i24KwJB3059225@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] FLD1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:19 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What are code patterns for FLD1? I an reading a text about x86 assembly lng, and will look into source code of the compiler, but I tried and could not right a simple function that generates this instruction. David From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 06:10:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17015 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 06:10:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17011 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 06:10:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 06:10:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A739A19AF9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:10:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAC0419A53; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:10:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7A2519EF9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:09:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFB6919EF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:09:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7f8dfc10571361dfb4d84be6064422d7@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] FLD1 From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403042058.i24KwJB3059225@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rhaisbgylxrrgdjtudiwiwuvih" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:07:15 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rhaisbgylxrrgdjtudiwiwuvih Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the following generates FLD1 #include #include double x(void) { return 1.5; } void main(int, char**) { double v; v = x(); print("%g\n", ++v); } --upas-rhaisbgylxrrgdjtudiwiwuvih Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Thu Mar 4 21:02:05 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 368B119CFA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:02:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 295CB19CA9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:02:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6700219CFA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:01:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C276A19CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24KwKki059226 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:20 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24KwJB3059225 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:19 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042058.i24KwJB3059225@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] FLD1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:58:19 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What are code patterns for FLD1? I an reading a text about x86 assembly lng, and will look into source code of the compiler, but I tried and could not right a simple function that generates this instruction. David --upas-rhaisbgylxrrgdjtudiwiwuvih-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 06:13:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17118 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 06:13:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17114 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 06:13:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 06:13:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8F6BB19CC2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:13:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1225619AF6; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:13:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 57C9B19BAD; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:12:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA90319C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:12:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <9e7e4c9c83f013f1c8475682eda42b0b@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jdsisayqplvzwhscfuvbqnziab" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:10:49 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jdsisayqplvzwhscfuvbqnziab Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit yes --upas-jdsisayqplvzwhscfuvbqnziab Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Thu Mar 4 19:11:58 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3AA919F75; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:12:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4334E19F74; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:12:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 889DA19F82; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:11:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C00119F74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:11:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9e7e4c9c83f013f1c8475682eda42b0b@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <8176186076c3a63714cca9cdef46577d@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:17:05 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it also seems to make more sense, or perhaps > look better, i'd say, in acme for the scrollbar > to sit on the right, since it can also marks the frame edge. you mean the left, i presume? --upas-jdsisayqplvzwhscfuvbqnziab-- From bakul@BitBlocks.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 06:41:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18349 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 06:41:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18345 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 06:41:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 06:41:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1E1EE19CEF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6F9319C6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:41:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85A5F19C22; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:40:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.bitblocks.com (bitblocks.com [209.204.185.216]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9F7C19AF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:40:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from bitblocks.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gate.bitblocks.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i24LdwHA024896 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 13:39:58 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bakul@bitblocks.com) Message-Id: <200403042139.i24LdwHA024896@gate.bitblocks.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 04 Mar 2004 14:04:57 EST." <20040304190457.GA11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> From: Bakul Shah Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:39:58 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Personally, I find it less distracting when reading text to have the > scrollbar out of the way on the right. My eyes seldom have to traverse > the window all the way to the right edge, but they're constantly refocusing > on the left edge, which is easier when it's uniform. But why use a scrollbar? Why move the mouse to any edge if all you want to do is to show a different part through a window? Panning would be so much easier (especially if combined with increasing scroll/pan speed proportional to the distance travelled by the mouse). From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 06:52:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18677 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 06:52:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18673 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 06:52:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 06:52:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85C7419BAD; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:52:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AF6819C88; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:52:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C56FA19BAD; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9AC119BAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:51:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403042139.i24LdwHA024896@gate.bitblocks.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:51:07 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But why use a scrollbar? Why move the mouse to > any edge if all you want to do is to show a > different part through a window? Panning would be > so much easier (especially if combined with > increasing scroll/pan speed proportional to the > distance travelled by the mouse). i've run out of mouse buttons for panning in acme... unless we do it with alt+button :) we could go with gestures too -- a clockwise circle with the mouse scrolls up, counterclockwise scrolls down; the larger the circle the more you scroll (or the faster you rotate the mouse :). this will help touch-screen users since they won't have to hold up to 15 buttons at once while hitting the screen with the little pointy pen. andrey From splite@purdue.edu Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:11:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19381 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:11:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19377 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:11:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:11:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E094C19B35; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 92D2319AE9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:11:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE02019B35; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:10:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A00FB19CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:10:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 47A98CDCE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:10:21 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar Message-ID: <20040304221021.GD11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <200403042139.i24LdwHA024896@gate.bitblocks.com> <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:10:21 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 02:51:07PM -0700, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > Bakul Shah wrote: > > But why use a scrollbar? Why move the mouse to I don't, myself. I turn 'em off on my terminal windows. > > any edge if all you want to do is to show a > > different part through a window? Panning would be > > so much easier (especially if combined with > > increasing scroll/pan speed proportional to the > > distance travelled by the mouse). Panning is fine for small movements, but there's a tendency to overshoot big movements because you can't see what's "coming up". Perhaps if it were combined with some sort of pop-up indicator of where you are in the document. The big problem is that panning doesn't allow for discontinuous movement. Think of the difference between cassette tapes and compact discs when you want to skip ahead two songs. > i've run out of mouse buttons for panning in acme... unless we do it > with alt+button :) Yep. Meta key chords rule. > we could go with gestures too -- a clockwise circle with the mouse > scrolls up, counterclockwise scrolls down; the larger the circle the > more you scroll (or the faster you rotate the mouse :). Man, you think you have RSI trouble now... > this will help touch-screen users since they won't have to hold up to > 15 buttons at once while hitting the screen with the little pointy > pen. True, but they won't be able to see if they've scrolled far enough with their hand in the way. I think that's why jog dials were invented. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:13:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19578 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:13:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19574 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:13:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:13:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1A5619CEF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:13:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5EB719CA9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:13:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 773B719CB9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:12:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14E3F19B35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:12:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3702936-4719>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:08:04 -0500 Message-ID: <05f501c40234$f3b38540$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:06:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > you're serious? build an enigma kit? we don't fuck around at insultant.net > Where do I order again? let me eat and i'll find the data. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:20:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19872 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:20:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19868 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:20:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:20:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8019219CBA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:20:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 913C119C78; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:20:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 32C2E19C6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:19:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B655F19C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:19:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <312092-1783>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:17:58 -0500 Message-ID: <061601c40236$55abf9c0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> <1078422902.10951.98.camel@zevon> Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:16:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The Amateur Radio Museum: > http://www.jancorver.org/ > have it slightly cheaper:-). yeah, i was in a radio hut copying 5 wpm morse in my head. '73 de VK2BHR From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:22:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20137 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:22:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20133 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:22:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:22:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27C7919CA9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:22:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8491E19C6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6C08A19CDE; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:21:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B7C919C78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:21:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24MIRki059561 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:18:27 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24MIRFI059560 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:18:27 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042218.i24MIRFI059560@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:18:27 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The offending function is hypot(2). If I replace it with sqrt(p*p+q*q), no more stack overflows no matter what are shapes and how complex the graph is. I think it is a compiler bug. But need more time or someone's help. David From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:25:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20315 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20311 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:25:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50DB819C40; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1D3C19C40; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDC8A19C6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CA2419BAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317258-1787>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:23:13 -0500 Message-ID: <063901c40237$1111e9e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403041825.i24IPbgF058569@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] 'fp: stack overflow' MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:21:39 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Any thoughts? diddums From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:25:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20336 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20332 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:25:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 264B119DF2; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C63D719D64; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9438E19C6B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1558C19CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317617-16361>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:22:47 -0500 Message-ID: <063201c40237$01855a70$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:19:09 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh shoot, it's electronic. of course. > Maybe worthwhile, but mechanical would be so much more fun. brucee nearly bought a real one [3 rotor] for $US 10k, but, iirc, the seller was suspect. mechanical? 4.99 GBP. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:25:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20351 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20347 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:25:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:25:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 15A2419DDA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FABA19D64; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:25:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DB5B19C40; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E43FE19D1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:24:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317595-16361>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:22:49 -0500 Message-ID: <063301c40237$020a41e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078424518.10951.104.camel@zevon> Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:21:13 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Hey, he gave you his home address so you could burgle him: > what more do you want? eh? my home address is easy to find. getting in may be hard and then there are always 'suprises' ;) i love suprises -- lorna cole From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:30:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20605 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:30:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20601 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:30:57 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:30:57 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CD3119D8C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:30:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1C8619CA9; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:30:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDD1319CBA; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:30:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F01B19C40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:30:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3731096-4724>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:29:37 -0500 Message-ID: <06a401c40237$f5e021e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:28:01 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: _fumbling the future_ tells some. working/meeting with the guys who did it tells more. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 07:44:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21234 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 07:44:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21230 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 07:44:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 07:44:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F8D119C24; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:44:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36BDA19A66; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:44:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7366F19C24; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:43:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC47D19ACC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:43:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <442847-14992>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:42:11 -0500 Message-ID: <06c901c40239$b62e5e20$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:40:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i've run out of mouse buttons for panning in acme... unless we do it > with alt+button :) i've always been wating for morse code .. From brucee@chunder.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 08:08:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22305 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 08:08:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22301 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 08:08:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 08:08:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AA8019EFF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:08:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2136D19EF7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:08:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDFD319EF7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:07:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 83C5919EED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 1707 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 23:07:36 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 23:07:36 -0000 Message-ID: <029a01c4023d$a80ecf60$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403042218.i24MIRFI059560@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:08:47 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i just discovered that the ape hypot and the libc hypot are different, and the ape one does in fact blowup. i'll look into a bit more. good that you tracked it down this far. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tolpin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 9:18 AM Subject: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot > > The offending function is hypot(2). If I replace it with sqrt(p*p+q*q), > no more stack overflows no matter what are shapes and how complex the graph > is. > > I think it is a compiler bug. But need more time or someone's help. > > David From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 08:14:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22582 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 08:14:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22578 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 08:14:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 08:14:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 21E3219EFF; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:14:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEF0F19EFC; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:14:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE5D419EF7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:13:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53E8019F04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:13:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317292-16367>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:12:30 -0500 Message-ID: <070d01c4023d$f0adf750$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403042218.i24MIRFI059560@adat.davidashen.net> <029a01c4023d$a80ecf60$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:10:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i just discovered that the ape hypot and the libc hypot > are different, and the ape one does in fact blowup. ape was a 'failure of vision'. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 08:22:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23211 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 08:22:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23207 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 08:22:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 08:22:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 276AC19F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06E8219EF8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:22:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 872B319EF8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1600F19EFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <449534-14983>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:19:40 -0500 Message-ID: <084101c4023e$efbcc410$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] [really OT] flash/flesh gordon Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:17:51 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'll buy you an Apocalypse Now Redux if you can find me a new Region 1 > Flash Gordon (the bad movie from '80 with all the RSC actors) for the > same price ;) i've already bought the redux and here is the gordon: http://s1.amazon.fr/exec/varzea/ts/exchange-glance/Y02Y4113058Y0954072/402-4597522-1029718 http://s1.amazon.fr/exec/varzea/ts/exchange-glance/Y05Y6722841Y5602479/402-4597522-1029718 -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From brucee@chunder.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 08:54:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25876 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 08:54:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25866 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 08:54:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 08:54:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30B5119F0B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:54:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FA9219D4B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:54:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B155C19EF8; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:53:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5880919D4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:53:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4483 invoked from network); 4 Mar 2004 23:53:55 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 4 Mar 2004 23:53:55 -0000 Message-ID: <02bb01c40244$20a2ac20$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403042218.i24MIRFI059560@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:53:47 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ok, i've found the problem. take a look in: /386/include/ape/math.h and you'll see that hypot() is not declared unless _RESEARCH_SOURCE is. hence the compiler presumes that the function returns int and picks up AX rather than popping the fp stack. solution: either define _RESEARCH_SOURCE, or if that introduces conflicts then simply copy the prototype from math.h to somewhere visible. it may really be a "faulty", in the posix sense, math.h but i'm avoiding investigating that. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tolpin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 9:18 AM Subject: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot > The offending function is hypot(2). If I replace it with sqrt(p*p+q*q), > no more stack overflows no matter what are shapes and how complex the graph > is. > > I think it is a compiler bug. But need more time or someone's help. > > David From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 08:58:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26149 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 08:58:20 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26145 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 08:58:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 08:58:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6F4A19D52; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:58:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 381CF19D22; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:58:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A21F219A99; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:57:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D9CF19A71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:57:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i24Ns8ki073469 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:54:08 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i24Ns8tA073468 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:54:08 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403042354.i24Ns8tA073468@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot In-Reply-To: <02bb01c40244$20a2ac20$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:54:08 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ok, i've found the problem. take a look in: > > /386/include/ape/math.h > > and you'll see that hypot() is not declared unless > > _RESEARCH_SOURCE is. > > hence the compiler presumes that the function returns > int and picks up AX rather than popping the fp stack. > > solution: either define _RESEARCH_SOURCE, or if > that introduces conflicts then simply copy the prototype > from math.h to somewhere visible. > > it may really be a "faulty", in the posix sense, math.h > but i'm avoiding investigating that. Yes, you are right, I am wrong, I wrote about it to the list; my apologies. hypot is not POSIX. I just didn't realize that, unlike pcc, cc does not issue warnings by default. David From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 09:44:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 09:05:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26534 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 09:05:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26530 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 09:05:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 09:05:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EA1919E5C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:05:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D58819CD0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:05:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE45E19C20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:04:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A01719D5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2501Bki073533 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2501BL1073532 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] APE paper Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, The paper about APE at http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/ape.html has turned to be much longer than I though it was. I am not saying it is a excuse for the story with hypot, but in my browser, it ends on the paragraph about BSD_EXTENSION (in Mozilla Firebird). It does rightfully so because < and > are not escaped, and is just an unknown tag with unterminated content. I understand it is a feature of ms2html. I would like to try to fix it (as soon as I package graphviz -- but dot and neato are working already and drawing nice graphs). David Tolpin From r@geekmail.cc Fri Mar 5 09:44:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 09:24:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28162 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 09:24:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28158 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 09:24:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 09:24:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 78F7C19F0B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:24:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AEBE19D5A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:24:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22F5019E5C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:23:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D937519D5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:23:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i250NUX6011226 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:23:30 -0800 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:23:30 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: this is weird. if i build ms2html it does the right thing, but the pages served by the web are bad. -rob From dfawcus@cisco.com Fri Mar 5 09:44:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 09:34:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29372 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 09:34:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29368 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 09:34:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 09:34:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99CBB19F0B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:34:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5802A19EEB; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:34:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91CF019D52; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB9EB19AF9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:33:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Mar 2004 16:40:28 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i250Wk1v005859 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:32:47 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id AAA18084 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:33:14 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar Message-ID: <20040305003313.A2766@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> <06c901c40239$b62e5e20$67844051@SOMA> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <06c901c40239$b62e5e20$67844051@SOMA>; from boyd@insultant.net on Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 11:40:27PM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:33:14 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 11:40:27PM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > > i've always been wating for morse code .. So if the box seems to have hung, one keys/clicks: dah dit dah dit dah dah dit dah ? From ajft@ajft.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 09:56:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31991 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 09:56:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31983 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 09:56:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 09:56:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DB9019F20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4772319F12; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 76DF119F15; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:55:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ALPHA8.ITS.MONASH.EDU.AU (alpha8.its.monash.edu.au [130.194.1.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEC4619C88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:55:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([130.194.13.85]) by vaxh.its.monash.edu.au (PMDF V5.2-31 #39306) with ESMTP id <01L7D7GB1HZ4909EOM@vaxh.its.monash.edu.au> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:31:40 +1100 Received: from broink.its.monash.edu.au (localhost.its.monash.edu.au [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A454158004 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 11:31:40 +1100 (EST) Received: from ajft.org (pc-949122.its.monash.edu.au [130.194.3.169]) (user ajft) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-MD5 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by broink.its.monash.edu.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D08C120004 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 11:31:40 +1100 (EST) From: Adrian Tritschler Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-reply-to: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <4047CA2C.8010703@ajft.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040221) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: ajft@ajft.org List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 11:30:36 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Presotto wrote: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 Microsoft OLE DB Provider for ODBC Drivers error '80040e4d' [Microsoft][ODBC Microsoft Access Driver] Too many client tasks. /newshop/araneabasket.asp, line 28 oh well. Adrian From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 10:06:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 343 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 10:06:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 339 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 10:06:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 10:06:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2270819F1D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0231F19F24; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:06:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E581719D5A; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:05:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76AFB19F12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:05:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6658104ca05dfcf2d3be65911b04b95a@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rnnkhplgxrbgvxucnbnosqztws" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:05:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rnnkhplgxrbgvxucnbnosqztws Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I remade ape.html and it comes out right. I think what was there was the output of some previous version of ms2html. --upas-rnnkhplgxrbgvxucnbnosqztws Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 19:05:27 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 19:05:24 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1426719EE0; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:05:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D86D819E1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:05:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE45E19C20; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:04:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A01719D5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2501Bki073533 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2501BL1073532 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] APE paper Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:01:11 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, The paper about APE at http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/ape.html has turned to be much longer than I though it was. I am not saying it is a excuse for the story with hypot, but in my browser, it ends on the paragraph about BSD_EXTENSION (in Mozilla Firebird). It does rightfully so because < and > are not escaped, and is just an unknown tag with unterminated content. I understand it is a feature of ms2html. I would like to try to fix it (as soon as I package graphviz -- but dot and neato are working already and drawing nice graphs). David Tolpin --upas-rnnkhplgxrbgvxucnbnosqztws-- From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 10:09:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 838 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 10:09:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 833 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 10:09:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 10:09:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D547719F22; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFCCB19E1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:09:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C5FDD19F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:08:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8EB219E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:08:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9055610b203af7b63c474a35fba0245f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <6658104ca05dfcf2d3be65911b04b95a@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:08:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm remaking everything in /sys/doc, just in case. You might see things in transition of you look over the next few minutes. From geoff@collyer.net Fri Mar 5 13:58:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 10:17:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2098 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 10:17:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2094 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 10:17:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 10:17:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8AB9F19F2E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:17:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D390F19F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:17:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 290C619F1B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:16:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (mail.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E854E19E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:16:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <06c901c40239$b62e5e20$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:16:06 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you long for morse code, try using a Mac with a one-button mouse: click click-click click. Gesture recognition may be a bad idea; if computers could recognise my gestures, any Windows machines I use would be smoking heaps (I got yer gesture, right here, Gates.) From bs@nospam.com Fri Mar 5 13:58:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 10:28:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3269 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 10:28:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3265 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 10:28:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 10:28:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72CDE19F12; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F5D119C88; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:28:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3B4619CA5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5A7819C88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:27:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004030501270701500rqhk0e>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:27:07 +0000 Message-ID: <4047D7B0.9050506@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper References: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <200403050001.i2501BL1073532@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 20:28:16 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Looks fine on Mozilla 1.4 on Linux (at 8:28pm EST)... > Hi, > > The paper about APE at http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/ape.html > has turned to be much longer than I though it was. I am not saying > it is a excuse for the story with hypot, but in my browser, it ends > on the paragraph about BSD_EXTENSION (in Mozilla Firebird). > > It does rightfully so because < and > are not escaped, and > is just an unknown tag with unterminated content. > > I understand it is a feature of ms2html. I would like to try > to fix it (as soon as I package graphviz -- but dot and neato > are working already and drawing nice graphs). > > David Tolpin > From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 5 13:58:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 11:56:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11748 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 11:56:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11744 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 11:56:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 11:56:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CBAEC19F41; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C6AC19F2F; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75DBA19F22; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:55:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9937519B22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:55:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:59:00 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Gesture recognition may be a bad idea; if computers could recognise my > gestures, any Windows machines I use would be smoking heaps (I got yer > gesture, right here, Gates.) the "hitchiker's guide.." should be made an official religion. after all it has the answer of the ultimate question. among its lines we read (what inspired my original gesture post, s/radios/computer/): The machine was rather difficult to operate. For years radios had been operated by means of pressing buttons and turning dials; then as the technology became more sophisticated the controls were made touch-sensitive - you merely had to brush the panels with your fingers; now all you had to do was wave your hand in the general direction of the components and hope. It saved a lot of muscular expenditure of course, but meant that you had to sit infuriatingly still if you wanted to keep listening to the same programme. andrey From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 5 13:58:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 11:56:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11790 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 11:56:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11785 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 11:56:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 11:56:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 058BF19F3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F048219F36; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:56:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DB0819980; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:55:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DDA119980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:55:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9eb53bbc05641a6fc2d8847000d10632@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 19:00:07 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Gesture recognition may be a bad idea; if computers could recognise my > gestures, any Windows machines I use would be smoking heaps (I got yer > gesture, right here, Gates.) the "hitchiker's guide.." should be made an official religion. after all it has the answer of the ultimate question. among its lines we read (what inspired my original gesture post, s/radios/computer/): The machine was rather difficult to operate. For years radios had been operated by means of pressing buttons and turning dials; then as the technology became more sophisticated the controls were made touch-sensitive - you merely had to brush the panels with your fingers; now all you had to do was wave your hand in the general direction of the components and hope. It saved a lot of muscular expenditure of course, but meant that you had to sit infuriatingly still if you wanted to keep listening to the same programme. andrey From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 12:46:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15851 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 12:46:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15847 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 12:46:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 12:46:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B75B519F3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:46:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0F7219F3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:46:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F39019F3B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:45:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53A4219F2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:45:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <30f7a0a1916a4854cbbbe9d966b1d653@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:45:06 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Gestures can work the other way too. In an effort to save energy, our bathrooms at work now have motion sensors operating the lights. Something about me seems to not trigger the motion sensors. If I enter just as someone is leaving, everything is fine till I sit down. Then the lights go off and I have wave my hands and jump up and down to get them to turn on the lights so that I can find the sink and avoid sticking my hands in the urinals. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 12:56:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16468 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 12:56:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16464 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 12:56:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 12:56:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1D1B19D5B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:56:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9FCF19D3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C470319D3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:55:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57AA319CB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:55:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i253qeki074117 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i253qeto074116 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <9055610b203af7b63c474a35fba0245f@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm remaking everything in /sys/doc, just in case. You might see things > in transition of you look over the next few minutes. > It contains all the text it needs, but something is still wrong. The second sentence in paragraph about Pcc contains #include #include <<I>file</I>>, displayed as #include <file>; later in the same paragraph, markup formed by 'tt' tags become unbalanced, with many extraneous tags inserted, as one of results, the rest of paragraph after word 'objtype' is printed in fixed-width font. From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:01:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16705 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:01:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16698 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:01:01 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:01:01 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B4D5E19F48; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:00:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94CDC19F3B; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:00:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A9B319D41; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:59:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D745E19D5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:59:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <851fb32466b581046773b125730ca4d7@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mpwclumnbaknileyfvkfcteifl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:59:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mpwclumnbaknileyfvkfcteifl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I know, I'm working on ms2html.c now to figure out what's happening. --upas-mpwclumnbaknileyfvkfcteifl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 22:56:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 4 22:56:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DCBDA19CB7; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:56:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8558519D41; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:56:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C470319D3D; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:55:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57AA319CB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:55:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i253qeki074117 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i253qeto074116 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <9055610b203af7b63c474a35fba0245f@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:52:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm remaking everything in /sys/doc, just in case. You might see things > in transition of you look over the next few minutes. > It contains all the text it needs, but something is still wrong. The second sentence in paragraph about Pcc contains #include #include <<I>file</I>>, displayed as #include <file>; later in the same paragraph, markup formed by 'tt' tags become unbalanced, with many extraneous tags inserted, as one of results, the rest of paragraph after word 'objtype' is printed in fixed-width font. --upas-mpwclumnbaknileyfvkfcteifl-- From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:05:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17051 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:05:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17047 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:05:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:05:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C41019F4C; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:05:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 258EB19D5E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:05:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E12CD19F31; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13C1D19D59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:04:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <68a4921b679f0dcd8d5b638f0f522b0a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:08:49 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It contains all the text it needs, but something is still wrong. > The second sentence in paragraph about Pcc contains > > #include #include <<I>file</I>>, displayed > as #include <file>; later in the same paragraph, markup formed > by 'tt' tags become unbalanced, with many extraneous tags inserted, > as one of results, the rest of paragraph after word 'objtype' is > printed in fixed-width font. just page the postscript files from /sys/doc... From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:17:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18017 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:17:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18013 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:17:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:17:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2AEC19CD5; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:17:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A12D819C93; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:17:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E705119C89; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:16:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00BB019BB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:16:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8b2f3a87ad98c07d4e1c4a642c843c4f@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:16:44 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Its clear I had no idea how troff works when I wrote ms2html. This isn't going to be fixed any time soon. It isn't just the APE paper. From jas@corpus-callosum.com Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:24:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19003 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:24:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18999 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:24:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:24:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 912B919D29; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC83A19C49; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:24:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4FEAD19BD3; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:23:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE09619AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i254NHfK090211 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:23:17 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Jeff Sickel X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Subject: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:23:12 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: After doing a fresh install (today) to update my machine to fossil, I noticed a few quirks that just needed a slight fix: lp based commands like 'man -t man | page -w' would error out with converting from troff to postscript... /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout: rc (lp): can't open: permission denied reading through postscript... cannot find end of first line The fix is just to create /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout a-rw-rw-rw- M 63 sys sys 0 Mar 4 21:56 /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout So for fossil either create your own stdout to use: mkdir $home/lib/log bind -c $home/lib/log /sys/lib/lp/log _or_: echo 'srv -AWP fs.noauth' >> /srv/fscons mount /srv/fs.noauth /n/fossil bind -bc /n/fossil/sys/lib/lp/log /sys/lib/lp/log man -t man | page -w exit As the file is 666, it doesn't really matter who the owner is in the long run. jas From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:43:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20978 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:43:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20973 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:43:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:43:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9652819D61; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:43:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 399F319C88; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:43:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A613119C9E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:42:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DD5F19C70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:42:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i254gkjt022515 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:42:46 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i254gktN018877 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:42:46 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i254gkfQ026555 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:42:46 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar In-Reply-To: <20040304202107.GB11430@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:42:45 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: on an unrelated note I noticed that you don't seem to be able to make a rio with borderless windows (don't ask). I.e. I compiled a rio with the various 'window edge' constants in defs.h set to 0, but there is a Border defined in /sys/include/draw.h that is fixed at 4. So you kind of get borderless windows, but then as programs draw in them there is clearly still a border. Which led to some curiousity for me: any reason that there is a border in (I guess) libdraw? ron From bakul@BitBlocks.com Fri Mar 5 13:58:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 13:46:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21229 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 13:46:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21222 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 13:46:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 13:46:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19E7A19D5E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:46:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7555F19D31; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:46:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A00019C9E; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:45:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.bitblocks.com (bitblocks.com [209.204.185.216]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5FDB19D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 23:45:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from bitblocks.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gate.bitblocks.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i254j4HA027118 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 20:45:05 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from bakul@bitblocks.com) Message-Id: <200403050445.i254j4HA027118@gate.bitblocks.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 04 Mar 2004 21:42:45 MST." From: Bakul Shah Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 20:45:04 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Which led to some curiousity for me: any reason that there is a border in > (I guess) libdraw? Wrong gestures. From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 14:04:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22857 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 14:04:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22853 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 14:04:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 14:04:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3927019D5E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:04:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67EC919D31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:04:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BDE719D11; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:03:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAA2219D11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:03:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2553ajt024166 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:03:36 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2553atN021670 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:03:36 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2553afQ027152 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:03:36 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: <05f501c40234$f3b38540$67844051@SOMA> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:03:35 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=LINES_OF_YELLING autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, 4 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > > you're serious? build an enigma kit? > > we don't fuck around at insultant.net QWERT ASDFG CGASD GDFGA YUIOP HJKLM AADBC ETRCU From lucio@proxima.alt.za Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 14:05:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22897 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 14:05:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22893 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 14:05:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 14:05:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ADF8C19D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E42519E9C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:05:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4290319D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0707819D31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:04:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2550KW09385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:00:21 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <151aed208c2faadadc5698ed3e94c592@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:03:45 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 Microsoft OLE DB Provider for ODBC Drivers error '80040e4d' [Microsoft][ODBC Microsoft Access Driver] Too many client tasks. /newshop/araneabasket.asp, line 28 So there you are, slashdotted! ++L From rob@mightycheese.com Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 14:18:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24022 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 14:18:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24014 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 14:18:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 14:18:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79DD719CDF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:18:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8065519F52; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:18:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1A4019CAE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:17:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6196C19CDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 00:17:41 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-27-103.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.27.103]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i255HcFp027891 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:17:39 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <8b2f3a87ad98c07d4e1c4a642c843c4f@plan9.bell-labs.com> References: <8b2f3a87ad98c07d4e1c4a642c843c4f@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <7A20748C-6E64-11D8-87B0-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:18:03 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Its clear I had no idea how troff works when I wrote > ms2html. This isn't going to be fixed any time soon. > It isn't just the APE paper. the quality would suffer, but you could easily adapt ms2html to use troff2html, which knows much more about troff but a lot less about html. -rob From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 15:18:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28862 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 15:18:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28858 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 15:18:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 15:18:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 32A4219BB8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:18:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A09A19BEF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:18:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4A7919BEF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:17:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41F4719BB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:17:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:18:24 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > lp based commands like 'man -t man | page -w' would error out with > converting from troff to postscript... > /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout: rc (lp): can't open: permission denied > reading through postscript... > cannot find end of first line curious, I have no error for the above command... > The fix is just to create /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout > > a-rw-rw-rw- M 63 sys sys 0 Mar 4 21:56 /sys/lib/lp/log/stdout /rc/bin/lp has lines of LPLOG=$LPLOGDIR/$LPDEST if (! test -e $LPLOG) { >$LPLOG chmod +rwa $LPLOG >[2]/dev/null } so, it will be made automatically if not. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 15:26:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29569 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 15:26:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29565 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 15:26:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 15:26:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9E85619CC1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F1EE19BE2; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:26:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B58B19C38; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:25:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF1F519BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:25:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cfc6b127b88a88a5c44a98dbe88f44e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:26:43 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > #include #include <<I>file</I>>, displayed > as #include <file>; later in the same paragraph, curiously, I don't see this. ape.html can be read fine by Links.☺ I also checked of /sys/doc/ape.html of our local version, --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 14176 Apr 28 2002 ape.html --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 12595 Mar 18 2000 ape.ms --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 258779 Jun 13 2000 ape.ps and all the files looks fine to me. Kenji From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 15:36:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30372 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 15:36:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30367 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 15:36:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 15:36:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70A7D19D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4256019C38; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:36:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7202119C38; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:35:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA0E019C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:34:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5d2199bf9053e87c62827a04a630fe86@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403042354.i24Ns8tA073468@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:32:52 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>I just didn't realize that, unlike pcc, cc does not issue warnings >>by default. no, presumably because too many old programs lacked prototypes, which indeed they did. -A stops it turning the checking off. From jas@corpus-callosum.com Fri Mar 5 18:04:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 16:11:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1708 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 16:11:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1704 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 16:11:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 16:11:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4338219E38; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:11:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCB5119AC9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:11:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A02E19A95; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:10:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE04219A71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:10:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i257AGfK090478 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:10:16 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <2423B1C4-6E74-11D8-8A93-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:10:10 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mar 5, 2004, at 12:18 AM, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > /rc/bin/lp has lines of > > LPLOG=$LPLOGDIR/$LPDEST > if (! test -e $LPLOG) { > >$LPLOG > chmod +rwa $LPLOG >[2]/dev/null > } > so, it will be made automatically if not. It would depend on if you have permissions to /sys/lib/lp/log or not. Right after a fresh (yesterday or today) install, /sys/lib/lp/log has the permissions sys.sys 775, so glenda couldn't create the $LPLOG file, unless you added glenda into the sys group before running lp. jas From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Fri Mar 5 18:04:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 17:53:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11568 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 17:53:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11564 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 17:53:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 17:53:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E87A919F69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:53:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B908419DA1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:53:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD78819D8D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3F9819D94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:52:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <2423B1C4-6E74-11D8-8A93-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:53:25 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > /sys/lib/lp/log has > the permissions sys.sys 775, so glenda couldn't create the $LPLOG file, > unless you added glenda into the sys group before running lp. Yes, I checked souces's /sys/lib/lp/log permission, and found you are right. It was long time ago when I, probably, made change it locally here, and I've forgotten it. Kenji From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 20:45:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 18:12:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12778 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 18:12:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12773 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 18:12:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 18:12:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A9F719F67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 570CC19D94; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:12:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E21E119D94; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:11:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from web13125.mail.yahoo.com (web13125.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.143]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A73FE19D6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:11:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.179.3.149] by web13125.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 01:11:34 PST From: dave cummings To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:11:34 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: So...I see in the archives that someone, brucee? had done work on the ps2 and had come up with the e compiler for the r5900. I'm wondering if there's source anywhere for the plan 9 port and what the latest status was with using the GS as a framebuffer, or something. I've got a ps2 and the linux kit, and, well, it's got the biggest HD, sure would be a nice cpu/file server! Thanks -dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Search - Find what youre looking for faster http://search.yahoo.com From paurea@lsub.org Fri Mar 5 20:45:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 18:15:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13007 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 18:15:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13001 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 18:15:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 18:15:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D11F919F67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:15:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2287D19F5A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:15:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC1B519D94; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:14:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BC6119D62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:14:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <050053c3b98432a7545c9f6fcc2e6479@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: <9eb53bbc05641a6fc2d8847000d10632@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Gesture recognition may be a bad idea; if computers could recognise my >> gestures, any Windows machines I use would be smoking heaps (I got yer >> gesture, right here, Gates.) > > the "hitchiker's guide.." should be made an official religion. after It is already here for some of us. I have an altar with "Don't Panic" in golden letters at home :-). G. From geoff@collyer.net Fri Mar 5 20:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 18:41:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15476 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 18:41:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15416 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 18:41:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 18:41:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B5C219D8B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:41:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEC9C19D5A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:41:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D99919A15; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:40:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3781C19A19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 04:40:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:40:00 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i initially thought `e compiler' was a typo, but it appears twice in the original message. has brucee developed a language that makes you happy and increases your empathy? i believe that's banned in the us under the controlled language analog act. From philo@privacy.net Fri Mar 5 20:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 19:07:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20991 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 19:07:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20986 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 19:07:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 19:07:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 534C219CC1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 741CB19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2C72D19C91; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7C2019C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AzC7i-0002e2-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:00:06 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: <104fh4f55m7cg0a@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com References: Subject: [9fans] Re: Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:59:43 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Thanks for all the replies... looks like I have a lot of reading to do! From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 20:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 19:07:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21013 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 19:07:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21009 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 19:07:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 19:07:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2FF619CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D44F19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3430F19BFA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B012219C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AzC7i-0002e8-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:00:06 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104g93v358tkf75@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] another possible board Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:59:58 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ron minnich wrote: > check out the MOPS 520. It's a nice fanless low power board, which could > be stacked and put in a can. I'll try it out with a kernel this or next > week. > > I keep wanting a 'backpack cluster', don't know why, but I don't want to > have to have a 15-lb BFB to power it. > > ron > wearable supercomputing :-) From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 20:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 19:08:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21025 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 19:08:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21021 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 19:08:00 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 19:08:00 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1EC0619D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8D6719D5A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA73C19C31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9853919C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AzC8G-0002fS-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:00:40 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104gajknvpufd7a@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:00:08 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i think it was meant as goto step 7 again (read) seems one can never do that enough here :-) From forsyth@terzarima.net Fri Mar 5 20:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 19:31:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22898 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 19:31:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22891 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 19:31:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 19:31:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96E5919CDD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:31:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C797D19CB9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:31:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B93519BAD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:30:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58B1E19B37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:30:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <104gajknvpufd7a@corp.supernews.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dqwgiynpsokhgyyqvgzjrqolui" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:28:29 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dqwgiynpsokhgyyqvgzjrqolui Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it's meant to stop you finding the bugs, because you're spending your time reading. --upas-dqwgiynpsokhgyyqvgzjrqolui Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Mar 5 10:07:35 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2393C19C91; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D95F919D5B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:07:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA73C19C31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9853919C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:06:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AzC8G-0002fS-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:00:40 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104gajknvpufd7a@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: , Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:00:08 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i think it was meant as goto step 7 again (read) seems one can never do that enough here :-) --upas-dqwgiynpsokhgyyqvgzjrqolui-- From 9nut@9netics.com Fri Mar 5 20:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 19:52:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25764 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 19:52:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25136 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 19:50:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 19:50:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 731A919C91; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C4AA19BFA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:50:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7C2B419C91; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5DBF19B6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 05:49:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <30f7a0a1916a4854cbbbe9d966b1d653@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 03:50:11 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Gestures can work the other way too. I believe Italians have the best gestures in the world. Perhaps we should tap into that. There are at least three (Italian) hand gestures that I use on Windows regularly. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 20:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:37:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30513 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:37:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30506 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:37:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:37:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1CD219C98; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:37:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57B7819C0F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:37:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBB1019BAD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:36:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82647199E0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:36:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315013-31056>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:35:14 -0500 Message-ID: <087c01c402a5$b4aaac40$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <7eaeeca7ba860f74bdcb2e30cd8f5d3a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> <06c901c40239$b62e5e20$67844051@SOMA> <20040305003313.A2766@edinburgh.cisco.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:33:36 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > dah dit dah dit dah dah dit dah ? CQ From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 20:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:40:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30663 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:40:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30658 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:40:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:40:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0CA1119D31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:40:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1424919C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:40:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BD7119C31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:39:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F05E19C0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:39:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314767-29685>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:38:23 -0500 Message-ID: <088f01c402a6$2458e9d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:36:44 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Gesture recognition may be a bad idea; if computers could recognise my > gestures, .... oh, i think the 9x19mm 124 grain FMJ parabellum would get their attention ;) From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:49:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31264 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:49:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31254 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:49:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:49:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF58119D41; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:49:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B31319C67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:49:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6046E19CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:48:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED84219C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:48:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <453826-14985>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:47:41 -0500 Message-ID: <08e601c402a7$70f75d70$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:46:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=LINES_OF_YELLING autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > QWERT ASDFG CGASD GDFGA YUIOP HJKLM AADBC > > ETRCU # of rotors [3 or 4 (naval)]? steckers, rotor order, rotors ... but the QWERT looks like a troll ;) From philo@privacy.net Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:52:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31365 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:52:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31354 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:52:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:52:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1CD6D19D1E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:52:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D113E19C31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:52:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63FF519C31; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:51:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED8E219C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:51:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1AzDpv-0004tP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 11:49:51 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: philo Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: , , <104gajknvpufd7a@corp.supernews.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Newbie Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:49:39 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * "Dave Cummings" wrote in message news:104gajknvpufd7a@corp.supernews.com... > i think it was meant as goto step 7 again (read) seems one can never do > that enough here :-) aah yes... well i shall be continuing my reading and poking around... but so far i find the whole thing rather fascinating. Plan 9 has a few features that i can only describe as: "so obviously correct, that no one has ever thought of them before!" From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:56:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31524 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:56:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31520 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:56:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:56:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1381519D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:56:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9A0A19C67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D97B19C98; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:55:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0BF019C31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:55:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log In-Reply-To: <2423B1C4-6E74-11D8-8A93-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-syzaaviwnjunpjczgnljqkymib" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:55:00 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-syzaaviwnjunpjczgnljqkymib Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit thanks, I just made /sys/lib/lp/log 777 on sources. --upas-syzaaviwnjunpjczgnljqkymib Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 02:11:21 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 02:11:18 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10EB919D67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:11:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA26619A95; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:11:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A02E19A95; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:10:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE04219A71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 02:10:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i257AGfK090478 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:10:16 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <2423B1C4-6E74-11D8-8A93-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: /sys/lib/lp/log To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:10:10 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mar 5, 2004, at 12:18 AM, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > /rc/bin/lp has lines of > > LPLOG=$LPLOGDIR/$LPDEST > if (! test -e $LPLOG) { > >$LPLOG > chmod +rwa $LPLOG >[2]/dev/null > } > so, it will be made automatically if not. It would depend on if you have permissions to /sys/lib/lp/log or not. Right after a fresh (yesterday or today) install, /sys/lib/lp/log has the permissions sys.sys 775, so glenda couldn't create the $LPLOG file, unless you added glenda into the sys group before running lp. jas --upas-syzaaviwnjunpjczgnljqkymib-- From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 20:57:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31572 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 20:57:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31568 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 20:57:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 20:57:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E992219D5B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5301E19D1E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:57:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5486219D1E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:56:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E097119D31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:56:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper In-Reply-To: <1cfc6b127b88a88a5c44a98dbe88f44e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jwbxqyhnwisafjvflbeqydxgez" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:56:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jwbxqyhnwisafjvflbeqydxgez Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I fixed ms2html somewhat last night and then fixed ape.html. I went and read the troff reference manual and figured out what I did wrong processing macro args. I still can't make troff.html but I know why. I'll have it fixed this morning, ran out of time last night. --upas-jwbxqyhnwisafjvflbeqydxgez Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 01:26:27 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 01:26:24 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C577C19D3E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:26:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D95A819BEF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:26:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B58B19C38; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:25:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF1F519BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:25:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cfc6b127b88a88a5c44a98dbe88f44e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] APE paper From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <200403050352.i253qeto074116@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:26:43 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > #include #include <<I>file</I>>, displayed > as #include <file>; later in the same paragraph,=20 curiously, I don't see this. ape.html can be read fine by Links.=E2=98=BA I also checked of /sys/doc/ape.html of our local version, --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 14176 Apr 28 2002 ape.html --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 12595 Mar 18 2000 ape.ms --rw-rw-r-- M 9 sys sys 258779 Jun 13 2000 ape.ps and all the files looks fine to me. Kenji --upas-jwbxqyhnwisafjvflbeqydxgez-- From trickey@lucent.com Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:14:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32389 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:14:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32385 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:14:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:14:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEAE919D06; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:14:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B24AD19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:14:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8F7E919C67; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:13:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from hoemail2.firewall.lucent.com (hoemail2.lucent.com [192.11.226.163]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4714E19B53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:13:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from nj9620exch001p.wins.lucent.com (h135-222-4-21.lucent.com [135.222.4.21]) by hoemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.8) with ESMTP id i25CDTc27955 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 06:13:29 -0600 (CST) Received: by nj9620exch001p.mh.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) id ; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:13:28 -0500 Message-ID: From: "Trickey, Howard W (Howard)" To: "'9fans@cse.psu.edu'" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: RE: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2657.72) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:13:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ape was a 'failure of vision'. > The 'vision' for ape was unrelated to plan 9. Andrew Hume and I wanted a way to use the same source for our 1127-developed programs on the diverse set of machines we had in the late 80's - Research Unix (v10), Suns, SGI's, and Plan 9. Before the days of very good ANSI/POSIX compliance. Yes, we could remove ape from plan 9 now, if someone cares to port the remaining ape-using programs to pure plan 9 - I'd be happy to see that. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:22:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 653 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:22:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 649 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:22:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:22:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FF8D19C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:22:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D55D519CE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:22:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C851819C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:21:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8786919BEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:21:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <454929-14991>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:20:57 -0500 Message-ID: <098c01c402ac$156d6da0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:19:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yes, we could remove ape from plan 9 now, > if someone cares to port the remaining ape-using > programs to pure plan 9 - I'd be happy to see that. i'm with you, captain ... From paurea@lsub.org Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:25:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 805 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:25:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 801 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:25:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:25:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19A8E19CE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E658919C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:25:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC92919C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:24:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7495519BEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:24:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:24:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Yes, we could remove ape from plan 9 now, > if someone cares to port the remaining ape-using > programs to pure plan 9 - I'd be happy to see that. I would like to see the programs ported, but I wouldn't dump ape lightly. It is useful for little programs like converters for exotic file types you don't really care to port. It is also useful for gradually porting programs (like links for example...). G. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:26:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 894 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:26:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 890 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:26:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:26:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC0CF19C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:26:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A264319D06; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:26:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4ED419C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:25:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05A9A19BEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:25:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25COriq009352 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:24:54 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25COrHk009351 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:24:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051224.i25COrHk009351@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:24:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Yes, we could remove ape from plan 9 now, > if someone cares to port the remaining ape-using > programs to pure plan 9 - I'd be happy to see that. I trust your experience and philosophy; however, with the very purpose of converting non plan9 programs to plan9 layout (mk instead of make, and posix source or native APIs), one could consider keeping APE. Ape helps eat an elephant -- one bite at a time. If one is able to compile a program under ape, and make it run, he has a value under Plan9 he may wish to increase by continuing development in Plan9 enviroment with Plan9 tools. If one has to spend that effort just to initially get the value he has on many other platforms, he will simply use it elsewhere. David Tolpin From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 21:33:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:27:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 921 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:27:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 917 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:27:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:27:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5285D19C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:27:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EFE219C66; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:27:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E4D4F19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:26:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EF0D19CEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:26:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <455508-14992>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:25:17 -0500 Message-ID: <09a101c402ac$b0147e20$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:23:34 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 guess that's it, but in the gift shop it's 99.99 quid -- i _nearly_ bought one, but had a better idea. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:34:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1279 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:34:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1275 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:34:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:34:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A36219CE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:34:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEF7219B53; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:34:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BECC19BEF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:33:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DED0519A23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:33:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314858-31059>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:32:34 -0500 Message-ID: <09a901c402ad$b4209b10$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:30:44 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I would like to see the programs ported, but I wouldn't dump > ape lightly. NO!! This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter From paurea@lsub.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:37:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1497 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:37:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1487 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:37:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:37:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D59119CE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:37:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00CA819C79; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F28A819CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:36:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F05419C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:36:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141825a1464a7a5d69ff1261bd3f2198@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: <09a901c402ad$b4209b10$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:36:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. Yes. Things are done for reasons. I have given mines. What are yours?. :-). G. From nemo@lsub.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:39:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1575 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:39:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1571 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:39:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:39:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A89DB19D1E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 619F519CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83B4019CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:38:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 785DA19C89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:38:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <141825a1464a7a5d69ff1261bd3f2198@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gxnsilxkyxawkgxhrcjbpeeuie" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:38:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gxnsilxkyxawkgxhrcjbpeeuie Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry boyd, I'll cancel his account. Just didn't notice earlier. --upas-gxnsilxkyxawkgxhrcjbpeeuie Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Mar 5 13:37:33 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E4CF319CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:37:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00CA819C79; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F28A819CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:36:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F05419C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:36:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <141825a1464a7a5d69ff1261bd3f2198@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: <09a901c402ad$b4209b10$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:36:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. Yes. Things are done for reasons. I have given mines. What are yours?. :-). G. --upas-gxnsilxkyxawkgxhrcjbpeeuie-- From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:39:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1583 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:39:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1579 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:39:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:39:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79F6219D41; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA02119D3C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 528CF19C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B5E619BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:38:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <326148-16230>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:37:09 -0500 Message-ID: <09af01c402ae$565da800$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> <09a101c402ac$b0147e20$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:35:24 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 > > guess that's it, but in the gift shop it's 99.99 quid -- i _nearly_ bought > one, but had a better idea. i stand corrected. it's the same thing, but at the gitshop (sic) it's cheaper. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:42:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1815 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:42:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1811 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:42:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:42:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F0B219D5B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D566E19CE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:42:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9523F19CE9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:41:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E1BB19C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:41:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <326684-16235>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:39:32 -0500 Message-ID: <09b501c402ae$acfd1a10$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403051224.i25COrHk009351@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:37:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I trust your experience and philosophy; however, with > the very purpose of converting non plan9 programs to > plan9 layout (mk instead of make, and posix source or > native APIs), one could consider keeping APE. mk has been around since [reaches for 9th Ed manual] 9th Ed -- ca sept 1986 From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:50:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2691 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:50:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2687 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:50:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:50:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22EF519C58; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3870519C3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:50:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB48319C13; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:49:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4EF2719C3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:49:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <455882-14993>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:48:44 -0500 Message-ID: <09cc01c402af$f5c690e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <141825a1464a7a5d69ff1261bd3f2198@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:46:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yes. Things are done for reasons. I have given mines. What are > yours?. :-). mine? i think ken summed it up best: oh, boyd, he's a unix enthusiast ca 198[89], just as the plan 9 rubber was about to hit the road. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 21:58:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3510 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 21:58:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3506 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 21:58:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 21:58:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0119D19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A12E319C3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:58:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5178F19C3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:58:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CBA119AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:57:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <327538-16226>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:50:51 -0500 Message-ID: <09dc01c402b0$40d1afc0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:49:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Sorry boyd, I'll cancel his account. > Just didn't notice earlier. i'm all for helping people out, but this is not AA. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:06:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3877 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3872 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:06:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43CE519D06; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:06:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AC9C19C89; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:06:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 233F619CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:05:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5138419C58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:05:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25D4uiq009594 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:04:56 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25D4utH009593 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:04:56 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051304.i25D4utH009593@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:04:56 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, ape/math.h defines Inf, isInf, NaN, isNaN; but I cannot find them in either ISO C standard, or my POSIX reference. Inf results in a name conflict with an otherwise POSIX compliant source. Instead, ISO/IEC 9989:1999 (The ISO C Standard) defines isinf() and isnan() macros, which are absent from the library. David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:28:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4874 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:28:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4870 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:28:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:28:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7CC7419D35; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:28:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7120219D1E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:28:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F025919C93; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:27:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AF3819CE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:27:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25DPjiq009671 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:25:45 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25DPjuu009670 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:25:45 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051325.i25DPjuu009670@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:25:45 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, COND LIST and COMMA are not supported by C compiler for vlong. Is it a feature or an omission? From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:42:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5767 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:42:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5763 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:42:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:42:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2E8419A9B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:42:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4A9719CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:42:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E10719A9B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:41:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0700319AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:41:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d1e553f5885573e30ebe41b3b5e18ef@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <200403051325.i25DPjuu009670@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:40:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > COND LIST and COMMA are not supported by C compiler for vlong. > Is it a feature or an omission? Its clearly an omission and I know that ken intended it. Is that what you're asking? From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:44:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5897 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:44:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5890 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:44:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:44:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D405A19CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:44:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91E6719CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:44:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD96A19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:43:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EC0319A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:43:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25Dh2iq009726 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:43:02 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25Dh2n2009725 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:43:02 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051343.i25Dh2n2009725@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:43:02 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 1 extern char **Files; 2 3 typedef struct { 4 char **Files; 5 } Ta; 6 7 static char **Files = 0; 8c -c test.c test.c:7 external redeclaration of: Files STATIC IND IND CHAR test.c:7 EXTERN IND IND CHAR test.c:4 I.e. instead of reporting 1st and 7th lines with conflicting declarations, the compiler reports the 7th line and a field in struct, which is from a different space. David From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:46:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6019 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:46:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6015 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:46:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:46:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72DF819D3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:46:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D227619D25; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:46:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1E0B19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:45:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D30E019A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25Dj5iq009754 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25Dj5CJ009753 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051345.i25Dj5CJ009753@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <7d1e553f5885573e30ebe41b3b5e18ef@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Its clearly an omission and I know that ken intended it. Is that > what you're asking? > graphviz has a package tools/sfio which is of not much use under plan9 (and not used by basic graphviz tools), but which macros rely heavily on COMMA. If not supporting COMMA is phisolophy, I will be trying to rewrite those macros to compile, but there are really a lot things to change. If it is an omission, I can leave sfio out of the port and write a comment about it in hope it will be implemented sometimes in the future. David From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:51:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6388 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:51:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6384 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:51:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:51:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 86F4B19CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:51:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40D7319CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:51:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C90D619CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:50:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F83F19C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:50:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <200403051345.i25Dj5CJ009753@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pyeuypivvlgqqcfrzdqtmfllrs" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:50:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pyeuypivvlgqqcfrzdqtmfllrs Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm assuming that by COMMA you mean expressions separated by COMMAs? If so, that is supported. I thought you meant vlong comma separated expressions or is that really what you mean? --upas-pyeuypivvlgqqcfrzdqtmfllrs Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 08:46:27 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 08:46:24 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 041F919A9B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:46:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9094119A9B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:46:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1E0B19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:45:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D30E019A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25Dj5iq009754 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25Dj5CJ009753 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051345.i25Dj5CJ009753@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <7d1e553f5885573e30ebe41b3b5e18ef@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Its clearly an omission and I know that ken intended it. Is that > what you're asking? > graphviz has a package tools/sfio which is of not much use under plan9 (and not used by basic graphviz tools), but which macros rely heavily on COMMA. If not supporting COMMA is phisolophy, I will be trying to rewrite those macros to compile, but there are really a lot things to change. If it is an omission, I can leave sfio out of the port and write a comment about it in hope it will be implemented sometimes in the future. David --upas-pyeuypivvlgqqcfrzdqtmfllrs-- From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:55:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6672 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:55:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6668 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:55:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:55:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D621219CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80A8119D25; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:55:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DEF8019CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:54:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3431119C73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:54:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25Ds3iq009812 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:54:03 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25Ds3IZ009811 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:54:03 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051354.i25Ds3IZ009811@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:54:03 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm assuming that by COMMA you mean expressions separated by > COMMAs? If so, that is supported. I thought you meant vlong > comma separated expressions or is that really what you mean? cpu% cat testv.c #include vlong foo() { vlong x=1; vlong y=2; vlong z; z=x,y; return z; } cpu% 8c -c testv.c testv.c:8 unknown vlong COMMA From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 22:59:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6934 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 22:59:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6926 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 22:59:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 22:59:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1ABDD19D3C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 263CB19CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA56619CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EC1619C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c1c0d3934feb2e46663047bdc455f2b@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <200403051354.i25Ds3IZ009811@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: right, no vlong COMMA. Your previous message confused me, it said that COMMA was not supported which it is in general. If and when brucee does his thing and we have new vlong support, it will work. Right now, vlong is a very strangely supported type. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:00:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7055 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:00:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7051 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:00:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:00:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DCA4A19D61; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A618B19D3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:00:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70D4919D41; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1234B19C73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315532-31056>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:58 -0500 Message-ID: <007d01c402b9$c1a13770$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403051343.i25Dh2n2009725@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:57:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 7 static char **Files = 0; err, who in their right mind codes the above? From dbailey27@ameritech.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:02:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7197 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:02:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7193 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:02:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:02:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16DFF19D3F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:02:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AD4A19C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:02:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC00019D3C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:01:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69C1219CEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:01:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25E1L3l209106; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:01:21 -0500 Message-ID: <9ce153dca415b50194d8cd5d36478f42@yourdomain.dom> To: presotto@closedmind.org, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: brucee@chunder.com Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <4c1c0d3934feb2e46663047bdc455f2b@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ajqknmukftyruyywsxfleerjsp" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:55:54 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ajqknmukftyruyywsxfleerjsp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave said: > If and when brucee does his thing and we have new vlong support, > it will work. Right now, vlong is a very strangely supported type. What is entailed in (fixing?) vlong support? --upas-ajqknmukftyruyywsxfleerjsp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Apparently-To: dbailey27@ameritech.net via web80509.mail.yahoo.com; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:59:22 -0800 Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mx1-klmzmi.klmzmi.ameritech.net (67.36.55.28) by mta823.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:59:22 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [130.203.4.6] Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mx1-klmzmi.klmzmi.ameritech.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25DxKuD012044 for ; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 07:59:21 -0600 (CST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 52D7619C3D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 583A919CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA56619CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EC1619C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c1c0d3934feb2e46663047bdc455f2b@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <200403051354.i25Ds3IZ009811@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: right, no vlong COMMA. Your previous message confused me, it said that COMMA was not supported which it is in general. If and when brucee does his thing and we have new vlong support, it will work. Right now, vlong is a very strangely supported type. --upas-ajqknmukftyruyywsxfleerjsp-- From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:04:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7230 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:04:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7225 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:04:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:04:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83A4219D41; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:04:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 445E919CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:04:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D33BB19CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:03:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 270BD19D6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:03:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3f53cc80a6ec3faca4d303b3c687371c@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting In-Reply-To: <007d01c402b9$c1a13770$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cginguxqbcvwycjtljpdozenmz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:03:26 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cginguxqbcvwycjtljpdozenmz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit dinna matter, we should get the error line right. --upas-cginguxqbcvwycjtljpdozenmz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 09:00:52 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 09:00:49 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B58319CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:00:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CD7119CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:00:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70D4919D41; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1234B19C73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:59:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315532-31056>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:58:58 -0500 Message-ID: <007d01c402b9$c1a13770$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403051343.i25Dh2n2009725@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:57:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 7 static char **Files = 0; err, who in their right mind codes the above? --upas-cginguxqbcvwycjtljpdozenmz-- From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:10:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:05:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7352 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:05:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7348 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:05:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:05:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0F72619C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF44D19C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:05:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1299D19D5B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:04:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20A3119C73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:04:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25E3riq009866 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:03:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25E3rlf009865 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:03:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051403.i25E3rlf009865@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <4c1c0d3934feb2e46663047bdc455f2b@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:03:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > If and when brucee does his thing and we have new vlong support, > it will work. Right now, vlong is a very strangely supported type. > Ok, so typedef long long off_t; expressions are left for later support when available in the compiler. David From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 5 23:10:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:07:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7433 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:07:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7429 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:07:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:07:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B31D819CE9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEA0B19BC3; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:07:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FDB919B62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:06:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4093A19AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:06:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <702df41a472275811c3ab02ef5e80f8a@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] ape math Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:06:33 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What do you call 2 bannanas + 2 bannanas = 3 banannas? I've added isinf and isnan macros to the ape math.h's. I'm not ready to nuke ape. Could anyone that hates ape please just ignore that its there unless you've all of a sudden volunteered to maintain all the code? From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:11:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7632 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:11:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7625 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:11:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:11:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 607B219D06; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE43019C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:11:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AACA219C20; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:10:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2102519AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:10:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25E9Tiq009906 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:29 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25E9T9g009905 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:29 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051409.i25E9T9g009905@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting In-Reply-To: <3f53cc80a6ec3faca4d303b3c687371c@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:29 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: "boyd, rounin" > > > 7 static char **Files = 0; > > err, who in their right mind codes the above? Emden R. Gansner of AT&T Research. From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:17:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8010 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:17:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8006 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:17:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:17:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B14919D3C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9345419CE9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8372F19CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:16:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56F7419C1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:16:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <316758-31059>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:15:22 -0500 Message-ID: <00d001c402bc$0b0b3e90$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <9ce153dca415b50194d8cd5d36478f42@yourdomain.dom> Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:13:32 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What is entailed in (fixing?) vlong support? fixing and a shitload of testing. From forsyth@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:17:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8023 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:17:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8019 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:17:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:17:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 40D2C19D8B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA40119D5E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD45E19C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:16:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3BB319C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:16:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <59742f7c586c86c4ab93ad9e0c8aa922@vitanuova.com> From: C H Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: <9ce153dca415b50194d8cd5d36478f42@yourdomain.dom> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:21:30 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>What is entailed in (fixing?) vlong support? the compiler quite early on converts most vlong operators to function calls. fixing it requires implementing it properly, which eventually requires changing all the code generators, not just 8c/8l. From dbailey27@ameritech.net Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:18:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8038 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:18:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8034 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:18:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:18:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4042819D6A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:18:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA3CE19D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:18:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 699F919D4B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.78]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57DC719CD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25EHHTq023532; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:18 -0500 Message-ID: <171eddc6dcf57d066672f9677b82e7fb@yourdomain.dom> To: dvd@davidashen.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <200403051409.i25E9T9g009905@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:11:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > Emden R. Gansner of AT&T Research. G. R. Emlin ...? From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:20:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8170 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:20:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8166 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:20:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:20:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1337F19D6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:20:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B880519D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:20:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E4A9F19D35; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:19:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A45A319C5D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:19:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <316566-29687>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:18:39 -0500 Message-ID: <00e001c402bc$7fcac980$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <702df41a472275811c3ab02ef5e80f8a@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ape math MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:16:47 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ... Could anyone that hates ape please > just ignore that its there unless you've all of a sudden > volunteered to maintain all the code? well i'd do it but it would involve: a) cash b) the right to add a diagnostic "do a native port, idiot" From boyd@insultant.net Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:22:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8304 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:22:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8300 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:22:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:22:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8821019D3C; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:22:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D87C519CD6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB79C19CE9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8992719D3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:21:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <396013-23065>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:19:53 -0500 Message-ID: <00e801c402bc$ac619500$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403051409.i25E9T9g009905@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:18:03 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Emden R. Gansner of AT&T Research. oh, i thought it was liz bimmler. ho hum, i know NOTHING. From mike@linuxlink.com Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:27:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9252 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:27:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9248 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:27:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:27:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6FD719D81; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:27:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D4D719CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:27:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2DA919CD6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:26:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (66-162-82-131.gen.twtelecom.net [66.162.82.131]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B96AC19A71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:26:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from linuxlink.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D6C98AB75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:26:34 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <40488E1A.4050309@linuxlink.com> From: "Michael H. Collins" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031209 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar References: <30f7a0a1916a4854cbbbe9d966b1d653@plan9.bell-labs.com> In-Reply-To: <30f7a0a1916a4854cbbbe9d966b1d653@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 08:26:34 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Presotto wrote: > Gestures can work the other way too. > > In an effort to save energy, our bathrooms at work now have motion sensors > operating the lights. Something about me seems to not trigger the motion > sensors. If I enter just as someone is leaving, everything is fine till > I sit down. Then the lights go off and I have wave my hands and jump up > and down to get them to turn on the lights so that I can find the sink > and avoid sticking my hands in the urinals. > > Now that is some funny sheite.... I have the same affliction. suX0rs. But when i walk by a street light it cuts off. -- Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://linuxlink.com http://www.gracklenews.com/ From mike@linuxlink.com Fri Mar 5 23:34:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:32:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9518 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:32:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9514 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:32:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:32:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 33DCA19D8F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:32:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2A5A19CE9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:32:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE8BE19D5E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:31:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (66-162-82-131.gen.twtelecom.net [66.162.82.131]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEE8019CE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:31:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from linuxlink.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0B228AB75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:31:11 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <40488F2F.9030107@linuxlink.com> From: "Michael H. Collins" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031209 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 08:31:11 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: having lived in Italy for some years I agree and i use them on winboxen too. Forza Napoli and bah fonguilo Bill. 9nut@9netics.com wrote: >>Gestures can work the other way too. > > > I believe Italians have the best gestures in the world. Perhaps we > should tap into that. > > There are at least three (Italian) hand gestures that I use > on Windows regularly. > > > -- Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://linuxlink.com http://www.gracklenews.com/ From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:45:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10527 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:45:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10501 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:45:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:45:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D6E019D8B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:45:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1EFF19CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:45:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFDD519BDF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:44:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B2D619CEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:44:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <54157a6aa44bcac1878319370e3d839c@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN In-Reply-To: <200403051304.i25D4utH009593@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:43:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>Instead, ISO/IEC 9989:1999 (The ISO C Standard) defines >>isinf() and isnan() macros, which are absent from the library. ape predates c9x, which (i suspect) added those--i don't remember them from the earlier standard--but that's really just a cue for doug gwyn to contradict me. i'd check myself, but for some reason, my c book is always where i am not. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:49:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10648 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:49:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10644 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:49:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:49:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6344219D92; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 286DC19D8E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:49:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4B8219D25; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:48:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD7AA19CEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:48:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25Eljiq059911 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25Eljwo059910 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051447.i25Eljwo059910@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN In-Reply-To: <54157a6aa44bcac1878319370e3d839c@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>Instead, ISO/IEC 9989:1999 (The ISO C Standard) defines > >>isinf() and isnan() macros, which are absent from the library. > > ape predates c9x, which (i suspect) added those--i don't remember > them from the earlier standard--but that's really just a cue > for doug gwyn to contradict me. i'd check myself, but > for some reason, my c book is always where i am not. > For me, the problem was not that isnan was not declared, but that isNaN was. David From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 5 23:59:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11160 invoked by uid 1020); 5 Mar 2004 23:59:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11156 invoked from network); 5 Mar 2004 23:59:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 5 Mar 2004 23:59:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16E0519D97; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:59:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB78619BC1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:59:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F319D19BC1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:58:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D4DA19B53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:58:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6d7710e6c5ed5131d6690332efcca304@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:58:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > and bah fonguilo Bill. You need to work on your accent. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:15:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11921 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:15:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11917 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:15:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:15:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9194619D25; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:15:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EECB419CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:15:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2D7119D69; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D068119B6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU300UH2ZIVMD@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:11:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:11:19 -0500 From: Noah Evans To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] Interesting behavior under vmware Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:11:19 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm getting odd behavior under vmware under really heavy load. For kicks I was recompiling all of my binaries(mk all in /sys/src/cmd) with a bunch of windows(3 rc, 1 cluttered acme, 1 faces) in a vmware session with 160 meg of ram. The system thrashes(acme won't let me type anything, if I'm about to resize a window in rio the cursor gets stuck on the bullseye etc.). The system doesn't seem to want to recover on its own(I waited about 30 minutes with no screen refreshing at all). But all of that is pretty boring. What's interesting is that when I hit ctl-(t,t) p and/or x, the system quits thrashing and goes back about its business quite happily(until it thrashes again, this takes a couple of minutes). I can get it working again using the same method. Anybody involved in the scheduler(russ?) interested in this behavior? Noah From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:15:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11937 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:15:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11933 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:15:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:15:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA35619B6E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC91119D9F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:15:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C29ED19D25; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.MCLNVA23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9350B19CEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:14:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i'd rather see ape stick around. imperfect, sure, but certainly still useful. there's a significant body of code that i either run on plan 9 (ghostscript, troff) or would like to see running on plan 9. given a finite set of plan 9 development resources (read: people), i'd rather see our efforts spent on other things than porting (and keeping current) the stuff we already have under ape. that aside, for the few programs i've written for unix, i've found ape to be a wonderful testbed for conformance and likely portability. granted, today i'd probably use rsc's 9libs instead... ア From vangoh12@singnet.com.sg Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:17:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11998 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:17:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11994 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:17:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:17:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 46E1E19D94; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:17:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8D3619CEA; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:17:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 06A8419CEC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:16:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp11.singnet.com.sg (smtp11.singnet.com.sg [165.21.6.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DBFC19BFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from snoopy (bb-203-125-86-41.singnet.com.sg [203.125.86.41]) by smtp11.singnet.com.sg (8.12.11/8.12.11) with SMTP id i25FGpmh027131 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:16:51 +0800 From: "Yi Li" Organization: peanuts.org Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Threads: Sewing badges of honor onto a Kernel User-Agent: Pan/0.13.3 (That cat's something I can't explain) Message-Id: Newsgroups: comp.os.plan9 References: <0265d55e51ecbc45b2e17f94df45c3f5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 23:17:00 +0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > And I suspect that the design philosophy of L4 has a certain > degree of impact on Linux. No proof, just a guess. On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 11:23:44 +0000, Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: >> I don't think so. The claim of L4 is that µkernels are non-portable >> (which makes sense) and that they must be coded in a non-portable way, >> The orignial one was assembly, and then fiasco is a reimplementation of L4 >> in C (mostly). >> >> Linux is UNIX, mostly, if we forget about its bloat. I understand that. Having impact does not necessarily mean to agree or even to be similar. What I meant was that from Linus's posting here I got the impression that he might have read those L4 papers. Best, E From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:29:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12459 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:29:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12450 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:29:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:29:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 53FC319DA9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:29:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F255119D97; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:29:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AB0C619D97; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:28:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 823D319D98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:28:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <312777-29687>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:27:15 -0500 Message-ID: <019501c402c6$123638a0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:25:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i'd rather see ape stick around. imperfect, sure, but certainly > still useful. there's a significant body of code that i either > run on plan 9 (ghostscript, troff) ... ken reversed engineered it for unix ?Ed, 'cos of the unfortunate death of ... From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:50:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13784 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:50:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13779 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:50:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:50:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F21C19DA8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE6F619DA9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:50:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F121E19D8F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:49:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 772DB19CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:49:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4988a36f8782ac389325fa3bdd81d258@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Interesting behavior under vmware From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:49:54 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Anybody involved in the scheduler(russ?) interested in this behavior? there is definitely a problem there.. for kicks try 'while () {}' on a cpu server and sweep a new terminal. it hands the machine completely (including rio) for a few seconds with only the while() loop being scheduled, everybody else waiting in the ready queue. it will recover after a few seconds (5 in my case) but it's almost 100% reproducible. we originally suspected fossil, where the flush thread is the one usually playing the role of the while loop. i'm looking into it, but now that the cat is out of the bag you may get much faster/better fix from bell-labs :) andrey From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 00:51:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13833 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 00:51:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13829 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 00:51:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 00:51:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 184A019D98; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:51:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD4A019DA6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:51:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 423A119DA6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:50:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7EB6C19DB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:50:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 05 Mar 2004 15:48:34 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25HRTZK005528 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:27:31 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Interesting behavior... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:50:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I too have noticed somthing like this recently. Its very rare, but the system load goes up to 100% (I know stats has an arbitary scale but 100% for 30secs is lots in anybodys language), then ^T^Tp releases it. If I wait long enough then sometimes I get a panic, somthing like "pool: block not allocated - double free?". I have had 2 temporary freezes and 2 panics in the last few months; never lost any data :-) I will write down accurate details next time. -Steve From noah.evans@cwru.edu Sat Mar 6 11:34:37 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 01:02:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14845 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 01:02:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14841 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 01:02:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 01:02:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83A1F19DB9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:02:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 224D519DC6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:02:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 88E5519DB9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:01:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3F9419D90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:01:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU400VT11RMOI@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:59:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:59:46 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] Interesting behavior... To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:59:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 'broke | rc' seemed to make things a lot happier, it's still laggy(as it should be given its load) but the problem's gone. Here's the current process table, anything interesting going on here?: glenda 1 0:00 0:00 88K Await init glenda 2 0:46 0:00 0K Wakeme genrandom glenda 3 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme alarm glenda 5 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme rxmitproc glenda 6 0:00 0:00 268K Pread factotum glenda 8 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 9 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 10 0:00 0:00 13808K Pread fossil glenda 11 0:01 24:28 13808K Fault fossil glenda 12 0:00 0:00 13808K Sleep fossil glenda 13 0:00 0:01 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 14 2:02 8:56 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 15 0:00 21:39 13808K Sleep fossil glenda 16 0:00 2:31 13808K Sleep fossil glenda 17 0:00 0:51 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 18 0:00 1:26 13808K Pread fossil glenda 19 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 20 0:00 0:00 13808K Pread fossil glenda 21 0:03 17:33 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 22 0:39 0:00 0K I/O pager glenda 23 0:01 2:43 2284K Rendez rio glenda 26 0:00 0:00 124K Pread mntgen glenda 29 0:00 0:00 172K Pread cs glenda 33 0:04 88:56 184K Sleep timesync glenda 37 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme floppy glenda 68 0:00 0:02 136K Pread vmwarefs glenda 71 0:00 0:04 128K Pread stub glenda 73 0:00 0:00 48K Sleep vmmousepoll glenda 75 0:02 11:15 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 88 0:00 0:00 560K Pread dossrv glenda 96 0:00 0:00 740K Pread fs glenda 97 0:00 0:05 740K Sleep fs glenda 100 0:00 0:06 996K Rendez plumber glenda 101 0:00 0:02 996K Rendez plumber glenda 104 0:00 0:28 2284K Pread rio glenda 105 0:00 0:00 2284K Pread rio glenda 106 0:00 0:00 2284K Rendez rio glenda 107 0:00 0:00 2284K Pread rio glenda 108 0:00 0:32 2284K Pread rio glenda 115 0:00 1:03 228K Sleep stats glenda 122 0:00 0:15 488K Pread faces glenda 125 0:02 5:52 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 129 0:02 18:33 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 154 0:00 0:41 488K Sleep faces glenda 155 0:00 0:00 488K Pread faces glenda 156 0:00 0:09 216K Pread stats glenda 157 0:00 0:01 228K Pread stats glenda 171 0:00 0:00 680K Pread win glenda 173 0:00 0:00 680K Await win glenda 175 0:00 0:00 244K Pread rc glenda 181 0:43 0:00 0K Wakeme etherread4 glenda 182 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme recvarpproc glenda 183 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme etherread6 glenda 184 0:00 0:01 164K Sleep ipconfig glenda 190 0:00 0:00 304K Pread dns glenda 207 0:00 0:00 0K Wakeme #I0tcpack glenda 221 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 222 0:00 0:00 244K Pread rc glenda 236 0:00 1:16 24684K Pread fs glenda 237 0:28 8:22 24684K Sleep fs glenda 554 0:00 0:00 1296K Rendez acme glenda 555 0:00 0:14 1296K Rendez acme glenda 556 0:00 0:00 1296K Pread acme glenda 557 0:00 0:00 1296K Rendez acme glenda 558 0:00 0:03 1296K Rendez acme glenda 559 0:00 0:00 1296K Pread acme glenda 26989 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 26990 0:00 0:00 244K Pread rc glenda 29229 0:00 0:00 1296K Await acme glenda 29230 0:00 0:02 1364K Open Mail glenda 29616 0:00 0:00 1364K Pread Mail glenda 29617 0:00 0:00 1364K Pread Mail glenda 29618 0:00 0:00 1364K Rendez Mail glenda 29619 0:00 0:00 1364K Pread Mail glenda 30096 0:00 0:00 996K Pread plumber glenda 30561 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 30562 0:00 0:00 244K Await rc glenda 30565 0:00 0:00 52K Pread con glenda 30566 0:00 0:00 52K Pread con glenda 30568 0:00 0:01 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 30569 0:00 0:01 13808K Pread fossil glenda 31289 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 31290 0:00 0:00 13808K Pread fossil glenda 31301 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 31302 0:00 0:00 13808K Pread fossil glenda 31322 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 31323 0:00 0:00 13808K Pread fossil glenda 34316 0:00 0:00 1364K Pread Mail glenda 35468 0:00 0:00 1296K Exits acme glenda 35523 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 35524 0:00 0:01 1644K Await rc glenda 35801 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 35802 0:00 0:00 244K Pread rc glenda 39686 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 39687 0:00 0:00 244K Await rc glenda 39733 0:00 0:00 348K Await mk glenda 39745 0:00 0:00 248K Await rc glenda 40812 0:00 0:00 380K Await mk glenda 40824 0:00 0:00 248K Await rc glenda 44246 0:00 0:00 248K Await rc glenda 44248 0:00 0:05 2168K Await mk glenda 45525 0:00 0:03 996K Rendez plumber glenda 45829 0:00 0:02 740K Rendez acme glenda 45836 0:00 0:00 740K Rendez acme glenda 45837 0:00 0:00 740K Pread acme glenda 45839 0:00 0:00 740K Pread acme glenda 45842 0:00 0:00 740K Pread acme glenda 45846 0:00 0:00 740K Pread acme glenda 45848 0:00 0:00 740K Pread acme glenda 46940 0:00 0:00 412K Await rc glenda 46942 0:00 1:38 61180K Pread 8l glenda 46967 0:00 8:48 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 46978 0:00 0:01 2284K Await rio glenda 46979 0:00 0:10 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 46980 0:00 0:00 244K Pread rc glenda 46999 0:00 0:01 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47008 0:00 0:08 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47009 0:00 0:10 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47010 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47013 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47015 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47018 0:00 0:00 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47019 0:00 0:04 13808K Rendez fossil glenda 47070 0:00 0:00 2284K Await rio glenda 47071 0:00 0:00 244K Await rc glenda 47075 0:00 0:00 188K Pread ps ----- Original Message ----- From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Date: Friday, March 5, 2004 10:50 am Subject: [9fans] Interesting behavior... > Hi, > > I too have noticed somthing like this recently. > > Its very rare, but the system load goes up to 100% (I know > stats has an arbitary scale but 100% for 30secs is lots in > anybodys language), then ^T^Tp releases it. > > If I wait long enough then sometimes I get a panic, > somthing like "pool: block not allocated - double free?". > > I have had 2 temporary freezes and 2 panics in > the last few months; never lost any data :-) > > I will write down accurate details next time. > > -Steve > From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 01:12:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15254 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 01:12:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15248 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 01:12:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 01:12:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6AE1D19DD7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:12:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46C7D19D7E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:12:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1B0519995; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:11:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95F2E19A25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:10:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <96153021f8fb276bf80d138dda519362@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting In-Reply-To: <171eddc6dcf57d066672f9677b82e7fb@yourdomain.dom> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-goxgctzudryvnrzflvcdigsyup" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:06:53 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-goxgctzudryvnrzflvcdigsyup Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I showed up for work at the labs, Dennis was nice enough to ask G. R. if I could use his ID badge for the day. I spend a whole day walking around with Mr. Emlin's badge and no one thought the picture didn't look like me :) --upas-goxgctzudryvnrzflvcdigsyup Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from relay.borf.com ([205.185.197.204]) by edsac; Fri Mar 5 09:18:28 EST 2004 Received: from [130.203.4.6] by borf.com ; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:14:29 -0400 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 01BC019D6F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FD8219D6A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:18:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 699F919D4B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.78]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57DC719CD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25EHHTq023532; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:17:18 -0500 Message-ID: <171eddc6dcf57d066672f9677b82e7fb@yourdomain.dom> To: dvd@davidashen.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <200403051409.i25E9T9g009905@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:11:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > Emden R. Gansner of AT&T Research. G. R. Emlin ...? --upas-goxgctzudryvnrzflvcdigsyup-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 01:21:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15647 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 01:21:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15642 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 01:21:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 01:21:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 11EA219DA8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:21:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFA6019D98; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:21:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D00819C79; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:20:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C89BD19C20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:20:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334020-16227>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:19:26 -0500 Message-ID: <023001c402cd$5a279030$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <96153021f8fb276bf80d138dda519362@borf.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Compiler bug - wrong error reporting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:17:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i've just walked around with a red 'escort' (iirc) badge and nothing's ever happened. the rent-a-cops being more interesting in my accent than security. From mike@linuxlink.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 01:34:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16231 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 01:34:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16227 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 01:34:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 01:34:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EAE0819DA8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:34:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A222199E5; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:34:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C54719D98; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:33:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (66-162-82-131.gen.twtelecom.net [66.162.82.131]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44976199E5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:33:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from linuxlink.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 673AE8AB75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:33:11 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <4048ABC7.3080403@linuxlink.com> From: "Michael H. Collins" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031209 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] scrollbar References: <6d7710e6c5ed5131d6690332efcca304@plan9.bell-labs.com> In-Reply-To: <6d7710e6c5ed5131d6690332efcca304@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:33:11 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hey it is a Texan accent. lol David Presotto wrote: >>and bah fonguilo Bill. > > > You need to work on your accent. > > -- Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://linuxlink.com http://www.gracklenews.com/ From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 01:54:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17078 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 01:54:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17074 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 01:54:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 01:54:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8FA8019CBC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F98519BAD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:54:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7858E19AD6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:53:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 38F2F19B2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 11:53:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 05 Mar 2004 16:50:56 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25ITqZK005607 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:29:53 GMT Message-ID: <61139cdd71fe9cb1943f4a4a676ea91c@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] confusion re auth and cpu Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:53:03 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I don't understand quite what is happening here. I have an account steve on my machine. I have run the cpu and keyfs listners so I can cpu to this machine. Now I cpu to one of the 9grid machines - where I am known as steve.simon. term% cat /dev/user steve term% cpu -h g.grid.bell-labs.com cpu% bind /mnt/term/net /net cpu% cpu larch.snellwilcox.com term% cat /dev/user steve.simon term% IE. I have come back to my machine, authenticated via the auth server on a.grid.bell-labs.com - though I don't know how, only to appear as somone else and of no-longer the owner of my files. How did I authenticate for this reverse connection? If I had the same username at both end would I have rights to my files? (and should I have?)! confused -Steve From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 02:01:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17474 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 02:01:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17470 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 02:01:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 02:01:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 53B0B19DAB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2D0719B6E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:00:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2599B19B99; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:00:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F74219B62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:00:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AzIg8-0008YZ-64 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:00:04 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong In-Reply-To: Your message of "Fri, 05 Mar 2004 08:40:52 EST." <7d1e553f5885573e30ebe41b3b5e18ef@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <32893.1078506000.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:00:00 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > COND LIST and COMMA are not supported by C compiler for vlong. > > Is it a feature or an omission? > > Its clearly an omission and I know that ken intended it. Is that > what you're asking? It's an omission. Ken decided it was too hard. Russ From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 02:07:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17890 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 02:07:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17886 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 02:07:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 02:07:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E15219DBB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C69AE19C2E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:07:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7724319C2E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:06:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E4AA19B6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:06:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0d86ad82347a8a22bd7234854649d3b4@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] confusion re auth and cpu From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <61139cdd71fe9cb1943f4a4a676ea91c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 10:06:22 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: that will happen if both factotums have the key for a different user. they agree on that key and the remote automatically "becomes" that user.. for a better treatment see: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&frame=right&th=40b73ca7473fa11f&seekm=Pine.LNX.4.44.0307282045420.31794-100000%40fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca#link1 From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:38 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 02:15:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18157 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 02:15:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18146 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 02:15:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 02:15:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FFB519E27; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:15:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EBC619C2E; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:15:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CA1B19DBB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:14:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C97B19DB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:14:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25HDSiq060443 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25HDSt7060442 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051713.i25HDSt7060442@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN In-Reply-To: <200403051447.i25Eljwo059910@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > ape predates c9x, which (i suspect) added those--i don't remember > > them from the earlier standard--but that's really just a cue > > for doug gwyn to contradict me. i'd check myself, but > > for some reason, my c book is always where i am not. > > > > For me, the problem was not that isnan was not declared, but that > isNaN was. > That is, any chance Inf, isInf, NaN, isNaN can be locked out by _POSIX_SOURCE or will it break something important enough? From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 03:40:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23626 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 03:40:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23622 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 03:40:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 03:40:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC49E19DAE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:40:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 090A119DC9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:40:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2ABE19DDC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:39:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B5A719DAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:39:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4f825ab42d917c07bf62fd6cb259bb55@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] borders Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:45:07 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Which led to some curiousity for me: any reason that there is a border in > (I guess) libdraw? getwindow() knows about rio borders (it gets the named image which is the rio window, then creates the application's window inside a screen inside that). this area is a little fragile (there's a race which means that getwindow() can return nil even though there is a window to be got; it's quite easy to crash acme this way, for example). From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 03:43:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23774 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 03:43:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23770 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 03:43:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 03:43:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0546219E6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:43:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE52F19DE7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:43:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F0D4D19DDF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:42:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B440A19DE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:42:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <05e57ed5e981d19eb86b9b62ea30a64e@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <4f825ab42d917c07bf62fd6cb259bb55@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:40:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>it's quite easy to crash acme this way, for example). it's quite easy for rog to crash acme that way, for example ... From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 03:45:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23817 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 03:45:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23813 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 03:45:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 03:45:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F7DA19ED8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:45:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B378519DE7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:45:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E105C19DFD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:44:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 563D719DDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:44:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <05e57ed5e981d19eb86b9b62ea30a64e@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:49:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it's quite easy for rog to crash acme that way, for example ... yup, cack handed with the mouse, that's me. From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 03:47:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23872 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 03:47:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23868 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 03:47:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 03:47:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D82519ECF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:47:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49C4B19E6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:47:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F397219DFD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:46:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C1AB19DDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:46:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7b6079c0b44c612e81f3f9099b68011f@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-sgnnttfkgytcnwvtvaobaukmfq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:44:47 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-sgnnttfkgytcnwvtvaobaukmfq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit no, it's just that i'd not seen it before you demonstrated it, but you could crash it quite easily. --upas-sgnnttfkgytcnwvtvaobaukmfq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Mar 5 18:44:54 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 20BD719E6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:45:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0CE719DE7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:45:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E105C19DFD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:44:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 563D719DDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:44:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <05e57ed5e981d19eb86b9b62ea30a64e@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:49:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it's quite easy for rog to crash acme that way, for example ... yup, cack handed with the mouse, that's me. --upas-sgnnttfkgytcnwvtvaobaukmfq-- From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 04:03:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24646 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 04:03:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24641 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 04:03:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 04:03:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EB2019DFF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C97F19DFD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:03:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8A3D219DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:03:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8AC219DAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:02:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2014a5000e816fc3ab8ce805c1de6188@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <7b6079c0b44c612e81f3f9099b68011f@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:08:19 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > no, it's just that i'd not seen it before you demonstrated it, > but you could crash it quite easily. actually i haven't done it for ages. it happens when i'm trying to click on a scrollbar in the left hand column, and miss and click on the window border instead, resizing the window; repeat a few times (almost subconscious mouse repetition), and acme crashes because it's trying to get a named image but rio has already discarded that named image in favour of the next one... i guess it happens with acme 'cos i usually have an acme window that covers most of the screen, so it takes a while to resize/move. it's an interesting illustration of the kind of problem that can occur when using out-of-band data transfer. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 04:27:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25342 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 04:27:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25338 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 04:27:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 04:27:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5BEC319B7D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:27:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E3C819B99; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:27:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2102519B86; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:26:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA8D019AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:26:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2db62b02578da8410a8e90d96546badb@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN In-Reply-To: <200403051713.i25HDSt7060442@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ntdtkjjtxyiksshgwevzbbymyo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:26:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ntdtkjjtxyiksshgwevzbbymyo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For you, anything. --upas-ntdtkjjtxyiksshgwevzbbymyo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 12:15:31 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 12:15:28 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C035119DDC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:15:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C71519DBD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:15:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CA1B19DBB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:14:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C97B19DB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:14:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25HDSiq060443 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25HDSt7060442 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403051713.i25HDSt7060442@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Inf isInf, NaN, isNaN In-Reply-To: <200403051447.i25Eljwo059910@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:13:28 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > ape predates c9x, which (i suspect) added those--i don't remember > > them from the earlier standard--but that's really just a cue > > for doug gwyn to contradict me. i'd check myself, but > > for some reason, my c book is always where i am not. > > > > For me, the problem was not that isnan was not declared, but that > isNaN was. > That is, any chance Inf, isInf, NaN, isNaN can be locked out by _POSIX_SOURCE or will it break something important enough? --upas-ntdtkjjtxyiksshgwevzbbymyo-- From jas@corpus-callosum.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 04:38:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25766 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 04:38:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25762 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 04:38:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 04:38:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9544919B99; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:38:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3870919C10; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:38:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC68719BDF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:38:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C873C19D69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 14:37:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i25JbrfK092154 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:37:53 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <94EAB50A-6EDC-11D8-8A93-003065E1714E@corpus-callosum.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] Interesting behavior... To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:37:47 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I had a similar experience yesterday when doing bunzip2 -c backup.tbz | tar xT onto a fossil file system. I'd originally archived my files from a kfs system and didn't have the same load issues. Now aside from bunzip2 putting in a significant load, fossil also contributed. And of course stats not only showed load at 100%, course context switching like mad. jas From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 07:25:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2786 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 07:25:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2782 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 07:25:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 07:25:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CAE919CD4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FC2619BB4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:25:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1623519BB4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8990F19D3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:24:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25MNRiq066611 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:23:27 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25MNQ3k066610 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:23:26 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403052223.i25MNQ3k066610@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:23:26 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 07:31:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3175 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 07:31:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3167 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 07:31:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 07:31:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A5FBF19D6F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:31:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68A2119BFF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:31:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2C10A19B02; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:30:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5FD419A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:30:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25MU1iq066663; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25MU198066662; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403052230.i25MU198066662@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: dvd@adat.davidashen.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm sorry for the empty message, have done something wrong. Hi, I've made an ape port of graphviz. dot and neato are working (the generated Postscript and SVG is the same as on other platforms, just better). I am not sure it won't be affected by setup discrepancies, but have done my best to make building easy. Execute hget://www.graphviz.org/pub/graphviz/ARCHIVE/graphviz-1.10.tar.gz|gunzip|tar x cd graphviz-1.10 hget http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/graphviz-9patch.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT ape/psh 9configure 9make to build the binaries, dotneato/dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps page crazy.ps To view the result. graphviz-plan9-diff.ed contains differences between original grapviz-1.10 and the ported version. I tried to touch as little as possible. David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:02:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4717 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:02:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4713 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:02:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:02:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F24AB19DA7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:02:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B01419D80; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:02:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7989419D6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:01:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D026219C10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:01:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] tab stop poll Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:56:18 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Just a quick poll. Who doesn't leave the tabstop set to 4 please email me. I'll summarize to the list if people want. Just curious if there is a defacto standard on this. Brantley From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:05:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4870 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:05:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4866 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:05:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:05:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1573419DC9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:05:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 669DF19C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:05:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13A5E19D1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:05:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (nolifeandliberty.com [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 833B819C10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:04:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <73c50788ea0f285c2b0e30e54d7b9742@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:04:53 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I use tabstop=8. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:09:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5069 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:09:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5065 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:09:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:09:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0596019DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0320E19D1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 66A2A19DA7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:08:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11B6519D1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:08:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320308-31056>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:07:58 -0500 Message-ID: <00d101c40306$85bf2440$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403052223.i25MNQ3k066610@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:06:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ----- Original Message ----- > From: "David Tolpin" > To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> > Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 11:23 PM > Subject: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port yup, 100% agreement. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:10:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5111 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:10:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5107 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:10:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:10:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 21D3D19DD8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:10:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F82419DEE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:10:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0050319DD8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F4BB19DC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3738191-4727>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:08:53 -0500 Message-ID: <00d701c40306$a727b160$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:07:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man, a tab is a tab. if the line slops, then it's too complex. From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:22:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5760 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:22:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5756 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:22:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:22:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C12B919C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:22:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBDCD19C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5802719CC0; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:21:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2C4819C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:21:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f6e94000cb98a5968e78148821ac3e3@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-Reply-To: <00d701c40306$a727b160$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-koicunqnisgljjhiowfdmyexvr" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:13:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-koicunqnisgljjhiowfdmyexvr Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll put you down as a tabstop=4 then. Thank you for playing. :) Brantley --upas-koicunqnisgljjhiowfdmyexvr Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from relay.borf.com ([205.185.197.204]) by edsac; Fri Mar 5 18:11:12 EST 2004 Received: from [130.203.4.6] by borf.com ; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:06:28 -0400 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0F86219DFF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:10:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7C1319DDC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:10:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0050319DD8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F4BB19DC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3738191-4727>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:08:53 -0500 Message-ID: <00d701c40306$a727b160$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:07:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man, a tab is a tab. if the line slops, then it's too complex. --upas-koicunqnisgljjhiowfdmyexvr-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:25:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5841 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:25:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5837 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:25:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:25:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F321219CC0; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:25:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4968819CC0; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:25:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9306D19C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:24:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 404CE19D1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <435710-23068>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:23:55 -0500 Message-ID: <010801c40308$bf2e70d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:22:35 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 yup From dbailey27@ameritech.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:32:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6291 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:32:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6287 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:32:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:32:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D0DC19DDC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:32:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EF5719DCB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:32:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4DADE19CC0; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:31:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.78]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06E6719C1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:31:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25NVgTq115486; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:31:42 -0500 Message-ID: <7a924e2b5a3669bed364ed34c07bba0d@yourdomain.dom> To: bwc@borf.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:26:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > Just a quick poll. Who doesn't leave the tabstop set to 4 > please email me. I'll summarize to the list if people > want. Just curious if there is a defacto standard on this. I even use ':set tabstop=4' obsessively in vi. From dbailey27@ameritech.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:35:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6430 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:35:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6426 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:35:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:35:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61D0519D8F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:35:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DDEF19C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:35:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A3F6119C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D5C019C10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:34:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i25NY93l112492; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:34:09 -0500 Message-ID: To: boyd@insultant.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <00d701c40306$a727b160$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:28:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > if the line slops, then it's too complex. Exaaactly. But, I still hate seeing all that leading whitespace. From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:43:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6814 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:43:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6810 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:43:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:43:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2D1C19E01; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:43:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A895919DE7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:43:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08AA319DAE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 05BF619C5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:42:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 27004 invoked by uid 991); 5 Mar 2004 23:42:32 -0000 Message-ID: <20040305234232.27003.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-reply-to: References: Comments: In-reply-to dbailey27@ameritech.net message dated "Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:28:43 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:42:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I don't change the tabstops from the default. At the same time, I don't think the tab key should necessarily insert a ctrl-I character. The editor could compute the right number of spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. From vdharani@infernopark.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 08:53:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7388 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 08:53:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7384 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 08:53:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 08:53:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B87A19DD8; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:53:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FB7519CA4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:53:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F20B419D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:52:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (unknown [216.127.72.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 431EF19CD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from infernopark.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2623WJ14403 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:03:32 -0500 Received: from 192.11.226.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:03:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7151.192.11.226.116.1078538612.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.5) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:03:32 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_NJABL, RCVD_IN_NJABL_RELAY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > Just a quick poll. Who doesn't leave the tabstop set to 4 > please email me. I'll summarize to the list if people > want. Just curious if there is a defacto standard on this. i would like to use tabstop set to 4 wherever possible. thanks dharani From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:21:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9382 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:21:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9378 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:21:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:21:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C45B019DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F81D19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:21:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CC7319D1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:20:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA11199DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:20:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <20040305234232.27003.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ixtejkauumogdxacpomktnglie" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:17:58 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ixtejkauumogdxacpomktnglie Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit but that doesn't avoid the issue! it often triggers it! oh no, i don't want to go back to being ded, ded, ded. --upas-ixtejkauumogdxacpomktnglie Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Mar 5 23:43:03 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E746619DF9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:43:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EC5619DC9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:43:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08AA319DAE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 05BF619C5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 18:42:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 27004 invoked by uid 991); 5 Mar 2004 23:42:32 -0000 Message-ID: <20040305234232.27003.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-reply-to: References: Comments: In-reply-to dbailey27@ameritech.net message dated "Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:28:43 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:42:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I don't change the tabstops from the default. At the same time, I don't think the tab key should necessarily insert a ctrl-I character. The editor could compute the right number of spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. --upas-ixtejkauumogdxacpomktnglie-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:32:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10269 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:32:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10265 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:32:52 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:32:52 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B20C419DA6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:32:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0C2D19D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:32:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3257C19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:31:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C526119CE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:31:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <360262-16233>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:29:36 -0500 Message-ID: <015301c40311$e967ae30$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:28:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh no, i don't want to go back to being ded, ded, ded. you used 'ded'? From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:33:05 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10303 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:33:05 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10299 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:33:05 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:33:05 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB4CD19DC5; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:32:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48C2519D6F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:32:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3699619CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:31:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A38E19D69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:31:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Poll Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:22:23 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you use tabstop of 4, let me know as well. So, far the only people who have responded use tabstop=4. Brantley From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:37:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10624 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:37:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10618 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:37:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:37:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B825419DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:37:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 084AC19D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:37:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 821DF19D1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:36:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6354E19C1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:36:37 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 78E5E341; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:35:16 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9973033D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:35:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id AAA03545 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:36:21 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 00:42:10 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh no, i don't want to go back to being ded, ded, ded. I don't think our trans-Atlantic/Pacific cousins will understand that reference to the Great Gods Thimbleby and Bornat. Dave. > From: Scott Schwartz ... > The editor could compute the right number of > spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. ... and the "right" number is ...? :-) Dave. From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:42:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10853 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:42:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10849 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:42:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:42:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D70019DAF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:42:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9244D19D62; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:42:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B476619C16; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:41:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (nolifeandliberty.com [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B7EB19A93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:41:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <077139e2d125fc59861fc2a9ee6e5fe4@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:41:29 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I know who Bornat is: Richard Bornat, author of Understanding and Writing Compilers, published by Macmillan and now tragically unavailable, the finest book on compiler-writing ever written (ignoring the incorrect figures). So does Laura Creighton and Henry Spencer and Ian Darwin, all Canadians. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 09:55:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11640 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 09:55:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11632 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 09:55:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 09:55:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E45E119D6F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:55:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28B5A19C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:55:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74BED19C1A; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:54:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B7AD19A93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320916-29677>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 19:53:29 -0500 Message-ID: <019301c40315$3d907390$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:52:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I don't think our trans-Atlantic/Pacific cousins will understand > that reference to the Great Gods Thimbleby and Bornat. i've used ded From dmturner@primenet.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:10:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12926 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:10:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12901 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:10:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:10:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7039B19DC5; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:10:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC9AE19CE1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:10:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F87919C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:09:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp3.roc2.gblx.net (smtp3.roc2.gblx.net [64.215.96.102]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9AE019CE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (from smmsp@localhost) by smtp3.roc2.gblx.net (8.12.9/8.12.8) id i2619Hu7032480 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:09:17 GMT Received: from radsl-dmturner.phx.primenet.com(208.48.202.218), claiming to be "localhost" via SMTP by smtp3.roc2.gblx.net, id smtpdjE_XUa; Sat Mar 6 01:09:08 2004 From: Dave Turner To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Organization: Primenet Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: dmturner@primenet.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:08:58 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:02:35 GMT, you wrote: >Just a quick poll. Who doesn't leave the tabstop set to 4 >please email me. I'll summarize to the list if people >want. Just curious if there is a defacto standard on this. > I like tabstop=3D8. Regards, Dave From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:12:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13053 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:12:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13049 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:12:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:12:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BCBF19DC9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 254FC19DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:12:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A558D19DA6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99C1E19C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:11:45 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id DAADC349; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:10:24 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F80C348 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:10:23 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA04360 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:11:29 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <077139e2d125fc59861fc2a9ee6e5fe4@collyer.net> References: <077139e2d125fc59861fc2a9ee6e5fe4@collyer.net> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078535836.1730.48.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 01:17:16 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Well, funnily enough, I met Bornat many years ago, and I was so put off by his arrogance that I never read the book! Also, he was working on a lightweight pascal-based distributed OS ... Dave. On Sat, 2004-03-06 at 00:41, Geoff Collyer wrote: > I know who Bornat is: Richard Bornat, author of Understanding and > Writing Compilers, published by Macmillan and now tragically > unavailable, the finest book on compiler-writing ever written > (ignoring the incorrect figures). So does Laura Creighton and Henry > Spencer and Ian Darwin, all Canadians. > From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:14:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13234 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:14:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13222 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:14:22 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:14:22 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4DD019DAF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:14:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA5EB19B16; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:14:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B5AF19AA1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3941D19B2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:13:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 7BEA034A; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:11:58 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A471D342 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:11:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id BAA04385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:13:04 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <019301c40315$3d907390$67844051@SOMA> References: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> <019301c40315$3d907390$67844051@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078535932.1730.52.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 01:18:52 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i've used ded Ahh! The great ded! You try explaining to someone that "Yes, it'll match a regexp longer than a line, but not one longer than a screen"!?! Dave. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:18:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13611 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:18:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13607 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:18:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:18:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C3F619C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE43119B16; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:18:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E98E19C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:17:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CF3F19A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:17:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5382d71d69063ba83f5043429c140f0e@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: [9fans] confusion re auth and cpu From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:17:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >Now I cpu to one of the 9grid machines - where I am known as >steve.simon. > > term% cat /dev/user > steve > term% cpu -h g.grid.bell-labs.com > cpu% bind /mnt/term/net /net > cpu% cpu larch.snellwilcox.com > term% cat /dev/user > steve.simon > term% > >IE. I have come back to my machine, authenticated via the auth server on >a.grid.bell-labs.com - though I don't know how, only to appear as somone >else and of no-longer the owner of my files. > >How did I authenticate for this reverse connection? >If I had the same username at both end would I have >rights to my files? (and should I have?)! Just for a wild guess: 1) on g, your profile mounts /mnt/term/mnt/factotum onto /mnt/factotum 2) on larch, your profile mounts /mnt/term/dev into /dev At least, that would have the effect you see. There are a few other ways. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:20:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13723 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:20:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13717 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:20:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:20:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6311F19DCE; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:20:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D10D19C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:20:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B19B19C5F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:19:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FEB819CA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321281-31058>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:17:58 -0500 Message-ID: <01d101c40318$a86e0ee0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> <019301c40315$3d907390$67844051@SOMA> <1078535932.1730.52.camel@rea> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:16:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Ahh! The great ded! with a t106[12] From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:22:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13870 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:22:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13866 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:22:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:22:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8F9D219DEB; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:22:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C9CB19B16; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D31FF19C73; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A90EE19DAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:21:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5847016dbd787c7ad21fb13a156bf3fa@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mxqcotdvjlrpsmcwowfzwyuunr" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:11:33 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mxqcotdvjlrpsmcwowfzwyuunr Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks. Brantley --upas-mxqcotdvjlrpsmcwowfzwyuunr Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from relay.borf.com ([205.185.197.204]) by edsac; Fri Mar 5 20:10:55 EST 2004 Received: from [130.203.4.6] by borf.com ; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:06:34 -0400 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A455719DB1; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:10:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC0DD19C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:10:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F87919C22; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:09:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp3.roc2.gblx.net (smtp3.roc2.gblx.net [64.215.96.102]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9AE019CE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (from smmsp@localhost) by smtp3.roc2.gblx.net (8.12.9/8.12.8) id i2619Hu7032480 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:09:17 GMT Received: from radsl-dmturner.phx.primenet.com(208.48.202.218), claiming to be "localhost" via SMTP by smtp3.roc2.gblx.net, id smtpdjE_XUa; Sat Mar 6 01:09:08 2004 From: Dave Turner To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Organization: Primenet Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: dmturner@primenet.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 18:08:58 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:02:35 GMT, you wrote: >Just a quick poll. Who doesn't leave the tabstop set to 4 >please email me. I'll summarize to the list if people >want. Just curious if there is a defacto standard on this. > I like tabstop=3D8. Regards, Dave --upas-mxqcotdvjlrpsmcwowfzwyuunr-- From bs@nospam.com Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:48:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15937 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:48:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15933 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:48:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:48:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFD5619DA4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:48:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2D9F19D70; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:48:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1264219C15; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:47:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.202.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EB9319B22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:47:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with SMTP id <2004030601475601100hks9ge>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:47:56 +0000 Message-ID: <40492DCC.7060809@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 20:47:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * tabstop = 4 From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:49:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15984 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:49:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15977 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:48:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:48:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8922F19DFF; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:48:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31C8B19DF4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:48:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AC6A19B7D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:47:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFFA119BBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:47:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <200403052230.i25MU198066662@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vfeaoeespvjqwdpnsuvtsfsoef" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:47:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vfeaoeespvjqwdpnsuvtsfsoef Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit check the links on additional software. --upas-vfeaoeespvjqwdpnsuvtsfsoef Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 17:31:33 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 5 17:31:30 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DC4319D7F; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:31:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F41FB19A85; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:31:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2C10A19B02; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:30:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5FD419A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 17:30:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i25MU1iq066663; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i25MU198066662; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403052230.i25MU198066662@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: dvd@adat.davidashen.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:30:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm sorry for the empty message, have done something wrong. Hi, I've made an ape port of graphviz. dot and neato are working (the generated Postscript and SVG is the same as on other platforms, just better). I am not sure it won't be affected by setup discrepancies, but have done my best to make building easy. Execute hget://www.graphviz.org/pub/graphviz/ARCHIVE/graphviz-1.10.tar.gz|gunzip|tar x cd graphviz-1.10 hget http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/graphviz-9patch.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT ape/psh 9configure 9make to build the binaries, dotneato/dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps page crazy.ps To view the result. graphviz-plan9-diff.ed contains differences between original grapviz-1.10 and the ported version. I tried to touch as little as possible. David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ --upas-vfeaoeespvjqwdpnsuvtsfsoef-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 6 11:34:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 10:54:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16414 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 10:54:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16410 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:54:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:54:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C376A19DCC; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F19D19DA7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:54:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E91C919C7B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:53:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB61319B7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:52:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3742006-4719>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:51:55 -0500 Message-ID: <023a01c4031d$6474fd20$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <40492DCC.7060809@nospam.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:50:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > tabstop = 4 the horror, the horror ... From bs@nospam.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 11:41:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20198 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 11:41:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20194 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 11:41:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 11:41:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EB9E19C05; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FC2119BBD; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:41:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E1C819C03; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:40:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.202.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62A8319AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:40:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with SMTP id <2004030602403501100hh9p2e>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:40:35 +0000 Message-ID: <40493A23.8030206@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll References: <023a01c4031d$6474fd20$67844051@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <023a01c4031d$6474fd20$67844051@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 21:40:35 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * boyd, rounin wrote: >>tabstop = 4 > > > the horror, the horror ... > if the intent of the indent is clarity, 4 is enough for me... From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 6 19:51:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 12:07:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21937 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 12:07:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21933 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 12:07:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 12:07:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 537DD19DA6; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:07:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7730B19C16; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:07:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E21719C05; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:06:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA0B819C16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:06:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2636Vjt027029 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:06:31 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2636UOs026795 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:06:30 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2636UfQ005090 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:06:30 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park In-Reply-To: <08e601c402a7$70f75d70$67844051@SOMA> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:06:30 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 5 Mar 2004, boyd, rounin wrote: > > QWERT ASDFG CGASD GDFGA YUIOP HJKLM AADBC > > > > ETRCU > > # of rotors [3 or 4 (naval)]? steckers, rotor order, rotors ... > > but the QWERT looks like a troll ;) it's your first enigma troll. It's actually a compressed discussion of threading on Linux vs. Plan 9 and whether TLBs matter. I think. It could also be semi-random letters, and it's up to you to figure out if it's one or the other or both. ron From mike@linuxlink.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 12:35:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24328 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 12:35:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24324 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 12:35:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 12:35:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ECD5119CA4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:35:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8669519AE4; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:35:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44C2719B4D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:34:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (adsl-64-123-11-62.dsl.austtx.swbell.net [64.123.11.62]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F59019AC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:34:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from linuxlink.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B433089930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:34:39 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <404946CE.9040006@linuxlink.com> From: "Michael H. Collins" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031209 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] [OT] Bletchley Park References: <4b7776715f34f50b9351c4f253fa32a9@plan9.bell-labs.com> <010801c40308$bf2e70d0$67844051@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <010801c40308$bf2e70d0$67844051@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 21:34:38 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: > https://secure.bletchleypark.org.uk/newshop/shopcategory.asp?productcode=ENIG050 > > yup > > > No workie for me. Error: Microsoft OLE DB Provider for ODBC Drivers error '80040e4d' [Microsoft][ODBC Microsoft Access Driver] Too many client tasks. /newshop/araneabasket.asp, line 28 -- Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://linuxlink.com http://www.gracklenews.com/ From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 13:17:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27569 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 13:17:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27563 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 13:17:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 13:17:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 46E9419D6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:17:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71C3B19B7D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:17:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47C2919B4D; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:16:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from web13126.mail.yahoo.com (web13126.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.163]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AC49E19B16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:16:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040306041650.41850.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.179.1.247] by web13126.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 05 Mar 2004 20:16:50 PST From: dave cummings To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [9fans] Re: errr, the e compiler? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:16:50 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ok, so I don't think Dr. Shulgin reads 9fans, but that's another story. Here's the original post I'm referencing: http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=036701c29644%2490638920%24c901a8c0%40cc77109e I believe it was originally about something in inferno, so I take it inferno for ps2(hosted in linux?) is ready-set-go. I was wondering if anybody had done work on the plan 9 port, or if there was info on it. Thanks again. -dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Search - Find what youre looking for faster http://search.yahoo.com From martin@parvat.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 13:42:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29323 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 13:42:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29319 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 13:42:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 13:42:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 34AD519D6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:42:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FEC919DED; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:42:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7908319D6B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:41:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.171]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC2F219D39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:41:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.155] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AzTcb-0005Gl-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 06 Mar 2004 05:41:09 +0100 Received: from [203.101.54.26] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1AzTca-0004aq-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 06 Mar 2004 05:41:09 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Message-Id: <20040306100805.37ed0631.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <7151.192.11.226.116.1078538612.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> References: <7151.192.11.226.116.1078538612.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:08:05 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:03:32 -0500 (EST) wrote: > i would like to use tabstop set to 4 wherever possible. s/4/8/ for me (and if the line slops, rewrite it, or get a bigger monitor :-) (i.e., rewrite it.) > > thanks > dharani > > > -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From presotto@plan9.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 13:51:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29721 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 13:51:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29717 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 13:51:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 13:51:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C15A19DA7; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:51:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C832319A8B; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:51:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 122E419AA9; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:50:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 758F819A15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:50:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <54d4214ff61202e86f40c01c039937c6@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: rsc@plan9.bell-labs.com, sape@plan9.bell-labs.com, jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] cooperative scheduling Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 23:50:13 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Well, after a bunch of other changes that were almost useless, the following is the big one: in sched(), I zerod m->readied after it was used: p = runproc(); if(!p->edf){ updatecpu(p); p->priority = reprioritize(p); } if(p != m->readied) m->schedticks = m->ticks + HZ/10; >> m->readied = 0; up = p; The problem is that, without zeroing m->readied, it stays pointing to some bogus proc that has the priority level of a hog and may not even be ready. From there I've found a few scenarios where the hog runs forever or at least for long runs. One is if it just calls sleep(0) 10 times a second or so, in other words, if it tries to be nice. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 6 19:51:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 15:26:09 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3574 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 15:25:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3466 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 15:25:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 15:25:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55F2219E16; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:25:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7874B19AD3; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:25:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3266E19E06; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2E6419AD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:24:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i266Naiq071245 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:23:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i266NaAP071244 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:23:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403060623.i266NaAP071244@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:23:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > check the links on additional software. Thank you for the link; one correction, if possible. I am not David Ashen, I am David Tolpin. Davida-shen (accent on the last syllable) means in Armenian 'built by David', that's why the domain name. And no, i'm not Armenian, just happen to live here. David Tolpin From noah.evans@cwru.edu Sat Mar 6 19:51:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 15:40:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4951 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 15:40:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4947 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 15:40:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 15:40:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3509519E09; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:40:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0B4219AC7; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:40:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A60919E08; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:39:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA6D319AC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 01:39:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU500ID66DTRM@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 06 Mar 2004 01:37:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.59.232] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Sat, 06 Mar 2004 01:37:05 -0500 From: Noah Evans To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] IBM 365x laptop w/ cyber9320 and DSTN Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 01:37:05 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm having trouble getting my laptop(IBM 365x with a cyber9320 video card) working at 800x600. I've already added the cyber9320 to cyber938x.c and put the proper frequencies in vgadb(I had to turn linear off too). after an 'aux/vga -l' I get the vertical bars that come from mismatched frequencies that Russ talked about a while ago on the list. Any advice for debugging this? Or a manual for the 9320 laying around? Any registers in particular to futz with? Noah From fst@9netics.com Sat Mar 6 19:51:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 16:45:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9735 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 16:45:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9731 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 16:45:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 16:45:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42EF619E25; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:45:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 630B319D6B; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:45:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DEDA819E06; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A42C19D6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 02:44:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <81617ba10a8f4c43d47fbd0c849da540@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: fst@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <7a924e2b5a3669bed364ed34c07bba0d@yourdomain.dom> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 00:44:49 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > even use ':set tabstop=4' obsessively in vi. Allow me to get on my high and mighty horse... term% man vi VI(1) VI(1) NAME 0i, 5i, ki, vi - instruction simulators SYNOPSIS vi [ textfile ] vi pid 0i [ textfile ] 0i pid 5i [ textfile ] 5i pid ki [ textfile ] ki pid DESCRIPTION Vi simulates the execution of a MIPS binary in a Plan 9 ... From nigel@9fs.org Sat Mar 6 19:51:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 17:43:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12970 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 17:43:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12966 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 17:43:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 17:43:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 01B18199D4; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 03:43:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0305E1998C; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 03:43:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E03C919E22; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 03:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9fs.org (82-68-131-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.68.131.214]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC90119B81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 03:42:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.100.111] (helo=blue) by 9fs.org with smtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AzXOL-000L8Z-52 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 06 Mar 2004 08:42:41 +0000 From: "Nigel Roles" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: RE: [9fans] tab stop poll Message-ID: <000e01c40356$fd05e7f0$2bdcfea9@blue> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 In-Reply-To: Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:42:42 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu wrote: > but that doesn't avoid the issue! it often triggers it! > oh no, i don't want to go back to being ded, ded, ded. Ded (a wonderfully prophetic name) was proved correct wasn't it? Doesn't that make it's behaviour definitive? From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 19:52:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 19:43:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19456 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 19:43:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19436 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 19:43:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 19:43:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 800D219BD0; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E13219DB6; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27EFD19E3B; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0788A19BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15668 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:42:27 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:42:27 -0000 Message-ID: <01f601c40367$e64a2470$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5d2199bf9053e87c62827a04a630fe86@terzarima.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:24:35 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: right on that charles, yes the reason that -A is needed to make ape/cc ANSI has to do with all the crap code that has to be compiled with it. anyone gonna conjecture why the ape hypot is not as good as the libc one ... can it just be preplaced? (prototype issues aside.) brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Charles Forsyth" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 6:32 AM Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot > >>I just didn't realize that, unlike pcc, cc does not issue warnings > >>by default. > > no, presumably because too many old programs lacked prototypes, > which indeed they did. > -A stops it turning the checking off. From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 19:52:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 19:43:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19465 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 19:43:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19461 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 19:43:53 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 19:43:53 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE1E419EB8; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40AE319E6B; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E44E619E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B82BF19BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15751 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:42:29 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:42:29 -0000 Message-ID: <01f701c40367$e758ae40$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:26:47 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i never used the HD. i can give away the compiler if i'm allowed to. actually you need 3c as well if you want to you use the other processor. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "dave cummings" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 8:11 PM Subject: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > So...I see in the archives that someone, brucee? had > done work on the ps2 and had come up with the e > compiler for the r5900. I'm wondering if there's > source anywhere for the plan 9 port and what the > latest status was with using the GS as a framebuffer, > or something. I've got a ps2 and the linux kit, and, > well, it's got the biggest HD, sure would be a nice > cpu/file server! Thanks > -dave From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 19:52:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 19:44:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19476 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 19:44:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19472 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 19:44:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 19:44:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54B8719EDC; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AE3A19ECF; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:43:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85C8019E3B; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5E4DE19BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15820 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:42:31 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:42:31 -0000 Message-ID: <01f801c40367$e8627d20$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:32:40 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: no, the 5900 is a strange beast. 128 bit registers. sloppy floating point. missing instructions, blah blah. but it took only a day to get the compiler working and a day to get thru l.s (great without a console). then inferno was up and running. i told mike that i'd better leave it at work or they'd never see me. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Collyer" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 8:40 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > i initially thought `e compiler' was a typo, but it appears twice in > the original message. has brucee developed a language that makes you > happy and increases your empathy? i believe that's banned in the us > under the controlled language analog act. From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 19:52:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 19:44:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19485 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 19:44:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19481 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 19:44:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 19:44:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0659E19ED8; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:44:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A292D19ECF; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:44:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39F6E19E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 249C019BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15894 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:42:33 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:42:33 -0000 Message-ID: <01f901c40367$e96df9b0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4c1c0d3934feb2e46663047bdc455f2b@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:43:19 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: please don't make me sad. i had a lot of it done but i had - yes - a double disk crash in a brownout. i've been silly and playing music in-between trying to recover data. it's cool with me now - i know how to do it and the code may be cleaner this time. damn that ax/dx need for MUL. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Presotto" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 12:58 AM Subject: Re: [9fans] COND LIST on vlong > If and when brucee does his thing and we have new vlong support, > it will work. Right now, vlong is a very strangely supported type. From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 19:56:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20309 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 19:56:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20304 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 19:56:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 19:56:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9216919E85; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B51A819E72; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:56:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C62719E62; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:55:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2AF0719BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 05:55:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 8106 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 10:55:50 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 10:55:50 -0000 Message-ID: <02cb01c40369$c4800470$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040306041650.41850.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:55:50 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: no - the inferno for ps2 is native. it was not expedient nor necessary to do a hosted port, their libraries were so ... umm deficient. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "dave cummings" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 3:16 PM Subject: [9fans] Re: errr, the e compiler? > Ok, so I don't think Dr. Shulgin reads 9fans, but > that's another story. Here's the original post I'm > referencing: > http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=036701c29644%2490638920%24c901a8c0%40cc77109e > I believe it was originally about something in > inferno, so I take it inferno for ps2(hosted in > linux?) is ready-set-go. I was wondering if anybody > had done work on the plan 9 port, or if there was info > on it. Thanks again. > -dave From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 20:03:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20612 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 20:03:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20604 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 20:03:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 20:03:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F0D019E94; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:03:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 318B719E2A; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:03:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1EC819E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:02:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (p9auth.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5A4619BB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:02:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60a5af827fadd12531bdc9f2e138ffb8@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <01f701c40367$e758ae40$8201a8c0@cc77109e> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 03:02:29 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What's 3c compile for? I don't recall that one at all, and I thought the other processor was a mips r3000, so you'd need vc. From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 20:36:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22699 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 20:36:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22695 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 20:36:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 20:36:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7AC4219E31; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:36:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EDD519E72; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:36:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BC3519B0B; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:35:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 13D0A19DD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:35:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16214 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 11:35:13 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 11:35:13 -0000 Message-ID: <037501c4036f$44f4e5d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <60a5af827fadd12531bdc9f2e138ffb8@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 22:36:17 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: endianess and minor quirks. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Collyer" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 10:02 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > What's 3c compile for? I don't recall that one at all, and I thought > the other processor was a mips r3000, so you'd need vc. From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 20:55:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24677 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 20:55:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24673 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 20:55:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 20:55:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2BF319E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:55:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6667619BA0; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:55:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3183019BA0; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:54:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D39C019B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 06:54:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] faces/nedmail tip Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:56:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: when you have a long email that you want to delete send the 'd' rather than type it and you don't have to scroll down for it to execute (I wish I'd thought of it sooner!) m From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 21:01:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24984 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 21:01:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24980 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 21:01:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 21:01:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 526BB19E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:01:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30C9C19B8C; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:01:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D49719BA0; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:00:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFA2219B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:00:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 12:03:17 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I like tabstop=0x09 down with spaces ! From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 21:13:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25650 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 21:13:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25646 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 21:13:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 21:13:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7B6719C2F; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D269A19BF0; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:13:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D546119BEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C03319BA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:12:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? In-Reply-To: <037501c4036f$44f4e5d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 12:14:28 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Oh master, I have some questions : what's the boot process for the ps2, does it just boot from cd/dvd rom? Or does it need to be 'chipped' ? did you get the networking working ? does it ouput graphics ? I have an Inferno subscription so presumably I'm licensed for it even if you *can't* put it on general release. :) Boyd's been enthusing about your Inferno work. It would be interesting/enlightening to see it first hand. m From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 6 23:18:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 6 22:47:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31698 invoked by uid 1020); 6 Mar 2004 22:47:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31694 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 22:47:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 22:47:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82E8519E2A; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:47:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5283E19D87; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:47:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1C4D19D6C; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:46:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 587A919CA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:46:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9882 invoked from network); 6 Mar 2004 13:46:04 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 6 Mar 2004 13:46:04 -0000 Message-ID: <001001c40381$8ca5b0f0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 00:47:17 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 12:14 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > Oh master, I have some questions : Hmmm. I wish I had a slave to fix pcs for me. > what's the boot process for the ps2, does it just boot from cd/dvd rom? Or does it need to be 'chipped' ? no, the box was never opened. you boot linux, and copy redboot to the cartridge and add an inferno option to the boot menu. and then serve inferno from a p9 box using tftp. the inferno image is a hacked elf that redboot likes. > did you get the networking working ? oh yeah. a lot better than their driver. > does it ouput graphics ? doesn't have draw or tk. the intention is a loadable /dev/fb driver. it ain't done. would be a great device to import into a p9 box. > I have an Inferno subscription so presumably I'm licensed for it even if you *can't* put it on general release. :) > > Boyd's been enthusing about your Inferno work. It would be interesting/enlightening to see it first hand. > > m i wish i had more time to put into it. brucee From jsnader@ix.netcom.com Sun Mar 7 09:46:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 00:42:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5143 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 00:42:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5139 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 00:42:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 00:42:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92ADE19D26; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:42:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B736819C63; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:42:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4120319C90; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:41:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from bsd.jcs.local (653220hfc93.tampabay.rr.com [65.32.20.93]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A4BC19BFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:41:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by bsd.jcs.local (Postfix, from userid 1001) id DB48540F; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:41:52 -0500 (EST) From: Jon Snader To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Message-ID: <20040306154152.GB68061@ix.netcom.com> Mail-Followup-To: Jon Snader , 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20040305234232.27003.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040305234232.27003.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 10:41:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 06:42:32PM -0500, Scott Schwartz wrote: > I don't change the tabstops from the default. > At the same time, I don't think the tab key > should necessarily insert a ctrl-I character. > The editor could compute the right number of > spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. I respectfully disagree. Not everyone likes the same value for tabstop. Some insist it should be 4, some 2, and others 8. Doubtless there are folks out there with other choices. By using the ctrl-I character, people can have the text formatted to their own tastes. (Yes I understand this can cause line wrapping, but at least people have a choice, and the choice works out pretty well in most cases). jcs From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 7 09:46:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 01:34:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7531 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 01:34:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7527 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 01:34:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 01:34:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E168219D1C; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:34:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9298719B7E; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:34:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC67719C50; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:33:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9532219B88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 11:33:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i26GWZiq073480 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:32:35 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i26GWZJn073479 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:32:35 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403061632.i26GWZJn073479@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll In-Reply-To: <20040306154152.GB68061@ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:32:35 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I don't change the tabstops from the default. > > At the same time, I don't think the tab key > > should necessarily insert a ctrl-I character. > > The editor could compute the right number of > > spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. > > I respectfully disagree. Not everyone likes the same value > for tabstop. Some insist it should be 4, some 2, and others > 8. Doubtless there are folks out there with other choices. I have just found a very thoughtful a detailed explanation of the proper choice of tab width at the following URL: http://www.jaffebros.com/lee/gulliver/bk1/chap1-4.html From matt@proweb.co.uk Sun Mar 7 09:46:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 06:20:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23109 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 06:20:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23105 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 06:20:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 06:20:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44F2419BBD; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 16:20:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E2B919D8F; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 16:20:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99CEF19C90; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 16:19:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A9E719BBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 16:19:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2083b35bf944a82acc568f6ce7c2d47a@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:21:53 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Hmmm. I wish I had a slave to fix pcs for me. If you mean specific machines, next time I'm in town I'll bring a screwdriver If you mean the PC platform, next time I'm in town I'll bring a hammer m From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 7 09:46:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 09:21:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1507 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 09:21:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1503 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 09:21:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 09:21:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5038B19DDE; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 19:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7407419DB8; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 19:21:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D12D19DC1; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 19:20:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F8EE19D48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 19:20:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <506ef70280983c80e1ff44facea4de31@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] libndb Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 19:20:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Big changes. The fixed length for the value of attr/value pairs was getting to be a pain so I made it variable. Shouldn't affect most things that use it but to be on the safe side I created: Ndbtuple* csgetvalue(char*, char*, char*, char*, char*, int); Ndbtuple* ndbgetvalue(Ndb*, Ndbs*, char*, char*, char*, char*, int); Ndbtuple* ndblookvalue(Ndbtuple*, Ndbtuple*, char*, char*, int); These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a length for the buffer that gets filled. The old interfaces will eventually disappear. From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 10:39:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5091 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 10:39:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5087 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 10:39:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 10:39:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 59F9D19E2A; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:39:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E352A19DEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:39:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2416E19DEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:38:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6CAE519DB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:38:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4000 invoked by uid 991); 7 Mar 2004 01:38:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20040307013844.3999.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb In-reply-to: <506ef70280983c80e1ff44facea4de31@plan9.bell-labs.com> References: <506ef70280983c80e1ff44facea4de31@plan9.bell-labs.com> Comments: In-reply-to David Presotto message dated "Sat, 06 Mar 2004 19:20:32 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 20:38:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: | These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a | length for the buffer that gets filled. How do they signal that it wasn't big enough? From matt@proweb.co.uk Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 10:44:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5279 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 10:44:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5274 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 10:44:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 10:44:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B31DC19E17; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:44:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E2BE19D08; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:44:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A59BE19D25; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:43:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64C9B19C8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:43:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <658ff6241f2a6ef94ae94c88e2faab5c@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] usbd Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 01:45:53 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: How does one begin to fiddle with USB? From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 10:51:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5572 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 10:51:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5568 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 10:51:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 10:51:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5808019DB5; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:51:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61C1019DB5; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:51:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDE0F19DC7; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:50:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9A2219D5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:50:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb In-Reply-To: <20040307013844.3999.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-svmqjklwbhzmdzvcuqmquyrkzt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:50:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-svmqjklwbhzmdzvcuqmquyrkzt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No, it just truncates. Suggest something else if you like. It's easy enough to call werrstr in it. --upas-svmqjklwbhzmdzvcuqmquyrkzt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 6 20:39:31 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sat Mar 6 20:39:28 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D37219DB5; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:39:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B29C19DB5; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:39:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2416E19DEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:38:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6CAE519DB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:38:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4000 invoked by uid 991); 7 Mar 2004 01:38:44 -0000 Message-ID: <20040307013844.3999.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb In-reply-to: <506ef70280983c80e1ff44facea4de31@plan9.bell-labs.com> References: <506ef70280983c80e1ff44facea4de31@plan9.bell-labs.com> Comments: In-reply-to David Presotto message dated "Sat, 06 Mar 2004 19:20:32 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2004 20:38:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: | These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a | length for the buffer that gets filled. How do they signal that it wasn't big enough? --upas-svmqjklwbhzmdzvcuqmquyrkzt-- From geoff@collyer.net Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 10:56:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5822 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 10:56:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5817 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 10:56:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 10:56:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05EA419E35; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:56:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C21819DFB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:56:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB8AE19E17; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:55:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF08219DEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:55:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <508d41fb4a5650a3b09bc918d004eb09@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usbd From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <658ff6241f2a6ef94ae94c88e2faab5c@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:55:01 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It's called `usb0' these days: ; ls -l /dev/usb0 d-r-xr-xr-x U 0 geoff geoff 0 Mar 5 22:00 /dev/usb0/0 --rw-rw-rw- U 0 geoff geoff 0 Mar 5 22:00 /dev/usb0/new --rw-rw-rw- U 0 geoff geoff 0 Mar 5 22:00 /dev/usb0/port Try ls '#U' From geoff@collyer.net Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 10:58:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5878 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 10:58:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5874 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 10:58:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 10:58:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 14D5E19DEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:58:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F53119DEB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:58:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9DC4919E29; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9695219D1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 20:57:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <50624c85f8ff54b2e8a64ed19ec41ab6@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usbd From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <658ff6241f2a6ef94ae94c88e2faab5c@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:57:22 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I missed that you'd already tried /dev/usb* initially. Are you getting a '#U: ...' line when you boot? From geoff@collyer.net Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 11:03:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6138 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 11:03:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6133 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 11:03:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 11:03:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 103F219E4E; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:03:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0896E19E3F; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:03:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E97BA19E31; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:02:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC85319E29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:02:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9c399e1132e435ff707d7cf3488abe22@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usbd From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <50624c85f8ff54b2e8a64ed19ec41ab6@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 18:02:07 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Something else to check: do you have usb usbuhci in the kernel configuration file for your kernel? From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 7 20:05:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 11:21:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7032 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 11:21:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7028 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 11:21:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 11:21:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 627F219E93; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CA8619E41; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:21:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C3D3019E12; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:20:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2BCE19DE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:20:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <376c2187061a006e18c6eacc3bb32796@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 21:20:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >| These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a >| length for the buffer that gets filled. > >How do they signal that it wasn't big enough? I put out new versions that set the errstr to "return value truncated" if it is. From sape@plan9.bell-labs.com Sun Mar 7 20:05:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 13:16:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13921 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 13:16:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13917 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 13:16:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 13:16:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3693219E22; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 23:16:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 102D019CBB; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 23:16:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F4C619C51; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 23:15:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C968119C51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 6 Mar 2004 23:15:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 6 23:15:23 EST 2004 Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.36.6.151]) by plan9; Sat Mar 6 23:15:22 EST 2004 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usbd From: sape@plan9.bell-labs.com In-Reply-To: <658ff6241f2a6ef94ae94c88e2faab5c@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2004 23:15:22 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > How does one begin to fiddle with USB? > > From reading usb(3) I should have > /dev/usbm > > but I don't Is usb enabled in the bios? Is there an IRQ assigned to it? Do you have usb in your kernel? Do you have an usb0= line in your plan9.ini? From brucee@chunder.com Sun Mar 7 20:05:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 17:35:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30329 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 17:35:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30325 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 17:35:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 17:35:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8852219BCF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 03:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2002519BAC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 03:35:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B27FD19BAC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 03:34:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 852DB19BA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 03:34:33 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31155 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 08:34:32 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 08:34:32 -0000 Message-ID: <003901c4041f$3271e9c0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] staying up to date ... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:35:46 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: anyone have a simple script for "staying up to date" when you are fossilized? i know how to grab a fossil partition without permissions but i don't want to fk up my machine trying to update it. regards, brucee From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sun Mar 7 20:05:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 18:54:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2543 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 18:54:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2539 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 18:54:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 18:54:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CE92E19B9C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 04:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52E9619B33; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 04:54:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1DA8619B5B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 04:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0A1819B33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 04:53:14 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27A1LBM028768 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:01:22 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] staying up to date ... X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056165@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] staying up to date ... Thread-Index: AcQEH1HimqFDO3dNT4erbHDaSy1MWAAB+N7w From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:53:15 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: =20 > anyone have a simple script for "staying up to date" when > you are fossilized? i know how to grab a fossil partition > without permissions but i don't want to fk up my machine > trying to update it. I'm looking right now at the latest /dist/replica/network, and it = already contains all the necessary setup. In case you don't have it, fn clientmount { echo 'srv -AWP replica'>>/srv/fscons; mount -c = /srv/replica /n/boot } c=3D/n/boot/dist/replica clientroot=3D/n/boot should do the trick. Tiit From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sun Mar 7 20:05:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 19:09:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3348 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 19:09:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3344 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 19:09:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 19:09:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3043E19B5B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1725E19ABC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F26F19B5E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31C6419ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:08:57 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27AH5RR028873 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:17:05 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056166@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQELDKA2KCSGOZgTFK1O7yj4SynXA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:59 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm getting my IP setup from a (non-Plan 9) DHCP server. It doesn't contain the name of the mail server. Hence, /net/ndb doesn't contain it. Hence, mail isn't working. Setting smtp=3D... in /lib/ndb/local has no effect. Suggestions? Also, how does /net/ndb relate to /lib/ndb? Tiit From ekarttun@cs.helsinki.fi Sun Mar 7 20:05:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 19:21:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4038 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 19:21:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4034 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 19:21:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 19:21:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 353F319B81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 360AD19B47; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:21:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2368519B7D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:20:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E45B819ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:20:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 12:20:21 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27AKLkZ016838 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:20:21 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i27AKLLc016836 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:20:21 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: Plan9 ML <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040307102020.GA16735@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] Following a file in an acme window Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:20:21 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello I am looking for a way to have acme follow a file that grows. Using win + cat works, but how can I manage it without them? - Einar Karttunen From ekarttun@cs.helsinki.fi Sun Mar 7 21:38:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 20:33:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8115 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 20:33:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8111 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 20:33:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 20:33:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C36119BD1; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:33:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4468319B94; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:33:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 76C7119BAE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:32:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32B4F19B92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:32:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 13:32:10 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27BW9kZ020651 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i27BW9wb020649 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: Plan9 ML <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040307113209.GA18849@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] making emalloc a library function Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello Quite many programs define emalloc, which does the same thing. I was thinking of ripping these out and replacing with a library. I have two alternative routes. Either make libemalloc which contains emalloc, estrdup and so on or add a flag which makes libc malloc behave like emalloc. The first way would give programs freedom, but library code would still use raw malloc instead of the emalloc. The second solution would be harder for programs wishing to use both emalloc and malloc (of course this would be still possible), but it would be more general... The changes would break no existing code in either case. Should I go forward with either idea? - Einar Karttunen From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 21:57:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13666 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 21:57:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13662 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 21:57:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 21:57:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2988119C51; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:57:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF91E19BFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:57:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 723B819C2B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:56:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1626019BFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:56:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <65d4ef76bf4b837c98e49850e56e5019@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function In-Reply-To: <20040307113209.GA18849@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vnyylldjybvwlitcunjuvndpmi" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:56:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vnyylldjybvwlitcunjuvndpmi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If its just a flag, some libraries will start to depend on the behavior and noone will be able to write programs that use the libraries and still can survive running out of memory. I think we should just bite the bullet and add e(malloc,realloc,mallocz) to the library. --upas-vnyylldjybvwlitcunjuvndpmi Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 06:33:29 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 06:33:26 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1414D19BCF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:33:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B660819B92; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:33:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 76C7119BAE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:32:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32B4F19B92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 06:32:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 13:32:10 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27BW9kZ020651 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i27BW9wb020649 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: Plan9 ML <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040307113209.GA18849@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] making emalloc a library function Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:32:09 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello Quite many programs define emalloc, which does the same thing. I was thinking of ripping these out and replacing with a library. I have two alternative routes. Either make libemalloc which contains emalloc, estrdup and so on or add a flag which makes libc malloc behave like emalloc. The first way would give programs freedom, but library code would still use raw malloc instead of the emalloc. The second solution would be harder for programs wishing to use both emalloc and malloc (of course this would be still possible), but it would be more general... The changes would break no existing code in either case. Should I go forward with either idea? - Einar Karttunen --upas-vnyylldjybvwlitcunjuvndpmi-- From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 21:59:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13719 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 21:59:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13715 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 21:59:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 21:59:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62CF319C46; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF7C419BFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:59:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6662A19C46; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:58:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BA6019BFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:58:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056166@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-frqmdneggbkppvuarhmbmokyin" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 07:58:35 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-frqmdneggbkppvuarhmbmokyin Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit /net/ndb is used by cs and dns before /lib/ndb. If you have an entry for the network in /lib/ndb/local with the smtp=, it will be found. Alternatively, you can do this in termrc or cpurc: echo ' smtp=....' >> /net/ndb after you do the ipconfig. --upas-frqmdneggbkppvuarhmbmokyin Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 05:09:27 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 05:09:24 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FD7319BA0; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C60E319B5B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F26F19B5E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:09:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31C6419ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 05:08:57 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27AH5RR028873 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:17:05 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056166@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQELDKA2KCSGOZgTFK1O7yj4SynXA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:59 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm getting my IP setup from a (non-Plan 9) DHCP server. It doesn't contain the name of the mail server. Hence, /net/ndb doesn't contain it. Hence, mail isn't working. Setting smtp=3D... in /lib/ndb/local has no effect. Suggestions? Also, how does /net/ndb relate to /lib/ndb? Tiit --upas-frqmdneggbkppvuarhmbmokyin-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:15:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14831 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:15:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14827 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:15:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:15:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D999219C66; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F3C619B58; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BE5C19B09; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:14:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E229719B58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:14:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27DDriq079474 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27DDrDh079473 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071313.i27DDrDh079473@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: /net/ndb: ip=192.168.1.28 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=192.168.1.1 dom=.davidashen.net dns=192.168.1.1 /lib/ndb/local: sys=xotic ether=0002a5561d54 proto=il ip=192.168.1.28 ipmask=255.255.255.0 dom=.home.davidashen.net Shouldn't dom in /net/ndb be .home.davidashen.net? David From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:16:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14858 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:16:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14854 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:16:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:16:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B943719C2B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:16:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF2ED19C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:16:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7B9319C7D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DEAC19BF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:35 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27DNjac030240 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:23:45 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056167@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQERBPiKw4KRfmDQoqguL9J+u8BmwAAEfpw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:15:37 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > /net/ndb is used by cs and dns before /lib/ndb. If you have=20 > an entry for > the network in /lib/ndb/local with the smtp=3D, it will be found. It was _not_ found. That's the whole problem that made me wonder if /lib/ndb/local is consulted at all. Later I realised that the search is probably conducted by IP address, but there's no address given in /lib/ndb/local 'cos its pointless. I solved the problem by defining a network with the correct parameters. OT: How to compensate for the fact that the real-time clock is in local = time? date(1) and friends constantly show me the time in GMT, although I've = set /adm/timezone/local. Also, how does timesync(8) fit into the picture? I mean, if I've set it = up to synchronise with a NTP server, is the RTC updated into GMT? Presumably not if the -L flag is given? It's a multiboot machine and i'd like to keep the RTC local. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:19:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15070 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:19:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15066 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:19:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:19:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 344D719BF5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:19:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5873C19BF5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:19:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F42F19BF5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:18:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C996819B09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:18:07 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27DQIe7030278 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:26:18 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D31@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQERlOulZPIdBNPRnu9aU1bJqkT7wAAEEjA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:18:09 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > dom=3D.home.davidashen.net it's probably confused by the leading dot From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:24:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15303 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:24:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15299 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:24:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:24:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA1C119C8E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:24:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FAC019C52; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:24:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8889119C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:23:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C13F19C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:23:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9068264d61698be89ea612b62212f186@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <200403071313.i27DDrDh079473@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jnazevpncwlmprfmhbksnzpnia" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:23:49 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jnazevpncwlmprfmhbksnzpnia Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit First of all, dom in our world is an FQDN. That means that both .home.davidashen.net and .davidachen.net are wrong. We ask dhcp for a hostname and a domain. For the latter, dhcp's seem to differ in what they give back, i.e., the FQDN of the machine, the FQDN domain name that the machine is in, or that FQDN starting with a '.'. Ipconfig tries to deal with the situation, clearly not well enough. I'll try to do better but, if the server doesn't return the hostname, its hard to guess. the dom=.davidashen.net clearly indicates that we only got the domain and not the hostname. This is a effect of the spread of windows where the hostname is always in local storage and diskless boot is not really considered. I'll try to do better in ipconfig. --upas-jnazevpncwlmprfmhbksnzpnia Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:15:31 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:15:28 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44CC419C37; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0032F19BFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BE5C19B09; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:14:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E229719B58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:14:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27DDriq079474 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27DDrDh079473 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071313.i27DDrDh079473@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:13:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: /net/ndb: ip=192.168.1.28 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=192.168.1.1 dom=.davidashen.net dns=192.168.1.1 /lib/ndb/local: sys=xotic ether=0002a5561d54 proto=il ip=192.168.1.28 ipmask=255.255.255.0 dom=.home.davidashen.net Shouldn't dom in /net/ndb be .home.davidashen.net? David --upas-jnazevpncwlmprfmhbksnzpnia-- From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:36:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15898 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:36:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15894 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:36:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:36:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A0E2519CA6; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20ED319C7D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:36:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B133B19C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:35:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 576C219BED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:35:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <684b651b33f17d72d25a4d82b12e622b@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056167@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bsdoteznqwbabvvehdaqghnset" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:35:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bsdoteznqwbabvvehdaqghnset Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There's no reason for the RTC to be in local time. One way to compensate is to reset it to GMT. However, if you're sharing a clock with Windows, you're stuck with their idiocy (i.e. a clock that is always at the wrong time until the system resets it if you live in a world with daylight savings time). Timesync sets the os's view of time. With -r it sets time from the RTC rather than a network source and stays synced with it. With -rL it sets from the RTC and assumes the RTC is in local time. Timesync never sets the RTC. This means that the system, by reading the RTC on boot, will be in the wrong time zone till timesync gets in there. Boot can't do any better because the file system with the timezone files hasn't started yet at that point. --upas-bsdoteznqwbabvvehdaqghnset Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:16:21 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:16:18 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E6C4A19C8B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:16:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 556AE19C6F; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:16:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7B9319C7D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DEAC19BF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:15:35 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27DNjac030240 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:23:45 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056167@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQERBPiKw4KRfmDQoqguL9J+u8BmwAAEfpw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:15:37 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > /net/ndb is used by cs and dns before /lib/ndb. If you have=20 > an entry for > the network in /lib/ndb/local with the smtp=3D, it will be found. It was _not_ found. That's the whole problem that made me wonder if /lib/ndb/local is consulted at all. Later I realised that the search is probably conducted by IP address, but there's no address given in /lib/ndb/local 'cos its pointless. I solved the problem by defining a network with the correct parameters. OT: How to compensate for the fact that the real-time clock is in local = time? date(1) and friends constantly show me the time in GMT, although I've = set /adm/timezone/local. Also, how does timesync(8) fit into the picture? I mean, if I've set it = up to synchronise with a NTP server, is the RTC updated into GMT? Presumably not if the -L flag is given? It's a multiboot machine and i'd like to keep the RTC local. --upas-bsdoteznqwbabvvehdaqghnset-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:51:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16393 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:51:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16389 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:51:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:51:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AF45019CC9; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:51:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE8F719C81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:51:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB73819B18; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B26719C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27DnZiq079595 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27DnZru079594 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071349.i27DnZru079594@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <9068264d61698be89ea612b62212f186@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > We ask dhcp for a hostname and a domain. For the latter, dhcp's > seem to differ in what they give back, i.e., the FQDN of the machine, > the FQDN domain name that the machine is in, or that FQDN starting > with a '.'. Ipconfig tries to deal with the situation, clearly > not well enough. I'll try to do better but, if the server doesn't > return the hostname, its hard to guess. the dom=.davidashen.net > clearly indicates that we only got the domain and not the hostname. > This is a effect of the spread of windows where the hostname is > always in local storage and diskless boot is not really considered. I have no Windows server in my network; the dhcp server sends domain names. I have only done that (the leading dot) because http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Mail_configuration/ in the last paragraph says: This name is generated from either the site enviroment var, or if that is not set, by appending the sending machines domain to its system name. The domain is picked up from the dom= attribute from /lib/ndb/local. The dom= attribut should be of the form dom=.machine.com (NB: leading dot). If it is wrong, I'll change it to the fqdn. From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:53:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16482 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:53:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16478 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:53:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:53:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90ED419A9C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:53:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E5A719A0D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:53:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 465D619CB2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9BB219B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27Dpdiq079614 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:51:39 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27DpdUm079613 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:51:39 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071351.i27DpdUm079613@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056167@black.aprote.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:51:39 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > /net/ndb is used by cs and dns before /lib/ndb. If you have > > an entry for > > the network in /lib/ndb/local with the smtp=, it will be found. > > It was _not_ found. That's the whole problem that made me wonder > if /lib/ndb/local is consulted at all. Later I realised that the search > is probably conducted by IP address, but there's no address > given in /lib/ndb/local 'cos its pointless. I think it's about mailserver in /cron/mail/cron. Edit it and replace with your mailserver's name or add mailserver to the dns. sys=mailserver, that is. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:54:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16501 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:54:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16497 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:54:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:54:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8DC319CC3; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:54:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AC7819ABD; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:54:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2339119C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:53:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6937D19A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:53:40 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27E1prC030608 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:01:51 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D32@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQES2dO1kx3Se6ESounifkASJnjWgAABGRA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:53:42 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > be of the form dom=3D.machine.com (NB: leading dot). >=20 > If it is wrong, I'll change it to the fqdn. i've always used the fqdn and works like a charm. my dhcp server doesn't return names, tho From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:55:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16587 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:55:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16583 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:55:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:55:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7145319CCD; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:55:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99FAD199E4; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:55:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70CD219A10; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:54:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 199CC19A9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:54:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <88c6e77a3e4ca429414a39724d4fc4c3@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <200403071349.i27DnZru079594@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-jnruljuwvadpbamuylpxgbtzxl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:54:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-jnruljuwvadpbamuylpxgbtzxl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It's wrong. Unfortunately, I don't vet the wiki. People put in whatever accidentally worked. I'll go change it. --upas-jnruljuwvadpbamuylpxgbtzxl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:51:32 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:51:29 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CD90919C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08EE219C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:51:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB73819B18; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B26719C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27DnZiq079595 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27DnZru079594 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071349.i27DnZru079594@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <9068264d61698be89ea612b62212f186@plan9.bell-labs.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:35 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > We ask dhcp for a hostname and a domain. For the latter, dhcp's > seem to differ in what they give back, i.e., the FQDN of the machine, > the FQDN domain name that the machine is in, or that FQDN starting > with a '.'. Ipconfig tries to deal with the situation, clearly > not well enough. I'll try to do better but, if the server doesn't > return the hostname, its hard to guess. the dom=.davidashen.net > clearly indicates that we only got the domain and not the hostname. > This is a effect of the spread of windows where the hostname is > always in local storage and diskless boot is not really considered. I have no Windows server in my network; the dhcp server sends domain names. I have only done that (the leading dot) because http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Mail_configuration/ in the last paragraph says: This name is generated from either the site enviroment var, or if that is not set, by appending the sending machines domain to its system name. The domain is picked up from the dom= attribute from /lib/ndb/local. The dom= attribut should be of the form dom=.machine.com (NB: leading dot). If it is wrong, I'll change it to the fqdn. --upas-jnruljuwvadpbamuylpxgbtzxl-- From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 22:59:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16912 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 22:59:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16908 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 22:59:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 22:59:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 679CF19CB5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:59:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FC6619A08; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:59:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0DD6E19A10; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7371E19A00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:58:16 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27E6RT7030670 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:06:27 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D33@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQESUkXO2JXZgbQROqC5ts4T6Wz9AAAlIKA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:58:18 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This means that the system, by reading the RTC on boot, will be in > the wrong time zone till timesync gets in there. Boot can't do > any better because the file system with the timezone files hasn't > started yet at that point. OK, I'll rephrase. How long will it take for timesync to annihilate a = 2-hour difference? From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 23:05:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17153 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 23:05:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17149 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 23:05:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 23:05:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55F8119D25; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:05:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1672E19CBB; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:05:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 011F119C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:04:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75C5C19ABD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:04:03 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27ECEMc030752 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:12:14 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D34@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQESUkXO2JXZgbQROqC5ts4T6Wz9AAA6hvw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:04:05 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Still, why are date(1) and friends telling the time in GMT when $timezone is set differently? From alcortes@coitt.es Mon Mar 8 00:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 23:13:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17687 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 23:13:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17676 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 23:13:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 23:13:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0979619ABD; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0057819C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:13:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1008F19AEF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:12:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from tnetsmtp2.mail.isp (smtp.telefonica.net [213.4.129.135]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 701D819A78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:12:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by tnetsmtp2.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU7M5F01.67D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:51 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Azz1O-0000KS-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 15:12:50 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Subject: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have make a new installation of a plan 9 terminal in a clean disk (actually, it is a vmware "machine"). After loading the kernel, boot(8) prints these lines: > root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: > user[none]: glenda > kfs...bad nvram key > bad authentication id > bad authentication domain > version...time... And then init(8) is executed and everything seems to work ok. I do not know what those "bad foo bar" lines mean. Does it have something to do with boot(8) trying authenticate with the local root server? I have been looking at /sys/src/9/boot/boot.c and /sys/src/9/boot/bootauth.c but i can not identify the problem, i think it is somewhere between these lines (from boot.c): > /* > * pick a method and initialize it > */ > mp = rootserver(argc ? *argv : 0); > (*mp->config)(mp); > islocal = strcmp(mp->name, "local") == 0; > ishybrid = strcmp(mp->name, "hybrid") == 0; > > /* > * authentication agent > */ > authentication(cpuflag); > > /* > * connect to the root file system > */ > fd = (*mp->connect)(); > if(fd < 0) > fatal("can't connect)(); > if(getenv("srvold9p")) > fd = old9p(fd); > if(!islocal && !ishybrid){ > if(cfs) > fd = (*cfs)(fd); > } I am not skilled enough for solving this, any pointers, explanations or recommendations? -- url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 00:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 23:15:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17801 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 23:15:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17795 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 23:15:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 23:15:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8FA619DC7; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:15:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B310619B3C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:15:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2326019D85; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:14:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB86119B9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27EDbiq079766 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:13:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27EDb7r079765 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:13:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071413.i27EDb7r079765@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D34@black.aprote.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:13:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Still, why are date(1) and friends telling the time in GMT > when $timezone is set differently? > timezone is meant to be set from /adm/timezone/local; the parser requires a linefeed at the end. Set it to timezone='EET 7200 EDT 10800 ' It will work. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 00:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 7 23:32:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22423 invoked by uid 1020); 7 Mar 2004 23:32:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22419 invoked from network); 7 Mar 2004 23:32:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 7 Mar 2004 23:32:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D08EF19CB5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:32:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3A9619C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:32:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B91A819C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:31:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C00F19BF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:31:41 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27EdqWb030992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:39:52 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056168@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQETq1bsQHoezobS1mAltR3bouDFAAAZUaw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:31:43 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It will work. I have /adm/timezone/local set up (and it ends in a line feed). It doesn't work. From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 00:33:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25401 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 00:33:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25397 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 00:33:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 00:33:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6613D19C6F; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:33:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDF3619C46; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:33:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE10819C51; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:32:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B810419C28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:32:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27FVoiq079977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:31:50 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27FVoe8079976 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:31:50 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071531.i27FVoe8079976@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056168@black.aprote.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:31:50 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > It will work. > > I have /adm/timezone/local set up (and it ends in a line feed). > It doesn't work. > What's in the file? cpu%timezone='EET 7200 EDT 10800 ' cpu%date Sun Mar 7 17:28:12 EET 2004 cpu% timezone='AMT 14400 AMD 18000 ' cpu% date Sun Mar 7 19:32:14 AMT 2004 cpu% From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 16:49:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 00:50:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26487 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 00:50:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26483 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 00:50:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 00:50:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D5AB19C8E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:50:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91E0F19AEF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:50:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9AAFE19A08; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:49:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11D3E19AEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:49:49 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27Fw1Ia031586 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:58:01 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D36@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQEWa58CrSRM6R9R5yxKjWHioRZfAAAfqwg From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 17:49:51 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: OK, I finally got it. The timezone name needs to be 3 letters _exactly_=20 or it will get confused. Tiit@enlightened From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 16:49:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 00:51:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26564 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 00:51:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26560 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 00:51:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 00:51:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AB90419CAF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:51:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F00019D87; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:51:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D19E619CAF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:50:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDF2C19A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:50:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key In-Reply-To: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-uklfvmdjlelcicnejtzboylqae" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:50:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-uklfvmdjlelcicnejtzboylqae Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You're booting a cpu kernel that doesn't expect a user to be around and does expect to find its key (and other stuff) either in nvram or in a disk paritition called nvram. Boot a terminal kernel (like 9pcdisk or 9pcf). --upas-uklfvmdjlelcicnejtzboylqae Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 09:13:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 09:13:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0446319AEF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:13:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B3E119B3C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:13:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1008F19AEF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:12:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from tnetsmtp2.mail.isp (smtp.telefonica.net [213.4.129.135]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 701D819A78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:12:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by tnetsmtp2.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU7M5F01.67D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:51 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Azz1O-0000KS-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 15:12:50 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Subject: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have make a new installation of a plan 9 terminal in a clean disk (actually, it is a vmware "machine"). After loading the kernel, boot(8) prints these lines: > root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: > user[none]: glenda > kfs...bad nvram key > bad authentication id > bad authentication domain > version...time... And then init(8) is executed and everything seems to work ok. I do not know what those "bad foo bar" lines mean. Does it have something to do with boot(8) trying authenticate with the local root server? I have been looking at /sys/src/9/boot/boot.c and /sys/src/9/boot/bootauth.c but i can not identify the problem, i think it is somewhere between these lines (from boot.c): > /* > * pick a method and initialize it > */ > mp = rootserver(argc ? *argv : 0); > (*mp->config)(mp); > islocal = strcmp(mp->name, "local") == 0; > ishybrid = strcmp(mp->name, "hybrid") == 0; > > /* > * authentication agent > */ > authentication(cpuflag); > > /* > * connect to the root file system > */ > fd = (*mp->connect)(); > if(fd < 0) > fatal("can't connect)(); > if(getenv("srvold9p")) > fd = old9p(fd); > if(!islocal && !ishybrid){ > if(cfs) > fd = (*cfs)(fd); > } I am not skilled enough for solving this, any pointers, explanations or recommendations? -- url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html --upas-uklfvmdjlelcicnejtzboylqae-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 00:53:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26653 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 00:53:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26649 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 00:53:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 00:53:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96FF119A9C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:53:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFE6619CC3; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:53:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BFB519A9C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D18EA19C52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:52:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27Fppiq080057 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:51:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27FppEX080056 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:51:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071551.i27FppEX080056@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] ctime timezone Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:51:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, either ctime(2) or the source in /sys/src/libc/9sys/ctime.c tm2sec.c is incorrect. The man says that /env/timezone is timezone specification (NAME LONG NAME LONG\n), optionally followed by altenrate time pairs, but the code is written so that the minimum required is (NAME LONG NAME LONG\n\n), otherwise an error is reported and the timezone is not set. David From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 16:49:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 00:56:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26830 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 00:56:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26826 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 00:56:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 00:56:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E9C1C19D85; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:56:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 051E319D66; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:56:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3AC6F19D85; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:55:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7B3619A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:55:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D33@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xhifrvuydwmfvmjlrheeplhhkg" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:55:41 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xhifrvuydwmfvmjlrheeplhhkg Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit immediate. It the diff is > 10 seconds it just sets it. you have some other problem. everyone that dual boots with windows that doesn't live on the prime meridian (myself included) is in the same boat. cd /adm/timezone cp EET local reboot and see how things look. --upas-xhifrvuydwmfvmjlrheeplhhkg Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:59:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 08:59:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E12A419C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:59:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F269A19A00; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:59:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0DD6E19A10; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7371E19A00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:58:16 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i27E6RT7030670 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:06:27 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] dhcp & metanames X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D33@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Thread-Index: AcQESUkXO2JXZgbQROqC5ts4T6Wz9AAAlIKA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:58:18 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This means that the system, by reading the RTC on boot, will be in > the wrong time zone till timesync gets in there. Boot can't do > any better because the file system with the timezone files hasn't > started yet at that point. OK, I'll rephrase. How long will it take for timesync to annihilate a = 2-hour difference? --upas-xhifrvuydwmfvmjlrheeplhhkg-- From bs@nospam.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:13:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29318 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:13:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29314 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:13:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:13:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1AB6A19D96; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB15719DEB; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:13:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9EF1819C81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:12:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64B4219B5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:12:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004030716123501500imq58e>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:12:35 +0000 Message-ID: <404B49F4.1070107@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb References: <20040307013844.3999.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 11:12:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Can i pass null for the buffer and a pointer to the length, and get the length needed to be allocated? > No, it just truncates. Suggest something else if you like. It's easy enough to > call werrstr in it. > > | These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a > | length for the buffer that gets filled. > > How do they signal that it wasn't big enough? From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:18:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29543 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:18:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29539 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:18:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:18:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2A8C19E22; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:18:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45E3F19DEB; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:18:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99CF619D96; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:17:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 515B619C6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:17:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11736d5a032860f5a5f617703661555d@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb In-Reply-To: <404B49F4.1070107@nospam.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xsfszmewkerpahjinyjgepamok" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:17:49 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xsfszmewkerpahjinyjgepamok Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a better idea. Why don't I make the interface csgetvalue(char *netroot, char *attr, char *val, char *rattr, char **pp); If buf is non-zero, I strdup a reply and sick a pointer to it in pp. Given how much these routines to, it probably doesn't hurt to do the extra malloc/free. --upas-xsfszmewkerpahjinyjgepamok Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 11:13:34 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 11:13:31 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6473A19BF2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:13:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FDBA19C81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:13:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9EF1819C81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:12:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64B4219B5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:12:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004030716123501500imq58e>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:12:35 +0000 Message-ID: <404B49F4.1070107@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb References: <20040307013844.3999.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2004 11:12:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Can i pass null for the buffer and a pointer to the length, and get the length needed to be allocated? > No, it just truncates. Suggest something else if you like. It's easy enough to > call werrstr in it. > > | These do the same thing csgetval, ndbgetval and ndbloolval but take a > | length for the buffer that gets filled. > > How do they signal that it wasn't big enough? --upas-xsfszmewkerpahjinyjgepamok-- From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:35:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30123 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30119 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:35:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:35:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 03D9319DB5; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B50119C6F; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:35:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA4D019C6F; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:34:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50A4E19CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:34:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20040307113209.GA18849@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 08:37:46 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: deja vu... anyone looking to add e* functions to a library should read the 'same functions everywhere' thread started almost exactly a year ago. contains some good arguments against it. andrey From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:37:23 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30197 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:37:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30193 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:37:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:37:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 183CA19DD2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D469119D66; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:37:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 194F419DC7; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:36:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C97A19D66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:36:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: 9nut@9netics.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:36:32 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Would supporting subdirectories in /srv be a bad idea? It seems because of '#s's global nature, it would be useful if an application (or its user) could confine itself to a subdirectory. Perhaps too much kernel overhead for the convenience it provides? I think I just talked myself out of it. From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:41:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30335 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:41:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30331 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:41:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:41:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D344A19CAF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAE7319BF3; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:41:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDB34199D9; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:40:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C744199D7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:40:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cytvvmbypoypqiurmwqicbtsdn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:40:02 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cytvvmbypoypqiurmwqicbtsdn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Its been done before. I think we just need to look back in time. I think we need to think more about permissions before going crazy expanding /srv. --upas-cytvvmbypoypqiurmwqicbtsdn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 11:37:22 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sun Mar 7 11:37:20 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F28CD19E17; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:37:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34F8A19B43; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 194F419DC7; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:36:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C97A19D66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:36:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: 9nut@9netics.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:36:32 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Would supporting subdirectories in /srv be a bad idea? It seems because of '#s's global nature, it would be useful if an application (or its user) could confine itself to a subdirectory. Perhaps too much kernel overhead for the convenience it provides? I think I just talked myself out of it. --upas-cytvvmbypoypqiurmwqicbtsdn-- From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 01:59:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31037 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 01:59:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31033 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 01:59:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 01:59:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A83819C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EC8F19CA6; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:59:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0DF0819C7D; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:58:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 165A219C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 11:58:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:59:08 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Its been done before. I think we just need to look back in time. > > I think we need to think more about permissions before going crazy > expanding /srv. for an applications I'm working on it would be very nice to have '#s/app/groupid/' style directories that could be bound to /srv in that application's namespace. In this case the security model fits because the application is confined to a minimal namespace that must include /srv. So, if the user doesn't have the right group permission on '#s/app/groupid/', the application wont be able to see anything. From rob@mightycheese.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:06:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31213 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:06:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31209 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:06:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:06:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C3E919DC7; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:06:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCA9E19C80; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:06:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CAD1E19C8E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:05:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52B2519C62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:05:49 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-18-183.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.18.183]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i27H5kF5014552 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:05:47 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> References: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:06:13 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > deja vu... anyone looking to add e* functions to a library should > read the 'same functions everywhere' thread started almost exactly > a year ago. contains some good arguments against it. right. my main objection is that the specification of what to do in the case of errors is so application-dependent that making a library for it will either fail to capture many cases or encourage programs to fail poorly. plus, i mean really, how hard is emalloc to write? the part you'd put in a library is trivial. the part that matters is still up to you. -rob From alcortes@coitt.es Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:08:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31279 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:08:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31275 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:08:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:08:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 587EF19DA4; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CD5819C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74C1819CAF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:07:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from telesmtp4.mail.isp (pop3.telefonica.net [213.4.129.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1B3219C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by telesmtp4.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU7U8600.W46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:07:18 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B01k6-0000DU-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 18:07:10 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Message-ID: <20040307170709.GA634@shire> References: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="VbJkn9YxBvnuCH5J" Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:07:09 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --VbJkn9YxBvnuCH5J Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some time ago, David said: > You're booting a cpu kernel that doesn't expect a user to be around > and does expect to find its key (and other stuff) either in nvram > or in a disk paritition called nvram. >=20 > Boot a terminal kernel (like 9pcdisk or 9pcf). term% 9fat: term% cat /n/9/plan9.ini bootfile=3DsdC0!fs!/386/9pcdisk =2E =2E =2E 9load finds this kernel and loads it to memory, or so it seems, something like: Found 9pcdisk... Plan 9 =2E.. from the booting secuence displayed information. Is there any way to know what kernel is loaded (cpu or terminal) from a runing system? maybe my kernels have wrong names. --=20 url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html --VbJkn9YxBvnuCH5J Content-Type: application/pgp-signature Content-Disposition: inline -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.0.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: For info see http://www.gnupg.org iD8DBQFAS1a93sDfaZ63xaURAu+gAKCjm2iJ2Oxzg4OUstPlcpFhSU5d0ACff5te 0Du/BVZCki7PVktO36Zus0U= =/rEs -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --VbJkn9YxBvnuCH5J-- From rob@mightycheese.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:09:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31296 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:09:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31292 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:09:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:09:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AABC819DA4; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:09:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34D1F19C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:09:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5273719DD2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5A3F19C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:08:47 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-18-183.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.18.183]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i27H8jF5014603 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:08:46 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <20040307102020.GA16735@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> References: <20040307102020.GA16735@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <28016D61-705A-11D8-8891-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] Following a file in an acme window To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:09:12 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I am looking for a way to have acme follow a file that grows. Using win > + cat works, but how can I manage it without them? what's wrong with tail -f file? -rob From ekarttun@cs.helsinki.fi Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:26:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31984 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:26:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31980 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:26:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:26:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AB60C19CE2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:26:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B78219CDA; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:26:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F3C719CDA; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:25:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB81819CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:25:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 19:25:12 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27HPBkZ005816 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:25:11 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i27HPB2U005814 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:25:11 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function Message-ID: <20040307172511.GA31935@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> References: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:25:11 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 07.03 09:06, Rob Pike wrote: > right. my main objection is that the specification of what to do in the > case of errors is so application-dependent that making a library for it > will either fail to capture many cases or encourage programs to fail > poorly. Well it seems that many programs in the source tree want the same behaviour as it is. And no-one would be forced to use the library. The functions lib9p seem to do this (at least close). Would it be possible to start from there? > plus, i mean really, how hard is emalloc to write? the part you'd > put in a library is trivial. the part that matters is still up to you. So why are part of the emalloc implementations missing e.g. setmalloctag? Of course it is quite trivial to write, but in my opinion having dozens of definitions for the same function is not exactly sane. Also if one writes a malloc wrapper which behaves unlike the emallocs naming it emalloc is quite confusing. - Einar Karttunen From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:44:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 404 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:44:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 400 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:44:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:44:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB8C819E19; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:44:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74D9219CDC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:44:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A4AD19CE0; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:43:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B5EA19CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:43:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <345297dba3bd4c579598a90b9a7e9a06@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20040307172511.GA31935@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 09:47:01 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Well it seems that many programs in the source tree want the same > behaviour as it is. And no-one would be forced to use the library. Isn't that the reverse of 'whoever wants it, could write it in their own code'? Less than 50% of all Plan 9 programs use emalloc so there isn't a majority rule you can apply. > > The functions lib9p seem to do this (at least close). Would it > be possible to start from there? > The exceptions that prove the rule? See how they aren't called 'emalloc' :) Have you considered at the problem from all sides? What are your suggested implementations for eallocimage() and egetwindow()? > So why are part of the emalloc implementations missing e.g. > setmalloctag? Of course it is quite trivial to write, but in my > opinion having dozens of definitions for the same function is > not exactly sane. TPOP was the first to mention emalloc (not that it wasn't used before), its authors were wise not to suggest default behavior. > Also if one writes a malloc wrapper which > behaves unlike the emallocs naming it emalloc is quite confusing. Again, you assume emalloc has a well defined behaviour. It doesn't. The fact that everybody uses it the same way means that they haven't really thought out how their programs should behave after malloc has returned an error. Would you be happy if fossil called the library emalloc and sysfatal()-ed after some user process has allocated too much memory "just for fun"? What should fossil do, define eemalloc()? andrey From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:46:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 447 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:46:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 443 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:46:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:46:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 33C8619E24; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:46:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 81B2019CDC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:46:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA5C419E12; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:45:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D32B919CDC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:45:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6f3d5eb2a102ffd5a93ff58482bfa3a9@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <20040307172511.GA31935@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:45:27 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Also if one writes a malloc wrapper which > behaves unlike the emallocs naming it emalloc is quite confusing. Not if emalloc is in the application in every instance. From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:49:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 527 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:49:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 523 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:49:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:49:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 57F1D19E12; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A7D119A91; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:49:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E32319B11; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A72F619A91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:48:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9288808af8b6c2f305a95292eb98f02d@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 10:48:42 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > plus, i mean really, how hard is emalloc to write? the part you'd > put in a library is trivial. the part that matters is still up to you. "I'm with you, captain" -- boyd From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 02:57:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 933 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 929 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 856F319E12; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:57:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FE2D19AD3; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:57:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C4F319B11; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:56:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8A3E19A91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:56:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27Htbiq080606 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27HtbcR080605 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071755.i27HtbcR080605@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] kfs locks Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, cmd_sync sets rlock(&mainlock); ... syncall(); ... runlock(&mainlock); ... syncproc, the background process forked by kfs, runs syncblock() without setting rlock(&mainlock) Can it the cause that I am getting wrenwrite errors after 'check f' on startup, if cmd_sync is not called after cmd_check and before forking 'sync' and 'serve'? I am still struggling to understand the problem. I've changed the disk to be sure and still can reproduce the error if cmd_sync is not called after the list of free blocks is rebuilt after blackdown. David Tolpin From jas@corpus-callosum.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 03:08:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1382 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 03:08:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1378 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 03:08:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 03:08:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7137B19C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:08:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FC0619B43; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:08:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72F5D19B15; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:07:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from think9 (ip-216-36-98-133.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33F9319B1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 13:07:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <80980e52ed16f3b122ec3450783c1212@corpus-callosum.com> From: jas@corpus-callosum.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] TeX replica script for fossil Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:07:43 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Below is a modified script to install TeX on a fresh fossilize machine. I ended up just putting it on my filesystem as /dist/replica/tex #!/bin/rc s=/n/dist serverroot=/n/dist serverlog=$s/tex.log serverproto=$s/tex.proto fn servermount { if ( ! test -e $home/tmp/tex.iso.bz2) { srv tcp!sources.cs.bell-labs.com sources /n/sources cp /n/sources/extra/tex.iso.bz2 $home/tmp } if ( ! test -e $home/tmp/tex.iso ) { cwd=`{pwd} cd $home/tmp; bunzip2 tex.iso.bz2 cd $cwd } mount /srv/9660 /n/cdrom $home/tmp/tex.iso bind /n/cdrom /n/dist } fn serverupdate { status='' } if ( ! test -e /srv/boot && ! test -e /srv/kfs ) { echo 'error: neither /srv/boot nor /srv/kfs present; make sure you are running on the file server' exit '/srv/boot or /srv/kfs not present' } if (test -e /srv/fscons) { if ( ! test -w /srv/fscons ) { echo 'error: no write access to /srv/fscons, make sure you are the host owner' exit 'no write access to /srv/fscons' } fn clientmount { echo 'srv -AWP replica'>>/srv/fscons; mount -c /srv/replica /n/boot } c=/n/boot/dist/replica clientroot=/n/boot if ( ! test -e $c/client/tex.db) { >>$c/client/tex.db >>$c/client/tex.log } } if not { fn clientmount { 9fs kfs } c=/n/kfs/dist/replica clientroot=/n/kfs } clientdb=$c/client/tex.db clientexclude=(dist/replica/client) clientlog=$c/client/tex.log clientproto=$c/tex.proto applyopt=(-u -T$c/client/tex.time) From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 04:38:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6817 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 04:38:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6813 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 04:38:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 04:38:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA67419C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:38:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A58919B81; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:38:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA5C819BC8; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:37:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B83F19BF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:37:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <497492-23065>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:36:15 -0500 Message-ID: <031f01c4047b$406e8590$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 20:34:44 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > deja vu... dj ;) From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 04:46:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7100 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 04:46:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7096 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 04:46:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 04:46:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D944019C8B; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:46:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9537D19C46; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:46:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7B9D019C51; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:45:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BA6019C44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:45:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321650-6060>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:40:44 -0500 Message-ID: <033601c4047b$e102c480$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8ba1956a9b92658e6e3c216f3cc5b3cc@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 20:39:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > right. my main objection is that the specification of what to do in the > case of errors is so application-dependent that making a library for it > will either fail to capture many cases or encourage programs to fail > poorly. exactly, unless you add yet another two arguments (which i'd be loathed to do): - function to call on failure - arg to function but i'd guess that this would degenerate to: - exits - "ran out of memory" so i'd be against it. malloc failing is not always fatal. From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 04:59:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7592 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 04:59:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7588 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 04:59:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 04:59:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 89D7F19CA8; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 810A219C51; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:59:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BBAA119C59; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:58:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0036019C44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 14:58:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <019206925c24941d4c6592964c40a290@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403071755.i27HtbcR080605@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hyppkfntogjzlhknlxyqfqxuqq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:56:34 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hyppkfntogjzlhknlxyqfqxuqq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the intent is that the sync command ensures that all current IO has gone to disc without allowing file system activity meanwhile--that's what the rlock of mainlock does-- but syncproc is allowed to run concurrently with file system activity to encourage the disc to be reasonably up to date but without ensuring it. there are interlocks on the buffers themselves (for instance) to prevent confusion between several processes active at once, whether for file system activity or syncproc. --upas-hyppkfntogjzlhknlxyqfqxuqq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Sun Mar 7 17:56:48 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E353B19DD2; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:57:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12E6A19AD3; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:57:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C4F319B11; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:56:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8A3E19A91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 12:56:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27Htbiq080606 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27HtbcR080605 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403071755.i27HtbcR080605@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] kfs locks Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, cmd_sync sets rlock(&mainlock); ... syncall(); ... runlock(&mainlock); ... syncproc, the background process forked by kfs, runs syncblock() without setting rlock(&mainlock) Can it the cause that I am getting wrenwrite errors after 'check f' on startup, if cmd_sync is not called after cmd_check and before forking 'sync' and 'serve'? I am still struggling to understand the problem. I've changed the disk to be sure and still can reproduce the error if cmd_sync is not called after the list of free blocks is rebuilt after blackdown. David Tolpin --upas-hyppkfntogjzlhknlxyqfqxuqq-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 05:05:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7810 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 05:05:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7806 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 05:05:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 05:05:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7AEDD19C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4498819C62; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:05:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C629C19CAA; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:04:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60B9D19CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:04:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27K3oiq080999 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:03:50 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27K3noh080998 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:03:49 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403072003.i27K3noh080998@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks In-Reply-To: <019206925c24941d4c6592964c40a290@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:03:49 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > there are interlocks on the buffers themselves (for instance) > to prevent confusion between several processes active > at once, whether for file system activity or syncproc. > But still, If I sync immediately after rebuilding the freelist, the kfs works fine. If I let syncproc do that, wrenwrite is passed offsets not present in the file system eventually. After a lot of investigation, I can only image a possible cause in insufficient interlocking, but fail to understand how this happens. This is not a hardware problem, I am able to reproduce it with a different fast enough computer. David From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 05:13:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8144 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 05:13:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8140 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 05:13:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 05:13:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 838E319CDC; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:13:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C859419CAA; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:13:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A359719CAF; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A25419CAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:12:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks In-Reply-To: <200403072003.i27K3noh080998@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 20:12:17 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: in a previous message, with various debugging prints turned on and inserted, there seemed to be driver requests to abort a command. you don't seem to see the problem unless you power cycle, and although i don't use it as much as i did, i still use kfs a fair bit (and i do sometimes just switch off that machine), and i don't see similar problems. now, it's quite likely that i'm running an older version of kfs, and there were changes in chk in november (for instance), although they look benign. i thought i'd like to know more about the actual cause of wrenwrite errors before trying to guess what and where the problem might be! From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 05:22:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8491 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 05:22:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8487 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 05:22:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 05:22:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82E8A19CA6; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:22:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0339119CAA; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:22:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EDDB19C7C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:21:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0D2619AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:21:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i27KKciq081069 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:20:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i27KKcAN081068 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:20:38 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403072020.i27KKcAN081068@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:20:38 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > in a previous message, with various debugging prints turned on > and inserted, there seemed to be driver requests to abort a command. write is being aborted, because it is asked to write at offset not present on the disk. It looks like the in-memory structure is corrupt. > you don't seem to see the problem unless you power cycle, > and although i don't use it as much as i did, i still use kfs a > fair bit (and i do sometimes just switch off that machine), > and i don't see similar problems. > now, it's quite likely that i'm running an older version of kfs, It is quite likely that your machine is slower. If I slow down the kfs or kernel code by inserting more debugging, the problem disappears because the structure is flushed before being overwritten. > actual cause of wrenwrite errors before trying to guess what and > where the problem might be! offsets are negative vlongs. From matt@proweb.co.uk Mon Mar 8 16:49:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 05:56:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10348 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 05:56:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10344 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 05:56:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 05:56:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C2FB19CB6; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:56:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDB2019C59; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:56:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B4A319B10; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:55:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE03E19CE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:55:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Following a file in an acme window In-Reply-To: <28016D61-705A-11D8-8891-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 20:57:16 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: tail -0f /tmp/test > /mnt/acme/new/body echo update acme please >> /tmp/test keeps the acme window updated it even keeps working if you save it m From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 08:06:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15859 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 08:06:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15855 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 08:06:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 08:06:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA54919CA8; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:06:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C297819B13; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:06:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 88E6019B09; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:05:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5830319AC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:05:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14bfed15c83bd4a72d9bcc0407e39ee7@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <345297dba3bd4c579598a90b9a7e9a06@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 15:05:08 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > TPOP was the first to mention emalloc (not that it wasn't used before) Actually emalloc was mentioned in publications at least as early as 1984, in The UNIX Programming Environment. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 08:13:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16138 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 08:13:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16134 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 08:13:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 08:13:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43C4A19D05; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:13:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B816219C28; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:13:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBC0819C37; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:12:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBF5619BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:12:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <326166-6052>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 18:11:55 -0500 Message-ID: <03d501c40499$5672d490$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <14bfed15c83bd4a72d9bcc0407e39ee7@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:10:08 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Actually emalloc was mentioned in publications at least as early as > 1984, in The UNIX Programming Environment. at basser we called it salloc(), back in 82. From micah@cnm-vra.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 10:37:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26125 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 10:30:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23307 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 09:58:12 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 09:58:10 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2127119B78; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4202319B56; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:57:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 88C6F19B1E; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:56:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E6DB19B61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 19:56:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9D9ABCE12; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:56:40 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040308005640.GA1168@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] OT: Inferno on NetBSD Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 16:56:40 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I know this isn't really on-topic. But the Inferno list doesn't seem to be working right now, so I'm asking here. I'd like to run Inferno on NetBSD without using Linux or FreeBSD (or whatever) emulation. Fiddling with the shared library dependencies for various emulated programs isn't my idea of fun, so I'd rather avoid it. I see from the Inferno source that there was (at least) some effort put into a NetBSD port of the hosted environment. What ever happened to it? Trying to compile the FreeBSD or Linux code and calling it NetBSD doesn't immediately work, so before I spend too much time figuring it all out, I was wondering if some or all of the work was already done for me. Thanks, Micah From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 12:29:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5136 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 12:28:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5086 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 12:28:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 12:28:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4C5219BE0; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:28:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 323F019AD4; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:28:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D896019B70; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:27:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A907819AD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:27:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks In-Reply-To: <200403072020.i27KKcAN081068@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:27:25 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun Mar 7 15:22:37 EST 2004, dvd@davidashen.net wrote: > > in a previous message, with various debugging prints turned on > > and inserted, there seemed to be driver requests to abort a command. > > write is being aborted, because it is asked to write at offset > not present on the disk. It looks like the in-memory structure > is corrupt. > > > you don't seem to see the problem unless you power cycle, > > and although i don't use it as much as i did, i still use kfs a > > fair bit (and i do sometimes just switch off that machine), > > and i don't see similar problems. > > now, it's quite likely that i'm running an older version of kfs, > > It is quite likely that your machine is slower. If I slow down > the kfs or kernel code by inserting more debugging, the problem > disappears because the structure is flushed before being overwritten. > > > actual cause of wrenwrite errors before trying to guess what and > > where the problem might be! > > offsets are negative vlongs. The offset is supposed to be checked way before getting to the ATA driver: 1) the write and seek system calls check the offset is not negative; 2) the higher level of the disc driver checks the address requested is within the partition. What does your partition table look like? From dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com Mon Mar 8 16:49:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 13:33:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9686 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 13:32:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9672 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 13:32:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 13:32:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 281E719BF7; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:32:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64F7919AFD; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:32:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C59C19AFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:31:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C7F719AB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:31:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8272d0a741697fa1be90989dfacf2d3e@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:31:13 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: A curiosum: I was looking at an Israeli web page, almost all in Hebrew, with IE. It contrives to make the scrollbar appear (and work) on the left. Dennis From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 13:40:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10289 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 13:40:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10285 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 13:40:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 13:40:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 082CD19AFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:40:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8622019B18; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:40:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 37B0219AD4; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:39:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3AD919AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:39:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <00d101c40306$85bf2440$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:40:00 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "David Tolpin" >> To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> >> Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 11:23 PM >> Subject: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port > > yup, 100% agreement. Don't insult a person who has contributed to Plan 9 community, boyd. Yes, it's better to write native programs for Plan 9. It, however, usually use up his/her full-time work, because it's harder to learn new ideas than to use such well known ones. Your gun should target other kind of persons... by the way, configure doesn't work for me. complains wrong executable suffix... Kenji From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:08:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11961 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:06:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11560 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 13:58:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 13:58:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FBBF19BD8; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:58:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 401FB19B2C; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:58:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D12119AFE; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:57:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD34619AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:57:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322504-8567>; Sun, 7 Mar 2004 23:56:51 -0500 Message-ID: <048401c404c9$99ed9b80$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:55:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Don't insult a person who has contributed to Plan 9 community, boyd. contributed? cat /dev/noise no, This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter "the nail that sticks up will be hammered down" -- not in this lifetime, homes. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:09:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12061 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:09:04 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11854 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:05:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:05:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C22819BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:05:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3A4419BD8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:05:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D27D319BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:04:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A788019BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:04:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322565-8572>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:00:25 -0500 Message-ID: <048801c404ca$195fa520$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:59:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Don't insult a person who has contributed to Plan 9 community, boyd. i got the 1st ammendment & la libert d'expression on my side, so ... From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:10:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12120 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:09:59 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11809 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:04:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:04:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 24D1B19BE4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:04:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DD2919BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:04:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A88C919BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:03:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C80419AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:03:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <88d6d546921e69ce977a0f48bf40f03a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <048401c404c9$99ed9b80$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:04:33 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter I know what you want to say, I believe. However, it has passed more than several years, and we got very few native programms for Plan 9. Furthermore, you demand cash based on a older business model of open-source movements. If we could get money, it's better of course. Anyway, I think your post includes very important and deep thought point against the today's movement. However, I'll repeat again, you are targetting wrong! Kenji From ggm@apnic.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:12:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12331 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:11:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12044 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:08:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:08:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12C8C19B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:08:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE51E19B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:08:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3CF219BD6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:07:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 093C119B2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:07:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2857dcl023830; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:07:40 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: boyd@insultant.net Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Message-Id: <20040308150739.1e0f541b@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: <048801c404ca$195fa520$67844051@SOMA> References: <048801c404ca$195fa520$67844051@SOMA> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.9claws17 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-unknown-netbsdelf1.6ZI) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.127 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.127 (notspam) BAYES_20,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:07:39 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm yet to feel (a) either insulted, or (b) that the insult was not justified when people tell me to piss off. speaking as a non-plan9 contributer... -George From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:14:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12792 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:14:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12677 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:14:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:14:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8A3C19BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:14:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A020F19B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:14:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D8B7719AF3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF99219ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:13:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321738-22807>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:10:52 -0500 Message-ID: <049c01c404cb$8e9e2ea0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <88d6d546921e69ce977a0f48bf40f03a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:09:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: code it in ken C. as for money: we all need to pay the rent. From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:19:05 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13097 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:18:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13079 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:18:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:18:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6647119BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:18:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3147419BE4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:18:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B078019AF3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5EFD19ABB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:17:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8032f34fdc9735f5bde2f0b2de21d34f@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <049c01c404cb$8e9e2ea0$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wqajxqesbjgowwlyfnxcxtoxep" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:18:46 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wqajxqesbjgowwlyfnxcxtoxep Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Of course, those two lines are wright! However, still remains a phrase "however". Kenji --upas-wqajxqesbjgowwlyfnxcxtoxep Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([157.16.103.2]) by diabase; Mon Mar 8 14:17:13 JST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3p2+/3.7W-03092514) with ESMTP id OAA25503 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:14:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8A3C19BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:14:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A020F19B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:14:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D8B7719AF3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF99219ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:13:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321738-22807>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:10:52 -0500 Message-ID: <049c01c404cb$8e9e2ea0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <88d6d546921e69ce977a0f48bf40f03a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:09:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: code it in ken C. as for money: we all need to pay the rent. --upas-wqajxqesbjgowwlyfnxcxtoxep-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:57:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14548 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:54:08 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13545 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:29:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:29:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE8FE19BFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:29:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A891B19B73; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:29:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B4E1019B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:28:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF8AB19B03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:27:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i285Qqiq083505 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:26:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i285Qquc083504 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:26:52 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080526.i285Qquc083504@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kfs locks In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:26:52 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The offset is supposed to be checked way before getting to the > ATA driver: Yes, I see. Not all offsets are negative, some. I've added debugging print (("%lld",...)) to wrenwrite, not to the ATA driver. I am getting offsets beyond the range of the filesystem, sometimes negative. > What does your partition table look like? geometry 29336832 512 16383 16 63 part data 0 29336832 part plan9 63 8225280 part 9fat 63 102463 part fs 102463 7442495 part nvram 7442495 7442496 part swap 7442496 8225280 part plan9.1 8225280 16450560 part swap.cpu 8225343 10322495 From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:58:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14744 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:56:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13704 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:33:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:33:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5279D19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:33:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1F2119B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:33:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C09E019B70; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:32:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76DAF19B03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:32:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i285Vkiq083541 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:31:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i285VkMA083540 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:31:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080531.i285VkMA083540@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:31:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > by the way, configure doesn't work for me. configure is a bourne shell script. > complains wrong executable suffix... It needs psh. hget://www.graphviz.org/pub/graphviz/ARCHIVE/graphviz-1.10.tar.gz|gunzip|tar x cd graphviz-1.10 hget http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/graphviz-9patch.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT ape/psh 9configure 9make to build the binaries, dotneato/dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps page crazy.ps To view the result. From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:58:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14772 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:56:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13731 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:34:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:34:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0EE7119C26; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:34:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 35FF219BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:34:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E144C19C09; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:33:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99A9319BE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:33:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <333414-6060>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:31:39 -0500 Message-ID: <04c401c404ce$73e3cea0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:30:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Of couse, s/wright/right/ you know, as usual.☺ wakatta From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:59:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15137 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:59:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14154 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:43:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:43:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27FDC19BE8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DBD119AF3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:21:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70FBB19AFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:20:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1196419ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:20:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <8032f34fdc9735f5bde2f0b2de21d34f@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:21:33 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Of course, those two lines are wright! Of couse, s/wright/right/ you know, as usual.☺ Kenji From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:59:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15183 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:59:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14308 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:48:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:48:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D1C219BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39B4119BA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A05519BA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA40919B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:47:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080531.i285VkMA083540@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:51:22 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ape/psh > 9configure > 9make for non-gui stuff you can also download the gcc 3.0 port and use gnu/gsh. graphviz used to compile relatively fine with it a year ago and configure scripts kind of work with it. would've saved you some time. andrey From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 14:59:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15237 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 14:59:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14374 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:50:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:50:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDABB19C23; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:50:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3141019C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:50:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 319E719BFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:49:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6E3C19BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i285meiq083605 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i285meSD083604 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080548.i285meSD083604@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <88d6d546921e69ce977a0f48bf40f03a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the make process. What would be the non-religious part of benefit of doing that? Would it help to merge with new versions of graphviz (the current is 1.12, post on March 1st) David From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:00:09 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15287 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:00:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14484 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 14:52:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 14:52:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3ADFC19B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9F9719B70; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:52:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6F7E19BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:51:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49E7719B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:51:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080531.i285VkMA083540@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:55:37 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: btw, should we send you bug reports on this list? i have this problem compiling it: # 9make No suffix or % pattern list. make all-recursive No suffix or % pattern list. Making all in cdt Making all in agraph 105: lex /tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph/scan.l (Warning) Invalid request %x comment 106: (Warning) Invalid request %x qstring 108: (Warning) Undefined start condition comment 108: (Warning) Undefined start condition qstring 110: (Warning) Undefined start condition comment 123: (Warning) Non-portable Character Class 123: (Warning) Non-portable Character Class 124: (Warning) Non-portable Character Class 126: (Warning) Undefined start condition qstring 127: (Warning) Undefined start condition qstring 128: (Warning) Undefined start condition qstring (Error) Too many transitions Try using %a num *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. # andrey >> by the way, configure doesn't work for me. > > configure is a bourne shell script. > >> complains wrong executable suffix... > > It needs psh. > > hget://www.graphviz.org/pub/graphviz/ARCHIVE/graphviz-1.10.tar.gz|gunzip|tar x > cd graphviz-1.10 > hget http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/graphviz-9patch.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT > ape/psh > 9configure > 9make > > to build the binaries, > > dotneato/dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps > page crazy.ps > > To view the result. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:09:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17096 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:09:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16241 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:05:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:05:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B65219B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA59819AD8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:05:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3678D19AD7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:04:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA9B419AB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:04:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080548.i285meSD083604@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:08:37 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter > > Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, > or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the > make process. the code isn't working. > > What would be the non-religious part of benefit of doing that? > Would it help to merge with new versions of graphviz (the current > is 1.12, post on March 1st) firstly you replace: ape/psh 9configure 9make with: plan9% mk secondly you replace: source='refstr.c' object='refstr.lo' libtool=yes depfile='.deps/refstr.Plo' tmpdepfile='.deps/refstr.TPlo' depmode=none /bin/sh /tmp/graphviz-1.10/depcomp /bin/sh ../libtool --mode=compile cc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I/tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph -I.. -I/tmp/graphviz-1.10/cdt -I/usr/local/include -D_BSD_EXTENSION=1 -A -c -o refstr.lo `test -f refstr.c || echo '/tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph/'`refstr.c with: pcc -I. -Ijpeg -Ipng -Izlib -B -p -c -DPLAN9 -DHAVE_CONFIG_H af_unix.c andrey From dbailey27@ameritech.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:10:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17363 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:10:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17049 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:09:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:09:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB6EA19C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:09:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8729919B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:09:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E70C19B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.78]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4D9E19AD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2868QTq012344; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:08:26 -0500 Message-ID: To: mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-prsjjtkhrdrfjunwllfqsqeqph" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:02:57 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-prsjjtkhrdrfjunwllfqsqeqph Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit then you replace pcc with: 8c --upas-prsjjtkhrdrfjunwllfqsqeqph Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Apparently-To: dbailey27@ameritech.net via web80506.mail.yahoo.com; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 22:05:23 -0800 Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mx1-milwwi.milwwi.ameritech.net (65.43.19.28) by mta820.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 22:05:23 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [130.203.4.6] Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mx1-milwwi.milwwi.ameritech.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2865KYC011412 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:05:20 -0600 (CST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 17D0D19BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:05:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0570019B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:05:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3678D19AD7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:04:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA9B419AB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:04:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080548.i285meSD083604@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:08:37 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter > > Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, > or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the > make process. the code isn't working. > > What would be the non-religious part of benefit of doing that? > Would it help to merge with new versions of graphviz (the current > is 1.12, post on March 1st) firstly you replace: ape/psh 9configure 9make with: plan9% mk secondly you replace: source='refstr.c' object='refstr.lo' libtool=yes depfile='.deps/refstr.Plo' tmpdepfile='.deps/refstr.TPlo' depmode=none /bin/sh /tmp/graphviz-1.10/depcomp /bin/sh ../libtool --mode=compile cc -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I/tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph -I.. -I/tmp/graphviz-1.10/cdt -I/usr/local/include -D_BSD_EXTENSION=1 -A -c -o refstr.lo `test -f refstr.c || echo '/tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph/'`refstr.c with: pcc -I. -Ijpeg -Ipng -Izlib -B -p -c -DPLAN9 -DHAVE_CONFIG_H af_unix.c andrey --upas-prsjjtkhrdrfjunwllfqsqeqph-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:14:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18148 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:14:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18105 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:14:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:14:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1091019C23; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:14:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B07519B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:14:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0238719BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:13:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 724F219AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:13:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286Cmiq083676 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286CmXb083675 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080612.i286CmXb083675@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, > > or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the > > make process. > > the code isn't working. Only because you run 'make clean'. graphviz distribution includes scan.c generated from scan.l (from research.att.com, not my port), because scan.l requires flex, not lex. Should I rewrite scan.l in lex too? > secondly you replace: In what respect will it make the program better? From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:16:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18273 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:16:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18255 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:16:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:16:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B43AC19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:16:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF38C19BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:16:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 127C619BF6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:15:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B356419B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286EEiq083690 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:14 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286EE7K083689 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:14 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080614.i286EE7K083689@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:14 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > ape/psh > > 9configure > > 9make > > for non-gui stuff you can also download the gcc 3.0 port and use > gnu/gsh. graphviz used to compile relatively fine with it a year ago and > configure scripts kind of work with it. would've saved you some time. 1) I wanted to know how well ape works. 2) I didn't want dependencies between ports. 3) That would definitely make transition to native tools more remote. David From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:18:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18385 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:18:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18381 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:18:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:18:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BBA219C62; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 232A519BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B689719C28; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4EF0219AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286G1iq083726 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286G1UM083725 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080616.i286G1UM083725@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > btw, should we send you bug reports on this list? You can send them to me directly. > i have this problem compiling it: > > # 9make > No suffix or % pattern list. > make all-recursive > No suffix or % pattern list. > Making all in cdt > Making all in agraph > 105: lex /tmp/graphviz-1.10/agraph/scan.l What for did you run 'make distclean'? scan.l is written in flex. AT&T includes scan.c into the distribution on purpose. Unless scan.l is rewritten in lex, scan.c is needed. Or, flex should be properly ported to Plan9. From dbailey27@ameritech.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:18:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18414 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:18:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18410 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:18:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:18:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A685F19CB6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BADF19C0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8959C19BF6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (pimout6-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.78]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C1CD19AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout6-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i286HMTq071504; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:23 -0500 Message-ID: To: dvd@davidashen.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: <200403080612.i286CmXb083675@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mlulikphxsmnpiakmvbbozwoel" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:11:54 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mlulikphxsmnpiakmvbbozwoel Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Should you rewrite scan.l in lex, too? Yes. Or at least remove cleaning it from the makefile so you don't screw your users. --upas-mlulikphxsmnpiakmvbbozwoel Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Apparently-To: dbailey27@ameritech.net via web80507.mail.yahoo.com; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 22:14:25 -0800 Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mx1-chcgil.chcgil.ameritech.net (206.141.192.66) by mta809.mail.yahoo.com with SMTP; Sun, 07 Mar 2004 22:14:25 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [130.203.4.6] Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mx1-chcgil.chcgil.ameritech.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i286EOkO012486 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:14:24 -0600 (CST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BD7019BBC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EDBE19B18; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:14:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0238719BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:13:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 724F219AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:13:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286Cmiq083676 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286CmXb083675 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080612.i286CmXb083675@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:12:48 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, > > or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the > > make process. > > the code isn't working. Only because you run 'make clean'. graphviz distribution includes scan.c generated from scan.l (from research.att.com, not my port), because scan.l requires flex, not lex. Should I rewrite scan.l in lex too? > secondly you replace: In what respect will it make the program better? --upas-mlulikphxsmnpiakmvbbozwoel-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:19:06 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18446 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:19:06 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18442 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:19:05 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:19:05 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 58F4E19CF1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:19:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B57F819BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:18:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C630A19BF6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7214119AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:17:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286GXiq083735 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:33 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286GXqs083734 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:33 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080616.i286GXqs083734@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <7a682bfdaa722f04b826e3b3851a7a28@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:33 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > What would be the non-religious part of benefit of doing that? > > Would it help to merge with new versions of graphviz (the current > > is 1.12, post on March 1st) > > firstly you replace: Not how, what for? From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:21:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18561 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:21:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18557 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:21:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:21:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D325719C62; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:21:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C096D19BF6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:21:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 93E0A19BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:20:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6155F19AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286JYiq083779 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:19:34 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286JYH1083778 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:19:34 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080619.i286JYH1083778@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:19:34 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Should you rewrite scan.l in lex, too? Yes. > > Or at least remove cleaning it from the makefile so > you don't screw your users. OK. Added to TODO list. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:23:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18620 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:23:05 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18596 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:22:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:22:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C8EF19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A1E219BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85F5019BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:21:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7549F19C0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:21:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080616.i286G1UM083725@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:25:05 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What for did you run 'make distclean'? scan.l is written > in flex. AT&T includes scan.c into the distribution on purpose. i followed your instructions to Okamoto almost exactly (had to fix for the botched URL you gave him). From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:24:12 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18670 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:24:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18641 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:23:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:23:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6136019CC9; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF03119C37; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:23:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 939D119CA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F46C19BFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <48570bfee0ac1f018fa3eed4c8c9ab86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <200403080614.i286EE7K083689@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:23:18 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have no offense to you, however,.... > 1) I wanted to know how well ape works. > 2) I didn't want dependencies between ports. > 3) That would definitely make transition to native tools > more remote. Probably, you'd know there may be many more powerful persons around the world, and also here... This may be the point what I've been feeling why you speaks so much. The problem is that you assumed your configure will work on Plan 9 environment with/without ape, but it was not written for it, which means it doesn't work. Do you really have working version for Plan 9? Kenji From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:29:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19000 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:29:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18970 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:29:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:29:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8ED5819BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:29:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BD8319BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:29:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E495419C26; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03F5319BF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:28:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:32:43 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Should you rewrite scan.l in lex, too? Yes. > > Or at least remove cleaning it from the makefile so > you don't screw your users. but, but but but but! configure is there exactly for that purpose, right? to catch if the damn thing is there or not! otherwise why go through the pain of running it at all? have you noticed how the configure script takes longer to complete than the compilation phase? :) From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:33:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19237 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:32:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19139 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:30:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:30:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B303619CCD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:30:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B397F19BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:30:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A7B619C8B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:29:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFBC419C7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:29:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:30:07 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i followed your instructions to Okamoto almost exactly (had to fix for > the botched URL you gave him). Andrey, as I said before, I don't want to be called just Okamoto. Here in Japan, it means you are downlooking me. If neccessary, please use Kenji or Kenji Okamoto, thank you. Kenji From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 8 16:49:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:41:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20007 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:41:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19996 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:41:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:41:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA91219C09; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC56419B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:41:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B58B919B2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:40:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D96F719AAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:40:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:44:06 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> i followed your instructions to Okamoto almost exactly (had to fix for >> the botched URL you gave him). > > Andrey, as I said before, I don't want to be called just Okamoto. > Here in Japan, it means you are downlooking me. If neccessary, > please use Kenji or Kenji Okamoto, thank you. > > Kenji Looks like two strikes: https://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2003-June/024901.html One more and i'm out. I'm sincerely sorry I'm not well acquainted with Japanese culture. I'd like to remedy that in the future. For now, please cope with me. andrey From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 16:49:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 15:46:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20519 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 15:46:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20513 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 15:46:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 15:46:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A487319C37; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:46:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFA4619AFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:46:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6BEC19BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:45:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5937019BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:45:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <493655c0e26ac77ea218c9f100725253@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:46:29 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Awawawa, I didn't expect such a comment, Andrey. I just wanted to let you and others know, please don't call me just Okamoto, if you are not intending to lookdown myself. Kenji From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 16:50:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 16:28:17 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23483 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 16:26:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23141 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 16:23:20 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 16:23:20 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B694919CF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:27:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14EF819CA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:27:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1476619C0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:26:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7E1519BFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:26:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i286PLiq083815 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:25:21 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i286PLb0083814 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:25:21 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080625.i286PLb0083814@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <48570bfee0ac1f018fa3eed4c8c9ab86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:25:21 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > The problem is that you assumed your configure will work > on Plan 9 environment with/without ape, but it was not written > for it, which means it doesn't work. Do you really have working > version for Plan 9? Yes, I do. I never assumed that it would work without ape. You have to launch ape/psh before invoking the scripts. From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 19:00:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:21:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28559 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:21:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28555 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:21:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:21:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ADA4819B70; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:21:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CC1719C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:21:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39F5F19BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:20:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71A0C19A3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:20:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:20:41 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>> i followed your instructions to Okamoto almost exactly (had to fix for >>> the botched URL you gave him). >> >> Andrey, as I said before, I don't want to be called just Okamoto. >> Here in Japan, it means you are downlooking me. If neccessary, >> please use Kenji or Kenji Okamoto, thank you. >> >> Kenji > > Looks like two strikes: > > https://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2003-June/024901.html > > One more and i'm out. > > I'm sincerely sorry I'm not well acquainted with Japanese culture. > I'd like to remedy that in the future. For now, please cope with me. > > andrey Andrey, you can call me anything you want so long as you don't call me late for dinner ☺ Seriously, I would think it onerous to expect everyone to live by *my* rules of etiquette or culture, given that this is an international medium and this forum has participants from all over the globe. From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 19:00:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:23:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28655 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:23:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28651 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:23:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:23:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 14E1519C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DD6B19C26; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:23:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 498BD19C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3146199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:22:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <235a6d52779a7bee6b29ac3ef70b75dd@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <493655c0e26ac77ea218c9f100725253@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:25 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Awawawa, What does this mean? Thanks. From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 8 19:00:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:25:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28760 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:25:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28756 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:25:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:25:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 831DF19C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:25:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC00719C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:25:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E76819A3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:24:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF7BE19B5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:24:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <10ad11586e5cbbb279249c8ad952e6fb@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <235a6d52779a7bee6b29ac3ef70b75dd@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-fmjvgtdoyrfjuidojgezfvheoh" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:24:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-fmjvgtdoyrfjuidojgezfvheoh Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Also, what's its kanji? ☺ --upas-fmjvgtdoyrfjuidojgezfvheoh Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 8 09:23:25 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 276A519C39; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:23:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DD6B19C26; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:23:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 498BD19C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3146199BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:22:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <235a6d52779a7bee6b29ac3ef70b75dd@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <493655c0e26ac77ea218c9f100725253@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 01:22:25 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Awawawa, What does this mean? Thanks. --upas-fmjvgtdoyrfjuidojgezfvheoh-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:31:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29104 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:31:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29088 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:31:15 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:31:14 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 605E719C35; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:31:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F53019AC3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:31:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D48019BFE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DF9919AF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:29:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i288T7D25602 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:29:13 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <4b54ad3cfca941cd954c8a951cbe7de8@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:28:49 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Seriously, I would think it onerous to expect everyone to live by *my* > rules of etiquette or culture, given that this is an international > medium and this forum has participants from all over the globe. I share the feeling, at the same time I believe that explicitly expressed requests should be accepted or equally explicitly rejected. The specific instance where there are two Kenjis but the surname (?) may not be used alone to differentiate them, is just one of those coincidences one would gladly do without :-) ++L From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:34:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29567 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:34:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29562 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:34:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:34:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C30B19B70; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:34:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9EF919C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:34:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61E6419C37; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:33:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E248419AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:33:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gzajxlodehsropwbfypmevszti" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:31:23 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gzajxlodehsropwbfypmevszti Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit perhaps, but this way we get all the architectures --upas-gzajxlodehsropwbfypmevszti Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 8 05:47:51 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 455C319BF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A8E819BA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A05519BA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:48:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA40919B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:47:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403080531.i285VkMA083540@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 21:51:22 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ape/psh > 9configure > 9make for non-gui stuff you can also download the gcc 3.0 port and use gnu/gsh. graphviz used to compile relatively fine with it a year ago and configure scripts kind of work with it. would've saved you some time. andrey --upas-gzajxlodehsropwbfypmevszti-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:36:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29736 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:36:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29725 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:36:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:36:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13D0619A3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:36:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 433AC19C26; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:36:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2ED1719C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:35:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 990B7199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:35:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e9fc191b02d0111bd43d6c250f8ee23@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403080548.i285meSD083604@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zcedhtkxrxvmbwqeyfqmtkrsoa" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:33:28 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zcedhtkxrxvmbwqeyfqmtkrsoa Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit it's usually not too hard and once set up it's usually fairly easy to maintain. it has the advantage that all architectures can be generated at once (ie, not just 386). that's far from saying that you must be the one to do it; i don't see why you should if it's not important to you. if it's that useful someone else will do it eventually. --upas-zcedhtkxrxvmbwqeyfqmtkrsoa Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 8 05:49:45 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFC6119BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:50:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98FAD19BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:50:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 319E719BFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:49:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6E3C19BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 00:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i285meiq083605 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i285meSD083604 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080548.i285meSD083604@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <88d6d546921e69ce977a0f48bf40f03a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter Now, when the code is working, either the poster of the remark, or any other volunteer, is welcome to re-arrange and rewrite the make process. What would be the non-religious part of benefit of doing that? Would it help to merge with new versions of graphviz (the current is 1.12, post on March 1st) David --upas-zcedhtkxrxvmbwqeyfqmtkrsoa-- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:39:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29928 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:39:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29919 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:39:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:39:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 60C1119CB5; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E95319C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB08719C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F4D519C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i288bCiq084443 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i288bCDa084442 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080837.i288bCDa084442@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > perhaps, but this way we get all the architectures I will do the 'normal' port, that is, with mk (but still pcc). I just wanted to realize what's needed. I didn't find an make->mk automation tool, and am going to write it. Is it against the religion too? From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:39:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29965 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:39:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29961 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:39:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:39:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2710F19CDC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE36719CC9; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F87419AD2; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43FF019C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i288kwn4007945 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:46:58 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE05616A@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Thread-Index: AcQE59tRzMjYuatcRuGKn2LZy6QLsgAABGcw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:38:37 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Seriously, I would think it onerous to expect everyone to=20 > live by *my* > > rules of etiquette or culture, given that this is an international > > medium and this forum has participants from all over the globe. Yes, but you can't expect people just to forget their cultural = differences. In Japan, addressing someone with their last name, but without a "politeness" suffix is considered undignifying/rude/offensive (take your = pick). So a Japanese reader will, while perfrectly understanding that this = wasn't the westerner's intent, still feel disturbed. This kind of problem can = be avoided. Tiit From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:41:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30157 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:41:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30144 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:41:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:41:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3CB719CF1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18E1919C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:41:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8F3B719D36; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:40:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 398CC19CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:40:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8074a2015162ebe15c8814636b62d983@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:40:03 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I think we need to think more about permissions before going crazy > expanding /srv. I think that it'd be a good thing to let the kernel know about permission checking in the same way that fossil does. I mean, I'd expect the same permission rules of /... apply for stuff in #... Perhaps a control file to write the fossil /adm/user to the kernel plus a generic routine to check permissions would be a good way to do it. From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:42:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30211 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:42:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30207 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:42:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:42:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 791F819CDC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:42:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 485A519C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:42:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E600819C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:41:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6ECA119C3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:41:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403080837.i288bCDa084442@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tpixdovzrelnudwslmiqzsupgz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:39:35 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tpixdovzrelnudwslmiqzsupgz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >> perhaps, but this way we get all the architectures i was referring to your (useful) use of ape/pcc not gcc; had you used gcc it wouldn't have given a port to other plan 9 architectures. in other words, i think you did the right thing! --upas-tpixdovzrelnudwslmiqzsupgz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Mon Mar 8 08:38:47 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7BE319C62; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA53B19C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:39:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB08719C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F4D519C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:38:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i288bCiq084443 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i288bCDa084442 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403080837.i288bCDa084442@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:37:12 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > perhaps, but this way we get all the architectures I will do the 'normal' port, that is, with mk (but still pcc). I just wanted to realize what's needed. I didn't find an make->mk automation tool, and am going to write it. Is it against the religion too? --upas-tpixdovzrelnudwslmiqzsupgz-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:43:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30281 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:43:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30275 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:43:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:43:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDE1A19CE6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:43:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFEB019CA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:43:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 251D719CB5; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:42:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19C8519C3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:42:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i288g0D26147 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:42:00 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <63cba62b2235fb8929b14df4e50bf45e@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE05616A@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:41:42 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yes, but you can't expect people just to forget their cultural differences. > In Japan, addressing someone with their last name, but without a > "politeness" suffix is considered undignifying/rude/offensive (take your pick). > I was wondering if Okamoto-san would be acceptable? ++L From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:48:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30688 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:48:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30684 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:48:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:48:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8176C19C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:48:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5221419AD0; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:48:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8BE3219BF9; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:47:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BEF519AF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:47:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403080619.i286JYH1083778@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:45:01 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: there is an ancient Unix sh program somewhere that helps convert makefiles to mkfiles. unfortunately, i've lost it, but it might turn up. i'm not sure it would be much help anyhow with `modern' gmake/nmake/imake/whymake mkfiles. someone else might have it though, which is why i mention it. From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:50:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30905 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:50:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30901 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:50:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:50:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 154C819C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:50:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0297119AF8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:50:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BCE0919C0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:49:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 690E519AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:48:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <983bf8493d3332e6d1bb9340d1b36ec7@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <235a6d52779a7bee6b29ac3ef70b75dd@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:49:48 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Awawawa, got into panic by facing unexpected response. Kenji From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:50:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30916 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:50:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30911 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:50:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:50:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E04119CF1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:50:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37D0019C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:50:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22BAF19C0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:49:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2EDE19AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:49:49 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i288wDaQ008064 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:58:13 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D3A@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Thread-Index: AcQE6Y1omHmyrYgbQq2Rp6IHhgnFzgAAGC7g From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:49:51 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was wondering if Okamoto-san would be acceptable? My guess would be that it covers from K. Okamoto to mr. Okamoto. The problem with Japanese is that it does not quite map to English. To me, as I'm talking a language considerably different from = English, too, it's sometimes easier :) From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 19:00:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:52:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31091 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:52:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31087 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:52:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:52:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFC6719C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:52:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22F6819C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:52:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1AC4619CE6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:51:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B905E19AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:51:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <037e8880ca76c8ae0f2897d6405ca1ea@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <10ad11586e5cbbb279249c8ad952e6fb@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:51:54 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Also, what's its kanji? ☺ (utf-8) "あわわわ", there is no kanji for it. It comes deep from Japanese, can write only by Kana. Kenji From t.lankots@aprote.ee Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:54:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31265 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:54:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31261 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:54:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:54:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 092EC19C0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:54:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E245519C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:54:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3042219C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:53:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D968B19AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:53:38 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i289223s008150 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:02:02 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D3B@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Thread-Index: AcQE6ot7XonWaMZMQUKwoSHhVK8syAAACViQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:53:41 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >> Awawawa, (a) oh dear? (b) whoopsy-daisies? From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 17:56:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31427 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 17:56:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31423 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 17:56:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 17:56:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72C7A19C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:56:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 052E719BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:56:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDEB519C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:55:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AB8719C08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 03:55:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <63cba62b2235fb8929b14df4e50bf45e@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:56:46 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was wondering if Okamoto-san would be acceptable? I love Kenji, here. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 18:17:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 332 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 18:17:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 319 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 18:17:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 18:17:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF13C19C7F; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:17:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43DBB19C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:17:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E7E619C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:16:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E15B219C35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:16:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0ca7d1163cb2bc0fddb3865909334ba5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 18:17:31 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> I was wondering if Okamoto-san would be acceptable? > > I love Kenji, here. Or, if you like Dr. Okamoto.☺☺ Kenji From lucio@proxima.alt.za Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 18:23:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 784 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 18:23:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 776 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 18:23:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 18:23:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE87619C92; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:23:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 251B119C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:23:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2117819C35; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:22:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A92E19BF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:22:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i289MnD27844 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:22:50 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <0ca7d1163cb2bc0fddb3865909334ba5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:22:31 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Or, if you like Dr. Okamoto. > That's perfectly fine by me. I don't think I'm likely to forget the correct title. Now if Kenji Arisawa were to state his preference, I for one would be happy to put the issue to sleep. ++L From kjn9@citizenearth.com Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 18:28:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1126 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 18:28:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1121 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 18:28:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 18:28:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69A6319C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:28:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 439B119B5C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:28:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 236EF19B5C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:27:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.dirac.net (195-97-240-22.onyx.net [195.97.240.22]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3C84919A9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:27:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16777 invoked by uid 60001); 8 Mar 2004 09:28:42 -0000 Message-ID: <20040308092842.16776.qmail@mail.dirac.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Keith Nash Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: 8 Mar 2004 09:28:42 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is not LINUX! This is Plan 9. There are rules. -boyd/walter Victim of Dinsdale: "...and then he nailed my head to the floor. There was nothing else he could do, to be fair. He told me I'd broken the unwritten rule." Interviewer: "What was that?" Victim of Dinsdale: "He wouldn't tell me." From 9nut@9netics.com Mon Mar 8 19:00:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 18:46:55 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2386 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 18:46:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2378 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 18:46:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 18:46:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B84ED19C92; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:46:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF65F19CA6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:46:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10B4919C08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:45:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76FB219AA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:45:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <96d2c11c1231780aa8280b7bfb92a1b9@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] directories in server registry (#s) From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <8074a2015162ebe15c8814636b62d983@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 02:45:36 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> I think we need to think more about permissions before going crazy >> expanding /srv. > > I think that it'd be a good thing to let the kernel know about permission > checking in the same way that fossil does. I mean, I'd expect the same > permission rules of /... apply for stuff in #... I just realized I missed what presotto was getting at in his reply. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:39 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:04:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3879 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:04:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3875 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:04:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:04:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 156C219CB5; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:04:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 197BB19C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:04:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1E52619C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 449D419C23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:03:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:01:25 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i28Bf4ZK014013 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:41:08 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] mkconv Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:03:19 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I have never used it in anger but the seccond edition had a script called mkconv which purported to help the conversion of Makefiles to mkfiles. Would the labs allow me to release it? BTW: I would prefer ported code to be released without Configure scripts and with mkfiles, however I realise how much pain in envolved in extracting the nescessary info. Having said this I heartly applaud any ports of usefull stuff in any form. -Steve From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:07:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4124 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:07:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4118 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:07:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:07:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4300819CB6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:07:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F09319C35; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:07:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47B7019C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:06:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB6AC19C35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:06:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5ea091e808fea5cf05ffce9fe544fb6b@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403080837.i288bCDa084442@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 02:05:48 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: mkconv converted makefiles to mkfiles and was distributed with old versions of Unix mk. You can find an rc version of it at /sys/src/cmd/mk/mkconv. mk -m used to generate a makefile from the current mkfile too. An advantage of rewriting makefiles into mkfiles is that you can use inclusion with '<' to drastically shorten the mkfile. This is the entire mkfile for the v7 shell: --- ; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:07:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] [OT] My joke and lsub.org Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:07:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Since It seems that paurea is receiving mails of people asking if I did cancel his account I'd like to clarify that I was kidding when I replied to Boyd and said that. Funny these things happen when making jokes through email. It just happen that plan9.escet.urjc.es is not reliable enough (dns) and we bought lsub.org to move all our addresses there. Thus, anything@plan9.escet.urjc.es (although will be kept working) is probably better accessed through anything@lsub.org. From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:22:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5044 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:22:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5040 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:22:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:22:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C3A119CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80A6819C81; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 88048199E4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7A1E19CA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0Hmy-0007AA-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:15:12 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <1dmdnfBNVc-F8NTdRVn-vA@comcast.com> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net>, <019501c402c6$123638a0$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:39 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: >>i'd rather see ape stick around. imperfect, sure, but certainly >>still useful. there's a significant body of code that i either >>run on plan 9 (ghostscript, troff) ... > ken reversed engineered it for unix ?Ed, 'cos of the unfortunate death of > ... If you mean troff, that was BWK and "..." was Osanna. (Not Been Laudin'.) The original was in PDP-11 Unix assembly language and made substantial use of tricks such as packing two character codes into a word. troff was rewritten again later (by BWK) to make a "device independent" version. I think the Plan 9 version represents one more overhaul to work better with "runes"; I rather lost track of it after it diverged from the DWB 2.0 version, which is the last one my org. paid for the right to use. From prem_mallappa@hotpop.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:22:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5051 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:22:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5045 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:22:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:22:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA0FB19D46; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6325919D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 481BB19CA7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBA3419CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0Hmz-0007AM-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:15:13 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Prem Mallappa Message-ID: Organization: GESL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] constant string Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:15:07 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, this is my program ------------------------------------------ #include int main(void) { char *s = "Hello"; s[2] = 'z'; printf ("%s\n", s); return 0; } ------------------------------------------ my question is when i compile this in Linux (gcc) i get a segmentation fault at the second statement of main(), As far as my knowledge i think this is because in 2nd chapter of K&R book it is being mentioned that ' any thing enclosed between " and " is a string constant' so here i am changing a constant, and i get a segmentation fault ( and i also noticed that gcc stores the string Hello in read-only datasegment) but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") why this is happenning.. sorry if i am posting to wrong group, thanks in advance prem From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:23:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5120 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5116 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:23:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7060019D6E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 668F619D54; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E29BE19CC4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A202D19C62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0Hmy-0007AG-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:15:12 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:51 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: For maximum compatibility with hardware tabs on (now "antique") terminals, and to properly reproduce the expected appearance of code from old Unix systems, use 8-character tab spacing. For your own code, use whatever your editor supports that you are happy with, and run it through "retab -i +whatever" to convert it to look identical on 8-character tabstop systems. From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:30:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5509 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:30:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5499 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:30:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:30:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 398C519D2B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5CFF19CC9; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:30:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0ADBF19CE6; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:29:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B06A419CA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:29:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i28ASPD00614 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:28:38 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <49c4b210171f3641287541b719d51b77@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:27:33 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" > and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") > why this is happenning.. > I'm sure you've tickled one of those "architecture/implementation" dependencies the "C" language is deservedly famed for. ++L From prem_mallappa@hotpop.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:37:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5854 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:37:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5833 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:37:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:37:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90FBE19CA7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:37:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCA7519CF1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:37:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F72619CF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCF78199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0I0L-0007PP-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:29:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Prem Mallappa Message-ID: Organization: GESL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] VMware+firewall+replica pull Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:26:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi Got plan9 working on my Linux + Vmware box now my question is i am connected to internet thru firewall that protect only port 80. when i say replica pull it says some error regaring unresolvable name ( may be some DNS problem), but in my linux machine i am using my firewall as the DNS how do i do it in Plan9 so that i get all updated things. thx in advance prem From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:37:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5886 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:37:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5882 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:37:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:37:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92E8719D43; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:37:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0771219D25; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:37:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B90E19D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC73E19CF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0I0M-0007Pb-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:29:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104o93hnpq2jc18@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:26:31 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ahh, so say I were to subscribe for inferno? e[acl] and 3c available to me? Can i prod you to do more work on the framebuffer? I think there's a few of us who are definitely interested in what you've done. Don't keep it a secret! -dave From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:38:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5899 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:38:04 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5894 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:38:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:38:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA29C19D7D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:38:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14209199F4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:37:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2841019CF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7FC919CA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0I0M-0007PV-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:29:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <14bfed15c83bd4a72d9bcc0407e39ee7@collyer.net>, <03d501c40499$5672d490$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:26:20 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: >>Actually emalloc was mentioned in publications at least as early as >>1984, in The UNIX Programming Environment. > at basser we called it salloc(), back in 82. And xmalloc() harks back to PWB, circa 1976. My own malloc implementation supports throwing an exception if you want to use it in a suitable environment where that is the general scheme. From DAGwyn@null.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:38:22 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5926 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:38:22 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5921 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:38:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:38:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E93919D88; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:38:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D27A719D4F; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:38:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 241D619CA7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D293B19CF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:36:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0I0L-0007PJ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:29:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040307113209.GA18849@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Subject: Re: [9fans] making emalloc a library function Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:25:57 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Einar Karttunen wrote: > I have two alternative routes. Either make libemalloc which contains > emalloc, estrdup and so on or add a flag which makes libc malloc behave > like emalloc. It is a *very* bad idea to change the behavior of malloc(). Your program might link with some library that knows how to recover when malloc() reports failure, and if you change malloc() to act like emalloc() you will break that library. There should be no problem adding emalloc() to the system C library. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 19:41:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6108 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 19:41:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6104 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 19:41:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 19:41:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D380919D4E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:41:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34B2619D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:41:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82B6B19D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:40:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C8A4199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:40:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <97b0409526ea30602eed2c4065b6092e@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <104o93hnpq2jc18@corp.supernews.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:38:06 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>ahh, so say I were to subscribe for inferno? e[acl] and 3c available to >>me? you don't need to do that just to get the compilers (as far as we're concerned). From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 20:00:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7340 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 20:00:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7336 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 20:00:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 20:00:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5F8419ABC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:00:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A64719ABC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:00:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DBAA19CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:59:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 374FA19C62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:59:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 2630 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 10:59:36 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 10:59:36 -0000 Message-ID: <012801c404fc$a1ba0910$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net>, <019501c402c6$123638a0$67844051@SOMA> <1dmdnfBNVc-F8NTdRVn-vA@comcast.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:59:50 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: you rather lost track of it. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 9:14 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot > boyd, rounin wrote: > >>i'd rather see ape stick around. imperfect, sure, but certainly > >>still useful. there's a significant body of code that i either > >>run on plan 9 (ghostscript, troff) ... > > ken reversed engineered it for unix ?Ed, 'cos of the unfortunate death of > > ... > > If you mean troff, that was BWK and "..." was Osanna. > (Not Been Laudin'.) The original was in PDP-11 Unix > assembly language and made substantial use of tricks > such as packing two character codes into a word. > troff was rewritten again later (by BWK) to make a > "device independent" version. I think the Plan 9 > version represents one more overhaul to work better > with "runes"; I rather lost track of it after it > diverged from the DWB 2.0 version, which is the last > one my org. paid for the right to use. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 20:05:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7800 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 20:05:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7791 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 20:05:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 20:05:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 77B8F19D21; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:05:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 288E119C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:05:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B1DC19ABC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C3A6119AF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:04:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:02:31 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i28CgEmI014263 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:42:15 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ziwavxmsreetyaubjjxznqlals" Subject: [9fans] tail -f Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:04:27 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MIME_MISSING_BOUNDARY, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ziwavxmsreetyaubjjxznqlals Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit RE: tail -f in an acme window. In a relate but slightly different tack, I still find I cannot write documents blind, Its not that I don't have faith in troff, but I don't have faith in my memory. I wrote the attached C and rc script which will re-display the given document every time its written - a poor mans vortex ☺ -Steve --upas-ziwavxmsreetyaubjjxznqlals Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=await.c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #include #include void main(int argc, char *argv[]) { Dir *ods, *ds; if (argc != 2){ fprint(2, "usage: await \n"); exits("usage"); } if ((ods = dirstat(argv[1])) == nil){ fprint(2, "%s - cannot stat file\n", argv[1]); exits("dirstat"); } for (;;) { sleep(1); if ((ds = dirstat(argv[1])) == nil){ fprint(2, "%s - cannot stat file\n", argv[1]); exits("dirstat"); } if (ds->mtime != ods->mtime) break; free(ds); } exits(0); } --upas-ziwavxmsreetyaubjjxznqlals Content-Type: cannot open Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=docvu --upas-ziwavxmsreetyaubjjxznqlals-- From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 20:06:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7867 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 20:06:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7862 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 20:06:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 20:06:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C33319D3B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:06:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E69819C3E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:06:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 981AB19D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:05:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1D94319CF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:05:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:03:15 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i28CgwmI014266 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 12:42:59 GMT Message-ID: <9583ff4902519cfb9fc23961765a3ed7@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kxlwyrsyafariykolcsocjfzmq" Subject: [9fans] tail -f Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:05:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kxlwyrsyafariykolcsocjfzmq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Doh!, missing file attached -Steve --upas-kxlwyrsyafariykolcsocjfzmq Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=docvu Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #!/bin/rc x=`{doctype $1} apid=not while(){ if (test -f /proc/$apid/notepg) echo kill>/proc/$apid/notepg eval $x | proof -m 1 & await $1 } --upas-kxlwyrsyafariykolcsocjfzmq-- From rlb@hoekstra-uitgeverij.nl Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 20:07:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7988 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 20:07:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7984 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 20:07:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 20:07:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D061E19D07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:07:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACBAA19CF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:07:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92DE119D25; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:06:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13EAF19D43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0IOe-00001l-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:54:08 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Richard Bos Message-ID: <404c460f.500459755@news.individual.net> Organization: Go wash your mouth. References: Subject: [9fans] Re: constant string Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:53:36 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Prem Mallappa wrote: > #include > > int main(void) > { > char *s = "Hello"; > > s[2] = 'z'; > > printf ("%s\n", s); > > return 0; > } > my question is when i compile this in Linux (gcc) i get a segmentation > fault at the second statement of main(), > As far as my knowledge i think this is because in 2nd chapter of K&R book > it is being mentioned that > ' any thing enclosed between " and " is a string constant' so here i am > changing a constant, and i get a segmentation fault ( and i also noticed > that gcc stores the string Hello in read-only datasegment) . Basically, yes, you're correct. > but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" > and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") > why this is happenning.. To begin with, IIRC Plan 9 C isn't exactly ISO C. But in any case, assigning to a constant (in those cases where you don't get a mandatory warning, and when you ignore the warning and do the assignment anyway, as well) invokes undefined behaviour. This means that the implementation is free to behave as it chooses to; this includes crashing, behaving as if it were correct code, and anything in between. Richard From brucee@chunder.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 20:12:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8339 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 20:12:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8335 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 20:12:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 20:12:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 67BC019D2E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A21EA19CF1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:12:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E16DA19AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:11:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A9CD519C3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 06:11:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24068 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 11:11:10 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 11:11:10 -0000 Message-ID: <013001c404fe$3fb13980$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com> <104o93hnpq2jc18@corp.supernews.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:12:25 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: charles has positioned me on this ... i had no time to examine the document fully but i think i can give the stuff away. please tell me wrong mr lawyer. i know i can give away a better 8c ... it's cleaner this time because i remember the false paths i went thru to solve stuff. i even remembered not to get fkd by peep, but maybe cause presto told me that it was a prob with the alpha. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Cummings" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 9:26 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > ahh, so say I were to subscribe for inferno? e[acl] and 3c available to > me? Can i prod you to do more work on the framebuffer? I think there's a > few of us who are definitely interested in what you've done. Don't keep > it a secret! > -dave From alcortes@coitt.es Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 21:07:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12201 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 21:07:04 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12197 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 21:07:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 21:07:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5028919A1D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:06:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 265CA19A08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:06:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6D98719CFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:05:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from tnetsmtp1.mail.isp (smtp.telefonica.net [213.4.129.135]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE5BB19CC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:05:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by tnetsmtp1.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU9AXI00.0N8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:05:42 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B0JVs-0000fs-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 13:05:40 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Message-ID: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> References: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:05:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Some time ago, David said: > You're booting a cpu kernel that doesn't expect a user to be around > and does expect to find its key (and other stuff) either in nvram > or in a disk paritition called nvram. > > Boot a terminal kernel (like 9pcdisk or 9pcf). I have tried with /386/9pcdisk and /386/9pcf but both kernels give me the same results: > root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: > user[none]: glenda > kfs...bad nvram key > bad authentication id > bad authentication domain > version...time... Any advice? -- url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html From lucio@proxima.alt.za Tue Mar 9 19:45:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 21:25:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16766 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 21:24:59 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14979 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 21:18:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 21:18:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69FED19A0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E63D419A07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84E6019A07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:17:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 185CB199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:17:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i28CHiD07955 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:17:44 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:17:24 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have tried with /386/9pcdisk and /386/9pcf but both kernels give me > the same results: > Don't worry about it, it is harmless. You may even want to get rid of the warning by executing auth/wrkey once the terminal is running. I suspect something has crept into the startup that always checks for NVRAM and the installation seems always to create an NVRAM partition. But, as I mentioned, it does no harm whatsoever. >> root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: >> user[none]: glenda >> kfs...bad nvram key >> bad authentication id >> bad authentication domain >> version...time... > > Any advice? > Of course, somebody may want to get to the bottom of this, but I'm not sure it's worth the effort. ++L From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 21:25:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16791 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 21:25:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15188 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 21:19:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 21:19:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFD4719D2E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:19:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53A1219A0D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:19:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A360C19D07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9484419A07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <912f0084d774ee243eb0f9fd2c8858f5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-btablgfltroujxtzyrwacxxedd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:18:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-btablgfltroujxtzyrwacxxedd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Use our 9pcdisk.gz, it's up to date and works. Also, zero out your nvram block (if any). It seems that you have one and it seems to have a bad password (although AFAIK, a 9pcdisk would not check that). --upas-btablgfltroujxtzyrwacxxedd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 8 13:07:04 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6467A19A07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:06:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 265CA19A08; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:06:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6D98719CFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:05:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from tnetsmtp1.mail.isp (smtp.telefonica.net [213.4.129.135]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE5BB19CC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:05:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by tnetsmtp1.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU9AXI00.0N8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:05:42 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B0JVs-0000fs-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 13:05:40 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Message-ID: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> References: <20040307141250.GC879@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:05:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Some time ago, David said: > You're booting a cpu kernel that doesn't expect a user to be around > and does expect to find its key (and other stuff) either in nvram > or in a disk paritition called nvram. > > Boot a terminal kernel (like 9pcdisk or 9pcf). I have tried with /386/9pcdisk and /386/9pcf but both kernels give me the same results: > root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: > user[none]: glenda > kfs...bad nvram key > bad authentication id > bad authentication domain > version...time... Any advice? -- url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html --upas-btablgfltroujxtzyrwacxxedd-- From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 22:05:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21750 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 22:05:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21746 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 22:05:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 22:05:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72C8B19C09; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A47E719AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:05:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C892619BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:04:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5080C19AF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:04:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <312718-15322>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:03:21 -0500 Message-ID: <054101c4050d$770b4ec0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:01:24 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Seriously, I would think it onerous to expect everyone to live by *my* > rules of etiquette or culture, given that this is an international > medium and this forum has participants from all over the globe. exactly. adapting to a culture is hard. living it is harder. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 22:11:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22032 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 22:11:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22028 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 22:11:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 22:11:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0DD8519CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B538B19BB3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:11:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D320319C09; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BD7919BA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:10:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <312833-13855>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:09:24 -0500 Message-ID: <056701c4050e$4e792620$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE05616A@black.aprote.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:07:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yes, but you can't expect people just to forget their cultural differences. > In Japan, addressing someone with their last name, but without a > "politeness" suffix is considered undignifying/rude/offensive (take your pick). depends on the situation. one kenji got all pissed off when i used -kun. you could try 'omae' ;) From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 22:12:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22086 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 22:12:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22081 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 22:12:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 22:12:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4042B19CB5; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2015519BA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:12:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D70C19D20; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:11:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F34219C92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <313446-15323>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:10:00 -0500 Message-ID: <057501c4050e$63e6d610$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <63cba62b2235fb8929b14df4e50bf45e@proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:08:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was wondering if Okamoto-san would be acceptable? normally, yes. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 22:13:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22169 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 22:13:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22163 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 22:13:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 22:13:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B098319C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4092A19AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CA3819BB3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:13:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29BC819AF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:12:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <455077-23069>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:12:28 -0500 Message-ID: <059001c4050e$bc8636d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040308092842.16776.qmail@mail.dirac.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:10:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Victim of Dinsdale: "He was a cruel man, but fair." From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 22:47:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24193 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 22:47:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24189 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 22:47:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 22:47:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 68B8119C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:47:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31FD419AA2; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:47:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B603C19A0B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:46:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41B0E199F9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 08:46:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU900Y0KFIX4K@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 08:44:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 08:44:57 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 08:44:57 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd, rounin" Date: Monday, March 8, 2004 8:07 am Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port > > Yes, but you can't expect people just to forget their cultural > differences. > > In Japan, addressing someone with their last name, but without a > > "politeness" suffix is considered undignifying/rude/offensive > (take your > pick). > > depends on the situation. Brief description of suffixes(I'm sure you know this boyd, this is for other people, not to patronize you): sama = gods, really honored folks (i.e. kami[god]-sama) san = normal polite suffix but inappropriate for teachers and medical doctors(always referred to as just "sensei") kun = male diminuitive used by superiors to inferiors(e.g. at work I'm "Noah-kun") chan = female diminuitive also works for boyfriends, children and pets. using a last name without a suffix is disrespectful because it's something like saying "that guy roberts", meaning that you don't really care for the person. First names, on the other hand, are an indication of familiarity(and can also be rude if used in the wrong context[e.g. to bosses and superiors]). Noah From carolina.federisi@chsla.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:06:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25232 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:06:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25226 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:06:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:06:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 675E119C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:06:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A51CB19AB2; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:06:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 59B3B19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:05:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (ric-dsl5010-64-83-24-236-vlan12.dsl.cavtel.net [64.83.24.236]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1B43A19A98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:05:34 -0500 (EST) From: carolina.federisi@chsla.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="56457383" Message-Id: <20040308140534.1B43A19A98@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] stolen Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:05:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --56457383 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) Found virus WORM_NETSKY.B in file party.txt.pif (in party.zip) The uncleanable file party.zip is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virNO6Nw1. If you have questions, contact administrator. --------------------------------------------------------- --56457383 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that is bad --56457383 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) party.zip is removed from here because it contains a virus. --------------------------------------------------------- --56457383-- From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:07:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25277 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:07:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25272 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:07:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:07:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B9DB19D2E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DAA919C92; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:07:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C53F419C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:06:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38FBF19C7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:06:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ikdstlvvpamksyyvrieypfhrzq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:06:17 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ikdstlvvpamksyyvrieypfhrzq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My mistake, I missed the kfs... and thought it was the kenrel complaining. I'm an idiot, sorry for causing someone to go off and check what kernel they where running. Rename the nvram partition to something else and the messages should go away. Man 8 prep. --upas-ikdstlvvpamksyyvrieypfhrzq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Mon Mar 8 07:18:33 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Mon Mar 8 07:18:30 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC15619A01; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D36A719A0C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:18:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84E6019A07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:17:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 185CB199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:17:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i28CHiD07955 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:17:44 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:17:24 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have tried with /386/9pcdisk and /386/9pcf but both kernels give me > the same results: > Don't worry about it, it is harmless. You may even want to get rid of the warning by executing auth/wrkey once the terminal is running. I suspect something has crept into the startup that always checks for NVRAM and the installation seems always to create an NVRAM partition. But, as I mentioned, it does no harm whatsoever. >> root is from (il, tcp, local)[local!#S/sdC0/fs]: >> user[none]: glenda >> kfs...bad nvram key >> bad authentication id >> bad authentication domain >> version...time... > > Any advice? > Of course, somebody may want to get to the bottom of this, but I'm not sure it's worth the effort. ++L --upas-ikdstlvvpamksyyvrieypfhrzq-- From paurea@lsub.org Tue Mar 9 19:45:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:10:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26020 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:10:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26016 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:10:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:10:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8F4419CC4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:10:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48D3719BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:10:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C5DE19C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D774F19AB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:09:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:09:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > kun = male diminuitive used by superiors to inferiors(e.g. at work I'm "Noah-kun") I thought くん (kun) was also for colleages (for example for a colleage at university) Kenji what do you say?. ゴルカ From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:14:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26532 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:14:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26524 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:14:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:14:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 806EB19CCD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:14:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5720919C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:14:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 28BA219C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5417B19C2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:13:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <322b4b8e432f369460fa23206b08f040@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:13:22 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Boyd forgot one, -ejit, as in Boyd-ejit From dbailey27@ameritech.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:20:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26771 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:20:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26767 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:20:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:20:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A397119ABC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:20:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5F8B19A1D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:20:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5276319BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:19:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (pimout5-ext.prodigy.net [207.115.63.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE8A219AB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:19:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.det.ameritech.net (adsl-67-38-3-179.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net [67.38.3.179]) by pimout5-ext.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i28EJ53l170592; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:19:05 -0500 Message-ID: <15d2f5fb6672706b232a46affc5b710e@yourdomain.dom> To: prem_mallappa@hotpop.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string From: dbailey27@ameritech.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kptmqtdshaeqbugltgrqxjlbgz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:13:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kptmqtdshaeqbugltgrqxjlbgz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You answered your own question. Linux uses an ELF file format. When the ELF is loaded, the variables loaded into the DATA segment are marked as read-only pages. This, of course, will cause a write to such pages to manifest a SIGSEGV. Plan 9, however, makes no effort to do this. Objects marked into the DATA segment of the Plan 9 file format are loaded into pages that are actually RWX. So, it's really a two-pronged issue. 1) The kernel loader doesn't handle the management of page protection in the DATA, Stack, BSS, or even the TEXT. 2) The current binary format doesn't allow for specification of whether or not the DATA segment should *be* ~W. There is one main reason why you would want a W DATA. Variables that end up initialized to a value other than nil must be put in the DATA segment. Otherwise, they end up in the BSS, which is initialized to nil. Thus, global pointers to objects in the DATA (not const?) must be R|W, while the object itself (raw data) must be ~W. This is the ideal solution. This is being implemented in my work on the SPARC/SPARCv9 and AMD64 ports. I've discussed this with other members of the AMD64 port, and there've been no nay-sayers. There will be other improvements, as well. However, they are to be seen later. FYI, I'm writing the toolchain(s) from scratch, so the new binary format for these archs will look only slightly different from the current. Don (north_) --upas-kptmqtdshaeqbugltgrqxjlbgz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Apparently-To: dbailey27@ameritech.net via web80507.mail.yahoo.com; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 02:22:45 -0800 Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mx1-klmzmi.klmzmi.ameritech.net (67.36.55.28) by mta829.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 02:22:45 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [130.203.4.6] Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mx1-klmzmi.klmzmi.ameritech.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i28AMguD007475 for ; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 04:22:43 -0600 (CST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62D4519D2E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70EFE19D05; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:22:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 481BB19CA7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBA3419CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 05:21:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0Hmz-0007AM-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 10:15:13 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Prem Mallappa Message-ID: Organization: GESL Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] constant string Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:15:07 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, this is my program ------------------------------------------ #include int main(void) { char *s = "Hello"; s[2] = 'z'; printf ("%s\n", s); return 0; } ------------------------------------------ my question is when i compile this in Linux (gcc) i get a segmentation fault at the second statement of main(), As far as my knowledge i think this is because in 2nd chapter of K&R book it is being mentioned that ' any thing enclosed between " and " is a string constant' so here i am changing a constant, and i get a segmentation fault ( and i also noticed that gcc stores the string Hello in read-only datasegment) but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") why this is happenning.. sorry if i am posting to wrong group, thanks in advance prem --upas-kptmqtdshaeqbugltgrqxjlbgz-- From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:21:25 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26811 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:21:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26806 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:21:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:21:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2712219CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:21:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25AAF19ABD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:21:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E2C2819C92; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:20:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EABCF19A1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU901BPFH5LRH@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 09:20:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 09:20:09 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 09:20:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It works that way too=2C but it implies a great deal of familiarity=2E Bu= t YMMV and Kenji will certainly give you a better explaination=2E = Noah ----- Original Message ----- From=3A Gorka Guardiola M=C3=BAzquiz =3Cpaurea=40lsub=2Eorg=3E Date=3A Monday=2C March 8=2C 2004 9=3A09 am Subject=3A Re=3A =5B9fans=5D graphviz-1=2E10 port =3E =3E kun =3D male diminuitive used by superiors to inferiors(e=2Eg=2E = at = =3E work I=27m =22Noah-kun=22) =3E = =3E I thought =3F=3F (kun) was also for colleages (for example for a = =3E colleage at university) =3E Kenji what do you say=3F=2E =3E = =3E =3F=3F=3F = =3E = =3E From lowzl@hotmail.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:22:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26854 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:22:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26849 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:22:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:22:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 34CD619D07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:22:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 729AF19ABD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:22:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5359019CFC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:21:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32C2619C4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:21:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0Law-0003jy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 14:19:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Zhen Lin Message-ID: <615e205d.0403080602.217f1d3@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20040307141250.GC879@shire>, <20040307170709.GA634@shire> Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:16:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You need to put a key into nvram. That is the easiest thing to do. Boot up as normal, and run the following command: wrkey I've found that not having a proper nvram key doesn't seem to affect anything, for a standalone Plan 9 system. From dfawcus@cisco.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:24:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26953 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:24:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26949 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:24:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:24:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1824119C80; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:24:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3006D19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:24:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C6A019BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:23:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2087D19ABD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:23:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Mar 2004 06:31:26 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i28EMa1v003305 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:22:37 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id OAA04927 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:23:04 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dhcp & metanames Message-ID: <20040308142304.A595@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D33@black.aprote.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: ; from presotto@closedmind.org on Sun, Mar 07, 2004 at 10:55:41AM -0500 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:23:04 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, Mar 07, 2004 at 10:55:41AM -0500, David Presotto wrote: > > everyone that dual boots with windows that doesn't live on the > prime meridian is in the same boat. and even when one does live on prime meridian (or as near as damn it), windows still get's confused for half the year... From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:48:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28237 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:48:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28232 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:48:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:48:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 25C1A19BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 616D019AFB; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:48:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92F6019C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:47:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D11319AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:47:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314364-15782>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:46:17 -0500 Message-ID: <008101c4051b$f260c2e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:45:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I thought くん (kun) was also for colleages (for example for a colleage at university) right, when you're ~ 'equals'. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 8 23:50:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28363 invoked by uid 1020); 8 Mar 2004 23:50:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28359 invoked from network); 8 Mar 2004 23:50:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 8 Mar 2004 23:50:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82E6119CB5; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEDE519C2A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:50:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC22C19AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:49:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F3D019AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:49:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3742697-4721>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 09:47:46 -0500 Message-ID: <008d01c4051c$26a00160$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <322b4b8e432f369460fa23206b08f040@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:46:32 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Boyd forgot one, -ejit, as in Boyd-ejit aye see you, jimmy! From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 00:14:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29681 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 00:14:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29676 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 00:14:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 00:14:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D083919B2D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 644D219AFB; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:14:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B53319BFD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:13:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 7439419B52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:13:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 15:11:40 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i28GpQmI014659 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:51:27 GMT Message-ID: <82d72cfe97699d87ddada67819810275@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] ejit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:13:36 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Eh?! This one I have to claim, its from Northern Ireland. As in: "Ya buck-ejit, if I leant ye a bra-in cell, it add be lonley" -Steve ☺ From forsyth@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 00:18:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29758 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 00:17:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29749 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 00:17:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 00:17:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ECFC719BB3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:17:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FEB619AFB; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:17:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F90819B2D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6507C19AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:16:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: <15d2f5fb6672706b232a46affc5b710e@yourdomain.dom> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:22:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the plan 9 compilers, in the main, don't put constant strings into read-only segments, though they could (easiest on most platforms that aren't separate I&D or x-only text would be to pop them into the text segment). on the other hand, you'd probably then need something like gcc's -fwritable-strings to cope with older C programs that wrote to them (and some did), although that need would mainly be limited to ape. (i haven't noticed plan 9 programs that do it, and i've ported quite a few to other platforms.) From alcortes@coitt.es Tue Mar 9 19:45:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 00:19:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29842 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 00:19:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29838 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 00:19:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 00:19:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1066619C4A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:19:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27D4219A0D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:19:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F01219B52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:18:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from telesmtp3.mail.isp (unknown [213.4.129.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A46A219AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:18:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es ([80.26.72.139]) by telesmtp3.mail.isp (terra.es) with ESMTP id HU9JUE01.XUG for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:18:14 +0100 Received: from alcortes by 80-26-72-139.uc.nombres.ttd.es with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1B0MWC-0000ox-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 16:18:12 +0100 From: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot.c -> bad nvram key -> solved! (workaround, not fixed) Message-ID: <20040308151812.GB2988@shire> References: <20040308120540.GB2405@shire> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Operating-System: Linux 2.4.18 i686 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 21.2.1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: Alberto =?iso-8859-1?Q?Cort=E9s?= List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:18:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.2 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Some time ago, lucio said: > > I have tried with /386/9pcdisk and /386/9pcf but both kernels give me > > the same results: > > > Don't worry about it, it is harmless. You may even want to get rid of > the warning by executing auth/wrkey once the terminal is running. I > suspect something has crept into the startup that always checks for > NVRAM and the installation seems always to create an NVRAM partition. > But, as I mentioned, it does no harm whatsoever. Thats right!, the last ISO i downloaded from Plan9 web site creates a small (1 sector, 512 B) partition for nvram. Also, the boot(8) process for terminals check keys in it. Maybe something crept in boot(8) on the last versions, because in a previous version of plan9 i didn't see that behaviour (maybe some code from cpu kernel leaked in???). Anyway, i have get rid of the warnings by deleting/renaming the nvram partition with disk/prep /dev/sdC0/9fat as Presotto & Nemo suggested. It can also be solved with the auth/wrkey trick that Lucio and Zhen Lin mentioned (not sure, i didn't try it). As Lucio said, the warnings were quite harmless as the systems boot normally, but i were a little worried (newbie thoughts). Thanks you all for your help. -- url: http://163.117.15.158/~acortes/index.html From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 01:25:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1355 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 01:25:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1351 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 01:25:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 01:25:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC09719CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:25:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8832D19C4D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:25:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 768C919C52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:24:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 098BD19ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:24:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315503-15784>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:23:25 -0500 Message-ID: <00dc01c40529$7f7ca650$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:22:03 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Brief description of suffixes(I'm sure you know this boyd, this is for other people, not to patronize you): you don't know me very well ;) > sama = gods, really honored folks (i.e. kami[god]-sama) yes, go-chisousama deshita [de gozaimashita] is a good one when you leave a restaurant. freaks 'em out. kami is also 'divine' and 'paper' (but different kanji). > chan = female diminuitive also works for boyfriends, children and pets. forgot about that one. From imp123@verizon.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 01:39:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1993 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 01:39:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1989 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 01:39:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 01:39:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D414F19CC4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:39:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07C7119AD0; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:39:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BE6319B52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:38:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from out004.verizon.net (out004pub.verizon.net [206.46.170.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 242BB19A1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:38:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mucky ([151.205.250.217]) by out004.verizon.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.06 201-253-122-130-106-20030910) with ESMTP id <20040308163833.GAPG11989.out004.verizon.net@mucky> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:38:33 -0600 From: imp123@verizon.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Message-ID: <404CA201.nail5BY113S43@verizon.net> References: <00dc01c40529$7f7ca650$67844051@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <00dc01c40529$7f7ca650$67844051@SOMA> User-Agent: nail 10.6 11/15/03 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authentication-Info: Submitted using SMTP AUTH at out004.verizon.net from [151.205.250.217] at Mon, 8 Mar 2004 10:38:33 -0600 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:40:33 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** q David Jeffers mailto: imp123@verizon.net From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 01:42:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2241 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 01:42:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2236 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 01:42:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 01:42:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2504119CC4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:42:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0429C19B52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:42:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C1E719B52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:41:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89FF419A1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:41:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU900OWHNM56Z@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:39:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:39:41 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:39:41 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: :) Nope. Any luck on the 3c574 pcmcia driver? hoshigatteru kara. ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd, rounin" Date: Monday, March 8, 2004 11:22 am Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port > > Brief description of suffixes(I'm sure you know this boyd, this > is for > other people, not to patronize you): > > you don't know me very well ;) > > > sama = gods, really honored folks (i.e. kami[god]-sama) > > yes, go-chisousama deshita [de gozaimashita] is a good one > when you leave a restaurant. freaks 'em out. > > kami is also 'divine' and 'paper' (but different kanji). > > > chan = female diminuitive also works for boyfriends, children > and pets. > > forgot about that one. > > From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 01:54:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3004 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 01:54:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3000 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 01:54:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 01:54:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A0ECE19C80; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:54:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 741CA19AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:54:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA86419AA2; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:53:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9406C19B29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:53:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314734-15787>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:52:07 -0500 Message-ID: <00f401c4052d$809349a0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:50:43 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Any luck on the 3c574 pcmcia driver? hoshigatteru kara. nope, 'cos if i can't type, i can't hack. so i don't hack. i fixed the kdb stuff once, but ... From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:50 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 01:58:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3220 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 01:58:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3216 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 01:58:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 01:58:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DCC8619CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:58:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCE0B19B29; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:58:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 48BB819AF7; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AF3A19AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:57:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU900N1ROFDUD@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:57:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:57:13 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 11:57:13 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: :) No biggie, I bought a 3c589 for $3 so I could get the craptop to have network access under Plan 9. How different is an audigy from a normal soundblaster 16(like Plan 9 supports)? How hard would it be to do an emu10k1 driver? Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd, rounin" Date: Monday, March 8, 2004 11:50 am Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port > > Any luck on the 3c574 pcmcia driver? hoshigatteru kara. > > nope, 'cos if i can't type, i can't hack. so i don't hack. > > i fixed the kdb stuff once, but ... > > From 9nut@9netics.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 03:17:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7553 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 03:17:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7548 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 03:17:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 03:17:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 98D3F19D07; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0ED019CBE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:17:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 804D119CBE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB08D19CB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 13:16:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: 9nut@9netics.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] make2mk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 11:16:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Can't remember who was looking for this; there is one under src/ on rsc's repository at: http://cvs.pdos.lcs.mit.edu/cvs/plan9/ From dfawcus@cisco.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 04:30:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14093 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 04:30:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13447 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 04:26:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 04:26:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 676ED19D43; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:26:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9575819C32; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:26:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D786219C19; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C0AF19C32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:25:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Mar 2004 11:33:46 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i28JOq1v002400 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:24:53 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id TAA21529 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 19:25:20 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Message-ID: <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp>; from okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp on Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 03:30:07PM +0900 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 19:25:20 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 03:30:07PM +0900, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > If neccessary, please use Kenji or Kenji Okamoto, thank you. I had the impression that Japan was one of those cultures where names are of the form 'family given' vs 'given family'. Is this correct? If so, then it can at times be difficult to know which name is the family name and which is the given one [1]. i.e. in the face of some people presenting their names in their 'natural' order and some presenting them in our 'natural' order. So one is sort of left having to use a full name! DF [1] Unless of course you recognise one or other of the names as being of a particular type: family vs given From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 04:31:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14258 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 04:31:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13679 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 04:28:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 04:28:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B995719C19; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66B6E19CAD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E88119C6E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:27:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40C9819B2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:27:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HU900B8JVE77Q@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 14:27:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Mon, 08 Mar 2004 14:27:43 -0500 From: Noah Evans To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] acme suicide Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 14:27:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I tried 'Edit , | man 2 9p' in the tag of an acme window and got: panic: D2B called on non-block 11a8c8 (double-free?) acme 1436: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aed5 and for fun: acid: stk() abort()+0x0 /sys/src/libc/9sys/abort.c:6 ppanic(p=0x472a0,fmt=0x48314)+0x152 /sys/src/libc/port/malloc.c:158 D2B(v=0x11a8c8,p=0x472a0)+0x32 /sys/src/libc/port/pool.c:943 poolreallocl(ndsize=0x3192,v=0x11a8c8,p=0x472a0)+0x47 /sys/src/libc/port/pool.c:994 poolrealloc(p=0x472a0,v=0x11a8c8,n=0x3192)+0x49 /sys/src/libc/port/pool.c:1151 realloc(size=0x318a,v=0x11a8c8)+0x4d /sys/src/libc/port/malloc.c:245 erealloc(p=0x11a8d0,n=0x318a)+0x17 /sys/src/cmd/acme/util.c:367 sizecache(n=0x1861,b=0x958f0)+0x32 /sys/src/cmd/acme/buff.c:26 bufinsert(b=0x958f0,q0=0x3024,n=0x1861,s=0x118890)+0x2cb /sys/src/cmd/acme/buff.c:168 elogflush(f=0xace50)+0x97 /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c:113 elogapply(f=0xace50)+0xf /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c:225 allupdate(w=0xcbf18)+0x7e /sys/src/cmd/acme/edit.c:121 allwindows(arg=0x0,f=0xacd7)+0x4e /sys/src/cmd/acme/rows.c:718 editcmd(n=0xc,r=0xc3792,ct=0xcbf2c)+0x1a4 /sys/src/cmd/acme/edit.c:189 edit(et=0xcbf2c,argt=0x0,arg=0xc3792,narg=0xc)+0x8c /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:821 execute(t=0xcbf2c,aq0=0x21,aq1=0x21,external=0x0,argt=0x0)+0x1ec /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:190 mousethread()+0x49d /sys/src/cmd/acme/acme.c:550 launcher386(arg=0x0,f=0x2276)+0x10 /sys/src/libthread/386.c:10 0xfefefefe ?file?:0 From salomo3@cooper.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 04:38:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15012 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 04:38:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15008 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 04:38:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 04:38:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C09F319D2B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:38:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C576019C32; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:38:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5BC3F19C6C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:37:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (wish.cooper.edu [199.98.16.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F11319C32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:37:27 -0500 (EST) Received: by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix, from userid 94) id 0E8C73938; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id 6961F3937 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from verb.ee.cooper.edu ([199.98.20.228]) (SquirrelMail authenticated user salomo3) by wish.cooper.edu with HTTP; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3166.199.98.20.228.1078774092.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> In-Reply-To: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> References: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: "Joel Salomon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:28:12 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=PRIORITY_NO_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Dave Lukes said: >> The editor could compute the right number of >> spaces to insert, and avoid the issue. > > ... and the "right" number is ...? > 42? Just guessing... --Joel From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 04:59:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16755 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 04:59:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16751 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 04:59:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 04:59:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43B3319C97; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:59:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C16A19C97; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:59:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AA3319CBF; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:59:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B850E19C97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:58:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i28Jvpiq087692 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:57:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i28Jvp9E087691 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:57:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403081957.i28Jvp9E087691@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] patch? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:57:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What is the right way to prepare and distribute patches? diff+ed+rc? From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:51 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 05:06:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17142 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 05:06:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17138 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 05:06:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 05:06:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B05E19CAD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:06:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE7D919CAD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:06:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E63B819CEE; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:05:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEDDD19C97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:05:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321860-13853>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:04:31 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd01c40548$56efd940$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078533730.1730.45.camel@rea> <3166.199.98.20.228.1078774092.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:02:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 42? Just guessing... 0x80 From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 9 19:45:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 05:22:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18146 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 05:22:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18142 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 05:22:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 05:22:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9ECD19D3B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:22:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9E1C19CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:22:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 150ED19D2B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:21:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B07819CEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:21:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i28KLgCi005022 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:21:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i28KLgfO015245 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:21:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i28KLgU18445 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:21:42 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Mar 2004 19:25:20 +0000." <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 21:21:42 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: some international groups (communities, circles, whatever)[1] solve this ambiguity by customarily using all-caps for the family name. Axel BELINFANTE [1] I know this at least holds for esperantists > I had the impression that Japan was one of those cultures where names are > of the form 'family given' vs 'given family'. Is this correct? > > If so, then it can at times be difficult to know which name is the family > name and which is the given one [1]. i.e. in the face of some people > presenting their names in their 'natural' order and some presenting them > in our 'natural' order. > > So one is sort of left having to use a full name! > > DF > > [1] Unless of course you recognise one or other of the names as being of a > particular type: family vs given From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 9 19:45:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 05:27:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18531 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 05:27:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18527 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 05:27:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 05:27:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0822C19AAA; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0344B19B52; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:27:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EAD919C84; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:26:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDD7D19AF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i28KQ7Ci005284 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:26:07 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i28KQ6fO016377 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:26:06 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i28KQ6n18489 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:26:06 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403082026.i28KQ6n18489@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 08 Mar 2004 21:21:42 +0100." <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 21:26:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I wrote: > some international groups (communities, circles, whatever)[1] solve > this ambiguity by customarily using all-caps for the family name. and know I'm wondering myself how to _pronounces_ something all-caps, e.g. when meeting in person... > Axel BELINFANTE > > [1] I know this at least holds for esperantists > > > I had the impression that Japan was one of those cultures where names are > > of the form 'family given' vs 'given family'. Is this correct? > > > > If so, then it can at times be difficult to know which name is the family > > name and which is the given one [1]. i.e. in the face of some people > > presenting their names in their 'natural' order and some presenting them > > in our 'natural' order. > > > > So one is sort of left having to use a full name! > > > > DF > > > > [1] Unless of course you recognise one or other of the names as being of a > > particular type: family vs given From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 05:44:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19954 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 05:44:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19945 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 05:44:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 05:44:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DBF7F19CE8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:44:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 446DC19CE8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:44:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B14DE199F4; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5DAA19A01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:43:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <319335-15783>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 15:42:17 -0500 Message-ID: <01d801c4054d$9c49a7f0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:40:34 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Axel BELINFANTE yup .fr: Boyd ROBERTS From dfawcus@cisco.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 06:21:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22017 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 06:21:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22013 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 06:21:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 06:21:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84CD419D43; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:21:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 092C819CE8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:21:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B80519B79; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:20:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 151C519A25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Mar 2004 13:28:48 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i28LJs1v029855 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:19:54 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id VAA27799 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:20:22 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port Message-ID: <20040308212021.E595@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200403082021.i28KLgU18445@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl>; from Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl on Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 09:21:42PM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:20:21 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 09:21:42PM +0100, Axel Belinfante wrote: > some international groups (communities, circles, whatever)[1] solve > this ambiguity by customarily using all-caps for the family name. I remember the imigration form at the Maldives. "Fill in name, and underline family name" DF From 9nut@9netics.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:52 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 06:41:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22875 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 06:41:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22871 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 06:41:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 06:41:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 035E719D43; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0B2D19CE8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:41:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B5E4919D2B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:40:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 426B719C14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:40:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <01d801c4054d$9c49a7f0$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 14:40:39 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > and know I'm wondering myself how to _pronounces_ > something all-caps, e.g. when meeting in person... IGOR: Frederick Frankenstein? FREDDY: Fron kon steen! IGOR: Are you putting me on? FREDDY: No, it's pronounced Fron konsteen. IGOR: And do you also say Fro dereck? FREDDY: No, Fred ereck. IGOR: Why isn't it Frodereck Fronkon steen? FREDDY: It's not. It's Fredereck Fronkonsteen. IGOR: I see. FREDDY: You must be Igor. IGOR: No, it's pronounced Aye gor. FREDDY: But they told me it was Ee gor. IGOR: Well, they were wrong then, weren't they? From wes@village.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 07:25:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25154 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 07:25:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25137 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 07:25:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 07:25:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 975FA199BC; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:25:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0242919CAD; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:25:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB95019CCA; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:24:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from www.abyx.com (s85f45n6e.servers.accentric.net [209.132.69.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88BC3199BC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:24:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from WK-HP-Pavilion.village.com (h004005bd31cc.ne.client2.attbi.com [65.96.215.98]) (authenticated) by www.abyx.com (8.10.2/8.10.2) with ESMTP id i28Lw0I00954 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 16:58:00 -0500 Message-Id: <6.0.1.1.2.20040308171957.028399c0@mail.village.com> X-Sender: wespop@mail.village.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.1.1 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Wes Kussmaul Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port In-Reply-To: <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <279699ef8d1c89f41c17574b049b64b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 17:24:40 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I say let's all just use our public key (properly issued) and be done with all the inscrutable etiquette! > some people >presenting their names in their 'natural' order and some presenting them >in our 'natural' order. > >So one is sort of left having to use a full name! > >DF > >[1] Unless of course you recognise one or other of the names as being of a > particular type: family vs given From jkw@eecs.harvard.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 07:41:17 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25913 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 07:41:17 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25909 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 07:41:16 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 07:41:16 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D456C19D54; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:41:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E0ABE19CE3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:41:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63D5E19D2B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:40:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F63919CAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:40:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mero.morphisms.net (mero.morphisms.net [66.93.84.246]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B288824FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:40:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by mero.morphisms.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id BC64B42; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:40:43 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 17:40:43 -0500 From: William Josephson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string Message-ID: <20040308224043.GA84717@mero.morphisms.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2i X-No-archive: yes Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 08, 2004 at 10:15:07AM +0000, Prem Mallappa wrote: > my question is when i compile this in Linux (gcc) i get a segmentation > > but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" > and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") Try compiling with gcc -fwritable-strings on Linux and see what happens. By default gcc puts initialized data in a read-only segment but pcc does not. From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Tue Mar 9 19:45:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 10:29:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7233 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 10:29:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7229 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 10:29:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 10:29:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA43819AA1; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:29:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40FB919A9F; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:29:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B18719AA3; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:28:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2FCD19A90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:28:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <98aed08fd6e6afcd4bb95fa6f5a9fa2a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:29:20 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> kun = male diminuitive used by superiors to inferiors(e.g. at work I'm "Noah-kun") > > I thought くん (kun) was also for colleages (for example for a colleage at university) > Kenji what do you say?. One of my friend in my youth said everybody as xxx-kun indicating some special friendliness. However, it depended on his special capability when he said so. He was always said so with _smile_. くん is usually attached from a senior 先輩. It's not easy to use くん here. You must be very careful when you use it. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Tue Mar 9 19:45:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 10:52:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9802 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 10:52:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9798 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 10:52:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 10:52:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9915519A1D; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B93FE19AA8; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:52:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F173819B23; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:51:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DDCA19A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 20:51:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2864dbef2a1aaae3c44a973d98de7ccd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <20040308192520.B595@edinburgh.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:51:52 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I had the impression that Japan was one of those cultures where names are > of the form 'family given' vs 'given family'. Is this correct? > > If so, then it can at times be difficult to know which name is the family > name and which is the given one [1]. i.e. in the face of some people > presenting their names in their 'natural' order and some presenting them > in our 'natural' order. There is a rule how to distinguish this, for an example, a member of this list writes his name as YAMANASHI Takeshi here, he may be proud of being Japanese and probably wants to express it by using formal expression of Japanese names. In this case, please remember his surname is written using capital letter only. I write my name KenJi Okamoto, which is de-facto standard from the time Japan accepted Western calture about 150 years ago. Kenji From salomo3@cooper.edu Tue Mar 9 19:45:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 12:22:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18935 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 12:22:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18931 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 12:22:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4087C19D04; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:22:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57E4E19BE9; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:22:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7608119C4E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:21:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (wish.cooper.edu [199.98.16.74]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C6C219B26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix, from userid 94) id C725F3939; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:11:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from wish.cooper.edu (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by wish.cooper.edu (Postfix) with SMTP id E453D3938 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:11:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from verb.ee.cooper.edu ([199.98.20.228]) (SquirrelMail authenticated user salomo3) by wish.cooper.edu with HTTP; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:11:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4160.199.98.20.228.1078801900.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> In-Reply-To: <8272d0a741697fa1be90989dfacf2d3e@plan9.bell-labs.com> References: <8272d0a741697fa1be90989dfacf2d3e@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] borders From: "Joel Salomon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:11:40 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=PRIORITY_NO_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com said: > A curiosum: I was looking at an Israeli web page, almost all > in Hebrew, with IE. It contrives to make the scrollbar > appear (and work) on the left. > > Dennis > I *am* curious - was this the browser's scroll bar that got moved by some ms html extension or what? www.bezeq.co.il, for example, has some code to give it a "cool" blue scrollbar, but on the right. Pointer, please. --Joel From rsc@swtch.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 12:42:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21028 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 12:42:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21024 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 12:42:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 12:42:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E26E019D0E; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:42:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A491119C9C; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:42:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 214B719C54; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:41:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F02F19C9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:41:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1B0Y7K-000C9v-R3 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 22:41:18 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Mar 2004 15:22:12." From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <46741.1078803675.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 22:41:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > mainly be limited to ape. (i haven't noticed plan 9 > programs that do it, and i've ported quite a few > to other platforms.) ed. From dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com Tue Mar 9 19:45:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 13:44:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26423 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 13:44:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26419 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 13:44:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 13:44:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 784FD19D3B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71E4B19D3B; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:44:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 25E8719D16; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:43:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5158619D0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:43:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2b87c68cfa80fa55e59ecf3038165132@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] borders In-Reply-To: <4160.199.98.20.228.1078801900.squirrel@wish.cooper.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:43:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I *am* curious - was this the browser's scroll bar that got moved by some > ms html extension or what? www.bezeq.co.il, for example, has some code to > give it a "cool" blue scrollbar, but on the right. The example is at http://www.whatsup.org.il/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=10639 I didn't try to understand the source, but it uses both Javascript and CSS. (BTW, it's a public page where the topic was "otherunix" stuff and thus is graphics-rich.) Dennis From r@geekmail.cc Tue Mar 9 19:45:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 14:29:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30424 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 14:29:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30420 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 14:29:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 14:29:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AAF119D56; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:29:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5A6719D24; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:29:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 493A519D3B; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:28:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FDF619C69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from waakzaamheid (none@glenda.corp.google.com [172.24.64.198]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i295SkX6031971 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:28:46 -0800 Message-ID: <36c13887672c32979c9849347bc8d07a@google.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:28:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I tried 'Edit , | man 2 9p' in the tag of an acme window and got: > > panic: D2B called on non-block 11a8c8 (double-free?) > acme 1436: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aed5 this is kind of amazing. i was testing something for rsc and crashed acme. tracked it down, fixed it. it was a day 1 bug; amazing it had never happened. then i decided to track down your bug. turns out it's the same thing. amazing coincidence. here's the fix: r% yesterday -d /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c diff /n/dump/2004/0308/sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c 173c173 < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f->elog.q0 if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f->elog.nr+nr; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:48:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i295cbiq089522 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:38:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i295cbWp089521 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:38:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403090538.i295cbWp089521@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide In-Reply-To: <36c13887672c32979c9849347bc8d07a@google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:38:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 173c173 > < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f->elog.q0 --- > > if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f->elog.nr+nr; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:56:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i295uDD10442 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:56:14 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <7f99851ff797f71d4658e40deaafbe70@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <200403090538.i295cbWp089521@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:55:49 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> 173c173 >> < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f->elog.q0> --- >> > if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f->elog.nr+nr > Is there a program under Plan 9 that can apply this (or similar) > diff automatically? ape/patch? With a little bit of assistance? ++L From r@geekmail.cc Tue Mar 9 19:45:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 15:07:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1510 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 15:07:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1506 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 15:07:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 15:07:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7708C19B69; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:07:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9710C19B69; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:07:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E03719C9C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:06:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2DE219A08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:06:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from waakzaamheid (none@glenda.corp.google.com [172.24.64.198]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2966ebk016402 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:06:40 -0800 Message-ID: <15cdbf99538d0685eba7b9e8580050c2@google.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <200403090538.i295cbWp089521@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:06:40 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there a program under Plan 9 that can apply this (or similar) > diff automatically? replica/pull, once the patch is on sources. -rob From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 15:11:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1896 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 15:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1868 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 15:11:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 15:11:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18E6019D60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AAC719BE9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:11:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8D0E19BD4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:10:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0753419B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:10:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2969hiq089700 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:09:43 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2969hh7089699 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:09:43 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403090609.i2969hh7089699@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide In-Reply-To: <15cdbf99538d0685eba7b9e8580050c2@google.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:09:43 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > Is there a program under Plan 9 that can apply this (or similar) > > diff automatically? > > replica/pull, once the patch is on sources. Yes, I understand it. I was asking about a port of patch. ape/patch is it, I simply did not know where to look. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 9 19:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 15:20:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2726 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 15:20:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2722 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 15:20:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 15:20:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D7F119D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:20:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 379AA19BDB; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:20:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9607119D4C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:19:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18EE219BDB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:19:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3773c1c6fc3eb563586d41cee4164718@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403090609.i2969hh7089699@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:23:05 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was asking about a port of patch. ape/patch is it, I simply > did not know where to look. if you're really twisted: http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/lanlp9/unix/patch-2.5.4.tar diffutils and paste are also there. enjoy. From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 15:33:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3993 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 15:33:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3973 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 15:33:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 15:33:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F94519B80; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:33:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7945219CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:33:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2DBB119BE9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:32:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E17919B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 01:32:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i296VFiq090622 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:31:15 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i296VFlZ090621 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:31:15 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403090631.i296VFlZ090621@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide In-Reply-To: <3773c1c6fc3eb563586d41cee4164718@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:31:15 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I was asking about a port of patch. ape/patch is it, I simply > > did not know where to look. > > if you're really twisted: > > http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/lanlp9/unix/patch-2.5.4.tar > Thank you. Actually, gnu patch 2.5 in ape/patch is working. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Tue Mar 9 19:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 17:03:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12324 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 17:03:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12320 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 17:03:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 17:03:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DF2319BA1; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 03:03:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 955C519C07; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 03:03:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D73319BB1; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 03:02:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA76219B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 03:02:54 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i298BS1M021064 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:11:28 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] borders X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D44@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] borders Thread-Index: AcQFkVsSNvSXDPsRSXWoChHJ9lwZ6QAG002g From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:02:51 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >I didn't try to understand the source, but it uses both >Javascript and CSS. You can say "direction: rtl" in CSS. That's what makes IE play games with its scrollbar. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:16:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21852 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:16:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21848 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:16:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:16:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3751419C17; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:16:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0677919B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:16:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C27FB19BD4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:15:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2443119B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:15:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11d3699fa3b1658feca34f8f02545d40@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-nmfogfblxyhzzqqejktbaeqpan" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:17:48 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-nmfogfblxyhzzqqejktbaeqpan Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit good thing i didn't port that one, then! --upas-nmfogfblxyhzzqqejktbaeqpan Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Tue Mar 9 03:41:39 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E204619C7A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:42:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C5AC19C7A; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:42:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 214B719C54; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:41:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F02F19C9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 22:41:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1B0Y7K-000C9v-R3 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 08 Mar 2004 22:41:18 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] constant string In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 08 Mar 2004 15:22:12." From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <46741.1078803675.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2004 22:41:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > mainly be limited to ape. (i haven't noticed plan 9 > programs that do it, and i've ported quite a few > to other platforms.) ed. --upas-nmfogfblxyhzzqqejktbaeqpan-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 9 19:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:23:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22588 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:23:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22584 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:23:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:23:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91D2319C0D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:23:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3C6F19BD4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:23:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9E8B19C07; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:22:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 790C219B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:22:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz-1.10 port From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <6.0.1.1.2.20040308171957.028399c0@mail.village.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:24:58 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>I say let's all just use our public key (properly issued) and be done with >>all the inscrutable etiquette! i'm afraid it's a common mistake, encouraged by 'orrible x.509, to suppose `public key' should be preceded by the definite article. the second common mistake relates to `properly issued'; similar cause i think. a splendid idea that has nearly been ruined by x.* From dagwyn@comcast.net Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:52:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25087 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:52:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25083 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:52:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:52:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3CAC519C54; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77B9119BD4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:52:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 089EB19C17; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD25719BD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0drC-0005OH-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:49:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <404CD66A.EF449949@comcast.net> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net>, <012801c404fc$a1ba0910$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: DAGwyn@null.net List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:47:58 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Bruce Ellis wrote: > you rather lost track of it. Not as badly as Boyd, however! From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:53:07 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25106 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:53:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25102 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:53:07 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:53:07 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 446AD19CAD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:53:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0B7D19CFD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:52:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 108EF19C3C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB84419B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0drC-0005ON-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:49:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104qo2ft7vjvv0a@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com>, <013001c404fe$3fb13980$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:48:11 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sounds excellent. now i beseech thee: point me to it! I'll give a go at porting whatever possible to the ps2 with your compiler. there are some homebrew hdd libs around as well, maybe I'll have a look-see. thanks again -dave From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:53:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25146 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:53:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25142 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:53:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:53:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EFC819C75; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9056919D0F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:53:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EFEA319B23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9145F19BD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:51:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B0drC-0005OT-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:49:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104qvd8n6nmd7e1@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D44@black.aprote.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] borders Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:48:22 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: on the topic of scrollbars, i've been playing with a ss10 w/openwindows. under workspace properties: Scrollbar Placement: Left/Right From nemo@lsub.org Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 18:58:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25438 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 18:58:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25433 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 18:58:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 18:58:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4415B19CFF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:58:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74E5419C54; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:58:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81B8A19C54; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:57:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 080EB19C17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 04:57:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1e518c61a4b6747b1e83cc88793aca08@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] LNCS troff template? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:57:44 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Anyone wrote a paper in troff for LCNS? Anyone with a template? thanks a lot From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 19:03:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25718 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 19:03:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25714 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 19:03:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 19:03:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B7BC19D04; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:03:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28CE219A63; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:03:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C66C319CC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:02:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48D4D19C96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:02:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6c6ef1c607d6d6233079a23ec55a55b7@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Kenji Okamoto MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] HP's SCL reference manual Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:03:10 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Does anyone have i? I visited HP's developper's web page, and found I may have to regist and (probably) have to pay somewhat. I don't like them. I just want to confirm the details of the commands and those formats. Please respond to me directly. Kenji From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 9 19:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 19:14:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26502 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 19:14:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26498 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 19:14:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 19:14:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91DD719CAD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:14:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CE1819C6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:14:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF22219CFD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:13:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00EF419C6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:13:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29ACaiq091431 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:12:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29ACatC091430 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:12:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091012.i29ACatC091430@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] ar exit code? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:12:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If ar is to create a new archive, but failed because of duplicate symbols, it exists with success; mk continues and it is hard to notice untill too late. Is it as it was intended? David From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 22:50:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 21:23:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8719 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 21:23:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8715 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 21:23:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 21:23:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4037219D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4231D19B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:23:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B13B419B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:22:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69D3219BBF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:22:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3748471-26033>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:21:26 -0500 Message-ID: <059e01c405d0$c393b430$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <404CD66A.EF449949@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:19:21 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Not as badly as Boyd, however! err, i beg to differ. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 22:50:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 21:36:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10110 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 21:36:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10106 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 21:36:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 21:36:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E4B219AC3; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:36:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A0F219D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:36:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5308519BBF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:35:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1604A19B79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:35:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <313317-8485>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:34:09 -0500 Message-ID: <05b901c405d2$88b4ae30$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403091012.i29ACatC091430@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ar exit code? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:32:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If ar is to create a new archive, but failed because of duplicate symbols, > it exists with success; mk continues and it is hard to notice untill too > late. > > Is it as it was intended? mk differs from make in that the whole block of commands is sent to rc, rather than forking a shell for each command. that might be the problem. From forsyth@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 9 22:50:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 21:38:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10217 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 21:38:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10213 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 21:38:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 21:38:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2963F19D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:38:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3084819D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:38:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DFE119C01; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:37:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C524819D13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:37:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ar exit code? From: C H Forsyth In-Reply-To: <05b901c405d2$88b4ae30$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ackdhtjvxhpfbtkeqmqdtikcjh" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:43:06 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ackdhtjvxhpfbtkeqmqdtikcjh Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit no, ar itself doesn't exit with error status if dupfound stops it from updating the archive. easy to fix, and it seems the right thing to me to change it. --upas-ackdhtjvxhpfbtkeqmqdtikcjh Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Mar 9 12:41:24 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3982519D46; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:36:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC4B919C01; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:36:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5308519BBF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:35:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1604A19B79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:35:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <313317-8485>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:34:09 -0500 Message-ID: <05b901c405d2$88b4ae30$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403091012.i29ACatC091430@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ar exit code? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:32:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If ar is to create a new archive, but failed because of duplicate symbols, > it exists with success; mk continues and it is hard to notice untill too > late. > > Is it as it was intended? mk differs from make in that the whole block of commands is sent to rc, rather than forking a shell for each command. that might be the problem. --upas-ackdhtjvxhpfbtkeqmqdtikcjh-- From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 9 22:50:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 21:47:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10994 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 21:47:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10990 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 21:47:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 21:47:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF82519D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DFC019D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:47:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9367619D47; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:46:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0087F19D13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 07:46:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 09 Mar 2004 12:44:09 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29EO9mI015951 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:24:12 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] v7 diff3 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:46:00 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, V7 diff3 ported to libc/bio in /n/sources/steve/diff3.tar.bz2 -Steve From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 9 22:50:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 22:11:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13144 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 22:11:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13139 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:11:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:11:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0968B19AC8; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2544E19BF1; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:11:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C62F19B8A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:10:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B24D119B1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:10:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <295177-23068>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:09:31 -0500 Message-ID: <061001c405d7$776d8430$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ar exit code? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:07:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > no, ar itself doesn't exit with error status if dupfound > stops it from updating the archive. easy to fix, and it > seems the right thing to me to change it. yup From ocio@mansiondelocio.com Tue Mar 9 22:50:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 22:37:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15073 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 22:37:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15069 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:37:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:37:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A10D19D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:37:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 946B319BB2; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:37:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2906219BF8; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:36:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from nombre-xhd5fc9s (8398-cm.able.es [212.97.183.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0229619B8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:36:17 -0500 (EST) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: ocio@mansiondelocio.com Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="--------wnvaclnskecpfhnvfasy" Subject: [9fans] Pricelist Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 14:36:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ----------wnvaclnskecpfhnvfasy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) Found virus WORM_BAGLE.C in file kukjfwxh.exe (in daddcbacba.zip) The uncleanable file daddcbacba.zip is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virLUyhEM. If you have questions, contact administrator. --------------------------------------------------------- ----------wnvaclnskecpfhnvfasy Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----------wnvaclnskecpfhnvfasy Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) daddcbacba.zip is removed from here because it contains a virus. --------------------------------------------------------- ----------wnvaclnskecpfhnvfasy-- From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 9 22:50:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 22:45:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15745 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 22:45:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15741 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:45:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:45:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E026419C6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:45:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99BBC19BF1; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:45:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D7A0D19BF8; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 203E219BB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:44:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4279d553bf7bac8dd7104530d52ecf71@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide In-Reply-To: <36c13887672c32979c9849347bc8d07a@google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pjypyiqdkhqzzdyritrcmchpzu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:44:34 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pjypyiqdkhqzzdyritrcmchpzu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fix now on sources. --upas-pjypyiqdkhqzzdyritrcmchpzu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 00:29:32 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 00:29:29 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B051319C0D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:29:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A5DF19D47; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:29:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 493A519D3B; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:28:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FDF619C69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 00:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from waakzaamheid (none@glenda.corp.google.com [172.24.64.198]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i295SkX6031971 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:28:46 -0800 Message-ID: <36c13887672c32979c9849347bc8d07a@google.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2004 21:28:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I tried 'Edit , | man 2 9p' in the tag of an acme window and got: > > panic: D2B called on non-block 11a8c8 (double-free?) > acme 1436: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aed5 this is kind of amazing. i was testing something for rsc and crashed acme. tracked it down, fixed it. it was a day 1 bug; amazing it had never happened. then i decided to track down your bug. turns out it's the same thing. amazing coincidence. here's the fix: r% yesterday -d /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c diff /n/dump/2004/0308/sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c 173c173 < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f->elog.q0 if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f->elog.nr+nr; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:49:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from antispam (localhost.web.am [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF2C661C30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:33 +0400 (AMT) Received: from localhost (localhost.web.am [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 6A78F61C28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:33 +0400 (AMT) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mx1.web.am (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2CE561C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:31 +0400 (AMT) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29DmU9S092287 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29DmUEd092286 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091348.i29DmUEd092286@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz/mk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hget http://www2.davidashen.net/graphviz-p9.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT cd graphviz-p9 mk mk BIN'='$home/bin/$objtype install to build the binaries, dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps page crazy.ps to visualize a graph. Thanks for friendy guidance. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 10 10:01:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 22:52:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16195 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 22:52:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16190 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:52:25 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:52:25 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 209A819D82; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:52:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8881619D71; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:52:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7824D19D47; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:51:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52FCD19BB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:51:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUB00TXSAD2KZ@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 08:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Tue, 09 Mar 2004 08:48:38 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 08:48:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Awesome! another thing, have you ever tried to "Get" a nil string(when you deleted the previous filename)? It's no biggie because I know to avoid the error, but it might be interesting nevertheless. Noah acme: text.load: 'Del' file does not exist acme 5965: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aecd acid: stk() abort()+0x0 /sys/src/libc/9sys/abort.c:6 error(s=0x4136c)+0x33 /sys/src/cmd/acme/util.c:55 textload(t=0x82648,file=0x99d68,q0=0x0,setqid=0x1)+0x2c /sys/src/cmd/acme/text.c:193 get(et=0x8256c,flag1=0x1,t=0x82648,argt=0x0,arg=0x833de,narg=0x0)+0x1fe /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:497 execute(t=0x8256c,aq0=0xc,aq1=0xc,external=0x0,argt=0x0)+0x1ec /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:190 mousethread()+0x49d /sys/src/cmd/acme/acme.c:550 launcher386(arg=0x0,f=0x2276)+0x10 /sys/src/libthread/386.c:10 0xfefefefe ?file?:0 ----- Original Message ----- From: "rob pike, esq." Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2004 0:28 am Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide > > I tried 'Edit , | man 2 9p' in the tag of an acme window and got: > > > > panic: D2B called on non-block 11a8c8 (double-free?) > > acme 1436: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aed5 > > this is kind of amazing. i was testing something for rsc and > crashed acme. > tracked it down, fixed it. it was a day 1 bug; amazing it had > never happened. > then i decided to track down your bug. turns out it's the same thing. > amazing coincidence. > > here's the fix: > > r% yesterday -d /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c > diff /n/dump/2004/0308/sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c > /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c173c173 > < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f- > >elog.q0 > if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f- > >elog.nr+nr > -rob > > From zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 22:56:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16395 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 22:56:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16391 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:56:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:56:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CF4919D7C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:56:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38B4619D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:56:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 474BF19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:55:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f96.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.96]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EAED19C69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 05:55:40 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.46 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 13:55:40 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.46] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Mar 2004 13:55:40.0791 (UTC) FILETIME=[35468870:01C405DE] Subject: [9fans] Plan9 questions and quarrel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 13:55:40 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Here're questions about the iPAQ version.. 1/ Does it support the CF Sleeve? (Compact Flash) 2/ How stable is it? 3/ Is it limited at all to what the x86 version can do? Or can it do exactly what you can do on a normal PC? Now, I have a Thinkpad R31, and I tried booting the Plan9 CD to start it but it gives me a kernel panic.. I can't exactly describe it just yet but it wouldn't even boot, it prompts me about the settings like resolution and such and I go with the default-- and then I get the panic. I hope that someone could help me with these questions and this quarrel, which I will go into detail soon. Thanks. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 From gdiaz@online.ie Wed Mar 10 10:01:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 23:12:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17323 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 23:12:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17319 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 23:12:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 23:12:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 97D4819D91; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:12:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB16719D87; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:12:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E36919D7D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:11:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.online.ie (mail.online.ie [213.159.130.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8224119D6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from web2.www.online.ie (eth4.web2.www.online.ie [10.10.4.33]) by mail.online.ie (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF88AA83D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:11:45 +0000 (GMT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by web2.www.online.ie with id i29EBjq02429 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:11:45 GMT Received: from 195.53.211.65 ( [195.53.211.65]) as user gdiaz@online.ie@mail.online.ie by mail.online.ie with HTTP; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:11:45 +0100 Message-ID: <1078841505.404dd0a1165df@mail.online.ie> From: gdiaz@online.ie To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan9 questions and quarrel References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1-cvs X-Originating-IP: 195.53.211.65 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:11:45 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello your panic is due (may be) to aux/vga. It does'nt have driver to your card. R31 have a radeon mobility isn't it? you need to patch your kernel with radeon support, search 9fans archives for radeon support. i hope that help you. PS: i haven't ipaq, but you should be able to run most of applications. > Here're questions about the iPAQ version.. > 1/ Does it support the CF Sleeve? (Compact Flash) > 2/ How stable is it? > 3/ Is it limited at all to what the x86 version can do? Or can it do exactly > > what you can do on a normal PC? > > Now, I have a Thinkpad R31, and I tried booting the Plan9 CD to start it but > > it gives me a kernel panic.. I can't exactly describe it just yet but it > wouldn't even boot, it prompts me about the settings like resolution and > such and I go with the default-- and then I get the panic. > I hope that someone could help me with these questions and this quarrel, > which I will go into detail soon. > Thanks. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 > > From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 23:15:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17568 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 23:15:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17563 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 23:15:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 23:15:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7AFAF19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:15:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDCA419D71; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:15:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E05DB19C6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:14:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F5C919D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:14:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6d6ceaeedeccf92df0e063ca84bce23a@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver In-Reply-To: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bdaswwphppkwfdovyhfnvaswhy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:14:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bdaswwphppkwfdovyhfnvaswhy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Wed Mar 3 11:35:53 EST 2004, lucho@ionkov.net wrote: > Hi, > > I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the > BIOS has panel information defined. I didn't test it for resolutions > different than the default for the display. I am attaching the two files > that are changed. You need the rest from > http://mapage.noos.fr/phillipe.anel/plan9rxxx.html. > > The driver does not support DFP panels, only LCD. I don't have DFP, so I > didn't bother to add support for something that I can't test. > > BTW, is there any reason for this driver to not be included in the distribution? It hasn't been added because, as far as I know, it hasn't been submitted. Perhaps a note on the license here. We don't consider anything a contribution unless you make it clear that something is. - If you email us a file or bug fixes to stick into the distribution we consider that clear intent. - if you actually say 'this is a contribution under the LPL' that's even better. I'ld prefer to see that in stuff that's genuinely new. Anything you write yourself you can release under as many licenses as you like. We are making a leap of faith that the code isn't ripped off from something released under another license (like the GPL). We do generally look at things and try to ascertain that but, not having seen all gnu code, we could miss things. If something is covered by another license, that's OK, but we'ld want to keep it separate in any distribution we do and add that license to its directory. If it passes our somewhat questionable taste, we'll stick it in the distribution. If it doesn't people are still free to call it a contribution (or not) and distribute it from some other site. At the moment 'we' comprises rsc, presotto, and jmk. --upas-bdaswwphppkwfdovyhfnvaswhy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:44 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:25 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA97419F1B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3871F19ECD; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:35:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F83719C3B; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C38119EAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <200403031634280130058dkbe>; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:34:29 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id E4CAF4622BF; Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6" Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Hi, I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the BIOS has panel information defined. I didn't test it for resolutions different than the default for the display. I am attaching the two files that are changed. You need the rest from http://mapage.noos.fr/phillipe.anel/plan9rxxx.html. The driver does not support DFP panels, only LCD. I don't have DFP, so I didn't bother to add support for something that I can't test. BTW, is there any reason for this driver to not be included in the distribution? Thanks, Lucho --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="radeon.c" #include #include #include #include "pci.h" #include "vga.h" #include "radeon.h" #include "radeon_pciids.h" static int debug = 0; #define DBGPRINT if (debug) print /* *********************************************** */ enum { Kilo = 1024, Mega = (Kilo*Kilo), }; enum { DISPLAY_NONE, DISPLAY_CRT, DISPLAY_FP, DISPLAY_LCD, }; /* *********************************************** */ typedef struct Radeon Radeon; struct Radeon { ulong mmio; Pcidev* pci; uchar* bios; ulong fbsize; int display_type; ulong ovr_clr; ulong ovr_wid_top_bottom; ulong ovr_wid_left_right; ulong ov0_scale_cntl; ulong subpic_cntl; ulong viph_control; ulong i2c_cntl_1; ulong rbbm_soft_reset; ulong cap0_trig_cntl; ulong cap1_trig_cntl; ulong gen_int_cntl; ulong bus_cntl; ulong crtc_gen_cntl; ulong crtc_ext_cntl; ulong dac_cntl; ulong crtc_h_total_disp; ulong crtc_h_sync_strt_wid; ulong crtc_v_total_disp; ulong crtc_v_sync_strt_wid; ulong crtc_pitch; ulong crtc_offset; ulong crtc_offset_cntl; ulong htotal_cntl; ulong surface_cntl; int type; ulong fp_horz_stretch; ulong fp_vert_stretch; ulong fp_crtc_h_total_disp; ulong fp_crtc_v_total_disp; ulong fp_h_sync_strt_wid; ulong fp_v_sync_strt_wid; ulong fp_gen_cntl; ulong lvds_gen_cntl; // inited from rom ushort reference_freq, reference_div, xclk; ulong max_pll_freq, min_pll_freq; ulong pll_output_freq; ulong feedback_div; ulong dot_clock_freq; ulong post_div; ulong ppll_ref_div; ulong ppll_div_3; // panel info int xres, yres; int valid; int clock; int hOver_plus, hSync_width, hblank; int vOver_plus, vSync_width, vblank; int pwr_delay; int use_bios_dividers; int ref_divider; int post_divider; int fbk_divider; int hAct_high, vAct_high; }; /* from io.c */ extern char* readbios(long len, long offset); /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon300_workaround(Radeon* radeon); static void radeon_get_bios_panel_info(Radeon* radeon); static void OUTREG8(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, uchar val) { ((uchar*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0] = val; } static void OUTREG(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val) { ((ulong*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0] = val; } static ulong INREG(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset) { ulong data; data = ((ulong*) (radeon->mmio + offset))[0]; return data; } static void OUTREGP(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val, ulong mask) { ulong tmp; tmp = INREG(radeon, offset); tmp &= mask; tmp |= val; OUTREG(radeon, offset, tmp); } static void OUTPLL(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val) { uchar tmp; tmp = (offset & 0x3f) | RADEON_PLL_WR_EN; OUTREG8(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, tmp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA, val); } static ulong INPLL(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset) { ulong data; OUTREG8(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, offset & 0x3f); data = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA); if (radeon->type & ATI_R300) radeon300_workaround(radeon); return data; } static void OUTPLLP(Radeon* radeon, ulong offset, ulong val, ulong mask) { ulong tmp; tmp = INPLL(radeon, offset); tmp &= mask; tmp |= val; OUTPLL(radeon, offset, tmp); } static void radeon300_workaround(Radeon* radeon) { ulong save, tmp; save = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX); tmp = save & ~(0x3f | RADEON_PLL_WR_EN); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, tmp); tmp = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_DATA); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, save); USED(tmp); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_getbiosparams(Radeon* radeon) { ushort offset; ulong addr; uchar* bios; ushort pib; radeon->bios = nil; addr = 0xC0000; bios = (uchar*)readbios(0x10000, addr); if (bios[0] != 0x55 || bios[1] != 0xAA) { addr = 0xE0000; bios = (uchar*)readbios(0x10000, addr); if (bios[0] != 0x55 || bios[1] != 0xAA) { print("radeon: bios not found\n"); return; } } radeon->bios = bios; offset = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, RADEON_BIOS_START); pib = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, offset+0x30); radeon->reference_freq = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x0e); radeon->reference_div = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x10); radeon->min_pll_freq = RADEON_BIOS32(radeon, pib+0x12); radeon->max_pll_freq = RADEON_BIOS32(radeon, pib+0x16); radeon->xclk = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, pib+0x08); DBGPRINT("radeon: bios=0x%08ulx offset=0x%ux\n", addr, offset); DBGPRINT("radeon: pll_info_block: 0x%ux\n", pib); DBGPRINT("radeon: reference_freq: %ud\n", radeon->reference_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: reference_div: %ud\n", radeon->reference_div); DBGPRINT("radeon: min_pll_freq: %uld\n", radeon->min_pll_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: max_pll_freq: %uld\n", radeon->max_pll_freq); DBGPRINT("radeon: xclk: %ud\n", radeon->xclk); if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_LCD) { radeon_get_bios_panel_info(radeon); } } static void radeon_get_bios_panel_info(Radeon* radeon) { int fp_bios_start = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, 0x48); int fpofs = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fp_bios_start + 0x40); int i; if (!fpofs) { radeon->xres = radeon->yres = 0; return; } radeon->xres = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 25); radeon->yres = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 27); radeon->pwr_delay = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 44); if (radeon->pwr_delay>2000 || radeon->pwr_delay<=0) { radeon->pwr_delay = 2000; } radeon->ref_divider = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 46); radeon->post_divider = RADEON_BIOS8(radeon, fpofs + 48); radeon->fbk_divider = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 49); if (radeon->ref_divider != 0 && radeon->fbk_divider > 3) { radeon->use_bios_dividers = 1; } DBGPRINT("radeon: panel size: %dx%d\n", radeon->xres, radeon->yres); DBGPRINT("radeon: power delay: %d\n", radeon->pwr_delay); for(i = 0; i < 32; i++) { int x, y; int ofs = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, fpofs + 64 + i * 2); if (ofs == 0) { break; } x = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs); y = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs + 2); if (x==radeon->xres && y==radeon->yres) { radeon->hblank = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+17) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs + 19)) * 8; radeon->hOver_plus = ((RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+21) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+19) -1) * 8) & 0x7FFF; radeon->hSync_width = RADEON_BIOS8(radeon, ofs+23) * 8; radeon->vblank = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+24) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+26); radeon->vOver_plus = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+28) & 0x7ff) - RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+26); radeon->vSync_width = (RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+28) & 0xf800) >> 11; radeon->clock = RADEON_BIOS16(radeon, ofs+9); radeon->hAct_high = 1; radeon->vAct_high = 1; return; } } radeon->xres = radeon->yres = 0; } /* *********************************************** */ static Pcidev* radeonpci(int* type) { static Pcidev *p = nil; struct pciids *ids; if (p != nil) return p; DBGPRINT("radeon: ATI Technologies Inc. " "Radeon [789]xxx drivers (v0.1)\n"); p = pcimatch(nil, ATI_PCIVID, 0); if (p == nil) return nil; for (ids = radeon_pciids; ids->did; ids++) { if (ids->did == p->did) { DBGPRINT("radeon: Found %s\n", ids->name); DBGPRINT("radeon: did:%04ux rid:%02ux\n", p->did, p->rid); if (type) *type = ids->type; return p; } } DBGPRINT("radeon: not found!\n"); return p = nil; } /* *********************************************** */ static void vga_disable(Vga* vga) { Ctlr* c; for(c = vga->link; c; c = c->link) if (strncmp(c->name, "vga", 3) == 0) { c->load = nil; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_snarf(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon *radeon; Pcidev *p; ulong mmio, tmp; int type; if (vga->private == nil) { vga_disable(vga); vga->private = alloc(sizeof(Radeon)); radeon = vga->private; p = radeonpci(&type); if (p == nil) error("%s: not found\n", ctlr->name); vgactlw("type", ctlr->name); mmio = segattach(0, "radeonmmio", 0, p->mem[2].size); if (mmio == ~0) error("%s: can't attach mmio segment\n", ctlr->name); DBGPRINT("radeon: mmio address: 0x%08ulx [size=0x%x]\n", mmio, p->mem[2].size); radeon->pci = p; radeon->type = type; radeon->mmio = mmio; } radeon = vga->private; radeon->fbsize = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CONFIG_MEMSIZE); vga->vmz = radeon->fbsize; DBGPRINT("radeon: frame buffer size=%uld [%uldMB]\n", radeon->fbsize, radeon->fbsize/Mega); tmp = INREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL); if (tmp & RADEON_FP_EN_TMDS) radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_FP; if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_NONE && radeon->type > ATI_MOBILITY) { if (INREG(radeon, RADEON_BIOS_4_SCRATCH) & 4 || INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL) & RADEON_LVDS_ON) { radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_LCD; } } if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_NONE) { radeon->display_type = DISPLAY_CRT; } DBGPRINT("radeon: display type: %d\n", radeon->display_type); radeon_getbiosparams(radeon); radeon->bus_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_BUS_CNTL); DBGPRINT("radeon: PPLL_CNTL=0x%08ulx\n", INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL)); if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT && radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_LCD) error("unsupported FP Display\n"); if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_LCD && radeon->xres == 0) { error("cannot find panel information\n"); } ctlr->flag |= Fsnarf; } /* *********************************************** */ static void options(Vga*, Ctlr* ctlr) { ctlr->flag |= Hlinear|Foptions; } /* *********************************************** */ static int radeondiv(int n, int d) { return (n + (d / 2)) / d; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_common_registers(Radeon* radeon) { radeon->ovr_clr = 0; radeon->ovr_wid_left_right = 0; radeon->ovr_wid_top_bottom = 0; radeon->ov0_scale_cntl = 0; radeon->subpic_cntl = 0; radeon->viph_control = 0; radeon->i2c_cntl_1 = 0; radeon->rbbm_soft_reset = 0; radeon->cap0_trig_cntl = 0; radeon->cap1_trig_cntl = 0; if (radeon->bus_cntl & RADEON_BUS_READ_BURST) radeon->bus_cntl |= RADEON_BUS_RD_DISCARD_EN; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_crtc_registers(Radeon* radeon, Mode* mode) { int format, dac6bit; int hsync_wid, vsync_wid; int hsync_start; int hTotal, hSyncStart, hSyncEnd, h_sync_pol; int vTotal, vSyncStart, vSyncEnd, v_sync_pol; int hsync_fudge, bpp; int hsync_fudge_crt[] = { 0x00, 0x12, 0x09, 0x09, 0x06, 0x05 }; int hsync_fudge_fp[] = { 2, 2, 0, 0, 5, 5, }; format = 0; bpp = 0; dac6bit = 0; switch (mode->z) { case 6: format = 2; dac6bit = 1; bpp = 8; break; case 8: format = 2; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 8; break; case 15: format = 3; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 16; break; case 16: format = 4; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 16; break; case 24: format = 5; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 24; break; case 32: format = 6; dac6bit = 0; bpp = 32; break; default: error("radeon: unsupported mode depth %d\n", mode->z); } if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { hsync_fudge = hsync_fudge_crt[format - 1]; } else { hsync_fudge = hsync_fudge_fp[format - 1]; } DBGPRINT("mode->z = %d (format = %d, bpp = %d, dac6bit = %s)\n", mode->z, format, bpp, dac6bit ? "true" : "false"); radeon->crtc_gen_cntl = RADEON_CRTC_EN | RADEON_CRTC_EXT_DISP_EN | (format << 8); radeon->crtc_ext_cntl = RADEON_VGA_ATI_LINEAR | RADEON_XCRT_CNT_EN; if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon->crtc_ext_cntl |= RADEON_CRTC_CRT_ON; radeon->crtc_gen_cntl |= mode->interlace ? RADEON_CRTC_INTERLACE_EN : 0; } else { radeon->crtc_gen_cntl &= ~(RADEON_CRTC_DBL_SCAN_EN | RADEON_CRTC_INTERLACE_EN); } radeon->dac_cntl = RADEON_DAC_MASK_ALL | RADEON_DAC_VGA_ADR_EN | (dac6bit ? 0 : RADEON_DAC_8BIT_EN); // ----------------------------------------------------------- if (radeon->display_type == DISPLAY_CRT) { hTotal = mode->ht; hSyncStart = mode->shb; hSyncEnd = mode->ehb; h_sync_pol = mode->hsync; vTotal = mode->vt; vSyncStart = mode->vrs; vSyncEnd = mode->vre; v_sync_pol = mode->vsync; } else { hTotal = mode->x + radeon->hblank; hSyncStart = mode->x + radeon->hOver_plus; hSyncEnd = mode->x + radeon->hSync_width; h_sync_pol = !radeon->hAct_high; vTotal = mode->y + radeon->vblank; vSyncStart = mode->y + radeon->vOver_plus; vSyncEnd = mode->y + radeon->vSync_width; v_sync_pol = !radeon->vAct_high; mode->frequency = radeon->clock; // hack } radeon->crtc_h_total_disp = ((((hTotal / 8) - 1) & 0x3ff) | ((((mode->x / 8) - 1) & 0x1ff) << 16)); hsync_wid = (hSyncEnd - hSyncStart) / 8; if (! hsync_wid) hsync_wid = 1; if (hsync_wid > 0x3F) hsync_wid = 0x3F; hsync_start = hSyncStart - 8 + hsync_fudge; DBGPRINT("hsync_start=%d hsync_wid=%d hsync_fudge=%d\n", hsync_start, hsync_wid, hsync_fudge); radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid = ( (hsync_start & 0x1fff) | ((hsync_wid & 0x3f) << 16) | (h_sync_pol ? RADEON_CRTC_H_SYNC_POL : 0)); // ----------------------------------------------------------- radeon->crtc_v_total_disp = (((vTotal - 1) & 0xffff) | ((mode->y - 1) << 16)); vsync_wid = vSyncEnd - vSyncStart; if (! vsync_wid) vsync_wid = 1; radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid = ( ((mode->vrs - 1) & 0xfff) | ((vsync_wid & 0x1f) << 16) | (v_sync_pol ? RADEON_CRTC_V_SYNC_POL : 0)); // ----------------------------------------------------------- radeon->crtc_offset = 0; radeon->crtc_offset_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET_CNTL); radeon->crtc_pitch = ((mode->x * bpp) + ((bpp * 8) - 1)) / (bpp * 8); radeon->crtc_pitch |= radeon->crtc_pitch << 16; } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init_pll_registers(Radeon* radeon, ulong freq) { struct { int divider; int bitvalue; } *post_div, post_divs[] = { { 1, 0 }, { 2, 1 }, { 4, 2 }, { 8, 3 }, { 3, 4 }, { 16, 5 }, { 6, 6 }, { 12, 7 }, { 0, 0 } }; DBGPRINT("radeon: initpll: freq=%uld\n", freq); if (freq > radeon->max_pll_freq) freq = radeon->max_pll_freq; if (freq * 12 < radeon->min_pll_freq) freq = radeon->min_pll_freq / 12; for (post_div = &post_divs[0]; post_div->divider; ++post_div) { radeon->pll_output_freq = post_div->divider * freq; if (radeon->pll_output_freq >= radeon->min_pll_freq && radeon->pll_output_freq <= radeon->max_pll_freq) break; } radeon->dot_clock_freq = freq; radeon->feedback_div = radeondiv(radeon->reference_div * radeon->pll_output_freq, radeon->reference_freq); radeon->post_div = post_div->divider; DBGPRINT("dc=%uld, of=%uld, fd=%uld, pd=%uld\n", radeon->dot_clock_freq, radeon->pll_output_freq, radeon->feedback_div, radeon->post_div); if (radeon->use_bios_dividers) { radeon->ppll_ref_div = radeon->ref_divider; radeon->ppll_div_3 = radeon->fbk_divider | (radeon->post_divider << 16); } else { radeon->ppll_ref_div = radeon->reference_div; radeon->ppll_div_3 = (radeon->feedback_div | (post_div->bitvalue << 16)); } radeon->htotal_cntl = 0; radeon->surface_cntl = 0; } static void radeon_init_fp_registers(Radeon* radeon, Mode* mode) { int x = mode->x; int y = mode->y; if (x > radeon->xres) { x = radeon->xres; } if (y > radeon->yres) { y = radeon->yres; } radeon->fp_horz_stretch = ((radeon->xres - 1) / 8) << RADEON_HORZ_PANEL_SHIFT; radeon->fp_vert_stretch = (radeon->yres - 1) << RADEON_VERT_PANEL_SHIFT; if (x != radeon->xres) { unsigned int hRatio = radeondiv(x * RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_RATIO_MAX, radeon->xres); radeon->fp_horz_stretch = (((((unsigned long)hRatio) & RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_RATIO_MASK)) | (radeon->fp_horz_stretch & (RADEON_HORZ_PANEL_SIZE | RADEON_HORZ_FP_LOOP_STRETCH | RADEON_HORZ_AUTO_RATIO_INC))); radeon->fp_horz_stretch |= (RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_BLEND | RADEON_HORZ_STRETCH_ENABLE); } radeon->fp_horz_stretch &= ~RADEON_HORZ_AUTO_RATIO; if (y != radeon->yres) { unsigned int vRatio = radeondiv(y * RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RATIO_MAX, radeon->yres); radeon->fp_vert_stretch = (((((unsigned long)vRatio) & RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RATIO_MASK)) | (radeon->fp_vert_stretch & (RADEON_VERT_PANEL_SIZE | RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_RESERVED))); radeon->fp_vert_stretch |= (RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_BLEND | RADEON_VERT_STRETCH_ENABLE); } radeon->fp_vert_stretch &= ~RADEON_VERT_AUTO_RATIO_EN; radeon->fp_crtc_h_total_disp = (((radeon->hblank / 8) & 0x3ff) | (((x / 8) - 1) << 16)); radeon->fp_crtc_v_total_disp = (radeon->vblank & 0xffff) | ((y - 1) << 16); radeon->fp_h_sync_strt_wid = radeon->hOver_plus & 0x1fff | (radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid & (~ 0x1fff)); radeon->fp_v_sync_strt_wid = ((radeon->vOver_plus & 0xfff) | (radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid & (0xfff))); radeon->fp_gen_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL) & ~(RADEON_FP_SEL_CRTC2 | RADEON_FP_RMX_HVSYNC_CONTROL_EN | RADEON_FP_DFP_SYNC_SEL | RADEON_FP_CRT_SYNC_SEL | RADEON_FP_CRTC_LOCK_8DOT | RADEON_FP_USE_SHADOW_EN | RADEON_FP_CRTC_USE_SHADOW_VEND | RADEON_FP_CRT_SYNC_ALT); radeon->fp_gen_cntl |= (RADEON_FP_CRTC_DONT_SHADOW_VPAR | RADEON_FP_CRTC_DONT_SHADOW_HEND); radeon->fp_gen_cntl &= ~(RADEON_FP_FPON | RADEON_FP_TMDS_EN); radeon->lvds_gen_cntl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL) | (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_init(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon* radeon; Mode* mode; radeon = vga->private; mode = vga->mode; DBGPRINT("radeon: monitor type = '%s'\n", mode->type); DBGPRINT("radeon: size = '%s'\n", mode->size); DBGPRINT("radeon: chan = '%s'\n", mode->chan); DBGPRINT("radeon: freq=%d deffreq=%d x=%d y=%d z=%d\n", mode->frequency, mode->deffrequency, mode->x, mode->y, mode->z); DBGPRINT("radeon: ht=%d shb=%d ehb=%d shs=%d ehs=%d hsync='%c'\n", mode->ht, mode->shb, mode->ehb, mode->shs, mode->ehs, mode->hsync ? mode->hsync : ' '); DBGPRINT("radeon: vt=%d vrs=%d vre=%d vsync='%c'\n", mode->vt, mode->vrs, mode->vre, mode->vsync ? mode->vsync : ' '); radeon_init_common_registers(radeon); radeon_init_crtc_registers(radeon, mode); if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon_init_fp_registers(radeon, mode); } radeon_init_pll_registers(radeon, mode->frequency / 10000); ctlr->flag |= (Finit|Ulinear); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_blank(Radeon* radeon) { switch (radeon->display_type) { case DISPLAY_LCD: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS, ~RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS); case DISPLAY_CRT: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS, ~(RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS)); break; } } static void radeon_unblank(Radeon* radeon) { switch (radeon->display_type) { case DISPLAY_LCD: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, 0, ~RADEON_LVDS_DISPLAY_DIS); case DISPLAY_CRT: OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, RADEON_CRTC_CRT_ON, ~(RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS)); break; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_common_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_CLR, radeon->ovr_clr); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_WID_LEFT_RIGHT, radeon->ovr_wid_left_right); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OVR_WID_TOP_BOTTOM, radeon->ovr_wid_top_bottom); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_OV0_SCALE_CNTL, radeon->ov0_scale_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_SUBPIC_CNTL, radeon->subpic_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_VIPH_CONTROL, radeon->viph_control); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_I2C_CNTL_1, radeon->i2c_cntl_1); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_GEN_INT_CNTL, radeon->gen_int_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CAP0_TRIG_CNTL, radeon->cap0_trig_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CAP1_TRIG_CNTL, radeon->cap1_trig_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_BUS_CNTL, radeon->bus_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_SURFACE_CNTL, radeon->surface_cntl); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_crtc_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_GEN_CNTL, radeon->crtc_gen_cntl); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_EXT_CNTL, radeon->crtc_ext_cntl, ~(RADEON_CRTC_VSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_HSYNC_DIS | RADEON_CRTC_DISPLAY_DIS)); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_DAC_CNTL, radeon->dac_cntl, RADEON_DAC_RANGE_CNTL | RADEON_DAC_BLANKING); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_H_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->crtc_h_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_H_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->crtc_h_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_V_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->crtc_v_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_V_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->crtc_v_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET, radeon->crtc_offset); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_OFFSET_CNTL, radeon->crtc_offset_cntl); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_CRTC_PITCH, radeon->crtc_pitch); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_pllwaitupd(Radeon* radeon) { int i; for (i = 0; i < 10000; i++) { ulong pllreg; pllreg = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV); if ((pllreg & RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_R) == 0) break; } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_pllwriteupd(Radeon* radeon) { while (1) { ulong pllreg; pllreg = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV); if ((pllreg & RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_R) == 0) break; } OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_W, ~RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_W); } static void radeon_load_fp_registers(Radeon* radeon) { unsigned long lctl; OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_CRTC_H_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->fp_crtc_h_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_CRTC_V_TOTAL_DISP, radeon->fp_crtc_v_total_disp); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_H_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->fp_h_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_V_SYNC_STRT_WID, radeon->fp_v_sync_strt_wid); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_HORZ_STRETCH, radeon->fp_horz_stretch); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_VERT_STRETCH, radeon->fp_vert_stretch); OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_FP_GEN_CNTL, radeon->fp_gen_cntl); lctl = INREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL); if ((lctl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON)) == (radeon->lvds_gen_cntl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON))) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl); } else { unsigned long pctl = INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL, 0, ~RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL); if (! (lctl & (RADEON_LVDS_ON | RADEON_LVDS_BLON))) { OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl | RADEON_LVDS_BLON); } sleep(radeon->pwr_delay); // ms OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_LVDS_GEN_CNTL, radeon->lvds_gen_cntl); if (pctl) { OUTPLL(radeon, RADEON_PIXCLKS_CNTL, pctl); } } } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load_pll_registers(Radeon* radeon) { OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_VCLK_ECP_CNTL, RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_CPUCLK, ~RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_MASK); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL, RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN, ~(RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN)); OUTREGP(radeon, RADEON_CLOCK_CNTL_INDEX, RADEON_PLL_DIV_SEL, ~RADEON_PLL_DIV_SEL); if (radeon->type & ATI_R300) { DBGPRINT("r300_workaround\n"); if (radeon->ppll_ref_div & R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_MASK) { /* When restoring console mode, use saved PPLL_REF_DIV * setting. */ OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, radeon->ppll_ref_div, 0); } else { /* R300 uses ref_div_acc field as real ref divider */ OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, (radeon->ppll_ref_div << R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_SHIFT), ~R300_PPLL_REF_DIV_ACC_MASK); } } else { OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV, radeon->ppll_ref_div, ~RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV_MASK); } OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_DIV_3, radeon->ppll_div_3, ~RADEON_PPLL_FB3_DIV_MASK); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_DIV_3, radeon->ppll_div_3, ~RADEON_PPLL_POST3_DIV_MASK); radeon_pllwriteupd(radeon); radeon_pllwaitupd(radeon); OUTPLL(radeon, RADEON_HTOTAL_CNTL, radeon->htotal_cntl); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL, 0, ~(RADEON_PPLL_RESET | RADEON_PPLL_SLEEP | RADEON_PPLL_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN | RADEON_PPLL_VGA_ATOMIC_UPDATE_EN)); if (debug) { Bprint(&stdout, "Wrote: 0x%08ulx 0x%08ulx 0x%08ulx (0x%08ulx)\n", radeon->ppll_ref_div, radeon->ppll_div_3, radeon->htotal_cntl, INPLL(radeon, RADEON_PPLL_CNTL)); Bprint(&stdout, "Wrote: rd=%uld, fd=%uld, pd=%uld\n", radeon->ppll_ref_div & RADEON_PPLL_REF_DIV_MASK, radeon->ppll_div_3 & RADEON_PPLL_FB3_DIV_MASK, (radeon->ppll_div_3 & RADEON_PPLL_POST3_DIV_MASK) >> 16); } /* Let the clock to lock */ sleep(5); OUTPLLP(radeon, RADEON_VCLK_ECP_CNTL, RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_PPLLCLK, ~RADEON_VCLK_SRC_SEL_MASK); } /* *********************************************** */ static void radeon_load(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon* radeon; radeon = (Radeon*) vga->private; radeon_blank(radeon); radeon_load_common_registers(radeon); radeon_load_crtc_registers(radeon); // if (radeon->display_type != DISPLAY_CRT) { radeon_load_fp_registers(radeon); // } radeon_load_pll_registers(radeon); radeon_unblank(radeon); // init palette [gamma] if (vga->mode->z > 8) { int i; OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_PALETTE_INDEX, 0); for (i = 0; i < 256; i++) OUTREG(radeon, RADEON_PALETTE_DATA, (i<<16)|(i<<8)|i); } ctlr->flag |= Fload; } /* *********************************************** */ static void dump(Vga* vga, Ctlr* ctlr) { Radeon * radeon; USED(ctlr); radeon = (Radeon*) vga->private; USED(radeon); } /* *********************************************** */ Ctlr radeon = { "radeon", /* name */ radeon_snarf, /* snarf */ options, /* options */ radeon_init, /* init */ radeon_load, /* load */ dump, /* dump */ }; /* *********************************************** */ Ctlr radeonhwgc = { "radeonhwgc", /* name */ 0, /* snarf */ 0, /* options */ 0, /* init */ 0, /* load */ 0, /* dump */ }; --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="radeon_pciids.h" // ATI Technologies Inc #define ATI_PCIVID 0x1002 struct pciids { ushort did; int type; char* name; }; enum { ATI_R300, ATI_RV250, ATI_R250, ATI_RV200, ATI_R200, ATI_RV100, ATI_R100, ATI_MOBILITY, ATI_M6, ATI_M7, ATI_M9, }; struct pciids radeon_pciids[] = { // ATI_M6, LY // ATI_M6, LZ 0x4c57, ATI_M7, "Radeon Mobility M7 LW [Radeon Mobility 7500]", 0x4c58, ATI_M7, "Radeon RV200 LX [Mobility FireGL 7800 M7]", 0x4c59, ATI_M6, "Radeon Mobility M6 LY", 0x4c64, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Ld [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c65, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Le [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c66, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Lf [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x4c67, ATI_M9, "Radeon R250 Lg [Radeon Mobility 9000 M9]", 0x5159, ATI_RV100, "Radeon RV100 QY [Radeon 7000/VE]", 0x515a, ATI_RV100, "Radeon RV100 QZ [Radeon 7000/VE]", 0x5144, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QD [Radeon 7200]", 0x5145, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QE", 0x5146, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QF", 0x5147, ATI_R100, "Radeon R100 QG", 0x5148, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QH [Radeon 8500]", 0x5149, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QI", 0x514a, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QJ", 0x514b, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QK", 0x514c, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QL [Radeon 8500 LE]", 0x514d, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QM [Radeon 9100]", 0x514e, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QN [Radeon 8500LE]", 0x514f, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 QO [Radeon 8500LE]", 0x5168, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qh", 0x5169, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qi", 0x516a, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qj", 0x516b, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Qk", 0x516c, ATI_R200, "Radeon R200 Ql", 0x5157, ATI_RV200, "Radeon RV200 QW [Radeon 7500]", 0x5158, ATI_RV200, "Radeon RV200 QX [Radeon 7500]", 0x4964, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Id [Radeon 9000]", 0x4965, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Ie [Radeon 9000]", 0x4966, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 If [Radeon 9000]", 0x4967, ATI_RV250, "Radeon R250 Ig [Radeon 9000]", 0x4144, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AD [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4145, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AE [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4146, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AF [Radeon 9500 Pro]", 0x4147, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 AG [FireGL Z1/X1]", 0x4e44, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 ND [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e45, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NE [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e46, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NF [Radeon 9700]", 0x4e47, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 NG [FireGL X1]", 0x4e64, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700 Pro] (Secondary)", 0x4e65, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700] (Secondary)", 0x4e66, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [Radeon 9700] (Secondary)", 0x4e67, ATI_R300, "Radeon R300 [FireGL X1] (Secondary)", 0 }; --IJpNTDwzlM2Ie8A6-- --upas-bdaswwphppkwfdovyhfnvaswhy-- From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 23:34:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18604 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 23:34:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18596 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 23:34:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 23:34:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E042419D84; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:34:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 78C3D19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:34:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AA4F19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:33:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC6B4199D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:33:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUB0158GCG28E@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:37 -0500 From: Noah Evans To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw)" Content-language: en X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] Re: Licenses Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline On the subject of licenses, where does idiom end and code copying begin? Looking through Plan 9 sources there are very distinct idioms that run through all the code(common arguments to ARGBEGIN and common function like emalloc spring to mind). To what extent can you use the conventions and helper functions of Plan 9 code(or GPL'ed code) without needing to consider licensing issues? Noah --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw) Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:44 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:25 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA97419F1B; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3871F19ECD; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:35:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F83719C3B; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C38119EAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <200403031634280130058dkbe>; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 16:34:29 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id E4CAF4622BF; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 From: Latchesar Ionkov Subject: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA)" Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> --Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Hi, I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the BIOS has panel information defined. I didn't test it for resolutions different than the default for the display. I am attaching the two files that are changed. You need the rest from http://mapage.noos.fr/phillipe.anel/plan9rxxx.html. The driver does not support DFP panels, only LCD. I don't have DFP, so I didn't bother to add support for something that I can't test. BTW, is there any reason for this driver to not be included in the distribution? Thanks, Lucho --Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA)-- --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw)-- From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 23:37:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18772 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 23:37:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18767 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 23:37:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 23:37:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFA4619D87; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:37:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0827619D7D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:37:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75D4319D7C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 662EA19D75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:35:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan9 questions and quarrel From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:35:46 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Here're questions about the iPAQ version.. > 1/ Does it support the CF Sleeve? (Compact Flash) Not that I know. Some of us used it with a pcmcia backpack. > 2/ How stable is it? It was stable the last time I used, but don't know today. > 3/ Is it limited at all to what the x86 version can do? Or can it do exactly > what you can do on a normal PC? I could do (almost) anything I could do with the PC. If you decide to try it out, drop a line if you need help. From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 9 23:54:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19780 invoked by uid 1020); 9 Mar 2004 23:54:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19776 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 23:54:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 23:54:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94E4B19D91; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:54:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E2B819D7C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:54:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E0DB19D60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:53:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB6B619A40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:53:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5e9a14eee7e26c4fbebf07d8175e55c8@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: Licenses In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mrveoqykcifqmahfylmnskezlt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:53:02 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mrveoqykcifqmahfylmnskezlt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To a certain extent the SCO suit will provide hard guidance if it doesn't just disappear in a puff of smoke. We (and I believe Linus) has taken the view that .h's and by implication interfaces are exportable without the license. That way, you can build a look/feel alike. Also, I've seen details about hardware come from and go to other OSs via code reading to the extent that the same misunderstandings about how the hardware works is shared by us, BSD, and Linux. As an instance of 'we would probably get mad' is if any major piece of Plan 9 (devmnt.c comes to mind) should appear in another OS without a compatible license. --upas-mrveoqykcifqmahfylmnskezlt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 09:34:40 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 09:34:36 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 34AE119D89; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:34:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6734019D75; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:34:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AA4F19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:33:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC6B4199D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:33:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUB0158GCG28E@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:37 -0500 From: Noah Evans To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw)" Content-language: en X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Subject: [9fans] Re: Licenses Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 09:33:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline On the subject of licenses, where does idiom end and code copying begin? Looking through Plan 9 sources there are very distinct idioms that run through all the code(common arguments to ARGBEGIN and common function like emalloc spring to mind). To what extent can you use the conventions and helper functions of Plan 9 code(or GPL'ed code) without needing to consider licensing issues? Noah --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw) Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:44 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 3 11:35:25 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA97419F1B; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:35:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3871F19ECD; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:35:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F83719C3B; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C38119EAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <200403031634280130058dkbe>; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 16:34:29 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id E4CAF4622BF; Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 11:34:32 -0500 From: Latchesar Ionkov Subject: [9fans] Support for LCD screens for the Radeon driver Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <20040303163432.GA14994@ionkov.net> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA)" Content-disposition: inline Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=UPPERCASE_25_50 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> --Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline Hi, I added support for LCD screens in the Radeon driver. It only works if the BIOS has panel information defined. I didn't test it for resolutions different than the default for the display. I am attaching the two files that are changed. You need the rest from http://mapage.noos.fr/phillipe.anel/plan9rxxx.html. The driver does not support DFP panels, only LCD. I don't have DFP, so I didn't bother to add support for something that I can't test. BTW, is there any reason for this driver to not be included in the distribution? Thanks, Lucho --Boundary_(ID_e0+mopB9rJbFkVMtfZlJSA)-- --Boundary_(ID_TEiJBmhaszDJQEQTD2BzNw)-- --upas-mrveoqykcifqmahfylmnskezlt-- From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 00:09:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21453 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 00:09:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21449 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 00:09:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 00:09:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 85FB419D76; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:09:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D97819B84; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:09:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5EE5919B3F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF55919BD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:08:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i29F8MCi017804 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:08:22 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i29F8NfO020273 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:08:23 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i29F8NJ28205 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:08:23 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403091508.i29F8NJ28205@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions (was: Plan 9 questions and quarrel) In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Mar 2004 15:35:46 +0100." References: From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 16:08:23 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Here're questions about the iPAQ version.. > > 1/ Does it support the CF Sleeve? (Compact Flash) > Not that I know. Some of us used it with a pcmcia backpack. For what it is worth: I succeeded to lift linux (I think: actually, bootloader) code to make the already existing (single) pcmcia sleeve code work (more or less, yes, this is vague) with a double-slot pcmcia sleeve. Maybe it is possible to do something similar for the CF Sleeve. W.r.t. stability: for me it was (is) stable, but suspend/resume does not work. Others had more success in this respect; could be related to different versions of bootloader being used, I don't recall seeing that this was explored 'to the bottom'. A somewhat related question: Is the support for pcmcia disks only in the ipaq (bitsy) kernel, or also in the pc one? (I tried over a year ago, and then it worked on ipaq and not on a laptop, and I'm wondering if that was due to erroneous config on my side, or simply because it is (was?) not supported) (it was a toshiba MK5002MPL) Axel. From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 10 10:01:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 00:40:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24676 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 00:40:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24672 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 00:40:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 00:40:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D83819D71; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:40:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 905A719C42; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:40:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C15619BB2; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:39:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CF3619B9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:39:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <580ded11d403086520dfd9f86ce33593@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions (was: Plan 9 questions and quarrel) From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403091508.i29F8NJ28205@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:39:13 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is the support for pcmcia disks only in the > ipaq (bitsy) kernel, or also in the pc one? > > (I tried over a year ago, and then it worked on > ipaq and not on a laptop, and I'm wondering > if that was due to erroneous config on my side, > or simply because it is (was?) not supported) > (it was a toshiba MK5002MPL) I used my toshiba(!!) disk in the PC too. Had to change sdata.c to recognize it. I think the change is in 9fans. From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:07:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26006 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:07:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26002 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:07:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:07:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8BCE519BC4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:07:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CD4F19C8D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:07:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30FD419B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:06:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13DF919B65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:06:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions (was: Plan 9 questions and quarrel) In-Reply-To: <200403091508.i29F8NJ28205@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:06:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue Mar 9 10:09:42 EST 2004, Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl wrote: > ... > A somewhat related question: > > Is the support for pcmcia disks only in the > ipaq (bitsy) kernel, or also in the pc one? > > (I tried over a year ago, and then it worked on > ipaq and not on a laptop, and I'm wondering > if that was due to erroneous config on my side, > or simply because it is (was?) not supported) > (it was a toshiba MK5002MPL) > > Axel. > there is some disabled code in pc/sdata.c which i put in just to see if it would work: if(0){ ... /* * Hack for PCMCIA drives. * This will be tidied once we figure out how the whole * removeable device thing is going to work. */ ... --jim From zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:14:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26582 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:14:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26578 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:14:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:14:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62A2519D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:14:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F357C19CAD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:14:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84BC219CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:13:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f83.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.83]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AB1A19C6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:13:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:11:11 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.46 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 09 Mar 2004 16:11:10 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.46] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Mar 2004 16:11:11.0331 (UTC) FILETIME=[23747B30:01C405F1] Subject: [9fans] Plan 9 questions and quarrel Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 16:11:10 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Quarrel portion: I have an i810/i830M Intel 32MB video card in the laptop.. not a radeon. Bitsy portion: Has noone tried the CF sleeve? Thanks. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:26:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27525 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:26:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27520 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:26:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:26:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5271019D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EA0519D0E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:26:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C0FC19C8D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:25:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19F4D19C57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:25:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8263e82f183820585a24508c6bb8103c@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan 9 questions and quarrel From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 09:25:48 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Quarrel portion: > I have an i810/i830M Intel 32MB video card in the laptop.. not a radeon. > that's right, the radeon driver isn't in the default distribution so it wouldn't have recognized your card at all.. there are a few options for you to try: one is to run the vga dumper code (available from the additional software page) under a different OS, find the VID/DID pairs or memory which can be plugged in vgadb, plug them in vgadb and recreate the cd. another is to install on a different laptop and switch the hard drive over, the third is to install from a floppy without vga... once you get plan9 on the laptop recompiling the kernel for your card to work should be easy. andrey From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:30:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27680 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:30:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27676 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:30:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:30:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D42219A10; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C818419C60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:30:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFD8F19BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F068519A10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:29:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <015301c40311$e967ae30$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:35:22 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > you used 'ded'? ded was the second editor i ever learnt under unix (after ed). i remember getting very confused when i was trying to learn make, and none of my makefiles worked... From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:33:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27824 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:33:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27819 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:33:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:33:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B08319CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:33:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D4CF19BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:33:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC2F619C9C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:32:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0529B19C42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:32:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0845de5347db858763cc296c45f0e582@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Poll From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:37:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If you use tabstop of 4, let me know as well. > So, far the only people who have responded use > tabstop=4. i use tabstop=4, but it's interesting to note that using proportionally spaced fonts under acme, the width of 4 'zero' characters is about the same as the width of 8 spaces. From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:41:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28120 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:41:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28116 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:41:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:41:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08AE019D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60BA819CAD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:41:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 41DC119C9C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:40:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 387FC19BC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:40:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 44B09344; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:39:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64E202FE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:39:01 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA13826 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:40:13 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078850327.6146.382.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 16:38:47 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ded was the second editor i ever learnt under unix (after ed). > > i remember getting very confused when i was trying to learn > make, and none of my makefiles worked... Now, be fair: there was a special hack to replace leading spaces with tabs if the file being written was called [Mm]akefile. Pass the emetic. Dave. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 01:57:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28884 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 01:57:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28880 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 01:57:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 01:57:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23B8519C6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F7F919BBF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:57:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16A8719C42; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98F3719CAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:56:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29Gt37b093216 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:55:03 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29Gt3al093215 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:55:03 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091655.i29Gt3al093215@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] non-english keyboard? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:55:03 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Is there support for keyboard mapping in Plan9? Either in the kernel or in rio? I regularly need access to Armenian and Russian, occasionally to Hebrew and Arabic. David From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:03:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29194 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:03:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29190 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:03:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:03:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D98BF19BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:03:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A98819BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:03:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0079D19BD1; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:02:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7885F19B8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:02:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <59bc7298ed1dceea953d0c7ea0e0a10a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403091655.i29Gt3al093215@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:02:11 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Hi, > > Is there support for keyboard mapping in Plan9? Either in the kernel > or in rio? > > I regularly need access to Armenian and Russian, occasionally to Hebrew > and Arabic. > > David why not read the archives and find out for yourself? From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:09:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29404 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:09:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29400 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:09:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:09:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 537E619CAD; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C21C119C8D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C04C19C11; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 710E519C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id D7173359; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:06:43 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D369833D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:06:42 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA17802 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:07:54 GMT From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Message-Id: <1078851988.6146.434.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] 9conlon (aka London Plan9 Conference): room booking Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 17:06:29 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've provisionally booked a room for 9conlon. We can cancel it if something better turns up. It's the upstairs bar/hall at Union Chapel: http://www.unionchapel.org.uk/ http://www.unionchapel.org.uk/hire/uphall.php (The photo shows it cleared for rehearsal: usually it's used as a bar and has a lot of seating). Reasons being (in no particular order): * It's an ideal location: 2 minutes walk from a well-connected station (Highbury and Islington: underground and overground). * It's a nice large room (lots of comfy sofas etc.) * Our money will help the homeless * It's an interesting building * I can swing a slight discount. * Quiet Negative points: * No easy internet connectivity (maybe a feature!) We may be able to scrounge part of an ADSL connection if we need to: ***** TELL ME IF YOU _NEED_ CONNECTIVITY ***** I'll cover the cost (~£300), although donations will be gratefully received! (Yes, I know it's expensive: this is London!) Although the bar isn't open at weekends, we can bring our own booze, or get the venue to supply some booze (we pay for what we drink). Since I know that RealAlefans are a non-empty subset of 9fans, I would suggest the former. Let me know of any objections/ideas etc. ASAP. Thanks, Dave. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:09:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29415 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:09:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29411 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:09:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:09:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB6EC19D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C98A719D56; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27EA419BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61DA419C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29H7W7b093278 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29H7WO1093277 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091707.i29H7WO1093277@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <59bc7298ed1dceea953d0c7ea0e0a10a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Is there support for keyboard mapping in Plan9? Either in the kernel > > or in rio? > > > > why not read the archives and find out for yourself? > The only thing I have found in the archives, Andrey, is a driver for russian keyboard compiled into the kernel; it is out of sync with the current kernel code and makefiles, and is generally a wrong thing. I did read about the driver (from ask.km.ru) and have decided to ask hoping there is a better solution around. I would appreciate less rude to attitude, Andrey. When I ask something, it is because I have a good reason too. David From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:13:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29603 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:13:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29599 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:13:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:13:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92CE519D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91FCF19CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:13:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0673E19C8D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E261719BBF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:12:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <169bd5597de953abd91e1c36138e4dd8@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403091707.i29H7WO1093277@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dhvvcqabapuljptmoqtsipuekn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:12:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dhvvcqabapuljptmoqtsipuekn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 9fs sources Use then the alternate driver (usbhid) from /n/sources/nemo drop a line if you need help. --upas-dhvvcqabapuljptmoqtsipuekn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 9 18:09:53 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0CC4319D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C98A719D56; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:09:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27EA419BC6; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61DA419C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:08:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29H7W7b093278 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29H7WO1093277 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091707.i29H7WO1093277@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <59bc7298ed1dceea953d0c7ea0e0a10a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:07:32 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Is there support for keyboard mapping in Plan9? Either in the kernel > > or in rio? > > > > why not read the archives and find out for yourself? > The only thing I have found in the archives, Andrey, is a driver for russian keyboard compiled into the kernel; it is out of sync with the current kernel code and makefiles, and is generally a wrong thing. I did read about the driver (from ask.km.ru) and have decided to ask hoping there is a better solution around. I would appreciate less rude to attitude, Andrey. When I ask something, it is because I have a good reason too. David --upas-dhvvcqabapuljptmoqtsipuekn-- From plan9@blueyonder.co.uk Wed Mar 10 10:01:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:41:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30644 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:41:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30640 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:41:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:41:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C8E519D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2B9019C60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:41:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A74619C8D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:40:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-200-130.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.200.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD3D419C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:39:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <70932acbc88446992618f774550f1e24@tombob.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: plan9@blueyonder.co.uk MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:39:58 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, some time ago I upgraded my machines from kfs to fossil/venti using the homegrown kernel (as described on the wiki page, this was before the fossil/conf times) that uses a fossil without srv -AWP support. In order to do a pull from sources, I created a special admin user, who is a member of the sys group. So, obviously, lots of new files that I have pulled subsequently are now owned by my admin user. And this leads to those annoying "cannot change attributes" messages during pulls. I have now rebuilt my kernel using the latest, greatest fossil. What is the most straightforward way of reverting all files owned by my admin user to sys? I have so far attempted doing just a pull, this has no effect, bar giving me the usual warning. I have attempted a pull -s, which has absolutely no effect whatsoever, doesn't pull anything as far as I can tell. I have attempted removing the offending files, but a pull only reports that it won't update "locally removed files", and an explicit pull -s of an explicit deleted file has no effect at all (again). Any ideas? Do I have to build a special purpose fossil that allows srv -AWPp? Thank you very much in advance, Robby PS I am having difficulties using the pcf and pccpuf kernels, but I haven't yet played around enough to figure out what I might be doing wrong. I just get a screen full of lots of 80...=something and a dump of the registers. I'll play some more. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 10 10:01:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:42:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30755 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:42:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30751 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:42:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:42:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DB9019CFF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:42:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1658619C9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:42:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1706A19C60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:41:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0FC019C85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:41:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29Hesog031559 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:40:54 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i29HesXk031556 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:40:54 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <200403091707.i29H7WO1093277@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:40:54 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 9 Mar 2004, David Tolpin wrote: > I would appreciate less rude to attitude, Andrey. When > I ask something, it is because I have a good reason too. I admit to finding your 'ask questions first' attitude a tad irritating, but that is, quite likely, completely my fault -- I would like to see the people interested in Plan 9 more immersed in its culture (which, in my opinion, favours searching for the answers instead of having them served on a platter) instead of dragging with them the one which I have tried to leave behind in a Lunix world. As an OS it has its ups and downs, but as a culture for learning and experimenting I frankly think there's no better. We'll find first gear at some point, I'm sure :) andrey From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 02:53:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31414 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 02:53:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31410 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 02:53:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 02:53:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 252F519CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:53:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D8E419B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:53:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5407619BC4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:52:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F68319B3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 12:52:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <93d34faa81c9eef57fc17a9446da8c1f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <70932acbc88446992618f774550f1e24@tombob.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 10:52:56 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: use the -AWP /srv/replica and just chmod there.. you can look at /dist/replica/client/plan9.log for ownership information or, alternatively, look at /n/sources/plan9/... with plan9.log you can script it quite easily -- it has original user/group for every file you've pulled... andrey From plan9@blueyonder.co.uk Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:04:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32120 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:04:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32116 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:04:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:04:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94AE619D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:04:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 601F019D0E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:04:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44EA119CFF; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:03:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-200-130.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.200.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07F2F19CAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:03:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil From: plan9@blueyonder.co.uk In-Reply-To: <93d34faa81c9eef57fc17a9446da8c1f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:03:18 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, > use the -AWP /srv/replica and just chmod there.. you can look at As far as I can tell, chmod does not support changing the owner of a file. I know I could do it by building a special fossil to allow srv -AWPp and then use '[ fsys name ] wstat file elem uid gid perm length' inside a con. Is there any immediately usable command similar to chown for use on a srv -AWP mounted tree? Thanks, Robby From t.lankots@aprote.ee Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:06:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32214 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:06:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32210 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:06:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:06:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7CEB619D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:06:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 291F219D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:06:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 878DD19D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:05:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 238A719D0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:05:57 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i29IEgOf027917 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:14:42 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D48@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil Thread-Index: AcQGAQxjU8EeadGeR+6Pk8K278SwQgAABkfQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:05:59 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there any immediately usable command similar to chown for use on a > srv -AWP mounted tree? chgrp=20 From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:07:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32276 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:07:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32272 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:07:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:07:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFB1F19D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:07:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 148B419B8A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:07:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B96BE19BC4; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:06:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B58119D0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:06:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0692e19ef622a66455ec68e18c40626e@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:11:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there any immediately usable command similar to chown for use on a > srv -AWP mounted tree? see chgrp(1). From plan9@blueyonder.co.uk Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:11:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32567 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:11:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32563 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:11:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:11:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D958D19D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:11:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B743719CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:11:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1481219B8A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:10:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-200-130.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.200.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0EE619D23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:10:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <86192baf99b9c503df57f965607243a0@tombob.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Beginner question on how to change owner of files in fossil From: plan9@blueyonder.co.uk In-Reply-To: <0692e19ef622a66455ec68e18c40626e@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:10:36 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > see chgrp(1). Aha! Excellent. Can't really see how I missed that. I'm pretty sure lookman owner didn't list that on Sunday. Probably selective vision, or something. Apols for the noise. Robby From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:23:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 945 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:23:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 941 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:23:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:23:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BCBC419D71; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:23:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 185AA19CF9; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:23:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD0E219D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:23:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94AE619CF9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:22:58 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id EB5DC36A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:21:32 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11030367 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:21:32 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA05147 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:22:43 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 18:21:18 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I would appreciate less rude to attitude, Andrey. When > > I ask something, it is because I have a good reason too. Now, to be pedantic, Andrey was not "rude": "terse", maybe "impolite", but not actually "rude". > I admit to finding your 'ask questions first' attitude a tad irritating, Ditto. If we spend all our time answering questions, we'll _never_ get the USB/hotplug/wifi/PDP11 ... support finished:-). > but that is, quite likely, completely my fault No ... For example, when I was training/mentoring people, I forced them to find as much information as possible independently. Apart from (obviously) trying to foster a hunger for knowledge and make them more independent, there is also an important psychological issue: information which is given to you is less permanently embedded in your memory than information which takes an effort to find. (No, I can't back this up experimentally or theoretically, but I'd bet money on it). Of course, this also eventually lessens your own workload, so you can concentrate on other things! Cheers, Dave. From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:33:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1427 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:33:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1423 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:33:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:33:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA65D19D56; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:33:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0625119D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:33:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13A0E19D45; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:32:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 464E619D4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:32:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c7b802870b3b8fda40aa4191ffcb0a4@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] information <-> knowledge Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:37:53 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > information which is given to you is less permanently embedded in your > memory than information which takes an effort to find. > (No, I can't back this up experimentally or theoretically, > but I'd bet money on it). the same thing applies to learning tunes - tunes that one learns to play from written music seem to embed themselves less deeply than tunes learnt by ear. (i learn lots of tunes...) i think the difference might be in the degree of conscious attention that one has directed at the problem. that said, in the 9 world, there are still some things that i have to look up every time, despite having researched the answer originally. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:45:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2036 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:45:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2032 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:45:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:45:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1DCF119B42; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:45:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BE6A19D60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:45:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C078A19CE7; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:44:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41B6119B42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:44:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29Igq7b093681 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:42:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29Igpj5093680 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:42:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:42:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I admit to finding your 'ask questions first' attitude a tad irritating, > > Ditto. If we spend all our time answering questions, > we'll _never_ get the USB/hotplug/wifi/PDP11 ... support finished:-). You'd better answered my questions once, instead of training and mentoring me. You'd save a whole lot of time. Really. > Of course, this also eventually lessens your own workload, > so you can concentrate on other things! So, am I looking in the wrong direction trying to figure out how to use usbhid driver (which is helpful, thank you for the hint) to have different keyboard mappings in different rio windows? Is there bidi support? I have failed to find anything on it. What would be the right level for bidi? David From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:48:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2259 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:48:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2255 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:48:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:48:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0547619D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:48:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7F8119D5D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:48:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2FA319D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:47:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B232019B24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 0EB2E36C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:46:12 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BED4369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:46:11 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA06227 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:47:22 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078857957.6146.480.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 18:45:57 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You'd better answered my questions once, instead of training and > mentoring me. You'd save a whole lot of time. Really. No, because if we train you in how to find the information, then we get asked less questions in the future! Dave. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 03:52:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2449 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 03:52:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2445 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 03:52:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 03:52:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C29B819D6E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:52:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66E6819D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:52:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACE0819B24; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:51:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17D5219D56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:51:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29Iof7b093732 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:50:41 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29Iof46093731 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:50:41 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091850.i29Iof46093731@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <1078857957.6146.480.camel@zevon> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:50:41 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > You'd better answered my questions once, instead of training and > > mentoring me. You'd save a whole lot of time. Really. > > No, because if we train you in how to find the information, > then we get asked less questions in the future! So, what would be the right level to implement bidi support? From lucho@ionkov.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 04:02:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3126 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 04:02:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3122 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 04:02:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 04:02:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC8E619D56; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:02:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09DC319D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:02:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6CC8119D13; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:02:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3E2819D4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:01:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with ESMTP id <20040309190158016004h0nge>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:01:58 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 88E134623E0; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:02:14 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? Message-ID: <20040309190214.GA10440@ionkov.net> References: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:02:14 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 10:42:51PM +0400, David Tolpin said: > > > I admit to finding your 'ask questions first' attitude a tad irritating, > > > > Ditto. If we spend all our time answering questions, > > we'll _never_ get the USB/hotplug/wifi/PDP11 ... support finished:-). > > You'd better answered my questions once, instead of training and > mentoring me. You'd save a whole lot of time. Really. > > > Of course, this also eventually lessens your own workload, > > so you can concentrate on other things! > > So, am I looking in the wrong direction trying to figure out > how to use usbhid driver (which is helpful, thank you for the > hint) to have different keyboard mappings > in different rio windows? IMO the easiest way is to replace the original /dev/keyboard with one that translates the default keymap with the one you need. I am sure somebody already wrote it, but if you cannot find it you can write it yourself. Check pipefile(1) and /sys/src/cmd/aux/accupoint.c as an example how can you use it to replace /dev/mouse. > Is there bidi support? I have failed to find anything on it. There is no bidi support. > What would be the right level for bidi? I think libframe is a good place to add it. It will work both for acme and rio. Lucho From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 04:15:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3877 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 04:15:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3873 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 04:15:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 04:15:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CEF819D71; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:15:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E591E19B84; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:15:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1278019D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:14:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57E1E1998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:14:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 11:17:36 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there bidi support? I have failed to find anything on it. No. I got as far as reading the UNICODE spec about it and downloading fribidi. It would be great if you got something going. I can put in a couple of hours a week, testing or fixing. I have a few Farsi/Arabic fonts converted also, but Andrey has the most complete set. From g.pavelcak@comcast.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 04:40:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5474 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 04:40:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5465 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 04:40:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 04:40:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E1B8019D7D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:40:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7771A19D75; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:40:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFE3B19D72; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:39:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E51819D4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:39:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from bsd.my.domain (h004005b2f1be.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.62.113.60]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004030919292801300dj6r9e>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:29:29 +0000 Received: from bsd.my.domain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i29JRraR001620 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:27:55 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp@bsd.my.domain) Received: (from gp@localhost) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id i29JRqWv001619 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:27:52 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp) From: Greg Pavelcak To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040309192751.GA1571@bsd.my.domain> Mail-Followup-To: Greg Pavelcak , 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.6i Subject: [9fans] Drawterm question. Related to NAT'ing maybe. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:27:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I set up a cpu/auth server, and I can drawterm to it from within my local network, i.e. drawterm -a 192.168.0.101 -c 192.168.0.101 -r /usr/glenda works. I can then login as glenda. However, I can't drawterm from the outside world. I have cable internet and a D-Link router. There's a browser-based interface to admin the router, and I have successfully configured it so I can ssh to my FreeBSD box. Unfortunately, I don't have those screens in from of me, but basically I choose the connection type (TCP/UDP) the "external port" (I've tried 17013 and 567 for drawterm), the "internal port" (also tried 17013 and 567), and the internal address, which is 192.168.0.101 on my network. There's also an "Applications Configuration" part for apps that need ranges of ports. I tried some similar things for drawterm there, but no joy. I'm not sure I'm making enough sense here to get help. I guess basically, if anyone is drawterm-ing to some server through a D-Link router, how'd you do it? Thanks. Greg From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 10 10:01:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 04:48:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5902 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 04:48:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5898 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 04:48:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 04:48:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7ACE719D91; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:48:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5828119A94; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:48:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CBEE19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:47:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9006019D47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:47:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm question. Related to NAT'ing maybe. In-Reply-To: <20040309192751.GA1571@bsd.my.domain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:50:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have just 17013 and 567 on TCP forwarded to 192.168.1.109 with my Linksys From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 04:57:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6375 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 04:57:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6371 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 04:57:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 04:57:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A12719D72; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDAB619B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:57:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A9EFC19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0B7819B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:56:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2ee2ff33ac36a17c304b97238571142f@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] bidi Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:02:23 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I think libframe is a good place to add it. It will work both for acme and > rio. do we really want non-displaying characters in acme/rio? how does one deal with selection (have i selected this zero-width character i've just clicked on or not?) and if i've got l-r and r-l text on the same line, and i drag a selection... how can it work? either i've got a discontinuous selection in the underlying file, or a discontinuous selection on screen. glyphs as display markup don't make a great deal of sense to me (but i'm sure others will tell me they're the only way forward). bidi *display*, certainly. but in rio/acme... bad idea, i think. From g.pavelcak@comcast.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 05:00:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6493 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 05:00:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6489 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 05:00:52 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 05:00:52 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A534A19D87; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:00:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AEE819D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:00:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95E1619B9F; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:59:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 191B819B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:59:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from bsd.my.domain (h004005b2f1be.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.62.113.60]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <20040309195134015006b3dke>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:51:34 +0000 Received: from bsd.my.domain (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i29Jo2sb001753 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:50:03 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp@bsd.my.domain) Received: (from gp@localhost) by bsd.my.domain (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id i29Jo0x5001749 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:50:00 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from gp) From: Greg Pavelcak To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm question. Related to NAT'ing maybe. Message-ID: <20040309194956.GA1739@bsd.my.domain> Mail-Followup-To: Greg Pavelcak , 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <20040309192751.GA1571@bsd.my.domain> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040309192751.GA1571@bsd.my.domain> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.6i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 14:49:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 02:27:51PM -0500, Greg Pavelcak wrote: > I set up a cpu/auth server, and I can drawterm to it from within my > local network, i.e. > > drawterm -a 192.168.0.101 -c 192.168.0.101 -r /usr/glenda > > works. I can then login as glenda. However, I can't drawterm from > the outside world. Ooops. Meant to say that the error I get is "can't dial tcp!address!17013". greg From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 10 10:01:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 05:02:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6573 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 05:02:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6569 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 05:02:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 05:02:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 07D4519D72; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:02:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E9AE19D82; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:02:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 143ED19D82; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71B6919B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:01:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29K0S7b094232 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:00:28 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29K0SMu094231 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:00:28 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403092000.i29K0SMu094231@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi In-Reply-To: <2ee2ff33ac36a17c304b97238571142f@vitanuova.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:00:28 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I think libframe is a good place to add it. It will work both for acme and > > rio. > > do we really want non-displaying characters in acme/rio? how does one > deal with selection (have i selected this zero-width character i've > just clicked on or not?) This has no relation to bidi. Unicode bidi does not imply use of any extra characters; just the opposite, the display media should automatically re-order the text. Explicit bidi marks are used only for codepoints with weak directionality, and this feature can be easily dropped if strong bidirectionality is supported. > and if i've got l-r and r-l text on the same line, and i drag a > selection... how can it work? either i've got a discontinuous > selection in the underlying file, or a discontinuous selection on > screen. You get discontinuous selection in the underlying file. If it does not work with the current model, then it is a limitation of the current model. > glyphs as display markup don't make a great deal of sense to me (but > i'm sure others will tell me they're the only way forward). What is it about? From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 10 05:14:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7167 invoked by uid 1020); 10 Mar 2004 05:14:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7163 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 05:14:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 05:14:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FE7919BD7; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:14:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2203819D23; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:14:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 628C219CD8; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:13:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C44B19BD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:13:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403092000.i29K0SMu094231@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:18:59 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You get discontinuous selection in the underlying file. If it > does not work with the current model, then it is a limitation > of the current model. it is indeed a limitation of the current model. for instance sam and acme's command language assumes that dot, the current selection, can be represented by two numbers, and changing that would change many fundamental assumptions in the code. acme(4) exposes its selections externally too; how would that work? i wouldn't say it'd be impossible, but it might be easier to code the whole thing from scratch. would it be worth it (against, say, having a heuristic to determine directionality for the whole of a window)? > What is it about? it? From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:29:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16802 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:25 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16798 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:29:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 479E719C87; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BF2819BDB; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16DDA19D6D; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:23:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15ED219CD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:23:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <826a9679868a1971a95584fe5712c5cc@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <1078850327.6146.382.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:28:26 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Now, be fair: there was a special hack to replace leading spaces > with tabs if the file being written was called [Mm]akefile. not in the version i used (in '87) From lucho@ionkov.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:29:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16834 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16830 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:29:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6D8919C4D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 356A319C96; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90AE819AA8; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:25:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3719519C8F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:25:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004030920243601300dghope>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:24:37 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 0ABFB4623E0; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:24:51 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi Message-ID: <20040309202450.GA10796@ionkov.net> References: <2ee2ff33ac36a17c304b97238571142f@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2ee2ff33ac36a17c304b97238571142f@vitanuova.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:24:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What is the point of having full Unicode support in Plan9, if people that use r-l languages cannot use it? How are they supposed to write in these languages if rio/acme doesn't render the text correctly? If bidi support doesn't add too much complexity, I don't see why we, the majority that uses l-r languages, should object to something that doesn't affect us much. Thanks, Lucho On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 08:02:23PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com said: > > I think libframe is a good place to add it. It will work both for acme and > > rio. > > do we really want non-displaying characters in acme/rio? how does one > deal with selection (have i selected this zero-width character i've > just clicked on or not?) > > and if i've got l-r and r-l text on the same line, and i drag a > selection... how can it work? either i've got a discontinuous > selection in the underlying file, or a discontinuous selection on > screen. > > glyphs as display markup don't make a great deal of sense to me (but > i'm sure others will tell me they're the only way forward). > > bidi *display*, certainly. > > but in rio/acme... bad idea, i think. From lucho@ionkov.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:29:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16846 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16841 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:29:57 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:29:57 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70FAC19995; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF65D19CC1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:29:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B012019A7A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:29:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.202.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 889DE19C8F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:29:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004030920290201100lmvj6e>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:29:03 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 46ED14623E0; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:29:14 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi Message-ID: <20040309202914.GB10796@ionkov.net> References: <200403092000.i29K0SMu094231@adat.davidashen.net> <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:29:14 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think the better way is to have discontinuous selection on the screen. It is more straightforward, and doesn't look that bad. You can check both in Mozilla and IE how the selection works with mixed direction text: http://ppewww.ph.gla.ac.uk/~flavell/charset/dir-sample.html Thanks, Lucho On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 08:18:59PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com said: > > You get discontinuous selection in the underlying file. If it > > does not work with the current model, then it is a limitation > > of the current model. > > it is indeed a limitation of the current model. for instance sam and > acme's command language assumes that dot, the current selection, can > be represented by two numbers, and changing that would change many > fundamental assumptions in the code. > > acme(4) exposes its selections externally too; how would that > work? > > i wouldn't say it'd be impossible, but it might be easier to code the > whole thing from scratch. would it be worth it (against, say, > having a heuristic to determine directionality for the whole > of a window)? > > > What is it about? > > it? From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:30:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16880 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:30:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16875 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:30:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:30:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 059FF19A08; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:30:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0A7E199E5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:30:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CFA419D72; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:40:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04D5319A7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 15:40:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29KdQ7b094408 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:39:26 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29KdQDk094407 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:39:26 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403092039.i29KdQDk094407@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi In-Reply-To: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:39:26 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > You get discontinuous selection in the underlying file. If it > > does not work with the current model, then it is a limitation > > of the current model. > > it is indeed a limitation of the current model. for instance sam and > acme's command language assumes that dot, the current selection, can > be represented by two numbers, and changing that would change many > fundamental assumptions in the code. > > acme(4) exposes its selections externally too; how would that > work? 1. That means that the code should be changed. 2. Untill it is changed, there are choices, and the choices are well explored: - limit selection to spans with one direction. - limit selection to spans with starting and ending points with the same direction > i wouldn't say it'd be impossible, but it might be easier to code the > whole thing from scratch. would it be worth it Untill bidi is implemented, it is not very usable for roughly a half of the Earth's population. > (against, say, > having a heuristic to determine directionality for the whole > of a window)? 1) It is not a heuristic, it is a setting. One does have now this setting, it has one value - ltr. It should be possible to add the other one, rtl. 2) It is not an issue of bidi. The basic bidi can be implemented without it. > > What is it about? > > it? > Use of glyphs for markup. Bidi is independent of use of direction marks. Bidi can be implemented without direction-override marks. And still be very usable. 'embed' as the only mode is almost the answer. It lets people write and read in their languages. ?tfel ot thgir morf hsilgnE daer ot deirt uoy evaH David From dfawcus@cisco.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:30:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16889 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:30:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16884 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:30:53 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:30:53 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DD3519995; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:30:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAAAD19999; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:30:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 775DA19D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:17:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AA3E19D23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:17:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 09 Mar 2004 13:26:32 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i29LHIHs010973 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:17:18 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id VAA01050 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:17:46 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] London 9con? (aka 9conlon) will be on May 15th 2004 Message-ID: <20040309211746.A27646@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <1077063602.7686.37.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <1077063602.7686.37.camel@rea>; from davel@anvil.com on Wed, Feb 18, 2004 at 12:20:02AM +0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:17:46 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Feb 18, 2004 at 12:20:02AM +0000, Dave Lukes wrote: > Right, > The decision is made. > > May 15th-16th 2004 will be the first London 9fans Con. > > Please email me with any requirements for beds, > interesting substances etc., and I'll try to coordinate, > supply, whatever ... Ooops. Forgot about this 'til I saw your email today. So just what is the story about beds, etc. Bring a sleeping bag and someone'll supply a floor, or book a Hotel (eek) room? DF From dfawcus@cisco.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:31:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16977 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:31:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16973 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:31:18 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:31:18 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55A9319C96; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:31:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D187199FD; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:31:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44C1D19D75; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:19:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-1.cisco.com (sj-iport-1-in.cisco.com [171.71.176.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08E3819D47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:19:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from edi-view2.cisco.com (edi-view2.cisco.com [144.254.112.71]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i29LJGaD009838 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:19:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (dfawcus@localhost) by edi-view2.cisco.com (8.11.2/CISCO.WS.1.2) id i29LJGY23750 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:19:16 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] London 9con? (aka 9conlon) will be on May 15th 2004 Message-ID: <20040309211916.A22831@edi-view2.cisco.com> References: <1077063602.7686.37.camel@rea> <20040309211746.A27646@edinburgh.cisco.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <20040309211746.A27646@edinburgh.cisco.com>; from dfawcus@cisco.com on Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 09:17:46PM +0000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:19:16 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 09:17:46PM +0000, Derek Fawcus wrote: Bugger. List reply to... From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:31:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17034 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:31:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17030 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:31:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:31:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 03AB419CF8; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:31:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C6B5199E5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:31:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B7B919B27; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:37:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80EB519AF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 1E52E1B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 16:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29LYB7b094881 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 01:34:11 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29LYBV9094880 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 01:34:11 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403092134.i29LYBV9094880@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] wiki links not for acme? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 01:34:11 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: many local links are written as [Wiki syntax | http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Wiki_syntax] instead of just [Wiki_syntax] . While the user still can right-sweep just the last part of the URL, it makes browsing wiki with acme much less convenient. Would it make sense to fix it and just revert to [Wiki_syntax] [what_do_people_think] etc.? From plan9@blueyonder.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:32:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17117 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:32:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17113 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:32:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:32:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9AF2A19D00; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:32:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14CD719D0C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:32:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C3DA719C55; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:03:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from lagaffe.tombob.com (82-41-200-130.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.200.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31A0819C0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:03:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <83e5183e7c346420e8927a5c2b36f14e@tombob.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm question. Related to NAT'ing maybe. From: plan9@blueyonder.co.uk In-Reply-To: <20040309194956.GA1739@bsd.my.domain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:03:15 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > On Tue, Mar 09, 2004 at 02:27:51PM -0500, Greg Pavelcak wrote: >> I set up a cpu/auth server, and I can drawterm to it from within my >> local network, i.e. >> >> drawterm -a 192.168.0.101 -c 192.168.0.101 -r /usr/glenda >> >> works. I can then login as glenda. However, I can't drawterm from >> the outside world. > > Ooops. Meant to say that the error I get is "can't dial > tcp!address!17013". Are you specifying the correct address to drawterm when attempting to connect from outside, i.e., your ip address provided by your ISP? The 192.168. addresses are not visible from the outside. Another thing that took me a while to figure out was that my workplace was blocking outgoing ports. Make sure that your outside machine can access those ports. Robby From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:33:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17202 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:33:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17198 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:33:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:33:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B3C619B90; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:33:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 566D9199FD; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:33:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC41C19C30; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:59:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 67DEE19AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:59:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18800 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:59:03 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:59:03 -0000 Message-ID: <016101c4062a$4f85ac10$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040305091134.19433.qmail@web13125.mail.yahoo.com>, <013001c404fe$3fb13980$8201a8c0@cc77109e> <104qo2ft7vjvv0a@corp.supernews.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:56:07 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: realistically - if you just wanna port a lot of stuff to the ps2 just run with linux. it's already done and the results are as expected - i.e. the ps2 is not as good as a cheap pc for most applications. the ps2 graphics engine is very good and well documented - the memory sub-system is great. no need for a "homebrew hdd lib" - it'll drive you insane. my ps2 inferno has a small sac fs (in an elf segment - eat my shorts redboot) and imports resources that aren't worth the battle - e.g. fs from emelie at the time. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Cummings" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 8:48 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] errr, the e compiler? > sounds excellent. now i beseech thee: point me to it! I'll give a go at > porting whatever possible to the ps2 with your compiler. there are some > homebrew hdd libs around as well, maybe I'll have a look-see. thanks > again -dave From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:56 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:33:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17248 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:33:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17243 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:33:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:33:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A46E919D1D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:33:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7B5219A23; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:33:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 59BA019CC5; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:59:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.0.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3427919AA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:59:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 18904 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2004 22:59:05 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 9 Mar 2004 22:59:05 -0000 Message-ID: <016201c4062a$50974320$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net>, <012801c404fc$a1ba0910$8201a8c0@cc77109e> <404CD66A.EF449949@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:58:05 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I guess you don't know him. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 8:47 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot > Bruce Ellis wrote: > > you rather lost track of it. > > Not as badly as Boyd, however! From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:34:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17309 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:34:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17305 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:34:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:34:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B26B19A26; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:34:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6140E19CD5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:34:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD6EE19D03; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B8C119CC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <332581-2525>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:48:02 -0500 Message-ID: <06fd01c40630$aef1b710$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <59bc7298ed1dceea953d0c7ea0e0a10a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:45:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I regularly need access to Armenian and Russian, occasionally to Hebrew > and Arabic. port this: http://www.insultant.net/repo/plan9/kbd.tar From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:34:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17352 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:34:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17348 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:34:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:34:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBAB119D11; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:34:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3052419D2A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:34:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 09BC319CC2; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:52:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96CB819CD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <333822-2512>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:51:09 -0500 Message-ID: <071801c40631$1e0bcaf0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:49:08 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Now, to be pedantic, Andrey was not "rude": > "terse", maybe "impolite", but not actually "rude". andrey has been more than reasoanable. > > I admit to finding your 'ask questions first' attitude a tad irritating, > > Ditto. If we spend all our time answering questions, ditto. it's easier to post to 9fans than to think. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:35:05 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17393 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:05 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17389 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:05 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:35:05 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 15B1919D47; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:35:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA84D19C58; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:34:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB3A419CD3; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:54:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AADA619CBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:54:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <319836-31535>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:53:02 -0500 Message-ID: <072201c40631$617135f0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:51:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You'd better answered my questions once, ... you'd be better off thinking and doing your own research, BEFORE posting. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:35:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17419 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17415 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:35:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70CCE19C96; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEDC219D63; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:35:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC274199FC; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:04:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C6C219CC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:04:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <1078857957.6146.480.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tbyujfwfhjclsdiizhmsezdgvi" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 19:04:16 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tbyujfwfhjclsdiizhmsezdgvi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit give a man a fish and he eats for a day. teach a man to fish and his industry will be destroyed by cheaper import fish and he'll be back on the street and even more depressed. --upas-tbyujfwfhjclsdiizhmsezdgvi Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 13:48:31 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 9 13:48:28 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D99C919D45; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:48:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24CC119CE7; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:48:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2FA319D4E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:47:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B232019B24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 0EB2E36C; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:46:12 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BED4369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:46:11 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA06227 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 18:47:22 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078857957.6146.480.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 18:45:57 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You'd better answered my questions once, instead of training and > mentoring me. You'd save a whole lot of time. Really. No, because if we train you in how to find the information, then we get asked less questions in the future! Dave. --upas-tbyujfwfhjclsdiizhmsezdgvi-- From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:35:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17447 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17443 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:35:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:35:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE3FD19D2A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:35:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 253C519D53; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:35:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42BFC19C9A; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A478D19AA6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:22:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0f5eacf2b1a4a03210a6c1e7d3412010@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan 9 questions and quarrel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:23:16 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Quarrel portion: > I have an i810/i830M Intel 32MB video card in the laptop.. not a radeon. My work based on late David Hogan has a problem to detect it's running on LCD, and I have no good idea how to fix it right yet (Any suggestion is welcome). So, it may be good for you to try David's orignal driver for your laptop. I'm not sure it may work or not though. Kenji From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:36:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17481 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:36:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17476 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:36:24 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:36:24 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C00E19D52; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:36:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F09D619D00; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:36:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 109E619CF2; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:53:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DE28419C55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:53:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 17194 invoked by uid 991); 10 Mar 2004 01:53:47 -0000 Message-ID: <20040310015347.17193.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi In-reply-to: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> References: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> Comments: In-reply-to rog@vitanuova.com message dated "Tue, 09 Mar 2004 20:18:59." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 20:53:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: | it is indeed a limitation of the current model. for instance sam and | acme's command language assumes that dot, the current selection, can | be represented by two numbers, and changing that would change many | fundamental assumptions in the code. bidi text aside, I think that could be worth doing. Sam already has a notion of iterating over discontiguous regions, so this is essentially a proposal to make them first class, by making dot a list of regions. For example, if you write an x expression, wouldn't it be nice for all the matches to show up as hilighted text? Then you could interactively give the next command to act on that set of regions. It might involve lots of internal changes, of course, but just stepping back for a minute and thinking about the interface, it seems interesting enough. From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:37:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17512 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17508 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D50719D57; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:37:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45D2719D4D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:37:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E8C919CA1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:09:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6D1E19C4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:09:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67f209ed8e3db7bd8cff7a051e7951b1@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan 9 questions and quarrel From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:10:45 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have an i810/i830M Intel 32MB video card in the laptop.. not a radeon. I replied (I thought so at least) this, however, I've not find it. I'll try again. My i81x driver for LCD has some problem to recognize that now LCD is beeing selected, I know the document, and I thought I did it right... Anyway, in such case try original late David Hogan's i81x.c. I'm all the ear if anyone has solution to this problem. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:38:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17525 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:38:08 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17521 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:38:08 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:38:08 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC59C19D74; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:38:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0883E19D11; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:38:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5831819CA1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:29:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E73719CD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 00:29:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] graphviz/mk From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <200403091348.i29DmUEd092286@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-yfvgamjfvpskxjhwyxxarbutmg" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:30:16 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-yfvgamjfvpskxjhwyxxarbutmg Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nice work! This time, it can be compiled smooth, and make binaries. Thank you very much for your contribution. Kenji --upas-yfvgamjfvpskxjhwyxxarbutmg Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([157.16.103.2]) by diabase; Tue Mar 9 22:53:17 JST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3p2+/3.7W-03092514) with ESMTP id WAA00801 for ; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 22:50:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1879E19D60; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:50:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13D4919D0E; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:50:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3D4C19C04; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:49:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.web.am (mx1.web.am [217.113.0.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3897319BB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 08:49:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from antispam (localhost.web.am [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF2C661C30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:33 +0400 (AMT) Received: from localhost (localhost.web.am [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 6A78F61C28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:33 +0400 (AMT) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mx1.web.am (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2CE561C26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:49:31 +0400 (AMT) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i29DmU9S092287 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i29DmUEd092286 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403091348.i29DmUEd092286@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] graphviz/mk Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 17:48:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hget http://www2.davidashen.net/graphviz-p9.tbz|bunzip2|tar xT cd graphviz-p9 mk mk BIN'='$home/bin/$objtype install to build the binaries, dot -Tps graphs/directed/crazy.dot -o crazy.ps page crazy.ps to visualize a graph. Thanks for friendy guidance. --upas-yfvgamjfvpskxjhwyxxarbutmg-- From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:38:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17542 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:38:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17538 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:38:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:38:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 44BBE19D76; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:38:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8902F19D64; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:38:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27FE219AAC; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 02:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FAB119BD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 02:36:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040309190214.GA10440@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:36:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > IMO the easiest way is to replace the original /dev/keyboard with one that > translates the default keymap with the one you need. I am sure somebody > already wrote it, but if you cannot find it you can write it yourself. Check > pipefile(1) and /sys/src/cmd/aux/accupoint.c as an example how can you > use it to replace /dev/mouse. Am I missing something? This is what usbhid does under -c flag. From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:39:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17574 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:39:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17570 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:39:07 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:39:07 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FABE19D8C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:39:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A0DF19D7C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:38:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EEE3A19C49; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 03:32:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8DD5D19B5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 03:32:19 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31631 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 08:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 08:32:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 08:32:17 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2A8WG877513; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:32:16 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] can your page display this? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:32:12 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I created a postscript file using graphviz but /386/bin/page on sources couldn't show the resulting ps file correctly. The image was shown shifted to up-left and clipped. try: hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps | page My relatively old page display it well, though. term% md5sum /bin/page 42e6b1c399f01df7ba421f5e5f163a04 /bin/page -- YAMANASHI Takeshi (and my family name is YAMANASHI :) From michaelo@ukr.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:41:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17855 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:41:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17851 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:41:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:41:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB91D19D76; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:41:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C33219D64; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:41:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 282DF19C5E; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D20BE19C5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B10Kj-000505-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:49:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Michaelo Message-ID: <404E431F.C44DE42A@ukr.net> Organization: UkrNet Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] plan9 on microcontrollers Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:47:05 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=DEAR_SOMETHING autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Dear sirs. Let me dare to write in this newsgroup again. My name is Michaelo Mitrofanov. I'm of Ukraine. About 4 years before I wrote in this NG under pseudonym "the Alternative" from alter@p21.kiev.ua or alter@cybercafe.com.ua. Four years ago I wrote that I want to, can and will create an OS more advanced than Plan9. I didn't. I tried to implement some of my ideas. For instance very light (easy) dynamic conditional compiler of web-pages. Some time ago I memorized my old idea, it's a "virtual kernel". It was invented when I put the question how run UNIX on microcontrollers. What's virtual kernel. It's a system of compilation of separated application, system services and only necessary features and elements of kernel into solid piece of code. This allow to enclose !VERY! expensive design of code for microcontrollers to design of application for "normal" computers. It may make such design much easier and cheaper. And because of it such tool may be very wanted. Finally code designed for microcontrollers may be translated for "normal" embedded computer. Algorithmic implementation of this idea is relatively difficult. But when I thought about implementation of my idea I was mostly scared by weirdness of UNIX. Just take only such monster as ioctl(). 1. UNIX has no sensible division on kernel "services" and "central" part of kernel. (There are microkernels based UNIX like OS, but it seams microkernels has nothing common with UNIX.) 2. UNIX has no general conception of system calls. 3. UNIX has no general conception of inter process communications. (I don't know how it is done in Plan9 but I feel it's done much better.) 4. UNIX has no general conception of network communication. What I want from Bell-Labs ? 1. Permission to implement Plan9 API in my product, without limitations for end users, but possibly without encryption protocol, or other "special" features. (Don't get me wrong, manufacturer can write at TV-set, mobile phone or system of elevators that their products can not be used by government of certain countries.) 2. Adapted version of Plan9 for run on embedded and industrial computers it must have such features: 1) It use to allow to united terminal and/or file server and/or application server on same machine. (It goes against conception of Plan9, but wanted.) 2) Permission to run Plan9 for any end user. 3) Presents it on market. (You may make it commercial and possibly not badly selling). If you don't want to make such version you may allow me to make it, and I do NOT pretend for right on Plan9. I only need such OS available on market. Thank you. Good bye. --Michaelo 9 of March 2004 P.S. If somebody wants invest in my project please contact me. From pichlo7@pobox.sk Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:42:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17868 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:08 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17864 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:08 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:42:08 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8389F19D82; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:42:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48FE519D88; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:41:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4ACEF19C64; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA83719C75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B10Kj-00050B-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:49:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Peter Pichler Message-ID: <404e4fd4_2@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: Subject: [9fans] Re: constant string Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:47:21 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: "Prem Mallappa" wrote: > #include > > int main(void) > { > char *s = "Hello"; > > s[2] = 'z'; > > printf ("%s\n", s); > > return 0; > } > > ------------------------------------------ > > my question is when i compile this in Linux (gcc) i get a segmentation > fault at the second statement of main(), > As far as my knowledge i think this is because in 2nd chapter of K&R book > it is being mentioned that > ' any thing enclosed between " and " is a string constant' so here i am > changing a constant, and i get a segmentation fault ( and i also noticed > that gcc stores the string Hello in read-only datasegment) > > but when i compile the same thing in plan9 C compiler ( both native "8c" > and "pcc" i get a output of "Hezlo") > why this is happenning.. Welcome o the world of undefined behaviour. Modifying (or attempting to) a string literal is one of many instances of UB. It may "work" on one machine or with one compiler, but on another. It may even "work" on Tuesdays only. In other words, do not do it. > sorry if i am posting to wrong group, > thanks in advance > prem Appropriate group, an equally appropriate answer. Peter From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:42:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17894 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17890 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:42:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F1EF19D91; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:42:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6775819D8A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:42:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4197419CA1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C797019CB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 04:51:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B10Kk-00050H-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:49:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <104tb8b4vlccs5e@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon>, <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:47:35 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a lifetime. From cej@gli.cas.cz Sat Mar 13 17:05:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:42:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17902 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17898 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:42:52 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:42:52 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D03F19DB0; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:42:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A72819D9B; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:42:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E74FB19B72; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 05:15:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53A2819AB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 05:15:12 -0500 (EST) content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: imaging Thread-Index: AcQGiJIKYVOlOVloR++LTA58OMVVjw== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] imaging Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:15:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, i've put a mpeg-2 encoder and and netpbm onto the neXt archive: ftp://ftp.gli.cas.cz/gli/cejchan/neXt/imaging/ enjoy, if possible, ++pac. From ekarttun@cs.helsinki.fi Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:43:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17932 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:43:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17928 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:43:14 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:43:14 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 48F9019DC0; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E80CB19DAD; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8479719BDB; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 06:17:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41B1219BC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 06:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:17:20 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2ABHKkZ016288 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:17:20 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i2ABHJXI016285 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:17:19 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: Plan9 ML <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040310111719.GA9327@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] tcs and many channels Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:17:19 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello I am hacking irc support to acme. I was wondering what would be the best way to perform the charset conversion. Irc is quite broken, most channels use legacy encodings, which are specified only implicitely. Now given a scenario with 30 channels, what would be a good way to convert the data streams from the legacy codings to utf? The simple solution would be to run one tcs for input and an another for output for each channel. This would mean 60 tcs processes (and 30mb of ram). The second approach would be to have one tcs process for each channel for input and run a tcs process each time the user says something. This would need half the memory, but would incur more overhead/line. Is there a good solution to this? (Other than changing irc...) - Einar Karttunen From arnold@skeeve.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:43:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17948 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:43:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17943 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:43:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:43:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62E0B19DD6; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B6D519DC4; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2F5919A86; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 06:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com (80.179.113.222.forward.012.net.il [80.179.113.222]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34CE019A65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 06:22:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com (skeeve [127.0.0.1]) by skeeve.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2ABMCG5021339 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:22:13 +0200 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by skeeve.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i2ABMCHe021337; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:22:12 +0200 From: Aharon Robbins Message-Id: <200403101122.i2ABMCHe021337@skeeve.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? X-Newsgroups: comp.os.plan9 In-Reply-To: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> References: Organization: Pioneer Consulting, Ltd. Cc: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:22:12 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In article <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon> you write: >For example, when I was training/mentoring people, >I forced them to find as much information as possible independently. This is fine and good, (a) in person, (b) in a work or school environment, where the relationship is clearly not peer-to-peer, and both sides agree and understand that. Those conditions don't apply to the mailing list/newsgroup, where the "RTFM, you idiot" attitude, without even a pointer as to which FM to R, is just likely to drive people away. It's particularly inappropriate when, as is the case here, the original questioner has shown a willingness to do his own research when pointed in the right direction. Arnold From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:44:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18125 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:44:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18121 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:44:01 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:44:01 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E29719DBF; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9609419D7C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D37719BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD75419BF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:01:06 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2ACA2jJ004111 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:10:03 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D49@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQGlxdvLoaqiMTGT0i67ME+ZOwpDgAAAr0w From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] locatefn Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:01:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: While developing, I found myself constantly needing to locate definitions of functions in a diverse source tree, so I wrote the following function. If I've reinvented the wheel, please let me know. fn locatefn { fun=3D$1 shift if (~ $#* 0) dirs=3D(.) if not dirs=3D$* for (dir in $dirs) { files=3D`{eval echo `{subdirs $dir}^'/*.c'} grep -n '^'$fun'\(' /dev/null $files >[2] /dev/null } }=20 Tiit From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:48:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18397 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:48:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18393 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:48:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:48:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D1C619D6A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:48:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91DB119BA5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:48:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 884D819D7C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:45:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95E8519DB2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:45:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <85317ce1b10ed508955aeda82e825b39@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] locatefn From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D49@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ssnhjzqwevijlrbfdodktnyrdi" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:45:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ssnhjzqwevijlrbfdodktnyrdi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You could use this (fg), and make your code smaller and clean ;-) so that you don't have to walk fg $f #!/bin/rc for (f in $*) { grep -n '^'$f'\(|^struct '$f *.[cCh] || echo $f : not defined } --upas-ssnhjzqwevijlrbfdodktnyrdi Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Wed Mar 10 16:43:59 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 00B1D19DD8; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9609419D7C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:43:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D37719BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD75419BF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:01:06 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2ACA2jJ004111 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:10:03 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D49@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQGlxdvLoaqiMTGT0i67ME+ZOwpDgAAAr0w From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] locatefn Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:01:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: While developing, I found myself constantly needing to locate definitions of functions in a diverse source tree, so I wrote the following function. If I've reinvented the wheel, please let me know. fn locatefn { fun=3D$1 shift if (~ $#* 0) dirs=3D(.) if not dirs=3D$* for (dir in $dirs) { files=3D`{eval echo `{subdirs $dir}^'/*.c'} grep -n '^'$fun'\(' /dev/null $files >[2] /dev/null } }=20 Tiit --upas-ssnhjzqwevijlrbfdodktnyrdi-- From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:49:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18448 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:49:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18444 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:49:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:49:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6380219DDD; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:49:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C9FA19DB5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:49:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B4EB19D3F; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:47:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2A9419B4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:47:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <39d99d2f787453000454954438978993@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040309202450.GA10796@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:47:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What is the point of having full Unicode support in Plan9, if people > that use r-l languages cannot use it? How are they supposed to write in > these languages if rio/acme doesn't render the text correctly? I wouldn't like support for r-l if I don't get also support for t-d (top-down). ネ モ From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:50:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18481 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:50:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18477 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:50:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:50:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3F5B19DB5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:49:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8BB619DC7; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:49:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18C9419BD1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:18:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 087D219BF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 07:18:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <66741fc7ddcd943001327447ff1e60cc@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon (aka London Plan9 Conference): room booking In-Reply-To: <1078851988.6146.434.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:21:02 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Looks a lovely place We can even go home with a souvenir mug http://www.unionchapel.org.uk/news.builder/00018.html ***** TELL ME IF YOU _NEED_ CONNECTIVITY ***** does the Pope have a nice balcony? I imagine it would be quite frustrating to say "I know this great website about that ... I'll mail you the address when I get home" otoh supposedly by then work will have supplied me with an IBM X20 & Nokia 6600 for keeping connected during my infrequent trips away from the desk so I should have a portable internet. It's not here yet though. I'll happily bring my 801.11b base station if that helps I've also got a 32 port 10/100 switch i can bring and any other kit required matt From zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 00:50:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18505 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 00:50:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18501 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:50:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:50:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D8B519DF3; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:50:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B69419DEA; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:50:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1AA119BA5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f69.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D93319B72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 09:17:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 06:17:27 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.46 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:17:26 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.46] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Mar 2004 14:17:27.0193 (UTC) FILETIME=[6A5D6890:01C406AA] Subject: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:17:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ok, I tried Plan9 on my Thinkpad R31 laptop.. Specs are: Intel Ethernet card Intel i810/830M video card Pentium 3 1.15Ghz (around that much) 512MB Ram 30GB HDD Now, I tried to choose 'Install Plan9 from this CD' and I got prompted about the mouse and video resolution, though before that, I got.. init: starting /bin/rc echo: write error: bad process or channel control request Now, after setting it up, both default and when I customized it, I get the panic... panic: mmukmap1: p panic: mmukmap1: pa 90100000 entry 10000183 I get the same thing when trying to boot from CD rather than install though /bin/rc started properly.. Can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong or how to fix this? I hope someone can help.. Thanks alot. _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From eric@willow.nutstreet.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 01:58:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24558 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24554 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:07 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:58:07 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB8DA19CE7; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:57:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6BF319D50; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:57:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E54019D44; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:48:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 977DA19C98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:48:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (adsl-66-139-38-87.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.139.38.87]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2AGmQth014943 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:48:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2AGmjxu003932 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:48:45 -0600 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) with ESMTP id i2AGmjCr003928 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:48:45 -0600 From: Eric KD5UWL To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: [9fans] install w/Smart Array 3200 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:48:44 -0600 (CST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, So far I've only installed Plan 9 on IDE machines. But now I have 3 Compaq proliant ML 570 machines that I'd like to install it on. The problem I am having is that I can't see the LUNs presented by the RAID controller (Smart Array 3200) -- the only device the installer sees is the CD ROM :( Any ideas how I can build an install floppy image that will see my RAID controllers? Thanks, Eric From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 01:58:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24583 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:24 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24578 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:58:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E3AA19D74; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:58:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3710319D68; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:58:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13F0C19C98; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:46:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3C6719D32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:46:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60919fa8d3da2efc099c84c83b1c54cd@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:46:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You would find the answer to this if you looked back far enough in the archives. The BIOS has placed the framebuffer physical address at a place where, when converted to a virtual address by the kernel using a one-to-one mapping stating at 0x80000000, it clashes with allocated physical memory. E.g. physical memory goes from 0 to 0x20000000 (512MB); kernel maps this to virtual by or'ing with 0x80000000, thus kernel virtual memory goes from 0x80000000 to 0xA0000000; the framebuffer physical address is 0x90100000; the kernel tries to map that to a virtual address (0x80000000|0x90100000 == 0x90100000) and finds it already has a mapping for that virtual address; boom. Sometimes, depending on the model of graphics chip, you can bypass this by deleting the 'linear=1' option in the vgadb entry for the controller, but I don't think that's possible with this controller. It's possible the base address of the framebuffer could be changed with this chip, but I'm not familiar with it and don't have one to try. This needs a rewrite of the MMU code on the x86, which needs to be done for other reasons, but I've had on my list for >5 years. It's not going to happen soon. Sorry. --jim On Wed Mar 10 10:50:51 EST 2004, zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com wrote: > Ok, I tried Plan9 on my Thinkpad R31 laptop.. Specs are: > Intel Ethernet card > Intel i810/830M video card > Pentium 3 1.15Ghz (around that much) > 512MB Ram > 30GB HDD > > Now, I tried to choose 'Install Plan9 from this CD' and I got prompted about > the mouse and video resolution, though before that, I got.. > init: starting /bin/rc > echo: write error: bad process or channel control request > Now, after setting it up, both default and when I customized it, I get the > panic... > panic: mmukmap1: p > panic: mmukmap1: pa 90100000 entry 10000183 > I get the same thing when trying to boot from CD rather than install though > /bin/rc started properly.. > Can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong or how to fix this? > I hope someone can help.. > Thanks alot. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 01:58:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24607 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24603 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:58:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:58:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 31D9C19D94; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:58:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F44719D89; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:58:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E180F19C93; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:22:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3ED9219BA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:22:46 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2AGVkxr006741 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 18:31:46 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D4A@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: i8042intr Thread-Index: AcQGu+pkwrHtOcC4SJGEDRcbEJgamQ== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] i8042intr Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 18:22:48 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I was messing around with the keyboard driver, and in the process added a number of debug prints to /sys/src/9/pc/kbd.c:^i8042intr I was completely stymied when I saw a flurry of "i8042intr: ..." messages each time I moved my mouse inside rio. Can anybody please explain? Tiit From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 01:59:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24659 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:14 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24655 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:13 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:59:13 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 342A419D64; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7FA419D84; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5911619ACE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:18:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10A3C19CEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:18:51 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 034F62F8; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:17:24 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F304E2D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:17:22 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA07320 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:18:36 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon (aka London Plan9 Conference): room booking From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <66741fc7ddcd943001327447ff1e60cc@juice.thebigchoice.com> References: <66741fc7ddcd943001327447ff1e60cc@juice.thebigchoice.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078935427.20383.117.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:17:08 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > We can even go home with a souvenir mug > http://www.unionchapel.org.uk/news.builder/00018.html ... and make a donation too: http://www.unionchapel.org.uk/restoration/index.php > I imagine it would be quite frustrating to say > "I know this great website about that ... I'll mail you the address when I get home" Well, we can LAN ourselves together at least ... > otoh supposedly by then work will have supplied me with an IBM X20 & Nokia 6600 for keeping connected during my infrequent trips away from the desk so I should have a portable internet. It's not here yet though. Hey! Matt's giving us connectivity! (Just joking!). The problem is this: they have ADSL in the office, which is several hundred feet ('cos of labyrinthine corridors) from where we are going to be, through lots of steel and stone, so WiFi is no good. If you want to try running some Cat5 through (and maybe using a hub or 2 as repeaters) I'll willingly help. > I'll happily bring my 801.11b base station if that helps > I've also got a 32 port 10/100 switch i can bring > and any other kit required Excellent! I can scounge up a couple of small hubs too, if we need them! Let's coordinate ASA I've found out exactly what we can and can't do (due to health&safety etc.). Cheers, Dave. From gdiaz@online.ie Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 01:59:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24683 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24679 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:59:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B3D7419D92; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2501419D68; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFC2519ACE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:17:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.online.ie (mail.online.ie [213.159.130.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 498A919CAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from web1.www.online.ie (eth3.web1.www.online.ie [10.10.3.32]) by mail.online.ie (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8044613025 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:17:33 +0000 (GMT) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by web1.www.online.ie with id i2AGHXd07177 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:17:33 GMT Received: from 195.53.211.65 ( [195.53.211.65]) as user gdiaz@online.ie@mail.online.ie by mail.online.ie with HTTP; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:17:33 +0100 Message-ID: <1078935453.404f3f9d5e21a@mail.online.ie> From: gdiaz@online.ie To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1-cvs X-Originating-IP: 195.53.211.65 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:17:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello, you can try to install p9 with vmware demo version (downloadable from www.vmare.com) from other OS. Give vmware access to real disk on your thinkpad and install plan9 on it. Then you can try to compile your kernel with your requirements. If you have another computer you can modify plan9.ini to send kernel events to serial ports, that would help you to write all debug messages produced by kernel on panic. In step by step way you can do: 1. download and install vmware demo (valid for 30days i think) 2. install plan9 on you real harddisk in a p9 partition using last compiled CD and vmware 3. modify plan9.ini (booted from vmware)to send events to serial 4. connect your serial to another computer 5. boot your laptop and save error messages recorded from serial port 6. modify your kernel as needed (hehehehe) 7. compile it from vmware 8. add a boot menu to plan9.ini , and test the new kernel you just compiled 9. report your experiences here or to 9trouble mail list BTW,I tested P9 with i815 video card and it worked fine (on VAIO PCG-FX) I hope that you have luck gabi. Quoting w0rd 2 th3 : > Ok, I tried Plan9 on my Thinkpad R31 laptop.. Specs are: > Intel Ethernet card > Intel i810/830M video card > Pentium 3 1.15Ghz (around that much) > 512MB Ram > 30GB HDD > > Now, I tried to choose 'Install Plan9 from this CD' and I got prompted about > > the mouse and video resolution, though before that, I got.. > init: starting /bin/rc > echo: write error: bad process or channel control request > Now, after setting it up, both default and when I customized it, I get the > panic... > panic: mmukmap1: p > panic: mmukmap1: pa 90100000 entry 10000183 > I get the same thing when trying to boot from CD rather than install though > /bin/rc started properly.. > Can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong or how to fix this? > I hope someone can help.. > Thanks alot. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail > > From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 02:00:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24710 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:59 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24706 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:59:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:59:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EF5EF19DB0; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12E9F19BF5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:59:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB1BD19C38; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC77E19AB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:11:45 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 9451E2F2; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:10:18 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B490B2AD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:10:17 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id QAA05098 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:11:31 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <200403101122.i2ABMCHe021337@skeeve.com> References: <200403101122.i2ABMCHe021337@skeeve.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078935002.20383.108.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:10:02 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This is fine and good, (a) in person, (b) in a work or school environment, > where the relationship is clearly not peer-to-peer, and both sides > agree and understand that. > > Those conditions don't apply to the mailing list/newsgroup, where the > "RTFM, you idiot" attitude, without even a pointer as to which FM to R, > is just likely to drive people away. Being gratuitously insulting _never_ applies. Yes, some people on this list (myself included) can be terse to the point where it is considered rude, but usually not deliberately. > It's particularly inappropriate when, as is the case here, the original > questioner has shown a willingness to do his own research when pointed > in the right direction. He _was_ pointed in the right direction ... I don't even have a plan9 system but it took me all of 2 minutes to google the archive for Nemo's stuff on keyboards? Cheers, Dave. From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 02:00:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24762 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 02:00:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24758 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 02:00:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 02:00:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A84C19DC8; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:00:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74CAB19D98; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:00:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 777DE19CAE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:06:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.MCLNVA23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 947B219A82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:06:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2e9b3fb4d7caf35ebc6c5c3a6257c30c@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? In-Reply-To: <104tb8b4vlccs5e@corp.supernews.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:04:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he'll sit in a boat and drink beer all day. or, my personal favorite: Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a night. Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. uh, anyway. ア From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 02:44:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27567 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 02:44:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27563 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 02:44:02 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 02:44:02 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39B4A19BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:43:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FF5219AA6; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:43:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3386119D7D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F31319D6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:22:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2AHKb7b099471 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:20:37 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2AHKbAs099470 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:20:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403101720.i2AHKbAs099470@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi In-Reply-To: <39d99d2f787453000454954438978993@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:20:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > What is the point of having full Unicode support in Plan9, if people > > that use r-l languages cannot use it? How are they supposed to write in > > these languages if rio/acme doesn't render the text correctly? > > I wouldn't like support for r-l if I don't get also support for t-d (top-down). Are you aware of languages for which there is support in UCS2 and which cannot be written either l-r or r-l instead of tb-rl or tb-lr? For presentation and publishing, vertical writing modes are required for Japanese, at least. For text display, this is not needed. David From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 02:44:24 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27593 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 02:44:23 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27589 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 02:44:23 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 02:44:23 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5772919D52; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2244619AA6; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:44:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4211219D7D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:06:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58C0519D68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:06:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67975b4297167795f934c5253207ce50@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] i8042intr In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D4A@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:06:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The mouse and keyboard are really the same device. You read it, look at a bit, and decide whether or not you read a keyboard or mouse byte based on the bit. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:05:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 02:57:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28255 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 02:57:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28251 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 02:57:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 02:57:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D97D19D18; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E9BC19BF5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:57:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9900C19BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4043419B1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 12:56:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60081d829e39e61636b7a579ec270ef5@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D4A@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zflhljpzweqoetgsbpbozllfhl" Subject: [9fans] estonia's flag Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 10:56:12 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zflhljpzweqoetgsbpbozllfhl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tiit Lankots appears as 'unknown' in faces, so i took the 5 minutes to convert an estonian flag i found on the net into a face icon, attached here. If there are no objections I will send it to Presotto for inclusion in the standard face lib on sources. To test: - save the image in /lib/face/48x48x8/u/unknown.218 - edit /lib/face/48x48x8/.dict and add: ee/unknown u/unknown.218 - start faces and run 'vwhois testing@somewhere.ee' the number '218' is chosen somewhat arbitrarily -- it's just the next highest in the unknowns in u/. andrey --upas-zflhljpzweqoetgsbpbozllfhl Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=unknown.218 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Y29tcHJlc3NlZAogICAgICAgICBtOCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAg ICA0OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgIDI3NyCA/3wAKAB8ACwAfAAs AHwALAAAAIAABAB8JgwABC9YDEASfC8sABwiCJQQmgwLAAYICxgdAAAQvww1EAYQCyAVHFck XxgMEC8YCRhUgf//JLIcHDgvGBoYBxyPFCkwKwxfHX8QcCTvECcQ9QgefAAsAHwALACAZnwA KACBZkp8ACAAgGZ8LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL4FmBnwAIACAZoBm Cp18ABAAgGZ8LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC+BZpl8ACAAgGaB Zv98ACAAgGZ8LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wALAB8UiwA --upas-zflhljpzweqoetgsbpbozllfhl-- From davide+p9@ux1.sp.cs.cmu.edu Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 03:13:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29090 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 03:13:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29086 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 03:13:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 03:13:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 923AF19D11; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47EA419BF5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E193F19BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu (YERAH.FAC.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.191.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E81D119BDB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:12:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from PIPER.NECTAR.CS.CMU.EDU ([128.2.194.80]) by yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu id aa16682; 10 Mar 2004 13:11 EST From: Dave Eckhardt To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <25626.1078942290.1@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Message-ID: <25627.1078942291@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:11:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This needs a rewrite of the MMU code on the x86, which needs to > be done for other reasons, but I've had on my list for >5 years. > It's not going to happen soon. Sorry. Are the goals for such a rewrite written down somewhere? I just looked in mmu.c and didn't see a todo list there... if there isn't a "wish list" repository, the source itself might be a good place. Dave Eckhardt From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 03:30:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30380 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 03:30:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30376 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 03:30:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 03:30:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4666019CBC; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:30:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABCF019C89; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:30:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A71519C67; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:29:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACDC519C4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:29:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2fd40bc6261ead24261b5fe237817964@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! In-Reply-To: <25627.1078942291@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:29:30 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 10 13:13:43 EST 2004, davide+p9@ux1.sp.cs.cmu.edu wrote: > > This needs a rewrite of the MMU code on the x86, which needs to > > be done for other reasons, but I've had on my list for >5 years. > > It's not going to happen soon. Sorry. > > Are the goals for such a rewrite written down somewhere? I just > looked in mmu.c and didn't see a todo list there... if there isn't > a "wish list" repository, the source itself might be a good place. > > Dave Eckhardt There is nothing written down in any single public place. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 04:05:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32752 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 04:05:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32748 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 04:05:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 04:05:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 11A0419D1D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:05:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91E7219CE9; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:05:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9312919C98; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:04:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36ED319C89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:04:29 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2AJDU4J008213 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:13:31 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C406D2.84EAC536" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D4D@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQG0jvfJwYTOyiET5yMT82+dXjYuwAAAJFA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] face Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:04:31 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406D2.84EAC536 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here's my (somewhat psychedelic) face so it can be added to=20 the standard face lib. Tiit ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406D2.84EAC536 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="tiit.1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: tiit.1 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="tiit.1" Y29tcHJlc3NlZAogICAgICAgICBtOCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAgICA0 OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgMTk2NiCbr56vnnhnSXhaZ1paa1pamVpr iGuIeElVSFVEVSgAglpnSQQrBACHeElKSlpKSXgABI2JSolaeFVJZlVVRERFRAwAAAqDVVlnawws BASZV0pnSWdJWnhrWolaWoh4VVWHlIeUZmZVREMMWodIiSd9r3x9SgQvBACJVklVSlVJSomIiAAv mlVmmKrI6djI16qYZkhVRURVSVlVfa9rfYd8eARbBAOBVkgAroRKZmdIVQACmoeq19jp6cjY6dfI xqZmVVZmSZmvSnxnqmt9awRbHF8M4puUyMjp1/r5+ujpyOjptrZqSY2efXxKqmurWn2vBFsYX4pV VRZEJ0Vmqdfp+gwAkeno6dfotpiJa42Jqn2Mfa99sARbBACBRVUAAYkWFjNFRKWq18j5EC8EMYXI 17Zmd50AiISwqu587gRbBAOMFwQWBAQzUCJDh7bX6RRegPoElI3X17aHZo18sHywfe58sAV/CF+K REURM0MRRGa2ttgIjpP57fr67Pr56ej29sa2pVVrsJmwfQABBC0EA5AkEQURQxERg6XGttj66fro +gAuAACJ6Prp6ei2tsaHZwBfgo2wiQgvBACMM0MiT0MBQ6WHpdfp1wDmgPkAuQAtgOgAOofo18a2 hFWviABhgGsALoGvngQzjwFFATNDM1RVh7bot8j69voAMILo+ekAAQBjitfHpYdVvEqva69nCF4I X4AzAL6HBVVmh7a2yOgU6wwAhcjIxraHgwJqgUqvDg4IX4EiIgFLh1Vmpbap2NfYACsAXwABAF2M 6OnGqrZVZiNJngueqwgvDL+AQwEehUNVlIe2qQABgbapBCsBHYO2h6WEBnmFgwBKnnivDa4IX5kR QBFBEUREhFWDVVRDT1SUpdfo6Oi2lFVQRQKiiU9EVQWer42e7n0EKw1/kSJEQzMig0REUVVig1Vm VYN31wWpjIKDgpSlVYMzVUCwnu4QLwl/gAYFfoIRVU8AkYallFRQUYN3AL+RtlRyRUNEVUODVFAR 7n3uq7B8BnAEAIREVENEFQBfh2WDclQiEVWCAyYCF4u2lJSHAERVUE9VgjMAL4J97koELgQDgDMA Xo5DVSJVg1FDRREAQ5RhcpQBhIu2tpSlQ0SlYlWCgxECbIJ9sFsEKwQAlSQzEURDRBGDg1BVlJRV toOUZZTX+vUCCo2Eh7allJSUgzOwSu5bsAhfCF+DIlUzRAAvA7eClLbGAIeDtoO2yAL7gMYAAQAA APOFpYiwa7BJBCsEAIYBQ0QERVVQAj8CXQLyhLaHlLbpACwGzoPGxraYAWeESLBKsEkEKwtfAC+C VU9UAg6Txsjp6di2mJSExvrp9bbo1+n51/YAP4aDlGawKLCIBC8Jf40RBVBDYVWDtrbp+unIyACB AzeF+te3tunZAtGJx7aHZaVKsEaw3QQrCF+JEUNDQ5RmlHe2xgFHgenXAMaFg+j1traqAD6A9gDG h4eElHivRK/uBC8EAIBWAguCI4dVBy8CCIvp5JSUTxGUhIKPtugCeInptsaUVYO8r0mvCy8IX4cz VRIng2aDhAMwgdfoAFGHhFWUtrbTtugAbARfhndVg6+efJ4L7wy/AJCAgwJsgpS2twDwh/rXtpTC ttfXCJyB6PoBLYWDpe6vr68ILwQDiigRM1UzQ4SCVaWHACaC6Nm2AtiByNcA94S26PXoyAAvglVm 7gCNCL8IX4ZPREUWQ6VVAGGEpei26MYBsIWp2Ojp19cDQAUegYRFAp4QLwRfAU8A8QAuAC8F0oB3 ASCAlAHmAMSBtscA7oBmAswAjQswCj8Cb4IzEVEAwoN3lIepBK+Lc4SlpcKlpWKTh8aYADyC7mCw AAEIvwhfhkMFBERFM1QEYYF3yACOi5SU09f1t7bktuiq1wJxg1nuYP8AjQiPBACQKBESRFVEr0VV ZoRVpcfGtncCR4ClAnmExqnXyMYAnIBmAFsIwQArDL+CREQWA1+BRGYBVIqpyKmHtoeHlKW21wEs hdeppZSlBQDrFL8Iv4hVVY2vfERmVVQBtIK22KkCd4bHtsjY6MjYADOFpYeHfd2vBL8IXwnfilVE fEhVSGdIVWaUBdmDpamp1wVPgPoCz4N3h4dFAFkAAQ4PCX+JBESNRBYWVVVEgwJFASGCqdjIAIqC u9fGASyDpWZAYAQtBbEAKwnfhFVEazMWAbMAMoKEZmYB5YDGAvuD18joqQCNgmZPZwQvAI2ArwQr BACHQUMWSkQWRRYBs4FPVQFVgGYB14W22MfYqcYB84NRVWuwBFsQjwu/gxEWZwUELo8WZ0QiQFBV g5SHh6WYlIelAC6AQwClhlVEBlVFZngL7wu/jyOvZzNEBUQWREpVUUNDEUQAJAAmgWVRAAiLT6WD gkURIjMiMxEFBCsEM4oBBK9EJ1UWRBYAjQJFjxEzIkART1BQRURRVUVEVYcAEYAiAC2CRBEzBC8I X4sAABEREQAAIwASRIMAWJFAQ0RDQ1RVg2ZmVZSlpWaCEhYEL4IEM68AXQhfgAAIAIhEVTMiQ1Vm ZoMAjgHVAdkAxoiHh4SDEQUABRICwwQrDF+JEQUSBQURACMjIgPFAFaJZmaIqZSUh3elpQF/g1Ui IgAAfYERAAQv ------_=_NextPart_001_01C406D2.84EAC536-- From michael@cibernet.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 04:46:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2826 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 04:46:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2822 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 04:46:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 04:46:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A318819C38; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:46:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C41F19D31; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:46:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1625B19C20; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:45:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.cibernet.com (xserve.cibernet.com [66.134.100.75]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2943519BEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:45:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.1.240.70] (unknown [10.1.240.70]) by juice.cibernet.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEAA7114ADD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:45:37 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <104tb8b4vlccs5e@corp.supernews.com> References: <1078856477.6146.470.camel@zevon>, <200403091842.i29Igpj5093680@adat.davidashen.net> <104tb8b4vlccs5e@corp.supernews.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <83D359F6-72CB-11D8-A0E9-000A95C4B4C0@cibernet.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Michael Baldwin Subject: Re: [9fans] non-english keyboard? To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:45:42 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Give a man a fire, and he keeps warm for a day. Set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life. From zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 04:57:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3786 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 04:57:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3782 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 04:57:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 04:57:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8757719D57; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E827D19B86; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:57:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4568719D37; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f17.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E291219CE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:56:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:56:10 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.46 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:56:10 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.46] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Mar 2004 19:56:10.0304 (UTC) FILETIME=[BBE20C00:01C406D9] Subject: [9fans] Bitsy problem: Not calibrating! Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:56:10 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I downloaded the bitsy pre-compiled kernel and ramdisk from the plan9 site and set it up on the iPAQ, model 3630. When doing the calibration, it never continues on, the calibration just never ends.. No matter how accurate I am it thinks I'm very off and doesn't proceed, what's going on? Am I the only one experiencing this? Or is this an old bug? Please, I'm really curious about this problem.. Thanks. _________________________________________________________________ Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 05:41:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6730 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 05:41:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6726 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 05:41:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 05:41:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F9BD19A23; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:41:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5200819D49; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:41:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 389E919D52; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:40:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2589F19D49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:40:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5517985fc6f8bc33a8221f882b9da9a8@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] estonia's flag MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:40:05 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: added but I used unknown.219 because we already had 218 for tajikstan. Anybody mind if I just go ahead and rename all the unknown.###'s that correspond to a country to unknown.xx where xx is the country code? From dfawcus@cisco.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 05:55:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7435 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 05:55:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7429 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 05:55:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 05:55:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A28CE19D81; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:55:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA15D19BDF; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:55:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 11B6A19D49; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:54:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB9EB19A66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 15:54:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 10 Mar 2004 13:03:08 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2AKrZHs003127 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:53:35 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id UAA05858 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:54:02 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi Message-ID: <20040310205402.H27646@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <101e1d3477ddc2d90dba62df1f391f86@vitanuova.com> <200403092039.i29KdQDk094407@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <200403092039.i29KdQDk094407@adat.davidashen.net>; from dvd@davidashen.net on Wed, Mar 10, 2004 at 12:39:26AM +0400 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:54:02 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 10, 2004 at 12:39:26AM +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > ?tfel ot thgir morf hsilgnE daer ot deirt uoy evaH reading it isn't a problem, now writing r->l would be a bit nore difficult. Hmm - bit I do find refelected slighty harder. DF From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 06:03:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7925 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 06:03:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7921 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 06:03:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 06:03:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D172719B0E; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C063F19A2A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:03:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F0E219D67; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:02:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71BC619D49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:02:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <57f6a72ca53c1281d03e4ece21cddaef@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403092039.i29KdQDk094407@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:07:59 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > (against, say, > > having a heuristic to determine directionality for the whole > > of a window)? > > 1) It is not a heuristic, it is a setting. One does have now > this setting, it has one value - ltr. It should be possible to > add the other one, rtl. i guess i was imagining that rather than have bidi implemented as per the spec, with different directions in each paragraph, each line, etc, one could just do a version that looked at the characters being displayed, and decided on directionality for the entire window (but automatically, so it would try and do the "right" thing) much simpler... but might be insufficient for normal usage; i dunno. From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 06:04:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7948 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 06:04:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7943 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 06:04:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 06:04:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2812119B51; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:04:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 397F4199B9; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:04:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 73A3019D86; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:03:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 495A519C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:03:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6b5e3dd8e5fae6f20fe90f39f3a21d12@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <20040310015347.17193.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:09:17 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > It might involve lots of internal changes, of course, but just stepping > back for a minute and thinking about the interface, it seems interesting > enough. true. it'd be expensive for big files though (imagine "x/[a-z]+/") From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 06:07:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8061 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 06:07:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8057 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 06:07:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 06:07:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D2BE19A1D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F18C0199B9; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:07:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 29C46199F4; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:06:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 551BB199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:06:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2e56fbb95f0fffcd71ce52fa57bab5c7@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tcs and many channels From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <20040310111719.GA9327@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:11:50 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i think tcs should probably be implemented as a library function. (come to that, it'd be nice if it understood the standard charset names, 'cos currently you'd have to do your own charset-name mapping, which doesn't seem quite right). From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 06:24:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8971 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 06:24:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8963 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 06:24:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 06:24:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D90B19D81; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:24:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3924919BC1; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:24:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9237B19BF4; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:23:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C93D19B0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:23:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <02a6cdd1b9829b2be36f3bc26b9cf9d4@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] estonia's flag MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tvnoesvgygqbwzacrdwgyeikrx" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:23:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.8 required=5.0 tests=MIME_MISSING_BOUNDARY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tvnoesvgygqbwzacrdwgyeikrx Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Forget I asked, I just did it. The unknowns for countries are just unknown.cc where cc is the country code. If I ever get bored later, I'll do the same with domain unknowns. The numbers really were stupid. --upas-tvnoesvgygqbwzacrdwgyeikrx Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline --upas-tvnoesvgygqbwzacrdwgyeikrx-- From lucho@ionkov.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 06:55:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10672 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 06:55:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10667 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 06:55:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 06:55:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 04CF619D74; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1E6E19D61; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:55:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 223A619D37; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:54:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B8A419B1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:54:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <200403102142440150096n57e>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:42:49 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 3824E4623E0; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:43:00 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi Message-ID: <20040310214300.GA15568@ionkov.net> References: <200403092039.i29KdQDk094407@adat.davidashen.net> <57f6a72ca53c1281d03e4ece21cddaef@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <57f6a72ca53c1281d03e4ece21cddaef@vitanuova.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 16:43:00 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If I remember correctly some languages use both l-r (for numbers for example) and r-l (for the rest). Thanks, Lucho On Wed, Mar 10, 2004 at 09:07:59PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com said: > > > (against, say, > > > having a heuristic to determine directionality for the whole > > > of a window)? > > > > 1) It is not a heuristic, it is a setting. One does have now > > this setting, it has one value - ltr. It should be possible to > > add the other one, rtl. > > i guess i was imagining that rather than have bidi implemented as per > the spec, with different directions in each paragraph, each line, etc, > one could just do a version that looked at the characters being > displayed, and decided on directionality for the entire window (but > automatically, so it would try and do the "right" thing) > > much simpler... but might be insufficient for normal usage; i dunno. From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 07:13:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11648 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 07:13:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11644 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 07:13:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 07:13:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F03D019D8C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:13:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98EF919D06; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3580B19A71; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:12:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7697C19C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:12:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <25627.1078942291@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bukmkmeodckfytaxgncpeezjbe" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:10:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.0 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_12_24 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bukmkmeodckfytaxgncpeezjbe Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i did that for a time, and sometimes still do, but i found it typically caused trouble because no matter how esoteric the `left to do' list became, some people concluded ``oh, it's not yet finished'', which was strictly speaking true (but a bit silly). i later decided that if someone was capable of finishing the things on the `to do' list they were capable of working out the list themselves once they'd looked at the code; either that, or the list didn't really matter. --upas-bukmkmeodckfytaxgncpeezjbe Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Wed Mar 10 18:12:40 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D081619BDB; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:13:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F008219BF5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:13:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E193F19BFE; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu (YERAH.FAC.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.191.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E81D119BDB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:12:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from PIPER.NECTAR.CS.CMU.EDU ([128.2.194.80]) by yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu id aa16682; 10 Mar 2004 13:11 EST From: Dave Eckhardt To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] The details on the kernel panic! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <25626.1078942290.1@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Message-ID: <25627.1078942291@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 13:11:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This needs a rewrite of the MMU code on the x86, which needs to > be done for other reasons, but I've had on my list for >5 years. > It's not going to happen soon. Sorry. Are the goals for such a rewrite written down somewhere? I just looked in mmu.c and didn't see a todo list there... if there isn't a "wish list" repository, the source itself might be a good place. Dave Eckhardt --upas-bukmkmeodckfytaxgncpeezjbe-- From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 07:14:26 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11667 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 07:14:26 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11663 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 07:14:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 07:14:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5383719D94; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:14:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F79F19CF2; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:14:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E2CD19D8E; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:13:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3D0C19C2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:13:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <68f6ec534da7043634a36938abf745dc@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <20040310214300.GA15568@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:17:25 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If I remember correctly some languages use both l-r (for numbers for > example) and r-l (for the rest). Correct. This is not the only reason for full bidi support. Citing titles of books or peoples names, or any type of quoting in line would run into the same issue. From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 09:00:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18577 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 09:00:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18572 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 09:00:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 09:00:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0ED219D57; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:00:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6247B19D2F; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:00:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EF8F819CF2; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 18:59:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 090E119C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 18:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 21806 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2004 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 10 Mar 2004 23:59:09 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2ANx98111612; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:59:09 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <1f65641d07928d4ba958c0ca13fd77b9@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] can your page display this? From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:59:01 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 11 00:39:08 JST 2004, YAMANASHI Takeshi wrote: > I created a postscript file using graphviz but > /386/bin/page on sources couldn't show the resulting > ps file correctly. The image was shown shifted to up-left > and clipped. try: > hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps | page Sorry. I hadn't dig in page(1) enough. 'page -P' did the job. i.e: hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps | page -P -- YAMANASHI Takeshi From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 09:28:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20766 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 09:28:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20762 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 09:28:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 09:28:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C011319D67; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:28:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FFB119D57; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:28:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F136719CF2; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:27:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 40E9719C2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:27:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 27974 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 00:27:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:27:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 00:27:39 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2B0Rd8112959; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:27:39 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tcs and many channels From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:27:36 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 11 06:07:38 JST 2004, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > i think tcs should probably be implemented as a library > function. Okamoto-san extracted the essence from tcs and made into a library. http://basalt.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp/plan9/s47.html -- YAMANASHI Takeshi From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 09:54:05 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23007 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 09:54:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22968 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 09:53:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 09:53:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CF4119D7D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:53:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EA3219D59; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:53:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E70A19D59; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:52:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1D2D19D49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:52:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <06d66a549ec42a32966ea2b2eb679cf8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] can your page display this? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:52:57 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps I can see this image here. Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:04:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24555 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:04:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24551 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:04:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:04:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6715019D67; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:04:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A502319D62; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:04:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8113E19D59; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:03:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EA6719C1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:03:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9089a509dcc980b15eea47849c9c1206@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] bidi From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <39d99d2f787453000454954438978993@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:04:06 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I wouldn't like support for r-l if I don't get also support for t-d (top-down). > ネ > モ Well done! ネモ Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:13:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25383 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:13:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25379 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:13:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:13:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B89D19A69; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 000ED199D7; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 331A119D62; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:12:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B28E019D59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:12:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <03cb54492526428897d75086e6947b3c@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tcs and many channels From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:13:07 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Okamoto-san Who is this? ☺ Kenji From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:16:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25653 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:16:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25649 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:16:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:16:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C349719D8C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2E3719A05; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:16:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7B4419A69; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:15:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73B8B199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:15:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] can your page display this? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <06d66a549ec42a32966ea2b2eb679cf8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:16:16 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps > > I can see this image here. I posted this too quick. I meant I can see this postscript file without -P option here. I'm using ghostscript-8.13. Kenji From eric@willow.nutstreet.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:20:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25986 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:20:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25974 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:20:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:20:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 860C219D93; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F9D919A05; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:20:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BE7619A69; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:19:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net [151.164.30.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2B7919A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:19:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (adsl-66-139-38-87.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.139.38.87]) by mta4.rcsntx.swbell.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2B1Jnjd027442 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:19:50 -0600 (CST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2B1K9xu004212 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:20:09 -0600 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) with ESMTP id i2B1K9re004208 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:20:09 -0600 From: Eric KD5UWL To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] install w/Smart Array 3200 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:20:09 -0600 (CST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Hope this wasn't a stupid question -- ? Eric On Wed, 10 Mar 2004, Eric KD5UWL wrote: > Hi, > > So far I've only installed Plan 9 on IDE machines. > > But now I have 3 Compaq proliant ML 570 machines that I'd like to install > it on. > > The problem I am having is that I can't see the LUNs presented by the RAID > controller (Smart Array 3200) -- the only device the installer sees is the > CD ROM :( > > Any ideas how I can build an install floppy image that will see my RAID > controllers? > > Thanks, > Eric > From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:36:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27738 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:36:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27734 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:36:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:36:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC4CA19D83; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D07D19BD5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A368419BFA; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:35:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DE05E19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:35:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 42053 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:35:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:35:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:35:32 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2B1ZV8116164; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:35:31 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] can your page display this? From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:35:28 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 11 10:16:32 JST 2004, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > >> hget http://p9c.cc.titech.ac.jp/tmp/a.ps : > I meant I can see this postscript file without -P option here. > I'm using ghostscript-8.13. Thank you for your report. I was using bundled AFL Ghostscript 7.04 (2002-01-31) with page. -- From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:37:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27800 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:37:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27792 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:37:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:37:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 11BF519D9C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4CF819D9D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:37:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B8EBB19D90; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31C6C19BD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <571993b7d0d1aea69b4d7a10f3f9e995@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] install w/Smart Array 3200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:38:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, with not having actually tested mine I didn't want to hazard a guess until someone else tried here's the news you probably don't want : I have FreeBSD installed on my 1600 proliant though it is due to come out of the co-lo soon dmesg reports the SMART as ida0: port 0x3000-0x30ff mem 0xb8000000-0xbfffffff,0xc6ffff00-0xc6ffffff irq 11 at device 0.0 on pci2 ida0: drives=1 firm_rev=4.48 idad0: on ida0 idad0: 8673MB (17764320 sectors), blocksize=512 and looking in the kernel conf device ida # Compaq Smart RAID means that it is specialised so for it to work in plan9 someone will have to write a driver for it The code for it is available and is under the BSD license %pwd /usr/src/sys/dev/ida %ls -l total 52 -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 13565 Mar 1 2001 ida.c -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 7837 Nov 27 2001 ida_disk.c -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 8364 Jul 30 2001 ida_eisa.c -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 7850 Jul 30 2001 ida_pci.c -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 4346 Jul 27 2000 idareg.h -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 5691 Jul 30 2001 idavar.h %cat * | wc 1881 5702 47653 If you don't have a FBSD handy it's in CVS http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/ida/ matt From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:37:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27823 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:37:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27819 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:37:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:37:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A86B19D96; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:37:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72B3E19D96; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:37:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 53D6C19D8E; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 735A019D90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:36:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] wiki links not for acme? From: Kenji Okamoto In-Reply-To: <200403092134.i29LYBV9094880@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:37:16 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Would it make sense to fix it and just > revert to [Wiki_syntax] [what_do_people_think] etc.? I remember it was once just [Wiki_syntax]. Something happened later, I suppose. However, the most important point of it is, probably, Russ has no good interest anymore if he think his freetime and how the Wiki is used by 9fans. I think I have sympathy with him if my guess is right... Kenji From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:44:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28356 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:44:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28352 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:44:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:44:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F229E19D98; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A844119A1C; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:44:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1660619C79; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9DDBE19BFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:43:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 43931 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 01:43:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:43:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 01:43:25 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2B1hP8116748; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:43:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <5f35762f7c823b50c4ebc582035314f3@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tcs and many channels From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:43:20 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 11 10:13:44 JST 2004, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > Okamoto-san > Who is this? ? Kenji-san. okini sawatta youde moushiwake arimasen deshita. :) -- From eric@willow.nutstreet.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 10:52:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28976 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 10:52:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28972 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 10:52:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 10:52:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F2FE19C79; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB60F19D8E; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:52:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9885119BD5; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:51:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtaw4.prodigy.net (mtaw4.prodigy.net [64.164.98.52]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E38EE19BFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:51:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (adsl-66-139-38-87.dsl.tulsok.swbell.net [66.139.38.87]) by mtaw4.prodigy.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2B1p1th003899 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:51:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from willow.nutstreet.net (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2B1pLxu004318 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:51:21 -0600 Received: from localhost (eric@localhost) by willow.nutstreet.net (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) with ESMTP id i2B1pLfP004314 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:51:21 -0600 From: Eric KD5UWL To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] install w/Smart Array 3200 In-Reply-To: <571993b7d0d1aea69b4d7a10f3f9e995@juice.thebigchoice.com> Message-ID: References: <571993b7d0d1aea69b4d7a10f3f9e995@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:51:21 -0600 (CST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Thanks, Matt -- and you are right -- not exactly what I wanted to hear. These boxes do have ncr scsi controllers in addition to the raid. I have some sun D1000 arrays (just boxes of scsi disks - no hw raid) I could drag over there and use, or just use these machines as CPU servers. I do have redhat on one of these machines and do see similar info about the device and its driver...thanks for sharing the output of yours. I haven't written a device driver since I rewrote the keyboard and video drivers for my trs80 in 1979 .. and that was in z80 assembler...guess there's no better time than the present to try another ... Looks like I have some nice CPU servers in the meantime :) Thanks to all, Eric On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > Hi, > > with not having actually tested mine I didn't want to hazard a guess until someone else tried > > here's the news you probably don't want : > > I have FreeBSD installed on my 1600 proliant though it is due to come out of the co-lo soon > > dmesg reports the SMART as > ida0: port 0x3000-0x30ff mem 0xb8000000-0xbfffffff,0xc6ffff00-0xc6ffffff irq 11 at device 0.0 on pci2 > ida0: drives=1 firm_rev=4.48 > idad0: on ida0 > idad0: 8673MB (17764320 sectors), blocksize=512 > > > and looking in the kernel conf > device ida # Compaq Smart RAID > > means that it is specialised so for it to work in plan9 someone will have to write a driver for it > > The code for it is available and is under the BSD license > > %pwd > /usr/src/sys/dev/ida > %ls -l > total 52 > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 13565 Mar 1 2001 ida.c > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 7837 Nov 27 2001 ida_disk.c > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 8364 Jul 30 2001 ida_eisa.c > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 7850 Jul 30 2001 ida_pci.c > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 4346 Jul 27 2000 idareg.h > -rw-r--r-- 1 root wheel 5691 Jul 30 2001 idavar.h > %cat * | wc > 1881 5702 47653 > > > If you don't have a FBSD handy it's in CVS > > http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/cvsweb.cgi/src/sys/dev/ida/ > > matt > From martin@Princeton.EDU Sat Mar 13 17:06:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 11:29:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32087 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 11:29:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32083 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 11:29:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 11:29:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62F7E19B5D; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F56219CCC; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:29:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7385519D57; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from Princeton.EDU (postoffice02.Princeton.EDU [128.112.130.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41B7419CCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpserver2.Princeton.EDU (smtpserver2.Princeton.EDU [128.112.129.148]) by Princeton.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2B2SFFE025948 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from Princeton.EDU (lane.Princeton.EDU [128.112.52.125]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtpserver2.Princeton.EDU (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2B2SEww021021 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <404FCEBE.5080503@Princeton.EDU> From: Martin Harriss User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20030208 Netscape/7.02 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] install w/Smart Array 3200 References: <571993b7d0d1aea69b4d7a10f3f9e995@juice.thebigchoice.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:28:14 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you go to http://sourceforge.net/projects/cpqarray you can find the specification for the Smart Array 3200 (and similar controllers.) It doesn't look *too* bad - probably not more complex than a driver for ATA disks. But I havn't looked at it too closely. 73 and Good Luck, Martin Eric KD5UWL wrote: > Hi, > > Thanks, Matt -- and you are right -- not exactly what I wanted to hear. > These boxes do have ncr scsi controllers in addition to the raid. I have > some sun D1000 arrays (just boxes of scsi disks - no hw raid) I could drag > over there and use, or just use these machines as CPU servers. > > I do have redhat on one of these machines and do see similar info about > the device and its driver...thanks for sharing the output of yours. > > I haven't written a device driver since I rewrote the keyboard and video > drivers for my trs80 in 1979 .. and that was in z80 assembler...guess > there's no better time than the present to try another ... > > Looks like I have some nice CPU servers in the meantime :) > > Thanks to all, > Eric > From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 13:27:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8707 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 13:27:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8703 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 13:27:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 13:27:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E47419C1A; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:27:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BADC419A93; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:27:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 68E8619AF9; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:26:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 833CA19A93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:26:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 78729 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 04:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 04:26:23 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 04:26:23 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2B4QM8124508; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:26:22 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <57f32e05cc6e575ac5e97ded553d603f@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] rm /lib/ndb/auth? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:26:16 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I accidentally removed /lib/ndb/auth on the authentication server; but still, I was still able to login to cpu servers as usual. /sys/log/auth: tirion Mar 11 22:34:34 no /lib/ndb/auth tirion Mar 11 22:34:34 tr-ok nashi@nashi(131.112.14.148) -> nashi@bootes How should I understand this? -- From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 13:58:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11247 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 13:58:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11242 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 13:58:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 13:58:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84BB119D41; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:58:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB6D119CA4; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:58:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F79819CA4; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:57:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD1B519C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:57:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6de20273a96d6aee59cfc1c906f30a68@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rm /lib/ndb/auth? From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <57f32e05cc6e575ac5e97ded553d603f@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 21:57:30 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I accidentally removed /lib/ndb/auth on the authentication server; > but still, I was still able to login to cpu servers as usual. > > /sys/log/auth: > tirion Mar 11 22:34:34 no /lib/ndb/auth > tirion Mar 11 22:34:34 tr-ok nashi@nashi(131.112.14.148) -> nashi@bootes > > How should I understand this? Could it be that authsrv had it open when you removed it, and it has not closed it? From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 14:06:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12077 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 14:06:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12073 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 14:06:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 14:06:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE85719C10; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:06:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55F7919C88; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:06:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABDA419C16; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:05:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F40BA19A8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:05:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 87982 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 05:05:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 05:05:13 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 05:05:13 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2B55C8126580; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:05:12 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rm /lib/ndb/auth? From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:05:10 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 11 13:58:42 JST 2004, 9nut@9netics.com wrote: > Could it be that authsrv had it open when you removed it, and > it has not closed it? Umm, I don't think so. Authsrv writes `no /lib/ndb/auth' error to syslog and that should mean authsrv couldn't open it. -- From martin@parvat.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 14:23:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14196 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 14:23:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14192 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 14:23:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 14:23:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6302919CA4; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:23:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8AC119B6B; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:23:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A53819DA3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:22:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.173]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F48E19CA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:22:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.208] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1IeZ-0000tY-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:22:43 +0100 Received: from [203.101.48.157] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1IeX-0007mQ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:22:42 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll Message-Id: <20040311104935.3a3b2aac.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <826a9679868a1971a95584fe5712c5cc@vitanuova.com> References: <1078850327.6146.382.camel@zevon> <826a9679868a1971a95584fe5712c5cc@vitanuova.com> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:49:35 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 9 Mar 2004 20:28:26 0000 rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > Now, be fair: there was a special hack to replace leading spaces > > with tabs if the file being written was called [Mm]akefile. > > not in the version i used (in '87) > and it didn't work for file.mk, etc... ded is what made me learn vi - I'm sorry to admit! Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 15:08:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18543 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 15:08:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18539 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 15:08:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 15:08:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8249219DAD; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:08:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA52919C67; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:08:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E85719A07; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:07:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8182C19C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:07:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3f342b9ff85a0d994a771a0666de4b3f@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rm /lib/ndb/auth? From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 23:07:50 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> Could it be that authsrv had it open when you removed it, and >> it has not closed it? > > Umm, I don't think so. Authsrv writes `no /lib/ndb/auth' > error to syslog and that should mean authsrv couldn't > open it. Since others appear to be getting some sleep, I'll try for double or nothing; maybe I can redeem myself ☺ I checked authsrv.c. Interesting. Perhaps your question is rhetorical. It looks like when hostid and uid in the ticket request are the same, speaksfor() does not consult /lib/ndb/auth and returns success. Is the hostid the same as the uid you're authenticating? From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 15:33:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21180 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 15:33:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21176 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 15:33:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 15:33:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6262919C88; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:33:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C43C19DAE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:33:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F26B19DAE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:32:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB9AE19C88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:32:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rfvfbbhvzadktoykcyzipigacn" Subject: [9fans] how could i've missed this one? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 22:37:33 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rfvfbbhvzadktoykcyzipigacn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit this is really silly -- only after pulling all the new unknowns did I realize that .bg isn't there! attached in this message is the bulgarian flag, to be added as 48x48x8/u/unknown.bg (.dict entry: "bg/unknown u/unknown.bg") thanks, andrey --upas-rfvfbbhvzadktoykcyzipigacn Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=unknown.bg Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Y29tcHJlc3NlZAogICAgICAgICBtOCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAgICAgMCAgICAgICAg ICA0OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgICA0OCAgICAgICAgIDI2OCCA/3wAKACB/wAAACAM VCUUCAgKIDB0XhAvBCcUAwRyFAUAGQwLFBcYFzwDFC0cDwAHQF8QAwjYICcMERwvDGwYAxwF FC8IAxUfDEsYoTBfHBd9PywAUZJYG3wALACAu3wAKACAu3xSKF58LywvfC8sL3wvLC98Lywv fC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvgbsmfAAcAIE3u4G7N3wAIACAu3wvLC98LywvfC8s L3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC+Bu6B8ACAAgLuBu/B8ACAAgLt8LywvfC8s L3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98LywvfC8sL3wvLC98ACwAgP98ACgA --upas-rfvfbbhvzadktoykcyzipigacn-- From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 15:37:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21559 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 15:37:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21555 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 15:37:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 15:37:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E318319DB3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:37:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 740F419A8D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:37:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF72F19DB3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:37:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC9A319D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:36:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id C121F2BA; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:35:31 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E19EF2B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:35:30 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id GAA03122 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:36:44 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <20040311104935.3a3b2aac.martin@parvat.com> References: <1078850327.6146.382.camel@zevon> <826a9679868a1971a95584fe5712c5cc@vitanuova.com> <20040311104935.3a3b2aac.martin@parvat.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1078987406.1845.1.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:43:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ded is what made me learn vi - I'm sorry to admit! Why "sorry"? I did the same! Dave. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 15:39:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21767 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 15:39:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21762 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 15:39:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 15:39:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E2F619A8D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:39:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A0E619DB0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:39:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F98D19DB7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:38:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BB3219D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:38:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how could i've missed this one? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 22:43:42 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: this ought to have gone to presotto only, sorry about the noise. From nmh@t3x.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 17:11:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31969 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 17:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31964 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 17:11:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 17:11:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F89819DC2; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:11:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8003019D55; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:11:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 986C419D97; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05EBD19D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:10:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1LGq-0001Fz-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:10:24 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1LGp-00011j-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:10:24 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2B7qhp70221; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:52:43 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Message-ID: <2004031107481700-70208@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Subject: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:48:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello, 9fans. Back in the 90's, I played with 2nd Edition for some time, but finally stuck with Unix (Coherent, to be exact). A few months ago, I 'rediscovered' Plan 9, downloaded it and meanwhile, a PC running Plan 9 has replaced my X-terminal. I am quite happy with it but somehow, I must be missing something, since I do not manage to get IP networking working right. What I have done is to set up /lib/ndb/local. A copy is attached to the end of this message. I can ping and telnet all Unix hosts on the LAN, but accessing hosts outside of the LAN fails: term% telnet tcp!symmetry!80 # host on LAN connected to tcp!symmetry!80 on /net/tcp/1 term% telnet tcp!134.155.50.51!80 # host on WAN telnet: connection timed out Our firewall blocks ICMP, so I am using telnet for testing. Any hints would be really appreciated. Thank you for your help, Nils. ----- /lib/ndb/local follows ----- ipnet=local ip=10.0.0.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=10.0.0.10 dns=134.155.50.51 dns=194.25.2.129 sys=nine ip=10.0.0.90 ether=00A0241D0BED dom=nine.local proto=il sys=symmetry ip=10.0.0.10 ether=0060086458AC dom=symmetry.local etc... -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 17:17:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32519 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 17:17:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32514 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 17:17:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 17:17:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27B7F19DC6; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:17:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1680519B4D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:17:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92B7519DB7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:16:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA36A19B4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:16:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <2004031107481700-70208@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pxyepkjjaazgrbmjtpfwkbymml" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:16:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pxyepkjjaazgrbmjtpfwkbymml Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you must use ipconfig to setup your interface. I think this is in the wiki. --upas-pxyepkjjaazgrbmjtpfwkbymml Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Mar 11 09:11:32 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D64E019DA1; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:11:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8003019D55; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:11:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 986C419D97; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05EBD19D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:10:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1LGq-0001Fz-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:10:24 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1LGp-00011j-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:10:24 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2B7qhp70221; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:52:43 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Message-ID: <2004031107481700-70208@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Subject: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:48:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello, 9fans. Back in the 90's, I played with 2nd Edition for some time, but finally stuck with Unix (Coherent, to be exact). A few months ago, I 'rediscovered' Plan 9, downloaded it and meanwhile, a PC running Plan 9 has replaced my X-terminal. I am quite happy with it but somehow, I must be missing something, since I do not manage to get IP networking working right. What I have done is to set up /lib/ndb/local. A copy is attached to the end of this message. I can ping and telnet all Unix hosts on the LAN, but accessing hosts outside of the LAN fails: term% telnet tcp!symmetry!80 # host on LAN connected to tcp!symmetry!80 on /net/tcp/1 term% telnet tcp!134.155.50.51!80 # host on WAN telnet: connection timed out Our firewall blocks ICMP, so I am using telnet for testing. Any hints would be really appreciated. Thank you for your help, Nils. ----- /lib/ndb/local follows ----- ipnet=local ip=10.0.0.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 ipgw=10.0.0.10 dns=134.155.50.51 dns=194.25.2.129 sys=nine ip=10.0.0.90 ether=00A0241D0BED dom=nine.local proto=il sys=symmetry ip=10.0.0.10 ether=0060086458AC dom=symmetry.local etc... -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ --upas-pxyepkjjaazgrbmjtpfwkbymml-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 17:20:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 318 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 17:20:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 314 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 17:20:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 17:20:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D046219DDB; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AF2819DBB; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:20:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A70119DC7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:19:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 252ED19DBB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:19:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2B8JhD13136 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:19:44 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <68fe98c7636dd9644dc035d696b1f866@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <2004031107481700-70208@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:19:09 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What I have done is to set up /lib/ndb/local. A copy is attached > to the end of this message. I can ping and telnet all Unix hosts > on the LAN, but accessing hosts outside of the LAN fails: > You need to check that /net/iproute conatins a reasonable routing table, amongst other possibilities. Note that the subnet width is in bits for IPv6. No harm checking /net/ndb and /net/ipifc/0/local, either, for sanity. I use the "sys" name in the "ipgw" field for the network, but I'm not sure if that matters. ++L From anyrhine@cs.helsinki.fi Sat Mar 13 17:06:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 17:27:27 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 888 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 17:27:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 878 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 17:27:26 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 17:27:26 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2646119DDC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3748819BB5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:27:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C949199F4; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:26:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F8F3199D2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 03:26:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.9.204]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:26:39 +0200 Received: from melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2B8Qc4r028763 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:26:38 +0200 Received: (from anyrhine@localhost) by melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i2B8QcPw028385 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:26:38 +0200 From: Aki M Nyrhinen To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040311082638.GA8380@cs.helsinki.fi> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] devkbmap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:26:38 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Devkbmap, originally by Charles Forsyth, modified by Boyd Roberts and now by me, is updated for current Plan 9. Available at http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/anyrhine/devkbmap.tar Aki From DAGwyn@null.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 18:52:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11814 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 18:52:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11810 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 18:52:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 18:52:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC9B019DE6; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 04:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D81F419DC4; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 04:52:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 933CB19DC6; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 04:51:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 435C519DBB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 04:51:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B1Meb-0001Mr-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:39:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <92c0a65f5d11f7e5fcf9b1bf72fa3d58@9srv.net>, <016201c4062a$50974320$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] fp stack overflow -- hypot Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:34 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Bruce Ellis wrote: > I guess you don't know him. At least I know who reverse-engineered troff. From nmh@t3x.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:03:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12649 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:03:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12645 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:03:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:03:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 364D319DEA; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:03:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C8DA19DE5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:03:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFCA119DE5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:02:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.186]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9929319DCA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:02:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.155] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N1R-0001yF-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:02:37 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N1R-0008RI-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:02:37 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2B9iuD70502; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:44:56 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2004031109423900-70412@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:42:39 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-11, "Fco.J.Ballesteros" wrote: > you must use ipconfig to setup your interface. I run ipconfig at boot time: ipconfig -h nine.local -g 10.0.0.10 ether /net/ether0 10.0.0.90 255.255.255.0 Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From nmh@t3x.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:10:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13276 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:10:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13272 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:10:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:10:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB7DD19DEA; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:10:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3532B19D57; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:10:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A00AF19D9F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CEB919CF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:09:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.207] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N7k-00050V-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:09:08 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N7k-0004oh-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:09:08 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2B9pRt70522; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:51:27 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN In-Reply-To: <68fe98c7636dd9644dc035d696b1f866@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: <2004031109450200-70412@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:45:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-11, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > You need to check that /net/iproute conatins a reasonable routing > table, amongst other possibilities. Note that the subnet width is in > bits for IPv6. > > No harm checking /net/ndb and /net/ipifc/0/local, either, for sanity. The routing table looks alright. If I read it correctly, the first entry should direct outbound packages to the IP gateway (10.0.0.10): 0.0.0.0 /96 10.0.0.10 4 none - 10.0.0.0 /120 10.0.0.0 4i ifc 0 10.0.0.0 /128 10.0.0.0 4b ifc - 10.0.0.90 /128 10.0.0.90 4u ifc 0 10.0.0.255 /128 10.0.0.255 4b ifc - 10.255.255.255 /128 10.255.255.255 4b ifc - 255.255.255.255 /128 255.255.255.255 4b ifc - /Net/ndb looks fine, too: ip=10.0.0.90 ipmask=/120 ipgw=10.0.0.10 sys=nine dom=nine.local > I use the "sys" name in the "ipgw" field for the network, but I'm not > sure if that matters. If have tried it, but it does not make a difference. What is /net/ipifc/0/local about? I cannot find it in the manual. Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:29:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15005 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:29:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15001 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:29:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:29:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A09F19DEF; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:29:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8023419DD2; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:29:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 28BA519DD2; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:28:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7C1B19DE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:27:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <2004031107481700-70208@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 02:27:34 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: What kind of machine is `symmetry'? Does it correctly gateway connections from other systems on your network 10? What ports does it allow through from the inside? From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:30:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15073 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:30:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15069 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:30:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:30:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4551319DF9; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:30:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07ECE19DF0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:30:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7736A19DE8; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:29:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E51519DD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:29:18 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2BAcSbX016013 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:38:29 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE05616B@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Thread-Index: AcQHUTKCNrCT9E8ZSdWeXF+tkilP1gAAeXmw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:29:19 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What is /net/ipifc/0/local about? I cannot find it in the manual. I think lucio meant /net/ipselftab. See ip(3). From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:31:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15117 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:31:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15113 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:31:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:31:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C1DD19D9F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:31:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99EA319DF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:31:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD67B19DE2; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:30:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A631319DF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:30:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2BAUWD19566 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:30:33 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <2004031109450200-70412@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:29:57 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > The routing table looks alright. If I read it correctly, the first > entry should direct outbound packages to the IP gateway (10.0.0.10): > > 0.0.0.0 /96 10.0.0.10 4 none - > 10.0.0.0 /120 10.0.0.0 4i ifc 0 > 10.0.0.0 /128 10.0.0.0 4b ifc - > 10.0.0.90 /128 10.0.0.90 4u ifc 0 > 10.0.0.255 /128 10.0.0.255 4b ifc - > 10.255.255.255 /128 10.255.255.255 4b ifc - > 255.255.255.255 /128 255.255.255.255 4b ifc - > That resembles what I have, too. Presumably that means ipgw is being understood correctly. Hm, not quite! Note: 0.0.0.0 /96 172.24.16.129 4 none 0 172.24.0.0 /112 172.24.0.0 4i ifc 0 172.24.0.0 /128 172.24.0.0 4b ifc - 172.24.16.12 /128 172.24.16.12 4u ifc 0 172.24.255.255 /128 172.24.255.255 4b ifc - 255.255.255.255 /128 255.255.255.255 4b ifc - there is a "0" at the end of the first line. I think 10.0.0.10 is not reachable as there isn't an interface assigned to it. Only a guess, mind you, nor do I know why that is the case. > /Net/ndb looks fine, too: > > ip=10.0.0.90 ipmask=/120 ipgw=10.0.0.10 > sys=nine > dom=nine.local > Yes, looks fine to me. Except the ipmask ought to be 255.255.255.0, I'm not sure if the /120 notation is just something I'm not familiar with. Maybe your arguments to ip/ipconfig are not exactly right? > What is /net/ipifc/0/local about? I cannot find it in the manual. > That's what ip/ipconfig produces, linking IP over the ether0 interface. What do you have in there? Try cpu% lookman ipifc man 2 ip # ip(2) man 3 ip # ip(3) Can you "ip/ping" the gateway or does it block ICMP that far back? If so, can you telnet there? Also, take a peek at /net/arp. I must confess I would expect your configuration to work, whatever is wrong, it is not quite where I would expect it to be. ++L From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 19:44:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16143 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 19:44:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16108 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 19:44:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 19:44:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E870919DD7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:44:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EFBE19DFA; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:44:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0348D19DD7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:43:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF7FD19DC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:43:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2BAhSD20044 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:43:28 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE05616B@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:42:53 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> What is /net/ipifc/0/local about? I cannot find it in the manual. > > I think lucio meant /net/ipselftab. See ip(3). No, I didn't ;-) I wouldn't recognise an ipselftab if it bit me. ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 20:53:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25381 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 20:53:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25353 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 20:53:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 20:53:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1561819DF0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:53:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9042E19D99; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:53:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DAF3819DC7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:52:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A590319DAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 06:52:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BBpG7b021311 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:51:16 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BBpGlg021310 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:51:16 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403111151.i2BBpGlg021310@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:51:16 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Sometimes, drawterm begins to print blanks instead of glyphs. This happens with X11 drawterm with some hardware and drivers. It happens because Xfree86 drivers for some video cards assume that masks (stipples) must have height equal to a multiple of 8. This causes drawterm to display blanks instead of glyphs with some fonts. To use drawterm with these drivers, the patch at http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/drawterm-stipple.diff can be applied to the source (/sys/src/cmd/unix/drawterm). drawterm will become slightly slower, but will not loose glyphs any more. Use ape/patch to apply the diff. David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 21:20:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27188 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 21:20:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27184 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 21:20:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 21:20:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5884319D99; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:20:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B405719C94; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:20:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3AB52199A3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:19:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA1719988 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:19:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <337686-1661>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:19:15 -0500 Message-ID: <0c6701c40762$ca516d60$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1078850327.6146.382.camel@zevon> <826a9679868a1971a95584fe5712c5cc@vitanuova.com> <20040311104935.3a3b2aac.martin@parvat.com> <1078987406.1845.1.camel@rea> Subject: Re: [9fans] tab stop poll MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:17:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Why "sorry"? I did the same! i saw ded, but avoided it. went from 'em' to 'qed' to 'vi'. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 22:39:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 308 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 22:39:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 304 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 22:39:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 22:39:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C074A19DFC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:39:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E16D719DF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:39:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4515719DEF; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:38:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C663A19DAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:38:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3775944-30969>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:37:10 -0500 Message-ID: <0cfa01c4076d$a8ed4c10$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040311082638.GA8380@cs.helsinki.fi> Subject: Re: [9fans] devkbmap MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:34:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Available at http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/anyrhine/devkbmap.tar now linked to on repo: http://www.insultant.net/repo From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 23:38:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4868 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 23:38:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4864 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 23:38:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 23:38:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A1F919E02; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CB5919DFC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DAD6199FD; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:37:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4203419A10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:37:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BEbdog004539 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:37:39 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2BEbdec004536 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:37:39 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters In-Reply-To: <200403111151.i2BBpGlg021310@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:37:39 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David, The patch/* code should be used to submit patches to the Plan 9 developers. see patch(1) for more information. I see how you could've missed it -- the man page isn't indexed so lookman doesn't show it, but it's really simple to find binaries if you just list recursively (scripts available in the archives) /bin. With the disappearance of the gajillion [s]bin directories the need for programs like 'locate' becomes non-existent :) andrey From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 23:38:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4893 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 23:38:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4889 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 23:38:52 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 23:38:52 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6971B19E12; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9644519E05; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:38:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5257C19DEF; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:37:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9CF6199FD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:37:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1d98482f676e5de58c8ac27c819f63d3@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: nmh@t3x.org, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pmgookwukbfffmcgksxcntqegt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:37:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pmgookwukbfffmcgksxcntqegt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I can't see what you might have done wrong. That routing table looks fine to me. The gateway is correct though the '-' at the end means that the default entry has never been chosen as a route. It is normally the next hop interface for route. It gets filled in whenever the route is chosen for a packet; it's a cache to avoid the interface lookup every time. Did you cat this out before trying to connect to something off of the 10 net? If this table was after failing to connect to an off LAN system, then it means that it couldn't find an interface when you tried to connect. That I really don't understand. What's the output of 'netstat -i'? Something you can do. 1) open a window, set it scrolling echo set ip > /net/log cat /net/log 2) open another window, set it scrolling snoopy 3) open yet another window tcp!134.155.50.51!80 If that doesn't immediately tell you something, send me all the output. --upas-pmgookwukbfffmcgksxcntqegt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 11 05:10:38 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 11 05:10:35 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C1AC19D9F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:10:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CFF919DE5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:10:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A00AF19D9F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CEB919CF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 05:09:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.207] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N7k-00050V-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:09:08 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1N7k-0004oh-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:09:08 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2B9pRt70522; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:51:27 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN In-Reply-To: <68fe98c7636dd9644dc035d696b1f866@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: <2004031109450200-70412@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:45:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-11, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > You need to check that /net/iproute conatins a reasonable routing > table, amongst other possibilities. Note that the subnet width is in > bits for IPv6. > > No harm checking /net/ndb and /net/ipifc/0/local, either, for sanity. The routing table looks alright. If I read it correctly, the first entry should direct outbound packages to the IP gateway (10.0.0.10): 0.0.0.0 /96 10.0.0.10 4 none - 10.0.0.0 /120 10.0.0.0 4i ifc 0 10.0.0.0 /128 10.0.0.0 4b ifc - 10.0.0.90 /128 10.0.0.90 4u ifc 0 10.0.0.255 /128 10.0.0.255 4b ifc - 10.255.255.255 /128 10.255.255.255 4b ifc - 255.255.255.255 /128 255.255.255.255 4b ifc - /Net/ndb looks fine, too: ip=10.0.0.90 ipmask=/120 ipgw=10.0.0.10 sys=nine dom=nine.local > I use the "sys" name in the "ipgw" field for the network, but I'm not > sure if that matters. If have tried it, but it does not make a difference. What is /net/ipifc/0/local about? I cannot find it in the manual. Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ --upas-pmgookwukbfffmcgksxcntqegt-- From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 11 23:53:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5827 invoked by uid 1020); 11 Mar 2004 23:53:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5819 invoked from network); 11 Mar 2004 23:53:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 11 Mar 2004 23:53:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0551519E0D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:53:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15DDC19DF5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:53:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 41C7F19DFC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:52:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B13B619DF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 09:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BEox7b022124 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:50:59 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BEoxf1022123 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:50:59 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403111450.i2BEoxf1022123@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:50:59 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The patch/* code should be used to submit patches to the Plan 9 > developers. see patch(1) for more information. I saw it a long time ago. I clearly understand its purpose and its purpose does not meet my intents. > I see how you could've missed it I didn't. I am not submitting a patch to the Plan 9 developers. Plan 9 developers should figure a way to adjust the pixmap size so that it works with all drivers properly, and check for Xlib status. What I have sent is a fully working, but temporary solution, aimed at temporary disabling buggy code. It should not be included into the source tree, and should not become the only solution to the problem. When/if I'll find time and desire to re-write pixmap-related code so that it is actually working, I'll submit the patch using appropriate tools. Sincerely, David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ From yourname@yourdomain.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 00:44:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12251 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 00:44:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12247 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 00:44:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 00:44:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C866E19E0E; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EBED19DEE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:44:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A38D19DFA; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:43:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (cpc1-hink1-4-0-cust116.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.5.201.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9C1A319DEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 10:43:21 -0500 (EST) From: yourname@yourdomain.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="43632243" Message-Id: <20040311154321.9C1A319DEE@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] hi Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:43:18 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --43632243 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) Found virus WORM_NETSKY.B in file party.doc.exe (in party.zip) The uncleanable file party.zip is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virh7vnxs. If you have questions, contact administrator. --------------------------------------------------------- --43632243 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit something is going wrong --43632243 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) party.zip is removed from here because it contains a virus. --------------------------------------------------------- --43632243-- From nmh@t3x.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 02:02:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17331 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 02:02:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17327 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 02:02:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 02:02:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 083A719E1A; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:02:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0DB519E10; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:02:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27A3D19E10; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:01:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.177]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC48019C73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:01:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.207] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1TYg-0003N3-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:01:22 +0100 Received: from [80.140.1.26] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B1TYg-0002BR-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:01:23 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2BGhOO71628; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:43:24 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] Cannot access hosts outside of LAN In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2004031116252100-71585@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:25:21 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-11, Geoff Collyer wrote: > What kind of machine is `symmetry'? Does it correctly gateway > connections from other systems on your network 10? What ports does it > allow through from the inside? Stupid me. Symmetry (a FreeBSD host acting as a gateway) did not supply routing information to other hosts. After killing routed(8) on the gateway and restarting it with the proper flags, everything works like a charm. Long story: Some days ago, we a had a power outage that could not be compensated by the UPS. After re-booting, Symmetry came up with the default routing flags (quiet). I had started 'routed -s' manually months ago while upgrading the system. I *knew* there was something, I wanted to fix in /etc/rc.conf. No I know. This error was not detected earlier, because all other clients on the LAN are X-terminals that are connected directly to the gateway. Many thanks to all who replied and sorry for wasting your time. Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From anyrhine@cs.helsinki.fi Sat Mar 13 17:06:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 02:55:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20766 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 02:55:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20762 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 02:55:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 02:55:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81E7319E0E; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:55:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43ACF19C5F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:55:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D82B319BFB; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:54:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8547E19B06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 12:54:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.9.204]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:54:35 +0200 Received: from melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BHsX4r020761 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:54:33 +0200 Received: (from anyrhine@localhost) by melkinkari.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BHsWdT020536 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:54:32 +0200 From: Aki M Nyrhinen To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] devkbmap Message-ID: <20040311175432.GA7621@cs.helsinki.fi> References: <20040311082638.GA8380@cs.helsinki.fi> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040311082638.GA8380@cs.helsinki.fi> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:54:32 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Seems i merged the kbd.c files too hastily and forgot to change the Spec constant (clashes with some unicode characters). Now fixed, and a finnish keymap included. Aki On Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 10:26:38AM +0200, Aki M Nyrhinen wrote: > > Devkbmap, originally by Charles Forsyth, modified by Boyd Roberts > and now by me, is updated for current Plan 9. > > Available at http://www.cs.helsinki.fi/u/anyrhine/devkbmap.tar From service@zahav.net.il Sat Mar 13 17:06:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 03:11:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22251 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 03:11:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22247 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F09F19DAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:11:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECBFD19CA3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:11:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5315A19BBE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:10:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from frigg.inter.net.il (frigg.inter.net.il [192.114.186.16]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C8A819AE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:10:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from gandalf.inter.net.il (gandalf.inter.net.il [192.114.186.17]) by frigg.inter.net.il (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.3.7-GR) with ESMTP id DMV15321; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:05 +0200 (IST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by gandalf.inter.net.il (MOS 3.4.5-GR) id BCZ37066; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:04 +0200 (IST) Auto-Submitted: auto-replied To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 From: service Message-Id: <20040311201004.BCZ37066@gandalf.inter.net.il> Subject: [9fans] Auto Reply From Internet Zahav Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:04 +0200 (IST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.2 required=5.0 tests=DEAR_SOMETHING autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Kiog15bXlNeVINee16LXoNeUINeQ15XXmNeV157XmNeZICoqDQoN Ctec16fXldeXINeQ15nXoNeY16jXoNeYINeW15TXkSDXmden16gs DQogDQrXqdec15XXnSDXqNeRLA0KIA0K16TXoNeZ15nXqteaINeR 15PXldeQ16gg15TXkNec16fXmNeo15XXoNeZINec15Ag15TXkteZ 16LXlCDXnNeZ16LXk9eULg0KDQrXkNeg15Ug157XldeT15nXnSDX nNeaINei15wg16TXoNeZ15nXqteaINeQ15XXnNedINei15wg157X oNeqINep16DXldeb15wg15zXmNek15wg15HXlCDXotec15nXmiDX nNek16DXldeqINeQ15zXmdeg15Ug15HXkNee16bXoteV16og15DX qteoINeU15HXmdeqINep15zXoNeVINeR15vXqteV15HXqiB3d3cu emFoYXYubmV0LmlsL3NlcnZpY2VzDQoNCteQ15nXoNeY16jXoNeY INeW15TXkSDXpNeV16LXnNeqINeR15DXldek158g16rXnteZ15PX mSDXnNep15nXpNeV16gg15TXqdeZ16jXldeqINec15zXp9eV15fX ldeq15nXlCDXldec15vXnyDXlNeb16DXodeg15Ug15zXqdeZ157X ldepINee16LXqNeb16og16nXmdeo15XXqiDXotem157XmSDXnteq 16fXk9ee16og15TXnteQ16TXqdeo16og15zXmiwgDQrXlNec16fX ldeXLCDXnNeR16bXoiDXnNec15Ag15TXnteq16DXlCDXldeR157X oten15Eg157XnNeQINep15XXqNeUINeQ16jXldeb15Qg16nXnCDX kden16nXldeqINec16nXmdeo15XXqi4gIA0KDQog15DXoNeVINee 15HXp9ep15nXnSDXkNeqINeh15zXmdeX16rXmiwg15DXmiDXotec INee16DXqiDXqdeg15XXm9ecINec15TXmdei16DXldeqINec16TX oNeZ15nXqteaINeR157XlNeZ16jXldeqINeV15HXmdei15nXnNeV 16osINeZ16kg16bXldeo15og15zXkdem16LXlCDXkdeQ157Xptei 15XXqiDXkNeq16gg16nXmdeo15XXqiDXlNec16fXldeX15XXqi4N CiANCteg16bXmdeS15nXoNeVINei15XXnteT15nXnSDXnNeo16nX ldeq15og15HXm9ecINei16ouDQogDQog15HXkdeo15vXlCwNCiAN CiDXpteV15XXqiDXqdeZ16jXldeqINec16fXldeX15XXqg0KINeQ 15nXoNeY16jXoNeYINeW15TXkQ0KIA0KIA0KICog157XmNei157X mSDXoNeV15fXldeqINeg16LXqdeUINeR157Xm9eq15Eg15bXlCDX qdeZ157XldepINeR15zXqdeV158g15bXm9eoLiDXlNek16DXmdeU INeU15nXkCDXnNeS15HXqNeZ150g15XXoNep15nXnSDXm9eQ15fX ky4NCiANCg0KICoqIFRoaXMgaXMgYW4gQXV0byBSZXBseSAqKg0K DQogRGVhciBJbnRlcm5ldCBHb2xkIGN1c3RvbWVyLA0KDQpZb3Vy IG1lc3NhZ2UgaGFkIG5vdCByZWFjaGVkIGl0cyBkZXN0aW55Lg0K DQogV2Ugd291bGQgbGlrZSB0byB0aGFuayB5b3UgZm9yIHdyaXRp bmcgdXMgYXQgSW50ZXJuZXQgR29sZCBidXQgaW4gb3JkZXIgdG8g aGFuZGxlIHlvdXIgcmVxdWVzdCwNCiB5b3Ugc2hvdWxkIGNvbnRh Y3QgdXMgdGhyb3VnaCBvdXIgY3VzdG9tZXIgc2VydmljZSB3ZWJz aXRlIGF0IHd3dy56YWhhdi5uZXQuaWwvc2VydmljZXMNCg0KIFRo YW5rIHlvdSB2ZXJ5IG11Y2ggZm9yIHlvdXIgY29vcGVyYXRpb24s IG91ciBjdXN0b21lciBzZXJ2aWNlIHJlcHJlc2VudGF0aXZlcyBh cmUgYWx3YXlzIGF0IHlvdXIgc2VydmljZS4NCiANCiBCZXN0IHJl Z2FyZHMsDQogDQogQ3VzdG9tZXIgQ2FyZSBEZXBhcnRtZW50DQog SW50ZXJuZXQgR29sZCANCiA= From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:06:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 03:40:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24360 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 03:40:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24356 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 03:40:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 03:40:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D62D19E20; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:40:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D51819E19; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:40:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE37519DA7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:39:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69DE919B76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 13:39:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1c05f9421f658c2ece4dac3e7b4d49f3@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] joys of java Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:41:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm really sorry for the noise but I felt I had to share this We've got Java viruses now - http://java.com/en/download/help/cache_virus.jsp Microsoft's buggy VM matt From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 04:13:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26654 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 04:13:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26650 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 04:13:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 04:13:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81FCE19E1B; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58A8B19DAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:13:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3ECDD19D1E; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:12:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9837E19DA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:11:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BJAT7b026875 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:10:29 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BJAT8Y026874 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:10:29 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403111910.i2BJAT8Y026874@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] joys of java In-Reply-To: <1c05f9421f658c2ece4dac3e7b4d49f3@juice.thebigchoice.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:10:29 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Thu Mar 11 22:39:43 2004 > From: matt@proweb.co.uk > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Subject: [9fans] joys of java > Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:41:51 0000 > > I'm really sorry for the noise but I felt I had to share this > > We've got Java viruses now - http://java.com/en/download/help/cache_virus.jsp > > Microsoft's buggy VM In fact, the viri are not related to Java. If a virus is attached to ld.com from plan9, it's not a plan9 virus. Bashing java is a nice way to amuse oneself, but there are more serious reasons to criticize it than faults of six years old (at least) Microsoft JVM. David From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:06:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 04:37:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28739 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 04:37:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28735 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 04:37:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 04:37:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2847A19E1C; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:37:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D53D219DAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:37:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C4E3E19C76; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:36:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E49119C82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:36:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78fd2bb6356de999a775d6f9d774692f@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] joys of java In-Reply-To: <200403111910.i2BJAT8Y026874@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:38:22 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >In fact, the viri In fact, viruses. >not related to Java. How could an attacker exploit this vulnerability? An attacker could seek to exploit this vulnerability by creating a malicious Java applet and inserting it into a web page. The web page could then be hosted on a web site, or sent to a user in e-mail. Impact of vulnerability: Allow attacker to execute code of his or her choice. I call that 'related to Java' > than faults of six years old (at least) Microsoft JVM. The patch was released in Feb 2003 so for at least 5 years a remotely exploitable JVM was shipped in the world's most installed OS. I call that 'serious' m From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 06:17:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3328 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 06:17:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3324 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:17:53 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:17:53 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B185F19C65; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADD6119C9D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:17:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EF0B19C65; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:16:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD22119BF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:16:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311764-1662>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:15:58 -0500 Message-ID: <003001c407ad$e3c54730$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1c05f9421f658c2ece4dac3e7b4d49f3@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] joys of java MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:14:48 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > We've got Java viruses now - http://java.com/en/download/help/cache_virus.jsp why am i not suprised? From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 06:18:07 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3345 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 06:18:06 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3341 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:18:06 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:18:06 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C730D19C9D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:17:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0CCF19D10; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:17:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DAFD819BF5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:16:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AAB119AF9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <310142-25420>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:14:48 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c407ad$ba7b83d0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040311082638.GA8380@cs.helsinki.fi> <20040311175432.GA7621@cs.helsinki.fi> Subject: Re: [9fans] devkbmap MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:13:38 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Seems i merged the kbd.c files too hastily and forgot to change > the Spec constant (clashes with some unicode characters). Now > fixed, and a finnish keymap included. yup i caught that one and fixed it. choose your codespace well. iirc all the 'esc2' stuff can be torn out of the intr routine. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:18 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 06:25:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4022 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 06:25:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4018 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:25:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:25:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CEF0D19D80; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20CDC19CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:25:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFC2C19CF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:24:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA07919C9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:24:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BLNO7b030388 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:23:24 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BLNOf3030387 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:23:24 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403112123.i2BLNOf3030387@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] drawterm unicode input under X11 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:23:24 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I've made changes to drawterm(8) to permit input of unicode text (whatever X11 passes) under X11. Patches: unified patch (for ape/patch): http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/drawterm-ucs.diff.bz2 patch(1) format: http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/drawterm-x11-ucs.tar.bz2 I would appreciate adding this to the distribution. Sincerely, David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 06:52:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5886 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 06:52:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5882 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:52:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:52:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2809319CA1; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C89319BF5; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:52:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5EED219A72; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:51:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 032F319BB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:51:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BLovog006132 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:50:57 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2BLovKc006129 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:50:57 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm unicode input under X11 In-Reply-To: <200403112123.i2BLNOf3030387@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:50:57 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: that's actually a useful feature, thanks. i've stuck compiled binaries for Linux and FreeBSD on: http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/ andrey From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 08:00:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10207 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 08:00:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10203 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 08:00:56 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 08:00:56 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A41319C63; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:00:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C2F619C1B; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:00:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1FB3D19C29; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:59:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEF6C19BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:59:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BMwI7b030760 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:58:18 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2BMwIIp030759 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:58:18 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403112258.i2BMwIIp030759@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm unicode input under X11 In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:58:18 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > that's actually a useful feature, thanks. i've stuck compiled binaries > for Linux and FreeBSD on: > > http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/ Thanks. Looking at the sources, I cannot understand whether international keyboard is available on Windows, and don't have Windows to try. David From steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:19 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 08:04:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10387 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 08:04:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10383 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 08:04:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 08:04:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CDFCE19C75; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:04:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 706DF19C1B; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:04:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AF52F19C29; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:03:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from paris (cpc2-sout4-6-0-cust223.sot3.cable.ntl.com [81.111.117.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE63819BFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:03:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> From: steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:03:01 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I want to reinvent a wheel. I want to be able to send an email from home to work which will cause my work machine to cpu(1) back to me. To prevent mistakes and nasty people this should be cryptographicially signed, PGP already does this, but I don't fancy implementing or porting PGP. I was thinking of just an email with 2 attachements one being the command to execute, the other being an SHA1 hash of this command followed by a shared secret. The neatest way to check the has would be to pass the hash of the command to factotum and let it hash the secret and reply yea or nay. I could write a seperate program and use proto=pass to query factotum but why make it release secrets it needn't? Anyone see any flaws? Anyone know of facilities in factotum that do this already? Other (relevant :-) thoughts? -Steve From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 08:42:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12760 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 08:42:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12756 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 08:42:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 08:42:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7487119CAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:42:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA36819C4D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:42:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12E9919C4D; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:41:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1C9B19C86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2BNfGog006386 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:41:16 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2BNfGPr006383 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:41:16 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum In-Reply-To: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:41:16 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: you've looked at pipeto, right? you can easily embed relevant auth info in the header or subject line and catch it in pipeto. people have done it lots with procmail. what really worries me is that htmlfmt is executed for each HTML email that is viewed in plan9 suppose there was a bug in htmlfmt or any other app plan9 plumbs to by default as soon as i can exploit htmlfmt i could write a self-propagating virus for plan9. as matt says, nedmail does the same for images... andrey From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 08:55:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13644 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 08:55:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13640 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 08:55:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 08:55:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DEE119CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:55:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B872119C2F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:55:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4CD119C50; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:54:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF2C319AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 18:54:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:57:55 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I want to be able to send an email from home to work > which will cause my work machine to cpu(1) back to me. I've not tried this, but I think it should work. Why not run a cron job on the cpu at work (on your behalf and your factotum), that dials home, and once it authenticated itself, runs exportfs. On the home system you'd run a service that authenticates the incoming call and then posts the fd on /srv later you mount /srv/incoming to /n/someplace. The part i'm not sure of is the cron/factotum interaction. From ggm@apnic.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 09:04:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14665 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 09:04:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14659 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:04:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:04:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B35E19CCC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:04:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6DF319C2F; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:04:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C1E719C7A; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:03:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 554C119AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:03:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2C036ni026162 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:03:06 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum Message-Id: <20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.9claws17 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-unknown-netbsdelf1.6ZI) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.6 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.6 (notspam) BAYES_01,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:03:05 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: one time pad? easier to port/code than GPG, reasonably secure, easy to deploy. (in the class of hacks to tell the remote to call you back by some trigger event) you could implement a MD5 challenge/response daemon which didn't reveal your token over the wire pretty simply. I've seen mention of some very simple schemes based on sequenced event delivery eg send mail *and* some other event *and* some subsequent event, any one of which is less secure than the combination of all three from the same endpoint. -George From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 09:13:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15324 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 09:13:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15320 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:13:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:13:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39CE619CF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04FE719CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:13:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5226419CAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:12:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 372EB19C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:12:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <316337-25425>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:10:53 -0500 Message-ID: <00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> <20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:09:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > one time pad? key exchange & key security? From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 09:25:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16318 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 09:25:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16310 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:25:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:25:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7CE2E19CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9F0519C7A; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:25:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B11CA19CAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:24:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 769D719C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:24:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9124780337ba5fbd0bd5d14cff2fba5a@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum In-Reply-To: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:27:16 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: as well as the other good suggestions there's also port knocking http://www.portknocking.org which you can use like a combination lock m From ggm@apnic.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:20 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 09:31:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16878 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 09:31:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16873 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:31:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:31:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7DDA19CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:31:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E9C519CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:31:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC3DC19CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:30:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C61F419C86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:30:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2C0U9ni032764 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:30:09 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum Message-Id: <20040312103009.225d781d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: <00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> <20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net> <00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.9claws17 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-unknown-netbsdelf1.6ZI) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.349 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.349 (notspam) BAYES_30,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:30:09 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:09:29 +0100 "boyd, rounin" wrote: >> one time pad? > >key exchange & key security? yes. always an issue with otp. cost:benefit usually means making that kind of judgement call. -George From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 09:58:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19543 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 09:58:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19539 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:58:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:58:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69C8019BFE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:58:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCAC619CAC; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:58:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D01E19BFE; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:57:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 757CF19AC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:57:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum In-Reply-To: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 19:49:41 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: // ...I don't fancy implementing or porting PGP. FWIW, note taht PGP "just worked" at some point. the version numbers are foggy in my head just now, but i think it was the 2.x tree. geoff did the port first, but i recall doing it myself and it being pretty straight-forward. i've not been using it for a few years now, and have lost my work, but it might be worth looking at again. as i recall, newer versions didn't work without more effort than i was willing to put in. oh, and as an aside, on the naming thing: on lists like this, i tend to refer to people either by handle (user part of ema) or however they sign their name, if handle's too difficult for me to remember (or too long to type). just a note. ア From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 10:03:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20901 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 10:03:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20890 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 10:03:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 10:03:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC62219CF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:03:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 805EC19CC0; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:03:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A842B19C98; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:02:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7202D19CAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:02:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 17:02:29 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: pgp has already been trivially modified and compiled on plan 9, for what it's worth. (Calling it a port is a stretch.) I use it a little bit. I wouldn't want to send the mail in the clear, so I'd send it over TLS at minimum. Does it need to be mail that triggers the cpu command? Couldn't cpu trigger it just as well? That way you can use an encrypted cpu session and just run some command, either one that schedules the outbound cpu call or just makes the call: cpu -h work -c callhome From okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 10:10:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21640 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 10:10:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21636 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 10:10:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 10:10:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95D2419CC4; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D553C19C98; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 787A119C5C; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:09:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2E219AB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:09:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Kenji Okamoto MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] Are you alright? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:10:29 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ネモ and ゴルカ, are you alright? Kenji From bs@nospam.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:21 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 10:19:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22265 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 10:19:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22260 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 10:19:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 10:19:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 17E4119C63; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:19:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C02D319CA1; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:19:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 363D119C61; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:18:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 195C719C98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:18:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with SMTP id <2004031201181301500p7fi6e>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:18:13 +0000 Message-ID: <40510FE8.50709@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum References: <20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: <20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:18:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * George Michaelson wrote: > one time pad? > > easier to port/code than GPG, reasonably secure, easy to deploy. > > (in the class of hacks to tell the remote to call you back by some trigger event) > > you could implement a MD5 challenge/response daemon which didn't reveal your > token over the wire pretty simply. > > I've seen mention of some very simple schemes based on sequenced event delivery > eg send mail *and* some other event *and* some subsequent event, any one of > which is less secure than the combination of all three from the same endpoint. > > -George SASL & OTP (one time password)? From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 13:11:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6702 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 13:11:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6698 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 13:11:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 13:11:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D041119D18; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:11:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C7A919CF3; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:11:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80B6719B7E; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:10:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05ADC199F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 23:10:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <412ab5c78006a624ef160082aa60b007@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <7131c0c74ea686afc44d40cdaf2222f7@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 21:10:38 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In an earlier post titled "rm /lib/ndb/auth?", YAMANASHI Takeshi reported a behavior that looks inconsistent: basically, in authsrv.c, it appears that if the hostid and the uid in the ticket request are the same, /lib/ndb/auth is not consulted. Is this right? Is it working as designed? From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 14:32:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15128 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 14:32:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15124 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 14:32:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 14:32:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 153BA19CF3; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:32:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F04F719CE7; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:32:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D986D19BD2; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:31:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BE7719CC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:31:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2C5V9D20351 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:31:16 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <412ab5c78006a624ef160082aa60b007@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:30:30 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > In an earlier post titled "rm /lib/ndb/auth?", YAMANASHI Takeshi > reported a behavior that looks inconsistent: basically, in authsrv.c, > it appears that if the hostid and the uid in the ticket request are the > same, /lib/ndb/auth is not consulted. > > Is this right? Is it working as designed? Well, /lib/ndb/auth indicates the speaksfor relationship. Surely uid X can be assumed to speakfor uid X? ++L From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 14:48:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16656 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 14:48:57 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16610 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 14:48:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 14:48:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D13C19BD2; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:48:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7706C19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:48:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8938719BD2; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:47:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 658AA19CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24687 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2C5lK8185667; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:14 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 14:32:41 JST 2004, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > Well, /lib/ndb/auth indicates the speaksfor relationship. Surely uid > X can be assumed to speakfor uid X? Then, every users in a domain can start their processes on arbitary cpu servers whose host owners aren't allowed to speak for the user? Is this the way that the speaksfor relationship works? I thought the relationship can be used to restrict which users are allowed to run their process on cpu servers. I am still confused with the relationship... :) -- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 14:57:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17983 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 14:57:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17979 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 14:57:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 14:57:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C1F619D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E62F719D0C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0D3719CD5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:56:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 809D0199CC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:56:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2C5v5D21543 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:57:05 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <87e383d03aac6653cc8974d1f2d3b1c1@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:56:26 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > On Fri Mar 12 14:32:41 JST 2004, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: >> Well, /lib/ndb/auth indicates the speaksfor relationship. Surely uid >> X can be assumed to speakfor uid X? > > Then, every users in a domain can start their processes on > arbitary cpu servers whose host owners aren't allowed to speak > for the user? Is this the way that the speaksfor relationship > works? > Not that I can see. To be able to execute a process on a CPU server, you need to be authenticated on the file server that holds the executable. If the CPU server can't speakfor you, then you are blocked from using it. > I thought the relationship can be used to restrict which users > are allowed to run their process on cpu servers. I am still > confused with the relationship... :) I found it hard to grasp too, the mailing list archives will bear witness of that :-) But I suspect it is simpler than one expects, which is what confuses one. I have no doubt whatsoever that the speakfor relationship is quite sufficient as a security measure. ++L From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 14:58:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18030 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 14:58:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18026 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 14:58:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 14:58:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69F2419AA9; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:58:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08BE019CD5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:58:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54E1319CD5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from t40.swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 407AD19CB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=t40.swtch.com) by t40.swtch.com with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1B1ffV-000G0o-Mo for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:13 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:37:39 MST." From: "Russ Cox" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <61552.1079071029.1@t40.swtch.com> Message-Id: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:57:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The patch/* code should be used to submit patches to the Plan 9 > developers. see patch(1) for more information. buh? Last I checked this still didn't work since there is no publically writable Plan 9 server. Russ From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:02:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18342 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:02:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18335 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:02:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:02:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2668319D1C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:02:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E74B319A20; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:02:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8701D19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AA7FD19CD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:01:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 27572 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:01:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:01:43 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:01:42 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2C61g8186881; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:01:42 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:01:40 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 14:57:38 JST 2004, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > Not that I can see. To be able to execute a process on a CPU server, > you need to be authenticated on the file server that holds the > executable. But what if the CPU server stands alone? -- From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:16:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19901 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:15:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19801 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:15:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:15:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81C0D19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:15:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B029D19BF4; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:15:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EB9219CD5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:14:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5639919C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:14:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:19:50 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> The patch/* code should be used to submit patches to the Plan 9 >> developers. see patch(1) for more information. > > buh? Last I checked this still didn't work since there > is no publically writable Plan 9 server. > > Russ nemo has been submitting patches there, i thought you've enabled it: home% 9fs sources post... home% cd /n/sources home% ls -l /n/sources ... d-rwxrwxrwx M 60 glenda sys 0 Mar 3 09:51 patch ... home% ls -l patch d-rwxrwxr-x M 60 nemo sys 0 Mar 3 00:39 patch/defaultmkfile d-rwxrwxr-x M 60 nemo sys 0 Mar 3 09:51 patch/httplength d-rwxrwxr-x M 60 nemo sys 0 Jan 15 08:45 patch/manfix d-rwxrwxr-x M 60 nemo sys 0 Jan 14 02:48 patch/stats d-rwxrwxr-x M 60 nemo sys 0 Jan 23 00:43 patch/test home% andrey From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:17:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20153 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:17:27 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20149 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:17:27 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:17:27 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 330B319D26; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B0F619CA6; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:17:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CD4B19D0C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:16:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8813919BF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:16:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2C6H6D22393 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:17:07 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <5f494fc39ea3204a9915d30a04ab1da6@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:16:28 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But what if the CPU server stands alone? At the risk of sounding facetious, it is not a CPU server, then, is it? If you're trying to lock out certain users from a standalone CPU server, you must make sure that they have no presence in /adm/users. I don't believe they will be able to access the CPU services in that situation. ++L From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:37:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22364 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:37:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22356 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:37:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:37:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1E3019AE5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2244C19BF4; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:37:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A050119CA6; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:36:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1271919B28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:36:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2C6Ya7b033949 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2C6YanB033948 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403120634.i2C6YanB033948@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > nemo has been submitting patches there, i thought you've enabled it: nemo has write access to sources; lc /n/sources/nemo From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:40:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22519 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:40:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22515 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:40:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:40:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4605919AE5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:40:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AEED199D7; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:40:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 76A0619B28; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:39:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7ADE19992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:39:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2C6bh7b033990 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:37:43 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2C6bhBt033989 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:37:43 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403120637.i2C6bhBt033989@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:37:43 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > The patch/* code should be used to submit patches to the Plan 9 > > developers. see patch(1) for more information. > > buh? Last I checked this still didn't work since there > is no publically writable Plan 9 server. just 9fs sources bind -bc /tmp /n/sources/patch then the patch archive is in /tmp and can be delivered to Bell Labs through other paths. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:44:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22961 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:44:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22957 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:44:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:44:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D784819BF4; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:44:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD6AC19A2A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:44:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 26C3119A95; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:43:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B67CE19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:43:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403120634.i2C6YanB033948@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:48:49 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> >> nemo has been submitting patches there, i thought you've enabled it: > > nemo has write access to sources; lc /n/sources/nemo no way! when did that happen? From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 15:49:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23509 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 15:49:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23505 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:49:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:49:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C438D19C7A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA5D119980; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:49:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2EC8019AE5; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:48:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 53B5119A2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:48:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 38442 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 06:48:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:48:45 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 06:48:45 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2C6mh8188580; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:48:43 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <3b5834199d8cc5ab8d3b7884ac0d9abc@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:48:38 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 15:17:28 JST 2004, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > If you're trying to lock out certain users from a standalone CPU > server, you must make sure that they have no presence in /adm/users. If users don't have their uid listed in /adm/users, standalone cpu servers still permit them to log in. The users' file accesses are treated as `none' in that situation. How shall I lock out certain users on cpu server, I wonder? -- From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 16:24:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27036 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 16:24:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27032 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 16:24:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 16:24:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CF0B19CCE; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3340219B83; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:24:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 308B419BD2; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:23:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF8A519B40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:23:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0be8de40a77839b601f48306ac0bf54b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-sjmoaiqemrjornckbexlpyktmy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:23:51 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-sjmoaiqemrjornckbexlpyktmy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When I was using the bitsy, to make it easier to merge the changes. I though it was easier to use patch w/o binding a local directory (as David suggested). --upas-sjmoaiqemrjornckbexlpyktmy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Mar 12 07:44:39 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 244CA19980; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:44:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD6AC19A2A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:44:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 26C3119A95; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:43:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B67CE19980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:43:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] drawterm prints blanks instead of characters From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403120634.i2C6YanB033948@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 22:48:49 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> >> nemo has been submitting patches there, i thought you've enabled it: > > nemo has write access to sources; lc /n/sources/nemo no way! when did that happen? --upas-sjmoaiqemrjornckbexlpyktmy-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 13 17:06:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 16:26:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27184 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 16:26:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27180 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 16:26:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 16:26:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB18F19CE7; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:26:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98E6519BA9; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:26:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84CEA19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:25:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A10AC19CDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:24:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2C7P9D26137 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:25:10 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <6e9d4bcd80f64d3b19be74237b5a272b@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <3b5834199d8cc5ab8d3b7884ac0d9abc@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:24:30 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > How shall I lock out certain users on cpu server, I wonder? Presumably, you have authenticated users, but you don't want them to access one or more standalone CPU servers. Then I think you'll need to list them in /adm/users and make sure their namespace locks them out. In my opinion, being aware of the users' identity is preferable to relying on defaults, as long as the authentication and users lists are managed together. There may be a different approach, but I'd be happy with the above. ++L From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 16:29:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27574 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 16:29:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27570 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 16:29:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 16:29:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD91919D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E784019C50; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:29:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E1AF119C50; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:28:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30A4419C81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:28:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <30fde69080889b36a084eb124b6094af@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: okamoto@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Are you alright? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cwuobygwmfnibkzhkihrktdnqk" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:28:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cwuobygwmfnibkzhkihrktdnqk Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes. Thanks for the asking. We all are fine. PS: Since you asked to the list, I'm replying there. --upas-cwuobygwmfnibkzhkihrktdnqk Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Mar 12 02:10:42 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A29B819CB7; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D553C19C98; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:10:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 787A119C5C; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:09:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2E219AB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 11 Mar 2004 20:09:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Kenji Okamoto MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: [9fans] Are you alright? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:10:29 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =E3=83=8D=E3=83=A2 and =E3=82=B4=E3=83=AB=E3=82=AB, are you alright? Kenji --upas-cwuobygwmfnibkzhkihrktdnqk-- From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 16:43:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29249 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 16:43:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29241 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 16:43:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 16:43:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA75E19D1C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:43:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 132C719CC0; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:43:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 36B2719CDD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:42:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D454619CD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 02:42:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <86e5d1c78dc35524545333c9b4c4043b@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] One way to make patch work? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:42:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I volunteer as a `patch gateway' while a better way to get patch working for all is found. Would it be reasonable if... - I open accounts for you in a file system here, used to send patches - I run a cron that collects those patches and puts them on sources From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 18:07:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4854 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 18:07:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4850 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 18:07:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 18:07:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B5B819D18; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:07:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DDD819CDD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:07:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFEA919CA6; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:03:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6230019CD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:03:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12976 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:02:43 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:02:43 -0000 Message-ID: <01a301c40810$fd82e750$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <404e4fd4_2@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: constant string Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:56:38 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: undefined or indeterminate behaviour means what it says. same with the hypot() case. undefined, and the program crashed. pragmatism determines what either U does in ?c. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Pichler" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 8:47 PM Subject: [9fans] Re: constant string From brucee@chunder.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:26 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 18:19:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7489 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 18:19:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6620 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 18:16:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 18:16:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F25719CDD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:16:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F2C119B87; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:16:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B76519B2B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:15:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A167D19A21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:15:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 31303 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 09:14:30 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 09:14:30 -0000 Message-ID: <022301c40812$a2e0c6d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com><20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net><00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> <20040312103009.225d781d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:07:34 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: an international phone call is often needed, talking in silly speak of course, hey boyd? brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Michaelson" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 11:30 AM Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum > On Fri, 12 Mar 2004 01:09:29 +0100 "boyd, rounin" wrote: > > >> one time pad? > > > >key exchange & key security? > > yes. always an issue with otp. cost:benefit usually means making that kind of > judgement call. > > -George > > From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 18:30:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10789 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 18:30:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9456 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 18:25:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 18:25:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB25819D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 855C619AD6; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:25:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AB4B19B36; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:24:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (mta06-svc.ntlworld.com [62.253.162.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B283E19AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 04:24:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from spindrift ([81.111.117.223]) by mta06-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with SMTP id <20040312092456.TDNL19383.mta06-svc.ntlworld.com@spindrift> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:24:56 +0000 Message-ID: <004b01c40813$bb9261b0$df756f51@ntlworld.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:23:50 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Thanks to all who replied. I realised I didn't say why I want to do this. At work my plan9 system is very carefully screened behind a firewall. The only way I can make somthing happen on it is either cron or emai (via pipeto). My idea was to send just a plaintext email that contains two attachements. One being an rc script and the other an authenticating signature for that command. I think this is secure enough as the signature (hash) would need a shared secret to be validated. The idea of hashing a sequence count is interesting but in the context of email as a transport (and our unreliable pop3 server) I am wary of going down this route. The real questions are: Should I attempt to add a non-standard (not PGP) signature verification algorithm to factotum? Or, should I just do a quick bodge and not worry, because no-one else would ever want such a thing? Another question: At home my plan9 system is straight onto broadband but I believe it's secure - it only listens on the cpu and exportfs, am I being naieve (again :-), tell me I don't need to buy a firewall... -Steve From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 20:39:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24179 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 20:39:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24175 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 20:39:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 20:39:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2C7D19D2F; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:39:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D99D19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:39:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C019919D18; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:38:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 622FB19A72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:38:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317536-6473>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:37:05 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd01c40826$2b1bfb10$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:35:43 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > But what if the CPU server stands alone? Only the cheese stands alone. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 21:08:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26313 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 21:08:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26309 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 21:08:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 21:08:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3DD8D19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:08:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E7D119B47; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:08:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DAAFF19B7D; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C00DC19B47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:07:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3751225-30959>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 06:50:30 -0500 Message-ID: <020401c40828$0a571610$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com><20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net><00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> <20040312103009.225d781d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> <022301c40812$a2e0c6d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:49:05 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > an international phone call is often needed, talking in > silly speak of course, hey boyd? yeah, idiolects and shared 'secret' data. From z@xv.m Sat Mar 13 17:06:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 21:14:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26675 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 21:14:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26671 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 21:14:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 21:14:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8750819D47; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:14:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8CE019D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:14:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E87C319C9B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:13:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (139.Red-81-39-121.pooles.rima-tde.net [81.39.121.139]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B909819B9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:13:48 -0500 (EST) From: z@xv.m To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="30437111" Message-Id: <20040312121348.B909819B9D@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] read it immediately Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:14:00 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.4 required=5.0 tests=MICROSOFT_EXECUTABLE, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --30437111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) Found virus WORM_NETSKY.B in file details.doc.scr The uncleanable file details.doc.scr is moved to /etc/iscan/virus/virlsgyve. If you have questions, contact administrator. --------------------------------------------------------- --30437111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit thats wrong --30437111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------------ Virus Warning Message (on niscan1) details.doc.scr is removed from here because it contains a virus. --------------------------------------------------------- --30437111-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 21:18:19 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27408 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 21:18:09 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27276 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 21:17:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 21:17:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B22019D4B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F9AB19D1C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:17:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FEA719D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:16:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07B0C19B9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:16:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3775587-30958>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:15:40 -0500 Message-ID: <024001c4082b$8cc6ef00$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <559b5ec89e2cfd991a8152e0ceddc88c@snellwilcox.com><20040312100305.62df0a5a@as-tech-l.apnic.net><00da01c407c6$4aea88e0$67844051@SOMA> <20040312103009.225d781d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> <022301c40812$a2e0c6d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> <020401c40828$0a571610$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:14:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: although, i think i have figured out a 'near' OTP [short messages, frequent key changes]. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 21:39:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28919 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 21:39:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28915 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 21:39:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 21:39:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3D2919D6D; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:39:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3319819D5A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:39:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EAFC619D5A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:38:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 986C419D4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:38:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3f42b157890205fce44e38e690ef7043@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zgbvsbvtyjmkbhtiqsxniwgtyy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 07:38:20 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zgbvsbvtyjmkbhtiqsxniwgtyy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You got it. The speaksfor relationship is used to allow a user that has cpu'ld (or ssh'd or telnet'd...) into a cpu server to access resources off of that cpu server. Assume you've telnet'd in but the file server is on another machine. In order to have any files at all to continue, your process (via the factotum on the cpu server) must authenticate to the file server. However the only keys in that factotum are those of the cpu server's owner. Therefore, that owner must be able to 'speak for' you to the file server. It does that by getting a ticket from the auth server, encrypted in the file server owner's key, that identifies the caller as you. Keeping people out of a machine is another problem altogether. In our world, having a key in a host's domain is equivalent to having access to the host. The way we lock people out of a host is to not give them a key into its domain. We run a number of authentication domains at the Labs for that reason. This was a lack of forsight on my part. Putting a system in a separate auth domain can be a pain for all the users involved. Some flavor of ACL would be nicer; i.e. the ability to say, user Alice can only do the following things on host X. We already have something like that in the form of /lib/ndb/consoledb. Perhaps we could do something similar on a per service basis, i.e., a servicesdb that each service (or listen itself) can consult to determine yay or nay for the service. For example, you could make /lib/ndb/common: tcp=cpu port=17013 uid=!presotto uid=* That way, stand alone servers could control who cold use its services. I'm not sold yet on the form it should take, but I think it is necessary. --upas-zgbvsbvtyjmkbhtiqsxniwgtyy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 12 00:48:39 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 12 00:48:36 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F4D219B1B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:48:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73FED19CE7; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:48:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8938719BD2; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:47:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 658AA19CC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 00:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24687 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 05:47:20 -0000 Received: from valinore by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2C5lK8185667; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:14 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 14:32:41 JST 2004, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > Well, /lib/ndb/auth indicates the speaksfor relationship. Surely uid > X can be assumed to speakfor uid X? Then, every users in a domain can start their processes on arbitary cpu servers whose host owners aren't allowed to speak for the user? Is this the way that the speaksfor relationship works? I thought the relationship can be used to restrict which users are allowed to run their process on cpu servers. I am still confused with the relationship... :) -- --upas-zgbvsbvtyjmkbhtiqsxniwgtyy-- From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 22:07:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1627 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 22:07:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 848 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 22:04:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 22:04:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EA3719D63; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:04:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8544E19B38; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:04:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70E8819D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:03:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A59719980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:03:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum In-Reply-To: <004b01c40813$bb9261b0$df756f51@ntlworld.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:03:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 04:25:49 EST 2004, plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com wrote: > The real questions are: > Should I attempt to add a non-standard (not PGP) signature verification > algorithm to factotum? Or, should I just do a quick bodge and not > worry, because no-one else would ever want such a thing? I'ld rather you just finish the pgp implementation that I started and rsc has gotten to (more or less?) work. Perhaps he'll give you the code. > > Another question: > > At home my plan9 system is straight onto broadband but I believe it's > secure - it only listens on the cpu and exportfs, am I being naieve (again > :-), tell me I don't need to buy a firewall... Yes, modulo my bugs in the security stuff. Our password algorithm is only DES. Brute force would eventually work. We should be moving to a new alg. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 22:19:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2877 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 22:19:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2873 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 22:19:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 22:19:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A9A9819D7A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:19:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E756A19D73; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:19:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 68BB119D72; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:18:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D87419B38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:18:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320340-6469>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:16:23 -0500 Message-ID: <025d01c40834$05b6e390$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:14:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yes, modulo my bugs in the security stuff. Our password algorithm is > only DES. Brute force would eventually work. We should be moving to > a new alg. http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/4/factotum By default when factotum starts it looks for a secstore(1) account on $auth for the user and, if one exists, prompts for a secstore password in order to fetch the file factotum, which should contain control file commands. An example would be key dom=x.com proto=p9sk1 user=boyd !hex=26E522ADE2BBB2A229 key proto=rsa service=ssh size=1024 ek=3B !dk=... where the first line sets a password for challenge/response authentication, strong against dictionary attack by being a long random string, and the second line sets a public/private keypair for ssh authentication, generated by ssh_genkey (see ssh(1)). From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 13 17:06:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 22:36:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4502 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 22:36:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4498 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 22:36:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 22:36:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C3E519D72; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:36:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCD9A19B06; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:36:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C67F319B04; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:35:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA97619B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:35:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum In-Reply-To: <025d01c40834$05b6e390$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:35:20 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri Mar 12 08:19:44 EST 2004, boyd@insultant.net wrote: > > Yes, modulo my bugs in the security stuff. Our password algorithm is > > only DES. Brute force would eventually work. We should be moving to > > a new alg. > > http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/4/factotum > > By default when factotum starts it looks for a secstore(1) account on $auth > for the user and, if one exists, prompts for a secstore password in order to > fetch the file factotum, which should contain control file commands. An > example would be > > key dom=x.com proto=p9sk1 user=boyd !hex=26E522ADE2BBB2A229 > key proto=rsa service=ssh size=1024 ek=3B !dk=... > > where the first line sets a password for challenge/response > authentication, strong against dictionary attack by being a long random > string, and the second line sets a public/private keypair for ssh > authentication, generated by ssh_genkey (see ssh(1)). > Yup, I figured everyone would want to be boyd. If you are implying that we already use a better algorithm, that's not really true for p9sk, only for secstore. If you are implying that we already have a better algorithm implemented, you're right up to a point. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 12 23:07:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6390 invoked by uid 1020); 12 Mar 2004 23:07:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6386 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 23:07:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 23:07:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC44E19D35; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:07:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF24A19BA9; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:07:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C802219BAE; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5909F19BA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:06:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321829-23979>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:04:04 -0500 Message-ID: <028201c4083a$ac71c8c0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 15:02:35 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Yup, I figured everyone would want to be boyd. If you are implying that we > already use a better algorithm, that's not really true for p9sk, only > for secstore. If you are implying that we already have a better algorithm > implemented, you're right up to a point. i'm implying that DES died 10+ years back. i carried out the odd 'experiment' with some fast h/w and large amounts of disk [then]. DES unix password cracking came down to a grep of 4096 files, so a few seconds. this was done for internal, sanctioned [allowed] security issues. i knew it was dead. i just wanted to test it. sadly, the 'experiment' was terminated, once it had proven its point. 3DES is another issue. From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 00:13:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11157 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 00:13:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11153 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 00:13:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 00:13:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C3DFA19D27; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:13:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D0E519D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:13:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6CAA419BCC; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9DEA519B8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:12:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 44820 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:12:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:12:11 -0000 Received: from p9c by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2CFCA8214146; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 00:12:10 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <6567e0441b415d4d487b878b9fabd202@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 00:12:09 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Only the cheese stands alone. Nihonjin dakara, kono joke ga wakaranai.... :) -- From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sat Mar 13 17:06:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 00:46:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15715 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 00:46:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15711 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 00:46:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 00:46:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5913C19D49; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:46:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5C5219D29; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:46:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E28619D26; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:45:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4FFB019D08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:45:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 52678 invoked from network); 12 Mar 2004 15:45:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:45:41 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Mar 2004 15:45:41 -0000 Received: from p9c by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2CFjf8221602; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 00:45:41 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 00:45:39 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=HOT_NASTY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Keeping people out of a machine is another problem altogether. : > Perhaps we could do something similar on a per service basis, > i.e., a servicesdb that each service (or listen itself) can > consult to determine yay or nay for the service. For example, > you could make /lib/ndb/common: > > tcp=cpu port=17013 uid=!presotto uid=* I thought of similar control, but based on the idea of tcpwrappers, like: /lib/ndb/local: ipnet=xxx.xx.xx.xx ipmask=xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx permit=tcp10 permit=tcp20 deny=all using ndb/ipquery to determine if a connection is allowed or not. ndb is so powerful, isn't it? P.S Thank you for all who helped me to understand the speaksfor relationship. -- From kodis@mail630.gsfc.nasa.gov Sat Mar 13 17:06:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 01:39:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23430 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 01:38:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23397 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 01:38:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 01:38:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B44419D61; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:38:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B83D19D11; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:38:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4286219D35; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:37:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF8BC19C56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:37:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B1pS6-0002Np-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:24:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: John Kodis Message-ID: Organization: NASA Goddard Space Flight Center (skates.gsfc.nasa.gov) References: , <028201c4083a$ac71c8c0$67844051@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:23:39 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In article <028201c4083a$ac71c8c0$67844051@SOMA>, boyd, rounin wrote: > i'm implying that DES died 10+ years back. i carried out the odd > 'experiment' with some fast h/w and large amounts of disk [then]. > DES unix password cracking came down to a grep of 4096 files, so a > few seconds. Do you mean fast general-purpose hardware, or fast special-purpose hardware? Could you explain your general approach? -- John Kodis Goddard Space Flight Center kodis@mail630.gsfc.nasa.gov Greenbelt, Maryland, USA Phone: 301-286-7376 Fax: 301-286-1771 From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 02:01:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24739 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 02:01:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24735 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 02:01:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 02:01:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E69A619D8A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:01:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48A2A19D7D; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:01:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F2A819D72; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D1FB19D63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 12:00:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:54:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. I'm now setting up several. What's customary for configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? Brantley From rob@mightycheese.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 03:09:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29198 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 03:09:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29194 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 03:09:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 03:09:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 429C419D47; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D380A19CDA; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:09:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8553819B8E; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:08:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBBA219CDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:08:32 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [10.0.2.128] (65.106.82.162.ptr.us.xo.net [65.106.82.162]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2CI8US8023940 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:08:30 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <4F129E0C-7450-11D8-B24B-000A95D0C144@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:08:48 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: this is a stupid error. an assertion failure should be reduced to a warning. /sys/src/cmd/acme/text.c:194,195 should be replaced by: if(t->ncache!=0 || t->file->b.nc || t->w==nil || t!=&t->w->body) error("text.load"); if(t->w->isdir && t->file->nname==0){ warning(nil, "empty directory name\n"); return 0; } in short, move the check for empty directory name out of the test for error. -rob On Mar 9, 2004, at 5:48 AM, Noah Evans wrote: > Awesome! another thing, have you ever tried to "Get" a nil string(when > you deleted the previous filename)? It's no biggie because I know to > avoid the error, but it might be interesting nevertheless. > > Noah > > acme: text.load: 'Del' file does not exist > acme 5965: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aecd > > acid: stk() > abort()+0x0 /sys/src/libc/9sys/abort.c:6 > error(s=0x4136c)+0x33 /sys/src/cmd/acme/util.c:55 > textload(t=0x82648,file=0x99d68,q0=0x0,setqid=0x1)+0x2c > /sys/src/cmd/acme/text.c:193 > get(et=0x8256c,flag1=0x1,t=0x82648,argt=0x0,arg=0x833de,narg=0x0)+0x1fe > /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:497 > execute(t=0x8256c,aq0=0xc,aq1=0xc,external=0x0,argt=0x0)+0x1ec > /sys/src/cmd/acme/exec.c:190 > mousethread()+0x49d /sys/src/cmd/acme/acme.c:550 > launcher386(arg=0x0,f=0x2276)+0x10 /sys/src/libthread/386.c:10 > 0xfefefefe ?file?:0 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "rob pike, esq." > Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2004 0:28 am > Subject: Re: [9fans] acme suicide > >>> I tried 'Edit , | man 2 9p' in the tag of an acme window and got: >>> >>> panic: D2B called on non-block 11a8c8 (double-free?) >>> acme 1436: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0003aed5 >> >> this is kind of amazing. i was testing something for rsc and >> crashed acme. >> tracked it down, fixed it. it was a day 1 bug; amazing it had >> never happened. >> then i decided to track down your bug. turns out it's the same thing. >> amazing coincidence. >> >> here's the fix: >> >> r% yesterday -d /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c >> diff /n/dump/2004/0308/sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c >> /sys/src/cmd/acme/elog.c173c173 >> < if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && (q0+nr)-f- >>> elog.q0>> if(f->elog.type==Insert && q0==f->elog.q0 && f- >>> elog.nr+nr> >> -rob >> >> From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 13 17:06:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 03:38:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31051 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 03:38:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31047 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 03:38:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 03:38:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12B3419BCB; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62BD119B5B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:38:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CBA2219B7C; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:37:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D717319A1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:37:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <706d07685ee955d9b01183a33b173b73@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] perl and locales Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 10:43:00 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: what would it take to set the default locale in perl to *.UTF-8? currently string functions break when faced with unicode characters, especially 'length'. the normal way of changing the locale: use locale; use POSIX qw "locale_h"; setlocale(...); doesn't work because "use POSIX" fails. perl also reports that it _has_ been compiled with locale support. lastly, does anyone besides me care? andrey From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 03:40:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31162 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 03:40:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31158 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 03:40:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 03:40:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30AE119D4D; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:40:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1365A19B39; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:40:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2DB9C19C33; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:39:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61F6819B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:39:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] perl and locales From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <706d07685ee955d9b01183a33b173b73@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:44:49 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > lastly, does anyone besides me care? not me! From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 03:53:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31991 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 03:53:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31987 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 03:53:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 03:53:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84FAE19B1A; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCADF19A8F; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:53:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8E9819BCD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:52:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F48519B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 13:52:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8e1d03995dd2b9c5039c44c131219f35@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] perl and locales From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 11:53:10 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> lastly, does anyone besides me care? > > not me! me neither! From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:09:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 667 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:09:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 663 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:09:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:09:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D5B3919D49; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:09:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 342F419BCE; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:09:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF0C219BA7; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:08:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FD6219B0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:08:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322703-6472>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:07:30 -0500 Message-ID: <02d001c40865$009c9f40$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:05:35 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I thought of similar control, but based on the idea of tcpwrappers, like: tcpwrappers was written to 'fix' the non-existant IP security. if you don't want to listen on the port, don't listen on the port. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:12:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 914 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:12:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 910 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:12:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:12:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A03219C0F; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:12:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB20A19B39; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:12:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 786CC19B38; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:11:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B61719B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:11:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <336630-1555>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:09:22 -0500 Message-ID: <02d601c40865$436c59f0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <6567e0441b415d4d487b878b9fabd202@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:07:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Only the cheese stands alone. > > Nihonjin dakara, kono joke ga wakaranai.... :) not being japanese won't help you understand the joke. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:13:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 980 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:13:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 976 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:13:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:13:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91FD119D68; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:13:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8DAB19D5B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:13:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1CFBA19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BDAE19C0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <333649-14360>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:10:40 -0500 Message-ID: <02e201c40865$71842020$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:08:45 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Do you mean fast general-purpose hardware, or fast special-purpose > hardware? Could you explain your general approach? fast GP hardware meets brute force. From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:14:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1107 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:14:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1103 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:14:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:14:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B24019D4B; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:14:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9AC519D68; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:14:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79E5C19D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:13:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4FF519C0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:13:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2CJDUCi005305 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:13:30 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2CJDUfO004394 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:13:30 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2CJDTA05825 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:13:29 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403121913.i2CJDTA05825@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 09 Mar 2004 11:06:28 -0500." References: From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:13:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multipart MIME message. --==_Exmh_-2091723110 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I asked: > > Is the support for pcmcia disks only in the > > ipaq (bitsy) kernel, or also in the pc one? and jmk replied: > there is some disabled code in pc/sdata.c which i put in just to see > if it would work: thanks! I have it working now. took me (quite) some time to find working numbers for port and irq. I tried guessing them using info from aux/pcmcia, /dev/irqalloc and /dev/ioalloc, I suppose I'm not smart at this. Is there a better way? I choose the first default configuration from aux/pcmcia -- naive question alert :-) just curious: Are there in general reasons to favor one over the other? (I attach the output of aux/pcmcia at the end) Somehow this worked more automatic on the bitsy, I recall. Is life easier on the bitsy wrt automatic choosing irq's? Or has more effort (default irq's) been put in for the bitsy? (I know/think more effort has been put in there wrt the possibility of sending a configure command to - what was it? - pcm?ctl ?) Rephrased/Related: just curious: are there intrincic differences between the bitsy and the pc that make things easier in one place and harder in another? For sake of completeness, for my laptop the following (inserted at the right place in sdata.c) made it work. I really have no idea how generally useful the irq is. if(channel == -1) { isa.port = 0x200; /* toshiba tecra 8000 */ isa.irq = 10; /* toshiba tecra 8000 */ channel = pcmspecial("MK5002MPL", &isa); } Axel. --==_Exmh_-2091723110 Content-Type: text/plain ; name="mk5002mpl"; charset=us-ascii Content-Description: mk5002mpl Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="mk5002mpl" device 2048 bytes of 100ns IO+MEM version 4.1 TOSHIBA MK5002MPL configuration registers at (0)0x200 (1)0x202 (2)0x204 (3)0x206 configuration 0 (default) memory device, Ready/Busy active Memory Wait required Vcc: Vnominal 5000000uV Iavg 400mA Ipeak 500mA Ipowerdown 60mA memory address range 0x0 - 0x800 configuration 0 Vcc: Vnominal 3300000uV Ipeak 500mA configuration 1 (default) I/O device, Ready/Busy active Vcc: Vnominal 5000000uV Iavg 400mA Ipeak 500mA Ipowerdown 60mA IO space 4 address lines selectable 8bit or 8&16bit access interrupts:level:pulse:shared, 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15 configuration 1 Vcc: Vnominal 3300000uV Ipeak 500mA configuration 2 (default) I/O device, Ready/Busy active Vcc: Vnominal 5000000uV Iavg 400mA Ipeak 500mA Ipowerdown 60mA IO space 10 address lines selectable 8bit or 8&16bit access 1f0 - 1f7 3f6 - 3f7 interrupts:level:pulse:shared, 14 configuration 2 Vcc: Vnominal 3300000uV Ipeak 500mA configuration 3 (default) I/O device, Ready/Busy active Vcc: Vnominal 5000000uV Iavg 400mA Ipeak 500mA Ipowerdown 60mA IO space 10 address lines selectable 8bit or 8&16bit access 170 - 177 376 - 377 interrupts:level:pulse:shared, 14 configuration 3 Vcc: Vnominal 3300000uV Ipeak 500mA --==_Exmh_-2091723110-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:19:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1440 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:19:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1436 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:19:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:19:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18A1719D63; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:19:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B9D819D5E; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:19:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0033219D17; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:18:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A11E119ADD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:18:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <331674-23973>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:16:46 -0500 Message-ID: <031301c40866$4b36b760$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8e1d03995dd2b9c5039c44c131219f35@9netics.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] perl and locales MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 20:14:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i'm pretty sure my position on perl is clear. From rog@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:33 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 04:47:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3206 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 04:47:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3202 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 04:47:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 04:47:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 475E619C43; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA6819B7D; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:47:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9DD9B19B8E; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:46:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBB2A19B5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:46:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <765092c31e27a92ba834782e6a4bdfcd@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:52:24 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh, and as an aside, on the naming thing: on lists > like this, i tend to refer to people either by > handle (user part of ema) or however they sign > their name, if handle's too difficult for me to > remember (or too long to type). just a note. i do the same, which is why i found the okamoto affair a bit difficult... i'd refer to Kenji Okamoto as "okamoto" in the same way i might refer to Jim McKie as "jmk", just 'cos that's his username. i'm glad it wasn't me that blundered. From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 13 17:06:34 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 06:08:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8559 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 06:08:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8555 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 06:08:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 06:08:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C4DD019D26; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:08:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7855519B0F; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:08:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0407919C06; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A453219B38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:07:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2CL7ojt029571 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:07:50 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2CL7oGZ024455 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:07:50 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2CL7ofQ023460 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:07:50 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] perl and locales In-Reply-To: <8e1d03995dd2b9c5039c44c131219f35@9netics.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 14:07:50 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 12 Mar 2004 9nut@9netics.com wrote: > >> lastly, does anyone besides me care? > > > > not me! > > me neither! > one could argue that a 'perl-proof' os is a good thing. ron From cnielsen@pobox.com Sat Mar 13 17:06:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 09:53:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24443 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 09:53:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24439 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 09:53:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 09:53:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D22919B45; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FC8E19B45; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:53:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B04BF19BCD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:52:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90DBE19B31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D75AE66C44; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by cassie.foobarbaz.net (tmda-sendmail, from uid 1000); Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:49 -0800 (PST) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers Message-ID: <20040313005247.GD7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i From: Christopher Nielsen X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.0.2 (Bold Forbes) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 11:54:43AM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. > I'm now setting up several. What's customary for > configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. > and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? That's exactly what I did. It works quite well for me. I'd be curious to hear other people's solutions, though. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From ekarttun@cs.helsinki.fi Sat Mar 13 20:07:36 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 13 18:52:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6725 invoked by uid 1020); 13 Mar 2004 18:52:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6721 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2004 18:52:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 13 Mar 2004 18:52:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A34519BFC; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 04:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4909519BD1; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 04:52:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D348719BD1; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 04:51:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cs.helsinki.fi (courier.cs.helsinki.fi [128.214.9.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C04A19B30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 04:51:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (melkki.cs.helsinki.fi [::ffff:128.214.48.122]) (IDENT: root, AUTH: PLAIN cs-relay, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,168bits,DES-CBC3-SHA) by mail.cs.helsinki.fi with esmtp; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 11:51:11 +0200 Received: from melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2D9pAkZ019708 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 11:51:10 +0200 Received: (from ekarttun@localhost) by melkki.cs.helsinki.fi (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id i2D9pAs5019706 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 11:51:10 +0200 From: Einar Karttunen To: Plan9 ML <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-ID: <20040313095110.GA19622@melkki.cs.Helsinki.FI> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] Installing extra software - replica/pull fails Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 11:51:10 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello The extra software from bell-labs that is distributed as iso.bz2 seems to be quite hard to install. After unpacking & mounting one is faced with a problem: replica/pull fails because it assumes kfs. As a solution one can allways tar the files inside the mountpoint and extract them in the right place, but something easier would be nice. (like e.g. scripts working with fossil or instructions how to do it on a fossilized system in the README) - Einar Karttunen From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 06:15:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18286 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 06:15:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18282 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 06:15:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 06:15:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2E6819C32; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:15:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E132D19C32; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:15:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6D53519BFD; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:14:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F32C419B5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:14:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2DLCi7b064835 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:12:45 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2DLChD5064834 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:12:43 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403132112.i2DLChD5064834@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] ndb? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:12:43 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've pulled updates yesterday, and today, after a reboot, ndb/cs does not set sysname any more. What has changed? David From matt@proweb.co.uk Sun Mar 14 09:21:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 06:22:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18583 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 06:22:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18579 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 06:22:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 06:22:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFA8619C4A; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:22:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D99419C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:22:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3417319BE0; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:21:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA1DF19BE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:21:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5b217b7c3630a666168baa0c566c4dfe@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb? In-Reply-To: <200403132112.i2DLChD5064834@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 21:23:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man diff From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 06:23:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18638 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 06:23:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18634 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 06:23:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 06:23:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEFF819C92; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:23:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 065B719BFD; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:23:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5ECD019C4F; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:22:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62EA119BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:22:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2DLLD7b064889 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:21:13 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2DLLDSN064888 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:21:13 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403132121.i2DLLDSN064888@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb? In-Reply-To: <200403132112.i2DLChD5064834@adat.davidashen.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:21:13 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I've pulled updates yesterday, and today, after a reboot, ndb/cs does not > set sysname any more. What has changed? Resolve, the replica has overwritten /lib/ndb/local; I must have done something wrong for that to happen. From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 06:27:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18931 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 06:27:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18927 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 06:27:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 06:27:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D54D719C6C; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BFDC19BFD; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:27:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED30E19C3A; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:26:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7DB419C09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:26:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2DLP47b064920 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:25:04 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2DLP4aB064919 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:25:04 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403132125.i2DLP4aB064919@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb? In-Reply-To: <5b217b7c3630a666168baa0c566c4dfe@juice.thebigchoice.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:25:04 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > man diff > I know how to use diff. I have looked at the changes in ndb and could not figure out what could affect ndb/cs and its processing of /lib/ndb. And asked only then. Aren't you tired of mentoring me? Something has happened to replica db with long file names in images for faces -- my other local changes have been overwritten too after that error. I have only noticed it now, but I have a backup. David From matt@proweb.co.uk Sun Mar 14 09:21:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 06:31:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19130 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 06:31:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19126 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 06:31:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 06:31:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E725219C7D; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:31:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22F4C19C2C; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:31:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9A4E19C3A; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:30:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56E0A19BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:30:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7ea3a51f558dd15b9856deed36214fcb@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ndb? In-Reply-To: <200403132125.i2DLP4aB064919@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 21:32:49 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man humour From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 07:17:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21982 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 07:17:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21978 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 07:17:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 07:17:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F29E719BE2; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2575919C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:17:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 778C819C3A; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:16:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4979419BE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:15:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2DMEK7b065069 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:14:20 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2DMEKUg065068 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:14:20 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403132214.i2DMEKUg065068@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] wiki httplogin Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:14:20 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, a patch that propagates .httplogin in wiki root to wikifs; http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/wiki-httplogin.tar.bz2 with this patch, .httplogin in /sys/lib/wiki (or wherever the wiki root is) is used for all wiki pages. David From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 07:25:28 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22362 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 07:25:28 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22357 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 07:25:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 07:25:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDFAC19CA8; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B8F319C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:25:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7778519BE2; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:24:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4374C19B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2DMMq7b065119 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:22:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2DMMq4q065118 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:22:52 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403132222.i2DMMq4q065118@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] wiki 10000 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:22:52 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I have also been concerned with hard-coded 10000 bytes limit on the size of wiki template, and have made the following change: http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/wiki-10000.tar.bz2 Ignore it if you think it is paranoia. David From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 09:21:24 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 07:46:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23803 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 07:46:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23799 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 07:46:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 07:46:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 442AB19CBE; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:46:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6376A19C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:46:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D4A6D19C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:45:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C210019A6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:45:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <318982-32568>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 17:44:22 -0500 Message-ID: <013901c4094c$837a2080$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403132222.i2DMMq4q065118@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] wiki 10000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="KOI8-R" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:42:45 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have also been concerned with hard-coded 10000 bytes limit on the size > of wiki template, and have made the following change: wot? a 16Mb memory stick can hold a lot of that. From ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz Sun Mar 14 20:19:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 12:41:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19976 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 12:41:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19972 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 12:41:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 12:41:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A88719CB5; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:41:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C770619C36; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:41:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D19A719A1E; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:40:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz [130.195.5.20]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25EF019A0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:40:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz [130.195.5.170]) by kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2E3e0pE028068 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 16:40:01 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (8.12.9p1/8.12.9) id i2E3e0WF016720 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 16:40:00 +1300 (NZDT) From: Nick Jamieson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum User-Agent: KMail/1.6 References: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> <004b01c40813$bb9261b0$df756f51@ntlworld.com> In-Reply-To: <004b01c40813$bb9261b0$df756f51@ntlworld.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200403141640.00154.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 16:39:59 +1300 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > My idea was to send just a plaintext email that contains two attachements. > One being an rc script and the other an authenticating > signature for that command. I think this is secure enough as the > signature (hash) would need a shared secret to be validated. Hi. You should also include a time stamp to prevent replay attacks. Suppose you send [command, time, SHA1(command, secret, time)] to your work computer. Then your work computer can check that the digest is valid and that the time stamp is recent and not the same as a previously given time stamp. The work computer needs to remember each time stamp given for as long as it may be regarded as 'recent'. Nick From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sun Mar 14 20:19:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 12:56:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20683 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 12:56:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20679 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 12:56:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 12:56:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2C3B719C09; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:56:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A8D119CB0; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:56:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E30D19C36; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 313D119B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:55:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 47349 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 03:55:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 03:55:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 03:55:21 -0000 Received: from p9c by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2E3tL8301326; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:55:21 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <04609957b29968a842f42fb2876e8ad2@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:55:19 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > Only the cheese stands alone. > not being japanese won't help you understand the joke. really!?... excuse me to start ask questions to understand the joke. The cheese is a blue one? -- From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 12:57:11 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20719 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 12:57:10 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20715 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 12:57:10 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 12:57:10 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9E8019CDC; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:56:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD403199DD; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:56:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BFB519B2E; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB33B19C36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:55:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3785035-30963>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:54:37 -0500 Message-ID: <00c001c40977$dfcdc820$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> <004b01c40813$bb9261b0$df756f51@ntlworld.com> <200403141640.00154.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 04:53:08 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You should also include a time stamp to prevent replay attacks. Suppose you > send [command, time, SHA1(command, secret, time)] to your work computer. you mean a 'nonce'. time is a really bad choice. however, the SecureID cards used time, and it was explained to me that they did it in a clever/secure way by mjr. From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 13:31:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22644 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 13:31:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22640 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 13:31:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 13:31:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80C0319CBF; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:31:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7982119AD2; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:31:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5DCC319A25; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:30:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E00ED19981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:30:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <327195-6603>; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:29:01 -0500 Message-ID: <00cf01c4097c$aca6e530$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <04609957b29968a842f42fb2876e8ad2@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 05:27:22 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > really!?... excuse me to start ask questions to understand the joke. > The cheese is a blue one? c'est une ENIGME From ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz Sun Mar 14 20:19:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 14:32:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26469 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 14:32:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26465 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 14:32:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 14:32:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9B1B19CD2; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:32:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FA0A19CA0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:32:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B751519CB0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:31:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz [130.195.5.20]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04EAA19C14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:31:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz [130.195.5.170]) by kaukau.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2E5V5pE000471 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:31:05 +1300 (NZDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [[UNIX: localhost]]) by square-affair.mcs.vuw.ac.nz (8.12.9p1/8.12.9) id i2E5V558008622 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:31:05 +1300 (NZDT) From: Nick Jamieson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum User-Agent: KMail/1.6 References: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> <200403141640.00154.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> <00c001c40977$dfcdc820$67844051@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <00c001c40977$dfcdc820$67844051@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <200403141831.05030.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:31:05 +1300 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > you mean a 'nonce'. time is a really bad choice. Time is a really bad choice *if* there is the possibility that the current-time source(s) can be manipulated. In this case I don't think it will be a problem. If general nonces are used then the work computer would need to keep all of the given nonces forever to prevent replay attacks. Trade offs... Nick From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 14:41:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26958 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 14:41:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26954 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 14:41:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 14:41:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C527919C34; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:41:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EC2819AA3; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:41:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51D5019AA3; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:40:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 212CC19B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:40:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3786127-30962>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 00:39:34 -0500 Message-ID: <010101c40986$83618310$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <76cc93f6db46e7ad7bd84bceb250ba14@collyer.net> <200403141640.00154.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> <00c001c40977$dfcdc820$67844051@SOMA> <200403141831.05030.ncj@mcs.vuw.ac.nz> Subject: Re: [9fans] cryptographic signatures & factotum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 06:37:57 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Trade offs... sure, that's what security is all about: - what you have to protect? - how much is it worth? - how much are you prepared to 'spend'? From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sun Mar 14 20:19:30 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 15:43:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30399 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 15:43:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30395 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 15:43:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 15:43:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55B8C19CCA; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B52919B2E; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:43:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 59AAC19CBE; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:42:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C10119AD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2E6gxD01817 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:43:01 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <20040313005247.GD7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:42:01 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > On Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 11:54:43AM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: >> I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. >> I'm now setting up several. What's customary for >> configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. >> and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? > > That's exactly what I did. It works quite well for me. > I'd be curious to hear other people's solutions, though. > I did so, too, since you're asking. ++L From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Sun Mar 14 20:19:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 15:58:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31151 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 15:58:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31147 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 15:58:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 15:58:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D497F19CDC; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:58:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E563A19C09; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:58:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5146719C09; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:57:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from web13126.mail.yahoo.com (web13126.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.163]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DB97119ABC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 01:57:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040314065738.25499.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.179.1.157] by web13126.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:57:38 PST From: dave cummings To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: <20040222170031.13081.74298.Mailman@psuvax1.cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [9fans] more dumb questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 22:57:38 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Alright, fellas. Time for more dumb questions(and dumb answers?) from me. I want a plan 9 network(cpu/auth, fs, term) i have 3 computers. That's where the easy part stops. Currently I like plan 9 as it runs on my ibm t20 laptop, but I don't have enough space for venti. The other computers are a Sparcstation 10 and a ps2 with the linux kit. Therefore: 1) What exactly is the Sun sources on extra software.(all the neccessary kernel source files concatenated? what's the garbage between each file?) 1a) Does anybody have a copy of the full 2ed, or what's the quickest way to get something resembling plan 9 on the sparc. 2) Can inferno serve venti? that is, how am i to best use the ps2(with its 40gb hdd). 4) should i give up and install openbsd/linux on everything, leave the list and be perfectly(?) happy using second-grade os's. Ok, that said, what books should I read to stop bothering all of you/if you help me out now, I may be able to contribute something in the future. maybe. Once again, thanks. -dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam http://mail.yahoo.com From geoff@collyer.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 16:42:55 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1071 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 16:42:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1067 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 16:42:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 16:42:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A61619CF0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1740719D0D; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:42:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB43D19C14; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:41:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9454119B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:41:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8058ddc8f229701e1df5b814dbcf7046@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <20040314065738.25499.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2004 23:41:15 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: 1) as its README says: --- This directory contains an approximation to the the sources included in the 1995, Release 2 edition of Plan 9, pertinent to the construction of Sun SLC, Sparcstation 2, and Sparcstation 10 kernels. It also includes some related files that may help the porter, including similar vintage ports for the PC and Gnot. Although it includes relevant C header files, it does not include the sources for the libraries. --- It looks like it's a gzipped tar file. 1a) Some of us have 2e source, but it's covered by the more-restrictive 2e licence, and you can't those licences any more. 2) Probably; it's just 9P (and the new Styx is supposed to be quite close to 9P2000). 4) [sic] `Three, sir!' It will take some work to update a 2e sparc kernel to 4e. Just running a 2e kernel might work; I don't think 9P1 changed enough after 2e to matter, as long as you don't need 9P2000 for anything. There is only one Plan 9 book, from 1995, and it's in German. You can get it from amazon.de if you really want it. I was told by a famous publisher that there is no market for a Plan 9 book. From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:31 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 16:48:06 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4046 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 16:48:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3643 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 16:47:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 16:47:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F214F19CE8; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:47:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADECF19BE7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:47:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8CBDE19BD9; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:46:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D93B19B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 02:46:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2E7iS7b067446 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:44:28 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2E7iSDg067445 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:44:28 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403140744.i2E7iSDg067445@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] http urldecode? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:44:28 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Do I understand it correctly that httpd does not urldecode URLS? That is, if I give a wiki page a non-English title, wiki will fail? David From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 17:16:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6264 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 17:16:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6260 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 17:16:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 17:16:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22D7819CCA; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:16:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2394319BE7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:16:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4AFB19C32; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:15:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C14B19BE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <334790-18085>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:14:56 -0500 Message-ID: <01b101c4099c$2f5c1ad0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8058ddc8f229701e1df5b814dbcf7046@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:13:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 4) [sic] `Three, sir!' it's one of the sacred relics brother maynard carries ... From boyd@insultant.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 17:39:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7957 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 17:39:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7953 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 17:39:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 17:39:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7FF1B19C14; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:39:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0C2719BE7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:39:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 294E119BE7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:38:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16ACC19B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:38:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <336922-18088>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:38:10 -0500 Message-ID: <01c801c4099f$6c979520$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] in anticipation of the the london 9 con Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:36:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: following andrey's lead (and i hate graphics). i have created some more stuff: http://www.cafeshops.com/lon9con they don't do exactly what i want, but reckon i can organise that on monday. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 14 20:19:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 17:52:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9051 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 17:52:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9034 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 17:52:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 17:52:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 93DA819CE8; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5C4119CCD; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:52:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0BDFF19BE7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:51:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC8E219B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 03:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2E8nu7b067735 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:49:56 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2E8nuDc067734 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:49:56 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403140849.i2E8nuDc067734@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] http urldecode? In-Reply-To: <200403140744.i2E7iSDg067445@adat.davidashen.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:49:56 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > That is, if I give a wiki page a non-English title, wiki will fail? Solved. From brucee@chunder.com Sun Mar 14 20:19:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 18:50:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12415 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 18:50:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12411 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 18:50:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 18:50:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC89A19CCA; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 04:50:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BEF5919BB1; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 04:50:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA1B619B14; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 04:49:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6D3E619B26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 04:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 3456 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 09:50:55 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 09:50:55 -0000 Message-ID: <023701c409a9$d737fc30$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <04609957b29968a842f42fb2876e8ad2@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 20:46:15 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: someone must have a "cheese stands alone" poster, or a picture at least. dennis might like to comment. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "YAMANASHI Takeshi" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2004 2:55 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. > > > > Only the cheese stands alone. > > not being japanese won't help you understand the joke. > > really!?... excuse me to start ask questions to understand the joke. > The cheese is a blue one? From uncover@beat.cc.titech.ac.jp Sun Mar 14 22:37:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 21:31:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20865 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 21:31:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20861 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 21:31:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 21:31:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99D9919CEB; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 07:31:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D73CA19CCD; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 07:31:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0EE2E19CC6; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 07:31:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6627819C07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 07:30:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49471 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 12:30:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 12:30:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 12:30:57 -0000 Received: from p9c by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id i2ECUu8317192; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 21:30:56 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <10c0386544a22b691db1732c3308641d@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] If hostid==uid, then /lib/ndb/auth is not checked. From: YAMANASHI Takeshi MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 21:30:54 +0900 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > The cheese is a blue one? > c'est une ENIGME Since it *SOUNDS* like french, Roguefort might be it. # Goolgle had told me what the joke is, I think ;) -- From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 22:56:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26518 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 22:56:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26509 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 22:56:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 22:56:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8571919CF1; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:56:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 589E519CDC; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:56:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 491E619CCD; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:55:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB11219C17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 08:55:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2EDrX7b068621 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:53:33 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2EDrX4G068620 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:53:33 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403141353.i2EDrX4G068620@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] acme wiki put patch Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:53:33 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Wiki application for acme always reload page number 0 (wiki syntax) after 'Put'. It looks as the code had been written for an older version which wrote document number instead of its name into the file. http://ftp.davidashen.net/misc/wiki-acme-put.tar.bz2 fixes it so that the file read back is one just written. David From nmh@t3x.org Mon Mar 15 13:06:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sun Mar 14 23:17:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27665 invoked by uid 1020); 14 Mar 2004 23:17:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27661 invoked from network); 14 Mar 2004 23:17:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Mar 2004 23:17:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B89BA19CDC; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:17:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6663819BF1; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:17:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4D8619BD4; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:16:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.188]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA6F419AF0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:16:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.206] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B2WPi-0001CL-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:16:26 +0100 Received: from [80.140.15.10] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B2WPi-00034c-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:16:26 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2EDvIB84329; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:57:18 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Message-ID: <2004031413541300-84310@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Subject: [9fans] ipso(1) patch Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:54:13 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I just put my passwords in a secstore and got the following message when running ipso: can't dial tcp!$auth!5356 secstore authentication failed secstore read failed - bad password? After adding '-s $auth' to the auth/secstore invocation in /rc/bin/ipso, everything works fine. However, I guess that ipso is supposed to run fine without this modification. Am I missing something? Anyway, while looking at ipso, I thought that an option to just fetch the factotum keys without displaying them would be nice. So I added the '-q' flag which does this. BTW, is there any common format for supplying patches for Plan 9? I guess that using diff(1) would cause trouble when patching an already-patched file, since it uses absolute line numbers. Below, there is a context diff containing my changes to ipso, in case anyone is interested. Nils. ----- ipso(1) -q cdiff ----- *** ipso.old Sun Mar 14 14:31:31 2004 --- ipso Sun Mar 14 14:34:36 2004 *************** *** 11,16 **** --- 11,17 ---- name = secstore get = secstoreget put = secstoreput + edit = yes fn secstoreget{ auth/secstore -i -g $1 <_password *************** *** 50,57 **** name = aescbc get = aesget put = aesput case * ! echo >[2=1] 'usage: ipso [-s] [file ...]' exit usage } shift --- 51,60 ---- name = aescbc get = aesget put = aesput + case -q + edit = no case * ! echo >[2=1] 'usage: ipso [-aqs] [file ...]' exit usage } shift *************** *** 68,74 **** bind -c /tmp /srv cd /tmp ! echo ' Warning: The editor will display the secret contents of your '$name' files in the clear. ' --- 71,77 ---- bind -c /tmp /srv cd /tmp ! if (~ $edit yes) echo ' Warning: The editor will display the secret contents of your '$name' files in the clear. ' *************** *** 103,109 **** sleep 2; date > _timestamp # so we can find which files have been edited. # edit the files ! $editor `{for(i in $files) basename $i} # copy the files back for(i in `{editedfiles}){ --- 106,113 ---- sleep 2; date > _timestamp # so we can find which files have been edited. # edit the files ! if (~ $edit yes) $editor `{for(i in $files) basename $i} ! if not if (~ factotum $files) read -m < factotum > /mnt/factotum/ctl # copy the files back for(i in `{editedfiles}){ -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 00:28:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1401 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 00:28:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1397 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 00:28:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 00:28:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1DE219B79; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:28:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E11219B79; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:28:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4BD4B19B80; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:27:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1EAC19B88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:27:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2EFPP7b068963 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:25:25 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2EFPPo1068962 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:25:25 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403141525.i2EFPPo1068962@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch In-Reply-To: <2004031413541300-84310@Symmetry.UUCP> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:25:25 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > BTW, is there any common format for supplying patches for Plan 9? > I guess that using diff(1) would cause trouble when patching an > already-patched file, since it uses absolute line numbers. > > Below, there is a context diff containing my changes to ipso, in > case anyone is interested. It has been recently discussed on the list, with the usual (for 9fans) friendliness and clarity of instructions. A way that works is to use ape/patch -- so your context diff is OK. ape/patch is Gnu patch 2.5.0. The right way is to use patch(1), except that it does not work. You must bind your /tmp (or another) directory before /n/sources/patch because /n/sources/patch is not writable, then roll the arcive created by patch and deliver it somehow to 'Plan 9 developers'. I wonder what the 'Plan 9 developers' use to merge patches in, if they do that at all, since many patches generated with diff are just posted to the list. I think that a good solution that does not have 'gnu' in its name is not yet available for Plan 9. From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 15 13:06:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 00:37:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1790 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 00:37:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1786 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 00:37:28 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 00:37:28 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96FDE19BAF; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:37:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0999819AB7; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:37:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC34119B88; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:36:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1AC719B6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:36:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <360ca72577fd3701d1d29387933a4581@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch In-Reply-To: <200403141525.i2EFPPo1068962@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 10:36:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If its small ( a few lines ) just email it to 9trouble as a diff or content diff. If its long, just bundle up the files somehow (tar in a MIME attachment is fine) and email it to 9trouble. I have no idea what patch is, nor care. From presotto@closedmind.org Mon Mar 15 13:06:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 01:08:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3580 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 01:08:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3576 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 01:08:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 01:08:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7EE3119BAF; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BEE319BAF; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:08:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 445EE19BF1; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:07:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F33C19B88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:07:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <04e78fcb36385c05f5a0a8850055a4fa@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch In-Reply-To: <2004031413541300-84310@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:07:24 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun Mar 14 09:17:49 EST 2004, nmh@t3x.org wrote: > > I just put my passwords in a secstore and got the following message > when running ipso: > > can't dial tcp!$auth!5356 > secstore authentication failed > secstore read failed - bad password? > > After adding '-s $auth' to the auth/secstore invocation in /rc/bin/ipso, > everything works fine. However, I guess that ipso is supposed to run > fine without this modification. Am I missing something? I find this odd to say the least. In secstore, the default for -s is $auth. Of course, if you didn't have $auth escaped (or quoted) the shell probably expanded it and you just happen to have the right server defined in your environment. If that's the case, then ndb/cs doesn't know where your default auth server is. This will bite you in the backside some other time, so you should fix it. You can either configure it for your network in /lib/ndb/local, get it from dhcp, or just cat it onto the end of /net/ndb once you've done a dhcp. To get it from dhcp you either have to be running a plan9 dhcp server or configure the response into the dhcp server you are running. > > Anyway, while looking at ipso, I thought that an option to just fetch > the factotum keys without displaying them would be nice. So I added the > '-q' flag which does this. > Looking at your code, it looks like you mean, just load the factotum from the secstore (or aes) file. It seems to me that editing and loading factotum are independent things. Perhaps they should be separate options. In general, I'ld like to load my factotum from the new keys whenever I edit them. Would anyone mind if I made that the default and added two options instead: - one to NOT start the editor - one to NOT load the files That way the default behavior would be a little more than it currently is, i.e., edit files and load factotum. From rminnich@lanl.gov Mon Mar 15 13:06:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 01:31:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5449 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 01:31:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5445 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 01:31:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 01:31:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB3B419CC6; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:31:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1EAB19BAF; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:31:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDE1919BF8; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:30:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FE9919BD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 11:30:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2EGUpjt015915 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:30:52 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2EGUpe1031137 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:30:51 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2EGUpfQ024521 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:30:51 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 09:30:50 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > > On Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 11:54:43AM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > >> I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. > >> I'm now setting up several. What's customary for > >> configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. > >> and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? > > > > That's exactly what I did. It works quite well for me. > > I'd be curious to hear other people's solutions, though. > > > I did so, too, since you're asking. hmm, not sure I'm going to want to do this for 256 servers, but we'll see... ron From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 03:58:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15430 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 03:58:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15426 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 03:58:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 03:58:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC6D219C60; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:58:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1824419B3A; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:58:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC48619C11; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:57:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AEAC19ABB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:57:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <339793-17313>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:56:41 -0500 Message-ID: <02d501c409f5$da7896b0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403141525.i2EFPPo1068962@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:54:57 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I think that a good solution that does not have 'gnu' in its name > is not yet available for Plan 9. i reckon the wobber/prusker solution predates all this by 10+ years. you could buy it off HP, maybe ... From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 04:03:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15791 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 04:03:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15787 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 04:03:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 04:03:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CE09D19C85; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:03:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE63419C69; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:03:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B2EA19B6D; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:02:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E725B19ABB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:02:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.64.132.103]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <340301-24136>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:57:33 -0500 Message-ID: <02db01c409f5$f9aa6db0$67844051@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <360ca72577fd3701d1d29387933a4581@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:55:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > have no idea what patch is, nor care. another larry wall-ism. nasty, when it breaks. From steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com Mon Mar 15 13:06:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 04:26:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17963 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 04:26:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17959 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 04:26:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 04:26:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0760019C9F; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:26:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C065199DE; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:26:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 412A019AF0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:25:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from paris (cpc2-sout4-6-0-cust223.sot3.cable.ntl.com [81.111.117.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 775DC199D2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:25:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8ea222c3c98bcdfe2dfb596b01da598e@snellwilcox.com> From: steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] boot fossil+fenti Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:25:44 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I installed a new machine (HP Brio + tekram scsi). The install from floppy was faultless, I built a venti as per the wiki. I saved my venti config using venti/conf -w /dev/sd06/arenas. The one piece of the jigsaw that appears to be missing from the wiki, how do I make the venti come up at boot time? If I set venti=#S/sd06/arenas in plan9.ini, I get a kernel panic on boot boot 7 suicide 0xef1000be in syscall pc=0xbd33 I wonder if its because I am uing SCSI and have 4 disks, 4G for fossil, a pair of fast 2Gs for indexes, and a 38G for venti; I am not using fs to mirror or anything clever (yet). The partitions don't appear on reboot, (disk/prep -p /dev/sd0?/data > /dev/sd0?/ctl needed). is it that the default kernel assumes I am using /dev/sdC0 and only write the partition info to the kernel for that one device? (I cannot see where this is done in the source). So near and yet... -Steve From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 15 13:06:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 05:04:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20301 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 05:04:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20296 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 05:04:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 05:04:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A60119C69; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:04:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 394BC19A63; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:04:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1D9B19A2A; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:03:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8425B19A1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 15:03:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <061daba7bdfc8cea12ffc1e69433e8aa@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] boot fossil+fenti From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <8ea222c3c98bcdfe2dfb596b01da598e@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 13:03:29 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If I set > venti=#S/sd06/arenas > in plan9.ini, I get a kernel panic on boot > boot 7 suicide 0xef1000be > in syscall pc=0xbd33 /sys/src/9/boot/local.c starts venti from /boot, do you have it compiled in 9pccpuf? my arena configuration is stored in /dev/sd[CD]0/arenas but venti works from /dev/fs. in plan9.ini i have 'venti=/dev/cdC0/arenas' (i change it with different menus, in case one of the disks fails and i need to boot off the other), boot then binds devfs (#k) and venti proceeds to read from /dev/fs. andrey From cnielsen@pobox.com Mon Mar 15 13:06:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 07:37:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29657 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 07:37:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29653 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 07:37:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 07:37:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 94D9619CF0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:37:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DF1F19C6D; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:37:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 379CF19C6D; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:36:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB40919B7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 17:36:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 2B78366C18; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:36:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by cassie.foobarbaz.net (tmda-sendmail, from uid 1000); Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:36:06 -0800 (PST) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers Message-ID: <20040314223604.GF7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i From: Christopher Nielsen X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.0.2 (Bold Forbes) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 14:36:04 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, Mar 14, 2004 at 09:30:50AM -0700, ron minnich wrote: > On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > > > > On Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 11:54:43AM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > > >> I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. > > >> I'm now setting up several. What's customary for > > >> configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. > > >> and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? > > > > > > That's exactly what I did. It works quite well for me. > > > I'd be curious to hear other people's solutions, though. > > > > > I did so, too, since you're asking. > > hmm, not sure I'm going to want to do this for 256 servers, but we'll > see... yeah. that's something that occurred to me. i don't think it's scaleable to large numbers of servers. if those 256 servers all start the same services, you could just use one directory for all of them, but i'm sure that occurred to you. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 08:59:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3315 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 08:59:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3311 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 08:59:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 08:59:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D18B519CCD; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:59:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 259BC19B42; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:59:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D534C19B8A; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:58:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F0D619AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 18:58:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <20040314223604.GF7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 23:54:21 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: assuming many fewer classes than servers: bind /rc/bin/service.$class /rc/bin/service might need /lib/namespace.$class instead or as well for listen (haven't checked). From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 13:06:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 09:06:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4074 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 09:06:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4067 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 09:06:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 09:06:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3FF5819CE8; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:06:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6A4A19AC0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:06:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B97C119B8A; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:05:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (p9auth.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6989619AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:05:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 16:05:45 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Both listen and listen1 do a newns("none", ...) so binds made before running listen or listen1 will only affect trusted (listen -t) services. For untrusted services, at least, you need to bind things suitably in the appropriate /lib/namespace* files. From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Mon Mar 15 13:06:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 12:10:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20788 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20784 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B12319B4F; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BC7B19B31; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:10:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61CAF19AF0; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:09:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from web13122.mail.yahoo.com (web13122.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.174.126]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E087D19A3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:09:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040315030929.73912.qmail@web13122.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [216.179.3.195] by web13122.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:09:29 PST From: dave cummings To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: <20040312064003.8452.23048.Mailman@psuvax1.cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [9fans] more dumb questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:09:29 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ahhh, it seems my decompression went awry. All I got was a single 2mb text file containing the source files, and a bunch of garbage. Searching this file for README finds it way at the bottom. So something went wrong detarring/preserving directory hierarchy. This explains a lot. As to where 3) went, it seems I need a book on counting first! I think it was caused by my trying to use letters in a primarily number based scheme (1a). Ok, I'll give something with these files a shot, can't hurt now. (maybe someone can send me a binary sparc kernel?) As to books, english is a germanic language after all! But I was asking more along the lines of general books that might give me some background I feel I'm obviously missing. Or maybe just more playtime is needed. thanks -dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - More reliable, more storage, less spam http://mail.yahoo.com From kristian@phase-space.net Mon Mar 15 17:28:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 13:14:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26249 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 13:14:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26245 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 13:14:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 13:14:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA89619C04; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 23:14:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE91019B27; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 23:14:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A25819B3A; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 23:13:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from toneburst.phase-space.net (metronomic.phase-space.net [64.81.227.234]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DDA519B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 23:13:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from phase-space.net ([192.168.0.7]) (authenticated bits=0) by toneburst.phase-space.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2F4982Y019398 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:09:08 -0600 Message-ID: <40552D67.6090609@phase-space.net> From: Kristian Hahn User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040215) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Enigmail-Version: 0.83.2.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2004 22:13:27 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hello, Could someone provide an estimate of the timescale for usb mass storage support. The last mail I could find on the topic was dated 01.04 and it seemed then that support was still a work in progress. I would like to experiment with Plan9 but I am limited to a usb install due to hardware constraints. -- +-------------------+----------------------------+ | Kristian A Hahn | kristian@phase-space.net | +-------------------+----------------------------+ From nmh@t3x.org Mon Mar 15 17:28:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 16:59:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15022 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 16:59:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15018 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 16:59:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 16:59:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A4BA19C34; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:59:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FD2E19C25; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:59:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C7D619C04; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8E7219AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:58:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.161] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B2mzY-0003j1-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 08:58:32 +0100 Received: from [80.140.4.40] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B2mzY-00081m-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 08:58:32 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2F7dEA86757; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 08:39:14 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] ipso(1) patch In-Reply-To: <04e78fcb36385c05f5a0a8850055a4fa@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: <2004031507292700-86730@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 08:29:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-14, David Presotto wrote: > If that's the case, then ndb/cs doesn't know where your default auth server > is. [...][ That was it. After adding an auth attribute to my ipnet in /lib/ndb/local, ipso works fine without the '-s $auth' modification. > Looking at your code, it looks like you mean, just load the factotum from > the secstore (or aes) file. [...] Yes. Without my modification, I have to make a fake change to the factotum file to make ipso load it. Since I run ipso each time I boot my terminal, this started to annoy me. To make editing and loading the factotum independent operations sounds like a good idea to me. Where would I get the new version of ipso? Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 15 19:53:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 18:02:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19770 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 18:02:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19766 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 18:02:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 18:02:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1136719BB8; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 042FA19B02; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:02:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A1E219BB8; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:01:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 877A619B02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:01:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <20040313005247.GD7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-srgtlywvscindzbmutxxdxahvc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:01:00 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-srgtlywvscindzbmutxxdxahvc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a switch in cpurc that starts different services for different cpuservers. --upas-srgtlywvscindzbmutxxdxahvc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Sat Mar 13 01:53:42 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA60119C44; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FC8E19B45; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:53:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B04BF19BCD; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:52:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90DBE19B31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 19:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D75AE66C44; Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by cassie.foobarbaz.net (tmda-sendmail, from uid 1000); Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:49 -0800 (PST) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] How to run different services on multiple cpu servers Message-ID: <20040313005247.GD7139@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i From: Christopher Nielsen X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.0.2 (Bold Forbes) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 16:52:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 11:54:43AM -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > I've been running a single cpu server for 9 years. > I'm now setting up several. What's customary for > configing the serivces? I created a new directory name service. > and moved things around in there. How do you folks do it? That's exactly what I did. It works quite well for me. I'd be curious to hear other people's solutions, though. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin --upas-srgtlywvscindzbmutxxdxahvc-- From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 15 19:53:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 18:39:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27634 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 18:39:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27630 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 18:39:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 18:39:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 547D019B02; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:39:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38F1819C36; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:39:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2DD1319BE5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:38:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9956A19BE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:38:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403121913.i2CJDTA05825@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:38:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is life easier on the bitsy wrt automatic choosing irq's? I'm not responsible for any of the sdata drivers (I think jmk did both), but I found the bitsy a lot cleaner than the PC. From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 18:47:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28275 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 18:47:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28271 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 18:47:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 18:47:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75B1119C57; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:47:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A51919C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:47:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 78A8A19C36; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:46:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA06319AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:46:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-reglnggnfpelmlgritwllpxfgd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 01:46:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-reglnggnfpelmlgritwllpxfgd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Not too surprising; the PC has ~20 years of legacy cruft to be compatible with. Our ata drivers would probably drive ST506 disks if any could be found. From rm@hamnavoe.com Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 18:53:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28706 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 18:53:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28702 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 18:53:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 18:53:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CAB4719C57; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54B4019C36; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:53:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2887A19C3B; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:52:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8F8519BE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:52:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <40552D67.6090609@phase-space.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:52:38 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I would like to > experiment with Plan9 but I am limited to a usb install due to hardware > constraints. Can you explain what your constraints are? Do you want to run Plan 9 on a machine with a usb drive as the main or only file system? Or are you looking for a way to install Plan 9 on an ide- or scsi-based system using a usb device to do the install? -- Richard From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:03:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30257 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:03:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30253 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:03:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:03:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1BE4519C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A62219A33; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:03:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B44AD19BD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:02:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 306EC19AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:01:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FA007b072773 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2FA00Lu072772 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403151000.i2FA00Lu072772@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] better than what Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Various improved sources (/n/sources/nemo, for example), such as alternative keyboard drivers and other things, are distributed as replacements for files in the source tree. It is never known whether they can safely replace files in the current source base or they had been branched off a while ago and just writing them over would lead to conflicts. Any chance the improvements can be delivered in a form (e.g. patch(1)), or context diff, or with a copy of the original tree, or with another reference to the exact versions/dates of the original files) that lets people like me know better than what the proposed improvements are? David From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:13:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31096 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:13:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31092 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:13:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:13:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E988A19A8A; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:13:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9845019AA0; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:13:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0945119C36; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:12:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CBA919BD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:12:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d775a295395a72f520ebea886c1bdc9@collyer.net> From: Geoff Collyer To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] latest smtpd anti-spam Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:12:23 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you pull now, you'll get an smtpd with my most recent anti-spam measure in it. It's intended for sites with separate inside and outside networks. If you have a /mail/lib/senders file, the envelope of an incoming message will be checked to verify that mail to particular addresses is coming only from a certain set of domains names or IP addresses. Addresses not mentioned in /mail/lib/senders are not affected by this processing. There's a single system-wide list because implementing per-user lists would require fully resolving recipient addresses to determine which users they correspond to, in smtpd, since we're again trying to keep the spam from being sent. In a trusting environment, I suppose one could make /mail/lib/senders world-writable and append-only. To make use of this, I have added a single rule to /mail/lib/rewrite: # user.* → user (local!)?([^!.]+)\.[^!]+ alias \2 before local mail delivery but after alias file translation. This means that any incoming mail to geoff.anything gets treated as mail to geoff. I can then invent addresses on the fly when filling out web forms. It's a hook that allows for a number of possible tricks, among them tracking who is leaking your addresses to spammers. sendmail does something similar with user+tag addresses; I like dot in part because it's unshifted and easy to type. This is my /mail/lib/senders; the first column is a recipient address and the second is domain name or IP address of a legitimate sending system for that recipient address. For example, I should only get mail to geoff.9fans from mail.cse.psu.edu (and only ever have, I scanned my mail logs). When given a domain name, we look up the name and compare all the returned IP addresses against our peer's IP. This is safer than reverse mapping the peer's IP since people who control their reverse maps can lie, especially if they run BIND instead of Plan 9's dns. Reverse dns maps are also sometimes accidentally missing or wrong at sites that run BIND. # collyer.net!geoff.buy mail03.rm04.net # collyer.net!geoff.ubc www.bussops.ubc.ca collyer.net!geoff.9fans mail.cse.psu.edu collyer.net!geoff.monster smtp-nat.ma.tmpw.net collyer.net!geoff.monster smtp-nat.in.tmpw.net # for register.com, IP addresses are more stable than DNS names collyer.net!geoff.register 209.67.50.16 collyer.net!geoff.register 216.21.228.13 collyer.net!geoff.register 216.21.229.220 collyer.net!geoff.register 216.32.192.101 collyer.net!geoff.sans 63-100-47-56.sans.org collyer.net!geoff.spamcop vmx1.spamcop.net collyer.net!geoff.std europe.std.com collyer.net!geoff.std smtp.theworld.com collyer.net!geoff.toad new.toad.com collyer.net!geoff.well assassin.well.com collyer.net!geoff.well smtp.well.com Here are a few rejections from /sys/log/smtpd, just within the last few hours. It's a very good bet that every one of the senders is a spammer, since they have no legitimate reason to be sending mail to geoff.9fans, geoff.register, nor geoff.spamcop. cpud Mar 14 21:06:21 Disallowed sending IP of HANMAIL.NET!geoff.9fansgeoff.9fans (Server.fremantle.juliennepenny.com.au/202.154.89.214) to collyer.net!geoff.9fans cpud Mar 14 21:44:10 Disallowed sending IP of lawyer.com!btijd (63.192.14.235/61.173.241.234) to collyer.net!geoff.9fans cpud Mar 14 21:54:30 Disallowed sending IP of dsl-verizon.net!ua.peck (63.192.14.235/219.95.192.19) to collyer.net!geoff.spamcop cpud Mar 14 22:05:46 Disallowed sending IP of sbprss.com!bTpISwhu (qb3.sbprss.com/66.54.93.250) to collyer.net!geoff.register cpud Mar 14 23:00:05 Disallowed sending IP of yahoo.com!pwlyutuox (12-215-216-14.client.mchsi.com/12.215.216.14) to collyer.net!geoff.9fans cpud Mar 15 00:42:43 Disallowed sending IP of netzero.com!vdjrp (218.93.19.82/218.93.19.82) to collyer.net!geoff.9fans cpud Mar 15 01:00:57 Disallowed sending IP of rescueteam.com!pthregmkobe (pd950f731.dip.t-dialin.net/217.80.247.49) to collyer.net!geoff.9fans From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:17:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31399 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:17:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31395 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:17:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:17:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2A4519CA2; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:17:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7B9519B49; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:17:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC01E19C55; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:16:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 37E3319B49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:16:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:15:01 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FBusg7029775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:56:55 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] fossil+venti boot problems Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:16:44 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Still failing to get my fossil to come up as a standalone fossil/venti/auth server (NB I'am using several SCSI disks). I had indeed tried to start venti with 9pcf which caused the "panic boot 7". I compiled 9pccpuf and used that; now I get a "panic boot 1", though only after a (roughly) 10 second delay. Unfortunately the stack backtrace scrolls any messages off the screen - I will try with a serial console tonight. I added ip/ipconfig lines for ether card and loopback to cpurc, though on reflection this is silly (its way too late by then). Looking at the source I reckon the kernel only tries to start ethernet if opening the disk given by venti= fails. My guess (only a guess) I wonder if I am still suffering from non-existant partitions? IE the partitions have not been read from the disk and written to the kernel yet, thus my venti=#S/sd06/arenas points to a device-file which doesn't exist. When opening this file fails the kernel tries to contact venti via ether, and fails to get an ethernet address via DHCP (I have no DHC server), and then gives up and panics. Anyone? -Steve From pmjcovello@shaw.ca Mon Mar 15 19:53:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:53:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1985 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:53:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1981 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:53:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:53:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E91A19CCF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBB6619CA2; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:53:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C54C19C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A86719CA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2pZi-0001Dj-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: TPC Message-ID: <2ece6e8.0403132050.75b12dc5@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad vga control message "type radeon" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:43:37 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Dear comp.os.plan9, I have installed and compiled Phillippe Anel's radeon drivers. When I boot, I am greeted with the following message: aux/vga: vgactlw: : bad vga control message "type radeon" Please let me know and I will be happy to give you any configuration details you wish. Thanks, Thomas Covello From murrayclimbs@yahoo.com Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:53:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2020 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:53:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2016 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:53:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:53:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 68DB619CD0; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:53:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8397D19CDE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:53:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6117D19CB3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16DB819CB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2pZi-0001Dp-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dave Cummings Message-ID: <105865noq9h8p4b@corp.supernews.com> Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040314065738.25499.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com>, <8058ddc8f229701e1df5b814dbcf7046@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:43:49 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_YAHOO_RCVD autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ahhh, it seems my decompression went awry. All I got was a single 2mb text file containing the source files, and a bunch of garbage. Searching this file for README finds it way at the bottom. So something went wrong detarring/preserving directory hierarchy. This explains a lot. As to where 3) went, it seems I need a book on counting first! I think it was caused by my trying to use letters in a primarily number based scheme (1a). Ok, I'll give something with the 2e kernel a shot, can't hurt now. As to books, english is a germanic language after all! But I was asking more along the lines of general books that might give me some background I feel I'm obviously missing. Or maybe just more playtime is needed. thanks -dave From pmjcovello@shaw.ca Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:54:21 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2075 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:54:21 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2071 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:54:21 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:54:21 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7EA019CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2909019CEB; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7B9B119CBA; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FB9019ACC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2paR-0001Es-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:47 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Thomas Covello Message-ID: Organization: Shaw Residential Internet Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Subject: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:23 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Dear comp.os.plan9, When I installed and compiled Phillippe Anel's radeon driver, I get the following error message: aux/vga: vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" Please let me know and I will be happy to give you any configuration details you need. Sincerely, Thomas Covello From saw@online.de Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 19:54:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2106 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 19:54:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2102 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 19:54:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 19:54:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2975A19CF9; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD0B419CCF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92B3019C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 464BB19CA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2paQ-0001Em-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:46 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Sascha Wildner Message-ID: Organization: Yoyodyne Natural Born Configurators Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040314065738.25499.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com>, <8058ddc8f229701e1df5b814dbcf7046@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Geoff Collyer wrote: > There is only one Plan 9 book, from 1995, and it's in German. You can > get it from amazon.de if you really want it. I was told by a famous > publisher that there is no market for a Plan 9 book. Hello, the book is from 1999: http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/3446188819/qid%3D1079258888/302-6468304-4109662 Sascha Wildner -- http://yoyodyne.ath.cx From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:01:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2460 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:01:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2436 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:00:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:00:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 995EA19D0D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:00:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B28219D03; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:00:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9086C19CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:59:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA0D819CD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:59:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <93616ef6f3005cff939db3025b1f8c4f@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pkzbbjwcwscojyeyvbaqwfzshr" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 02:59:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pkzbbjwcwscojyeyvbaqwfzshr Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My apologies; I could have sworn it was 1995. Perhaps there was an earlier edition. In any case, it can't be describing any version of the system newer than second edition, since 3e didn't appear until spring of 2001. --upas-pkzbbjwcwscojyeyvbaqwfzshr Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 02:54:54 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 02:54:54 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6B8A19CFD; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4B2119CDE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:54:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92B3019C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 464BB19CA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:52:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2paQ-0001Em-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:46 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Sascha Wildner Message-ID: Organization: Yoyodyne Natural Born Configurators Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20040314065738.25499.qmail@web13126.mail.yahoo.com>, <8058ddc8f229701e1df5b814dbcf7046@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:44:09 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Geoff Collyer wrote: > There is only one Plan 9 book, from 1995, and it's in German. You can > get it from amazon.de if you really want it. I was told by a famous > publisher that there is no market for a Plan 9 book. Hello, the book is from 1999: http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/ASIN/3446188819/qid%3D1079258888/302-6468304-4109662 Sascha Wildner -- http://yoyodyne.ath.cx --upas-pkzbbjwcwscojyeyvbaqwfzshr-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:04:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2621 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:04:30 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2617 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:04:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:04:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B373719CFF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:04:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2076419B3E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:04:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42A1B19A0C; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:03:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 043BD19A2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:03:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <93616ef6f3005cff939db3025b1f8c4f@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:59:44 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>the system newer than second edition, since 3e didn't appear until >>spring of 2001. 2000, i think. From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:09:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2854 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:09:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2849 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:09:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:09:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C62B919CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:09:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0AA019D0F; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:09:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 87C4819D13; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:08:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0132C19CFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:08:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2fe82c7ed26f4f1cd5ba0cb839de0ed1@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vfgarwehtbshgvsvtxthwqvrrs" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:08:00 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vfgarwehtbshgvsvtxthwqvrrs Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit /sys/doc/release3.ms says you're right. I could have sworn 3e was released the day after I left the Labs, which would have made it 1 April 2001. I guess that was some interim release. --upas-vfgarwehtbshgvsvtxthwqvrrs Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 03:04:37 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 03:04:36 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 57D8319CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:04:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7527319C42; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:04:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42A1B19A0C; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:03:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 043BD19A2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:03:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] more dumb questions From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <93616ef6f3005cff939db3025b1f8c4f@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:59:44 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>the system newer than second edition, since 3e didn't appear until >>spring of 2001. 2000, i think. --upas-vfgarwehtbshgvsvtxthwqvrrs-- From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:15:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3289 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:15:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3281 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:15:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:15:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C723C19CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:15:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0F1719D20; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:15:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6AFD19D0D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:14:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDD4B19CD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:14:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <999207f32f95a89b0657cef49bf3ce83@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] better than what From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <200403151000.i2FA00Lu072772@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ksfgzskoyncglquoxvgtarsxrs" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:14:34 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ksfgzskoyncglquoxvgtarsxrs Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I wouldn't call /n/sources/nemo improvements, but anyway, I try to keep then up to date. I merge often our changes with those in sources, and push changed /n/sources/nemo files back again. --upas-ksfgzskoyncglquoxvgtarsxrs Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 15 11:03:40 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 31AEB19BD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A62219A33; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:03:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B44AD19BD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:02:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 306EC19AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 05:01:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FA007b072773 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2FA00Lu072772 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403151000.i2FA00Lu072772@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] better than what Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:00:00 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Various improved sources (/n/sources/nemo, for example), such as alternative keyboard drivers and other things, are distributed as replacements for files in the source tree. It is never known whether they can safely replace files in the current source base or they had been branched off a while ago and just writing them over would lead to conflicts. Any chance the improvements can be delivered in a form (e.g. patch(1)), or context diff, or with a copy of the original tree, or with another reference to the exact versions/dates of the original files) that lets people like me know better than what the proposed improvements are? David --upas-ksfgzskoyncglquoxvgtarsxrs-- From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:19:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3507 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:19:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3503 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:19:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:19:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B57BD19D33; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:19:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9957719CFF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:19:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1BDEE19D15; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:18:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E95EE19CFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:18:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <6b26c83b.0403131930.7afe96e1@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:18:39 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Is that all?!?! What's missing, IBM 3270 support? Teletype model 37 support? I guess Plan 9 was never ported to microVAXen nor PDP-15s; have to get cracking on that. The Carerras in question have MIPS CPUs. The Viaducts are not terminals, they're network encryption devices with Power PC CPUs. The SLC is indeed a Sun and the Magnums were made by MIPS. There was some form of terminal with a Hobbit CPU in it, possibly a form of Gnot? SGI Indigos were supported. The ipaq (bitsy) is still supported. From VirusWatcher@akc.org Mon Mar 15 22:44:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:28:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3878 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:28:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3874 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:28:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:28:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61C0019D02; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:28:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41E1319CD0; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:28:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84AAC19CCD; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:27:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.akc.org (mail.akc.org [68.156.53.144]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C0B319CBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:27:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from trigger.akc.org (trigger.akc.org [10.1.1.175]) by mail.akc.org (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id i2FBQep05531 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:26:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by trigger.akc.org (8.12.7/8.12.7) id i2FBRFaD025736; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:27:15 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200403151127.i2FBRFaD025736@trigger.akc.org> From: "AKC Email Scanner" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-MailScanner: generated Subject: [9fans] Warning: E-mail viruses detected Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:27:15 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Our virus detector has just been triggered by a message you sent:- To: info@akc.org Subject: Re: hello Date: Mon Mar 15 06:27:15 2004 Any infected parts of the message (letter_attachment.com) have not been delivered. This message is simply to warn you that your computer system may have a virus present and should be checked. The virus detector said this about the message: Report: letter_attachment.com Found the W32/Netsky.c@MM virus !!! Executable DOS/Windows programs are dangerous in email (letter_attachment.com) -- This e-mail was automatically generated. Please do not reply to it directly Send all responses to postmaster@akc.org Best Regards, System Adminstrator From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:30:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4005 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:30:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4000 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:30:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:30:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74B2919CE8; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:30:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC85319CD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:30:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43F9219CCF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:29:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2905C19CBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:29:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:29:24 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I suppose there is one other obvious candidate for a terminal port: modern Macs. I believe that's underway. Some NCD's X terminals might have made decent Plan 9 terminals too. From philippe.anel@noos.fr Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:34:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4572 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:34:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4568 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:34:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:34:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D87E19D2E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:34:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4FD619CFD; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:34:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D964919CBA; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:33:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (nan-smtp-13.noos.net [212.198.2.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EA5719D15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:33:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15249 invoked by uid 0); 15 Mar 2004 11:33:36 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ntmail.noos.fr) ([195.132.21.206]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.121 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; 15 Mar 2004 11:33:36 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040315121546.09cfb590@pop.noos.fr> X-Sender: philippe.anel@pop.noos.fr X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Philippe Anel Subject: Re: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:35:23 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: At 11:44 15/03/04, you wrote: >Dear comp.os.plan9, >When I installed and compiled Phillippe Anel's radeon driver, I get the >following error message: > >aux/vga: vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" > >Please let me know and I will be happy to give you any configuration >details you need. Hi, It seems you forgot to build/use a new kernel with the radeon driver. At least, the kernel part didn't find the card. It could be a pciid problem. Could you execute aux/vga -v and send me the result ? Philippe, Ps: I have updated the sources of the radeon driver (merged with the LCD support by Latchesar Ionkov, added the X11 License from the X11 sources I had to read, removed the pci_ids[] struture from the kernel part), but I also found a bug with my radeon 8500 I'd like to fix before posting it to the 9fans list. http://mapage.noos.fr/philippe.anel/radeon.tar From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:36:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4614 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:36:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4610 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:36:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:36:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABF4019D34; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:36:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C588219CD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:36:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F199319CFD; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:35:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2CE819CD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:35:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9850e8e23b844cd5a90286e1245219b0@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:31:35 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>The ipaq (bitsy) is still supported. only in its original h36xx form, with SA1110, not the newer XScale ones From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:38:30 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4707 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:38:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4703 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:38:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:38:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B38F319CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3B2019CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:38:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5862C19CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:37:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAD0619CD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:37:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <116f90107ed4a05b196780472bf971ef@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <9850e8e23b844cd5a90286e1245219b0@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hhiywammxpgdvqavwtnaxzgudu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 03:37:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hhiywammxpgdvqavwtnaxzgudu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit True enough. What is an Xscale anyway? A faster ARM? --upas-hhiywammxpgdvqavwtnaxzgudu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 03:36:38 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Mon Mar 15 03:36:38 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C56A19CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:36:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D47419CD3; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:36:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F199319CFD; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:35:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2CE819CD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:35:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9850e8e23b844cd5a90286e1245219b0@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:31:35 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>The ipaq (bitsy) is still supported. only in its original h36xx form, with SA1110, not the newer XScale ones --upas-hhiywammxpgdvqavwtnaxzgudu-- From a@9srv.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:44:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5176 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:44:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5172 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:44:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:44:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E635819D38; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:44:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF87D19CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:44:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3735F19D03; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:43:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AFD619CD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:43:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:34:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: // ...modern Macs. I believe that's underway. oo! any details? who? my kernel hacking skills are minimal, but i've got a moderate variety of G3 and G4 boxes to test stuff on, at least. // Some NCD's X terminals might have made decent Plan 9 terminals... i think they still would, although i've not got any anymore, and the cost proposition isn't quite as compelling as it used to be. they're still nice self-contained boxes, although i like the older ones more (which have the advantage of being mips; are *all* the current ones x86?). i'd just be happy if i can buy a viaduct or epia or some brick-like thing with plan9 pre-installed. ア From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:56:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6022 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:56:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6018 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:56:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:56:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBE9B19D4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 140C019CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B3E8219D46; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EB8519CCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7cf9cd7e97048602033c63bed8973292@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <116f90107ed4a05b196780472bf971ef@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:52:17 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>True enough. What is an Xscale anyway? A faster ARM? it's a family of Intel ARM5-based processors with a (fairly) standard core and a range of application-specific modules surrounding it. in its PXA25x form, it's similar to the Strongarm but many of the bugs are different, some of the peripherals are different, and most of the registers are in different places even when the bit values are the same. at least they redesigned the DMA. that A bit B bit dance was just confused. the PXA250 didn't quite give the power or speed improvements over SA1110 that were expected, though it's all right. the PXA255 supposedly manages it. if i sound a bit grumpy it's because some of the PXA bugs are fairly fundamental. for instance, if fancy clock switching and sleep modes are big selling points for the device, and supposedly enabled by setting a few bits, you'd expect them to work, wouldn't you? especially since they were embarrassingly wrong in the StrongARM. silly you. if anything, the situation is worse. the errors are decently documented in the errata, but the fix is as fiddly as ever, and bigger. the cache might corrupt things. still, it's not too hard to get it to work. in general, however, i've found that IBM does a better job, with the smaller powerpcs. i don't know why. generally things work as documented, the documentation is well-organised, and the bugs in the errata tend to be understandably obscure. fairly tidy architecturally as well. my big IBM powerpc processor hasn't arrived yet so i've yet to see about that. From dvd@davidashen.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:56:55 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6029 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:56:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6025 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:56:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:56:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8044219D77; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CB5E19CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D29719CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C199419CFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 6494A1B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FBpW7b073385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2FBpWUY073384 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403151151.i2FBpWUY073384@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] better than what In-Reply-To: <999207f32f95a89b0657cef49bf3ce83@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I wouldn't call /n/sources/nemo improvements, I am sorry if I used the wrong word. > but anyway, I try to keep then up to date. > I merge often our changes with those in sources, and > push changed /n/sources/nemo files back again. Is there a way to know what particular instance of each file the nemo version is merged against? From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 20:59:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6212 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 20:59:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6208 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 20:59:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 20:59:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B88F019D5D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18D4519CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:59:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BDDEC19D4C; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:58:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CB6219CFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:58:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] better than what In-Reply-To: <200403151151.i2FBpWUY073384@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-waucwrkzvtozofbsgaeyycnohk" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:58:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-waucwrkzvtozofbsgaeyycnohk Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You can use the modified time of each file to see that. --upas-waucwrkzvtozofbsgaeyycnohk Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 15 12:56:56 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA1CE19D65; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CB5E19CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:56:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D29719CFC; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C199419CFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 6494A1B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FBpW7b073385 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2FBpWUY073384 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403151151.i2FBpWUY073384@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] better than what In-Reply-To: <999207f32f95a89b0657cef49bf3ce83@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:51:32 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I wouldn't call /n/sources/nemo improvements, I am sorry if I used the wrong word. > but anyway, I try to keep then up to date. > I merge often our changes with those in sources, and > push changed /n/sources/nemo files back again. Is there a way to know what particular instance of each file the nemo version is merged against? --upas-waucwrkzvtozofbsgaeyycnohk-- From geoff@collyer.net Mon Mar 15 22:44:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 21:08:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7189 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 21:08:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7163 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 21:08:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 21:08:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 157FD19D71; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17FA219D6D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:08:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FD3E19D64; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:07:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4BB819D46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:07:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d843e2943c2916e49620542387192fd@collyer.net> From: Geoff Collyer To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 04:07:10 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You'd have to look in the archives for the Mac porting effort. I believe north_ was heading up the effort and maintains a web page with progress reports. I was thinking of the MIPS-based NCDs. I haven't looked at their current product line. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 16 09:08:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 23:19:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17817 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 23:19:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17813 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 23:19:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 23:19:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD7CC19D7D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:19:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C395B19CFF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:19:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 926B119CFF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:19:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96D2319CBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:18:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c43aad6428f2ca46620092c24926217@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 06:24:17 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > aux/vga: vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" > you've compiled vgaradeon.c in the kernel but haven't compiled /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/, try doing 'mk install' there. you can send me (privately) all the steps you followed for compiling it if the above fails. andrey From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 16 09:08:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Mon Mar 15 23:35:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18846 invoked by uid 1020); 15 Mar 2004 23:35:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18842 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2004 23:35:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 15 Mar 2004 23:35:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FF3419D6B; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45BD319CD2; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:35:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8D2F19CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:34:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8657919CCA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 09:34:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2FEYfog025849 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:34:41 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2FEYfgt025846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:34:41 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" In-Reply-To: <4c43aad6428f2ca46620092c24926217@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 07:34:41 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: silly me, 'type' is a #v control message, so your kernel doesn't know about radeons, not aux/vga... philippe's email is right, i somehow missed it before replying myself (changed subject line :) andrey On Mon, 15 Mar 2004, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > aux/vga: vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" > > > > you've compiled vgaradeon.c in the kernel but haven't compiled > /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/, try doing 'mk install' there. > > you can send me (privately) all the steps you followed for compiling > it if the above fails. > > andrey > From rcbilson@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca Tue Mar 16 09:08:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 00:46:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25440 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 00:46:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25436 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 00:46:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 00:46:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6FD3B19CEE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:46:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0011019D0E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:46:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5EEED19D0E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:45:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.140.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0940B19A87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:45:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rcbilson@localhost) by plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (8.11.7/8.11.7) id i2FFjGx05205 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:45:16 -0500 (EST) From: Richard C Bilson Message-Id: <200403151545.i2FFjGx05205@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 10:45:16 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: Geoff Collyer > > I was thinking of the MIPS-based NCDs. I haven't looked at > their current product line. I've always taken an interest in these since they've traditionally been cheaply available used around here, as the university migrates away from them. I've never been able to find sufficient technical documentation to enable me to write anything for them, unfortunately. Now the screen on mine is fading, which means that it will probably end up in the dumpster the next time it gets in my way. From kristian@phase-space.net Tue Mar 16 09:08:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 02:28:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30880 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 02:28:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30876 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 02:28:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 02:28:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 27DAC19C00; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:28:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE72719AB7; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:28:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7ACF19AD0; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:27:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from toneburst.phase-space.net (metronomic.phase-space.net [64.81.227.234]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C09219A9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:27:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from phase-space.net (d-r17238.dhcp.fnal.gov [131.225.242.122]) (authenticated bits=0) by toneburst.phase-space.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2FHMs2Y020126 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:22:55 -0600 Message-ID: <4055E770.9050103@phase-space.net> From: Kristian Hahn User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040215) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.83.2.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 11:27:12 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry, I should have been more specific. I would like to run Plan9 with a usb drive hosting the filesystem. -- Kristian Richard Miller wrote: >>I would like to >>experiment with Plan9 but I am limited to a usb install due to hardware >>constraints. >> >> > >Can you explain what your constraints are? Do you want to run Plan 9 on >a machine with a usb drive as the main or only file system? Or are you >looking for a way to install Plan 9 on an ide- or scsi-based system using >a usb device to do the install? > >-- Richard > > -- +-------------------+----------------------------+ | Kristian A Hahn | kristian@phase-space.net | +-------------------+----------------------------+ From dpeschel@eskimo.com Tue Mar 16 09:08:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 02:53:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32152 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 02:53:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32148 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 02:53:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 02:53:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9540B19CA2; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66F3419C4F; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:53:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C44B319C36; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:52:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95D3C19A94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:52:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B2w8A-0000bM-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:44:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Derek Peschel Message-ID: <6b26c83b.0403150932.2f0a79a6@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <6b26c83b.0403131930.7afe96e1@posting.google.com>, <064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:40:29 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: geoff@collyer.net (Geoff Collyer) wrote in message news:<064c5840b7c22fbda4e4743e0aef98bc@collyer.net>... > Is that all?!?! I meant "did I miss any that are documented, or are there any missing from the documentation?". I'd love to hear about the Mac port. I can test it my on 350MHz G4. -- Derek From rm@hamnavoe.com Tue Mar 16 09:08:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 02:56:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32308 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32304 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF66919C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:56:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D17319C18; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:56:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E040419A94; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:55:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E25C19C18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:55:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <242f772552ae5e01715c8a6dea0393d7@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <4055E770.9050103@phase-space.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 17:55:23 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Sorry, I should have been more specific. I would like to run Plan9 with > a usb drive hosting the filesystem. There is a user-level file server which allows reading and writing of (some) usb mass storage drives. In theory it should be possible to use this as a root filesystem (by starting it in /sys/src/9/boot/local.c before running the kfs server). I wouldn't expect performance to be very satisfactory though. Booting from usb storage would be much more difficult, because the 9load program has no usb support. Do you have a floppy drive or CDROM to read the kernel and plan9.ini from? -- Richard From kristian@phase-space.net Tue Mar 16 09:08:15 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 03:30:58 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1444 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 03:30:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1440 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 03:30:58 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 03:30:58 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30BF919CBA; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:30:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EE8A19C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:30:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E6E019B95; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:29:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from toneburst.phase-space.net (metronomic.phase-space.net [64.81.227.234]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F8CD19B3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:29:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from phase-space.net (d-r17238.dhcp.fnal.gov [131.225.242.122]) (authenticated bits=0) by toneburst.phase-space.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2FIP72Y020199 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:25:08 -0600 Message-ID: <4055F607.4030304@phase-space.net> From: Kristian Hahn User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040215) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? References: <242f772552ae5e01715c8a6dea0393d7@hamnavoe.com> In-Reply-To: <242f772552ae5e01715c8a6dea0393d7@hamnavoe.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.83.2.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 12:29:27 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Thanks for the advice! My plan was boot from ide and hand off to a root filesystem on the usb drive (it's a 'RocketPod'). I'm using a older model Inspiron whose BIOS doesn't permit bootfing from usb. There's enough space left on its 3G ide drive to accomadate the kernel but not enough for the primary filesystem. Is there a way for me to figure out in advace whether my particular drive would work with the user-level file server? -- Kristian Richard Miller wrote: >There is a user-level file server which allows reading and writing of >(some) usb mass storage drives. In theory it should be possible to >use this as a root filesystem (by starting it in /sys/src/9/boot/local.c >before running the kfs server). I wouldn't expect performance to be >very satisfactory though. > >Booting from usb storage would be much more difficult, because the 9load >program has no usb support. Do you have a floppy drive or CDROM to read >the kernel and plan9.ini from? > >-- Richard > > -- +-------------------+----------------------------+ | Kristian A Hahn | kristian@phase-space.net | +-------------------+----------------------------+ From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 16 09:08:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 04:17:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3617 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 04:17:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3613 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 04:17:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 04:17:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 065EA19CD5; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:17:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07A0D19C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:17:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5A5C19C4E; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:16:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAC3A19A78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:16:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ea9e49ffd46dd6592d37a0afd7fd517@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] ipso++ Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:16:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Ipso change: By default, ipso will edit the secstore files and, if one of them is named factotum, flush your current keys from facto- tum and load the new ones from the file. If you supply any of the -e, -f, or -l options, ipso will just perform the operations you requested, i.e., edit, flush, and/or load. From rm@hamnavoe.com Tue Mar 16 09:08:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 04:23:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3959 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 04:23:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3955 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 04:23:54 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 04:23:54 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 286E419AA4; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:23:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DDAA19A28; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:23:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D67319CAE; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBDC319CC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 14:22:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <212ff2aed8469a0052e52690bf15c7b3@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <4055F607.4030304@phase-space.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 19:22:28 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is there a way for me to > figure out in advace whether my particular drive would work with the > user-level file server? Can you boot from the Plan 9 installation CD? If so, run 'usb/usbd -v' and see what it reports when you plug your drive in. If there's an interface line with "8.6.80" or "8.5.80" it may work. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 16 09:08:16 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 05:39:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7959 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 05:39:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7951 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 05:39:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 05:39:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3274019CFF; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:39:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E248519CEA; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:39:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 283A519CC8; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B30C19CD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.87.65]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321802-13381>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:36:44 -0500 Message-ID: <003201c40acd$102bb5d0$41577d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4055E770.9050103@phase-space.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:35:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Sorry, I should have been more specific. I would like to run Plan9 with > a usb drive hosting the filesystem. code it From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 16 13:22:32 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 11:13:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9167 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 11:13:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9163 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 11:13:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 11:13:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A342819D7B; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 971EB19D7D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:13:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C0D219D6D; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:12:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D253E19D1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:11:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <267ed5c9f46a40453ccf70e4a170d248@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] terminal types and photos? From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <6b26c83b.0403131930.7afe96e1@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 02:17:33 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I would need a [...] set of mouse gestures that [allow] me to work with > structured data acme mouse chording does pretty well in this respect. From kristian@phase-space.net Wed Mar 17 00:15:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 15:11:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30257 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 15:11:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30240 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 15:11:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 15:11:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 26C9219D53; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:11:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56E8119BFA; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:11:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BD2A19C40; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:10:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from toneburst.phase-space.net (metronomic.phase-space.net [64.81.227.234]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E00B619C1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:10:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from phase-space.net ([192.168.0.7]) (authenticated bits=0) by toneburst.phase-space.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2G65Z2Y020969 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 00:05:36 -0600 Message-ID: <40569A2E.3050604@phase-space.net> From: Kristian Hahn User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040215) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? References: <4055E770.9050103@phase-space.net> <003201c40acd$102bb5d0$41577d50@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <003201c40acd$102bb5d0$41577d50@SOMA> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.83.2.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 00:09:51 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: thanks, real helpful ... boyd, rounin wrote: >>Sorry, I should have been more specific. I would like to run Plan9 with >>a usb drive hosting the filesystem. >> >> > >code it > > From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 17 00:15:23 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 15:34:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32645 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 15:34:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32641 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 15:34:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 15:34:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 415B119D62; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:34:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1719F19C7B; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:34:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4608619CBA; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:33:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3E2D19BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 01:33:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <40569A2E.3050604@phase-space.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 23:33:42 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > thanks, real helpful ... that's our boyd ☺ From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 17 00:15:25 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 18:38:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17736 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 18:38:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17732 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 18:38:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 18:38:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7010019D96; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:38:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD58419AF2; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:38:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 45AC919C36; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47D7E19A1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 04:37:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5c21c01fad0f9af17f885ff4276e4991@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <003201c40acd$102bb5d0$41577d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kenriwtgdrmwzcdoxjlzckjycx" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 10:37:23 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kenriwtgdrmwzcdoxjlzckjycx Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think there was some usb drive code posted to the list. IIRC, it had no high speed transfer support, but it's a starting point. --upas-kenriwtgdrmwzcdoxjlzckjycx Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Mar 15 21:39:50 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E50119CE4; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:39:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E248519CEA; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:39:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 283A519CC8; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B30C19CD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.87.65]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321802-13381>; Mon, 15 Mar 2004 15:36:44 -0500 Message-ID: <003201c40acd$102bb5d0$41577d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <4055E770.9050103@phase-space.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 21:35:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Sorry, I should have been more specific. I would like to run Plan9 with > a usb drive hosting the filesystem. code it --upas-kenriwtgdrmwzcdoxjlzckjycx-- From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 17 00:15:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 21:59:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1354 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 21:59:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1350 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 21:59:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 21:59:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4020F19B33; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:59:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23D2319D4A; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:59:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA1A719C47; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs01-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98BBE19B33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:58:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.98]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317900-15374>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 07:54:16 -0500 Message-ID: <016e01c40b55$912a7120$41577d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] usb mass storage projections? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 13:52:35 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > thanks, real helpful ... > > that's our boyd ☺ well, should presto put the kbmap keyboard driver in i'll at least be able to type. From dfawcus@cisco.com Wed Mar 17 00:15:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 22:22:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2821 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 22:22:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2817 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 22:22:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 22:22:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6390519D7D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9767C19CD4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:22:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C7CB19CD4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:21:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97F1519C96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:21:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 16 Mar 2004 05:26:05 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2GDKwiZ005882 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:20:59 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id NAA26128 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 13:21:26 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions Message-ID: <20040316132125.C536@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: ; from geoff@collyer.net on Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 01:46:46AM -0800 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 13:21:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 01:46:46AM -0800, Geoff Collyer wrote: > Not too surprising; the PC has ~20 years of legacy cruft to be > compatible with. Our ata drivers would probably drive ST506 disks if > any could be found. Well I've got one in the cupboard behind me. A 5 1/4" Full Height beast, 70 or 80 MB if I recall. Now where is that controller card... DF From cej@gli.cas.cz Wed Mar 17 00:15:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 22:25:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3025 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 22:25:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3021 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 22:25:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 22:25:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 78EDC19CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6921A19D90; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B9DE319CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4807C19CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:02 -0500 (EST) content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: starting to write native code Thread-Index: AcQLWfBqyrmLs+7iTqaF8SqKNyYA9g== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] starting to write native code Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:23:59 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, all! I'm trying to read-in a matrix of floats, rows separated by newline, columns by blanks: 0.000026 0.000019 0.000003 ... 0.000051 0.000022 0.000059 0.000003 ... 0.000033 0.000024 0.000011 0.000053 ... 0.000021 ... my idea is to use s_read_line() and s_parse(), or am I [completely] wrong? Or is Brdline() and strtok() the way? I usually look how others write code, however, i haven't grepped much of those from /sys/src/cmd... so, if somebody could just push me the right direction. thanks, regards, ++pac. From lucio@proxima.alt.za Wed Mar 17 00:15:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 22:28:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3243 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 22:28:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3239 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 22:28:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 22:28:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 608DA19D97; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADF5819B62; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D42519C2E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:27:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63DB519BDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:27:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2GDRmD10632 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:27:57 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Bitsy questions Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <20040316132125.C536@edinburgh.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:26:34 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Well I've got one in the cupboard behind me. A 5 1/4" Full Height beast, > 70 or 80 MB if I recall. Now where is that controller card... > How many controller cards do you need? I can give you a few choices... ++L From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 00:15:27 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 22:29:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3301 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 22:29:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3297 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 22:29:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 22:29:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5678219DA1; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:29:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AD2B19C2E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:29:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90E5819D98; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3677819B62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <33a9260c412cec3942d2de862f44acd7@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] starting to write native code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:30 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Given that sizes are fixed, I'ld use Brdline, tokenize, and atof. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 08:25:36 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 08:25:32 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D45A719CD4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EE7B19CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B9DE319CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4807C19CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:02 -0500 (EST) content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: starting to write native code Thread-Index: AcQLWfBqyrmLs+7iTqaF8SqKNyYA9g== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] starting to write native code Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:23:59 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, all! I'm trying to read-in a matrix of floats, rows separated by newline, columns by blanks: 0.000026 0.000019 0.000003 ... 0.000051 0.000022 0.000059 0.000003 ... 0.000033 0.000024 0.000011 0.000053 ... 0.000021 ... my idea is to use s_read_line() and s_parse(), or am I [completely] wrong? Or is Brdline() and strtok() the way? I usually look how others write code, however, i haven't grepped much of those from /sys/src/cmd... so, if somebody could just push me the right direction. thanks, regards, ++pac. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd-- From zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 00:15:28 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 23:23:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7407 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 23:23:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7403 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:23:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:23:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C3D119D1F; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:23:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71D1C19BE3; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:23:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D34FD19BF0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:22:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f113.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.113]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4546219BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:22:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 06:22:30 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.62 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.62] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30.0486 (UTC) FILETIME=[1D9EBF60:01C40B62] Subject: [9fans] Even more bitsy questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Well, I got bitsy working, and I have a few questions to ask... 1/ Does Infrared work? 2/ With the bitsy hooked up to the serial port and Plan9 running, I can only import keyboard text and look at debugging info, how can I make it so that I can send files via Xmodem or set up a PPP connection for net access? or perhaps have shell access to the bitsy? (Or whatever you Plan9 users call it) 3/ How can I get a PCMCIA HDD working? I have a CF sleeve but it works as a PCMCIA sleeve and can be used with those modules, so how could I get it working? That is all. I hope I can get some feedback on this because I'm really desperate to knowing what to do.. Thanks alot. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 00:15:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 23:32:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8033 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 23:32:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8029 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:32:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:32:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0838319BF0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:32:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D49D019BF0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:32:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F050119CCB; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:31:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3EFC19BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:31:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <866ee87616d137d52b98091c566769b5@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] keyboard maps Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:31:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Anyone have keyboard maps other than qwerty and azerty for the Boyd/Forsyth devkbmap stuff? From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 17 00:15:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 23:43:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8861 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 23:43:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8857 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:43:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:43:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D02B19D90; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:43:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E063419D7D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:43:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BCC0F19D7D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:42:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA9B719C1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:42:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Even more bitsy questions From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bfjgkzqwhixqecfrprlsbjllzt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:42:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bfjgkzqwhixqecfrprlsbjllzt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 1. never tried. 2. there're examples in Booting101 3. It's very much like in the PC. There are scripts in paqfiles. --upas-bfjgkzqwhixqecfrprlsbjllzt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 16 15:23:44 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D4EC19CCB; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:23:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71D1C19BE3; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:23:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D34FD19BF0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:22:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay8-f113.bay8.hotmail.com [64.4.27.113]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4546219BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:22:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 06:22:30 -0800 Received: from 62.215.3.62 by by8fd.bay8.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30 GMT X-Originating-IP: [62.215.3.62] X-Originating-Email: [zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com] X-Sender: zbxhfhxha@hotmail.com From: "w0rd 2 th3" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30.0486 (UTC) FILETIME=[1D9EBF60:01C40B62] Subject: [9fans] Even more bitsy questions Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Well, I got bitsy working, and I have a few questions to ask... 1/ Does Infrared work? 2/ With the bitsy hooked up to the serial port and Plan9 running, I can only import keyboard text and look at debugging info, how can I make it so that I can send files via Xmodem or set up a PPP connection for net access? or perhaps have shell access to the bitsy? (Or whatever you Plan9 users call it) 3/ How can I get a PCMCIA HDD working? I have a CF sleeve but it works as a PCMCIA sleeve and can be used with those modules, so how could I get it working? That is all. I hope I can get some feedback on this because I'm really desperate to knowing what to do.. Thanks alot. _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail --upas-bfjgkzqwhixqecfrprlsbjllzt-- From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 17 00:15:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 23:55:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9694 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 23:55:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9690 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:55:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:55:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 672CA19D9F; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:55:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3486819D59; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:55:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A8A219D91; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A871819D7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:54:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2GErwCi009691 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:53:59 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2GErwxC019051 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:53:59 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2GErwg17569 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:53:58 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403161453.i2GErwg17569@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Even more bitsy questions In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:22:30 +0000." References: From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:53:58 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I do not have many answers, but I do have a question: does susend/resume work for you? If so, what bootloader version do you use? (what bitsy type?) For me it only works if I resume within 30 seconds or so. (my bitsy kernel is old, however) > 2/ With the bitsy hooked up to the serial port and Plan9 running, > I can only import keyboard text and look at debugging info, > how can I make it so that I can send files via Xmodem or set up a > PPP connection for net access? > or perhaps have shell access to the bitsy? > (Or whatever you Plan9 users call it) Searching the archive might help; in the past there have been discussions about using an external keyboard, that may have some relevance. > 3/ How can I get a PCMCIA HDD working? I have a CF sleeve but > it works as a PCMCIA sleeve and can be used with those modules, > so how could I get it working? I use a script startsd (original at /n/sources/nemo/sys/src/9/bitsy/paqfiles) #!/bin/rc names=(\ 'MK5002MPL' \ 'MK2001MPL' \ ) dev='' name='' for (d in /dev/pcm?ctl) { for (n in $names) { if(grep -s $n $d){ name=$n dev=$d echo -n 'configure #SC ata 1'>$d bind -a '#S' /dev disk/fdisk -p /dev/sdC0/data >/dev/sdC0/ctl disk/prep -p /dev/sdC0/plan9 >/dev/sdC0/ctl disk/kfs -f /dev/sdC0/fs mount /srv/kfs /n/kfs } } } From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 17 00:15:29 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Tue Mar 16 23:57:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9762 invoked by uid 1020); 16 Mar 2004 23:57:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9758 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:57:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:57:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08F1219D93; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:57:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61E9519D91; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:57:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6FDD19D91; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:56:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE1B119C03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 09:56:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8a70d553bbc3a31cda5b3814f5ab3eef@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] starting to write native code From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <33a9260c412cec3942d2de862f44acd7@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-hqlhngjhwyqqieawdcsvstkfqj" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:01:48 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-hqlhngjhwyqqieawdcsvstkfqj Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit and even if the line lengths weren't fixed, there's always Brdstr. --upas-hqlhngjhwyqqieawdcsvstkfqj Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Mar 16 14:55:10 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC38419D9D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D69A19D95; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:29:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90E5819D98; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3677819B62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <33a9260c412cec3942d2de862f44acd7@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] starting to write native code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:28:30 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Given that sizes are fixed, I'ld use Brdline, tokenize, and atof. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 08:25:36 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 08:25:32 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D45A719CD4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EE7B19CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:25:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B9DE319CE9; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4807C19CCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 08:24:02 -0500 (EST) content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: starting to write native code Thread-Index: AcQLWfBqyrmLs+7iTqaF8SqKNyYA9g== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] starting to write native code Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:23:59 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hi, all! I'm trying to read-in a matrix of floats, rows separated by newline, columns by blanks: 0.000026 0.000019 0.000003 ... 0.000051 0.000022 0.000059 0.000003 ... 0.000033 0.000024 0.000011 0.000053 ... 0.000021 ... my idea is to use s_read_line() and s_parse(), or am I [completely] wrong? Or is Brdline() and strtok() the way? I usually look how others write code, however, i haven't grepped much of those from /sys/src/cmd... so, if somebody could just push me the right direction. thanks, regards, ++pac. --upas-pxofzklfldqhumtutzzhacgmmd-- --upas-hqlhngjhwyqqieawdcsvstkfqj-- From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 16:58:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 04:56:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 529 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 04:56:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 525 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 04:56:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 04:56:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A4EE19C53; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1157519C3D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:56:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4866119C22; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:55:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8E2819C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:55:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2GJrO7b080780 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:53:24 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2GJrNMv080779 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:53:23 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403161953.i2GJrNMv080779@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Novice question - run as other Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:53:23 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I'm missing something basic and cannot figure out. How can I run a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. David From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 16:58:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 05:36:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3251 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 05:36:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3247 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 05:36:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 05:36:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB61D19BDE; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:36:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DF5E19B6E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:36:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6899C19A0B; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:35:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44B61199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:35:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] devkbmap.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:19:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I included the boyd/forsyth keyboard map stuff in the kernel. man kbmap for details. In general you can bind -a'#κ' /dev cat /dev/kbmap > /tmp/xxx edit /tmp/xxx cat /tmp/xxx > /dev/kbmap I also changed /sys/src/9/boot/boot.c to automaticly load a map if specified in plan9.ini as kbmap= In this case has to be something you can get at before there's a file system so you'll have to make sure its in /boot/. The reason it gets done so early is that factotum starts before you have an fs and it would be nice if your keyboard had the right mapping when you type in your login name ans password. No idea of the boot change works yet. Haven't tested it... As usual, my apologies to the japanese/chinese/etc. I'll put any mapping files I get into /sys/lib/kbmap on sources. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 17 16:58:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 05:57:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4543 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 05:57:49 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4539 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 05:57:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 05:57:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 383AC19CA2; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:57:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BA9819B62; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:57:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F14A19C3D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:56:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 014B319B62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.64.52]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311138-32161>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:53:00 -0500 Message-ID: <003e01c40b98$78f2a940$34407d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] devkbmap.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:51:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: nice one! From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 17 16:58:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 06:55:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7897 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 06:55:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7893 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 06:55:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 06:55:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83CFA19C7E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:55:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 885D719CF4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:55:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB48B19C7E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:54:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A868519C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:54:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10041 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 21:55:18 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 21:55:18 -0000 Message-ID: <00d501c40ba1$7c4ba930$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] new 8c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:55:56 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've improved the vlong support in 8c. The missing ops are in, load/store optimizations, and things like add, sub etc. aren't function calls. A simple test (summing a large array of random vlongs) shows a factor of 3 speed up on my machine (braindead PII) so maybe I haven't been just wasting time. It's not ready for public consumption yet but I have thrown a copy at presto and jmk. I'll put it on my web-site in a few days. Reading x86 assemb, let alone generating it is starting to get to me. brucee From sape@research.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 17 16:58:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 06:57:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7967 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 06:57:29 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7963 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 06:57:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 06:57:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D97AB19D7D; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E529B19D5A; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:57:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91E8119D40; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 913CF19C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:56:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <178ea93498be8ec6e3bc3df06666199b@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] new 8c From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <00d501c40ba1$7c4ba930$8201a8c0@cc77109e> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:56:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I've improved the vlong support in 8c. Brucee, you're my hero. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 17 16:58:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 07:13:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8667 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 07:13:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8663 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 07:13:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 07:13:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13E3D19D40; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1A9D19C4C; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:13:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AF29819B48; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:12:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D0D119BCA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.64.52]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <324836-15369>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:10:42 -0500 Message-ID: <008701c40ba3$4f6bdbe0$34407d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <00d501c40ba1$7c4ba930$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] new 8c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:09:04 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Reading x86 assemb, let alone generating it is > starting to get to me. did you run out of ice? From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 17 16:58:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 07:52:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10932 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 07:52:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10928 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 07:52:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 07:52:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 02D2F19CA2; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:52:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BD1B19AE0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:52:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6766B19BEB; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB4D019AE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 17:51:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5697eeee83e079696212a62a1122c1f9@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <200403161953.i2GJrNMv080779@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 14:54:54 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm missing something basic and cannot figure out. How can I run > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. The security model doesn't allow this. Perhaps by running it as a service on a cpu. Check /sys/src/cmd/auth/cron.c and cap(3). For somethings you can cpu over and change to a different uid: % cpu -a netkey user[dvd]: glenda challenge: 2304 response: etc. You could also drawterm as a different user. From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 17 16:58:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 08:13:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12476 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 08:13:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12472 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 08:13:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 08:13:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A6B219CFB; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F289C19C73; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:13:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A982319BD0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:12:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5385319B76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:12:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16047 invoked from network); 16 Mar 2004 23:13:40 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 16 Mar 2004 23:13:40 -0000 Message-ID: <00f601c40bac$6f5490b0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <178ea93498be8ec6e3bc3df06666199b@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] new 8c Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:08:01 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ahh, i forgot that edf.c was vlong bound. you'll be glad to know that i get a factor of 6 in a complex expression - they tend to cluster around vlongs. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sape Mullender" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 8:56 AM Subject: Re: [9fans] new 8c > > I've improved the vlong support in 8c. > > Brucee, you're my hero. From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 17 16:58:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 08:37:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13643 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 08:37:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13639 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 08:37:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 08:37:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4212119B33; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:37:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F98019BF5; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:37:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 93C4119B33; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:36:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E66F119BD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 18:36:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2GNaVCi014583 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:36:32 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2GNaVxC016134 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:36:31 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2GNaVY22060 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:36:31 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403162336.i2GNaVY22060@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Subject: [9fans] MK5002MPL pc card power on problem (digital hinote 2000) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:36:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm very unsucesful trying to get the toshiba MK500MPL pc card drive to work on a digital hinote 2000 (sape should know that one :-) in the plan9.ini I have pccard0=disabled and explicit lines for pcmcia[01] including irq. I think I have traced the problem (good ol' print statements) to the card not getting power in /sys/src/9/pc/devi82365.c:/^slotena in the slotinfo called from slotena, only pp->occupied gets set, but none of the other values. The comment in the slotena code says that the wait's are empiral, so I'll just play a bit. In the meantime, anyone a more constructive idea? Thanks, Axel. From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 16:58:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 11:49:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30569 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 11:49:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30564 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 11:49:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 11:49:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0BE8F19C98; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:49:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF42E19A99; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:49:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B53D719C1E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:48:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A10ED199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:48:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <73420e490bd572cf6e8101af2e72acf6@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] plan9, devkbmap, kbd.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 21:48:48 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From: Aki M Nyrhinen the current kbd.c handles ctrl-key in a bit straight forward way, which causes problems if you load for example a cyrillic keymap: ctrl-whatever remaps in unexpected ways. i changed ctrl-mappings to be modifiable in the same way as others (altgr, shift, none) and leave it to your consideration whether this is important enough. western keyboarders sure like having the ctrl implicitly correct. This was getting pretty close to the noise for me but he was right. Masking a bit out of the middle of a rune because you hit Ctrl was a somewhat scarey. From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 17 16:58:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 12:10:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 32751 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 12:10:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 32744 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3C81219DA2; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:10:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DF9619DA7; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:10:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D84C519DA5; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:10:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB75919DA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:09:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.217.142]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3819655-18114>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:08:31 -0500 Message-ID: <000701c40bcc$f517d430$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <73420e490bd572cf6e8101af2e72acf6@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] plan9, devkbmap, kbd.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:07:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the 4th Ed port credit should go to: Aki M Nyrhinen it's a hard problem. although having said that, constructing the right namespace in the right place may avoid extra code, but i am not sure. andrey, aki and i have been hacking away at each other. From sape@research.bell-labs.com Wed Mar 17 16:58:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 12:28:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1637 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 12:28:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1630 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 12:28:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 12:28:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E877919DA4; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:28:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C31EF19B97; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:28:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1F3619BB0; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:27:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99B2B19B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:27:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 22:27:54 EST 2004 Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.36.6.151]) by plan9; Tue Mar 16 22:27:53 EST 2004 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] new 8c From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <00f601c40bac$6f5490b0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 22:27:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ahh, i forgot that edf.c was vlong bound. you'll be > glad to know that i get a factor of 6 in a complex > expression - they tend to cluster around vlongs. I am, I am! Sape From BHuntsman@mail2.cu-portland.edu Wed Mar 17 16:58:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 16:17:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22293 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 16:17:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22289 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 16:17:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 16:17:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F28C19DA6; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E0D819D9F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:17:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50D8919CA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:16:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from drax.ntdom.cupdx (drax.cu-portland.edu [65.170.220.179]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2679219B7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:16:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from vargas.ntdom.cupdx ([65.170.220.154]) by drax.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:16:48 -0800 Received: from cellctl ([65.170.222.199]) by vargas.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:16:48 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 References: AAwHZMBAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf X-Mailer: Groupwise 6.5 Message-ID: <20040316T231647Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> From: Ben Huntsman To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Mar 2004 07:16:48.0304 (UTC) FILETIME=[CFB4D300:01C40BEF] Subject: [9fans] NVidia support Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:16:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I recently upgraded to a 128MB NVidia GeForce FX 5200, since I dual boot = and that extra ram comes in handy with other OSes I run. Unfortunately, = though the vga drivers recognize the card, they don't quite work, and the = video becomes unusable. Anyone know about these cards, or am I going to = be faced with going back to my 32MB GeForce2 MX? Thanks for the tips! -Ben From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 17 16:58:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 16:19:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22473 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 16:19:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22469 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 16:19:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 16:19:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3EF619B7E; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8895119CF3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:19:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B2B519CA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:18:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A209919D91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:18:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <733e4618bd40c06765b233dc3c0a42b4@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] devkbmap.c From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lnrudklzecbjqpcyicsqvkryag" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:18:39 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lnrudklzecbjqpcyicsqvkryag Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Thanks a lot! Yet another local diff we can get rid of ☺ I'll change usbhid to work with this for usb keyboards. --upas-lnrudklzecbjqpcyicsqvkryag Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Mar 16 21:36:33 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8EEA819D0F; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:36:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DF5E19B6E; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:36:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6899C19A0B; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:35:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44B61199E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:35:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: [9fans] devkbmap.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2004 15:19:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I included the boyd/forsyth keyboard map stuff in the kernel. man kbmap for details. In general you can bind -a'#=CE=BA' /dev cat /dev/kbmap > /tmp/xxx edit /tmp/xxx cat /tmp/xxx > /dev/kbmap I also changed /sys/src/9/boot/boot.c to automaticly load a map if specified in plan9.ini as kbmap=3D In this case has to be something you can get at before there's a file system so you'll have to make sure its in /boot/. The reason it gets done so early is that factotum starts before you have an fs and it would be nice if your keyboard had the right mapping when you type in your login name ans password. No idea of the boot change works yet. Haven't tested it... As usual, my apologies to the japanese/chinese/etc. I'll put any mapping files I get into /sys/lib/kbmap on sources. --upas-lnrudklzecbjqpcyicsqvkryag-- From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 16:58:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 16:21:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22729 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 16:21:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22724 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 16:21:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 16:21:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB00319DA0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:21:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 568C019D95; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:21:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B511319D82; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:20:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18C6419CA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:20:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H7IC7b083369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:18:12 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H7ICJm083368 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:18:12 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170718.i2H7ICJm083368@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <5697eeee83e079696212a62a1122c1f9@9netics.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:18:12 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. > > The security model doesn't allow this. Perhaps by running it as a service > on a cpu. Check /sys/src/cmd/auth/cron.c and cap(3). For somethings > you can cpu over and change to a different uid: The following works: cpu% cat > test.c #include #include void main(int argc,char **argv) { int fd = open("#c/user",OWRITE); if(argc==1) exits("argument required"); fd>=0 && (write(fd,"none",strlen("none"))!=-1) || (exits("cannot become none"),1); close(fd); exec(argv[1], argv+1); } ^D cpu% 8c test.c cpu% 8l test.8 cpu% 8.out /bin/rc -c 'while () {}' In another window cpu% ps -a|grep 8.out none 4546 0:15 0:00 244K Ready /bin/rc -c 'while () {}' How can I do this without the code in C? David From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 17:11:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27237 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 17:11:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27233 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 17:11:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 17:11:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 167B719D9A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:11:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8DD1C19BBD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:11:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5EB719C50; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:10:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FB6C19B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:10:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <72e06ef5740b842e877e96268483dea8@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403170718.i2H7ICJm083368@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:10:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Switching to `none' is a special case. You have to authenticate cryptographically to become any other user. If you want to really become none and actually change your access rights, you have to do more, notably newns(). See /bin/auth/none and its source. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 17:27:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28586 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 17:27:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28578 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 17:27:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 17:27:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C1F019DA5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:27:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B43A19C61; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:27:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B68019C7F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:27:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51A8919B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:26:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H8Or7b083689 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:24:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H8OrqU083688 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:24:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170824.i2H8OrqU083688@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <72e06ef5740b842e877e96268483dea8@collyer.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:24:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Switching to `none' is a special case. You have to authenticate I know that. > cryptographically to become any other user. If you want to really > become none and actually change your access rights, you have to do I want the process to be owned by none. > more, notably newns(). Yes, I know that. I didn't think it would help to add one more call to the C code that did what it should. My puprose was to ask whether I can do it from rc(1) without calling C programs. If I can't that's fine, I just wanted to know whether I missed something. > See /bin/auth/none and its source. OK. would help mentioning it in man somewhere. David From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 17:34:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29376 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 17:34:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29372 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 17:34:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 17:34:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFA6E19C61; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:34:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C60C19C7F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:34:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3935F19BBE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:33:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D6EF19A11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:33:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <200403170718.i2H7ICJm083368@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 01:33:38 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. >> >> The security model doesn't allow this. Perhaps by running it as a service >> on a cpu. Check /sys/src/cmd/auth/cron.c and cap(3). For somethings >> you can cpu over and change to a different uid: > > The following works: ... > fd>=0 && (write(fd,"none",strlen("none"))!=-1) That's not what you asked. From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 17:56:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31045 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 17:56:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31041 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 17:56:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 17:56:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E68A19DAE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28F7819CB8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8EC3419CC6; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:55:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3DF019CB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:55:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403170824.i2H8OrqU083688@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:55:14 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Regrettably auth/none is undocumented. This sometimes happens. You do however have the sources and grep, and /sys/src/cmd/auth would have been an obvious place to look. I had been reserving judgement on whether or not you (David Tolpin) really are the ungrateful punk that you appeared to be in all your other interactions on 9fans. I have now concluded that you are. Many of us have tried to help you, most of us civilly, and you've responded like a spoiled snot-nosed kid who thinks he's entitled to answers and that we have some obligation to provide them. So I'm now deleting your messages on contact. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:11 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 17:57:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31108 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 17:57:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31104 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 17:57:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 17:57:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6EA7319DB3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:57:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 26F1A19CB8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:57:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D18DB19DAF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2053219DAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H8sq7b083769 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H8sk2J083766 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170854.i2H8sk2J083766@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >> > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. > >> > >> The security model doesn't allow this. Perhaps by running it as a service > >> on a cpu. Check /sys/src/cmd/auth/cron.c and cap(3). For somethings > >> you can cpu over and change to a different uid: > > > > The following works: > ... > > fd>=0 && (write(fd,"none",strlen("none"))!=-1) > > That's not what you asked. > ? Is none not user? cpu% grep none /adm/users 0:none:adm cpu% none cat /env/user none I want a program to run as a different user. From C, it means opening '#c/user' and writing the user's name there. The security model is a separate issue, the call either succeeds or fails, but it is a consequence of security limitations, and not of the API. My question was how to do the same from rc. @{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? David From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:02:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31494 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:02:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31490 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:02:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:02:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1A0A19DB8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:02:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3441019DB2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:02:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22B1719DAC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:01:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE75019A11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:01:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36fa252fff9f4cb8ae8642352754b58d@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403170854.i2H8sk2J083766@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 08:56:14 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>My question was how to do the same from rc. >>@{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } >>succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? aha! when that message arrived, i was just writing one to point out that you need to take care that you stay in the same process as changes #c/user. in the case above, it does indeed change for the process that writes to #c/user (ie, the echo -n none) but of course that process ends, and the parent shell carries on to run while() {...} which happens in a different process from the echo! From 9nut@9netics.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:14:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 525 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:14:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 511 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:14:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:14:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFA3919C63; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86D7019AA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43CA419B20; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5127B19AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:07:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <979f9e76afab7e554d97ad2083cac2c8@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <200403170854.i2H8sk2J083766@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 02:08:25 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You said: >> >> > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. and later > ? Is none not user? Are you trying to solve a real problem or win an argument? From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:15:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 576 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:15:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 569 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:15:00 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:15:00 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D5CB119DBD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B5AE19BAD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C8C319BAD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:07:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD39719AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:07:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H94w7b083839 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:04:58 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H94w8F083838 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:04:58 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170904.i2H94w8F083838@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:04:58 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Regrettably auth/none is undocumented. This sometimes happens. You > do however have the sources and grep, and /sys/src/cmd/auth would have > been an obvious place to look. But my question is not about authentication. My novice question is about a basic thing I don't understand about rc, not about authentication. The question has been stated clearly, and was not answered -- and its your right not to answer it. But I have no use of answers to questions I did not ask. auth/none does nothing httpd and listen do, and I did read the code for them before asking. > I had been reserving judgement on whether or not you (David Tolpin) > really are the ungrateful punk that you appeared to be in all your > other interactions on 9fans. I have now concluded that you are. Many > of us have tried to help you, most of us civilly, and you've responded > like a spoiled snot-nosed kid who thinks he's entitled to answers and > that we have some obligation to provide them. So I'm now deleting > your messages on contact. You are welcome. David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:15:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1049 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:15:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 890 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:15:29 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:15:29 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 979EE19BAD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:15:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B930319AA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:15:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9648119BAD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:10:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28E7219AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:09:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H97p7b083855 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:07:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H97psH083854 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:07:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170907.i2H97psH083854@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <36fa252fff9f4cb8ae8642352754b58d@terzarima.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:07:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>My question was how to do the same from rc. > >>@{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } > >>succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? > > aha! when that message arrived, i was just writing one to point out that you need to take > care that you stay in the same process as changes #c/user. in the case above, > it does indeed change for the process that writes to #c/user (ie, the echo -n none) > but of course that process ends, and the parent shell carries on to run > while() {...} > which happens in a different process from the echo! > Thank you for the comment. I really don't realize a simple thing. Will go and look into the source code of rc. I thought redirection would mean I would modify rc's #c/user. I don't understand something basic. Thanks again From t.lankots@aprote.ee Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:17:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1651 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:17:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1437 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:16:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:16:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B69B19DC4; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:16:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C27B19C7A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:16:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1110B19AA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EEDC199D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:42 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2H9PR03007793 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:25:28 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D5C@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: selected papers Thread-Index: AcQMAEY9atvDsFjnRAiZNiPOXSTHlA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] selected papers Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:14:45 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: All the links to papers in=20 http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/doc/index.html are pointing to wonderland. Tiit From brucee@chunder.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:22:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3354 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:21:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2492 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:19:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:19:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C2AC19DBE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEBD9199D3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:19:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B36F719AE2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:18:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 6D21B199D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:18:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 10477 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 09:18:48 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 09:18:48 -0000 Message-ID: <007c01c40c00$fdcd73d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:19:40 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: it's funny that an astute colleague suggested that last week. go out in the sun, mate! geoff is not bad judge ... brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Collyer" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 7:55 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other > Regrettably auth/none is undocumented. This sometimes happens. You > do however have the sources and grep, and /sys/src/cmd/auth would have > been an obvious place to look. > > I had been reserving judgement on whether or not you (David Tolpin) > really are the ungrateful punk that you appeared to be in all your > other interactions on 9fans. I have now concluded that you are. Many > of us have tried to help you, most of us civilly, and you've responded > like a spoiled snot-nosed kid who thinks he's entitled to answers and > that we have some obligation to provide them. So I'm now deleting > your messages on contact. From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:12 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:24:50 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 4441 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:24:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 4392 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:24:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:24:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEA6D19DAC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA40E19AFF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:24:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2838519BE1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:23:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB8D219AFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:23:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <36c92cd19b8287b5a8451095ae4d40e2@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403170907.i2H97psH083854@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:17:53 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>would mean I would modify rc's #c/user. I don't understand something >>basic. sorry, i ought to have added that #c/user changes per-process data, not per-namespace data, so it changes the data for the echo process, not for the rc. /sys/src/9/port/auth.c:/^userwrite userwrite(char *a, int n) { if(n!=4 || strncmp(a, "none", 4)!=0) error(Eperm); kstrdup(&up->user, "none"); /* note use of up-> */ up->basepri = PriNormal; return n; } From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 18:31:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5035 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 18:31:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5026 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 18:31:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:31:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 623A019DA3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:31:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91EFB19C7A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:31:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8540A19C7A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:30:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CD9619AE2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:30:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H9S27b084014 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:28:02 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H9S2LS084013 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:28:02 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170928.i2H9S2LS084013@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <36c92cd19b8287b5a8451095ae4d40e2@terzarima.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:28:02 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >>would mean I would modify rc's #c/user. I don't understand something > >>basic. > > sorry, i ought to have added that #c/user changes per-process data, > kstrdup(&up->user, "none"); /* note use of up-> */ Oh, many thanks. I said it was a novice question. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 19:21:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8796 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 19:21:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8791 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 19:21:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 19:21:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95C2419DC5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:21:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C7D419DC1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:21:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B3A419CB7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5B86B19CAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:20:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:18:51 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2HC1HjR000546 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:01:22 GMT Message-ID: <4f59670656dcdc3b7300567ff8acba3f@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] disappearing partitions understood Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:20:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, For the archives (as others asked as well as me). If you forget to fdisk your partitions and only prep them then the kernel will know about the partitions (prep writes them to /dev/sd??/ctl), and venti will run fine. On reboot 9load doesn't try to reload /dev/sd??/ctl because they haven't been fdisk'ed and thus look like blank disks, your reference to '#S/sd06/arenas0' points to a non-existant partition, venti cannot come up, the kernel prints an error and then stackdumps pushing the error off the screen. I couldn't find an RS232 cable with a crossover at home to use the serial console and see the error message. Thanks and kudos to whoever left #define parttrace in /sys/src/boot/pc/devsd.c, twas very obvious with this turned on. All comes down to RTFM-MC (more carefully) on my behalf. I now have Venti. -Steve From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 19:34:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9555 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 19:34:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9551 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 19:34:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 19:34:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E8DE19DC8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:34:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9656019C81; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:34:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D7E4719C81; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:33:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA74C19AF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <312710-21949>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:33:11 -0500 Message-ID: <00ad01c40c0a$fd00f080$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:31:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I had been reserving judgement on whether or not you (David Tolpin) > really are the ungrateful punk that you appeared to be in all your > other interactions on 9fans. I have now concluded that you are. made that choice about a week ago. i'm with you, captain. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 19:42:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9952 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 19:42:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9948 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 19:42:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 19:42:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D19C619C81; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F26E719DCC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:42:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 03A9719DC2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:41:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9DE7A19C81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:41:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:39:23 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2HCLsjR000597 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:21:54 GMT Message-ID: <90e3cacb5ecd6a2b27bc57240be3d1c6@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] anyone done an http proxy Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:41:02 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I'am after an http proxy for Plan9, anyone done one already? Looks trivial... until I started to think about https. -Steve From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 19:46:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10176 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 19:46:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10172 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 19:46:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 19:46:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1716419DB9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:46:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6326519DB9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:46:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED8BE19DC7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:45:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50F7519A8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 05:45:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2HAjACi007592 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:45:10 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2HAj9xC012615 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:45:09 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2HAj9W28710 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:45:09 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403171045.i2HAj9W28710@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] MK5002MPL pc card power on problem (digital hinote 2000) In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 17 Mar 2004 00:36:31 +0100." <200403162336.i2GNaVY22060@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <200403162336.i2GNaVY22060@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:45:09 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: playing with timing in slotena did not help, so far. of course, the MK5002MPL works in a toshiba tecra 8000. of course, an orinico wavelan card works in digital hinote ultra 2000. below follow some symptoms, a hypothesis, a suggestion, and some hardware details at the end. I have no idea where to look further, so suggestions of things to try are welcome. Axel. symptoms: with the MK5002MPL in a digital hinote ultra 2000, (configured to use #y instead of #Y -- pccard0=disabled in plan9.ini) booting with card inserted hangs after the apm0 line is printed. booting without card works, then inserting card and doing cat '#y'/pcm?ctl freezes the machine. hypothesis: my guess is that slotena fails to put power to the card without noticing that it fails. I base this on the result of print statements added to slotinfo. So, a bit later an attempt is done to read (config?) info from the card and then it freezes in /sys/src/9/port/cis.c:/^readc when it tries to execute *x = cis->cisbase[cis->cisskip*cis->cispos]; I guess at that point it tries to access memory from the card and fails because the card has no power. suggestion: Just as a safety precaution, to avoid the freeze due to a hanging readc, I'm tempted to suggest an additional check in slotena, to bail out (with a warning?) if pp->occupied && !pp->powered Maybe it is sufficient to set pp->enabled only if above condition holds. However, I do not know much about this, and have no idea what could break when doing that. hardware: Unfortunately I do not have the machine here at work so cannot report details reported by kernel about hardware. (I thought I saved, cannot find back) It has an internal pc card (network/modem), and a dual external slot. Some info from memory, some from digital legacy support doc from the website. 9load recognizes two some #Y TI .... (1131 acc. to doc) The interesting thing is that the kernel reporst two different #y (pcmcia) 'mode' controllers. One of the two is reported as a i82365, other I don't recall. According to doc, for the internal slot there is a CL-PD6722 dual slot pcmcia controller (of which 1 slot is used) So, I guess there is a TI1131 for the external slot (that also works in i82365 compatible mode?) and a CL-PD6722 for the internal slot. I wrote: > I think I have traced the problem (good ol' print statements) > to the card not getting power in > > /sys/src/9/pc/devi82365.c:/^slotena > > in the slotinfo called from slotena, only pp->occupied gets set, > but none of the other values. The comment in the slotena code says > that the wait's are empiral, so I'll just play a bit. From nickw@pobox.com Wed Mar 17 22:15:13 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 20:32:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12622 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 20:32:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12618 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 20:32:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 20:32:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F87319DC7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:32:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF91819C8D; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:32:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7661B19C35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:31:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from boggle.pobox.com (boggle.pobox.com [208.58.1.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58BEA19AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:31:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from colander (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by boggle.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FBED6EDE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:31:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from jester.pobox.com (jester.pobox.com [64.71.166.114]) by boggle.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:31:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.1] (adsl-50-100.swiftdsl.com.au [218.214.50.100]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by jester.pobox.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E1BC84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 06:31:43 -0500 (EST) From: Nicholas Waples X-X-Sender: nickw@debian To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] NVidia support In-Reply-To: <20040316T231647Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> Message-ID: References: AAwHZMBAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf <20040316T231647Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:31:29 +1100 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I had a go at rewriting the drivers based on the latest xfree86 which should support the 5X00 series. (see http://www.pobox.com/~nickw for the src files). Ive only tested them on a ti4200 though. Nick. On Tue, 16 Mar 2004, Ben Huntsman wrote: > I recently upgraded to a 128MB NVidia GeForce FX 5200, since I dual boot and that extra ram comes in handy with other OSes I run. Unfortunately, though the vga drivers recognize the card, they don't quite work, and the video becomes unusable. Anyone know about these cards, or am I going to be faced with going back to my 32MB GeForce2 MX? Thanks for the tips! > > -Ben > > From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 22:15:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 21:39:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17175 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 21:39:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17171 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 21:39:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 21:39:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2A9EC19DB0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:39:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C46019CE7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:39:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDDE419CF8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:38:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77FA119CDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:38:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67d4169071a8c0f73d4df542171e788f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] selected papers In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D5C@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ylbwmojqbytjwyvbpbhzittfxh" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:38:20 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ylbwmojqbytjwyvbpbhzittfxh Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't understand. I just looked at it with two browsers and they point to the papers. What is wonderland? --upas-ylbwmojqbytjwyvbpbhzittfxh Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 04:16:33 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 04:16:30 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B5F819DB6; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:16:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA2AE19AE2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:16:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1110B19AA1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EEDC199D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 04:14:42 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2H9PR03007793 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:25:28 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D5C@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: selected papers Thread-Index: AcQMAEY9atvDsFjnRAiZNiPOXSTHlA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] selected papers Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:14:45 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: All the links to papers in=20 http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/doc/index.html are pointing to wonderland. Tiit --upas-ylbwmojqbytjwyvbpbhzittfxh-- From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 17 22:15:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 21:44:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17701 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 21:44:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17697 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 21:44:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 21:44:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 38EA319DB8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1005619C9B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:44:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1484719B7E; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:43:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5300199B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:43:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: dvd@davidashen.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-yqhuppmcyevqwhceqskcdbbgeb" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:43:53 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-yqhuppmcyevqwhceqskcdbbgeb Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It worked, I believe you just didn't notice. The echo process became none and then immediately died. --upas-yqhuppmcyevqwhceqskcdbbgeb Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 03:57:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 03:57:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3FE5019CC6; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36BCC19DAF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:57:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D18DB19DAF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2053219DAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 03:56:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2H8sq7b083769 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:52 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2H8sk2J083766 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403170854.i2H8sk2J083766@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >> > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. > >> > >> The security model doesn't allow this. Perhaps by running it as a service > >> on a cpu. Check /sys/src/cmd/auth/cron.c and cap(3). For somethings > >> you can cpu over and change to a different uid: > > > > The following works: > ... > > fd>=0 && (write(fd,"none",strlen("none"))!=-1) > > That's not what you asked. > ? Is none not user? cpu% grep none /adm/users 0:none:adm cpu% none cat /env/user none I want a program to run as a different user. From C, it means opening '#c/user' and writing the user's name there. The security model is a separate issue, the call either succeeds or fails, but it is a consequence of security limitations, and not of the API. My question was how to do the same from rc. @{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? Dav id --upas-yqhuppmcyevqwhceqskcdbbgeb-- From t.lankots@aprote.ee Wed Mar 17 22:15:14 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 21:49:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17881 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 21:49:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17877 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 21:49:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 21:49:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8792919DB9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:49:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22AD819C81; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:49:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9738019BA9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:48:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2528619A17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 07:48:02 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2HCwoIa009963 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:58:50 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] selected papers X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D60@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] selected papers Thread-Index: AcQMHQRk/pl/T0AEQUS1BPNvIpN/aAAAGAkQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:48:05 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I don't understand. I just looked at it with two browsers and Oops, my bad. Internet Exploder refuses to open anything,=20 giving a strange 404-like error, but all other browsers work just fine. Sorry for the noise. > they point to the papers. What is wonderland? a dangling pointer points to wonderland (by definition) From davel@anvil.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Wed Mar 17 23:04:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26749 invoked by uid 1020); 17 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26745 invoked from network); 17 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4509019D92; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:04:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5CBB19CDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:04:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A31819D0F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:03:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 373F119CDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 09:03:36 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 4D4EA29A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:03:27 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 082C5298 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:03:26 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA22450 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:03:20 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <00ad01c40c0a$fd00f080$8ed97d50@SOMA> References: <00ad01c40c0a$fd00f080$8ed97d50@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079532085.14420.251.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:01:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > I had been reserving judgement on whether or not you (David Tolpin) > > really are the ungrateful punk that you appeared to be in all your > > other interactions on 9fans. I have now concluded that you are. > > made that choice about a week ago. i'm with you, captain. Metoo ... BUT .... It ain't his fault: "I blame the system". Now I don't want to get too mystical here but ... I've been doing a lot of thinking recently, not just about plan9, but also about life, the universe, me etc., and I realised the fundamental truth of the following: "We didn't want to lose the pleasant niche we occupied. What we wanted to preserve was just not a good environment in which to do programming, but a system around which a fellowship could form." http://www.bell-labs.com/about/history/unix/somethingelse.html To me, the last phrase is key: "fellowship". People in general are far too used to paying software vendors to spoonfeed them garbage. To benefit from plan9 you have to understand and go with the flow of its fundamental nature. This is _not_ a product. You are *not* entitled to * pretty manuals, * 0-800 support lines, * annual upgrades * virus scanners * butt-kissing: if you're stupid, someone will tell you. This is a community of people with a common interest. You *are* entitled to: * realise that you are part of something bigger than all of us * work hard trying to understand it * not piss the giants off by whining and shuffling from one foot to the other while you are standing on their shoulders * sweat blood and carry boulders trying to make it better * the wonderful feeling you get when something JUST WORKS. If you can't get over this initial conceptual hump, then fuck off back to CrapOS and leave us alone. Dave out. From rog@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:18:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5672 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:18:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5668 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:18:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:18:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 17F3319D92; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:18:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C9A219CBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:18:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9D2919CBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:17:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECB6519B5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:17:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] insularity Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:22:50 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > So I'm now deleting your messages on contact. oh for f***'s sake! ok, so david tolpin has been a bit verbose, (and we're naturally suspicious that his deep involvement with XML implies a fundamental lack of taste) but when it comes down to it, he's has actually dived in there and done stuff. most newcomers to plan 9 don't get further than booting the damn thing. i think people that have been involved in this stuff for a long time forget the distance between plan 9 and other systems. yes, most stuff is documented (often by implication), but having someone to talk to that knows about the system makes all the difference. i think all david's questions have been perfectly acceptable, and i wouldn't have thought twice about answering them had they been asked by someone across the room. this system *needs* people with some energy to spare, otherwise it'll continue to decline the way it has been since the great scattering from bell labs. if this is the way we treat someone who appears to have some energy and inclination, then i've no hope at all. i'm ashamed to be part of this group. > If you can't get over this initial conceptual hump, > then fuck off back to CrapOS and leave us alone. *cringe* From arnold@skeeve.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:33:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6367 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:33:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6363 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:33:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:33:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A901A19A70; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:33:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C91E619BED; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:33:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 357ED19CBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:32:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com (80.179.113.222.forward.012.net.il [80.179.113.222]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B45A819D50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:32:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com (skeeve [127.0.0.1]) by skeeve.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2HGWQOW007858 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:32:26 +0200 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by skeeve.com (8.12.10/8.12.10/Submit) id i2HGWQHw007856; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:32:26 +0200 From: Aharon Robbins Message-Id: <200403171632.i2HGWQHw007856@skeeve.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity X-Newsgroups: comp.os.plan9 In-Reply-To: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> References: Organization: Pioneer Consulting, Ltd. Cc: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:32:26 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In article <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> you write: >i think people that have been involved in this stuff for a long time >forget the distance between plan 9 and other systems. yes, most stuff >is documented (often by implication), but having someone to talk to >that knows about the system makes all the difference. i think all >david's questions have been perfectly acceptable, and i wouldn't have >thought twice about answering them had they been asked by someone >across the room. > >this system *needs* people with some energy to spare, otherwise it'll >continue to decline the way it has been since the great scattering from >bell labs. if this is the way we treat someone who appears to have >some energy and inclination, then i've no hope at all. i'm ashamed to >be part of this group. Hear, hear! Well said. Arnold From suspect@suspicious.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:37:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6536 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:37:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6532 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:37:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:37:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE3CA19CB7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:37:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9870119C63; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:37:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D9C619CB7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:36:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from bache.ece.cmu.edu (BACHE.ECE.CMU.EDU [128.2.129.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 098BB19B46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:36:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by bache.ece.cmu.edu (Postfix, from userid 953) id C7CE1AE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:36:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from [128.2.64.74] (MUNG.WV.CC.cmu.edu [128.2.64.74]) by bache.ece.cmu.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8D3D9D; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:36:44 -0500 (EST) In-Reply-To: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> References: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v613) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <46BBE6C0-7831-11D8-B18D-000A95C53D8A@suspicious.org> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: David Tolpin From: suspect@suspicious.org Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:36:44 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i stared at the last few messages to David with my mouth open. Those were not very kind words to be spoken to someone who has shown interest, willingness to actually contribute and most importantly, humility. Repeated humility. I'm just an observer on this list, but feel obligated to speak up. I'm also a dot/neato user. Thanks for the work. Thanks again. cheers, On Mar 17, 2004, at 11:22 AM, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >> So I'm now deleting your messages on contact. > > oh for f***'s sake! > > ok, so david tolpin has been a bit verbose, (and we're naturally > suspicious that his deep involvement with XML implies a fundamental > lack of taste) but when it comes down to it, he's has actually dived > in there and done stuff. > > most newcomers to plan 9 don't get further than booting the damn > thing. > > i think people that have been involved in this stuff for a long time > forget the distance between plan 9 and other systems. yes, most stuff > is documented (often by implication), but having someone to talk to > that knows about the system makes all the difference. i think all > david's questions have been perfectly acceptable, and i wouldn't have > thought twice about answering them had they been asked by someone > across the room. > > this system *needs* people with some energy to spare, otherwise it'll > continue to decline the way it has been since the great scattering from > bell labs. if this is the way we treat someone who appears to have > some energy and inclination, then i've no hope at all. i'm ashamed to > be part of this group. > >> If you can't get over this initial conceptual hump, >> then fuck off back to CrapOS and leave us alone. > > *cringe* > From vdharani@infernopark.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:44:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 6984 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:44:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 6980 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:44:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:44:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB35919CB7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:44:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CE3A19BCC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:44:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AF47919D48; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:43:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (unknown [216.127.72.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FD4919BCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:43:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from infernopark.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2HIuwg10148 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:56:58 -0500 Received: from 192.11.226.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:56:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42610.192.11.226.116.1079549818.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> References: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.5) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:56:58 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_NJABL, RCVD_IN_NJABL_RELAY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * rog, i fully agree with you. david, please dont feel bad. just ignore any negative comments and proceed with what you are doing. we need more people into plan 9. i know how difficult it is to bring people in. i know how easy it is to chase people out. i wouldnt want a nice OS to disappear and show it to my grandchildren in museum. regards dharani >> So I'm now deleting your messages on contact. > > oh for f***'s sake! > > ok, so david tolpin has been a bit verbose, (and we're naturally > suspicious that his deep involvement with XML implies a fundamental > lack of taste) but when it comes down to it, he's has actually dived in > there and done stuff. > > most newcomers to plan 9 don't get further than booting the damn > thing. > > i think people that have been involved in this stuff for a long time > forget the distance between plan 9 and other systems. yes, most stuff > is documented (often by implication), but having someone to talk to > that knows about the system makes all the difference. i think all > david's questions have been perfectly acceptable, and i wouldn't have > thought twice about answering them had they been asked by someone > across the room. > > this system *needs* people with some energy to spare, otherwise it'll > continue to decline the way it has been since the great scattering from > bell labs. if this is the way we treat someone who appears to have > some energy and inclination, then i've no hope at all. i'm ashamed to > be part of this group. > >> If you can't get over this initial conceptual hump, >> then fuck off back to CrapOS and leave us alone. > > *cringe* From lucio@proxima.alt.za Thu Mar 18 07:13:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:49:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7152 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:49:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7148 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:49:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:49:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D06C19A2C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:49:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AAF919A70; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:49:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D75519CBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:48:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 044A619A70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:48:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2HGmfD05994 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:48:42 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <46BBE6C0-7831-11D8-B18D-000A95C53D8A@suspicious.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:48:23 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i stared at the last few messages to David with my mouth > open. Those were not very kind words to be spoken to > someone who has shown interest, willingness to actually > contribute and most importantly, humility. Repeated humility. I'm going to add my voice to Pip's and especially Rog's. I envy David's ability to get things done in a totally novel environment (I'm also a recent dot convert, thank you, David) and I have little trouble sympathising with David's queries, understanding that not everyone is as comfortable with English idioms as the Bell Labs ex-convicts are. As for those who have spent time on this list just to deplore David's behaviour, I believe they should put a bit more effort, in a considerably less anglocentric fashion, to understand where some of us come from and what we are able to contribute. It is a shame that I should waste more bandwidth to do this. ++L From noah.evans@cwru.edu Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 01:55:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 7509 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 01:55:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 7504 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 01:55:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 01:55:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E325519DB0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:55:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 822CC19B97; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:55:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8424719C7F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:54:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B64C19B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:54:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUQ01CZSC6TMM@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:52:05 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:52:05 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry to pile on to the discussion. As rob said It's a fundamental difference in perspective. Plan 9 was more or less inscrutible to me until I read the Unix Programming Environment and Software Tools. why wasn't there a tar z? why wasn't there tab completion? Where was my history and job control? These things are obvious to people who are familiar with the philosophy(I always think of boyd's comments to hapless newbies :)), if you use a long command combination often enough you should write a shell script or a shell function. essentially adding to your productive vocabulary. But this philosophy is lost on people who are used to the windows/consumer Unix world because they're used to solutions that violate the tools method of solving problems. A really bad habit of mine is relying on the history to do things, Rather than spend the initial cost of effort to write a shell function and remember it, I'm constantly using Bash's tab completion and history functions to avoid having to expend any effort organizing my patterns of use and solving problems. Everything I do is an ad hoc solution. With Plan 9 I'm forced to do it right, because the people who implemented the OS religiously keep the cruft out. But, as Dave said, it's a long and arduous process whose benefits are hardly apparent when you set out(i.e. "why should I use du and awk to walk a tree when you could use find" is the first question that hits every new user familiar with Unix). You only realize in hindsight. The problem comes when people who are used to the ad hoc way of doing things like this come in contact with Plan 9. The majority of the people on this list are so immersed in the tools philosophy that it's like breathing to them. The intracacies and nuances are natural to them. When you pit this mastery against the sense of entitlement that comes from mainstream systems you get conflicts like this. People expect canned solutions not pointers to *how* to solve things. But this is all obvious and has been discussed to death in the archives. The real issue is how to solve this problem. I propose that we emphasize the tools philosophy to clarify the underlying philosophy and justifications in introductions to new users. It's already there really, but scattered in other explanations rather than dealt with systematically. Now that I'm thinking about it, I think this is what ESR and Jim Choate mean when they talk about a lack of documentation --but not in the way they think. Plan 9 *is* sufficiently documented assuming that you make it past the first "conceptual hump", understanding the basis of the tools philosophy. One way of solving this would be to use existing books like the "Unix Programming Environment" or "Software Tools" with their code updated for Plan 9. I think a lot of people avoid those books because they don't believe they need to learn ancient Unix or Ratfor. And it's a shame because they miss the conceptual forest for the trees of individual system implementations and cruft. I'll gladly contribute anything I can if we can agree on a roadmap. Noah From rminnich@lanl.gov Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:05:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8061 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:05:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8057 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:05:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:05:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B691119DC2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:05:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D816F19DBE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:05:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 628A519DB8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:04:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1555F19DAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:04:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HH41jt005756 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:04:01 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HH3wL7013871 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:04:01 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HH3sfQ003639 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:03:54 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:03:53 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >My question was how to do the same from rc. >@{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } >succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? well, seems it would be bad if all you had to do to change userid was echo into '#c/user' So, starting from that, the why should be apparent. ron From rog@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:09:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8328 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:09:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8324 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:09:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:09:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39C5019DB9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:09:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3D4719C9B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:09:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55BA219DAC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 182ED199DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:08:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0e0cb432b6b2920c12c7b9bde24f0e27@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:13:58 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > well, seems it would be bad if all you had to do to change userid was > echo into '#c/user' but if echo was built in to the shell (as it is in some other systems) that's all you *would* have to do! From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:14:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8704 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:14:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8700 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:14:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:14:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 31EC019DCA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:14:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90AC319DB5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:14:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED7FF19BEE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:13:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D78E19D87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:13:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <0e0cb432b6b2920c12c7b9bde24f0e27@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pgzofyunmvbtwkypnvovmtshad" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:13:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pgzofyunmvbtwkypnvovmtshad Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If all you wanted to do was change the user id, that would be true. However, without running newns() it's kind of useless/dangerous. --upas-pgzofyunmvbtwkypnvovmtshad Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 12:09:37 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 12:09:34 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91CF119D3C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:09:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B8A4919DAE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:09:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55BA219DAC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 182ED199DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:08:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0e0cb432b6b2920c12c7b9bde24f0e27@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:13:58 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > well, seems it would be bad if all you had to do to change userid was > echo into '#c/user' but if echo was built in to the shell (as it is in some other systems) that's all you *would* have to do! --upas-pgzofyunmvbtwkypnvovmtshad-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:25:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9306 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:25:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9302 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:25:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:25:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6C27E19BBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:25:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BF9619B0B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:25:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC99419AC9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:24:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A9AA19B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:24:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HHOGjt013453 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:24:16 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HHOGL7025968 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:24:16 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HHOGfQ004746 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:24:16 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity In-Reply-To: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:24:15 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 17 Mar 2004, Noah Evans wrote: > A really bad habit of mine is relying on the history to do things, > Rather than spend the initial cost of effort to write a shell function > and remember it, I'm constantly using Bash's tab completion and history > functions to avoid having to expend any effort organizing my patterns of > use and solving problems. Everything I do is an ad hoc solution. there's some real humor here, in some sense, as this is what we did in the 70s with Unix V6, before stuff like history. Some things have come full circle. ron From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 18 07:13:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:26:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9334 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:26:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9330 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:26:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:26:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 16F7719D9A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:26:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C0CA19BEE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:26:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 25CC319A03; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCED319B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:25:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:25:06 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Very well put Noah, thanks. I would like to add a quote by somebody well respected outside our little community (the quote itself regards Plan 9 so it's on-topic). In my opinion it explains fairly well what most of us (who have migrated to Plan 9 not going through the 1127 school of thought education) were like when we first came: Ok, sure, I admit a little bias. I'm used to treating the OS as an enemy that, given a chance, does everything wrong :-) You can find the original discussion in the comp.os.plan9 archives on groups.google.. andrey From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:44:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10239 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:44:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10232 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:44:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:44:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0A8719DBC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A3FA19CDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:44:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9EBF819B97; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B26C419B0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:43:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /sys/src/cmd/kbmap.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:43:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Now on sources. This is mirtchov's utility to let you switch between keyboard maps easily. It always loads the 'ascii' (or default) map between switches because many of the keyboard maps are just deltas on that map. From davel@anvil.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:46:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10316 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:46:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10312 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:46:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:46:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BD8F19DC7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:46:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 279B919D35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:46:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C4D4619D35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:45:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B396819B93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:45:13 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 00B122B5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:45:05 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C6502A7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:45:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06087 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:44:58 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> References: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079545383.14420.651.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:43:03 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > When you pit this mastery against the sense of entitlement that comes > from mainstream systems you get conflicts like this. People expect > canned solutions not pointers to *how* to solve things. Yes, and maybe we should emphasise this more. Personally, I feel that if people don't "get it", then maybe that's their problem? > The real issue is how to solve this problem. Well, to some extent it solves itself ... If people aren't willing to invest the effort, then they don't get the benefit. Remember, I'm in a far worse position than a lot of 9fans: I have no plan9 system, but nonetheless, I think I "get it". > I propose that we emphasize the tools philosophy to clarify the underlying philosophy and justifications in introductions to new users. It's already there really, but scattered in other explanations rather than dealt with systematically. Well, OK, but I would have thought that was a "given" ... > One way of solving this would be to use existing books like the > "Unix Programming Environment" or "Software Tools" with their code updated for Plan 9. I think a lot of people avoid those books because they don't believe they need to learn ancient Unix or Ratfor. And it's a shame because they miss the conceptual forest for the trees of individual system implementations and cruft. > I'll gladly contribute anything I can if we can agree on a roadmap. Well, I still think that, since I "get it" with the available information, there's no problem! Dave. From rog@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:55:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10777 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:55:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10773 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:55:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:55:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 45ACE19DC9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:55:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B6B319A03; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:55:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CD7819CDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A86319A03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:54:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <1079545383.14420.651.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:59:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have no plan9 system, but nonetheless, I think I "get it". just thinking you "get it" doesn't necessarily mean anything when it comes to *actually* doing things with the system. it's only then that the ugly (or not) realities start to bite. i really don't see how you could justify saying the things you previously said when you haven't actually tried to do this stuff yourself. i read plan 9 manuals for years before i ever got my hands on a working system - and when i did, i quickly realised that it's very easy to imagine a system that's significantly different from the one which actually exists... From davel@anvil.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:56:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10817 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10813 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:56:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6DDE919B20; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:56:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4C5B19D35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:56:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42CAF19DC8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:55:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAB0319DC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 154142C5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:55:17 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B13D52C7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:55:12 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA08661 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:55:08 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> References: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079545993.14420.684.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:53:13 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh for f***'s sake! Careful: you're next:-). > ok, so david tolpin has been a bit verbose, (and we're naturally > suspicious that his deep involvement with XML implies a fundamental > lack of taste) Not the deep involvement: I and at least one or 2 other people on this list have used XML, but don't evangelise about it 'cos we know it's barfious. > but when it comes down to it, he's has actually dived > in there and done stuff. Cool, which means he's halfway there. > most newcomers to plan 9 don't get further than booting the damn > thing. Which means that some people don't want to talk to them, which is fine too! > i think people that have been involved in this stuff for a long time > forget the distance between plan 9 and other systems. No, I continually thank my non-existent deity for that distance. > yes, most stuff > is documented (often by implication), but having someone to talk to > that knows about the system makes all the difference. Yes, but expecting them to answer _all_ your questions is not useful. > i think all > david's questions have been perfectly acceptable, and i wouldn't have > thought twice about answering them had they been asked by someone > across the room. Fine. We differ. > this system *needs* people with some energy to spare, otherwise it'll > continue to decline the way it has been since the great scattering from > bell labs. I don't see the benefit in involving people who don't "get it": we'll end up with linux again. Also, if plan9 dies, then maybe it will be down to bad luck, or maybe it deserves to, because it ain't good enough. If that is the case, then, in another few years, some bright spark in a room somewhere will say, "I know, let's write our own ..." and history will repeat itself. > if this is the way we treat someone who appears to have > some energy and inclination, then i've no hope at all. We treat everyone the same around here ... > i'm ashamed to > be part of this group. Then don't be. I admit to being ashamed of my own brutality at times, but the alternative (spoonfeeding people) is far, far worse. > > If you can't get over this initial conceptual hump, > > then fuck off back to CrapOS and leave us alone. > *cringe* I stand by it: if you're not willing to do the brainwork to understand the system, don't use it. It ain't Windows. Dave. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 02:57:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10893 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 02:57:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10889 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 02:57:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 02:57:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3014E19DCB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0089519DCC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:57:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CC0C19A7D; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:56:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C3BC19A7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:56:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUQ00DBUF1VLM@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:53:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:53:55 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <297e6b297131.297131297e6b@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 12:53:55 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Exactly(if I understand you right). Everything that's been added on since then is just a way of avoiding the right way of doing things(i.e. coming up with a way of describing the problem, then adding that idiom to your vocabulary). But then again, I'm just quoting the gospel of "software tools". Sociologists have studied this process quite a bit. A small group of talented people come up with something very interesting and elegant, like a religion or clothing style, and then as it spreads and diffuses the meme begins to mutate and simplify. Pretty soon it ossifies and barely even resembles the original. I wish I had paid more attention when my professor was discussing it. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: ron minnich Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 12:24 pm Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity > On Wed, 17 Mar 2004, Noah Evans wrote: > > > A really bad habit of mine is relying on the history to do things, > > Rather than spend the initial cost of effort to write a shell > function> and remember it, I'm constantly using Bash's tab > completion and history > > functions to avoid having to expend any effort organizing my > patterns of > > use and solving problems. Everything I do is an ad hoc solution. > > there's some real humor here, in some sense, as this is what we > did in the > 70s with Unix V6, before stuff like history. Some things have come > full > circle. > > ron > > From davel@anvil.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:01:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11112 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:01:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11108 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:01:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:01:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2F3A19DD8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:01:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DBA019D73; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:01:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4631219B20; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EA7F19CDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 9E642298; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:00:03 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FCA027E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:00:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA09381 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:59:57 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> References: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:58:02 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > just thinking you "get it" doesn't necessarily mean anything when it > comes to *actually* doing things with the system. it's only then that > the ugly (or not) realities start to bite. And the pretty ones too. > i really don't see how you could justify saying the things you > previously said when you haven't actually tried to do this stuff > yourself. Because I understand how the system's supposed to work. Getting bogged down in "how do I get an azerty keyboard to work?" is not what it's about. > i read plan 9 manuals for years before i ever got my hands on a > working system - and when i did, i quickly realised that it's very > easy to imagine a system that's significantly different from the one > which actually exists... Yes, and it's equally easy to imagine a system that's significantly the same too ... From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:03:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11227 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:03:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11217 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:03:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:03:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A3BD19DDA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E91519DC2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:03:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 067E319DCC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:02:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D05319DCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:02:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2HI0j7b086907 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2HI0jtq086906 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > >@{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } > > >succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? > > well, seems it would be bad if all you had to do to change userid was > echo into '#c/user' > > So, starting from that, the why should be apparent. The 'Why' was about a different issue. The question was why the C program behaves differently than the shell script. The C program just writes to #c/user to change the owner of the process. The answer is that writing to #c/user is special in the sense that although it is a part of namespace, it changes the state of the process space, which is only apparent if you look into the kernel source. A more general conclusion is that for tasks where writing to or reading from files reflects or affects process space, and not name space, rc is not suitable and C code must be written. I am now into the sources to understand which files in the namespace are actually not in it, but in the process space. David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ From davel@anvil.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:12:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11655 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:12:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11651 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:12:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:12:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 07C6919DD9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07EE619BBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70DAB19D35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:11:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 599D719BB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:11:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 95D652CF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:16 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BCA62CD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:15 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA11487 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:11 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079546956.14420.730.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:09:16 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm going to add my voice to Pip's and especially Rog's. I envy > David's ability to get things done in a totally novel environment (I'm > also a recent dot convert, thank you, David) and I have little trouble > sympathising with David's queries, understanding that not everyone is > as comfortable with English idioms as the Bell Labs ex-convicts are. It's not to do with english and queries, it's to do with understanding the system. As soon as I have time, I'm going to sweat reading the kernel right the way through, just so I understand what's going on. > As for those who have spent time on this list just to deplore David's > behaviour, I believe they should put a bit more effort, in a > considerably less anglocentric fashion, to understand where some of us > come from and what we are able to contribute. I think you're being a bit unfair. From dbailey27@ameritech.net Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:13:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11698 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:13:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11694 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:13:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:13:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E000019D35; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A2F819D72; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 363B919DDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B2F5719DD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from unknown (HELO ameritech.net) (dbailey27@ameritech.net@69.212.36.67 with plain) by smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:07:13 -0000 Message-ID: <4058969E.9060000@ameritech.net> From: Don Bailey User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity References: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> In-Reply-To: <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:19:10 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > And the pretty ones too. Well, I think you're all jerks! Let's get back to the main point of the day, Guinness!! Today, that's *my* tall pretty one... Happy St. Patrick's Day! Don From rminnich@lanl.gov Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:14:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11743 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:14:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11739 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:14:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:14:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D683119DDE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:14:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A979719DE2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:14:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0361019A2C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FE4A19B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HID0jt030117 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:13:00 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HID0Gr003291 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:13:00 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2HICxfQ007001 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:12:59 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:12:59 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 17 Mar 2004, David Tolpin wrote: > The question was why the C program behaves differently than > the shell script. The C program just writes to #c/user to > change the owner of the process. oops, sorry, missed it. Ignore me :-) ron From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:15:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11786 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:15:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11774 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:15:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:15:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D796219DC2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:15:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C0D619CDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:15:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B442919DE3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:14:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EF7D19DDC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:14:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d59453c959b7754370ac8f4953956d3@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-pwpejlnbscgvathjxzpwvwjrrn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:14:29 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-pwpejlnbscgvathjxzpwvwjrrn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You're confusing name space and semantics. It is indeed in the name space but the semantics of writing it is to change the state of the writer not everyone who can see the name space. Processes owned by different users can all share objects in the same name space. However reading or writing those objects can have different permissions and results for the different processes. If I where to unbind /dev, all processes in that name space would see that object disappear. The discontinuity/incongruity in Plan 9 is what an object can see about the process using it. Kernel objects (things implemented with #x for any x) can see the process and can adjust their behavior on its immediate state (this is especially true of #p). However anything that goes through 9P only sees the user's state by way of the messages sent to it. It can't tell anything about the particular process performing an action and can thus only adjust its semantics according to the user who actually bound the object into its name space (this action turns to an attach). --upas-pwpejlnbscgvathjxzpwvwjrrn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 13:03:32 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 13:03:29 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A540619B20; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:03:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 299BF19DC8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:03:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 067E319DCC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:02:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D05319DCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:02:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2HI0j7b086907 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2HI0jtq086906 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > >@{echo -n none > '#c/user' ; while() {sleep 1} } > > >succeeds but does not change the owner of the process. Why? > > well, seems it would be bad if all you had to do to change userid was > echo into '#c/user' > > So, starting from that, the why should be apparent. The 'Why' was about a different issue. The question was why the C program behaves differently than the shell script. The C program just writes to #c/user to change the owner of the process. The answer is that writing to #c/user is special in the sense that although it is a part of namespace, it changes the state of the process space, which is only apparent if you look into the kernel source. A more general conclusion is that for tasks where writing to or reading from files reflects or affects process space, and not name space, rc is not suitable and C code must be written. I am now into the sources to understand which files in the namespace are actually not in it, but in the process space. David Tolpin http://davidashen.net/ --upas-pwpejlnbscgvathjxzpwvwjrrn-- From noah.evans@cwru.edu Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:16:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11895 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:16:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11891 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:16:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:16:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F38619DE2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:16:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6CDB119CDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:16:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5300419DD2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:15:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1042119DC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUQ00MY7FUDYF@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:11:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:11:01 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <29684f29c4dd.29c4dd29684f@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:11:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm really not sure how to answer this without waxing philosophical. I think the real key here is the idea of nature vs nurture. Some people are born with a great ability to handle complexity, they can, just by looking at the source code, discussions and man pages, determine all of the important ideas by induction. These people will naturally gravitate towards the elegant and the good. But there are other people, who lack this natural ability but still possess a great thirst for knowledge and drive yet can't find the right information on their own. These are the people with the potential to grasp Plan 9 but lack the nurturing environment that will allow them to realize this potential. They muddle around the wiki for a little bit, read some 9fans and maybe post once or twice and then decide they're too stupid, plan 9 sucks, what have you. These are the people I'm talking about. Most of the people on this list are in the first category so people in the second category seem dense or deliberately obtuse. By trying to understand their position I think we can do a lot more to make Plan 9 accessible. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: Dave Lukes Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 12:43 pm Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity > > When you pit this mastery against the sense of entitlement that > comes> from mainstream systems you get conflicts like this. People > expect> canned solutions not pointers to *how* to solve things. > > Yes, and maybe we should emphasise this more. > > Personally, I feel that if people don't "get it", > then maybe that's their problem? > > > The real issue is how to solve this problem. > > Well, to some extent it solves itself ... > > If people aren't willing to invest the effort, > then they don't get the benefit. > > Remember, I'm in a far worse position than a lot of 9fans: > I have no plan9 system, but nonetheless, I think I "get it". > > > I propose that we emphasize the tools philosophy to clarify the > underlying philosophy and justifications in introductions to new > users. It's already there really, but scattered in other > explanations rather than dealt with systematically. > > Well, OK, but I would have thought that was a "given" ... > > > One way of solving this would be to use existing books like the > > "Unix Programming Environment" or "Software Tools" with their > code updated for Plan 9. I think a lot of people avoid those books > because they don't believe they need to learn ancient Unix or > Ratfor. And it's a shame because they miss the conceptual forest > for the trees of individual system implementations and cruft. > > > I'll gladly contribute anything I can if we can agree on a roadmap. > > Well, I still think that, > since I "get it" with the available information, there's no problem! > > Dave. > > > From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:19:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12101 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:19:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12097 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:19:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:19:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1224119DEB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:19:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A66F019DBD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:19:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D47919DA7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:18:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DC1219DBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:18:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <76b40548c67f31799ad030dc8bc822c5@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity In-Reply-To: <4058969E.9060000@ameritech.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tzgfncapgyquphnwrulrfkgorj" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:18:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tzgfncapgyquphnwrulrfkgorj Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To get people in the mood of the day: Welcome to the St Patrick's day virus! Since we've found people to be much sociable on this day we're trying a new generation of viruses. To take part do the following: 1) forward this message to at least two friends 2) delete all your files Have a Guinness and thank you for playing. --upas-tzgfncapgyquphnwrulrfkgorj Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 13:13:33 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Wed Mar 17 13:13:30 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9461319B28; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EAFC19BB9; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:13:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 363B919DDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com (smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com [66.163.170.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id B2F5719DD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from unknown (HELO ameritech.net) (dbailey27@ameritech.net@69.212.36.67 with plain) by smtp811.mail.sc5.yahoo.com with SMTP; 17 Mar 2004 18:07:13 -0000 Message-ID: <4058969E.9060000@ameritech.net> From: Don Bailey User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity References: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> In-Reply-To: <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:19:10 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.9 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > And the pretty ones too. Well, I think you're all jerks! Let's get back to the main point of the day, Guinness!! Today, that's *my* tall pretty one... Happy St. Patrick's Day! Don --upas-tzgfncapgyquphnwrulrfkgorj-- From 9nut@9netics.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:21:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12176 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:21:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12172 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:21:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:21:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 970BB19DE8; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 080A019DF0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:21:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 141D519DE1; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79FB919CDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:20:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: dvd@davidashen.net Cc: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <200403170948.i2H9mi3W084127@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 10:24:05 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In a private email to me, David Tolpin said: >> You said: >> >> >> > a program from a shell script and change the user it runs as. >> and later >> > ? Is none not user? >> >> Are you trying to solve a real problem or win an argument? >> > > I was trying to understand why #c/user does not obey the rules > of namespaces. But I didn't know that I was trying to do that, > what I did is that I could do an obvious thing with rc, > and was asking for help. And Charles Forsyth explained the issue > without resorting to offensive rants. > > The art of listening to others is not yet well-developed on > 9fans. > > David A couple of things: 1. Anything you need to say to me you can say on 9fans. Helps keep the story straight. 2. Are you saying that you did not ask: a. "Novice question - run as other" (from the subject line) b. "... from a shell script and change the user it runs as." (from your message) If your question was truely about changing to "none" and not some arbitrary user, then why not say "... - run as none", or "... from a shell script and change the user it runs as, to none". you seem like a smart guy, and i would have no reason to think what you asked is related to anything other than what you asked about. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:30:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12614 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:30:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12610 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:30:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:30:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CDC8519DEE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:30:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F76C19C6F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:30:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E052199DB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:29:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 716861998C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:29:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:28:08 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2HKAgjR001487 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:10:45 GMT Message-ID: <12ee874bd1d1ca3246f99555054e2820@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:29:43 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, My all-time favorite Unix story, lifted from http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/hist.html Although the multiple-process idea slipped in very easily indeed, there were some aftereffects that weren't anticipated. The most memorable of these became evident soon after the new system came up and apparently worked. In the midst of our jubilation, it was discovered that the chdir (change current directory) command had stopped working. There was much reading of code and anxious introspection about how the addition of fork could have broken the chdir call. Finally the truth dawned: in the old system chdir was an ordinary command; it adjusted the current directory of the (unique) process attached to the terminal. Under the new system, the chdir command correctly changed the current directory of the process created to execute it, but this process promptly terminated and had no effect whatsoever on its parent shell! It was necessary to make chdir a special command, executed internally within the shell. It turns out that several command-like functions have the same property, for example login. -Steve From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:57:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13939 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:57:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13934 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:57:00 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:57:00 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C0B219CE2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:56:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F005119BBB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:56:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9EF1F19E48; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:39:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47BBA19E3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:39:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <76fd53eacc4a855081ab20e2a1b94ed2@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] vmware 4.5 and plan9's vmware image Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 11:39:34 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: put a relatively complete guide to running plan9 in vmware 4.x: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/vmware4/index.html it's rather hastily written, so feel free to add your comments :) andrey From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 03:57:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13968 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 03:57:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13964 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 03:57:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 03:57:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4175419E54; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4D4919E51; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:57:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F031F19E4C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:45:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACE9819E3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:45:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (skeletor.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.142]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31C7124FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:45:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] patch(1) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 13:47:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On a more positive note, the discussion a few days ago did catch my attention by pointing out that Nemo had been submitting patches with patch(1). I found it so pleasant to apply the patches that I did the legwork to make patch(1) work for everyone. So if you have proposed changes to the system, feel free to use patch(1) to submit them. It's much more convenient for us, and I suspect it's more convenient for submitters. Thanks to David Tolpin for helping to test the setup. Russ From lucho@ionkov.net Thu Mar 18 07:13:08 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:14:11 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15392 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:14:10 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15387 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:14:10 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:14:10 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E32D019DF0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:13:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BBF619DEA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:13:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 01CB919DBE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:12:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc11.comcast.net (sccrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.202.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D8AB19D00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.38.117.182]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2004031719120601100lgb5be>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:12:06 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id C03F74623E0; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:12:23 -0500 (EST) From: Latchesar Ionkov To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity Message-ID: <20040317191223.GA16937@ionkov.net> References: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> <1079545993.14420.684.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1079545993.14420.684.camel@zevon> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:12:23 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, Mar 17, 2004 at 05:53:13PM +0000, Dave Lukes said: > I admit to being ashamed of my own brutality at times, > but the alternative (spoonfeeding people) > is far, far worse. What is wrong with just ignoring the questions that require the spoonfeeding you are not willing to provide? I also fully agree with Rog. Lucho From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 18 07:13:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:28:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16151 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:28:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16147 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:28:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:28:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EF5419DE3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:28:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1520919DEA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:28:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1FA5519DBA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:27:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 779DA19D00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:26:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0885f65cf26a5c1a8a981e5650bb366f@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <1079546956.14420.730.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:26:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > As soon as I have time, I'm going to sweat reading the kernel > right the way through, just so I understand what's going on. Although *a*lot* out of date, the Notes on the Plan 9 Kernel Sources (see google) may help you to do that. hth From rog@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:29:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16220 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:29:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16215 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:29:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:29:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D96A019DF5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:29:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13ED419DD3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:29:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C2EC819DD3; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:28:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D56419D00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:28:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <90ae5a0975174f463f066e8be24438f5@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:34:28 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > A more general conclusion is that for tasks where writing to > or reading from files reflects or affects process space, and not > name space, rc is not suitable and C code must be written. that's not necessarily the case - only for something that changes something in the writing process that isn't inherited by child processes. quite a few devices use this hack, often for efficiency reasons. ones i'm aware of include (aspects of) srv(3), ssl(3), tls(3), ip(3), cap(3), fs(3), dup(3) and cons(3) From soytimofonico@yahoo.es Thu Mar 18 07:13:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:44:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17270 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:44:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17266 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:44:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:44:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 220AD19DDD; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2FFB19DA5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:44:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4018F19D9A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:43:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from web40703.mail.yahoo.com (web40703.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.78.160]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id BF89119C9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:43:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040317194341.14601.qmail@web40703.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [80.58.2.236] by web40703.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:43:41 CET From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Jose=20timofonic?= To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: <90ae5a0975174f463f066e8be24438f5@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] unsuscribe Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:43:41 +0100 (CET) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: unsuscribe ___________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - Nueva versin GRATIS Super Webcam, voz, caritas animadas, y ms... http://messenger.yahoo.es From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:51:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17677 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:51:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17673 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:51:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:51:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C04419DFE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:51:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85BAF19DB5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:51:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6275619DEA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:50:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 523CF19DA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (skeletor.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.142]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCA4E24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:50:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4058AC77.40205@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other References: <90ae5a0975174f463f066e8be24438f5@vitanuova.com> In-Reply-To: <90ae5a0975174f463f066e8be24438f5@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:52:23 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >quite a few devices use this hack, often for efficiency reasons. > >ones i'm aware of include (aspects of) srv(3), ssl(3), tls(3), ip(3), >cap(3), fs(3), dup(3) and cons(3) > > ip(3) ? russ From rog@vitanuova.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:09 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 04:53:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17847 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 04:53:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17791 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 04:53:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 04:53:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 31DC619D7B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87DCB19DBE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:53:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2012419DFC; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 506EC19DF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:52:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <4058AC77.40205@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:58:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ip(3) ? bind ether path From sar_966@hotmail.com Thu Mar 18 07:13:10 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 06:10:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22589 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 06:10:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22585 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 06:10:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 06:10:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9801419C9F; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7FC319B93; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:10:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5334919B93; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:09:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.one.net.pk (unknown [202.5.159.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B733519B7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:09:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from 202.5.159.98 (ISDN-Dialup-98.One.Net.pk [202.5.159.98]) by mail.one.net.pk (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id i2HL16L27367 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:01:16 +0500 (PKT) Message-Id: <200403172101.i2HL16L27367@mail.one.net.pk> From: "SAR" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Mach5 Mailer-2.50 PID{4ca6be40-6853-11d8-9033-994f30a86c34} RC{Arif ur Rehman} MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----000000000000000000000" Subject: [9fans] Sstop Spreading Hatred Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: sar_966@hotmail.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:20:22 +0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.3 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_PAST_06_12,DCC_CHECK, FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** ------000000000000000000000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Stop Spreading Hatred I think being a Muslim you are not working for peace. You are misguided, mistaken and spreading hatred through disinformation and false accusations, which is resulting in death and miseries for number of innocent people living around the world at the hands of merciless KILLER MUSLIMS and also bringing bad name to MOHAMMED as Founder Of Islam. Try and work for peace and reconciliation, and prove to the WORLD through your deeds that MOHAMMED teaches "love & peace" and not Cruelty, Inhumanity and "Hatred & Killing" of the innocent civilians. S.A.R ------000000000000000000000-- From geoff@collyer.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 07:49:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29497 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 07:49:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29493 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 07:49:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 07:49:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 578F719DFF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:49:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FCF519DDE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:49:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 37FD919DEB; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:48:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDD8F19DDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:48:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7e35c7b619f4bb7936677f2b26f0b69a@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <1079546956.14420.730.camel@zevon> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 14:48:00 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: davel touches many of the relevant points. I have no objection to David asking questions, per se (though some of them did suggest a real lack of effort, but that's not fatal). I have no problem with David's use of English, or anybody else's. I'm glad to see others taking an interest in Plan 9. What I did, and do, object to is a persistently snarky attitude among someone asking for help, particularly in response to answers intended to be helpful and responsive to his questions, as the people answering them understood them. His apparent perception that we're all trying to insult him (`I knew that.', `I knew that.') probably doesn't help his attitude, but I don't believe that these apparently-perceived insults were intended as insults. If he can't find a way to get along with people here without irritating large numbers of us frequently, it's going to be an unpleasant experience for him and many of us. From ggm@apnic.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:11:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31051 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:11:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31047 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:11:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:11:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2396919DFF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8351719B04; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1C5A19DF7; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:10:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B155119DEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:10:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2HNArni001429 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:10:54 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-Id: <20040318091052.66c7ec8d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.349 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.349 (notspam) BAYES_30,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Subject: [9fans] xen port? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:10:52 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Xen just got ported to NetBSD, so I have hopes I can have plan9 on my dell L400 which is otherwise not viable (ATI Mobility chipset) can I get a brief sitrep on xen? cheers -george From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 18 21:51:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:12:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31152 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:12:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31145 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:12:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:12:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B99819E02; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F34019B04; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:12:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 480E119E00; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2027419DFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5d6f468b29b3f42e61638de44bc95604@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity In-Reply-To: <7e35c7b619f4bb7936677f2b26f0b69a@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:11:29 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: It's too hard to read a person's attitude through mail messages. Give it a rest please. From ggm@apnic.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:14:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31366 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:14:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31362 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:14:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:14:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB9A919E03; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:14:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B34BB19DDA; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:14:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 32A0C19DF2; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:13:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B95519C50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:13:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2HNDkni001905 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:13:46 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-Id: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.6 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.6 (notspam) BAYES_01,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Subject: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:13:45 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I may have misunderstood some email a few days back saying that the wiki now demanded a plan9 path to change its contents. Its kind of hard to make the list of non-supported hardware up to date if you can't run the tool to say you can't run the tool... -george From vdharani@infernopark.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:40 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:38:52 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 559 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:38:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 538 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:38:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:38:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E03B19DDE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2DBF719B37; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:38:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE20019DDE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (unknown [216.127.72.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7269119B37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from infernopark.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2I1ojg11393 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:50:45 -0500 Received: from 192.11.226.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:50:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <56957.192.11.226.116.1079574645.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> References: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.5) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:50:45 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.7 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,RCVD_IN_NJABL, RCVD_IN_NJABL_RELAY autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > > I may have misunderstood some email a few days back saying that the > wiki now demanded a plan9 path to change its contents. > > Its kind of hard to make the list of non-supported hardware up to > date if you can't run the tool to say you can't run the tool... in that case, an email to this mailing list could be one way to do that? From ggm@apnic.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:44:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 990 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:44:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 981 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:44:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:44:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47A2919DDE; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84C8219E0E; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:44:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFA1519E10; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:43:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B466619DEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:43:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2HNhBni013783; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:43:11 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: vdharani@infernopark.com Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes Message-Id: <20040318094311.59d16822@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: <56957.192.11.226.116.1079574645.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> References: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> <56957.192.11.226.116.1079574645.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.127 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.127 (notspam) BAYES_20,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:43:11 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:50:45 -0500 (EST) wrote: >> Its kind of hard to make the list of non-supported hardware up to >> date if you can't run the tool to say you can't run the tool... >in that case, an email to this mailing list could be one way to do that? cool! can you update this link on the wiki please so its clear how people who can't run plan9 can report not being able to run it on specific h/w? http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Supported_PC_hardware/index.html cheers -george -- George Michaelson | APNIC Email: ggm@apnic.net | PO Box 2131 Milton QLD 4064 Phone: +61 7 3858 3150 | Australia Fax: +61 7 3858 3199 | http://www.apnic.net From jas@corpus-callosum.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:45:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1257 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:45:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1172 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:45:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:45:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A397B19E14; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:45:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A56419E1C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:45:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1840E19E11; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:44:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from gate.corpus-callosum.com (ip-216-36-98-130.dsl.chi.megapath.net [216.36.98.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C02AD19DDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:44:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (codex [10.0.1.8]) by gate.corpus-callosum.com (8.12.6/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i2HNiAfK029679 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:44:11 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from jas@corpus-callosum.com) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v613) In-Reply-To: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> References: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:44:05 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: You can always post your non-supported hardware to 9fans. The late February comment requiring Plan 9 tools and protocols be used when making modifications to the wiki does help create a basic editorial responsibility on the individuals desiring to submit changes to the wiki. For those who do use Plan 9, feel free to clean up the new addition to the wiki-- http://plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/Informal_Wiki_Setup/index.html jas From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 18 21:51:41 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:54:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2242 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:54:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2238 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:54:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:54:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BED319E26; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:54:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4395719E20; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:54:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A39F919E25; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:53:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from home.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E0CC19E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:53:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:52:17 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I may have misunderstood some email a few days back saying that the wiki now > demanded a plan9 path to change its contents. > > Its kind of hard to make the list of non-supported hardware up to > date if you can't run the tool to say you can't run the tool... > > -george i think it's justified as a (temporary?) solution to all the crap everybody suddenly decides to tell the world the second they find a world-writable wiki. of all the pages that were created in the wiki (see the what's new page) only about 20% were plan9 related. watching for them and deleting them would be a task as hard as moderating 9fans :) i spent a good hour today removing all the '3y3 0wnz0rz j00' text from all pages that had nothing to do with plan9 (i have no permission to delete them, so i simply replaced the offending text with links to the plan9 homepage)... it wasn't pretty, must say :) if you want something added to the wiki send the text to someone running plan9. you can even send it to me if you like -- adding it to the wiki will take considerably less time than removing extraneous pages had it been left open. andrey From ggm@apnic.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 08:59:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2870 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 08:59:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2866 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 08:59:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 08:59:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2073D19E31; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A26E419E26; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:59:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B36DB19E21; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:58:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBB1619E24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:58:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2HNwYni017950; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:58:34 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes Message-Id: <20040318095834.65730eb9@as-tech-l.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.127 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.127 (notspam) BAYES_20,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:58:34 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sorry. I should have been more clear. I think its good to eat your own dogfood. There is just one specific case where it won't work: (if you're a goldfish?) -And from other responses its clear the special-case is to mail here. -george From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 18 21:51:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 09:02:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3133 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 09:02:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3125 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 09:02:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 09:02:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B47419E32; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:02:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5028119E2B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:02:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7A8619E2C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:01:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87E8119E20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 19:01:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <106cbfec5ee0f8cb575ff45a7a23dae2@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 16:40:26 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I may have misunderstood some email a few days back saying that the wiki now > demanded a plan9 path to change its contents. > > Its kind of hard to make the list of non-supported hardware up to > date if you can't run the tool to say you can't run the tool... > > -george i think it's justified as a (temporary?) solution to all the crap everybody suddenly decides to tell the world the second they find a world-writable wiki. of all the pages that were created in the wiki (see the what's new page) only about 20% were plan9 related. watching for them and deleting them would be a task as hard as moderating 9fans :) i spent a good hour today removing all the '3y3 0wnz0rz j00' text from all pages that had nothing to do with plan9 (i have no permission to delete them, so i simply replaced the offending text with links to the plan9 homepage)... it wasn't pretty, must say :) if you want something added to the wiki send the text to someone running plan9. you can even send it to me if you like -- adding it to the wiki will take considerably less time than removing extraneous pages had it been left open. andrey From bs@nospam.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 10:06:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9640 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 10:06:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9635 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 10:06:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 10:06:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4267F19E36; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:06:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC44319E19; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:06:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 21A0A19DFF; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:05:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc12.comcast.net (sccrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.202.56]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDB1719B11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:05:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from nospam.com (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[65.96.66.33]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id <2004031801053701200n7t98e>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 01:05:37 +0000 Message-ID: <4058F5EF.8040306@nospam.com> From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity References: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> In-Reply-To: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: bs@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:05:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > But this philosophy is lost on people who are used to the windows/consumer Unix world because they're used to solutions that violate the tools method of solving problems. This is not a fair statement. IMO, the beauty of something is to the builder, the experience of something is to the user. A porsche driver cares about how it feels to drive, not the geometry of the suspension or the degrees of freedom used to tune it. Similary, one can keep the innovations of plan9 under the covers and deliver something an end user might enjoy(even if it means tab completion). (this is from someone who has contributed zippo (other than noise) to this list). From taj.khattra@pobox.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:42 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 10:17:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10750 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 10:17:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10739 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 10:17:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 10:17:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8296319E04; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:17:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C926419E04; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:17:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A461019E19; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:16:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.net (outbound04.telus.net [199.185.220.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D90419DEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 20:16:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([207.6.113.245]) by priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.net (InterMail vM.6.00.05.02 201-2115-109-103-20031105) with ESMTP id <20040318011632.FPHF26906.priv-edtnes51.telusplanet.net@localhost.localdomain> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 18:16:32 -0700 Received: (qmail 30874 invoked by uid 500); 18 Mar 2004 01:20:20 -0000 From: Taj Khattra To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity Message-ID: <20040318012020.GB30755@localhost.localdomain> References: <286242286f27.286f27286242@cwru.edu> <4058F5EF.8040306@nospam.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <4058F5EF.8040306@nospam.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:20:20 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Similary, one can keep the innovations of plan9 under the covers I am working under the covers, you know... -- Inspector Clouseau From noah.evans@cwru.edu Thu Mar 18 21:51:43 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 11:10:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16578 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 11:10:01 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16541 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 11:09:53 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 11:09:53 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A59B019E3A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3130519E1B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:09:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E447B19E04; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA82919C9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUR00JHN1Y1MQ@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:08:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.59.232] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:08:25 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <2fa7582fad1f.2fad1f2fa758@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:08:25 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. I'm not saying that people can't have a perfectly productive and enjoyable experience in other systems. What I'm saying is that those experiences are essentially impoverished. By necessity in windows and by sufficiency in modern *nix. Think of this analogy, modern operating systems are like eating in restaurants all your life. It's fine if you like the food, but if you ever want something else, because you never learned to cook(linux) or the restaraunt won't let you(windows), you'll be stuck. Or, worse yet, you'll end up building another restaurant to get the food you want, wasting 10 times the effort you would have learned by learning the proper(tool based) way of doing things. Noah By The difference between rote memorization and understanding. ----- Original Message ----- From: bs Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 8:05 pm Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity > > > But this philosophy is lost on people who are used to the > windows/consumer Unix world because they're used to solutions that > violate the tools method of solving problems. > This is not a fair statement. > IMO, the beauty of something is to the builder, the experience of > something is to the user. > A porsche driver cares about how it feels to drive, not the > geometry of > the suspension or the degrees of freedom used to tune it. > > Similary, one can keep the innovations of plan9 under the covers > and > deliver something an end user might enjoy(even if it means tab > completion). (this is from someone who has contributed zippo (other > than > noise) to this list). > > From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 11:43:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19911 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 11:43:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19905 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 11:43:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 11:43:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 936F819E4A; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:43:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 736EA19E40; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:43:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0351119E16; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:42:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C12319B42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:42:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315217-22499>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:41:37 -0500 Message-ID: <01e001c40c92$39084ba0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <6a2483a3e86ca91902d7199212d02f44@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:39:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh for f***'s sake! i see you can't spell. From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:44 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 11:49:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20939 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 11:49:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20934 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 11:49:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 11:49:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EEA3319A6C; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:49:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA10C19E44; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:49:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 372EA19E47; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:48:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1558619B42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:48:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <318396-21949>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 21:47:20 -0500 Message-ID: <01f201c40c93$04877ad0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:45:01 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm going to add my voice to Pip's and especially Rog's. I envy > David's ability to get things done in a totally novel environment (I'm > also a recent dot convert, thank you, David) ... get things done? cat /dev/noise From martin@parvat.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:45 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 13:25:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 30527 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 13:25:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30523 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 13:25:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 13:25:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFBAA19E52; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 23:25:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2618319DF5; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 23:25:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BC8319E3B; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 23:24:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7412819DF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 17 Mar 2004 23:24:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.205] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B3p54-0002YH-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:24:30 +0100 Received: from [203.101.54.206] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B3p53-0002yX-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:24:30 +0100 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other Message-Id: <20040318095116.673c3fcc.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403171800.i2HI0jtq086906@adat.davidashen.net> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:51:16 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed, 17 Mar 2004 22:00:45 +0400 (AMT) David Tolpin wrote: > A more general conclusion is that for tasks where writing to > or reading from files reflects or affects process space, and not > name space, rc is not suitable and C code must be written. Is it the process that writes to the device that gets altered, or the process that opens the device? I suspect the former, but why is it not the second? If it was the second, then rc could probably be used, but what else wouldn't work, or would break? Was the choice one of expediency, or is there a real semantic advantage to the first choice? Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 16:27:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16551 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 16:27:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16547 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 16:27:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 16:27:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C767A19E5C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:27:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCFFF19D35; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:27:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E982C19B6C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:26:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56DD219D35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:26:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <316378-21942>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:24:59 -0500 Message-ID: <022501c40cb9$e58b6f20$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <189cf4ae0d3c5216477f4e72d63e0589@vitanuova.com> <1079546282.14420.696.camel@zevon> Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:23:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Because I understand how the system's supposed to work. > Getting bogged down in "how do I get an azerty keyboard to work?" > is not what it's about. it is. internationalisation is _hard_; i'm yet to see it done right. if i can't type, i don't code. & charlie don't surf ... From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 16:42:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17691 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 16:42:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17687 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 16:42:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 16:42:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5FB8F19E61; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:42:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA9E219E53; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:42:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B151419E54; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:41:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E34719B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:41:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321342-20308>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:40:42 -0500 Message-ID: <024901c40cbc$16be1f00$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Novice question - run as other MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:38:54 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 1. Anything you need to say to me you can say on 9fans. Helps keep > the story straight. i'm with you, captain ... From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 16:45:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17931 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 16:45:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17927 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 16:45:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 16:45:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C89919E67; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:45:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F6F319B10; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:45:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 318A619E5A; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:44:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE40419B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:44:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311476-20307>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:43:18 -0500 Message-ID: <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:41:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > On a more positive note, the discussion a few days ago did catch > my attention by pointing out that Nemo had been submitting patches > with patch(1). I found it so pleasant to apply the patches that I did > the legwork to make patch(1) work for everyone. patch? nice idea, but when it goes wrong it goes horribly wrong. From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 16:50:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18248 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 16:50:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18244 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 16:50:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 16:50:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5BC3219E6A; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:50:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2F0D19BD8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:50:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1818D19B0C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:49:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F05119A63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:49:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315700-21945>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:49:15 -0500 Message-ID: <02aa01c40cbd$486c5cf0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <7e35c7b619f4bb7936677f2b26f0b69a@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:47:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If he can't find a way to get along > with people here without irritating large numbers of us frequently, > it's going to be an unpleasant experience for him and many of us. as per usual, geoff is bang on the money. From boyd@insultant.net Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 16:58:08 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18856 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 16:58:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18852 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 16:58:06 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 16:58:06 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0340F19B1E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:57:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1E6E19B1E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:57:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC3CF19BD8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:56:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57CC119B1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315601-21945>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:54:51 -0500 Message-ID: <02ce01c40cbe$105ce720$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20040318091345.0f1b52f4@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] closing the wiki to non-9 hosted changes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:53:09 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You can always post your non-supported hardware to 9fans. isn't that list rather long? err, infinite? i'd port it to my microwave, but it doesn't have an IP interface. finger coke From mike@linuxlink.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:46 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 17:15:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20628 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 17:15:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20624 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 17:15:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 17:15:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0C1A619E7B; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:15:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 260BD19E70; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:15:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22E0E19E76; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from riecilla.sotol.org (ppp-67-67-193-8.dsl.austtx.swbell.net [67.67.193.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCF9E19BD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:14:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from linuxlink.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by riecilla.sotol.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 808E189930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:14:46 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <40595A76.5010802@linuxlink.com> From: "Michael H. Collins" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.5) Gecko/20031209 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity References: <2fa7582fad1f.2fad1f2fa758@cwru.edu> In-Reply-To: <2fa7582fad1f.2fad1f2fa758@cwru.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 02:14:46 -0600 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: bobdamn this thread Noah Evans wrote: > I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. > > I'm not saying that people can't have a perfectly productive and enjoyable experience in other systems. What I'm saying is that those experiences are essentially impoverished. By necessity in windows and by sufficiency in modern *nix. > > Think of this analogy, modern operating systems are like eating in restaurants all your life. It's fine if you like the food, but if you ever want something else, because you never learned to cook(linux) or the restaraunt won't let you(windows), you'll be stuck. Or, worse yet, you'll end up building another restaurant to get the food you want, wasting 10 times the effort you would have learned by learning the proper(tool based) way of doing things. > > Noah > > > > > > By > > The difference between rote memorization and understanding. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: bs > Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 8:05 pm > Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity > > >>>But this philosophy is lost on people who are used to the >> >>windows/consumer Unix world because they're used to solutions that >>violate the tools method of solving problems. >>This is not a fair statement. >>IMO, the beauty of something is to the builder, the experience of >>something is to the user. >>A porsche driver cares about how it feels to drive, not the >>geometry of >>the suspension or the degrees of freedom used to tune it. >> >>Similary, one can keep the innovations of plan9 under the covers >>and >>deliver something an end user might enjoy(even if it means tab >>completion). (this is from someone who has contributed zippo (other >>than >>noise) to this list). >> >> > > > > -- Michael H. Collins Admiral, Penguinista Navy http://linuxlink.com http://www.gracklenews.com/ From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 18 21:51:47 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 17:22:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21331 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 17:22:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21327 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 17:22:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 17:22:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0110619E80; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:22:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DDF5C19E7F; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:22:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B81919E7D; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:21:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF31119BD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 03:21:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <820c9820a48475a749bde0b09a599bc9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] usbhid updated Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:21:47 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Since the kernel now has kbmaps, usbhid no longer services them for regular keyboards. Sadly, for usb keyboards, usbhid still has to do it by itself. hth From pmjcovello@shaw.ca Thu Mar 18 21:51:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 18:57:03 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31535 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 18:57:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 30558 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 18:53:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 18:53:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BE1819BD6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 04:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7796719B8E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 04:53:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8FA3C19BC8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 04:52:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2568719A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 04:52:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B3u98-0005VS-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:49:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Thomas Covello Message-ID: <7186c.846424$X%5.462229@pd7tw2no> Organization: Shaw Residential Internet Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT References: Subject: Re: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:48:40 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Monday, March 15th, Phillipe Anel wrote: > It seems you forgot to build/use a new kernel with the radeon driver. > At least, the kernel part didn't find the card. It could be a pciid > problem. I've mk install'd the whole OS for good measure. (It's pretty fast at compiling, eh?) > Could you execute aux/vga -v and send me the result ? % aux/vga -v main->snarf vga->snarf radeon->snarf +vgactlw type radeon sequencer->enter on sequencer->leave on vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" > Ps: I have updated the sources of the radeon driver [...], but I > also found a bug with my radeon 8500 I'd like to fix before posting it > to the 9fans list. I'll try installing the update tomorrow. P.S.: I'm using a 7000 model. Thanks for your help, Thomas Covello --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.624 / Virus Database: 401 - Release Date: 15/Mar/2004 From philippe.anel@noos.fr Thu Mar 18 21:51:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 19:07:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 310 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 19:07:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 304 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 19:07:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 19:07:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9449E19E8E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:07:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56C4719E89; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:07:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E770C19E7D; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:06:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (nan-smtp-14.noos.net [212.198.2.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DC0B19DAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 05:06:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 3599 invoked by uid 0); 18 Mar 2004 10:06:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ntmail.noos.fr) ([195.132.21.174]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.122 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; 18 Mar 2004 10:06:39 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040318110210.0a8120b0@pop.noos.fr> X-Sender: philippe.anel@pop.noos.fr X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Philippe Anel Subject: Re: [9fans] radeon driver doesn't work: bad VGA control message "type radeon" In-Reply-To: <7186c.846424$X%5.462229@pd7tw2no> References: <7186c.846424$X%5.462229@pd7tw2no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 11:08:28 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: At 10:48 18/03/04, you wrote: >On Monday, March 15th, Phillipe Anel wrote: > > > It seems you forgot to build/use a new kernel with the radeon driver. > > At least, the kernel part didn't find the card. It could be a pciid > > problem. > >I've mk install'd the whole OS for good measure. (It's pretty fast at >compiling, eh?) Ok. Remember to copy you compiled kernel to 9fat, and to update your plan9.ini if needed. 9load doesn't boot kernels copied in /386 (at least when fossil is the main filesystem). > > Could you execute aux/vga -v and send me the result ? > >% aux/vga -v >main->snarf >vga->snarf >radeon->snarf >+vgactlw type radeon >sequencer->enter on >sequencer->leave on >vgactlw: : bad VGA control message "type radeon" The kernel you boot on doesn't have radeon support compiled in. Could you send me your kernel configuration file ? >I'll try installing the update tomorrow. I still haven't fixed the bug I have with my radeon8500. Regards, Philippe. From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 18 21:51:48 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 21:18:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9557 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 21:18:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9553 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 21:18:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 21:18:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 49E9219E93; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:18:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74E9E19B3D; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:18:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B04019E87; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:17:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5E2719E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:17:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] Xp ssh server Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:20:10 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I found an sshd server for Xp one can install without a full cygwin install http://lexa.mckenna.edu/sshwindows/ http://lexa.mckenna.edu/sshwindows/download/releases/3.7.1/setupssh371-20031015.zip to force protocol 1 I had to change this in the registry [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\OpenSSHd\Parameters] "AppArgs"="-D -o \"Protocol=1\"" once in you get a cmd.exe shell 9% ssh shelly Last login: Thu Mar 18 12:05:56 2004 from term Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600] (C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp. D:\Documents and Settings\matt>c:\matt_my_documents\hello.py hello from windows python D:\Documents and Settings\matt> that last bit should suggest to you the "oh dear lord, why?" part I can now use ftpfs & ssh to do Windows Python dev m From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 18 21:51:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 21:33:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10770 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 21:33:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10766 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 21:33:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 21:33:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F05B819CAA; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:33:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43FD019E96; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:33:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BF3919A80; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:32:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB6C0199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:32:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <750306fef4a1959243e728b9ca6e1a09@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Xp ssh server In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:35:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: hehe curse you explorer turned off "only show files of known file types" and I found \Program Files\OpenSSH\etc\sshd_config m From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 18 21:51:49 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 21:39:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11111 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 21:39:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11107 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 21:39:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 21:39:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FFED19EA3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:39:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDE5919E9F; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:39:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF8A219E95; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:38:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EF5F19D5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:38:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D53A24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:38:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: rsc@swtch.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 07:37:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: >>On a more positive note, the discussion a few days ago did catch >>my attention by pointing out that Nemo had been submitting patches >>with patch(1). I found it so pleasant to apply the patches that I did >>the legwork to make patch(1) work for everyone. >> >> > >patch? nice idea, but when it goes wrong it goes horribly wrong. > > just once, it would be nice if you actually understood what was being said before you started spouting off criticizing it. see http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/patch, which has been posted here before. it's not what you think. russ From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:04:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12953 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:04:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12949 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:04:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:04:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A599619C59; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:04:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D56D519BFC; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:04:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F11A19BFC; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:03:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 914FF19B0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:03:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] upas-like "translate" function in other mailers? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:01:27 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: does anyone have any experience with doing what translate in upas does in any other mailers? i'm currently trying to put some of my rules into postfix, but can't figure out how the stuff works. it may all be simpler than sendmail, but it's still rougher than upas. help appreciated. ア From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:05:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13004 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:05:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12999 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:04:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:04:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F31C19D26; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:04:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BB3E19CAF; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:04:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EDA3319BA2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:03:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C596819B0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:03:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321471-26441>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:02:32 -0500 Message-ID: <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 14:00:15 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > just once, it would be nice if you actually understood what was being > said before you started spouting off criticizing it. see > http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/patch, i stand corrected (actually i'm seated). > which has been posted here before. > it's not what you think. fix replica/* and i might be amused. http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/replica From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:06:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13078 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:06:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13074 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:06:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:06:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C70FD19D1E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:06:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B400619CAA; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:06:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E34CA19CB2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:05:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD55A19C5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:05:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9a2bfccc4355091cbc88a27f04521ccc@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:08:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry for sending it here but as you can see, I can't mail geoff From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:14:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13607 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:14:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13603 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:14:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:14:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 106CE19D17; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:14:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F6CB19C8E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:14:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B74019CF7; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC36E19B0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:13:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <38443664609221049756187304efe78c@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well In-Reply-To: <9a2bfccc4355091cbc88a27f04521ccc@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:15:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: lol, now my outgoing mail is working too well, marshall split them up hehe now i deleted them both anyway it said something like (dates roughly correct) 8th March couldn't send, remote said 451 Please try again soon from the same IP 16th March couldn't send, remote said 451 Please try again soon from the same IP 18th March Permanent failure, giving up From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:40:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15208 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:40:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15203 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:40:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:40:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F24F19C8B; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:40:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3D0919BD6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:40:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 55C2219AD9; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:39:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F30F19A6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:39:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 063F424FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:39:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4059A639.1030107@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: rsc@swtch.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:38:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: >>just once, it would be nice if you actually understood what was being >>said before you started spouting off criticizing it. see >>http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/patch, >> >> > >i stand corrected (actually i'm seated). > > > >>which has been posted here before. >>it's not what you think. >> >> > >fix replica/* and i might be amused. > > http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/replica > > what's wrong with them? From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 22:53:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15892 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 22:53:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15888 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 22:53:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 22:53:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5465319D27; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3136719BD6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:53:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1DB6419C45; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:52:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EF5D19AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:52:58 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 2880F36C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:52:48 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40774369 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:52:47 +0000 (GMT) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA09726 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:52:44 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] insularity From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <0885f65cf26a5c1a8a981e5650bb366f@plan9.escet.urjc.es> References: <0885f65cf26a5c1a8a981e5650bb366f@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079617845.5476.36.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:50:45 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Although *a*lot* out of date, the Notes on the Plan 9 Kernel Sources > (see google) may help you to do that. I know, and I'm looking forward to that as well, thanks, Nemo! Cheers, Dave. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:53 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 23:10:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16843 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 23:10:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16839 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 23:10:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 23:10:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE34D19DB3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEE6019CFA; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:10:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F49319D47; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:09:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27C2A19CFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:09:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <318136-28172>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:08:05 -0500 Message-ID: <046e01c40cf2$203b1b60$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <4059A639.1030107@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:05:42 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > what's wrong with them? read the archives: pull smashed X read the prusker/wobber paper(s). From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 20 15:45:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 23:29:54 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18825 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 23:29:54 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18821 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 23:29:53 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 23:29:53 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AB0B199F6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:29:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54A1B19B66; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:29:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0591019C3E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:28:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 59F4C19B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:28:11 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2IEdFoq025690 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:39:16 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D64@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well Thread-Index: AcQM6wA4PIijpp12QS+Uw21b7pXiPwACiB9w From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:28:14 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Not to mention that http://www.collyer.net points to a... err...=20 rather interesting place. Not unrelated, tho :) From oz@zonzorp.canada.sun.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:54 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Thu Mar 18 23:46:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19984 invoked by uid 1020); 18 Mar 2004 23:46:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19980 invoked from network); 18 Mar 2004 23:46:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 18 Mar 2004 23:46:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1256B19E55; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:46:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0815A199F2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:46:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D11B19E6C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:45:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from nwkea-mail-2.sun.com (nwkea-mail-2.sun.com [192.18.42.14]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49D7619EA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from canadamail1mrk.Canada.Sun.COM ([129.155.2.1]) by nwkea-mail-2.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2IEj4ng019248 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 06:45:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from zonzorp.canada.sun.com (zonzorp.Canada.Sun.COM [10.9.130.22]) by canadamail1mrk.Canada.Sun.COM (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL,v2.2) with ESMTP id i2IEj3oO011025 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:45:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from zonzorp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zonzorp.canada.sun.com (8.12.9+Sun/8.12.2) with ESMTP id i2IEj3UK008329 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:45:03 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200403181445.i2IEj3UK008329@zonzorp.canada.sun.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with nmh-1.0.4 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: "ozan s. yigit" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:45:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > read the prusker/wobber paper(s). he means the siphon paper, mid nineties(?) dec labs at europe i think. oz --- sense of humor is a vital part of wisdom. -- stanley schmidt From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:55 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 02:08:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 31197 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 02:08:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 31193 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 02:08:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 02:08:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 35C5619DB2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:08:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EBB3519C39; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:08:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5787E19D26; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:07:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 171BB19C39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:07:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3BB24FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:07:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4059D6F9.4030600@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <4059A639.1030107@swtch.com> <046e01c40cf2$203b1b60$8ed97d50@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <046e01c40cf2$203b1b60$8ed97d50@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: rsc@swtch.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 12:06:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: >>what's wrong with them? >> >> > >read the archives: > > pull smashed X > >read the prusker/wobber paper(s). > > i'm not convinced you've actually used replica/*. you have to explicitly ask it to smash your files. it's very careful not to smash any local changes unless you explicitly request that. much safer than rm, for example. the problem is that it's too easy to think "well, i haven't made any changes that i really care about", blindly run "pull -s" and then all of a sudden your /lib/ndb/local has none of your useful modifications anymore. a good (g)ui would help here considerably. and maybe overwritten files should get backed up somewhere. but the architecture of the system is sound. siphon is intended for a very different task. the main difference is that they're trying to present a single file system, just distributed. as such the changes propagate in both directions and all the replicas are assumed to be continuously connected. replica does software distribution, which is one-way. usually, i don't want to see the changes that other 9fans make -- if you edit your /lib/ndb/local, those changes shouldn't go back to sources. and there's no way that everyone who downloads a distribution can be expected to be online 24/7. russ From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 05:19:53 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9460 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 05:19:52 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9456 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 05:19:51 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 05:19:51 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B535719EAE; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:19:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECE7819EAC; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:19:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6AEB719EA6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:18:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8524919E9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:18:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <338293-16524>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:11:30 -0500 Message-ID: <048f01c40d24$f7780c00$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403181445.i2IEj3UK008329@zonzorp.canada.sun.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 21:09:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > he means the siphon paper, mid nineties(?) dec labs at europe i think. yup, the siphon. PRL [paris] / SRC [palo alto]: http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/prusker91siphon.html From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:57 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:01:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12743 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:01:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12738 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:01:47 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:01:47 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F04FF19EB3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:01:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68C8B19EAB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:01:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BABAE19CDB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:00:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5F2B19B38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:00:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <08def36bba72acee503be1e79c965612@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D64@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kilscvlaxebesspwpxcfrczhcz" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:00:19 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kilscvlaxebesspwpxcfrczhcz Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Curious. Claudia is my wife, so it's not completely off the wall, but it is unexpected. I visit www.collyer.net reasonably often, so it hasn't been doing this for long. Thanks for the notice. --upas-kilscvlaxebesspwpxcfrczhcz Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Thu Mar 18 06:29:46 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Thu Mar 18 06:29:46 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D27D119D47; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:29:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4992019B66; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:29:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0591019C3E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:28:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 59F4C19B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 09:28:11 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2IEdFoq025690 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:39:16 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D64@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well Thread-Index: AcQM6wA4PIijpp12QS+Uw21b7pXiPwACiB9w From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:28:14 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Not to mention that http://www.collyer.net points to a... err...=20 rather interesting place. Not unrelated, tho :) --upas-kilscvlaxebesspwpxcfrczhcz-- From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:05:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12991 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:05:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12987 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:05:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:05:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D3DD19EB9; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:05:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30CFD19EA6; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:05:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B6E819EB8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:04:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C30E2199F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:04:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <9a2bfccc4355091cbc88a27f04521ccc@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vxrfgmgmzffhrwxvmhowucpzvh" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:04:07 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vxrfgmgmzffhrwxvmhowucpzvh Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Matt, I'm not sure what happened. I remove everything under /mail/grey each night, so perhaps your system tried to call once on the 7th and then not again until the 13th? The greylist code does assume that an unknown caller will call back within the same day. If your cron is only running the mail queues every day or week, I'd suggest changing it to once per hour. Transient failures are possible even when calling sites that don't implement greylists. --upas-vxrfgmgmzffhrwxvmhowucpzvh Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Thu Mar 18 05:06:40 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Thu Mar 18 05:06:39 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C0A8919C51; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:06:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6FEA19C8E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:06:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E34CA19CB2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:05:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD55A19C5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 08:05:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9a2bfccc4355091cbc88a27f04521ccc@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:08:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry for sending it here but as you can see, I can't mail geoff From /dev/null Thu Mar 18 13:06:05 GMT 2004 Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:06:05 0000 From: /dev/null To: matt Subject: permanent failure Your request ``mail net!collyer.net geoff '' failed (code Giveup). The symptom was: Sun Mar 7 22:54:04 GMT 2004 connect to net!collyer.net: 451 please try again soon from the same IP. Sat Mar 13 11:45:39 GMT 2004 connect to net!collyer.net: 451 please try again soon from the same IP. --- 1.2 message/rfc822 282 (from,matt@proweb.co.uk)(subj,usbd) /mail/fs/mbox/74/2/body.msg Subject: usbd From: matt@proweb.co.uk Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2004 22:53:44 0000 To: geoff@collyer.net thanks, it is my machine matt --upas-vxrfgmgmzffhrwxvmhowucpzvh-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:16:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14068 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:16:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14064 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:16:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:16:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2CE2E19EC7; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:16:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 523B419EB5; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:16:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D7A119EB3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:15:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C903A199E1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:15:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <340107-26444>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:40:12 -0500 Message-ID: <04ea01c40d28$f68a2cc0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <40589D28.9040806@swtch.com> <025b01c40cbc$73fdbbd0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <405997F8.2080407@swtch.com> <042a01c40ce8$fb7cc2a0$8ed97d50@SOMA> <4059A639.1030107@swtch.com> <046e01c40cf2$203b1b60$8ed97d50@SOMA> <4059D6F9.4030600@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] patch(1) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 21:38:17 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > siphon is intended for a very different task. the main difference > is that they're trying to present a single file system, just distributed. > as such the changes propagate in both directions and all the replicas > are assumed to be continuously connected. bits of the siphon can do exactly what replica/* does. i've done it; managed all of PRL's ULTRIX machines with it. From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:18:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14288 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:18:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14284 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:18:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:18:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 040FF19EB5; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:18:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DCAC19EC3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:18:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BE8519BDD; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:17:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 064CD19EB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:17:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <26dbd01b33457a4b0bdbf0fb6218fe47@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <08def36bba72acee503be1e79c965612@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:21:28 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Curious. Claudia is my wife, so it's not completely off the wall, but > it is unexpected. I visit www.collyer.net reasonably often, so it > hasn't been doing this for long. Thanks for the notice. My wife's birthday is coming up. Is there anything with a glenda motif? Earrings perhaps? From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:22:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14529 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:22:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14525 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:22:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:22:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3322219ECB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3B8119ECC; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:22:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8625419EC3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:21:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E1FD19EBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:21:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <324134-28173>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:18:48 -0500 Message-ID: <057401c40d2e$5b21e060$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:16:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: making things failsafe is hard. drowning in noise o i'm ok is not a solution, nor neither is silently chucking stuff on the floor. geoff-kun From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:33:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15311 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:33:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15305 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:33:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:33:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BFC319ED5; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:33:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F7DD19DE0; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:33:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BBDBA19E90; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:32:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A32219B38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:32:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a7ab491d39c03994fd4c2d5f80df09e@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <08def36bba72acee503be1e79c965612@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 13:32:31 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I believe www.collyer.net now points to the right web server. It looks like I made a mistake editing cnames when we shuffled machines recently. In a few minutes, the corrected DNS data will have circulated. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:44:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15972 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:44:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15968 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:44:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:44:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 667E519B82; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBFDD19B0C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:44:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C47A119A6C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:43:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5AB319ADF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:43:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2ILer7b095119 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:40:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2ILervN095118 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:40:53 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] ls question Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:40:53 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: cpu% bind -b tmp tmp cpu% ls tmp sam.err sam.err cpu% ls tmp/sam.err tmp/sam.err cpu% I understand why it is so, but is it how it should be? From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 06:49:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16519 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 06:49:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16515 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 06:49:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 06:49:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A24FA19B0C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BBD919ECF; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C04B419EAE; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B85919B0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322043-18575>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:46:12 -0500 Message-ID: <05a101c40d32$2d432ec0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <7a7ab491d39c03994fd4c2d5f80df09e@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] geoff's anti spam worked a bit too well MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:44:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: doumo arigatou gozaimasu From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:00:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17264 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:00:51 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17260 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:00:50 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:00:50 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3BA819EE0; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:00:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90A9919ECE; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:00:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EABB19BA8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D99219B30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question In-Reply-To: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: yes From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:01:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17290 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:01:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17286 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:01:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:01:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43EA619EE8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:01:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6451A19EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:01:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39ED219BA8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C44B19B30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CBCA24FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:59:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405A1B6A.8050207@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question References: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: rsc@swtch.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:58:02 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin wrote: >cpu% bind -b tmp tmp >cpu% ls tmp >sam.err >sam.err >cpu% ls tmp/sam.err >tmp/sam.err >cpu% > >I understand why it is so, but is it how it should be? > > Yes. Try this. mkdir a b c d >a/f >b/f bind a c bind -a b c bind a d bind -b b d ls -ln c ls -ln d ls -l c/f ls -l d/f Russ From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:03:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17474 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:03:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17470 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:03:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:03:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC38819EEC; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E617619EDB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:03:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F28119ECE; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:02:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B53AE19EDC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:02:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3a654174960c3c4e42bf85f88ac125a4@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question In-Reply-To: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:05:07 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: what did you expect it to be ? if you understand it, what for the question? ls -q will give you the qids too see if the files are identical directories are just files so effectively ls is doing for (directory in bindlist) cat $directory | format_directory_output m From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:07:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17788 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:07:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17784 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:07:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:07:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB4DD19EED; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:07:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6037319EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:07:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 985DE19EE3; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:06:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0379F19EEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:06:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2IM4U7b095297 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:04:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2IM4UwJ095296 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:04:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182204.i2IM4UwJ095296@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question In-Reply-To: <3a654174960c3c4e42bf85f88ac125a4@juice.thebigchoice.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:04:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > what did you expect it to be ? I would expect it to be cpu% bind -b tmp tmp cpu% lc -l tmp sam.err sam.err cpu% lc -l tmp/sam.* sam.err sam.err cpu% lc -l tmp/sam.err sam.err sam.err From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:08:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17854 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:08:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17850 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:08:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:08:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C440B19EFD; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:08:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6ACF219EF8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:08:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0DA019EEF; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:07:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB82519EE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:07:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F58824FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:07:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405A1D45.9030400@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (Windows/20040207) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question References: <200403182140.i2ILervN095118@adat.davidashen.net> <405A1B6A.8050207@swtch.com> In-Reply-To: <405A1B6A.8050207@swtch.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: rsc@swtch.com List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:05:57 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > ls -ln c > ls -ln d this was supposed to be ls -lnq. sigh. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:58 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:12:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18182 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:12:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18172 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:12:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:12:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E6C6919EFD; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:12:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2E0019EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:12:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CFDB19EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:11:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14D1C19EED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:11:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <338170-26442>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:10:51 -0500 Message-ID: <05cc01c40d35$9dd58360$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <3a654174960c3c4e42bf85f88ac125a4@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:08:54 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: la question From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 07:44:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20241 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 07:44:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20237 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 07:44:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 07:44:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F109E19EB1; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC75A19EAB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:44:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F421A19EA8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:43:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from runiv.plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.7.238]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8427A19C80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:43:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Subject: [9fans] favourite hobby os Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 15:41:38 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: it's a slashdot poll, plan9 is missing from the choices, but it appears in the comments (from http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=100921&cid=8601598): With considerable polite help from the 9fans mailing list, I had been trying to figure out the proper way to turn fossil's access controls off in order to perform a system software update. But, when the last of my RAM went bad, that was the end of that project. take that everybody who says we're impolite! ☺ From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 08:04:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21440 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 08:04:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21436 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 08:04:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 08:04:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 516B519EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:04:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F27819B82; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:04:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F09119C80; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:03:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64A7019AE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:03:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2IN0p7b095714 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2IN0p5T095713 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182300.i2IN0p5T095713@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question In-Reply-To: <405A1D45.9030400@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I am not asking why there are two file names in the directory listing. I understand it. I think that behaviours of rc and ls are confusing. I would either expect rc's globbing to only match one path name, or ls to display all files. man rc says 'A pattern is replaced by a list of arguments, one for each path name matched'. Not for each directory entry. For each path name. There is one path name /dev/user for two files. cpu% ls -q /dev|grep user (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user (000000000000000c 0 00) /dev/user Globbing expands this to two elements: cpu% echo /dev/user* /dev/user /dev/user I think this is not what the manual says. Then, cpu% ls -q /dev/user* (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user I understand why it is so. But I think that consistency is sacrificed for simplicity. Either rc should do what the manual says and return one match for /dev/user* (so that /dev/user* and /dev/user is the same thing), or ls -q /dev/user should recursively list all directory entries matching the path name. David Tolpin From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 08:34:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23789 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 08:34:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23785 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 08:34:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 08:34:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE64F19EF5; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:34:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1516C19AAB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:34:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE44419AAB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C47F19C99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2INVc7b096236 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2INVbsA096235 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182331.i2INVbsA096235@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dirread In-Reply-To: <200403182300.i2IN0p5T095713@adat.davidashen.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man 2 dirread :... :The data returned by a read(2) on a directory is a set of complete directory :entries in a machine-independent format, exactly equivalent to the result of :a stat(2) on each file or subdirectory in the directory. But it is not so. stat(2) on each file in the directory, when there are multiple files with identical names, will return data for the first entry only. What am I missing? David From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 08:50:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24852 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 08:50:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24848 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 08:50:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 08:50:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 24DD819EF7; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:50:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E285C19EE8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:50:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7097719EDB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:49:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 102A019C7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:49:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2INnHjt015218 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:17 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2INnHGM004271 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:17 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2INnHfQ006425 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:17 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dirread In-Reply-To: <200403182331.i2INVbsA096235@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 16:49:16 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, David Tolpin wrote: > > man 2 dirread > > :... > :The data returned by a read(2) on a directory is a set of complete directory > :entries in a machine-independent format, exactly equivalent to the result of > :a stat(2) on each file or subdirectory in the directory. > > But it is not so. stat(2) on each file in the directory, when > there are multiple files with identical names, will return > data for the first entry only. Let's see how much more I can get wrong. Pretend you have a union of /tmp and /tmp2 all bound onto /tmp. /tmp and /tmp2 have a file a in them. You read the dir and you get the union. So that sort of makes sense. You'll see all the /tmp/a twice. You stat the entry, and the pathname resolutions rules apply, so even if there are multiple /tmp/a files, the stat of /tmp/a always resolves to "the one on top", thus you only get that stat info. ron From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 09:18:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27487 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 09:18:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27483 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 09:18:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 09:18:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47AB219F03; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:18:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2448919EE4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:18:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 77A6319C7D; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1401719C4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.202.172]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322346-26448>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:16:55 -0500 Message-ID: <062601c40d47$330262d0$8ed97d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403182331.i2INVbsA096235@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] dirread MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:14:36 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > What am I missing? lots ... http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/lexnames.html From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 09:22:29 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27808 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 09:22:07 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27776 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 09:21:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 09:21:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8CBB219F02; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF42419EF9; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:21:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 03A2419EF9; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:20:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3883919EE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:20:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <59e21c2f98e6d9c3ac4dd217dc7ffed5@borf.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Brantley Coile MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] how do I debug a program that runs a none... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:18:18 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: that runs as none on a cpu server, goes broke? I don't have read permissions on the /proc/ files. Do I add myself to the group that `owns' the cpu server? Brantley From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 20 15:45:59 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 09:34:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29238 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 09:33:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29224 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 09:33:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 09:33:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E02ED19C92; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:33:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A32A019C7D; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:33:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6178719CA8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:32:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D70B19C42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 19:32:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how do I debug a program that runs a none... From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <59e21c2f98e6d9c3ac4dd217dc7ffed5@borf.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 17:32:18 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > that runs as none on a cpu server, goes broke? > I don't have read permissions on the /proc/ files. > Do I add myself to the group that `owns' the cpu server? > > Brantley if it's a program started by listen you can run just the binary with aux/listen1 as yourself (and not necessarily on the cpu server either). you can control other processes if you're in the owner of /proc, before discovering aux/listen1 i used to chmod 777 /proc//*. not sure if it was really successful -- been too long ago :) being just a member of the group won't work, afaik... andrey From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 12:39:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15526 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 12:39:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15514 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 12:39:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 12:39:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9461D19F14; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:39:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6CA1619ED8; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:39:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CFBC19EEE; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:38:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 057D519BCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:38:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 22:38:56 EST 2004 Received: from 64.36.89.66 ([64.36.89.66]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 22:38:55 EST 2004 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dirread From: rsc@swtch.com In-Reply-To: <200403182331.i2INVbsA096235@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-oqobcgpzhetrdlkucpxwzpfuzo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:38:53 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-oqobcgpzhetrdlkucpxwzpfuzo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit the data for the file you cannot get at is exactly equivalent to the result of stat(2) if only you could get at it, except that your name space is keeping you from doing that. but it's still there. ;-) russ --upas-oqobcgpzhetrdlkucpxwzpfuzo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> X-Original-To: rsc@swtch.com Delivered-To: rsc@morphisms.net Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36A0724FE8 for ; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:34:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 18:34:43 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 18:34:40 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51B5319EC0; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:34:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEE5919EB7; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:34:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE44419AAB; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C47F19C99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2INVc7b096236 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2INVbsA096235 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182331.i2INVbsA096235@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dirread In-Reply-To: <200403182300.i2IN0p5T095713@adat.davidashen.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: man 2 dirread :... :The data returned by a read(2) on a directory is a set of complete directory :entries in a machine-independent format, exactly equivalent to the result of :a stat(2) on each file or subdirectory in the directory. But it is not so. stat(2) on each file in the directory, when there are multiple files with identical names, will return data for the first entry only. What am I missing? David --upas-oqobcgpzhetrdlkucpxwzpfuzo-- From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 12:42:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15777 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 12:42:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15772 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 12:42:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 12:42:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7A3A19F0C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:42:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16A6119F0E; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:42:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 722E219F0C; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:41:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E504D19BCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:41:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 22:41:44 EST 2004 Received: from 64.36.89.66 ([64.36.89.66]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 22:41:41 EST 2004 Message-ID: <96e06cebf14ac0ed02a5390ac3dd1dbf@swtch.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: rsc@swtch.com In-Reply-To: <200403182300.i2IN0p5T095713@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-eiurptqanheavukftrazbnnkwq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:41:39 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-eiurptqanheavukftrazbnnkwq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit if you want, you can think of this as a bug in read(2): if a file is covered up, it should be completely hidden. it turns out that actually implementing this is quite hard, that it doesn't really break much (you've found about all of it!) to leave it as is, and that it results in things like /bin/ls giving interesting information about the union. --upas-eiurptqanheavukftrazbnnkwq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> X-Original-To: rsc@swtch.com Delivered-To: rsc@morphisms.net Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7201A24FE8 for ; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:04:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 18:04:47 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 18 18:04:44 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 570F419AE5; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:04:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E3E919C84; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:04:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F09119C80; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:03:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64A7019AE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 18:03:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2IN0p7b095714 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2IN0p5T095713 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403182300.i2IN0p5T095713@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question In-Reply-To: <405A1D45.9030400@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:51 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I am not asking why there are two file names in the directory listing. I understand it. I think that behaviours of rc and ls are confusing. I would either expect rc's globbing to only match one path name, or ls to display all files. man rc says 'A pattern is replaced by a list of arguments, one for each path name matched'. Not for each directory entry. For each path name. There is one path name /dev/user for two files. cpu% ls -q /dev|grep user (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user (000000000000000c 0 00) /dev/user Globbing expands this to two elements: cpu% echo /dev/user* /dev/user /dev/user I think this is not what the manual says. Then, cpu% ls -q /dev/user* (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user (0000000000000015 0 00) /dev/user I understand why it is so. But I think that consistency is sacrificed for simplicity. Either rc should do what the manual says and return one match for /dev/user* (so that /dev/user* and /dev/user is the same thing), or ls -q /dev/user should recursively list all directory entries matching the path name. David Tolpin --upas-eiurptqanheavukftrazbnnkwq-- From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:00 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 13:03:39 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17633 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 13:03:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17628 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 13:03:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 13:03:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA6ED19CF2; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0879019B86; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:03:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FA2319AB4; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD09019AD8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:02:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3824612-2256>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:00:46 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] lon9con Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:59:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: after a bit of a rave with dave we decided on a t-shirt. it's gonna be black and XL and i think it's gonna look like this: http://www.insultant.net/repo/plan9/images/lon9cont.html obviously bit flipping/backgrounds will be done so it renders. personalised for each attendee, so i have to do some recon here in paris to get 'em printed up on high grade cotton with 'near indestructable' printing. given they're personalised, like: http://www.insultant.net/images/9qab-207.jpg my rough guess is 20 EUR a pop. comments? From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 14:30:48 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25618 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 14:30:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25614 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 14:30:48 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 14:30:48 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EF6C419B87; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:30:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BD1E19AEB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:30:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3BD819A00; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:29:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2339199DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:29:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] how do I debug a program that runs a none... From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <59e21c2f98e6d9c3ac4dd217dc7ffed5@borf.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 21:29:32 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I usually get on the cpu server's console (C cpu), so I'm running as bootes, and cd /proc/12345 && chmod +rw * I've found that the write permission is necessary to debug, at least with acid. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 14:35:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26145 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 14:35:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26141 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 14:35:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 14:35:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B95519C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:35:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 433C119BAA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:35:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D301419BC5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42E3C19B51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:34:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J5W27b097146 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:32:02 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J5W2MU097145 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:32:02 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190532.i2J5W2MU097145@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question In-Reply-To: <96e06cebf14ac0ed02a5390ac3dd1dbf@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:32:02 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > if you want, you can think of this as a bug in read(2): In fact, I think both read(2) and stat(2) are OK. The bug (or just inexact wording in the manual for read(2)). But then either globbing should work differently (and looking at the code in rc, i think it is easy to make it work as with union); or the manual for rc should be changed as well. Besides, then why bind(,,MBEFORE|MAFTER) is said to create a 'union' then? It is very confusing too. It does not. It creates a list, and name-oriented calls ([a-z]*stat, open) are restricted to only retrieve the first element in the list. Other calls can still traverse the list. > that it doesn't really break much (you've found about > all of it!) to leave it as is, and that it results in things > like /bin/ls giving interesting information about the union. Do you think that rc globbing returning as many identical words as there are directory entries with the same name is in any way useful too? From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 14:48:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28030 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 14:48:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28025 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 14:48:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 14:48:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E1D1519C47; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:48:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CABEE19BAA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:48:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA77C19BFA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:47:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98EAC19BAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:47:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314667-26445>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:46:55 -0500 Message-ID: <00c201c40d75$5cfdfb20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403190532.i2J5W2MU097145@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:45:15 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: "David Tolpin" got a problem with simple graphs? From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 14:51:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28353 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 14:51:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28349 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 14:51:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 14:51:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0B6CD19CA6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:51:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C91BA19BFA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:51:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFAAA19BFA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:50:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CC3719B12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:50:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2J5oAjt014216 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:50:10 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2J5oAL7004974 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:50:10 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2J5oAfQ017636 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:50:10 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question In-Reply-To: <200403190532.i2J5W2MU097145@adat.davidashen.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 22:50:10 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Well, I guess it's confusing the way some union stuff works, but once you start trying to do things with unions to make them less weird, it can get ugly fast, see this from a bsd list: " Perhaps one situation would be, modify a lower-layer file so that the modified file now exists in the upper layer, with the original still in the lower layer. Then try to delete the file. The upper-layer version will be deleted, but we don't want the lower-layer version to now start showing up, because we 'delete'd it. We also don't want to delete the lower-layer version, because it's a union filesystem, and that's one of the features of a union mount -- the lower layer is not allowed to change (much). So, cover up the lower-layer version with 'whiteout' in the upper layer so that it becomes not visible to the union-mount, but still exists via non-union-mount access. " Also see rm -W on bsd. Or how about this: "Running find(1) over a union tree has the side-effect of creating a tree of shadow directories in the upper layer." BSD does do this: "In this example, /b is layered over an empty directory /mnt, then /a is layered over the new view of /mnt. Duplicate names are suppressed so that only one occurrence of `x' (and also `.' and `..') will appear." (see http://www.usenix.org/publications/library/proceedings/neworl/full_papers/mckusick.a) Seems once you start to try to get smart there's no end to it. I've had it put to me that union mounts would so hopelessly confuse users that they can't be used. The first time I showed them to a quite smart CS person she blanched a bit -- "how can anybody use that given you don't really know what those two files are?" And here I was showing it off -- "see how you can build kernels outside the kernel tree". The only reaction was: "yeah but having two pccpu files show up in ls is hopelessly confusing. " I had to disagree :-) The thing is, reads from a union directory do in fact give you the union. But what would you do for stat etc? I'm not sure you could do much different that has been done without really making the kernel pretty dirty (see above). ron From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 15:43:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1626 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 15:43:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1621 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 15:43:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 15:43:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5746319CCB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:43:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D5E419C7E; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:43:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9276D19CB2; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:42:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D124119BF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:42:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3782986-2261>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:41:03 -0500 Message-ID: <00e101c40d7c$ea858060$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:39:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: after much fscking around i have come up with this: http://www.insultant.net/repo/plan9/images/lon9con.jpeg From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 15:48:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2106 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 15:48:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2102 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 15:48:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 15:48:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E31D819CF7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:48:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A36419BF3; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:48:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2547C19C7E; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:47:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9D9519BF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:47:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311162-16395>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:46:47 -0500 Message-ID: <00ea01c40d7d$b71f6e60$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:45:03 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: yeah, you could get yourself into a real bind ... From micah@cnm-vra.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:01 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 16:01:59 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3191 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 16:01:58 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3187 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 16:01:57 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 16:01:57 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3FE5E19D48; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:01:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D65CA19D00; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:01:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD4CB19CBF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:01:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC87C19CA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:01:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 8B91BD06F; Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:01:00 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question Message-ID: <20040319070100.GA7900@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <96e06cebf14ac0ed02a5390ac3dd1dbf@swtch.com> <200403190532.i2J5W2MU097145@adat.davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200403190532.i2J5W2MU097145@adat.davidashen.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2004 23:01:00 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Do you think that rc globbing returning as many identical words > as there are directory entries with the same name is in any > way useful too? Of course! Let's suppose you have a multipage document that you want to print multiple copies of, but you want all the copies of a single page to print together. Well, just split the document into one file per page and then run 'bind -a . .' followed by 'lp *'. How cool is that? This example should make it clear that lp -c is a violation of the tools approach. Micah (For the more serious among us, this is all 'tongue in cheek'.) From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:01:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 10157 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:01:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 10153 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:01:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:01:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 38FA519B2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:01:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE58019BFA; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:00:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7AF0199E5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:59:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C54D19995 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:59:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J7vU7b097550 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:57:30 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J7vUIO097549 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:57:30 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190757.i2J7vUIO097549@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <20040319070100.GA7900@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:57:30 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Do you think that rc globbing returning as many identical words > > as there are directory entries with the same name is in any > > way useful too? > > Of course! Let's suppose you have a multipage document > that you want to print multiple copies of, but you want > all the copies of a single page to print together. Well, Since I don't have a printer, here is a proposed change to rc/glob.c cpu% diff /sys/src/cmd/rc/glob.c glob.c 31c31 < word *a; --- > word *a, *b; 37c37,47 < for(a = left,n = 0;a!=right;a = a->next,n++) a->word = list[n]; --- > for(a = left,n = 0;a!=right;n++){ > if(a->next!=right && globcmp(list+n,list+n+1)==0){ > b = a->next; > a->next = b->next; > efree((char *)list[n]); > efree((char *)b); > }else{ > a->word = list[n]; > a = a->next; > } > } Since rc sorts results of globbing expansion, it makes perfect sense to only keep only one occurence of each path name. It bring rc in synchronization with the manual; besides, repeated names cannot be used for access to the files they are generated for so they should be omitted. I am not supplying it as a patch because I actually want to know opinions whether it makes sense. David Tolpin From rob@mightycheese.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:15:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11878 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:15:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11706 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:14:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:14:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8E3C019CBE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C04419C5F; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:14:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F2C4419B2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FA8619B51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-5-245.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.5.245]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2J8DGxF015966 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:13:16 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v613) In-Reply-To: <200403190757.i2J7vUIO097549@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403190757.i2J7vUIO097549@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:13:49 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Since I don't have a printer, here is a proposed change to rc/glob.c i don't like changing the shell to mask kernel behavior. it leads to surprises. consider unix shells that `fix' cd in a way that it differs from the chdir system call. i say leave it. the current behavior doesn't break much and as rsc says it can even be informative. -rob From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:21:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12986 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:21:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12981 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:21:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:21:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EF6819CC9; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:21:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A1C619C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:21:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C3D419B2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1581719AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:20:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J8Ig7b097748 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:18:42 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J8IgUU097747 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:18:42 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190818.i2J8IgUU097747@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:18:42 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Since I don't have a printer, here is a proposed change to rc/glob.c > > i don't like changing the shell to mask kernel behavior. it leads > to surprises. consider unix shells that `fix' cd in a way that it > differs from the chdir system call. 1. There is no kernel behavior in glob. It is just a pass over a list, with results sorted after the pass. 2. The changes I propose make it conforming to the manual. > i say leave it. the current behavior doesn't break much and as > rsc says it can even be informative. It cannot. ls -q /dev/user* will not give information about two different user files. It will display the first /dev/user twice. There is a difference between ls /dev |grep user ls /dev/user* ls /dev/user While bringing two elements is informative in the first case (and I do not propose to change it), in the second case it is not. It cannot be used. David From rob@mightycheese.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:28:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13773 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:28:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13767 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:28:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:28:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E1DD019CA0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:28:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02CC519C83; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:28:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BBCFE19C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:27:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7303519AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:27:12 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-5-245.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.5.245]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2J8R9xF016245 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:27:10 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v613) In-Reply-To: <200403190818.i2J8IgUU097747@adat.davidashen.net> References: <200403190818.i2J8IgUU097747@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <4ACCD005-797F-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:27:43 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > 1. There is no kernel behavior in glob. It is just a pass over > a list, with results sorted after the pass. that's sophistry. the data is generated by a read system call. you're proposing making the shell differ from every other program that reads directories. that seems like a bad idea. this is not a bug, it's a feature. i'd rather fix the manual than add special code to applications. -rob From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:29:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13811 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:29:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13804 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:28:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:28:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B91B019CB8; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3E8A19ADB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:28:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB5E019C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:27:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3789E19B2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:27:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J8Ou7b097775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:24:56 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J8OuSG097774 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:24:56 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190824.i2J8OuSG097774@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <200403190818.i2J8IgUU097747@adat.davidashen.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:24:56 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If 'echo /dev/user*' returns two-element list (if there are two files there), then 'echo /dev/user' should return a two-element list too, if one cares about kernel semantics in shell behavior. If, however, it is just globbing, both should return one element. From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:32:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14090 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:32:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14085 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:32:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:32:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1748A19D3C; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:32:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10E2B19C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:32:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6749419C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DB8C19AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:31:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i don't like changing the shell to mask kernel behavior. it leads > to surprises. consider unix shells that `fix' cd in a way that it > differs from the chdir system call. But filename pattern matching in the shell is already different from just reading a directory in the kernel. By saying 'ls /tmp/*.c' instead of 'ls /tmp' you are asking for a selection of names. The question is how many times to select a name which matches more than one file. As David has pointed out, the rc manual at present unambiguously says "A pattern is replaced by a list of arguments, one for each path name matched" -- not "one for each file matched". So if rc isn't changed, the manual does need to be corrected. But I would vote for changing rc. Although I am (after some years of experience) sufficiently used to unions that I don't find the behaviour surprising, I do find it irritating: for example, when doing 'grep XXX *.c' in a union directory produces duplicate output for files which occur in more than one underlying directory. -- Richard From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:39:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 14532 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:39:37 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 14528 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:39:37 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:39:37 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BFF0919B06; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:39:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B588319AFD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:39:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63E6219B0A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:38:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41BF7199F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:38:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3800395-2257>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:37:21 -0500 Message-ID: <012701c40d8d$23e163a0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403190757.i2J7vUIO097549@adat.davidashen.net> <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:35:25 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i say leave it. the current behavior doesn't break much and as > rsc says it can even be informative. yup, Leave it Alone -- Living Colour From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:48:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15383 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:48:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15379 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:48:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:48:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B64A719C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:48:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45D6019B10; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:48:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D44D19B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:47:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.ca [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2D13199F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:47:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6671d1d4f2f936baafa24cd257ae90ce@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tuqyhiusfqcfxaoagitfjjkbjy" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 00:47:32 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tuqyhiusfqcfxaoagitfjjkbjy Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit But in the case of a union directory with duplicate names, potentially representing distinct files, there are multiple names, not all of them distinct, in the directory. Since rc(1) doesn't say ``one for each distinct [or unique] path name matched'', one could argue that neither code nor manual needs change. If it's really a problem, fn nodup {ls -d $*|uniq} pr `{nodup *} | lp --upas-tuqyhiusfqcfxaoagitfjjkbjy Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Fri Mar 19 00:32:47 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Fri Mar 19 00:32:47 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2855419C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:32:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E24819C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:32:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6749419C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DB8C19AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:31:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:31:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i don't like changing the shell to mask kernel behavior. it leads > to surprises. consider unix shells that `fix' cd in a way that it > differs from the chdir system call. But filename pattern matching in the shell is already different from just reading a directory in the kernel. By saying 'ls /tmp/*.c' instead of 'ls /tmp' you are asking for a selection of names. The question is how many times to select a name which matches more than one file. As David has pointed out, the rc manual at present unambiguously says "A pattern is replaced by a list of arguments, one for each path name matched" -- not "one for each file matched". So if rc isn't changed, the manual does need to be corrected. But I would vote for changing rc. Although I am (after some years of experience) sufficiently used to unions that I don't find the behaviour surprising, I do find it irritating: for example, when doing 'grep XXX *.c' in a union directory produces duplicate output for files which occur in more than one underlying directory. -- Richard --upas-tuqyhiusfqcfxaoagitfjjkbjy-- From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:54:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15886 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:54:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15882 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:54:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:54:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63F0519C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:54:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C0A419AD7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:54:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8AEA619AD7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:53:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14CCD19B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:53:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3f13f64a6cb8c5707f9f78fcac4c5dbb@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con In-Reply-To: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:56:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: look good to me m From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:02 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 17:56:02 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 16057 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 17:56:02 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 16053 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 17:56:01 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 17:56:01 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3FFA619B93; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:55:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEF8519B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:55:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F2B119C26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6BB719B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 03:54:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J8qN7b097861 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:52:23 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J8qNee097860 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:52:23 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190852.i2J8qNee097860@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <4ACCD005-797F-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:52:23 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > 1. There is no kernel behavior in glob. It is just a pass over > > a list, with results sorted after the pass. > > that's sophistry. the data is generated by a read system call. > you're proposing making the shell differ from every other > program that reads directories. that seems like a bad idea. This is wrong. The data is generated by glob/globsort. The 'read' (in case of Plan9) system call is buried deep into system-dependent implementations for Unix, Plan9 and win32. Each using native calls of the underlying operating system. The semantics of globbing is (correctly) defined in a system-independent manner, stating that each globbing result is delivered once. > > this is not a bug, it's a feature. i'd rather fix the manual than > add special code to applications. Suppose I want to edit glob.c in rc.c. I am copying rc.c to $home/src/rc/. and then delete definition of globsort from the file. (This is what I actually do when I edit system sources). cpu% mkdir $home/src/rc cpu% cp /sys/src/cmd/rc/glob.c $home/src/rc/. cpu% bind -bc $home/src/rc /sys/src/cmd/rc cpu% cd /sys/src/cmd/rc cpu% mk cpu% sam glob.c # delete definition of globsort cpu% grep '^globsort' *.c glob.c:globsort(word *left, word *right) cpu% grep -n '^globsort' glob.c cpu% This is a bug. From rob@mightycheese.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:15:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18285 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:15:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18280 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:15:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:15:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 472A019C5F; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:15:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A775F19B0A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:15:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B46F19B28; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:06:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailer01.geekmail.cc (dictum-ext.geekmail.cc [204.239.179.245]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19BC919B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:06:46 -0500 (EST) X-Envelope-To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Received: from [192.168.0.2] (adsl-69-110-5-245.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net [69.110.5.245]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailer01.geekmail.cc (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2J96hxF017101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:06:44 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v613) In-Reply-To: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> References: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rob Pike Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.613) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:07:16 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: are you planning to change the other shells too? what about every other program that reads directories? what does '*' really mean? you're making assumptions about what's right and i don't think it's clear what's right and when things aren't clear i say leave them alone until they clear up. after something like 15 years they still haven't cleared up. i'm not saying the behavior is right, but i'm not admitting it's wrong, either. moreover, i can explain everything that's going on by applying a very simple model that is clear from the documentation. that's worth a lot. -rob From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:16:04 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18344 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:16:03 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18340 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:16:03 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:16:03 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9E4EC19C42; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:16:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A781E19C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:15:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBE1D19AFD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:06:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74AFB19AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:06:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34feff09e0eb478d71030dd09fcd8135@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:07:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>The thing is, reads from a union directory do in fact give you the union. i think the argument is provoked by the assumption that it's a union of sets, preventing duplicates, but the system happens to work with bags, not sets, where union can (must) allow duplicates. i'd agree it's sometimes annoying but it's both explicable and understandable, and (i'd say) not theoretically indefensible. at a practical level, making the duplicates visible happens to make it easy to illustrate (bind a directory to itself: look, everything in it is duplicated). From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:16:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18414 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:16:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18410 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:16:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:16:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9949C19CAF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:16:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B8D0319B0A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:16:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9578419B30; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:11:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DFCC19B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:11:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <310742-4314>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:09:31 -0500 Message-ID: <014b01c40d91$a0ef1aa0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <3f13f64a6cb8c5707f9f78fcac4c5dbb@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:07:37 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > look good to me cool, i took the idea from the bowling shirt, 'cept email addresses will have to be used. i hate graphics. From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:18:16 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18613 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:18:15 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18609 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:18:15 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:18:15 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1485C19C26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:18:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F074C19B58; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:18:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 697FA19C83; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:16:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0283B19B0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:16:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8fa6c9f34eddb63062fab1d09781f1cb@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <4ACCD005-797F-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:16:36 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > you're proposing making the shell differ from every other > program that reads directories. that seems like a bad idea. The shell is the only program which applies a regular expression match to the directory entries as it reads them. If this is a bad idea, it has a respectable history: "Putting this expansion mechanism into the shell has several advantages: the code only appears once, so no space is wasted and commands in general need take no special action; the algorithm is certain to be applied uniformly." (D.M.Ritchie, "Unix Time-Sharing System: A Retrospective", BSTJ July-Aug 1978) From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:25:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19315 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:25:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19311 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:25:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:25:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 17B6F19B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:25:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 489B119B10; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:25:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E30819B0A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:24:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C121219AD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:24:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <34feff09e0eb478d71030dd09fcd8135@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:24:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>>The thing is, reads from a union directory do in fact give you the union. > > i think the argument is provoked by the assumption that it's a union of sets, preventing duplicates, > but the system happens to work with bags, not sets, where union can (must) allow duplicates. Sorry, David is correct on this point. Sets and bags are both unordered, and union is therefore commutative. But directories are ordered -- the ordering is essential to resolve the ambiguity of duplicate names. So the accurate mathematical model is a sequence (aka list), and bind is not union of sets or bags, but append of sequences -- a non-commutative operator, hence the need to specify MBEFORE or MAFTER. -- Richard From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:33:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20197 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:33:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20192 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:33:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:33:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1CD5619BCE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43A5019B58; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:33:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BF08819B50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:33:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6990C19ADF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:32:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317946-8405>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:31:20 -0500 Message-ID: <017001c40d94$ab9a17e0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8fa6c9f34eddb63062fab1d09781f1cb@hamnavoe.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:29:21 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: "Richard Miller" Violation of protocol can result in permanent data loss -- RX02 manual From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:35:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20340 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:35:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20336 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:35:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:35:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F02F919B96; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50D8319B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:35:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 169FA19B0A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:34:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AC3519B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:34:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con In-Reply-To: <014b01c40d91$a0ef1aa0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:36:25 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: the email address part I'm not so sure of these things have a habit of expiring and mine's not that cool and belongs to a company I'm happy to use for email but don't want to wear clothes with their name on (I *used* to work there) I think I'd rather have maht:irc.freenode.org#plan9 but that looks a bit long perhaps I'd settle for maht m From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:37:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20489 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:37:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20485 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:37:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:37:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91F9A19C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:37:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEDFE19B86; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:37:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 49D8219B96; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:36:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FF1319B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:36:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <313646-4308>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:35:22 -0500 Message-ID: <018101c40d95$3ba2a6e0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:33:25 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Sorry, David is correct on this point. BULLSHIT hiding things will only wind up in nasty suprises, further down the track ... From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:38:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20591 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:38:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20587 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:38:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:38:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6669819C2A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:38:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C30219B86; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:38:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C66B19B41; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:37:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1EDA19B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:36:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J9Yf7b099978 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:34:41 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J9YfaS099977 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:34:41 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190934.i2J9YfaS099977@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:34:41 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > are you planning to change the other shells too? Yes for all which require to do so. Are there other documented shells for Plan9? > what about every other program that reads directories? No, I do not. I am not proposing to change the behavior of dirread(). > what does '*' really mean? The meaning is defined in manual for rc. you're making > assumptions > about what's right and i don't think it's clear what's right I just read the manual. > i'm not saying the behavior is right, but i'm not admitting it's wrong, > either. > moreover, i can explain everything that's going on by applying a very > simple > model that is clear from the documentation. that's worth a lot. For every problem there always exists a simple, easy to understand, incorrect solution. From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:40:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20796 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:40:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20791 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:40:35 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:40:35 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 79CAC19C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:40:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D46FF19AE5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:40:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 92D6419C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:39:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 282C719C37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:39:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <018101c40d95$3ba2a6e0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:39:18 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > BULLSHIT A soundly reasoned mathematical argument, very impressive. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:41:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20861 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:41:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20857 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:41:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:41:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A432419B69; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:41:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A07719BE6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:41:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC66F19AEE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:40:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 039B219C09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:40:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2J9cA7b000105 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:38:10 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2J9cAbV000104 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:38:10 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403190938.i2J9cAbV000104@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: <34feff09e0eb478d71030dd09fcd8135@terzarima.net> Subject: [9fans] Bind, look, everything is duplicated Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:38:10 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > visible happens to make it easy to illustrate (bind a directory to itself: > look, everything in it is duplicated). What I am proposing does not change this behaviour. Bind a directory to itself, look (ls), everything is still duplicated. I do not propose a change in the behaviour of read(). I do propose a change that fixes a bug in rc's globbing routine. From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:42:31 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20942 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:42:31 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20938 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:42:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:42:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7B4CD19C83; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:42:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A78119C3D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:42:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F285E19BE6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:41:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.ca [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38F9919AEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:41:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <717f95a3cb2a4436801b897eb34e2a1c@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <8fa6c9f34eddb63062fab1d09781f1cb@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:41:29 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: But dmr's comment is talking about wildcard expansion ("filename generation" in sh-speak), not directory-reading. And his argument does make sense in that context. At minimum, you'd need to modify rc and ape/sh to suppress duplicates. Programs other than the shells read directories without expanding wildcards, and if not also changed would behave inconsistently with the shells. They are at least: acme, bitsy/keyboard, cron, du, exportfs, faces, gzip, listen, mk, mkfs, mothra, replica programs, srvold9p, tar, vac, and winwatch. From david@cantrell.org.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:46:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21353 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:46:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21345 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:46:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:46:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B56F19CA6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 102CF19C09; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF12E19C37; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:45:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from plough.barnyard.co.uk (plough.barnyard.co.uk [195.149.50.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B4F819BB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:45:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from david by plough.barnyard.co.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B4GZT-0000UI-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:45:43 +0000 From: David Cantrell To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hi Message-ID: <20040319094542.A1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> References: <20040318193705.0F55B19B66@mail.cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <20040318193705.0F55B19B66@mail.cse.psu.edu>; from compusis@simon.intertel.hn on Thu, Mar 18, 2004 at 02:37:05PM -0500 X-Tell-Your-Children: knives taste nice Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:45:43 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > [wormspew] Could a listadmin *please* block this crap somehow? -- David Cantrell | Benevolent Dictator | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:47:06 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21379 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:47:06 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21365 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:47:00 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:47:00 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70DEB19CB2; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BCEE19CAF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0E1AB19BE6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:45:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9F6F19BB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:45:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311243-20135>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:44:11 -0500 Message-ID: <018b01c40d96$76e0dc80$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:42:14 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I think I'd rather have maht:irc.freenode.org#plan9 > > but that looks a bit long > > perhaps I'd settle for maht whatever. davel gave me an unspamable list, so i just took it from there. i actually like login names, 'cos it's simpler and shorter to type. the bowling shirt (seemed to me) to be tied to your login at bell. From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:47:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21432 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:47:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21428 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:47:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:47:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CCB6719C3D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:47:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B275D19AEB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:47:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD72319BB7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.ca [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CA7319C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:46:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <89a5343d7bd3a4fe85df04a398d25e7b@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:46:44 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Mathematics is a powerful tool, but not appropriate for solving all problems. I think that the things that made Unix and now Plan 9 most appealing are matters of judgement and taste. Obviously hard technical work has also gone into those systems, but I don't believe that that is enough to produce a compelling operating system. I wouldn't want to try to justify the creation or use of pipes or 9p or namespaces or user-mode file servers solely using mathematics. From david@cantrell.org.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:49:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21696 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:49:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21692 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:49:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:49:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EEE119C8B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:49:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34D4119BB7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:49:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2EBC19C71; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from plough.barnyard.co.uk (plough.barnyard.co.uk [195.149.50.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7510219AEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:48:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from david by plough.barnyard.co.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B4Gc9-0000Vd-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:48:29 +0000 From: David Cantrell To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con Message-ID: <20040319094829.B1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> References: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA>; from boyd@insultant.net on Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at 04:59:11AM +0100 X-Tell-Your-Children: knives taste nice Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:48:29 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at 04:59:11AM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > it's gonna be black and XL and i think it's gonna look like this: > > comments? Is it impractical to have more than one size? -- David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david Soylent green is purple! Soylent green is purple! From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:50:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21762 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:50:33 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21758 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:50:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:50:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D2E119BB7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:50:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10F3119BE6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:50:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7EB7719BE6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:49:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E37CE19BB7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:49:35 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2JA0rTv003476 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:00:53 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] hi X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6A@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] hi Thread-Index: AcQNlyLrAhh1ujDRQzqKQFoF8VvSLwAADE/g From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:49:38 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Could a listadmin *please* block this crap somehow? and exactly *how the hell* could he do that? From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sat Mar 20 15:46:03 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:53:49 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22016 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:53:48 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22003 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:53:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:53:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A484019CC6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:53:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17B4B19C99; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:53:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BBB3919C97; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E53AD19C51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:52:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14327 invoked by uid 991); 19 Mar 2004 09:52:36 -0000 Message-ID: <20040319095236.14326.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-reply-to: References: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> Comments: In-reply-to Rob Pike message dated "Fri, 19 Mar 2004 01:07:16 -0800." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:52:35 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > are you planning to change the other shells too? I think having a standard glob routine that all shells (and other programs!) used would be desirable. From david@cantrell.org.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 18:54:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22124 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 18:54:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22120 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 18:54:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 18:54:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C652619B42; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:54:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9B8219C97; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:54:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0028B19C51; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:53:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plough.barnyard.co.uk (plough.barnyard.co.uk [195.149.50.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD7BD19B42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:53:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from david by plough.barnyard.co.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B4Gge-0000Ww-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:53:08 +0000 From: David Cantrell To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hi Message-ID: <20040319095307.C1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> References: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6A@black.aprote.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5i In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6A@black.aprote.com>; from t.lankots@aprote.ee on Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at 11:49:38AM +0200 X-Tell-Your-Children: knives taste nice Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:53:07 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 19, 2004 at 11:49:38AM +0200, Tiit Lankots wrote: > > Could a listadmin *please* block this crap somehow? > and exactly *how the hell* could he do that? All sorts of ways. I find procmail useful. -- David Cantrell | Degenerate | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david Repent through spending From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:00:56 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22556 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:00:55 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22552 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:00:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:00:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1821919C97; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:00:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41ED019C42; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:00:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D035D19C42; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:59:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CEF1619A6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:59:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 14475 invoked by uid 991); 19 Mar 2004 09:59:56 -0000 Message-ID: <20040319095956.14474.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hi In-reply-to: <20040319094542.A1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> References: <20040318193705.0F55B19B66@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20040319094542.A1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> Comments: In-reply-to David Cantrell message dated "Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:45:43 +0000." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 04:59:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: | Could a listadmin *please* block this crap somehow? We're working on it. The plan is to attach some anti-virus software to spamassassin. But it's an arms race at best. From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:04:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22752 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:04:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22747 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:04:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:04:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 71C9419BED; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:04:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7080419BB9; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:04:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5EBF519A6A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:03:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E05EF19BB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:03:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <83dbd8440dc92835372c890aba553dd6@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:03:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>duplicate names. So the accurate mathematical model is a sequence >>(aka list), and bind is not union of sets or bags, but append of you're right. i was trying too hard to justify the term `union' (or not hard enough, depending on how you look at it). i've seen it argued elsewhere that union directories ought to have used another term, for much these reasons. still, they seem to work whatever you call them. From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:12:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23329 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:12:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23325 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:12:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:12:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F09319CCB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AB1819B2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:12:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E162219C51; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:11:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37C9A19BB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:11:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <018101c40d95$3ba2a6e0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:11:52 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I said: > Sorry, David is correct on this point. said: > BULLSHIT By "this point", I meant the observation that bind(..MAFTER|MBEFORE) doesn't produce a union in the mathematical sense, but a list. If someone finds a reference anywhere in the mathematical literature to a union operator which is non-commutative, I will happily retract my claim. said: > Mathematics is a powerful tool, but not appropriate for solving all > problems. ... Agreed. ("A mathematician, a physicist, and an engineer checked into a hotel one night ... " No, you've all heard that one already.) But when we use mathematical metaphors to explain the behaviour of engineering artefacts, choosing a not-quite-right metaphor can cause confusion. As in this case. -- Richard From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:14:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23466 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:14:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23462 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:14:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:14:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E14219C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:14:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0320719B2E; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:14:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8CB8019AB0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:13:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 393F519A20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:13:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314421-4308>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:11:33 -0500 Message-ID: <01ae01c40d9a$47f527b0$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <717f95a3cb2a4436801b897eb34e2a1c@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:09:34 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Programs other than the shells read directories without expanding > wildcards, and if not also changed would behave inconsistently with > the shells. roll on VMS ... From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:15:32 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23632 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:15:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23628 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:15:31 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:15:31 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B9D9D19CBE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:15:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDDE119A20; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:15:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C20519AEE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:14:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E982019BE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:14:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.221.198]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <314806-20131>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:13:57 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd01c40d9a$9e238870$c6dd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <004501c40d66$8e208e20$c6dd7d50@SOMA> <20040319094829.B1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:11:58 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is it impractical to have more than one size? no, you just need to re-code rc ;) From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:27:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24551 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:27:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24547 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:27:40 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:27:40 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D12119CD4; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:27:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B2D619C83; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:27:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC0A619B96; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E99419C62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:26:08 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2JAbQkE003798 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:37:26 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] ls, rc question X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056171@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] ls, rc question Thread-Index: AcQNldi9mDtyuVFiRfitzv817PGQFwAADwHA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:26:11 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: As Rob said, the current beahaviour is good in the sense that it's simple and predictable. However, it would maybe also be nice to glob match _names_, not paths. Right now, I fail to see, how it would=20 break something, e.g. acme. From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:43:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 25717 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:43:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 25713 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:43:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:43:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8BBCB19CA0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76A1819BED; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:43:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 755A119BBD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:42:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 496C819BC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:41:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6b02a9a02907b3d6abd735ed6abe8600@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:42:35 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>By "this point", I meant the observation that bind(..MAFTER|MBEFORE) >>doesn't produce a union in the mathematical sense, but a list. If >>someone finds a reference anywhere in the mathematical literature to a >>union operator which is non-commutative, I will happily retract my claim. a non-commutative union does occur when working with certain constructions on trees (funnily enough) [for much the same reason that addition and multiplication aren't always commutative] but i haven't got a good reference. From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 19:51:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 26298 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 19:51:40 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 26294 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 19:51:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 19:51:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7111219BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:51:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADEAA19B26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:51:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC13219ADF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:50:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 931D119AD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 05:50:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5703c110d2b1be322b2013b834545d1d@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <717f95a3cb2a4436801b897eb34e2a1c@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:50:50 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I thought my list of directory-reading programs was too short; I forgot to grep for dirreadall also (not having ls on the list should have been a tip-off). It should also include: aux/depend, diff, ftpd, history, kbmap, ls, mkpaqfs, netstat, news, pptpd, ps, rm, scp. Not too surprising on a system built on file servers. The problem isn't so much breaking things as the inconsistent behaviour that would result from suppressing duplicates only in some programs. This would be especially confusing to new users. From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 20:16:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28739 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 20:16:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28735 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 20:16:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 20:16:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D17E19B8D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3953019B04; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1EB419B04; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B76D19B41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JBCs7b000661 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JBCsTK000660 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <5703c110d2b1be322b2013b834545d1d@collyer.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Fri Mar 19 14:50:31 2004 > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c > From: Geoff Collyer > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:50:50 -0800 > > I thought my list of directory-reading programs was too short; I > forgot to grep for dirreadall also (not having ls on the list should > have been a tip-off). It should also include: aux/depend, diff, ftpd, > history, kbmap, ls, mkpaqfs, netstat, news, pptpd, ps, rm, scp. Not > too surprising on a system built on file servers. Which of these programs uses globbing? From nigel@9fs.org Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 21:27:37 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1380 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 21:27:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1369 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 21:27:30 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 21:27:30 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1EB3B19B86; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:27:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9362719B10; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:27:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 987BD19B51; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:26:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from nietze.cachelogic.com (unknown [212.44.43.80]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B22A319AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:26:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from amavis by nietze.cachelogic.com with scanned-ok (Exim 4.30) id 1B4J2O-0001Fr-Ma for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:23:44 +0000 Received: from cronus.saviso.com ([192.168.0.86] helo=9fs.org) by nietze.cachelogic.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1B4J2O-0001Fk-1o for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:23:44 +0000 Message-ID: <405AE707.9020309@9fs.org> From: Nigel Roles User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.5 (X11/20040208) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hi References: <20040318193705.0F55B19B66@mail.cse.psu.edu> <20040319094542.A1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> In-Reply-To: <20040319094542.A1420@plough.barnyard.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS 0.3.12 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:26:47 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Cantrell wrote: >>[wormspew] >> >> > >Could a listadmin *please* block this crap somehow? > > > Sorry, it may look like wormspew to you, but that's just how Boyd writes emails. From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 21:33:14 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1829 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 21:33:13 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1825 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 21:33:13 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 21:33:13 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A06819BC5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:32:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D11419B93; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:32:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B64B19B26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:31:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1841C19AF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:31:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:31:36 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i'm neutral about the whole thing: i think it's fine as it is, but woudn't fret too much if glob changed. as it happens, i discovered only last year that roger changed Inferno's Filepat (rhymes with cow pat) four years ago to return a result that had the names sorted and unique (it just required invoking an option in a lower-level routine). i probably wouldn't have done it myself (partly for reasons below), but on a list of changes that would end the world, it's fairly low on my list, and i doubt it would cause much more trouble in Plan 9. in practice, though, i find it makes very little difference, and i use both systems of course. one reason might be that (in my experience) union mounts aren't much used in the small, so there aren't a lot of them, and those there are tend to be used to set up a larger structure (eg, /bin, /dev, /net, service directories) or to provide limited, judicious replacement of one thing by another. thus, except when initially experimenting with the mechanism on seeing the system for the first time, or testing things after changing the implementation, i rarely interact with union directories through the user interface or scripts to the extent that i need worry in practice about whether pattern matching returns duplicates or not for lp (say). thus, i don't really care too much about the duplication effect. furthermore, if worrying about pattern matching returning duplicates for a directory, i'd have thought in practice it might be equally troublesome for the use of lp (say) that lp a* would no longer produce duplicates, which is splendid, but lp a* *a* q/a*.[ch] q/*.[ch] would of course still produce duplicates in general (as a simple example to illustrate the point, there are probably more compelling ones). you could therefore make good use of a nodup function (as geoff suggested) in general anyhow. (its surrounding `{} limits the scope of the nodup operation.) thus, you could just as well use it for the special case of duplicate names possibly produced by a union directory. i don't think union mount is particularly good at creating variant directory structures for software development, because of the white-out and other problems already mentioned; for that i suspect you want a different definition of union, more like union of whole directory trees, and it seems both better and possible to supply that through a user-level file server that can be precisely configured, rather than putting too much load on the existing simple bind/union operations in the kernel that are quite effective within their own scope. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 21:57:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 3990 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 21:57:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 3986 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 21:57:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 21:57:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B71719B26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:57:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEA0919B26; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:57:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6958A19B04; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:56:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DE2119B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:56:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.207.121]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3823835-2257>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:55:27 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c40db1$4192d1d0$79cf7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:53:57 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: cheating with metacharacters will get you into woe, union moints or not. type ls first. the amount of code required to fix this peculiar, but extremely powerful, end case flies in the face of good taste, good design and minimalism. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:01:01 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8683 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:01:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8677 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:00:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:00:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B36EB19BCE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F4BD19BC5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 52CF819BB9; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E1ED19BB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit None, they just walk through the directory they get. --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 06:16:40 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 06:16:37 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FF6119B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4928019B41; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1EB419B04; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B76D19B41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JBCs7b000661 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JBCsTK000660 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <5703c110d2b1be322b2013b834545d1d@collyer.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Fri Mar 19 14:50:31 2004 > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c > From: Geoff Collyer > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:50:50 -0800 > > I thought my list of directory-reading programs was too short; I > forgot to grep for dirreadall also (not having ls on the list should > have been a tip-off). It should also include: aux/depend, diff, ftpd, > history, kbmap, ls, mkpaqfs, netstat, news, pptpd, ps, rm, scp. Not > too surprising on a system built on file servers. Which of these programs uses globbi ng? --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw-- From bwc@borf.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:04 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:01:38 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 8718 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:01:38 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 8714 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:01:38 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:01:38 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DD17C19BB1; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:01:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73F3519BBD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:01:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D25A619BED; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC5F919BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2ce4939bd92880ae2cc78de5ccf532bf@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] tabstop poll results Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:52:40 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In case you were wondering, of the 18 responses received, 12 used tabstop=4, five used tabstop=8, and one used tabstop=9--0x09 actually. Brantley From lsdc1@york.ac.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:08:33 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9004 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:08:32 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9000 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:08:32 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:08:32 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E6AD19C0D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:08:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2F9619BE7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:08:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB25E19BD9; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:07:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D60019B38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B4KbR-0005c9-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:04:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Leo Caves Message-ID: <237cdbb8.0403190517.1fb498c7@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit References: <20040318091052.66c7ec8d@as-tech-l.apnic.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:01:37 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ggm@apnic.net (George Michaelson) wrote in message news:<20040318091052.66c7ec8d@as-tech-l.apnic.net>... > > can I get a brief sitrep on xen? > Xen looks interesting: to save a google: http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/Research/SRG/netos/xen/ Xen appears to be a mulitplexer for (appropriately ported) operating systems(?) Plan9 and inferno are so light-weight, you can imagine instances being created in a thread-like manner. It might be an interesting route for providing secure services ("have a whole machine - its yours!"), but quite a different model from (say) a name-space protected sandbox on plan9/inferno. Also, inferno (emu) is (already) a virtual OS. Would Xen offer any advantages over multiple inferno instances hosted on a conventional OS? I am interested to hear opinion on what xen might offer in the Plan 9/inferno world-view. Leo Followup-To: Distribution: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Keywords: Cc: -- Dennis Davis, BUCS, University of Bath, Bath, BA2 7AY, UK D.H.Davis@bath.ac.uk From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:14:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9429 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:14:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9425 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:14:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:14:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF07719C2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:14:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 000AD19BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:14:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7347719BF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:13:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56DAC19BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:13:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2F5B24FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:13:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405B0000.8070509@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c References: <50440c6f4b6946137968d772dcf08a2a@hamnavoe.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:13:20 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Rob Pike wrote: > are you planning to change the other shells too? what about every > other program > that reads directories? what does '*' really mean? you're making > assumptions > about what's right and i don't think it's clear what's right and when > things aren't > clear i say leave them alone until they clear up. after something like > 15 years > they still haven't cleared up. > > i'm not saying the behavior is right, but i'm not admitting it's > wrong, either. > moreover, i can explain everything that's going on by applying a very > simple > model that is clear from the documentation. that's worth a lot. continuing this... note how much more complicated the model gets if rc and ls (or perhaps dirreadall) start removing duplicates from the list. right now, it took you no time at all to find the existence of duplicates, and then once you realize they exist, you notice them everywhere. if the bulk of directory-processing programs remove duplicates for themselves, then some day you run across a program that doesn't (either out of neglect or because it doesn't fit the way the program does directory processing). now you know duplicates exist again. but nothing makes sense -- why haven't you noticed before? why do some programs show them and others not? the explanation isn't simple or regular or predictable -- some do, some don't, depending on their code. i'd rather live in the first world, where all programs agree. the alternate universe, where illusions come and go depending on the program, where shortcomings of the kernel are fixed by hacking around them in user space, it's a terrible way to live. if you want modern unix, you know where to find it. the clearest example i can think of in modern unix where this happens is the handling of .. by shells in order to make symlinks look not like symlinks, while the kernel is still broken, as rob points out in http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/lexnames.pdf. there are plenty of others. russ p.s. amusingly enough, now we've filled in all the context necessary to read boyd's first post in this thread, where he posted that url and nothing else! From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:20:41 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 9783 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:20:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 9779 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:20:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:20:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23A9E19C53; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74E5019C3D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:20:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8872B19BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:19:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8EA8119BEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:19:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1339924FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:19:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405B0182.3030905@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c References: <200403190757.i2J7vUIO097549@adat.davidashen.net> <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> In-Reply-To: <59B1952A-797D-11D8-8706-000A95B984D8@mightycheese.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:19:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Rob Pike wrote: >> Since I don't have a printer, here is a proposed change to rc/glob.c > > > i don't like changing the shell to mask kernel behavior. it leads > to surprises. consider unix shells that `fix' cd in a way that it > differs from the chdir system call. From matt@proweb.co.uk Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:38:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11080 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:38:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11076 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:38:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:38:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F55319C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 855B619B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:38:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 60F7D19BDD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:37:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0831019B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:37:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tabstop poll results In-Reply-To: <2ce4939bd92880ae2cc78de5ccf532bf@borf.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:39:34 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > and one used tabstop=9--0x09 actually. that was a joke 0x09 is the tab character, I dont change tabs to spaces m From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:40:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11346 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:40:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11342 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:40:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:40:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 200F219AF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:40:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1ADA19AF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:40:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 49B4C19AE5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:39:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60C0E19AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:39:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JEbV7b001726 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:37:31 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JEbVZn001725 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:37:31 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191437.i2JEbVZn001725@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <405B0000.8070509@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:37:31 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > continuing this... > > note how much more complicated the model gets if rc and ls > (or perhaps dirreadall) start removing duplicates from the list. > right now, it took you no time at all to find the existence of duplicates, > and then once you realize they exist, you notice them everywhere. I didn't propose ls to remove duplicates from the list. ls should not. rc should from the list of globbing results. It is written in the manual. > > if the bulk of directory-processing programs remove duplicates globbing is not directory processing. > i'd rather live in the first world, where all programs agree. echo x and echo x* will bring different results for a directory with two entries named x . The program does not agree with itself. Globbing has little in common with directory reading. > out in http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/lexnames.pdf. there are > plenty of others. > > p.s. amusingly enough, now we've filled in all the context necessary > to read boyd's first post in this thread, where he posted that url > and nothing else! I had read that article, I do know the problem with symlinks, and this problem is not related to the one I'm discussing. From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:43:40 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11468 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:43:39 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11464 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:43:39 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:43:39 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0986819C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E79CF19C09; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:43:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A76919C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:42:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21E8B19C09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:42:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEgKjt011940 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:42:20 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEgKL7011169 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:42:20 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEgKfQ031215 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:42:20 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <20040319095236.14326.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:42:19 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, Scott Schwartz wrote: > > are you planning to change the other shells too? > > I think having a standard glob routine that all shells (and other > programs!) used would be desirable. maybe a tool! we could call it glob. The shell could call it so that we got standardized globbing. I recommend putting it in /etc ron p.s. Yes, :-) From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:47:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 11807 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:47:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 11803 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:47:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:47:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E3E9119B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:47:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA09919C09; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:47:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9328F19C2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:46:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B61A19B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:46:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JEiH7b001766 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:44:17 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JEiHG9001765 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:44:17 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191444.i2JEiHG9001765@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:44:17 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > None, they just walk through the directory they get. That's why I think those examples are not relevant. dirread semantics stays intact. globbing semantics should correspond to its definition. ls -l *.c and ls -l give different results now, without changes. The first form will list some entries twice. The second form will list each entry once, with some entries having the same name. I'm proposing to make the first form bring what it should. Namely, to bring every entry once. How displaying the first occurence of a file as many times as there are entries with the same name makes it similar or consistent with the second form, I really don't get. They are confusing now. The cause of the confusion is a bug in globbing. The bug should be fixed. From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Fri Mar 19 23:53:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12198 invoked by uid 1020); 19 Mar 2004 23:53:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12194 invoked from network); 19 Mar 2004 23:53:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 19 Mar 2004 23:53:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E1A719C2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:53:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 097E619C2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:53:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7D2119C2D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:52:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9399219B32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:52:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEqVjt014538 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:31 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEqVGr029212 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JEqVfQ031606 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:31 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? In-Reply-To: <237cdbb8.0403190517.1fb498c7@posting.google.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:30 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, Leo Caves wrote: > I am interested to hear opinion on what xen might offer in the Plan > 9/inferno world-view. my one interest was that I could run auth, fs, and term on one laptop. ron From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:02:18 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 12922 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:02:18 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 12918 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:02:17 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:02:17 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5432E19C6A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:02:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC8E519C53; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:01:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A81AB19C09; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0593919B26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:00:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2JF0HD11695 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:00:18 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Subject: [9fans] Globbing Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:59:58 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: For the record, I have no trouble agreeing with dvd, although I'm speaking from a weak position: I have not explored all the possible consequences of changing the globbing rules to remove duplications. I think forsyth put his agnostic view rather well, but in my opinion applying a uniqueness filter would be esthetically preferable. As for consequences, here are a few data points. * I don't think there are any advantages to retaining duplicates, they just clutter scripts that have to deal with them. * It isn't always possible and it is never clean to apply filtering to the output of the globbing operation. At least, to the best of my knowledge. We are talking about the command line, here. A particular ugly case would be > x* just to stir the pot a little further. But of course that could be taken as an argument in favour of either standpoint. * It is a change in the league of another similarly controversial difference between rc and the traditional Unix shells (or is it exec(2)?). Lack of a leading /, ./ or ../ allows rc to use the "path" variable to determine the origin of an executable, whereas the presence of a slash anywhere in the command name suppresses this behaviour in traditional Unix shells. You should have seen the confusion, consternation and outright resentment a question on this last subject caused on a NetBSD mailing list. It didn't help that I used the term "absolute" to describe a pathname starting with /, ./ or ../ and "relative" for one that didn't. ++L PS: One NetBSD contributor suggested making up a version of the shell with behaviour more similar to rc's. I refrained from pointing out that rc was as good as I needed, in that case. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:08:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 13880 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:07:53 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 13872 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:07:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:07:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 155BD19CA6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:07:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62E4819C53; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:07:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1BA5E19C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:06:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E120199FD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:06:00 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2JFHLnT006470 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:17:21 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] Globbing X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6D@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Globbing Thread-Index: AcQNwzhXR3NEUoDISJylCrfsbT2XJgAAEAsg From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:05:56 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: my point exactly=20 From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:18:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 15193 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:18:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 15189 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:18:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:18:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C70C319C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:18:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CF5819B69; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:18:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFE5819C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5150619B69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:17:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:18:07 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > maybe a tool! we could call it glob. The shell could call it so that we > got standardized globbing. > > I recommend putting it in /etc > > ron > p.s. Yes, :-) If you get this joke, you may qualify for a Senior discount at Denny's. ☺ From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:38:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17279 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:38:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17275 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:38:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:38:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 151E619C56; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:38:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A895D19BEE; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:38:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 476DF19AFD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:37:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21EE8199FD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:37:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 10:37:11 EST 2004 Received: from 68.37.144.241 ([68.37.144.241]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 10:37:09 EST 2004 Message-ID: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> From: "david presotto" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:34:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I would be most disturbed if 'ls' and 'ls *' returned different numbers of entries. The fact that 'ls -l' and 'ls -l *' show different properties bothers me less. I see it as a failure of ls and not globing. However, requiring ls to read the whole directory every time seems silly. I wouldn't mind if the kernel threw out the unreachable entries when you read a directory. However, I don't think its worth the effort or the likely bugs. This is what I would change, if anything since it is the source of the problem and 'fixing' it in rc just makes rc and globing in general odd. From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:44:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17818 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:44:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17814 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:44:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:44:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7BC3719A07; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65825199FD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:44:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 45468199FD; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:43:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03EBF19B69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:43:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JFhkjt025318 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:43:46 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JFhkAu004564 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:43:46 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JFhkfQ000918 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:43:46 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:43:45 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, david presotto wrote: > I wouldn't mind if the kernel threw out the unreachable entries when you > read a directory. However, I don't think its worth the effort or the > likely bugs. This is what I would change, if anything since it is the > source of the problem and 'fixing' it in rc just makes rc and globing in > general odd. in the mode of lnfs, for people who care, make a uniquefs that enforces bsd-like behavior? ron From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:45:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 17847 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:45:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 17843 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:45:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:45:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B838219A07; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:45:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8B6219C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:45:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91F8D19BF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:44:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8D8219A07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:44:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 8A5D61B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:44:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2JFDkD11820 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:13:47 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] Globbing Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6D@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:13:28 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > my point exactly I think rminnich had a point :-) How about a dynamically loadable link module so one could choose different types of globbing? Oh, I forget Plan 9 does not have dynamic linking. What a relief! ++L PS: Tongue firmly planted in cheek, need I mention? From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 00:54:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18563 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 00:54:46 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18556 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 00:54:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 00:54:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF26119BF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:54:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27C5519B82; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:54:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A47B819BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:53:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76B1C19AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:53:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2JFreD12139 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:53:40 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:53:22 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If you get this joke, you may qualify for a Senior discount at Denny's. ☺ MKS tools. Unless there was prior art that I don't know about. I have a lot to thank Mortice Kern for. ++L From t.lankots@aprote.ee Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:00:57 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 18978 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:00:56 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 18974 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:00:55 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:00:55 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B3E619BEB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03CB119B51; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC2A619BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39A8019AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:59:27 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2JGAmwh006991 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:10:49 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D6E@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Thread-Index: AcQNyogipWREbGDBSJ2nyNzyozjmlQAAGeng From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:59:24 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: U3VkZGVubHkgSSBmZWVsIGV2ZW4gbW9yZSBuZXdiaWUgdGhhbiBiZWZvcmUuDQpBbmQgSSBzZXJp b3VzbHkgdXNlZCB0byB0aGluayB0aGF0IHdhcyBpbW9zc2libGUhDQoNClAuUy4gVG9uZ3VlIHN0 aWxsIGZpcm1seSBpbiBjaGVlay4gUHJvYmFibHkgYSBuZXcgDQp2aXJ1cyBvciBzb21ldGhpbmcu DQo= From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:01:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19031 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:01:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19027 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:01:33 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:01:33 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 52F8619C8B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:01:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63CE919C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:01:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0C2119BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 249C619AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15f613e904eab811d1f9e1c23983beb2@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qpazlkpkjmvbxgaseichrkfxqf" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:01:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qpazlkpkjmvbxgaseichrkfxqf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sorry, you must be under age. --upas-qpazlkpkjmvbxgaseichrkfxqf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Mar 19 15:55:03 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 057D119BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:54:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87DF219B69; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:54:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A47B819BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:53:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76B1C19AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 10:53:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2JFreD12139 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:53:40 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 17:53:22 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > If you get this joke, you may qualify for a Senior discount at Denny's.= =E2=98=BA MKS tools. Unless there was prior art that I don't know about. I have a lot to thank Mortice Kern for. ++L --upas-qpazlkpkjmvbxgaseichrkfxqf-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:02:00 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19059 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:02:00 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19054 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:01:59 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:01:59 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D018619BB1; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:01:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5115119B51; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:01:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62A2319AB0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2A4619B51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:00:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:00:57 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>in the mode of lnfs, for people who care, make a uniquefs that enforces >>bsd-like behavior? that was what i was alluding to earlier, although the uniqueness didn't seem to me to be the main thing, it's having the effect of `recursive bind' (taking unions over whole trees), white-out, and similar things that would be useful when compiling variant versions, including experimental ones, in the style of ClearCase (but without the need for a dedicated administrator!). From forsyth@terzarima.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:03:34 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19156 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:03:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19152 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:03:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:03:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 930E819BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:03:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F375519BAC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:03:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B9D9319BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3511019B51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:02:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:02:54 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>I wouldn't mind if the kernel threw out the unreachable entries when >>you read a directory. However, I don't think its worth the effort or the trouble with that is that it's sometimes quite important to see that there are duplicates and what they are, if only to diagnose an unexpected effect caused by a union, so i think you'd need some way to give an equivalent effect, as i think rsc mentioned earlier. roger's away so i'll give his observation that the result of ls -l on a union directory (or reading a union directory and sorting it) will be less useful or even misleading unless the sort is stable. if you can rely on that, you know the attributes of the files of the same name below in the union appear in the correct order (which allows quick checks on the state of the union). of course, /proc/$pid/ns will give some of that for the directories involved, but when it is a particular file or files that you worry about, {ls -l | grep} seems a natural thing to use to check their attributes. as it happens, i don't think Plan 9's sort is stable: term% ls -l /bin|grep 8c --rwxrwxr-x M 9 forsyth inferno 303305 Dec 10 18:11 /bin/8c --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 299674 Feb 17 03:59 /bin/8c term% ls -l /bin/8c --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 299674 Feb 17 03:59 /bin/8c From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:09:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19429 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:09:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19425 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:09:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:09:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C2F919AD2; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:09:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F45819BAC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:09:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C59819BEB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:08:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A73D19AD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:08:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <25f480aa2faa426fc5a083e1a34ce82e@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:08:09 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> If you get this joke, you may qualify for a Senior discount at Denny's. ☺ > > MKS tools. Unless there was prior art that I don't know about. > > I have a lot to thank Mortice Kern for. Ron showed me his 6th Ed. Manual day to prove that glob was indeed a binary, a dæmon running on the system. andrey From rminnich@lanl.gov Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:13:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 19663 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:13:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 19658 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:13:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:13:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6AFD19BB1; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:13:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69DA919C1A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:13:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9406A19BAC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:12:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A98A19BD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JGCWjt007741 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:12:32 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JGCV0w015672 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:12:31 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2JGCVfQ002039 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:12:31 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <25f480aa2faa426fc5a083e1a34ce82e@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:12:31 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > Ron showed me his 6th Ed. Manual day to prove that glob was indeed a > binary, a dæmon running on the system. not a daemon, but yeah a binary. ron From lucio@proxima.alt.za Sat Mar 20 15:46:05 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:23:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20424 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:23:41 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20420 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:23:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:23:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F5A119C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:23:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 857B519B0F; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:23:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 477F219B0F; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:22:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (sparkle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F63E19BEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:22:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2JGMZD12352 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:22:35 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <347acfd4fa7017c4a8312dfe27e38d86@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <25f480aa2faa426fc5a083e1a34ce82e@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:22:17 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Ron showed me his 6th Ed. Manual day to prove that glob was indeed a > binary, a dæmon running on the system. > You mean a predecessor of the Plan 9 file server concept? ++L From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:25:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 20619 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:25:34 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 20614 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:25:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:25:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 58F2019C2A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:25:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8485519C0D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:25:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9E74019BAC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:24:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C20AD19BFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:23:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78629242821455f5aa5d2fbbf5b8c9a4@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:23:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The number of times I've reliably used the duplicates in a listing to see a namespace problem has been 0. Ns is the only tool I've ever found useful there. From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:35:47 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 21471 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:35:47 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 21465 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:35:46 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:35:46 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA29919C4B; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D631019BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:35:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 029E419ABC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F8E519BFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:34:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:34:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I would be most disturbed if 'ls' and 'ls *' returned different numbers > of entries. term% cd / term% ls|wc 40 40 202 term% ls *|wc 1056 1056 10972 From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:47:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22565 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:47:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22560 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:47:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:47:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B0CE19C54; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:47:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7629F19BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:47:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9B2B119BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:46:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39E2A19BED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:46:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0f7baf1240c48a949d3f1e29cacddeff@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:34:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: / I would be most disturbed if 'ls' and 'ls *' returned // different numbers of entries. i was totally with David T. on this one until i read this. now i see that the coice is really that either 'ls' and 'ls *' can agree, -*or*- 'ls /tmp/foo' and 'ls /tmp/foo*' can agree. changing globing as proposed will make the later true and the former false, which, as presotto notes, is likely to be much more confusing. the fix really would have to be a kernel-level change, and that's a much bigger deal. fwiw, it was a decent suggestion on a tricky point, and many 9fans are still confusing what david was suggesting/asking for with a dirread change which he *wasn't* asking for. ア From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:49:35 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 22893 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:49:35 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 22889 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:49:34 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:49:34 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C82E19BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:49:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE7AA19BC0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:49:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B63719BFC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:48:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E53ED19C40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:48:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:47:17 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: // ...ls|wc... different cause and different context. there ls is being instructed to do different things. i think presotto had an implied "in a dir with only plain files" or something similar. ア From rm@hamnavoe.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 01:53:36 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 23046 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 01:53:36 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 23042 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 01:53:36 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 01:53:36 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1FAF19BE7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:53:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91FFF19BA3; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:53:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A2E0F19C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:52:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 397ED19BFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:52:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6a53e6d5775f654c78bef1f84157eedd@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:52:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i > think presotto had an implied "in a dir with only > plain files" or something similar. ... and I hope he realised I was only teasing. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 02:16:42 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 24826 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 02:16:42 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 24822 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 02:16:41 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 02:16:41 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C01819AB6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:16:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46E8B19D00; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:16:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 252E119CB5; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:15:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC5BD19AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:15:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4a97ae43a796977107959fc6efba0608@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bblmsyafhlexloamyprwrwrdmo" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:15:40 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bblmsyafhlexloamyprwrwrdmo Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit come on, you know what I meant. --upas-bblmsyafhlexloamyprwrwrdmo Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 11:35:39 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 11:35:36 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13BB019C50; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:35:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A7B319ABC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:35:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 029E419ABC; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F8E519BFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 11:34:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <000b01c40dc7$b8df6e40$1602a8c0@bl.belllabs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 16:34:12 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I would be most disturbed if 'ls' and 'ls *' returned different numbers > of entries. term% cd / term% ls|wc 40 40 202 term% ls *|wc 1056 1056 10972 --upas-bblmsyafhlexloamyprwrwrdmo-- From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:06 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 02:58:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 27920 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 02:58:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 27916 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 02:58:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 02:58:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D1A019CDB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:58:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D70919CE1; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:58:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7872319CDB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B5B019B6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:57:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (lusitania.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.154]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 624D024FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:57:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405B347F.3080703@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c References: <200403191444.i2JEiHG9001765@adat.davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <200403191444.i2JEiHG9001765@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:57:19 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin wrote: >I'm proposing to make the first form bring what it should. Namely, >to bring every entry once. How displaying the first occurence of >a file as many times as there are entries with the same name makes >it similar or consistent with the second form, I really don't get. > >They are confusing now. The cause of the confusion is a bug in globbing. >The bug should be fixed. > > Actually the cause of the confusion is not agreed upon, as evidenced by the continuation of this discussion! I'm perfectly happy with things as they are now, so that: echo `{ls /dev | grep mouse} echo /dev/*mouse* produce the same output. If you want to fix something, figure out how to fix the kernel. If 9P servers were required to sort their directory entries then the kernel could just toss entries easily during a merge. Not that I'm proposing this. Russ From dvd@davidashen.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 03:07:44 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 28500 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 03:07:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 28496 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 03:07:43 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 03:07:43 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 599A019AF6; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:07:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 934FF19D3C; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:07:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9A3F519D20; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:06:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 376C719AF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:06:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JI4O7b002742 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:04:24 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JI4OIs002741 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:04:24 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191804.i2JI4OIs002741@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <405B347F.3080703@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:04:24 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm perfectly happy with things as they are now I'm convinced. Many thanks for opinions. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 03:22:46 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 29630 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 03:22:45 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 29626 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 03:22:45 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 03:22:45 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6D43719D65; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6CB319CCB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:22:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F00119CCB; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AB87819AD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 13:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:19:38 -0000 Received: from larch.snellwilcox.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JK2sjR004768 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 20:02:55 GMT Message-ID: <2c33976d548ff37c24d8fde9334232c8@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] m4 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 18:21:14 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, As we are talking history (v6 glob) I put a port of m4 on /n/sources/steve/m4.tar.bz2. I still touch FORTRAN occasionally (but I'am feeling much better now). -Steve From 9nut@9netics.com Sat Mar 20 15:46:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 04:22:43 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 1334 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 04:22:43 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 1330 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 04:22:42 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 04:22:42 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B688F19D73; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34EA819D59; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:22:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39F1419D59; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:21:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D99919D26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:21:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <269cd379224cbe9a68f0596da723f8cb@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] m4 From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <2c33976d548ff37c24d8fde9334232c8@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:22:20 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I still touch FORTRAN occasionally > (but I'am feeling much better now). check out efl++ ☺ ← just in case From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 04:46:51 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 2821 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 04:46:50 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 2817 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 04:46:49 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 04:46:49 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6F7E19D8A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:46:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0170F19D95; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:46:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 260E419D92; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:45:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9D7C19D75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:45:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.207.121]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320835-31375>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 14:44:13 -0500 Message-ID: <00b801c40dea$48854b60$79cf7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 20:42:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: From: "ron minnich" > maybe a tool! we could call it glob. The shell could call it so that we > got standardized globbing. it'll never work, guv. no chance, zero, zip, nada ... ;) From geoff@collyer.net Sat Mar 20 15:46:07 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.3]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 05:32:45 JST 2004 Received: (qmail 5883 invoked by uid 1020); 20 Mar 2004 05:32:44 +0900 Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: (qmail 5879 invoked from network); 20 Mar 2004 05:32:44 +0900 Received: from niscan1.aichi-u.ac.jp (HELO mail.cse.psu.edu) (202.16.124.100) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp with SMTP; 20 Mar 2004 05:32:44 +0900 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 862B219D7E; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:32:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E37319D9C; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:32:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D38419C07; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:31:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D87219C56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:31:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mqkpwmuqqaloalsswisfxjybar" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 12:31:50 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mqkpwmuqqaloalsswisfxjybar Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > None, they just walk through the directory they get. Actually, ftpd, mkfs and replica (pull at least) glob. --upas-mqkpwmuqqaloalsswisfxjybar Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([10.9.0.12]) by collyer.net; Fri Mar 19 06:01:05 PST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Fri Mar 19 06:01:05 PST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E51EE19BB7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7084619BB7; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 09:00:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 52CF819BB9; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E1ED19BB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 08:59:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit None, they just walk through the directory they get. --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 06:16:40 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 19 06:16:37 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9FF6119B32; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4928019B41; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:16:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1EB419B04; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B76D19B41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 06:15:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2JBCs7b000661 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2JBCsTK000660 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403191112.i2JBCsTK000660@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <5703c110d2b1be322b2013b834545d1d@collyer.net> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 15:12:54 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Fri Mar 19 14:50:31 2004 > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c > From: Geoff Collyer > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 02:50:50 -0800 > > I thought my list of directory-reading programs was too short; I > forgot to grep for dirreadall also (not having ls on the list should > have been a tip-off). It should also include: aux/depend, diff, ftpd, > history, kbmap, ls, mkpaqfs, netstat, news, pptpd, ps, rm, scp. Not > too surprising on a system built on file servers. Which of these programs uses globbi ng? --upas-owwvbnxepdydgcbjftoiztieyw-- --upas-mqkpwmuqqaloalsswisfxjybar-- From stevemw@place.org Sat Mar 20 22:53:10 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 16:42:28 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 138B2344164 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:42:18 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C01C77580FB; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:42:16 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35B8275810A for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:42:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E00E234418C for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:02:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED9AF19D9D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:37:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3B4119BA0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:37:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 09A5219D65; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:36:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from zachs.place.org (place.org [65.163.18.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28A8719AE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:36:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from place.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zachs.place.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5ABBB180F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:36:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <405BBC30.3050208@place.org> From: Stephen Wynne User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6) Gecko/20040113 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en, ja, zh-cn, zh-hk, zh-sg, zh-tw, ar-qa, ar-sa MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con References: <018b01c40d96$76e0dc80$c6dd7d50@SOMA> <023b01c40e2a$13e31140$c7597d50@SOMA> In-Reply-To: <023b01c40e2a$13e31140$c7597d50@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 19:36:16 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Glenda needs some dark pilot's glasses. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 22:53:10 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 16:51:07 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D0DC344185 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:50:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B62F47580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:50:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B6847580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:50:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EDEB344185 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 16:50:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3F10519C21; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 02:50:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD4B219C30; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 02:50:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08D9819C17; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 02:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B49F119C21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 02:49:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.223.43]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <335260-1146>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 02:49:15 -0500 Message-ID: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:47:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i have added some generic merchandise at: http://www.cafeshops.com/lon9con From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sat Mar 20 22:53:10 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 17:09:50 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C4E53441FF for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 558667580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34EF57580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F31AB3441FF for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3F7A19B6C; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:25:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85F6519B6A; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:25:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 601FE19B6C; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38C5F19B23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 00:24:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20040320100657.342f45f7.martin@parvat.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:24:29 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > (BTW: you should already be able to do the above using VMware, but > you would need lots of physical memory, and the performance might not > be very exciting!) everybody's doing virtualization in grids nowadays -- that's the only way they can have a secure environment when they don't have the luxury of being able to access private namespaces. many of the papers accepted to IPDPS'04 and CCGrid'04 are looking for solutions exactly in that area. rumour is globus has even got improvements in vmware, something like binaries running at 20% native speed was considered an good speed. andrey From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 22:53:10 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 17:09:54 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A98D344203 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 466F77580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 259D87580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFE79344203 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:09:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 013CB19D73; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:35:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E460C19BA0; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:35:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DD70F19C8F; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94F6519BF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:34:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.89.199]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321910-31372>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:20:26 -0500 Message-ID: <023b01c40e2a$13e31140$c7597d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <018b01c40d96$76e0dc80$c6dd7d50@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 04:18:48 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: well, it looks like it's gonna be done like this with login names: http://www.insultant.net/repo/plan9/images/t/boyd.jpg on a black XL t-shirt. From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 22:53:11 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 17:43:19 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B432C34424B for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:12 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EF3317580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:10 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E018B7580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0428B34424B for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6EB9619B8A; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:28:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 178D919BBF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:28:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 014F119B6D; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:27:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C6AB19B8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:27:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <566efcdfa1b421607b391c0f1e4ace22@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] fossil Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:27:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: We fixed a pretty major security whole on Mar 11th. Make sure you're up to date. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 20 22:53:11 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 17:43:25 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9065234424D for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:18 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D7F067580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:16 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5FD37580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 163D534424D for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DED7B19D65; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:46:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F6C719B6C; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:46:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 25C8119BF1; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:45:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3AEC19B6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:45:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.89.199]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3652770-2253>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 22:41:49 -0500 Message-ID: <027a01c40e2d$0f741700$c7597d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <018b01c40d96$76e0dc80$c6dd7d50@SOMA> <023b01c40e2a$13e31140$c7597d50@SOMA> <405BBC30.3050208@place.org> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 04:40:13 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Glenda needs some dark pilot's glasses. an' maybe a CWU/27-P ... From presotto@closedmind.org Sat Mar 20 22:53:11 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 17:43:26 JST 2004 Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3FA634424E for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:19 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 04B5E7580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E27267580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A94534424E for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 17:43:14 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC48A19CBF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:26:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E13CC19BBF; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:26:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBCBD19C40; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:25:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12EE919B8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:25:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] dns Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2004 21:25:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Fixed a problem in dns related to flush. You should pick up new dns source and rebuild it. From oeystein@imset.net Sun Mar 21 14:48:04 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 22:56:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 72005ad6_7a76_11d8_837e_00304828b574_1735; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A10A734448A for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 717e4de8_7a76_11d8_9374_00304828b574_1732; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 496087580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 039967580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 71207f06_7a76_11d8_9f77_00304828b574_1729; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 675FA34448A for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7011834e_7a76_11d8_869d_00304828b574_1725; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 22:56:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9ADE819C6B; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6CEB119C6C; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:56:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7418519C57; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:55:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (cpc1-hink1-4-0-cust116.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.5.201.116]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1BC1A19C48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 08:55:21 -0500 (EST) From: oeystein@imset.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="75070050" Message-Id: <20040320135521.1BC1A19C48@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [Virus Delete] was:[9fans] stolen Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:55:17 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --75070050 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit what does it mean? --75070050-- From rminnich@lanl.gov Sun Mar 21 14:48:04 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 20 23:35:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbdcab44_7a7b_11d8_8725_00304828b574_7456; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B74D3444D9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbac5638_7a7b_11d8_9edf_00304828b574_7453; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id F263E7580FA; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A46267580F9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id db4ca0da_7a7b_11d8_8648_00304828b574_7450; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9739C3444D9 for ; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id da95b136_7a7b_11d8_9a16_00304828b574_7446; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:35:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8D5919C95; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 09:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 085E519C5E; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 09:35:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C41F319C5E; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 09:34:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6C6F19A90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 09:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2KEYAjt009069 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:34:10 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2KEYAAu002414 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:34:10 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2KEY9fQ011064 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:34:09 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? In-Reply-To: <20040320100657.342f45f7.martin@parvat.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 07:34:08 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sat, 20 Mar 2004, Martin C.Atkins wrote: > Does Xen virtualise the display? I couldn't see anything that suggested > it did in a 10-minute parse of the website, but then I couldn't find anything > that said it didn't either! not sure, but maybe that is not impossible to add. ron From davel@anvil.com Sun Mar 21 14:48:05 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 03:46:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f10f0872_7a9e_11d8_931f_00304828b574_14140; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 061F0344711 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0bc2ea4_7a9e_11d8_9c40_00304828b574_14137; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B5A2A7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F1FD7580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f05e2c64_7a9e_11d8_993a_00304828b574_14134; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43077344711 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ef9a3322_7a9e_11d8_80e7_00304828b574_14130; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B49EC19B4E; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:46:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91AC319B4E; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:46:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 03CA719C00; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:45:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08B7119A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:45:00 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 6D50934C; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:44:46 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA7334A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:44:44 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA29673 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:43:44 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> References: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079808711.2282.3.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:51:51 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Gracias for t-shirt image. Sorry I've been a bit incommunicado ... I'll try to get my shit back together next week: I'm gonna go talk to Skea about all the shit with credguard etc. too. From davel@anvil.com Sun Mar 21 14:48:06 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 03:49:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 57c4b10c_7a9f_11d8_93b0_00304828b574_14557; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 589B034471B for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 57741db4_7a9f_11d8_8c91_00304828b574_14554; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0A83F7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A57677580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 570e76bc_7a9f_11d8_9a60_00304828b574_14551; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9188934471B for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 56506230_7a9f_11d8_9441_00304828b574_14547; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 03:49:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 398E319CD2; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:49:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C28E19C70; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:49:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A817419A75; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:48:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF99F19C83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 13:48:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id E85EB34A; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:48:31 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C01E33B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:48:31 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id SAA29745 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:48:00 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <1079808711.2282.3.camel@rea> References: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> <1079808711.2282.3.camel@rea> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1079808967.2282.7.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 18:56:07 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry, private message. Cheers, Dave. On Sat, 2004-03-20 at 18:51, Dave Lukes wrote: > Gracias for t-shirt image. > > Sorry I've been a bit incommunicado ... > > I'll try to get my shit back together next week: > I'm gonna go talk to Skea about all the shit with credguard etc. too. > > From rsc@swtch.com Sun Mar 21 14:48:08 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 13:52:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 996a900a_7af3_11d8_826d_00304828b574_19121; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E724344B6B for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 99261e02_7af3_11d8_988e_00304828b574_19118; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1FF877580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D179D7580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98dc6d48_7af3_11d8_8041_00304828b574_19115; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C466C344B6B for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 982a868c_7af3_11d8_9da1_00304828b574_19111; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 13:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4558819C4F; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:52:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B691A19B02; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:52:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D25EF19BD5; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:51:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B145A19AB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:51:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D0C024FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:51:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:51:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: The Plan 9 ports tree is now at http://swtch.com/plan9port, though the CVS repository remains at MIT. Acme is now included in the ports tree, and has been for a few weeks. Rob tracked down a bad stack overflow in libregexp, and since then it's been quite stable. I changed some constants in 9term to make it look more like a normal rio window and less like an acme window. There is a new command "rio" which is David Hogan's 9wm cleaned up to give most of the modern rio interface rather than 8.5. See src/cmd/rio/README for more. It's missing a few minor details (e.g., I would like to be able to drag window borders to resize and move windows), but for the most part it's quite convincing. Rio and 9term are not well tested and are only known to work on Linux, so they're not built by default. If you want them, cd into their directories and mk install. Bug reports appreciated. As usual see the notes linked from the main web page for more. Russ From noah.evans@cwru.edu Sun Mar 21 14:48:08 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 14:09:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f79d2f28_7af5_11d8_9340_00304828b574_21739; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60433344B8E for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f769cd2c_7af5_11d8_8f93_00304828b574_21736; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1E7FC7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D54E7580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f6f78136_7af5_11d8_9b74_00304828b574_21733; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87650344B8E for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f63250f0_7af5_11d8_987b_00304828b574_21729; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:09:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5D23519C68; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:09:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDBCF19BE9; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:09:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8342319C46; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:08:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D07819BC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:08:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUW000G0U82YM@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:07:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.59.232] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:07:14 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:07:14 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: idiff didn't compile :( Noah 9c fortune.c 9l -o o.fortune fortune.o ../../lib/libsec.a ../../lib/libfs.a ../../lib/libmux.a ../../lib/libregexp9.a ../../lib/libthread.a ../../lib/libbio.a ../../lib/lib9.a install -c o.fortune ../../bin/fortune 9c freq.c 9l -o o.freq freq.o ../../lib/libsec.a ../../lib/libfs.a ../../lib/libmux.a ../../lib/libregexp9.a ../../lib/libthread.a ../../lib/libbio.a ../../lib/lib9.a install -c o.freq ../../bin/freq 9c fsize.c 9l -o o.fsize fsize.o ../../lib/libsec.a ../../lib/libfs.a ../../lib/libmux.a ../../lib/libregexp9.a ../../lib/libthread.a ../../lib/libbio.a ../../lib/lib9.a install -c o.fsize ../../bin/fsize 9c idiff.c idiff.c:15: error: conflicting types for `opentemp' ../../include/lib9.h:459: error: previous declaration of `opentemp' mk: 9c idiff.c : exit status=exit(1) mk: for i in ... : exit status=exit(1) mk: for i in ... : exit status=exit(1) From rsc@swtch.com Sun Mar 21 14:48:08 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 14:26:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 567d5c5a_7af8_11d8_8c21_00304828b574_24822; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DE12344BAD for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 564cceaa_7af8_11d8_99d3_00304828b574_24819; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 451BB7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E82597580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 55ecb43e_7af8_11d8_9556_00304828b574_24816; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6E62344BAD for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 55347a9a_7af8_11d8_9a35_00304828b574_24812; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:26:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EAD0719C93; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:26:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1669219C46; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:26:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8950C19BE9; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:25:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97A1C199F9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:25:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05FC824FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:25:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405D2746.3000603@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports References: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> In-Reply-To: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:25:26 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Noah Evans wrote: >idiff didn't compile :( > > should work now. From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sun Mar 21 15:47:59 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 15:13:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e975d360_7afe_11d8_94a9_00304828b574_922; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF745344C24 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e9238092_7afe_11d8_8c55_00304828b574_919; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C007D7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75E487580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e8e16e96_7afe_11d8_85df_00304828b574_916; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82D6C344C24 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e8322f44_7afe_11d8_86a0_00304828b574_912; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:13:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A735A19C94; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:13:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84F9519C5B; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:13:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9389919C64; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:12:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 86D8119C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:12:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 20694 invoked by uid 991); 21 Mar 2004 06:12:53 -0000 Message-ID: <20040321061253.20693.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-reply-to: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> References: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> Comments: In-reply-to Noah Evans message dated "Sun, 21 Mar 2004 00:07:14 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 01:12:53 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Thanks Russ! On linux/x86, gcc wants LL for the uvlong constants in nan64.c. Acme fails to build (but mk doesn't stop): 9l -o o.acme acme.o addr.o buff.o cols.o disk.o ecmd.o edit.o elog.o exec.o file.o fsys.o look.o regx.o rows.o scrl.o text.o time.o util.o wind.o xfid.o ../../../lib/libcomplete.a ../../../lib/libplumb.a ../../../lib/libfs.a ../../../lib/libmux.a ../../../lib/libthread.a ../../../lib/libframe.a ../../../lib/libdraw.a ../../../lib/libbio.a ../../../lib/lib9.a -L/usr/X11R6/lib -lX11 look.o(.text+0x29): In function `plumbproc': /home/schwartz/plan9/src/cmd/acme/look.c:33: undefined reference to `plumbrecvfid' look.o(.text+0x77): In function `startplumbing': /home/schwartz/plan9/src/cmd/acme/look.c:43: undefined reference to `plumbopenfid' look.o(.text+0xaa):/home/schwartz/plan9/src/cmd/acme/look.c:50: undefined reference to `plumbopenfid' look.o(.text+0x72e): In function `look3': /home/schwartz/plan9/src/cmd/acme/look.c:159: undefined reference to `plumbsendtofid' collect2: ld returned 1 exit status mk: 9l -o o.acme ... : exit status=exit(1) In 9term (and maybe other places) it would be nicer if it wouldn't abort if the plumber isn't running. From ggm@apnic.net Sun Mar 21 17:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 16:25:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f6b03d22_7b08_11d8_9ea1_00304828b574_14925; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F1A3344CC4 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f679f71c_7b08_11d8_8246_00304828b574_14919; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0E96E7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B309A7580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f629d21e_7b08_11d8_91e0_00304828b574_14912; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF434344CC4 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f57a0938_7b08_11d8_8f98_00304828b574_14907; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:25:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 01CB519CB3; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 02:25:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6A8819BB4; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 02:25:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E002C19C87; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 02:24:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (cumin.apnic.net [202.12.29.59]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E89A819B34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 02:24:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (durian.apnic.net [202.12.29.252]) by apnic.net (8.12.8/8.12) with SMTP id i2L7Ohph011839; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:24:43 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Cc: rminnich@lanl.gov Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? Message-Id: <20040321172443.076993e8@dhcppc1> In-Reply-To: References: <237cdbb8.0403190517.1fb498c7@posting.google.com> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.9.10claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AP-Spam-Status: No, hits=-100.001 required=6 X-AP-Spam-Score: -100.001 (notspam) BAYES_44,USER_IN_WHITELIST X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.15 (www dot roaringpenguin dot com slash mimedefang) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:24:43 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:30 -0700 (MST) ron minnich wrote: >On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, Leo Caves wrote: > >> I am interested to hear opinion on what xen might offer in the Plan >> 9/inferno world-view. > >my one interest was that I could run auth, fs, and term on one laptop. > >ron Me three. and, get around non-supported h/w by using a virtual machine instance which would be a longterm port available across changing pee cee hardware. xens website claims to reveal a lot of the underlying machine speed-wise. It may depend what you compare it to. -George From plan9@kp.km.ua Mon Mar 22 00:04:46 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 22:42:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a42275c2_7b3d_11d8_884d_00304828b574_21111; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15AE7344FAC for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a3ecc7a6_7b3d_11d8_9ba8_00304828b574_21108; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 01D0C7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE0247580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a3b39666_7b3d_11d8_94c7_00304828b574_21105; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF854344FAC for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a2fcf942_7b3d_11d8_8a61_00304828b574_21101; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6F5B19CF0; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 08:42:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7789519BE8; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 08:42:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A8B9119C5A; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 08:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.46.36.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F078C19BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 08:41:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@RE-2M.kp.km.ua [195.46.36.90]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/ic) with ESMTP id i2LDfexD065034 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:41:41 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup14.kp.km.ua [195.135.202.29]) by kp.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/kp-branch) with SMTP id i2LDfbIk024475 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:41:39 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <04032115345805.00575@localhost.localdomain> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:43:39 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12 autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Russ, once again you made plan9faq.html#unix out-of-date :) P.S. Minimalism is no longer confined to Plan 9 but is=20 pervasive throughout Unix systems. Great job! kyxap From rsc@swtch.com Mon Mar 22 00:04:46 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 23:03:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8f3c8b90_7b40_11d8_9e48_00304828b574_24113; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 844EB344FDE for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8f0a8154_7b40_11d8_8619_00304828b574_24110; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 63F247580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18F1C7580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8ec79db2_7b40_11d8_879d_00304828b574_24107; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26327344FDE for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8e184a1a_7b40_11d8_90ba_00304828b574_24103; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:03:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 309C019D09; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B45E19CF9; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C485819CF6; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:02:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E165819CEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:02:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D49524FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:02:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405DA062.3060708@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports References: <4d43cc4cfdcc.4cfdcc4d43cc@cwru.edu> <20040321061253.20693.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <20040321061253.20693.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:02:10 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sigh. My automatic scripts to build the archive were getting tripped up by some CVS stupidity. If you downloaded the big tarball rather than use CVS, you didn't get rio, for instance. I've fixed that now. Russ From rsc@swtch.com Mon Mar 22 00:04:46 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 21 23:04:36 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id afec0906_7b40_11d8_99b4_00304828b574_24236; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 546CD344FE0 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id afb4e930_7b40_11d8_9245_00304828b574_24233; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3F02C7580FA; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:36 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9D947580F9 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id af79eb96_7b40_11d8_9b69_00304828b574_24230; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECA88344FE0 for ; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aec420fe_7b40_11d8_870d_00304828b574_24226; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 23:04:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9ABFB19D0A; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17C0519CFC; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:04:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE0CE19CFC; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C338219CEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10FC924FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <405DA0A1.4050204@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] xen port? References: <237cdbb8.0403190517.1fb498c7@posting.google.com> <20040321172443.076993e8@dhcppc1> In-Reply-To: <20040321172443.076993e8@dhcppc1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 09:03:13 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: George Michaelson wrote: >On Fri, 19 Mar 2004 07:52:30 -0700 (MST) ron minnich wrote: > > > >>On Fri, 19 Mar 2004, Leo Caves wrote: >> >> >> >>>I am interested to hear opinion on what xen might offer in the Plan >>>9/inferno world-view. >>> >>> >>my one interest was that I could run auth, fs, and term on one laptop. >> >>ron >> >> > >Me three. and, get around non-supported h/w by using a virtual machine instance >which would be a longterm port available across changing pee cee hardware. > > it all depends on their driver support. they do ether but punt on video. since ethernet drivers are becoming more and more trivial while video is the real stumbling block, it's not clear that xen is so useful. as for running auth server, fs, and terminal on one laptop, just do it natively -- you don't need three separate kernels anyway, as long as fs == fossil. russ From noah.evans@cwru.edu Mon Mar 22 10:03:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 00:59:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4ae5082_7b50_11d8_870e_00304828b574_15080; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 085BF3450D3 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c469fc52_7b50_11d8_9599_00304828b574_15074; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id DD5797580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 880DC7580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4213bfc_7b50_11d8_83ee_00304828b574_15067; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92F6D3450D3 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c370ac56_7b50_11d8_9ce7_00304828b574_15063; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 00:59:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD96419D23; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:59:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 898F119CFC; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:59:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 637BC19CFC; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:58:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DB2D19BB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUX00MB9OBSTL@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:57:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.59.232] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:57:28 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <4e0a564e0d5e.4e0d5e4e0a56@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 10:57:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: :) We love you anyway. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: Russ Cox Date: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:02 am Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports > Sigh. My automatic scripts to build the archive were > getting tripped up by some CVS stupidity. > > If you downloaded the big tarball rather than use CVS, > you didn't get rio, for instance. I've fixed that now. > > Russ > > From rog@vitanuova.com Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 05:43:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 735b7d22_7b78_11d8_9e52_00304828b574_3222; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48004345313 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 72fd0be8_7b78_11d8_960a_00304828b574_3219; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 143497580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76C367580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7278a95c_7b78_11d8_8d95_00304828b574_3216; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE6D4345313 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 717c8a5a_7b78_11d8_8c81_00304828b574_3212; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:43:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90E2019D5F; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:43:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0916F19D4F; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:43:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DA8619D44; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:42:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 912DC19D3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:42:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ykttiwvdkmfsuzrinyxxkxscna" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:47:46 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ykttiwvdkmfsuzrinyxxkxscna Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit for programs that require read-write access to a namespace, requirements are different, as charles points out. however, most tools do not write to the namespace. for me, one of plan 9's fundamental strengths is that while a tool is often written to access a predefined portion of the namespace, the actual namespace that it sees can be arranged at will for the tool in question. thus if a program accesses files in directory /d, i think it's reasonable to expect that if i bind another directory, say /b, before /d, i can expect the program to treat /d exactly as if i had really replaced the files therein with files from /b. the program shouldn't have to *care* whether it's dealing with a union directory or not - that should be solely the concern of whoever's arranging the namespace. i think the difference between: bind /dev/null /bin/ls and mkdir /tmp/x > /tmp/x/ls bind /dev/null /tmp/x/ls bind -b /tmp/x /bin should be invisible, particularly to shell scripts, which have no concept of sequentially reading a directory, and which are often short and trivial, but for which the above invariants are still important. russ: > if a file is covered up, it should be completely hidden. > it turns out that actually implementing this is quite hard, i.e. the visibility of mutiple names in a directory is an implementation issue. it's something that's easily solved at user level (no problems with arbitrary buffering there, and programs can eliminate duplicates in their own way if they like as, for example, du(1), mk(1), cron(1) listen(1) do). i think it should be made as easy as possible to write programs that behave in a namespace-agnostic way. i think that if a version of dirreadall was available that eliminated duplicates, most (all?) programs would wish to use it. i think it's particularly silly that wc */*.[ch] should give me erroneous results in a union directory, and that echo /bin/ape/* should be different from echo /bin/ape*/* when there's only one accessible directory starting "ape" in /bin, and the shell's sorting the globbed output anyway. i think eliminating duplicates in two core places would break nothing, but make parts of the system work more smoothly together. it's one less thing to think about. geoff points out many programs that use dirread. a random inspection turns up many programs that already do their own elimination of duplicates (in different ways), and others that behave badly in the face of duplicate directory entries (e.g. diff). this seems to me to point towards a systematic problem, which should be solved centrally. towards this end, i've attached a stable sort routine, along the same lines as qsort(2), which can optionally eliminate duplicates. i've tested it to a degree, but not greatly; i haven't done any performance analysis of it, but i doubt that's a limiting factor in this case. i envisage ls(1) being changed to use this routine (with an option to show/suppress duplicate entries), and perhaps a version of dirreadall that sorts the directory entries alphabetically and eliminates duplicates, to make it easy to replace it in existing programs. PS it's interesting to note that ls(1) does make some sort of an effort to do a stable sort: if(i == 0) i = (a #include int mergesort1(int uniq, char *a, int r, int width, int (*compare)(void*, void*), char *b) { int m, n0, n1, i, j, k, e, c; if(r <= width) return r; m = ((r/width-1)/2 + 1) * width; n0 = mergesort1(uniq, a, m, width, compare, b); n1 = mergesort1(uniq, a+m, r-m, width, compare, b); memcpy(b, a, n0); memcpy(b+n0, a+m, n1); e = n0+n1; i = 0; j = n0; k = 0; for(; i < n0 && j < e; k += width){ c = (*compare)(b+i, b+j); if(c > 0){ memcpy(a+k, b+j, width); j += width; }else{ memcpy(a+k, b+i, width); i += width; if(c == 0 && uniq) j += width; } } if(i < n0){ memcpy(a+k, b+i, n0-i); k += n0-i; }else if(j < e){ memcpy(a+k, b+j, e-j); k += e-j; } return k; } int mergesort(int uniq, void *a, long n, long width, int (*compare)(void*, void*)) { void *b; n *= width; b = malloc(n); if(b == nil) return -1; n = mergesort1(uniq, a, n, width, compare, b); free(b); return n / width; } --upas-ykttiwvdkmfsuzrinyxxkxscna-- From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 05:59:12 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9b09f5ea_7b7a_11d8_85cd_00304828b574_9589; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12132345325 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9acbbd02_7b7a_11d8_91f1_00304828b574_9583; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:12 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7E5087580F9; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:11 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0FDE758108 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:08 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98f4f322_7b7a_11d8_999b_00304828b574_9565; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:59:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DA0D345327 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:54:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f76d0aee_7b79_11d8_87f0_00304828b574_7242; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:54:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B583019D3A; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:54:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BE5719D25; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:54:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0DDC19D3A; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:53:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A490719CD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:53:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.196.203]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <320488-1832>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:52:11 -0500 Message-ID: <025701c40f86$3053a940$cbc47d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 21:50:42 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: presto: ls == ls * QED From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 06:04:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 61b17222_7b7b_11d8_81f9_00304828b574_10444; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65026345334 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 617b596c_7b7b_11d8_857b_00304828b574_10441; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1A6267580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B85EA7580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6110c520_7b7b_11d8_9d31_00304828b574_10438; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BADB4345334 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6060ddea_7b7b_11d8_8397_00304828b574_10434; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:04:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6999019D25; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:04:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F104619D4F; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:04:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1688119D56; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:03:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFB1019D3E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:03:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2LL3Zog017187 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:03:35 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2LL3ZqN017184 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:03:35 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:03:35 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I downloaded and tried some of the things -- very nice, thanks! The rio wm has kept the original 8.5 feel though, so I backported my changes to 9wm into it to make it feel like rio does on window creation and movement. Here's what the changes do: - the user is prompted to swipe a window whenever a new one is created (via the menu's New option or any other way). clicking a mouse button will cancel the swipe and open the window with whatever default size it has. - moving a window (with the menu's Move option) does not reposition the mouse at the top right corner of a window - the menu font is changed to lucidasanstypewriter-12 -- it looks just like the default installation font and is good for laptops and larger monitors - ignore GraphicsExpose events -- makes rio much quieter... at some point i should think about adding support for resizing windows by dragging the borders.. tell me if you want me to send them, they're about 30 lines altogether, 4 files... andrey From noah.evans@cwru.edu Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 06:48:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 874d7430_7b81_11d8_8bc5_00304828b574_16750; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DB7B3453BD for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 871af35c_7b81_11d8_9127_00304828b574_16747; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 31A8D7580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8E1C7580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 86a910f2_7b81_11d8_90e8_00304828b574_16744; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4C6D3453BD for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 85f7603c_7b81_11d8_9a42_00304828b574_16740; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:48:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A659819D53; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB36D19C15; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:48:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6C7319D1F; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:47:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83B6B19D43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:47:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HUY018QZ4GNOS@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:45:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.59.232] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:45:59 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <4ffd3d501e1a.501e1a4ffd3d@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:45:59 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I like the improvements for the most part. But IMO the window placement is better as it is now until there's something that works like the window command. Personally I really don't open that many windows after I start initially, but I have a setup with a couple of windows that I like to position exactly right using geometry commands in X. When 9wm-1.2 opens I have to left click to make all of the programs in my .xinitrc position themselves correctly. In Russ's version they pop up automatically right where I want them. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: andrey mirtchovski Date: Sunday, March 21, 2004 4:03 pm Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports > I downloaded and tried some of the things -- very nice, thanks! > > The rio wm has kept the original 8.5 feel though, so I backported > my changes > to 9wm into it to make it feel like rio does on window creation and > movement. Here's what the changes do: > > - the user is prompted to swipe a window whenever a new one is > created (via the menu's New option or any other way). clicking > a mouse button > will cancel the swipe and open the window with whatever > default size > it has. > > - moving a window (with the menu's Move option) does not > reposition the > mouse at the top right corner of a window > > - the menu font is changed to lucidasanstypewriter-12 -- it > looks just > like the default installation font and is good for laptops > and larger > monitors > > - ignore GraphicsExpose events -- makes rio much quieter... > > at some point i should think about adding support for resizing > windows by > dragging the borders.. > > tell me if you want me to send them, they're about 30 lines > altogether, 4 > files... > > andrey > > From rminnich@lanl.gov Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 06:54:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5dd28aa4_7b82_11d8_89af_00304828b574_17652; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 582033453CD for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5d906552_7b82_11d8_85a0_00304828b574_17649; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 322E67580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D80537580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5d4e8b64_7b82_11d8_9141_00304828b574_17646; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D05EC3453CD for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c923f86_7b82_11d8_9ea0_00304828b574_17642; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 164E219D6E; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:54:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA2B619C15; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:54:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B9DF19D5C; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:53:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 412AB19C15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 16:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2LLrKjt020931 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:53:21 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2LLrKAu017489 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:53:20 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2LLrKfQ027252 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:53:20 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 14:53:19 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: assume lsfilter takes a stream of plan 9 stat structs and turns them into an 'ls'-like listing bind -b /usr/rminnich/bin /bin lsfilter; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b6eb362_7b84_11d8_8c83_00304828b574_19655; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5DD2E7580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078A97580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b24b140_7b84_11d8_8687_00304828b574_19652; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13DA83453FA for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0a748b3a_7b84_11d8_818b_00304828b574_19648; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:06:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A678B19D73; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BAEA19A9D; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:06:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8CA4119B54; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:05:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3864319A9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:05:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0aba8ee306d0a7aef7d20244bd119a7b@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 22:05:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>I also have to wonder about the perceived inconsistent behavior of union >>directories and the hacks that people keep developing (BSD) or proposing >>(this list) to deal with those inconsistencies. Could this imply that my i think it's only a problem when one expects them to do too much: recursive combination of two directories is an example (yet that's usually what's needed in general for versioning, i think). they are an effective way of doing what they usually do now: build up directories of services and other resources from many sources, local and remote, including substituting one for another. the naming seems consistent to me. if a name appears in a directory, i can use that name. whether it appears once or twice, doesn't matter. the arguments seem to focus on whether with a change here or there they could be got to do a little more work (eg, by allowing * to iterate exactly once over all services, protocols, say). i don't think it's that essential in practice. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Mon Mar 22 10:03:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 07:22:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 49d28a28_7b86_11d8_8af6_00304828b574_26195; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C678934541D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 499a090a_7b86_11d8_87ff_00304828b574_26190; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B36997580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89E5E758105 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 47aabba8_7b86_11d8_8201_00304828b574_26169; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B014B34541D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:16:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6ce27f38_7b85_11d8_93d4_00304828b574_23286; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:16:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1BDD019D71; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:16:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 107E219D1F; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:16:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED85419D64; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:15:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFA8A19D1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 17:15:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <4ffd3d501e1a.501e1a4ffd3d@cwru.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2004 15:15:32 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I like the improvements for the most part. > > But IMO the window placement is better as it is now until there's something that works like the window command. > > Personally I really don't open that many windows after I start initially, but I have a setup with a couple of windows that I like to position exactly right using geometry commands in X. When 9wm-1.2 opens I have to left click to make all of the programs in my .xinitrc position themselves correctly. > > In Russ's version they pop up automatically right where I want them. > > Noah you're right. Russ also wants the current behaviour with regards to opening windows to be kept untouched (i.e. the create-and-sweep patch won't be applied). i've sent a one-line diff to swipe on create only for xterms and 9terms -- if you open a terminal it prompts you to sweep, all other programs just open windows without user interaction. i'm convinced that's the right way to go now too :) andrey From enache@rdslink.ro Mon Mar 22 10:03:45 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 08:47:09 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1150b416_7b92_11d8_9ed7_00304828b574_10946; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02D2234549E for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 111e999a_7b92_11d8_8d2f_00304828b574_10940; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:09 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 37DA87580F9; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:08 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4816F75810D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0d1dd720_7b92_11d8_8e92_00304828b574_10856; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:47:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48D31345519 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:44:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b85bf6fe_7b91_11d8_85b2_00304828b574_9617; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:44:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB12019D80; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 18:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DA0719D74; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 18:44:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1209F19D4C; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 18:43:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.rdslink.ro (mail.rdslink.ro [193.231.236.20]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C0FB19D5D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 18:43:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24376 invoked from network); 21 Mar 2004 23:43:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO localhost.localdomain) (81.196.254.19) by mail.rdslink.ro with SMTP; 21 Mar 2004 23:43:21 -0000 From: Enache Adrian To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Message-ID: <20040321232928.GA1197@ratsnest.hole> Mail-Followup-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu References: <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 01:29:28 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, Mar 21, 2004 a.d., ron minnich wrote: > should these yield the same results? If you don't care, then the libc.a > approach is fine. If you do want the same results, I think you may be > stuck doing the uniqueness tricks in the kernel a la BSD, which to me > anyway is unattractive. I'm afraid the uniqueness tricks are done in library/userland in BSD. (the McKusick paper referred to in lexnames.html already tells it). Just try to read a "-o union" mounted directory with open/getdirentries. The hack is in libc/gen/opendir.c. Quoting from there: /* * The strategy here is to read all the directory * entries into a buffer, sort the buffer, and * remove duplicate entries by setting the inode * number to zero. */ Only bloating the kernel with a sort/uniq filter could be worse than that. Regards, Adi From boyd@insultant.net Mon Mar 22 14:09:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 10:34:37 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 147a45f8_7ba1_11d8_9d91_00304828b574_2633; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCC8234562D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1448fe3a_7ba1_11d8_9bfd_00304828b574_2630; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 77C057580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 290137580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13eca04a_7ba1_11d8_83cd_00304828b574_2625; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33F0C34562D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 133c111c_7ba1_11d8_93b2_00304828b574_2621; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:34:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEFF619BD0; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:34:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E320019BD0; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:34:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10EB919BD0; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:33:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA8E619BAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:33:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.196.203]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3638621-2257>; Sun, 21 Mar 2004 20:32:32 -0500 Message-ID: <02b801c40fad$4ab018b0$cbc47d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> <20040321232928.GA1197@ratsnest.hole> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 02:30:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The hack is in libc/gen/opendir.c. Quoting from there: > /* > * The strategy here is to read all the directory > * entries into a buffer, sort the buffer, and > * remove duplicate entries by setting the inode > * number to zero. > */ > Only bloating the kernel with a sort/uniq filter could be worse than that. pure bsd. i can't see the point in adding more code to handle end cases. large N% of the time it's not a problem, so Leave It Alone: http://www.lyricsdepot.com/living-colour/leave-it-alone.html From philippe.anel@noos.fr Mon Mar 22 18:10:33 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 17:13:13 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c3ac913e_7bd8_11d8_9361_00304828b574_3166; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7DE9345A03 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c3522cf8_7bd8_11d8_8735_00304828b574_3163; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:12 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 6D2777580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:12 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F8CF7580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c2e3bd9a_7bd8_11d8_95dd_00304828b574_3153; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14F0D345A03 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c234ff76_7bd8_11d8_88a5_00304828b574_3149; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:13:11 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB6C819CB1; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 02:51:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1778B19C5A; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 02:51:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6194F19C5A; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 02:50:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (nan-smtp-17.noos.net [212.198.2.117]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA0F19C5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 02:50:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 8193 invoked by uid 0); 22 Mar 2004 07:50:26 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ntmail.noos.fr) ([195.132.21.218]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.117 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; 22 Mar 2004 07:50:26 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040322085023.0448b2d0@pop.noos.fr> X-Sender: philippe.anel@pop.noos.fr X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Philippe Anel Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [9fans] ATI Radeon Driver. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:52:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Dear 9fans, I've just finished to modify the ATI Radeon sources. Indeed, I've merged the previous code with the one provided by Latchesar Ionkov [LCD Support] and now, both the kernel part and the aux/vga part only trust the pciid list recorded into /lib/vgadb (ie there is no need to update/compile the driver sources to add a supported Radeon chipset). I also added the copyright notice from the Xll source, which helped me write this driver. Can this driver be included in the distribution? http://mapage.noos.fr/philippe.anel/radeon.tbz Regards, Philippe. Ps: It works with my Radeon 8500, could the radeon owners test this driver and report if it works (with the pciid). From saw@online.de Mon Mar 22 20:50:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 19:27:05 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 774d3eca_7beb_11d8_9622_00304828b574_32130; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB429345B25 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 76bbfdc0_7beb_11d8_8b6e_00304828b574_32123; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:04 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4721F758100; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:03 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFC527580FC for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7507a90c_7beb_11d8_9590_00304828b574_32061; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6AD5345B25 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:24:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2214d4c2_7beb_11d8_9a0e_00304828b574_30983; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:24:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1F83219B98; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:24:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F155A19D54; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:24:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AEA2719A99; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E4E119A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5MMg-0007I1-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:09:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Sascha Wildner Message-ID: Organization: Yoyodyne Natural Born Configurators Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:07:56 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: > i have added some generic merchandise at: > > http://www.cafeshops.com/lon9con > Is Glenda still black on the red and blue jerseys? Sascha -- http://yoyodyne.ath.cx From liusemail@tom.com Mon Mar 22 20:50:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 19:27:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8de5d5b6_7beb_11d8_9dc0_00304828b574_32338; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20FFE345B22 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8d0b8a0a_7beb_11d8_8ceb_00304828b574_32330; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 19AC9758100; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A577580FC for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8afb77e8_7beb_11d8_9df3_00304828b574_32315; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:27:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A70E0345B22 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2cb1a748_7beb_11d8_8785_00304828b574_31163; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:01 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D389419D7F; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:24:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D25E19D80; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:24:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6AA7919D54; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A386B19A99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5MMg-0007Hu-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:09:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "liusemail@tom.com" Message-ID: <52802546.0403191819.72e4f18@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [9fans] What is the window system of plan9? Can anyone give me some design document of it to me? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:07:44 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.4 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFCI_DSN autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello, everyone. I am a new man of plan9, I am very interest in it's window system. Can anyone tell me that what is the window system of plan9. And can anyone give me some documents about how it design? Thanks. From DAGwyn@null.net Mon Mar 22 20:50:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 19:28:37 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae18a0de_7beb_11d8_9673_00304828b574_32765; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD534345B27 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ad9d5c1c_7beb_11d8_83e0_00304828b574_32756; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C3BBA7580FD; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF8AC7580FF for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac819af0_7beb_11d8_8f86_00304828b574_32743; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:28:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B443A345B27 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3cd1cb26_7beb_11d8_802f_00304828b574_31363; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:28 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 86AD719D6F; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:25:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F93819D7D; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:25:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E37A519D42; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 761D819D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5MNt-0007KC-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:10:17 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <240892daccaec2131635fbd4917479de@hamnavoe.com>, <393a7f63e7c4973e661988f1009f5d7a@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:09:37 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > the program shouldn't have to *care* whether it's dealing with a union > directory or not - that should be solely the concern of whoever's > arranging the namespace. Absolutely. However, I don't mind there being some obscure way to examine what is mounted in more detail, so long as it is not the facility usually used by apps. (Consider Unix treatment of symbolic links; you usually want to follow them but not always, thus lstat(2) vs. stat(2).) From kruhft@hotmail.com Mon Mar 22 20:50:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 19:29:28 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cc2ed2dc_7beb_11d8_89b6_00304828b574_723; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B8CC345B29 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb9bc0fa_7beb_11d8_9e23_00304828b574_714; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:27 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9E7E97580FC; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:26 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F98F7580FA for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb2634de_7beb_11d8_90c4_00304828b574_710; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:29:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86DCD345B29 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c34bb64_7beb_11d8_9382_00304828b574_31510; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:25:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C641D19D8B; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:25:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CCFF19D82; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:25:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0EBE919D6C; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9170B19A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:23:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5MMg-0007I7-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:09:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Burton Samograd Message-ID: <42a7445f.0403202145.5cbcbf2a@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [9fans] Installation problem during mountdist Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:08:07 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, My plan9 installation is going smoothly up until I get to the mountdist task, where I keep getting the following error after selecting the 'storage media' that the distribution disk is contained on: # /dev/sdD1/fs is a partition I created during the installation # process and I have also tried on a linux ext2fs and on a=20 # burned cd iso Distribution disk [no default]: /dev/sdD1/fs=20 ...=20 # I've already browsed on a number of occasions and still get the same problem Location of archives [browse]: /dist ...=20 # I always get this error message here no matter what media i use Preparing menu...mount: mount /n/dist: I/O read error mount: mount /n/dist: I/O read error =20 # ...which then takes me back to the mountdist option. =20 I thought it might be a hardware problem with the older disk I was using, but I got the same error with a different hard disk *and* when I try to select the cd that I burned plan9.iso onto as well. After trying 3 different media, I'm starting to think that this might be a software problem, so I thought I would ask the experts. Anybody have any advice or wisdom to help me solve this problem? Replies by email are appreciated since I only have usenet acess through google, and I don't check too frequently. --=20 Burton Samograd=20 kruhft .@. hotmail From forsyth@terzarima.net Mon Mar 22 20:50:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 19:50:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4cd8c92_7bee_11d8_914b_00304828b574_8505; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C71E4345B64 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4979c36_7bee_11d8_9a29_00304828b574_8498; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id ACB787580FB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 592FD7580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c452a20c_7bee_11d8_9026_00304828b574_8492; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E827345B6D for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c39ed808_7bee_11d8_958c_00304828b574_8463; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:50:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F27D19D8E; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:50:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89E2519D85; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:50:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E62B619CF4; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:49:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 817CB19D7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 05:49:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <877cd28f100e43ead94de82da6b4f49b@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:49:39 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>facility usually used by apps. (Consider Unix treatment of symbolic >>links; you usually want to follow them but not always, thus lstat(2) vs. >>stat(2).) it's a good example of how that approach breaks down: there isn't any way to tell from the outside how any given application will deal with symbolic links. for instance, some versions of ls follow them (unless given -L), others do not, following different reasonable rationales. if i tar up a tree, am i interested in following the links (ie, i want the tree's contents) or recording them (ie, i want the tree's structure)? it might depend on the link! fortunately tar has lots of options, but the default is to copy the structure (-h follows all symbolic links). generally, the approach seems to be for directory-traversing programs and programs such as mv do not follow the links, but programs that open files naturally follow the links. so cp follows the links. unless it's cp -R! then there are three options -H, -L, and -P to (attempt to) control handling of symbolic links, distinguishing between names on the command line that happen to be links, and names in the structure that are links. in some ways, it's rather worse with symbolic links. From nemo@lsub.org Mon Mar 22 20:50:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 20:18:35 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a91ce318_7bf2_11d8_968b_00304828b574_14563; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D050345B9E for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a8ec4438_7bf2_11d8_88e9_00304828b574_14560; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3B7C47580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9DB27580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a8a1b8f0_7bf2_11d8_9bac_00304828b574_14557; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E63E9345B9E for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a7f21878_7bf2_11d8_9a8b_00304828b574_14553; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:18:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6F5FB19D84; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:18:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30B6C19CB4; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:18:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A77C119995; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:17:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2901F19D09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:17:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <37495865411229f6d3bf5edee7becfac@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Fco.J.Ballesteros MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] usb keyboard (usbhid) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 12:17:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This program changed one more time. I hope it's the last time it happens. I changed it to send scan codes from the usb keyboard to the kernel. After considering all the alternatives, the more simple and clean way was to remove all keymap processing from usbhid and let the kernel do that (now that the std one does it). Thus, the usbhid thing stands now as follows: - the usr-level program handles usb mouse/kbd. - it feeds mouse / keyboard events through /dev files - a pc/devkbdin.c provides /dev/kbdin for that purpose - keymap, Latin composition, etc. are all handled by the kernel using devkbmap. I have pushed the changes to /n/sources/nemo. hth From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 00:35:17 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 21:04:59 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 244353d2_7bf9_11d8_8749_00304828b574_28021; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3D52345BDE for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23f816ce_7bf9_11d8_9c43_00304828b574_28015; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:58 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7226575810B; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46B7F7580FA for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2016a890_7bf9_11d8_81d4_00304828b574_27941; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:04:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4C09345BEA for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:56:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fa6c82fa_7bf7_11d8_8d0f_00304828b574_23702; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:56:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B507219D7D; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:56:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1D2F19C7A; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:56:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D35919C8D; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:55:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB7FE19AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:55:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <310412-31533>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 06:54:37 -0500 Message-ID: <005a01c41004$2bb6a440$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 12:52:30 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is Glenda still black on the red and blue jerseys? glenda is white. rob asked me to take off the black glenda off the back of the jerseys. i was never too convinced about it either, so i removed it. white glenda == white background. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 00:35:17 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 21:19:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 32a9b19e_7bfb_11d8_931b_00304828b574_30777; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C8F7345C31 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3277baae_7bfb_11d8_912c_00304828b574_30774; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EEAE67580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4A627580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 32343040_7bfb_11d8_8d82_00304828b574_30771; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4A03345C31 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 317ce296_7bfb_11d8_8d12_00304828b574_30767; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:19:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6524D19D7E; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:19:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0010719C8D; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:19:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 450CE19D7E; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5A9D19C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:18:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <310920-22298>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:17:26 -0500 Message-ID: <00a001c41007$5b94a420$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <877cd28f100e43ead94de82da6b4f49b@terzarima.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:15:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it's a good example of how that approach breaks down: > there isn't any way to tell from the outside how any given application > will deal with symbolic links. for instance, > some versions of ls follow them (unless given -L), others do not, > following different reasonable rationales. symlinks really mess things up. i think the only time i use them is to point at the current version of the file or directory and they only ever link to a 'file' in the same directory. the (revolting) output of ls make it very obvious what the link points too. i could use hard links, but sorting through inums is no fun. a case in point is the lunix sam Make.* files. i symlink the right one(s) to Makefile. i think it's a clean approach, but i don't symlinks because they add far too much complexity, another system call, more bits and in practice they are grossly abused. From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 23 00:35:18 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 22:00:58 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f64e2404_7c00_11d8_8352_00304828b574_5854; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5DEB345C92 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f6188b82_7c00_11d8_8b76_00304828b574_5851; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B2EF37580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:57 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69CD47580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f5df002e_7c00_11d8_99b3_00304828b574_5848; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77551345C92 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f52fe954_7c00_11d8_8a0f_00304828b574_5844; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:00:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E90819D62; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D74119C8D; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 08:00:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D72119CAD; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:59:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F07219AF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:59:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] What is the window system of plan9? Can anyone give me some design document of it to me? In-Reply-To: <52802546.0403191819.72e4f18@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:01:41 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable http://plan9.bell-labs.com/sys/doc/ The one titled 8=C2=BD, the Plan 9 Window System http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/1/rio http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/man2html/4/rio m From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 23 00:35:18 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 22 23:19:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fbadac52_7c0b_11d8_89cb_00304828b574_25230; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DDF9345D32 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fb7c99f0_7c0b_11d8_8fab_00304828b574_25227; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2F08C7580FA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D10027580F9 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fb35fbda_7c0b_11d8_8c33_00304828b574_25224; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE1AF345D32 for ; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fa86be40_7c0b_11d8_94d6_00304828b574_25219; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:19:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 509E019D6C; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:19:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9761919D54; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:19:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AD0A719D2E; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:18:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62C5F19C7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:18:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4f476d8475c64e75d02f55e65c8f843d@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Installation problem during mountdist From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <42a7445f.0403202145.5cbcbf2a@posting.google.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:18:05 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: when installing from a cd (say /dev/sdC1 or /dev/sdD0, it'll tell you which one it is at the beginning): > Distribution disk [no default]: /dev/sdD1/fs give the data partition of the cd rom here (it should list them all beforehand so you can see which device has it): /dev/sdD0/data or /dev/sdC1/data, whichever is the cdrom. > ... > # I've already browsed on a number of occasions and still get the same > problem Location of archives [browse]: /dist if installing from cdrom simply hit ^D -- it will pick it up from the root of the data partition. andrey From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 23 00:35:18 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 00:22:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ca7aca30_7c14_11d8_8781_00304828b574_10556; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA8D6345D71 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c8e2ba2a_7c14_11d8_8d15_00304828b574_10548; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 42D857580FF; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4958C758106 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c7ef7766_7c14_11d8_90d0_00304828b574_10541; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7856345DEB for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c47425be_7c14_11d8_9f0a_00304828b574_10490; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:22:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A317D19D70; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:22:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 437CC19D54; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:22:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BE73819C76; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:21:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2528E19AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:21:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2MFKt1b027728 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:20:55 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2MFKtac027727 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:20:55 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403221520.i2MFKtac027727@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] wiki's what's new? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:20:55 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: what's_new/ is created with a script, isn't it? can the script be made available? From plan9@kp.km.ua Tue Mar 23 00:35:18 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 00:24:36 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 072cbe7a_7c15_11d8_9c3c_00304828b574_11169; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08AF5345DED for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 06f5550c_7c15_11d8_8f4b_00304828b574_11166; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E716F7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D5117580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 06b9ab42_7c15_11d8_83f9_00304828b574_11163; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A51E3345DED for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 06071d6a_7c15_11d8_884f_00304828b574_11159; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:24:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDA4919D73; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:24:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE6B019CF3; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:24:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 028F219D54; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:23:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.46.36.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2325D19AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:23:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@RE-2M.kp.km.ua [195.46.36.90]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/ic) with ESMTP id i2MFNFKx061346 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:23:19 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup10.kp.km.ua [195.135.202.25]) by kp.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/kp-branch) with SMTP id i2MFNDRg066682 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:23:13 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] What is the window system of plan9? Can anyone give me some design document of it to me? X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <04032217203800.00526@localhost.localdomain> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:25:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=2.2 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12, NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ** Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable http://204.178.31.2/who/rob/lec5.pdf kyxap From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 23 08:20:21 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 01:26:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b920d58c_7c1d_11d8_9f84_00304828b574_28523; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E5C1345E9A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b8c41b08_7c1d_11d8_8654_00304828b574_28520; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2C7477580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78D3D7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b84613ca_7c1d_11d8_8c34_00304828b574_28517; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3C9D345E9A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b738f4ca_7c1d_11d8_9393_00304828b574_28512; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:26:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 407A819B16; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:26:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B612719D6C; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:26:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3047519B16; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:25:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05A4219D5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:25:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6fba570549e5f5817a701cbc58695f4f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] wiki's what's new? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <200403221520.i2MFKtac027727@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vketxvobzxxuzzbtoxantpabbq" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:25:14 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vketxvobzxxuzzbtoxantpabbq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > what's_new/ is created with a script, isn't it? can the script be made available? attached. the script was heavily modified by rog, who made it much leaner and faster. andrey --upas-vketxvobzxxuzzbtoxantpabbq Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=wikicheck Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #!/bin/rc rfork n # plan9.bell-labs is EST cp /adm/timezone/US_Eastern /env/timezone page='what''s_new' # get wiki connection test -e /srv/wiki || srv 'net!plan9.bell-labs.com!wiki' wiki || exit mount -c /srv/wiki /mnt/wiki cd /mnt/wiki lastupdate=`{sed '/^D/q' < /mnt/wiki/$page/current | sed -n 's,^D,,p'} echo last update: `{date $lastupdate} { echo 'What''s New' echo D$lastupdate echo Amirtchov@ucalgary echo Cwiki update script echo echo Recently changed wiki pages: echo ls -ltQ */current | awk '{printf("* %s %s %s [%s\n", $7, $8, $9, $10)}' | sed 's:/current$:]:' # commit echo -n } > /mnt/wiki/new rm /srv/wiki --upas-vketxvobzxxuzzbtoxantpabbq-- From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 23 08:20:21 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 01:29:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1fa14e4a_7c1e_11d8_941a_00304828b574_29045; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86C83345EA3 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1f6c7c7e_7c1e_11d8_9bb7_00304828b574_29042; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 70A6C7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C3E87580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1f33eb70_7c1e_11d8_8ccc_00304828b574_29039; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B425345EA3 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1e85e21e_7c1e_11d8_8881_00304828b574_29035; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:29:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 64EB619B16; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:29:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DDDF619D5C; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:29:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 93A5F19D6C; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:28:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C33019B16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:28:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8e24a5cd0f38619a1d000b52787f827e@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] What is the window system of plan9? Can anyone give me some design document of it to me? In-Reply-To: <04032217203800.00526@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 16:30:48 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > http://204.178.31.2/who/rob/lec5.pdf is it me or does that seem truncated, I get 19 pages and it ends somewhat abruptly m From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 23 08:20:21 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 01:33:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b3f02f26_7c1e_11d8_8ed9_00304828b574_29651; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E4EF345EAC for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b3bd914c_7c1e_11d8_8793_00304828b574_29648; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 429447580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E41F87580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b378a212_7c1e_11d8_9f42_00304828b574_29645; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2F96345EAC for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b2a27ca0_7c1e_11d8_8131_00304828b574_29641; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:33:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B47F219E74; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:33:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21A2C19DA4; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:32:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D9C0C19D7F; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:31:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B0DD19D6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:31:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2MGVgCi025023 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:31:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2MGUgxC022488 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:31:42 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2MGUf511738 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:30:41 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403221630.i2MGUf511738@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 20 Mar 2004 23:51:47 -0500." <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com> References: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:30:41 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Acme is now included in the ports tree, and has been > for a few weeks. Rob tracked down a bad stack overflow > in libregexp, and since then it's been quite stable. Tried building all (esp. acme) on SunOS 5.8. Build works best with gcc. Anybody else trying the stuff on SunOS 5.8? Got a number of warnings, and some 'fatal' problems: no futimesat for lib9/dirfwstat.c (could not find futimes at all) no TIOCGWINSZ for cmd/mc.c (needs Unfortuntely I'm still running 8-bit depth. Running acme on 8-bit depth only works after commenting out in libdraw/x11-init.c the XMatchVisualInfo tests for 16, 15, 24 bits. After that, acme runs on 8-bit. However, resizing causes segfault. I see what happens but don't see how to fix it. in the getwindow (or before?) (Image) row.tag.fr.b gets freed, I guess, because after the mallocz in getimage0 (from getwindow from acme.c) its is zeroed (id field incremented), with resulting segfault when row.tag.fr.b->display is accessed in frinit. Commenting out in libdraw/alloc.c in freeimage: free(i); makes that it no longer segfaults, but then when I resize to make the window larger, the additional space is not used by the text already in the window, that resizes in the old size. When I Delcol and the Newcol the rightmost column the stuff in the new column does use the whole availabe size. If more info is needed to track this down, I'm happy to help. Axel. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Tue Mar 23 08:20:21 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 01:35:34 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f10a977a_7c1e_11d8_8d1e_00304828b574_29987; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF00B345EB3 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0d5be42_7c1e_11d8_8bc8_00304828b574_29984; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B93517580FB; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78A4C7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f09a0186_7c1e_11d8_92f6_00304828b574_29978; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82269345EB3 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id efe87b6e_7c1e_11d8_8f51_00304828b574_29967; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:35:32 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 588F319DBB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:35:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA3E119D88; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:35:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFAE719DAB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:34:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A3F419D7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 11:34:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] wiki's what's new? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <6fba570549e5f5817a701cbc58695f4f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 09:34:17 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > attached. > that should've been 'rfork en' :)... From dfawcus@cisco.com Tue Mar 23 08:20:21 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 03:24:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 365306a0_7c2e_11d8_89a7_00304828b574_22674; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 936F3346013 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3622aba4_7c2e_11d8_804e_00304828b574_22671; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 733BD7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A38A7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 35e0eff2_7c2e_11d8_8c99_00304828b574_22668; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37BE7346014 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3531dbb6_7c2e_11d8_96b1_00304828b574_22657; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:24:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7191619DA0; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:24:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCB4E19D93; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:24:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FEDC19B82; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:23:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-iport-1.cisco.com (sj-iport-1-in.cisco.com [171.71.176.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 288CE19D8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:23:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from edi-view2.cisco.com (edi-view2.cisco.com [144.254.112.71]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2MINAaD004087 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 10:23:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (dfawcus@localhost) by edi-view2.cisco.com (8.11.2/CISCO.WS.1.2) id i2MIN9F18535 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:23:09 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c Message-ID: <20040322182308.C21329@edi-view2.cisco.com> References: <877cd28f100e43ead94de82da6b4f49b@terzarima.net> <00a001c41007$5b94a420$6d4a7d50@SOMA> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <00a001c41007$5b94a420$6d4a7d50@SOMA>; from boyd@insultant.net on Mon, Mar 22, 2004 at 01:15:19PM +0100 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:23:09 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Mon, Mar 22, 2004 at 01:15:19PM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > > a case in point is the lunix sam Make.* files. i symlink the > right one(s) to Makefile. make -f From plan9@kp.km.ua Tue Mar 23 08:20:24 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 03:49:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9500fcf4_7c31_11d8_9c73_00304828b574_28505; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:49:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18428346066 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:48:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 94505b4c_7c31_11d8_8d7d_00304828b574_28437; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:48:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 6457D758102; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:48:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2499758101 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:48:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9393764e_7c31_11d8_81b4_00304828b574_28427; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:48:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53B98346066 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:45:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1f836674_7c31_11d8_95ea_00304828b574_26824; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:45:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6688019DAD; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:45:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75ED519D97; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:45:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 534E419DA1; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:44:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from infocom.km.ua (infocom.km.ua [195.46.36.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93C8E19D9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 13:44:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from kp.km.ua (root@RE-2M.kp.km.ua [195.46.36.90]) by infocom.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/ic) with ESMTP id i2MIiqKx005174 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:44:53 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Received: from localhost.localdomain (dialup04.kp.km.ua [195.135.202.19]) by kp.km.ua (8.12.9p2/8.12.9/kp-branch) with SMTP id i2MIioRg089541 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 20:44:50 +0200 (EET) (envelope-from plan9@kp.km.ua) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r" From: "Andrey S. Kukhar" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [spam] Re: [9fans] What is the window system of plan9? Can anyone give me some design document of it to me? X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.2] References: <8e24a5cd0f38619a1d000b52787f827e@juice.thebigchoice.com> In-Reply-To: <8e24a5cd0f38619a1d000b52787f827e@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <04032219362800.00644@localhost.localdomain> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: plan9@kp.km.ua List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:36:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06, NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-NAI-Spam-Score: 6.4 X-NAI-Spam-Level: ****** X-NAI-Spam-Report: 2 Rules triggered * 4.4 -- DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06 -- Date: is 3 to 6 hours after Received: d * 2.0 -- NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP -- URI: Uses a dotted-decimal IP address in U the document is right kyxap > > http://204.178.31.2/who/rob/lec5.pdf > > is it me or does that seem truncated, I get 19 pages and > it ends somewhat abruptly > From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 23 08:20:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 08:00:34 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b9a7ad00_7c54_11d8_8e40_00304828b574_841; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6F273463B8 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b96d2f22_7c54_11d8_8e73_00304828b574_832; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:33 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8872C758100; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:32 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 478D5758103 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b6c53d14_7c54_11d8_9a97_00304828b574_800; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:00:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82C203463B8 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a2d1ed94_7c53_11d8_8896_00304828b574_29139; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:52:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 356C319DBF; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6CC519DAC; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:52:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E54C919DB5; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36BEE19DAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:51:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <5703c110d2b1be322b2013b834545d1d@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:56:26 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i'm in a minority here, so i'll say this and then shut up. i think the symlink comparison is not really valid, as a symbolic link is a potentially useful entity in its own right (hence tools that can look at them in both ways) whereas a duplicate name signifies nothing beyond the fact that the directory might be a union directory; there's nothing useful that can be done with the name. what this discussion boils down to is epitomised by boyd's: > large N% of the time it's not a problem, so Leave It Alone: basically union directories are used hardly at all, and when they are, it's generally only in "special purpose" places, such as /bin, /cron, etc. of course, they're crucial in the places where they are used, but it's not really the general mechanism that one gets the impression of when reading the documentation (as one quickly realises when trying to do unusual things with it, such as bind onto directories in /n/dump). i have a feeling almost nothing would break if the kernel was changed to disallow reading of union directories completely... > the arguments seem to focus on whether with a change here or there > they could be got to do a little more work (eg, by allowing * to > iterate exactly once over all services, protocols, say). > i don't think it's that essential in practice. not essential. it'd just be nice. for what it's worth, i had a look through the programs that geoff mentioned, categorising how they react to union directories. no (or unlikely) adverse consequences: pptpd controls own namespace bitsy/keyboard faces ps winwatch displays duplicates (but union unlikely) aux/depend exportfs reflects duplicates in exported namespace cron du aux/listen mk do their own duplicate elimination history could produce erroneous results on snap (but union unlikely) displays duplicate entries/info: acme news display duplicate entries netstat displays duplicate info inefficient: mkfs gzip/zip scp produces duplicate copy of file vac stores duplicate directory entries questionable: rm removes all entries, including hidden ones erroneous: ip/ftpd ls displays duplicates, with non-stable reordering of entries. diff reports spurious extra entries tar doesn't work properly, (but probably for reasons unrelated to union directory reading (try {tar c /bin | tar t}) unknown: replica/revproto not sure. From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Tue Mar 23 09:40:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 08:20:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a859322_7c57_11d8_9505_00304828b574_3990; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B4E23463FD for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a434a4e_7c57_11d8_8cbb_00304828b574_3987; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EFF097580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0D837580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a082b80_7c57_11d8_9f50_00304828b574_3983; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDFA23463FD for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8958f84a_7c57_11d8_8420_00304828b574_3979; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:20:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8655419DD0; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61EBF19DC4; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:20:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 037BD19DC5; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:19:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id F383419D62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:19:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 2281 invoked by uid 991); 22 Mar 2004 23:19:45 -0000 Message-ID: <20040322231945.2280.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-reply-to: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> References: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> Comments: In-reply-to rog@vitanuova.com message dated "Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:56:26." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:19:45 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Rog writes: | i'm in a minority here, so i'll say this and then shut up. Just to give you some moral support, I think you've made a lot of sense. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 23 09:40:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 08:53:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 26b203d0_7c5c_11d8_8e31_00304828b574_9241; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31F9634646E for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 267d7674_7c5c_11d8_958b_00304828b574_9238; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1D81A7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAE4D7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 26447a22_7c5c_11d8_8153_00304828b574_9235; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7FB734646E for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 25954890_7c5c_11d8_8064_00304828b574_9231; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D528D19DCD; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:53:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7993719DC9; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:53:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6408319DC9; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 209EE19CB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 18:52:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:50:33 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >i have a feeling almost nothing would break if the kernel was changed >to disallow reading of union directories completely... but of course it would: i couldn't ls it at all. i couldn't traverse the hierarchy at all. you should spend more time in the Windows or OS worlds where such restrictions are (were) commonplace! From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 09:40:31 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 09:22:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 36722ad0_7c60_11d8_9416_00304828b574_21715; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EE813464B5 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3638d35c_7c60_11d8_854b_00304828b574_21712; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 24402758100; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0542758107 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 32e2389c_7c60_11d8_8ca5_00304828b574_21683; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:22:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36FA03464B6 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:10:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 865980ae_7c5e_11d8_8070_00304828b574_15521; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:10:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B593519DD8; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:10:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECF0D19DD2; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:10:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8DC0119DCA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:09:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30D0C19DC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:09:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3656071-2250>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:08:24 -0500 Message-ID: <018201c4106a$ad4fea50$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <877cd28f100e43ead94de82da6b4f49b@terzarima.net> <00a001c41007$5b94a420$6d4a7d50@SOMA> <20040322182308.C21329@edi-view2.cisco.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 01:06:18 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > make -f try that in the top dir? is it maintainable? i just wanna cd and type make/mk and have the job done. i save 3 chars and lotta time poking around in files. From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 23 09:40:31 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 09:27:28 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbfd748c_7c60_11d8_8e0d_00304828b574_24169; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 502FF3464A7 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbc4892e_7c60_11d8_82a3_00304828b574_24156; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:25 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 20B9B7580FE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:24 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC961758101 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:15 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d61d61c6_7c60_11d8_9c39_00304828b574_24055; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:27:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E6103464B6 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:23:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5592d4dc_7c60_11d8_8b15_00304828b574_22165; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:23:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13F4719DDB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:23:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCE5919DD2; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:23:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E960019DD6; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:22:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E68C19DCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:22:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:28:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i couldn't traverse the hierarchy at all. you could walk into it, which is all most things do operationally... ls is nice ("look, here's a union directory and this is what's in it") but i reckon almost none of the tools that are used by the system in its day to day running actually read union directories. union directory reading is most useful interactively. most non-trivial uses require elimination of duplicates. for example, even du(1) gets things wrong, i now realise. > >> rm > >> removes all entries, including hidden ones > > it did years ago, but i don't think it does now. it does. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 23 14:46:06 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 09:43:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23df19ca_7c63_11d8_95bc_00304828b574_27110; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFF9A346506 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23887e58_7c63_11d8_8b1a_00304828b574_27107; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9136C7580FB; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB9947580FA for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23152c00_7c63_11d8_9384_00304828b574_27104; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05126346506 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2266509a_7c63_11d8_92c0_00304828b574_27096; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:43:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23B1019DE2; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:43:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12D1F19DD0; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:43:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F04FF19DCB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A035B19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:42:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <088d886f074a753a31625a831ac07f8e@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:40:19 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >> rm > >> removes all entries, including hidden ones > > it did years ago, but i don't think it does now. >it does.[?] term% mkdir a term% mkdir b term% >a/x term% >b/x term% bind -b b a term% ls a a/x a/x term% rm a/x term% ls a a/x i'm fairly sure it once had some code to do that but it doesn't now. rm -r will remove them all -- but that's exactly what it's supposed to do: empty the directory, surely! indeed, it's interesting that here's an example where the underlying mechanism seems to encourage just the right behaviour! i also note that ls a showed two x's the first time, then i removed one, leaving one, which seems good accounting to me ... in fact, with the `show only one name' approach, surely it would be the Ruby principle of least surprise to leave `a' empty so rm should revert to its `questionable' behaviour! From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 23 14:46:07 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 09:52:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 664bf5b6_7c64_11d8_8224_00304828b574_29188; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDE2F346524 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 661b38ae_7c64_11d8_831e_00304828b574_29185; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id BDA3E7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 767A97580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 65da9c86_7c64_11d8_8a6d_00304828b574_29182; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86203346524 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 652cfd42_7c64_11d8_9e08_00304828b574_29178; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6B66419DDF; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:52:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34EF719DCB; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:52:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5B9719DD2; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:51:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A75D919DCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:51:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4491bb14617eb61e87f7bc895e75b901@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 00:49:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: come to think of it, if i expect {rm -r a} to empty (and delete) `a' might i not expect {rm a/*} and especially {rm -r a/*} to remove all removable names from `a'? From rminnich@lanl.gov Tue Mar 23 14:46:07 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 11:14:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bf39cd0a_7c6f_11d8_9529_00304828b574_19821; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 818573465F0 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id befca128_7c6f_11d8_9834_00304828b574_19815; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9EF717580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBAC6758109 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bd5d7234_7c6f_11d8_88c5_00304828b574_19798; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BCE93465F0 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b4352c7e_7c6f_11d8_97ff_00304828b574_19683; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B604519DFA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:13:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51C4A19DF3; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:13:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5548A19DE1; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:12:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED1EE19DEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:12:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2N2CCjt026742 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:12:12 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2N2CCv8012512 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:12:12 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2N2CCfQ017456 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:12:12 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <4491bb14617eb61e87f7bc895e75b901@terzarima.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 19:12:11 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue, 23 Mar 2004, Charles Forsyth wrote: > come to think of it, if i expect {rm -r a} to empty (and delete) `a' > might i not expect {rm a/*} and especially {rm -r a/*} > to remove all removable names from `a'? seems right. There's a lot of subtleties to the union thing. I think that Plan 9's decision (present it to the users in its entirety) is the right one. ron From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 14:46:07 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 11:24:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3e56556c_7c71_11d8_8ed4_00304828b574_21814; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A902346618 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3e22a2b2_7c71_11d8_8358_00304828b574_21811; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 38BED7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2C007580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3de90a52_7c71_11d8_8543_00304828b574_21808; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0C1E346618 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3d3a9148_7c71_11d8_9cbf_00304828b574_21804; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0136019DF8; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:24:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A5E919DF1; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:24:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8A9A419DF3; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:23:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72E8519DE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:23:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317424-28647>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 21:18:59 -0500 Message-ID: <023a01c4107c$e57efb70$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:16:46 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > seems right. There's a lot of subtleties to the union thing. I think that > Plan 9's decision (present it to the users in its entirety) is the right > one. yup From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 23 14:46:07 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 12:13:07 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 01ca847c_7c78_11d8_87c6_00304828b574_6386; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3ABD346653 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 01779abe_7c78_11d8_84e6_00304828b574_6383; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2E317758100; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:05 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5BDE7580FB for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fdce5a74_7c77_11d8_8533_00304828b574_6233; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:13:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 944F134667D for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:10:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aaafe51a_7c77_11d8_96ab_00304828b574_5102; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:10:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C8B4819DF2; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:10:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5133419DE6; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:10:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 02DA919DEA; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25AE119DE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 22:09:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:15:24 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > come to think of it, if i expect {rm -r a} to empty (and delete) `a' > > might i not expect {rm a/*} and especially {rm -r a/*} > > to remove all removable names from `a'? > > seems right. There's a lot of subtleties to the union thing. I think that > Plan 9's decision (present it to the users in its entirety) is the right > one. it's a trade-off. some things work better, some things work worse. having said that, the above is the only occasion i've seen that makes use of the duplicate names in any kind of a sensible manner (but remove (and rename) is a strange operation in a union directory anyway - remove("x") does not necessarily mean that "x" goes away). i excluded write operations originally, and marked the rm behaviour as "questionable" because i believe it can be argued both ways. union directories themselves cannot be removed, so one's on fairly shaky ground trying to rm -r them... most tools read a directory in order to enumerate its accessible items. in that context, seeing unique names only is more correct. From npe@cwru.edu Tue Mar 23 14:46:07 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 13:10:34 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 084239d2_7c80_11d8_8b72_00304828b574_16759; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 444A63466FF for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 079c5e7c_7c80_11d8_838e_00304828b574_16751; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:33 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 109F17580FC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:33 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C555A7580FF for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 075451d6_7c80_11d8_960f_00304828b574_16746; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:10:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 261893466FF for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ea35d7f0_7c7f_11d8_9bd2_00304828b574_16216; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C9E719DF0; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:09:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6015C19DF3; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:09:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBEBE19DEC; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:08:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ms-smtp-01-eri0.southeast.rr.com (ms-smtp-01-lbl.southeast.rr.com [24.25.9.100]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2F2E19DE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:08:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.2.2 (rdu26-59-232.nc.rr.com [66.26.59.232]) by ms-smtp-01-eri0.southeast.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i2N48DSm022709 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 22 Mar 2004 23:08:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <545b051eabb2020555d47d10064e6e67@cwru.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: npe@cwru.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Subject: [spam] [9fans] ap script Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 04:07:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.1 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** X-NAI-Spam-Score: 5.0 X-NAI-Spam-Level: ***** X-NAI-Spam-Report: 2 Rules triggered * 4.4 -- DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06 -- Date: is 3 to 6 hours after Received: d * 0.6 -- NO_REAL_NAME -- From: does not include a real name Does anyone still use the ap script? If so what was the original format of the articles? I've munged the sed to get it halfway working, but I want to keep it like it was before. Also, what was the /acme/bin/386/apread program? It doesn't seem to be around anymore. Noah From saw@online.de Tue Mar 23 20:35:55 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 18:58:01 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 91fdd886_7cb0_11d8_8d31_00304828b574_27451; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:58:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB84B346A29 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:58:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 91cc8ab0_7cb0_11d8_84ca_00304828b574_27448; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:58:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2EF837580F9; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:57:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 662B5758108 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:57:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8de22996_7cb0_11d8_90a0_00304828b574_27408; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:57:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06776346A79 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1bb2d118_7cb0_11d8_8601_00304828b574_25875; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CBC7D19B19; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 04:54:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7FC519D7F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 04:54:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D343019D76; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 04:53:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A05CD19B19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 04:53:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5iNB-0000pn-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:39:01 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Sascha Wildner Message-ID: Organization: Yoyodyne Natural Born Configurators Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <003701c40e4f$a7e9f730$0000fea9@SOMA>, <005a01c41004$2bb6a440$6d4a7d50@SOMA> Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:38:01 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: boyd, rounin wrote: > glenda is white. rob asked me to take off the black > glenda off the back of the jerseys. i was never too > convinced about it either, so i removed it. > > white glenda == white background. Oops, misunderstanding. I was asking if the glenda on the front and the text are printed in black regardless of the sleeve color. BTW: They definitely look better without the black glenda on the back. Regards, Sascha -- http://yoyodyne.ath.cx From bengt.kleberg@ericsson.com Tue Mar 23 20:35:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 19:09:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 36a458b4_7cb2_11d8_9432_00304828b574_29558; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC36D346AA4 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3674138e_7cb2_11d8_8ff0_00304828b574_29555; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8A9497580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42A6C7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 36321948_7cb2_11d8_9de1_00304828b574_29552; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4092E346AA4 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 35796fce_7cb2_11d8_9bb3_00304828b574_29548; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 04F4A19DC2; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB06119B7A; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:09:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ADE7A19D67; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:08:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BB9619B19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:08:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B5ihH-00015I-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:59:47 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Bengt Kleberg Message-ID: Organization: Ericsson Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com>, <200403221630.i2MGUf511738@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:59:18 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Axel Belinfante wrote: ...deleted > Tried building all (esp. acme) on SunOS 5.8. > Build works best with gcc. > Anybody else trying the stuff on SunOS 5.8? i am running SunOS 5.8 as my only system (at work). i found that sun cc (Forte/6u2/SUNWspro/bin/cc) does not accept some plan9 cc contructs. ramfs.c has char *(*fcalls[])(Fid*) = { [Tversion] rversion, where [Tversion] is not understood. moreover, there are some files where plan9 cc allows a cast to a struct, which sun cc does not allow. one example, acme.c, has rs = cleanrname((Runestr){rb, nr}); > Got a number of warnings, and some 'fatal' problems: > no futimesat for lib9/dirfwstat.c (could not find futimes at all) > no TIOCGWINSZ for cmd/mc.c (needs using gcc it is possible to get this far. note that mc.c also is missing a struct winsize it too is found in . ...deleted > If more info is needed to track this down, I'm happy to help. add me to the list of happy to help'ers. bengt This communication is confidential and intended solely for the addressee(s). 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From administrator@crosscountry.co.za Tue Mar 23 20:35:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 19:17:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5591f046_7cb3_11d8_8944_00304828b574_31282; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16A45346ABB for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5561f3aa_7cb3_11d8_8bbe_00304828b574_31279; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E980C7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABB2B7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5526889c_7cb3_11d8_9eab_00304828b574_31276; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9EA1346ABB for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 54780e0c_7cb3_11d8_81fa_00304828b574_31272; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:17:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 69C9A19DF3; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:17:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E73D419DEC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:17:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80EF319D7F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:16:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from cccsc.crosscountry.co.za (cccsc.crosscountry.co.za [196.37.121.105]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB33719D67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 05:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by cccsc.crosscountry.co.za (8.12.8/8.12.8) id i2NAKD7A000564 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:20:14 +0200 Message-Id: <200403231020.i2NAKD7A000564@cccsc.crosscountry.co.za> From: administrator@crosscountry.co.za To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Inflex scan report [03231220335] Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:20:12 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Administrator Email Reply Address: administrator@crosscountry.co.za Email sent to: johannesz@crosscountry.co.za Inflex ID: 03231220335 Report Details ----------------------------------------------- AntiVirus Results... Virus scanning off. File NAME/TYPE Scan Results MS-DOS executable (EXE), OS/2 or MS Windows MS-DOS executable (EXE), OS/2 or MS Windows 03231220335 from:9fans@cse.psu.edu to: johannesz@crosscountry.co.zaText scanning off. END OF MESSAGE. End. . From a@9srv.net Tue Mar 23 20:35:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 20:28:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3b42641e_7cbd_11d8_9d37_00304828b574_20407; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE8E8346B65 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3b115130_7cbd_11d8_9a07_00304828b574_20404; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id BF6E67580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7644E7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3ad031e6_7cbd_11d8_8e0d_00304828b574_20401; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 849D6346B65 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3a2143d4_7cbd_11d8_81f7_00304828b574_20397; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:28:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C94B619DF9; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:28:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23B8719DCC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:28:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8D45019DCC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:27:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74F7A19D62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:27:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <48659d520230215d54b9ffb11b22eaf9@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c In-Reply-To: <1cfa5e29c25777a3842f88338e39b634@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:13:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable // ...union directories are used hardly at all, and when they are, // it's generally only in "special purpose" places... for what it's worth, the lab i was in at BL did a fairly complete overlay on top of 1127's file server with our own tree. as i recall our /lib/namespace approached 350 lines. we were pushing hard on what the kernel was expecting that file to do, and did run into issues on occasion, but for the most part it just worked, and was very nice to use in practice. obviously, we would've been SOL had the kernel not allowed reading union directories. if i remember correctly, one user even had a fairly complicated additional overlay of his own as his home directory was split between our own and 1127's file servers (and he managed to be a huge user on both ;-). =E3=82=A2 From t.lankots@aprote.ee Tue Mar 23 20:35:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 20:35:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 37a21a1a_7cbe_11d8_92b2_00304828b574_21456; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 510AB346B78 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 37721c34_7cbe_11d8_857b_00304828b574_21453; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 36EC77580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E27E17580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 37347ff0_7cbe_11d8_9afe_00304828b574_21450; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E5993346B78 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 367efd24_7cbe_11d8_97de_00304828b574_21446; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0EAA19E03; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:35:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EF6D19B7A; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:35:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95A0719B5A; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E844A19A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:34:13 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2NBkUZ7017241 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:46:31 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056173@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: libndb.a Thread-Index: AcQQyr+S9UQwmYfDQx+iBuvGiPXOLA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] libndb.a Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:34:06 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: aux/vga, when compiled from current sources, always fails with the message=20 "main: @ not found in /lib/vgadb" for all values of and . I traced the problem to /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga.db.c:266 where the=20 ndbsearch() fails. ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb fails also. But binaries from March 21st installation cd work flawless: term% ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 term% /mnt/cd/386/bin/ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 xga=3D1024x768 include=3D1024x768 term% And: term% diff /lib/vgadb /mnt/cd/lib/vgadb term% diff /mnt/cd/sys/src/libndb /sys/src/libndb term% But: term% cp -x /mnt/cd/386/lib/lib/libndb.a /386/lib term% cd /sys/src/cmd/ndb term diff . /mnt/cd/sys/src/cmd/ndb term% mk all [snip] term% 8.query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 term% Tiit@clueless From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 23 23:31:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 20:48:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0943dcba_7cc0_11d8_8de1_00304828b574_23807; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7857F346B9A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 090dcfe4_7cc0_11d8_9007_00304828b574_23804; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 657657580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D44F7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 08d4f3ea_7cc0_11d8_9146_00304828b574_23801; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28056346B9A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 081e1ecc_7cc0_11d8_92d7_00304828b574_23797; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:48:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8372C19DFC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7793919BC6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:48:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70F4619BC6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:47:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (dnspac16.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1939D19B4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:47:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5c7c3a9137d3e0eb0359125edfb04817@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ls, rc question -- proposed change to rc/glob.c From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <48659d520230215d54b9ffb11b22eaf9@9srv.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 03:47:50 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The place where our massive overlay didn't work too well was building kernels from 1127 sources with a few of our own source files. The overlay file server that Russ and I wrote attempted to solve that but also required a minor change to mk. Unfortunately we wrote it using the first public version of lib9p, which has since changed quite a bit. I'd like to take another stab at it once I've finished my current round of file servers. Actually most of my files remained on 1127's file servers, where they had started out. I had relatively few files on our departmental file server, though obviously the overlay worked well enough that Anthony couldn't tell. =E2=98=BA I felt a little bad about hogging 1127's optica= l storage, but then Ken had ~160GB of compressed music on ours by the end, which relieved my guilt somewhat. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 23:31:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 21:08:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d580d6a0_7cc2_11d8_9a26_00304828b574_26950; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2189E346BC8 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d54a2dd0_7cc2_11d8_9fc8_00304828b574_26947; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 00B657580FB; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD09C7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d508db28_7cc2_11d8_8768_00304828b574_26943; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBA79346BC8 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d45a86a4_7cc2_11d8_9040_00304828b574_26936; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:08:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A43B19A95; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:08:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4801F19A95; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:08:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 919B519A95; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:07:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2272219A95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <313255-18833>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:05:57 -0500 Message-ID: <028301c410ce$e9608220$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <545b051eabb2020555d47d10064e6e67@cwru.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ap script MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:03:48 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Does anyone still use the ap script? i'd guess this is the stuff for the AP feed. do you have an AP feed? From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 23:31:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 21:31:23 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fee396ba_7cc5_11d8_84fd_00304828b574_4015; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 082FB346BF2 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fe101ad8_7cc5_11d8_981d_00304828b574_3996; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:22 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AC621758100; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:21 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E5387580FA for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fdb77496_7cc5_11d8_8a2c_00304828b574_3988; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9863A346BF2 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:22:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c7c11ef6_7cc4_11d8_9366_00304828b574_32262; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:22:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 35D6919DEC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:22:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12E0619D43; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:22:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D2E5319D43; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18B0B19C6B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <316017-18835>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:20:05 -0500 Message-ID: <02f501c410d0$e20c37b0$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] lon9con MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:17:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Oops, misunderstanding. I was asking if the glenda on the front and the > text are printed in black regardless of the sleeve color. they are all printed in black [glenda + text]. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 23:31:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 21:31:33 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 04ddbf82_7cc6_11d8_94bc_00304828b574_4091; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEAB1346BE2 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03f3733c_7cc6_11d8_9b60_00304828b574_4084; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:32 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 65CC97580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:30 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FC4B758108 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0123d85e_7cc6_11d8_9653_00304828b574_4054; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:31:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41926346C06 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:28:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9e1e81dc_7cc5_11d8_9ae0_00304828b574_2764; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:28:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6710919D0F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:28:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F0CC19C61; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:28:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 843AA19D0F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:27:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4995619B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:27:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <321599-26249>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 07:25:40 -0500 Message-ID: <030701c410d1$a974a620$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:23:31 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > char *(*fcalls[])(Fid*) = { > [Tversion] rversion, > > where [Tversion] is not understood. this is Ken C. [Tversion] is used as the value for the index in the array to reference rversion. for lunix systems, just hack/comment them out and make sure all the tables are in sync (by hand or |sort). > moreover, there are some files where plan9 cc allows a cast to a struct, > which sun cc does not allow. one example, acme.c, has > > rs = cleanrname((Runestr){rb, nr}); more Ken C: use a temporary variable. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Tue Mar 23 23:31:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 22:12:23 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b94c8282_7ccb_11d8_8617_00304828b574_15004; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50FB6346C5C for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b91af65e_7ccb_11d8_8c09_00304828b574_15001; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:23 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 30C8C7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:23 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB1817580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b8d885f8_7ccb_11d8_973f_00304828b574_14998; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7FD4346C5C for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b8295862_7ccb_11d8_82d5_00304828b574_14994; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:12:22 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C3B5919B1D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:12:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB5B319B7B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:12:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 04D6719B7B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:10:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D899F19B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:10:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HV100YP45WTE0@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:10:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:10:05 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] ap script To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <642d0b643fb1.643fb1642d0b@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:10:05 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think that's the acme version that's missing the "apread" binary. The one I'm talking about is the "/rc/bin/ap" script that uses hget, html format and sed to allow article browsing. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd, rounin" Date: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 7:03 am Subject: Re: [9fans] ap script > > Does anyone still use the ap script? > > i'd guess this is the stuff for the AP feed. > > do you have an AP feed? > > From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 23 23:31:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 22:18:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9e965ed0_7ccc_11d8_8f1d_00304828b574_15915; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 066A2346C6B for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9e657658_7ccc_11d8_9636_00304828b574_15912; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id DC75F7580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96CE17580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9e26b83c_7ccc_11d8_86d8_00304828b574_15909; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3BAD346C6B for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d77d394_7ccc_11d8_879f_00304828b574_15905; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BB4A619B7B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:18:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D18719B7B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:18:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C6CF519B8E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:17:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87AA019B59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:17:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2be013141fc2a00d069c6d6aac363fb2@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <030701c410d1$a974a620$6d4a7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:17:19 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue Mar 23 07:28:50 EST 2004, boyd@insultant.net wrote: > > this is Ken C. [Tversion] is used as the value for the index in > the array to reference rversion. gosh. I thought you were boyd. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 23 23:31:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 22:34:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d932f7ae_7cce_11d8_885f_00304828b574_18751; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C6F3346C91 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d8fc2288_7cce_11d8_985d_00304828b574_18748; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 333A97580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEB0D7580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d8be0d90_7cce_11d8_97b7_00304828b574_18745; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8366346C91 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d80d8b6e_7cce_11d8_95cf_00304828b574_18741; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50AF419BC8; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:34:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79CFA19B7C; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:34:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FA9C19B7C; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:33:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CFBC19B0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:33:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.74.109]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315469-28407>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:32:52 -0500 Message-ID: <036c01c410db$08ac2c40$6d4a7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <2be013141fc2a00d069c6d6aac363fb2@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:30:38 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > gosh. I thought you were boyd. nah, i'm nemo. From presotto@closedmind.org Tue Mar 23 23:31:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 22:59:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58057072_7cd2_11d8_97e5_00304828b574_30189; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D866346CB7 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 57a9527e_7cd2_11d8_88b2_00304828b574_30184; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4D339758105; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A34A7758100 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 54e30b8e_7cd2_11d8_8184_00304828b574_30156; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:59:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA159346CB7 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:54:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a8a4b43a_7cd1_11d8_9b9e_00304828b574_27941; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:54:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A97EF19BC6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:54:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5ABE19C2B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:54:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18BB019BC8; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3FB219BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] libndb.a In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056173@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-irkzfejdfkqhfgfwvznjedmrvx" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 08:53:26 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-irkzfejdfkqhfgfwvznjedmrvx Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Argh! I had to tighten up the ndb parsing to avoid ambiguities. To wit a = b worked before, but some people used it to mean attribute(a) has value (b) and others atribute(a) has not value and attribute(b) has no value. That was blowing away people that had domain area definitions like soa= dom= ns=xyzzy I no longer allow spaces twixt the '=' and the value. Unfortunately, /lib/vgadb had lots of things like include = 640x480@72Hz I've put a new /lib/vgadb on sources. --upas-irkzfejdfkqhfgfwvznjedmrvx Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 23 06:35:44 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 23 06:35:41 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A65819DF6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:35:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC01719B4D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:35:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95A0719B5A; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E844A19A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:34:13 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2NBkUZ7017241 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:46:31 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1257" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056173@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: libndb.a Thread-Index: AcQQyr+S9UQwmYfDQx+iBuvGiPXOLA== From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] libndb.a Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:34:06 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: aux/vga, when compiled from current sources, always fails with the message=20 "main: @ not found in /lib/vgadb" for all values of and . I traced the problem to /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga.db.c:266 where the=20 ndbsearch() fails. ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb fails also. But binaries from March 21st installation cd work flawless: term% ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 term% /mnt/cd/386/bin/ndb/query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 xga=3D1024x768 include=3D1024x768 term% And: term% diff /lib/vgadb /mnt/cd/lib/vgadb term% diff /mnt/cd/sys/src/libndb /sys/src/libndb term% But: term% cp -x /mnt/cd/386/lib/lib/libndb.a /386/lib term% cd /sys/src/cmd/ndb term diff . /mnt/cd/sys/src/cmd/ndb term% mk all [snip] term% 8.query -f /lib/vgadb xga 1024x768 term% Tiit@clueless --upas-irkzfejdfkqhfgfwvznjedmrvx-- From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 23 23:56:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4dd3df32_7cda_11d8_8d8a_00304828b574_9593; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51395346D6A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d8e9f3a_7cda_11d8_9457_00304828b574_9589; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 32B127580FA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD3917580F9 for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d4d7960_7cda_11d8_8ed0_00304828b574_9586; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9A36346D6A for ; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c9df30a_7cda_11d8_8256_00304828b574_9582; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:56:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE6CA19CD2; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB60319C23; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:56:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A40C419AED; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:55:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A602C19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:55:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2NEsa1b035258 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2NEsaPO035257 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403231454.i2NEsaPO035257@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] forty Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Shouldn't the magic number 40 mentioned in dial(2) and used in a few places in the source code be replaced with NETPATHLEN? From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:11:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6a1d1fd0_7cdc_11d8_9779_00304828b574_16278; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAFAF346D7F for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 69cb4cbe_7cdc_11d8_9732_00304828b574_16273; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4E40875810C; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA7B7580FC for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 675eeaa8_7cdc_11d8_83bb_00304828b574_16241; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:11:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC826346D7F for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:05:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8c1ac66a_7cdb_11d8_8c8d_00304828b574_13451; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:05:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D7E8519C06; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:05:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF995199D1; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:05:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1602519C01; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:04:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3B1F19B7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:04:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <036c01c410db$08ac2c40$6d4a7d50@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:04:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> gosh. I thought you were boyd. > > nah, i'm nemo. Then I must be boyd. From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:18:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5e6ecc0a_7cdd_11d8_80a7_00304828b574_19692; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B9A346D7F for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5b5da1da_7cdd_11d8_9d8d_00304828b574_19663; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7AEAE75810F; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:29 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 011C9758102 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5567d3ae_7cdd_11d8_8119_00304828b574_19591; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36E58346DA1 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:13:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a6bc259e_7cdc_11d8_8108_00304828b574_17126; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:13:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 181C919DCC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:13:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F23F019D23; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:13:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 553FE19CD2; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F92019BAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:12:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:13:26 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>but i missed a few. gcc gets more and more >>like ken's c every day. i haven't yet worked >except for size, speed, and readability. and most important, being predictable. From rsc@swtch.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:18:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5eb49c76_7cdd_11d8_9f0e_00304828b574_19696; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20C7B346D99 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c0c3466_7cdd_11d8_9873_00304828b574_19674; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 84E42758104; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:27 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B3D8758105 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 54983478_7cdd_11d8_9c2d_00304828b574_19577; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6812B346D9A for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 43f39dfc_7cdc_11d8_94ca_00304828b574_15771; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9975319C2B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:10:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FD6919C23; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:10:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43AC119C33; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:09:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14F6E19B7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:09:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 776FC24FE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:09:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports References: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com>, <200403221630.i2MGUf511738@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:09:33 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Bengt Kleberg wrote: > i found that sun cc (Forte/6u2/SUNWspro/bin/cc) does not accept some > plan9 cc contructs. ramfs.c has > > char *(*fcalls[])(Fid*) = { > [Tversion] rversion, > > where [Tversion] is not understood. > > moreover, there are some files where plan9 cc allows a cast to a > struct, which sun cc does not allow. one example, acme.c, has > > rs = cleanrname((Runestr){rb, nr}); thanks. i tried to remove most of these, but i missed a few. gcc gets more and more like ken's c every day. i haven't yet worked very hard on sunos. i'm glad to hear it works though. russ From forsyth@terzarima.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:18:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5ef6dbcc_7cdd_11d8_9271_00304828b574_19700; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A52C4346D94 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5bc645fa_7cdd_11d8_90cd_00304828b574_19666; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9DEAE758105; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:31 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F0927580FF for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 550c3648_7cdd_11d8_80d5_00304828b574_19584; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:18:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2759C346D9F for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:12:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 82fb7042_7cdc_11d8_823b_00304828b574_16642; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:12:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8AB8519CE6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:12:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A463B19C7C; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:12:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7EDC119BAD; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:11:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD08D19C7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:11:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5ef88d2c0e1fde10ddb9769676714b7e@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:12:46 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>but i missed a few. gcc gets more and more >>like ken's c every day. i haven't yet worked except for size, speed, and readability. From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:31:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f927204_7cdf_11d8_99e9_00304828b574_26010; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCA8A346D98 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f2bf83a_7cdf_11d8_9715_00304828b574_25992; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8AA317580FE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21D1475810D for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2cf78534_7cdf_11d8_8772_00304828b574_25976; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40026346DA6 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a891da8_7cdf_11d8_985d_00304828b574_25940; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62DD719AB1; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:31:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9B2619D8D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:31:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BF7019AC9; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66D0F19D8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:30:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3a74b7ee586fd74d816f6c73a3e760cb@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] forty In-Reply-To: <200403231454.i2NEsaPO035257@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-emisevfqkyigszvbbkblnbecxi" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:30:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-emisevfqkyigszvbbkblnbecxi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Funny you should mention that. I had the routine on my screen and was thinking of changing the interface to not have a fixed len. --upas-emisevfqkyigszvbbkblnbecxi Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Tue Mar 23 09:56:45 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Tue Mar 23 09:56:42 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABE6719D21; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B04A219AED; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:56:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A40C419AED; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:55:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A602C19A2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:55:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2NEsa1b035258 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2NEsaPO035257 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403231454.i2NEsaPO035257@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] forty Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:54:36 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Shouldn't the magic number 40 mentioned in dial(2) and used in a few places in the source code be replaced with NETPATHLEN? --upas-emisevfqkyigszvbbkblnbecxi-- From rsc@swtch.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:31:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 303225ec_7cdf_11d8_8cee_00304828b574_26029; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6F46346D77 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2fac995e_7cdf_11d8_94c3_00304828b574_26019; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E25CF7580FD; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D232575810C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2ccd2ab4_7cdf_11d8_891a_00304828b574_25975; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:31:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACE64346DC7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:30:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 11c4862c_7cdf_11d8_9fa7_00304828b574_25573; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:30:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8A6F119D43; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA9BC19AB1; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:30:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2159A19D3D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:29:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2175719AC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:29:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7589724FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:29:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <406057BF.8040206@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports References: <5ef88d2c0e1fde10ddb9769676714b7e@terzarima.net> In-Reply-To: <5ef88d2c0e1fde10ddb9769676714b7e@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:29:03 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Charles Forsyth wrote: >>>but i missed a few. gcc gets more and more >>>like ken's c every day. i haven't yet worked >>> >>> > >except for size, speed, and readability. > > i was referring to the language, not the compiler. though your points apply equally well. From dvd@davidashen.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:38:37 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 26ac00a0_7ce0_11d8_8d6a_00304828b574_27396; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7BCF346DC7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 267ae0a6_7ce0_11d8_902c_00304828b574_27393; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9835A7580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:36 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD1D7580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2638c400_7ce0_11d8_968a_00304828b574_27390; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50F3F346DC6 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 25833eb4_7ce0_11d8_807c_00304828b574_27385; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:38:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9038C19D52; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:38:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CCAF19C06; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:38:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E8A4119B01; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:37:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B97419ADE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2NFad1b035524; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:36:39 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2NFadOX035523; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:36:39 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403231536.i2NFadOX035523@adat.davidashen.net> To: 'magic@adat.davidashen.net, -s@adat.davidashen.net, 9fans@cse.psu.edu, numbers'@adat.davidashen.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] magic numbers Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:36:39 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've tried to pattern a simple program I am writing after /sys/src/cmd/ip/telnet.c; I'm lost trying to figure out what each of the magic numbers means. dodial(char *dest) defines char name[2*NETPATHLEN] that is, 80 characters long. Why NETPATHLEN should be doubled? How is NETPATHLEN related to the length of address tuple? Then name is used to copy the result of netmkaddr to it; but internally the array netmkaddr stores its result in a static char addr[256] and if the host name is long enough, the stack becomes corrupt. In the same function, on the next line after char name[2*NETPATHLEN], devdir is defined as char devdir[40] Is 40 in fact NETPATHLEN? David From a@9srv.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:41:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9753a678_7ce0_11d8_8095_00304828b574_27921; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAF34346DD2 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 972401fc_7ce0_11d8_9e7a_00304828b574_27918; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9FFB47580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 579087580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 96e5f8e4_7ce0_11d8_9113_00304828b574_27915; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65B3C346DD2 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 963754d8_7ce0_11d8_97b1_00304828b574_27911; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1E5C19C23; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:41:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C678E19C06; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:41:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E23FC19B85; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:40:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7191619B7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:40:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4cc1e14e6f593a6766f80378f5472912@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <2be013141fc2a00d069c6d6aac363fb2@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:39:00 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: // gosh. I thought you were boyd. no, he's susan, remember? http://groups.google.com/groups?q=boyd+9fans+%22call+me%22&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&selm=020401c3a962%24410f0b60%24b9844051%40insultant.net&rnum=2 From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:42:06 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a36c241c_7ce0_11d8_93a0_00304828b574_28052; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02779346DD3 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a3350c70_7ce0_11d8_8301_00304828b574_28049; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:06 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E80D77580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:05 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 944027580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a2f7a790_7ce0_11d8_916c_00304828b574_28046; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EB9D346DD3 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a246c344_7ce0_11d8_9a4f_00304828b574_28042; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:42:05 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B82719D52; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:42:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AF8219DFC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:41:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C28E619B01; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:40:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B1AB19ADE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:39:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2NFduCi026043 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:39:56 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2NFduXc016023 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:39:56 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2NFduR25907 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:39:56 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403231539.i2NFduR25907@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:09:33 -0500." <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> References: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com>, <200403221630.i2MGUf511738@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:39:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i haven't yet worked very hard on sunos. > i'm glad to hear it works though. Great job!!! Thanks!!! FYI: Another thing that needs some work ons sunos 5.8 is bin/ps (almost there, I'll supply a patch) Please don't take this as criticism, but I agree with what is suggested in the NOTES, if I read it correctly, that it would be nice to have multiple architecture dependent bin/lib directories as we have in plan 9 (have now separate trees for linux and sunos, and thought of using (ahem... cough...) symlink tricks to share sources) wrt (acme) color depth: I found why I could not run 24bit colors; I'll try to clean up and (off list?) supply a patch. Have a similar problem with drawterm, would be cool if the same fix works there! The acme resizing problem still beats me -- I today build for linux (Red Hat Linux 7.3) and have the same problem there (only tried running remotely, display on sun). Axel. From a@9srv.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 00:52:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21565f2c_7ce2_11d8_9756_00304828b574_30338; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1753346DF7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21210200_7ce2_11d8_9c0f_00304828b574_30335; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9F3167580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F9517580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 20e79952_7ce2_11d8_95a4_00304828b574_30332; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 522DE346DF7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2027af0c_7ce2_11d8_8dcc_00304828b574_30327; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 00:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4AFD819E06; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:52:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5EC819C06; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:52:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA6ED19DAE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:51:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8384319C06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:51:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <200403231539.i2NFduR25907@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 10:49:20 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable // ...it would be nice to have multiple architecture // dependent bin/lib directories as we have in plan 9... see also /usr/inferno (or the like). =E3=82=A2 From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 01:13:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 11fde9ca_7ce5_11d8_94c1_00304828b574_1256; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8631D346E2C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 11ce11e6_7ce5_11d8_995e_00304828b574_1253; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 66E377580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CE5C7580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 118c6520_7ce5_11d8_89fa_00304828b574_1250; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CA73346E2C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 10debe70_7ce5_11d8_9f4f_00304828b574_1246; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:13:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 486E919D43; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E373019A15; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:13:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4028919B7B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6141C19A15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:12:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:12:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: telnet's dodial fixed to be more understandable. From rsc@swtch.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 01:27:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0055df3c_7ce7_11d8_8b1d_00304828b574_4801; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DACE346E4B for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ffc9feae_7ce6_11d8_85cf_00304828b574_4794; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AA6C77580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53347758101 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fe9aa1fa_7ce6_11d8_9745_00304828b574_4783; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:27:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 200E8346E4B for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9c9d0632_7ce6_11d8_88e6_00304828b574_3620; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ABEEA19D43; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A16FA19DF6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:24:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC6AB19D63; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:23:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9727A19CFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:23:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F023B24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:23:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40606498.1050200@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:23:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: a@9srv.net wrote: >// ...it would be nice to have multiple architecture >// dependent bin/lib directories as we have in plan 9... > >see also /usr/inferno (or the like). > > the problem isn't that i don't know what the structure should look like. the problem is that i don't want to do it. i find it annoying to have to type things like /usr/local/plan9/FreeBSD/386/bin/acme, and further it makes writing shell scripts impossible: #!/usr/local/plan9/FreeBSD/386/bin/rc isn't very portable! you'd have to have a shell script "rc" that ran the binary rc and then use #!/usr/local/plan9/rc/bin/rc or something like that. it's just disgusting. i don't have many environments where different architectures share a tree like /usr/local, so i don't worry much about it. if we had union directories (or even athena's environment variable symlinks) to hide the ugliness, i might feel differently. it's easy enough to change if you want to change it -- just edit /usr/local/plan9/src/mkhdr and change BIN and LIB. russ From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 01:34:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e3630246_7ce7_11d8_9c17_00304828b574_7660; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:34:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6A5E346E57 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:33:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e32d8094_7ce7_11d8_8329_00304828b574_7652; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:33:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4A69D7580FD; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:33:57 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EDF075810A for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:33:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e006c2d6_7ce7_11d8_8886_00304828b574_7624; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0978346E57 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:28:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 20ba849e_7ce7_11d8_8553_00304828b574_5220; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:28:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C78E919D9D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:28:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F24C19DCC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:28:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84B7119DAE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:27:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2BD519B14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:27:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2NGRqCi002755 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 17:27:52 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2NGRqXc004453 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 17:27:52 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2NGRqa26759 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 17:27:52 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403231627.i2NGRqa26759@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:23:52 -0500." <40606498.1050200@swtch.com> References: <40606498.1050200@swtch.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 17:27:52 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > >// ...it would be nice to have multiple architecture > >// dependent bin/lib directories as we have in plan 9... > > > >see also /usr/inferno (or the like). > > > > > > the problem isn't that i don't know what the structure should look like. > the problem is that i don't want to do it. ... I see your point. From a@9srv.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 01:57:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1a3cb048_7ceb_11d8_92f1_00304828b574_18370; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:57:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20D79346E9E for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:57:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 19e8b0d8_7ceb_11d8_86d9_00304828b574_18336; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:57:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EAA437580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:56:59 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A351A7580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:56:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 19a2ccf8_7ceb_11d8_8fe2_00304828b574_18295; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:56:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B12C2346E9E for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:56:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 18f3f110_7ceb_11d8_8317_00304828b574_18291; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 01:56:59 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B80DD19E0B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:56:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4463B19D9E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:56:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFC1E19D9E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 641F519B08 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:55:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <99829a227be3cc75e4bf554aa71df57b@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-Reply-To: <40606498.1050200@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:54:06 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable // the problem is that i don't want to do it. and, for the record, i wasn't suggesting you do so. given the very different needs (and tastes) at different sites, i generally think the best route for a package maintainer is to aim for the general target (/usr/local/plan9 or whatever) and provide a sane way to build in other places and modify what the default location for tools to look is. i think rsc's dist does that nicely, and (were i still in a heterogeneous environment) allows me to do either the symlink or environment variable tricks just fine. =E3=82=A2 From Lori@bkkmail.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 02:20:59 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7342c6de_7cee_11d8_854e_00304828b574_23139; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD457346EE7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 72e42c96_7cee_11d8_959f_00304828b574_23136; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C87557580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:57 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 396677580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 727de0da_7cee_11d8_9b79_00304828b574_23133; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7B49346EE8 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 71869c6c_7cee_11d8_8c86_00304828b574_23123; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:20:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8FD1619D9E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:20:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AE5D19BCB; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:20:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9902619BDE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:19:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from STUBBS (unknown [4.8.164.62]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0729819BAD; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:19:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from 218.44.25.220 by 4.8.164.62; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:10:41 +0500 Message-ID: From: "Giovanni Castle" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----------02AA4187017E089" Subject: [spam] [9fans] Pay less money - receive more software! It's too simple. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: "Giovanni Castle" List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:14:41 -0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=5.0 required=5.0 tests=BIZ_TLD,HTML_FONTCOLOR_RED, HTML_FONTCOLOR_UNSAFE,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET, RCVD_IN_DSBL,RCVD_IN_NJABL,RCVD_IN_NJABL_DIALUP autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: **** X-NAI-Spam-Score: 5.7 X-NAI-Spam-Level: ***** X-NAI-Spam-Report: 4 Rules triggered * 5.0 -- BIZ_URL -- URI: Contains a URL in the '.biz' domain * 1.8 -- HTML_MESSAGE -- BODY: HTML included in message * -1.0 -- BIZ_W_HTML -- Bonus: biz url in html message * -0.2 -- HTML_FONT_COLOR_NAME -- BODY: HTML font color has unusual name ------------02AA4187017E089 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------63D96E08EB0899" ------------63D96E08EB0899 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------------63D96E08EB0899 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If those third parties don't obtain the required information, then airlines will have to do it at the airport, which will cause delays, he said.
I am pleased that Washington is finally making progress toward becoming a results-oriented government. In these tight budgetary times, we need to know which programs work and which do not. GAO has provided Congress and the American taxpayers with an insightful appraisal of the government's efforts to account for the trillions of tax dollars it spends each year, said Senator Collins.
I commend GAO for their work on the GPRA 10-year retrospective and am pleased that agencies are improving the quality of their annual plans and reports. I believe that GRPA is a vital tool that has benefits far beyond linking agency budgets with performance information. Agencies and managers can improve the success of GPRA by linking their annual plans and reports directly with employee work plans, said Senator Voinovich.


Each of the AU members has the same five-person representation in the 265-member assembly. MPs are picked from each state's national parliament. Thursday's session will have only 195 members since to date only 39 countries have ratified the protocol setting up the pan-African body.
The TSA has said all those who book tickets will be required to obtain the passenger data needed for CAPPS II.
Several indicators have been pointing up for the job market, including a steady, if slow, decline in weekly jobless claims, leading many economists to forecast greater job growth this year.
"At the end of the day, the system isn't going to be any good if we can't assure privacy for the flying public's information," ATA President James May said.
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1kytO2GdVV9d2TUl1nOl2T59AJulWAWQUP8PoNUvhRNm9dgLxdValVmYDVMildAdslSHfdE1wFSv YNSejVkqKdpmxdbpk9Xqs1SO3daJXVoX9dWgdYw4tSdV5VdYdVhifYB4xVFXNdt11VMBeNuBVVVt xVpFRdZzbQqL/QHD9QHE/btQ1Tq4xdSWBVbIVdl+XQdMrdulRVR3pdhD6tSt0Fyn1Vtg0VEsOVS1 3das9dkWldSrXVZJagAqgQnYfV0rZdyccFjQndTQ3VkYZV1uHdsPcFQxRdmYvdAOotI0HV5OaNrH pdiGIFMnlQJT/dDGWKgedZLq/bvBVQfmZVedRd3cwdmB9RSQ9Yq/FdZPdVfXvdGwHV8jLd//Oz3U 0+hT4A1SXyjdhm0ve9Vfc8U7nF0Hxx1U7r3WgCXTPejdvN2IA+5RnVUBBV6HA7ZaBv7euO3QQiVV Kf2SCx7VOlU7ZwXfKrrdvy3b44VYB55ZiKXfgJVc3cXdVz1Y30Vh7p3g2wUAcpVaDvZP/21S031Z DShUeHLg2c3bcPXVHdPT3PXh0AliIn5hCl5XIT5cv0Veqo1hpW3gsyXSLeHaXGXfpcVhtfPWRkXU kq0HJyVd8rXTI+hdkH3OBd5WOtXgFw1ZbKXV1J3j1end0j1jiL3SJbHW3dUaHU5ZaP3dwTvfhfUR k6XYJM1YLEbhps2dql1Y4l3fX4BbSr7Rk5mZ4NrdXLMN0dRI2MQtZMxlX0EevHvdkvvtXhUWYwYe 2ohl4VeW3MZQ18J1ZRK+ZbBdU7Rd4VjGXn51kj7OiC2eA2KG0GNG5mRW5mVmZu9Y32eG5miW5mmm 5mq25mvG5mzW5m3m5m62Zr7z5nAW53Em53I253MmZ3BG53Vm53Z253d252aW53mm53q253vGZxmJ AAA7 ------------02AA4187017E089-- From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 03:54:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8dadeca8_7cfb_11d8_9808_00304828b574_16831; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA0F8346FBB for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8d787258_7cfb_11d8_8d3b_00304828b574_16825; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CDEF87580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 837047580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8d38772a_7cfb_11d8_9125_00304828b574_16822; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91561346FBB for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8c86da06_7cfb_11d8_8eb8_00304828b574_16810; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 03:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CD09119DF3; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:54:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 705F919D8D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:54:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 274A719AF5; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:53:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD32719D11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 13:53:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <28bd96eba76eb6b193e64dd03719f5c1@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] rio bug Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:53:07 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: if a rio window is being moved while it disappears it'll leave a white rectangle at the last position it is placed at. to trigger try selecting a terminal window with the right mouse button and hit ^D, then move it around and deselect. i guess a solution would be to add a control message to redraw the grey, but i can just see someone 'fixing' it to allow random images to be put as background and it's all downhill from there :) andrey From rsc@swtch.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:06:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3cbc0e04_7cfd_11d8_86e2_00304828b574_18747; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CD25346FC5 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3c8bbf92_7cfd_11d8_84de_00304828b574_18744; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0D82F7580FB; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B75017580FA for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3c49e23e_7cfd_11d8_8d97_00304828b574_18741; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3F1F346FC5 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3b9a3c94_7cfd_11d8_864a_00304828b574_18737; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 202CD19AF5; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:06:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C8E619D2F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:06:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F35819AF5; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:05:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33B2D19BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:05:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4A7224FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:05:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40608A5A.4010803@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug References: <28bd96eba76eb6b193e64dd03719f5c1@plan9.ucalgary.ca> In-Reply-To: <28bd96eba76eb6b193e64dd03719f5c1@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:04:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: andrey mirtchovski wrote: >if a rio window is being moved while it disappears it'll leave a white >rectangle at the last position it is placed at. to trigger try selecting a >terminal window with the right mouse button and hit ^D, then move it >around and deselect. > >i guess a solution would be to add a control message to redraw the >grey, but i can just see someone 'fixing' it to allow random images to >be put as background and it's all downhill from there :) > > that sounds like a workaround rather than a solution. the solution is to make the behavior go away completely. russ From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:14:11 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 43fa7eb6_7cfe_11d8_9302_00304828b574_21545; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDEEB346FD1 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 43471718_7cfe_11d8_8459_00304828b574_21536; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:10 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B97697580FE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:09 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BD117580FC for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:08 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 42627a90_7cfe_11d8_8b2a_00304828b574_21526; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:14:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81462346FD1 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:11:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eb45eda0_7cfd_11d8_864c_00304828b574_20356; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:11:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E360519DFF; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:11:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F347519BDE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:11:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 95FE919C0F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:10:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC5D119AF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:10:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <40608A5A.4010803@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:15:41 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: it looks like the problem is a spurious image is being left behind, as the white rectangle redraws itself (which it wouldn't if it was just background corruption) so andrey's workaround wouldn't actually work anyway... From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:28:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d895b26_7d00_11d8_8f3b_00304828b574_28466; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0F0B346FE8 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4cb4887e_7d00_11d8_809a_00304828b574_28450; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D93987580FF; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 098367580FB for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 48af4f2a_7d00_11d8_8efd_00304828b574_28386; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6437B346FE4 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:20:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30a4b894_7cff_11d8_83f9_00304828b574_24651; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:20:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7513619C8E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:20:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B97DD19ADA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:20:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DCDC19ADA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:19:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15BDA19BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:19:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67c9a432fcc5efbb15356107e3a5b658@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <40608A5A.4010803@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:19:30 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > that sounds like a workaround rather than a solution. > the solution is to make the behavior go away completely. > > russ it is a more serious problem that requires changes deep in Plan 9's drawing library and we see it all the time without it even bothering us -- try dragging a window border over something that does draw() in the meantime and you'll get a leftover red streak from the border. the solution is to slightly resize the original window causing a new draw() to refresh it. yes, it's a workaround. nobody seems bothered by it enough to solve the problem though (well, in my case i don't know how, so i'm excused) oops, looks like my "workaround" won't work anyway, so it's only an "around" -- back to where we started :) andrey From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:30:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 92c5e722_7d00_11d8_95da_00304828b574_29340; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB942346FF1 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 91f428f4_7d00_11d8_9e47_00304828b574_29329; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8DCF87580FD; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 017757580FA for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 916202a8_7d00_11d8_906b_00304828b574_29324; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:30:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66D21347016 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:26:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 05703472_7d00_11d8_8c07_00304828b574_27523; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:26:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA4FA19DFC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:26:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38C9419DF3; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:26:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C36A19D11; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:25:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EB2D19ADA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:25:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5fd787a7923434da2f34205f4aa33bea@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <67c9a432fcc5efbb15356107e3a5b658@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bljsamdxrzutkxyxpnxkklxjpp" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:30:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bljsamdxrzutkxyxpnxkklxjpp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > it is a more serious problem that requires changes deep in Plan 9's > drawing library and we see it all the time without it even bothering > us -- try dragging a window border over something that does draw() in > the meantime and you'll get a leftover red streak from the border. > the solution is to slightly resize the original window causing a new > draw() to refresh it. that's a different problem as far as i'm aware - due to the fact that rio uses unbuffered windows to draw the borders. --upas-bljsamdxrzutkxyxpnxkklxjpp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Mar 23 19:25:46 GMT 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B96E19D2A; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD11F19C8E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:20:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DCDC19ADA; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:19:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15BDA19BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:19:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67c9a432fcc5efbb15356107e3a5b658@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <40608A5A.4010803@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 12:19:30 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > that sounds like a workaround rather than a solution. > the solution is to make the behavior go away completely. > > russ it is a more serious problem that requires changes deep in Plan 9's drawing library and we see it all the time without it even bothering us -- try dragging a window border over something that does draw() in the meantime and you'll get a leftover red streak from the border. the solution is to slightly resize the original window causing a new draw() to refresh it. yes, it's a workaround. nobody seems bothered by it enough to solve the problem though (well, in my case i don't know how, so i'm excused) oops, looks like my "workaround" won't work anyway, so it's only an "around" -- back to where we started :) andrey --upas-bljsamdxrzutkxyxpnxkklxjpp-- From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:34:05 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b9f8306_7d01_11d8_9557_00304828b574_30964; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA8E5346FE6 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b63657e_7d01_11d8_82dc_00304828b574_30958; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:04 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B05047580F9; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:03 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A98D47580FF for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 099a2444_7d01_11d8_9c18_00304828b574_30890; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:34:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E42C346FE6 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 46300b40_7d00_11d8_8247_00304828b574_28353; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:28:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 41A2519D11; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:28:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE79F19CF1; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:28:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2F70F19D11; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:27:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB58519CF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:27:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <541327ff4b03ef9cd164b6b1a7cef1ea@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:30:07 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've often noticed border droppings and other bits of crud left behind Like Andrey says - does it matter really? I would say that it's not very professional, if you'd paid someone to write it for you, you'd send it back until it was fixed. It certainly doesn't affect any ability to work, though now I have an annoying white square on my desktop I can't get rid of ! From r@geekmail.cc Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:49:48 JST 2004 Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 25c1d084_7d03_11d8_911c_00304828b574_3626; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:49:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E96A347037 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 07acc748_7d03_11d8_9bec_00304828b574_3603; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 578B57580FC; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:17 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFBEF7580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:47:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ef8a366e_7d02_11d8_98c9_00304828b574_3487; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E03AB347037 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d0fd8cb4_7d02_11d8_9814_00304828b574_3368; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:47:26 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 033DF19C8E; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:46:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A635519BD6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:46:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 603A419BFE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:45:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1901519BD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:45:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2NJjilU018394 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:45:44 -0800 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <5fd787a7923434da2f34205f4aa33bea@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:45:43 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > that's a different problem as far as i'm aware - due to the fact that > rio uses unbuffered windows to draw the borders. not exactly. it's a consequence of the one major change in design between 8=C2=BD and rio. 8=C2=BD muxed all graphics ops, but rio only works as a= true window manager. under rio, programs write directly to the screen through their own connection to /dev/draw. the border bug is a consequence of that coupled with my unwillingness to provide a 'grab' operation to lock out drawing access. -rob From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:50:11 JST 2004 Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 33da507e_7d03_11d8_9e5e_00304828b574_3751; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:50:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F855347038 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 15c81b98_7d03_11d8_9441_00304828b574_3618; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:49:21 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 017B77580FE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A62297580FA for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fdaa53aa_7d02_11d8_9051_00304828b574_3493; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AEAF347038 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:47:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id df165b64_7d02_11d8_8f23_00304828b574_3482; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:47:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CB46319D2F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:47:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C05E319D08; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:47:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A53419BE4; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:45:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 997B019BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:45:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <786097446c3f68f435e166932333b2d7@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <67c9a432fcc5efbb15356107e3a5b658@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 19:50:51 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sorry, i was talking rubbish. the bug is nothing to do with unbuffered windows, and is documented in the rio code: /* * BUG: should interlock so applications don't change screen * while tmp[] holds backing store */ it's not a problem deep in the drawing code at all - it's just that rio (well drawgetrect()) is trying to be efficient and drawing the red borders directly on the screen. to be honest, it should be quite fast enough if it just allocates new windows every time it moves the border - that's what i did in the inferno wm and it works fine, as smooth as you like. From r@geekmail.cc Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:51:46 JST 2004 Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6c6293fc_7d03_11d8_94a6_00304828b574_3943; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 046C0347038 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:50:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4e570686_7d03_11d8_9dae_00304828b574_3895; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:50:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E10727580FF; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:50:05 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FDC67580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:49:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30485c26_7d03_11d8_96ff_00304828b574_3740; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:50:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8624034703E for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:48:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 11bd4f50_7d03_11d8_8497_00304828b574_3614; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:49:15 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A7C6919DCC; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84FE119BE4; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:48:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 451B219A9B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:47:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E28819A9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:47:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2NJlOfP020804 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:47:24 -0800 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <28bd96eba76eb6b193e64dd03719f5c1@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:47:23 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i guess a solution would be to add a control message to redraw the > grey, but i can just see someone 'fixing' it to allow random images to > be put as background and it's all downhill from there :) i'd rather just fix the bug. -rob From r@geekmail.cc Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 04:55:58 JST 2004 Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 028d64c4_7d04_11d8_9ce0_00304828b574_4617; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:55:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9890347057 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:54:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e481c876_7d03_11d8_947b_00304828b574_4474; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:55:08 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C681C7580F9; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:54:17 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7379C7580FD for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:53:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c668f9c2_7d03_11d8_8f46_00304828b574_4346; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:54:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FAAD347051 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:52:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a7d95510_7d03_11d8_9878_00304828b574_4209; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 04:53:26 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFF4019CF1; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:52:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFC3819BD6; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:52:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6706419BDE; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28EA319BE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:51:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2NJpVlU021131 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:51:31 -0800 Message-ID: <7f1d729e39aeaff3582d27f30de484a9@google.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: <786097446c3f68f435e166932333b2d7@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 11:51:31 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > to be honest, it should be quite fast enough if it just allocates new > windows every time it moves the border - that's what i did in the > inferno wm and it works fine, as smooth as you like. i tried that and the current code is a consequence of my inability (incompetence?) to get it to work. horrible lockup problems and other disasters. it was also slow, but modern machines are faster. i believe much of the old code was still in rio.c, commented out, until fairly recently. if you think you can make it work, please do. -rob From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 24 08:26:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 05:37:57 JST 2004 Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e00517de_7d09_11d8_9ea6_00304828b574_11266; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:37:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E84C2347078 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:36:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c1f1e592_7d09_11d8_9f6d_00304828b574_11118; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:37:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C53597580FB; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:36:16 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 735F5758101 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:35:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a3db9bc0_7d09_11d8_84f4_00304828b574_10963; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:36:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 515DE34707B for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:13:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 976dd2fc_7d06_11d8_80f0_00304828b574_7617; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:14:27 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E41219D3B; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:13:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAF4719CAB; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:13:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3222519BE4; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:12:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E195719B25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:12:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([80.125.205.134]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3668456-2250>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:10:58 -0500 Message-ID: <008701c41112$c152d050$86cd7d50@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 21:09:24 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i'd rather just fix the bug. yup From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 24 11:22:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 10:09:04 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d778561e_7d2f_11d8_8856_00304828b574_423; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:09:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9183B3471C7 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:09:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d74441d0_7d2f_11d8_8bc3_00304828b574_417; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:09:03 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7B608758111; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:08:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72C08758105 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:08:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb450aae_7d2f_11d8_8ccd_00304828b574_32604; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:08:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (unknown [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 000BE3472D8 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:51:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from nodnsquery by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f314552c_7d24_11d8_8514_00304828b574_9422; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE98419B54; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:50:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F6E119B2C; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:50:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A9A7E19B2C; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D0B119AF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:49:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 15:49:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think there's another bug. Suppose you "cpu -c rio" and in the inner rio (the one on the cpu server), create windows and hide one or more of them. Then move the inner rio slightly (I dragged the border a few pixels). I think that hiding and exposing the inner rio will also trigger the bug. The inner rio then redraws its windows but now it thinks the hidden windows are visible. If you select Move on button 3, point the cursor where an invisible window was (but now you can only see background) and click, you'll see a red border until you release, then the hidden window will reappear. Not only that, but if you now click button 3, the hidden window will still be on the menu and can be selected, at which point it drops off the menu. If you often hide windows and have lots of overlap of windows, this can lead to very mysterious behaviour. From r@geekmail.cc Wed Mar 24 20:33:09 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 13:38:16 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0ff56c6c_7d4d_11d8_839a_00304828b574_4506; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD2633473F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0f3cf1dc_7d4d_11d8_876e_00304828b574_4498; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AEFC47580F9; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:12 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BED07580FE for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0ef5fdae_7d4d_11d8_849a_00304828b574_4493; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:38:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F01633473F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:36:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id df7adcd4_7d4c_11d8_8588_00304828b574_3826; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:36:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3F2919B1F; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:36:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC0CA19BE9; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:36:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8A35319C7D; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:35:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from 216-239-45-4.google.com (216-239-45-4.google.com [216.239.45.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4817219B74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 23:35:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from stinkhorn.corp.google.com (stinkhorn.corp.google.com [172.24.64.199]) by 216-239-45-4.google.com (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2O4ZNfP027894 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:23 -0800 Message-ID: <23273620f560dbea27646c85aceb6d4a@google.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: "rob pike, esq." In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 20:35:23 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-4.3 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: yes, there are two bugs. one isn't worth fixing, one is. but rog might fix the one not worth fixing, if he thinks it's worthwhile. -rob From nemo@lsub.org Wed Mar 24 20:33:11 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 17:03:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4fa47b0_7d69_11d8_903c_00304828b574_22133; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BB8A34418A for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4c5551e_7d69_11d8_9a79_00304828b574_22130; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5ED277580F9; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2EE6758102 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:30 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bd463916_7d69_11d8_8604_00304828b574_22006; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:03:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0B41344370 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:55:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a7f2911e_7d68_11d8_9136_00304828b574_18043; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:55:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BAAB819BE4; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:55:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89926199CC; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:55:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 67DFF19AFC; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:54:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8CAF199BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 02:54:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9e8673aaefac7706fa9d27891bafeed9@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio bug From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:54:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > unwillingness to provide a 'grab' > operation to lock out drawing access. A grab that is timed out shouldn't be a problem. At least if nobody but rio uses it. Or is there something else? From pavlovetsky@ztel.ru Wed Mar 24 20:33:12 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 19:25:55 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a211ccd2_7d7d_11d8_8b0d_00304828b574_21864; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADB24344535 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a1d7b9ca_7d7d_11d8_84dd_00304828b574_21861; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9DA167580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:54 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C3867580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a172a08a_7d7d_11d8_8df8_00304828b574_21858; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE7F6344535 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a09c1aa6_7d7d_11d8_98ff_00304828b574_21854; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:25:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22B8719B3D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:25:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 489FB19B58; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:25:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6F3E19B58; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:24:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C88519B7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:23:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B65Jm-0004EB-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:09:02 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Anton Pavlovetsky Message-ID: <81b3a3f4.0403240101.500fc689@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:07:02 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In order to make my Trident 9385 work I add the following ID to the VGADB (where cyber938x controller sits): 0xC7350-0xC7390=3D"TVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05)" # IBM Thinkpad 760XL Now I have this message while booting: aux/vga: unknown Cyber revision 0x34 I know I have to do something to help aux/vga to program my chip, but I don't know what. You see, my idea is to find an extra technical information about my card, its ramdac, clock values. I tried to find specification, but failed. From the other point of view, I could miss something in manuals - I am sorry if that is the case. I included plan9.ini, pci.txt and vgainfo.txt for your reference. PLAN9.INI *nomp=3D1 distname=3Dplan9 partition=3Dnew nobootprompt=3Dlocal!/bzroot #console=3D0 monitor=3Dsvga vgasize=3D800x600x8 mouseport=3Dps2 debug=3D1 bootfile=3Dfd0!dos!9pcflop.gz PCI.TXT 0.0.0: 06.00.00 8086/1235 0 0.1.0: 06.01.00 8086/122e 0 0.2.0: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 0.2.1: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 0.3.0: 03.00.00 1023/9660 11 0:08000000 4194304 1:08400000 65536 2:08800000 4194304 VGAINFO.TXT main->snarf vga->snarf cyber938x->snarf vga->attr: 0xC7350-0xC7390=3DTVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05) vga->dump vga misc 67 vga feature 01 vga sequencer 03 00 03 00 02 vga crt 5F 4F 50 82 55 81 BF 1F - 00 4F 0D 0E 00 00 05 50 9C 8E 8F 28 1F 96 B9 A3 - FF vga graphics 00 00 00 00 00 10 0E 00 - FF vga attribute 00 01 02 03 04 05 14 07 - 38 39 3A 3B 3C 3D 3E 3F 0C 00 0F 08 00 vga virtual 0 0 vga panning off vga vm a b 4194304 0 vga vmz 1048576 vga apz 0 vga linear 1 cyber938x->dump cyber938x Seq08 97 34 00 D3 F8 00 00 B0 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 cyber938x Old Seq0C F8 28 E8 cyber938x pcr 00 cyber938x Crt19 4A 00 00 00 00 00 43 cyber938x Crt20 30 CF 00 C8 80 07 34 00 - 0C 8C 14 00 00 00 00 5F 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 10 00 00 21 00 00 00 00 20 00 20 00 FF 03 00 00 - FF FF FF 00 FF FF FF 00 00 FF 02 C0 03 00 00 FF - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 cyber938x CrtCF 00 cyber938x Gr09 00 00 00 00 00 00 14 cyber938x Gr10 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 05 90 16 88 D7 02 00 50 - 06 00 81 00 00 07 00 A3 81 00 00 30 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 D0 00 00 02 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 9F 99 B0 A0 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 53 13 A2 30 14 00 cyber938x mclk 00 00 cyber938x vclk 00 00 57272720 cyber938x lcd size 800 600 vmf 0 vmdf 40000000 vf1 0 vbw 0 cyber938x->options vga->init cyber938x->init sequencer->enter on sequencer->leave on unknown Cyber revision 0x34 From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Wed Mar 24 20:33:12 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 19:43:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22efddc4_7d80_11d8_9c88_00304828b574_25184; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0B3234456C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22b797fc_7d80_11d8_8d0f_00304828b574_25181; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C566A7580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 207B37580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 223f3528_7d80_11d8_9cc3_00304828b574_25178; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2973F34456C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 218db7bc_7d80_11d8_8ae7_00304828b574_25174; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:43:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 957D819C39; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:43:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84A6E19BFE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:43:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 89ADF19BFE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:42:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20C6919A20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 05:42:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2OAgiCi005555 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:42:44 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2OAghXc024346 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:42:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2OAghe08231 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:42:43 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403241042.i2OAghe08231@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] acme, rio workalike available in plan 9 ports In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 23 Mar 2004 16:39:56 +0100." <200403231539.i2NFduR25907@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <405D1F63.5010002@swtch.com>, <200403221630.i2MGUf511738@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> <4060532D.1020803@swtch.com> <200403231539.i2NFduR25907@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:42:43 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: SunOS update: plumber works after fixing a name clash in fsys.c (s/clock/myclock/) In acme, for some commands, button-2 execute consistently fails (command args matter: 'echo date' works, 'echo $PLAN9' doesn't) with an error like echo : sys: segmentation violation in the main +Errors window, not in the one for the directory associated with the tag in which I have the command. I'll start digging - but maybe somebody has an idea? In the same way, the plan9/bin/ps (patched for sunos) occasionally gives a similar error about sort (fail to reproduce right now). Any ideas, anyone? Axel. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 24 21:16:23 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 21:05:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 96ed3e78_7d8b_11d8_9c64_00304828b574_10715; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 061F834465C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 96bb7a82_7d8b_11d8_93da_00304828b574_10712; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D8DFE7580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EDAA7580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 966446a4_7d8b_11d8_97f0_00304828b574_10709; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A17E34465C for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 958c08e8_7d8b_11d8_9269_00304828b574_10705; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 21:05:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B976819D63; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:05:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3A7119D01; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:05:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EEC0E19D0E; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:04:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A850E19D01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:04:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HV200EAKXJZAN@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:04:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from [66.26.58.22] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:04:47 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <7243e972a4bc.72a4bc7243e9@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 07:04:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Your driver isn't currently supported by the cyber938x driver. It's easy enough to fix in the source code. just grep -n 9385 /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/cyber* to find the case statement you need(IIRC they have 0x33, so just add it after that). And you'll be good to go. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: Anton Pavlovetsky Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 5:07 am Subject: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 > In order to make my Trident 9385 work I add the following ID > to the VGADB (where cyber938x controller sits): > > 0xC7350-0xC7390="TVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05)" # IBM Thinkpad 760XL > > Now I have this message while booting: > > aux/vga: unknown Cyber revision 0x34 > > I know I have to do something to help aux/vga to program my chip, > but I don't know what. You see, my idea is to find an extra technical > information about my card, its ramdac, clock values. I tried to find > specification, but failed. From the other point of view, I could miss > something in manuals - I am sorry if that is the case. > I included plan9.ini, pci.txt and vgainfo.txt for your reference. > > PLAN9.INI > *nomp=1 > distname=plan9 > partition=new > nobootprompt=local!/bzroot > #console=0 > monitor=svga > vgasize=800x600x8 > mouseport=ps2 > debug=1 > bootfile=fd0!dos!9pcflop.gz > > PCI.TXT > 0.0.0: 06.00.00 8086/1235 0 > 0.1.0: 06.01.00 8086/122e 0 > 0.2.0: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 > 0.2.1: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 > 0.3.0: 03.00.00 1023/9660 11 0:08000000 4194304 > 1:08400000 65536 2:08800000 4194304 > > VGAINFO.TXT > main->snarf > vga->snarf > cyber938x->snarf > vga->attr: 0xC7350-0xC7390=TVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05) > vga->dump > vga misc 67 > vga feature 01 > vga sequencer 03 00 03 00 02 > vga crt 5F 4F 50 82 55 81 BF 1F - 00 4F 0D 0E 00 00 05 50 > 9C 8E 8F 28 1F 96 B9 A3 - FF > vga graphics 00 00 00 00 00 10 0E 00 - FF > vga attribute 00 01 02 03 04 05 14 07 - 38 39 3A 3B 3C 3D 3E 3F > 0C 00 0F 08 00 > vga virtual 0 0 > vga panning off > vga vm a b 4194304 0 > vga vmz 1048576 > vga apz 0 > vga linear 1 > cyber938x->dump > cyber938x Seq08 97 34 00 D3 F8 00 00 B0 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > cyber938x Old Seq0C F8 28 E8 > cyber938x pcr 00 > cyber938x Crt19 4A 00 00 00 00 00 43 > cyber938x Crt20 30 CF 00 C8 80 07 34 00 - 0C 8C 14 00 00 00 00 5F > 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 10 00 00 21 00 00 00 00 > 20 00 20 00 FF 03 00 00 - FF FF FF 00 FF FF FF 00 > 00 FF 02 C0 03 00 00 FF - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > cyber938x CrtCF 00 > cyber938x Gr09 00 00 00 00 00 00 14 > cyber938x Gr10 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 05 90 16 88 D7 02 00 50 - 06 00 81 00 00 07 00 A3 > 81 00 00 30 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 D0 00 00 02 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 9F 99 B0 A0 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 53 13 A2 30 14 00 > cyber938x mclk 00 00 > cyber938x vclk 00 00 57272720 > > cyber938x lcd size 800 600 > > vmf 0 vmdf 40000000 vf1 0 vbw 0 > cyber938x->options > vga->init > cyber938x->init > sequencer->enter on > sequencer->leave on > unknown Cyber revision 0x34 > From a@9srv.net Wed Mar 24 23:20:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 22:17:38 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9f29cf3e_7d95_11d8_923b_00304828b574_26303; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C88A334473B for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9ef9a020_7d95_11d8_91a0_00304828b574_26299; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id ABCD57580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 693E97580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9ebe0be6_7d95_11d8_9290_00304828b574_26296; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 745BA34473B for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9e0da0a8_7d95_11d8_82bc_00304828b574_26292; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8ABB919D9D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D2D019BE4; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:17:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C548419B50; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:16:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4D0319A1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:16:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: [9fans] rc in plan9port and $PLAN9 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:03:30 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable in the /src/cmd/rc/plan9ish.c i've got, the bit in Rcmain that looks for $PLAN9 (and thus finds rcmain) is commented out. any reason? how is teh #9/rcmain in there supposed to work? i may be confused. =E3=82=A2 From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 24 23:20:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 22:21:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30dd9366_7d96_11d8_94f8_00304828b574_26894; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21E59344746 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30998414_7d96_11d8_9a08_00304828b574_26891; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 04B057580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1B057580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 305ac51c_7d96_11d8_9bb2_00304828b574_26888; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A067A344746 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f989d5c_7d96_11d8_8fec_00304828b574_26884; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:21:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EBF1C19B42; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:21:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53E2119BCF; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:21:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1284519DFD; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:20:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D4D819CDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:20:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8ba882e70ce69690a670ecc4f7d072b4@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] replica Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:20:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I've rebuilt rio, sam, acme, and vnc{vs} for the keyboard.h change. I've also rebuilt aux/vga since it was getting behind. Make sure you've removed any spaces around = in your /lib/vgadb. I've already done it on the sources one. From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 24 23:20:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 22:29:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5127ecce_7d97_11d8_8844_00304828b574_28700; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEA6B344765 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 50df70e8_7d97_11d8_8a0a_00304828b574_28697; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A05067580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54EB37580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 509d535c_7d97_11d8_98bc_00304828b574_28694; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0041E344765 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4fb120e0_7d97_11d8_842d_00304828b574_28690; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:29:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C032319E15; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:29:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A96219E07; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:29:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 41DEA19E06; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:28:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B48F19BCF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HV300RLR1G7OY@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:28:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:28:55 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <733534735459.735459733534@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:28:55 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I put the case statement into a patch in sources(mondef.cyberhack) if you want to try it out. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: Anton Pavlovetsky Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 5:07 am Subject: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 > In order to make my Trident 9385 work I add the following ID > to the VGADB (where cyber938x controller sits): > > 0xC7350-0xC7390="TVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05)" # IBM Thinkpad 760XL > > Now I have this message while booting: > > aux/vga: unknown Cyber revision 0x34 > > I know I have to do something to help aux/vga to program my chip, > but I don't know what. You see, my idea is to find an extra technical > information about my card, its ramdac, clock values. I tried to find > specification, but failed. From the other point of view, I could miss > something in manuals - I am sorry if that is the case. > I included plan9.ini, pci.txt and vgainfo.txt for your reference. > > PLAN9.INI > *nomp=1 > distname=plan9 > partition=new > nobootprompt=local!/bzroot > #console=0 > monitor=svga > vgasize=800x600x8 > mouseport=ps2 > debug=1 > bootfile=fd0!dos!9pcflop.gz > > PCI.TXT > 0.0.0: 06.00.00 8086/1235 0 > 0.1.0: 06.01.00 8086/122e 0 > 0.2.0: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 > 0.2.1: 06.07.00 104c/ac12 255 > 0.3.0: 03.00.00 1023/9660 11 0:08000000 4194304 > 1:08400000 65536 2:08800000 4194304 > > VGAINFO.TXT > main->snarf > vga->snarf > cyber938x->snarf > vga->attr: 0xC7350-0xC7390=TVGA BIOS Z6.1I (0.05) > vga->dump > vga misc 67 > vga feature 01 > vga sequencer 03 00 03 00 02 > vga crt 5F 4F 50 82 55 81 BF 1F - 00 4F 0D 0E 00 00 > 05 50 > 9C 8E 8F 28 1F 96 B9 A3 - FF > vga graphics 00 00 00 00 00 10 0E 00 - FF > vga attribute 00 01 02 03 04 05 14 07 - 38 39 3A 3B 3C 3D > 3E 3F > 0C 00 0F 08 00 > vga virtual 0 0 > vga panning off > vga vm a b 4194304 0 > vga vmz 1048576 > vga apz 0 > vga linear 1 > cyber938x->dump > cyber938x Seq08 97 34 00 D3 F8 00 00 B0 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 > 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 > cyber938x Old Seq0C F8 28 E8 > cyber938x pcr 00 > cyber938x Crt19 4A 00 00 00 00 00 43 > cyber938x Crt20 30 CF 00 C8 80 07 34 00 - 0C 8C 14 00 00 00 > 00 5F > 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 10 00 00 21 00 00 > 00 00 > 20 00 20 00 FF 03 00 00 - FF FF FF 00 FF FF > FF 00 > 00 FF 02 C0 03 00 00 FF - 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 > cyber938x CrtCF 00 > cyber938x Gr09 00 00 00 00 00 00 14 > cyber938x Gr10 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 > 05 90 16 88 D7 02 00 50 - 06 00 81 00 00 07 > 00 A3 > 81 00 00 30 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 > 00 00 D0 00 00 02 00 00 - 00 00 00 00 00 00 > 00 00 > 9F 99 B0 A0 00 00 00 00 - 00 00 53 13 A2 30 > 14 00 > cyber938x mclk 00 00 > cyber938x vclk 00 00 57272720 > > cyber938x lcd size 800 600 > > vmf 0 vmdf 40000000 vf1 0 vbw 0 > cyber938x->options > vga->init > cyber938x->init > sequencer->enter on > sequencer->leave on > unknown Cyber revision 0x34 > From steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com Wed Mar 24 23:20:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 24 22:49:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22bd4e6c_7d9a_11d8_92d4_00304828b574_31840; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DB3E3447A0 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2272c5d6_7d9a_11d8_9bfe_00304828b574_31837; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 41D197580FA; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0BA87580F9 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22360dbc_7d9a_11d8_82f8_00304828b574_31834; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A1AE3447A0 for ; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21870e84_7d9a_11d8_95b8_00304828b574_31830; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:49:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2BCD419E0B; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:49:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B254D19A19; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:49:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B31A619E17; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from paris (cpc2-sout4-6-0-cust223.sot3.cable.ntl.com [81.111.117.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FEF119E11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 08:48:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6b075e39140ebca87aca9cbee4b70e4c@snellwilcox.com> From: steve-simon@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] /rc/bin/ap Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:48:23 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: fixed ap script now in /n/sources/patch/ap-fixed, the Newsday website was stable for 2-3 years until now, if they start redesigning it often I will give up the fight. -Steve From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 01:01:07 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7602919c_7dac_11d8_8577_00304828b574_28892; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FF6334491C for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 75d182a0_7dac_11d8_9558_00304828b574_28889; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 167607580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:07 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1C577580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 759407d6_7dac_11d8_9376_00304828b574_28886; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF20D34491C for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 74e4ff16_7dac_11d8_85d0_00304828b574_28882; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:01:06 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B7F219E0B; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C580719E06; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC4FB19CA3; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:59:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79E9419BCE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E443C24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:59:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4061B048.8010109@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rc in plan9port and $PLAN9 References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:59:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: a@9srv.net wrote: >in the /src/cmd/rc/plan9ish.c i've got, the bit in Rcmain >that looks for $PLAN9 (and thus finds rcmain) is commented >out. any reason? how is teh #9/rcmain in there supposed to >work? i may be confused. > > #9 is a clumsy hack that I brought over from more full-featured ports. It means "the $PLAN9 directory" to open and Bopen. It was a mistake (it's too hard to contain, and it makes ported programs different from normal programs; same mistake as handling dotdot specially in some programs but not others). I'm going to rid the tree of these references. But it should be working right now. Russ From matthias@mteege.de Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 01:41:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 24f7d7ca_7db2_11d8_97ba_00304828b574_3693; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3369C34498B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 24c6a8c6_7db2_11d8_94ea_00304828b574_3690; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 15D447580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C08317580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 24864718_7db2_11d8_8bca_00304828b574_3686; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD4C434498B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23d6f204_7db2_11d8_9806_00304828b574_3682; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:41:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A372E19E1D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:41:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F80C19CD0; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:41:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8410F19DFB; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:40:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [81.2.131.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E55C19B2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:40:13 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 6028 invoked by uid 66); 24 Mar 2004 16:40:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 2361 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2004 16:39:38 -0000 Received: from gic.mteege.de (HELO mteege.de) (192.168.153.10) by 0 with SMTP; 24 Mar 2004 16:39:38 -0000 Received: (qmail 45896 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2004 16:35:02 -0000 Received: from loco.mteege.de (HELO loco) (192.168.153.22) by 0 with SMTP; 24 Mar 2004 16:35:02 -0000 Message-ID: From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] update via replica/pull Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 16:35:42 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Moin, I try to update from sources but I'm not sure about the procedure. Is 9fs sources bind /n/sources/plan9 /n/dist replica/pull -v /n/dist what I'm looking for? What about permissions and users? Can I do this as "normal" user? I use an non fossil fileserver. Is it necessary to turn off the permission checking on the fileserver? After replica/pull, which parts should be rebuild? Is there somthing like "make world"? Many thanks Matthias From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 01:53:19 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c0d228d4_7db3_11d8_96d5_00304828b574_8226; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D70034499B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c0a12dd8_7db3_11d8_8ec9_00304828b574_8223; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:19 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 225097580F9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76F5D758103 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bf055de6_7db3_11d8_8a2b_00304828b574_8200; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6873434499B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:49:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 410ae24e_7db3_11d8_8859_00304828b574_6345; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:49:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC91919E2B; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:49:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EBDEB19E20; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:49:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1ECBD19E20; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:48:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1153919E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:48:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 09:48:50 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: replica/pull -v /dist/replica/network should be enough From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 01:54:38 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id efc9c00c_7db3_11d8_819d_00304828b574_8830; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8A5934499D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ef940c28_7db3_11d8_837d_00304828b574_8827; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D51C87580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CFF17580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ef5ac01c_7db3_11d8_89cd_00304828b574_8824; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D21F34499D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eea37c72_7db3_11d8_96a9_00304828b574_8819; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:54:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23D6E19E22; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:54:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E3C119E11; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:54:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1DE4D19E71; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:53:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BB9819BB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:53:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6E1C24FE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:53:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4061BD17.4090306@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:53:43 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Matthias Teege wrote: >Moin, > >I try to update from sources but I'm not sure about the >procedure. Is > >9fs sources >bind /n/sources/plan9 /n/dist >replica/pull -v /n/dist > >what I'm looking for? > > 9fs sources cp /n/sources/plan9/usr/glenda/bin/rc/pull /usr/you/bin/rc pull should work. You may already have the script in /usr/glenda/bin/rc depending on how recently you installed. >What about permissions and users? Can I do this as "normal" >user? I use an non fossil fileserver. Is it necessary to turn off >the permission checking on the fileserver? After replica/pull, >which parts should be rebuild? Is there somthing like "make >world"? > > Pull will take care of kfscmd allow and disallow. We try to keep the binaries up-to-date so you shouldn't need to "make world". If you want to, just cd /sys/src and mk all; mk install. Russ From matthias@mteege.de Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:21:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bb24b768_7db7_11d8_9888_00304828b574_13432; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95C0A3449FC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id baee8706_7db7_11d8_8efe_00304828b574_13429; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 81C567580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35F6B7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bab2a556_7db7_11d8_810f_00304828b574_13426; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 377B73449FC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b9fc3ab4_7db7_11d8_98f9_00304828b574_13422; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:21:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 83DF619B10; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:21:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B49A19B11; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:21:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5394419BCE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:20:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [81.2.131.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECD9419B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:20:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 6608 invoked by uid 66); 24 Mar 2004 17:20:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 2676 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2004 17:17:52 -0000 Received: from gic.mteege.de (HELO mteege.de) (192.168.153.10) by 0 with SMTP; 24 Mar 2004 17:17:52 -0000 Received: (qmail 48743 invoked from network); 24 Mar 2004 17:13:16 -0000 Received: from loco.mteege.de (HELO loco) (192.168.153.22) by 0 with SMTP; 24 Mar 2004 17:13:16 -0000 Message-ID: <42651da6b45efb5ab911f10cad609387@mteege.de> From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull In-Reply-To: <4061BD17.4090306@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:13:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 24 17:02:39 GMT 2004, rsc@swtch.com wrote: > 9fs sources > cp /n/sources/plan9/usr/glenda/bin/rc/pull /usr/you/bin/rc > pull > > should work. You may already have the script in /usr/glenda/bin/rc > depending on how recently you installed. I don't use a local KFS. I use an "old style" fileserver. Pull gives me term% pull kfscmd: can't open commands file kfs init 2210: can't open /dev/sdC0/fs kfs 2210: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0001d649 mount: can't open /srv/kfs: '/srv/kfs' file does not exist clientmount: 9fs 2208: mount 2211: open kfscmd: can't open commands file I think I must disable permission checking on the fileserver. Matthias From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:25:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4836d78a_7db8_11d8_8e13_00304828b574_14086; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49B4B344A04 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 48025302_7db8_11d8_97f3_00304828b574_14083; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 36C227580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4E777580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 47cab6f4_7db8_11d8_8825_00304828b574_14080; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2E3E344A04 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 471c1b80_7db8_11d8_9bda_00304828b574_14076; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:25:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 97DD619E1D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:25:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C425F19BEE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:25:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 66A3619BCE; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:24:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F98019BEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:24:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <73fc6020ce2ff2aeff1d813f0a508e13@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 10:24:53 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable i've submitted a patch bringing drawterm in compliance with Plan 9's special character handling -- the latest recompilation of rio/acme/vnc[vs] and friends will cause them to misinterpret the old down-arrow key. new binaries for freebsd and linux (sorry, no windows around) are available at: http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/ the binaries also include David Tolpin's patch to accept UTF-8 input from X (see below). =D0=B0=D0=BD=D0=B4=D1=80=D0=B5=D0=B9 From skip@9netics.com Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:30:59 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 038ef99a_7db9_11d8_8ce4_00304828b574_14791; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91018344A0D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03577830_7db9_11d8_8026_00304828b574_14788; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:58 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 73CEE7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D5697580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03192968_7db9_11d8_80ca_00304828b574_14785; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EAB3344A0D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 02628474_7db9_11d8_8425_00304828b574_14781; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:30:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2414919E11; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:30:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CD7019B50; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:30:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5578319AD7; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:29:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9322E19B50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:29:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <687c4bf5db7647a2686a17dc776af2b3@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull From: "Skip Tavakkolian" In-Reply-To: <42651da6b45efb5ab911f10cad609387@mteege.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 09:32:53 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I don't use a local KFS. I use an "old style" fileserver. Pull gives me > If you mean kenfs, you'll need to modify your /dist/replica/network. I've included mine as a sample. May not fit your need exactly: cpu% cat /dist/replica/network #!/bin/rc s=/n/dist/dist/replica serverroot=/n/dist serverlog=$s/plan9.log serverproto=$s/plan9.proto fn servermount { srv tcp!sources.cs.bell-labs.com sources /n/sources bind /n/sources/plan9 /n/dist } fn serverupdate { status='' } fn clientmount { 9fs il!fs /n/fs } c=/n/fs/dist/replica clientroot=/n/fs clientdb=$c/client/plan9.db clientexclude=(dist/replica/client) clientlog=$c/client/plan9.log # applyopt=(-u -T$c/client/plan9.time) # remove the -u so we can do the pulls with somebody who is # a member of sys applyopt=(-T$c/client/plan9.time) > I think I must disable permission checking on the > fileserver. > > Matthias For permission checking either add yourself to sys group or do allow on the fs console. Check Russ' response to similar questions in the past at groups.google.com (comp.os.plan9) From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:33:02 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4cfa3d7e_7db9_11d8_817a_00304828b574_15187; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5FA6344A10 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4cc8e40e_7db9_11d8_8e4a_00304828b574_15184; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:01 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A73427580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:01 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6022E7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c893886_7db9_11d8_9961_00304828b574_15141; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F047344A10 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4bdb15bc_7db9_11d8_9647_00304828b574_15133; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:33:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4CEA619B42; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:32:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9BF419E22; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:32:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 84EBE19E20; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:31:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F72F19E1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:31:33 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2OHiFV0001238 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:44:15 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D74@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix Thread-Index: AcQRxSKa/p/hYho0TqijZoQ5/bBdHwAAFYEQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:31:30 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: PiDQsNC90LTRgNC10LkNCg0K0YDRg9GB0YHQutC40Lkg0YHQu9C+0L0g0LTRgNGD0LMg0LHQvtC7 0LPQsNGA0YHQutC+0LPQviDRgdC70L7QvdCwDQoNCnl1cCwgd29ya3MgbGlrZSBhIGNoYXJtDQo= From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:34:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 90c0a818_7db9_11d8_8b28_00304828b574_15812; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 684C0344A13 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8fe8c312_7db9_11d8_990a_00304828b574_15802; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1F23C7580FF; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:54 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 772967580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8f596956_7db9_11d8_9442_00304828b574_15795; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 738A5344A14 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 834ca11e_7db9_11d8_9747_00304828b574_15671; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:34:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1631419E2D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:34:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B69DC19E1F; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:34:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B20B919AD7; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from paris (cpc2-sout4-6-0-cust223.sot3.cable.ntl.com [81.111.117.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 724DE19E22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:33:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull In-Reply-To: <42651da6b45efb5ab911f10cad609387@mteege.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-uivojopqqwprzgtaedsdgcltpc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:33:43 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-uivojopqqwprzgtaedsdgcltpc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sounds right to me, I only ever use kfs or fossil. --upas-uivojopqqwprzgtaedsdgcltpc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by mta07-svc.ntlworld.com (InterMail vM.4.01.03.37 201-229-121-137-20020806) with ESMTP id <20040324172148.WFWE325.mta07-svc.ntlworld.com@mail.cse.psu.edu> for ; 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24 Mar 2004 17:13:16 -0000 Message-ID: <42651da6b45efb5ab911f10cad609387@mteege.de> From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull In-Reply-To: <4061BD17.4090306@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 17:13:56 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 24 17:02:39 GMT 2004, rsc@swtch.com wrote: > 9fs sources > cp /n/sources/plan9/usr/glenda/bin/rc/pull /usr/you/bin/rc > pull > > should work. You may already have the script in /usr/glenda/bin/rc > depending on how recently you installed. I don't use a local KFS. I use an "old style" fileserver. Pull gives me term% pull kfscmd: can't open commands file kfs init 2210: can't open /dev/sdC0/fs kfs 2210: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0001d649 mount: can't open /srv/kfs: '/srv/kfs' file does not exist clientmount: 9fs 2208: mount 2211: open kfscmd: can't open commands file I think I must disable permission checking on the fileserver. Matthias --upas-uivojopqqwprzgtaedsdgcltpc-- From 9nut@9netics.com Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:42:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aa844790_7dba_11d8_8512_00304828b574_17437; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B64B344A23 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aa535964_7dba_11d8_92db_00304828b574_17434; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1E03E7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB59F7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aa14b6d2_7dba_11d8_85e1_00304828b574_17431; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC8B8344A23 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a96815c6_7dba_11d8_8840_00304828b574_17427; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 90CB719E31; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C858919E29; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:42:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 207DC19E2A; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:41:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9FA419E22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:41:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5286681eac528f3d0d5e3b3417bc4fbf@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D74@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 09:45:40 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> =D0=B0=D0=BD=D0=B4=D1=80=D0=B5=D0=B9 >=20 > =D1=80=D1=83=D1=81=D1=81=D0=BA=D0=B8=D0=B9 =D1=81=D0=BB=D0=BE=D0=BD =D0= =B4=D1=80=D1=83=D0=B3 =D0=B1=D0=BE=D0=BB=D0=B3=D0=B0=D1=80=D1=81=D0=BA=D0= =BE=D0=B3=D0=BE =D1=81=D0=BB=D0=BE=D0=BD=D0=B0 >=20 > yup, works like a charm What are the extra carriage returns for? From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 02:45:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1426733a_7dbb_11d8_951d_00304828b574_17883; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 722C3344A2F for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13f5a534_7dbb_11d8_8a74_00304828b574_17880; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 53BA37580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B1037580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13b52d24_7dbb_11d8_93b9_00304828b574_17877; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77E3F344A2F for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 12a93736_7dbb_11d8_9f15_00304828b574_17873; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D9F6A19C1A; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:45:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 529C319B13; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:45:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3C9419B38; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:44:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1714519B13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 12:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2OHvCZB001375 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:57:13 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D75@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix Thread-Index: AcQRx3JkJeVnKkNkTgyh7dz9P3U9BQAACNEA From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:44:28 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: PiA+PiDQsNC90LTRgNC10LkNCj4gPiANCj4gPiDRgNGD0YHRgdC60LjQuSDRgdC70L7QvSDQtNGA 0YPQsyDQsdC+0LvQs9Cw0YDRgdC60L7Qs9C+INGB0LvQvtC90LANCj4gPiANCj4gPiB5dXAsIHdv cmtzIGxpa2UgYSBjaGFybQ0KPiANCj4gV2hhdCBhcmUgdGhlIGV4dHJhIGNhcnJpYWdlIHJldHVy bnMgZm9yPw0KPiANCg0KY29weS1wYXN0ZSBpbnRvIE91dGxvb2sNCg== From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Thu Mar 25 11:54:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 03:08:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4b6832fe_7dbe_11d8_873f_00304828b574_22053; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE54C344A8F for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4aa95a64_7dbe_11d8_9ba4_00304828b574_22044; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 33B387580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7FA87580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 49994b7a_7dbe_11d8_908d_00304828b574_22039; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:08:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96157344A8B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:07:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 261507de_7dbe_11d8_9a5b_00304828b574_21663; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AF1E819B42; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:07:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BF8219C5F; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:07:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC4A819BE4; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:06:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9A9F19B42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:06:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] drawterm keyboard.h fix From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D75@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 11:06:46 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: due to a mishap i only got ssl-less binaries on my web page. please download again if you want to use devssl... as for carriage returns, i seem to get them added by procmail in some magic way, they don't appear if my mail goes directly through a Plan 9 server. andrey From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 25 11:54:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 03:49:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0370aef8_7dc4_11d8_90a0_00304828b574_30868; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4E2A344B17 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 033b08d4_7dc4_11d8_86b2_00304828b574_30865; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C1DEC7580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 78BD87580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03016f98_7dc4_11d8_8141_00304828b574_30862; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 863D0344B18 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 02527498_7dc4_11d8_8ef5_00304828b574_30852; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 03:49:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80C9819D39; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:49:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0178119CD0; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:49:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9199B19CDD; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:48:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4651919CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 13:48:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2OIll1b055493 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:47:47 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2OIllFJ055492 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:47:47 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403241847.i2OIllFJ055492@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] samterm, not sam Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:47:47 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, samterm should be recompiled to work with the new keyboard handling code David From geoff@collyer.net Thu Mar 25 11:54:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 08:53:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7bb0059c_7dee_11d8_9861_00304828b574_350; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D672344F4C for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7b800b62_7dee_11d8_810a_00304828b574_346; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5E69B7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 148F37580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7b3e92e0_7dee_11d8_9577_00304828b574_343; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23564344F4D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7a90511c_7dee_11d8_83cd_00304828b574_334; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:53:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 740CB19D72; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 18:53:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48CCC19BE3; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 18:53:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4481A19BE3; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 18:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA16D19B84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 18:52:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <4061BD17.4090306@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 15:52:12 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: However, only 386 binaries are kept up to date on sources. If you have plan 9 machines of other architectures (e.g., arm [bitsy], alpha), you'll want to rebuild those binaries when the sources change. From matt@proweb.co.uk Thu Mar 25 11:54:39 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 09:33:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 147579ce_7df4_11d8_8fd8_00304828b574_10283; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A27B344FF0 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 14455442_7df4_11d8_8426_00304828b574_10280; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2CC307580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8EA27580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1405f6d0_7df4_11d8_8157_00304828b574_10277; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA4CE344FF0 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13593666_7df4_11d8_9830_00304828b574_10273; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE71619C71; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DBC819BE3; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:33:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 31DE619C3C; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:32:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D65D919AA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 19:32:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] LinuxBIOS on /. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 00:35:08 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/03/24/2327229 m From rminnich@lanl.gov Thu Mar 25 15:14:33 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 12:18:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21eeb676_7e0b_11d8_9c67_00304828b574_18898; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DCCB34521A for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21bbfc68_7e0b_11d8_86cf_00304828b574_18895; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2BFB77580FC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D31E47580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2176ef06_7e0b_11d8_8000_00304828b574_18891; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD76834521C for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 20c611c2_7e0b_11d8_9125_00304828b574_18876; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E59D19E1C; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:18:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A03819D9D; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:18:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DDD4A19E04; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0B6619D72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 22:17:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2P3HAjt005457 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 20:17:10 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2P3H975025475 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 20:17:09 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2P3H9fQ031969 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 24 Mar 2004 20:17:09 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Subject: [9fans] the /. article Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004 20:17:09 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: sorry folks there were some 'boot plan9' numbers in there that went away. But the numbers were power on to cpu ready for 'cpu' commands: 11 seconds. plan 9 reboots plan 9 to ready for 'cpu' commands: 6 seconds. This on the dog-slow EPIA. ron From matthias@mteege.de Thu Mar 25 19:27:10 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 15:18:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 46a8ecde_7e24_11d8_901f_00304828b574_29371; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4E36345466 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 460ee8b4_7e24_11d8_8518_00304828b574_29362; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5AAA8758100; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12CCF7580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 45b385c8_7e24_11d8_8637_00304828b574_29358; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C80C8345466 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:16:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ffb0bd2a_7e23_11d8_8a54_00304828b574_28467; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:16:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB46519E2F; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:16:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B056519E0B; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:16:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 70D6819E21; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:15:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [81.2.131.61]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98D6A19C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:15:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 15180 invoked by uid 66); 25 Mar 2004 06:15:30 -0000 Received: (qmail 7395 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2004 06:14:02 -0000 Received: from gic.mteege.de (HELO mteege.de) (192.168.153.10) by 0 with SMTP; 25 Mar 2004 06:14:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 98892 invoked from network); 25 Mar 2004 06:09:18 -0000 Received: from loco.mteege.de (HELO loco) (192.168.153.22) by 0 with SMTP; 25 Mar 2004 06:09:18 -0000 Message-ID: <739046692636dce1e2f99fc437d065d3@mteege.de> From: Matthias Teege To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull In-Reply-To: <687c4bf5db7647a2686a17dc776af2b3@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:10:02 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Wed Mar 24 17:42:38 GMT 2004, skip@9netics.com wrote: > If you mean kenfs, you'll need to modify your /dist/replica/network. > I've included mine as a sample. May not fit your need exactly: Ok, I've setup my /dist/replica/network like yours and run replica/pull -v /dist/replica/network. It works and fetches the files. After that I have some backups in /i386/bin like --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 100873 Jun 23 2003 /386/bin/_yacc --rwxrwxr-x M 9 sys sys 89339 Jun 23 2003 /386/bin/_zip I think I can remove this files without problems!? Beause I run pull as user the updated files are owned by me but group sys. Is it necessary/reasonable to change the owner to sys? Many thanks Matthias From forsyth@terzarima.net Thu Mar 25 19:27:10 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 15:25:38 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3b74eb0a_7e25_11d8_88fb_00304828b574_32690; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 117DD345475 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3b450304_7e25_11d8_8bf8_00304828b574_32687; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 320D57580FE; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:36 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C8EF758104 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 388ce898_7e25_11d8_9862_00304828b574_32651; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:25:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91E44345477 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:20:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8ba11564_7e24_11d8_88f8_00304828b574_30296; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:20:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B92FA19E38; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:20:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D82619E2A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:20:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F1E3819E2E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:19:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9563919E2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:19:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <31027eecd4a115e1d8c633e2d02fb672@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] update via replica/pull From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <739046692636dce1e2f99fc437d065d3@mteege.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:13:40 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>I think I can remove this files without problems!? Beause I run as soon as you are certain they are not currently being run >>Is it necessary/reasonable to change the owner to sys? if you're running the file server (temporarily) in `allow' mode to allow changes to user name, you can have replica put the right users and groups on automatically by ensuring that the setting of applyopt in /dist/replica/network includes -u: applyopt=(-u -T$c/client/plan9.time) From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 25 19:27:10 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 15:45:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b190380_7e28_11d8_92be_00304828b574_4757; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D49D3454B2 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0ae20240_7e28_11d8_8ee4_00304828b574_4754; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3E8547580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8D5A7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0aa08144_7e28_11d8_8543_00304828b574_4751; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 022853454B2 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 09f1aa84_7e28_11d8_9ac5_00304828b574_4747; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 693C419E49; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:45:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D3E319E3C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:45:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6C6319E3B; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:44:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70EC119E38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:44:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2P6hT1b060542 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:43:29 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2P6hROt060541 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:43:27 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403250643.i2P6hROt060541@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] errstr(2) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:43:27 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, is ERRMAX the 'official' limit on the length of the buffer filled by errstr? David From rsc@swtch.com Thu Mar 25 19:27:10 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 15:53:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2aa7c154_7e29_11d8_92b5_00304828b574_6507; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA8033454C9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a71a272_7e29_11d8_8bca_00304828b574_6504; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B195A7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68FD37580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a349684_7e29_11d8_9209_00304828b574_6501; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76BCC3454C9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2985de14_7e29_11d8_8f22_00304828b574_6497; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:53:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0AEFC19E44; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B02DB19B03; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:53:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18ACD19E25; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:52:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF21E19E38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D14624FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:52:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40628185.4070308@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) References: <200403250643.i2P6hROt060541@adat.davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <200403250643.i2P6hROt060541@adat.davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 01:51:49 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: David Tolpin wrote: >Hi, > >is ERRMAX the 'official' limit on the length of the buffer filled by >errstr? > > there is no official limit. that's why you pass your own limit to the kernel. ERRMAX is what the kernel is likely to keep around, but it's okay for user and kernel to disagree. From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 25 19:27:10 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 16:10:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 895c3962_7e2b_11d8_8b45_00304828b574_11034; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5D92344216 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 892b343e_7e2b_11d8_80bd_00304828b574_11031; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 97D1A7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 500B57580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 88eb7d58_7e2b_11d8_805b_00304828b574_11028; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BFA4344220 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 883993a4_7e2b_11d8_8642_00304828b574_11021; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:10:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8340519E46; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:10:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EBFB219B6A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:10:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7819C19B73; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:09:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12FBE19B6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 02:09:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2P78M1b060660 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:08:22 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2P78MpX060659 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:08:22 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403250708.i2P78MpX060659@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) In-Reply-To: <40628185.4070308@swtch.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:08:22 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > >is ERRMAX the 'official' limit on the length of the buffer filled by > >errstr? > > > > > > there is no official limit. that's why you pass your > own limit to the kernel. ERRMAX is what the kernel > is likely to keep around, but it's okay for user and kernel > to disagree. I have been unclear. error(5) suggests that messages can be truncated to ERRMAX. 9/port/generrstr defines the buffer to be of ERRMAX bytes long. The question is whether it means that if I define my buffer to be ERRMAX bytes long, I am likely to get all the characters the kernel provides, and the kernel is likely to keep all the characters I pass to it through errstr(2). I am asking because errstr(2) mentions neither ERRMAX or error(5), implies internal use of a fixed length buffer , and does not say anything about truncating the user string to the size of the system buffer's limit. David From pavlovetsky@ztel.ru Thu Mar 25 19:27:12 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 18:54:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 753f263a_7e42_11d8_8a64_00304828b574_23031; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 704803443AA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 750a0f04_7e42_11d8_961d_00304828b574_23027; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4223C7580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDE0B7580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 74c95d42_7e42_11d8_9396_00304828b574_23021; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 077CC3443AA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 741a7412_7e42_11d8_8c91_00304828b574_23009; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D68F19AF6; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 04:54:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F085E19B94; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 04:54:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B057A19E5A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 04:53:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C03419B94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 04:53:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B6RWZ-0004FS-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:51:43 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Anton Pavlovetsky Message-ID: <81b3a3f4.0403242339.37bb26dd@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 References: <733534735459.735459733534@cwru.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:51:40 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Noah, I appreciate your help and advice very much. Taking into account that this is my first Plan 9 installation, I would like to clear the point. Am I right if I think that I have to: 1: Perform textonly installation using diskette. 2: Download the distribution.=20 3: Edit the source (/sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/cyber*) 4: Recompile the driver I am interested in. ? From lucio@proxima.alt.za Thu Mar 25 20:09:14 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 19:44:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6f383db0_7e49_11d8_8c5a_00304828b574_5048; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C11F934446D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6f0735c6_7e49_11d8_8004_00304828b574_5045; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A21D47580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57CA87580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6ec560ec_7e49_11d8_8497_00304828b574_5042; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60B7934446D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6e139d08_7e49_11d8_9ec0_00304828b574_5038; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 19:44:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7612319E65; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3286F19E22; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:44:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F0A519E22; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:43:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 872A919E61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:43:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2PAhOD14979 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:43:38 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] read it immediately Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <20040325103456.3845919D65@mail.cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:43:05 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i wait for a reply! So where did this one actually come from? > Received: from cse.psu.edu (unknown [81.2.122.217]) > by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 3845919D65 > for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:34:56 -0500 (EST) > From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp ++L - curious... From nmh@t3x.org Thu Mar 25 20:09:14 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 20:00:58 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b220f2d2_7e4b_11d8_93d3_00304828b574_10171; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AEB134449D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b1f0acf8_7e4b_11d8_90b9_00304828b574_10168; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:58 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E25327580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:57 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C4FA7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b1b300e2_7e4b_11d8_9426_00304828b574_10165; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A929834449D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b103ad9a_7e4b_11d8_91f2_00304828b574_10161; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:00:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D1D4819B9F; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 790BA19B31; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:00:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 975C719B6A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.184]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69CCB19AE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:59:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6SaZ-0006Me-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:59:55 +0100 Received: from [80.140.17.110] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6SaY-0002Wr-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:59:54 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2PAuaM74846; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:56:36 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Message-ID: <2004032510535500-74837@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Subject: [9fans] Finding the object suffix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:53:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I am currently writing an rc script that needs to know the object suffix of the architecture it is running on. Would the following code reliably return this suffix, or is there a better way? grep '^O=.$' /$objtype/mkfile | sed -e 's/O=//' Thanks, Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 25 23:05:41 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 20:46:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1de636d4_7e52_11d8_929d_00304828b574_23612; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB7923441F8 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1db59484_7e52_11d8_90e6_00304828b574_23606; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E96207580FE; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:54 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDF7E758110 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1abc812a_7e52_11d8_8f9c_00304828b574_23587; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B68734451A for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 17781920_7e52_11d8_9ffd_00304828b574_23527; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DF0CB19BD7; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:46:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B820019ADC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:46:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BD87919E4E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:45:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E99BC19C04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:45:43 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PBwcLl011211 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:58:38 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Subject: RE: [9fans] kayborad layout X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D79@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] kayborad layout Thread-Index: AcQSXBc/Hk1/AAhXSseiResxYRh6kQAAYVVgAABB/OA= From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:45:42 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: UC5QLlMuIEkgaGF2ZSB0byBsZWFybiB0byB0eXBlLCBkYW1taXQuDQo= From t.lankots@aprote.ee Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 20:46:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1e46d818_7e52_11d8_9557_00304828b574_23628; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3D003444D1 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1dcece54_7e52_11d8_845f_00304828b574_23609; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D23877580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E966E758103 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 199c7c50_7e52_11d8_948f_00304828b574_23563; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:46:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6443534452C for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:44:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cfd9d7b6_7e51_11d8_914a_00304828b574_22481; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:44:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BBA0A19E76; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:44:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E599E19BF1; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:44:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80BD519C0B; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:43:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF63C19BF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PBuCGK011196 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:56:12 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C4125E.5C778DC2" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D78@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQSXBc/Hk1/AAhXSseiResxYRh6kQAAYVVg From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] kayborad layout Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:43:16 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C4125E.5C778DC2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGVyZSdzIGEgZGlmZiB0aGF0IG1ha2VzIC9zeXMvc3JjLzkvYm9vdC9ib290LmMNCmNvcnJlY3Rs eSByZWFkIHRoZSBrZXltYXAgZ2l2ZW4gaW4gcGxhbjkuaW5pOg0KDQp0ZXJtJSBkaWZmICRob21l L3NyYy85L2Jvb3QvYm9vdC5jIC9zeXMvc3JjLzkvYm9vdC9ib290LmMNCjMxMCwzMTFjMzEwDQo8 IAlzbnByaW50KGJ1Ziwgc2l6ZW9mIGJ1ZiwgIi9ib290LyVzIiwgZik7DQo8IAlpbiA9IG9wZW4o YnVmLCBPUkVBRCk7DQotLS0NCj4gCWluID0gb3BlbihmLCBPUkVBRCk7DQoNClRoZSBtYW4gcGFn 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------_=_NextPart_001_01C4125E.5C778DC2 Content-Type: text/plain; name="ATT72966.txt" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Description: ATT72966.txt Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="ATT72966.txt" MCAxMiAnKw0KMCAxMyAnwrQNCjAgMjYgJ8O8DQowIDI3ICfDtQ0KMCAzOSAnw7YNCjAgNDAgJ8Ok DQowIDQxICdeDQowIDQzICcnDQowIDUxICcsDQowIDUyICcuDQowIDUzICctDQowIDg2ICc8DQox IDIgJyENCjEgMyAnIg0KMSA0ICcjDQoxIDUgJ8KkDQoxIDYgJyUNCjEgNyAnJg0KMSA4ICcvDQox IDkgJygNCjEgMTAgJykNCjEgMTEgJz0NCjEgMTIgJz8NCjEgMTMgJ2ANCjEgMjYgJ8OcDQoxIDI3 ICfDlQ0KMSAzOSAnw5YNCjEgNDAgJ8OEDQoxIDQxICd+DQoxIDQzICcqDQoxIDUxICc7DQoxIDUy ICc6DQoxIDUzICdfDQoxIDg2ICc+DQozIDMgJ0ANCjMgNCAnwqMNCjMgNSAnJA0KMyA4ICd7DQoz IDkgJ1sNCjMgMTAgJ10NCjMgMTEgJ30NCjMgMTIgJ1wNCjMgMjcgJ8KnDQozIDQzICfCvQ0KMyA4 NiAnfA== ------_=_NextPart_001_01C4125E.5C778DC2-- From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 20:51:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cc38fce4_7e52_11d8_9ba8_00304828b574_24549; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80E3A344534 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb92a1c8_7e52_11d8_8ce2_00304828b574_24537; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 640827580F9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6189E7580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cae6c39e_7e52_11d8_805f_00304828b574_24530; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FA26344534 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c98158ca_7e52_11d8_9e0f_00304828b574_24519; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:51:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9F63419E74; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:51:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F04CC19E7B; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:51:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 05E5A19B10; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:50:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CB5319B10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:50:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <683cd7fee8bc1e3b3f13d17daf391c65@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D78@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-iphqkftcuxblshfemxpsfczwha" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:50:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-iphqkftcuxblshfemxpsfczwha Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I was expecting you to put /boot/es (or whatever in plan9.ini). Your change does sayve people that whopping 6 chars but I kind of liked it being explicit. --upas-iphqkftcuxblshfemxpsfczwha Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 06:44:47 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 06:44:43 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 89FDE19D65; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:44:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4ACE19E46; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:44:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80BD519C0B; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:43:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF63C19BF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:43:18 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PBuCGK011196 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:56:12 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C4125E.5C778DC2" X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D78@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcQSXBc/Hk1/AAhXSseiResxYRh6kQAAYVVg From: "Tiit Lankots" To: "Plan 9 Mailing List (E-mail)" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] kayborad layout Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:43:16 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu 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9fe20734_7e53_11d8_9d96_00304828b574_26126; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9C3087580F9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EF117580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9fa5053c_7e53_11d8_9680_00304828b574_26123; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C7CF344542 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9ef5b2ee_7e53_11d8_898d_00304828b574_26118; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:57:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 71F1819B10; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3051919E7E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:57:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E1B819E79; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:56:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA87119E78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PC9QAK011303 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:09:26 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] kayborad layout X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D7A@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] kayborad layout Thread-Index: AcQSX5Z7m32hhi7aSxWIhbxXuFDHWgAAEt1A From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:56:30 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was expecting you to put /boot/es (or whatever in plan9.ini). > Your change does sayve people that whopping 6 chars but I kind > of liked it being explicit. Yup, it makes sense cos' you'll need to include the layouts in /boot explicitly anyway. Diff > /dev/null From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 20:58:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c0fe2eca_7e53_11d8_8d56_00304828b574_26320; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BFB3344545 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c09d2be8_7e53_11d8_859b_00304828b574_26317; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8CE177580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC5A97580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c0372604_7e53_11d8_9cba_00304828b574_26314; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F992344545 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bf3b75d4_7e53_11d8_8f52_00304828b574_26310; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:58:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B553B19E7E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE43819E80; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:58:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D58019E78; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:57:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5890D19E79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:57:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5e98ce2e01a213c1498c3df04e10c326@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Finding the object suffix In-Reply-To: <2004032510535500-74837@Symmetry.UUCP> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qrepoyajksaypjgsdydqpbswhn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:57:21 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qrepoyajksaypjgsdydqpbswhn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit first of all, $objtype is the target to compile for, not the type of the local cpu. You at least need to look at $cputype. The following would do it with one less process: sed -n 's/^O=(.*)/\1/p' /$cputype/mkfile --upas-qrepoyajksaypjgsdydqpbswhn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 06:00:54 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 06:00:51 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9CEC619E6C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:00:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D03019B9F; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 06:00:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 975C719B6A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.184]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69CCB19AE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 05:59:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6SaZ-0006Me-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:59:55 +0100 Received: from [80.140.17.110] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6SaY-0002Wr-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:59:54 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2PAuaM74846; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:56:36 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Message-ID: <2004032510535500-74837@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Subject: [9fans] Finding the object suffix Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:53:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I am currently writing an rc script that needs to know the object suffix of the architecture it is running on. Would the following code reliably return this suffix, or is there a better way? grep '^O=.$' /$objtype/mkfile | sed -e 's/O=//' Thanks, Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ --upas-qrepoyajksaypjgsdydqpbswhn-- From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 21:34:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cbe58572_7e58_11d8_8d38_00304828b574_450; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE51C3445BA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cbb1fb3a_7e58_11d8_8945_00304828b574_447; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9877A7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50A847580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb77cca8_7e58_11d8_806d_00304828b574_444; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E31F3445BA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cac887fc_7e58_11d8_82f2_00304828b574_440; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:34:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE85419E87; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:34:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE70D19E74; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:34:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7D87119E84; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:33:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7230619E79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:33:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) In-Reply-To: <200403250708.i2P78MpX060659@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:33:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 25 02:10:54 EST 2004, dvd@davidashen.net wrote: > I have been unclear. error(5) suggests that messages can be > truncated to ERRMAX. 9/port/generrstr defines the buffer to be > of ERRMAX bytes long. > > The question is whether it means that if I define my buffer to > be ERRMAX bytes long, I am likely to get all the characters the > kernel provides, and the kernel is likely to keep all the characters > I pass to it through errstr(2). > > I am asking because errstr(2) mentions neither ERRMAX or error(5), > implies internal use of a fixed length buffer , and does not say > anything about truncating the user string to the size of the system > buffer's limit. Given that you looked at the implimentation of the system call, I take it that this question is rhetorical? You are right that we should mention ERRMAX in errstr(2) since it is indeed the size of the system buffer. I've changed the man page. Also, the error(5) man page was wrong. It stated that ERRMAX was 255, which it is not. From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 21:41:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c681411a_7e59_11d8_86c5_00304828b574_2365; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26E9434451D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c64cd8d0_7e59_11d8_8ecb_00304828b574_2362; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 147297580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2C1F7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c61606de_7e59_11d8_89be_00304828b574_2359; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEDB734451D for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c565ddcc_7e59_11d8_831a_00304828b574_2355; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 13C9D19C24; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:41:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9273719B00; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:41:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D8A7819B49; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:40:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E09119B00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:40:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PCd11b061965 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:39:01 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2PCd16P061964 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:39:01 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403251239.i2PCd16P061964@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:39:01 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > Given that you looked at the implimentation of the system call, I > take it that this question is rhetorical? I can't learn to ask my questions right. I am sorry for that. My question was whether the code was right (in generrstr) or accidental. Since you think the question is rhetorical, it is the answer, thank you. I have been writing a piece of code where I wanted to set a message for the next "%r" (which might be the wrong intent), and wondered what I was expected to de to ensure it would not truncated. From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 21:47:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9dcb50fc_7e5a_11d8_9866_00304828b574_4112; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5541C3445EF for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d960c30_7e5a_11d8_86df_00304828b574_4108; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 433387580F9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F35E27580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d60a3e2_7e5a_11d8_9ced_00304828b574_4105; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CE823445F0 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9cb168dc_7e5a_11d8_956f_00304828b574_4095; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D95E519E8A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 233F619E75; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CE0019E75; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA34419B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <683cd7fee8bc1e3b3f13d17daf391c65@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:46:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was expecting you to put /boot/es (or whatever in plan9.ini). > Your change does sayve people that whopping 6 chars but I kind > of liked it being explicit. I think I created a patch fixing ascii too. It must not only fix Spec, but also include all runes in all tables; to let kbmap(1) recover to a known state before switching a map. From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 21:53:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7024cd94_7e5b_11d8_84e2_00304828b574_5080; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45F4834460B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6ff40146_7e5b_11d8_804d_00304828b574_5077; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 275097580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D22A67580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6fb369e2_7e5b_11d8_8d39_00304828b574_5074; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0CD134460B for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6f04d1fc_7e5b_11d8_9daf_00304828b574_5070; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:53:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5778219E80; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:53:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD86B19B6A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:53:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D21619E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:52:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30B2C19E7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:52:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2d02a062f561ff0711a63707cb49cb26@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) In-Reply-To: <200403251239.i2PCd16P061964@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:52:42 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu Mar 25 07:41:52 EST 2004, dvd@davidashen.net wrote: > I can't learn to ask my questions right. I am sorry for that. > My question was whether the code was right (in generrstr) > or accidental. In other words are we stupid or just incompetent? We will always have some limit to error strings in the kernel though it may not always be the current 128 bytes. You buffer len should be more determined by how long an error string you might consider useful. From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 21:56:24 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d2235a56_7e5b_11d8_924b_00304828b574_5878; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:24 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FB12344600 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d09349f8_7e5b_11d8_89d4_00304828b574_5869; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:21 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 07154758100; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:21 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71C617580FB for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:19 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cf6cda3a_7e5b_11d8_8c38_00304828b574_5861; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:56:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F98E344611 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:55:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b4690b64_7e5b_11d8_8804_00304828b574_5568; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:55:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1848F19E97; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:55:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4698319E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:55:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7854719E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C97B19E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0634c73cd642b5ea78ed90c2ac4cf00f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry about that. I'ld changed it a week ago on our systems and forgot to update sources. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 07:47:43 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 07:47:40 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19C3319E7E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 707DC19E7C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CE0019E75; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA34419B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <683cd7fee8bc1e3b3f13d17daf391c65@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:46:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was expecting you to put /boot/es (or whatever in plan9.ini). > Your change does sayve people that whopping 6 chars but I kind > of liked it being explicit. I think I created a patch fixing ascii too. It must not only fix Spec, but also include all runes in all tables; to let kbmap(1) recover to a known state before switching a map. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt-- From lucio@proxima.alt.za Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:02:09 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9fc8bfa0_7e5c_11d8_9426_00304828b574_8242; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADE5D344601 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9eff9ed6_7e5c_11d8_8b37_00304828b574_8234; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:08 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 64ED67580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:07 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26233758101 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9eab21bc_7e5c_11d8_8d16_00304828b574_8231; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:02:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CA5F344601 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:58:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 23b0a856_7e5c_11d8_88ef_00304828b574_6681; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:58:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3EC5019E88; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:58:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20C2019E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:58:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8686219E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from sparkle.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E6F319E88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (prawn.iba.co.za [192.168.30.22]) by sparkle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/8.11.5) with ESMTP id i2PCvOD29712 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:57:25 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <69cceaf677e7b3f431ef142d8a5441b4@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) Organization: Proxima Research & Development From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <2d02a062f561ff0711a63707cb49cb26@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-RAVMilter-Version: 8.4.3(snapshot 20030221) (sparkle) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:57:06 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > In other words are we stupid or just incompetent? Hardly either. dvd was just not sure that he understood the details. I've been there myself plenty of times, dvd seems to be made of sterner stuff than I. I just kept my head in the sand. ++L From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:03:35 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d308610e_7e5c_11d8_83bc_00304828b574_8849; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCA02344636 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d1b2ceb6_7e5c_11d8_83d8_00304828b574_8840; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:32 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 427177580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:32 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 748347580FC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:30 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d054ad5a_7e5c_11d8_80c8_00304828b574_8835; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:03:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06EF3344619 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:59:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 450fe502_7e5c_11d8_8084_00304828b574_7018; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:59:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 682BD19E99; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:59:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44BE819E94; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:59:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C208F19E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:58:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C059919BF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:58:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4351bbc250065a3710ed9abae0e8ca69@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <0634c73cd642b5ea78ed90c2ac4cf00f@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-syeqnezeqtyvimdpzkgkolqcgc" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:58:50 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-syeqnezeqtyvimdpzkgkolqcgc Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Don't worry. It's always impressive how short the problem detection <-> problem fixed cycle can be on Plan 9. Our local unix users tend not to believe that I may talk to them about a problem and then tell them it's fixed in a day or even hours :-) thanks a lot once more=E2=81=B1 =E2=81=B1 - I think I'm going to write this line in an automated .signatu= re to save some work =E2=98=BA --upas-syeqnezeqtyvimdpzkgkolqcgc Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Mar 25 13:55:28 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B150019E90; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:55:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40BCA19E85; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:55:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7854719E8C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C97B19E85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0634c73cd642b5ea78ed90c2ac4cf00f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:54:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry about that. I'ld changed it a week ago on our systems and forgot to update sources. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 07:47:43 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Thu Mar 25 07:47:40 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 19C3319E7E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 707DC19E7C; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:47:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CE0019E75; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA34419B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:46:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <683cd7fee8bc1e3b3f13d17daf391c65@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:46:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I was expecting you to put /boot/es (or whatever in plan9.ini). > Your change does sayve people that whopping 6 chars but I kind > of liked it being explicit. I think I created a patch fixing ascii too. It must not only fix Spec, but also include all runes in all tables; to let kbmap(1) recover to a known state before switching a map. --upas-udqjrhmgaoaeobdecposrbnmgt-- --upas-syeqnezeqtyvimdpzkgkolqcgc-- From noah.evans@cwru.edu Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:27:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30a6749c_7e60_11d8_8b6b_00304828b574_15410; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31BDD344695 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 306f6b96_7e60_11d8_8020_00304828b574_15407; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1D3167580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:40 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C721F7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30345c7c_7e60_11d8_97d6_00304828b574_15404; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA4CE344695 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f7ed12c_7e60_11d8_9861_00304828b574_15400; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:27:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82FA619E8F; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:27:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B76A619C30; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:27:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3D03C199FD; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ims-msg.TIS.CWRU.Edu (northuist.CNS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.60]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4C6419E87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:26:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from cwru.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTP id <0HV400LERVXX8J@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:25:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from [152.19.50.16] by ims-msg.cwru.edu (mshttpd); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:25:09 -0500 From: Noah Evans Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <81e5588179d7.8179d781e558@cwru.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: iPlanet Messenger Express 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-language: en Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Content-disposition: inline X-Accept-Language: en Priority: normal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:25:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm sure there's a better way, but I would do it by just changing step 3. There's a place you can go to get all the pending Plan 9 patches. You can get to it by going to: http://www.cs.bell-labs.com/plan9dist/newaccount.html once you get it, type: 9fs sources(this need authentication); cp /n/sources/patch/mondef.cyberhack/cyber938x.c /sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/ and recompile and you should be good to go. Noah ----- Original Message ----- From: Anton Pavlovetsky Date: Thursday, March 25, 2004 4:51 am Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 > Noah, I appreciate your help and advice very much. Taking into account > that this is my first Plan 9 installation, I would like to clear the > point. > Am I right if I think that I have to: > 1: Perform textonly installation using diskette. > 2: Download the distribution. > 3: Edit the source (/sys/src/cmd/aux/vga/cyber*) > 4: Recompile the driver I am interested in. ? > From dvd@davidashen.net Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:33:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0bdb04a6_7e61_11d8_8592_00304828b574_16797; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F05E03446AC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0ba66994_7e61_11d8_8ab1_00304828b574_16794; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id DBEA47580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 936B27580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0b6c67bc_7e61_11d8_970c_00304828b574_16791; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1A7C3446AC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0abdd90e_7e61_11d8_95d4_00304828b574_16787; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A96F219EA1; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:33:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3FC319E61; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:33:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E9DFA19B80; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:32:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA51719C30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:31:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PDUe1b062615 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:30:40 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2PDUemX062614 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:30:40 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403251330.i2PDUemX062614@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] errstr(2) In-Reply-To: <2d02a062f561ff0711a63707cb49cb26@plan9.bell-labs.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:30:40 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > My question was whether the code was right (in generrstr) > > or accidental. > > In other words are we stupid or just incompetent? I like the use of fixed-length buffer for error strings. > You buffer len should be more determined by how long > an error string you might consider useful. Unless it is truncated by the kernel limit. So as long as my buffer is not longer than ERRMAX, I'm on a safe ground. From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Thu Mar 25 23:05:42 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:37:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 994cb5aa_7e61_11d8_83f7_00304828b574_17527; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 486EC3446BF for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 991964a2_7e61_11d8_9e50_00304828b574_17524; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2AE4E7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1C6A7580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98ccb5e4_7e61_11d8_9543_00304828b574_17521; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2C493446BF for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9815e968_7e61_11d8_9c4d_00304828b574_17517; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D983019E61; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:37:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F36519E80; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:37:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 823A419C30; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:36:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CECC319B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:36:02 -0000 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PFJhjR017820 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:19:44 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] auth on terminal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:36:04 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Firstoff, sorry for dumb question. I'am trying connect two stand alone terminals together, larch and paris; paris is also going to act as authserver. On paris I start the auth server by hand auth/keyfs -m /mnt/keys /adm/keys aux/listen -q -t $home/bin/service.auth -d $home/bin/aservice setup my auth info (only once) auth/wrkeys auth/changeuser steve Add keys to factotum for both machines. key proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user=steve !password=xxxx Now if I run auth/debug on either machine and everything looks OK. When I try to do larch% cpu -h paris the command doesn't return. When I hit return on paris it prints password: "behind rio" there is obviously two processes reading the keyboard, rio, and this program running behind it (keyfs ?) if I hit return a few more times larch prints no key rio: can't find mouse: device or object already in use Unfortuanately this process on paris keeps reading the keyboard and eating every other character or so I have to reboot it in the end. I think I am nearly there but I don't know what I have missed. Anyone? -Steve From nemo@lsub.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:43 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:44:36 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8df66d30_7e62_11d8_9822_00304828b574_18547; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 765713446D8 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8d972a32_7e62_11d8_97c5_00304828b574_18544; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5BAB17580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B83637580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8d27c5c0_7e62_11d8_96be_00304828b574_18541; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43B063446D8 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8c279254_7e62_11d8_81fa_00304828b574_18537; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:44:33 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1537619BD7; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:44:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3A2619E5E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:44:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5703419AFC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:43:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79CAA19AAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:43:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0a2f8da5c86e1956d76920929f52caae@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth on terminal From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rnqhrodhcqiakutsdzqniktbty" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:43:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rnqhrodhcqiakutsdzqniktbty Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Why don't you start one of them as a cpuserver? You may start rio on it and run it on the name of a user, of course. --upas-rnqhrodhcqiakutsdzqniktbty Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Thu Mar 25 14:37:36 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 37D7D19E9F; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:37:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EDE119E61; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:37:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 823A419C30; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:36:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CECC319B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:36:02 -0000 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PFJhjR017820 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:19:44 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] auth on terminal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:36:04 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, Firstoff, sorry for dumb question. I'am trying connect two stand alone terminals together, larch and paris; paris is also going to act as authserver. On paris I start the auth server by hand auth/keyfs -m /mnt/keys /adm/keys aux/listen -q -t $home/bin/service.auth -d $home/bin/aservice setup my auth info (only once) auth/wrkeys auth/changeuser steve Add keys to factotum for both machines. key proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user=steve !password=xxxx Now if I run auth/debug on either machine and everything looks OK. When I try to do larch% cpu -h paris the command doesn't return. When I hit return on paris it prints password: "behind rio" there is obviously two processes reading the keyboard, rio, and this program running behind it (keyfs ?) if I hit return a few more times larch prints no key rio: can't find mouse: device or object already in use Unfortuanately this process on paris keeps reading the keyboard and eating every other character or so I have to reboot it in the end. I think I am nearly there but I don't know what I have missed. Anyone? -Steve --upas-rnqhrodhcqiakutsdzqniktbty-- From presotto@closedmind.org Thu Mar 25 23:05:43 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 22:56:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 40fa0d96_7e64_11d8_82a5_00304828b574_21278; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97D1934471A for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 40c94422_7e64_11d8_98e4_00304828b574_21275; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7982B7580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 307A17580FA for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4088ab7e_7e64_11d8_84ff_00304828b574_21272; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E8D934471A for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3fda15d2_7e64_11d8_9aa1_00304828b574_21268; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 22:56:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 33FE919EA6; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DACFE19C1A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:56:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 087F619BD7; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E390019B57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:55:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth on terminal In-Reply-To: <0a2f8da5c86e1956d76920929f52caae@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:55:38 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: If you are running as the same user on both systems, you don't even need an auth server... Keyfs will get the password it encrypts/decrypts the /adm/keys with from the nvram parittion if there's anything there (i.e. if you've already run wrkeys and put something there). Otherwise, it will indeed prompt with password:. Did you start it in the background? From rm@hamnavoe.com Thu Mar 25 23:05:43 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 23:03:11 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 26a12e10_7e65_11d8_8e08_00304828b574_22778; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6D733454EC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 266afcc8_7e65_11d8_9f42_00304828b574_22775; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:10 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C875F7580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:10 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F3A77580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 26343774_7e65_11d8_8bbb_00304828b574_22772; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DAA43454EC for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2585de9a_7e65_11d8_9ece_00304828b574_22768; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:03:09 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A5FF019E87; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:02:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 089F519E51; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:02:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B393919E51; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:01:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51F9F19B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:00:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth on terminal From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:00:57 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > aux/listen -q -t $home/bin/service.auth -d $home/bin/aservice Try changing this to service=cpu aux/listen -q -t $home/bin/service.auth -d $home/bin/aservice -- Richard From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 23:07:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ca5cd392_7e65_11d8_9e86_00304828b574_23533; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FC87345538 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ca284122_7e65_11d8_9265_00304828b574_23530; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7AE047580FA; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 354F57580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c9efa77c_7e65_11d8_982b_00304828b574_23527; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02A3C345538 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c918aaa6_7e65_11d8_9f89_00304828b574_23523; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:07:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4DFA119EA9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:07:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09FE019EA1; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:07:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 541B319E51; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:06:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (unknown [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1264119E87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:06:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <04511df495a049e3e5f742a308da0c3d@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kayborad layout From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <4351bbc250065a3710ed9abae0e8ca69@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 07:06:17 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > =E2=81=B1 - I think I'm going to write this line in an automated .signa= ture to save > some work =E2=98=BA well, there's always the "happy users' thanks" page on the wiki ... From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Thu Mar 25 23:52:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13266e52_7e6c_11d8_8390_00304828b574_3417; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB59634477E for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 12f43ae0_7e6c_11d8_8169_00304828b574_3414; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 90F847580FB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 473C87580F9 for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 12b59902_7e6c_11d8_96ac_00304828b574_3411; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47FE134477E for ; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 11febafc_7e6c_11d8_9e1d_00304828b574_3407; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 23:52:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 37F9819EBC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:52:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A292219B86; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:52:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7AF4919B86; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:51:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E79E719B58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:51:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:51:11 -0000 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PGYpjR017935 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:34:51 GMT Message-ID: <7a5d84be9a54c9d963300461d06c069c@snellwilcox.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth on terminal In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 14:51:10 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > If you are running as the same user on both systems, you don't even need > an auth server... > > Keyfs will get the password it encrypts/decrypts the /adm/keys with from > the nvram parittion if there's anything there (i.e. if you've already > run wrkeys and put something there). Otherwise, it will indeed prompt > with password:. Did you start it in the background? I didn't start keyfs in the background, however Richards suggestion of using service=cpu auth/keyfs ... stopped the prompts for a password; I guess keyfs changes it behaviour depending. Perhaps I am beginning to understand, Is it that keyfs is only needed to change ones identity? Ok, I scapped keyfs, now I just use aux/listen on the server side. larch% cpu -h paris !Adding key: proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user[steve]: password: ! !Adding key: proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user[steve]: password: ! [ad nausem] However I do have a key, and the factotums are the same (the contents transfered securely via Neware :-) larch% grep mydom /mnt/factotum/ctl key proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user=steve !password? paris% grep mydom /mnt/factotum/ctl key proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user=steve !password? only one small step now ... -Steve From t.lankots@aprote.ee Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:03:15 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a809e04_7e6d_11d8_9212_00304828b574_5750; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EE553447AD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a50d048_7e6d_11d8_8145_00304828b574_5747; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5566D7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C0E77580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8a12fd90_7e6d_11d8_98dd_00304828b574_5744; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 191183447AD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8963d090_7e6d_11d8_9dc1_00304828b574_5740; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:03:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7A8E619E74; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:02:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0778519E60; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:02:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E90619BA0; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:01:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBFDB19B84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:00:59 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PFDuJ3013342 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:13:56 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056175@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] auth on terminal Thread-Index: AcQSeOWPHiADMy/7RTah3aDKz5I4owAAE6Pw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:00:57 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > However I do have a key, and the factotums are the same > (the contents transfered securely via Neware :-) If you're not running secstored(8), then your factotums are = nonpersistent. Factotum(4) looks for a secstore on startup; if it's not found at tcp!$auth!5356 it gives up and does not use it even if later you start = one. From t.lankots@aprote.ee Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:10:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9944ab28_7e6e_11d8_95f8_00304828b574_7748; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEAE4344272 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 99139470_7e6e_11d8_970f_00304828b574_7745; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 906D57580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46B967580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98d2911e_7e6e_11d8_8844_00304828b574_7742; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FB57344272 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9812d7c0_7e6e_11d8_8054_00304828b574_7738; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:10:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DAAD319EBB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:10:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A15C519EBE; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:10:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 831E719EA9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB6DD19EA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:09:51 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PFMmnb013437 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:22:48 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056176@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] auth on terminal Thread-Index: AcQSeOWPHiADMy/7RTah3aDKz5I4owAAUqOw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:09:49 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > larch% cpu -h paris >=20 > !Adding key: proto=3Dp9sk1 dom=3Dmydom.net > user[steve]:=20 > password:=20 > ! The fact that you see this implies that the local factotum does not=20 have a key for what the remote requests. I think it works this way: A full-blown auth server runs factotum -S on startup; it (factotum) = reads authentication data (which contains the auth domain, among other things) from nvram and initialises some important data to use this info. So I guess, nvram setup + factotum -S should solve your problems. From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:11:21 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac76f944_7e6e_11d8_8ae0_00304828b574_7897; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9914344789 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac4132dc_7e6e_11d8_92d1_00304828b574_7894; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:20 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C50D37580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:20 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AD4E7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac05f370_7e6e_11d8_8610_00304828b574_7891; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02A1B344789 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:19 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ab02b7ce_7e6e_11d8_8e4b_00304828b574_7887; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:11:19 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B6CF19EC1; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:11:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB9A519EB1; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:11:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1AA7419EBB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:09:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C66FE19EB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:09:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056175@black.aprote.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:09:33 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >> However I do have a key, and the factotums are the same >> (the contents transfered securely via Neware :-) > > If you're not running secstored(8), then your factotums are nonpersistent. > Factotum(4) looks for a secstore on startup; if it's not found at > tcp!$auth!5356 it gives up and does not use it even if later you start one. in his case he needs to run keyfs and authsrv in the same namespace, looking at /sys/log/auth would probably tell you that there's nothing in /mnt/keys From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:12:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dde41ec6_7e6e_11d8_8690_00304828b574_8079; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C65FE3447CD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ddadfecc_7e6e_11d8_854e_00304828b574_8076; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B33447580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A56E7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dd747008_7e6e_11d8_940d_00304828b574_8073; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 770823447CD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dcc5092e_7e6e_11d8_8231_00304828b574_8069; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:12:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A4F5719AF8; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:12:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03CDB19C0E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:12:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A79A19EC6; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:11:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84A2219EC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:11:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PFAuog028766 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:10:56 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2PFAuDp028763 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:10:56 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal In-Reply-To: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056175@black.aprote.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 08:10:56 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: oh, i forgot the standard addition -- auth/debug is your friend :) From t.lankots@aprote.ee Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:15:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 49c70216_7e6f_11d8_9398_00304828b574_8594; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD75E3447D5 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4994d3ea_7e6f_11d8_8954_00304828b574_8591; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AEABC7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67A067580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 495528c6_7e6f_11d8_87e8_00304828b574_8588; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 731033447D5 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 48a4f38e_7e6f_11d8_8b91_00304828b574_8584; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:15:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 18D8119EC9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:15:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6AFD19EC6; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:15:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39B7019EB0; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:15:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A037019E74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:14:58 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PFRtBw013536 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:27:55 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE479D7E@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] auth on terminal Thread-Index: AcQSe71OzxN4WrpqTpud5YIw/qR7HAAAAwGw From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:14:56 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > oh, i forgot the standard addition -- auth/debug is your friend :) running a terminal as an auth server is a good excercise in what makes an auth server special ;) From rm@hamnavoe.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:33:08 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b798b094_7e71_11d8_8342_00304828b574_11584; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:08 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E221344803 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:08 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b762f166_7e71_11d8_9881_00304828b574_11581; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:08 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E36CD7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:07 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CD9A7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7238b5c_7e71_11d8_9e69_00304828b574_11578; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9997A344803 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b66a2eb4_7e71_11d8_9ed1_00304828b574_11574; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:33:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C2FD19ECD; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:32:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A45419EB3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:32:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D5EA19EB6; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:31:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CFAF19EB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:31:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth on terminal From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <7a5d84be9a54c9d963300461d06c069c@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:31:34 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I didn't start keyfs in the background, however Richards suggestion > of using > service=cpu auth/keyfs ... That's not what I suggested. It's the aux/listen which needs service=cpu, so that rc knows it's on a "cpu server" when running $home/lib/profile. > Ok, I scapped keyfs, now I just use aux/listen on the server side. Not a good idea: if aux/listen is still starting authsrv, it needs a keyfs. That's why the client keeps prompting for a password. -- Richard From matt@proweb.co.uk Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:34:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ee222956_7e71_11d8_84dd_00304828b574_11781; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8909F344806 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eded40e2_7e71_11d8_9147_00304828b574_11778; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7613B7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30AEA7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id edb604e2_7e71_11d8_9b0d_00304828b574_11775; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F551344806 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ed07d4a8_7e71_11d8_8372_00304828b574_11771; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:34:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C1D4219ECE; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:34:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C073119EB9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:34:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B113A19EB3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D621F19ECB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:33:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d53804b2270dec4f980d22461a9fb4c@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] microsoft patent Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:36:04 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: In a story on TheRegsiter today it mentions a Microsoft patent that was filed in 2004 for "a common namespace for Internet and local filesystem objects" http://theregister.co.uk/content/4/36520.html here's the patent application in question http://appft1.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-adv.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&d=PG01&p=1&S1=20020188758.PGNR.&OS=DN/20020188758&RS=DN/20020188758 it starts out with 'document browser' but gets a bit more specific I know next to nothing about patent stuff but I just thought it might be relevant to someone. Though their description of the problem does show how convoluted their OS is :) m From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:27 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 00:50:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a84087c_7e74_11d8_8c11_00304828b574_16566; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D175D344813 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a4eb7bc_7e74_11d8_9c1a_00304828b574_16562; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4FCD675810B; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 277867580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 281ac4ae_7e74_11d8_8991_00304828b574_16530; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:50:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5164344830 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:46:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9a825486_7e73_11d8_9874_00304828b574_14804; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:46:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4098719EC3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:46:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E23119EB9; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:46:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3292019AF7; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:45:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 06F5619AB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 10:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:03 -0000 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PHSijR017989 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 17:28:45 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] auth on terminal Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:45:03 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Thanks for the help guys but I'am still not there. >...then your factotums are nonpersistent. My factotum's state is sort-of persistant as I run auth/aescbc -d < /n/cdrom/secrets | read -m > /mnt/factotum/ctl in my profile to populate it. > ...keyfs and authsrv in the same namespace, During my attempts to run auth/keyfs it was in the same namespace as aux/listen, they where started on the command line in a Rio window. >...nvram setup + factotum -S should solve your problems. If I run factotum -S and populate it then I guess it would stop the password prompts from behind rio (I have not tried, see below). > ..-- auth/debug is your friend If I don't run the authserver then auth/debug says I have a problem, however if I do run the auth server it is happy, on bowth systems. However I now think I don't need an auth server as all I want is a direct connection between two machines, both running as me. I tried turning on factotums debug but the issue wasn't "obvious" Again I did: cpu -h paris !Adding key: proto=p9sk1 dom=quintile.net user[steve]: !Adding key: proto=p9sk1 dom=quintile.net user[steve]: ... Factotum debug from larch 287: start proto=p9any role=client yields phase CNeedProtos: ok 287: read 4093 in phase CNeedProtos yields phase CNeedProtos: phase: protocol phase error: read in state CNeedProtos 287: write 0 in phase CNeedProtos yields phase CNeedProtos: toosmall 2048 287: start proto=p9sk1 role=client dom=mydom.net yields phase CHaveChal: ok 287: write 78 in phase CNeedProtos yields phase CHaveProto: ok 287: read 19 in phase CHaveProto yields phase CRelay: ok 287: read 8 in phase CHaveChal yields phase CNeedTreq: ok 287: read 8 in phase CRelay yields phase CRelay: ok 287: read 4093 in phase CNeedTreq yields phase CNeedTreq: phase: protocol phase error: read in state CNeedTreq 287: read 4093 in phase CRelay yields phase CRelay: phase: protocol phase error: read in state CNeedTreq 287: write 0 in phase CNeedTreq yields phase CNeedTreq: toosmall 141 287: write 0 in phase CRelay yields phase CRelay: toosmall 141 287: write 141 in phase CNeedTreq yields phase CNeedTreq: needkey proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user? !password? 287: write 141 in phase CRelay yields phase CRelay: needkey proto=p9sk1 dom=mydom.net user? !password? Factotum debug from paris 8: start proto=p9any role=server yields phase SHaveProtos: ok 8: no key matches proto=p9sk1 role=server dom? 8: read 78 in phase SHaveProtos yields phase SNeedProto: ok 8: read 4093 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: phase: protocol phase error: read in state SNeedProto 8: write 0 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 1 8: write 1 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 2 8: write 2 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 3 8: write 3 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 4 8: write 4 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 5 8: write 5 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 6 8: write 6 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 7 8: write 7 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 8 8: write 8 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 9 8: write 9 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 10 8: write 10 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 11 8: write 11 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 12 8: write 12 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 13 8: write 13 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 14 8: write 14 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 15 8: write 15 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 16 8: write 16 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 17 8: write 17 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 18 8: write 18 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SNeedProto: toosmall 19 8: write 19 in phase SNeedProto yields phase SRelay: ok 8: read 4093 in phase SNeedChal yields phase SNeedChal: phase: protocol phase error: read in state SNeedChal 8: read 4093 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: phase: protocol phase error: read in state SNeedChal 8: write 0 in phase SNeedChal yields phase SNeedChal: toosmall 8 8: write 0 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: toosmall 8 8: write 8 in phase SNeedChal yields phase SHaveTreq: ok 8: write 8 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: ok 8: read 141 in phase SHaveTreq yields phase SNeedTicket: ok 8: read 141 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: ok 8: read 4093 in phase SNeedTicket yields phase SNeedTicket: phase: protocol phase error: read in state SNeedTicket 8: read 4093 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: phase: protocol phase error: read in state SNeedTicket 8: write 0 in phase SNeedTicket yields phase SNeedTicket: toosmall 85 8: write 0 in phase SRelay yields phase SRelay: toosmall 85 -Steve From t.lankots@aprote.ee Fri Mar 26 07:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 01:17:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f683b442_7e77_11d8_870e_00304828b574_24087; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E1DE34488A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f64b959e_7e77_11d8_95bf_00304828b574_24083; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 72CDA7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E1F47580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f6057f8c_7e77_11d8_9951_00304828b574_24080; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CE5434488A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f54d6352_7e77_11d8_9284_00304828b574_24076; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A48419EE0; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB27C19ED4; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:17:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0CB5019ED4; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E0EB19ECA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:16:19 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id i2PGTGcm014169 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:29:16 +0200 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] auth on terminal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Message-ID: <81132473206F3A46A72BD6116E1A06AE056177@black.aprote.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] auth on terminal Thread-Index: AcQSgGxnzh5Ur66uRdWubWUlQZGqQQAArKHQ From: "Tiit Lankots" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:16:17 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > -----Original Message----- > From: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu=20 > [mailto:9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu]On Behalf Of=20 > plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 5:45 PM > To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu > Subject: [9fans] auth on terminal >=20 >=20 > Thanks for the help guys but I'am still not there. >=20 > >...then your factotums are nonpersistent. > My factotum's state is sort-of persistant as I run=20 > auth/aescbc -d < /n/cdrom/secrets | read -m > /mnt/factotum/ctl > in my profile to populate it. >=20 > > ...keyfs and authsrv in the same namespace, > During my attempts to run auth/keyfs it was in the same namespace > as aux/listen, they where started on the command line in a Rio window. >=20 > >...nvram setup + factotum -S should solve your problems. > If I run factotum -S and populate it then I guess it would stop > the password prompts from behind rio (I have not tried, see below). >=20 > > ..-- auth/debug is your friend > If I don't run the authserver then auth/debug says I have a problem, > however if I do run the auth server it is happy, on bowth systems.=20 >=20 > However I now think I don't need an auth server as all I want > is a direct connection between two machines, both running as me. >=20 > I tried turning on factotums debug but the issue wasn't "obvious" > Again I did: >=20 > cpu -h paris > !Adding key: proto=3Dp9sk1 dom=3Dquintile.net > user[steve]:=20 > !Adding key: proto=3Dp9sk1 dom=3Dquintile.net > user[steve]:=20 > ... >=20 > Factotum debug from larch >=20 Whaddayaknow, man pages + source can be really informative :) It turns out that factotum is not used on the auth server at all.=20 Authsrv uses keyfs to get to it's auth data. Keyfs database (/adm/keys) is encrypted with the server's key, stored in nvram. So you'll need to 1. auth/wrkey (if you don't want to type a password each startup), or 2. run auth/keyfs -p in termrc (this prompts for password) The 'Configuring a Standalone CPU Server' page in Wiki gives a=20 decent rundown. From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 26 07:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 01:54:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1d0e3a38_7e7d_11d8_83bd_00304828b574_31003; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B46C0345567 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1cd81192_7e7d_11d8_80be_00304828b574_31000; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 986417580FB; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48BA27580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1c94a510_7e7d_11d8_98b8_00304828b574_30996; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 546A9345567 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1be4a23c_7e7d_11d8_8b17_00304828b574_30988; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:54:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D38CF19EDB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:54:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F174E19C24; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:54:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D937119C5E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:53:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2C1619C24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:53:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PGrNjt031423 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:53:23 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PGrM75017982 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:53:22 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PGrMfQ027813 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:53:22 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] microsoft patent In-Reply-To: <4d53804b2270dec4f980d22461a9fb4c@juice.thebigchoice.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 09:53:22 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: yeah, microsoft invented this amazing idea of making your mail look like a file system. Did Plan 9 guys ever consider such a brilliant idea? ron From info@panda.co.jp. Fri Mar 26 07:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 02:04:19 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 74392a92_7e7e_11d8_99c4_00304828b574_32482; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5537B34557D for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 73ef3202_7e7e_11d8_95a9_00304828b574_32479; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:18 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 412437580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC7E07580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 73b50cbc_7e7e_11d8_9ec7_00304828b574_32476; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 353D534557D for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 728b33de_7e7e_11d8_9ac8_00304828b574_32472; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:04:16 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB49B19EF4; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:04:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8490B19EEF; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:04:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B39CE19EE3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:02:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (ric-dsl5010-64-83-24-236-vlan12.dsl.cavtel.net [64.83.24.236]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id D7E1119EB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:02:09 -0500 (EST) From: info@panda.co.jp. To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="27801765" Message-Id: <20040325170209.D7E1119EB8@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [Virus Delete] :[9fans] information Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:02:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --27801765 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you try to steal --27801765-- From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 03:55:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0768d98e_7e8e_11d8_8879_00304828b574_26759; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D79A6344A39 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0733cff0_7e8e_11d8_840e_00304828b574_26756; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C09057580F9; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 736C27580FA for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 06f699be_7e8e_11d8_8794_00304828b574_26753; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F045344A39 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 064644f6_7e8e_11d8_85ef_00304828b574_26745; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:55:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8455019E72; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:55:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F5B119E60; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:55:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8938D19E60; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:54:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C3FA419E6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:54:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:25 -0000 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2PKc9jR018243 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:38:10 GMT Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] terminal auth - Ahaaa Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:54:24 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Sorry for all the noise. Problem solved. I think I was nearly right in the first place, my suspicion is that the password prompt was from auth/aescbc trying to populate my factotum in my profile. This was fixed by "service=cpu auth/keyfs ..." (thanks again Richard, sorry for miss-quoting you). Unfortunately I got confused and started changing too many things at once. Thanks to all who helped, -Steve From 9nut@9netics.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 03:59:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 97c3683c_7e8e_11d8_93c4_00304828b574_27321; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 113DF344A46 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 978ffa74_7e8e_11d8_9d3e_00304828b574_27318; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id F10417580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8E007580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9756243e_7e8e_11d8_828f_00304828b574_27315; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B62E9344A46 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 96a71084_7e8e_11d8_9a69_00304828b574_27311; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:59:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A533E19E86; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:59:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EFCE19B39; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:59:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5F22219C5E; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:58:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BB4A19B39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:58:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] microsoft patent From: 9nut@9netics.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 11:02:00 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > yeah, microsoft invented this amazing idea of making your mail look like a > file system. Did Plan 9 guys ever consider such a brilliant idea? Apparently M$ is also working on a new invention called "the ham sandwich". Their OS is a pig, so maybe not much of a stretch. http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/166206_choices25.html?source=rss From ben_salzman@yahoo.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 05:33:18 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a6105866_7e9b_11d8_88ce_00304828b574_15580; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7402E344B99 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a5d5f996_7e9b_11d8_99e4_00304828b574_15577; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 60DEE7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19B3D7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a59d85f2_7e9b_11d8_9391_00304828b574_15574; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27722344B99 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a4eebdec_7e9b_11d8_9d1d_00304828b574_15570; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:33:16 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F72519E85; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:32:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE97619E86; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:32:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1239219E7A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:31:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from web41710.mail.yahoo.com (web41710.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.127]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id CC28319E33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:31:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040325203117.79352.qmail@web41710.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.113.20.242] by web41710.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:31:17 PST From: Ben Salzman To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:31:17 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I've read a bit about Plan 9. It seems it is based on ideas of XML, isn't it? Both use a hierarchical structure (tree) for everything; 9p is very similar to XPath. Is it just the same idea with a different syntax? Ben S. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From rminnich@lanl.gov Fri Mar 26 07:44:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 05:35:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fe9b2696_7e9b_11d8_948e_00304828b574_15988; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12314344BAC for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fe686e68_7e9b_11d8_9a0a_00304828b574_15985; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E8F3D7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B0327580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fe255aba_7e9b_11d8_8e07_00304828b574_15982; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A596A344BAC for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fd749270_7e9b_11d8_891b_00304828b574_15978; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:35:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3BDA19EA3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:35:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50C6119E86; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:35:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6E33719E7A; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:34:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6C6B19E33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:34:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay1.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PKYGjt006249 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:34:16 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay1.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PKYGbL025140 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:34:16 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2PKYGfQ006297 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:34:16 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? In-Reply-To: <20040325203117.79352.qmail@web41710.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 13:34:16 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Thu, 25 Mar 2004, Ben Salzman wrote: > I've read a bit about Plan 9. It seems it is based on ideas of XML, > isn't it? Both use a hierarchical structure (tree) for everything; 9p is > very similar to XPath. yes. I suggest you just keep using internet explorer. ron From ben_salzman@yahoo.com Fri Mar 26 07:44:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 05:48:07 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7ef547c_7e9d_11d8_8f5d_00304828b574_18920; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E51F344BEB for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7aabea2_7e9d_11d8_959d_00304828b574_18917; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:06 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 413437580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:06 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB9007580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b76abd5c_7e9d_11d8_8bc6_00304828b574_18914; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4D9E344BEB for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b6af2a7e_7e9d_11d8_9547_00304828b574_18910; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:48:05 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9224819EA3; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:47:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A6D019E85; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:47:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EE1E619D85; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:46:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from web41704.mail.yahoo.com (web41704.mail.yahoo.com [66.218.93.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 854C519B73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:46:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20040325204611.14192.qmail@web41704.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [217.113.20.242] by web41704.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:46:11 PST From: Ben Salzman Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 12:46:11 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > for everything; 9p is > > very similar to XPath. > > yes. I suggest you just keep using internet > explorer. > Actually, I am using w3m; a nice browser -- runs in a terminal window but with full graphics. I tried to use internet explorer for inferno plugin, but the plugin crashes often. Ben S. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From geoff@collyer.net Fri Mar 26 14:26:40 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 08:44:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6680a3ac_7eb6_11d8_9660_00304828b574_25873; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42EC13455D7 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 664a45fa_7eb6_11d8_875b_00304828b574_25870; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2ED887580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB8FD7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6610f048_7eb6_11d8_943c_00304828b574_25867; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAA143455D7 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 656323f0_7eb6_11d8_8dbf_00304828b574_25862; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:44:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 86AC719EE8; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:44:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB91019EC4; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:44:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E389D19EAC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:43:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 878AE19C78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 18:43:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <20040325203117.79352.qmail@web41710.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 15:43:14 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think that hierarchical file systems are a form of Rorschach ink-blot. What a person sees in them tells us more about the person than the idea. In 1980, I was describing the Unix file system to a supervisor who hadn't heard of it and he said `oh, it sounds like a database system'. When did the first hierarchical file system appear? Multics? CTSS? From dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com Fri Mar 26 14:26:40 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 10:24:14 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4ad86e74_7ec4_11d8_88eb_00304828b574_22870; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E4AB344F79 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4a54d7bc_7ec4_11d8_81b5_00304828b574_22854; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 29B387580FC; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:10 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FE1E758116 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4455cf2e_7ec4_11d8_9449_00304828b574_22700; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:24:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A936344F9B for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:20:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cf6ab1d4_7ec3_11d8_990f_00304828b574_21062; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:20:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7CA9C19EFC; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:20:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44A3119EF2; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:20:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 504F019EF0; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:19:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7372E19C19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:19:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 20:19:07 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > When did the first hierarchical file system appear? Multics? CTSS? The first I saw was Multics. CTSS was approximately 2-level, perhaps with more than one root. Dennis From rsc@swtch.com Fri Mar 26 14:26:41 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 11:22:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79e4fab8_7ecc_11d8_8ab7_00304828b574_2775; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDF68345049 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79b4edf0_7ecc_11d8_87f5_00304828b574_2772; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9F8397580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 551347580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79734576_7ecc_11d8_8ec4_00304828b574_2769; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61C3F345049 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 78c3eea0_7ecc_11d8_8c93_00304828b574_2765; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC9B719BDB; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:22:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D628319E85; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:22:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 934D219EBE; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:21:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 643C619D87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3E2724FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:21:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4063939B.90609@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] ports update Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2004 21:21:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: As usual, http://swtch.com/plan9port. Lots of bugs fixed. The C is now more standard, so much so that it compiles under SunOS with their compilers. The resulting programs don't stay running for very long, but I've grown to expect that from SunOS. Various small feature additions. Not least, win uses a real pty now, so that ^D and DEL are interpreted properly during the session, and 9term behaves more like recent rio, with filename completion and arrow movement. 9term works on Mac OS X now too. There is a link to a change log at the bottom of the page. Thanks to all who reported bugs, fixes, enhancements, and suggestions. Enjoy. Russ From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 26 18:58:23 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 14:48:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 436c95d2_7ee9_11d8_96ee_00304828b574_22322; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB00B345300 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4337be98_7ee9_11d8_87bb_00304828b574_22319; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A6EC87580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F0387580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 42fe6ef4_7ee9_11d8_97ab_00304828b574_22316; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C51D345300 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 424f21a6_7ee9_11d8_8d40_00304828b574_22312; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:48:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 53E1719F05; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:48:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AA1719EFF; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:48:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D640E19EFC; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:47:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B027819C5D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 00:47:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2Q5k31b066229 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:46:03 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2Q5k3tf066228 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:46:03 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403260546.i2Q5k3tf066228@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:46:03 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > than the idea. In 1980, I was describing the Unix file system to a > supervisor who hadn't heard of it and he said `oh, it sounds like a > database system'. What is it if it is not a database? Your supervisor was a smart guy back in 1980. From nmh@t3x.org Fri Mar 26 18:58:24 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 16:29:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 60082cf2_7ef7_11d8_9514_00304828b574_15913; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3ED7345448 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5fd680e4_7ef7_11d8_805e_00304828b574_15910; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 96A1E7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F8297580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5f97cdf4_7ef7_11d8_9ece_00304828b574_15907; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C2E8345448 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5ee84154_7ef7_11d8_945b_00304828b574_15903; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:29:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4C7A119E62; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:29:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B05819B87; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:29:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8773B19D87; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.185]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D59219B73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:28:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.206] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6llG-0002vf-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:28:14 +0100 Received: from [80.140.17.123] (helo=t3x.org) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (TLSv1:EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B6llF-0001bo-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:28:14 +0100 Received: (from nmh@localhost) by t3x.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i2Q7Q1M03159; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:26:01 +0100 (CET) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Nils M Holm Subject: Re: [9fans] Finding the object suffix In-Reply-To: <5e98ce2e01a213c1498c3df04e10c326@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: <2004032607144000-3134@Symmetry.UUCP> X-Mailer: NMail X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:5b68ff8df1d89a0a7485e040b6c88401 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:14:40 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_NJABL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On 2004-03-25, David Presotto wrote: > first of all, $objtype is the target to compile for, not the type > of the local cpu. You at least need to look at $cputype. I see. I think my explanation was a bit fuzzy, so I will try again. My script runs a compiler that compiles to C. It then has to invoke the proper C compiler and loader to create a program that can be run in the window the compiler was started in. I currently use $O^c -Dplan9 $file.c $O^l $file.$O where $O is the object suffix found. I want the compiler driver to make a good guess on $O, so that the resulting code can run on both terminals and CPU servers (of course not at the same time in case the CPU types differ). > The following would do it with one less process: > sed -n 's/^O=(.*)/\1/p' /$cputype/mkfile Yes, thanks. Nils. -- Nils M Holm -- http://www.t3x.org/nmh/ From philippe.anel@noos.fr Fri Mar 26 18:58:24 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 16:42:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3004de22_7ef9_11d8_946e_00304828b574_19214; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DA2434547E for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2fd487c2_7ef9_11d8_97e0_00304828b574_19211; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 134DC7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF0177580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f96d9d6_7ef9_11d8_83ea_00304828b574_19208; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCC3E34547E for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2ee80f32_7ef9_11d8_964a_00304828b574_19204; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:42:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C748419F0A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A33A19F0E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:42:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 121D819EFD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:41:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.noos.fr (nan-smtp-20.noos.net [212.198.2.120]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBF2319A75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:41:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12709 invoked by uid 0); 26 Mar 2004 07:41:35 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ntmail.noos.fr) ([195.132.21.201]) (envelope-sender ) by 212.198.2.120 (qmail-ldap-1.03) with SMTP for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; 26 Mar 2004 07:41:35 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.0.22.0.20040326083817.0a539bf0@pop.noos.fr> X-Sender: philippe.anel@pop.noos.fr X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.0.22 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Philippe Anel Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Subject: [9fans] Keyboard.h and Win Drawterm Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:43:27 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Dear 9fans, I've just recompiled drawterm.exe with the new keyboard.h. However, the file screen-win.c required the symbol Kdel to be defined, and it is not in the new keyboard.h. What is the value of this symbol ? Regards, Philippe. From nautica@nauticatartessos.com Fri Mar 26 18:58:24 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 16:58:19 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58726b48_7efb_11d8_8f26_00304828b574_22038; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:19 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 015E03454B5 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5841d4a6_7efb_11d8_9f8e_00304828b574_22035; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:19 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D81EB7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 915D67580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58035014_7efb_11d8_93b7_00304828b574_22031; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 136BB3454B5 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 56fd1e02_7efb_11d8_8f5f_00304828b574_22027; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:17 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A75419F0A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:57:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABB1219F0A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:57:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 28E4B19F0F; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:56:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from cse.psu.edu (153.Red-81-38-71.pooles.rima-tde.net [81.38.71.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id DF73819ADD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 02:56:08 -0500 (EST) From: nautica@nauticatartessos.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="10368133" Message-Id: <20040326075608.DF73819ADD@mail.cse.psu.edu> Subject: [Virus Delete] :[9fans] hi Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:56:15 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --10368133 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit anything ok? --10368133-- From forsyth@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 26 18:58:25 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 17:42:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8bd86978_7f01_11d8_9bb6_00304828b574_1787; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 271CA34421D for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8b9eea36_7f01_11d8_825f_00304828b574_1783; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 12E597580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:42 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEE6A7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8b654114_7f01_11d8_8284_00304828b574_1777; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC04234421D for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8ab603f2_7f01_11d8_8d57_00304828b574_1772; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:42:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC95C19F0F; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:42:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3375019F02; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:42:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 935B419F0F; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:41:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from doppio.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42AA919B69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 03:41:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78f16f84fb0fd7bbd231afba600bce13@vitanuova.com> From: C H Forsyth To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:46:04 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > When did the first hierarchical file system appear? Multics? CTSS? OS/360 had hierarchical names ca. 1964/5, although much might depend on the interpretation of `appear', given that system's troubled early history, and i recall someone telling me the implementation was unusual. Several groups seemed to be implementing them about the same time. None of my old books mention who suggested it first, or indeed when Microsoft first got the patent. I've got some more old books at the office, though. From geoff@collyer.net Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:00:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13c06154_7f04_11d8_9063_00304828b574_5825; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3678634428A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 138f8cc8_7f04_11d8_991d_00304828b574_5822; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1AF927580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C78E07580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1351b8b2_7f04_11d8_8d3a_00304828b574_5819; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7A7634428A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 12a3dc1a_7f04_11d8_8b9b_00304828b574_5814; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:00:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3B5EA19F16; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2100919C64; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3740419EF6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FC9519C83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <378214d4b24f870a683cd4d88ea5b009@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <78f16f84fb0fd7bbd231afba600bce13@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:00:04 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A google search turned up this claim at http://turing.cs.camosun.bc.ca/comp112/notes/chapter5.html: Among the first such systems (if not the first) was MIT's CTSS (Corbat=C3=B3 et. al) implemented on an IBM 7090. This was also th= e first system to implement a hierarchical file store (i.e. one with directories - aka folders - and files with them) From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:25:24 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 82e4237e_7f07_11d8_848d_00304828b574_14047; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:24 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6510334419D for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:23 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 823f2d6a_7f07_11d8_8dc1_00304828b574_14031; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:23 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 048BB75810E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:21 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13B32758103 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7e78fc74_7f07_11d8_8713_00304828b574_13987; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:25:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48E4E3442EC for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2db603e6_7f06_11d8_885c_00304828b574_9228; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 783D419F22; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97BA019F1A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:15:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B23B319E96; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:12:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57C2919C83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:12:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2Q9BN1b076781 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:11:23 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2Q9BNN8076780 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:11:23 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403260911.i2Q9BNN8076780@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Keyboard.h and Win Drawterm In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.22.0.20040326083817.0a539bf0@pop.noos.fr> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:11:23 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > However, the file screen-win.c required the > symbol Kdel to be defined, and it is not in the new > keyboard.h. What is the value of this symbol ? 0x7f From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:28:10 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e5ec4ea6_7f07_11d8_8f3d_00304828b574_15538; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 445C834416B for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e5b4ce90_7f07_11d8_92f2_00304828b574_15528; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:10 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 44F0A7580FC; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:06 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF15F7580FA for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e15170c4_7f07_11d8_9a5a_00304828b574_15411; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:28:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A50E7344249 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:15:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 229b16ea_7f06_11d8_99ab_00304828b574_9118; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:15:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63DF119AE4; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:15:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 990CB19F13; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:14:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B8B4A19E62; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:07:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B65919C64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:06:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2Q95k1b076758 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2Q95kfs076757 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403260905.i2Q95kfs076757@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hierarchical filesystems for non-file things? In-Reply-To: <78f16f84fb0fd7bbd231afba600bce13@vitanuova.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Is the use of a uniform hierarchical (filesystem-like) representation for various non-filesystem things an invention brought with Plan 9? 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From brucee@chunder.com Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:31:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6cac733a_7f08_11d8_8064_00304828b574_16424; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BEE13441E1 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6c648cc8_7f08_11d8_92c9_00304828b574_16421; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1FB307580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF0B17580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6c280050_7f08_11d8_97c2_00304828b574_16418; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A80C93441E1 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6b5815de_7f08_11d8_9e98_00304828b574_16414; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1982619AE4; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:31:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47A4019E96; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:31:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 431EB19E96; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:30:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id ED5D919AE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:30:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 32067 invoked by uid 89); 26 Mar 2004 09:28:40 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 26 Mar 2004 09:28:40 -0000 Message-ID: <005e01c41315$49c1b8d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403260546.i2Q5k3tf066228@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:32:38 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: give me a break. tell me how to do a join efficiently if you are trying to treat any filesystem as a dataset. of course a flat file is a database, but it suffers from the same problem. my junk room is a database if you are willing to linear search it to do any data op. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tolpin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 4:46 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? > > than the idea. In 1980, I was describing the Unix file system to a > > supervisor who hadn't heard of it and he said `oh, it sounds like a > > database system'. > > What is it if it is not a database? Your supervisor was a smart guy > back in 1980. From dvd@davidashen.net Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:47:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a221d17a_7f0a_11d8_921d_00304828b574_19534; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13EA134418A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a1f17336_7f0a_11d8_84e5_00304828b574_19531; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EB2057580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A50587580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a1b3a916_7f0a_11d8_9de2_00304828b574_19528; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2D1834418A for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a104934a_7f0a_11d8_824a_00304828b574_19524; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:47:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C55A319F2D; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:47:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B158819F1A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:47:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A9BE819F1A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:46:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4725819AE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:46:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2Q9jF1b076977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:45:15 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2Q9jFRe076976 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:45:15 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403260945.i2Q9jFRe076976@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? In-Reply-To: <005e01c41315$49c1b8d0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:45:15 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > give me a break. tell me how to do a join efficiently if join has never been efficient with hierarchical databases. > you are trying to treat any filesystem as a dataset. I am not trying to treat any filesystem as a dataset. From matt@proweb.co.uk Fri Mar 26 18:58:26 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 18:54:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d9d987c_7f0b_11d8_907d_00304828b574_20754; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 014FF344307 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d6de60e_7f0b_11d8_85c1_00304828b574_20751; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D5CA77580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 964077580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9d3285e6_7f0b_11d8_8416_00304828b574_20748; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7429344307 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9c85a3d0_7f0b_11d8_828f_00304828b574_20744; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0061619F1F; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:54:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D6AE19CCA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:54:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7981D19CA5; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:53:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0211219B71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:53:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] fs as database Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:56:05 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: ah, the tin god efficiency m From DAGwyn@null.net Fri Mar 26 23:11:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 19:09:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b536ea54_7f0d_11d8_9d9a_00304828b574_23698; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8372234432C for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b4ff27d6_7f0d_11d8_97ee_00304828b574_23692; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 656247580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E0B97580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b4bfea12_7f0d_11d8_85ed_00304828b574_23689; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C81C34432C for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b4116a46_7f0d_11d8_9ece_00304828b574_23685; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:09:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DED0419F3A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A536F19F2A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:09:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B0BA19F2C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:08:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4584419F22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:08:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B6o2y-0004f9-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:54:40 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <4063939B.90609@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:54:30 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Russ Cox wrote: > The C is now more standard, so much so that it compiles > under SunOS with their compilers. The resulting programs > don't stay running for very long, but I've grown to expect > that from SunOS. Solaris has been very stable in my experience. Most likely you're doing something like growing the stack without bound, or failing to close fds in a server, or something of the sort involving differences between the Plan 9 and Solaris program environments. From nemo@lsub.org Fri Mar 26 23:11:53 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 21:33:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d438d62e_7f21_11d8_92bd_00304828b574_31515; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3361A3444B6 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d3d5b74c_7f21_11d8_80e9_00304828b574_31512; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1E7537580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F61B7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d36ca7c0_7f21_11d8_8620_00304828b574_31509; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E33A3444B6 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d26e73ee_7f21_11d8_9030_00304828b574_31505; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:33:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B380A19EC7; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:33:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6918619EBB; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:33:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7D1D19CE5; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:32:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DE1B19C5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:32:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3098edf65c7bcf1faf2661621fe0812d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update From: Fco.J.Ballesteros In-Reply-To: <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-zcuedlocevxmctbkqbmgkpflkb" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:32:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-zcuedlocevxmctbkqbmgkpflkb Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Anyone has a translator from Ken C to the std? --upas-zcuedlocevxmctbkqbmgkpflkb Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Mar 26 11:09:33 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 151EE19F34; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0D3819F2C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:09:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B0BA19F2C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:08:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4584419F22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 05:08:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B6o2y-0004f9-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:54:40 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Douglas A. Gwyn" Message-ID: <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <4063939B.90609@swtch.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:54:30 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Russ Cox wrote: > The C is now more standard, so much so that it compiles > under SunOS with their compilers. The resulting programs > don't stay running for very long, but I've grown to expect > that from SunOS. Solaris has been very stable in my experience. Most likely you're doing something like growing the stack without bound, or failing to close fds in a server, or something of the sort involving differences between the Plan 9 and Solaris program environments. --upas-zcuedlocevxmctbkqbmgkpflkb-- From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 26 23:11:53 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 21:36:37 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3930a214_7f22_11d8_93a1_00304828b574_32025; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4C573444BD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 38d7ee30_7f22_11d8_8791_00304828b574_32022; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8D3107580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:36 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 939CE7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3834a5ae_7f22_11d8_95a6_00304828b574_32019; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21C0B3444BD for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 37362f24_7f22_11d8_8d2e_00304828b574_32015; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:36:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0297C19EBD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:36:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07DFE19EC5; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:36:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3034319E3F; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:35:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFD6719CC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:35:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hierarchical filesystems for non-file things? In-Reply-To: <200403260905.i2Q95kfs076757@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-vfnissluuulnejdmnnhavmmpce" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:35:54 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-vfnissluuulnejdmnnhavmmpce Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Depends on what you want to call that which Unix did. We stuck the proc file system there before there was a plan 9. Also, Unix had devices as files, though a hierarchy of 1 is not that general. There were various file systems on Unix, like the semantic file system, that represented more than just files. I remember similar things also presented in Usenix over the years. Then there was the Mumps computer system at the Mas General Hosp built in 1969. It was a system that presented an integrated language and database where everything available to the language was a persistent object. Not hierarchical though. --upas-vfnissluuulnejdmnnhavmmpce Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 26 04:15:30 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 26 04:15:27 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 598DD19E62; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:15:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AF4819B28; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:14:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B8B4A19E62; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:07:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B65919C64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:06:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2Q95k1b076758 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2Q95kfs076757 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403260905.i2Q95kfs076757@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hierarchical filesystems for non-file things? In-Reply-To: <78f16f84fb0fd7bbd231afba600bce13@vitanuova.com> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:46 +0400 (AMT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Is the use of a uniform hierarchical (filesystem-like) representation for various non-filesystem things an invention brought with Plan 9? --upas-vfnissluuulnejdmnnhavmmpce-- From brucee@chunder.com Fri Mar 26 23:11:53 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 21:45:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8004b3aa_7f23_11d8_9e1e_00304828b574_946; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E7A13444DF for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7fd2bd96_7f23_11d8_8cca_00304828b574_943; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1FE1B7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C98527580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f910ff4_7f23_11d8_82d7_00304828b574_940; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCC333444DF for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7edbc482_7f23_11d8_95ff_00304828b574_936; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:45:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7BE319EFE; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:45:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2216C199F9; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:45:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 65ABA19ECA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 291F419E3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:44:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 21043 invoked by uid 89); 26 Mar 2004 12:42:18 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 26 Mar 2004 12:42:18 -0000 Message-ID: <00a701c41330$5810f200$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403260945.i2Q9jFRe076976@adat.davidashen.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:45:19 +1100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: try and convince a generation of database researchers that your first claim is right. try and convince anyone that you can implement a database without implicit datasets. brucee ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Tolpin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 8:45 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? > > give me a break. tell me how to do a join efficiently if > > join has never been efficient with hierarchical databases. > > > you are trying to treat any filesystem as a dataset. > > I am not trying to treat any filesystem as a dataset. From rog@vitanuova.com Fri Mar 26 23:11:53 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 22:01:02 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a268d848_7f25_11d8_81bc_00304828b574_4160; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E95BC344515 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a23804c0_7f25_11d8_9984_00304828b574_4154; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CC1C07580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:01 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87CF17580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a1fa2330_7f25_11d8_8534_00304828b574_4150; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FC48344516 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a134ac9a_7f25_11d8_9670_00304828b574_4082; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:01:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3950D19EF6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:00:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC2B619EDC; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:00:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3E92B19C5E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:59:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24F4D19C82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 07:59:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <378214d4b24f870a683cd4d88ea5b009@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:05:21 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > A google search turned up this claim at > http://turing.cs.camosun.bc.ca/comp112/notes/chapter5.html: some interesting snippets there. i particularly liked this throwaway line: "... a replica Colossus was completed .... A Pentium was programmed to perform the same task and Colossus was found to be just as fast." shows the value of h/w acceleration, i guess. From presotto@closedmind.org Fri Mar 26 23:11:53 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 22:02:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dc2b002e_7f25_11d8_9e00_00304828b574_4372; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D6DD34451B for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbc594aa_7f25_11d8_8d88_00304828b574_4369; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 6FD1C7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C76CF7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id db5b3fd8_7f25_11d8_959e_00304828b574_4366; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FC3634451B for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id da59186c_7f25_11d8_9507_00304828b574_4362; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:02:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 80C1819F05; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:02:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EC8719EBD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:02:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E49F019EF8; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:01:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15E6319C5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:01:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <83653bd32ffffbb975cd81818a419455@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? In-Reply-To: <378214d4b24f870a683cd4d88ea5b009@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qoushuoxoiasvddekeuiqwaovg" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 08:01:30 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.9 required=5.0 tests=WEIRD_PORT autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qoushuoxoiasvddekeuiqwaovg Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I used CTSS in the 1971/72, my first year at MIT. They gave undergrads spare time accounts on any systems there. It was at the end of its life, was way overloaded, and ran on a 7094 that stuck around for quite a few years later. It didn't have a hierarchical file system per se. Just a single level of directories. I can't remember how you named an other user's directory or even the system one. Multics fixed that and added much more. So, I went to see what I could find on the web... http://larch-www.lcs.mit.edu:8001/~corbato/turing91 is a nice read. --upas-qoushuoxoiasvddekeuiqwaovg Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Fri Mar 26 04:00:48 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Fri Mar 26 04:00:44 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1D1AD19F13; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 951B419E62; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3740419EF6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FC9519C83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 04:00:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <378214d4b24f870a683cd4d88ea5b009@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <78f16f84fb0fd7bbd231afba600bce13@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 01:00:04 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A google search turned up this claim at http://turing.cs.camosun.bc.ca/comp112/notes/chapter5.html: Among the first such systems (if not the first) was MIT's CTSS (Corbat=C3=B3 et. al) implemented on an IBM 7090. This was also th= e first system to implement a hierarchical file store (i.e. one with directories - aka folders - and files with them) --upas-qoushuoxoiasvddekeuiqwaovg-- From michael@vitanuova.com Sat Mar 27 00:26:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Fri Mar 26 23:24:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 55f2e114_7f31_11d8_9e95_00304828b574_24537; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9447934460C for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 55bd6db8_7f31_11d8_90f2_00304828b574_24530; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7FE1A7580FA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3761D7580F9 for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 55837234_7f31_11d8_8341_00304828b574_24527; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 450E834460C for ; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 54d48c6a_7f31_11d8_90f3_00304828b574_24523; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:24:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C24D419ECA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:24:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A1F719CC2; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:24:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61E6719CD6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:23:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3756719B69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 09:23:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B6sEV-0000Bf-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:22:51 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Michael Jeffrey Message-ID: Organization: ntl Business News Service References: , <20040325204611.14192.qmail@web41704.mail.yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:22:39 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I tried to use internet explorer for inferno plugin, > but the plugin crashes often. What version of IE were you using? I have experienced no problems recently with the plug-in though I do know that some aspects of the Vita Nuova demo grid have been a little flaky (www.vitanuova.com/solutions/grid.html) and might exhibit themselves as problems in the plug-in. From sah@softcardsystems.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 00:34:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 20494cf6_7f3b_11d8_856e_00304828b574_8316; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 669743446C7 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2000f5c8_7f3b_11d8_8764_00304828b574_8313; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4A6CD7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00DC87580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1fc18dac_7f3b_11d8_8e56_00304828b574_8310; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F0763446C7 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1f12ca74_7f3b_11d8_83b8_00304828b574_8306; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:34:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BC69419EE3; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:34:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A96E19ECA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:34:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3596119BE8; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:33:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36A9D19B09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:33:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2QFb3XV019662 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:37:03 -0500 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] fs as database In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:37:03 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Not sure if this has been noted yet, but it certainly seems germane to the topic: http://msdn.microsoft.com/Longhorn/understanding/pillars/WinFS/default.aspx (gotta use those extra cycles somehow, right?) Sam From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 00:42:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 39bef6ee_7f3c_11d8_82af_00304828b574_10349; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA21E3446E2 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 398ab816_7f3c_11d8_8a4d_00304828b574_10346; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A691D7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D6A17580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3950e7da_7f3c_11d8_96bc_00304828b574_10343; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69AAF3446E2 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 38a0f44c_7f3c_11d8_98ea_00304828b574_10339; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:42:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 34F3F19EBD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1F1319C67; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE3EA19C9C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E70D619C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6718724FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40644F18.4060208@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <3098edf65c7bcf1faf2661621fe0812d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> In-Reply-To: <3098edf65c7bcf1faf2661621fe0812d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: >Anyone has a translator from Ken C to the std? > > Yes, but it's hard to preserve comments and the like. I typically use acme and global search and replace. It's usually trivial. (For a counterexample, though, see libhtml.) Russ From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 00:43:38 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 59387e14_7f3c_11d8_84b8_00304828b574_10577; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 891173446E6 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 59032fe8_7f3c_11d8_8695_00304828b574_10573; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 749F67580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F3D67580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58cb3458_7f3c_11d8_9f87_00304828b574_10570; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30ED63446E6 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5814bff2_7f3c_11d8_84a4_00304828b574_10562; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:43:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D9D9B19F02; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0C0A19ECA; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:43:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E020F19CF9; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA14A19ECA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99BD224FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40644F6C.2010605@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <4063939B.90609@swtch.com> <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> In-Reply-To: <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Douglas A. Gwyn wrote: > Russ Cox wrote: > >> The C is now more standard, so much so that it compiles >> under SunOS with their compilers. The resulting programs >> don't stay running for very long, but I've grown to expect >> that from SunOS. > > > Solaris has been very stable in my experience. Most likely you're > doing something like growing the stack without bound, or failing to > close fds in a server, or something of the sort involving differences > between the Plan 9 and Solaris program environments. I suspect it's a stack overflow problem, I just don't know where to look or how. I'm not overflowing the stack on other systems, and I've got 32kB stacks in the program in question, which should be way more than enough. On Linux I can use valgrind to check such things (well, sort of). Russ From nemo@lsub.org Sat Mar 27 13:00:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 00:49:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 35fbaede_7f3d_11d8_99bb_00304828b574_11569; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1950344704 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 359c20cc_7f3d_11d8_8e4f_00304828b574_11566; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8723F7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6BAC7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 352ed42c_7f3d_11d8_8cd8_00304828b574_11563; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CFA2344704 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 34354e52_7f3d_11d8_8222_00304828b574_11559; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:49:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F276619EF7; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:49:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE93119D07; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:49:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 645B819CD5; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:48:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7B1E19C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:48:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <051da330d0a61ef476d5c5bdf2f1f98d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> From: Fco.J.Ballesteros To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update In-Reply-To: <40644F18.4060208@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bewvwjjrrwnrpcdftbvuydfrvn" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:48:15 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bewvwjjrrwnrpcdftbvuydfrvn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Do you mean that you use global search and replace both to translate anonymous struct/unions to named ones and also to translate array initialization syntax? Initialization syntax can be hard to do that way, unless I'm missing something obvious (eg. like it existing now in the std). Do you have the translator at hand anyway? thanks --upas-bewvwjjrrwnrpcdftbvuydfrvn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Fri Mar 26 16:42:37 MET 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DE0719C7B; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73D5919C67; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE3EA19C9C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E70D619C67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6718724FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40644F18.4060208@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <3098edf65c7bcf1faf2661621fe0812d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> In-Reply-To: <3098edf65c7bcf1faf2661621fe0812d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:41:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: >Anyone has a translator from Ken C to the std? > > Yes, but it's hard to preserve comments and the like. I typically use acme and global search and replace. It's usually trivial. (For a counterexample, though, see libhtml.) Russ --upas-bewvwjjrrwnrpcdftbvuydfrvn-- From rcbilson@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca Sat Mar 27 13:00:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 00:53:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4ea5e6a_7f3d_11d8_8284_00304828b574_12367; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A34DC34470F for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c4aa53e2_7f3d_11d8_9751_00304828b574_12364; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 881A57580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3F0267580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c46bacd2_7f3d_11d8_9483_00304828b574_12361; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CCEA34470F for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c3bcf03e_7f3d_11d8_8095_00304828b574_12357; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:53:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CFE7019F04; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:53:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8393119CF9; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:53:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D087E19CF6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.140.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89C0019F07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:52:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rcbilson@localhost) by plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (8.11.7/8.11.7) id i2QFqlX27346 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:52:47 -0500 (EST) From: Richard C Bilson Message-Id: <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:52:47 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > From: Russ Cox > > I suspect it's a stack overflow problem, I just don't know > where to look or how. I'm not overflowing the stack on other > systems, and I've got 32kB stacks in the program in question, > which should be way more than enough. On Linux I can use > valgrind to check such things (well, sort of). For what it's worth, I haven't yet been able to get the ports working reliably under either Linux/x86 or SunOS. Strangely, they're quite sturdy when run over VNC, but not when I use my normal (Xfree86) X server. I was hoping I could say something more constructive but I can't. If I have some time, I'll see if I can send 'em through purify. - Richard From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Sat Mar 27 13:00:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 01:09:21 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0e1b3ea_7f3f_11d8_96cd_00304828b574_15370; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEB75344738 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id efb075e2_7f3f_11d8_8f87_00304828b574_15364; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:19 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1505E758109; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E5EC758106 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ee5df1ce_7f3f_11d8_9b0d_00304828b574_15353; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D922344738 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:08:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dc4c6182_7f3f_11d8_9a81_00304828b574_15071; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:08:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BA6E519F03; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:08:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AC5019D03; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:08:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E33DC19CFD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:07:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8476519CEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2QG7YCi014206 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:07:34 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2QG7YXc001317 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:07:34 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2QG7Xh09038 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:07:33 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403261607.i2QG7Xh09038@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:52:47 -0500." <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> References: <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 17:07:33 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > For what it's worth, I haven't yet been able to get the ports working > reliably under either Linux/x86 or SunOS. Strangely, they're quite > sturdy when run over VNC, but not when I use my normal (Xfree86) X > server. If the problem is at start up time of window apps (X BadMatch error) the answer may be in a fix (on a fix) I privately send to Russ. If not... on sunos, acme dies when I resize it (make it bigger). I worked around by commenting out the free(i) in libdraw/alloc.c:/^freeimage Now it no longer dies but still does not use the added size. I recompiled all with that 'patch' and now at least those apps I tried seem to work (acme, 9term). Did not use them a lot, so far, though. Axel. From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 01:23:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f66e2b3e_7f41_11d8_8c37_00304828b574_21657; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9494344744 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f63ce31c_7f41_11d8_9d0f_00304828b574_21651; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AB9867580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 621CE7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f5fc5932_7f41_11d8_9556_00304828b574_21648; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67931344744 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f548663e_7f41_11d8_9b52_00304828b574_21644; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:23:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 09E1019F0A; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:23:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42B2519CE8; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:23:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 634A019CFD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48C2719CE8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFD8524FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:22:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4064589E.9020304@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> In-Reply-To: <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:21:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Richard C Bilson wrote: >>From: Russ Cox >> >>I suspect it's a stack overflow problem, I just don't know >>where to look or how. I'm not overflowing the stack on other >>systems, and I've got 32kB stacks in the program in question, >>which should be way more than enough. On Linux I can use >>valgrind to check such things (well, sort of). >> >> > >For what it's worth, I haven't yet been able to get the ports working >reliably under either Linux/x86 or SunOS. Strangely, they're quite >sturdy when run over VNC, but not when I use my normal (Xfree86) X >server. > > I'm running quite reliably under Linux/x86 for all day-to-day work, and I was using FreeBSD for a good while too. There was an important bug fix to libregexp a couple weeks ago, but since then they've been solid. Russ From sah@softcardsystems.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 01:24:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 17b00362_7f42_11d8_89ef_00304828b574_21811; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 926A3344747 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 177b85ce_7f42_11d8_8b85_00304828b574_21808; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 80A8A7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 394CC7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1743c36e_7f42_11d8_8655_00304828b574_21805; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46A85344747 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1694c86e_7f42_11d8_9b56_00304828b574_21801; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:24:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DB02B19F08; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:24:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E644F19EE3; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:24:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1B2CC19CFE; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:23:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F627199EB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:23:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2QGQkXV021953 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:26:46 -0500 From: Sam X-Sender: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update In-Reply-To: <200403261552.i2QFqlX27346@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 11:26:46 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Strangely, they're quite sturdy when run over VNC, but > not when I use my normal (Xfree86) X server. It works like a champ here (gentoo linux, x86, xfree86). I wish I could find the words to express how happy I am using the ports. The first time I used acme in linux I was damn near misty-eyed. (stands and claps) Sam From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 02:42:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 01fc70ae_7f4d_11d8_873d_00304828b574_7005; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EF57344828 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 01b36bb6_7f4d_11d8_917f_00304828b574_7002; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 318AC7580FB; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27321758100 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ff1b4a7c_7f4c_11d8_98d9_00304828b574_6965; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:42:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1616B344845 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:40:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b6d1a1a8_7f4c_11d8_9762_00304828b574_5924; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 02:40:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1261619EE3; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:40:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC3C919CF9; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:40:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8C5BF19D03; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D7F219CD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C96024FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40646AD9.7030304@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <051da330d0a61ef476d5c5bdf2f1f98d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> In-Reply-To: <051da330d0a61ef476d5c5bdf2f1f98d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:37 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Fco.J.Ballesteros wrote: >Do you mean that you use global search and replace both to >translate anonymous struct/unions to named ones and >also to translate array initialization syntax? > > Yes, but different search-and-replaces. >Initialization syntax can be hard to do that way, unless I'm >missing something obvious (eg. like it existing now in the std). > > It's easy to turn int x[10] = { [a] 1, [b] 2, [c] 3, }; into int x[10]; static void initx(void) { x[a]= 1; x[b]= 2; x[c]= 3; }; and then call initx() from somewhere appropriate. > Do you have the translator at hand anyway? I'd have to dig it up and it doesn't entirely work. Russ From schwartz@bio.cse.psu.edu Sat Mar 27 13:00:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 03:25:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 05df85e8_7f53_11d8_9ba3_00304828b574_15244; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BE743448D9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 05aeab4e_7f53_11d8_81a9_00304828b574_15241; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0F96C7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAD767580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 056f5db8_7f53_11d8_8a77_00304828b574_15238; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9B523448D9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 04c15600_7f53_11d8_9b48_00304828b574_15230; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 03:25:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A6FCA19CFD; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:25:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4798F19A6E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:25:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8098B19A20; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:24:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from galapagos.bx.psu.edu (galapagos.bx.psu.edu [128.118.201.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A3DCD199D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:24:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11425 invoked by uid 991); 26 Mar 2004 18:24:52 -0000 Message-ID: <20040326182452.11424.qmail@g.galapagos.bx.psu.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update In-reply-to: <40644F6C.2010605@swtch.com> References: <4063939B.90609@swtch.com> <4uidnZbhYMHKVf7dRVn-tw@comcast.com> <40644F6C.2010605@swtch.com> Comments: In-reply-to Russ Cox message dated "Fri, 26 Mar 2004 10:42:36 -0500." From: Scott Schwartz Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 13:24:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: | I suspect it's a stack overflow problem, I just don't know | where to look or how. I'm not overflowing the stack on other | systems, and I've got 32kB stacks in the program in question, | which should be way more than enough. On Linux I can use | valgrind to check such things (well, sort of). Sun's bcheck might work. I'll see if I can give it a try. From rcbilson@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca Sat Mar 27 13:00:36 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 04:08:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e63bc87c_7f58_11d8_9154_00304828b574_25895; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:08:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04B6634495C for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:08:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e60202f4_7f58_11d8_94c7_00304828b574_25892; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:08:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 22260758102; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:07:59 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A3517580FF for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:07:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e3507fc2_7f58_11d8_9ba0_00304828b574_25841; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:07:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D355344977 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bb263000_7f58_11d8_8fb5_00304828b574_25278; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9777319F05; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:06:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EAA319EF6; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:06:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E194919EDF; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:05:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.140.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A762B19EE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:05:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from rcbilson@localhost) by plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca (8.11.7/8.11.7) id i2QJ5OA19487 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:05:24 -0500 (EST) From: Richard C Bilson Message-Id: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:05:24 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I'm running quite reliably under Linux/x86 for all day-to-day work, Actually, I just blew away my existing copy and did a fresh check-out, and now things seem to work on Linux. Thanks, cvs. I'll see if I can get purify to work on SunOS. From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:36 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 04:17:41 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 409c40c0_7f5a_11d8_92cd_00304828b574_27577; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 30D3C34498D for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 406b21fc_7f5a_11d8_8401_00304828b574_27574; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 123507580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFB207580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 402bd47a_7f5a_11d8_82a7_00304828b574_27571; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A0D34498D for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3f7aaa9c_7f5a_11d8_8924_00304828b574_27567; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:17:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5C2CB19F0B; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C8DF19EE3; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:17:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A754A19AF4; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:16:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C06A419A69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:16:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EA3024FDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:16:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40648187.6050901@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update References: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> In-Reply-To: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:16:23 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Richard C Bilson wrote: >>I'm running quite reliably under Linux/x86 for all day-to-day work, >> >> > >Actually, I just blew away my existing copy and did a fresh check-out, >and now things seem to work on Linux. Thanks, cvs. > >I'll see if I can get purify to work on SunOS. > > I did just fix an important bug in the resize code that could cause stray memory accesses after you've resized the window. And I rolled in Axel's new startup code changes -- they handle the case where you're sitting at a (say) 24-bit display but have your default window depth set to 8-bit. William Josephson suggests that the setlabel/gotolabel implementation for SPARC may not be handling register window overflow/underflow properly. We have a different implementation in tra (and of course I don't know the history of either one) that might be worth trying, but I've done my time fighting this stuff for the day. ("SPARC" is "CRAPS" backwards. -- rob) Russ From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Sat Mar 27 13:00:36 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 04:29:05 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d802b8b2_7f5b_11d8_8104_00304828b574_29631; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92E5534493F for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7c1e648_7f5b_11d8_8bb9_00304828b574_29628; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:04 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 457727580FE; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:04 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D16D4758105 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d6b7b084_7f5b_11d8_8064_00304828b574_29625; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:29:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B4F33449C6 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:28:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cfaca88a_7f5b_11d8_97d6_00304828b574_29426; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 04:28:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A53319B19; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:28:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8F3019B19; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:28:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E5F6D19EE3; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:27:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 81BF819ADD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:27:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2QJR8Ci004445 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:27:08 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2QJR8Xc020951 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:27:08 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2QJR8Y18542 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:27:08 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403261927.i2QJR8Y18542@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 26 Mar 2004 14:16:23 -0500." <40648187.6050901@swtch.com> References: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> <40648187.6050901@swtch.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:27:08 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I did just fix an important bug in the resize code > that could cause stray memory accesses after you've > resized the window. And many thanks for that!! > And I rolled in Axel's new startup > code changes -- they handle the case where you're > sitting at a (say) 24-bit display but have your default > window depth set to 8-bit. Just to have it mentioned in public: the code only uses the default window depth if all else fails -- if it succeeds at 24-bit it will happily ignore your default 8-bit. (if this would be too surprising the code could be changed to only try the default, I guess) Axel. From poundsmack@hotmail.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:36 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 05:40:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7d2517c_7f65_11d8_8941_00304828b574_12784; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E1A7344A95 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d787e42a_7f65_11d8_970f_00304828b574_12781; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 10AEB7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B028C7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7409962_7f65_11d8_8017_00304828b574_12778; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA9AF344A95 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d685c060_7f65_11d8_9fa1_00304828b574_12774; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:40:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 61ED119F08; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 15:40:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CBBD19D31; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 15:40:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB73119C03; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 15:39:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay15-f8.bay15.hotmail.com [65.54.185.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CE1A19C9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 15:39:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:51 -0800 Received: from 67.117.24.1 by by15fd.bay15.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:39:51 GMT X-Originating-IP: [67.117.24.1] X-Originating-Email: [poundsmack@hotmail.com] X-Sender: poundsmack@hotmail.com From: "chris niewiarowski" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Mar 2004 20:39:51.0743 (UTC) FILETIME=[7CFDE4F0:01C41372] Subject: [9fans] please someone take me off this mainling list Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 12:39:51 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: please someone take me off this mailing list. thank you very much _________________________________________________________________ Free up your inbox with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage. Multiple plans available. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/ From micah@cnm-vra.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 09:59:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0f093ac4_7f8a_11d8_957b_00304828b574_6991; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7E6C344DD8 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0eda0434_7f8a_11d8_8e15_00304828b574_6988; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id BB8997580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75AF67580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0e9c9090_7f8a_11d8_9104_00304828b574_6985; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8239E344DD8 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0ded1f2a_7f8a_11d8_922e_00304828b574_6981; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:59:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7968219EF7; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:59:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B828019BFF; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:59:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CC89D19D60; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:58:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C2BE19BFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:58:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id E8FAC8E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:28 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 16:58:28 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Lately, I've been having a problem with scrolling under acme and rio. Basically, unless I am VERY quick with my click on the scroll bar, the window scrolls much more than a single click should. The delay that used to occur between the initial one-click scroll and the hold-the-button continuous scrolling is no longer there. However, I don't see any recent changes (looking in sources' dump) that look to me like they would affect that. Also, the symptoms are kind of weird. When I boot my laptop off of my newly assembled (yay) Fossil/Venti/Auth server, which is up to date as of today, I get the effect consistently. I think I remember seeing it happen booting from the hard disk on my laptop a few weeks ago, but I can't be sure. Still, I booted on my laptop this afternoon and couldn't reproduce the problem. Even when I would cpu to the new server and run the rio or acme binary from there, it didn't happen. So I updated the laptop from sources (it hadn't been since late February) and continued to puzzle about it. I did not reboot, and unsurprisingly, the behavior didn't change. But after the update, I left the machine sitting for an hour or two while I worked on other things. When I came back, I got the weird scrolling. But I still haven't rebooted. Now this puzzles me more than everything else put together. What happened while I wasn't looking? Thanks, Micah From rsc@swtch.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 10:52:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 71345ea2_7f91_11d8_8132_00304828b574_20270; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BE9D344E75 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7103749a_7f91_11d8_8c36_00304828b574_20267; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E193D7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 995DD7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 70c32cf0_7f91_11d8_9526_00304828b574_20264; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A736E344E75 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 701491e0_7f91_11d8_9b77_00304828b574_20260; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:52:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 63BEC19F13; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D327519D77; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:52:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EC4BC19D4C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D716719D1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:51:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 660FE24FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:51:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling References: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> In-Reply-To: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:51:26 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: When you get the weird scrolling, try: date; sleep 10; date and see if the clock is running at the right speed. Look at a real clock too. Sleep 10 is what will be too fast if the clock is bogus. The date may actually be accurate, thanks to timesync. Russ From dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 10:58:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 47df7aae_7f92_11d8_952b_00304828b574_21110; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32B27344E89 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 47af541e_7f92_11d8_8e32_00304828b574_21107; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1300E7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE0E17580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 476dbad6_7f92_11d8_855a_00304828b574_21104; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C24A0344E89 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 46b90906_7f92_11d8_8051_00304828b574_21100; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:58:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BEFE519F15; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE1BB19D60; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:58:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EA88219D77; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1153A19D51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:57:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5e1723a506eab3a3f86f39d50139d148@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: dmr@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] is plan 9 based on XML? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:57:25 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > CTSS didn't have a hierarchical file system per se. Just a single level of > directories. I can't remember how you named an other user's directory > or even the system one. I recall it was just 2-level; a sort of root, plus user directories (some of them associated with the system). There was a scheme for linking which appears to be effectively the same as a Unix symbolic link; the command was link name1 name2 prob prog [name3 [name4]] which meant that what one might think of as name1.name2 in ones own directory would now refer to name3.name4 in the directory of person prog in group prob. The prob&prog were things like t234 and 8038 which might approximate the one I had. Permissions were checked at the time of making the link. Groups/probs had several "comfiles", directories shared among a group. There was a command to switch the current directory to one of the group's comfile directories and also to the system one. In many ways the effect was analogous to the one described in the early Unix history paper about the PDP-7: names always referred to the current directory, but links to others could be made. >Multics fixed that and added much more. That's for sure. Dennis From jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com Sat Mar 27 13:00:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 12:15:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0e1daa2e_7f9d_11d8_96ee_00304828b574_6057; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B37F0344FB3 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0de81594_7f9d_11d8_81d6_00304828b574_6054; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 96CD07580FB; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EDB17580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0da8fc10_7f9d_11d8_937c_00304828b574_6050; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BB8E344FB3 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0cf9deba_7f9d_11d8_812f_00304828b574_6043; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:15:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 07CCE19F1C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:15:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3121719F1C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:15:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4A3BB19F1C; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:14:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E1E519F27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:14:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 22:14:49 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I remarked on this yesterday at work when it happened on my laptop. We discovered that when the laptop has the lid closed, on re-opening some of the clocks have been altered by the BIOS/APM. The real solution would be to make Plan 9 deal with these events properly, but in the meantime we're testing something else. As Presotto said, time is, indeed, slippin' slippin' slippin' into the future. From micah@cnm-vra.com Sat Mar 27 18:08:43 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 14:08:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d49195c6_7fac_11d8_8e78_00304828b574_1012; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28F3934518D for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d460f1a0_7fac_11d8_9bce_00304828b574_1009; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0BC1F7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B33FF7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d41eaa16_7fac_11d8_9df0_00304828b574_1006; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B39EB34518D for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d3678b1a_7fac_11d8_834d_00304828b574_1001; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F355419F46; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:08:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9CFC319F41; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:08:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23FB319F3E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:07:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F385319B48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 537468E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:07:54 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327050754.GA20193@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:07:54 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 26, 2004 at 08:51:26PM -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > date; sleep 10; date On Fri, Mar 26, 2004 at 10:14:49PM -0500, jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > We discovered that when the laptop has the lid closed, on re-opening > some of the clocks have been altered by the BIOS/APM. The real ... > As Presotto said, time is, indeed, slippin' slippin' slippin' into > the future. Thanks, guys, that's exactly it. When I boot the system from the hard disk, it doesn't have the problem. But if I simply close the lid and reopen it, windows scroll like lightning and sleep 10 sleeps for about 3 seconds. The thought of the clock running out of control had flitted into my mind yesterday, but I didn't actually consider it, that should teach me. Micah From a@9srv.net Sat Mar 27 22:46:45 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 19:24:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fb3b56ea_7fd8_11d8_917d_00304828b574_9925; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9719344298 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fb0ab95e_7fd8_11d8_9b72_00304828b574_9922; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id BED477580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 765DB7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id faccefd4_7fd8_11d8_9113_00304828b574_9919; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84F47344298 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fa1e8d90_7fd8_11d8_977e_00304828b574_9915; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:24:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8981919F55; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:24:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01A6319F59; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:24:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CA73319F43; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:23:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9srv.net (h-66-134-100-77.mclnva23.covad.net [66.134.100.77]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 602E719CAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:23:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <630e5da285bc5b2624d3f1429c11926d@9srv.net> From: a@9srv.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:21:26 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable // As Presotto said, time is, indeed, slippin' slippin' slippin' // into the future. huh. that was presotto? coulda' *swore* that was someone else... steve something-or-other, maybe... =E3=82=A2 From davel@anvil.com Sat Mar 27 22:46:45 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 19:51:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be67fc1a_7fdc_11d8_8886_00304828b574_16543; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C18723454E8 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be31c276_7fdc_11d8_8381_00304828b574_16540; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A3EAB7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51C297580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bdec0a7e_7fdc_11d8_9f82_00304828b574_16537; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56BA63454EB for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bd3773e8_7fdc_11d8_9091_00304828b574_16521; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 19:51:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42C6119CEA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:51:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D943919F66; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:51:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51F0C19CEA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:50:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54CA119F5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 8CD8029A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:49:58 +0000 (GMT) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6A07296 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:49:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from localhost (IDENT:root@rothko [192.168.4.66]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id KAA17864 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:50:07 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <630e5da285bc5b2624d3f1429c11926d@9srv.net> References: <630e5da285bc5b2624d3f1429c11926d@9srv.net> Content-Type: text/plain Message-Id: <1080384619.1811.1.camel@rea> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:50:19 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sat, 2004-03-27 at 10:21, a@9srv.net wrote: > // As Presotto said, time is, indeed, slippin' slippin' slippin' > // into the future. > > huh. that was presotto? coulda' *swore* that was someone else... > steve something-or-other, maybe... Not quite ... That was "Time _keeps on_ slippin', slippin' ..." (my emphasis) Back to your usual programming:-) Dave. From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 27 23:36:19 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 23:08:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 47699ca6_7ff8_11d8_80d9_00304828b574_31220; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1B2A3444DC for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 471e5ed0_7ff8_11d8_9c7f_00304828b574_31217; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8E09C7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 367987580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 46a74700_7ff8_11d8_950f_00304828b574_31214; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 314143444DC for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 45f8c270_7ff8_11d8_84cf_00304828b574_31210; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:08:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D9DB919F8E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:08:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1E6319B49; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:08:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A4D819F8F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:07:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCFE219F8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:07:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.136.140.87]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <318405-4656>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:06:41 -0500 Message-ID: <005801c413fc$1b5e7cc0$1dfea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] hierarchical filesystems for non-file things? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:04:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Depends on what you want to call that which Unix did. We stuck the > proc file system there before there was a plan 9. 8th Ed From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 27 23:36:19 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 23:11:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac169352_7ff8_11d8_953a_00304828b574_31698; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB3263444E4 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id abdfa7de_7ff8_11d8_8ebd_00304828b574_31695; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D71BA7580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E34F7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aba56c54_7ff8_11d8_9c95_00304828b574_31692; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A0F73444E4 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aaf59720_7ff8_11d8_94e2_00304828b574_31688; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:11:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A9C5C19F5E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6322B19F93; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:11:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 43EBA19F8C; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:10:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CB3919C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:10:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.136.140.87]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <317518-21771>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:09:18 -0500 Message-ID: <00ac01c413fc$77fdbae0$1dfea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <051da330d0a61ef476d5c5bdf2f1f98d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:07:32 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Do you have the translator at hand anyway? sam From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 27 23:36:19 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 23:12:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cdeb3870_7ff8_11d8_9b40_00304828b574_31870; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8C583444ED for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cdafa8d2_7ff8_11d8_9cdd_00304828b574_31867; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 993C47580FA; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5095D7580F9 for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cd786886_7ff8_11d8_87e7_00304828b574_31864; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C99A3444ED for ; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ccc8a70c_7ff8_11d8_8cd6_00304828b574_31860; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:12:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9C11A19F9D; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:12:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEB7119F91; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:12:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 869C719F96; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:11:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B15119C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:11:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.136.140.87]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <330588-29111>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:10:56 -0500 Message-ID: <00e101c413fc$b3159940$1dfea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:09:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Thanks, cvs. oxymoron From boyd@insultant.net Sat Mar 27 23:36:19 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sat Mar 27 23:14:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 178c8254_7ff9_11d8_88be_00304828b574_32131; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 23:14:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47CE43444F3 for ; 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Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:14:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F96A19F5E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:14:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E9E7619F9F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:13:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FE2B19F94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:13:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.136.140.87]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <322615-2063>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:12:33 -0500 Message-ID: <00f701c413fc$ecfbfc80$1dfea8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403261905.i2QJ5OA19487@plg2.math.uwaterloo.ca> <40648187.6050901@swtch.com> <200403261927.i2QJR8Y18542@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Subject: Re: [9fans] ports update MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 14:10:49 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rob did say, many years ago, that the SPARC FPU was a nightmare. From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 28 08:53:49 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:02:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cfcd5b4e_7fff_11d8_865b_00304828b574_9903; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF0B93445A5 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cf5c84c8_7fff_11d8_99b4_00304828b574_9900; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D72177580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40E007580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ceef9a02_7fff_11d8_89e6_00304828b574_9897; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB28E3445A5 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cdec26c0_7fff_11d8_89de_00304828b574_9893; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:02:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7115019D7E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4D9A19D7E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:02:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 843B419C90; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:01:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1659619D09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:01:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <20040327050754.GA20193@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-wmithulgiftrgjbhhcosezbxjl" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:01:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-wmithulgiftrgjbhhcosezbxjl Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. I can only assume that the firmware uses it for something to do with detecting the lid opening again. Timesync doesn't change the local hardware, it just tweaks the kernel's idea of what time it is and of what the clock frequency is. It would cope with the clock change except that I made timesync ignore any huge swings (anything more than 25%) because I had assumed that would only be the result of a samplng mistake. I changed the limits and timesync will now put up with such a change, though it will take some minutes to latch onto the exact new value (needs enough of a time base to compare to). Tell me if this is a problem. Short of actually implementing ACPI, I think this is as good as we can do. --upas-wmithulgiftrgjbhhcosezbxjl Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 00:08:43 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 00:08:40 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 875F619F3E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:08:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7125B19B48; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:08:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 23FB319F3E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:07:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F385319B48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 00:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 537468E; Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:07:54 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327050754.GA20193@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <246ae64b4f3f36dddcc5dbebebb92c9f@plan9.bell-labs.com> <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 21:07:54 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Fri, Mar 26, 2004 at 08:51:26PM -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > date; sleep 10; date On Fri, Mar 26, 2004 at 10:14:49PM -0500, jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com wrote: > We discovered that when the laptop has the lid closed, on re-opening > some of the clocks have been altered by the BIOS/APM. The real ... > As Presotto said, time is, indeed, slippin' slippin' slippin' into > the future. Thanks, guys, that's exactly it. When I boot the system from the hard disk, it doesn't have the problem. But if I simply close the lid and reopen it, windows scroll like lightning and sleep 10 sleeps for about 3 seconds. The thought of the clock running out of control had flitted into my mind yesterday, but I didn't actually consider it, that should teach me. Micah --upas-wmithulgiftrgjbhhcosezbxjl-- From sape@huygens.org Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:08:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a5e31b4c_8000_11d8_901d_00304828b574_10777; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BF453445B4 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a5b23b58_8000_11d8_8a22_00304828b574_10774; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 6D8577580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24DF57580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a571c230_8000_11d8_980b_00304828b574_10771; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32B473445B4 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a4c31794_8000_11d8_891b_00304828b574_10767; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:08:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51B2619F84; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:08:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B08219F30; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:08:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 28E4A19F84; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCC7B19D7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:07:16 EST 2004 Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.36.6.151]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:07:14 EST 2004 Message-ID: <609fa6e57786ca89ae54d85144ba7630@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. > I can only assume that the firmware uses it for something > to do with detecting the lid opening again. > > Timesync doesn't change the local hardware, it just > tweaks the kernel's idea of what time it is and of > what the clock frequency is. It would cope with > the clock change except that I made timesync ignore any huge > swings (anything more than 25%) because I had assumed that > would only be the result of a samplng mistake. > > I changed the limits and timesync will now put up with such a > change, though it will take some minutes to latch onto > the exact new value (needs enough of a time base to > compare to). > > Tell me if this is a problem. Short of actually > implementing ACPI, I think this is as good as we can > do. Does this work if timesync doesn't have an external time source to synchronize to? Sape From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:14:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7756c7aa_8001_11d8_87ac_00304828b574_12166; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E50453445D0 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7687a3b2_8001_11d8_8694_00304828b574_12155; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9C43F758102; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03DA07580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7561b9e6_8001_11d8_93a6_00304828b574_12142; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:14:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C30D5344614 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 57535234_8001_11d8_8414_00304828b574_11737; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:13:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96A7819F9C; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:13:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA79219F30; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:13:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB8F019F84; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:12:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC1E519C90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:12:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00277185ea730763ab1db50b85fa473b@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <609fa6e57786ca89ae54d85144ba7630@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-yayrzxwwkglmyeuuasrtoijowa" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:12:47 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-yayrzxwwkglmyeuuasrtoijowa Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You always have the local real time clock. It doesn't tick very often but is fairly accurate. aux/timesync -r This is the default in termrc. --upas-yayrzxwwkglmyeuuasrtoijowa Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:08:44 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:08:41 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB94919F8E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:08:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE2CF19F84; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:08:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 28E4A19F84; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCC7B19D7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:07:16 EST 2004 Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.36.6.151]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:07:14 EST 2004 Message-ID: <609fa6e57786ca89ae54d85144ba7630@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:07:12 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. > I can only assume that the firmware uses it for something > to do with detecting the lid opening again. > > Timesync doesn't change the local hardware, it just > tweaks the kernel's idea of what time it is and of > what the clock frequency is. It would cope with > the clock change except that I made timesync ignore any huge > swings (anything more than 25%) because I had assumed that > would only be the result of a samplng mistake. > > I changed the limits and timesync will now put up with such a > change, though it will take some minutes to latch onto > the exact new value (needs enough of a time base to > compare to). > > Tell me if this is a problem. Short of actually > implementing ACPI, I think this is as good as we can > do. Does this work if timesync doesn't have an external time source to synchronize to? Sape --upas-yayrzxwwkglmyeuuasrtoijowa-- From rm@hamnavoe.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:24:58 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e8183f04_8002_11d8_861c_00304828b574_17377; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 594DA34416F for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e7bcbc06_8002_11d8_9199_00304828b574_17369; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:57 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1881F7580FB; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FA82758107 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e57c596a_8002_11d8_9df1_00304828b574_17344; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:24:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B6BB3445B7 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:23:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b9b9e9aa_8002_11d8_95e7_00304828b574_16762; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:23:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4145B19CCC; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:23:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFF5C19F30; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:23:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C389C19F46; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:22:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40FBC19CCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:22:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:22:57 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. > I can only assume that the firmware uses it for something > to do with detecting the lid opening again. This seems to be a particular problem with thinkpads - and it's not just closing the lid: screen blanking will reset the clock period as well. Fixing it with timesync is not good enough, because bad things can still happen while the clock is racing until timesync notices. In particular, the timeout waiting for a spun-down hard drive to come up is much too short, resulting in spurious "disk errors" - I've lost my fossil fs twice because of this. (Thanks to venti, this was an irritation rather than a disaster.) Here's the workaround I use to detect the loss of the clock period and repair it as soon as it happens. You'll still lose the odd millisecond but it's better than an ongoing 5x clock overrun: term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/i8253.c i8253.c 268c269 < else --- > else { 269a271,278 > if (x > 3*MaxPeriod) { > outb(Tmode, Load2|Square); > outb(T2cntr, 0); /* low byte */ > outb(T2cntr, 0); /* high byte */ > y = 0xFFFF; > x = i8253.period; > } > } Alternatively, why not use the TSC when there is one? I note that this is the default for the MP architecture, but only for CPU server kernels -- does anyone know why? Here's a one-line fix which also seems to work on my thinkpad: term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/devarch.c devarch.c 692a693 > archgeneric.fastclock = tscticks; -- Richard From sape@huygens.org Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:37:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b1419a3c_8004_11d8_9adb_00304828b574_19474; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92E6B344609 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b10ba2ba_8004_11d8_8bed_00304828b574_19471; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7F6147580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 345257580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b0d08310_8004_11d8_81fb_00304828b574_19468; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ED98344609 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b01fc19c_8004_11d8_81f3_00304828b574_19464; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:37:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C11B19F93; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:37:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF53719F8F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:37:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A485D19F8F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A059A19D81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:36:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:36:17 EST 2004 Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.36.6.151]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:36:16 EST 2004 Message-ID: <68eab5e7e52aa9a6451a513da72ba395@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:36:15 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Alternatively, why not use the TSC when there is one? I note that > this is the default for the MP architecture, but only for CPU server > kernels -- does anyone know why? TSC is a problem on laptops too. The TSC frequency changes as the power management changes the CPU speed. This was why we didn't use it. Sape From rsc@swtch.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:39:36 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f39916da_8004_11d8_804d_00304828b574_19801; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE46B344615 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f363fbe4_8004_11d8_958b_00304828b574_19798; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:35 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CAE6E7580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:35 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81B0D7580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f32a1db6_8004_11d8_92c0_00304828b574_19795; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EC61344615 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f27af624_8004_11d8_87c6_00304828b574_19791; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:39:34 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6983F19FA1; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:39:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7339819F88; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:39:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E128419F9C; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF33B19D81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (pcp02328361pcs.summit01.nj.comcast.net [68.84.56.226]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61C1724FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40659FE8.8030709@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling References: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> In-Reply-To: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:16 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >Alternatively, why not use the TSC when there is one? I note that >this is the default for the MP architecture, but only for CPU server >kernels -- does anyone know why? > >Here's a one-line fix which also seems to work on my thinkpad: > >term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/devarch.c devarch.c >692a693 > > >> archgeneric.fastclock = tscticks; >> >> The TSC is not reliable once the BIOS starts playing tricks with CPU speeds. Try unplugging your Thinkpad and see if your TSC keeps running at the same speed. Russ From presotto@closedmind.org Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 00:40:08 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 065a1742_8005_11d8_9721_00304828b574_19937; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10BFE344617 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 05f65784_8005_11d8_8492_00304828b574_19934; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:07 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id F1D757580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:06 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 665A07580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 05933f64_8005_11d8_98cb_00304828b574_19931; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:06 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25292344618 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:05 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 04b318f8_8005_11d8_9e7a_00304828b574_19924; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:40:05 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0715219FA3; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:40:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9EE419F88; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:39:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4088A19D81; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2DD419F88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7d074d7874b8d3363a1f853ce63c4e5b@plan9.bell-labs.com> From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-fbzydrivhufubortqkbsoesntm" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:08 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-fbzydrivhufubortqkbsoesntm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Too many of the laptops systems have clock scaling for power conservarion. I used to use the TSC everywhere I could but it's even more of a problem with laptops. People kept complaining that when plugging/unplugging their machines into power supplies or when their batteries ran down, time would speed up or slow down. I use it on my own laptop. I agree that timesync doesn't notice anywhere near fast enough. I'll add ytour hack too. --upas-fbzydrivhufubortqkbsoesntm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com ([135.104.9.2]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:23:41 EST 2004 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by plan9; Sat Mar 27 10:23:38 EST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1AD4019F96; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:23:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B14C19CCC; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:23:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C389C19F46; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:22:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40FBC19CCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:22:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:22:57 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. > I can only assume that the firmware uses it for something > to do with detecting the lid opening again. This seems to be a particular problem with thinkpads - and it's not just closing the lid: screen blanking will reset the clock period as well. Fixing it with timesync is not good enough, because bad things can still happen while the clock is racing until timesync notices. In particular, the timeout waiting for a spun-down hard drive to come up is much too short, resulting in spurious "disk errors" - I've lost my fossil fs twice because of this. (Thanks to venti, this was an irritation rather than a disaster.) Here's the workaround I use to detect the loss of the clock period and repair it as soon as it happens. You'll still lose the odd millisecond but it's better than an ongoing 5x clock overrun: term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/i8253.c i8253.c 268c269 < else --- > else { 269a271,278 > if (x > 3*MaxPeriod) { > outb(Tmode, Load2|Square); > outb(T2cntr, 0); /* low byte */ > outb(T2cntr, 0); /* high byte */ > y = 0xFFFF; > x = i8253.period; > } > } Alternatively, why not use the TSC when there is one? I note that this is the default for the MP architecture, but only for CPU server kernels -- does anyone know why? Here's a one-line fix which also seems to work on my thinkpad: term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/devarch.c devarch.c 692a693 > archgeneric.fastclock = tscticks; -- Richard --upas-fbzydrivhufubortqkbsoesntm-- From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 01:10:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4dc69dd6_8009_11d8_8f8a_00304828b574_25558; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DD32344676 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d911102_8009_11d8_9b9f_00304828b574_25555; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1A4957580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C59CF7580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d576fc4_8009_11d8_99ab_00304828b574_25552; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4F7E344676 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4ca9949e_8009_11d8_8305_00304828b574_25548; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:10:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7F80019F71; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 11:10:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47DCD19F6A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 11:10:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B99AF19B48; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 11:09:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rhome.plan9.ucalgary.ca (d137-186-244-103.abhsia.telus.net [137.186.244.103]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93A2119B21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 11:09:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <87ea250dc079d0b59b56acdd9018c1ed@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:07:07 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DSBL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * [snip] > term% diff /sys/src/9/pc/i8253.c i8253.c [snip] to confirm it works on my T23, thanks! From rm@hamnavoe.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 02:04:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dbf41fb4_8010_11d8_9970_00304828b574_5469; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3B973446F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id db8beb88_8010_11d8_9285_00304828b574_5466; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B35667580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BED47580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id db4b2166_8010_11d8_99f1_00304828b574_5460; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A5833446F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id da9cc742_8010_11d8_8965_00304828b574_5455; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:04:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 803BF19F88; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:04:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EB5D19CCC; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:04:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A3E2C19C86; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 307DF19C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:03:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3c09fb0c924aa24d3909682be04258df@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling From: Richard Miller In-Reply-To: <40659FE8.8030709@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 17:03:29 0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Try unplugging your Thinkpad and see > if your TSC keeps running at the same speed. I have, and it does. But there must be other circumstances where it wouldn't (it is supposed to have "SpeedStep=E2=84=A2 Technology", after a= ll). I may have thought about this and then forgotten again, after I settled on the other fix. > What's really nuts is that after rebooting with your fix and closing/op= ening > the lid a few times now my t23 runs much colder and the fan rarely spin= s up. No idea why this should be - maybe some other APM side effect in the BIOS= ? But I daren't close the lid on my t21, because the vga doesn't recover pr= operly (the left third of the screen image is replicated three times). The t23 = must use a different vga chip. -- Richard From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sun Mar 28 08:53:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 02:41:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03e125b2_8016_11d8_84ce_00304828b574_12049; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAB2C344774 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 03b08272_8016_11d8_9206_00304828b574_12046; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8C0867580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44A6E7580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0370c7a4_8016_11d8_9b8d_00304828b574_12043; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 513EC344774 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 02c13ba4_8016_11d8_8613_00304828b574_12039; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 02:41:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A4B919D6B; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:41:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A867419D2E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:41:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 12B1319D2E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:40:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from rhome.plan9.ucalgary.ca (d137-186-244-103.abhsia.telus.net [137.186.244.103]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3EA219CCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:40:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b0916ab8db61cc99e267e7e550558a0@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] mounting channels in a Plan 9 server? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:38:24 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.1 required=5.0 tests=RCVD_IN_DSBL autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * what's the best way to import a file hierarchy into a 9p server? for example, when i'm serving a set of files (A) and want to add to that set another hierarchy served by a different program (B) on a file descriptor i have. trivially it could be done using general plan9 tools by mounting A somewhere, mounting B in one of the directories served by A and srvfs-ing the whole thing, but what if I don't want to post a file descriptor in /srv? looking at the devsrv code in /sys/src/9/port doesn't have a solution, since all the 9p messages there return channels, which doesn't happen in userland... i also looked at the QTMOUNT mode bit but there are exactly three examples or it being used, none of which tell whether it's the thing i need. so my question is: is there a possibility to say 'here is a file descriptor/chan you shall use for your next request' when a client walks a file hierarchy i'm serving? i.e. is there a way to mount a file descriptor in an in-memory server? andrey From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:12:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1d3e82ce_802b_11d8_8370_00304828b574_16560; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0DAF344967 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1d04d45c_802b_11d8_94e4_00304828b574_16556; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7B4F87580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B7967580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1cac7b72_802b_11d8_8806_00304828b574_16553; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D342344967 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1bf62aca_802b_11d8_9f3e_00304828b574_16546; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:12:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 677A519D91; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:12:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D5F719D8F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:12:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B300619D8E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7F9719D80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:11:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id AE9C58E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:11:30 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327201130.GA20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:11:30 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > This seems to be a particular problem with thinkpads - and it's > not just closing the lid: screen blanking will reset the clock > period as well. Yeah, mine's a T22, and before that I had a 600. Thinkpads seem to be very common on this list. Is it because they have three buttons on the builtin pointer thing? That was one of the selling points for me. Micah From Victim_Of_Hype@idiqto.com.br Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:25:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ef041e12_802c_11d8_9de3_00304828b574_18601; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A84934499F for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eec147b8_802c_11d8_9ee1_00304828b574_18598; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D51F97580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B1847580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ee576e2e_802c_11d8_8cbc_00304828b574_18595; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43D7734499F for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ed9b83bc_802c_11d8_8218_00304828b574_18591; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:25:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91DDE19D9C; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:25:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E0A419D7A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:25:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E4D1C19D29; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:24:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51FD919B98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:24:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B7KCG-0000TJ-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:14:24 +0000 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Victim_Of_Hype@idiqto.com.br Message-ID: Organization: X-Privat NNTP Server - www.x-privat.org Subject: [9fans] When You Hear The Heavy Accent & The Poor Phone Connection... HANG UP!!! _____ 3n9s66CgKP Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 17:33:02 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.8 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME,PLING_PLING, SUBJ_HAS_UNIQ_ID autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * When You Hear The Heavy Accent & The Poor Phone Connection... HANG UP!! - I think you must know what Im talking about. Together, a heavy foreign accent, coupled with a lousy phone connection can only mean one thing... An outsourced operation, in a place like India, China, The Philippines, etc.; where some greedy American corporation is saving a few pieces of Silver and displacing American workers in the process. - The best thing you can do is hang up... look for the companies on-shore counterpart and complain! Tell them youre sick and tired of sub-standard services by people who speak English so poorly that you can hardly communicate... are most often poorly trained... have little accountability for the advice they give you... often cant be heard clearly because of a poor satellite phone connection... conveniently block their caller-ID... give themselves phony names like Tina or Jimmy (to deceive you into thinking theyre local) and most often provide no avenue to escalate an issue to someone who can really help. - Corporations will only end this practice if they see theyre losing their customer base as a consequence. Lets start doing our part by starting a grass-roots movement... - When You Hear The Heavy Accent & The Poor Phone Connection... HANG UP! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -(Ignore what follows) To be wet or distant will fill sharp clouds to loudly reject. I am angrily weak, so I converse you. Both believing now, Gilbert and Gay attacked the healthy shores in short cap. She may weekly look among durable smart cellars. They are wandering about urban, towards bad, behind fat balls. Will you cover among the office, if Ramsi freely likes the cat? Don't try to creep the butchers lazily, expect them slowly. No dark kettle or hill, and she'll inadvertently burn everybody. Where will you irrigate the glad stale sauces before Ismat does? For Ronette the hen's active, within me it's sweet, whereas on you it's pulling abysmal. Tomorrow, go seek a code! When will we jump after Ayub dyes the proud station's elbow? He can walk the deep fig and taste it inside its bedroom. 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From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:28:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5a74e636_802d_11d8_965c_00304828b574_18993; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29FA73449A9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5a1e3ed0_802d_11d8_8e2c_00304828b574_18990; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id BFE2D7580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 694EB7580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 59a78d62_802d_11d8_87b9_00304828b574_18987; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49D023449A9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58e9124c_802d_11d8_99e0_00304828b574_18983; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:28:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2118F19F6A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:28:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 338A319DA2; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:28:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 59DB719D88; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:27:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 218BA19B98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:27:14 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id AD6928E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:27:13 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327202713.GB20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <20040327050754.GA20193@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:27:13 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > The clock (timer 2) speeds up by a factor of 5 or so. I think this might also explain another problem I've had. Sometimes, when I've booted from the fileserver using IL, my laptop will work fine for a while and then decide that the fileserver connection has hung up. Running netstat on the server says it's still established. This has happened 2 or 3 times in as many days, and, if I remember correctly, always after a screen blank. I haven't noticed it using TCP, but I've only booted with TCP once or twice. I'm thinking the factor five speedup is causing a race between the 30 second keep-alive timer and the 6-second delay before a query is sent on an inactive connnection. When the timer wins, the connection is torn down. I've also seen a disk error or two recently from fossil on this machine, as someone else talked about in this thread. It's so nice to have something to blame it all on. Micah From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:42:50 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4fe459c0_802f_11d8_9946_00304828b574_21284; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91062345595 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4fabea9a_802f_11d8_9f3b_00304828b574_21280; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 792417580F9; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E3827580FC for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4f6e3592_802f_11d8_8588_00304828b574_21271; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BFEC345595 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4ebf6e5e_802f_11d8_96ce_00304828b574_21255; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:42:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F13F19DA7; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:42:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B146E19D7A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:42:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B369319D88; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:41:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD7D619D5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:41:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 508638E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:41:46 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] When You Hear The Heavy Accent & The Poor Phone Connection... HANG UP!!! _____ 3n9s66CgKP Message-ID: <20040327204146.GC20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:41:46 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.5 required=5.0 tests=PLING_PLING,SUBJ_HAS_UNIQ_ID autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: * > The bucket for the upper kiosk is the powder that recollects > actually. Mark V. Shaney a spammer? Who can you trust? Micah From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:47:14 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ed7e02c6_802f_11d8_99b6_00304828b574_22165; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C9D13449D2 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ec4dba5e_802f_11d8_8fc8_00304828b574_22158; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:12 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0FB0C7580F9; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:12 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC5FA7580FB for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ebf11510_802f_11d8_934e_00304828b574_22154; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:47:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76FB23449D2 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:46:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dc2648da_802f_11d8_9319_00304828b574_21928; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:46:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A5D3B19D95; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:46:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 276B219D7A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:46:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 194CA19D8A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:45:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9633019D5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:45:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2RKjCCi023967 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 21:45:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2RKjCXc027513 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 21:45:12 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2RKjC009972 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 21:45:12 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200403272045.i2RKjC009972@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: thinkpads (was Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling) In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 27 Mar 2004 12:11:30 -0800." <20040327201130.GA20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> <78e57cf1aaa73ca03a1e3a5df2385bd8@hamnavoe.com> <20040327201130.GA20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 21:45:12 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Micah wrote: > Yeah, mine's a T22, and before that I had a 600. Thinkpads > seem to be very common on this list. Is it because they > have three buttons on the builtin pointer thing? That > was one of the selling points for me. (I don't have one, unfortunately) it would be the sellng point for me (the other would be my (correct or not?) impression of robustness) Axel. From dfawcus@cisco.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 05:59:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id acca8b8a_8031_11d8_8b9c_00304828b574_27284; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52BC9344A00 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac81b0b8_8031_11d8_866b_00304828b574_27281; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3DF5B7580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB0F17580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac485796_8031_11d8_9f94_00304828b574_27278; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2C47344A00 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ab8bba8c_8031_11d8_837b_00304828b574_27274; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 05:59:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2FCAF19F9A; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:59:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B02AA19D9C; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:59:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 10CF819F62; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:58:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B389B19D95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:58:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 27 Mar 2004 13:06:51 +0000 Received: from cisco.com (edinburgh.cisco.com [144.254.112.76]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i2RKwBsk010936 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 21:58:12 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id UAA05754 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:58:42 GMT From: Derek Fawcus To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327205841.A5244@edinburgh.cisco.com> References: <609fa6e57786ca89ae54d85144ba7630@plan9.bell-labs.com> <00277185ea730763ab1db50b85fa473b@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <00277185ea730763ab1db50b85fa473b@plan9.bell-labs.com>; from presotto@closedmind.org on Sat, Mar 27, 2004 at 10:12:47AM -0500 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:58:42 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sat, Mar 27, 2004 at 10:12:47AM -0500, David Presotto wrote: > You always have the local real time clock. It doesn't tick very > often but is fairly accurate. One can always reprogram it to tick faster (I've previously used 1024 Hz) In fact one can even use it as the systems clock - though I've only ever come across one OS that did. DF From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 08:53:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 06:34:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9172d7de_8036_11d8_80c7_00304828b574_1747; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 033BE344A7D for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 912b60de_8036_11d8_8da0_00304828b574_1743; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C81587580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 822747580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 90ea82da_8036_11d8_86b1_00304828b574_1740; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EB58344A7D for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9031015c_8036_11d8_9cee_00304828b574_1736; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:34:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E964119FA4; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 16:34:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C916B19D97; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 16:34:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 39BC619DAD; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 16:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4588D19D6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 16:33:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id D0BD48F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 13:33:45 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20040327213345.GA27727@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Subject: [9fans] kernels on sources Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 13:33:45 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: With the new kbd stuff, the kernels on sources need to be recompiled. If you run the new programs with the old kernels, you just get the question-in-a-box glyph whenever you hit the down arrow. Thanks, Micah From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 17:11:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 08:58:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b06d4cd2_804a_11d8_947c_00304828b574_4279; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03351344C48 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b03c4470_804a_11d8_9bde_00304828b574_4276; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id DBA167580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 918EC7580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id affca568_804a_11d8_818b_00304828b574_4273; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E0A6344C48 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id af4ca4f6_804a_11d8_9eb8_00304828b574_4269; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 08:58:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5CAEC19DB9; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:58:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0588019D5F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:58:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 223A619D5E; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:57:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 395B019D29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:57:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 62B9D8F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:57:09 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040327235709.GE4181@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <20040327050754.GA20193@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <466a2993c3a0232a58065be590e2a716@plan9.bell-labs.com> <20040327202713.GB20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20040327202713.GB20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:57:09 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sat, Mar 27, 2004 at 12:27:13PM -0800, Micah Stetson wrote: > TCP once or twice. I'm thinking the factor five speedup > is causing a race between the 30 second keep-alive timer > and the 6-second delay before a query is sent on an > inactive connnection. When the timer wins, the connection > is torn down. Well, if that was happening, it wasn't the only problem. I just had the fileserver connection hang up without APM being involved at all (as far as I can see). I ran sleep from my hard disk and it took the appropriate amount of time. Back to puzzling, Micah From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Sun Mar 28 17:11:44 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 10:18:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dd4f163a_8055_11d8_92b2_00304828b574_22526; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDA64344D18 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dd1e1a26_8055_11d8_987c_00304828b574_22523; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A07C97580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 612687580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dce4451c_8055_11d8_9118_00304828b574_22520; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6212C344D18 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dc2d8958_8055_11d8_913c_00304828b574_22516; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 10:18:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E14F119DBF; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:18:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48C3F19DC2; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:18:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7563219DC0; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:17:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 287E519DBE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 20:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2S1Hkog002089 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:17:47 -0700 Received: from localhost (mirtchov@localhost) by fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) with ESMTP id i2S1HkrT002086 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:17:46 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca: mirtchov owned process doing -bs From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kernels on sources In-Reply-To: <20040327213345.GA27727@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 18:17:46 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: not the kernels but programs like rio, acme and vncv. the problem comes from a change in /sys/include/keyboard.h which changed down arrow to send something else, instead of 0x80... they were recompiled on sources two days ago andrey On Sat, 27 Mar 2004, Micah Stetson wrote: > With the new kbd stuff, the kernels on sources need to > be recompiled. If you run the new programs with the old > kernels, you just get the question-in-a-box glyph whenever > you hit the down arrow. > > Thanks, > > Micah > From micah@cnm-vra.com Sun Mar 28 17:11:45 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 15:19:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e47b229e_807f_11d8_9305_00304828b574_21256; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0EB034510A for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e3b9cb9e_807f_11d8_9eff_00304828b574_21249; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 6AEAE7580FD; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CC107580FB for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e2c2ddde_807f_11d8_8fa0_00304828b574_21236; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:19:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15EE534510A for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:16:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79216b8e_807f_11d8_910a_00304828b574_19856; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:16:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACB2719DE7; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:16:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 502EE19C9F; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:16:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 58FB819C91; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:15:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from epaphras.cnm-vra.com (adsl-66-122-178-130.dsl.chic01.pacbell.net [66.122.178.130]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 578BE19BC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:15:57 -0500 (EST) Received: by epaphras.cnm-vra.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 79EA68F; Sat, 27 Mar 2004 22:15:56 -0800 (PST) From: Micah Stetson To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kernels on sources Message-ID: <20040328061556.GC1634@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> References: <20040327213345.GA27727@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2004 22:15:56 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > not the kernels but programs like rio, acme and vncv. the problem comes from > a change in /sys/include/keyboard.h which changed down arrow to send > something else, instead of 0x80... > > they were recompiled on sources two days ago That's the point. Rio, acme, etc. were recompiled to expect the new rune (0xf800, I think). But the kernels in /386 are still sending 0x80. When I rebuilt 9pcf from source and rebooted with it, all was well again. Micah From dvd@davidashen.net Sun Mar 28 17:11:45 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 15:58:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5e473efa_8085_11d8_96e8_00304828b574_29790; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72DFD3451C3 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5e124ed4_8085_11d8_8096_00304828b574_29787; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 605A77580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 183D17580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5dd968f8_8085_11d8_84d7_00304828b574_29784; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24D473451C3 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5d2a226c_8085_11d8_8b75_00304828b574_29780; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 15:58:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E0EAC19DF5; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAE1619CE7; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:58:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AFA7719DCD; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:57:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4818C19CE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:56:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2S6tT1b092600 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 11:55:29 +0500 (AMST) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2S6tSGP092599 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 11:55:28 +0500 (AMST) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403280655.i2S6tSGP092599@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] kernels on sources In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 11:55:28 +0500 (AMST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > not the kernels but programs like rio, acme and vncv. the problem comes from > a change in /sys/include/keyboard.h which changed down arrow to send > something else, instead of 0x80... > > they were recompiled on sources two days ago If there was a need to change drawterm, there is a need to recompile kernels for those who use plan9 terminals. From brucee@chunder.com Sun Mar 28 21:10:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 17:46:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6deae352_8094_11d8_872d_00304828b574_19730; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 246BB3453CC for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6db40792_8094_11d8_85ba_00304828b574_19727; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 10E917580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB0787580F9 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6d79ac96_8094_11d8_830d_00304828b574_19724; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2F693453CC for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6cc72a30_8094_11d8_8e42_00304828b574_19720; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:46:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id F3F3D19EE5; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:46:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6CD919DF5; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:46:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 828F819DF5; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 46F5619DF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:45:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 32651 invoked by uid 89); 28 Mar 2004 08:42:56 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 28 Mar 2004 08:42:56 -0000 Message-ID: <002101c414a1$52f33fe0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403280655.i2S6tSGP092599@adat.davidashen.net> Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Subject: [9fans] 8c vlong support Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 18:47:28 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i have been doing a fair amount of vlong support for 8c. it's all table driven and fraught with peril. it compiles itself to a fixed point and passed all the torture tests i thru at it. jmk did some testing and found a nasty, which is fixed, and now he reports that the kernel runs just fine. i'd like bashers - break it please and you get a beer. should i post a URL now or is it better for me to find some more bugs (and write some more tables) and post it next week? humbly and stumbly, brucee From brucee@chunder.com Sun Mar 28 21:10:35 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 17:58:20 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0f6a25b6_8096_11d8_8eea_00304828b574_23799; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89EB334419A for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0d653300_8096_11d8_9403_00304828b574_23767; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:16 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A58FE7580FA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:14 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FD4D758106 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0af3d112_8096_11d8_9466_00304828b574_23740; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:58:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02B0C344186 for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:54:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 905c116c_8095_11d8_9691_00304828b574_22047; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:54:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 09CD319F9B; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:54:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FFC519D6D; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:54:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9796E19DFA; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:53:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from wmail.atlantic.net (wmail.atlantic.net [209.208.112.158]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A087D19DF1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 03:53:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12954 invoked by uid 89); 28 Mar 2004 08:50:08 -0000 Received: from cpe-203-51-68-173.nsw.bigpond.net.au (HELO cc77109e) (203.51.68.173) by wmail.atlantic.net with SMTP; 28 Mar 2004 08:50:08 -0000 Message-ID: <002b01c414a2$542fc210$8201a8c0@cc77109e> From: "Bruce Ellis" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200403280655.i2S6tSGP092599@adat.davidashen.net> <002101c414a1$52f33fe0$8201a8c0@cc77109e> Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c vlong support Organization: www.chunder.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 18:54:46 +1000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: oh yeah, private e-mail is preferred. in any case if the e-mail's subject contains "vlong" it will be tendered to with due haste. brucee From matt@proweb.co.uk Sun Mar 28 21:10:36 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Sun Mar 28 20:06:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0204d684_80a8_11d8_9ce3_00304828b574_20364; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A0473454CE for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 01d515ac_80a8_11d8_9838_00304828b574_20361; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id EF8267580FB; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7C2E7580FA for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 019543e6_80a8_11d8_8db5_00304828b574_20358; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB8493454CE for ; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 00e009b8_80a8_11d8_8917_00304828b574_20350; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 20:06:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3977119FAC; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:06:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39E5719FAC; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:06:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 22EC419FAC; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:05:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEC3519DD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 28 Mar 2004 06:05:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <20040327201130.GA20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 12:07:46 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > Is it because they have three buttons on the builtin pointer thing? of the 21 laptops listed in the supported hardware list, 10 of them are IBM Thinkpads Of the remainder, many are hard to find and when you do find them, you discover they are early pentium 1s. The only non IBM one's from the list I've regularly found on ebay.co.uk were the Dell Inspiron 7000 and the Toshiba Portege 3440CT, which are at the expensive end of the spectrum. m From blstuart@bellsouth.net Tue Mar 30 00:06:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 29 22:55:43 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c580689a_8188_11d8_831f_00304828b574_28818; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F709344385 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c54e87a8_8188_11d8_8bec_00304828b574_28815; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 31F477580FA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:43 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFFD47580F9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c510689c_8188_11d8_9216_00304828b574_28812; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECB27344385 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c460b762_8188_11d8_9223_00304828b574_28807; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:55:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 74DA919BAA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:55:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F183719CDE; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:55:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5B4D919CB6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B78419CDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B7x3a-00042Z-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:44:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Message-ID: <5m69c.149631$rB4.13369@bignews6.bellsouth.net> Organization: University of Bath Computing Services, UK References: <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com>, <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:41:52 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rsc@swtch.com (Russ Cox) wrote: >When you get the weird scrolling, try: > >date; sleep 10; date > >and see if the clock is running at the right speed. >Look at a real clock too. Sleep 10 is what will >be too fast if the clock is bogus. The date may >actually be accurate, thanks to timesync. I've seen the same sort of thing with the new build of acme on Linux. The really wierd thing is that I've seen a similar thing in Inferno running hosted in Linux. Occationally, on a single click, it takes off as if I were holding it, and only stops if I move the mouse out of the scroll bar. Brian From pavlovetsky@ztel.ru Tue Mar 30 00:06:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 29 22:56:14 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7e76b1e_8188_11d8_8dd9_00304828b574_28954; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A087344385 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7a75e16_8188_11d8_8842_00304828b574_28950; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:14 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 062E87580FA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:14 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B060F7580F9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d76ce0e2_8188_11d8_824a_00304828b574_28947; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF346344385 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d6be8380_8188_11d8_833d_00304828b574_28943; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 98DB219CE0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:56:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B37A19D18; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:56:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 47ED119D11; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 27C5D19CB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B7x3a-00042f-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:44:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Anton Pavlovetsky Message-ID: <81b3a3f4.0403270512.38222d55@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [9fans] Glenda wants to change files in /rc/bin/inst Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:42:03 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Glenda asked me wether she able to make changes in /rc/bin/inst/startppp, line 28: from "atdt"=20 to "adtp". Also, we have error message while=20 trying to download distribution as a part of=20 textonly installation process: unknown option s usage: ppp [-cCdfPSu] [-b baud] [-k keyspec] [-m mtu] [-p dev] [-s username]... How can I help her? From pavlovetsky@ztel.ru Tue Mar 30 00:06:38 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 29 22:56:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ec3764c0_8188_11d8_8d67_00304828b574_28994; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CB44344388 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ec010650_8188_11d8_80e0_00304828b574_28991; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 283277580FA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D35437580F9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ebc6b644_8188_11d8_8f66_00304828b574_28988; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA04344388 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eb16e444_8188_11d8_8f5e_00304828b574_28984; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:56:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DA12419D1D; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:56:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 890C619D11; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:56:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 730F019D0F; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 411B519CDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B7x3a-00042o-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:44:02 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Anton Pavlovetsky Message-ID: <81b3a3f4.0403272326.1e72e0e8@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 References: <81e5588179d7.8179d781e558@cwru.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Programming Trident 9385 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:42:12 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable While I was trying textonly install Glenda asked me wether she able to make changes in /rc/bin/inst/startppp, line 28: from "atdt"=20 to "adtp". Also, we have error message while=20 trying to download distribution as a part of=20 textonly installation process: unknown option s usage: ppp [-cCdfPSu] [-b baud] [-k keyspec] [-m mtu] [-p dev] [-s username]... How can I help her, do you know, Noah? From pavlovetsky@ztel.ru Tue Mar 30 00:06:39 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 29 22:57:18 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fdac685e_8188_11d8_8374_00304828b574_29155; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8606D34438B for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fd77e750_8188_11d8_97e6_00304828b574_29152; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 712677580FA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 265017580F9 for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fd3c3692_8188_11d8_800e_00304828b574_29149; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3269534438B for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id fc8c48ae_8188_11d8_9a7c_00304828b574_29145; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:57:16 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0617419D2F; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:57:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B69D19BAA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:57:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B0ABB19CE0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B9D419CB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:54:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B7x3b-00042u-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:44:03 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Anton Pavlovetsky Message-ID: <81b3a3f4.0403281338.719ac1fe@posting.google.com> Organization: http://groups.google.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [9fans] I'm sorry: seems to be bug. Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:42:23 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We have error message while=20 trying to download distribution as a part of=20 textonly installation process: unknown option s usage: ppp [-cCdfPSu] [-b baud] [-k keyspec] [-m mtu] [-p dev] [-s username]... Please help. I want to install Plan 9 very much. From rsc@swtch.com Tue Mar 30 00:06:39 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Mon Mar 29 23:37:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a885c068_818e_11d8_8510_00304828b574_5349; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F72534439B for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a7841282_818e_11d8_807b_00304828b574_5342; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 21D2A7580FF; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D625D7580FC for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a73fd554_818e_11d8_8afa_00304828b574_5336; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:37:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 643193443CC for ; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:35:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 611cdaf4_818e_11d8_8a82_00304828b574_4389; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:35:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3250C19D52; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:35:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A92C219D2F; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:35:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5DA6719D58; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:34:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F8C419D3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:34:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (node-40245942.bos.onnet.us.uu.net [64.36.89.66]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F0BE24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:34:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <406833D7.8080000@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling References: <4064DE1E.5050805@swtch.com>, <20040327005828.GA2896@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> <5m69c.149631$rB4.13369@bignews6.bellsouth.net> In-Reply-To: <5m69c.149631$rB4.13369@bignews6.bellsouth.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:33:59 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: blstuart@bellsouth.net wrote: >rsc@swtch.com (Russ Cox) wrote: > > >>When you get the weird scrolling, try: >> >>date; sleep 10; date >> >>and see if the clock is running at the right speed. >>Look at a real clock too. Sleep 10 is what will >>be too fast if the clock is bogus. The date may >>actually be accurate, thanks to timesync. >> >> > >I've seen the same sort of thing with the new >build of acme on Linux. The really wierd thing >is that I've seen a similar thing in Inferno >running hosted in Linux. Occationally, on >a single click, it takes off as if I were holding >it, and only stops if I move the mouse out of >the scroll bar. > > I've seen this under FreeBSD under VMware. I think it's an XFree86 bug. When I stopped using VMware and FreeBSD, the problem went away, but I'm sure I'm also running a different version of XFree86. From splite@purdue.edu Tue Mar 30 14:47:55 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 00:19:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f997644_8194_11d8_848a_00304828b574_16482; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F6E34443D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f6736de_8194_11d8_927b_00304828b574_16479; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D6FCC7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E5B37580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f2682ba_8194_11d8_92cb_00304828b574_16476; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A55234443D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7e767a6e_8194_11d8_8475_00304828b574_16472; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:19:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 121B419D55; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:19:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D8EF19D61; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:19:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B7FD719D55; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:18:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from sigint.cs.purdue.edu (sigint.cs.purdue.edu [128.10.2.82]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE39219AAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:18:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by sigint.cs.purdue.edu (Postfix, from userid 118) id 5D807CDCE; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:18:46 -0500 (EST) From: splite@purdue.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling Message-ID: <20040329151846.GA1841@sigint.cs.purdue.edu> References: <20040327201130.GA20944@epaphras.cnm-vra.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: X-Disclaimer: Any similarity to an opinion of Purdue is purely coincidental Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:18:46 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Sun, Mar 28, 2004 at 12:07:46PM +0100, matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > The only non IBM one's from the list I've regularly found on ebay.co.uk > were the Dell Inspiron 7000 and the Toshiba Portege 3440CT, which are > at the expensive end of the spectrum. The cost for the Inspiron is in the shipping; the thing's a tank. I just did a net install on an Inspiron 3500 and it's working fine, modulo sound. Same Pentium II, XGA TFT, and 440BX chipset as the 7000, but about 2/3 the height and a bit lighter. Sadly, it also has the same detestable two-button trackpad. Would be nice if one of the useless "billg ego keys" could be used as a third mouse button instead of shift+button 2. From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 30 14:47:55 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 00:35:44 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be5795b2_8196_11d8_853b_00304828b574_19490; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43F613444D9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be272dfa_8196_11d8_94f3_00304828b574_19487; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 269517580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6FEF7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bdeaa83a_8196_11d8_9ef7_00304828b574_19484; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8E443444D9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bd3da0b8_8196_11d8_8659_00304828b574_19480; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:35:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CF74619D8D; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:35:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0884E19D8F; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:35:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 62D4D19D80; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:34:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E687319D3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:34:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <685cee3b3e29a9b78b907075ddbba3d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-Reply-To: <5m69c.149631$rB4.13369@bignews6.bellsouth.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:36:38 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have had this in native plan9 in acme more than once m From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 30 14:47:55 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 01:00:32 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 35010e20_819a_11d8_804a_00304828b574_24783; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1357C3442A5 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 345b2e92_819a_11d8_81a1_00304828b574_24775; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:31 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A89C77580FB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:30 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 657427580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 335ccca8_819a_11d8_8db5_00304828b574_24764; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:00:30 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7684C34431E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:58:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f8df6a18_8199_11d8_93df_00304828b574_23815; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:58:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0877A19DF0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:58:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B30E019D91; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:58:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9D39419D91; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A31219DAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 10:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2TFvSCi017883 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:57:28 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2TFvRXc002448 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:57:27 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2TFvRk12751 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:57:27 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200403291557.i2TFvRk12751@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol X-Mailer: exmh version 2.6.3 04/04/2003 with version: MH 6.8.3 #20[UCI] To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:36:38 +0100." <685cee3b3e29a9b78b907075ddbba3d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> References: <685cee3b3e29a9b78b907075ddbba3d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:57:27 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have slightly faster than expected scrolling in ports acme. On the other hand, button2 in acme scroll bar sometimes is slow, and a bit jerky (and 'elavator' overshoots?) as if it has trouble keeping up with the mouse movement. From Axel.Belinfante@cs.utwente.nl Tue Mar 30 14:47:55 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 02:32:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 14e4ad42_81a7_11d8_8147_00304828b574_16402; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54BBD344303 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:41 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 14a7154a_81a7_11d8_8613_00304828b574_16399; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:41 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 41D647580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA5707580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 146bf0b4_81a7_11d8_9db6_00304828b574_16396; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F34C1344303 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 13ba30a4_81a7_11d8_9f69_00304828b574_16392; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 02:32:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4059519B35; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 12:32:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 842F5199FB; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 12:32:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB2E4199E6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 12:31:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B6F819A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 12:31:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.cs.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by utrhcs.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id i2THVkCi029233 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 19:31:46 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2THVkXc006331 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 19:31:46 +0200 (MEST) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id i2THVk613381 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 19:31:46 +0200 (MEST) Message-Id: <200403291731.i2THVk613381@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] rio and acme scrolling In-reply-to: Your message of "Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:57:27 +0200." <200403291557.i2TFvRk12751@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> References: <685cee3b3e29a9b78b907075ddbba3d4@juice.thebigchoice.com> <200403291557.i2TFvRk12751@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut,/8z,z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN,DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M,iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.67, clamav-milter version 0.66n Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 19:31:45 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have slightly faster than expected scrolling in ports acme. > On the other hand, button2 in acme scroll bar sometimes is slow, > and a bit jerky (and 'elavator' overshoots?) > as if it has trouble keeping up with the mouse movement. To be more precise: I run acme 'on' a sunos vnc server at work, vnc client in plan 9 at home. (cable modem connection) I click button 1 or button 3 _once_ in a scroll bar: it scrolls _twice_. Of course, it also happens that it scrolls only once. Axel. From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 03:37:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 305af488_81b0_11d8_91bc_00304828b574_30097; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E78AB34461A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 30261092_81b0_11d8_9c7c_00304828b574_30094; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CA5ED7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83F177580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2fe7e1b4_81b0_11d8_9edd_00304828b574_30091; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9065F34461A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2f383a7a_81b0_11d8_9965_00304828b574_30087; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 03:37:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4501519CA9; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D15C19BAB; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:37:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AE80419BB3; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:36:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D154619B00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:36:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403291731.i2THVk613381@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] hget Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 19:42:01 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: i just noticed that hget always seeks to the start of its output fd, which meant that the script i was trying to run: {for(i in $urls) hget $i} > allurls can't work. (and it does seem reasonable to be able to pipe hget through other commands, etc). a simple fix won't work, due to the "partial content" error, and the fact that hget restarts after error. does anyone know how common these conditions are? i often do: ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aa918848_81ba_11d8_8a39_00304828b574_16946; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2E0B47580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D99317580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aa52b1c2_81ba_11d8_877d_00304828b574_16943; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B601A3446F4 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a985386e_81ba_11d8_8ab5_00304828b574_16935; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:52:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0D94219ADF; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C87319C2A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:52:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 498A219C2A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:51:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70BF619ADF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:51:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (lusitania.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.154]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E05BB24FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:51:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40687E22.2010506@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 14:50:58 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >i often do: > > >in acme (highlight, then middle-button click, to substitute the >contents of the url); i realise now that this won't always work. > > it won't work if the connection gets halfway done, hangs up, and the remote server doesn't support content-range requests. but how often are you in this situation? From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:02:11 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f752560c_81bb_11d8_93e5_00304828b574_18929; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 131F234471A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f7071660_81bb_11d8_919a_00304828b574_18918; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:11 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7675B758101; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:10 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 775E37580FD for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f614b69a_81bb_11d8_84bf_00304828b574_18891; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E37A1344723 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:07 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f5073750_81bb_11d8_8159_00304828b574_18838; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:02:08 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1077419B00; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:01:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AE3B19B67; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:01:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51FE519B67; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DB5519D3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:00:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2TJwt1b003587 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:58:55 +0500 (AMST) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2TJwsOC003586 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:58:54 +0500 (AMST) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403291958.i2TJwsOC003586@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:58:54 +0500 (AMST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > should hget get to a temporary file when writing to stdout, > or avoid retry, or... ? > > has anyone got strong views on this? > hcat ? A separate utility that does just what hget is mostly used for? From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:10:34 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22e312ba_81bd_11d8_9a7f_00304828b574_22126; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:34 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 244AC34471E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:33 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22494270_81bd_11d8_96f2_00304828b574_22118; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:33 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C1627758100; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:32 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 839057580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21ec269e_81bd_11d8_82fe_00304828b574_22113; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AED29344721 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:08:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e3eb581a_81bc_11d8_8b80_00304828b574_21261; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:08:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2719A19DF3; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:08:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 188DD19D27; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:08:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 632E119D2A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:07:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C4FA19BEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:07:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <00a2104440670cbbedfa015c194ac561@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <40687E22.2010506@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 21:12:48 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > it won't work if the connection gets halfway done, hangs up, > and the remote server doesn't support content-range requests. > but how often are you in this situation? actually, it seems (from the hget code) that the server can return error 206 (partial content) which causes a seek on the output, even if the content-range request is supported. i've no idea how common this is though. i was thinking of changing hget so that if it's writing to stdout, it would give up with an error rather than trying to seek back and try again. the would at least mean you could use it in a pipeline without worrying about occasionally duplicated portions of output. an option similar to -o but without the modification time semantics could yield the current behaviour (ideally, i'd make the modification time stuff a separate option (-u?) and use it in addition to -o to get the current -o semantics; but that would break some things). From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:13:59 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9ced29a6_81bd_11d8_9416_00304828b574_23662; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8574934471E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9cb68392_81bd_11d8_8ff5_00304828b574_23659; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:58 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 256CB7580FF; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:57 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C05E77580FA for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 9a78e304_81bd_11d8_9934_00304828b574_23633; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE2EB34471E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 245ab97c_81bd_11d8_9032_00304828b574_22139; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:10:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E669519BEA; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:10:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 070D319D27; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:10:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9100619DD6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DCB919D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:09:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2TK891b003699 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:08:09 +0500 (AMST) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2TK89gK003698 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:08:09 +0500 (AMST) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403292008.i2TK89gK003698@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget In-Reply-To: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:08:09 +0500 (AMST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i just noticed that hget always seeks to the start of its output > fd, which meant that the script i was trying to run: > > {for(i in $urls) hget $i} > allurls > > can't work. (and it does seem reasonable to be able to pipe hget > through other commands, etc). {for(i in $urls) hget $i} | cat > allurls should work, shouldn't it? seek on a pipe should do nothing? From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:17:42 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2223517c_81be_11d8_8f6d_00304828b574_25674; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08DF73441A1 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:42 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 21ec555a_81be_11d8_8fda_00304828b574_25671; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:42 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4514C7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:41 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4520A7580FF for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2048654a_81be_11d8_8f66_00304828b574_25655; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:17:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0E1A344730 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 94648bbc_81bd_11d8_9f8e_00304828b574_23565; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:13:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 75CFD19DFB; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:13:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 455A719D3D; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:13:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 81EE919DD6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:12:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C379919D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:12:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <200403292008.i2TK89gK003698@adat.davidashen.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 21:18:20 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > {for(i in $urls) hget $i} | cat > allurls > > should work, shouldn't it? seek on a pipe should do nothing? yes. except that in the case of a retry after premature eof, you'll get duplicated output, something it's probably better to avoid if poss. From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:18:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4e9f2cb2_81be_11d8_90c3_00304828b574_25853; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F52F3441A1 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4e5be074_81be_11d8_9ae0_00304828b574_25850; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5F6267580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DCFF7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4e0ad9f4_81be_11d8_9e75_00304828b574_25847; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC7DC3441A1 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4d462c08_81be_11d8_8663_00304828b574_25843; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:18:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 858C419AA1; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:18:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D36C19AD7; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:18:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ED32519D3D; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:17:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F4B619D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:17:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7beb0bc1a3de01c3c6844789bf84f187@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] mounting channels in a Plan 9 server? From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <9b0916ab8db61cc99e267e7e550558a0@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 21:23:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > trivially it could be done using general plan9 tools by mounting A > somewhere, mounting B in one of the directories served by A and > srvfs-ing the whole thing, but what if I don't want to post a file > descriptor in /srv? then use exportfs directly (it's what srvfs uses, after all). this is the correct solution; in general you can't just add the namespace for one 9p server into another - after all they use different qid, tag and fid spaces. this kind of multiplexing is exactly what exportfs is for. (along with the kernel itself). you could of course do the job of exportfs within your own fileserver (but there are lots of non-trivial gotchas). in limited domains, this can be a reasonable approach; i've done similar things in the past. From rsc@swtch.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:19:19 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5b972032_81be_11d8_9d94_00304828b574_25977; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 523EC3442CA for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5b492436_81be_11d8_9591_00304828b574_25974; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:18 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 034607580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:18 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A28757580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5ae4af74_81be_11d8_9bbf_00304828b574_25971; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:17 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C31C3442CA for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:16 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5a26e250_81be_11d8_8dfd_00304828b574_25967; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:16 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 53EC119AC4; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3592319DFC; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:19:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B6F9819DFC; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:17:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B735D19D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (lusitania.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.154]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72DA324FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:17:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40688432.9030502@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget References: <00a2104440670cbbedfa015c194ac561@vitanuova.com> In-Reply-To: <00a2104440670cbbedfa015c194ac561@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:16:50 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >>it won't work if the connection gets halfway done, hangs up, >>and the remote server doesn't support content-range requests. >>but how often are you in this situation? >> >> > >actually, it seems (from the hget code) that the server can return >error 206 (partial content) which causes a seek on the output, even if >the content-range request is supported. i've no idea how common this >is though. > >i was thinking of changing hget so that if it's writing to stdout, it > > down that path lies madness... >would give up with an error rather than trying to seek back and try >again. > > how about hget -1 meaning "try once, then give up."? From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:24:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2343a1dc_81bf_11d8_9279_00304828b574_26928; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68402344738 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 230d55d2_81bf_11d8_8383_00304828b574_26925; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4B3CB7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 036367580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 22ce347e_81bf_11d8_8f99_00304828b574_26922; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EC5A344739 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 221df078_81bf_11d8_8b03_00304828b574_26909; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:24:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3767219DD8; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:24:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46C4F19C99; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:24:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9861019C99; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:23:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B26FE199B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:23:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2TKMD1b003796 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:22:13 +0500 (AMST) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2TKMDXn003795 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:22:13 +0500 (AMST) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403292022.i2TKMDXn003795@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] pipe, dirfstat Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:22:13 +0500 (AMST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: why shouldn't the mode of a descriptor returned by pipe be append-only? From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:35:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aeb1f268_81c0_11d8_99a2_00304828b574_29102; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF948344758 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae7a8486_81c0_11d8_8639_00304828b574_29095; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B48D47580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 697AA7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae3bb4cc_81c0_11d8_8010_00304828b574_29086; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67809344758 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ad8349fa_81c0_11d8_85b8_00304828b574_29073; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:35:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5652B19A7B; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:35:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7903719A27; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:35:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 690DB19CF2; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:34:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB4E519CAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:34:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <359104229c4622713a37f906e086ec14@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <40688432.9030502@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 21:40:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > how about hget -1 meaning "try once, then give up."? no, 'cos it's fine to try again, just as long as you haven't already written anything. (and i'll bet that's by far the most common failure mode). > down that path lies madness... hmm. maybe. however we're already admitting a qualititive difference in types of file by using the -o option as it is. (oh no, danger! danger! file seek thread trying to re-establish; apologies!) at least when you're creating a file, you're reasonably sure you can seek on it ok (although of course that's not the case for >{}). i think the default case should be not to seek, because that will produce less surprises. From rsc@swtch.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 05:44:29 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dfd68f24_81c1_11d8_8c86_00304828b574_32149; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB563344777 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id df8eb78a_81c1_11d8_9ea4_00304828b574_32139; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:28 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8EE027580FB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:27 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A9F8758100 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ddfc510c_81c1_11d8_9f6e_00304828b574_32125; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:44:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E9E034476C for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c6447b02_81c1_11d8_899b_00304828b574_31754; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:43:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 734AA19DD6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20D3519D00; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:43:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72E1819A21; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E9CA19AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (lusitania.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.154]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E2B724FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40688A19.3000602@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget References: <359104229c4622713a37f906e086ec14@vitanuova.com> In-Reply-To: <359104229c4622713a37f906e086ec14@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >however we're already admitting a qualititive difference in types of >file by using the -o option as it is. (oh no, danger! danger! file >seek thread trying to re-establish; apologies!) > >at least when you're creating a file, you're reasonably sure you can >seek on it ok (although of course that's not the case for >{}). > >i think the default case should be not to seek, because that >will produce less surprises. > > right enough. then how about hget -1 meaning "one shot at writing data" (or if that doesn't describe it, "what rog thinks it should do" ;-) ) my point is mainly that i'd rather see an option than some magic guessing that will confuse people once they see the difference. i do hget >file all the time, when i want to make sure i get a new copy (whereas hget -o file will not replace the file if the server or some broken intermediate cache thinks things are up-to-date). From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:56 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 06:07:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 263fa2fe_81c5_11d8_8085_00304828b574_4329; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFA0E3447C4 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 25bd499e_81c5_11d8_9bcb_00304828b574_4323; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id C262D7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:54 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3462B7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 255230fa_81c5_11d8_9270_00304828b574_4320; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E98E23447C4 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 24739390_81c5_11d8_8d09_00304828b574_4316; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:07:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5684119DF0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A84519AFF; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:07:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 352FF19D2A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:06:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DA1619AFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:06:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1b6fb567a0c2dae27065d1be1ac861c5@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <40688A19.3000602@swtch.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dryottrpafnlkjnkstfputyqoa" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:12:03 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dryottrpafnlkjnkstfputyqoa Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > whereas hget -o file will not replace the file if the server > or some broken intermediate cache thinks things are up-to-date that's why i thought it might be reasonable to divorce the "look at modification time of file" semantics of -o from the "can seek on output" semantics of same. i've never used -o as it currently is because i don't trust computers to keep or record time properly, either here or out there (i've the same problem with my thinkpad time speeding up as everyone else). i'd expect hget | wc to produce the same results as hget > file wc < file > then how about hget -1 meaning "one shot at writing data" i think the option should the other way around, e.g. hget -m meaning "multiple shots at writing data. then the above correspondence still holds. (and -o still does the same thing) --upas-dryottrpafnlkjnkstfputyqoa Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Mon Mar 29 21:48:51 BST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A81B219A21; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:43:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C16F19A53; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:43:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 72E1819A21; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E9CA19AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from swtch.com (lusitania.lcs.mit.edu [18.26.4.154]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E2B724FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <40688A19.3000602@swtch.com> From: Russ Cox User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.6b) Gecko/20031221 Thunderbird/0.4 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget References: <359104229c4622713a37f906e086ec14@vitanuova.com> In-Reply-To: <359104229c4622713a37f906e086ec14@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:42:01 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >however we're already admitting a qualititive difference in types of >file by using the -o option as it is. (oh no, danger! danger! file >seek thread trying to re-establish; apologies!) > >at least when you're creating a file, you're reasonably sure you can >seek on it ok (although of course that's not the case for >{}). > >i think the default case should be not to seek, because that >will produce less surprises. > > right enough. then how about hget -1 meaning "one shot at writing data" (or if that doesn't describe it, "what rog thinks it should do" ;-) ) my point is mainly that i'd rather see an option than some magic guessing that will confuse people once they see the difference. i do hget >file all the time, when i want to make sure i get a new copy (whereas hget -o file will not replace the file if the server or some broken intermediate cache thinks things are up-to-date). --upas-dryottrpafnlkjnkstfputyqoa-- From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 06:24:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 86fae9e4_81c7_11d8_8843_00304828b574_7173; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE3153447F4 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 86c73acc_81c7_11d8_84e5_00304828b574_7170; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 998F27580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 521367580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 868d93da_81c7_11d8_9e37_00304828b574_7167; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 600E23447F4 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 85df089c_81c7_11d8_81b8_00304828b574_7163; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:24:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 54D3B19DD6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:24:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD96B19DF3; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:24:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BEDA19DF0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:23:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11C6519D2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:23:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a4a127e36d445afb8476a59d48819d6@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <1b6fb567a0c2dae27065d1be1ac861c5@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:23:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: if you're anxious, perhaps it might be reasonable to provide an option (say -e if it's not used) that tells hget not to produce output until it is error-free (or at an end, -e works either way). i actually have got another idea but it's more involved, and probably not worthwhile for this case. From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 06:33:29 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7e3299e_81c8_11d8_9bdd_00304828b574_9363; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F5913446CA for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:27 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7025928_81c8_11d8_9897_00304828b574_9350; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:27 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8145A7580FB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:26 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E332F7580FF for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:24 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b5b26ca2_81c8_11d8_87ef_00304828b574_9337; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:33:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45BFE3446CA for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:31:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7e5ba070_81c8_11d8_9779_00304828b574_8661; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:31:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7995319E08; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:31:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1FE419DFD; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:31:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 08BF019DFD; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:30:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70E1019DF0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:30:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <94907f663aa077b5526b10a39a34ecda@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <7a4a127e36d445afb8476a59d48819d6@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-usffbxhyzhjbmpnynjamhteiuu" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 22:36:02 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-usffbxhyzhjbmpnynjamhteiuu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i think output duplication is more dangerous than output truncation. the latter can be determined from the error status anyway, which the former cannot. hence my preference for an option that will explicitly allow seeking on output, rather than one which will suppress it. --upas-usffbxhyzhjbmpnynjamhteiuu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Mon Mar 29 22:29:54 BST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D979B19DFF; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:24:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B3E019DD6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:24:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6BEDA19DF0; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:23:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11C6519D2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:23:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7a4a127e36d445afb8476a59d48819d6@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <1b6fb567a0c2dae27065d1be1ac861c5@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:23:16 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: if you're anxious, perhaps it might be reasonable to provide an option (say -e if it's not used) that tells hget not to produce output until it is error-free (or at an end, -e works either way). i actually have got another idea but it's more involved, and probably not worthwhile for this case. --upas-usffbxhyzhjbmpnynjamhteiuu-- From rmci2004@confinf.org Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 06:43:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 248ebbc0_81ca_11d8_9b4a_00304828b574_13179; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A637344815 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 24559f0c_81ca_11d8_8e0c_00304828b574_13176; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E129B7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A051B7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 241aab36_81ca_11d8_9174_00304828b574_13173; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A20C344815 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 234182ac_81ca_11d8_9e77_00304828b574_13169; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:43:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AA4D419E06; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:43:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5987919E08; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:43:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 07E6719ADB; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:42:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from callaosemail.iiisci.org (unknown [206.48.79.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E95C819A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from callaos ([172.16.246.75]) by callaosemail.iiisci.org with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:05:54 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.32.20040329163502.0132de20@confinf.org> X-Sender: rmci2004@confinf.org (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Dale Zinn Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-OriginalArrivalTime: 29 Mar 2004 21:05:54.0781 (UTC) FILETIME=[9FDFD0D0:01C415D1] Subject: [9fans] Extending you a warm invitation to participate in RCMI'04 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:06:17 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.1 required=5.0 tests=FROM_ENDS_IN_NUMS, LINES_OF_YELLING,MAILTO_TO_SPAM_ADDR,RCVD_IN_DSBL,RCVD_IN_RFCI autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** Symposium on Risk Management and Cyber-Informatics: RMCI '04 In the Context of the The 8th Multi-conference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics: SCI 2004 July 18 - 21, 2004 - Orlando, Florida, USA RMCI 2004: http://www.confinf.org/rmci04/ Symposium Announcement: Dear Quinlan , Sean : On behalf of the RMCI'04 Organizing Committee and IIIS: The International Institute of Informatics and Cybernetics (affiliated to the International Federation of Systems Research (IFSR) and to the International Systems Institute (California)), we would like to invite you to participate in The 1st. International Symposium on Risk -Management And cyber - Informatics: RMCI '04, to be celebrated in the context of the 8th. World Multi-Conference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics, which will be held in Orlando, Florida, from July 18-21, 2004. Risk management has been related, in increasing degree, to Informatics and Cybernetics. Today, almost every organization depends on Information and Communications Technologies. Software and networks supporting organizational everyday activities must be reliable, secure and safe. Flawed or failed software can present severe organizational and business risks that include liability costs, productivity loss, quality decreasing, brand damage, revenue loss, etc. Simultaneously, cyber crimes (cyber frauds, sensible data protection, etc.) and liability in the electronic workplace are requiring, with increasing urgency, an adequate risk management. Consequently, Organizational/business risk management is increasingly including informatics and cybernetics in their planning and activities. And vice versa, Informatics and Cybernetics technologies, concepts and theories are increasingly being used in risk managements research, consulting, studies, projects, training, and activities. Consequently, the major areas of the symposium are, but not limited to: Risk Management Risk Management in Informatics and Cybernetics Applications of Informatics and Cybernetics to Risk Management problems and solutions Applications of Risk Management and Cyber-Informatics (RMCI) Applications of RMCI in Energy Systems, Technologies, procedures and Methodologies Applications of RMCI in Economics and Finance Applications of RMCI in the War on Terrorism Other Applications of RMCI Call for Papers EXTENDED ABSTRACTS AND PAPER DRAFTS SUBMISSION FORM Extended abstracts or paper drafts should be sent taking into account the following format: -Major theme of the paper should be related to at least one of the major themes given above. -Paper title. -Extended abstract of 500 to 1500 words and/or paper drafts of 2000 to 5000 words, in English. -Author(s) and/or co-author(s) with names, addresses, telephone and fax numbers, and e-mail addresses. Extended abstracts or paper drafts should be sent via the Symposium web site (http://www.confinf.org/rmci04/), filling the respective form and uploading the respective paper or extended abstract. If the Symposium web site is not accessible for you, you can also make your submission by e-mail, attaching it to the following e-mail address: rmci2004@confinf.org. DEADLINES April 21st, 2004: Submission of extended abstracts (500-1500) words or paper drafts (2000-5000) words. April 21st, 2004: Invited Sessions proposals. Acceptation of invited session proposals will be done in about one week of its registration via the respective Symposium web form, and final approval will be done after the registration of at least five papers in the respective session. May 12th, 2004:Acceptance notifications. June 02nd, 2004:Submission of camera-ready papers: hard copies and electronic versions. Papers REVIEWING And PUBLICATION Submitted papers will be sent to reviewers. Accepted papers, which should not exceed six single-spaced typed pages, will be published by means of paper and electronic proceedings. SCI Journal will publish, at least, the best 10% of the papers presented at the Symposium. Invited sessions Based on past Symposiums experience, we suggest the following steps in order to organize an invited session: Identify a special topic in the scope of RMCI'04, and the invited session title. Fill the invited session organization form, provided in the Symposium web page http://www.confinf.org/rmci04/, and fill the respective form. Invited Session proposals can be submitted by filling the form published at RMCI '04 web/site on: http://www.confinf.org/rmci04/invitedsession/organizer.asp. Best Invited sessions and symposia organizers are candidates for invited editors or co-editors of the SCI Journal special issue related to their field of research interest. Symposium fees The Symposium fees will be $380 before the deadline, or $430 after the deadline, including the publication of only one (1) paper per fee paid. This fee will include exclusively: A CD-ROM version of the Proceedings; One volume of the hard copy version of the Conference Proceedings; Coffee breaks; Welcome Reception. Each registration fee might include just one paper, which presentation will be included in the conference program and published in the conference proceedings. We are looking forward to meeting you at RMCI04 symposium, in Orlando. The RMCI '04 Organizing Committee From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 07:05:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 40e80986_81cd_11d8_9b1a_00304828b574_17164; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A858C344835 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 40713144_81cd_11d8_8fc9_00304828b574_17156; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 484AB7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09FBE7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 400e2324_81cd_11d8_9764_00304828b574_17153; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:05:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21063344843 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:04:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1806ec94_81cd_11d8_8530_00304828b574_16563; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:04:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 365BD19D2A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:04:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0204B19BF6; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:04:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6453719BA2; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:03:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from paris.snellwlcox.com (cpc2-sout4-6-0-cust223.sot3.cable.ntl.com [81.111.117.223]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 830B719CBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:03:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] auth_proxy: write fd: file does not exist Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:02:53 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi I am trying to get a single machine to serve CPU/fossil/venti/auth. Venti and fossil are happy. keyfs seems OK - If I boot my terminal standalone auth/debug to the server is happy with both my username and bootes. The secstore seems to work - put and get are OK and when I network boot a terminal off the server I can see a GET of 'factotum'. The secstore contents is correct, I use the same list of keys cat'ed int /mnt/factotum/ctl on my standalone terminals. All the below give the correct results, though auth/debug checks them implicitly I beleive. ndb/ipquery ip xx.xx.xx.xx auth ndb/ipquery ip xx.xx.xx.xx fs ndb/ipquery ip xx.xx.xx.xx cpu ndb/ipquery authdom mydom.com auth BUT When I try to boot from the server (pulling only 9load from the terminals hard drive), the kernel loads (even bootp is OK), I enter my username and secstore password and get: Version... Authentication failed (auth_proxy write fd: file does not exist), trying anyways. [panic and stackdump] Other very suspicious symptom is that cpu from a standalone terminal to the server also fails (even though auth/debug is happy). cpu -h felix cpu: can't authenticate: felix: auth_proxy rpc write: cpu: srvauth:: auth server protocol botch Pointers? -Steve From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 07:50:26 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 786a4378_81d3_11d8_9693_00304828b574_28622; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38DC434418B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7835b66c_81d3_11d8_896f_00304828b574_28619; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:26 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 377797580FE; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:25 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50479758100 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 74b05ef2_81d3_11d8_8583_00304828b574_28552; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CC8E344882 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:44:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aeb6a09e_81d2_11d8_8cd2_00304828b574_25565; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:44:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DFA4219E13; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CF7F19E09; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:44:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC2A119E06; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:43:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D598319B5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:43:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <3fd8b4257ddb713934a427a83bdf2835@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:48:54 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > i see: you can have too much of a good thing? unfortunately most of what can be obtained using hget is not good at all... From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 07:50:29 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79bcb68e_81d3_11d8_8a5b_00304828b574_28635; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 524B534487D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7976d9d4_81d3_11d8_964f_00304828b574_28629; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:28 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0295D7580F9; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:24 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCD7B758107 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:18 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 73cdd190_81d3_11d8_8a78_00304828b574_28533; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 741A1344887 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:40:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1fb831be_81d2_11d8_8fa0_00304828b574_23956; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:40:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B03D119E11; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:40:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24FEA19DFC; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:40:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 77F2319D39; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:39:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD1B919DFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:39:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3fd8b4257ddb713934a427a83bdf2835@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <94907f663aa077b5526b10a39a34ecda@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:39:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>i think output duplication is more dangerous than output truncation. i see: you can have too much of a good thing? From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 07:50:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 805cf1a2_81d3_11d8_837a_00304828b574_28715; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8892B34487D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 80273c38_81d3_11d8_8d2f_00304828b574_28712; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 75AB57580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B6727580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7fecf500_81d3_11d8_8a78_00304828b574_28709; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D96E34487D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f36f2d2_81d3_11d8_8ef9_00304828b574_28705; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:50:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9816F19E19; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AD7419D3C; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:50:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A3EA19B77; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:49:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3272619B00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:49:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.1.71.123]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315155-1232>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:48:23 -0500 Message-ID: <020f01c415d7$46afe120$c002a8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] hget MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 23:46:18 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > i see: you can have too much of a good thing? > > unfortunately most of what can be obtained using > hget is not good at all... truncation is better than duplication? explain that to me ... From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 07:56:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c777022_81d4_11d8_89ba_00304828b574_29895; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3FB234489E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c474e10_81d4_11d8_9968_00304828b574_29892; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B6C597580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 700557580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c08c974_81d4_11d8_8010_00304828b574_29889; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D8AE34489E for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5b59dbee_81d4_11d8_8f9b_00304828b574_29885; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:56:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4E08019E28; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E9A8E19E0C; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:56:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C7C1619E06; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:55:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51B5119E0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:55:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <46d59a9c8fa654a15eefe349621a5f11@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <020f01c415d7$46afe120$c002a8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:01:06 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > truncation is better than duplication? explain that to me ... a file is usually treated as a stream of bytes. particular files will obey particular conventions. for instance, a body of data will follow a header. conventions for truncation are well defined, easily observed, and usually checked for (premature eof). if however an arbitrary part of the file can be repeated, there's no way of knowing how it can happen, no way of knowing when it has happened, and nobody checks for it. hence my statement. From forsyth@terzarima.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:01:46 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0d6ffd90_81d5_11d8_9194_00304828b574_30807; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B97803448AB for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0d3d5606_81d5_11d8_87e2_00304828b574_30804; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A06967580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11E597580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0cd493b4_81d5_11d8_8cc5_00304828b574_30801; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2014D3448AB for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0c2616cc_81d5_11d8_8c1c_00304828b574_30797; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A89E19E44; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:01:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D599419E0C; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:01:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0767C19E12; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust44.leed.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.44]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7968319D5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:00:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: Charles Forsyth In-Reply-To: <46d59a9c8fa654a15eefe349621a5f11@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:02:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: >>conventions for truncation are well defined, easily observed, and unfortunately, it is not in fact guaranteed in practice that the http message will have a header that includes a byte count (at all) or an accurate one (if that). hence some of the heuristics. From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:17:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4caec732_81d7_11d8_996e_00304828b574_898; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBF963448C5 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c78369a_81d7_11d8_83a5_00304828b574_895; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B1BFA7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B5977580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c3bce26_81d7_11d8_9978_00304828b574_892; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79FF23448C5 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4b8da530_81d7_11d8_8687_00304828b574_888; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 50C2D19E36; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B72D19DFD; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:17:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0A3BE19DFD; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:17:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AC4319D3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:16:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:22:41 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > unfortunately, it is not in fact guaranteed in practice that the http > message will have a header that includes a byte count (at all) or an > accurate one (if that). hence some of the heuristics. agreed, but i'd still maintain that it's not good for it to potentially produce the same data multiple times on an output stream. in fact it seems to me it should never do this, and doesn't need to: there's a known point up to which it has good data. if it has to refetch data before this point it can just discard it. getting partial parts of a file there's always a danger that you're a getting a partial part of a different file, but that case is wrong for the current hget too (if the new file is shorter you'll get a part of the older one tacked on to the end, as it doesn't truncate the file when it seeks to 0). so maybe that's the right solution: avoid all seeks always; they're never necessary. no extra options, and the code should be straightforward. From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:22:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f8a42de8_81d7_11d8_9b27_00304828b574_1682; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51F5B3448D0 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f86ddbee_81d7_11d8_8d97_00304828b574_1679; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 339EF7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFE077580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f82df3e4_81d7_11d8_90e4_00304828b574_1676; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC1373448D0 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f77e2e96_81d7_11d8_8165_00304828b574_1671; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:22:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id AC35A19D4A; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:22:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0DD019A9C; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:22:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 51AB719D75; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:21:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD5AC19C8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:21:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.1.71.123]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <311688-10998>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:19:52 -0500 Message-ID: <022201c415db$aaf831b0$c002a8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <46d59a9c8fa654a15eefe349621a5f11@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] hget MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:17:45 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > conventions for truncation are well defined, easily observed, and > usually checked for (premature eof). so /dev/null actually gives you information? From rog@vitanuova.com Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:29:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f8999602_81d8_11d8_9119_00304828b574_3555; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1FC03448E6 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f8541384_81d8_11d8_8177_00304828b574_3552; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 83B277580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 397B57580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f812bf74_81d8_11d8_98f1_00304828b574_3549; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27FB83448E6 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f7490f80_81d8_11d8_8839_00304828b574_3545; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:29:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ACEFD19D7B; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:29:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B10719BA1; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:29:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7E5FE19C8B; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:28:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3BD219B8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:28:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3c381f52b84796f03f72087976e5e795@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <022201c415db$aaf831b0$c002a8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:34:26 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > so /dev/null actually gives you information? of course. From geoff@collyer.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:39:38 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 578e8888_81da_11d8_8af9_00304828b574_5322; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 954D6344900 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 575e6b4e_81da_11d8_8b6a_00304828b574_5319; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 78BCE7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32B087580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5720c56e_81da_11d8_83c9_00304828b574_5316; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 405A0344900 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5671f03e_81da_11d8_958c_00304828b574_5312; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ADD8F19B8D; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:39:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFC3519D66; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:39:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D102519D7B; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:38:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (venti.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67CE919A96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:38:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4c2f35c3e25497cf37de1505d6e9f4da@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth_proxy: write fd: file does not exist From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:38:47 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Do you have an `nvram' partition (or `plan9.nvr' file on floppy) with your hostowner, password and domain recorded in it by the kernel or auth/wrkey? From boyd@insultant.net Tue Mar 30 14:47:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 08:53:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 52bbd778_81dc_11d8_8f98_00304828b574_7861; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73E9F344921 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5285d8d0_81dc_11d8_99dd_00304828b574_7858; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 614D57580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C174C7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 521db3e0_81dc_11d8_8295_00304828b574_7855; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCCD4344922 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 516d750c_81dc_11d8_8cc5_00304828b574_7845; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:53:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DD0D319E44; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCF4219E28; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:53:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 224D319E1B; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:52:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams005.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n05.valueweb.net [216.219.253.151]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE3EE19DF9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:52:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.1.71.123]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <3650055-18510>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 18:51:29 -0500 Message-ID: <027701c415e0$14053640$c002a8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <3c381f52b84796f03f72087976e5e795@vitanuova.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] hget MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 00:49:08 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > so /dev/null actually gives you information? > > of course. i see you're not much of a fan of Shannon: http://www.lucent.com/minds/infotheory/who.html From npe@cwru.edu Tue Mar 30 14:48:02 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 10:55:53 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 60752124_81ed_11d8_9ef5_00304828b574_9584; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3176344A17 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 60353d8e_81ed_11d8_9044_00304828b574_9581; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B95EA7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:52 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74CC37580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5ff80d6a_81ed_11d8_9031_00304828b574_9578; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72106344A17 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5f3f0af4_81ed_11d8_985b_00304828b574_9574; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:55:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 32DDD19ECC; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 20:55:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98E0519CB8; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 20:55:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A13D19EC4; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 20:54:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ms-smtp-03-eri0.southeast.rr.com (ms-smtp-03-lbl.southeast.rr.com [24.25.9.102]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2B1419D3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 20:54:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.0.5 (rdu26-58-022.nc.rr.com [66.26.58.22]) by ms-smtp-03-eri0.southeast.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.7) with ESMTP id i2U1s7s1021458 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 29 Mar 2004 20:54:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2ed920d1b1e63247052f36a7f1159d7f@cwru.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: [spam]: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: npe@cwru.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:53:31 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.1 required=5.0 tests=DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06, NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: *** X-NAI-Spam-Score: 5.0 X-NAI-Spam-Level: ***** X-NAI-Spam-Report: 2 Rules triggered * 4.4 -- DATE_IN_FUTURE_03_06 -- Date: is 3 to 6 hours after Received: d * 0.6 -- NO_REAL_NAME -- From: does not include a real name How would one go about merging several files at once? I'm working on a crappy little barebones AIM toc client running in plan 9. It tentatively implements itself as a file server like this /mnt/aim/buddies/bob/send # messages you send /mnt/aim/buddies/bob/recv # messages you get /mnt/aim/buddies/bob/status # away, idle etc... messages are sent by echo hello>/mnt/aim/buddies/bob/send and read by tail -f /mnt/aim/buddies/bob/recv bots attach by: tail -f /mnt/aim/buddies/bob/recv | eliza >/mnt/aim/buddies/bob/send I want to get functionality something like a traditional aim client by combining all three files, so new data in any of the three files come out at the same place(like doing three tail -f's in the same acme errors window). What's the best way in Plan 9? Also, is the interface reasonable(thanks to Andrey for the initial help)? Any other ideas? Noah From dvd@davidashen.net Tue Mar 30 21:57:50 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 15:47:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a620970_8216_11d8_9406_00304828b574_12569; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90346344C41 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2a2caf00_8216_11d8_9d86_00304828b574_12566; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 7CBAB7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 344E57580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 29f3192a_8216_11d8_9e82_00304828b574_12563; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40BB2344C41 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 2943a62a_8216_11d8_9fdc_00304828b574_12559; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:47:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5629219CD4; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:47:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70BF719D14; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:47:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6491C19C39; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:46:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.242]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDEC919CC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 01:45:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from adat.davidashen.net (localhost.davidashen.net [127.0.0.1]) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2U6iK1b006102 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:44:20 +0500 (AMST) (envelope-from dvd@adat.davidashen.net) Received: (from dvd@localhost) by adat.davidashen.net (8.12.8p1/8.12.8/Submit) id i2U6iH5D006101 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:44:17 +0500 (AMST) From: David Tolpin Message-Id: <200403300644.i2U6iH5D006101@adat.davidashen.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=KOI8-R Subject: [9fans] hget -- append-only Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:44:17 +0500 (AMST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Why can't hget just check that the output is append-only and if it is, fail on all operations that require writing over previously written (by hget, during the same session) data? This way hget would retain its current behaviour in conditions it can be currently used, and would not produce repeated pieces. The only problem is that pipe fds do not have append-only bit set, but why shouldn't they? From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 30 21:57:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 18:33:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5d444a62_822d_11d8_8f7a_00304828b574_19099; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6681B344D87 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5d13c388_822d_11d8_8c97_00304828b574_19096; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 49FBB7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01DAB7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5cd5644e_822d_11d8_99a6_00304828b574_19092; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 103F8344D86 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5c271c9a_822d_11d8_9443_00304828b574_19087; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:33:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1E15B19DEE; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB84B19D72; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 02E3C19D78; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA04C19BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:20:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-Reply-To: <2ed920d1b1e63247052f36a7f1159d7f@cwru.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:22:39 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: will this do ? tail -f file1 & tail -f file2 & tail -f file3 & m From xning@soforge.com Tue Mar 30 21:57:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 18:44:13 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cd108cec_822e_11d8_8bf3_00304828b574_21076; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0565344192 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:11 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cc809ccc_822e_11d8_91ae_00304828b574_21070; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:12 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E34A67580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:10 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60FFD758102 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb09e77c_822e_11d8_8337_00304828b574_21053; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:44:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5A5C344192 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:43:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c0fd6358_822e_11d8_8814_00304828b574_20846; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:43:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 074D619CCB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:43:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A80A19CCB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:43:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B1D9E19D72; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mercury.bath.ac.uk (mercury.bath.ac.uk [138.38.32.81]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88CA419AD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:39:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from news by mercury.bath.ac.uk with local (Exim 3.12 #1) id 1B8FYx-0000Tp-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 10:29:39 +0100 Received: from GATEWAY by bath.ac.uk with netnews for 9fans@cse.psu.edu (9fans@cse.psu.edu) To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Xning Lee Message-ID: <87ptau6fcb.fsf@xengine.softforge.ods.org> Organization: Soforge.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii References: Subject: Re: [9fans] auth_proxy: write fd: file does not exist Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:29:00 GMT X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com writes: > When I try to boot from the server (pulling only > 9load from the terminals hard drive), the kernel loads > (even bootp is OK), I enter my username and secstore > password and get: > Version... > Authentication failed (auth_proxy write fd: file does not exist), trying anyways. > > [panic and stackdump] > > Other very suspicious symptom is that cpu from a > standalone terminal to the server also fails (even though > auth/debug is happy). > > cpu -h felix > cpu: can't authenticate: felix: auth_proxy rpc write: cpu: srvauth:: auth server protocol botch Before a few of days, I seem to have same question, when I do the following steps, then it's ok. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ mv /rc/bin/service.auth/authsrv.il566 /rc/bin/service.auth/il566 mv /rc/bin/service.auth/authsrv.tcp567 /rc/bin/service.auth/tcp567 mv /rc/bin/service/il566 /rc/bin/service/_il566 mv /rc/bin/service/tcp567 /rc/bin/service/_tcp567 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Tue Mar 30 21:57:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 19:20:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eb6364a8_8233_11d8_8587_00304828b574_31098; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA918344A3A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eb31b7aa_8233_11d8_8877_00304828b574_31095; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id AD3F27580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6461B7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id eaf1e576_8233_11d8_8873_00304828b574_31092; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7042C344A3A for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ea41e248_8233_11d8_8977_00304828b574_31088; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:20:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EF9AD19E02; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:20:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2D9219DFE; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:20:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6C77C19CCB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id E993D19BD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:19:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:19:45 +0100 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UC54jR029803 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:05:05 +0100 Message-ID: <8577b4b34e765fb0a35c8e80a7f949c6@snellwilcox.com> From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] hget In-Reply-To: <027701c415e0$14053640$c002a8c0@SOMA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:19:44 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > > > so /dev/null actually gives you information? > > > > of course. > > i see you're not much of a fan of Shannon: > > http://www.lucent.com/minds/infotheory/who.html But it _does_ give you information. The quantity of information is equal to log() of the improbability of that information arriving. Thus you expected to read a file you got EOF, you get information, "this file is zero length". -Steve From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 30 21:57:51 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 19:30:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5430b8b8_8235_11d8_8645_00304828b574_429; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C83344DCC for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 540031a2_8235_11d8_92fe_00304828b574_426; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 08B6F7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:56 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3BAC7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 53bd0b8e_8235_11d8_8642_00304828b574_423; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id BABAF344DCC for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 530c1482_8235_11d8_9779_00304828b574_419; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:30:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5984419CC5; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:30:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 858D319CC5; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:30:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9284419BFC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:30:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8819E19B0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 05:30:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0100 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UCFLjR029811 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:22 +0100 Message-ID: From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] auth_proxy: write fd: file does not exist MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:30:01 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue Mar 30 00:40:26 BST 2004, geoff@collyer.net wrote: > Do you have an `nvram' partition (or `plan9.nvr' file on floppy) with > your hostowner, password and domain recorded in it by the kernel or > auth/wrkey? Yep, I wrote them to a partition with auth/wrkey, I did it twice in fact, as I was worried I had misstyped somthing, I hadn't. On Tue Mar 30 10:46:49 BST 2004, xning@soforge.com wrote: > Before a few of days, I seem to have same question, > when I do the following steps, then it's ok. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > mv /rc/bin/service.auth/authsrv.il566 /rc/bin/service.auth/il566 > mv /rc/bin/service.auth/authsrv.tcp567 /rc/bin/service.auth/tcp567 > mv /rc/bin/service/il566 /rc/bin/service/_il566 > mv /rc/bin/service/tcp567 /rc/bin/service/_tcp567 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- I thought I had done this, I certinally meant to, though I have obviously missed somthing. I will check later (the server is at home, and I am at work). Thanks Geoff and Xning (or should I say Lee ?) -Steve From plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com Tue Mar 30 21:57:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 21:10:39 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 41fbca58_8243_11d8_9cea_00304828b574_21075; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84B8B344E34 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 41c7000c_8243_11d8_8ee4_00304828b574_21072; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 717867580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2776A7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 418cbd70_8243_11d8_9287_00304828b574_21068; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6D85344E34 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 40b46c7c_8243_11d8_97c0_00304828b574_21064; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:10:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DE31319E13; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:10:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C38AC19D72; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:10:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7382819CA5; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:09:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C1DB419DC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:09:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:09:47 +0100 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UDt7jR029910 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 14:55:09 +0100 Message-ID: <82c68858c986199b4dce22e12851f4ad@snellwilcox.com> From: plan9fans@ntlworld.nospam.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] web proxy Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:09:45 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, I had to offer this: my web filtering proxy in 8 lines. Its not complete, or the fastest, but it does all I need. More filtering rules available at: http://www.surferprotectionprogram.com/rules/sites-blocked.ini.txt -Steve install as /bin/rc/service/tcp8080 #!/bin/rc get=`{read} switch ($get(2)){ case *.doubleclick.net/* *.valueclick.net/* exit 0 case * hget $get(2) } From matt@proweb.co.uk Tue Mar 30 21:57:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 21:31:02 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1b6bd51a_8246_11d8_934f_00304828b574_27697; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 593A1344221 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1b3b6286_8246_11d8_8554_00304828b574_27694; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:02 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3C3BD7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:02 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E854A7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1afc4420_8246_11d8_8022_00304828b574_27688; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE5F3344221 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 1a489eca_8246_11d8_9fd5_00304828b574_27621; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:31:01 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C740119CA5; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:30:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C45C519BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:30:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0FD6419CC5; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:29:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D261119BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:29:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0057647ac7e4fd07a1dd01ee96d89d03@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] web proxy In-Reply-To: <82c68858c986199b4dce22e12851f4ad@snellwilcox.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:32:11 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: thats okay for not seeing ads, however, it could *increase* your bandwidth as hget doesn't use "Accept-Encoding: gzip, deflate, compress", the use of which can reduce your bandwidth requirements for html by around 70% m From steve.simon@snellwilcox.com Tue Mar 30 21:57:52 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 21:42:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be771f2a_8247_11d8_9065_00304828b574_29333; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 608B9344241 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be453d2a_8247_11d8_946d_00304828b574_29330; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 41C837580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:45 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC2207580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id be03ee74_8247_11d8_8021_00304828b574_29327; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 026DA344244 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id bd519fbc_8247_11d8_8174_00304828b574_29316; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:42:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5A8D719B30; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71CE919BBC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:42:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3DA019BBC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:41:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.snellwilcox.com (mail2.snellwilcox.com [195.173.15.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 895BC19BAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:41:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.253.14 by mail2.snellwilcox.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:41:50 +0100 Received: from larch.com (netscreen-gateway.snellwilcox.com [192.168.253.1]) (authenticated bits=0) by smtp-uk.snellwilcox.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UERDjR029955 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:27:14 +0100 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] web proxy In-Reply-To: <0057647ac7e4fd07a1dd01ee96d89d03@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:41:51 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Tue Mar 30 13:33:40 BST 2004, matt@proweb.co.uk wrote: > thats okay for not seeing ads, however, it could *increase* your bandwidth as hget doesn't use "Accept-Encoding: gzip, deflate, compress", the use of which can reduce your bandwidth requirements for html by around 70% > > m Hmmm, shows how little I know about html. The idea is to allow me to put my plan9 box on the cablemodem and proxy the occasional WinNT WWW access for my girlfriend without paying for a NAT router (the car needs its C service). -Steve From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 31 09:05:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 22:01:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 658aefb0_824a_11d8_8a0d_00304828b574_32559; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC681344296 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 655a3cda_824a_11d8_8b30_00304828b574_32556; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8DD3D7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 465ED7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 651a7abe_824a_11d8_929b_00304828b574_32553; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 527463442A3 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 646aa95e_824a_11d8_9d1e_00304828b574_32547; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:01:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5E3DF19B8D; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF61D19BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:01:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9DB0F19E02; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:00:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25F5919B8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:00:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <983590b5129c51e042a375f3b0ca28af@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] web proxy In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 14:02:56 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=NORMAL_HTTP_TO_IP,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: if you have a motorola surfboard (like mine) , the ones ntl recommended years ago, it might have DHCP and nat enabled (a feature they choose not to tell you at ntl:) take a look at http://192.168.100.1/config.html [ ] Enable DHCP Server The SURFboard cable modem can be used as a gateway to the Internet by a maximum of 32 users on a Local Area Network (LAN). When the Cable Modem is disconnected from the Internet, users on the LAN can be dynamically assigned IP Addresses by the Cable Modem DHCP Server. These addresses are assigned from an address pool w hich begins with 192.168.100.11 and ends with 192.168.100.42. Statically assigne d IP addresses for other devices on the LAN should be chosen from outside of thi s range m From boyd@insultant.net Wed Mar 31 09:05:28 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 22:44:00 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4ccfc242_8250_11d8_8d36_00304828b574_9623; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:44:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F1B1344268 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:44:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4c94c714_8250_11d8_8f86_00304828b574_9619; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:44:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 39B2D7580FC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:43:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 563CE7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:43:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 49bbcc9a_8250_11d8_9036_00304828b574_9581; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:43:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48FE83441A2 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:40:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d7b737e2_824f_11d8_8b00_00304828b574_7977; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:40:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id BECD419E10; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14DED19BD9; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:40:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E7FE719BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B30A319BAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:39:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from SOMA ([81.1.71.123]) by ams.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <315909-5040>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:38:52 -0500 Message-ID: <046801c41653$a829b9e0$c002a8c0@SOMA> From: "boyd, rounin" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <983590b5129c51e042a375f3b0ca28af@juice.thebigchoice.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] web proxy MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 14:36:41 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > if you have a motorola surfboard (like mine) i got one too. and then there's the 1M/320Kbit phone line ADSL. From glenda@cwru.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 22:49:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 176aa094_8251_11d8_8b4a_00304828b574_11220; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C450134427C for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 170b5378_8251_11d8_8b6b_00304828b574_11217; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A80F37580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FF0C7580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 169aabd2_8251_11d8_8197_00304828b574_11214; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 905D034427C for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 159ae774_8251_11d8_99c2_00304828b574_11210; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:49:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 558CF19E0B; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:49:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 768EC19E02; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:49:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 012C019B77; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:48:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC5EB199D4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:48:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UDmL3q020051; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:48:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34cf493ae26944869c1f4b427f1d1649@cwru.edu> To: npe@cwru.edu, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: glenda@cwru.edu In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-mdfzjxpcxnijonknzzipotkfvt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:48:52 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-mdfzjxpcxnijonknzzipotkfvt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That's pretty close thanks :) I had forgotten the way rc's brackets work. This is what I wanted fn bt { eval '{' `{for (i in $*) echo 'tail -f '$i '&'} '}' } Gives me the behavior I wanted for toc and let's me put my log files together for debugging(i.e. smtp and smtp.fail } Thanks, Noah --upas-mdfzjxpcxnijonknzzipotkfvt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVD01B5EUK1BR@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE13391 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint2.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.47]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE13389; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id ASI28793; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4F89B19D78; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F3EC19BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:33:28 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 02E3C19D78; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA04C19BE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 04:20:16 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:22:39 +0100 From: matt@proweb.co.uk Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: <2ed920d1b1e63247052f36a7f1159d7f@cwru.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: bc5d1a6c8d914d521637e4c2f0606a7f X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu will this do ? tail -f file1 & tail -f file2 & tail -f file3 & m --upas-mdfzjxpcxnijonknzzipotkfvt-- From cej@gli.cas.cz Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 22:57:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 397abf38_8252_11d8_8871_00304828b574_12402; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B236C344294 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 39465270_8252_11d8_9e10_00304828b574_12399; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 91F417580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C7817580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3906c970_8252_11d8_87af_00304828b574_12396; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46514344294 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 384b7c92_8252_11d8_811a_00304828b574_12392; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 22:57:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3A1E519E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:57:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F22B119E0C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:57:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 99FBC19E21; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:56:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36CB719E14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:56:56 -0500 (EST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: matrix library Thread-Index: AcQWXtnJppt5+odbR8qrVFq2nxC7Rg== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] matrix library Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:56:50 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Hi, folks! an embryonic matrix manipulation library (native) is on neXtarchive: ftp://ftp.gli.cas.cz/gli/cejchan/neXt/libs/libmatrix-0.03.tbz your comments, esp. on style etc., more than welcome, I expect no mercy = ;-) bugs, fames, etc. > cej@gli.cas.cz Enjoy! ++pac. From matt@proweb.co.uk Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 23:01:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cb24ec42_8252_11d8_9abf_00304828b574_13128; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1288834429B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id caea8cfa_8252_11d8_9f99_00304828b574_13125; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id F25B27580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB1577580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cab161e6_8252_11d8_845b_00304828b574_13122; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B976A34429B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ca02e404_8252_11d8_8932_00304828b574_13118; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:01:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id E935719E27; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EAA9719E1F; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AC1519E22; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD15919E23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:00:46 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <22c65f87f1174822b66d9c35b6ed9c14@juice.thebigchoice.com> From: matt@proweb.co.uk To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-Reply-To: <34cf493ae26944869c1f4b427f1d1649@cwru.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:03:10 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: untested but surely : fn bt { for (i in $*) { { tail -f $i} & } } or even fn tail_it { tail -f $1 & } fn bt { for (i in $*) tail_it $i } m From cej@gli.cas.cz Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 23:04:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 34157636_8253_11d8_88e7_00304828b574_13590; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 215E63442A9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 33db4a06_8253_11d8_910a_00304828b574_13587; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 0DFCD7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B88647580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 33a13f00_8253_11d8_9790_00304828b574_13584; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C77523442AC for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 32f3057a_8253_11d8_8655_00304828b574_13573; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:04:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C9D0219E35; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:04:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 284BB19E2F; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:04:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 91F6319E22; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:03:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from XMAIL.asuch.cas.cz (clusterb.asuch.cas.cz [147.231.136.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75B4F19BAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:03:19 -0500 (EST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6249.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: this really got me Thread-Index: AcQWX8EV9LUPq9QfSy2GAOPM3BiOgQ== From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] this really got me Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 16:03:19 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: A dialogue: A: Damned! ... my linux freezes so often today!!! B: Just curious, aren't you sitting at the Windows machine? A: Oh, sh*t, you're right.... (from sasa babic :-) ++pac. From glenda@cwru.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 23:11:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3395bf12_8254_11d8_8202_00304828b574_15321; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7880F34425D for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 332d5ec2_8254_11d8_9bb2_00304828b574_15311; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 625FF7580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5A987580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 32c4e3ba_8254_11d8_9db0_00304828b574_15299; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B1F43442BC for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 31acda46_8254_11d8_8968_00304828b574_15281; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:11:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4EDBF19C62; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:11:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9477719C62; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:11:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8B48419E13; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:10:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B52919C62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:10:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UEAD3q022528 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:10:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: glenda@cwru.edu In-Reply-To: <22c65f87f1174822b66d9c35b6ed9c14@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-lgvpenhslwiuefsghskgbtfrul" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 07:10:09 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-lgvpenhslwiuefsghskgbtfrul Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry I wasn't clear enough in my explaination. You need to put the brackets on the outside to make the combination of tail -f's act like a single 'tail -f'. That was my real conceptual misunderstanding the first time around. If you just do all the 'tail &' without bracketing them you get dumped back into the shell immediately which isn't the sort of behavior I was thinking about, although perfectly valid in many cases. Noah --upas-lgvpenhslwiuefsghskgbtfrul Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE013AP6YQFM@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE36173 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint2.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.47]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE36141; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id ASJ26727; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 30A4219E22; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72C3619BAB; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:01:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2AC1519E22; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from juice.thebigchoice.com (cpc1-nott2-3-0-cust18.nott.cable.ntl.com [80.4.204.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD15919E23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:00:46 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:03:10 +0100 From: matt@proweb.co.uk Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: <34cf493ae26944869c1f4b427f1d1649@cwru.edu> Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <22c65f87f1174822b66d9c35b6ed9c14@juice.thebigchoice.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: 811fb6a4e302e88359c330cc41c36808 X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu untested but surely : fn bt { for (i in $*) { { tail -f $i} & } } or even fn tail_it { tail -f $1 & } fn bt { for (i in $*) tail_it $i } m --upas-lgvpenhslwiuefsghskgbtfrul-- From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:29 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Tue Mar 30 23:45:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f229f1ce_8258_11d8_8aac_00304828b574_21004; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6799834430B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f1e0fbe0_8258_11d8_9154_00304828b574_21001; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4BD807580FA; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:53 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D23A57580F9 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f18b0a46_8258_11d8_8df6_00304828b574_20998; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF77734430B for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0bdf3ee_8258_11d8_9bd0_00304828b574_20994; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 23:45:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0862319A9C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:45:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF43719B77; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:45:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A429C19A9C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:44:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC68719B77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:44:14 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id CCB172E8; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:43:46 +0100 (BST) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD5922DC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:43:45 +0100 (BST) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA28750 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:44:00 +0100 (BST) From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-2FEfGzzlrlIB6XwpypNG" Message-Id: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Subject: [9fans] 9conlon ... Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:43:29 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: --=-2FEfGzzlrlIB6XwpypNG Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is in a month and a half: could people please start firming up their plans so I can start matching beds to bodies? Unless otherwise stated, I will assume that the attendance list is as attached. Please encourage other 9sympathisers to attend! Thanks, Dave. --=-2FEfGzzlrlIB6XwpypNG Content-Description: Content-Disposition: inline; filename=attendees.txt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit a att 9srv.net alcortes att coitt.es boyd att insultant.net brucee att chunder.com davel att anvil.com dfawcus att cisco.com geoff att collyer.net kleal att plan9.escet.urjc.es martin att parvat.com matt att proweb.co.uk paurea att plan9.escet.urjc.es steve.simon att snellwilcox.com --=-2FEfGzzlrlIB6XwpypNG-- From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:02:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae777216_8263_11d8_8ba0_00304828b574_5277; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72815344375 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae46906a_8263_11d8_9f03_00304828b574_5274; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 56D277580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E5F07580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ae07f26a_8263_11d8_96bd_00304828b574_5271; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CA78344375 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ad5976f4_8263_11d8_833f_00304828b574_5266; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:02:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8284E19BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CE7619D65; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0D9B199CC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:01:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6FE419980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:01:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0bfa30b4e4570a291f4ea406d1a699db@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:07:24 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: surely rather than using the rather slow polling behaviour of tail -f it would be better to have the files block on read until data is available. then you could just do: cat send & cat recv & cat status no long latency on messages arriving, and you get the same functionality. also, if you've got a lot of traffic, you get correct interleaving of messages, as the server controls the size of the data packets that cat reads, which isn't the case for tail -f. slightly harder on the server side, but not difficult, and a good excuse to explore ways of structuring that kind of thing. From ishwar@pali.cps.cmich.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:10:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d0bf9b40_8264_11d8_89a3_00304828b574_6699; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C52E344380 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d088fe82_8264_11d8_95f4_00304828b574_6696; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 578817580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10B537580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id d04fb28a_8264_11d8_84ee_00304828b574_6691; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D08D344380 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id cfa01afa_8264_11d8_9a3d_00304828b574_6687; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:10:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id DC43B19E26; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:10:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D238219BA0; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:10:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2438F19BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ob1.cmich.edu (ob1.cmich.edu [141.209.20.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE7D519AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:09:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cps.cmich.edu (cps3.cps.cmich.edu [141.209.168.43]) by ob1.cmich.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2UG7ab6022990 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:07:36 -0500 Received: from pali.cps.cmich.edu (pali.cps.cmich.edu [141.209.169.81]) by mail.cps.cmich.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32DB839CA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:09:07 -0500 (EST) From: Ishwar Rattan To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-CanItPRO-Stream: default X-Spam-Score: -0.9 () X-Bayes-Prob: 0.0001 X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . canit . ca) Subject: [9fans] fossil+venti question? Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:05:13 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I have a kfs based installation of cpu/auth/terminal box and want to try the fossil stuff. 1. Is there a way to convert kfs installation to fossil+venti? 2. If not how does one do a fresh install using plan9.iso as the install document states: "On the 4th edition CD, the default for filesystem configuration is fossil+venti. Take note that the boot image on the CD does not have any venti tools or servers, so this option is non-functional. kfs, even though it is marked deprecated, is probably the best choice." -ishwar From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:16:59 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ab99c61e_8265_11d8_9d94_00304828b574_7631; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53F1034438E for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:58 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ab397fd4_8265_11d8_8c70_00304828b574_7628; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:58 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3B1AB7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:58 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97D937580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id aacb5446_8265_11d8_9c70_00304828b574_7625; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:57 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2093234438E for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a9c96fec_8265_11d8_9bb6_00304828b574_7621; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:16:56 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D762219E24; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:16:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B06A19E20; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:16:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5002B19E10; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:15:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBEAD19AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:15:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UGFP3q008066; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:15:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9102ce170ca256e6ca36e07bb341f8a0@cwru.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu, rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: Noah Evans In-Reply-To: <0bfa30b4e4570a291f4ea406d1a699db@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-fveahkmyheapvavuoxablhublt" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:15:55 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-fveahkmyheapvavuoxablhublt Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Good advice, thanks. Noah --upas-fveahkmyheapvavuoxablhublt Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE00QD2CKD0I@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE59826 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint1.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint1.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.46]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE59816; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint1.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id BBI57773; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1C26D19BA0; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FAC019BE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:02:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D0D9B199CC; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:01:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6FE419980 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:01:42 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:07:24 +0100 From: rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <0bfa30b4e4570a291f4ea406d1a699db@vitanuova.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: a0a8c7f58498afeb8bc43419ab42fcee X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu surely rather than using the rather slow polling behaviour of tail -f it would be better to have the files block on read until data is available. then you could just do: cat send & cat recv & cat status no long latency on messages arriving, and you get the same functionality. also, if you've got a lot of traffic, you get correct interleaving of messages, as the server controls the size of the data packets that cat reads, which isn't the case for tail -f. slightly harder on the server side, but not difficult, and a good excuse to explore ways of structuring that kind of thing. --upas-fveahkmyheapvavuoxablhublt-- From vdharani@infernopark.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:30 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:19:45 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0e92047a_8266_11d8_88fa_00304828b574_8067; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAA06344398 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0e614650_8266_11d8_9175_00304828b574_8064; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:44 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8DAEB7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:44 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41AB47580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0e1fa632_8266_11d8_9e84_00304828b574_8061; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:44 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50214344398 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:43 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 0d715672_8266_11d8_8e9c_00304828b574_8057; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:19:43 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2D2ED19E32; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:19:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F82D19E20; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:19:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 454AA19AD7; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:18:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensim.rackshack.net (unknown [216.127.72.23]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 99BD719AD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:18:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from infernopark.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (authenticated (0 bits)) by ensim.rackshack.net (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id i2UIU3Z22895 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:30:03 -0500 Received: from 192.11.226.116 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:30:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <60922.192.11.226.116.1080671403.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] fossil+venti question? From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: SquirrelMail (version 1.2.5) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:30:03 -0500 (EST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > I have a kfs based installation of cpu/auth/terminal box and want to > try the fossil stuff. > > 1. Is there a way to convert kfs installation to fossil+venti? Isnt it mentioned in the wiki pages on setting up fossil? > 2. If not how does one do a fresh install using plan9.iso as the > install document states: > > "On the 4th edition CD, the default for filesystem configuration is > fossil+venti. Take note that the boot image on the CD does not have any > venti tools or servers, so this option is non-functional. kfs, even > though it is marked deprecated, is probably the best choice." From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:21:40 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 53539524_8266_11d8_9d29_00304828b574_8385; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07F9F344398 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:40 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 531fd090_8266_11d8_8cc5_00304828b574_8382; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:40 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E7A217580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:39 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8A877580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 52eb9f5a_8266_11d8_8209_00304828b574_8379; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:39 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3001344398 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:38 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 523aa682_8266_11d8_918a_00304828b574_8374; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:21:39 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 14EC019E22; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B22D19E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D764219E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2967619C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:25:46 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > You need to put the brackets on the outside to make the combination of > tail -f's act like a single 'tail -f'. That was my real conceptual > misunderstanding the first time around. erm, i don't think so. {a & b &} should be exactly the same as a & b & you almost never need eval in rc, unless you genuinely want to evaluate an rc expression that's unknown beforehand (which isn't true in your case). you could have got the behaviour i think you were after with something like: fn bt { x=$1 shift for(i) {tail -f $i &} tail -f $x } From mirtchov@cpsc.ucalgary.ca Wed Mar 31 09:05:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 01:26:05 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0f1a208_8266_11d8_8cdf_00304828b574_10003; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:04 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F03843443A5 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f0738f1c_8266_11d8_997b_00304828b574_9954; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:04 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B606D7580FC; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:03 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7149A7580FB for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id f024385e_8266_11d8_8adc_00304828b574_9950; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:26:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 745463443A7 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:24:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id c352136e_8266_11d8_9ee4_00304828b574_9276; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 01:24:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 0556519E35; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:24:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7002619E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:24:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D3DA819AD7; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:23:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9-2.ucalgary.ca (fbsd.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.7.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9435119DE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:23:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <878dac2846de0dd0cfee858a31cafe4a@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] fossil+venti question? From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 09:23:46 -0700 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I have a kfs based installation of cpu/auth/terminal box and want to > try the fossil stuff. > > 1. Is there a way to convert kfs installation to fossil+venti? > the 'setting up fossil' section of the wiki will give you instructions on how to set up your fossil partition and move kfs to it, you will need access to both the kfs and fossil disks at the same time. in particular, moving all kfs data onto the fossil can be done with: g% mount /srv/kfs /n/kfs g% disk/mkfs -a -s /n/kfs /sys/lib/sysconfig/proto/allproto | disk/mkext -u -d /n/fossil note that the section 'booting standalone fossil' is a bit old since it refers to the 'pcfl' kernels, which were deprecated for 'pcf' -- to boot your fossil use 'fossil/conf -w' to write the fossil configuration to /dev/sd??/fossil, then compile a 'pcf' (or pccpuf if you're running a cpu server) and boot it. > 2. If not how does one do a fresh install using plan9.iso as the > install document states: > > "On the 4th edition CD, the default for filesystem configuration is > fossil+venti. Take note that the boot image on the CD does not have any > venti tools or servers, so this option is non-functional. kfs, even > though it is marked deprecated, is probably the best choice." the fossil installation on the cd is quite stable but you won't get venti configured -- install with the fossil option, update from sources and configure venti as you see fit afterwards. andrey From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:33 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 03:15:52 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 46eda116_8276_11d8_8ee9_00304828b574_31505; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:51 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5A79344456 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 468b6168_8276_11d8_95de_00304828b574_31502; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id B6D987580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 294567580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 461fb224_8276_11d8_97b1_00304828b574_31499; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7B6D344456 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 453cb6ea_8276_11d8_95fb_00304828b574_31495; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:15:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A7FC419C57; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A953E19E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D6CD19E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9679419E0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UIE33q020586 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: Noah Evans In-Reply-To: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:14:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll agree with you there. The eval is unnecessary. But fn bt { eval '{'for {tail -f $i &} '}' } mimics how I would write it by hand. {tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 &}>file Which allows me to consider the command one block, which I can pipe to and from etc. The idiom that you and matt give doesn't work for pipes tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 >file only puts the text from file3 in the pipe. The for loop you gave obviates that problem, since it counts as a single block, but it's considerably different than my interactive shell usage and is more verbose(though much more readable :)). Noah --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE00QRMDG31E@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE63078 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint2.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.47]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE63076; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id ASJ57268; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2DD519DE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D58AB19AD7; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D764219E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2967619C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:25:46 +0100 From: rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: cb554f7c7f0064cc56e600f872486f69 X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu > You need to put the brackets on the outside to make the combination of > tail -f's act like a single 'tail -f'. That was my real conceptual > misunderstanding the first time around. erm, i don't think so. {a & b &} should be exactly the same as a & b & you almost never need eval in rc, unless you genuinely want to evaluate an rc expression that's unknown beforehand (which isn't true in your case). you could have got the behaviour i think you were after with something like: fn bt { x=$1 shift for(i) {tail -f $i &} tail -f $x } --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom-- From rog@vitanuova.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:33 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 03:23:57 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 67d74804_8277_11d8_9cab_00304828b574_1213; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55120344483 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6750223e_8277_11d8_964e_00304828b574_1210; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 3A1897580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54EDC7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 66b783b2_8277_11d8_98df_00304828b574_1207; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 89045344483 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 65880624_8277_11d8_87b9_00304828b574_1203; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:23:52 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C066E19E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFDFD19E39; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C64E019E3C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F93219C2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:22:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6b5dcd845b37ef60c5063f852832aea0@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:27:55 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > fn bt { > eval '{'for {tail -f $i &} '}' > } > > mimics how I would write it by hand. if that's all you need, then fn bt { for(i){tail -f $i&} } should be just fine. then bt > file might work (if file is append-only, otherwise you'd need a process (e.g. cat) in the middle to avoid overlapping writes) using eval is disastrous... consider what happens if you've got a filename with a shell metacharacter in it. --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Mar 30 19:20:50 BST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 56ECE19C2C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69E9719C57; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D6CD19E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9679419E0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UIE33q020586 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: Noah Evans In-Reply-To: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:14:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll agree with you there. The eval is unnecessary. But fn bt { eval '{'for {tail -f $i &} '}' } mimics how I would write it by hand. {tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 &}>file Which allows me to consider the command one block, which I can pipe to and from etc. The idiom that you and matt give doesn't work for pipes tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 >file only puts the text from file3 in the pipe. The for loop you gave obviates that problem, since it counts as a single block, but it's considerably different than my interactive shell usage and is more verbose(though much more readable :)). Noah --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE00QRMDG31E@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE63078 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint2.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.47]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE63076; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id ASJ57268; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2DD519DE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D58AB19AD7; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D764219E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2967619C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:25:46 +0100 From: rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: cb554f7c7f0064cc56e600f872486f69 X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu > You need to put the brackets on the outside to make the combination of > tail -f's act like a single 'tail -f'. That was my real conceptual > misunderstanding the first time around. erm, i don't think so. {a & b &} should be exactly the same as a & b & you almost never need eval in rc, unless you genuinely want to evaluate an rc expression that's unknown beforehand (which isn't true in your case). you could have got the behaviour i think you were after with something like: fn bt { x=$1 shift for(i) {tail -f $i &} tail -f $x } --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom-- --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio-- From noah.evans@cwru.edu Wed Mar 31 09:05:33 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 03:31:15 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6d1fc678_8278_11d8_9c47_00304828b574_2430; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:14 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AD9834449C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6c6f3e48_8278_11d8_97a3_00304828b574_2427; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:13 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4DDE67580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:13 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27FD87580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6baceb0e_8278_11d8_8dc0_00304828b574_2424; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F57134449C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 6a4d7e2c_8278_11d8_83bd_00304828b574_2420; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:10 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A0B2D19E48; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:30:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AB9D19C2C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:30:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id CBFE219C2C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:29:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (wanchese.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.46]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55FE019C30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:29:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UIT5vZ003178 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:29:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: Noah Evans In-Reply-To: <6b5dcd845b37ef60c5063f852832aea0@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-auofrcighfatokpegtfjxiqhjg" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:28:56 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-auofrcighfatokpegtfjxiqhjg Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit True and much more elegant. :) Good point about the security hole too :( Noah --upas-auofrcighfatokpegtfjxiqhjg Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE000NBJ3IWB@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE86495 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint1.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint1.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.46]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE86475; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint1.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id BBI95367; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A975019E43; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A81E619C30; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C64E019E3C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F93219C2C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:22:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 19:27:55 +0100 From: rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <6b5dcd845b37ef60c5063f852832aea0@vitanuova.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/mixed; boundary=upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: 81992f5a81655734aa550b3dfa78e608 X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > fn bt { > eval '{'for {tail -f $i &} '}' > } > > mimics how I would write it by hand. if that's all you need, then fn bt { for(i){tail -f $i&} } should be just fine. then bt > file might work (if file is append-only, otherwise you'd need a process (e.g. cat) in the middle to avoid overlapping writes) using eval is disastrous... consider what happens if you've got a filename with a shell metacharacter in it. --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Mar 30 19:20:50 BST 2004 Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 56ECE19C2C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69E9719C57; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:15:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4D6CD19E2A; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.med.unc.edu (ahoskie.med.unc.edu [152.19.4.48]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9679419E0E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from 192.168.222.128 (d8k4c531.med.unc.edu [152.19.50.16]) by smtp.med.unc.edu (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2UIE33q020586 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 13:14:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs From: Noah Evans In-Reply-To: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:14:32 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'll agree with you there. The eval is unnecessary. But fn bt { eval '{'for {tail -f $i &} '}' } mimics how I would write it by hand. {tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 &}>file Which allows me to consider the command one block, which I can pipe to and from etc. The idiom that you and matt give doesn't work for pipes tail -f file1 &; tail -f file2 &; tail -f file3 >file only puts the text from file3 in the pipe. The for loop you gave obviates that problem, since it counts as a single block, but it's considerably different than my interactive shell usage and is more verbose(though much more readable :)). Noah --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: <9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu> Received: from mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (mpspam4.tis.case.Edu [129.22.104.191]) by ims-msg.cwru.edu (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.21 (built Sep 8 2003)) with ESMTPS id <0HVE00QRMDG31E@ims-msg.cwru.edu> for npe@cwru.edu; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) id AEE63078 (forwarded by mail filter of npe); Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (mirapoint2.TIS.CWRU.Edu [129.22.104.47]) by mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu (MOS 3.4.4-GR) with ESMTP id AEE63076; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mirapoint2.tis.cwru.edu (MOS 3.4.3-CR) with ESMTP id ASJ57268; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id B2DD519DE3; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D58AB19AD7; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:21:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id D764219E0E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rapido.vitanuova.com (unknown [62.254.170.97]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2967619C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 11:20:04 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:25:46 +0100 From: rog@vitanuova.com Subject: Re: [9fans] multiple inputs In-reply-to: Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Errors-to: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Reply-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <19236d27e19c4ebbe4ba92e507e29149@vitanuova.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Precedence: bulk X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-to: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mirapoint-Loop-ID: cb554f7c7f0064cc56e600f872486f69 X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Junkmail-Status: score=5/45, host=mpspam4.TIS.case.Edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 List-Archive: List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> Original-recipient: rfc822;npe@spamfree.cwru.edu > You need to put the brackets on the outside to make the combination of > tail -f's act like a single 'tail -f'. That was my real conceptual > misunderstanding the first time around. erm, i don't think so. {a & b &} should be exactly the same as a & b & you almost never need eval in rc, unless you genuinely want to evaluate an rc expression that's unknown beforehand (which isn't true in your case). you could have got the behaviour i think you were after with something like: fn bt { x=$1 shift for(i) {tail -f $i &} tail -f $x } --upas-xvmovnniftcvgeloqnuvadhuom-- --upas-rbfuxponujdtqmquxiqcomcqio-- --upas-auofrcighfatokpegtfjxiqhjg-- From bwc@coraid.com Wed Mar 31 09:05:34 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 08:52:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 59b9c12e_82a5_11d8_9b2c_00304828b574_5471; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07013344803 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 5980d9b8_82a5_11d8_986b_00304828b574_5466; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id E579C7580FB; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DF7C7580FA for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 59469262_82a5_11d8_91c6_00304828b574_5463; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC1C5344803 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 58984acc_82a5_11d8_830e_00304828b574_5455; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id C5EC419E41; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:52:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFD8519B6D; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:52:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2E83219BBD; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 563B519B6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:51:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7be527322675fc944d7d1c17df72672b@borf.com> From: Brantley Coile To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] certificates and tlssrv Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:48:16 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I'm running a custom https server and I'm using tlssrv to setup the session. How do I specify all the certificates to show the client that I'm in a known chain of certificates? I have three certificates that chain all the way back to someone all the browers trust, but it appears that tlssrv is only telling them about the first one. Brantley From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 31 17:48:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 11:01:02 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 42de61a0_82b7_11d8_867d_00304828b574_5515; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:02 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86DB834494B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 428e9558_82b7_11d8_8be4_00304828b574_5471; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 498B27580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:01 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 013977580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:00 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 424749dc_82b7_11d8_8679_00304828b574_5444; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:01 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E7B7B34494B for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:00:59 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4187b2c0_82b7_11d8_808d_00304828b574_5440; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:01:00 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 429F919E68; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:00:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B533119E56; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:00:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 8054119E56; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:00:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (nolifeandliberty.com [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01AFE19E48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 21:00:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Geoff Collyer To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] byte-order-independent aan Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 18:00:01 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: On Feb 11, 2004, Peter Bosch said: --- > do what aan ought to have done ... > pack and unpack the values using a fixed byte order. yup, this need to be fixed. i'll do it tonight... peter. --- but I haven't seen the new one yet on sources (and my binary is much newer than my source): ; ls -l /bin/aan /sys/src/cmd/aan.c --rwxrwxr-x M 46387 sys sys 128816 Sep 26 2003 /bin/aan --rw-rw-r-- M 46387 sys sys 9758 Apr 26 2002 /sys/src/cmd/aan.c If there's newer aan source, could somebody please put it on sources? From presotto@closedmind.org Wed Mar 31 17:48:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 11:18:27 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b1abfee2_82b9_11d8_918b_00304828b574_9992; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AC53344982 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b17bb796_82b9_11d8_9d39_00304828b574_9988; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 5ECA97580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11D327580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b1300b0c_82b9_11d8_8f84_00304828b574_9985; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22685344982 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b08355ec_82b9_11d8_946b_00304828b574_9981; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:25 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 1A4F719E5F; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:44:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F9FE19E46; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:44:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A1E4519E53; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:43:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.huygens.org (mail.closedmind.org [204.178.31.13]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D6E419E46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:43:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: David Presotto To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] certificates and tlssrv In-Reply-To: <7be527322675fc944d7d1c17df72672b@borf.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:43:48 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: We don't follow chains, we just believe any x.509 fingerprints we have. Is that what you are asking? From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 31 17:48:32 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 11:18:37 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b8018884_82b9_11d8_94de_00304828b574_10020; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 299B0344988 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7cd74a4_82b9_11d8_9960_00304828b574_10017; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:37 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1492F7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:37 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0B867580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b7933c76_82b9_11d8_97cf_00304828b574_10014; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:36 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1018344988 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:35 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b6e65c36_82b9_11d8_8aaa_00304828b574_10009; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 11:18:36 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4910519E5C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:49:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D84F919E3C; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:49:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 58E0019E4E; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:48:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (nolifeandliberty.com [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D58719E3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 20:48:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] certificates and tlssrv From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 17:47:58 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I think he wants to have tlssrv present multiple certificates to clients, so that they can follow the chain back to the root. From stalker@Math.Princeton.EDU Wed Mar 31 17:48:39 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 17:17:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e6150656_82eb_11d8_88db_00304828b574_1191; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5128B344F2C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e5e44c28_82eb_11d8_9792_00304828b574_1187; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 2FD9F7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:49 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC2DC7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e5a299cc_82eb_11d8_87c1_00304828b574_1183; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAB0B344F2C for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e4f48526_82eb_11d8_8a7b_00304828b574_1179; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:17:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 82E4219EAA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:17:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44FBD19EA7; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:17:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 218EB19EA6; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from Mail.Math.Princeton.EDU (mail.math.Princeton.EDU [128.112.18.14]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01CA019E9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:16:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from math.Princeton.EDU (math.Princeton.EDU [128.112.18.16]) by Mail.Math.Princeton.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id i2V8GqwF007829 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=EDH-RSA-DES-CBC3-SHA bits=168 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:16:52 -0500 Received: from math.Princeton.EDU (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by math.Princeton.EDU (8.12.10/8.12.8) with ESMTP id i2V8GppS027545 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:16:51 -0500 Message-Id: <200403310816.i2V8GppS027545@math.Princeton.EDU> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: John Stalker Subject: [9fans] troff and latin2, devpost Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:16:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Greetings. I am trying to prepare a document in Czech using troff. My procedure is the naive sam foo.ms troff -ms foo.ms | lp -dstdout >foo.ps Looking at foo.ps shows that characters in the unicode range 00** are specified as Times Roman while those in the range 01** are specified as LucidaSans01. Page dutifully displays them that way. This looks stupid, but page is just doing what it is told to do. Displaying foo.ps with gv on FreeBSD gives garbage, however. Is there a good way to produce postscript output with all the roman characters in the same font which will render properly on any reasonable postscript viewer? One of the things I tried while struggling with the problem above is troff -ms -Tpost I discovered that /lib/troff/fonts/devpost is missing. Apologies if I got the path wrong; I am not on a plan9 system right now. dev202 is also missing, but I doubt it will be much missed. -- John Stalker Department of Mathematics Princeton University (609)258-6469 From geoff@collyer.net Wed Mar 31 17:48:39 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 17:31:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id deb4b4ae_82ed_11d8_8082_00304828b574_3924; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1E13344F5A for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id de800b8c_82ed_11d8_9e20_00304828b574_3921; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CD97E7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85D667580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id de4691b8_82ed_11d8_85b9_00304828b574_3918; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96116344F5A for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id dd998bee_82ed_11d8_8ecd_00304828b574_3913; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:31:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 698F019ECF; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9340819EB6; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:31:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3430A19EB2; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:30:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [63.192.14.226]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04A7619EB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 03:30:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] troff and latin2, devpost From: Geoff Collyer In-Reply-To: <200403310816.i2V8GppS027545@math.Princeton.EDU> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 00:30:01 -0800 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: I ran `/sys/doc/cleanps foo.ps', which inserts the necessary fonts. From martin@parvat.com Wed Mar 31 23:40:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 20:26:32 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 4299a0de_8306_11d8_810f_00304828b574_16062; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F43D344174 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 425d11fa_8306_11d8_82ef_00304828b574_16055; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:31 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D6D2A75810C; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:23 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50DE5758108 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3bc5c648_8306_11d8_9e34_00304828b574_15944; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:26:21 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E46B3441A8 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:18:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 31199f90_8305_11d8_8b69_00304828b574_11968; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:18:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 381F919EDA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:18:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E5A219ED3; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:18:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id EB93119DDC; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8059C19ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:17:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.208] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B8djG-0007E9-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:17:54 +0200 Received: from [203.101.52.89] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B8djF-0000vx-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:17:54 +0200 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... Message-Id: <20040331164426.2a795002.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> References: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 16:44:26 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Dave, On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:43:29 +0100 Dave Lukes wrote: > Is in a month and a half: > could people please start firming up their plans so I can start > matching beds to bodies? Yes, we're also trying to firm-up our arrangements for May! Some time back you said: > I've looked at a couple of guest houses further out, > and they're about UK=C2=A370 (~105 Euros) per night for a triple room: > about 45mins journey time to anywhere in central London. > If you get a more central room it'll cost you about =C2=A3120/night, > and it won't be as nice. Whereabouts were these guest houses? I don't want to burden you with finding a place for us, especially when we can probably do it ourselves over the internet! On the other hand, if you found some specific places, then I don't want to discard your efforts either! BTW: the venue is fab! Anyway, we're still planning on being with you - any initial thoughts about an "agenda" yet, or is it just: 10:00-20:00: chill out, chat, eat and drink etc. :-) Thanks, Martin --=20 Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From paurea@lsub.org Wed Mar 31 23:40:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 20:28:55 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98459d80_8306_11d8_8bcc_00304828b574_16630; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FD583441F7 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 98141990_8306_11d8_809d_00304828b574_16627; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 1237B7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C75DB7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 97da5e1c_8306_11d8_9b00_00304828b574_16624; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3C113441F7 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 972adc62_8306_11d8_87ae_00304828b574_16620; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:28:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 42D4419EDD; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:28:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6D8319ED2; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:28:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3BB1419EDD; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:27:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sailu.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc031.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BADBF19ECB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:27:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3e67f5d850453a1ab2470243b0c66503@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... From: Gorka Guardiola Múzquiz In-Reply-To: <20040331164426.2a795002.martin@parvat.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:27:34 +0200 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> I've looked at a couple of guest houses further out, >> and they're about UK=C3=82=C2=A370 (~105 Euros) per night for a triple= room: >> about 45mins journey time to anywhere in central London. >> If you get a more central room it'll cost you about =C3=82=C2=A3120/ni= ght, >> and it won't be as nice. >=20 > Whereabouts were these guest houses? I don't want to burden you with > finding a place for us, especially when we can probably do it ourselves > over the internet! On the other hand, if you found some specific places= , > then I don't want to discard your efforts either! A pair of years ago I went to London and I slept by Victoria Station on some ugly shared rooms for students (like guest houses but old and dirty :-)). They were really really cheap (I remember something like =C2=A320/night if my memory is right but good only for people with good stomach (and not much money :-)). I think I prefer the 105 euros triple = room if I can't sleep for free :-) on the floor of someone's house, but there is always the choice. If someone wants, I can forward the info. G. From martin@parvat.com Wed Mar 31 23:40:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 20:50:51 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a8388b1e_8309_11d8_9f73_00304828b574_21229; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C9E43444E0 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a8072312_8309_11d8_8281_00304828b574_21225; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4F5CF7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07B7A7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a7c83d64_8309_11d8_9837_00304828b574_21222; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D4193444E0 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id a714786a_8309_11d8_97f2_00304828b574_21218; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 20:50:49 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 3755119EE4; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:50:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 936F419EDA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:50:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 7DFBD19ECB; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:49:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.189]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4910719E04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 06:49:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.179] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B8eDr-000175-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:49:31 +0200 Received: from [203.101.52.89] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1B8eDq-0001qy-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:49:31 +0200 From: Martin C.Atkins To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... Message-Id: <20040331171607.32785434.martin@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <20040331164426.2a795002.martin@parvat.com> References: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> <20040331164426.2a795002.martin@parvat.com> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:113a684b1fe18b05bb432fb0fae7a311 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 17:16:07 +0530 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Oooops, sorry, sorry! I've caught the wrong 'reply' button bug - that wasn't meant to go to the whole list! Apologies. Martin On Wed, 31 Mar 2004 16:44:26 +0530 Martin C.Atkins wrote: > Hi Dave, > > On Tue, 30 Mar 2004 15:43:29 +0100 Dave Lukes wrote: > > Is in a month and a half: > > could people please start firming up their plans so I can start > > matching beds to bodies? > > Yes, we're also trying to firm-up our arrangements for May! -- Martin C. Atkins martin@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 31 23:40:57 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 22:13:48 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3f139d7a_8315_11d8_823c_00304828b574_7711; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3BC1344E01 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3ee17156_8315_11d8_9480_00304828b574_7707; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id D56807580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:47 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 814187580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3e9a15fe_8315_11d8_82ed_00304828b574_7701; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81770344E01 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 3de2d3d0_8315_11d8_89df_00304828b574_7697; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:13:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 96E8119EF9; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:13:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12D1C19EF2; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:13:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 208FD19ED6; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:12:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0298619C87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:12:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 440BB2A6; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 14:12:15 +0100 (BST) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B26412A8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 14:12:12 +0100 (BST) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA14073 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 14:12:28 +0100 (BST) Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <3e67f5d850453a1ab2470243b0c66503@plan9.escet.urjc.es> References: <3e67f5d850453a1ab2470243b0c66503@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Message-Id: <1080738713.17780.185.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 14:11:53 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We might as well discuss all this on the list, so people can get ideas of where to stay. I can guarantee at least 3, possibly more, floor spaces, BUT YOU WILL NEED TO BRING YOUR OWN BEDDING. I would recommend against really cheap places: we won't thank you if you bring fleas with you! I believe someone else offered some more spaces: please volunteer if you're in the area and have a spare floor. If my numbers are right, we need 5 beds so far, of which 3 are accounted for! Cheers, Dave. On Wed, 2004-03-31 at 12:27, Gorka Guardiola M=C3=BAzquiz wrote: > >> I've looked at a couple of guest houses further out, > >> and they're about UK=C3=82=C2=A370 (~105 Euros) per night for a trip= le room: > >> about 45mins journey time to anywhere in central London. > >> If you get a more central room it'll cost you about =C3=82=C2=A3120/= night, > >> and it won't be as nice. > >=20 > > Whereabouts were these guest houses? I don't want to burden you with > > finding a place for us, especially when we can probably do it ourselv= es > > over the internet! On the other hand, if you found some specific plac= es, > > then I don't want to discard your efforts either! >=20 > A pair of years ago I went to London and I slept by Victoria Station > on some ugly shared rooms for students (like guest houses but old and > dirty :-)). They were really really cheap (I remember something like > =C2=A320/night if my memory is right but good only for people with good > stomach (and not much money :-)). I think I prefer the 105 euros tripl= e room > if I can't sleep for free :-) on the floor of someone's house, but ther= e > is always the choice. If someone wants, I can forward the info. >=20 > G. >=20 From bwc@coraid.com Wed Mar 31 23:40:58 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 22:22:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 803a0022_8316_11d8_9c11_00304828b574_9085; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C634D344E16 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 8009d7c6_8316_11d8_8283_00304828b574_9082; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id A8A927580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6018D7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7fca36d4_8316_11d8_8b12_00304828b574_9079; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EE7F344E16 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7f1c2cc4_8316_11d8_8d63_00304828b574_9075; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:22:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 40E1919EDA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:22:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65B4A19EF5; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:22:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id ECEBA19EDA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:21:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from edsac.borf.com (borf.com [209.179.94.84]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 26FCC19EE0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:21:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <83a81270a19a808b4df7202350f77568@borf.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] certificates and tlssrv From: Brantley Coile In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:20:28 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: > I think he wants to have tlssrv present multiple certificates to > clients, so that they can follow the chain back to the root. I should know better than to compose a 9fans request at 8pm! Geoff is correct. I want web browsers not to complain about the certificate I give them. I have a chain we bought from somewhere. Under openSSL (don't get me started : ) I put them all into a single file that was loaded. The readcert(2) seems to stop after reading a single cert. Should I hack it to catenate them togeter and set the TLSconn->cert to that whole thing? Thanks Brantley From glenda@comcast.net Wed Mar 31 23:40:58 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 22:36:56 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 7a25a7a2_8318_11d8_83e3_00304828b574_12166; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F686344E31 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:55 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 79d4b8a6_8318_11d8_8cc0_00304828b574_12163; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:55 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 4AAEB7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:55 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAC737580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 797f72d8_8318_11d8_9825_00304828b574_12160; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75E94344E31 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 78931226_8318_11d8_902f_00304828b574_12156; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:36:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 4B2D119EE0; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:36:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A37D219EFD; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:36:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 2B2C419E34; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:35:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc12.comcast.net (sccrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.202.56]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6A3019D5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:35:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from brain.org (h004005b2f1be.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.62.113.60]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id <2004033113350301200nemnje>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:35:03 +0000 Message-ID: From: glenda@comcast.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-letneoxxizvoyobhksbezwmdgu" Subject: [9fans] (no subject) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:32:04 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-letneoxxizvoyobhksbezwmdgu Content-Disposition: inline --upas-letneoxxizvoyobhksbezwmdgu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mx2.freebsd.org ([216.136.204.119]) by sccrmxc13.comcast.net (sccrmxc13) with SMTP id <20040331123929s1300cbd0be>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 12:39:29 +0000 X-Originating-IP: [216.136.204.119] Received: from hub.freebsd.org (hub.freebsd.org [216.136.204.18]) by mx2.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB2365726B; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 04:37:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org) Received: from hub.freebsd.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E991916A599; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 04:37:22 -0800 (PST) Delivered-To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org Received: from mx1.FreeBSD.org (mx1.freebsd.org [216.136.204.125]) by hub.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1542A16A4CE for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:04:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from viviendaatualcance.com.mx (dsl-200-78-18-163.prod-infinitum.com.mx [200.78.18.163]) by mx1.FreeBSD.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 847F943D46 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 06:04:41 -0800 (PST) (envelope-from eculp@viviendaatualcance.com.mx) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (uid 80) by viviendaatualcance.com.mx with local; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:04:40 -0600 Received: from dsl-200-78-18-163.prod-infinitum.com.mx (dsl-200-78-18-163.prod-infinitum.com.mx [200.78.18.163]) by mail.viviendaatualcance.com.mx (Horde) with HTTP for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:04:40 -0600 Message-ID: <20040330080440.wp0k8084ko0cwgsg@mail.viviendaatualcance.com.mx> Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2004 08:04:40 -0600 From: Edwin Culp To: noackjr@alumni.rice.edu References: <20040330043830.scwgckcs8kcc0cws@mail.viviendaatualcance.com.mx> <40697C93.2070701@alumni.rice.edu> In-Reply-To: <40697C93.2070701@alumni.rice.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 4.0-cvs X-EnContacto.net: Edwin Culp celular Mexico 001 228 824 5542 WorldInternet.ORG X-WorldInternet.org: Edwin Culp Te mantiene, siempre, EnContacto. X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 04:37:13 -0800 Cc: current@freebsd.org Subject: Re: apache13 signal 11 with php4 - with or without ssl X-BeenThere: freebsd-current@freebsd.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.1 Precedence: list List-Id: Discussions about the use of FreeBSD-current List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Errors-To: owner-freebsd-current@freebsd.org Quoting Jon Noack : > On 3/30/2004 4:38 AM, Edwin Culp wrote: >> Good morning, >> >> With yesterday's current with all updated, mergemaster, >> portupgrade, openssl port removed and all dependent ports >> rebuilt (confirmed with libchk and ldd), apache13 >> immediately crashes when accessing libphp4.so. If I >> comment out the libphp4.so and mod_php4.c in httpd.conf, I >> can start apache and it seems more or less stable. It will >> not start (apachectl start) with php but strangely, if I >> start it, I can uncomment the php4 lines in httpd.conf and >> add a php4 site, run apachectl graceful and it doesn't >> crash immediately. If I try to add more php4 >> nameVirtualHosts it will crash even using graceful and to >> start it I have to repeat the strange process just to use >> my php4 email client. >> >> If anyone has seen this or has an idea, it would be >> appreciated. The only thing that I'm thinking is that >> maybe I shouldn't have removed the openssl port but after >> all the testing I am doubting it. > > Although I'm using apache2, I also had some crash issues with PHP 4.3.5. > Specifically, it segfaults on exit (graceful or otherwise). Although > the PHP folks have tagged it as Bogus, this bug describes exactly what I > am seeing (the backtrace is identical): > http://bugs.php.net/bug.php?id=27735 > > This is quite annoying, because among other things it breaks logfile > rotation -- the logfile gets rotated, but apache dies with these > messages in httpd-error.log: > [Tue Mar 30 06:44:48 2004] [notice] Graceful restart requested, doing > restart > [Tue Mar 30 06:44:48 2004] [notice] seg fault or similar nasty error > detected in the parent process > > Reverting to the PCRE bundled with PHP 4.3.4 (PCRE version 4.3) resolved > the problem for me (just replace the PHP 4.3.5 ext/pcre directory with > the one from PHP 4.3.4). Going to try that, right now. I'll let you and the list know. Thanks, ed > > Jon Noack _______________________________________________ freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" --upas-letneoxxizvoyobhksbezwmdgu-- From g.pavelcak@comcast.net Wed Mar 31 23:40:58 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 22:52:54 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b597c426_831a_11d8_86c2_00304828b574_15196; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47AE73450B9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:54 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b561b0c0_831a_11d8_885c_00304828b574_15193; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:54 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 319977580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:54 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC7D77580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b52654f8_831a_11d8_81a1_00304828b574_15190; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:53 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB42D3450B9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:52 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id b478290a_831a_11d8_8b26_00304828b574_15186; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 22:52:53 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 266C319EE7; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 785B519ED7; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:52:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 192EF19ED7; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:51:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc12.comcast.net (sccrmhc12.comcast.net [204.127.202.56]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 105F919E8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from brain.org (h004005b2f1be.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.62.113.60]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc12) with SMTP id <2004033113513601200nd2vhe>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 13:51:36 +0000 Message-ID: <90b6c2431eff47da9198c2c36375a932@comcast.net> From: Greg Pavelcak To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [9fans] FreeBSD list apache question and trivial nedmail observation Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 08:48:36 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: First, if you're wondering why 9fans got a forwarded message about FreeBSD and apache, I did "m 9fans@cse.psu.edu" while on that message. My intent was to compose a new message, and I typed a hybrid of a "mutt-ism" and a "nedmail-ism". I don't know how you guys who actually have to work with different platforms keep it all straight. Anyway, sorry about that. As for nedmail, I was looking at the source, and I just have a comment correction. The syntax for nedmail commands says: // cmd := range cmd ' ' arg-list ; // range := address // | address ',' address // | 'g' search ; // address := msgno // | search ; // msgno := number // | number '/' msgno ; ******************************************* // search := '/' string '/' // | '%' string '%' ; // I assume that the '/' should be a '.' indicating message subparts. Greg From davel@anvil.com Wed Mar 31 23:40:58 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 23:15:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e797e0d4_831d_11d8_90c6_00304828b574_22446; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id A38EB344257 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e761b298_831d_11d8_87dd_00304828b574_22443; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 8F66E7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47A127580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e728779e_831d_11d8_9054_00304828b574_22440; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CB54344257 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id e6745098_831d_11d8_991d_00304828b574_22436; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:15:45 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 078AA19EDA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:15:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65C1619EBC; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:15:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id A602619EBC; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:14:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A010C19E7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:14:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id EDFAA2C3; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 15:13:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from anvil.co.uk (mother.anvil.co.uk [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C98A2BD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 15:13:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from zevon (zevon [192.168.4.64]) by anvil.co.uk (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id PAA28404 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 15:13:53 +0100 (BST) Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... From: Dave Lukes To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> References: <1080657809.4901.214.camel@zevon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Message-Id: <1080742399.17780.318.camel@zevon> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.5 (1.4.5-1) Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 15:13:19 +0100 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Folks, One other detail: the room is going to cost ~UK=C2=A3350~=3D~US$640~=3D=E2=82=AC520. (I know that's not cheap, but it gets us a nice room in a good location). I'm going to pay for this (out of my divorce settlement:-(), but I'd be grateful for any donations to defray the cost! If everyone chips in, say, =C2=A320 (=E2=82=AC30), we should be half way = there! Any profit will be spent on beer/crisps/chips/nuts/... for everyone, and no, you can't get a receipt to claim back the tax. Thank you! Dave. P.S. We're up to 13 definite attendees, plus a couple of maybes! P.P.S. We also have at least 2 jugglers! P.P.P.S. There's a company in the UK that does personalised juggling balls:-). From rminnich@lanl.gov Wed Mar 31 23:40:59 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 23:39:49 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 431cb1b6_8321_11d8_885c_00304828b574_27639; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:49 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA92A3442A9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 42e5e514_8321_11d8_85a4_00304828b574_27636; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:48 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id 9778F7580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:48 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DD9A7580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 42ac10be_8321_11d8_8f35_00304828b574_27633; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:48 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B6373442A9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id 41fd2d6a_8321_11d8_8ea5_00304828b574_27627; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:39:47 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 86CA119EE4; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:39:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 551D919E75; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:39:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 9786219D38; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:38:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7531619C82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:38:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay3.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEcBik013776 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:38:12 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay3.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEcBdo003598 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:38:11 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEcBwO009287 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:38:11 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tactic In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:38:10 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: you just can't beat those bayesian spam filters with a stick, eh? :-) ron p.s. Yeah, I am sure there is not bayesian spam filter on this list, but still, I betcha that last message (most appropriate name, eh?) would have gone right through. From rminnich@lanl.gov Thu Apr 1 11:39:37 2004 Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp ([202.16.124.2]) by ar; Wed Mar 31 23:42:47 JST 2004 Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ad6dc0aa_8321_11d8_82bb_00304828b574_28141; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:47 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (vega [202.16.124.3]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECAC03442ED for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from vega.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ad27d96e_8321_11d8_8d78_00304828b574_28138; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) id CF3357580FA; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Delivered-To: arisawa@aichi-u.ac.jp Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (smtp [202.16.124.2]) by vega.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 875D57580F9 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ace8a834_8321_11d8_9a86_00304828b574_28135; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: from kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by smtp.aichi-u.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9542F3442ED for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:45 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu by kwck.aichi-u.ac.jp via csmap id ac3a1940_8321_11d8_97e6_00304828b574_28131; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 23:42:46 +0900 (JST) Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 5568119EF2; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3682E19EE3; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:42:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server, from userid 60001) id 6A87219EC5; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.16.0.25]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55B8F19ED7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 09:41:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailrelay2.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEfIik015344 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:41:18 -0700 Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by mailrelay2.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEfIFb011773 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:41:18 -0700 Received: from maxroach.lanl.gov (maxroach.lanl.gov [128.165.250.187]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.10/8.12.10/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id i2VEfHwO009412 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:41:17 -0700 From: ron minnich To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 9conlon ... In-Reply-To: <3e67f5d850453a1ab2470243b0c66503@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Sender: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-admin@cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.11 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Archive: Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2004 07:41:17 -0700 (MST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on psuvax1.cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: just check out IYH in the UK for cheap accomodations, there's a fair number in london. They're not the greatest but a step up from a park bench. ron