From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 00:03:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 00:03:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8A5DD63ACE for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:02:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A56ED318DA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08368-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65261318D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 08:01:41 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <673bb0f7f7be8c76f1db56fb175f06a9@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > point2rgb(Image *, Point, uchar *r, uchar *g, uchar *b) > point2rgb(Image *, Point, uchar *r, uchar *g, uchar *b, uchar *alpha) make the second one 'point2rgba' :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 00:53:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 00:53:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBE6563AC5 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:53:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B39BA639F0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15601-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:53:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46FA4639EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:53:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: mtg@crn.mteege.de, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] nfsserver no mapping From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:52:54 0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> you try '9fs crn' on crn? > > it mounts crn to /n/crn and I can see the tree. Try '-D' flag for more detailed status messages. If you are still seeing the "no map for pair" message, it may be that the client IP is mapping to a name which doesn't match the client regexp in the configuration file. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 01:22:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 01:22:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D807B63B40 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:22:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 301C263A6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:21:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14970-01-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:21:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C25863A80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:21:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 16:28:27 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Juke depends on some recent additions to acme. would you be able to summarise these? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 02:02:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 02:02:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCD6263CF7 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:02:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8408963C70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:01:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16512-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:01:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D6FF63C4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:01:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.1] (port=1086 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1CvevY-000EyY-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:01:29 +0300 Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:01:37 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1004635046.20050131190137@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] writing services X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans I already understand how work srv (in most part) but have some question first is... My file tree initialized by following strings mysrv.tree=alloctree(nil,nil,DMDIR|0777,destroyfile); createfile(mysrv.tree->root,"data",nil,0666,(void*)DATAFILE); (I use aux pointer for file identification in tree) How I can set file size, and when I need realloc data pointer? I try set it in open and/or stat function but it's not work... In my case I need create fixed size file, and then work with it. Thanks for advice -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 02:18:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 02:18:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B8E263D20 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 422C363C31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:17:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20087-01-56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:17:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18C7B63C11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:17:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so393702rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:17:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=cBjJ9xxq9U0lEvMc7Yc3r89N6kK/rHoSAUnD6111M0i2t/HDrrMT00YllmLbqqsFuBVDydaY3a/kymj58zR+KtntVCcHsIGnRQqEc03S+RYEOKjs8oaegypmFXGUicUjPawMXEUREVpvcYX+Pe/k3eyVXDKvk02fnA3bCoJLV9Y= Received: by 10.38.208.51 with SMTP id f51mr188829rng; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:17:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:17:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:17:40 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing services In-Reply-To: <1004635046.20050131190137@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1004635046.20050131190137@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > mysrv.tree=alloctree(nil,nil,DMDIR|0777,destroyfile); > createfile(mysrv.tree->root,"data",nil,0666,(void*)DATAFILE); > How I can set file size, and when I need realloc data pointer? > I try set it in open and/or stat function but it's not work... > In my case I need create fixed size file, and then work with it. If you create a stat function, then you can do void mystat(Req *r) { r->d->length = 1000000; respond(r, nil); } The data pointer f->aux is yours. You can do whatever you want with it. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 02:18:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 02:18:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4F3D63D41 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C0C963C11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20033-01-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2173F63C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so393848rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:18:25 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=JezQ/prmuW74O8Zzbv4CGs8klIb/iW9Ob+XiPJnQ+Q0IwkOwjFkrJGsJH0JIZbH0sCZe3N/Vr5eajzCCsgrYd/FnerE/5uz1bWJRvadHTaapjp6DiEwSjSh9p+NUNWWeTxF3g2RxlXNYUn+K7lZUWV2GCTYtTblIXYYkT+fq6Yc= Received: by 10.38.208.17 with SMTP id f17mr196486rng; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:18:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:18:25 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:18:25 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > Juke depends on some recent additions to acme. > > would you be able to summarise these? there are new files n/errors and n/xdata. see acme(4). russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 02:59:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 02:59:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1866063C0B for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:59:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B839563BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:59:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21391-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5250363BDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:59:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so402725rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:59:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=XClP3FT8DgSrktLOiXXAr4JpFY3hyV3jE24Z2kB32spiuRNJ4IM6qfDFoi46R4Gw0HRrNXChV7DGpWnNKpDJJMzaZSOLw7l+ZXn6X4Rn1dY5P2rALba+P4jeF/8nc7a6ikWKPtgVuxKugA8yQi0Xk7KOEsYc4ouYgjQpjIWjLnY= Received: by 10.38.99.1 with SMTP id w1mr215752rnb; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:59:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:59:10 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:59:10 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: <200501311101.j0VB16Z05598@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <2f2448a71d0dbd4ba4954a288604df0b@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <200501311101.j0VB16Z05598@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > maybe also sape's playlist server could be used > (although there are some differences in the > operations allowed on the playlist, I think) > such that essentially (some version of) acme Juke > would just be an alternative to sape's juke gui? doing that is possible, but it would be a different program. the one neat thing about ajuke (and acd before it) is that the acme buffer *is* the playlist. when it's time to move to the next song, ajuke just looks at the window text to figure out what was playing and what to play next. so editing the playlist is very familiar -- it's no different from editing text files. > On the sun I have named pipe's /tmp/dev/audio and /tmp/dev/volume > and two small programs, one to read audio bytes from /tmp/dev/audio > and shuttle them to the real sun audio device, and another one i did that for a while, but on my linux only one app can have the sound card open at a time, so it got annoying killing it off and restarting it. this way ajuke can take care of closing the audio device when it is paused or stopped. either way the code has to be written. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:02:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:02:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1265963C02 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:02:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A1BE63BF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:01:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21391-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:01:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E952E63BDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:01:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so403189rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Yfuxsv8DAReL84T113wPGIIU5lo+UsXMBXhNcq0VuvtuRzMiM1e5u7WFsiyt/8oLmLAi3TXuE+N2G6tY9r3pdxexvTHgG8ocb9O3bgCujfQJDj4dNdgNPATX3hV/SZgv4d7iaVGYttIPKRDZh07YslLYe/OZyqXw/BmecQtj4WU= Received: by 10.38.89.4 with SMTP id m4mr269231rnb; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:01:32 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:01:32 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba In-Reply-To: <673bb0f7f7be8c76f1db56fb175f06a9@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <673bb0f7f7be8c76f1db56fb175f06a9@plan9.ucalgary.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > here are the prototypes: > > point2rgb(Image *, Point, uchar *r, uchar *g, uchar *b) > point2rgb(Image *, Point, uchar *r, uchar *g, uchar *b, uchar *alpha) > > s/uchar/int/ if you think it's better... i'd just make it ulong point2rgba(Image*, Point) but i question the utility. if you want just one pixel, fine, but how often does that happen? you probably want many pixels, in which case you should use unloadimage anyway. each call to point2rgba would have to do multiple 9p transactions with the draw server. for anything that processes an entire image, unloadimage is the right way to go. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:24:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:24:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28E6C63DD0 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:24:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55EAD63D0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:23:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21391-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:23:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C30FA63D80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:23:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4ad5917a1de943d2ae8a9b05c0420417@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:23:43 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > but i question the utility. if you want just one > pixel, fine, but how often does that happen? > you probably want many pixels, in which case > you should use unloadimage anyway. > i'm actually going the other way, but loadimage is really slow on anything remote, i was hoping that querying a single pixel would be faster and i could go away with the memimage* functions. i'll handle chan2rgb conversion locally. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:26:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:26:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5CFB63D7E for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:26:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A3FD63D2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:26:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21391-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32C7163C3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so408012rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:26:10 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=mC+9P5K0+ABtQwybYpWljU2pgCfEI9C2emAIX+/sKUxu7YagvVMDSNc9xwhwT5+b95/y7oAd8X5D02T6Plcl0KU7GcCePkutzi16pq6rfPOKPlIYBwqZT1o5979w5ICjufSZdJs3fF0+rL94cybAoCZYs06jxOLwcdou3qCeikc= Received: by 10.38.96.28 with SMTP id t28mr264180rnb; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:26:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:26:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:26:06 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba In-Reply-To: <4ad5917a1de943d2ae8a9b05c0420417@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <4ad5917a1de943d2ae8a9b05c0420417@plan9.ucalgary.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > i'm actually going the other way, but loadimage is really slow on > anything remote, i was hoping that querying a single pixel would be > faster and i could go away with the memimage* functions. if you're using Image* functions, you are editing an image stored on the other end of /dev/draw. you don't have the bits in memory. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:40:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:40:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9969D63DCE for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:40:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED1ED63D2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:39:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21391-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:39:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D60C63D12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:39:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:46:30 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > if you're using Image* functions, you are editing an image > stored on the other end of /dev/draw. you don't have the bits in memory. i've always thought that it was a pity that when the image memory is in fact local, that this can't be optimised (e.g. by providing direct access to an offscreen bitmap via segattach(2), negotiating the seg class via /dev/draw). has anyone thought about doing something like this? it'd be nice to be able to push pixels really fast. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:41:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:41:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEEC563DF4 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:41:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B52263DAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:40:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27900-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:40:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB54663D69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:40:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so410969rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:40:49 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=t7YitpnoxWq5Uy+szQCMNxtTqkLxEpqwMqBKzO8cXJjOJobc5DxNN05a+1fdL4YUkCQUeulHL+EFA99SAlWeAgqJJURZtMXlSR5Fvs5n7Ng/ifbgRr7R454R23y38+0BdGOOx/mXMworKbdlpNi3M8KUgY9ARFPloz3NDsUrExY= Received: by 10.38.208.77 with SMTP id f77mr86289rng; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:40:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:40:48 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:40:48 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-15; format=3Dflowed > | Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >=20 > in the header doesn't lead to properly displayed 'umlauts', but >=20 > | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-15; format=3Dflowed > | Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >=20 > does lead to properly displayed 'umlauts'. I don't believe Plan 9 is causing the problem. I just=20 manually sent myself an 8-bit 8859-15 message on Plan 9 with the script below and it came through just fine, at least using "mail" to read (didn't try acme Mail but they should be the same). Probably some mail server before Plan 9 is screwing with the 8-bit characters. Russ #!/usr/local/plan9/bin/rc { =09echo 'HELO rsc' =09sleep 2 =09echo 'MAIL FROM: ' =09sleep 2 =09echo 'RCPT TO: ' =09sleep 2 =09echo 'DATA' =09sleep 2 =09echo 'Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3DISO-8859-15; format=3Dflowed' =09echo 'Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit' =09echo =09echo Hello world. =09echo Here is an umlaut: =FC | tcs -t 8859-15 =09echo =09echo . =09sleep 2 =09echo QUIT =09sleep 2 } | dial -e tcp!204.178.31.2!25 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:48:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:48:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C6DF63E14 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:48:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A897D63DD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:47:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28350-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:47:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63EE663DB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:47:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34115094a64fb3c82839e2c4f194424c@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:47:51 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > has anyone thought about doing something like this? > it'd be nice to be able to push pixels really fast. i've stumbled upon this many times since the xscreensaver hacks use pixel mangling routines so much... i don't know what the right solution is, except that loadimage is really slow (and it hits you really bad whenever the display isn't on the same machine as the program, drawterm for example). i know aki nyrhinen did some work on increasing the bulk transfer for loadimage, but that's about it. point2rgb seemed like the simplest solution (with rgb2point on the other hand), but i am now convinced it would be, again, painfully slow on remote displays. this situation is rarely seen in the real world :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 03:58:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 03:58:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01A2263E50 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:58:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF6F863DFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:57:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28350-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAFD963DFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so414536rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:57:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=XEqN4fdlaMbXp5zcFXWCEhvnLxhorjJ0tp6jb7kq85zASylKR+PPoqcask8XY8kZmciaUoOl2WEnoAiZB3MDcbZu5SOdOFb2TLj3zKr72qQgGrRoJK6n0Mx3WJGVl1s3iUGu6dmQ6Y81g9ZCFZdKtK9NTNECAQauy8Gmb0cBSVc= Received: by 10.38.11.48 with SMTP id 48mr61812rnk; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:57:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:57:32 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 13:57:32 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba In-Reply-To: <34115094a64fb3c82839e2c4f194424c@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <34115094a64fb3c82839e2c4f194424c@plan9.ucalgary.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > this situation is rarely seen in the real world :) drawterm, cpu, remote X? if you express what you want to do in terms of real draw operations instead of loadimage and unloadimage, then you will be much happier. xscreensaver is slow because you are not using the system the way it was intended to be used. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:13:36 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:13:36 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C9AA63AD3 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:13:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B50163977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:13:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28475-01-66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:13:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B6F062A48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:13:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <11d3735baba19e7c2a9a059159f39460@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:19:53 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > if you express what you want to do in terms > of real draw operations instead of loadimage > and unloadimage, then you will be much happier. > xscreensaver is slow because you are not using > the system the way it was intended to be used. but the real draw operations are a fairly arbitrary set. i'd hazard that most of the xscreensaver graphics output could not be nicely expressed in terms of real draw operations. didn't an earlier version of the draw device rely entirely on pushing bitmaps? from that perspective, the current draw device is just a bandwidth optimisation for commonly found graphics operations. there are applications that really do need to push lots of custom-generated pixels of data to the screen. it seems a pity that this kind of thing is so heavily penalised in plan 9. maybe it's just that so many of these kind of applications are basically frivolous (screensavers and games)... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:14:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:14:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAE8A63A83 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:14:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3021A63A14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:14:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28350-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:14:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6BE563A09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:14:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:14:21 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > xscreensaver is slow because you are not using > the system the way it was intended to be used. I agree :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:20:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:20:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0129063DB5 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:20:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FCF163C02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:19:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28475-01-84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:19:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA91563A95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:19:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([84.4.62.233]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <370125-451>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:19:15 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c507c9$c1d2dd50$e93e0454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:19:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Probably some mail server before Plan 9 is screwing with the 8-bit characters. yeah i've seen this before. some EMSTP implementations screw up and some blendmail mailers need the undocumented mailer flag '9'. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:33:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:33:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC6BB63F08 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:33:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD71A63E24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:33:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03647-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F2A163E1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:33:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:33:17 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <11d3735baba19e7c2a9a059159f39460@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > there are applications that really do need to push lots of > custom-generated pixels of data to the screen. it seems a pity that > this kind of thing is so heavily penalised in plan 9. maybe it's just > that so many of these kind of applications are basically frivolous > (screensavers and games)... anything opengl is an example of this. it's nearly impossible to do opengl for plan9 using libdraw primitives, since converting a ulong to a color needs to go through allocimage. i heard someone suggest using an rgb color triangle already allocimage'd in rio as a source for pre-allocated colors, but try drawing a replicated pixel sourced from a larger image without a 1x1 intermediary :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:39:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:39:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00F4963E87 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:39:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7476F63E6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:38:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03707-01-48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:38:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0603863E76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:38:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id D04E42FEA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:38:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 58so239389wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:37:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Eone+bTk6u0EPEXvILA216g16aeJMcRc57pk02Gx6FBX5NA0wIMqmpoj9cP5oL7GGM8kegLdVOyb7EUuuvQdH8RLtGGafojkR6GHZisYWfXbv60gC54nc18kup433uj133mdMkBxYfq3DlC5uaBkTUkGvYMOlDuZD1HOWqYZw5Y= Received: by 10.54.47.2 with SMTP id u2mr88185wru; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:37:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.5 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 11:37:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf5050131113724b79a68@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:37:30 -0500 From: Joel Salomon To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba In-Reply-To: <11d3735baba19e7c2a9a059159f39460@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <11d3735baba19e7c2a9a059159f39460@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:19:53 0000, rog@vitanuova.com wr= ote: > there are applications that really do need to push lots of > custom-generated pixels of data to the screen. it seems a pity that > this kind of thing is so heavily penalised in plan 9. maybe it's just > that so many of these kind of applications are basically frivolous > (screensavers and games)... >=20 IIRC, the XaoS fractal browser uses some form of double buffering and whole-screen updates to get decent performance. My guess would be that for 2-D graphics=E2=80=94even at the high end (like real-time MPEG-2 or MPE= G-4 display)=E2=80=94such would be sufficient. Does the current draw device penalize these operations so much? --Joel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 04:49:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 04:49:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF92163E97 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:49:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCCA063DFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:48:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03647-01-70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:48:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 998B263E32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 14:48:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:48:43 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <7871fcf5050131113724b79a68@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > IIRC, the XaoS fractal browser uses some form of double buffering and > whole-screen updates to get decent performance. My guess would be that > for 2-D graphics=E2=80=94even at the high end (like real-time MPEG-2 or= MPEG-4 > display)=E2=80=94such would be sufficient. Does the current draw device > penalize these operations so much? >=20 > --Joel xaos uses a CMAP8 image to which it loads a bitmap, the image is then drawn using draw().. the problem with that is the slowdown is twofold -- once to transfer the bitmap to draw, then the draw operation itself is slow if the image has a different channel than the display. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 05:08:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 05:08:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E97C63F16 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:07:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D8AB63EB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:07:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08576-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D88363EC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:07:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25740133B8; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:07:23 -1000 (HST) Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 10:07:23 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <2f2448a71d0dbd4ba4954a288604df0b@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <200501311101.j0VB16Z05598@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> On the sun I have named pipe's /tmp/dev/audio and /tmp/dev/volume >> and two small programs, one to read audio bytes from /tmp/dev/audio >> and shuttle them to the real sun audio device, and another one > > i did that for a while, but on my linux only one app can > have the sound card open at a time, so it got annoying > killing it off and restarting it. this way ajuke can take > care of closing the audio device when it is paused or stopped. > > either way the code has to be written. What I think would be nifty to see (although I don't use plan9port much, and am not volunteering to do myself ;-) would be to have all the filesystem operations get translated into 9p messages and have a server for accessing the native unix filesystem and servers for each of the devices that you'd want to access from plan9ports (ie. /dev/audio). > russ Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 05:21:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 05:21:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 409B163F33 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24DCB63E93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08653-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E1F863E95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] point2rgb and point2rgba Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:27:58 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <7871fcf5050131113724b79a68@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Does the current draw device penalize these operations so much? i believe so. (particularly if you're doing lots of small scattered updates to a largish image). say you've got some software which maintains its own client-side bitmap. for each rectangle to be updated, you've got to copy the bits for that rectangle into a buffer(*), invoke loadimage, which copies the data into another buffer (with at least 21 extra), invokes a write syscall (one for each 64K of data), which copies the data into the destination image. since the display can be in any channel format, and one generally wants to avoid code bloat, it's not uncommon to have the destination image actually be an intermediate image in a known pixel format, which is then actually copied onto an on-screen image. if you could get the draw device to create an image to which there was shared-memory access, all but the last step could be eliminated. i reckon this could speed things up a lot, but i haven't measured it, so it's quite possible i'm totally misguided. (*) one way to eliminate one data copy in the above scenario might be to give loadimage a "skip" argument (a number of bytes in the data to skip after each line). then at least you could do loadimage directly from the client-side image data. this wouldn't affect the anything if you're always blitting the whole image. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 05:22:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 05:22:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7148063F6C for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:22:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 369A663F23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08576-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B7FA63E99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so431192rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:21:04 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=i2svfdRykS6QWlPuEzLA8q69kojWBRUnnbGcV9JYAs9uWSjpzxtQYZFXZu3MZxDjwlRdQ7jqZvPBxiDwfI6uHXq8fK7aBw/JSl4aduqgPLq7cyM2Mx68DB5Qce0KbTqZgFhY8FdeCUbNrn4qdnrzzjOVQMpmWgL8MgE1iuFaPgk= Received: by 10.38.209.74 with SMTP id h74mr156277rng; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:21:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.69 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 12:21:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:21:04 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Tim Newsham Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <2f2448a71d0dbd4ba4954a288604df0b@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <200501311101.j0VB16Z05598@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > What I think would be nifty to see (although I don't use plan9port > much, and am not volunteering to do myself ;-) would be to have > all the filesystem operations get translated into 9p messages > and have a server for accessing the native unix filesystem and > servers for each of the devices that you'd want to access from > plan9ports (ie. /dev/audio). This sounds great until you try it, and then it's like you're living in this bizarre alternate universe where you have to keep traack of which programs are "9p-ified" and which are not, so there's no difference between 9 cat /etc/passwd cat /etc/passwd but there is a difference between 9 cat /mnt/plumb/rules cat /mnt/plumb/rules which is just weird. And then maybe you change the shell so it can cd into these directories-which-don't-really-exist, and then you can run 9p-ified programs while in those directories but not normal ones. And you can't run any executables in those directories, because they're not really directories. Or maybe you don't change the shell, in which case 9 cat /mnt/plumb/rules works but cd /mnt/plumb does not. I agree it's a great idea in principle, but to do it right you really have to go all the way and put the support in the kernel (like Ron and Eric did for Linux). And then you're way more system-specific than just writing a few lines of code to initialize the audio device. If enough of this kind of system-specific code shows up, then I will probably create a libsysgoo that at least isolates it from the rest of the system. But right now it's just the tty code in 9term, and the code in libthread but that isn't possible to split out. (Audio is not there, since Juke isn't in plan9port.) Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 05:23:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 05:23:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD7B363F7B for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:23:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 713BB63F0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:23:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08579-01-66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:23:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E296A63ED4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 15:23:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:30:10 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > have a server for accessing the native unix filesystem and > servers for each of the devices that you'd want to access from > plan9ports (ie. /dev/audio). that's basically what inferno does. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 10:12:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 10:12:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D812462A35 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:12:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC5CB31EAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:11:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06280-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:11:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 8363631EA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:11:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 2108 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2005 01:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 01:11:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 01:11:22 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j111BJq421735; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 10:11:20 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <05b7ca7e8285696ad011d8d8b359dc20@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 10:11:15 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] remove files in /srv X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hi, Anyone can replace files in /srv. Bad things won't happen if /srv/boot has been replaced by a malicious user? Therefore, how about changing '#s' so that only file owner or host owner can remove the file? -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 10:43:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 10:43:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E7FE63A26 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:43:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3854B63A26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:42:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09089-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:42:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D3FF63A18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:42:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <54c90b7a63d427697eaa553ffc09006a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 10:42:53 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed > | Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I think this is not supported in Upas. You have to add its support by yourself. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 12:21:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 12:21:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8767263F6A for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:21:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD2C563C93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20510-01-44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:21:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93A9F63C23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:21:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:21:01 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <05b7ca7e8285696ad011d8d8b359dc20@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >Anyone can replace files in /srv. Bad things won't >happen if /srv/boot has been replaced by a malicious user? Try: term% cd /srv term% ls -ld /srv d-r-xr-xr-x s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 /srv term% ls -l --rw-rw-rw- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 boot --rw-rw-rw- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 cs --rw-rw-rw- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 dns --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 dos --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 f --rw-rw-rw- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 factotum --rw-rw-rw- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 fossil --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 fscons --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 nfsserver.chat --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 pc --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 plumb.arisawa.199 --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 portmapper.chat --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 rio.arisawa.44 --rw------- s 0 arisawa arisawa 0 Oct 26 20:44 riowctl.arisawa.44 term% su alice su# rm boot rm: boot: permission denied su# echo bla | /srv/boot /srv/boot: permission denied su# cp fossil boot cp: can't create boot: srv file already exists su# Kenji Arisawa . From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 12:43:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 12:43:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A07B63E29 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:43:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80E8B63CEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:42:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21992-02-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51B5F63CA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:42:36 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so493812rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:42:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=mDSoPUVjCpdu4TT663ujxgDbiLyaNaS2D1nCYLljLYG3WS7mgp7SzSJkEKxUYyr/OsPLgmwsoEqUUNJOmA9oqX5WR1ysWb0vr/VUOWkTGpLoDz5HVnv+lFrhfQjC3YlceReLLrm3xUlK3Umnz2xJSuS/2Q5Uk7a9o3Rs4djFdrs= Received: by 10.38.15.72 with SMTP id 72mr122422rno; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:42:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.39 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:42:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:42:35 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs In-Reply-To: <54c90b7a63d427697eaa553ffc09006a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <54c90b7a63d427697eaa553ffc09006a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > | Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed > > | Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > > I think this is not supported in Upas. > You have to add its support by yourself. No. It is supported, and it works well. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 12:48:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 12:48:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8299A63E09 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:48:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA06C63D69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:48:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23851-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:48:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 2700763D35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:48:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 45398 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2005 03:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 03:48:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 03:48:21 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j113mLq463518; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:48:21 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <76195867b7c075504e92d249a17df2ea@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:48:10 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue Feb 1 12:21:37 JST 2005, arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > >Anyone can replace files in /srv. Bad things won't > >happen if /srv/boot has been replaced by a malicious user? : > su# rm boot > rm: boot: permission denied oops. you can surely remove /srv/dns though. what's the difference between boot and dns...? I got it: #s is doing a special treatment for boot in /sys/src/9/port/devsrv.c:/^srvremove . if(strcmp(sp->name, "boot") == 0) error(Eperm); I'd rather have #s only removable by hostowner/file owner instead. Would this change break something? -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 12:56:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 12:56:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BBD963E5F for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:56:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B320E63E43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23851-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:56:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3269E63E3F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:56:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so495526rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:56:17 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=LeWhe9BCM57Y3JgO0xnuN2wgXT+sq4Kijq5eTaiqL3wI9uen/MElHSxa7XW3sNLaYKn7eH05qIKqIv4K0tLWERq9sULdi5iXHKDjNzmSimNwrnQZMQ4H/JDxTFJrEu/loGFUer72zRVK3BNe/PuLLYwhG0N4VStO+uDCRXEzAhE= Received: by 10.38.79.48 with SMTP id c48mr211050rnb; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:56:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.39 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 19:56:17 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 22:56:17 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <05b7ca7e8285696ad011d8d8b359dc20@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <05b7ca7e8285696ad011d8d8b359dc20@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Anyone can replace files in /srv. Bad things won't > happen if /srv/boot has been replaced by a malicious user? #s/boot is explicitly unremovable. > Therefore, how about changing '#s' so that only file owner > or host owner can remove the file? This won't work well. 9fs alice creates /srv/alice as the user who runs it, but if the connection is lost and someone else runs 9fs alice, then they need permission to remove it and replace it. It's not at all clear what the right answer is. The users have to trust themselves in /srv. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 13:06:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 13:06:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3433363CA5 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7706063CA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24245-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C375963C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49480 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j11464q464824; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:06:04 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:05:59 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > This won't work well. 9fs alice creates /srv/alice as the user > who runs it, but if the connection is lost and someone else > runs 9fs alice, then they need permission to remove it and > replace it. They can post a new connection under another name like /srv/alice.username, can't they? There are many other important services now in /srv to trust users. I'm concerned for /srv/^(fossil fscons cs dns factotum) especially. # boot is excluded because of the special treatment -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 13:07:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 13:07:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E80B63EF5 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:07:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2967D63E30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23851-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DB4A63DF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <445eefa0258b2da0a9497a5f8be79032@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:06:08 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <76195867b7c075504e92d249a17df2ea@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >oops. you can surely remove /srv/dns though. >what's the difference between boot and dns...? Permission bit of files in /srv/* is only formal, I think. The meaning of the bit follows by the service program, not OS. Service program can do anything what ever the bit is. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 13:34:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 13:34:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71D6763F02 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:33:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B72163E8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:33:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24344-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:33:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDF4763E32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:33:27 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id z35so945136rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:33:25 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=YBocvswg/JcTz7D26wA3VMXCXgPzQAk7UsTy2zQC9EIJv0LOQu6fjIqUYFlbeTdgxnh1NhvVeowYnbZWfA988+qzUK0k4DyvUvSkmxcRdfK6a3QW92EKgS6O8uBuH/liEfSoumfIoUmqmEKcUSMI2rQkbdbEBJOHCOyq3Mldm7s= Received: by 10.38.97.67 with SMTP id u67mr274565rnb; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:33:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.39 with HTTP; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:33:25 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:33:25 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <445eefa0258b2da0a9497a5f8be79032@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <76195867b7c075504e92d249a17df2ea@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> <445eefa0258b2da0a9497a5f8be79032@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Permission bit of files in /srv/* is only formal, I think. > The meaning of the bit follows by the service program, not OS. > Service program can do anything what ever the bit is. That's not true -- the bits are checked when the file is opened. The real solution is to put directories in /srv and have a common directory and personal directories. But instead I made a smaller change and tightened up what can be removed. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 13:44:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 13:44:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C128963EA8 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:44:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73E1063E6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:44:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26282-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:44:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B921863EA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:44:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15cc4d61b9ec75c7277a026702d4cc8d@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 20:44:11 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bhcuqowfwriafnwjvdcyludwdn" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bhcuqowfwriafnwjvdcyludwdn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Would it make sense for cs to maintain the posted connections in /srv? Then only the hostowner has to do so. --upas-bhcuqowfwriafnwjvdcyludwdn Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from collyer.net ([216.240.55.164]) by collyer.net; Mon Jan 31 20:06:28 PST 2005 Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by collyer.net; Mon Jan 31 20:06:27 PST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C859C63DF6 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7706063CA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24245-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id C375963C79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:06:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49480 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 1 Feb 2005 04:06:05 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j11464q464824; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:06:04 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:05:59 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+geoff.9fans=collyer.net@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+geoff.9fans=collyer.net@cse.psu.edu > This won't work well. 9fs alice creates /srv/alice as the user > who runs it, but if the connection is lost and someone else > runs 9fs alice, then they need permission to remove it and > replace it. They can post a new connection under another name like /srv/alice.username, can't they? There are many other important services now in /srv to trust users. I'm concerned for /srv/^(fossil fscons cs dns factotum) especially. # boot is excluded because of the special treatment -- --upas-bhcuqowfwriafnwjvdcyludwdn-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 13:50:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 13:50:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A8AF63EE8 for ; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:50:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAAE963EBF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:49:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01205-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67CCC63EB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 23:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EB131712F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:49:52 -1000 (HST) Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2005 18:49:52 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <76195867b7c075504e92d249a17df2ea@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> <445eefa0258b2da0a9497a5f8be79032@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] allocb question X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm allocating a block that has special alignment requirements. I'm doing the following: Block *bp; bp = iallocb(EthBufSz + 64); if(bp) bp->rp = (uchar*)ROUNDUP((ulong)bp->rp, 64); return bp; which seems to work, but feels a little dirty. Is this the right way to do this or is there another mechanism I should be using? Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 16:00:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 16:00:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87D6D63F89 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 02:00:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CF9863D72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 01:59:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07925-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 01:59:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from al.aichi-u.ac.jp (unknown [202.250.160.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A21763DC8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 01:59:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3b447c77786671064c7444e6bdb3fca8@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:59:33 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] pop3 X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, My pop3 is something wrong after I rebooted my server. That runs in infinite loop if I try to get my mail with clear text password. ar% ps ... arisawa 13505 95:16 0:00 332K Ready pop3 ... ar% ar% acid 13505 /proc/13505/text:386 plan 9 executable /sys/lib/acid/port /sys/lib/acid/386 acid: stk() memchr(n=0x2000,p=0x38358,c=0xa)+0x13 /sys/src/libc/386/memchr.s:13 Brdline(bp=0x38320,delim=0xa)+0x5b /sys/src/libbio/brdline.c:29 readmbox(box=0x2e59c)+0x31d /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:245 dologin(response=0x7fffeb61)+0x11b /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:767 apopcmd(arg=0x7fffeb59)+0x39 /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:801 main(argv=0x7fffefac,argc=0x0)+0x15d /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:140 _main+0x31 /sys/src/libc/386/main9.s:16 acid: lstk() memchr(n=0x2000,p=0x38358,c=0xa)+0x13 /sys/src/libc/386/memchr.s:13 Brdline(bp=0x38320,delim=0xa)+0x5b /sys/src/libbio/brdline.c:29 ip=0x38358 i=0x2000 j=0x134 ep=0x0 readmbox(box=0x2e59c)+0x31d /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:245 err=0x33c50 pid=0x34c2 fd=0x3 d=0x4bf30 nd=0xee i=0xe1 m=0x37f2c buf=0x2f363232 n=0x28 lines=0x7 b=0x38320 dologin(response=0x7fffeb61)+0x11b /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:767 ai=0x33c60 apopcmd(arg=0x7fffeb59)+0x39 /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:801 resp=0x7fffeb61 main(argv=0x7fffefac,argc=0x0)+0x15d /sys/src/cmd/upas/pop3/pop3.c:140 _argc=0x0 _args=0x0 fd=0x0 cmdbuf=0x504f5041 arg=0x7fffeb59 c=0x2b160 _main+0x31 /sys/src/libc/386/main9.s:16 acid: Of couse I know my server reject plain text password. I cannot get my mail using MD5 charange/response. pop3 does not fall into infinite loop. /sys/log/auth shows I am authenticate. /sys/log/pop3 says nothing. I also tried upas/pop3 with -d option. The debugging information shows the last message is ar% tail /sys/log/pop3 -> +OK POP3 server ready <42e43b7c405786ef.29766d694ebdd862@hera> CAPA -> +OK -> TOP -> PIPELINING -> UIDL -> STLS -> . That comes "capa" request from client. What should I check? Thanks in advance. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 17:25:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 17:25:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A87263F0B for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 03:24:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1FFD63B63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 03:24:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15290-01-36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 03:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1575A63B60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 03:24:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 81A5072289; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:24:21 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <87cb016c9bd81d2cce16b0219800bf01@voidness.de> To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:24:18 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I don't believe Plan 9 is causing the problem. I just > manually sent myself an 8-bit 8859-15 message on > Plan 9 with the script below and it came through just fine, > at least using "mail" to read (didn't try acme Mail but they > should be the same). > > Probably some mail server before Plan 9 is screwing > with the 8-bit characters. The problem remained when I sent this test mail to the local smtp server But I found out, that all is fine when I move away my pipeto file. It seems as if /mail/lib/pipeto.lib introduces the problem somewhere. I hope to find it. Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 19:30:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 19:30:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A85DA63A1C for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 05:30:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 955D26399E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 05:29:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23292-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 05:29:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFBEB6398C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 05:29:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 5DABA72344 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 11:29:34 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <58218e63961d40d19c91d9e10f0be666@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 11:29:32 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87cb016c9bd81d2cce16b0219800bf01@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > The problem remained when I sent this test mail to the local smtp > server But I found out, that all is fine when I move away my pipeto > file. >=20 > It seems as if /mail/lib/pipeto.lib introduces the problem somewhere. > I hope to find it. Ok, i took a mail, made by Russ' smtp dialogue script, and did manually what pipeto.lib does with every mail. % cd /mail/fs/mbox/124 % cat rawunix | sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /' > /tmp/msg This file is already screwed. I compared to the original rawunix file with xd: term% diff <{xd -c rawunix} <{xd -c /tmp/msg} 21,23c21,23 < 0000140 a n u m l a u t : fc \n 04 04 < 0000150 \n < 0000151=20 --- > 0000140 a n u m l a u t : c2 80 \n 04 > 0000150 04 \n > 0000152=20 term%=20 0xfc represents '=C3=BC' in iso-8859-15 but sed replaces it by 0xc2 and 0xc8. Why? It should only hide bogus 'From ' lines in the mail body. Is sed allowed to replace 0xfc by something different here? Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 22:00:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 22:00:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6763D63F8C for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 08:00:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E997863EC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 08:00:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01828-02-45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 08:00:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DDBD63D2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 08:00:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6a1c6d93eadf8a463b1de679a505c740@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 22:00:06 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] pop3 In-Reply-To: <3b447c77786671064c7444e6bdb3fca8@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.2 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_21, J_CHICKENPOX_71, J_CHICKENPOX_84, NO_REAL_NAME X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Half of the problem is resolved. Mac OSX is cleaver enough because the mail reader use challenge/response even if I instruct it to use clear text password, if pop3 server accepts challenge/response. The following loop in pop3.c makes a problem. readmbox(char *box) { .... for(;;){ p = Brdline(b, '\n'); if(p == nil){ if(Blinelen(b) == 0) break; }else lines++; } .... } The code is unclear if p==nil and Blinelen(b) != 0 happens. I replaced it by for(;;){ p = Brdline(b, '\n'); if(p == nil) break; else lines++; } then infinite loop is stopped. Now I can get mails from my server if I instruct Mac OXS to use clear password. However if I instruct it to use challenge/response, I cannot get mails. I don't know the reason yet. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 1 23:09:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 1 23:09:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A5F263F37 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:09:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34F3863F20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:08:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07877-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:08:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B7A6663F0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:08:37 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <28e10a71ea11fff5210e30edd9d75602@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:08:35 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] pop3 In-Reply-To: <3b447c77786671064c7444e6bdb3fca8@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I said > >I cannot get my mail using MD5 charange/response. >pop3 does not fall into infinite loop. >/sys/log/auth shows I am authenticate. >/sys/log/pop3 says nothing. however >/sys/log/auth shows I am authenticate. is probably my mistake. The first command from Mac is CAPA and then pop3 server responds and nothing. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 02:12:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 02:12:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40DBA63BEA for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:11:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32BD363B31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:11:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26087-01-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:11:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47D1A63AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:11:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id B95C0723AF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:11:09 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <5d1294dbc2ec360ffbcdcc8fd86e829f@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:11:07 +0100 In-Reply-To: <58218e63961d40d19c91d9e10f0be666@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > 0xfc represents '=C3=BC' in iso-8859-15 but sed replaces it by 0xc2 and > 0xc8. Why? It should only hide bogus 'From ' lines in the mail body. > Is sed allowed to replace 0xfc by something different here? I don't feel good answering to my own mails so often. But someone mailed to me off-list and made clear that sed doesn't have to be able to read non-utf input. I understand that point now. Is it then desireable for pipeto.lib to deal with the situation? I am trying to modify it to fit my needs. If pipeto.lib should deal with incoming 8bit ISO-* mails I will put it as patch on sources when I finished. Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 03:27:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 03:27:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABA1763BEE for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:27:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6D1E63B1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:26:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06781-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:26:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7CAE63B27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:26:56 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so607807rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 10:26:56 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=C3KrZY8PYbeRc/TamdwykSeOa/glX4VUOl6E9PPnjSwmSYz9FoIld6PruSr0HQldu9aBbIveHfeuW+vWfDyI6j3IfTc6w4e+rIx6Ds7yGrjvcXcETTe1usx1v4DCc5sq7YgBa1oheKBP75fBNOSBLTYfhEurs1Spe8Y4mT/GUik= Received: by 10.38.208.8 with SMTP id f8mr85062rng; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 10:26:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 10:26:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:26:56 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs In-Reply-To: <58218e63961d40d19c91d9e10f0be666@voidness.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <87cb016c9bd81d2cce16b0219800bf01@voidness.de> <58218e63961d40d19c91d9e10f0be666@voidness.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Sed operates on UTF, so if you give it non-UTF (aka garbage) it replaces bad UTF sequences with error runes, which is what you are seeing. Probably the best thing to do is write a program that applies the transformations you want but works a byte at a time and is character-set-ignorant. Russ On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 11:29:32 +0100, Heiko Dudzus wrote= : > > The problem remained when I sent this test mail to the local smtp > > server But I found out, that all is fine when I move away my pipeto > > file. > > > > It seems as if /mail/lib/pipeto.lib introduces the problem somewhere. > > I hope to find it. >=20 > Ok, i took a mail, made by Russ' smtp dialogue script, and did > manually what pipeto.lib does with every mail. >=20 > % cd /mail/fs/mbox/124 > % cat rawunix | sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /' > /tmp/msg >=20 > This file is already screwed. I compared to the original rawunix file > with xd: >=20 > term% diff <{xd -c rawunix} <{xd -c /tmp/msg} > 21,23c21,23 > < 0000140 a n u m l a u t : fc \n 04 04 > < 0000150 \n > < 0000151 > --- > > 0000140 a n u m l a u t : c2 80 \n 04 > > 0000150 04 \n > > 0000152 > term% >=20 > 0xfc represents '=FC' in iso-8859-15 but sed replaces it by 0xc2 and > 0xc8. Why? It should only hide bogus 'From ' lines in the mail body. > Is sed allowed to replace 0xfc by something different here? >=20 > Heiko >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 03:39:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 03:39:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85E4863D0F for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:39:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3CB731E62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:39:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06784-01-52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:39:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E16EB63B60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:39:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:37:54 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Probably the best thing to do is write a program that applies > the transformations you want but works a byte at a time and > is character-set-ignorant. alternatively, a very quick solution might be to get pipeto.lib to take an extra verbatim copy of the message before running upas/fs on it. e.g. # save and parse the mail file cat > $TMP.msgraw sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /' < $TMP.rawmsg >$TMP.msg upas/fs -p -f $TMP.msg || exit $status and in fn spool: $BIN/deliver $RECIP $D/from $_mbox < $TMP.rawmsg || exit $status this does mean that more space is used, and that the spam classification isn't strictly accurate for non-utf charsets, but it does avoid having to write any code... N.B. i haven't tried this out! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 04:51:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 04:51:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE4E063D35 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:51:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A55E763AEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:51:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15425-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:51:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5221863AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:51:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([213.223.78.214]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <370823-17049>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:50:54 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c50897$55ed0dd0$d64edfd5@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:50:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu this might help to debug rune errors (well that's what it was written for): http://www.insultant.net/code/plan9/vr.c -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 05:32:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 05:32:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E89B563D45 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:32:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A02CF63AC9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:32:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21048-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:32:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00A3F63AC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:32:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3e150c50b648eee71367993586c7c474@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:31:03 0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > The real solution is to put directories in /srv and have a common > directory and personal directories. But instead I made a smaller > change and tightened up what can be removed. i've sometimes wondered whether it might be worth having the capability to have a non-shared /srv; e.g. #snew gives a new, clean instance of #s owned by the current user. it would be possible to move services between old and new by opening a file in the old #s and writing the fd to the new one. it would also be possible to access the globally shared #s, but perhaps only the hostowner could post names there. that way, there's no clash of service names when people cpu in; easier to implement than directories, too. then again #s is also the source of lots of useful hacks. just a thought. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 05:41:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 05:41:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF2FE63D4C for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:41:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70B1663AFE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:41:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21104-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:41:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 824B163AC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:41:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:41:16 -0500 From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <5d1294dbc2ec360ffbcdcc8fd86e829f@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-rnqcmfrnbcfovfvtkaogtwfuxx" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-rnqcmfrnbcfovfvtkaogtwfuxx Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This might help to change you umlauts into real ones :-) Sape --upas-rnqcmfrnbcfovfvtkaogtwfuxx Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=utf2latin.c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #include FILE *f; main(int argc, char ** argv) { int c, c1, c2; unsigned int r; char buf[8]; if (argc > 2) { fprintf(stderr, "Usage: %s [ file ]\n", argv[0]); return; } if (argc == 2) { f = fopen(argv[1],"r"); if (f == NULL) { fprintf(stderr, "Can't open %s\n", argv[1]); return; } } else { f = stdin; } while ((c = getc(f)) != EOF) { if (c < 0x80) putchar(c); else if ((c & 0xe0) == 0xc0) { /* two-char rune */ c1 = c; r = (c & 0x1f) << 6; if ((c = getc(f)) == EOF) { fprintf(stderr, "EOF in rune\n"); putchar(c1); break; } if ((c & 0xc0) != 0x80) { fprintf(stderr, "Bad rune %x, %x\n", r, c); putchar(c1); putchar(c); continue; } r = r | (c & 0x3f); if (r < 0x100) putchar(r); else { fprintf(stderr, "Rune too big %x\n", r); putchar(c1); putchar(c); } } else if ((c & 0xf0) == 0xe0) { /* three-char rune */ r = (c & 0xf) << 12; c1 = c; if ((c = getc(f)) == EOF) { fprintf(stderr, "EOF in rune\n"); putchar(c1); break; } if ((c & 0xc0) != 0x80) { fprintf(stderr, "Bad rune %x, %x\n", r, c); putchar(c1); putchar(c); continue; } c2 = c; r = r | ((c & 0x3f) << 6); if ((c = getc(f)) == EOF) { fprintf(stderr, "EOF in rune\n"); putchar(c1); putchar(c2); break; } if ((c & 0xc0) != 0x80) { fprintf(stderr, "Bad rune %x, %x\n", r, c); putchar(c1); putchar(c2); putchar(c); continue; } r = r | (c & 0x3f); if (r < 0x100) putchar(r); else { fprintf(stderr, "Rune too big %x\n", r); putchar(c1); putchar(c2); putchar(c); } } else { fprintf(stderr, "Bad rune %x, %x\n", r, c); putchar(c); } } fflush(f); return; } --upas-rnqcmfrnbcfovfvtkaogtwfuxx Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=latin2utf.c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit #include FILE *f; main(int argc, char ** argv) { int c; unsigned int r; char buf[8]; if (argc > 2) { fprintf(stderr, "Usage: %s [ file ]\n", argv[0]); return; } if (argc == 2) { f = fopen(argv[1],"r"); if (f == NULL) { fprintf(stderr, "Can't open %s\n", argv[1]); return; } } else { f = stdin; } while ((c = getc(f)) != EOF) { if (c < 0x80) putchar(c); else { /* print a two-char rune */ putchar(0xc0 | (c >> 6)); putchar(0x80 | (c & 0x3f)); } } fflush(f); return; } --upas-rnqcmfrnbcfovfvtkaogtwfuxx-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 05:46:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 05:46:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8FDB63B59 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:46:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AA736397D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:46:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24188-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:46:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEE53639B1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:46:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([213.223.78.214]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <375956-17042>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:45:15 -0500 Message-ID: <004401c5089e$eda9a460$d64edfd5@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 21:45:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > This might help to change you umlauts into real ones :-) if yer into troff this might help too: http://www.insultant.net/repo/plan9/ralph.c -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 09:00:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 09:00:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50AED63F4C for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:00:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DD5C63AAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:00:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12286-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:00:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B20A963ACD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:00:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.88.63]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <364503-29510>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:59:56 -0500 Message-ID: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:59:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] XP boot X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu rather than do some something irresponsible, i was wondering if anyone knew the XP tweaking to do to get XP to have a boot menu so i couid could boot XP or p9 off IDE. i did an ISO text only install. for extra points i have a 1280x800x32 ATI MOBILITY RADEON 9200 wxga card. thanks. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 09:12:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 09:12:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 92BD163AFF for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:12:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CC2B63ADB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11787-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B40D63ABA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so663244rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 16:12:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ez/dw4QL3PtlmPliT+R2Z4FbuFiBKGAKdHqaIri+UBbQtgZNS/V8vVBdec2/6eE8yEeEW+5BrGPRfZdBwOEYLf7/whfvSEj99MkD3Li4FZ2l2y03YPcGfOqKrE+N+IQREkL4qszD7DEDqb5FCpKjcylbG0oplaxiTXjAGiysYsI= Received: by 10.38.96.6 with SMTP id t6mr224187rnb; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 16:12:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 16:12:15 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:12:15 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu see /bin/pc/bootwinnt. it works for xp. On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:59:50 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > rather than do some something irresponsible, i was wondering > if anyone knew the XP tweaking to do to get XP to have a > boot menu so i couid could boot XP or p9 off IDE. > > i did an ISO text only install. > > for extra points i have a 1280x800x32 ATI MOBILITY RADEON 9200 wxga card. > > thanks. > -- > MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 09:39:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 09:39:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38BDAC6740 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:38:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 78BC631C84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:37:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14827-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:37:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BC5F3197A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:37:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:37:14 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Brdline X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, The following program falls into endless loop if we execute echo -n alice | 8.out Try. #include #include #include void main() { Biobuf in; char *p; int lines; Binit(&in, 0, OREAD); lines = 0; for(;;){ p = Brdline(&in, '\n'); if(p == nil){ if(Blinelen(&in) == 0) break; }else lines++; } print("lines=%d\n",lines); } I have been desired to have such a Brdline that can work even if we execute: echo -n alice | 8.out Current Brdline requires delim as second argument, and the worse the delim is left untouched *mostly* at Blinelen -1 We must replace it using Blinelen by '\0' if we want the returned value to be used as string. This makes program difficult if input data doesn't have delim. My imagination of new Brdline (or some other name) is: void main() { Biobuf in; char *p; Binit(&in,0,OREAD); while((p = Brdline(&in))) print("%s", p); } '\n' is automatically replaced by '\0', and '\0' is automatically appended at EOF. p is nil only at EOF. some function will be required to detect buffer full. if buffer full the next Brdline should return the pointer of the character that is replaced by '\0' after fixing the value. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 09:45:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 09:45:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 749FC63B09 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:44:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFEB76395C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:44:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14827-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:44:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D00031E41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:44:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 773C717148 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:44:23 -1000 (HST) Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 14:44:23 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] partition question X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hi, I noticed the sd device (devsd, '#s') doesnt probe for partitions itself, but relies on an external source for partitions. Commands like disk/prep -p and disk/fdisk -p can probe the disk to generate the commands sd needs to populate the tables. The /rc/bin/termrc has such fdisk and prep commands. What is confusing to me though is that I cant find a similar instance for cpurc. How are these tables populated in the cpu case (9load through the getconf call that devsd makes?)? Pointers to where in the code to look would be appreciated. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 09:46:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 09:46:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFE0163D0A for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:46:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B52F31E41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:45:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12286-01-90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:45:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66DD963AAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 19:45:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3fea294bf520c4b8ff519aaad23aae18@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:45:35 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: Brdline X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Please replace: > while((p = Brdline(&in))) > print("%s", p); to while((p = Brdline(&in))) print("%s\n", p); Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 10:07:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 10:07:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD4EF63EC3 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:07:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 924D963AFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:06:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17132-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:06:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3A1C63AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:06:36 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so669536rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 17:06:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=QzzOUndiE26CX2mHlROX7cuixE3wRl/+MBlpmQ3iodpIeplRLbFwqVjzqVQgsN92EHWav7YcMFiwToDXqbH9CEmjG9VgBPkamxrOC8/jvgSgIdn6BMqfC9DcvPDkyZSGNSV2GGmKmfZzh3O0vXwSMf+UJtWWk//BF7AXQRI0RNA= Received: by 10.38.97.73 with SMTP id u73mr98564rnb; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 17:06:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 17:06:36 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:06:36 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Brdline In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu try using Brdstr instead. On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:37:14 +0900, arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp wrote: > Hello, > > The following program falls into endless loop if we execute > echo -n alice | 8.out > Try. > > #include > #include > #include > > void > main() > { Biobuf in; > char *p; > int lines; > Binit(&in, 0, OREAD); > lines = 0; > for(;;){ > p = Brdline(&in, '\n'); > if(p == nil){ > if(Blinelen(&in) == 0) > break; > }else > lines++; > } > print("lines=%d\n",lines); > } > > I have been desired to have such a Brdline > that can work even if we execute: > echo -n alice | 8.out > > Current Brdline requires delim as second argument, > and the worse the delim is left untouched *mostly* > at Blinelen -1 > We must replace it using Blinelen by '\0' if we want the > returned value to be used as string. > This makes program difficult if input data doesn't have delim. > > My imagination of new Brdline (or some other name) is: > > void > main() > { Biobuf in; > char *p; > Binit(&in,0,OREAD); > while((p = Brdline(&in))) > print("%s", p); > } > > '\n' is automatically replaced by '\0', > and '\0' is automatically appended at EOF. > p is nil only at EOF. > some function will be required to detect buffer full. > if buffer full the next Brdline should return the > pointer of the character that is replaced by '\0' > after fixing the value. > > Kenji Arisawa > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 10:13:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 10:13:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D586463D50 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:13:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9078C63A6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:12:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20968-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:12:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2654F63A64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:12:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.74]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <368749-29521>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:11:45 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 02:11:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu see /bin/pc/bootwinnt. it works for xp. i see i have a /dev/sdC0/ntfs and there's this horrible XP thing called bootcfg to tweak it. /bin/pc/bootwinnt looks for /dev/sdC0/dos 'doze is such a wretched system. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 10:21:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 10:21:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BB1E63D0A for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:21:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B0AF63BEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:20:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20968-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:20:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF82663BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:20:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so671080rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 17:20:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WjBnGLxT7viy5ONJCACJpkL65Kl3pGJ0jN3b66/llVeqVP4KXuKEQMddPMRK4hN8l8W+RK6t1jyMkU7IrOnuAv31UvLrrPG54L5GzocKeFCSc0tjnRiJUxyvGAA3TJx6PSKwU/m2M/yiaCX03ClU1k3ZC+bdqFbdi4FWnpd8ed0= Received: by 10.38.97.67 with SMTP id u67mr33685rnb; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 17:20:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 17:20:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:20:50 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i think that if you edit the boot.ini file manually while you are running xp (just add the lines that pc/bootwinnt is trying to add) then it should work. what i don't remember is whether the nt boot loader can actually read boot.ini files on ntfs partitions. i hope so. russ On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 02:11:11 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > see /bin/pc/bootwinnt. it works for xp. > > i see i have a /dev/sdC0/ntfs and there's this horrible XP > thing called bootcfg to tweak it. > > /bin/pc/bootwinnt looks for /dev/sdC0/dos > > 'doze is such a wretched system. > -- > MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 13:43:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 13:43:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA5CA62A3B for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:43:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64245318A8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:42:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01319-01-36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:42:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B415E31885 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:42:27 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 58so492352wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 20:42:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=rr2w8B3mxsmUWMAJUzjbBKWMryIDx+I0A7hyPY4s9/HLJM4ehmzrGdr0ZFKipaZlFj+Kn75zotvLHWdSaFs/yRhpc7zkc/BroDyyQuvBUJ/qubLRn0W/93z7Jf4MNzEAfWKKRElTQvDYU2fXP5qTPvzwOxZz5y0dlZC7JzU8wDE= Received: by 10.54.47.67 with SMTP id u67mr13761wru; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 20:42:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.5 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:42:26 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 23:42:26 -0500 From: Joel Salomon To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 20:20:50 -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > i think that if you edit the boot.ini file manually > while you are running xp (just add the lines that > pc/bootwinnt is trying to add) then it should work. Trying to edit boot.ini can be a pain, though. Right-click on a "My Computer" icon, select "Properties" from the drop-down menu. Click the "Advanced" tab, then the "Settings" button in the "Startup and Recovery" section. Click "Edit" to edit boot.ini. Any other method fails=E2=80=94boot.ini is protected by more than the NTFS file protection scheme, and I don't believe there's another way around it. --Joel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 14:05:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 14:05:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C16CC63B6E for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:05:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B31131A54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:05:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01319-01-81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:05:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mproxy.gmail.com (mproxy.gmail.com [216.239.56.249]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D233731B73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:05:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by mproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id x71so36059cwb for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 21:05:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=EAiEV5TtIUJ+mfMptN5hnxbDOxAvw+PSlLx4DpOEWYFgDvsHPk59XT53wU+rAnllZS8ZR/gxrbL25khFuW3Wlt6iBhB2ATkRIMgGkIXsFTVAw3gc02r9gdUpyuU/Fl1M7rgVoi9UO+R3u2APxg+/301pxdTKa5Dy/OBmdlBGhMo= Received: by 10.11.100.10 with SMTP id x10mr149755cwb; Tue, 01 Feb 2005 21:05:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.122.6 with HTTP; Tue, 1 Feb 2005 21:05:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32d987d5050201210571b1be41@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 02:05:00 -0300 From: Federico Benavento To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Federico Benavento , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Any other method fails=E2=80=94boot.ini is protected by more than the NTF= S > file protection scheme, and I don't believe there's another way around > it. What about "edit c:\boot.ini" at the cmd prompt? --=20 Federico G. Benavento From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 15:51:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 15:51:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47CE963E09 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 01:51:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F37D63D2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 01:51:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09153-01-93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 01:51:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from drax.ntdom.cupdx (drax.cu-portland.edu [65.170.220.179]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47D0863D1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 01:51:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from vargas.ntdom.cupdx ([65.170.220.154]) by drax.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 1 Feb 2005 22:51:08 -0800 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C508F3.92C61188" Subject: RE: [9fans] XP boot Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 22:51:08 -0800 Message-ID: <7DD37218104E31429E79EB0BB136800E11C586@vargas.ntdom.cupdx> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: <7DD37218104E31429E79EB0BB136800E11C586@vargas.ntdom.cupdx> Thread-Topic: [9fans] XP boot Thread-Index: AcUI5NSYLDProZAAQmWDHC2ptI2cRAADgpDF From: "Benjamin Huntsman" To: "Federico Benavento" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2005 06:51:08.0446 (UTC) FILETIME=[92E4A3E0:01C508F3] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C508F3.92C61188 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Edit doesn't work right from cmd.exe... it'll crash on exit when it = tries to load command.com... ...Assuming you are the Administrator, you shouldn't have to worry about = boot.ini's security. In my expereince, the Plan9 option for setting up = the boot menu will set things up right in principle, but it won't work = when you select the "Plan 9" option. (that could be because my P9 = install was on a different HD) I've heard it said somewhere that instead = of having some sort of pointer (I forget what exactly... XP system not = present currently), you can copy the boot sector and imbed it directly = into the Plan9 section in boot.ini. Hope that helps... -Ben ------_=_NextPart_001_01C508F3.92C61188 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef; name="winmail.dat" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgkGAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEgAEAFAAAAFJFOiBbOWZhbnNdIFhQIGJv b3QAJgYBBYADAA4AAADVBwIAAQAWADMACAACADIBASCAAwAOAAAA1QcCAAEAFgAzAAgAAgAyAQEJ gAEAIQAAAEMwNEFFNDRBRTA3RDFCNEY4NkM2QzVCQ0JCOUFDNDI5AHcHAQOQBgAQCQAANwAAAAMA JgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAiBHGkvMIxQEeAD0AAQAAAAUAAABSRTogAAAAAAIBRwABAAAANwAA AGM9VVM7YT0gO3A9Q29uY29yZGlhIFBvcnRsYTtsPVZBUkdBUy0wNTAyMDIwNjUxMDhaLTIxOAAA HgBJAAEAAAAUAAAAUmU6IFs5ZmFuc10gWFAgYm9vdABAAE4AAOYAv+QIxQEeAFoAAQAAABMAAABG ZWRlcmljbyBCZW5hdmVudG8AAAIBWwABAAAARAAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAEZl ZGVyaWNvIEJlbmF2ZW50bwBTTVRQAGJlbmF2ZW50b0BnbWFpbC5jb20AAgFcAAEAAAAZAAAAU01U UDpCRU5BVkVOVE9AR01BSUwuQ09NAAAAAB4AXQABAAAAEwAAAEZlZGVyaWNvIEJlbmF2ZW50bwAA AgFeAAEAAABEAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A3QEPVAIAAAAARmVkZXJpY28gQmVuYXZlbnRvAFNN VFAAYmVuYXZlbnRvQGdtYWlsLmNvbQACAV8AAQAAABkAAABTTVRQOkJFTkFWRU5UT0BHTUFJTC5D T00AAAAAHgBmAAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAGcAAQAAABQAAABiZW5hdmVudG9AZ21haWwuY29t AB4AaAABAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgBpAAEAAAAUAAAAYmVuYXZlbnRvQGdtYWlsLmNvbQAeAHAA AQAAABAAAABbOWZhbnNdIFhQIGJvb3QAAgFxAAEAAAAbAAAAAcUI5NSYLDProZAAQmWDHC2ptI2c RAADgpDFAB4AdAABAAAAMwAAAEpvZWwgU2Fsb21vbjsgRmFucyBvZiB0aGUgT1MgUGxhbiA5IGZy b20gQmVsbCBMYWJzAAAeABoMAQAAABIAAABCZW5qYW1pbiBIdW50c21hbgAAAB4AHQ4BAAAAEAAA AFs5ZmFuc10gWFAgYm9vdAACAQkQAQAAAKoCAACmAgAAqwMAAExaRnWCqDP/AwAKAHJjcGcxMjXi MgNDdGV4BUEBAwH3/wqAAqQD5AcTAoAP8wBQBFY/CFUHshElDlEDAQIAY2jhCsBzZXQyBgAGwxEl 9jMERhO3MBIsETMI7wn3tjsYHw4wNREiDGBjAFAzCwkBZDM2FlALpiBFJGRpBUBkbweQbiclBUB3 BbBrIAUQZ2iDBUADUiBjbWQuDsCUZS4fMCAdECdsAyChBQBhc2ggAiAgDsCZHRF3aAnwH2EgdAiB kQQgdG8gF7BhZB6w/wNwA4Ee4CIRHzEKogqECoAlHzFBBBB1bQuAZyDqeQhgIArAZSEgIMAQwC5k JCEEACEwYSGQcixnJGMgAAhgbGQdghPgdmck0SGgHcFyeSSgBuB1owVABuBvdC4lYScEICUUEGMI cXR5H1AgSa0DoG0nwA7AcASQZQuALGNlJgAk8lALYG45+yAgBTBpIDECEAXAFBErgPkkQXVwJOMo QinACfAkkP8D8B+hFBEk4SQxBCAskR4UuQuAIHAFECpwBSBsKpF+YigRIIICIB2WILMmI2UtL9Bj LhIk0CIrAiA59iIrVR9QKCTwJcAiASaRZygwLOEFkGF1FBApwlDfK0ALgCWQB0ADIHcf8CAiNmEd MAaQZioxAjAgSPREKSmQJychIMALESDy9nMLcCHwcwNwB9AgwCTDzzOxNVI3oCHwb2Ym8iQyzzhy OGEAIDnScG8LgA6w6QXAKEkrwmcuASCwM7EzDsAA0HRsKWAfQVhQ7SZQeTmBHqBuLSEvYAeQ7zbC KRE2sj0QKSYENJADoP0FoHAnwCzHKPEl0SSgImD/H2AG0AmAIPIdABggPPIvIX8hkSrIQPIrki8x KEYpcUhHK2A49SDAbHBzIs0tFkIJ8CL0fUegAAAeADUQAQAAADwAAAA8N0REMzcyMTgxMDRFMzE0 MjlFNzlFQjBCQjEzNjgwMEUxMUM1ODZAdmFyZ2FzLm50ZG9tLmN1cGR4PgAeAEcQAQAAAA8AAABt ZXNzYWdlL3JmYzgyMgAACwDyEAEAAAAfAPMQAQAAADQAAABSAEUAJQAzAEEAIABbADkAZgBhAG4A cwBdACAAWABQACAAYgBvAG8AdAAuAEUATQBMAAAACwD2EAAAAABAAAcwwHvY3vIIxQFAAAgwiBHG kvMIxQEDAN4/5AQAAAMA8T8JAAAAHgD4PwEAAAASAAAAQmVuamFtaW4gSHVudHNtYW4AAAACAfk/ AQAAAFYAAAAAAAAA3KdAyMBCEBq0uQgAKy/hggEAAAAAAAAAL089Q09OQ09SRElBIFBPUlRMQU5E L09VPUNVUERYL0NOPVJFQ0lQSUVOVFMvQ049QkhVTlRTTUFOAAAAHgD6PwEAAAAVAAAAU3lzdGVt IEFkbWluaXN0cmF0b3IAAAAAAgH7PwEAAAAeAAAAAAAAANynQMjAQhAatLkIACsv4YIBAAAAAAAA AC4AAAADAP0/5AQAAAMAGUAAAAAAAwAaQAAAAAADAB1AAAAAAAMAHkAAAAAAHgAwQAEAAAAKAAAA QkhVTlRTTUFOAAAAHgAxQAEAAAAKAAAAQkhVTlRTTUFOAAAAHgAyQAEAAAAUAAAAYmVuYXZlbnRv QGdtYWlsLmNvbQAeADNAAQAAABQAAABiZW5hdmVudG9AZ21haWwuY29tAB4AOEABAAAACgAAAEJI VU5UU01BTgAAAB4AOUABAAAAAgAAAC4AAAALACkAAAAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAGEBEFkI4DAAcQAAIA AAMAEBAAAAAAAwAREAAAAAAeAAgQAQAAAGUAAABFRElURE9FU05UV09SS1JJR0hURlJPTUNNREVY RUlUTExDUkFTSE9ORVhJVFdIRU5JVFRSSUVTVE9MT0FEQ09NTUFORENPTUFTU1VNSU5HWU9VQVJF VEhFQURNSU5JU1RSQVRPAAAAAAIBfwABAAAAPAAAADw3REQzNzIxODEwNEUzMTQyOUU3OUVCMEJC MTM2ODAwRTExQzU4NkB2YXJnYXMubnRkb20uY3VwZHg+AL0z ------_=_NextPart_001_01C508F3.92C61188-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 18:19:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 18:19:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0A0663F24 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 04:18:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A614318C2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 04:18:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18907-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 04:18:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C94263DC4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 04:18:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:18:32 +0900 In-Reply-To: <200501311056.j0VAuQq05503@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I finally built up music database, and begin to use Sape's juke(7) program. Interesting, because it can show the lyrics of the song which is now playing. I copied many lyrics, such as Beatles, Simon & Garfunkel, Carpenters or Peter Paul and mary etc, and now using it through mp3! I'm using SB16 card though.=E2=98=BA Thanks Sape. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 19:45:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 19:45:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 619D76398C for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:45:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE0A531EA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:45:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21980-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:45:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1124031A2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:45:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] partition question From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:44:35 0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Some sd partitions are set up as a side effect of the bootstrap process. Look at mbrpart() in /sys/src/boot/pc/part.c, which is called for each sd while probing for possible boot devices. The comment says /* * Fetch the first dos and all plan9 partitions out of the MBR partition table. * We return -1 if we did not find a plan9 partition. */ That's why termrc does further probing, to find any extra partitions besides the above. To do the same for a CPU server, you would have to add something to the local cpurc. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 20:00:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 20:00:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32BDC63EF5 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 06:00:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 529F363B59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 06:00:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21737-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 06:00:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E9A963B65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 06:00:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 42E0872733 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:00:01 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <2dedc9fe7367d2d8a7f475a7f845ddc3@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 11:59:58 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > alternatively, a very quick solution might be to get pipeto.lib > to take an extra verbatim copy of the message before running > upas/fs on it. Ah, good idea. I will try it. I have a question, though, about the sed pipe here: In the usual case, where one doesn't use pipeto.lib, upas/fs has to deal with mails that have 'From '-lines in the body. There is no sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /' applied to mails before they get read by upas/fs. So, does pipeto.lib really has to do it better? How about dropping the sed pipe in the pipeto.lib at all? BTW: Thanks also to the other who posted code Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 22:47:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 22:47:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1BE4E63DF6 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:47:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAAD8318C9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:46:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02771-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:46:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 903F6318DA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:46:55 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so60986rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 05:46:55 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=mGCUpk+sISGrnVdY1HXuf+6xz7o4P9M+Bg/zdOCIU8Ago3AQj+SFDjW5ao59mu5ZDYlSWZFKUUU+NMHQZDWM/E7/Sn1pg8i2NBKmCJxu+WEcFActUDYhulsMza6VpkBys3Sn8VZuJSqPMhBwqwNJn19T2dqunQhu0tUc3eQ92VU= Received: by 10.38.11.60 with SMTP id 60mr178424rnk; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 05:46:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:46:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:46:55 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] partition question In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I noticed the sd device (devsd, '#s') doesnt probe for partitions > itself, but relies on an external source for partitions. Commands like > disk/prep -p and disk/fdisk -p can probe the disk to generate the commands > sd needs to populate the tables. The /rc/bin/termrc has such fdisk and > prep commands. What is confusing to me though is that I cant find a > similar instance for cpurc. How are these tables populated in the cpu > case (9load through the getconf call that devsd makes?)? Pointers to > where in the code to look would be appreciated. In addition to what Richard said, there are no disks on our CPU servers. ;-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 2 22:49:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 2 22:49:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD5A83198E for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:49:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5C09318FB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:48:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25583-02-71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 775DB318F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so61216rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 05:48:39 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=SZnr9PfJUv/um0/7BYQnRLEc5vJHi4cUGkpFDI0Z5kBRIs1XOYVUBwf3P/TSaZ6teR3T0BDjOZR/FDIumGCqFCd6OcOUlwUqkpDnJs6rWmVmxiQRm/BdzpABypGVJY1UInuzF70tJz0KqljTbNLiIldkBCOVZifjYBXj7rHwFLw= Received: by 10.38.104.47 with SMTP id b47mr65642rnc; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 05:48:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:48:39 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:48:39 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs In-Reply-To: <2dedc9fe7367d2d8a7f475a7f845ddc3@voidness.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <2dedc9fe7367d2d8a7f475a7f845ddc3@voidness.de> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I have a question, though, about the sed pipe here: In the usual case, > where one doesn't use pipeto.lib, upas/fs has to deal with mails that > have 'From '-lines in the body. > > There is no sed '/^$/,$ s/^From / From /' applied to mails before they > get read by upas/fs. That's not true. Upas/deliver and the other programs that write to the mail boxes do this tranformation. If you have lines beginning with "From ", then upas/fs will think there are multiple messages. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 00:00:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 00:00:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D42F31EA0 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:00:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 488D63189E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:59:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10882-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:59:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp3.server.rpi.edu (smtp3.server.rpi.edu [128.113.2.3]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEF2231893 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:59:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from 128.113.7.246 (albert-06.dynamic.rpi.edu [128.113.7.246]) by smtp3.server.rpi.edu (8.13.0/8.13.0) with ESMTP id j12ExT6Q030420 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:59:29 -0500 Message-ID: <16d2306991e96af8dee7ce5fb5e58eaa@rpi.edu> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:59:28 -0500 From: jpc@rpi.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-CanItPRO-Stream: default X-RPI-SA-Score: undef - spam-scanning disabled X-Scanned-By: CanIt (www . canit . ca) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] data recovery X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cummij@rpi.edu, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu does anyone have experience with data recovery companies? i have an 8mm tape with a tar on it that was written on an ibm about 6 years ago. it contains some data from a high energy physics experiment that we would like to revisit, but attempts to read it give only a partial read and then tape errors. i get the impression these companies are a one-shot deal, so i'd like to choose a reputable one. sorry for the non-plan 9 post, but there seem to be a good number of people here "in the know"... john cummings From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 00:43:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 00:43:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F42E17BE0 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:43:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A38417BA3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11052-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:43:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout17.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6788217B9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:43:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050202154325.BVBI29900.mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:43:25 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050202154325.JOVK9818.aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:43:25 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:43:22 0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] umlaut X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu mail -s umlaut 9fans Isn't the 'problem' that you are reading the rawunix headers which don't honour the mime character set encoding, and then processing them with sed which assumes its input is utf8? There are many solutions to this, most are ugly (use ape's sed) or a load of work (upas/fs to support a cookedunix file). My prefered solution is to replace sed with a trivial c prog in pipeto.lib: /* * upas/padfrom - prevent upas/fs from miss interpreting * the work From in email messages */ #include #include #include main() { char *p; Biobuf bi, bo; Binit(&bi, 0, OREAD); Binit(&bo, 1, OWRITE); while ((p = Brdline(&bi, '\n')) != nil && Blinelen(&bi) > 1) Bwrite(&bo, p, Blinelen(&bi)); while ((p = Brdline(&bi, '\n')) != nil){ if (strncmp(p, "From ", 5) == 0) Bputc(&bo, ' '); Bwrite(&bo, p, Blinelen(&bi)); } } From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 02:18:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 02:18:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BECA863620 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:17:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB63A31939 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:17:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23842-08-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:17:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C8F131930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:17:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.88.81]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <373268-14358>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:16:48 -0500 Message-ID: <007401c5094a$f8ac79d0$51587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Joel Salomon" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore><000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:16:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Any other method fails=E2=80=94boot.ini is protected by more than the= NTFS file protection scheme, and I don't believe there's another way aroun= d it. yes, it is a very strange file. i got some private mail from russ and af= ter finding boot.ini it was read only. turn that off and write it with notep= ad. [seemingly] randomly it would turn on read only. there is this command line thing called 'bootcfg' which is absolutely undecipherable, although i now understand something about the format of the file by tinkering. boot.ini essentially points at a 'boot block'. i'm a bit wary about [pot= entially] smashing a currently bootable system. this will take some thought. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 03:42:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 03:42:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F4F863651 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 13:42:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EB6031DA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 13:42:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01299-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 13:42:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from cartel.imaginatif.org (c207.134.168-8.clta.globetrotter.net [207.134.168.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40D2A31DA8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 13:42:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9485688eeb3c73f83c01c0623eac4622@imaginatif.org> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 13:42:04 -0500 From: fbriere@imaginatif.org To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] cmd/auth/login.c [broken] X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello 9fans, cartel% pwd /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/auth cartel% ls -l login.c --rw-rw-r-- M 354 glenda sys 3975 Feb 2 10:39 login.c in cmd/auth/login.c on line 165: fprint(2, "warning: running on a cpu server!n") to fprint(2, "warning: running on a cpu server!\n); thanks From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 04:15:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 04:15:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 986B0639A8 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:15:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3154D31E6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:14:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00312-01-94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:14:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D5E331E48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:14:42 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so122776rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 11:14:41 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=uMQu9cx5IIG/a7/q/1kSy6unr6wY4RvsLCsga22iBZWied6k3GlOAJ8ESQTz8LbAOFqgA8DEJyKwlE3VTmzEPX7rYwCuxh6rJVLZo5xsAo9frs671an0Y6vRLGuQ5C4legw/ZrvrBwCj6HUWcMsRBQMBNakeuZRPXBnd43slJcs= Received: by 10.38.208.17 with SMTP id f17mr388270rng; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 11:14:41 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 11:14:41 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:14:41 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <007401c5094a$f8ac79d0$51587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> <007401c5094a$f8ac79d0$51587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu it's much easier just to install smart boot manager and avoid the nt boot loader. =20 hget http://pdos.lcs.mit.edu/~rsc/mbr.bootmgr disk/mbr -m mbr.bootmgr /dev/sdC0/data russ On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:16:43 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > Any other method fails=E2=80=94boot.ini is protected by more than the= NTFS > file protection scheme, and I don't believe there's another way aroun= d it. >=20 > yes, it is a very strange file. i got some private mail from russ and af= ter > finding boot.ini it was read only. turn that off and write it with notep= ad. > [seemingly] randomly it would turn on read only. >=20 > there is this command line thing called 'bootcfg' which is absolutely > undecipherable, although i now understand something about the format > of the file by tinkering. >=20 > boot.ini essentially points at a 'boot block'. i'm a bit wary about [pot= entially] > smashing a currently bootable system. >=20 > this will take some thought. > -- > MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 07:26:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 07:26:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E750C673B for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:26:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B995763FA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:26:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21113-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:26:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B83863F8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:26:13 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 58so129614wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:26:12 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=MlS/pbPteuRYKeY8fJrR1xkcpG0AkImC4laUTaxlqYo/xCJZq/E3hYsNw1C1HWHkPfh8LUmMZr7/7+jjMx325cEuwn8GdD/tbUamvZQACVZLKD3xT+mY3C14u0tMmRDnr0NQoyjcNX2jFt1yJ8v5O71Zez0Ky77a0p/M0QGXotY= Received: by 10.54.29.34 with SMTP id c34mr351913wrc; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:26:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.5 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:26:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:26:12 -0500 From: Joel Salomon To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:16:43 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > boot.ini essentially points at a 'boot block'. i'm a bit wary about [pot= entially] > smashing a currently bootable system. >=20 > this will take some thought. Well, I checked the 9fans archives, since I recall getting help on this problem some time ago, and voil=E0! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Russ Cox Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 20:17:16 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] winnt boot method - hand editing boot.ini You need to copy the first sector of your Plan 9 partition into a file bootsect.p9 on your NT drive, and then use something like (this is from my Win2000 system): [boot loader] timeout=3D3600 default=3Dmulti(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT [operating systems] multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT=3D"Microsoft Windows 2000 Professional" /fastdetect c:\bootsect.p9 =3D "Plan 9 from Bell Labs" There are a few gotchas. First, make sure your 9fat has the right PBS before you copy the first sector. For example, disk/format -b /386/pbslba /dev/sdC0/plan9 dd -bs 512 -count 1 < /dev/sdC0/plan9 > bootsect.p9 will probably do the right thing. Note that format -b doesn't do anything other than replace the PBS code. In particular it doesn't format the disk. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 07:28:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 07:28:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76D1563FD3 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:28:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F07D663FA6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:28:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22315-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:28:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CA6C63F8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:28:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 58so129881wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:28:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=JEXnaMcQvHpbmH2eupFMs4lmsxNeOPvtW450vGFLumF+bW6LfcHguOk5Opvrh3V6y1gNWV5sY6+JvOCVL9vzOKXMYdWxttqEn+oDVxzyDzGsi7PPk/FVhGCvgDsYFJs1Au1W+jGLC8CWhmF5E/KaI3YjHhz2bjEWi4ixnhKpugQ= Received: by 10.54.44.45 with SMTP id r45mr51899wrr; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:28:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.5 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 14:28:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 17:28:06 -0500 From: Joel Salomon To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:16:43 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > boot.ini essentially points at a 'boot block'. i'm a bit wary about [pot= entially] > smashing a currently bootable system. > > this will take some thought. Well, I checked the 9fans archives, since I recall getting help on this problem some time ago, and voil=E0! ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Russ Cox Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 20:17:16 GMT Subject: Re: [9fans] winnt boot method - hand editing boot.ini You need to copy the first sector of your Plan 9 partition into a file bootsect.p9 on your NT drive, and then use something like (this is from my Win2000 system): [boot loader] timeout=3D3600 default=3Dmulti(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT [operating systems] multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT=3D"Microsoft Windows 2000 Professional" /fastdetect c:\bootsect.p9 =3D "Plan 9 from Bell Labs" There are a few gotchas. First, make sure your 9fat has the right PBS before you copy the first sector. For example, disk/format -b /386/pbslba /dev/sdC0/plan9 dd -bs 512 -count 1 < /dev/sdC0/plan9 > bootsect.p9 will probably do the right thing. Note that format -b doesn't do anything other than replace the PBS code. In particular it doesn't format the disk. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:23:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:23:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D21E639C7 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:22:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D327F317A2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25530-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:22:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BEB731784 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:22:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so208188wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 15:22:26 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=npDsOQR5zAOigJmd0sLEChTXV2liNAfxYVLNTCRO/lW5xW05I+ZaurYQCRbb24w5o0LUSyMOeQsvFGjDeA0Mbhd9PBC2FskhCozZmaYftm/V1eo73iuMLFZRx+vq6EOxYJb02VGCIK9L1rI2DfGKrU5k111xwCwuxgz5Q5Gi1CM= Received: by 10.54.59.30 with SMTP id h30mr114506wra; Wed, 02 Feb 2005 15:22:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.67 with HTTP; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:22:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905020215226123a9c7@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:22:24 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <3e150c50b648eee71367993586c7c474@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <3e150c50b648eee71367993586c7c474@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu later inferno's #s has all the requested properties (the #s in VN inferno is different). if a user binds '#s' he gets a new empty one. a named srv, e.g. #sauth, is shared and a rebind is possible. permissions and lots of details are handled differently. brucee From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:25:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:25:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F5723191F for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:25:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6A9A3191F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:24:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24343-02-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:24:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DB5C31A2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:24:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <361707-15413>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:20:03 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com><7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 00:19:59 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Well, I checked the 9fans archives, since I recall getting help on this problem some time ago, and voil=E0! well yeah, until you get this [translation for the tiny amount of french]= : \system32\hall.dll would appear to be missing. it would seem they [u$loth] have gone out of their way to make it impossi= ble. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:39:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:39:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E417C67C9 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:39:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F87C31EB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:38:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28319-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:38:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ALPHA8.ITS.MONASH.EDU.AU (alpha8.its.monash.edu.au [130.194.1.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80C3663554 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:38:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost ([130.194.13.82]) by vaxh.its.monash.edu.au (PMDF V5.2-31 #39306) with ESMTP id <01LKD5740BHW8Y5G0V@vaxh.its.monash.edu.au> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:37:43 +1100 Received: from larry.its.monash.edu.au (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with ESMTP id 534A180004 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 10:37:42 +1100 (EST) Received: from [130.194.3.169] (pc-949122.its.monash.edu.au [130.194.3.169]) (user ajft) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by larry.its.monash.edu.au (Postfix) with ESMTP id 210523C00C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 10:37:42 +1100 (EST) Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2005 10:37:41 +1100 From: Adrian Tritschler Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-reply-to: <007401c5094a$f8ac79d0$51587d50@kilgore> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Message-id: <42016445.6020402@ajft.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=UTF-8 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en X-Enigmail-Version: 0.90.0.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime References: <001e01c508ba$1e86d7e0$3f587d50@kilgore> <000a01c508c4$25f2d290$4aec7d50@kilgore> <7871fcf505020120421bf9ff8e@mail.gmail.com> <007401c5094a$f8ac79d0$51587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable boyd, rounin wrote: > Any other method fails=E2=80=94boot.ini is protected by more than th= e NTFS > file protection scheme, and I don't believe there's another way=20 > around it. >=20 > yes, it is a very strange file. i got some private mail from russ and=20 > after > finding boot.ini it was read only. turn that off and write it with=20 > notepad. > [seemingly] randomly it would turn on read only. >=20 > there is this command line thing called 'bootcfg' which is absolutely > undecipherable, although i now understand something about the format > of the file by tinkering. >=20 > boot.ini essentially points at a 'boot block'. i'm a bit wary about=20 > [potentially] > smashing a currently bootable system. >=20 > this will take some thought. The following (linux-centric) doc may help. http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/docs/HOWTO/other-formats/pdf/Linux+NT-Lo= ader.pdf OTOH, I use one of the simple boot managers, such as BOOTMGR mentioned=20 by Russ. --------------------------------------------------------------- Adrian Tritschler mailto:ajft@ajft.org Latitude 38=C2=B0S, Longitude 145=C2=B0E, Altitude 50m, Shoe size 44 --------------------------------------------------------------- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:42:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:42:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A942D639C7 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:42:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83BB631EB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:41:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28996-01-40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B58B3192F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 3A5067297F; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 00:41:43 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <9e563a7521e930ce523247c6cc73dbfd@voidness.de> To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] conversion of charsets in upas/fs From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 00:41:40 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > That's not true. Upas/deliver and the other programs that write to > the mail boxes do this tranformation. Ok. I finally made up my mind to use Steve Simons' upas/padfrom. Thanks to all who helped or corrected me. Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:58:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:58:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 559DDC67D0 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:57:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E0313BAAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:57:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28319-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 482CAB9D4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:57:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <30ca86da2ca3ed36cef431bf41d55a88@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 23:57:17 0000 To: bruce.ellis@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] remove files in /srv In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905020215226123a9c7@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>(the #s in VN inferno is different). no it's not! >>if a user binds '#s' he gets a new empty one. a named srv, e.g. >>#sauth, is shared and a rebind is possible. permissions and >>lots of details are handled differently. in fact, i was going to post something almost word-for-word! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 08:59:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 08:59:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06C5EC248 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:59:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94F60C1C4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:59:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00782-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:59:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (smtp.monitorbm.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 57B14C1C1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 18:59:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 9972 invoked from network); 2 Feb 2005 23:59:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mollywuppy.monitorbm.co.nz) (192.168.0.41) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 2 Feb 2005 23:59:19 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> X-Sender: andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz@pop.monitorbm.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.2.0 Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2005 12:59:18 +1300 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: Andrew Simmons Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > \system32\hall.dll > >would appear to be missing. This may or may not help: http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;330184 You're entering a world of pain son, a world of pain. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 09:05:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 09:05:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8042DC4C6 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:05:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 709DFC292 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:04:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28319-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:04:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E761C28A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <366696-23872>; Wed, 2 Feb 2005 19:03:42 -0500 Message-ID: <005001c50983$d17dde60$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com><7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com><7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com><000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> <6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 01:03:40 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > You're entering a world of pain son, a world of pain. locks and loads M1911 ... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 16:54:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 16:54:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA44FC67D0 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 02:54:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B19D2C67C9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 02:54:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01652-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 02:53:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFA53C67CD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 02:53:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8a6c32b4c646bf350fffe62401c9607d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:54:08 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-eqphgjsvtoakhwxtpnifqrbwjn" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-eqphgjsvtoakhwxtpnifqrbwjn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > I finally built up music database, and begin to use Sape's > juke(7) program. Sorry everone, I can't stop to post this.=E2=98=BA Included are some our mapfiles for Sape's juke(7) program\ Kenji --upas-eqphgjsvtoakhwxtpnifqrbwjn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable category { composer =3D schubert Frantz Schubert (=E3=83=95=E3=83=A9=E3=83=B3=E3=83=84 =E3=82=B7=E3=83=A5= =E3=83=BC=E3=83=99=E3=83=AB=E3=83=88) (1797 =E2=80=94 1828) work { path {classic/schubert} class =3D symphonic orchestra =3D Orchestre de la Soci=C3=A9t=C3=A9 des Concerts du Conserv= atoir conductor =3D Andr=C3=A9 Cluytens Symphony N=C2=BA 8 in B minor D.759 (=E6=9C=AA=E5=AE=8C=E6=88=90=E4=BA=A4= =E9=9F=BF=E6=9B=B2) performance{ Orchestre la Soci=C3=A9t=C3=A9 des Concerts du Conservatoir Andr=C3=A9 Cluytens, conductor recorded: Paris, 1950, Mono } command {number} track { Allegro moderato (=E3=82=A2=E3=83=AC=E3=82=B0=E3=83=AD =E3=83=A2=E3=83= =87=E3=83=A9=E3=83=BC=E3=83=88) time {11:21} file {Unfinished1.mp3} } track { Andante con moto (=E3=82=A2=E3=83=B3=E3=83=80=E3=83=B3=E3=83=86 =E3=82= =B3=E3=83=B3 =E3=83=A2=E3=83=88) time {12.10} file {Unfinished2.mp3} } } } include {beatles} include {PPM} include {johndenver} include {carpenters} include {simon_garfunkel} include {=E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C} category { composer =3D Bob Dylan Bob Dylan (=E3=83=9C=E3=83=96 =E3=83=87=E3=82=A3=E3=83=A9=E3=83=B3) work { path {pops/bobdylan} class =3D folk song Bob Dylan Greatest Hits command {number} track { Blowin' in the Wind (=E9=A2=A8=E3=81=AB=E5=90=B9=E3=81=8B=E3=82=8C=E3=81= =A6) lyrics { How many roads must a man walk down Before they call him a man How many seas must a white dove sail Before she sleeps in the sand How many times must the cannon balls fly Before they're forever banned The answer my friends is blowin' in the wind The answer is blowin' in the wind How many years must a mountain exist Before it is washed to the sea How many years can some people exist Before they're allowed to be free How many times can a man turn his head And pretend that he just doesn't see The answer my friend is blowin' in the wind The answer is blowin' in the wind How many times must a man look up Before he can see the sky How many ears must one man have before he can hear people cry How many deaths will it take Till he knows That too many people have died The answer my friend is blowin' in the wind The answer is blowin' in the wind } time {} file {BlowinWind.mp3} } } } --upas-eqphgjsvtoakhwxtpnifqrbwjn Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable category { =E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C work { path {classic/=E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C} class =3D lyric songs =E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C performance { =E9=AE=AB=E5=B3=B6=E6=9C=89=E7=BE=8E=E5=AD=90, Soprano Helmut Deutsch, Piano } command {number} track { =E8=B5=A4=E3=83=88=E3=83=B3=E3=83=9C (Aka Tonbo) composer =3D =E5=B1=B1=E7=94=B0=E8=80=95=E4=BD=9C words =3D =E4=B8=89=E6=9C=A8=E9=9C=B2=E9=A2=A8 lyrics { =E5=A4=95=E3=82=84=E3=81=91=E3=81=93=E3=82=84=E3=81=91=E3=81=AE =E8=B5= =A4=E3=83=88=E3=83=B3=E3=83=9C =E8=B2=A0=E3=82=8F=E3=82=8C=E3=81=A6=E8=A6=8B=E3=81=9F=E3=81=AE=E3=81= =AF =E3=81=84=E3=81=A4=E3=81=AE=E6=97=A5=E3=81=8B =E5=B1=B1=E3=81=AE=E7=95=91=E3=81=AE =E6=A1=91=E3=81=AE=E5=AE=9F=E3=82= =92 =E3=81=93=E3=81=8B=E3=81=94=E3=81=AB=E3=81=A4=E3=82=93=E3=81=A0=E3=81= =AF =E5=B9=BB=E3=81=8B =E5=8D=81=E4=BA=94=E3=81=A7=E3=81=AD=E3=81=88=E3=82=84=E3=81=AF=E5=AB= =81=E3=81=AB=E8=A1=8C=E3=81=8D =E3=81=8A=E9=87=8C=E3=81=AE=E4=BE=BF=E3=82=8A=E3=82=82 =E7=B5=B6=E3=81= =88=E3=81=AF=E3=81=A6=E3=81=9F =E5=A4=95=E3=82=84=E3=81=91=E3=81=93=E3=82=84=E3=81=91=E3=81=AE =E8=B5= =A4=E3=83=88=E3=83=B3=E3=83=9C =E3=81=A8=E3=81=BE=E3=81=A3=E3=81=A6=E3=81=84=E3=82=8B=E3=82=88 =E3=81= =95=E3=81=8A=E3=81=AE=E5=85=88 } time {2:27} file {Akatonbo.mp3} } track { =E9=9D=92=E8=91=89=E3=81=AE=E7=AC=9B (Aoba no Fue) composer =3D =E7=94=B0=E6=9D=91=E8=99=8E=E8=94=B5 words =3D =E5=A4=A7=E5=92=8C=E7=94=B0=E5=BB=BA=E6=A8=B9 lyrics { =E4=B8=80=E3=81=AE=E8=B0=B7=E3=81=AE=E8=BB=8D=E7=A0=B4=E3=82=8C =E8=A8=8E=E3=81=9F=E3=82=8C=E3=81=97=E5=B9=B3=E5=AE=B6=E3=81=AE =E5=85= =AC=E9=81=94=E3=81=82=E3=82=8F=E3=82=8C =E6=9A=81=E5=AF=92=E3=81=8D =E9=A0=88=E7=A3=A8=E3=81=AE=E5=B5=90=E3=81= =AB =E8=81=9E=E3=81=93=E3=81=88=E3=81=97=E3=81=AF=E3=81=93=E3=82=8C=E3=81= =8B =E9=9D=92=E8=91=89=E3=81=AE=E7=AC=9B =E6=9B=B4=E3=81=8F=E3=82=8B=E5=A4=9C=E5=8D=8A=E3=81=AB =E9=96=80=E3=82= =92=E6=95=B2=E3=81=8D =E3=82=8F=E3=81=8C=E5=B8=AB=E3=81=AB=E8=A8=97=E3=81=9B=E3=81=97 =E8=A8= =80=E3=81=AE=E8=91=89=E3=81=82=E3=82=8F=E3=82=8C =E4=BB=8A=E3=82=8F=E3=81=AE=E9=9A=9B=E3=81=BE=E3=81=A7 =E6=89=93=E3=81= =A1=E3=81=97=E7=AE=99=E3=81=AB =E6=AE=8B=E3=82=8C=E3=82=8B=E3=81=AF =E3=80=8E=E8=8A=B1=E3=82=84 =E4=BB= =8A=E5=AE=B5=E3=80=8F =E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C } time {2:10} file {AobanoFue.mp3} } track { =E3=81=82=E3=82=8F=E3=81=A6=E5=BA=8A=E5=B1=8B (Awate Dokoya) composer =3D =E5=B1=B1=E7=94=B0=E8=80=95=E4=BD=9C words =3D =E5=8C=97=E5=8E=9F=E7=99=BD=E7=A7=8B lyrics { =E6=98=A5=E3=81=AF=E6=97=A9=E3=81=86=E3=81=8B=E3=82=89 =E5=B7=9D=E8=BE= =BA=E3=81=AE=E8=8A=A6=E3=81=AB =E3=81=8B=E3=81=AB=E3=81=8C=E5=BA=97=E5=87=BA=E3=81=97 =E5=BA=8A=E5=B1= =8B=E3=81=A7=E3=81=94=E3=81=96=E3=82=8B =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA =E3=81=93=E3=81=8C=E3=81=AB=E3=81=B6=E3=81=A4=E3=81=B6=E3=81=A4 =E3=81= =97=E3=82=83=E3=81=BC=E3=82=93=E3=82=92=E6=BA=B6=E3=81=8B=E3=81=97 =E3=81=8A=E3=82=84=E3=81=98=E8=87=AA=E6=85=A2=E3=81=A7 =E3=81=AF=E3=81= =95=E3=81=BF=E3=82=92=E9=B3=B4=E3=82=89=E3=81=99 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA =E3=81=9D=E3=81=93=E3=81=B8=E3=81=86=E3=81=95=E3=81=8E=E3=81=8C =E3=81= =8A=E5=AE=A2=E3=81=AB=E3=81=94=E3=81=96=E3=82=8B =E3=81=A9=E3=81=86=E3=81=9E=E6=80=A5=E3=81=84=E3=81=A7 =E9=AB=AA=E5=88= =88=E3=81=A3=E3=81=A6=E3=81=8A=E3=81=8F=E3=82=8C =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA =E3=81=86=E3=81=95=E3=81=8E=E3=82=A1=E6=B0=97=E3=81=8C=E3=81=9B=E3=81= =8F =E3=81=8B=E3=81=AB=E3=82=A1=E3=81=82=E3=82=8F=E3=81=A6=E3=82=8B=E3=81= =97 =E6=97=A9=E3=81=8F=E6=97=A9=E3=81=8F=E3=81=A8 =E5=AE=A2=E3=82=A1=E8=A9= =B0=E3=82=81=E3=81=93=E3=82=80=E3=81=97 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA =E9=82=AA=E9=AD=94=E3=81=AA=E3=81=8A=E8=80=B3=E3=81=AF =E3=81=B4=E3=82= =87=E3=81=93=E3=81=B4=E3=82=87=E3=81=93=E3=81=99=E3=82=8B=E3=81=97 =E3=81=9D=E3=81=93=E3=81=A7=E3=81=82=E3=82=8F=E3=81=A6=E3=81=A6 =E3=81= =A1=E3=82=87=E3=82=93=E3=81=A8=E5=88=87=E3=82=8A=E3=81=8A=E3=81=A8=E3=81=99 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA =E3=81=86=E3=81=95=E3=81=8E=E3=82=A1=E6=80=92=E3=82=8B=E3=81=97 =E3=81= =8B=E3=81=AB=E3=82=A1=E6=81=A5=E3=82=87=E3=81=8B=E3=81=8F=E3=81=97 =E3=81=97=E3=81=8B=E3=81=9F=E3=81=AA=E3=81=8F=E3=81=AA=E3=81=8F =E7=A9= =B4=E3=81=B8=E3=81=A8=E9=80=83=E3=81=92=E3=82=8B =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81= =A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93 =E3=81=A1=E3=82=87=E3=81=A3=E3=81=8D=E3=82=93=E3=81= =AA } time {2:08} file {AwateDokoya.mp3} } track { =E4=B8=AD=E5=9B=BD=E5=9C=B0=E6=96=B9=E3=81=AE=E5=AD=90=E5=AE=88=E6=AD=8C= (Chugoku Chihou no Komori Uta) composer =3D =E5=B1=B1=E7=94=B0=E8=80=95=E4=BD=9C words =3D =E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E5=8F=A4=E8=AC=A1 lyrics { =E3=81=AD=E3=82=93=E3=81=AD=E3=81=93 =E3=81=97=E3=82=83=E3=81=A3=E3=81= 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17:01:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62ED2C67EA for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 03:01:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FEBC63FF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 03:00:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01652-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 03:00:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E690E63FE8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 03:00:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <362950-14340>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 03:00:12 -0500 Message-ID: <00b401c509c6$62ff4bc0$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8a6c32b4c646bf350fffe62401c9607d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:00:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu jeez, no Van Halen ... -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 18:06:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 18:06:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 26A58C67E5 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:06:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AED163B68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:06:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08033-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:06:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3D6963AF0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:06:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:06:36 +0900 In-Reply-To: <00b401c509c6$62ff4bc0$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > jeez, no Van Halen ... I googled Van Halen, and found I know no songs from them.=E2=98=BA Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 18:16:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 18:16:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91938C6834 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:16:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B7C6C67F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:16:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07477-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:16:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1D5EC67F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:16:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <359187-24983>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 04:16:03 -0500 Message-ID: <00be01c509d0$fb1b11f0$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:16:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > I googled Van Halen, and found I know no songs from them.=E2=98=BA i just did: http://www.van-halen.com i woulda had it soona, but a head crash ruins yer day. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 23:31:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 23:31:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D465C6981 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:31:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F7D263FAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:30:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22688-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:30:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (webhosting.rdsbv.ro [213.157.185.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 757D5C67F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:30:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j13EUghg010767 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:30:42 +0200 Received: from localhost (util@localhost) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) with ESMTP id j13EUgOR010764 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:30:42 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: webhosting.rdsbv.ro: util owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:30:42 +0200 (EET) From: "Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE" X-X-Sender: util@webhosting.rdsbv.ro To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello! I tried to make plan9 to work under qemu and seems thare are some problems with the ne2000 driver (8390 to be more exact). Can you share your success stories with plan9 with a ne2000 hardware card? Seems that I found one error in the driver and I want to know if it works with a hardware driver. Thank you very much! P.S. I will come later with more info about the bug. --- Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE catab at deuroconsult.ro http://kernel.umbrella.ro/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 3 23:56:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 3 23:56:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E67A563FAA for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:55:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0B0131848 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:55:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22863-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:55:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from 35260.ds.nac.net (35260.ds.nac.net [209.123.8.186]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7369E3183C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:55:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (h000423501cf1.ne.client2.attbi.com [65.96.212.55]) by 35260.ds.nac.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 202A812448B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 09:55:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42023B4C.3010405@village.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2005 09:55:08 -0500 From: Wes Kussmaul User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> <6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Andrew Simmons wrote: > > This may or may not help: > > http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;330184 > > You're entering a world of pain son, a world of pain. I tried to make this XP laptop into a multi-boot machine following those instructions (after having tried the usual *BSD methods). It didn't work. Once XP owns your machine it does not want to see squatters in its midst. Ended up sending the machine back to HP. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 00:33:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 00:33:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C4DA763FE2 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:33:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20FF063E00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:32:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03358-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:32:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A05DD63DD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:32:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ho.lucent.com ([135.112.29.4]) by plan9; Thu Feb 3 10:28:45 EST 2005 Message-ID: <7261abd02f76cbc1abfdcf97ef9fca26@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 10:28:42 -0500 From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <8a6c32b4c646bf350fffe62401c9607d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Sorry everone, I can't stop to post this.=E2=98=BA Frantz Schubert =E2=86=92 Franz Schubert cool. Maybe we should build a central repository for map files. Saves people a lot of typing. Sape =09 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 04:46:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 04:46:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0867C6900 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 14:46:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DABC31E77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 14:45:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25317-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 14:45:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout19.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D26FC3198E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 14:45:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050203194529.PIQA11211.mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:45:29 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050203194529.JVGA3760.aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:45:29 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:45:26 0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Can you share your success stories with plan9 with a ne2000 hardware card? I have used ne2000' before with success. Perhaps what you need is nodummyrr in plan9.ini, here is the relevant snippet from the manual page. ne2000 Not software configurable. 16-bit card. Defaults are port=0x300 irq=2 mem=0x04000 size=0x4000 The option (no value) nodummyrr is needed on some (near) clones to turn off a dummy remote read in the driver. -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 05:49:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 05:49:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5CD9C672C for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 15:49:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B327C300 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 15:48:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04158-01-80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 15:48:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15647C2FD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 15:48:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:44:38 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu apart from qemu does anyone see ne2000/8390 cards today? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 07:26:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 07:26:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A906AC688F for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 17:26:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 195D4317C1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 17:25:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10864-01-85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 17:25:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F09231753 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 17:25:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams004.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <373800-6162>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 17:25:44 -0500 Message-ID: <012c01c50a3f$4d71fae0$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore><6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> <42023B4C.3010405@village.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 23:25:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Once XP owns your machine it does not want to see squatters in its > midst. Ended up sending the machine back to HP. yes, this was my conclusion. i've seen these bastards break interfaces etc to ensure that their shit is the only thing that runs on it. lesson 1: go near XP you don't get to run plan 9 (unless you use external boot media). lesson 2: fewer and fewer machines have floppies. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 08:22:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 08:22:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A7D0C695B for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:22:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1C0AC6902 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:21:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21802-01-50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:21:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68A91C68B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:21:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so358430rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 15:21:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=YQipFCM4za9F3ryIznZkCQEjxN1YxkVOHXGPxfUW8zj0K2A/eMslulH7XbKjsYv5NRM3z26v49lJ0th5I4g5CD+m/THh3o7mZQDQ4b51WoD6Rq+dLySxfYQnCuqXFCNv9iKuOw8nRTKix71MVXklW7+fhuFoHbXWARAc0kxtEXc= Received: by 10.38.75.70 with SMTP id x70mr317160rna; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 15:21:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 15:21:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:21:43 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot In-Reply-To: <012c01c50a3f$4d71fae0$26ec7d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com> <7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com> <7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com> <000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore> <6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> <42023B4C.3010405@village.com> <012c01c50a3f$4d71fae0$26ec7d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > lesson 1: go near XP you don't get to run plan 9 (unless you use external > boot media). this is just not true. you can use smart boot manager, as has been mentioned already in this thread, and everything just works. you get a nice little menu at boot time, and neither plan 9 nor windows xp has to get involved. i've used 2000/xp and plan 9 together without external boot media for four years. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 08:29:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 08:29:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13106C6934 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:29:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25D05C6902 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:29:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17639-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:29:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2DE0C6900 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:29:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <376538-11309>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 18:28:53 -0500 Message-ID: <018601c50a48$1f043660$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1107382723.563392.231440@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com><7871fcf505020214266b4a46d7@mail.gmail.com><7871fcf505020214284509022a@mail.gmail.com><000401c5097d$b7a78be0$26ec7d50@kilgore><6.0.2.0.0.20050203125810.01b55c28@pop.monitorbm.co.nz><42023B4C.3010405@village.com><012c01c50a3f$4d71fae0$26ec7d50@kilgore> Subject: Re: [9fans] XP boot Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:28:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> lesson 1: go near XP you don't get to run plan 9 (unless you use external >> boot media). > > this is just not true. you can use smart boot manager, > as has been mentioned already in this thread, and > everything just works. russ, i'm just not 'feeling lucky'. customer 'service' in .fr is a bit of an oxymoron. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:08:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:08:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2ECB9C6981 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:08:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8B256399E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:08:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24435-02-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:08:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B47D23197E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:08:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:08:22 +0900 In-Reply-To: <7261abd02f76cbc1abfdcf97ef9fca26@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Maybe we should build a central repository for map files. > Saves people a lot of typing. Yeah, but the music data themselves can't be shared between us because of copyright... everytime this causes the problem, however, we have to keep the artists feeding money for their new work. We can share muisc database itself of course! By the way, I checked the name of Frantz, and found two Franz and Frantz. Frantz is not formal? By the way, my original /sys/lib/music/=E6=97=A5=E6=9C=AC=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C= file does not include all the 0x13 code at the end of each line. Those are added by someone else.=E2=98=BA Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:18:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:18:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD2D5C692D for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:18:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54FD2C6900 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:17:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B42B5C68FC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <373887-17449>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:17:24 -0500 Message-ID: <01a301c50a57$48ed4930$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:17:23 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu why not use the CDDB? -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:20:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:20:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 591CFC6969 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:20:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1B34C691B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:19:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:19:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E965C6910 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:19:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1cb1b0b04ce2f9acd483c3424a644a56@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:20:09 +0900 In-Reply-To: <01a301c50a57$48ed4930$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > why not use the CDDB? I'm not sure, however, I'm afraid it cannot use French, English and Japanese in a file.=E2=98=BA Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:21:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:21:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 669C7C6975 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:20:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 304A5C6944 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:20:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24435-02-65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:20:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45084C695D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:20:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <379292-15975>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:19:24 -0500 Message-ID: <01aa01c50a57$8fa2f0a0$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:19:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > By the way, I checked the name of Frantz, and found two Franz > and Frantz. Frantz is not formal? i've only ever seen Franz. brucee? -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:23:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:23:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB24AC6956 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:23:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B4B7C6946 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:22:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:22:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc12.comcast.net (rwcrmhc12.comcast.net [216.148.227.85]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF155C6944 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:22:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.34.50.194]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc12) with ESMTP id <2005020401225301400394jte>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 01:22:53 +0000 Message-ID: <4202CE69.4020102@abc.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2005 20:22:49 -0500 From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.3) Gecko/20040913 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) References: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> In-Reply-To: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: balajis@comcast.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Kenji Okamoto wrote: > By the way, I checked the name of Frantz, and found two Franz > and Frantz. Frantz is not formal? Historically... Franz - German Frantz - German & Jewish eg: Schwarz & Schwartz (from one who is neither :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:25:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:25:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58BC8C6956 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:25:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48A0BC694C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:25:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27935-01-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:25:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B110EC6947 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:25:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <373966-17452>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:24:39 -0500 Message-ID: <01b401c50a58$4b2a7280$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1cb1b0b04ce2f9acd483c3424a644a56@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:24:37 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > I'm not sure, however, I'm afraid it cannot use French, English > and Japanese in a file.=E2=98=BA you probably just need a filter to smash iso-latin-1 into utf-8. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:28:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:28:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75A8FC6974 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:28:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A28EC695D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:27:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:27:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 735B8C6946 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:27:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <16cd025757ca27017839af98c11f8230@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:27:52 +0900 In-Reply-To: <01b401c50a58$4b2a7280$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> I'm not sure, however, I'm afraid it cannot use French, English >> and Japanese in a file.=E2=98=BA >=20 > you probably just need a filter to smash iso-latin-1 into utf-8. I thought CDDB is not for Plan 9... Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 10:36:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 10:36:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0348BC698B for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:36:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1268DC6892 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:36:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28221-02-39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:36:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82568C6916 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:36:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <410542-15621>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 20:36:12 -0500 Message-ID: <01c101c50a59$e7496080$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <16cd025757ca27017839af98c11f8230@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:36:08 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I thought CDDB is not for Plan 9... i don't know the protocol, but i believe the service is free. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 11:02:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 11:02:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBAF42487 for ; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 21:02:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A447C696F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 21:01:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08772-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 21:01:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 061CFC696A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 21:01:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 11650 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2005 02:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 4 Feb 2005 02:01:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 4 Feb 2005 02:01:48 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1421Bq171536; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:01:11 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:01:08 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I thought CDDB is not for Plan 9... try: term% cdfs; sleep 10; grep cddb /mnt/cd/ctl | rc -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 14:46:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 14:46:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E98CC6997 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:46:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 495CBC6908 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:46:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25676-02-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:45:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0261C68FF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:45:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 06:45:47 +0100 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 06:45:47 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E2000158FC@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] netpbm X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu those interested, grablatest version of netpbm at: http://www.gli.cas.cz/home/cejchan/neXt/imaging/netpbm-10.26.1.tbz please, test it heavily as it is intended to be included in the next offi= cial release... thanks, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 16:01:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 16:01:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2B7C6925 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:01:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 895DB31E48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:00:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26495-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8358631916 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:00:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:00:41 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <41F879E2000158FC@stateless1.tiscali.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, How to unpack netpbm-10.26.1.tbz ? term% gunzip netpbm-10.26.1.tbz gunzip: netpbm-10.26.1.tbz is not a gzip deflate file term% Kenji Arisawa E-mail: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 16:12:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 16:12:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F496C68FF for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:12:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B46B63F85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28316-01-76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:12:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCD31C6789 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 02:12:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2da558543c76b64a1860878a04152b58@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:17:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > term% gunzip netpbm-10.26.1.tbz > gunzip: netpbm-10.26.1.tbz is not a gzip deflate file "bunzip2" rather than "gunzip". Is it not possible to use a single utility that recognises the nature of the archive? Enhanced Unix "tar" utilities all seem to be able to do it. I haven't explored how it is implemented, but I recall vaguely a discussion in one of the NetBSD mailing lists about trivially adding bunzipping to TAR a long time ago. ++L ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 17:07:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 17:07:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89887C69CD for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:07:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9606131805 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:06:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08461-01-48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:06:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15B57C50C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:06:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8bf0b69726fc7e71d578cd77033a53b4@collyer.net> To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 00:06:42 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: <2da558543c76b64a1860878a04152b58@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I've written a new (faster) tar and at Russ's suggestion have made it recognise the compressed tar archives. I think it's up to Russ whether or not it becomes the sstandard tar. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 17:53:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 17:53:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4940FC68F0 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:53:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0623C687C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:52:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12050-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:52:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93F1BC6870 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 03:52:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:52:16 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <2da558543c76b64a1860878a04152b58@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >Is it not possible to use a single utility that recognises the nature >of the archive? Enhanced Unix "tar" utilities all seem to be able to >do it. I have, but we should add more. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:01:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:01:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B8AD1C6922 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:01:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D17CC687C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:01:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12916-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:01:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C60F1C6861 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:01:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:06:36 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8bf0b69726fc7e71d578cd77033a53b4@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I've written a new (faster) tar and at Russ's suggestion have made it > recognise the compressed tar archives. I think it's up to Russ > whether or not it becomes the sstandard tar. That has _my_ vote, for all it may be worth. Maybe I ought to look at integrating the various uncompressors or at least providing a single front-end for them myself. But these things just disappear into a time warp as my time is too fragmented (bad habits) for me to conclude anything of any magnitude :-( ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:04:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:04:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E752C68C0 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:04:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BE8CBC6897 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:03:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12048-02-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:03:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B77EAC6865 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:03:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:03:37 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Mine is #!/bin/rc -e # unpack file ... # foo.gz -> foo in case of file. # foo.tar.gz -> foo in case of dir. # foo. -> DO NOTHING # foo -> DO NOTHING # # coded by Kenar # fn usage { echo 'usage: unpack file ...' exit usage } fn error { echo $* exit 'not found' } if(~ $#* 0) usage while (! ~ $#* 0 ){ x = $1 if (test ! -e $x) error file $x not found f = 1 while(~ $f 1){ switch($x){ case *.gz gunzip $x x=`{basename $x .gz} case *.tgz gunzip $x x=`{basename $x .tgz}^.tar case *.tar tar -xf $x echo rm $x x=`{basename $x .tar} case *.bz2 bunzip2 $x x=`{basename $x .bz2} case *.tbz bunzip2 $x x=`{basename $x .tbz}^.tar case *.tbz2 bunzip2 $x x=`{basename $x .tbz2}^.tar case * f=0 } } shift } More decoding methods should be added. And I rarely uses execept gzip. Therefore not so much debugged. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:08:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:08:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B22A9C6923 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:08:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 15132C68CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:08:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10670-01-69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:08:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A8DEC68C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:08:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:13:47 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8bf0b69726fc7e71d578cd77033a53b4@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I've written a new (faster) tar and at Russ's suggestion have made it > recognise the compressed tar archives. I think it's up to Russ > whether or not it becomes the sstandard tar. I also note that APE has PAX in it, probably an ancient version. I'm no fan of PAX and I agree with Rob that APE is inconsistent with the Plan 9 philosophy, but I don't think perpetuating obsolence is a great option either, so updating ape/pax may be worth looking into. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:12:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:12:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF468C6956 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:12:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93B7DC68CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:11:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12048-02-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:11:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AB87C68C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:11:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:16:39 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > More decoding methods should be added. > And I rarely uses execept gzip. > Therefore not so much debugged. I'd think the plumber could be drawn into this? bunzip2 < abc.tar.bz2 | {cd somewhere && tar xv} is my usual way to deal with this. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:29:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:29:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 134CF317A7 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:29:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 021C3317A7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:28:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12050-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:28:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BADC531780 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:28:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> From: C H Forsyth Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:31:30 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>Enhanced Unix "tar" utilities all seem to be able to do it. i dare say it can. cd /usr/src/contrib/tar; wc -l lib/*.c src/*.c ... far too many files 24449 total and that's an old version. it has got `remote tape access', though. i'd forgotten about that. there's probably a command language interpreter in there somewhere. plan 9's pax is only 9000 lines, and is a little behind the times: cd /usr/src/bin/pax; wc -l *.c ... 13455 total does anyone still use cpio or pax? apparently it's like that OSI stuff that never quite dies, however many stakes have been banged through its heart. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:31:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:31:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80840C6938 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:31:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CF0363ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:30:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12048-02-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:30:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A829317A7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:30:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <05aaf9cdf4b06d76dccbcc391b87f8c2@vitanuova.com> From: C H Forsyth Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:33:41 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I thought CDDB is not for Plan 9... man 4 cdfs for aux/cddb From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:34:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:34:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6986C6925 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:34:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E559C67EB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:33:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13411-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:33:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55B1D63ECF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:33:55 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j149Z9Wd006187 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:35:10 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:33:52 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 11:33:50 +0200 In-Reply-To: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 04 Feb 2005 09:33:52.0444 (UTC) FILETIME=[A383FFC0:01C50A9C] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > however many stakes have been banged through its heart. s/its heart/its black heart/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 18:59:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 18:59:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C13AC6956 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:59:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC64CC68CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:59:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13708-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:59:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout19.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16652C67E6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 04:59:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050204095926.BAMX11211.mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:59:26 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050204095925.THWW26737.aamta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:59:25 +0000 Message-ID: <256700e1bd7131da6808d4016b8643bc@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:59:23 0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) In-Reply-To: <01b401c50a58$4b2a7280$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > you probably just need a filter to smash iso-latin-1 into utf-8. This is tcs(1) isn't it? -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 21:33:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 21:33:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6B2AC6A0E for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 07:33:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0BC7C6881 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 07:32:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27962-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 07:32:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75E51C68CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 07:32:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <374ca28fab719d7acf3f3c29da9e8275@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 21:32:36 +0900 From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <41F879E2000158FC@stateless1.tiscali.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello pac, Thanks for your elaboration term% tar -xf netpbm-10.26.1.tar tar: mkdir /usr/pac failed: permission denied tar: mkdir /usr/pac/wrk failed: '/usr/pac/wrk' does not exist tar: mkdir /usr/pac/wrk/netpbm-10.26.1 failed: '/usr/pac/wrk/netpbm-10.26.1' does not ... Therefore I used fs/tarfs + cpdir Following your instruction in README.plan9 term% cp pm_config.9.h pm_config.h term% cd lib term% mk libnetpbm.a doesn't exist: assuming it will be an archive pcc -c -I .. -I util -B -D_PLAN9 -D_POSIX_SOURCE -D_SUSV2_SOURCE -I ../ -D_BSD_EXTENSION bitio.c /usr/local/src/pac/netpbm-10.26.1/lib/../pm_config.h:169[stdin:166] not a function /usr/local/src/pac/netpbm-10.26.1/lib/../pm_config.h:169[stdin:166] syntax error, last name: uint32n pcc: cpp: 8c 2219: error mk: pcc -c -I ... : exit status=rc 2216: pcc 2218: cpp: 8c 2219: error term% ape/psh # pwd /usr/local/src/pac/netpbm-10.26.1/lib # mk libnetpbm.a doesn't exist: assuming it will be an archive pcc -c -I .. -I util -B -D_PLAN9 -D_POSIX_SOURCE -D_SUSV2_SOURCE -I ../ -D_BSD_EXTENSION bitio.c /usr/local/src/pac/netpbm-10.26.1/lib/../pm_config.h:169[stdin:166] not a function /usr/local/src/pac/netpbm-10.26.1/lib/../pm_config.h:169[stdin:166] syntax error, last name: uint32n pcc: cpp: 8c 2364: error mk: pcc -c -I ... : exit status=rc 2361: pcc 2363: cpp: 8c 2364: error # It seems your help is needed. Thanks in advance. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 22:25:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 22:25:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FFD1C6938 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:25:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47B8FC6926 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:25:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29213-01-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:24:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (outside.cs.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8C19C691E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:24:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from amsterdam.cs.bell-labs.com ([68.44.64.161]) by plan9; Fri Feb 4 08:24:57 EST 2005 Message-ID: <8514978bc9b640ead7582e0f1b2dbe33@plan9.bell-labs.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:24:24 -0500 From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <5199ba12bc43c68db86dba41d1c4224d@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > By the way, I checked the name of Frantz, and found two Franz > and Frantz. Frantz is not formal? Franz is the normal German way of spelling it. But it does sound like Frantz when pronounced. I can't remember having seen Frantz. Anyway, it doesn't matter much, does it? Sape From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 23:01:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 23:01:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB775C6949 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:01:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F70131859 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:00:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03963-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:00:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77F9163B00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:00:44 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <374ca28fab719d7acf3f3c29da9e8275@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> References: <374ca28fab719d7acf3f3c29da9e8275@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <3dd3ac69e516af0fcdf31761e843638e@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 23:00:41 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Hello pac, > Sorry, that is thrown into 9fans. just my fault. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 23:07:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 23:07:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4786C6881 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:07:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7779BC6737 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:07:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00425-01-52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:07:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC74F63FE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:07:20 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <962546eea8ff5b57df991f45163235cf@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 23:07:18 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I'd think the plumber could be drawn into this? > > bunzip2 < abc.tar.bz2 | {cd somewhere && tar xv} > > is my usual way to deal with this. > good idea to plumb tar file. my preference is fs/tarfs. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 4 23:36:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 4 23:36:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2A1EC6968 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:36:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B537EC68A6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:35:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04775-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:35:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E0B7C6881 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:35:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j14EWBDe010798 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:32:11 -0500 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:32:11 -0500 (EST) From: Sam X-X-Sender: sah@athena To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <962546eea8ff5b57df991f45163235cf@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Message-ID: References: <962546eea8ff5b57df991f45163235cf@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> I'd think the plumber could be drawn into this? >> >> bunzip2 < abc.tar.bz2 | {cd somewhere && tar xv} >> >> is my usual way to deal with this. >> > > good idea to plumb tar file. my preference is fs/tarfs. In case no one has noticed, tarfs/tapefs is in man sections 1 and 4, with the only difference being that the section 1 variant documents zipfs. Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 00:24:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 00:24:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D57EC683F for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:24:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41A1E31EBE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:24:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10482-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:24:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 690A131A5C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:24:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14FO0o2021634 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:24:00 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14FNxKe028025 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:23:59 -0700 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:23:59 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] performance problems (fwd) X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I am sending this as the data is interesting for plan 9 vmware vs. plan 9 xen. Which is to say, I sure would like some people to try xen and plan 9: - free - faster - xen will soon be standard part of linux --> setup will be easy ron ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:04:23 +0100 From: Henning Glawe To: xen-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Xen-devel] performance problems On Wed, Jan 19, 2005 at 09:02:02PM -0000, Ian Pratt wrote: > > I think you're going to have to do a few IO microbenchmarks such as ttcp > and dd to figure out what's going slow on your system -- something is > badly wrong. Are you sure the same hardware drivers are being used in > both cases? yup. the only difference was that I didn't touch dumU's kernel config; in dom0 I already disabled the debugging flags (except magic sysreq), but in default domU's config they were still enabled. Overall impression from my newer benchmark experiments: - Harddisk IO is about 30% faster in XenU than in vmware ws (both accessing the same raw partition) - Network IO is at the same level in xenU and vmware, which is about 30% slower than dom0/native net io (netpipe, 2 machines using 1000Mbit ethernet connected via a switch, xenU and vmware bridged). -- c u henning ------------------------------------------------------- This SF.Net email is sponsored by: IntelliVIEW -- Interactive Reporting Tool for open source databases. Create drag-&-drop reports. Save time by over 75%! Publish reports on the web. Export to DOC, XLS, RTF, etc. Download a FREE copy at http://www.intelliview.com/go/osdn_nl _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/xen-devel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 00:55:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 00:55:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40B2AC6A13 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:55:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BE30C6935 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:54:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16308-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:54:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C47FDC6942 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:54:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:54:40 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i liked this when i first saw it and still think it's relevant: http://cm.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/intro_to_tools_philosophy_for_*nix_users/index.html whoever wrote it made a nice job explaining why it's pointless to hack tar adding z (gzip/gunzip) and j (bzip2/bunzip2) options... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:36:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:36:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5DCC6C681D for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:36:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C688563E16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:35:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16508-01-4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F79563DC3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j14GWF1i011451 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:32:15 -0500 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:32:15 -0500 (EST) From: Sam X-X-Sender: sah@athena To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] rc internals X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Can anyone provide pointers to (or a short description of) how rc works internally? I'm looking into a bug in the p9p rc that pops up on my freebsd machine. Sometimes subshells don't return what they ought (or so it currently seems). http://www.coraid.com/misc/rcfailure Cheers, Sam From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:43:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:43:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C9A9C68F3 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:43:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EAC8C674A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:43:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16367-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:43:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 552FD63FED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:43:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.224.150) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2005 17:54:08 +0100 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j14GhCiN018531 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:43:13 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8-Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id QAA01145 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:43:12 GMT Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:43:12 +0000 From: Derek Fawcus To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu Message-ID: <20050204164312.D27080@mrwint.cisco.com> References: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net>; from forsyth@terzarima.net on Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000, Charles Forsyth wrote: > apart from qemu does anyone see ne2000/8390 cards today? Well I think I've got a WD80[01]3 floating around here somewhere... DF From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:44:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:44:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91C93C6961 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77BAEC674A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21699-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BEA2C6717 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.224.150) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2005 17:55:13 +0100 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j14GiJiN018798 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:44:19 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8-Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id QAA01181 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:44:18 GMT Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:44:18 +0000 From: Derek Fawcus To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu Message-ID: <20050204164418.E27080@mrwint.cisco.com> References: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net>; from forsyth@terzarima.net on Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000, Charles Forsyth wrote: > apart from qemu does anyone see ne2000/8390 cards today? anyway... can't you still get bastardised PCI cards which are a NE200 at heart? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:48:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:48:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A97AFC6935 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:48:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2F5363A8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:48:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16367-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:48:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 220E463A0F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:48:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.224.150) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2005 17:58:52 +0100 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j14GlviN019755 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:47:58 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8-Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id QAA01543 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:47:57 GMT Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:47:57 +0000 From: Derek Fawcus To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Message-ID: <20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com> References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com>; from forsyth@vitanuova.com on Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 09:31:30AM +0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, Feb 04, 2005 at 09:31:30AM +0000, C H Forsyth wrote: > does anyone still use cpio or pax? apparently Linux distributions... At heart the archive inside a .rpm file is in a cpio varient, there is even a rpm2cpio filter. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:49:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:49:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F15BC697B for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:49:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B19FF63A8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:49:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21699-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:49:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF7696399E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:49:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14GnCuI003165 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:49:12 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14GnC5Y002490 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:49:12 -0700 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:49:12 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com> Message-ID: References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> <20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, Derek Fawcus wrote: > Linux distributions... At heart the archive inside a .rpm > file is in a cpio varient, there is even a rpm2cpio filter. linux initrd are now cpio archives. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:53:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:53:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CEF6C6990 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:53:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97D57C6847 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:52:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21882-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:52:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E743931886 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:52:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so482503rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 08:52:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=D4tHEJRzJl1X2qlWr3g3acDWU/CFmXml6U7AWGMasiGUp13HCnRsMnaxHs5ZoYBmOKR8VF1RAKsRI1zvbybh+YgYPjUEhuCFEU3MvsAhRkvLnY3vQPqRm4bQZ1uQtDt/coy218yrsiuiLrH0F/NSBv0AdltPSLdnZvvYfXhF8rg= Received: by 10.38.97.13 with SMTP id u13mr457092rnb; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 08:52:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:52:44 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:52:44 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] rc internals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I'm looking into a bug in the p9p rc that pops up > on my freebsd machine. Sometimes subshells don't > return what they ought (or so it currently seems). A few others have reported that bug too. Your trace is helpful. I didn't even know about rc -r. Try putting print("notifyf pid %d: %s\n", getpid(), s); at the top of notifyf. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:57:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:57:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5992C6994 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:57:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA4026399E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16367-01-48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:56:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03CF731886 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:56:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:50:15 +0000 In-Reply-To: <20050204164418.E27080@mrwint.cisco.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-nvzwfemkjzeskyqrbmyyoisjer" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-nvzwfemkjzeskyqrbmyyoisjer Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit that's more what i was wondering, not whether people had old ISA ne2000s in a box somewhere --upas-nvzwfemkjzeskyqrbmyyoisjer Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Feb 4 16:44:41 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B4A5C681D for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77BAEC674A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21699-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BEA2C6717 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:44:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (144.254.224.150) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2005 17:55:13 +0100 X-BrightmailFiltered: true X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id j14GiJiN018798 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:44:19 +0100 (MET) Received: (from dfawcus@localhost) by cisco.com (8.8.8-Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) id QAA01181 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:44:18 GMT Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:44:18 +0000 From: Derek Fawcus To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu Message-ID: <20050204164418.E27080@mrwint.cisco.com> References: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0.1i In-Reply-To: <72d3e22300787b121205d76d5288c374@terzarima.net>; from forsyth@terzarima.net on Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu On Thu, Feb 03, 2005 at 08:44:38PM +0000, Charles Forsyth wrote: > apart from qemu does anyone see ne2000/8390 cards today? anyway... can't you still get bastardised PCI cards which are a NE200 at heart? --upas-nvzwfemkjzeskyqrbmyyoisjer-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 01:58:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 01:58:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BE41C69B1 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:58:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0ACF7C687B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:58:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16367-01-51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:58:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66877C6847 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:58:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0d50f850a10546807fd1e87bdb6a83f6@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:52:17 +0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> Linux distributions... At heart the archive inside a .rpm >> file is in a cpio varient, there is even a rpm2cpio filter. >linux initrd are now cpio archives. i see. clearly stakes didn't work on that one! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 06:49:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 06:49:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4BBEC69E6 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:49:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 102FFC1A8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:48:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20725-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 900E2C181 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams004.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <377424-20758>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:38:27 -0500 Message-ID: <003301c50b01$d91b3940$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8bf0b69726fc7e71d578cd77033a53b4@collyer.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:38:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I've written a new (faster) tar and at Russ's suggestion have made it > recognise the compressed tar archives. i'm opposed. compress/uncompress programs should do that. tar should tar. or write a script that uses file etc and does the right thing. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 07:00:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 07:00:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D84AC69AB for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:00:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43A31C683F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:59:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25828-01-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:59:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC48DC6811 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:59:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <378760-14702>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 16:45:48 -0500 Message-ID: <007101c50b02$e2d00190$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> <20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:45:44 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > does anyone still use cpio or pax? apparently cpio should be dead by now -- horrible thing. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 07:02:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 07:02:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0325963AC0 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:02:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCAE6C4D2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:02:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25828-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:02:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F048C4C4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:02:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14M2AJs016978 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 15:02:10 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j14M29kT031140 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 15:02:09 -0700 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 15:02:09 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <007101c50b02$e2d00190$26ec7d50@kilgore> Message-ID: References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> <20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com> <007101c50b02$e2d00190$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 4 Feb 2005, boyd, rounin wrote: > cpio should be dead by now -- horrible thing. it will live forever. No file format ever dies. Just look at SREC! ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 07:10:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 07:10:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B73EC695E for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:10:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0D6363A30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:09:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20641-01-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 853CB63904 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.236.38]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <413562-9323>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:08:28 -0500 Message-ID: <00a901c50b06$0ea6aa00$26ec7d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com><20050204164757.F27080@mrwint.cisco.com><007101c50b02$e2d00190$26ec7d50@kilgore> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 23:08:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > it will live forever. No file format ever dies. Just look at SREC! yuk, if you mean S-records. gawd, i remember burning EPROMs with those. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 09:22:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 09:22:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62694C6A68 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 19:22:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E81BC69E4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 19:21:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06333-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 19:21:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 656E6C69DD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 19:21:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] ne2000 (8390) driver not works under qemu From: Brantley Coile Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 19:17:58 -0500 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > that's more what i was wondering, not whether people > had old ISA ne2000s in a box somewhere If you mean a cardboard box, I think we do. If you mean in a running system that still has ISA, I don't think we do. Our last system with ISA was the last SCSI Ken fs we ran. Long replaced by ATA drives. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 10:36:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 10:36:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6A42C6AB5 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:35:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AD19C6A05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09341-01-49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:35:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD63163BFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:35:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <96fa1b48edef3f254b346628ac2174d8@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:35:24 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: <003301c50b01$d91b3940$26ec7d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Russ requested recognising compressed archives by name (e.g., *.tgz) when extracting, and creating compressed archives under `rz' key-letters, with the compressor determined by the archive name. It doesn't use a different key-letter (option) for each compression scheme. It's table-driven and just runs the appropriate compressor or decompressor. We've all got shell scripts to do this sort of thing, but dealing with compressed archives is a common case and I don't see much harm in having tar initiate one end of a pipeline internally rather than requiring the user to do it externally. My tar.c is 994 lines currently, a little bigger than /sys/src/cmd/tar.c at 795 lines. It looks like 102 lines are devoted to dealing with compressed archives. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 10:42:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 10:42:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F56BC6893 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:42:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83AFAC672E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:41:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11042-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:41:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20EFFC6723 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:41:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 18:41:47 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <96fa1b48edef3f254b346628ac2174d8@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > My tar.c is 994 lines currently, a little bigger than > /sys/src/cmd/tar.c at 795 lines. It looks like 102 lines are devoted > to dealing with compressed archives. how about the 128-character name limit which gnu tar has extensions for? e.g. (original p9 tar): plan9% touch `{perl -e 'print "A"x130'} plan9% tar cv AA* tar: name too long for tar header: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA plan9% From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 10:46:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 10:46:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8512C6A28 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:46:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44599C676A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:45:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08970-01-90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:45:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DDDB5C6755 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:45:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:45:49 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu My tar creates POSIX "ustar" archives by default, which can handle names up to 255 bytes as long as they can be split at a `/' into two strings, the first 155 or fewer bytes long and the second 100 or fewer bytes long. It also recognises "ustar" archives automatically when reading archives, as does the standard tar. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 10:48:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 10:48:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3155CC6A13 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:48:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C96D8C6860 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:47:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08970-01-93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:47:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7129DC6846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:47:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9b5e3b95121a96f97760d974a4b582a0@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:47:55 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I should add that names are split only if necessary when writing "ustar" archives, so "ustar" archives containing only names 100 or fewer bytes long can be read with no problem by old tars. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 15:19:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 15:19:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8139C69F7 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 01:19:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30D3363F1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 01:19:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29067-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 01:19:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A9BC63F03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 01:19:05 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so429565wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 22:19:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=R7vqVta9aIUS/td6uPf1CEzsKc/rYhO6FCctwyDjbV4xlJmKGeOJcoC6r8zdOWQ77bjkBIyo52edZ9IiIyUP0tb3er/w2VhdbgwWegdoQGVj4UoYio4DKAgeOCPByJWmGGR6X1ocODjReYhNZ/VcqwAfNz0B0Q7QI4t+6Tkcs5E= Received: by 10.54.59.37 with SMTP id h37mr338183wra; Fri, 04 Feb 2005 22:19:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.67 with HTTP; Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:19:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d19050204221949064d3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 17:19:00 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm In-Reply-To: <003301c50b01$d91b3940$26ec7d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8bf0b69726fc7e71d578cd77033a53b4@collyer.net> <003301c50b01$d91b3940$26ec7d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Respect Doug. Pipes are your friend. Or throw emacs into tar. I'm sure that's not out of line with "don't use pipes". brucee On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:38:17 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > > I've written a new (faster) tar and at Russ's suggestion have made it > > recognise the compressed tar archives. > > i'm opposed. compress/uncompress programs should do that. > > tar should tar. > > or write a script that uses file etc and does the right thing. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 19:05:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 19:05:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EACA5C6A85 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:05:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22457C6865 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:05:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08166-01-96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:05:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [82.149.227.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E036C6860 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:05:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 22753 invoked by uid 66); 5 Feb 2005 10:05:25 -0000 Received: (qmail 13226 invoked by uid 0); 5 Feb 2005 10:04:49 -0000 Received: from crn.mteege.de (192.168.153.15) by 0 with SMTP; 5 Feb 2005 10:04:49 -0000 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:04:20 0000 From: Matthias Teege MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] redirect fossil console output to seriell con X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Moin, I've hooked up a matrix printer to the serial port of my cpu/auth server. Works great and I get the console messages on paper. Now I try to redirect the output of the fossil console to the printer and run: srv -p fscmd (on fscons) and aux/clog /srv/fscons /dev/eia0 on the cpu/auth server. Works to. Is there a better way to get to fossil output to the seriell printer? How do I redirect other logs to the printer (like /sys/log/auth)? Matthias From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 19:17:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 19:17:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FCD8C697B for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:17:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20136C001 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:17:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09678-01-36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:17:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E464DBF13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:17:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] redirect fossil console output to seriell con From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:16:41 0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > How do I redirect other logs to the printer (like > /sys/log/auth)? What about 'tail -f /sys/log/auth >/dev/eia0' ? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 20:52:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 20:52:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2760FC6AF1 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 06:52:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 00FF4C6A0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 06:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13979-01-39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 06:52:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 973AFC6A09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 06:52:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] redirect fossil console output to seriell con From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:51:35 0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I said: > What about 'tail -f /sys/log/auth >/dev/eia0' ? But of course this is a stupid idea because it won't multiplex more than one log stream - you'll just get output jumbled together. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 21:52:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 21:52:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D46AFC6AC8 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:52:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19801C6A41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19254-01-36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21050C6A35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.29] (port=1262 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1CxPPX-0003Ad-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 15:51:40 +0300 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:41:05 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1112547546.20050205144105@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] groups and names X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans, As described in FOSSILCONS(8) default /adm/users for fossil is: adm:adm:adm:sys none:none:: noworld:noworld:: sys:sys:: glenda:glenda:glenda: Most of system files owned by user sys in group sys, but what do adm? And why sys belong to group Adm? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 21:52:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 21:52:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6188BC6A35 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:52:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43335C6A35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18970-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC7FEC6A40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 07:51:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.29] (port=1262 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1CxPPa-0003Ad-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 15:51:43 +0300 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:52:00 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1263202156.20050205145200@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] localization X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans, At least I configured my vmware network and can send patches, i am already sended ukrainian and russian kbmap, and want create timezone file, i read man page and ask: does we have program to generate ranges for alternative time (i mean number after ??? nnn ??? nnn), or I need calculate by self? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 22:26:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 22:26:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB23FC6A87 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:26:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0127CC6A4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:25:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17597-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:25:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DC6EC6A4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:25:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so596790rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 05:25:35 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Fb3JNkYTtaUDDNws9yIOmX2kKFLczRUzirXLKX13L5KEz641d3HaiM5U2JqQdyGUTOFsgqq1em0JVRVxiQ9gSo337T9CIcPVRA3JLUIRpA1DzNTbr7BTSZMs952jNKsu4Dmo7V8JKVlDYQs9GTQlkm41gmNO2qi8PffOacOCTXs= Received: by 10.39.3.38 with SMTP id f38mr373712rni; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 05:25:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 05:25:34 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:25:34 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] groups and names In-Reply-To: <1112547546.20050205144105@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1112547546.20050205144105@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu adm is for fileserver configuration. ordinary users are often in group sys, but no one is in group adm. i don't remember why sys is in adm. maybe to back up the keys file. russ On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:41:05 +0200, Sergey Reva wrote: > Hello Fans, > > As described in FOSSILCONS(8) default /adm/users for fossil is: > adm:adm:adm:sys > none:none:: > noworld:noworld:: > sys:sys:: > glenda:glenda:glenda: > > Most of system files owned by user sys in group sys, but what do adm? > And why sys belong to group Adm? > -- > http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 5 23:51:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 5 23:51:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA29FC6AC6 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:51:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90804C6A02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:51:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22127-01-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout17.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AF98C69E9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050205145114.TSXS29900.mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:51:14 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050205145113.FTTW13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:51:13 +0000 Message-ID: <6ed0269cbc54de7d49d1ec5adde22e1c@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:51:12 +0000 To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] localization In-Reply-To: <1263202156.20050205145200@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I don't believe there is a program to do it. The files are re-formatted form of the Unix timezone info. You can get the latest Unix code from: http://www.twinsun.com/tz/tz-link.htm which points you at ftp://elsie.nci.nih.gov/pub/. The timezone is fixed, the hassle is the Daylight saving time switching days which tend to move around based on the local government's whim [1]. Timezones are described in an textural table which is "compiled" to a binary file. All you need to do is convert this output to text (the Unix toolkit contains such a program) and add the apropriate header to make a plan9 timezone file. -Steve [1] wasn't there a case a few years back, of the mayor of Rio changing the metropolitan area's timezone so its workers could have more time on the beach? Doesn't sound such a good idea in a rainy English winter... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 6 01:52:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 6 01:52:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0A5FC6A4F for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C99563FF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26409-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A04463FF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so613101rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 08:52:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=l2ZBNGwl6pzuIge5KiPt2O8jbTOWUsd6mb0ntthDKFKLL1XZEXGduTZc/nQPQUkID+/LP8fiXoIRz2aavRWQ0HMARPRS7LgO1dccZgeBOlRPjhqilx3I7yvRDBCtV+ab38lhBSF7N7R8sId5waz4HPRVJwhl0szyO4mHf8gTwxY= Received: by 10.38.65.14 with SMTP id n14mr84082rna; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 08:52:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 08:52:11 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:11 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] gmail invitations X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Gmail seems to want me to give a bunch of these out: https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-17e0034db7-84640ee60b https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-e218998383-3a8b2a165b https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-7a4ea812a9-fe889c7df2 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-a9dca0e831-de2a0d8843 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-e51cfd3933-344fe10a3b https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-9cd644ae1f-e442fedebb https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-322d803bff-94ae449ac9 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-031a512849-0e875d51ae https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-17de6fe310-873055bfe9 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-599f170690-f9003c6cfd And feel free to contact me directly if those run out. Enjoy. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 6 03:27:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 6 03:27:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5341E63F9B for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:27:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88AB463D17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:26:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06378-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:26:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1839863D10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:26:41 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j15IS0xU003227 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:28:01 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:26:38 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2005 20:26:37 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2005 18:26:38.0421 (UTC) FILETIME=[3B22C050:01C50BB0] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don't have a secstore. Each time I connect to, say, sources, and I type either an incorrect username or password, I can't connect (authentication fails) until I clean factotum's database and get it correct the first tim= e. What exactly happens when authentication fails and factotum re-prompts the user for credentials? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 6 05:13:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 6 05:13:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F11AC6A27 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20FB763B29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:12:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10543-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:12:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF0A163AD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:12:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so630482rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 12:12:54 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=F+3AOWMXJboARkl+Xp0vAjDYBAA7OYrU4alif7bAeGql/mby8/r49RGFzMOsPGAX3DA4CvYWx0TkPm2kK8nRlJ5fhJscwPktdoNzdlwACqOS6YdRfpDXAVdU9UGRNchfWQAzpwUDFSfr+DORW/F8uB1fL+9TbZmAuUdfeTmwWdQ= Received: by 10.38.92.44 with SMTP id p44mr438533rnb; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 12:12:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 12:12:54 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 15:12:54 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8ff5bc522d87f33eb5b6dc5c159350b4@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I don't have a secstore. Each time I connect to, say, sources, and I type > either an incorrect username or password, I can't connect (authentication > fails) until I clean factotum's database and get it correct the first time. I think you are half-mistaken. If you type a bad password, it should be no big deal. If you type a bad user name, that's when you get the infinite loop. > What exactly happens when authentication fails and factotum re-prompts > the user for credentials? If you type the same user name and a new password, then factotum replaces the bad key, and all is well. But if you type the wrong user name the first time and then get it right the second time, factotum won't think the two keys match (the user names are different!) so your key gets added to the end of the list. Factotum looks for keys to use from the beginning of the list, so it finds the bad key again, and adding more keys isn't going to help. I changed things so that the new keys get inserted at the beginning of the list. That should help a bit. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 6 10:40:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 6 10:40:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17FF263F97 for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:39:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 028F663D82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:39:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27308-02-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:39:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6967A63D57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:39:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so568383wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 17:38:56 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=N4zakYUGYMk7YriCwU1j3chd8L3wxCUoWn5SNSzQI639/viE/6kvOzwuypPNO4/kS8xQAU8z5UOeynWxWJ+emXa697qgEPK9X3mgCf4sr6jbTuUv9RxchsrfOBBDNWWMx3bbziZ21Wb/xvPky4/vtgyhIUIQjpwSjnFkAbPCQfg= Received: by 10.54.24.45 with SMTP id 45mr222938wrx; Sat, 05 Feb 2005 17:38:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.23.27 with HTTP; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 17:38:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <2781f0205020517382daec133@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 20:38:56 -0500 From: Joseph Stewart To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] gmail invitations In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joseph Stewart , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I wonder if google is about to go public with gmail... I got 50 (!!!) invites in my box yesterday... if you want one, ask for it! -j On Sat, 5 Feb 2005 11:52:11 -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > Gmail seems to want me to give a bunch of these out: > > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-17e0034db7-84640ee60b > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-e218998383-3a8b2a165b > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-7a4ea812a9-fe889c7df2 > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-a9dca0e831-de2a0d8843 > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-e51cfd3933-344fe10a3b > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-9cd644ae1f-e442fedebb > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-322d803bff-94ae449ac9 > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-031a512849-0e875d51ae > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-17de6fe310-873055bfe9 > https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-c037ef5f22-599f170690-f9003c6cfd > > And feel free to contact me directly if those run out. > > Enjoy. > Russ > -- If it ain't broke, break it. How else are you going to figure out how it works? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 6 11:46:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 6 11:46:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C7C363EEA for ; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:46:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A294563BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:45:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05852-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 4578363BAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 5 Feb 2005 21:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 69476 invoked from network); 6 Feb 2005 02:45:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 6 Feb 2005 02:45:32 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 6 Feb 2005 02:45:32 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j162jUq321656; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:45:30 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:45:26 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I changed things so that the new keys get inserted at the beginning > of the list. That should help a bit. When the factotum is the one started by kernel on a cpu server, adding a new key to the beginning of the list might change the authdom which the cpu server running in? -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 01:12:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 01:12:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E1AE63E2A for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:12:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6045363C66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:12:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16788-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D899163C65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so701742rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 06 Feb 2005 08:12:18 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=AI93q4fH2nHeUnu+nd2CN9pikdpz59xMnRNBQcLbBGs9lvP7SwVqvGLSRr/dF7lp+9sshAYuM6rGJI66qspKBTN8V76ePq0OC2KFjXQgmii/gXJ7uxigfOOolSgI+0weCtqjs0XUkQ8ryYV7jXclmhQs0vKJrGabbbB4IW8wBd8= Received: by 10.38.150.58 with SMTP id x58mr206474rnd; Sun, 06 Feb 2005 08:12:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 08:12:18 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 11:12:18 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > I changed things so that the new keys get inserted at the beginning > > of the list. That should help a bit. > > When the factotum is the one started by kernel on a cpu server, > adding a new key to the beginning of the list might change the > authdom which the cpu server running in? > -- That's a bad thing. I put in a different solution. Keys with a disabled attribute are passed over when looking for keys to use during authentication. If factotum figures out that the key you've entered is bad, then it adds "disabled=by.factotum" to the key before asking for a new one. All keys append to the end again. Let's see what breaks this time. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 02:41:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 02:41:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C06A63D26 for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 12:41:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BDC0163A77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 12:41:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20120-01-76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 12:41:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64A3F63A73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 12:41:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.34.50.194]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <20050206174118015009hhrce>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 17:41:18 +0000 Message-ID: <420656B9.7090600@abc.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 12:41:13 -0500 From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Gmail invites X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: balajis@comcast.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-1909b4d7d4-5a7416acc2 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-5ce2d034ac-ca44d1f23e http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-fb8b7a5abd-fea1fa90e1 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-90f9465400-7ef8d90c66 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-e05c696eab-99a5d3f650 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-d621f07f80-5c82f87a91 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-33cece5cf3-70fa6abd1b http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-ecdb3fd41a-dc96efdeb1 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-06de80f6f8-93a2ac96b7 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-db6c59fa39-e46ae26833 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-f41545ecc6-fcb820a9aa http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-c542c63fba-094f0fadc0 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-86abcb1da8-cbf596e506 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-9a5d497fff-3602e11c85 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-4b8a383d10-36fc6e78f6 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-8644b37642-a09e72fea9 http://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-566dd49fc2-0280a6ac31 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 05:00:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 05:00:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1301163D0E for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:00:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA2C663BD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29908-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:00:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7451863BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:00:21 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j16K1gOL025143 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 22:01:43 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Sun, 6 Feb 2005 22:00:16 +0200 To: "Russ Cox" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries References: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Message-ID: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 22:00:16 +0200 In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Feb 2005 20:00:16.0991 (UTC) FILETIME=[7A7A3EF0:01C50C86] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Let's see what breaks this time. It seems to me like the semantically correct solution. Thanks! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 05:23:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 05:23:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B787663D06 for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:23:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F62431880 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:23:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00738-01-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:23:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CAC33186A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 15:23:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 5B12070EA; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:27:38 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mother.anvil.com (mother [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB59B70E7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:27:36 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (rothko [192.168.4.66]) by mother.anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23283172C4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 20:20:55 +0000 (GMT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: Dave Lukes Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 20:23:10 +0000 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] 9conlon: call for volunteers X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Folks, Sadly, if there's going to be a 9conlon this year, I won't be organising it. I'm on a 24 week course of interferon (to try and eliminate my friendly Hepatitis C-3a virus) which ends on June 20th, so I'm in no state to organise it. If others want to stump up the brains and brawn, I can contribute some money if that's useful. DaveL. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 11:36:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 11:36:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85D5631886 for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:35:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E1F231769 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:35:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23038-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:34:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 921F431765 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 21:34:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <16fba940a10a02e5da2b73704e782f16@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] playing music (was RSA) From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:35:07 +0900 In-Reply-To: <8514978bc9b640ead7582e0f1b2dbe33@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kjzbgikphzqprtyckcvwujaork" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=4.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_23, J_CHICKENPOX_42, J_CHICKENPOX_43, J_CHICKENPOX_83 X-Spam-Level: **** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kjzbgikphzqprtyckcvwujaork Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Anyway, it doesn't matter much, does it? No, it doesn't. I included my holiday work for Schubert, here. This /sys/lib/music/schubert file is include from the default mapfile /sys/lib/music/map. I got motivation again for USB audio driver, I'll be too busy for a while though... Kenji --upas-kjzbgikphzqprtyckcvwujaork Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable category { composer =3D schubert Franz Schubert (=E3=83=95=E3=83=A9=E3=83=B3=E3=83=84 =E3=82=B7=E3=83=A5=E3= =83=BC=E3=83=99=E3=83=AB=E3=83=88) (1797 =E2=80=94 1828) work { path {classic/schubert} class =3D symphonic orchestra =3D Orchestre de la Soci=C3=A9t=C3=A9 des Concerts du Conserv= atoir conductor =3D Andr=C3=A9 Cluytens Symphony N=C2=BA 8 in B minor D.759 (=E6=9C=AA=E5=AE=8C=E6=88=90=E4=BA=A4= =E9=9F=BF=E6=9B=B2) performance { Orchestre la Soci=C3=A9t=C3=A9 des Concerts du Conservatoir Andr=C3=A9 Cluytens, conductor recorded: Paris, 1950, Mono } command {number} track { Allegro moderato (=E3=82=A2=E3=83=AC=E3=82=B0=E3=83=AD =E3=83=A2=E3=83= =87=E3=83=A9=E3=83=BC=E3=83=88) time {11:21} file {Unfinished1.mp3} } track { Andante con moto (=E3=82=A2=E3=83=B3=E3=83=80=E3=83=B3=E3=83=86 =E3=82= =B3=E3=83=B3 =E3=83=A2=E3=83=88) time {12.10} file {Unfinished2.mp3} } } work { path {classic/schubert} class =3D Deutch Lied Schubert Lieder (=E3=82=B7=E3=83=A5=E3=83=BC=E3=83=99=E3=83=AB=E3=83=88= =E6=AD=8C=E6=9B=B2=E9=9B=86) from Winterreise, Op.89 D.911 words =3D Wilhelm M=C3=BCller performance { Peter Pears, tenor Benjamin Britten, piano Recoded: London, October 1963 } command {number} track { Gute Nacht (=E3=81=8A=E3=82=84=E3=81=99=E3=81=BF) lyrics { Fremd bin ich eingezogen, Fremd zieh' ich wieder aus. Der Mai war mir gewogen Mit manchem Blumenstrau=C3=9F, Das M=C3=A4dchen sprach von Liebe, Die Mutter gar von Eh' Nun ist die Welt so tr=C3=BCbe, Der Weg geh=C3=BCllt in Schnee. Ich kann zu meiner Reisen Nicht w=C3=A4hlen mit der Zeit: Mu=C3=9F selbst den Weg mir weisen In dieser Dunkelheit. Es zieht ein Mondenschatten Als mein Gef=C3=A4hrte mit, Und auf den wei=C3=9Fen Matten Such' ich des Wildes Tritt. Was soll ich l=C3=A4nger weilen. Da=C3=9F man mich trieb hinaus? La=C3=9F irre Hunde heulen Vor ihres Herren Haus! Die Liebe liebt das Wandern, Gott hat sie so gemacht Von Einem zu dem Andern Fein Liebchen, gute Nacht! Will dich im Traum nicht str=C3=B6ren, W=C3=A4r schad' um deine Ruh', Sollst meinen Tritt nicht h=C3=B6ren Sacht, sacht die T=C3=BCre zu! Schreib' im Vor=C3=BCbergehen Ans Tor dir: >>Gute Nacht!<< Damit du m=C3=B6gest sehen, An dich hab' ich gedacht. } time {5:51} file {GuteNacht.mp3} } track { Gefrorne Tr=C3=A4nen (=E5=87=8D=E3=81=A3=E3=81=9F=E6=B6=99) lyrics { Gefrone Tropfen fallen Von meinen Wangen ab; Ob es mir denn entgangen, Da=C3=9F ich geweinet hab'? Ei Tr=C3=A4nen, meine Tr=C3=A4nen, Und seid ihr gar so lau, Da=C3=9F ihr erstarrt zu Eise. Wie k=C3=BChler Morgentau? Und dringt doch aus der Quelle Der Brust so gl=C3=BChend hei=C3=9F, Als wollter ihr zerschmelzen Des ganzen Winters Eis! } time {2:14} file {GefrorneTr=C3=A4nen.mp3} } track { Der Lindenbaum (=E8=8F=A9=E6=8F=90=E6=A8=B9) lyrics { Am Brunnen vor der Tore Da steht ein Lindenbaum: Ich tr=C3=A4umt' in seinem Schatten So manchen s=C3=BC=C3=9Fen Traum. Ich schnitt in seine Rinde So manches liebe Wor; Es zog in Freud und Leide Zu ihm mich immer fort. Ich mu=C3=9Ft' auch heute wandern Vorbei in tiefer Nacht, Da hab' ich noch im Dunkeln Die Augen zugemacht. Und seine Zweige rauschten, Als riefen sie mir zu: >>Komm her zu mir, Geselle, Hier find'st du deine Ruh'!<< Die kalten Winde bliesen Mir grad ins Angesicht, Der Hut flog mir vom Kopfe, Ich wendete mich nicht. Num bin ich manche Stunde Entfernt von jenem Ort, Und immer h=C3=B6r' ich's rauschen: Du f=C3=A4ndest Ruhe dort! } time {5:08} file {DerLindenbaum.mp3} } track { Auf dem Flusse (=E5=87=8D=E3=81=A3=E3=81=9F=E5=B7=9D=E3=81=A7) lyrics { Der du so lustig rauschtest, Du heller, wilder Flu=C3=9F, Wie still bist du geworden, Gibst keinen Scheidegru=C3=9F. Mit harter, starrer Rinde Hast du dich =C3=BCberdeckt, Liegst kalt und unbeweglich Im Sande ausgestreckt. In deine Decke grab' ich Mit einem spitzen Stein Den Namen meiner Liebsten Und Stund' und Tag hinein: Den Tag des ersten Gru=C3=9Fes, Den ag, an dem ich ging; Um Nam' und Zahlen windet Sich ein zerbroch'ner Ring. Mein herz, in diesem Bache Erkennst du nun dein Bild? Ob's unter seiner Rinde Wohl auch so rei=C3=9Fend schwillt? } time {3:33} file {AufdemFlusse.mp3} } track { Fr=C3=BChlingstraum (=E6=98=A5=E3=81=AE=E5=A4=A2) lyrics { Ich tr=C3=A4umte von bunten Blumen, So wie sie wohl bl=C3=BChen im Mai; Ich tr=C3=A4umte von gr=C3=BCnen Wiesen, Von Instigen Vogelgeschrei. Und als die H=C3=A4hne kr=C3=A4hten, Da ward mein Auge wach; Da war es kalt und finster, Es schrien die Raben vom Dach. Doch an den Fensterscheiben, Wer malte die Bl=C3=A4tter da? Ihr lacht wohl =C3=BCber den Tr=C3=A4umer, Der Blumen im Winter sah? Ich tr=C3=A4umte von Lieb' um Liebe, Von einer sch=C3=B6nen Maid, Von Herzen und K=C3=BCssen, Von Wonne und Seligkei. Und als die H=C3=A4hne kr=C3=A4hten, Da ward mein Herze wach; Num sitz' ich hier alleine Und denke dem Traume nach. Die Augen schlie=C3=9F' ich wieder, Noch schl=C3=A4gt das Herz so warm. Wann gr=C3=BCnt ihr Bl=C3=A4tter am Fenster? Wann halt' ich mein Liebchen im Arm? } time {4:38} file {Fr=C3=BChlingstraum.mp3} } track { Einsamkeit (=E5=AD=A4=E7=8B=AC) lyrics { Wie eine tr=C3=BCbe Wolke Durch heit're L=C3=BCfte geht, Wenn in der Tanne Wipfel Ein mattes L=C3=BCftchen weht: So zieh ich meine Stra=C3=9Fe Dahin mit tr=C3=A4gem Fu=C3=9F, Durch helles, frohes Leben Einsam und ohne Gru=C3=9F. Ach, da=C3=9F die Luft so ruhig! Ach, da=C3=9F die Welt so licht! Als noch die St=C3=BCrme tobten, War ich so elend nicht. } time {2:54} file {Einsamkeit.mp3} } track { Die Post (=E9=83=B5=E4=BE=BF=E9=A6=AC=E8=BB=8A) lyrics { Von der Stra=C3=9Fe her ein Posthorn klingt. Was hat es, da=C3=9F es so hoch aufspringt, Mein Herz? Die Post bringt keinen Brief f=C3=BCr dich. Was dr=C3=A4ngst du denn so wunderlich, Mein Herz? Nun ja, die Post kommt aus der Stadt, Wo ich ein liebes Liebchen hatt', Mein Herz? Willst wohl einmal hin=C3=BCberseh'n Und fragen, wie es dort mag geh'n, Mein Herz? } time {2:00} file {DiePost.mp3} } track { Im Dorfe (=E6=9D=91=E3=81=A7) lyrics { Es bellen die Hunde, es rasseln die Ketten; Es schlafen die Menschen in ihren Betten, Tr=C3=A4umen sich manches, was sie nicht haben, Tun sich im Gutten und Argen erlaben; Und morgen fr=C3=BCh ist alles zerflossen. je, num, sie haben ihr Teil genossen, Und hoffen, was sie noch =C3=BCberig lie=C3=9Fen, Doch wieder zu finden auf ihren Kissen. Bellt mich nur firt, ihr wachen Hunde, La=C3=9Ft mich nicht ruh'n in der Schlummerstunde! Ich bin zu Ende mit allen Tr=C3=A4umen, Was will ich unter den Schl=C3=A4fern s=C3=A4umen? } time {4:12} file {ImDorfe.mp3} } track { Der Wegweiser (=E9=81=93=E3=81=97=E3=82=8B=E3=81=B9) lyrics { Was vermeid' ich denn die Wege, Wo die ander'n Wand'rer geh'n, Suche mir versteckte Stege Durch verschneite Felsenh=C3=B6h'n? Habe ja doch nichts begangen, Da=C3=9F ich Menschen sollte scheu'n, Welch ein t=C3=B6richtes Verlangen Treibt mich in die W=C3=BCstenei'n? Weiser stehen auf den Wegen, Weisen auf die St=C3=A4dte zu, Und ich wand're sonder Ma=C3=9Fen, Ohne Ruh', und suche Ruh'. Einen Weiser seh' ich stehen Unverr=C3=BCckt vor meinem Blick; Eine Stra=C3=9Fe mu=C3=9F ich gehen, Die noch keiner ging zur=C3=BCck. } time {3:52} file {DerWegweiser.mp3} } track { Mut! (=E5=8B=87=E6=B0=97) lyrics { Fliegt der Schnee mir ins Gesicht, Sch=C3=BCttl' ich ihn herunter. Wenn mein Herz im Busen spricht, Sing' ich hell und munter. H=C3=B6re nicht, was es mir sagt, Habe keine Ohren; F=C3=BChle nicht, was es mir klagt, Klagen ist f=C3=BCr Toren. Lustig in die Welt hinein, Gegen Wind und Wetter! Will kein Gott auf Erden sein, Sind wir selber G=C3=B6tter! } time {1:31} file {Mut!.mp3} } track { Der Leiermann (=E8=BE=BB=E9=9F=B3=E6=A5=BD=E5=B8=AB) lyrics { Dr=C3=BCben hinterm Dorfe Steht ein leiermann, Und mit starren Fingern Dreht er, was er kann. Barfu=C3=9F auf dem Eise Wankt er hin und her, Und sein kleiner Teller Bleibt ihm immer leer. Keiner mag ihm h=C3=B6ren, Keiner sieht ihn an; Und die Hunde knurren Um den alten Mann. Und er l=C3=A4=C3=9Ft es gehen, Alles wie es will, Dreht, und seine Leier Steht ihm mimmer still. Wunderlicher Alter, Soll ich mit dir geh'n? Willst zu meinen Liedern Deine Leier dreh'n? } time {3:19} file {DerLeiermann.mp3} } } work { path {classic/schubert} class =3D Deutch Lied Schubert Lied others (=E3=82=B7=E3=83=A5=E3=83=BC=E3=83=99=E3=83=AB=E3=83= =88=E6=AD=8C=E6=9B=B2=E3=80=81=E3=81=9D=E3=81=AE=E4=BB=96) command {number} track { An die Musik D.547 (=E6=A5=BD=E3=81=AB=E5=AF=84=E3=81=99=E3=80=81=E4=BD= =9C=E5=93=81547) words =3D Franz von Schober performance { Elisabeth Schwarzkopf, soprano Edwin Fisher, piano recorded =3D Abbey Road, London, 1952 October 4-7, Mono } lyrics { Du holde Kunst, in wieviel grauen Stunden, Wo mich des Lebens wilder Kreis umstrickt, Hast du mein Herz zu warmer Lieb entzunden, Hast mich in eine be=C3=9Fre Welt entr=C3=BCckt! Oft hat ein Seufzer, deiner Harf entflossen, Ein s=C3=BC=C3=9Fer, heiliger Akkord von dir Den Himmel be=C3=9Frer Zeiten mir erschlossen, Du holde Kunst, ich danke dir daf=C3=BCr! } time {2:39} file {AndieMusik1.mp3} } track { An die Musik D.547 (=E6=A5=BD=E3=81=AB=E5=AF=84=E3=81=99=E3=80=81=E4=BD= =9C=E5=93=81547) words =3D Franz von Schober performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Du holde Kunst, in wieviel grauen Stunden, Wo mich des Lebens wilder Kreis umstrickt, Hast du mein Herz zu warmer Lieb entzunden, Hast mich in eine be=C3=9Fre Welt entr=C3=BCckt! Oft hat ein Seufzer, deiner Harf entflossen, Ein s=C3=BC=C3=9Fer, heiliger Akkord von dir Den Himmel be=C3=9Frer Zeiten mir erschlossen, Du holde Kunst, ich danke dir daf=C3=BCr! } time {2:39} file {AndieMusik2.mp3} } track { An Sylvia D.891 (=E3=82=B7=E3=83=AB=E3=83=B4=E3=82=A3=E3=82=A2=E3=81=AB= =E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81891) words =3D William Shakespeare/Bauernfeld performance { Elisabeth Schwarzkopf, soprano Edwin Fisher, piano recorded =3D Abbey Road, London, 1952 October 4-7, Mono } lyrics { Was ist Silvia, saget an, Da=C3=9F sie die weite Flur preist? Sch=C3=B6n und zart seh' ich sie nah'n, Auf Himmelsgunst und Spur weist, Da=C3=9F ihr alles untertan. Ist sie sch=C3=B6n und gut dazu? Reiz labt wie milde Kindheit; Ihrem Aug' eilt Amor zu, Dort heilt er seine Blindheit, Und verweilt in s=C3=BC=C3=9Fer Ruh'. Darum Silvia, t=C3=B6n', o Sang, Der holden Silvia Ehren; Jeden Reiz besiegt sie lang, Den Erde kann gew=C3=A4hren: Kr=C3=A4nze ihr und Saitenklang! } time {3:05} file {AnSylvia1.mp3} } track { An Sylvia D.891 (=E3=82=B7=E3=83=AB=E3=83=B4=E3=82=A3=E3=82=A2=E3=81=AB= =E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81891) words =3D William Shakespeare/Bauernfeld performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Was ist Silvia, saget an, Da=C3=9F sie die weite Flur preist? Sch=C3=B6n und zart seh' ich sie nah'n, Auf Himmelsgunst und Spur weist, Da=C3=9F ihr alles untertan. Ist sie sch=C3=B6n und gut dazu? Reiz labt wie milde Kindheit; Ihrem Aug' eilt Amor zu, Dort heilt er seine Blindheit, Und verweilt in s=C3=BC=C3=9Fer Ruh'. Darum Silvia, t=C3=B6n', o Sang, Der holden Silvia Ehren; Jeden Reiz besiegt sie lang, Den Erde kann gew=C3=A4hren: Kr=C3=A4nze ihr und Saitenklang! } time {2:35} file {AnSylvia2.mp3} } track { An die Laute D.905 (=E3=83=AA=E3=83=A5=E3=83=BC=E3=83=88=E3=81=AB=E5=AF= =84=E3=81=99=E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81905) words =3D Johann Friedrich Rochlitz performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Leiser, leiser, kleine Laute, Fl=C3=BCstre, was ich dir vertraute, Dort zu jenem Fenster him! Wie die Wellen sanfter L=C3=BCfte, Mondenglanz und Blumend=C3=BCfte, Send' es der Gebieterin! Neidisch sind des Nachbars S=C3=B6hne, Und im Fenster jener Sch=C3=B6ne Flimmert noch ein eisam Licht. Drum noch ein einsam Licht. Dich vernehme die Vertraute, Nachbarn aber Nachbarn nicht! } time {1:35} file {AndieLaute.mp3} } track { Auf dem Wasser zu singen D.774 (=E6=B0=B4=E3=81=AE=E4=B8=8A=E3=81=A7=E6= =AD=8C=E3=81=86=E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81774) words =3D Friedrich Leopold Graf zu Stolberg performance { Elisabeth Schwarzkopf, soprano Edwin Fisher, piano recorded =3D Abbey Road, London, 1952 October 4-7, Mono } lyrics { Mitten im Schimmer der spiegelnden Wellen Gleitet wie Schw=C3=A4ne der wankende Kahn; Ach, auf der Freude sanftschimmernden Wellen Gleitet die Seele dahin wie der Kahn; Denn von dem Himmel herab auf die Wellen Tanzet das Abendrot rund um den Kahn. =C3=9Cber den Wipfeln des westlichen Haines Winket uns freundlich der r=C3=B6tliche Schein; Unter den Zweigen des =C3=B6stlichen Haines S=C3=A4uselt der Kalmus im r=C3=B6tlichen Schein; Freude des Himmels und Ruhe des Haines Atmet die Seel' im err=C3=B6tenden Schein. Ach, es entschwindet mit tauigem Fl=C3=BCgel Mir auf den wiegenden Wellen die Zeit. Morgen entschwinde mit schimmerndem Fl=C3=BCgel Wieder wie gestern und heute die Zeit, Bis ich auf h=C3=B6herem strahlenden Fl=C3=BCgel Selber entschwinde der wechselnden Zeit. } time {3:19} file {AufdemWasserzusingen.mp3} } track { Das Lied im Gr=C3=BCnen D.917 (=E7=B7=91=E9=87=8E=E3=81=AE=E6=AD=8C=E3= =80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81917) words =3D Johann Anton Friedrich Reil performance { Elisabeth Schwarzkopf, soprano Edwin Fisher, piano recorded =3D Abbey Road, London, 1952 October 4-7, Mono } lyrics { In's Gr=C3=BCne, in's Gr=C3=BCne, Da lockt uns der Fr=C3=BChling, der liebliche Knabe, Und f=C3=BChrt uns am blumenumwundenen Stabe Hinaus, wo die Lerchen und Amseln so wach, In W=C3=A4lder, auf Felder, auf H=C3=BCgel zum, Bach, In's Gr=C3=BCne, in's Gr=C3=BCne. Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen, Da lebt es sich wonning, da wandeln wir germe Und heften die Augen Dahin schon von ferne, Und wie wir so wandeln mit heiterer Brust, Um wallet uns immer die kindliche Lust, Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen. Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen, Da ruht man so wohl, empfindet so Sch=C3=B6nes, Und denket behaglich an dieses und jenes, Und zaubert von hinnen, ach, was uns bedr=C3=BCckt, Und alles herbei, was den Busen entz=C3=BCckt, Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr"nen. Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen, Da werden die Sterne so lar, die die Weisen Der Vorwelt zur Leitung des Lebens Uns preisen, Da streichen die W=C3=B6lkchen so zart uns dahin. Da heitern die Herzen, da kl=C3=A4rt sich der Sinn. Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen. Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen, Da wurde manch Pl=C3=A4nchen auf F=C3=BCgeln getragen, Die Zukunft der gr=C3=A4mlichen Ansicht entschlagen, Da st=C3=A4rkt sich das Auge da labt sich der Blick, Sanft wiegen die W=C3=BCnsche sich hin und zur=C3=BCck, Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen. In's Gr=C3=BCne, in's Gr=C3=BCne, Lasst heiter uns folgen dem freundlichen Knaben Gr=C3=BCnt einst das Leben nicht f=C3=B6rder, so haben Wir kl=C3=BCglich die gr=C3=BCnende Zeit nicht vers=C3=A4umt, Und wann es gegolten, doch gl=C3=BCcklich getr=C3=A4umt, Im Gr=C3=BCnen, im Gr=C3=BCnen } time {4:33} file {DasLiedimGr=C3=BCnen.mp3} } track { Der Tod und das M=C3=A4chen D.531 (=E6=AD=BB=E3=81=A8=E3=81=8A=E3=81=A8= =E3=82=81=E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81531) words =3D Matthias Claudius performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Das M=C3=A4dchen: Vor=C3=BCber, and vor=C3=BCber! Geh, wilder Knochenmann! Ich bin noch jung, geh, Lieber, Und r=C3=BChre mich nicht an. Der Tod: Gib deine Hand, du sch=C3=B6n und zart Gebild! Bin Freund und komme nicht zu strafen. Sei guten Muts! Ich bin nicht wild, Sollst sanft in meinen Armen schlafen! } time {3:18} file {DerTodunddasM=C3=A4chen.mp3} } track { Der Wanderer D.493 (=E3=81=95=E3=81=99=E3=82=89=E3=81=84=E4=BA=BA=E3=80= =81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81493) words =3D Georg Philipp Schmidt von L=C3=BCbeck performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Ich komme vom Gebirge her, Es dampft das Tal, es braust das Meer. Ich wandle still, bin wenig froh, Und immer fragt der Seufzer: wo? Die Sonne d=C3=BCnkt mich hier so kalt, Die Bl=C3=BCte welk, das Leben alt, Und was sie reden, leere Schall, Ich bin ein Fremdling =C3=BCberall. Wo bist du, mein geliebtes Land? Gesucht, geahnt, und nie gekannt! Das Land, das Land so hoffnungsgr=C3=BCn, Das Land, wo meine Rosen bl=C3=BChn, Wo meine Freunde wandelnd gehn, Wo meine Toten auferstehn, Das Land, das meine Sprache spricht, O Land, wo bist du? Ich wandle still, bin wenig froh, Und immer fragt der Seufzer: wo? Im Geisterhauch t=C3=B6nt's mir zur=C3=BCick: Dart, wo du nicht bist, dort ist das Gl=C3=BCck! } time {5:40} file {DerWanderer.mp3} } track { Erlk=C3=B6nig D.328 (=E9=AD=94=E7=8E=8B=E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81328) words =3D Johann Wolfgang von Goethe performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Wer reitet so sp=C3=A4t durch Nacht und Wind? Es ist der Vater mit seinem Kind; Er hat den Knaben wohl in dem Arm, Er fa=C3=9Ft ihn sicher, er h=C3=A4lt ihn warm. >>Mein Sohn, was birgst du so bang dein Geisicht?<< >>Siehst, Vater, du den Erlk=C3=B6nig nicht? Den Erlenk=C3=B6nig mit Kron und Schweif?<< >>Mein Sohn, es ist ein Nebelstreif.<< >>Du liebes Kind, komm, geht mit mir! Gar sch=C3=B6ne Spiele spiel ich mit dir; Manch bunte Blumen sind an dem Strand, Meine Mutter hat manch g=C3=BCilden Gewand.<< >>Mein Vater, mein Vater, und h=C3=B6rest du nicht, Was Erlenk=C3=B6nig mir leise verspricht?<< >>Sei ruhig, bleibe ruhig, mein Kind: In d=C3=BCrren Bl=C3=A4ttern s=C3=A4uselt der Wind.<< >>Willst, feiner Knabe, du mit mir gehn? Meine T=C3=B6chter sollen dich warten sch=C3=B6n; Meine T=C3=B6chter f=C3=BChren den n=C3=A4chtlichen Reihn Und wiegen und tanzen und singen dich ein.<< >>Mein Vater, mein Vater, und siehst du nicht dort Erlk=C3=B6nigs T=C3=B6chter am d=C3=BCstern Ort?=C2=AB >>Mein Sohn, mein Sohn, ich seh es genau: Es scheinen die alten Weiden so grau.<< >>Ich liebe dich, mich reizt deine sch=C3=B6ne Gestalt; Und bist du nicht willig, so brauch ich Gewalt.<< >>Mein Vater, mein Vater, jetzt fa=C3=9Ft er mich an! Erlk=C3=B6nig hat mir ein Leids getan!<< Dem Vater grausets, er reitet geschwind, Er h=C3=A4lt in den Armen das =C3=A4chzende Kind, Erreicht den Hof mit M=C3=BChe und Not: In seinen Armen das Kind war tot. } time {3:50} file {Erlk=C3=B6nig.mp3} } track { Erster Verlust D.226 words =3D Johann Wolfgang von Goethe performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Ach, wer bringt die sch=C3=B6nen Tage, Jene Tage der ersten Liebe, Ach, wer bringt nur eine Stunde Jener holden Zeit zur=C3=BCk! Einsam n=C3=A4hr ich meine Wunde, Und mit stets erneuter Klage Traur ich ums verlorne Gl=C3=BCck. Ach, wer bringt die sch=C3=B6nen Tage, Wer jene holde Zeit zur=C3=9Cck! } time {2:14} file {ErsterVerlust.mp3} } track { Fr=C3=BChlingsglaube D.686 (=E6=98=A5=E3=81=AE=E6=8C=A8=E6=8B=B6=E3=80= =81=E4=BD=9C=E5=93=81686) words =3D Ludwich Uhland performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Die linden L=C3=BCfte sind erwacht, Sie s=C3=A4useln und wehen Tag und Nacht, Sie schaffen an allen Enden. O frischer Duft, o neuer Klang! Num, armes Herze, sei nicht bang! Num mu=C3=9F sich alles, alles wenden. Die Welt wird sch=C3=B6ner mit jedem Tag, Man wei=C3=9F nicht, was noch werden mag, Das Bl=C3=BChen will nicht enden; Es bl=C3=BCht das fernste, tiefste Tal; Num, armes Herz, vergi=C3=9F der Qual! Num mu=C3=9F sich alles, alles wenden! } time {3:13} file {Fr=C3=BChlingsglaube.mp3} } track { Heidenr=C3=B6slein D.257 (=E9=87=8E=E3=81=B0=E3=82=89=E3=80=81=E4=BD=9C= =E5=93=81257) words =3D Johann Wolfgang von Goethe performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { Sah ein Knab ein R=C3=B6slein steh'n, R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden, War so jung und morgensch=C3=B6n, Lief er schnell, es nah zu seh'n, Sah's mit vielen Freuden. R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein rot, R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden. Knabe sprach: Ich breche dich, R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden! R=C3=B6slein sprach: Ich steche dich, Da=C3=9F du ewig denkst an mich, Und ich will's nicht leiden. R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein rot, R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden. Und der wilde Knabe brach 's R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden: R=C3=B6slein wehrte sich und stach, Half ihm doch kein Weh und Ach, Mu=C3=9Ft'es eben leiden. R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein, R=C3=B6slein rot, R=C3=B6slein auf der Heiden. } time {1:59} file {Heidenr=C3=B6slein.mp3} } track { Wanderers Nachtlied D.768 words =3D Johann Wolfgang von Goethe performance { G=C3=A9rard Souzay, baritone Dalton Baldwin, piano recorded =3D Switzerland, 1967 July } lyrics { =C3=9Cber allen Gipfeln Ist Ruh, In allen Wipfeln Sp=C3=BCrest du Kaum einen Hauch; Die V=C3=B6gelein schweigen im Walde. Warte nur, balde Ruhest du auch. } time {2:25} file {WanderersNachtlied.mp3} } } } --upas-kjzbgikphzqprtyckcvwujaork-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 13:20:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 13:20:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AAD7318CA for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:20:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4ECA31862 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:19:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24557-02-34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:19:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.65]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 608F331859 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:19:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([65.4.251.34]) by imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050207041953.MWEY1992.imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:19:53 -0500 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] performance problems (fwd) In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 4 Feb 2005 08:23:59 -0700 (MST) . Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 22:19:41 -0600 Message-Id: <20050207041953.MWEY1992.imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , "Ronald G. Minn ich" writes: >I am sending this as the data is interesting for plan 9 vmware vs. plan 9 >xen. Which is to say, I sure would like some people to try xen and plan 9: >- free >- faster >- xen will soon be standard part of linux --> setup will be easy Is there a place where we can download the patches? There didn't appear to be any xen support in the latest CD image I pulled. Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 13:39:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 13:39:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC28D63DAB for ; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:38:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CE733179D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:37:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24557-02-65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.72]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A6D97317B2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([65.4.251.34]) by imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050207043721.CNMC2021.imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 6 Feb 2005 23:37:21 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Brian L. Stuart" Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 22:37:08 -0600 Message-Id: <20050207043721.CNMC2021.imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Plan9 on qemu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I was playing around with qemu the other day and came across an issue that had been reported earlier. Namely, it would hang after the two A0 lines and before the kernel was loaded. It seemed as if the loader couldn't find anything. However, the loader in the CD image worked fine and the install was successful. Oddly, I noticed that even when plan9.ini was set to boot from the disk image, if I invoked qemu with: qemu -boot c -cdrom plan9.iso test.disk it would still boot the iso image. This led me to try qemu -boot c -cdrom test.disk test.disk and things worked fine. So if anyone else is seeing this sort of hang, here's a trick that should hold us until things are happy again. Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 14:21:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 14:21:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D08E5318FC for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:20:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 92DA331717 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:20:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00761-01-71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:20:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B2B93161E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:20:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5508fb40668038e8e325861b39070dcd@proxima.alt.za> To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 07:25:47 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Let's see what breaks this time. Would anything break if factotum actually "delkey"ed the failed entry? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 14:42:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 14:42:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF21B31934 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:42:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 939203184A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:42:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09511-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:42:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7DD7A3184B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:42:10 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <5508fb40668038e8e325861b39070dcd@proxima.alt.za> References: <5508fb40668038e8e325861b39070dcd@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <35553ab2ecc60e6729e502161bad3131@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:42:07 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Would anything break if factotum actually "delkey"ed the failed entry? > Russ will answer but I would like to say. I think nothing break but I want the key is kept untouched only adding disabled flag at the beginning. because the disabled key is useful to see what was wrong. And I want, the disabled key is replaced by new one when I add new key. Then I can edit factotum without changing the order. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 14:58:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 14:58:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0160C31E6D for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:58:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04B0931757 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:57:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09511-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:57:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5468231765 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 00:57:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <650b439e355682372e7a55e68df66554@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:03:07 +0200 In-Reply-To: <35553ab2ecc60e6729e502161bad3131@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I think nothing break but I want the key is kept untouched only adding > disabled flag > at the beginning. Hm. You can't inspect the password at that point (sometimes I wish there was a way to do that) so just the username is pertinent. Wouldn't a log entry be more useful and less intrusive? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 15:48:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 15:48:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BBC6531E77 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:48:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C867631772 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:47:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10528-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:47:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 160173176F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:47:55 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <650b439e355682372e7a55e68df66554@proxima.alt.za> References: <650b439e355682372e7a55e68df66554@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:47:52 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Hm. You can't inspect the password at that point (sometimes I wish > there was a way to do that) so just the username is pertinent. > Wouldn't a log entry be more useful and less intrusive? > I believe factotum does not keep clear password if proto=p9sk1 Then log entry will be useless even if the log shows the key. If authentication failed and attribute value list is right except password, then we should retry with a new password. Current factotum is inconvenient if the order is matter. I think my proposal is one of idea to resolve the problem. Of course if we failed in authentication, then disabled flag will be put automatically at the beginning of the attribute value list, and if we succeed in next authentication the attribute value list is automatically replaced by new one without changing the order. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 15:52:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 15:52:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5305631931 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:52:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D27E318A2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:52:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12499-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:52:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0745F31871 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 01:52:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <6a82af1edce3d3fa97b967d8e060b8b5@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] netpbm From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:57:24 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > whoever wrote it made a nice job explaining why it's pointless to hack > tar adding z (gzip/gunzip) and j (bzip2/bunzip2) options... There's plenty of room for disagreement here: - The pipeline is not reserved for the shell's sole use. TAR can spawn a decompressor and read its output without user intervention. The shell's contribution here would be the ease of change. Casting it in TAR stone may (usefully ot otherwise) discourage enhancements (it didn't when Bzip2 was introduced). - Anything more complex than a pipe isn't suitable for purely command line use. TAR can inspect the archive and determine its format (it's a published header), selecting the most appropriate tool for decompression. My suggestion was to move the identification into the decompressors, but in this case we're merely extending TAR's existing capabilities. Whether the filename suffix is a suitable discriminator is for some other jury. PAX, unless I'm mistaken, will even choose TAR or CPIO as the archiver, which is commendable if one is looking for simplification in a different realm. - One can push the principle to breaking point. "One task, one program". By that token, there ought to be a TAR and an UNTAR as I don't see them as equivalent. In fact fa/tarfs (or whatever) is a case in point and I have no reservations in this regard. But one can shift the "task" definition, too. There are hundreds of archive formats, all in some use and having to be familiar with each is painful. A utility that subsumes at least the extraction process into a single operation is not to be sneered at. Of course, one has to be realistic, too. In my opinion, the "one task, one program" principle is very sensible for modelling and should only be abandoned when the components have been so carefully tested that it is possible to combine them together without major unpredictable problems being created. Programming skills have a great influence here: I would trust Geoff's multi-purpose TAR more than I would trust my own simple attempt at a TAR implementation. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:11:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:11:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3641639E4 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:11:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F305931817 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10528-01-71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4984631814 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:11:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:11:08 +0100 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:11:08 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E20001AB4E@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] allow X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu hi, this works for me on fossil like 'disk/kfscmd allow' does on kfs: term% con /srv/fscons prompt: uname adm +pac prompt: uname adm -pac however, is this the right way to temporarily circumvent permissions?? thanks, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:13:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:13:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61A7231929 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:13:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD4A531818 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12505-01-56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:13:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CDDC31814 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:13:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:13:24 +0100 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:13:24 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E20001AB5A@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] 8c(pcc) X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu pcc complains: sigsetjmp: DoPlot: not defined i found the following in /sys/src/ape/lib/ap/plan9/signal.c /* BAD CODE - see /sys/src/ape/lib/ap/$objtype/setjmp.s for real code does it mean i need to recompile libap.a before i can use it? Or what am i missing?? Thanks a lot, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:16:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:16:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07D4E3169B for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:16:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 003F117BE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:16:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12505-01-67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A61C17BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:16:22 +0100 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:16:22 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E20001AB77@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] memory X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu hi, can someone show me the pros and cons of having kernel and user memory sp= aces separated? just would like to learn... thanks, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:21:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:21:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7718F639CE for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:21:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 206983169B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:21:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12505-01-74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:21:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 944BD3168C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:21:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1ae7aeda5561f403475aea19a6f0b493@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 09:26:42 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I believe factotum does not keep clear password if proto=p9sk1 > Then log entry will be useless even if the log shows the key. > If authentication failed and attribute value list is right except > password, > then we should retry with a new password. > That, unless I misunderstand Russ's comment, is already the case: factotum will re-prompt if an attempted connection fails because of an authentication error. It is when a different username is submitted that problems arise in the old style of operation where entries were appended to the factotum database. > Current factotum is inconvenient if the order is matter. Correct: responding to a factotum request with a new username causes a new entry to be created, whereas if only the password is different, the previous entry is replaced. The earlier entry, now with an invalid username, will have priority over a subsequent correct entry, invalidating the entire procedure (again, as things used to be). > I think my proposal is one of idea to resolve the problem. > Of course if we failed in authentication, then disabled flag will be put > automatically at the beginning of the attribute value list, and if we > succeed > in next authentication the attribute value list is automatically > replaced by new > one without changing the order. > The point you raised was that you actually want to retain the error entry for inspection which in my opinion causes more difficulty than is justified. A middle ground is to log the erroneous entry in the same form as would be displayed by looking at the factotum database and then discard it altogether. This ought to satisfy your curiosity and allow us to append new entries rather than prepend them, at the same time removing the need for the "disabled" attribute. Once we start treating sequence as significant (we already do, of course), I think we tread on very thin ice. Russ's idea of additional attributes is a sound one to resolve possible ambiguities, rather than rely on position in the database with all the associated risks. For example, what happens if I delete a key and resubmit it instead of merely overwriting it (IPSO does that, doesn't it?)? Are these intentionally different in outcome? In my opinion, factotum ought to detect ambiguous requests and have rules for resolving them. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:26:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:26:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB2F431909 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:26:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA9F831724 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:26:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12505-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A45C031710 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:26:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] allow From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 09:31:31 +0200 In-Reply-To: <41F879E20001AB4E@stateless1.tiscali.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > however, is this the right way to temporarily circumvent permissions?? I have a prompt: srv -APW fossil in the config file and only % mount -c /srv/fossil /n/fossil where required. The replica/network script does a similar thing. The permissions on /srv/fossil are adequate protection and it seems they can be altered to no avail (last time I tried). In passing, does % rm /srv/fossil reverse the above fossilcons command? And % rm /srv/fscons ? I'm not sure I ought to test this. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 16:33:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 16:33:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8F1263A6E for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:32:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53FC56184 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:32:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13476-01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:32:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 94A37617C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 02:32:21 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <41F879E20001AB4E@stateless1.tiscali.cz> References: <41F879E20001AB4E@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] allow Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 16:32:18 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > this works for me on fossil like 'disk/kfscmd allow' does on kfs: > > term% con /srv/fscons > prompt: uname adm +pac > prompt: uname adm -pac > > > however, is this the right way to temporarily circumvent permissions?? > term% mkdir /n/f # need only once term% echo srv -APW f | con /srv/fscons term% 9fs f term% then you can do every thing without permission in /n/f/* this is very very convenient. and I have a script named "-f", the usage example is -f chgrp staff foo You will find the code at /n/source/arisawa/misc/-f Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 17:09:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 17:09:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21A4431670 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:09:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40C8CC4E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13732-01-48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:09:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 275EDC4F5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:09:29 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <1ae7aeda5561f403475aea19a6f0b493@proxima.alt.za> References: <1ae7aeda5561f403475aea19a6f0b493@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <65ce4516c890a7cc231be49f75689b0e@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 17:09:27 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.2 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_45, J_CHICKENPOX_46, J_CHICKENPOX_47, NO_REAL_NAME X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu some miscommunication probably because of my sketchy explanation. My image is term% cat /mnt/factotum/ctl key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=bootes !password? disabled key proto=p9sk1 dom=inside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=grid.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? term% Factotum knows attribute value list is useless or not. If the list is confirmed useless in authentication process, I would like disabled is put at the beginning. Next time I will fix the problem and put key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? then I will get term% cat /mnt/factotum/ctl key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=bootes !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=grid.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? term% If I put wrong user name, say alice instead of arisawa, then factotum is not authenticated. therefore we will get: term% cat /mnt/factotum/ctl key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=aichi-u.ac.jp user=bootes !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=grid.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? disabled key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=alice !password? term% Wrong user name does no harm The current problem is in that factotum put every data even if the data is confirmed invalid. The above is rough sketch. we should examine more. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 17:50:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 17:50:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A98131787 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:50:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E08F631727 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:50:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15417-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:50:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2ED3131726 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 03:49:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3258eb01a201159c8e06f2b23d8b8f4b@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 10:55:04 +0200 In-Reply-To: <65ce4516c890a7cc231be49f75689b0e@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > The above is rough sketch. we should examine more. If I read your explanation right, you misunderstand something. key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=arisawa !password? would be valid if the password is correct. key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=alice !password? would be invalid if you're not registered as "alice" on sources. Now, in my case, I always log onto my system as lucio, but as proxima on sources: key proto=p9sk1 dom=proxima.alt.za user=lucio !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=proxima !password? Unlike pac, I do use the secstore. But, before I put the "proxima" entry in the secstore, I used to get prompted for authentication (the dom= would cause this) and would regularly type "lucio" instead of "proxima" as well as the wrong password to go with it. I would then get, instead of the above: key proto=p9sk1 dom=proxima.alt.za user=lucio !password? key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=lucio !password? and I'd religiously delkey the second entry before retrying for exactly the reasons raised by pac and Russ. Now, I submit that factotum would be right to "delkey" the second entry as soon as it is aware that the authentication failed. It would, by default, overwrite the entry if I changed the password, but it is not allowed to do so (by design) if I change the username. I'd like to stress that there are two conditions here: wrong password and wrong username. The first is not a problem, the second is, because each new username adds an entry, but the first one has precedence. Reversing the sequence of insertion solves the problem of precedence, but leaves unwanted rubbish (the username is incorrect) in the factotum database. It has one additional side effect, incidental but critical and Russ addressed that by "invalidating" the record. In my opinion, that's the wrong approach. I fail to see a negative side to factotum deleting the erroneous record rather than flag it "disabled". I can see race conditions if different instances of factotum are involved, possibly denial of service attacks, even, which is why I asked whether anything would break. I'm hoping that the simpler approach is the way to go, anyway. I am keen to create a log entry, as, like you, I also like to know where I went wrong. But because factotum is required to hide information by design, I fear one has to learn to minimise errors instead. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 18:16:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 18:16:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A38B831918 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:16:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A467FC29C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:15:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20394-02-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:15:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 876B8C272 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:15:44 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <3258eb01a201159c8e06f2b23d8b8f4b@proxima.alt.za> References: <3258eb01a201159c8e06f2b23d8b8f4b@proxima.alt.za> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 18:15:41 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > key proto=p9sk1 dom=proxima.alt.za user=lucio !password? > key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=lucio !password? > > and I'd religiously delkey the second entry before retrying for > exactly the reasons raised by pac and Russ. > > Now, I submit that factotum would be right to "delkey" the second > entry as soon as it is aware that the authentication failed. It > would, by default, overwrite the entry if I changed the password, but > it is not allowed to do so (by design) if I change the username. If factotum automatically changed key proto=p9sk1 dom=proxima.alt.za user=lucio !password? disabled key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=lucio !password? when it know the list is useless, you can add key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user= proxima !password? at the place of disabled entry. this is what you desire. What is the problem? If factotum have deleted erroneous record then factotum put next record only at the end. If order is matter this make a problem. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 19:00:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 19:00:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9545D63B75 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:00:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA9FE31929 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:59:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21951-01-94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:59:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFA8C31921 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:59:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2872b3cbd27d48bc556bc9be60560d38@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 12:05:09 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > If factotum automatically changed > key proto=p9sk1 dom=proxima.alt.za user=lucio !password? > disabled key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user=lucio > !password? > when it know the list is useless, you can add > key proto=p9sk1 dom=outside.plan9.bell-labs.com user= proxima > !password? > at the place of disabled entry. this is what you desire. It's not what I desire: I don't want erroneous records in the factotum database and I fail to see why anyone else would. It solves a non-existent problem, as deleting the record has the same effect. > What is the problem? Ugliness? Note that the record is the most recently added record, so the sequence is not affected. > If factotum have deleted erroneous record then factotum put next record > only at the end. If order is matter this make a problem. But factotum always did that, and it's precisely what I would do manually. As I mentioned, the sequence is not altered, nor should it really matter if it was altered. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 19:20:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 19:20:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A21903198F for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:20:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C763E3186C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:20:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20260-03-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:20:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from sdf.lonestar.org (mx.freeshell.org [192.94.73.21]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A61E31856 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:20:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from sdf.lonestar.org (IDENT:dudzus@otaku.freeshell.org [192.94.73.2]) by sdf.lonestar.org (8.13.1/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j17AJDFD029324; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 10:19:13 GMT Received: (from dudzus@localhost) by sdf.lonestar.org (8.13.1/8.12.8/Submit) id j17AJDcL003901; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:19:13 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:19:13 +0100 From: Heiko Dudzus To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] allow Message-ID: <20050207101913.GA13600@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> References: <41F879E20001AB4E@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Lucio De Re wrote: > > however, is this the right way to temporarily circumvent permissions?? > I have a > > prompt: srv -APW fossil > > in the config file and only > > % mount -c /srv/fossil /n/fossil [snip] > In passing, does > > % rm /srv/fossil > > reverse the above fossilcons command? And > > % rm /srv/fscons > > ? I'm not sure I ought to test this. prompt: srv -d fossil removes the srv file. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 7 19:53:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 7 19:53:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47E7A31E8A for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:52:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1F085E39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:52:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20260-03-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:52:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 771104E5A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 05:52:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <93d20952fc2eb5636d8d5baaf810ba7e@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] allow From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 12:57:40 +0200 In-Reply-To: <20050207101913.GA13600@SDF.LONESTAR.ORG> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > prompt: srv -d fossil > > removes the srv file. Well, that's consistent, I hadn't even thought about it. I think Russ's 9p library deals with the condition I was being curious about, but I haven't looked that deep. If I remember right, rm /srv/ftpfs, typically, causes ftpfs to terminate. Fossil is more complicated (and close has not been implemented, last I looked, as one small, unrelated quibble), so I'm edging my bets :-) ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 13:19:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 13:19:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 855DA63F3B for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:18:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA51A63E29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:18:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06425-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:18:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A879B63B61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:18:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so957857rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:18:21 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=iXhCqGUzcpczKItLS/tG3nDtHCwuydLQFkmiP8BL19hnBAJY94Mz9Y+Bxq8BRGSanVmzRdpjoycmKBIU15jYZuKFX91KVCwITl9tJYqn6qmTPTGDSeQzTzkG5hJpxUoSPuUNdkQKaEf30SdENlmGLJ7HfU6bVvVG85mf4tF6kEk= Received: by 10.38.208.45 with SMTP id f45mr278274rng; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:18:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:18:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:18:20 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] to: sources account mvb X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu (sorry to everyone else.) patch/list applied/keyfs thanks. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 13:52:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 13:52:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7D2963E71 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:52:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63E7F63E3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:52:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10572-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:52:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F159F63E3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:52:13 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so961534rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:52:13 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=cTh0Re8HK7rAQlLFRvXt+eehubRlhsIJ06RLpP+F2hofbe1muSknC+zHFWt8Io+7DAcjtepp+mvOx5haLPhyQByaz+c0dr1FWjwpjXdetfjOOC7DJ1YEdRBu2wVfCnFTXFnrBc6CqQAAWD0HKFkiREUI3Qh4VGRXXYm0gbcSUaU= Received: by 10.38.97.78 with SMTP id u78mr2847rnb; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:52:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:52:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:52:13 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] memory In-Reply-To: <41F879E20001AB77@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <41F879E20001AB77@stateless1.tiscali.cz> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu pro: errant user programs can't scribble all over the kernel's memory and cause it to crash. =20 con: that makes it harder to simulate dos and windows. russ On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:16:22 +0100, tapique@tiscali.cz wrote: > hi, > can someone show me the pros and cons of having kernel and user memory sp= aces > separated? just would like to learn... > thanks, > ++pac. >=20 > -------------------------- > Pos=C3=ADlejte SMS p=C5=99es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCA= LI. > V=C3=ADce na http://www.tiscali.cz >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 13:57:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 13:57:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44B7F63EA1 for ; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:56:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09BCA2B9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:55:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10572-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:55:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51C91F1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:55:39 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so961894rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:55:39 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=qC2O0BL9PaeaHoH+IkwX/ghCOmqTSGVztiMOjqLL1vlqP2ZSBf79cBpUEPT8O9qNHXJ1sQF7b+muBsAulUhVb+pxB7R8iVjDfm33YoW8cH7IP85LOZ570V6I1B2ZwU6X0NY0K4LK1/afZOY9X2frTGpjq8qF9mmgPH6l3woK8ZY= Received: by 10.38.75.53 with SMTP id x53mr110650rna; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 20:55:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:55:38 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:55:38 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c(pcc) In-Reply-To: <41F879E20001AB5A@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <41F879E20001AB5A@stateless1.tiscali.cz> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu like the comment says, the code is in /sys/src/ape/lib/ap/386/setjmp.s. g% nm /386/lib/ape/libap.a |grep sigsetjmp setjmp.8: T sigsetjmp g%=20 check yours. russ On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 08:13:24 +0100, tapique@tiscali.cz wrote: > pcc complains: > sigsetjmp: DoPlot: not defined >=20 > i found the following in /sys/src/ape/lib/ap/plan9/signal.c > /* BAD CODE - see /sys/src/ape/lib/ap/$objtype/setjmp.s for real code >=20 > does it mean i need to recompile libap.a before i can use it? Or what am > i missing?? >=20 > Thanks a lot, > ++pac. >=20 > -------------------------- > Pos=C3=ADlejte SMS p=C5=99es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCA= LI. > V=C3=ADce na http://www.tiscali.cz >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 14:07:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 14:07:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 589BDB8A3 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:07:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4C84613F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:07:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13219-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:07:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 052BE613A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:07:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] memory From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:12:26 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > con: that makes it harder to simulate dos and windows. Con? Con?! Surely you jest? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 14:13:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 14:13:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A29D763EE2 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:12:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8934A63A9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:12:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13219-01-10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:12:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ECD476365 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:12:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so963727rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 21:12:19 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=h9ytsZUGKx6v1v/4ZlE7taOOEpF03eF7Wme1r/JZ2mPa7zer80b/x9lucbtrhRO8cK54oM+Y465mJwg5TUNczrV3EgajmPOS8TGS9T0npIA7a4wVu+iL29M5AXIM5OiOp27e775Ov70TWQj9bAZxTHqNkYtUb+tsE2vmneKf08Q= Received: by 10.38.88.9 with SMTP id l9mr127131rnb; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 21:12:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:12:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:12:19 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: <2872b3cbd27d48bc556bc9be60560d38@proxima.alt.za> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <2872b3cbd27d48bc556bc9be60560d38@proxima.alt.za> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_33, J_CHICKENPOX_43, J_CHICKENPOX_54, RCVD_BY_IP, SPF_HELO_PASS, SPF_PASS X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In response to the flood of messages in this thread: - I decided against silently deleting keys. It would be very confusing if keys just magically disappeared. I like the disabled=by.factotum tag a lot better. I didn't use the log file mainly because it's intended only for debugging messages. I wouldn't think to look there to figure out why a key disappeared. - Adding disabled=by.factotum only changes whether factotum uses the key in authentications. It doesn't change whether you can see the password. You never can. That's the whole point of factotum. Except in proto=pass, which exists to break the rule. - Factotum has a precise semantics for disambiguating key selection: use the first one. That said, there is nothing stopping you from adding your own tags and then using the -k flag to mount to resolve the ambiguity some other way. This has been there since day 1. - If you've developed a habit of deleting bad keys to avoid the original problem that was reported, you can drop the habit. - When you add a new key with the ctl file, here is what happens. If there is already a key in factotum with exactly the same set of public attr=val pairs, that key is replaced with the new one and stays at the same place in the list. Otherwise, the new key is appended to the list. When doing this comparison, the role= and disabled= attributes are ignored. This means that if you have a key like: key proto=p9sk1 dom=foo user=bar !password? disabled=by.factotum and you write a new key proto=p9sk1 dom=foo user=bar !password=quux to the ctl file, then the first key is replaced by the second. But if the first had an attribute baz=1 that the second did not, or vice versa, then the new key would just be added to the list. There's a lot of incorrect speculation flying around about what factotum might or might not be doing. When in doubt, try it. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 14:17:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 14:17:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AE27B891 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:17:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE9E8B5CC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:17:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10573-01-49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BD69B5C4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:17:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so964210rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 21:17:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=qPq9aklNhCcB6UfSEZMD5huwqKV8Rw+TwlmR9hdEDVCKHmHqCwpu2hzUzpi2R8i3NqQDFVPS+mfXczgSEOPTCXNisnoFKdDrfjM9yooYs6fb2AUJ53QLc4bMkI8l+/1dKg9oTrJTRLmfXFOYjPh4OSZug1e/Kcka+5T7g8EG2Vs= Received: by 10.38.97.78 with SMTP id u78mr12376rnb; Mon, 07 Feb 2005 21:17:23 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:17:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:17:23 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] inst/isfat bug In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > If you have more than one 9fat partitions among disks, > inst/isfat called from "bootsetup checkdone" fails > because isfat accepts only 1 argument. > > Thus, you can't go further than [bootsetup]. > > I had /dev/sdC0/9fat (being installed) and > /dev/sdD0/9fat (old installation) when I encountered this. Fixed, I hope. Thanks. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 17:06:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 17:06:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E529063F52 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C43463E29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21440-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA12363DAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:20 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so980343rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=WBjarVCPSz9zhgC0uF0PBmJZw6qnqQ93lkjY3KXyVKMvOVE5K5NAeDSpQStkP6/s2WR74Z6cVCS4G/Eb7iEwy8q9HbHsBcj17TuIf9CgvIPaYniaJzq12ZDXtkOpmGkCXMR6C92mywG0QcT7LsB9c2RFK9OyxnJ4HThiluvhlNU= Received: by 10.38.88.9 with SMTP id l9mr187410rnb; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:20 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] tip o' the day X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I was debugging a program with Nashi just now and he was surprised to find out about snap and snapfs. What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? Russ P.S. If you keep them to one line, maybe I'll make an alternate fortune file so you can put fortune /sys/lib/plan9.tips or something in your profile. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 17:07:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 17:07:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 744FA63E5E for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:07:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D45663E41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:07:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21440-01-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:07:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9480C63B4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:07:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so980546rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:07:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=cnFeQQ9O+FPCAvBXlmOQC/BbJ+iq/J6lNwsPE7lkH8ubH4eKvjUMCoSWDhb2KJT2MsWPurTCag5pJ1b2effk2a6Y0abtb6wA1bI3wYTibHu01r4ww1m607OS6Bo/McypMQRohosK9Ke5jVBE6vT6Cc6O/M3fi4995iNL4ErcfDA= Received: by 10.38.101.71 with SMTP id y71mr355899rnb; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:07:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:07:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:07:06 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: tip o' the day X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? I'll start. Use getcallerpc(2) to record a function's caller for debugging. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 17:17:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 17:17:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AFE2BDEF for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:16:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74094B8B8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:16:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24558-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:16:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensemada.lava.net (ensemada.lava.net [64.65.64.27]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E84AB8AA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:16:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by ensemada.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4402B30155; Mon, 7 Feb 2005 22:16:13 -1000 (HST) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 22:16:13 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? fn cd { builtin cd $* && awd $sysname } but that should be in the standard distribution now. I'm sure there are more, but I can't remember them now. > Russ Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 18:39:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 18:39:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F8F5C1BD for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0047D63D51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01198-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DAFB63DA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d95201587124bf36889be11b7effcce@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:37:23 0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] C compiler bug? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Or misunderstanding? term% cat t.c #define STRING "//foo" main() { print(STRING); } term% 8c t.c t.c:6 newline in string t.c:6 syntax error, last name: "" term% From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 18:42:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 18:42:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40B9231818 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:41:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38A6DC76E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:41:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29973-04-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:41:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72E7557A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:41:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:41:13 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-kfbrsfjotzhfexbjpefrjsqvre" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-kfbrsfjotzhfexbjpefrjsqvre Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you can use stub(8) to provide file mount points. /sys/src/cmd/unix/winplumb lets you plumb to a windows navigator thanks --upas-kfbrsfjotzhfexbjpefrjsqvre Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Tue Feb 8 09:05:38 MET 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63F6E63ED4 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C43463E29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21440-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA12363DAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:20 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so980343rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=WBjarVCPSz9zhgC0uF0PBmJZw6qnqQ93lkjY3KXyVKMvOVE5K5NAeDSpQStkP6/s2WR74Z6cVCS4G/Eb7iEwy8q9HbHsBcj17TuIf9CgvIPaYniaJzq12ZDXtkOpmGkCXMR6C92mywG0QcT7LsB9c2RFK9OyxnJ4HThiluvhlNU= Received: by 10.38.88.9 with SMTP id l9mr187410rnb; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 00:05:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 03:05:20 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] tip o' the day X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+nemo=lsub.org@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+nemo=lsub.org@cse.psu.edu I was debugging a program with Nashi just now and he was surprised to find out about snap and snapfs. What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? Russ P.S. If you keep them to one line, maybe I'll make an alternate fortune file so you can put fortune /sys/lib/plan9.tips or something in your profile. --upas-kfbrsfjotzhfexbjpefrjsqvre-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 18:44:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 18:44:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2EE3E31837 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:44:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5243131760 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:44:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29973-04-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:44:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [216.240.55.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C36433175B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:44:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:44:03 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? In-Reply-To: <4d95201587124bf36889be11b7effcce@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Looks like a bug to me, but `8c -p t.c' will work around it. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 18:51:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 18:51:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F74E63F3A for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:51:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A383731782 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01198-01-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:51:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout19.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A00631780 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:51:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050208095111.NNIM11211.mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:51:11 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050208095111.FKUI13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:51:11 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:51:10 +0000 To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > alternate fortune file so you can put > fortune /sys/lib/plan9.tips Though I thing learning more is "a good thing", I cannot help but get an image of a paperclip poping up to give me the tip... -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 18:59:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 18:59:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2389863D69 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:59:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B92C31E9B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:58:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00371-02-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:58:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout18.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D29B231E81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:58:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050208095846.MOTC20856.mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:58:46 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050208095846.NSXJ3760.aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:58:46 +0000 Message-ID: <859cbd67a14ef0bbe78e122c8f413bcc@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:58:45 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu my bad, I meant to offer one Add this rule to $home/lib/plumbing: type is text data matches 'Local (.*)' plumb to none plumb start rc -c $1 so you can attach a remote file server "behind" rio, IE in all rio windows: term% plumb 'Local 9fs machine' -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 19:01:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 19:01:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FAB263D48 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 05:01:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBE1A31EA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 05:01:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00275-02-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 05:01:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (webhosting.rdsbv.ro [213.157.185.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3E9663976 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 05:01:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j18A1PCA006287 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:01:25 +0200 Received: from localhost (util@localhost) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) with ESMTP id j18A1Od3006284; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:01:24 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: webhosting.rdsbv.ro: util owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:01:24 +0200 (EET) From: "Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE" X-X-Sender: util@webhosting.rdsbv.ro To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Russ Cox wrote: > I was debugging a program with Nashi just now > and he was surprised to find out about snap and > snapfs. > > What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? > > Russ > > P.S. If you keep them to one line, maybe I'll make an > alternate fortune file so you can put > fortune /sys/lib/plan9.tips > or something in your profile. Good idea! P.S. What is the CTRL+C key combination? --- Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE catab at deuroconsult.ro http://kernel.umbrella.ro/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 20:01:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 20:01:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9284FC6746 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:01:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EF2C63D57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:01:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05187-02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:01:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D212A63D45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:01:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: Charles Forsyth Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:01:16 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >P.S. What is the CTRL+C key combination? Delete. it was possibly more appropriate when it was labelled `RUBOUT', as in `get the boys to rub out those processes'. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 20:04:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 20:04:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 723D9C2A9 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:04:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E98BCBFCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:04:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06802-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:04:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (webhosting.rdsbv.ro [213.157.185.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D6F1BFC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:04:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j18B4ElL027101 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:04:14 +0200 Received: from localhost (util@localhost) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) with ESMTP id j18B4EDj027096 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:04:14 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: webhosting.rdsbv.ro: util owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:04:14 +0200 (EET) From: "Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE" X-X-Sender: util@webhosting.rdsbv.ro To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Charles Forsyth wrote: >> P.S. What is the CTRL+C key combination? > > Delete. it was possibly more appropriate when it was labelled `RUBOUT', > as in `get the boys to rub out those processes'. Thanks! --- Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE catab at deuroconsult.ro http://kernel.umbrella.ro/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 8 21:09:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 8 21:09:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 707A563FD4 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:09:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CCFE613F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:08:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08161-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:08:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-227-30.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.227.30]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8D7188C1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 07:08:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7dedbdaa54d28296bbde790313eade88@tombob.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:08:49 +0000 From: Robert Raschke In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu To build a kernel as a mere mortal user (a bit too long for the one line restriction): mkdir -p $home/src/kernel/ ^ (pc boot ip port) for (i in pc boot ip port) { bind -c $home/src/kernel/$i $home/src/kernel/$i bind -a /sys/src/9/$i $home/src/kernel/$i } cd $home/src/kernel/pc mk 'CONF=pccpuf' The only thing that irks me with this ever so slightly, is the fact that in order to make actual changes to existing files in /sys/..., I need to copy them into my own directory before doing the binding. Robby From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 00:10:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 00:10:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40F8363F31 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:09:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BD0B63E10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20100-01-59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0E3163DEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:09:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <46fe329ee96d5070f6604bbe5da5da45@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? From: C H Forsyth Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:08:28 +0000 In-Reply-To: <4d95201587124bf36889be11b7effcce@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-smlinarotmzovcyqifdoplaaeg" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-smlinarotmzovcyqifdoplaaeg Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i think i've got a fix for that. --upas-smlinarotmzovcyqifdoplaaeg Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Tue Feb 8 09:42:01 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D86FC6771 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0047D63D51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01198-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DAFB63DA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:38:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d95201587124bf36889be11b7effcce@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:37:23 0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] C compiler bug? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=vitanuova.com@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=vitanuova.com@cse.psu.edu Or misunderstanding? term% cat t.c #define STRING "//foo" main() { print(STRING); } term% 8c t.c t.c:6 newline in string t.c:6 syntax error, last name: "" term% --upas-smlinarotmzovcyqifdoplaaeg-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 00:39:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 00:39:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DE58C6799 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:39:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B09963E3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:38:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27278-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C06931750 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:38:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:43:29 +0200 In-Reply-To: <46fe329ee96d5070f6604bbe5da5da45@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > i think i've got a fix for that. Maybe I'm out of sync, but i recently used 8c and it barfed on the // abc'ed construct. I seem to recall brucee commenting on it, is that fixed yet? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 00:46:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 00:46:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8DDF4BDE4 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:46:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCABFAFB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:46:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27345-01-15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:46:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29D59AF0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:46:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:46:04 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i humbly offer this as contribution: http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/lanlp9/tips.html these tips were laboriously assembled by dean prichard and company at LANL in their Plan 9 days. i'm only hosting it. pick and choose what you feel is of value. andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:31:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:31:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12CB463DC2 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:30:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABF7063C20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:29:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27345-01-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:29:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 100BE63BF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j18GTsTj030810 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:29:55 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j18GTrUX021811; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:29:54 -0700 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:29:54 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Russ Cox wrote: > What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? if you want to watch how 9p works between client and server, man iostats It's worth your time to find out what the '1' attribute is on a file From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:32:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:32:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E6CE63E8D for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:32:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29EF463C11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:31:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27345-01-84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:31:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C560963C21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:31:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j18GVhVo031493 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:31:43 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j18GVg5k021966; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:31:43 -0700 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:31:42 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: russcox@gmail.com X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Steve Simon wrote: > Though I thing learning more is "a good thing", I cannot help but get an > image of a paperclip poping up to give me the tip... glenda with a chainsaw works for me. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:39:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:39:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18D4063F5F for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:38:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29ADFC252 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:37:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27542-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 829C9C267 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:37:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4b12bf2586840d19f90100f81874ac0c@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:36:46 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > - When you add a new key with the ctl file, here is what happens. > If there is already a key in factotum with exactly the same set > of public attr=val pairs, that key is replaced with the new one > and stays at the same place in the list. Otherwise, the new key > is appended to the list. does that mean it's now not possible to add a new key to the beginning of the list (the old default)? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:43:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:43:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF39D63DE2 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17F1E63C8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04271-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 420B663AB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c51so1051486rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 08:42:22 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WYLia/Csm3K6GPi/JiN8dLngi8AN+qb4MFs9nFD8UqgWRbi5kSSAenzpinb7ey2JnkYIz9m93OSX/Q/mX6gnguasssjLt4VCkBfTot/M94e9/bDLHCPN1t4z/6K8ratCElKlPCC9kf9ONI7RYt9p783nSdHRlz8TzY6gngVPTBc= Received: by 10.38.171.29 with SMTP id t29mr42579rne; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 08:42:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:42:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:42:20 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: <4b12bf2586840d19f90100f81874ac0c@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <4b12bf2586840d19f90100f81874ac0c@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > - When you add a new key with the ctl file, here is what happens. > > If there is already a key in factotum with exactly the same set > > of public attr=val pairs, that key is replaced with the new one > > and stays at the same place in the list. Otherwise, the new key > > is appended to the list. > > does that mean it's now not possible to add a new key to the beginning > of the list (the old default)? Yes, that functionality is gone. No one ever seemed to need it, and I don't know the right way to express it. I left the machinery that made it possible. In general I think it's better not to use ambiguous key patterns. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:50:36 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:50:36 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF98563E6F for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:50:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F3AB31625 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:49:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04321-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 591D763AA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:49:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 18:55:11 +0200 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Yes, that functionality is gone. No one ever seemed to need it, > and I don't know the right way to express it. I left the machinery > that made it possible. In general I think it's better not to use > ambiguous key patterns. echo 'key -a|b proto=...' > /mnt/factotum/ctl, analogously to "bind"? For that matter, would ">" and ">>" possibly represent different operations (ducks!)? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:53:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:53:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68E3F63FF7 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 950ABB01B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01418-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E04D1AFF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:15 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8989695cc85fe4fd0800b8bd63c350b5@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:51:27 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > For that matter, would ">" and ">>" possibly represent different > operations (ducks!)? according to the man page, they did before (or they would have if stat /mnt/factotum/ctl yielded length>0) so you're not too out there... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 01:53:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 01:53:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7277963FC7 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:53:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47FD7B057 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01418-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpq1.home.nl (smtpq1.home.nl [213.51.128.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D5EEB514 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from [213.51.128.135] (port=51593 helo=smtp4.home.nl) by smtpq1.home.nl with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1CyYbQ-0004MY-Tl; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 17:52:40 +0100 Received: from cc740438-a.deven1.ov.home.nl ([82.72.18.239]:35398 helo=192.168.1.100) by smtp4.home.nl with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1CyYbO-0004F7-Hd; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 17:52:38 +0100 Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: "Devon H. O'Dell" To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: SiteTronics Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 17:52:38 +0100 Message-Id: <1107881558.4731.39.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.0.2 (2.0.2-3) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AtHome-MailScanner-Information: Please contact support@home.nl for more information X-AtHome-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 2005-02-08 at 18:55 +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > Yes, that functionality is gone. No one ever seemed to need it, > > and I don't know the right way to express it. I left the machinery > > that made it possible. In general I think it's better not to use > > ambiguous key patterns. > > echo 'key -a|b proto=...' > /mnt/factotum/ctl, analogously to "bind"? > > For that matter, would ">" and ">>" possibly represent different > operations (ducks!)? > > ++L > means send output (stdout) to a file and overwrite its contents >> means append output to a file :) --Devon From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 02:03:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 02:03:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EE3663C35 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:03:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D7904B8DC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:02:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04321-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:02:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (p9cpu.proxima.alt.za [196.30.44.147]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A39EB695 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:02:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:08:05 +0200 In-Reply-To: <1107881558.4731.39.camel@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > means send output (stdout) to a file and overwrite its contents > Not necessarily, as rog pointed out, factotum retained the contents. Other servers do likewise. > >> means append output to a file I never noticed a difference with factotum, although rog suggests there was. Maybe I should convince myself, I'll check when I get home. Options are ugly, but if there is reason to be explicit, then I can't think of a better approach. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 02:12:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 02:12:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8A103178E for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:12:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A296DC760 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:11:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04321-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:11:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EACBC575 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:11:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4ad709400d63d68d2bce5b1219d1f1f2@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:10:01 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I never noticed a difference with factotum, although rog suggests > there was. not quite. the man page used to say: : If the offset of the write is zero, the key is added at the beginning : of factotum's list; otherwise, it is added to the end. this would have meant that there was a difference between '>' and '>>' *if* the length of the ctl file had been greater than zero (all '>>' does is set the offset to the length returned from stat). this would have been an easy fix, if anyone had cared. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 02:36:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 02:36:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A856639DF for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:36:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 463C731E9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:35:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01168-01-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena.softcardsystems.com (mail.softcardsystems.com [12.34.136.114]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1942C31E7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from athena (athena [12.34.136.114]) by athena.softcardsystems.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j18HVvIo008614 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:31:57 -0500 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:31:57 -0500 (EST) From: Sam X-X-Sender: sah@athena To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? The -[sS] flags to /acme/mail/Mail. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 03:23:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 03:23:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87B7063F76 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:22:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3D7063E6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:22:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10768-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0802963E5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id A20B0716A5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:22:27 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <8297e293944fde84ef070ce2385b8469@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:22:26 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> What surprises do you wish someone had told you about? > > The -[sS] flags to /acme/mail/Mail. Nice, yes, nice. :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 04:14:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 04:14:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6022463F80 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:14:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0E276398A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:14:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12399-01-85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:14:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACE1663976 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:14:00 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 58so956293wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:14:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=GHKFZc46BmbRa5YyDGOl/K68odUbKEaOU7d3Y++BLb3WGWhb5WaI9IRED1JwiCudnp1gN/kNv+j/Vfs0beRP2VdjtUj19vllsBymCx3bO/mTXOKd+UXmtAshjWcrYD6LmUKa6TNBEDvcinO5DvkoX1lYVvaykj7atVd3Dk2fwOM= Received: by 10.54.42.8 with SMTP id p8mr156898wrp; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:13:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.39.60 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:13:59 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:13:59 -0800 From: Micah Stetson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: micah@stetsonnet.org, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu bind -c /n/unix/some/awfully/long/path/name /n/shorter Use files named guide for per-project scratch space in acme. I'm not sure that's the best one-liner for what I mean. I used to use directory windows and unnamed windows made with 'New' for scratch space in Acme. Now I create a guide file for the project I'm working on and use it for temporary notes, commands, and the names of files that I'm working with. The commands get an appropriate working directory, the notes get some context (i.e. what project they go with), and I don't get warned to save the file when I exit, but I can still save it if I want to. Micah From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 04:40:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 04:40:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53DDC63ED6 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:39:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3065A63E75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:38:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22109-01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:38:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 522AE63E94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:38:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <62333f35693a7e9ad479b9248ff205e6@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:37:30 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > bind -c /n/unix/some/awfully/long/path/name /n/shorter this is even better with mntgen, "global-mutable namespace" hack (or is it a hack?) and the Local plumb trick mentioned earlier: (in $home/lib/profile): mntgen srvfs plumbspace /n plumber rfork n mount -b /srv/plumbspace /n a little shell script, "local" completes the picture: #!/bin/rc plumb 'Local ' ^ $"* then i can do: local bind -c /n/unix/some/awfully/long/path/name /n/anything and /n/anything is immediately visible everywhere (including in cpu'd shells under /mnt/term) and i can plumb files in it without any further hassle. the use of mntgen means that i don't have to restrict myself to previously existing names. this is great when constantly dealing with namespaces that come and go (and particularly since i can import namespaces directly from Inferno, which means it's easy to gateway across to Windows machines). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 04:57:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 04:57:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EB4A63F23 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:56:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54CB05ED2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19067-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 929ADCA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so82637wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:55:41 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Tk+QpiSTYmky8wcQAMZbIdlDzLrVek75eLeCTgK677vydydqZBHw0b4OU2hylNsVdYrXIF8/sTBxvl5VvLyK1ikfA2NkmcRCUz4pS5V8ErlL9c2mF+Q1P/3eMAJ7AjejkdmnWSmGO894YprkSDnr24BNusETy/NJFed9axrzAqw= Received: by 10.54.17.6 with SMTP id 6mr361109wrq; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:55:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:55:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d190502081155e1c4730@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 06:55:40 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <46fe329ee96d5070f6604bbe5da5da45@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i thought i'd fixed that. hmmm. will check brucee On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:43:29 +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > i think i've got a fix for that. > > Maybe I'm out of sync, but i recently used 8c and it barfed on the > > // abc'ed > > construct. I seem to recall brucee commenting on it, is that fixed > yet? > > ++L > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 04:58:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 04:58:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1103AFE4 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:58:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6B8F63F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:57:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22990-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:57:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.2.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 252195C5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:57:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (imgw1 [136.159.5.9]) by ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j18Jsjs1018056 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:54:45 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j18JsjcO015599 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:54:45 -0700 Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (imgw1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 15432-04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:54:37 -0700 (MST) Received: from fbsd (fbsd [136.159.7.68]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j18JsbFx015591 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:54:37 -0700 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:54:32 -0700 (MST) From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: <62333f35693a7e9ad479b9248ff205e6@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: References: <62333f35693a7e9ad479b9248ff205e6@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cpsc.ucalgary.ca X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu my personal favourite, which i can't live without is the function to start acme mail in its own rio window (i don't share it with my main acme editor): it contains my favourite fonts here, but you can make your own file by starting Mail and issuing a 'Dump' command, then cp-ing acme.dump to acmemail.dump: plan9% cat /env/'fn#amail' fn amail {acme -l $home^/acmemail.dump} plan9% cat $home/acmemail.dump /usr/andrey /lib/font/bit/10646/7x13/7x13.font /lib/font/bit/10646/7x13/7x13.font 0 e 0 0 0 0 1 1 49 143 0 0 /mail/fs/mbox/ Del Snarf | Look Put Mail Delmesg /acme/mail Mail mbox plan9% andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 07:51:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 07:51:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84C3B63F28 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:51:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B5B563E3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:51:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04620-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:50:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD27A63E2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:50:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <66bfe3f5403d419487eaa9e20de6d542@terzarima.net> To: bruce.ellis@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? From: Charles Forsyth Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 22:50:51 +0000 In-Reply-To: <775b8d190502081155e1c4730@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-oqjixnpswbureqtgswfskftgzw" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-oqjixnpswbureqtgswfskftgzw Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i thought it was fixed. it seemed to be, when i checked earlier. but i've been wrong before. --upas-oqjixnpswbureqtgswfskftgzw Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Tue Feb 8 19:56:50 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 493B0B912 for ; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:56:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54CB05ED2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19067-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 929ADCA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:55:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so82637wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:55:41 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Tk+QpiSTYmky8wcQAMZbIdlDzLrVek75eLeCTgK677vydydqZBHw0b4OU2hylNsVdYrXIF8/sTBxvl5VvLyK1ikfA2NkmcRCUz4pS5V8ErlL9c2mF+Q1P/3eMAJ7AjejkdmnWSmGO894YprkSDnr24BNusETy/NJFed9axrzAqw= Received: by 10.54.17.6 with SMTP id 6mr361109wrq; Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:55:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:55:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d190502081155e1c4730@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 06:55:40 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <46fe329ee96d5070f6604bbe5da5da45@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu i thought i'd fixed that. hmmm. will check brucee On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 17:43:29 +0200, Lucio De Re wrote: > > i think i've got a fix for that. > > Maybe I'm out of sync, but i recently used 8c and it barfed on the > > // abc'ed > > construct. I seem to recall brucee commenting on it, is that fixed > yet? > > ++L > > --upas-oqjixnpswbureqtgswfskftgzw-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 15:12:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 15:12:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A908363CA7 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 00:43:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3A2263B8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 00:43:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11487-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 00:43:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (server.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37AB263BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 00:43:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7f29beb6ab9ef7d73bf02145664873c8@proxima.alt.za> To: bruce.ellis@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] C compiler bug? From: Lucio De Re Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail X-Disclaimer: Everything expressed is an opinion Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:28:52 +0200 In-Reply-To: <775b8d190502081155e1c4730@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Lucio De Re , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > i thought i'd fixed that. I may be out of sync, although I wouldn't have raised the issue without some motivation. I do remember you suggesting that a solution existed. Sorry if it's a red herring. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 15:50:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 15:50:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE6BF63E79 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 01:49:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC1B431E67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 01:49:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11488-02-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 01:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC066317A0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 01:49:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:49:19 +0100 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:49:19 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E200020C44@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 1 (Highest) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.3 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE, DNS_FROM_RFC_POST, FORGED_RCVD_HELO, NO_REAL_NAME, PRIORITY_NO_NAME, X_PRIORITY_HIGH X-Spam-Level: *** Subject: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu seems like 8c compiler doesn't like apostrophes in // comments: // we don't have the value yet doesn't work, while // we dont have the value yet works. Tried with pcc, not directly 8c. Should not matter, however. ++pac -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 18:34:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 18:34:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1966EC6725 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:34:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 993B363F8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:34:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17937-02-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:34:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02F9963F8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:34:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([213.223.24.124]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <361190-25121>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:32:58 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c50e8a$56392af0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <41F879E200020C44@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:32:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="ISO-8859-2"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu this is one nasty bug. the problem is the // and /* comments are parsed twice: 1) in a #define 2) in an ordinary code block the assumption that /sys/src/cmd/cc/macbody makes [case #1] is that a #define consists of a: - name - optional list of args - list of names (possibly arguments) - line continuations - comments - characters should you have the misfortune to: #define S "//... or #define S "/*... you get: #define S " and you are in a "world of pain". to my mind it should be taught about strings, but this is somewhat non-trivial. well, maybe not. it needs to know about comments to skip arguments that maybe are hidden away in comment. ahh, this give me an idea. /sys/src/cmd/cc/lex.c [case 2] goes to some effort to lex up strings and pass them up to yacc. it uses esschar() which decodes chars & Runes in char and string constants, Rune by Rune. i'm not a language lawyer, nor do i have copies of the numerous standards, but do i do believe that: #define S "//foo" should give me: "//foo" hmm, yeah, i think i have a fix. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 21:09:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 21:09:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFDE9C672F for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:09:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A374C272 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:08:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28798-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:08:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DC89C29A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:08:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([213.223.24.124]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <362256-25113>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 07:07:33 -0500 Message-ID: <005d01c50e9f$ee3de5b0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <41F879E200020C44@stateless1.tiscali.cz> <002301c50e8a$56392af0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:07:30 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="ISO-8859-2"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i think if the following diff if applied to /sys/src/cmd/cc/macbody it should fix this nasty bug. it's not amazingly well tested, but if you're in a position to or are feeling brave, please do so 236a237,264 > if (c == '\'' || c == '"') { > int e; > > base = allocn(base, len, 1); > base[len++] = c; > e = c; > > for (;;) { > int p; > > p = c; > if ((c = getc()) == '\n') > break; > > base = allocn(base, len, 1); > base[len++] = c; > > if (p == '\\' && c == e) > continue; > > if (c == e) { > c = getc(); > break; > } > } > > continue; > } -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 22:03:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 22:03:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8901263FF3 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:03:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9879963FBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:03:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01517-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:03:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (unknown [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8856963FB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:03:01 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0f488fb7e6595876142947a189c17b0b@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:02:57 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? In-Reply-To: <41F879E200020C44@stateless1.tiscali.cz> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>Tried with pcc, not directly 8c. Should not matter, however. you need to give -+ to pcc to have it (or rather underlying cpp) support c++ comments. 8c alone is fine From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 22:31:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 22:31:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F08FC671C for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:30:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2025363F99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:29:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29819-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:29:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 798C663F8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:29:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <926767657872b9c4fd8d966c14dc26bf@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? From: C H Forsyth Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:29:06 +0000 In-Reply-To: <005d01c50e9f$ee3de5b0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu the reason i mentioned that i `thought' i had a fix was that i wanted to think whether there was any code that relied on a property of the existing implementation, which i kept, somewhat messily, but boyd's tidier change doesn't. the answer is ... /sys/include/libc.h:/^#define.*assert From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 9 22:34:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 9 22:34:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE5C0C676B for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:33:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADB9A63F9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:33:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01517-01-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:33:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout15.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.15]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAAF563F8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:33:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050209133318.OGHQ1139.mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:33:18 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050209133318.KAZQ3760.aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:33:18 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:33:15 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] scripts X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I some scripts I use in /n/sources/steve/rc caveat emptor -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 10 01:30:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 10 01:30:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61E50C6827 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:29:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D9E9C249 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:29:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13555-01-70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:29:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 171BFBF6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:29:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j19GTPhr011794 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 09:29:25 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j19GTNCP024559 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 09:29:23 -0700 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 09:29:23 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <62333f35693a7e9ad479b9248ff205e6@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu yikes! These tip of the day things are amazing! This is so good it seems like it to be on the wiki as well? ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 10 16:22:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 10 16:22:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87DA1C6850 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:21:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95BDF63D18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16682-02-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from pallas.invalid (cust.7.19.adsl.cistron.nl [62.216.7.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3804D63C93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: by pallas.invalid (Postfix, from userid 500) id A82B223133; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 08:21:15 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day From: Vincent van Gelderen To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1108020075.2762.2.camel@pallas.invalid> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Ximian Evolution 1.4.4 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 08:21:15 +0100 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu fn c {history -D /$1} (so you can paste the output of replica/pull somewhere.) Cheers, Vincent From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 10 16:41:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 10 16:41:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3C80C683A for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:41:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC3D163F9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:40:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19496-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:40:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 912F063F99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 02:40:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCD1917110 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 9 Feb 2005 21:40:43 -1000 (HST) Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 21:40:43 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: <1108020075.2762.2.camel@pallas.invalid> Message-ID: References: <1108020075.2762.2.camel@pallas.invalid> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Here are some simple shortcuts I find useful during development. fn f { du -a $* | sed 's/^.* //g' } <-- that whitespace is a tab Tree enumerator (simple "find") useful for many purposes fn s { lc *.[chsyl] } List out the sources in the current directory. Similar to an example in the rc paper if I remember correctly. fn gn { grep -n $* /dev/null } Grep, but force listing of filename:lineno so you can click on an entry to jump to it in an editor. fn g { grep -n $* *.[chsyl] /dev/null } gn on all sources in the current directory (how about a plumber command that ran grep -n on the files in the current directory and the include directory? Then you could plumb words to it in acme with mouse chording to quickly crossreference keywords in the src tree. I tried goofing with that once but failed pretty miserably). Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 10 23:27:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 10 23:27:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D04817BCC for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:26:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6BB4B68D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11127-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:26:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AEF7B5B8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:26:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:26:09 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:26:09 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E2000251B5@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] netpbm X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu hi, friends! thanks for care, i'm back again after a couple of days of working hard in the lab (having no assistant, sigh). now netpbm should compile fine, grab the fresh version: http://www.gli.cas.cz/home/cejchan/neXt/imaging/netpbm-10.26.1.tbz or with precompiled bins http://www.gli.cas.cz/home/cejchan/neXt/imaging/netpbm-10.26.1.+bin.tbz now with jpeg2000 support! sorry for having released a dead beast before, enjoy, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 00:00:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 00:00:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36F7CBEDB for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:00:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A88A4AFC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:59:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11127-01-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:59:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04F40AFAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so110325rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 06:59:42 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=DqDUI9TFCU6GYAubtTImyeZBwmL+P0I78mXz3MBhadCiseICy993NpS+sGKKE/oHGjRuGSlZSPio551eb5GhmSWI6+LH5MR764arPTo+xDtUuJR357U5BaQi3m2Hnt6zWPL56Ar08mzEaLQRrvlmaZZ17EapexAatMK5pVCeDpU= Received: by 10.38.92.38 with SMTP id p38mr71304rnb; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 06:59:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 06:59:41 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:59:41 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1108020075.2762.2.camel@pallas.invalid> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > fn gn { grep -n $* /dev/null } > Grep, but force listing of filename:lineno so you > can click on an entry to jump to it in an editor. > > fn g { grep -n $* *.[chsyl] /dev/null } > gn on all sources in the current directory rob and i use this as /bin/g. it handles both of these: % cat /bin/g #!/bin/rc flags=() while(! ~ $#* 1 && ~ $1 -* && ! ~ $1 --){ flags=($flags $1); shift } if(~ $1 --) shift switch($#*){ case 0 echo 'usage: g [flags] pattern [files]' >[1=2] exit usage case 1 pattern=$1 files=(`{ls *.[bcChm] *.cc *.py *.tex *.ms *.java >[2]/dev/null}) case * pattern=$1 shift files=($*) } grep -n $flags -- $pattern $files /dev/null % > (how about a plumber command that ran grep -n on the files > in the current directory and the include directory? Then > you could plumb words to it in acme with mouse chording to > quickly crossreference keywords in the src tree. I tried > goofing with that once but failed pretty miserably). i don't see why you'd involve the plumber. just write a script. i find i almost never want to grep both local files and /sys/include. i either run g or sig. % sig memmove void* memmove(void *s1, void *s2, long n) % russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 00:25:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 00:25:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D886CC6796 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:24:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF87631703 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:24:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11400-01-53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:24:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF488316A5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:24:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:24:11 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:24:11 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E20002541F@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] netpbm X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu archive moved from www back to anonymous ftp: ftp://ftp.gli.cas.cz/cej/neXt/ (find netpbm under ./imaging) pls report if access denied to thanks, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 00:29:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 00:29:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B943BC6804 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:29:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7408731734 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:29:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11133-02-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:28:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A727B31718 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:28:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:28:56 +0100 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:28:56 +0100 Message-ID: <41F879E20002544F@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.5 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE, DNS_FROM_RFC_POST, FORGED_RCVD_HELO, MISSING_SUBJECT, NO_REAL_NAME X-Spam-Level: *** Subject: [9fans] (no subject) X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu //pcc complains: result =3D (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] > (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] ? = (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] - (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] : (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] - (int)tupler= ow1[col][plane1]; // but this is OK (just an 'if-else' rewrite) if((int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] > (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] ) result =3D (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] - (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2]= ; else result =3D (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] - (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1]= ; regards, ++pac. -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 03:37:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 03:37:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C18EB63622 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:36:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DFAD6197 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:35:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27970-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:35:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C84D02B98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:35:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so156165rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:35:46 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=TFUfGiUTO2HG44qhj9eVSmqQBARP/SuDScEWPQcqxqMw1pf7huEKdQQUzq8xF+7d6GtHcGcH/e6zTeP/Y1JzOUwdiVbin5/V+BEeVT5/pubZESO8BuJG5BVErePK46XKdik/DMAtaUCKwC9Ml/aypMjWU4U5XfyiiLdd7aT7sQ0= Received: by 10.38.15.37 with SMTP id 37mr225760rno; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:35:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:35:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:35:46 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_13, J_CHICKENPOX_54, J_CHICKENPOX_74, RCVD_BY_IP, SPF_HELO_PASS, SPF_PASS X-Spam-Level: *** Subject: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm sorry for the off-topic post, but I have no idea where to send this and I suspect there are still Linux experts lurking here who do. Please feel free to forward. $ uname -a Linux t23 2.6.8-1-686 #1 Thu Oct 7 03:15:25 EDT 2004 i686 GNU/Linux $ This program creates a second pthread and then lets the first pthread exit: $ cat x.c #include #include #include void* sleeper(void *a) { for(;;) sleep(1000); } int main(void) { pthread_t id; pthread_create(&id, 0, sleeper, 0); pthread_exit(0); } $ gcc x.c -lpthread $ ./a.out & [1] 4723 $ Because the first pthread has exited, the ps listing makes it look like the process is a zombie, even though it's still running: $ ps axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep rsc 4723 0.0 0.0 0 0 pts/2 Z 13:29 0:00 [a.out] $ The -T and -L flags to ps don't help: $ ps -T axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep $ ps -L axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep $ It's not ps just misdisplaying information: gdb cannot attach either. $ gdb a.out 4723 GNU gdb 6.1-debian Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. Type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4723 ptrace: Operation not permitted. /home/rsc/4723: No such file or directory. (gdb) quit $ On the other hand, if I guess the process/thread id of the second pthread, then I can still look at that: $ gdb a.out 4724 GNU gdb 6.1-debian Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. Type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0...done. [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] [New Thread 1083603888 (LWP 4724)] Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0 Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libc.so.6...done. Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libc.so.6 Reading symbols from /lib/ld-linux.so.2...done. Loaded symbols for /lib/ld-linux.so.2 Reading symbols from /lib/libgcc_s.so.1...done. Loaded symbols for /lib/libgcc_s.so.1 0x400dc5dc in nanosleep () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6 (gdb) quit The program is running. Quit anyway (and detach it)? (y or n) y Detaching from program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 $ But that's stupid. The process known as 4723 has not exited, and it should be debuggable, even though the pthread known as 4723 _has_ exited. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 03:56:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 03:56:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97BCAC6824 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:55:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2628263AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:55:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27866-02-63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C4A663AA6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:55:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.102.136]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <364518-25308>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:54:22 -0500 Message-ID: <00c901c50fa1$ee3ec6d0$88667d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:54:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > On the other hand, if I guess the process/thread id of the > second pthread, then I can still look at that: > > $ gdb a.out 4724 ahh, when i was doing some driver hacking for some PCI based Xilinx FPGA driver i had to learn a buncha stuff about the process structure and all sorts of horrible mire. from what you describe, it is consistant with the way linux does threads. lunix threads are 'processes' and the thread is therefore a new 'process'. my other guess is that their tools are not in sync with the kernel. does linux have crash(8)? that might shed some more light. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 04:16:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 04:16:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1272B63EC7 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0215863EBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00533-01-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9AE7E63E95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D23513398; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:16:13 -1000 (HST) Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:16:13 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <1108020075.2762.2.camel@pallas.invalid> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > % sig memmove > void* memmove(void *s1, void *s2, long n) Ahh, there's a "wish someone had told me earlier" right there! (Also the "src" command). Although this doesnt get me everything that I get from grepping ("sig OREAD" and "sig Disk" dont get me information about OREAD or struct Disk). > russ Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 04:17:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 04:17:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67D1763EFC for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:17:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3286063ED4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29812-01-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net (rwcrmhc11.comcast.net [204.127.198.35]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 23AD263ED1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.34.50.194]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id <2005021019164601300mh26se>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:16:47 +0000 Message-ID: <420BB31D.4060701@abc.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:16:45 -0500 From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_13, J_CHICKENPOX_54, J_CHICKENPOX_74 X-Spam-Level: *** Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: balajis@comcast.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Works for me... [bs@rebox temp]$ uname -a Linux rebox 2.4.20-31.9 #1 Tue Apr 13 17:41:45 EDT 2004 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux [bs@rebox temp]$ cat /etc/redhat-release Red Hat Linux release 9 (Shrike) [bs@rebox temp]$ gcc x.c -lpthread [bs@rebox temp]$ ./a.out & [1] 3909 [bs@rebox temp]$ ps -ef|grep a.out bs 3909 2249 0 14:13 pts/0 00:00:00 ./a.out bs 3928 2281 0 14:14 pts/1 00:00:00 grep a.out [bs@rebox temp]$ gdb a.out 3909 GNU gdb Red Hat Linux (5.3post-0.20021129.18rh) Copyright 2003 Free Software Foundation, Inc. GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. Type "show copying" to see the conditions. There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. This GDB was configured as "i386-redhat-linux-gnu"... Attaching to program: /home/bs/temp/a.out, process 3909 Reading symbols from /lib/libpthread.so.0...done. [New Thread 32769 (LWP 3911)] [New Thread 16386 (LWP 3913)] Loaded symbols for /lib/libpthread.so.0 Reading symbols from /lib/libc.so.6...done. Loaded symbols for /lib/libc.so.6 Reading symbols from /lib/ld-linux.so.2...done. Loaded symbols for /lib/ld-linux.so.2 0x4002ae0d in __pthread_sigsuspend () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 (gdb) where #0 0x4002ae0d in __pthread_sigsuspend () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 #1 0x4002a69d in __pthread_wait_for_restart_signal () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 #2 0x40027506 in __pthread_do_exit () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 #3 0x40027398 in pthread_exit () from /lib/libpthread.so.0 #4 0x0804845c in main () #5 0x4008862d in __libc_start_main () from /lib/libc.so.6 (gdb) q The program is running. Quit anyway (and detach it)? (y or n) y Detaching from program: /home/bs/temp/a.out, process 3909 [bs@rebox temp]$ > I'm sorry for the off-topic post, but I have no idea > where to send this and I suspect there are still Linux > experts lurking here who do. Please feel free to forward. > > $ uname -a > Linux t23 2.6.8-1-686 #1 Thu Oct 7 03:15:25 EDT 2004 i686 GNU/Linux > $ > > This program creates a second pthread and then > lets the first pthread exit: > > $ cat x.c > #include > #include > #include > > void* > sleeper(void *a) > { > for(;;) > sleep(1000); > } > > int > main(void) > { > pthread_t id; > > pthread_create(&id, 0, sleeper, 0); > pthread_exit(0); > } > $ gcc x.c -lpthread > $ ./a.out & > [1] 4723 > $ > > Because the first pthread has exited, the ps listing > makes it look like the process is a zombie, even > though it's still running: > > $ ps axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > rsc 4723 0.0 0.0 0 0 pts/2 Z 13:29 0:00 > [a.out] > $ > > The -T and -L flags to ps don't help: > > $ ps -T axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ ps -L axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ > > It's not ps just misdisplaying information: gdb cannot attach either. > > $ gdb a.out 4723 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4723 > ptrace: Operation not permitted. > /home/rsc/4723: No such file or directory. > (gdb) quit > $ > > On the other hand, if I guess the process/thread id of the > second pthread, then I can still look at that: > > $ gdb a.out 4724 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0...done. > [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] > [New Thread 1083603888 (LWP 4724)] > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libc.so.6...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > Reading symbols from /lib/ld-linux.so.2...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/ld-linux.so.2 > Reading symbols from /lib/libgcc_s.so.1...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/libgcc_s.so.1 > 0x400dc5dc in nanosleep () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > (gdb) quit > The program is running. Quit anyway (and detach it)? (y or n) y > Detaching from program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > $ > > But that's stupid. The process known as 4723 has not > exited, and it should be debuggable, even though the > pthread known as 4723 _has_ exited. > > Russ > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 04:20:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 04:20:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABA0D63F7F for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:20:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 519C663EE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:19:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27866-02-100 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:19:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9fs.org (82-68-131-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.68.131.214]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB82363ED1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:19:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.100.111] (helo=office) by 9fs.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1CzJqo-000H6B-I4 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:19:42 +0000 From: "Nigel Roles" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: RE: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:19:41 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 In-Reply-To: <420BB31D.4060701@abc.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu 9fans-bounces+ngr=9fs.org@cse.psu.edu wrote: > Works for me... > [bs@rebox temp]$ uname -a > Linux rebox 2.4.20-31.9 #1 Tue Apr 13 17:41:45 EDT 2004 i686 i686 Russ has 2.6. I would say that makes all the difference in the world, including version of glibc. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 04:25:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 04:25:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45111C6825 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:24:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7993163EF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:24:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27981-01-81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:24:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C2DBF63EE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:24:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.34.50.194]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2005021019242001600icvf8e>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:24:20 +0000 Message-ID: <420BB4E3.70502@abc.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:24:19 -0500 From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: balajis@comcast.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Nigel Roles wrote: > 9fans-bounces+ngr=9fs.org@cse.psu.edu wrote: > >>Works for me... >>[bs@rebox temp]$ uname -a >>Linux rebox 2.4.20-31.9 #1 Tue Apr 13 17:41:45 EDT 2004 i686 i686 > > > Russ has 2.6. I would say that makes all the difference in the > world, including version of glibc. and I use the NPTL for RedHat Linux. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 05:24:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 05:24:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29332C6809 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:24:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAA58C6788 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:23:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07713-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:23:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96BBFC672E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:23:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from moria.ionkov.net ([68.36.169.182]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2005021020234401600imsdte>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:23:44 +0000 Received: by moria.ionkov.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id DE4BD18C3D4; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:24:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:24:59 -0500 From: Latchesar Ionkov To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint Message-ID: <20050210202459.GA14282@ionkov.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_RCVD_HELO, J_CHICKENPOX_13, J_CHICKENPOX_54, J_CHICKENPOX_74 X-Spam-Level: *** Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu The bug was reported to LKML back in October: http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0410.0/1141.html Lucho On Thu, Feb 10, 2005 at 01:35:46PM -0500, Russ Cox said: > I'm sorry for the off-topic post, but I have no idea > where to send this and I suspect there are still Linux > experts lurking here who do. Please feel free to forward. > > $ uname -a > Linux t23 2.6.8-1-686 #1 Thu Oct 7 03:15:25 EDT 2004 i686 GNU/Linux > $ > > This program creates a second pthread and then > lets the first pthread exit: > > $ cat x.c > #include > #include > #include > > void* > sleeper(void *a) > { > for(;;) > sleep(1000); > } > > int > main(void) > { > pthread_t id; > > pthread_create(&id, 0, sleeper, 0); > pthread_exit(0); > } > $ gcc x.c -lpthread > $ ./a.out & > [1] 4723 > $ > > Because the first pthread has exited, the ps listing > makes it look like the process is a zombie, even > though it's still running: > > $ ps axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > rsc 4723 0.0 0.0 0 0 pts/2 Z 13:29 0:00 > [a.out] > $ > > The -T and -L flags to ps don't help: > > $ ps -T axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ ps -L axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ > > It's not ps just misdisplaying information: gdb cannot attach either. > > $ gdb a.out 4723 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4723 > ptrace: Operation not permitted. > /home/rsc/4723: No such file or directory. > (gdb) quit > $ > > On the other hand, if I guess the process/thread id of the > second pthread, then I can still look at that: > > $ gdb a.out 4724 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0...done. > [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] > [New Thread 1083603888 (LWP 4724)] > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libc.so.6...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > Reading symbols from /lib/ld-linux.so.2...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/ld-linux.so.2 > Reading symbols from /lib/libgcc_s.so.1...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/libgcc_s.so.1 > 0x400dc5dc in nanosleep () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > (gdb) quit > The program is running. Quit anyway (and detach it)? (y or n) y > Detaching from program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > $ > > But that's stupid. The process known as 4723 has not > exited, and it should be debuggable, even though the > pthread known as 4723 _has_ exited. > > Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 05:34:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 05:34:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 638B9C6811 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:34:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 742EC63D1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:34:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10214-03-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:34:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 945C163C9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:34:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so188709wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:34:08 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=DARUdzTQfZI+4XpJ1fs/j2uAJLMmvKVcMmlxsV4697AsuRZFm1wnqxGSFBcFD0PiRt0TwZwAkpb4i0h9X/WwM9hCqmePqS9/hihoa4bZfvP0+mS9VL7Z7IPKY2Ln7Foai7CF5taydbFw6JCHFFsGD9gyVM1KYBSv5ZEInLTJTt8= Received: by 10.54.23.34 with SMTP id 34mr32587wrw; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:34:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.18.24 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:33:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3e1162e6050210123332be7add@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:33:58 -0800 From: David Leimbach To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_13, J_CHICKENPOX_54, J_CHICKENPOX_74, RCVD_BY_IP, SPF_HELO_PASS, SPF_PASS X-Spam-Level: *** Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I tried it on solaris: sultan% ps -p 1362 -o "lwp user pid ppid taskid pcpu pmem fname" LWP USER PID PPID TASKID %CPU %MEM COMMAND 1 dave 1362 1354 59 - 0.1 2 dave 1362 1354 59 0.0 0.1 x 2 Light Weight processes, one of which is defunct. Sounds similar to the linux behavior. Dave On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:35:46 -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > I'm sorry for the off-topic post, but I have no idea > where to send this and I suspect there are still Linux > experts lurking here who do. Please feel free to forward. > > $ uname -a > Linux t23 2.6.8-1-686 #1 Thu Oct 7 03:15:25 EDT 2004 i686 GNU/Linux > $ > > This program creates a second pthread and then > lets the first pthread exit: > > $ cat x.c > #include > #include > #include > > void* > sleeper(void *a) > { > for(;;) > sleep(1000); > } > > int > main(void) > { > pthread_t id; > > pthread_create(&id, 0, sleeper, 0); > pthread_exit(0); > } > $ gcc x.c -lpthread > $ ./a.out & > [1] 4723 > $ > > Because the first pthread has exited, the ps listing > makes it look like the process is a zombie, even > though it's still running: > > $ ps axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > rsc 4723 0.0 0.0 0 0 pts/2 Z 13:29 0:00 > [a.out] > $ > > The -T and -L flags to ps don't help: > > $ ps -T axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ ps -L axwwu|grep a.out |grep -v grep > $ > > It's not ps just misdisplaying information: gdb cannot attach either. > > $ gdb a.out 4723 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4723 > ptrace: Operation not permitted. > /home/rsc/4723: No such file or directory. > (gdb) quit > $ > > On the other hand, if I guess the process/thread id of the > second pthread, then I can still look at that: > > $ gdb a.out 4724 > GNU gdb 6.1-debian > Copyright 2004 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > GDB is free software, covered by the GNU General Public License, and you are > welcome to change it and/or distribute copies of it under certain conditions. > Type "show copying" to see the conditions. > There is absolutely no warranty for GDB. Type "show warranty" for details. > This GDB was configured as "i386-linux"...Using host libthread_db > library "/lib/tls/libthread_db.so.1". > > Attaching to program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0...done. > [Thread debugging using libthread_db enabled] > [New Thread 1083603888 (LWP 4724)] > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libpthread.so.0 > Reading symbols from /lib/tls/libc.so.6...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > Reading symbols from /lib/ld-linux.so.2...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/ld-linux.so.2 > Reading symbols from /lib/libgcc_s.so.1...done. > Loaded symbols for /lib/libgcc_s.so.1 > 0x400dc5dc in nanosleep () from /lib/tls/libc.so.6 > (gdb) quit > The program is running. Quit anyway (and detach it)? (y or n) y > Detaching from program: /home/rsc/a.out, process 4724 > $ > > But that's stupid. The process known as 4723 has not > exited, and it should be debuggable, even though the > pthread known as 4723 _has_ exited. > > Russ > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 06:07:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 06:07:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50C1063ECF for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:06:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3E4DBFC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:06:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07713-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:06:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE059BF6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:06:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so185140rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:06:29 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=bGNIFk/Lr3gA3X2X2kg+ALmr/1bKS+pXZvJP9StBtnCY2p6OdgS3vEodKB1Xv9fOHSTZesBeax/nsvI8q+rA7xRHng6Y92VkqedUL/Vnbnt1QGVEsdybUjY+KBSddgVJuXnQMpcG+WZApFUnWBVmldJSdK6zePCtOG9VgG5MmkA= Received: by 10.38.79.48 with SMTP id c48mr32494rnb; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:58:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:58:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 15:58:24 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: David Leimbach Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint In-Reply-To: <3e1162e6050210123332be7add@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <3e1162e6050210123332be7add@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I tried it on solaris: > > sultan% ps -p 1362 -o "lwp user pid ppid taskid pcpu pmem fname" > LWP USER PID PPID TASKID %CPU %MEM COMMAND > 1 dave 1362 1354 59 - 0.1 > 2 dave 1362 1354 59 0.0 0.1 x > > 2 Light Weight processes, one of which is defunct. Sounds similar to > the linux behavior. The Linux behavior -- that ps is misleading and gdb is unusable unless you have some magic guess as to some other "pid" -- is broken. SunOS is not broken this way: ps shows a non-zombie process, and the debugger can attach to it. % ./a.out & [3] 12058 % ps -aA -o 'user,pid,stime,time,rss,s,args' | grep a.out rsc 12058 15:55:40 0:00 920 S ./a.out % adb a.out :A 12058 $c libc.so.1`_libc_nanosleep+4(3e8, ff350234, 0, 0, 0, 0) sleeper+0xc(0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0) libthread.so.1`_lwp_start(0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0) ^D % Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 09:04:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 09:04:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56275C68E3 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:04:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B287863EBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:03:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08938-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:03:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0329063E47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:03:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.102.136]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <363162-14538>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 19:03:28 -0500 Message-ID: <011201c50fcd$1d417ab0$88667d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <41F879E200020C44@stateless1.tiscali.cz><002301c50e8a$56392af0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> <005d01c50e9f$ee3de5b0$7c18dfd5@kilgore> Subject: Re: [9fans] 8c (pcc) bug?? Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 01:03:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="ISO-8859-2"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu russ has pointed out that my fix has bugs, so don't apply it. i'm gonna have another look "i'm sure it's down here somewhere". -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 11 10:48:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 11 10:48:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 72DAAC68CF for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:47:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A194C67C5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:47:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13620-01-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:47:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50518C67B1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:47:27 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so227258rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 17:47:26 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=OAEx2ZIfavzj/AnVzoEfXPyR/ynV0vc2lsVMZeeZOf7Al8FT7uXbGwU9sxZIF/MTntl4dYG0Y6s7voetADvieMjTOqV8T1/EECAVpRcf3B8YQBf1QB08UfO+Hz/UQaB52JoXMe7QOJJbl76KhPZPbNzI6Z/U7yYMitQ+PMNcOkE= Received: by 10.38.70.70 with SMTP id s70mr124576rna; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 17:46:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.65.69 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2005 17:46:56 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <57a21f7305021017466498d2a8@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 17:46:56 -0800 From: Taj Khattra To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Taj Khattra , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i think the process' task_struct->mm may already have been deallocated which is why ptrace() fails for gdb? % grep State /proc/5962/status /proc/5963/status /proc/5962/status:State: Z (zombie) /proc/5963/status:State: S (sleeping) % cat /proc/5962/maps % From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 01:17:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 01:17:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46E73C68BB for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:16:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 737CB60E5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:15:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02786-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:15:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EC67273 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:15:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGFSRm008477 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:15:29 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGFReJ030636; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:15:28 -0700 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:15:27 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu The new thread is going to do a clone, which gets you a new pid. So you'll see old pid as zombie, new pid as new proc. That's what I thought, and I just tested this on my machine and it sure seems to work that way. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 01:23:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 01:23:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14910C565 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:22:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DAE1BDE5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:22:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02786-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:22:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70C9CB9D0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:22:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGMBk0009368 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:22:11 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGMAQM031218; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:22:10 -0700 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:22:10 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] off-topic linux threading bug complaint In-Reply-To: <20050210202459.GA14282@ionkov.net> Message-ID: References: <20050210202459.GA14282@ionkov.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Russ Cox X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 10 Feb 2005, Latchesar Ionkov wrote: > The bug was reported to LKML back in October: > > http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0410.0/1141.html what's weird for me is that the process really does exit. It does not hang around. But I'm on 2.6.10. Actually, the child doesn't hang around at all either. Can someone remind me: the 'thread group leader', if it exits: doesn't it take everyone with it? Because on my box the parent does an exit_group and that does indeed take the child out. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 01:28:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 01:28:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18A9563F92 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86DF8BFC8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08582-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.67]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09777BEFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.155]) by imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with SMTP id <20050211162729.TQUP2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:29 -0500 X-Mailer: Openwave WebEngine, version 2.8.16.1 (webedge20-101-1106-101-20040924) X-Originating-IP: [199.82.243.74] From: To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:27:29 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20050211162729.TQUP2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I have Plan9 running in Xen. (Thanks for the pointer to the images on sources. I ended up pulling them down using an instance running in qemu. Ain't virtualization fun?) Anyway, after changing the bootes password as instructed in the archives I am getting the "dreaded" cannot authenticate with p9 message from drawterm. auth/debug and /sys/log/auth both seem to be fine on the xen instance of Plan9. I was able to successfully drawterm to a file server machine at home last night, which brings up a question about /dev/draw on a machine with an unsupported video card. (But that's a question for another day.) So why can't I drawterm into the Plan9 instance on Xen? Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 01:49:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 01:49:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EF415EE0 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:49:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30A5263ACA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:48:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09154-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B6A663AA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGmSND013488 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:48:28 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BGmRh9001224 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:48:27 -0700 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:48:27 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen In-Reply-To: <20050211162729.TQUP2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> Message-ID: References: <20050211162729.TQUP2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@mail.bellsouth.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu sorry about this. nobody has had luck changing the password. Just don't change the password for now, password is ronronron have fun. ronronron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 02:12:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 02:12:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53095C683F for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:12:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5384B63A91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:12:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10510-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:12:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E490E63A8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:12:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <14bb26a2151d1dfbeb187f51ae12139c@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 17:12:19 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>Just don't change the password for now, password is >>ronronron not dadoronronron?? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 02:21:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 02:21:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BB37C68ED for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:21:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 533EB63B83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:20:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10545-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:20:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9fs.org (82-68-131-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.68.131.214]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D44B163B13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:20:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.44.43.80] (helo=[172.16.24.1]) by 9fs.org with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1CzeTE-000Icl-Sl for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 17:20:44 +0000 Message-ID: <420CE96B.6000101@9fs.org> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 17:20:43 +0000 From: Nigel Roles User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen References: <14bb26a2151d1dfbeb187f51ae12139c@terzarima.net> In-Reply-To: <14bb26a2151d1dfbeb187f51ae12139c@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Charles Forsyth wrote: >>>Just don't change the password for now, password is >>>ronronron >>> >>> >not dadoronronron?? > > > Oh thanks goodness. I thought the opportunity was going to be passed up. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 03:13:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 03:13:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D021FC68AF for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:13:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EE7DB5D7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:12:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15660-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:12:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8C3FB1C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:12:54 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so377732wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 10:12:54 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=XE/I8SBy4rpbbqFXjYAlSjI15fluNeVuJhDN9gudH6bUGDbtRmSqXn1VlaikUVojlN0iYiHPuDwVvcLF3TWLM3oi+TKvgko15gify24KgHKpIxQTCTyznEdZ6vZCIjjMBhKX+ozKRYwMUFCHfmBv8Vojkve5kcdNlaI19dhcsGU= Received: by 10.54.17.37 with SMTP id 37mr105118wrq; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 10:12:53 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 10:12:53 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905021110121c7b659@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 05:12:53 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <41F879E20002544F@stateless1.tiscali.cz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <41F879E20002544F@stateless1.tiscali.cz> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu We've been down this road. Please give me a one page program that exhibits this bug and I'll fix 8c for a cz beer. brucee On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 16:28:56 +0100, tapique@tiscali.cz wrote: > //pcc complains: > result =3D (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] > (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] ? = (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] > - (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] : (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] - (int)tupler= ow1[col][plane1]; >=20 > // but this is OK (just an 'if-else' rewrite) > if((int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] > (int)tuplerow2[co= l][plane2] ) > result =3D (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1] - = (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2]; > else > result =3D (int)tuplerow2[col][plane2] - = (int)tuplerow1[col][plane1]; >=20 > regards, > ++pac. >=20 > -------------------------- > Pos=C3=ADlejte SMS p=C5=99es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCA= LI. > V=C3=ADce na http://www.tiscali.cz >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 03:47:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 03:47:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BAA06B692 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:46:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BD6963B73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:45:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18791-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:45:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 742B463B6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:45:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BIj7d6001392 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:45:07 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BIj6aR013035 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:45:06 -0700 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:45:06 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] have fun with HP X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu http://www.everythingispossible.com/ it's pretty scathing ... but very funny. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 06:24:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 06:24:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6F2FDC696D for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:23:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C737AC675B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:23:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05275-01-84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DEA663F7A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEB1D172D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:23:24 -1000 (HST) Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:23:24 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] mail questions X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm setting up mail (through gmail) on my machine. I'm following the wiki directions. I was able to get upas to check mail from the remote pop fine. Now I'm trying to get outgoing smtp working. The first thing I noticed was that the instructions in the wiki seem to be wrong here: Try to send email to the server: ;upas/send -d -a -h mymachine.dom net!smtp.myserver.dom account-on-server dest-user@sest-system.dom running this command gives a usage error and the flags dont line up at all. Is this the wrong command name? Or have the flags changed? Second I'm getting some errors when I try to send out. I'm using the rewrite-gateway setup and edited fd= in remotemail. When I send mail out /sys/log/smtp.fail says dns: dns failure (net!$smtp). I do have an smtp=... line in my /lib/ndb/local for my ipnet. ip/ipquery ip smtp displays the line properly and con -l 'net!$smtp!smtp' connects to the remote properly. Why am I getting this error? Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 06:49:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 06:49:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B0AD8B8D8 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:49:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 35309C687F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:48:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01303-02-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EA8263DC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BLmUrF026244 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:48:30 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1BLmU1u031908 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:48:30 -0700 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:48:30 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] job posting for Plan 9 types X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu See this: http://www.hr.lanl.gov/JPS/SingleJobAd.asp?ReqNumber=209754&ReqScope=INTERNAL%2FEXTERNAL&ReqTitle=STAFF+MEMBER&JobType=JobSearch&JobReopened=N One key attribute is: Demonstrated research work in extending or modifying any one of the Linux, Plan9, or BSD kernels. yeah, plan 9 is on the list. But Xen and Linux are too, and this is not a job for a Linux-phobe, just a job for a Plan9-phile. You pretty much have to be a US citizen, sorry about that, but DOE is making non-US a real pain in the a@@ nowadays. I hope nobody minds the spam, but I figure job postings for Plan 9 philes are not that frequent. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 09:13:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 09:13:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE28FC6868 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:13:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B92E2C686A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:12:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17227-01-50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:12:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFA3BC6868 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:12:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 831B77468F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 01:12:51 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <18922f27aeceafa670c459b89c81b7d0@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 01:12:49 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > The first thing I noticed was that the instructions in > the wiki seem to be wrong here: > > Try to send email to the server: > > ;upas/send -d -a -h mymachine.dom net!smtp.myserver.dom > account-on-server dest-user@sest-system.dom Do you really tried upas/send this way (or is this a typo)? send(8) is not documented to take these options. But instead, smtp(8) knows exactly these options. (perhaps the wiki is wrong on that?) (Just for completeness: The upas/smtp command is called in /mail/lib/remotemail and can be reconfigured there.) Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 09:33:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 09:33:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68282C695E for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:33:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 193FC63C86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:32:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16001-01-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:32:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 455EE63C71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 19:32:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 989E3742A7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 01:32:49 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <251e54f746dba758e91cfc4b1a13cb30@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 01:32:48 +0100 In-Reply-To: <18922f27aeceafa670c459b89c81b7d0@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Do you really tried upas/send this way (or is this a typo)? It's late and and perhaps the wine... Well: "Did you really try..." =C3=84hem... ;-)) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 11:10:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 11:10:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4D29C6909 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 21:09:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBDDBC688C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 21:09:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25975-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 21:09:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BD7FC687E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 21:09:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC50F1339A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:09:30 -1000 (HST) Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:09:30 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions In-Reply-To: <18922f27aeceafa670c459b89c81b7d0@voidness.de> Message-ID: References: <18922f27aeceafa670c459b89c81b7d0@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> ;upas/send -d -a -h mymachine.dom net!smtp.myserver.dom >> account-on-server dest-user@sest-system.dom > > Do you really tried upas/send this way (or is this a typo)? Yes, that line is from the wiki. Looks like "smtp" is what they meant. Looks like upas/smtp doesnt like getting 'net!$smtp' as an address. I hardwired my smtp gateway into /mail/bin/remotemail and got passed the x509 certificate bits (added -a so that it knows to use ssl, and added the cert to the proper file). Now it seems like it should be succeeding, but that the smtp program is confused: p9term Feb 11 19:02:01 delivery to smtp.gmail.com failed: 250-smtp.gmail.com at your service 250-SIZE 20971520 250-8BITMIME 250-AUTH LOGIN PLAIN 250 ENHANCEDSTATUSCODES The smtp host is saying "everything's good" and upas is saying "failed." Is anyone currently using gmail's smtp service? Tim N. PS. My /sys/src/cmd/upas/* and corresponding /bin/* are up to date. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 13:46:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 13:46:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51B77C691B for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 23:45:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 314053BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 23:45:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03254-02-44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 23:45:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6A22C685E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 23:45:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A8E217219 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 11 Feb 2005 18:45:25 -1000 (HST) Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 18:45:25 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] zerotrunc? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Looks like sys/src/cmd/aux/mkfile is missing a rule for building and installing aux/zerotrunc. Any reason why? fossil/conf is trying to invoke it. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 14:07:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 14:07:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FB38C688E for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 00:06:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57A4363AB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 00:06:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03254-02-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 00:06:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6995563AA6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 00:06:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 00:06:15 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] zerotrunc? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu no good reason i can think of. On Fri Feb 11 23:46:56 EST 2005, newsham@lava.net wrote: > Looks like sys/src/cmd/aux/mkfile is missing a rule for building > and installing aux/zerotrunc. Any reason why? fossil/conf > is trying to invoke it. > > Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 12 20:29:36 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 12 20:29:36 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1343C699C for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 06:29:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE02363B65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 06:28:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24308-02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 06:28:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F22C763A01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 06:28:57 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1CBUb37022832 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 13:30:39 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Sat, 12 Feb 2005 13:28:53 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] job posting for Plan 9 types References: Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 13:28:51 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2005 11:28:53.0023 (UTC) FILETIME=[07E2CAF0:01C510F6] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > I hope nobody minds the spam, but I figure job postings for Plan 9 phil= es > are not that frequent. It's the first during my Plan 9 time. Tiit, pre-open source From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 00:37:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 00:37:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 890A463A01 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:37:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34222AFA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:36:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05324-01-45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:36:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46095B057 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:36:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.19] (port=1164 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1CzzJv-0000dr-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 18:36:31 +0300 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 15:42:51 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1556930515.20050212154251@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] replica X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans I got new installation cd, and use replica/pull I change 'cd' profile from kfs to fossil target, and run replica/pull. When pull reached /usr/glenda/lib/profile it write '... file does not exist...' (i remove glenda user from my system). Does it mean replica/pull broken (and some files after /usr dir not processed) or it's only report at end of work? Why not change 'clientroot' (in replica profile) to '/root'? It's should work in kfs and fossil too. -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 01:16:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 01:16:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13296C68F2 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:16:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B34731931 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:15:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08196-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 239CF318DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:15:37 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so461716rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:15:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ImkZaQW//VZwUZ2fNpZuLzPzHnF/4fEntBTdk7swG5ZS7FQQVfNWfpwEpn9h6MmSNexkX49X1gAeHIiPEDI4XBZAdJqaAjJ/EuozskX9LF0b9dlwSzutb2IX6cR6+9viMNfHbF3ERWSAOBvL6bb/jPasjPowWTiDZFzCMCZDPAU= Received: by 10.38.66.77 with SMTP id o77mr306203rna; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:15:36 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:15:36 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 11:15:36 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] replica In-Reply-To: <1556930515.20050212154251@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1556930515.20050212154251@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > When pull reached /usr/glenda/lib/profile it write '... file does not exist...' > (i remove glenda user from my system). > > Does it mean replica/pull broken (and some files after /usr dir not > processed) or it's only report at end of work? errors are reported at the end. > Why not change 'clientroot' (in replica profile) to '/root'? It's > should work in kfs and fossil too. the existence of /root is a side-effect of the boot script. i'd rather that things didn't depend on it. also if you have rootdir set in plan9.ini then /root and / may be very different trees. finally, it won't work for fossil since we need to arrange a special non-permissions-checked connection for people who don't like putting themselves in group sys. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 02:01:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 02:01:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9CC3FC6927 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 12:01:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB375C672E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 12:00:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11834-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 12:00:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8058763FDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 12:00:56 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so437939wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:00:55 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=caEifE6exGSRBbDKaZYNx/ggC5+mBho61WhPC/r15lJFje1MgBtMp4v4WuTGC4KgSSa5x60DBASNAajq33O3xblJyPRkMquTNIpGyxKp8OoZOZtKu0kHZlFWojnSKwztf/NkE1GDddOScyfcqWdpwe20nWdt6M//FxLienWhFjg= Received: by 10.54.22.68 with SMTP id 68mr31230wrv; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:00:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.18.24 with HTTP; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:00:54 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3e1162e60502120900196cfbb2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:00:54 -0800 From: David Leimbach To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] job posting for Plan 9 types In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I hope nobody minds the spam, but I figure job postings for Plan 9 philes > are not that frequent. > > ron > > Ron, if I didn't already have a job I enjoyed I'd be very excited about such a possible position. Especially hoping to be able to work with like minded individuals such as yourself. I don't see how this could be offtopic for a "9fans" list :). In fact I'd like to see more such activity personally. Dave From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 12:16:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 12:16:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE4EA63E06 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 22:15:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09ACA63DDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 22:14:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15672-01-65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 22:14:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55E5663DCE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 22:14:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050213031452.ECAS2060.imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 12 Feb 2005 22:14:52 -0500 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen In-reply-to: Your message of Fri, 11 Feb 2005 09:48:27 -0700 (MST) . Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 21:14:36 -0600 Message-Id: <20050213031452.ECAS2060.imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , "Ronald G. Minni ch" writes: >sorry about this. nobody has had luck changing the password. > >Just don't change the password for now, password is >ronronron > >have fun. > >ronronron Excellent! It's now working happily. Now my biggest challenge is finding the time to compile a fossil kernel and set thing up so that I can run with the same file system I use when booting directly. Speaking of booting directly, has anyone by any chance done a driver for the Broadcom Tigon3 Ethernet controller? That's what's in this new laptop. Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 21:52:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 21:52:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 070D0C6958 for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 07:52:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86D1F63DD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 07:51:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15848-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 07:51:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E8C563B94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 07:51:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([80.125.210.190]) by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <362290-2198>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 07:51:05 -0500 Message-ID: <010c01c511ca$af193d20$bed27d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:51:05 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] ndb ether attr value X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu devon and i noticed that if you use upper case in /lib/ndb/* for an ether value you don't get a match. i've had a look at the cs/libip/libndb code and there seems no good way of handling this. perhaps it should be noted somewhere rather than hacking up code for a trivial end case? i can't recall seing this documented. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 22:21:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 22:21:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C88AC68EC for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:21:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97E6A63E43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18316-02-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:21:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFB9663DF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:21:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 432C075366 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 14:21:04 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <2d917f6e8e4b6ea9d3497711e254b999@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 14:20:56 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Yes, that line is from the wiki. Looks like "smtp" is what > they meant. Looks like upas/smtp doesnt like getting 'net!$smtp' > as an address. I hardwired my smtp gateway into /mail/bin/remotemail > and got passed the x509 certificate bits (added -a so that it > knows to use ssl, and added the cert to the proper file). > > Now it seems like it should be succeeding, but that the smtp > program is confused: > > p9term Feb 11 19:02:01 delivery to smtp.gmail.com failed: > 250-smtp.gmail.com at your service > 250-SIZE 20971520 > 250-8BITMIME > 250-AUTH LOGIN PLAIN > 250 ENHANCEDSTATUSCODES > > The smtp host is saying "everything's good" and upas is saying > "failed." When I try to post a message with upas/smtp -a I can't get around the following error that shows up in /sys/log/smtp: | talisker Feb 13 13:20:36 remote cert. has bad thumbprint: x509 sha1=08F63C39700EA3F2DCD47B9DE70358123BE09DB6 server=smtp.web.de although I added | x509 sha1=08F63C39700EA3F2DCD47B9DE70358123BE09DB6 server=smtp.web.de to /sys/lib/tls/mail. In the SMTP dialog, the client therefore keeps silence after it requested STARTTLS and the server the server said "go ahead". The session quits through timeout, then. Is that also what you get? BTW: The man page of smtp(8) explains the meaning of '-a' two times (slightly differing, slightly confusing) > Is anyone currently using gmail's smtp service? I gave up trying to send mail via authenticated SMTP at this point last year. Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 13 22:27:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 13 22:27:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E59FC6921 for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:27:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65DCB63F05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:27:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18319-01-39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout16.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.16]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53B7F63F03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050213132703.JQCP8887.mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:27:03 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050213132703.DFFX13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:27:03 +0000 Message-ID: <9bc38ee99b2d3f9fcbecaca71f3011c3@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:27:00 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions In-Reply-To: <2d917f6e8e4b6ea9d3497711e254b999@voidness.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu For the archives: To receive TLS encrypted email (via pop or imap) you need to put the thumbprint in /sys/lib/tls/smtp. To send TLS encrypted email (via smtp) you need to put the thumbprint in /sys/lib/tls/smtp -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 01:18:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 01:18:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E195AC6919 for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:17:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9645AC6900 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:17:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24762-01-100 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62C92C68FF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:17:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so548754rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:17:28 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=N4dA2lB3R07GPLHdPRLkq6jRLFsAZkjdrwvFmO64gKXutZOpjXH6DYZvRRKAKXXM0sKmsob/wphOkxS3srUKHZWH6HKCs+/M8ELdzDRxSYOgupOStLQOrM6pWNZvFFqIFS6fIdzDXcyoQmEJLZYWm4UDYyO46A6uZG4W7alevzM= Received: by 10.38.65.12 with SMTP id n12mr244585rna; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:17:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:17:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:17:28 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] mail questions In-Reply-To: <9bc38ee99b2d3f9fcbecaca71f3011c3@quintile.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <2d917f6e8e4b6ea9d3497711e254b999@voidness.de> <9bc38ee99b2d3f9fcbecaca71f3011c3@quintile.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > To receive TLS encrypted email (via pop or imap) you need to put the > thumbprint in /sys/lib/tls/smtp. no, mail. > To send TLS encrypted email (via smtp) you need to put the thumbprint in > /sys/lib/tls/smtp yes. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 13:33:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 13:33:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34770BDFC for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:48:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 347DA63F4B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:48:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04140-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout15.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.15]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 792FF63FBF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 13:48:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050213184828.BDVO1139.mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:48:28 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050213184827.XAEQ3760.aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:48:27 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:48:24 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] prophetic X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Re: my bad with TLS certs. One of my lecturers used to say: "Cut and paste have a lot to answer for" If you work in TV, his other one is relevant: "Never undestimate the horrors of interlace" -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 13:49:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 13:49:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8842DC699B for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:51:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6CE4763E7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:51:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22598-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:50:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (blacksheep.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FE1663E3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:50:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (pool-151-201-48-12.pitt.east.verizon.net [151.201.48.12]) by blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9A5B930D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:50:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <420FE7D8.7080900@csh.rit.edu> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:50:48 -0500 From: George Gensure User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] i81x development X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Just started adding support for my 852/855GM chipset Intel graph card, and after adding the device id under the i81x software (kernel, aux/vga and /lib/vgadb), I end up with a blank screen (no display at all). Is anyone else working on something similar, or seen a reason why this chipset should be any different from the rest of the Intel i81x line? Thanks, -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 14:05:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 14:05:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C074B8EE for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 22:42:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C87B376 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 22:42:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05909-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 22:42:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9602679 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 22:42:12 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so610042rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:42:12 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=A9Svfbztz1sRNYBMsZMMxZd6dYsHlE7I2yaM+8X/mNcyN37XPdDZ10PupgBtihAvwHAMONqauz0K6SpK0aAQS4sxXSlJxlYtgUg2NjBphx37gt+sgLUClZyBTgd3iE7D0+BCJGPuMSUchhdvYOCx0H/a65HGNhVXr+uDVxcxgdk= Received: by 10.38.92.21 with SMTP id p21mr89990rnb; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:42:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:42:11 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 22:42:11 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: <982d3bcedf7d8fddec08e270c610616d@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <982d3bcedf7d8fddec08e270c610616d@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Oookay, a cpu server can run in multiple auth doms! > I thought a cpu could only run in a single auth dom... > > Is this the same for other services which authenticate via > factotum 'proto=p9any' that they accepts multiple auth domain as well? > I guess the answer is yes... Anything that uses proto=p9any (factotum, cpu, etc.) kind of runs in multiple auth domains, though the names are treated as a flat space by the kernel. Other services, like apop or p9cr, don't have p9any's flexibility and are tied to a specific domain -- the domain on the first p9sk1 server key. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 14:06:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 14:06:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B932C69AB for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 15:04:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AF5963FAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 15:04:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10592-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 15:04:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D32F563F2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 15:03:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so568079rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 12:03:59 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=E0oqF2bWjWGncqINpUuZ/hko9gSMNRDOY8Vjk9QInWJfhk9oRHzuY0hv8bgLIfpZ84vJIbnndYozpXHG7y2qv+cF8Es4alwD9vMQQd47hWfB5dvixcc8IpJXfs4Tbichw0vDxJQsANJsSbM+jhAlrBQ8aiQPWrlcq5tgH//sWXA= Received: by 10.38.89.32 with SMTP id m32mr352793rnb; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 12:03:59 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 12:03:59 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 15:03:59 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries In-Reply-To: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <773e440ebeb76f706118be8d73bfca39@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > I changed things so that the new keys get inserted at the beginning > > of the list. That should help a bit. > > When the factotum is the one started by kernel on a cpu server, > adding a new key to the beginning of the list might change the > authdom which the cpu server running in? I was working on factotum and I realized that this question doesn't actually make sense. The cpu server runs in as many authentication domains as there are p9sk1 server keys in its factotum. It doesn't matter where you put the key -- beginning or end of list. In the p9any protocol, factotum will offer as possible authentication domains all the proto=p9sk1 keys that have no role attribute or an explicit role=server attribute. It's not generally safe to be using the cpu server factotum as your personal one, since adding new role-less p9sk1 keys allows people in those domains to get in. Probably the key prompt should make sure to specify a role whenever it asks for a key. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 14:22:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 14:22:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCEE363620 for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:35:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB80863DCF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:35:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04309-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:35:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 62AFB63E6A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:35:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 91009 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2005 02:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 14 Feb 2005 02:35:12 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 14 Feb 2005 02:35:12 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1E2ZCq341320; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 11:35:12 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <982d3bcedf7d8fddec08e270c610616d@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] factotum & invalid entries From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 11:35:03 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > When the factotum is the one started by kernel on a cpu server, > > adding a new key to the beginning of the list might change the > > authdom which the cpu server running in? > > I was working on factotum and I realized that this question > doesn't actually make sense. The cpu server runs in as many > authentication domains as there are p9sk1 server keys in its > factotum. Oookay, a cpu server can run in multiple auth doms! I thought a cpu could only run in a single auth dom... Is this the same for other services which authenticate via factotum 'proto=p9any' that they accepts multiple auth domain as well? I guess the answer is yes... -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 14:39:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 14:39:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8707FC69FF for ; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:42:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFC75C6942 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25990-02-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:41:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52037C693F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:41:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so593237rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 16:41:45 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=SO1Mwsaciqf5mk95RGihorXmjyz1GWIohLZWpHV7ndL/R4L2G3QGUrfuZBF8sOx3E80sce3BqlCmHXZZ4wpkrvxA7zzwm212M81GI5Z+7OKY1bA2ZT8E0imSUXIl4OUZzgjzu3Dx0i53SzDQq9B9YYStpsmXG3zJILzEEkjJ0SQ= Received: by 10.38.79.74 with SMTP id c74mr194841rnb; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 16:41:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 13 Feb 2005 16:41:45 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:41:45 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] plan9port: recent changes X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Lots of little changes in the past week or so: autoindent for sam, better label handling in awd et al., new diff flags -c and -a, various stack overflow fixes (*cough* X11 *cough*), programs should work better with SIGTSTP, SIGTTIN, and SIGTTOU, lots of little bug fixes. The big new additions are factotum and various supporting libraries and programs. Thanks to Lucho, plan9port now has a working factotum that can be used with 9p to access files on protected servers: =09ibook=3D; factotum =09ibook=3D; sources=3D'tcp!sources.cs.bell-labs.com!9fs' =09ibook=3D; 9p -a $sources read plan9/adm/users =09!adding key: role=3Dclient proto=3Dp9sk1 dom=3Doutside.plan9.bell-labs.c= om =09user[rsc]: bozo =09password: =09! =09-1:adm:adm:bootes =090:none:adm: =091:tor:tor: =092:glenda:glenda: =099999:noworld:: =0910000:sys:: =0910001:upas:upas: =0910002:bootes:bootes: =09ibook=3D; 9p -a $sources read plan9/NOTICE =09Copyright =A9 2002 Lucent Technologies Inc. =09All Rights Reserved =09ibook=3D;=20 Over the weekend I added DSA and RSA signature support to factotum and used them to implement an ssh-agent front end for factotum: =09l=3D; factotum =09secstore password:=20 =09l=3D; eval `{9 ssh-agent} =09l=3D; ssh tux =09tux=3D; ^D =09l=3D;=20 It's hard to see, but ssh used factotum via the ssh-agent interface to authenticate to tux. Also hard to see is the fact that this is using SSH version 2 keys (SSH1 is also supported), so this setup is ahead of Plan 9. (Sadly, it's not too easy to move the DSA and RSA support back into Plan 9, firstly due to the lack of an SSH2 client. Also the=20 factotum is completely different--simpler--inside.) Enjoy. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 14 15:38:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 14 15:38:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E1BBC6ABC for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 01:37:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5076C6982 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 01:36:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21454-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 01:36:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38C98C6981 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 01:36:51 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1E6cbO6028895 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:38:38 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:36:47 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] i81x development References: <420FE7D8.7080900@csh.rit.edu> Message-ID: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:36:46 +0200 In-Reply-To: <420FE7D8.7080900@csh.rit.edu> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Feb 2005 06:36:47.0418 (UTC) FILETIME=[8EA331A0:01C5125F] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Just started adding support for my 852/855GM chipset Intel graph card, = =20 > and after adding the device id under the i81x software (kernel, aux/vga= =20 > and /lib/vgadb), I end up with a blank screen (no display at all). Is = =20 > anyone else working on something similar, or seen a reason why this =20 > chipset should be any different from the rest of the Intel i81x line? AFAIK 81x and 85x are completely incompatible (different designs). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:32:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:32:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FA8AC69EA for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:31:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0FE6F63F39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:31:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27121-01-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:31:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30EC563F35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:31:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so606043wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:31:05 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=kVDsBKPkzeJPsODj+c0qmVnRL3+yC4ML4ISjHtrZ/sgiYihn6GTZxElz5y4bSJVQ0fPYvaqHAgjBaceo0S8VpHwSHr4/iu2Xe2azMceTjbA1fCl7t+02p+6RguWS3EAz/5jMEa8GlbS7V0Jau5hCLoB1LRdefDUmU2PDhNDC9DY= Received: by 10.54.20.71 with SMTP id 71mr131912wrt; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:31:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:31:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905021412313a0ec28d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 07:31:04 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i don't like autoindent ... it always seems to do what i don't want it to do, the tab key is big, and i don't write deeply nested code. but if you do - fine ... make it an option (i hate thousands of options too). good to see a prolifertion of factota - the ozinferno one is even simpler than the original, but loads modules on demand to do the good stuff. brucee On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:09:34 -0500, Russ Cox wrote: > A few people have reported that running acme and exiting > leaves behind a 9pserve process with the effect that you can't > run acme a second time. I believe I just checked in a fix to this bug, > which I introduced trying to work around the pthread nonsense > we were discussing last week. After updating from CVS, you'll > have to rebuild libthread and then 9pserve (or just use > cd $PLAN9; ./INSTALL -- it's still much faster than compiling the > Linux kernel). > > It's worth noting for everyone that you can't run two acmes in > the same "name space" since they'll both want to post as the Unix > socket `namespace`/acme. If you want to start a new "name space" > you can set $NAMESPACE manually, as in > > mkdir /tmp/ns; NAMESPACE=/tmp/ns; export NAMESPACE > > and then you'll have a separate acme that is isolated from the > first (and from the plumber that the first acme is using). > > Intro(4) has details. > > Setting $NAMESPACE also lets you run file servers before you > start X and share them with your X session. For example, in my > .profile I have the following: > > # Logging in on tty1 sets up factotum and then runs X automatically > if [ "`/bin/ls -l /proc/self/fd/0 2>/dev/null | awk '{print $NF}'`" = > '/dev/tty1' ] > then > NAMESPACE=/tmp/ns.`hostname` > export NAMESPACE > rm -rf $NAMESPACE; mkdir $NAMESPACE > 9 factotum > eval `9 ssh-agent -e` > startx > fi > > I have to start factotum and ssh-agent before X because I run > stats to remote machines (via ssh) in my .xinitrc, and so that > the $SSH_AUTH_SOCK variable is set in all my X windows. > > Russ > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:32:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:32:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82B4BC69F5 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 10:13:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC67563D21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 10:13:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27791-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 10:13:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtaout2.012.net.il (mtaout2.012.net.il [84.95.2.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CEB3863D09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 10:13:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com ([80.179.113.222]) by i_mtaout2.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTP id <0IBW00GZSQDMOC30@i_mtaout2.012.net.il> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 17:15:23 +0200 (IST) Received: from skeeve.com (skeeve [127.0.0.1]) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1EFD6cY022643 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 17:13:06 +0200 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j1EFD6kL022642 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 17:13:06 +0200 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 17:13:06 +0200 From: Aharon Robbins Subject: Re: [9fans] plan9port: recent changes To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200502141513.j1EFD6kL022642@skeeve.com> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > > Lots of little changes in the past week or so: autoindent for sam, > > > > Aren't you risking excommunication for this? > > Rob and I almost made it always on instead of > a flag but we feared a mass exodus. > > Russ Well, if you've got Rob helping you, who am I to cry "heresy"? :-) Arnold P.S. Besides, I know Boyd will do it for me. ;-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:32:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:32:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A56163F89 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:54:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD95463AA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27574-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:53:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3138563AFB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:53:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so684077rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:53:31 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=mkvqV4/rYBHIK8vuCykZqbeGAuOJDsnY1JwjMfOY3wBQkt3AeFcNs3T+NS9/eRMT0Eyml7OADDgV93TbrelwxrQoNa1mOAA1aXelmrePlX0AnaszfFX++3+6+DJMTyIXBLOS9AFonrJfzaKGOJwFoEvdFUG7d4EtrK1LjaOyc5k= Received: by 10.38.88.69 with SMTP id l69mr30003rnb; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:53:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:53:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 09:53:31 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] plan9port: recent changes In-Reply-To: <200502141127.j1EBR0qq020337@skeeve.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <200502141127.j1EBR0qq020337@skeeve.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > Lots of little changes in the past week or so: autoindent for sam, > > Aren't you risking excommunication for this? Rob and I almost made it always on instead of a flag but we feared a mass exodus. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:32:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:32:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57679C69D1 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:22:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0085E63E3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:21:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23431-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:21:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from sccrmhc13.comcast.net (sccrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.202.64]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE8F063E6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:21:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.0.3] (h00095b53ce25.ne.client2.attbi.com[24.34.50.194]) by comcast.net (sccrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2005021413214601600ijcqbe>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:21:46 +0000 Message-ID: <4210A5E9.6090801@abc.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:21:45 -0500 From: bs User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] more invites X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: balajis@comcast.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-d585042503-21bac7e8ed https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-72bf9e4231-760ba8ba63 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-0d50714e7e-39dce44d33 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-372dcc0040-4a82de4300 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-f1981dfc39-c351baa244 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-2364628486-ded08859fc https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-0522c9d360-252a7b4670 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-39a703073e-3f930d0677 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-a6b2c05554-8dc14e50d4 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-16655fb213-778ea8a585 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-912f650c40-1e5c0da51d https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-f96d93a43d-dd97f77e63 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-7c15bb7259-4c3d256e2c https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-2a49b91965-44686b8c40 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-b707a03c07-dac701b30c https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-dd4abd95c9-956a7ba61e https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-9ca88af684-e1f37feb99 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-78e192a4fd-7c165cd092 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-51247cc5fc-16efb9622e https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-2317640c30-f8228d2e78 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-e1bddd1873-4f68a3f376 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-1b992d6b9c-f89b864a47 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-d1db6d168d-e44f0abe67 https://gmail.google.com/gmail/a-85ffcd24a2-6478a86154-9ee5d8b7a5 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:33:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:33:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1017C69C7 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:10:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0AFEB63A7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:09:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17721-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:09:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5049263A6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:09:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so739390rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 11:09:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=i+8/ALhJLb4NMS9qJP8Os9uHi46J4V6NEkvJkFjt0+JgIluEGNpc+6tq88M9jsS7r5dMNeZPc26U/FJkWsZN//02NcXi2BQnjDdFvfSQYRERPy3LYcTN7n+LEAMEAEeqJI6itzCuCKRSLcjtTYWevFGSlvfVsZZW0AK5QG6CnwU= Received: by 10.38.163.59 with SMTP id l59mr83214rne; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 11:09:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 11:09:34 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 14:09:34 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu A few people have reported that running acme and exiting leaves behind a 9pserve process with the effect that you can't run acme a second time. I believe I just checked in a fix to this bug, which I introduced trying to work around the pthread nonsense we were discussing last week. After updating from CVS, you'll have to rebuild libthread and then 9pserve (or just use cd $PLAN9; ./INSTALL -- it's still much faster than compiling the Linux kernel). It's worth noting for everyone that you can't run two acmes in the same "name space" since they'll both want to post as the Unix socket `namespace`/acme. If you want to start a new "name space" you can set $NAMESPACE manually, as in mkdir /tmp/ns; NAMESPACE=/tmp/ns; export NAMESPACE and then you'll have a separate acme that is isolated from the first (and from the plumber that the first acme is using). Intro(4) has details. Setting $NAMESPACE also lets you run file servers before you start X and share them with your X session. For example, in my .profile I have the following: # Logging in on tty1 sets up factotum and then runs X automatically if [ "`/bin/ls -l /proc/self/fd/0 2>/dev/null | awk '{print $NF}'`" = '/dev/tty1' ] then NAMESPACE=/tmp/ns.`hostname` export NAMESPACE rm -rf $NAMESPACE; mkdir $NAMESPACE 9 factotum eval `9 ssh-agent -e` startx fi I have to start factotum and ssh-agent before X because I run stats to remote machines (via ssh) in my .xinitrc, and so that the $SSH_AUTH_SOCK variable is set in all my X windows. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 09:33:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 09:33:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CD38C69C3 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:42:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52E0563A23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:42:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12335-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:42:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 970FC63A15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:42:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([213.223.76.98]) by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <364126-18329>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:41:49 -0500 Message-ID: <00ce01c512bc$75e4aec0$3bd27d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200502141513.j1EFD6kL022642@skeeve.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] plan9port: recent changes Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 18:41:47 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > P.S. Besides, I know Boyd will do it for me. ;-) it used to annoy the shit out me, but i rationalised it: tab is a pretty big key and i can type it pretty quickly and i'm not gonna pollute the editor with that junk. that's pretty small beer compared to hacking /sys/src/cmd/cc/macbody with drawterm _across the atlantic_. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 15 10:06:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 15 10:06:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5881C6705 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:03:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BA7963E8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:03:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29583-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:03:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 676C063E5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:03:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <66d43fa513e8fedebd08c3e847848313@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:03:08 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Is anyone working on a win32 port? 9pm is showing its age (but still better than cmd or cygwin). >> i don't like autoindent ... it always seems to do what i don't >> want it to do, the tab key is big, and i don't write deeply >> nested code. but if you do - fine ... make it an option (i hate >> thousands of options too). > > it's not the usual "guess where my cursor should be" autoindent. > when you type newline, it initializes the new line by copying the > leading white space from the previous line. it's more of a > persistent indent than autoindent. in any case, it's the first one > i've ever used that felt natural. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9823EC6AA4 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:00:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4137A31905 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:59:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12965-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:59:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEF3531889 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:59:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([84.4.62.50]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <363255-30920>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:59:36 -0500 Message-ID: <001c01c513c2$c7c6b9c0$323e0454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 01:59:33 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> ronronron > > Just from my curiousity, two persons responded this, Why? > Is it something from special sound, or feel something special? old '[56]0s pop song: http://www.keno.org/stones_lyrics/da_doo_ron_ron.htm -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B58F1C6A4E for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:30:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0CBE9C6846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:30:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09543-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E943C6778 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:30:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2745fc4573654f1cce3d3146685baf2a@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 14:29:55 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu oops sorry about that - accidentally pressed the middle button several times on the tag of a 9fans post in acme... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC8B0C6B97 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:12:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41C24C69F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:12:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15176-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:12:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD9F3C68E5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:12:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5ce5de952f86098684af3b1af9ac08f8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:12:20 +0900 In-Reply-To: <001c01c513c2$c7c6b9c0$323e0454@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > old '[56]0s pop song: >=20 > http://www.keno.org/stones_lyrics/da_doo_ron_ron.htm Rolling Stones, I passed them by.=E2=98=BA Thanks all! Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1196EC69C3 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:47:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4347CC69AE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:46:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04921-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:46:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout19.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACDBFC69C1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:46:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215114655.JSBM11211.mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:46:55 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215114655.YCZF769.aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:46:55 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:46:51 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] cvsfs In-Reply-To: <017f98799317ca7bad54a55c2d5ad0ab@quintile.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dafzfshgjemnwioaofdgayzjij" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dafzfshgjemnwioaofdgayzjij Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Arrgh, find the code in /n/sources/steve/cvsfs.tar.bz2 -Steve --upas-dafzfshgjemnwioaofdgayzjij Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by felix; Tue Feb 15 11:34:59 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6CFBC6ACC for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:34:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25B91C69B8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:34:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01883-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:34:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout16.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.16]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44A5AC69B4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 06:34:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215113411.OJNN8887.mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:34:11 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215113411.WCZE769.aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:34:11 +0000 Message-ID: <017f98799317ca7bad54a55c2d5ad0ab@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:34:07 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] cvsfs X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+steve=quintile.net@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+steve=quintile.net@cse.psu.edu cvsfs beta now available. It presents a readonly view of a remote cvs server as a plan9 filesystem. Two views are offered: by date (like venti dumps) and by tag; Aditionally an autogenerated ChangeLog is produced. The code works, and doesn't crash, but I'am not sure it presents exactly the view it claims to. Bugs, complaints, RFEs to me. -Steve --upas-dafzfshgjemnwioaofdgayzjij-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5D7DC6AF2 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36BBDC69F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27273-01-94 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F072C69F1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:22:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8fd9ce77c40c8069aef69fa88b7d9841@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:21:58 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Yes. I copy mntgen from source and I can see my files ;-) But if I > run "local 9fs unixbox" first and then "local bind -c > /n/unixbox/foo/bar /n/bar" works. yes, that'll work because the namespace is being changed locally to mntgen. your previous example was failing to work because the mount was in your current namespace - through the exportfs "window". the mount worked ok, but exportfs didn't keep the reference to the mount-point around, so mntgen removed the new directory. the next time the mount point was created by mntgen, it was given a new qid, and since the kernel uses qids to index its mount table, it wasn't finding your mount point. the change i made to mntgen was always to generate the same qid for a given name; hence although mntgen does delete the name, at least anything mounted on it will still be visible when it's created again. the real fix (i think) is to allow fds to refer to non-open files in the plan 9 syscall interface (hence allowing exportfs to retain a reference to walked-to directories without opening them), but that's a significant change, hence unlikely to happen. i'm sure you didn't want to know that! cheers, rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DADDBC69B0 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 22:39:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5690963F8C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 22:39:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01865-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 22:39:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0185063F70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 22:39:17 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so817999rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 19:39:17 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=l5hUTOKvQDDlfSXCo1VDmuahlKrE1bPm7arxrTXwXcsjWO7uaJWdMdzQm2He3haVpvMfo82N3dBavarbUisrsR4HeyC2ln5MDTiiDwz6Zj7v5yZrSM5KJhuCo13odx7LsC4R4n0SPxgIVCC3c6S/b9jFoZnbVd0f4ibUh6boRGA= Received: by 10.38.15.80 with SMTP id 80mr96618rno; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 19:39:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 19:39:17 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 22:39:17 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes In-Reply-To: <6.0.2.0.0.20050215162332.01b5bf18@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <66d43fa513e8fedebd08c3e847848313@9netics.com> <6.0.2.0.0.20050215162332.01b5bf18@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I occasionally have a look at it. The likes of libfmt/libutf/libregexp > build pretty much straight out of the box, but I can't get over the hurdle > of libdraw, which I'm too lazy/ignorant/stupid/busy to make much headway > on. Would the drawterm implementation provide any pointers as to how to > proceed? The X version in drawterm seems at first sight quite different > from the plan9port version. They're very similar. You may need to look past initdraw. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3644C6B62 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:03:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD2D4C674F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15176-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57401C6729 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:02:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:02:30 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> ronronron > > Just from my curiousity, two persons responded this, Why? > Is it something from special sound, or feel something special? > > Kenji -- from non-english-native Perhaps it's "due to ron" "ron" minnich http://www.lyricsfreak.com/r/rolling-stones,-the/118320.html From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 10:32:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 10:32:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39DB7C6A2A for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:28:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6C1BC6778 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:27:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09946-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:27:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D9FEC675A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:27:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu BadHeader: To: bFrom:, rminnich@lanl.gov, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Fri Feb 11 16:52:32 GMT 2005 Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen From: rog@vitanuova.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu sorry about this. nobody has had luck changing the password. Just don't change the password for now, password is ronronron have fun. ronronron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 11:39:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 11:39:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8B08C69B7 for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:50:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B485663C96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:49:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24761-01-44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:49:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AFE863D37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:49:47 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so759277rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:49:46 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=MEe4MgjxXrU/zBCUGHAFKu4f5492nqQTM+rrskUtXszICypLoZEQU1Fl1dxKA9U63ro0U646hJr9tW2h+krBgUBgvbiU537l56K9jGhS9HfjMSVuD5hwQnpiitUQ4/eno4VVhLYQgfWOI8Imy37BACEH8aE2UsgXH5kP1ovb5KY= Received: by 10.38.209.27 with SMTP id h27mr8578rng; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:49:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 12:49:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 15:49:46 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905021412313a0ec28d@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <775b8d1905021412313a0ec28d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > i don't like autoindent ... it always seems to do what i don't > want it to do, the tab key is big, and i don't write deeply > nested code. but if you do - fine ... make it an option (i hate > thousands of options too). it's not the usual "guess where my cursor should be" autoindent. when you type newline, it initializes the new line by copying the leading white space from the previous line. it's more of a persistent indent than autoindent. in any case, it's the first one i've ever used that felt natural. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 11:39:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 11:39:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21671C6AFC for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:30:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2CFDC69F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:29:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18852-01-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:29:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47D13C69F2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:29:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5fcd0595f4d5fbf6d4809a46a8078c79@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 15:29:00 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <2d1ac19c5e9bf73db861532bcc0c6168@crn.mteege.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Matthias: > > mntgen > > srvfs plumbspace /n > > plumber > > rfork n > > mount -b /srv/plumbspace /n > > I don't understand it completly. here's some explanation: mntgen - creates mountpoints on demand in /n srvfs plumbspace /n - runs exportfs exporting /n on /srv/plumbspace plumber - runs the plumber; this runs in the same namespace as the exportfs command, so if a command run by the plumber changes its namespace, the namespace exported by exportfs will change too. (the "Local" rule allows this to happen on command). rfork n - fork the namespace mount -b /srv/plumbspace /n - take the namespace exported by exportfs and mount it on /n. this makes exportfs's namespace visible, but at one level of indirection - any changes to /n made by the plumber will now be visible to all. /srv/plumbspace could be deleted at this point. > After that, I try > > % 9fs unixbox > % ls /n/unixbox > > and get nothing. My profile looks like this this is almost certainly because of a problem with exportfs (it can't keep references to directories that have been walked to but not opened). the problem isn't easy to fix without a kernel interface change, but mntgen has a recent workaround that fixes the problem. copy mntgen from sources, and i think your problem should go away. cheers, rog. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 11:55:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 11:55:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC1BEC6B6B for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:53:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34B8D63ECE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:53:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15176-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:53:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50AFE63EB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 19:53:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:53:35 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > ronronron Just from my curiousity, two persons responded this, Why? Is it something from special sound, or feel something special? Kenji -- from non-english-native From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:27:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:27:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B86FC683D for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:27:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6047D63FC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:26:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25529-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:26:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1329D63FBE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:26:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1G3QiLN032090 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:26:44 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1G3QhNG027529 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:26:43 -0700 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 20:26:43 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 16 Feb 2005, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > ronronron > > Just from my curiousity, two persons responded this, Why? > Is it something from special sound, or feel something special? those two people violated the Cultural Neutrality Act for Jokes, and have been appropriately punished. This is a new EU regulation regarding sensitivity to any and all objects of jokes, up to and including people who work on dead operating systems. The reference is to an old, old 50s pop song in the US met him on a sunday and my heart went boom da do ron ron ron da do ron ron blah blah blah blah blah forget the rest da do ron ron ron da do ron ron yeah, when he caught my eye blah, ya da bla bla forget da do ron ron ron da do ron ron etc. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:28:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:28:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05B99C6A14 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:00:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EAFCC6A01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29501-01-47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [82.149.227.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2505C69FD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:00:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 60916 invoked by uid 66); 15 Feb 2005 17:00:32 -0000 Received: (qmail 84257 invoked by uid 0); 15 Feb 2005 16:58:02 -0000 Received: from crn.mteege.de (192.168.153.15) by 0 with SMTP; 15 Feb 2005 16:58:02 -0000 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 16:57:34 0000 From: Matthias Teege In-Reply-To: <5fcd0595f4d5fbf6d4809a46a8078c79@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > copy mntgen from sources, and i think your problem should go > away. Yes. I copy mntgen from source and I can see my files ;-) But if I run "local 9fs unixbox" first and then "local bind -c /n/unixbox/foo/bar /n/bar" works. Thanks alot Matthias From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:28:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:28:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 938CBC6B14 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:26:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09B55C6A3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00652-01-40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:26:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E828C6A34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:26:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1FHQ4B7030392 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:26:04 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1FHQ3io009838 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:26:03 -0700 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:26:03 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: <8fd9ce77c40c8069aef69fa88b7d9841@vitanuova.com> Message-ID: References: <8fd9ce77c40c8069aef69fa88b7d9841@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 15 Feb 2005 rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > the real fix (i think) is to allow fds to refer to non-open files in the > plan 9 syscall interface (hence allowing exportfs to retain a reference > to walked-to directories without opening them), but that's a significant > change, hence unlikely to happen. well, overall, it would be actually kind of neat if 9p was reflected right out to userspace for some of the stuff I do. But boy, that is a change from open/read/write/close, that's for sure. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:28:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:28:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C7A363F7E for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:02:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 63B2C3186D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:02:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23243-01-15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:02:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (blacksheep.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17D4B31855 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:02:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.103] (pool-151-201-48-12.pitt.east.verizon.net [151.201.48.12]) by blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02B8A92A2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:02:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4210A142.9080700@csh.rit.edu> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 08:01:54 -0500 From: George Gensure User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] i81x development References: <420FE7D8.7080900@csh.rit.edu> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Tiit Lankots wrote: >> Just started adding support for my 852/855GM chipset Intel graph >> card, and after adding the device id under the i81x software >> (kernel, aux/vga and /lib/vgadb), I end up with a blank screen (no >> display at all). Is anyone else working on something similar, or >> seen a reason why this chipset should be any different from the rest >> of the Intel i81x line? > > > AFAIK 81x and 85x are completely incompatible (different designs). From what I saw of the linux driver, the 85x cards looked like they ran under the 81x code. -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AD93C69BF for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 04:52:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 090A6C6928 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 04:51:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24918-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 04:51:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from nova.renderx.com (64.124.45.232.renderx.com [64.124.45.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CA1AC6913 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 04:51:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.1.222] (245.15.113.217.auto.web.am [217.113.20.245] (may be forged)) (authenticated) by nova.renderx.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id j1F7bVs17090; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 23:37:31 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: <775b8d1905021412313a0ec28d@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <53e74417c0cef8231749dd537fc29bbc@davidashen.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: David Tolpin Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: plan9port: recent changes Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 13:51:18 +0400 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, Russ Cox X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 15.02.2005, at 0:49, Russ Cox wrote: >> i don't like autoindent ... it always seems to do what i don't >> want it to do, the tab key is big, and i don't write deeply >> nested code. but if you do - fine ... make it an option (i hate >> thousands of options too). > > it's not the usual "guess where my cursor should be" autoindent. > when you type newline, it initializes the new line by copying the > leading white space from the previous line. it's more of a > persistent indent than autoindent. in any case, it's the first one > i've ever used that felt natural. Yes, it's a good edition to Sam. I had implemented it over a year ago (and was beaten for that on 9fans), and using Sam for programming is much easier with it. I still use the old unix port of Sam, which runs without plan9port, and the two useful editions are the handling of tabstop environment variable and the autoindent. David From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1893C6A55 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:23:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 536D6C68E5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:23:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18852-01-43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:23:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9fs.org (82-68-131-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.68.131.214]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97C49C6782 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:23:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.44.43.80] (helo=[172.16.24.1]) by 9fs.org with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.43) id 1D14Xh-000PEp-5G for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 15:23:13 +0000 Message-ID: <421213DC.8080408@9fs.org> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 15:23:08 +0000 From: Nigel Roles User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Raising The Bar References: <42120FF4.7080309@village.com> In-Reply-To: <42120FF4.7080309@village.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Wes Kussmaul wrote: > > I'm at the RSA conference in San Francisco and I just saw the title of > Bill Gates' keynote: > > Security: Raising The Bar > > Yes. Gates. Wonder if anyone remembered to bring the cream pie. > > Alternate titles anyone? > > Wes Kussmaul > Propping Up The Bar: an alternative to attending the keynote? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AE23CC6B1F for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:49:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1D85C6A0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:48:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27273-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:48:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10E01C6757 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:48:34 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so923170rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:48:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=c8sEL+M1fw8tGzIcoO1NrL0S8+vg+T7rkxX+5/qo/xZ/uh92lG+JHnmciM7htuU2SeByKKvSdz7ItT0BJeRKtGPxGn3+VfMczK/uwOc37ZML7vDLLkSLK5MGvkemVi/Vkriuq1pB56rKey7BG1T28+kZWKiCcxp6o5zakFnv3e8= Received: by 10.38.88.69 with SMTP id l69mr48612rnb; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:48:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:48:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 11:48:33 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > accessing the dump of another file system: > > % 9fs sources > % 9fs sourcesdump > % history -d sourcesdump /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c even easier now: 9fs sources history /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD7F4C6A15 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:15:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51106C6774 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:15:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05230-02-96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:15:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [82.149.227.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88D45C6757 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 09:15:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 57975 invoked by uid 66); 15 Feb 2005 14:15:28 -0000 Received: (qmail 82316 invoked by uid 0); 15 Feb 2005 14:11:35 -0000 Received: from crn.mteege.de (192.168.153.15) by 0 with SMTP; 15 Feb 2005 14:11:35 -0000 Message-ID: <2d1ac19c5e9bf73db861532bcc0c6168@crn.mteege.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 14:11:07 0000 From: Matthias Teege In-Reply-To: <62333f35693a7e9ad479b9248ff205e6@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > (in $home/lib/profile): > mntgen > srvfs plumbspace /n > plumber > rfork n > mount -b /srv/plumbspace /n I don't understand it completly. After that, I try % 9fs unixbox % ls /n/unixbox and get nothing. My profile looks like this case terminal mntgen srvfs plumbspace /n plumber rfork n mount -b /srv/plumbspace /n upas/fs echo -n accelerated > '#m/mousectl' echo -n 'res 3' > '#m/mousectl' prompt=('term% ' ' ') fn term%{ $* } exec rio -i riostart What is my mistake? Do I need to mount the unixboxes before lib/profile? Matthias From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19106C6AC5 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:07:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 81E9CC69F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:06:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18852-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:06:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from atreuscorp.com (unknown [208.34.118.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCE62C68E6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:06:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by atreuscorp.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) id HAA31303 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 07:01:06 -0800 X-Scanned-By: scanned by AMaViS-ng anti-virus Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([172.20.1.110]) by atreuscorp.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id HAA31254 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 07:01:04 -0800 Message-ID: <42120FF4.7080309@village.com> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:06:28 -0500 From: Wes Kussmaul User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Raising The Bar X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm at the RSA conference in San Francisco and I just saw the title of Bill Gates' keynote: Security: Raising The Bar Yes. Gates. Wonder if anyone remembered to bring the cream pie. Alternate titles anyone? Wes Kussmaul From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E566C6AA1 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:30:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3E9FC4D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:30:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03860-01-4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:30:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout19.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.19]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E87E2318D0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:30:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215223022.CWQA11211.mta13-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:22 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050215223022.WFMD13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:22 +0000 Message-ID: <92e036ffee69b91588dd9d844aaeaeb9@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:19 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] netgear fa411 X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I got hold of a Netgear FA411 10/100 PCMCIA card in the hope of a faster connection but Plan9 sees it as a 10Mbps device. Anyone got one to run at 100Mbps (With Plan9) ? -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C07D0C6A1F for ; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:28:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEA3063D09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:28:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15131-01-70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtaout2.012.net.il (mtaout2.012.net.il [84.95.2.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1641B63CA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 06:28:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com ([80.179.113.222]) by i_mtaout2.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTP id <0IBW00G29FWT7F30@i_mtaout2.012.net.il> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:29:18 +0200 (IST) Received: from skeeve.com (skeeve [127.0.0.1]) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1EBR19V020338 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:27:01 +0200 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j1EBR0qq020337 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:27:00 +0200 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 13:27:00 +0200 From: Aharon Robbins Subject: Re: [9fans] plan9port: recent changes To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200502141127.j1EBR0qq020337@skeeve.com> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Lots of little changes in the past week or so: autoindent for sam, Aren't you risking excommunication for this? :-) :-) Keep up the good work! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20DC7C6A9B for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:35:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B7E063DAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:35:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00546-01-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:35:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A94A763D52 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:35:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([84.4.62.50]) by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <362042-30920>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 17:34:50 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c513ae$8dee9e70$323e0454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <92e036ffee69b91588dd9d844aaeaeb9@quintile.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] netgear fa411 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 23:34:46 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu has anyone got the the FA511 to go? -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:29:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:29:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24206C6A94 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:39:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93577C69F8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:38:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22786-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.2.4]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21405C6A07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 10:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (imgw1 [136.159.5.9]) by ensc.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1FFXN0o016062 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:33:23 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1FFXNnc002846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:33:23 -0700 Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (imgw1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 02765-05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:33:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from fbsd (fbsd [136.159.7.68]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j1FFXMn5002835 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:33:22 -0700 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 08:33:18 -0700 (MST) From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cpsc.ucalgary.ca X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu accessing the dump of another file system: % 9fs sources % 9fs sourcesdump % history -d sourcesdump /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c Jul 1 20:32:24 MDT 2004 /n/sources/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5400 [jmk] Jul 1 20:32:24 MDT 2004 /n/sourcesdump/2005/0215/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5400 [jmk] Dec 30 07:07:14 MST 2003 /n/sourcesdump/2004/0701/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5388 [presotto] Jun 15 11:46:59 MDT 2003 /n/sourcesdump/2003/1230/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5284 [rsc] Mar 2 16:59:32 MST 2003 /n/sourcesdump/2003/0615/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5378 [rsc] Feb 17 11:10:18 MST 2003 /n/sourcesdump/2003/0302/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5440 [rsc] Nov 11 10:09:11 MST 2002 /n/sourcesdump/2003/0217/plan9/sys/src/cmd/ls.c 5609 [rsc] % sourcesdump is hardcoded in the 9fs script, but is essentially a mount of main/archive :) andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:31:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:31:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBAA663CFB for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:31:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8B2F463AE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00423-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mint.apnic.net (mint.apnic.net [202.12.29.58]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1C74963A7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:30:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (garlic.apnic.net [202.12.29.224]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mint.apnic.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F735D5F31; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:21:41 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:30:41 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Message-ID: <20050216133041.691e8beb@garlic.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: References: Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed-Claws 1.0.1 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: rminnich@lanl.gov X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu it should also be noted that in the EU, 'ronron' is the snoring noise made by fat gaulish menhir workers ... -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:40:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:40:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5547AC6A87 for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:39:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3287663EA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:39:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26927-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:39:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A879863E4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:39:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([84.4.62.50]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <364390-20769>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:38:37 -0500 Message-ID: <005501c513d8$fd887790$323e0454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20050216133041.691e8beb@garlic.apnic.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 04:38:32 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > it should also be noted that in the EU, 'ronron' is the snoring noise made > by fat gaulish menhir workers ... no, the infinitive is 'ronfler'. 'ronronner' is to purr [like a cat]. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 16 12:52:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 16 12:52:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 978C3C6A1F for ; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:52:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 47276C676C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:52:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04731-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:52:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mint.apnic.net (mint.apnic.net [202.12.29.58]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6C2AC6760 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 15 Feb 2005 22:52:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from apnic.net (garlic.apnic.net [202.12.29.224]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mint.apnic.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71ADBD5F31; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:42:58 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:51:58 +1000 From: George Michaelson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Message-ID: <20050216135158.0f2d9553@garlic.apnic.net> In-Reply-To: <005501c513d8$fd887790$323e0454@kilgore> References: <20050216133041.691e8beb@garlic.apnic.net> <005501c513d8$fd887790$323e0454@kilgore> Organization: APNIC Pty Ltd X-Mailer: Sylpheed-Claws 1.0.1 (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386--netbsdelf) X-Fruit-Of-The-Month-Club: persimmon Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: boyd@insultant.net X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu infintive may well be ronfler, but the speech bubble seems to say { ron .... rrrrrrrrron... ron.. ron.. } -G From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 09:53:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 09:53:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C685DC6AEE for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 03:16:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ADDEC63A43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 03:16:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24374-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 03:16:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9fs.org (82-68-131-214.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk [82.68.131.214]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E61D63A30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 03:16:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.168.100.111] (helo=office) by 9fs.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1D1KM7-0000ir-9I for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 08:16:19 +0000 From: "Nigel Roles" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: RE: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 08:16:19 -0000 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <5ce5de952f86098684af3b1af9ac08f8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu 9fans-bounces+ngr=3D9fs.org@cse.psu.edu wrote: >> old '[56]0s pop song: >>=20 >> http://www.keno.org/stones_lyrics/da_doo_ron_ron.htm >=20 > Rolling Stones, I passed them by.? > Thanks all! >=20 > Kenji Hmm. It's all very rock and roll, but The 'Stones would not be the band that came to mind. It was The Crystals, and of course written by Phil Spector. A hit in the UK in '63. Your midi compliant Plan 9 web browser can play it here as you sing along, but it lacks the feel of the Wall of Sound. http://w3.restena.lu/musep/Songs/Dadooro2.html I shall be voting in favour of a local derrogation from the Cultural Neutrality Act for Jokes in the forthcoming referendum, and am glorying in my outlaw status. Nigel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:09:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:09:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 025EEC6BDF for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:15:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83E38C690C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:15:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21633-01-63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:15:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 48FC8C693C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:15:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 90714 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2005 00:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 17 Feb 2005 00:15:25 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 17 Feb 2005 00:15:25 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1H0FOq63145; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:15:24 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <8aade15e429f44584054a2114892a054@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:15:13 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > window)... At least we need something like Atl-TAB to change active > window by keyboard... Plan 9 is the first environment that taught me how to use mouse properly. I was once a lover of Alt-Tab window switching too, but I just don't need that now and click at the target window, keeping all windows shown on 1280x1024 desktop and hiding them rarely. > What need to do people who have only 800x600? use smaller fonts maybe? :) -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:09:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:09:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B607EC6A82 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:44:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8343E63BC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:44:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24843-01-39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:44:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B006963B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:44:03 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so138112rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:44:02 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=S4S/4ehqKMkqKD23wQTkfSyncMImBTAtYxnaIgnJCmWOzJy8PqPXlDJq2zzboUXp8oG+gQBTJUedOh6OmXRq5iOMzeEPtV+HbxbO6VtzpwCwU9DbYMYmVDFE8eDFqQss6y7k2e7kiDKSWebLu1lL7qzq0cMZVUMVkZCl3PdQnY4= Received: by 10.11.98.23 with SMTP id v23mr85982cwb; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:44:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:44:02 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb3010502161144fefc75a@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:44:02 +0200 From: McLone To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <56761140.20050216211557@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> <56761140.20050216211557@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:15:57 +0200, Sergey Reva wrote: > How much people work on Plan 9? Who can do this (and who have time for just look on Freedesktop's cairo -> glitz -> (debrix|xserver) -> DRI and u'll understand. Sure they [still] have monolithic tree, XAA drivers and such.... but i'm telling it's not easy to do now, at least from HW support PoV. > RC> This is interesting. Why don't you find yourself spending a lot > RC> of time using the other window managers? > Because other more advanced (more friendly to user). complicated configs != user-friendly simple/mainstream ones ~= unuseable IMO > SS> Ideally I would run at 1600 odd but my monitor just isn't sharp enough. > What need to do people who have only 800x600? w00t? 800x600 nowadays? * You must be kiddin'. Even used cards/CRTs can do 1024x768x75+hz! * Turn it on, work couple'o'hours, then report. [different OSes] -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:26:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:26:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB5F8C6B95 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:38:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 53EE631977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:38:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19774-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:37:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20B7A3192C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:37:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id c16so164305rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:37:46 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=dRjlGiqT1EyWWzHzTDZVwR2zforvVdWOUWZM6g3Q3wkoYr4suEunwaXZHlhl1E8yRiWob8rYzA1KdB+ICigia8ZRte4xs5H5QGUxGD4EccQ9vMbLsYzUCeTLHgLwyvnNjat0PDDKmaCB0NtnqCbtbosDGtTlvEcluWmT3tQq0QY= Received: by 10.38.13.28 with SMTP id 28mr32545rnm; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:37:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.76.22 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:37:45 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <14ec7b1805021610372b08e239@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:37:45 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: andrey mirtchovski , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i rarely manage rio either. i do much more 'managing' of windows inside acme, where there are some strides made with automatic cursor placement and windows resize. i suggest you look there for inspiration. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:26:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:26:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6588063D3F for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:18:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C731C63B70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:17:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19785-01-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:17:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FE9763B67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:17:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so133613rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:17:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=nrH2wkAEDs8uLK/zhJYx2w3s04xX7XL3Zm1ehXnRqjDpxI+X4yzcf0hj45qhvvIvszHGtlNR9zCJo2uPOUV7YWrEQ5dMmKgumMYq4/gyRxrY7gUI6njKzpk3RQZBT+ie3F8iVue1eQrR1pzPBfFKMNdgVH4zSvntyTE3NpHpW/0= Received: by 10.11.100.63 with SMTP id x63mr81520cwb; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:17:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:17:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb3010502161117796fe751@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:17:30 +0200 From: McLone To: micah@stetsonnet.org, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:13:59 -0800, Micah Stetson wrote: > Use files named guide for per-project scratch space in acme. Good one. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for emgrish From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:26:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:26:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5AC6C67E2 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:16:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA0D763B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:16:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21820-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:16:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E963D63B45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:16:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.1] (port=1201 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D1Uei-000FlT-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:16:13 +0300 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:15:57 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <56761140.20050216211557@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans, g01495> I find rio very usable, but I also find I spend alot of my time "using g01495> rio". When I say this I mean moving windows, organizing the screen, g01495> hiding windows, resizing things. I use riostart to setup my workspace (other word in English to say this?) 1. acme -l $home/acme.dump 2. stats -lm 3. clock 4. taskbar And I can use this four(!) window for full work. If I need shell window I just right click on my taskbar, work on it and then kill it... As I see people who develop winwatch and rio never manage many window too. g01495> They also put a great deal of effort into cosmetic changes, and are beginning to use g01495> hardware acceleration of the GUI using OpenGL framebuffer cards. How much people work on Plan 9? Who can do this (and who have time for this)? g01495> The idea of an interface itself is very complicated and difficult to g01495> develop. The general idea hasn't really changed in decades. What you can suggest? Use 3D desktop? In 2D display? RC> This is interesting. Why don't you find yourself spending a lot RC> of time using the other window managers? Because other more advanced (more friendly to user). RC> I wonder if it is similar to the reason people find themselves RC> spending a lot of time using the mouse but not the keyboard: RC> the mouse is easier to use so your brain is free to do other RC> things like wonder when you'll be done. With 99% accuracy may say: people who read this, usually use keyboard ;-) RC> (Argument about mice vs. keyboards can go to /dev/null. RC> We've already been through that multiple times. Here's one: RC> http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2002-April/016946.html) I found keyboard very useful, but when I can (like in OS Windows ) all task do with keyboard or mouse it's great, but when some task I do by keyboard and some only by mouse it's very hard (example: hiding window)... At least we need something like Atl-TAB to change active window by keyboard... SS> I beleive a lot depends upon what resolution you run the display at, SS> I run at 1080x1024 which is just enough. 1024x768 on my laptop is painfull SS> Ideally I would run at 1600 odd but my monitor just isn't sharp enough. What need to do people who have only 800x600? AM> i rarely manage rio either. i do much more 'managing' of windows AM> inside acme, where there are some strides made with automatic cursor AM> placement and windows resize. i suggest you look there for AM> inspiration. Interesting idea! If acme can handle Image it can be used for more things... why it don't do it? Other thing which I wont add to this post: We need port of libtk or equivalent for Plan 9 (previously to say "we have libcontrol" firstly try use it). When we have complete GUI we can faster develop application! -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:26:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:26:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4ECD463984 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:31:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 26015318DE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:31:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19774-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:31:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout17.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 574E3318CD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:31:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050216183122.BYGA29900.mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:31:22 +0000 Received: from paris.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050216183122.RDAX13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@paris.quintile.net>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:31:22 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:31:08 +0000 To: g01495@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I find I hadly use "rio" at all. The only window I hide is my vnc session which itself only ever holds IE6 (yea, I know). I beleive a lot depends upon what resolution you run the display at, I run at 1080x1024 which is just enough. 1024x768 on my laptop is painfull Ideally I would run at 1600 odd but my monitor just isn't sharp enough. High resolution displays are wonderfull and allow you room to just put things anywhere and still see them, think of the traditional desktop metaphor - how would you cope with a 3 foot square desk? -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:26:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:26:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6192BC6D15 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:26:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2872531618 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:26:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24272-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from nwkea-mail-1.sun.com (nwkea-mail-1.sun.com [192.18.42.13]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F93FB9DA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:26:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.42]) by nwkea-mail-1.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j1H1QKvB013325 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:26:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from submarine.sfbay.sun.com (submarine.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.78.138]) by sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL, v2.2) with ESMTP id j1H1QJAH023229 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:26:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rs76089@localhost) by submarine.sfbay.sun.com (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j1H1QJq28395 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:26:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:26:19 -0800 From: Roman Shaposhnick To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Message-ID: <20050217012619.GA28387@submarine> References: <15a0c2bff3f238d0e1ac569ae4275213@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <15a0c2bff3f238d0e1ac569ae4275213@plan9.ucalgary.ca> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, Feb 16, 2005 at 06:15:09PM -0700, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > article here: > > http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/png/ >>> "(believe me, you don't want to see the source!)" A much more sane png decoder (compared to libpng) is available here: http://www1.mplayerhq.hu/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/ffmpeg/libavcodec/png.c?rev=1.11&content-type=text/x-cvsweb-markup&cvsroot=FFMpeg Just an FYI. Thanks, Roman. P.S. If only I had more time to port ffmpeg to P9... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:42:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:42:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86EE9C6BAE for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:15:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E347DC6931 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:14:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28979-01-10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:14:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0013xmh.sng.swissbank.com (dmz-vsgate1.sng.ibb.ubs.com [147.60.1.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5454C67E4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:14:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0013xmh.sng.swissbank.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ssng0013xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1H1EcC21228; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:38 +0800 (SGT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by ssng0013xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) id j1H1Ecq21200; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:38 +0800 (SGT) Received: from (mailhost-nat [10.240.16.227]) by ssng0013xmh.sng.swissbank.com via smap (V2.0b/ubs) id xma021170; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:30 +0800 Received: from nsng9004pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net (nsng9004pap.sng.swissbank.com [147.60.12.20]) by sn1p661pos.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1H1ESQ18853; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:28 +0800 (SGT) From: Noel.Hunt@ubs.com Received: from nsng9001pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net ([147.60.12.16]) by nsng9004pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:25 +0800 Received: from NTKYC900PEX1.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net ([147.60.130.245]) by nsng9001pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:14:24 +0800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: RE: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:14:23 +0900 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam thread-index: AcUUf4PpUZoqXN0DQTmiojnh0pDXTQADmTXg To: , <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2005 01:14:25.0032 (UTC) FILETIME=[04EA9080:01C5148E] X-UBSIB-Journal: yes X-UBS-Disclaimer: Version $Revision: 1.26 $ X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >there is a copy on sources in /n/sources/steve, and there >is a newer and perhaps safer version in the plan9port copy >of samterm: Many thanks. Visit our website at http://www.ubs.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:42:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:42:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8465C6C64 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:15:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB05EC6BEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:15:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28511-01-67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:15:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 13CD1C6C2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:15:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <15a0c2bff3f238d0e1ac569ae4275213@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:15:09 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu article here: http://pages.cpsc.ucalgary.ca/~mirtchov/p9/png/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A34963FD3 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:59:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 52D0B639CF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:59:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21716-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7631639BB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:59:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so130523rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:59:21 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=oNSX1oZ2QpBoWzpEq7SpMJgl7lf2bkrZ6XNS8fDnvLbmtM+zY7gpO+8yrY0wmuQX7S5G3DjRllc8VxHzgP/Oet5Yr/mSCMh+otqECOZYHWwSzDSOuq2zWgKzdLPSN+GUlV/HiBfJ4ff4AEWnaEOfxC1yX/Ng9tntvhugUEPOYXc= Received: by 10.11.98.24 with SMTP id v24mr83335cwb; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:59:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:59:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105021610592d7b2b0f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:59:21 +0200 From: McLone the Great To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone the Great , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:45:14 -0600, g01495@gmail.com wrote: > I find rio very usable, but I also find I spend alot of my time "using > rio". When I say this I mean moving windows, organizing the screen, > hiding windows, resizing things. I won't comment rio, used it not so long; but for X window... 17'' all around, at 1152x864 or 1024x768; almost all windows - fullscreen, so i'm using mostly Ctrl+A because of nested screen(1)s and Win+A because i bind virtual desks to it. In case of 1280x1024 or better, i use Alt+Tab etc, so good task-switch-previewer is a must [as in MacOSX/Aqua]. Personally i dislike window hiding - shading is for me. Also i found tabbed windows useable [as in fluxbox-stable] on high-res displays My X wm's often driven by keys, not mouse. I have bindings in {open,flux}box or {bad,evil}wm to place windows in a smart way, so they don't move in a merely weeks.On a mouse i use wheel. Win32/gnome's/kde's etc. WMs/DEs all unuseable as for me, and i don't need no taskbars/icons/applets. Think "CUI freak". > What does everybody else think about this? to think not in a main[stream] "slab" is a task for chosen one. Especially when one talks about GUIs. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for emgrish From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 949E663B03 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:05:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E33D63AA5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:04:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19785-01-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:04:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FB4D63A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 14:04:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so131484rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:04:52 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WdKhGWo2zfPBZqMlp+aP1xImoWK04wQCZSaqTt5OvXMdlvtx2xCFfFX5lwDisCG2a9kP9BovFMmMpYrDAHICpSl2ghueklWSrhlgRpMDC4ePYAydM0lu4rQKqRtudcXsp85lNcPJuHaUFeR/1ck8jb62C/pLs8PtKBX1foiRjX4= Received: by 10.11.119.61 with SMTP id r61mr79221cwc; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:04:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:04:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105021611046448ef1c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:04:52 +0200 From: McLone To: andrey mirtchovski , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <14ec7b1805021610372b08e239@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> <14ec7b1805021610372b08e239@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:37:45 -0700, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > i do much more 'managing' of windows inside acme, where there are some > strides made with automatic cursor placement and windows resize. Strides? Hmm. For me acme's placement heuristic seems almost natural and indeed convenient. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for emgrish From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 78EE5C6B7A for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:12:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03C50BAC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:12:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15921-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:12:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0014xmh.sng.swissbank.com (dmz-vsgate2.sng.ibb.ubs.com [147.60.1.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93E48C6A73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:12:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0014xmh.sng.swissbank.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ssng0014xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1GNC2A17237 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:12:02 +0800 (SGT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by ssng0014xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) id j1GNC2H17217 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:12:02 +0800 (SGT) Received: from (mailhost-nat [10.240.16.227]) by ssng0014xmh.sng.swissbank.com via smap (V2.0b/ubs) id xma017202; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:12:00 +0800 Received: from nsng9003pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net (nsng9003pap.sng.swissbank.com [147.60.12.19]) by sn1p661pos.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1GNBxH20380 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:11:59 +0800 (SGT) From: Noel.Hunt@ubs.com Received: from nsng9001pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net ([147.60.12.16]) by nsng9003pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:11:57 +0800 Received: from NTKYC900PEX1.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net ([147.60.130.245]) by nsng9001pap.ubsgs.ubsgroup.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:11:15 +0800 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 08:11:15 +0900 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development thread-index: AcUUUPYWMgUiFpipSU+lZNUviYDzPAAK3MMg To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2005 23:11:16.0172 (UTC) FILETIME=[D0D000C0:01C5147C] X-UBSIB-Journal: yes X-UBS-Disclaimer: Version $Revision: 1.26 $ X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I was browsing through the 9fans archives and came across this mail (http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2002-April/016954.html) which mentions a patch for the unix sam which introduces chords for cut/paste. Is this still available somewhere? Visit our website at http://www.ubs.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ABD9AC6A1E for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:23:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D93BC6827 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:23:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04940-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:22:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from relais-inet.francetelecom.com (relais-inet.francetelecom.com [212.234.67.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31F9EC6824 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:22:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from prive-Rline3.com ([192.168.1.32] [192.168.1.32]) by Rline3.francetelecom.com with ESMTP for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:22:52 +0100 Received: from fedft02a.francetelecom.fr ([193.248.188.50] [193.248.188.50]) by Rline3.francetelecom.com with ESMTP for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:22:52 +0100 Received: from puexcc21.nanterre.francetelecom.fr by fedft02a.francetelecom.fr with ESMTP for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:22:51 +0100 Received: from PUEXCBB0.nanterre.francetelecom.fr ([10.168.74.43]) by PUEXCC21.nanterre.francetelecom.fr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6673); Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:22:51 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6603.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 17:22:51 +0100 Message-Id: <56E11FD12D007249A4210B22B61832EE10FB34@PUEXCBB0.ad.francetelecom.fr> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: TIP9UG URL wrong on Plan9 Wiki Thread-Index: AcUUQ8IAFXYMK6+1QCak3nOmhN41xw== From: "GUDIN Francis OF/UNPS/EXT" To: <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2005 16:22:51.0335 (UTC) FILETIME=[C2CA9D70:01C51443] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] TIP9UG URL wrong on Plan9 Wiki X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hi, just to mention that the correct URL for the English index is wrong; the = right one: http://www.tip9ug.jp/en/index.html I had the following when attempting to edit the page: "Object not found The object does not exist on this server." Francis. PS: yes, outlook way of formatting stinks... ...but the company i'm working for doesn't care :-[ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B47FC6AA4 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:45:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8151C69F3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:45:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14024-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:45:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3446FC6A6E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:45:15 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so119735wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:45:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=lf/GXzswAJnEf8k9+kgnH8uWeKxHPFk/+uzcRFFu3FWDhZXcw81xSyt+l7hWfJ7bELWFaOX3lwjN0NBtZrSf5LCKfNcvrNNfRpDpQwt7Ln/xIHwPVRqINbMAx1aKEuX/dY/Ck5sn7rH+5UHcOY84/lfGtmy2zFv9/doVxorUIks= Received: by 10.54.35.49 with SMTP id i49mr284414wri; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:45:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.50.35 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:45:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 11:45:14 -0600 From: "g01495@gmail.com" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu 9fans, I have some questions and some points -- I am interested in the general consensus regarding interfaces to computers in general and how Plan 9 fits into this. There currently exists a large contrast in the way interfaces are presented on different operating systems. "modern" operating systems such as GNU/Linux, Windows, MacOS provide an interface largely disconnected from the underlying operating system. They also put a great deal of effort into cosmetic changes, and are beginning to use hardware acceleration of the GUI using OpenGL framebuffer cards. Ideas like three dimensional interfaces are counterproductive as the paradigm can't be applied to the current technology. rio on the other hand provides a minimal interface to the applications on the system. I believe this is the right thing to do, but I believe some things are missing. The idea of an interface itself is very complicated and difficult to develop. The general idea hasn't really changed in decades. I find rio very usable, but I also find I spend alot of my time "using rio". When I say this I mean moving windows, organizing the screen, hiding windows, resizing things. Where will rio (or it's successors) end up going? What does everybody else think about this? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 10:59:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 10:59:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A00EC6A98 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:49:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FD03C6849 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:48:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14024-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2FB2C6845 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 63D14778C5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:48:29 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] TIP9UG URL wrong on Plan9 Wiki From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:48:25 +0100 In-Reply-To: <56E11FD12D007249A4210B22B61832EE10FB34@PUEXCBB0.ad.francetelecom.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > just to mention that the correct URL for the English index is wrong; the right one: http://www.tip9ug.jp/en/index.html fixed. > I had the following when attempting to edit the page: "Object not found > The object does not exist on this server." Editing the wiki with web browser is disabled because of abuse. Perhaps that is the reason for the error message. Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 11:16:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 11:16:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B88B3C6848 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:30:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BB9063E6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:30:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17963-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:30:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5D2F63DCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:30:15 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so228386rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 15:30:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=PHaCNZ4K38OWPbDPJ8Uq7OQUZ87YO19jnKYva9bPQ9Eth7QUqzKRWCPtc2smotVJUbv3w7axxCNua7rs1Kkg9fHNb1Q64s2DPQsgQK4MdthdqOzX5Nk7T6m9Veci4nqCuFTdnF8zy9fGSd799HY3MGDfj836Q3W07SXKhJ5Dv6Q= Received: by 10.38.104.45 with SMTP id b45mr77509rnc; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 15:30:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 15:30:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:30:13 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I was browsing through the 9fans archives and came across this mail > (http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2002-April/016954.html) > which mentions a patch for the unix sam which introduces chords > for cut/paste. Is this still available somewhere? there is a copy on sources in /n/sources/steve, and there is a newer and perhaps safer version in the plan9port copy of samterm: http://swtch.com/usr/local/plan9/src/cmd/samterm/main.c. they're disabled because they make sam to lock up occasionally and it just hasn't been a high priority to figure out why. look for "chording". russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 11:16:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 11:16:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BEF90B69A for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:56:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3893E6311 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:56:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18896-04-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.196]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8ADF02B97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so160746rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:56:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WlxsqP1EmD4RxigPFxxW8aOuV7S8xRosrvGvdR4YNOoq+NZpMPcsuzXecsmPbU4uxRQL1rC8uIAbEiianlr/fstcB6oFsjPD8ypU56Opft9dtNPy2myibN6hUEnWjOXTWQvSix6jZP8lQe0hbo6Wed/Vs15zeJ9WKdxNkAo1k0M= Received: by 10.38.101.30 with SMTP id y30mr209111rnb; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:56:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:56:16 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:56:16 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I find rio very usable, but I also find I spend alot of my time "using > rio". When I say this I mean moving windows, organizing the screen, > hiding windows, resizing things. This is interesting. Why don't you find yourself spending a lot of time using the other window managers? I wonder if it is similar to the reason people find themselves spending a lot of time using the mouse but not the keyboard: the mouse is easier to use so your brain is free to do other things like wonder when you'll be done. (Argument about mice vs. keyboards can go to /dev/null. We've already been through that multiple times. Here's one: http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2002-April/016946.html) Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 11:25:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 11:25:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64BD9C6EAB for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:24:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD9E4C6BF3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:24:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00545-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:24:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29503C6C07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:24:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <891a5377ff1da1ded27bab5ab4906895@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:24:36 +0900 In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Where will rio (or it's successors) end up going? >=20 > What does everybody else think about this? Rio is aimed just to devide the whole window to some smaller ones,=20 and multiplex the keyboard/mouse events for the focused window. =20 That's all I believe. There are some other neat things in rio, however, I suppose it's just for minimum. Then how to make GUI programs for Plan 9? I think this is still open to everyone. Why? probably, rob had no time or got older?=E2=98=BA We have control library (control(2)), however, I think there is no good consensus that it's should be the upper level GUI library for Plan 9. (Sorry Sape, I'm not abusing you. _o_) Regarding this, look at inferno which has the GUI developed in the same laboratory, and uses one button GUI interface (Tk) different from that of= acme. =20 When I saw it first, I thought they probably had no enough time to make=20 completely new GUI scheme, however, now, I believe that they believed=20 it's enough! I don't think its enough though... In short, we have no good agreement regarding what should be the Plan 9=20 GUI programming and/or user interface, I believe. Young and talented programmer can try this, however, it must be painful and brain consuming thing I think. First of all, they have to forget an= y existing GUI scheme.=E2=98=BA Please correct me if I'm wrong. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 11:43:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 11:43:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E83B7C6E91 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:43:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BDD1C6E25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:42:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03835-01-43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:42:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06775C6E22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:42:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2fa10b4849b32b269cf512bae5ae9247@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:42:33 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20050217012619.GA28387@submarine> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > P.S. If only I had more time to port ffmpeg to P9... i have ffmpeg for p9, but haven't written the player (the libdraw part)... i get so much flak for porting stuff that it's not worth it ;) just a clarification: the p9 part of the code isn't ugly, the rest is #ifdef'ed to oblivion. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 11:51:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 11:51:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24D6AC6D42 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:51:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C93DDC6BB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:51:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03835-01-63 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:51:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from brmea-mail-3.sun.com (brmea-mail-3.Sun.COM [192.18.98.34]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55C9BC6BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 21:51:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com ([129.145.155.42]) by brmea-mail-3.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j1H2pKOJ020892 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 19:51:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from submarine.sfbay.sun.com (submarine.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.78.138]) by sfbaymail2sca.sfbay.sun.com (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL, v2.2) with ESMTP id j1H2pKAH017024 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:51:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rs76089@localhost) by submarine.sfbay.sun.com (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j1H2pJY28650 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:51:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 18:51:19 -0800 From: Roman Shaposhnick To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Message-ID: <20050217025119.GA28632@submarine> References: <20050217012619.GA28387@submarine> <2fa10b4849b32b269cf512bae5ae9247@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <2fa10b4849b32b269cf512bae5ae9247@plan9.ucalgary.ca> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, Feb 16, 2005 at 07:42:33PM -0700, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > > P.S. If only I had more time to port ffmpeg to P9... > > i have ffmpeg for p9, but haven't written the player (the libdraw > part)... i get so much flak for porting stuff that it's not worth it > ;) care to share ? Thanks, Roman. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 12:14:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 12:14:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 198EAC704A for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:14:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDF60C6FAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:13:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10155-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:13:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D4B2C6EAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:13:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 20:13:55 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20050217025119.GA28632@submarine> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > care to share ? #plan9@irc.freenode.org it's where the fun is =E2=98=BA From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 12:32:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 12:32:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2EC36C7007 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:31:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12D82C6D11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:31:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10155-01-56 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:31:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4EDCCC6D0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:31:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from kilgore ([84.4.64.38]) by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id <360706-9811>; Wed, 16 Feb 2005 22:30:43 -0500 Message-ID: <005f01c514a1$0af73330$26400454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 04:30:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="UTF-8"; reply-type=original X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > #plan9@irc.freenode.org > > it's where the fun is =E2=98=BA "where real men duke it out" -- f2f -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 15:01:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 15:01:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43C3DC6E07 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 01:00:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86F85C6C90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 01:00:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22453-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 01:00:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75406C6C07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 01:00:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.2] (port=1046 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D1ei1-0004IK-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:00:19 +0300 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:50:14 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <451cb3010502161144fefc75a@mail.gmail.com> References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> <56761140.20050216211557@mail.ru> <451cb3010502161144fefc75a@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> Because other more advanced (more friendly to user). M> complicated configs != user-friendly Most of modern GUI have gui configurator >> SS> Ideally I would run at 1600 odd but my monitor just isn't sharp enough. >> What need to do people who have only 800x600? M> w00t? 800x600 nowadays? M> * You must be kiddin'. Even used cards/CRTs can do 1024x768x75+hz! M> * Turn it on, work couple'o'hours, then report. [different OSes] Now I work at 1024x768@85Hz (CRT 17"), and my hardware can do more. I got this hardware only in 2004... It's still many users who can work only at 800x600 in 14"-15". But may be you right - we need look to future... KO> Young and talented programmer can try this, however, it must be painful KO> and brain consuming thing I think. Many programmers can do this, but after his work we get many incompatible GUI's, as result we got manu programs, may be good but uses different gui library... I see this in Linux. I have three variant of any program (mean gui program): one for KDE, one for Gnome and one which not use this library... (maybe i mistake somewhere?) -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 17 16:10:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 17 16:10:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7F59C7054 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 02:10:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D830C6E5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 02:09:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21139-02-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 02:09:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A779C6E59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 02:09:31 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:07:45 +0900 In-Reply-To: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I see this in Linux. I have three variant of any program (mean gui > program): one for KDE, one for Gnome and one which not use this library... (maybe i mistake somewhere?) To me these things look like same, but just variants. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:53:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:53:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 819A6C6BDF for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:11:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83C4C63EFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:11:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02162-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:11:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8BA663E81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:11:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from [84.4.64.38] ([84.4.64.38]:25612 "HELO kilgore") by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S361885AbVBQOLI (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:11:08 -0500 Message-ID: <008101c514fa$80a7b060$26400454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:10:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-15"; reply-type=response X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Now, this is a SERIOUSLY creepy signature. Company policy, I assume? they're all doing it. those UBS boys are like pit bulls on crack. i talked to a few of them in geneva about setting up a numbered bank account. just walked in off the street and it was done deal in 30 minutes. well, i had the info, but not the 30k =A4 :( -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:53:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:53:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B12863DFB for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:32:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1B63E63AF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:32:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19686-01-80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:32:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0016xmh.sng.swissbank.com (dmz-vsgate4.sng.ibb.ubs.com [147.60.1.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1427763B03 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:32:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ssng0016xmh.sng.swissbank.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ssng0016xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1HMW1P06289 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:32:01 +0800 (SGT) Received: (from smap@localhost) by ssng0016xmh.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) id j1HMW0O06260 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:32:00 +0800 (SGT) Received: from (mailhost-nat [10.240.16.227]) by ssng0016xmh.sng.swissbank.com via smap (V2.0b/ubs) id xma006199; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:31:57 +0800 Received: from tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com (tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com [147.60.131.64]) by sn1p661pos.sng.swissbank.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id j1HMVt425773 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:31:55 +0800 (SGT) Received: from stky0630dwk.tky.swissbank.com (stky0630dwk.tky.swissbank.com [147.60.138.46]) by tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA12789 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:31:54 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <200502172231.HAA12789@tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Noel Hunt Subject: Re: FW: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam In-reply-to: Your message of "Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:07:09 +0900." Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:31:54 +0900 X-UBSIB-Journal: yes X-UBS-Disclaimer: Version $Revision: 1.26 $ X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Visit our website at http://www.ubs.com . . . > related financial instruments. Now, this is a SERIOUSLY creepy signature. Company policy, I assume? Yes. I do apologize, but I had forgotten about the garbage before mailing so I'll subscribe from a different address. It seems to be the standard piffle attached to mail in securities companies and the like. I think lawyers must be _very clever people_. Visit our website at http://www.ubs.com This message contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual named. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail. Please notify the sender immediately by e-mail if you have received this e-mail by mistake and delete this e-mail from your system. E-mail transmission cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message which arise as a result of e-mail transmission. If verification is required please request a hard-copy version. This message is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as a solicitation or offer to buy or sell any securities or related financial instruments. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:53:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:53:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04AA7C6BBD for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 06:22:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D16F363DC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 06:22:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19449-01-96 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 06:22:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout17.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.17]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B58A63D4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 06:22:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050217112224.TBU29900.mta09-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:22:24 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050217112224.JJLJ3760.aamta02-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:22:24 +0000 Message-ID: <15a76c3d4b0c8cc035bc4b1e818ddf21@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 11:22:21 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I was browsing through the 9fans archives and came across this mail > (http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2002-April/016954.html) > which mentions a patch for the unix sam which introduces chords > for cut/paste. Is this still available somewhere? Yep, /n/sources/steve/sam-chord-patch.txt -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:53:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:53:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D942318B3 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:57:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 650863183D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:56:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18387-04-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93BC631821 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so326498wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:56:31 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=DBxUHeJM+O27oDVA/i6YMP8WlHQl6T+DFEtM0w63apP3mPJVsT7Zdmt40l9Fr5/e3yRbEjEkmVblir29Lo+NSY/Sjwnr8jm0WtUnU1yX+ofpOaVjj3p4k2gEIFTV9bkJqId56wviSQ2nkWRadcLHFvO/Ui7tMp5gLrqeqOCAJRo= Received: by 10.54.50.72 with SMTP id x72mr185075wrx; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:56:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.50.35 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:56:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:56:30 -0600 From: "g01495@gmail.com" To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:00:20 +0200, Sergey Reva wrote: > TL> how about no new gui > TL> the old one ain't smellin' yet > What you mean in term 'GUI'? > Yes, with large monitors we can forget about window switching, but now > most of Plan 9 programs have only console version! When you want > create application with buttons, entryes, list boxes you need draw it > by self... > > RM> With multiple desktops, as much as I like rio, I find it easier to use > RM> flwm and swap around with CTRL-F[1234] etc. > See! People need advanced window manager! Maybe the ability to create a container frame. The interface could be similar to ``win'' and Acme, but allowing you to run any type of application within the frame. You could create this frame, associate applications with it, and click within the frame to toggle between the applications it's managing (which could be any type of application, graphical, etc). This could be useful as you could tile your windows initially and assign applications to each container as required, similar to ``tab'' functionality many UNIX WM's have. This would increase manageability on displays with many clients. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9056EC6B57 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:48:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A29F1318EB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:47:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24296-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:47:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EF24318B6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:47:50 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1HHno8r021961 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:49:50 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:47:47 +0200 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:47:47 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2005 17:47:47.0691 (UTC) FILETIME=[CADE93B0:01C51518] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > YMMV is always the case. My (somewhat sarcastic) comment was more referring to the probability that no excellent new idea will likely be unraveled here, so nothing will be (re-)implemented, either. Plan 9 has a strong intrinsic opposition to change; this is mostly good beacuse of obvious reasons. But some experimentation would'nt hurt. I just can't see the mechanism of this happening, short of reimplementing the whole shebang. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 934FCC6B95 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:05:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFC85C6A92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:04:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27978-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:04:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AC9EC6A85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:04:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from [84.4.64.38] ([84.4.64.38]:48146 "HELO kilgore") by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S363571AbVBQRmp (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:42:45 -0500 Message-ID: <011201c51518$16059470$26400454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru><1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:42:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > YMMV is always the case. hide & /dev/label ;) -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EFDE3186A for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:03:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4800A3186A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:02:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18387-04-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:02:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE1C631869 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 34so246488rns for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:02:33 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=b1siR2oPE8lE7TPDC2sn2wFzQgLm5Vv0j8f53P29kiqiC7dma1hoWOOrx+oFNYP1gtgoMl7QexhJ2ZG3idgc3i1ZJei1Ok5aCXh8Aji8uQ2bkslMPnLDIHeQNW8SjIpruzSl7WfXMul9ce9QgzG0atP0uVjiQxsddTyJcAUSCAM= Received: by 10.11.119.60 with SMTP id r60mr20243cwc; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:02:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.117.70 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:02:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7359f04905021713026e7e9e92@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:02:33 -0500 From: Rob Pike To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Rob Pike , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu You might want to read the paper I wrote long ago called "A Concurrent Window System.". 8=BD and rio arose from those ideas, although they sacrificed a lot of the generality. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B785531E71 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:36:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1507931E4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:36:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22457-01-90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:36:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F30731E4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:36:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HMaAEI024350 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:36:10 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HMa9BH018658 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:36:09 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:36:09 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] vmware hell X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu ok, my friend is booting plan 9 in vmware 4.5.2 using the vmware CD from the web page. It is hanging right after it prints dev B0 port 1F0 blah blh anything we should be looking for? Has anyone tried this on this vmware? ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4D4763B3E for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21AC463BF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06212-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A0AF63B54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.3] (port=1037 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D1rwQ-000FL4-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:08:04 +0300 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:07:02 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <894847921.20050217220702@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Do we have dynamic loading? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans $subj -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2F5463A9A for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:43:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4FB863A65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:42:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00350-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BDA763A15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so452247rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:42:52 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WTkmeCsliK+fl1dL5odjNYJ3F67JFU0lhFbVV8BiYQb0EBRhZFBOkyyNwHP99yGULcphs4FiMB+2G8oF+IoHq7+h6FHK3tI9bYtGJS/qOP5pWKLPz353y6LgRLdAW/L2hJuwfUoM8caQXlFBFRa19kirYXH35ZkAi1CYgoeP7QY= Received: by 10.38.163.54 with SMTP id l54mr92434rne; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:42:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:42:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:42:52 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <21f67c6e38ea6a23caf7fb801589997e@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050217231738.GO77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <21f67c6e38ea6a23caf7fb801589997e@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu it presents a clean 9p interface to user space. On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:33:47 +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > did you read russ' original post? > > yes. i was left wondering "why?" though. > > it's seems a bit like choosing a different fixed point for a recursive > function (though i'm probably abusing terminology again here!). > the work's got to be done somehow, and changing how the multiplexing > is done doesn't really change the fact that the multiplexing has to be > done somehow - it's just an internal architecture issue. > > i don't see what problem it was trying to address. > > hence my question to you. > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A842263B81 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:36:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3ACA3193A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:35:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22511-01-87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:35:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BCE131932 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:35:51 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so329407rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:35:51 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=r1OCDY0saKlXcYksqjR6cqjhOO7A9exbxik0z7WgwC/VPo2k8Rt2JnHsH5IXidrTUuCztAbSClJtLFnWe/FYcemifiGQd/AVkFJVzQ9ec6rnstjq0PRAuRhc0ZgJFG2B3qUD+6fmBbyJ0wIYofi0ysx4Smq8wtd76Unqb2R78RE= Received: by 10.11.100.63 with SMTP id x63mr186795cwb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:35:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:35:51 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb301050217143547623375@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:35:51 +0200 From: McLone To: Rob Pike , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <7359f04905021713026e7e9e92@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> <7359f04905021713026e7e9e92@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:02:33 -0500, Rob Pike wrote: > "A Concurrent Window System.". 8=BD and rio arose from those > ideas, although they sacrificed a lot of the generality. why WM is in Rio? can they be divided? or we'll got another X? --=20 wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1495363E70 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:22:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97B4763A76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:21:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22457-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:21:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C973A63A77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:21:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:21:19 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] writing code X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > The mechanism is, and always is, someone writes code. maybe this is unrealistic, but i'd like to see more "encouragement on principle". that is, if someone suggests something, it'd be nice if people (particular labs or ex-labs people) would chip in and say "yes, it's a good idea in principle; i'd like to see something like that" (or perhaps "yes, but it should be done in this way", or "bad idea, philosophically misguided"). if there were various projects around that had been given the thumbs-up on principle (pending actual implementation), perhaps more people might be inclined to get their hands dirty and write some code towards those ends. instead, i feel that people face the prospect of spending weeks writing code, only to be told at the end that the whole aim of their effort was misguided; or, worse, that the work was indeed misguided, but it gets included anyway on the grounds of inclusiveness, diluting the excellence of the whole system. of course, it's perfectly possible to take the view that plan 9 is perfect; that beyond minor bug fixes, new hardware ports and device drivers and more applications, plan 9 is as good as it could be. if that's the consensus view, then fine, i can live with that. but personally, i think that there *are* places where plan 9 doesn't perhaps do as well as it could, and fixing some of those might require the rethinking of some core parts of the system. maybe the first thing to do is to try and get some consensus as to where the weaknesses of the system are. the kind of things that might be put in the BUGS section of intro(1), if there was one. to start with, perhaps we could suggest areas in plan 9 which we think could use some work, in the broadest terms possible, avoiding specific solutions; then we could try to work towards specific projects aimed at addressing those areas. people could give their views on each issue, e.g. a) this isn't a problem, it's meant to be this way. b) yes this is a problem; i've no idea what to do about it though. c) yes, this is a problem, but i don't think there's a decent solution possible. d) yes, this is a problem, and here's a possible solution. e) yes, this is a problem, but the right solution is too hard. f) you're coming at this from the wrong angle. g) you're making a mountain out of a molehill. h) i don't care in the slightest about this issue. i) i don't know what the hell you're on about. here are a few for starters: isochronous/streaming data transfer over 9p: 9p is slow over wide area networks when streaming data, due to the ping-pong nature of the data transfer. can anything be done to help solve this? distributed authentication: the plan 9 authentication model relies on having an on-line authentication server. as firewalls and mobile devices continue to proliferate, might it be worthwhile adding support for a peer-to-peer model be more appropriate? graphics: high-bandwidth bitmap access is slow. additionally, even the existing hardware acceleration could be leveraged more than it is (if any portion of a window is obscured, then no h/w acceleration is used for that window). is it conceivable to have a system where all graphics operations are accelerated (as apple are apparently to be doing with their next system), or does the current architecture preclude this? graphics primitives: graphics drawn with the existing non-bitblt primitives is not great (e.g. lots of jaggies on diagonal lines). could implementing subpixel rendering help matters here? how can i continue to do work when a server goes down? aan can deal with a broken network connection, but say someone reboots the fileserver? is there any way we can incorporate some redundancy into the system, or make it easier for a applications to recover? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E506C6AB2 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:43:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 42C7FC6870 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:43:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27978-01-90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:43:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 697F1C685E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:43:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so394049rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:43:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=bJYVjO9VckcD31U0lkcGZK+DhHouoqAfLh4yqqDoTz0titxKqANsLP3QkF93Soho7CvxX2eCS1Nv8vhfPLg2GyWdfY4rfZOk8lDyeW8slMEzTgHgldgj4/7jTxoHna6cPZFHNAWAjOncTTu3S1+nTnlS52AC2+hltB+m9u9PYX0= Received: by 10.38.126.62 with SMTP id y62mr163197rnc; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:43:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:43:22 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:43:22 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <0345be3b46120cbf06bdff45601d5540@plan9.ucalgary.ca> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] tip o' the day X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Here's a long one. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Russ Cox Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:41:56 -0500 Subject: Re: png To: andrey mirtchovski Cc: anyrhine@cs.helsinki.fi > mem user overflow > pool sbrkmem block 115348 > hdr 0a110c09 00000020 00002d1e 00000000 00000000 faf0f100 > tail 0a110c09 00000020 00002d1e 00000000 00000000 faf0f100 | ef1400be > 00000020 > user data 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 | 00 f1 f0 fa be 00 14 ef > panic: pool panic > 8.png 336871: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x00006cd5 This says that the block at address 0x115348 has overflowed the amount written to it. In the "user data" print, the | marks the place where the user data should end. The next magic bytes are "fe f1 f0 fa" (fee fi fo fum), but a 00 has overwritten the fe. The size of the block is the second word of the header minus the 16-bit word contained between ef and be in the tail, so 0x20-0x14 = 12 in this case. That includes the 2 words of tags, so there's really only 4 bytes. So you called malloc(4) and then wrote 5 bytes to it. The header is two words. The next two are the malloc tags and then after that comes the real data. The malloc tags are by default the pc that last allocated and reallocated the block, so you allocated from 0x2d1e. Run src -s 0x2d1e /bin/png and you'll have the line that allocated. If that's a wrapper (e.g., pngmalloc) you can change the wrapper to do v = malloc(n); setmalloctag(v, getcallerpc(&n)); so that the tag will have the caller of pngmalloc instead of pngmalloc itself. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D713E63E00 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A929463AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:08:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10003-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2A1263AFA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.3] (port=1037 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D1rwF-000FL4-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:07:54 +0300 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:00:20 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu TL> how about no new gui TL> the old one ain't smellin' yet What you mean in term 'GUI'? Yes, with large monitors we can forget about window switching, but now most of Plan 9 programs have only console version! When you want create application with buttons, entryes, list boxes you need draw it by self... RM> With multiple desktops, as much as I like rio, I find it easier to use RM> flwm and swap around with CTRL-F[1234] etc. See! People need advanced window manager! AM> with rio i can sit behind somebody else's terminal and use it without AM> having to read a 100-page manual on their key bindings, virtual AM> displays configuration, focus behaviour and menu buttons. Show at least one GUI which need 100 page manual... most of it have intuitive interface, and 'rio' too. -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:54:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:54:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 522E763B19 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:18:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 276B763A18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:17:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00350-01-47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:17:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7711463A1F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:17:40 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id E142466B8C; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:17:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:17:38 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Message-ID: <20050217231738.GO77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, Feb 17, 2005 at 11:07:01PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > > i talked to russ about his idea of turning the kernel into an > > > efficient 9p mux and making everything talk 9p. > > > > That, to me, is the really exciting idea. > > what does it get you? did you read russ' original post? -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 09:55:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 09:55:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 49B68317B3 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:55:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CD77C1C0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:54:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10000-03-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:54:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7FE94BEF5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:54:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:24580 "HELO kilgore") by ams004.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S367982AbVBRAyZ (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:54:25 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c51554$6337e1d0$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <9f2d830957be70f5cdcc7ffee2827920@plan9.bell-labs.com> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 01:54:22 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > it's not the 8259 that's the problem, your bios isn't telling the > truth about the interrupt setup. i explained it to you. > i gave you the hack. you didn't reply as to whether it worked. ok, i stand corrected. pretty sure i applied it and got no joy. that mail got lost in a head crash -- don't ask. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:10:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:10:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0080F63CF5 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:05:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2FEC63556 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:04:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00288-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:04:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F16EC62E14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:04:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HN4Zs1027939 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:04:35 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HN4YoW021231; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:04:34 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:04:34 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <20050217225236.GN77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Message-ID: References: <20050217225236.GN77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Christopher Nielsen wrote: > i talked to russ about his idea of turning the kernel into an > efficient 9p mux and making everything talk 9p. That, to me, is the really exciting idea. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:10:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:10:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A5BB63F62 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:45:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98ADC63B7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:45:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06606-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D0C8639E0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id 560922FECB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:20:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9f2d830957be70f5cdcc7ffee2827920@plan9.bell-labs.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:20:36 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <01af01c51544$cf83adc0$26400454@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu Feb 17 18:03:41 EST 2005, boyd@insultant.net wrote: > i'd like to see a fix for: > > i8259.c: print("i8259enable: irq %d shared but not level\n", irq); > > i'd have a hack if i had the controller's doc and declaration from a psych that i wouldn't lose my sanity ... > -- > MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 > it's not the 8259 that's the problem, your bios isn't telling the truth about the interrupt setup. i explained it to you. i gave you the hack. you didn't reply as to whether it worked. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:10:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:10:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4ED5563D7E for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:03:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C133962E14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:03:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00350-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:03:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D499E63556 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:03:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from [84.4.64.38] ([84.4.64.38]:50439 "HELO kilgore") by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S364612AbVBQXC6 (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:02:58 -0500 Message-ID: <01af01c51544$cf83adc0$26400454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20050217225236.GN77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:02:51 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i'd like to see a fix for: i8259.c: print("i8259enable: irq %d shared but not level\n", irq); i'd have a hack if i had the controller's doc and declaration from a psych that i wouldn't lose my sanity ... -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:20:57 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:20:57 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C9D763D7E for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:20:45 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D187763B25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:20:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10000-03-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:20:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D66B63B1C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:20:17 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so466374rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:20:17 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=RSDuHqoE1i3akp8o3MikkQGDxjdzRIFO6qtIi+xIr2L4PwaSvs1InNFfsn2PCWjkMQJ2Ajl9m9FYuJdb4PBZiQui+TvqHOMQz+DZBA2Wkg4L3tDYgu7YZselUrLLuQYVMu3PpPpGtA0PJkDCYzGB8cheCDZ6oK3r5RiDKEV2U6U= Received: by 10.38.99.45 with SMTP id w45mr44827rnb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:20:17 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:20:17 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:20:17 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > The mechanism is, and always is, someone writes code. > > maybe this is unrealistic, but i'd like to see more "encouragement on > principle". that is, if someone suggests something, it'd be nice if > people (particular labs or ex-labs people) would chip in and say "yes, > it's a good idea in principle; i'd like to see something like that" > (or perhaps "yes, but it should be done in this way", or "bad idea, > philosophically misguided"). i'm all for encouragement on principle, but the thread i was replying to had gotten beyond that point. it started out with an interesting question -- what to do beyond rio -- but devolved into religion about why rio should be more like what's on unix/mac/windows without pointing out a single problem that would solve. i think there are plenty of interesting answers to the original question. acme is one. but "be more like other systems" is never an interesting answer. ultimately, it always comes down to code. we can talk all we want but at the end of the day the only real proof that something is a good idea is to implement it, try it, and see. andrey and i have been talking about an implementation of alt-tab for the plan9port rio that i think will feel quite rio-like (except for the whole typing thing), but we won't know if it's actually reasonable until we write it. > if there were various projects around that had been given the > thumbs-up on principle (pending actual implementation), perhaps more > people might be inclined to get their hands dirty and write some code > towards those ends. that would be great. nothing in the rio thread resembled a project. > instead, i feel that people face the prospect of spending weeks > writing code, only to be told at the end that the whole aim of their > effort was misguided; or, worse, that the work was indeed misguided, but > it gets included anyway on the grounds of inclusiveness, diluting the > excellence of the whole system. i can see that, but it's hard to say ahead of time that something isn't misguided. i think what happens most of the time is someone writes something to solve a problem that they have, and if it's generally useful, it makes its way in. a good example is aquarela. but there are problems that have been solved and not rolled in -- ron is working on better clustering support, but i doubt that will be polished enough to be mainstream for a while yet. tim has got the ultrasparc almost working. all of these people wrote the code because it solved a problem they had, so it was useful to do regardless of whether it gets picked up. it's also hard to say something's not misguided until you try it. (it's often easy to say it *is* misguided, but that's not the encouragement you were looking for). there's always a risk that it might turn out not to be a good idea, or to need another go around. even the things that are successful often need extra go-arounds: even central pieces such as the file server, 9P, and the graphics system have gone through at least three major revisions each. i agree that it would be great to have a list of interesting problems to solve, but i'm not sure we could actually figure out beforehand which solutions are the best ones or even which are complete flops. but you're right -- we can at least identify the problems. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8BF3263AD9 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:53:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCEDD31E91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E2273187F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <944907962be7d1ef91c5b67bf62b923a@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:52:19 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>could implementing subpixel rendering help matters here? that one's easy: no. something else might, though. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4D1363B69 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:09:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6640B63B00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:09:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22457-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:09:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A698763AFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:09:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:08:44 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > (that's why I was trying to figure out how to do borderless windows and > failing badly :-) name the window image starting with "noborder". i don't think this is documented. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A27063C8B for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:01:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFB6963977 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:00:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22457-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:00:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E0B2F31722 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:00:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HM0mLe019596 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:00:48 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HM0lWL015130; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:00:47 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:00:47 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: "g01495@gmail.com" , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I tried doing rio-in-rio to do multiple desktops but it got clunky fast. (that's why I was trying to figure out how to do borderless windows and failing badly :-) ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BBF263AB3 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:13:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E584B63A10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:13:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22957-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:13:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5028463A15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:13:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <21f1a1152def30f8d0d87918946dd05a@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:12:57 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <944907962be7d1ef91c5b67bf62b923a@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > >>could implementing subpixel rendering help matters here? > > that one's easy: no. > something else might, though. maybe i got the terminology wrong. i wasn't referring to that LCD hack, if that's what you're thinking of, but of being able to specify finer resolutions for (say) the endpoints of lines than single pixels, and perhaps have the primitives use alpha blending (i.e. non boolean mask) to achieve a decent result. some already allow the former, internally (e.g. _memfillpolysc). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CA2A4C6747 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:08:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4583163D46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:07:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00918-01-47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout18.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E7BF318B9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:07:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050218000751.GDKK20856.mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:07:51 +0000 Received: from paris.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050218000751.QSSY13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@paris.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:07:51 +0000 Message-ID: From: "Steve Simon" Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:07:38 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I think the idea of a list of "accepted" problem areas and thoughts on differnt strategys is a good idea, in the same way as the tip O' the day list is a good idea. My contribution is actually an indirest reference to the discussion on the 9grid list about cross domain authentiction IE: I want to allow YOU to be able use some of my cpu cycles and to be able t= o see a limited namespace on THIS machine using THAT authentication server to prove your credentials. I am willing to write the code but its still a ways down the list. If anyone wants another good reason for such a discussion, 9fans has been far too quiet of late =E2=98=BA -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC0AA63BAC for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:07:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2E904639FB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:07:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28555-01-50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:07:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75D1A639FA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:07:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:07:01 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > i talked to russ about his idea of turning the kernel into an > > efficient 9p mux and making everything talk 9p. > > That, to me, is the really exciting idea. what does it get you? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:27:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:27:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDE3F639BF for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:53:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E58363AD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-01-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9774B63B8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:52:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 3BA5566B8C; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:52:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:52:36 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Message-ID: <20050217225236.GN77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, Feb 17, 2005 at 10:21:19PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > of course, it's perfectly possible to take the view that plan 9 is > perfect; that beyond minor bug fixes, new hardware ports and device > drivers and more applications, plan 9 is as good as it could be. > > if that's the consensus view, then fine, i can live with that. > > but personally, i think that there *are* places where plan 9 doesn't > perhaps do as well as it could, and fixing some of those might require > the rethinking of some core parts of the system. we talked about some of this at the OSDI BoF. there are places where plan 9 can be improved. i have a list of projects that i ammend every time i come across something that i think would be good to have or should be improved. i talked to russ about his idea of turning the kernel into an efficient 9p mux and making everything talk 9p. i think that is an interesting idea. a link to his initial thoughts on it is here: http://groups-beta.google.com/group/comp.os.plan9/msg/3bcdde3580d62263 i've talked to presotto about implementing something like sfs. http://www.fs.net/sfswww/ i've started working on an implementation of gbde as an extension of devfs. don't hold your breath on when it will be done. really busy with paying work these days. http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf so there are plenty of good project ideas. i don't announce mine because i don't want there to be any expectations that i am going to produce them in a timely fashion. unfortunately, plan 9 is a hobby for me. if i had a way to pay the bills and improve plan 9, i'd certainly do it. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 10:28:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 10:28:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAD9F63BAC for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D6BAAFCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10001-02-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65F386311 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:05 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so467347rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:27:05 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WPwxXWVfDnQutnfdeFm/6qrZSq4I7yVpIk+bERF5YQPvPn+CxVetQp2X0nDdmcJ2IhmTOOqxaX0LPRESwVxCaDonpIpbiTbNzgMsBZric/qJMZgPKlUIzmbWLi2hTNj8sP42ltv8d1z+UnCFO6mC8XKjIRLNoPTkGwkvEXqAWgs= Received: by 10.38.96.50 with SMTP id t50mr47154rnb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:27:04 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:27:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:04 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > a plan 9 laptop is about as secure as dos 1.0 > > I mean, turn it on, pick a random user name which is likely to work, and > you're in with no password or anything. Am I the only one who thinks this > is not so terrific? [answer 1] i think it's realistic. a boot cd would get you the same access. if you get physical machine access, you win. typing a password to authenticate to the local system gives you the feeling of security, not actual security. [answer 2] you could just run the screen locker that rob wrote in termrc. [answer 3] plan 9 is intended to be used as a networked system. laptops are second-class citizens. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:00:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:00:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E53EB63E6C for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:27:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 625DBBE22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:27:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10164-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:27:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 788A4BDE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:27:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [84.4.64.38] ([84.4.64.38]:62213 "HELO kilgore") by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S365126AbVBQURN (ORCPT ); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:17:13 -0500 Message-ID: <015201c5152d$a8249ad0$26400454@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru><1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:17:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Show at least one GUI which need 100 page manual... X11 -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BB2CC6C27 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:59:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 884DFC6A67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:59:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27915-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:59:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB638C6A43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:59:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <89ef1818b119cd2f8c1fb7dca4135596@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:58:56 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <451cb30105021709412b350168@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu with rio i can sit behind somebody else's terminal and use it without having to read a 100-page manual on their key bindings, virtual displays configuration, focus behaviour and menu buttons. rio gives you great functionality. throwing that away because it doesn't implement your particular pet-peeve is like cutting the forest to make more room for fresh air. (and no, this comment isn't directed towards ron, he has his own version of rio with virtual displays and focus-follows-mouse. that's what happens when you're the ruler of minions ;) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B919631888 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:41:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01A343187A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:41:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21785-01-100 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:41:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 315DF31873 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:41:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so283460rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:41:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WwsysfXm219juhwdMo5uDr69KRwVa3GMm7tPZOZLLSA61k/mCvCjdOju0tOHBLJGJ/DgrkWzaDODDxIdBHrR4kFBLyAt6IjfoEXTUhIgC6zRcu1SY5IHD9Gegryti1T5wOUFRpJh7uQWwezBAFjo18apDlKujJZBW9TjicLVPso= Received: by 10.11.100.9 with SMTP id x9mr169140cwb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:41:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 09:41:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105021709412b350168@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:41:07 +0200 From: McLone To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <8c029c990502160945781f293d@mail.gmail.com> <56761140.20050216211557@mail.ru> <451cb3010502161144fefc75a@mail.gmail.com> <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 07:50:14 +0200, Sergey Reva wrote: > >> Because other more advanced (more friendly to user). > M> complicated configs != user-friendly > Most of modern GUI have gui configurator ...which just isn't enought for, say, fvwm2. Yes GUI configurator can do basic settings, like focus policy etc, but what if you need "personalized desktop environment from scratch"? > incompatible GUI's, as result we got manu programs, may be good but > uses different gui library... > program): one for KDE, one for Gnome and one which not use this library... don't forget that only Motif is "full" toolkit; neither Qt nor GTK can't do X resources IIRC -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B994563C9A for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:40:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68CDF3188C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:39:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25405-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:39:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCEBAB8C7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:39:40 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so442553rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:39:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=oLtm48+DBJ9GJ16lJMkOjb0Ldx0fgvyN+by8HQXKWrJX9IEM+DAPGg0fi63yXOq9Qxv9h0BB9nPQur2LAaGTGawI97uaIbmJZdhZQroHbo1LXILLRiMUmFMA3uOKo+GftDYeJeuGKmYtnXi8AugLLra+0fK9ZdLH6LJWAjfS/Y0= Received: by 10.38.15.45 with SMTP id 45mr183870rno; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:39:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:39:39 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 17:39:39 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <451cb301050217143547623375@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <8c029c990502171256b4c6532@mail.gmail.com> <7359f04905021713026e7e9e92@mail.gmail.com> <451cb301050217143547623375@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > "A Concurrent Window System.". 8=BD and rio arose from those > > ideas, although they sacrificed a lot of the generality. > why WM is in Rio? can they be divided? or we'll got another X? They already are divided. Insofar as the analogy holds, rio is the window manager and /dev/draw is X11. Graphics can be used without rio: slay rio | rc acme Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8A85C6BCE for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:37:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50CDD3187A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:36:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21990-01-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:36:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77F6531878 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:36:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HHakEs017358 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:36:46 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1HHajGO019222; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:36:46 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 10:36:45 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Tiit Lankots wrote: > how about no new gui > the old one ain't smellin' yet well, you folks all seem to be able to fit all your windows tiled. I just plain can't. I've to two 21" LCDs and with the CAD systems etc. I use there's no room at all to tile everything. It just doesn't work, hence my need for multiple desktops and other such things. With multiple desktops, as much as I like rio, I find it easier to use flwm and swap around with CTRL-F[1234] etc. So, yes, rio is a fine and wonderful thing, but I don't buy it as the be-all and end-all of window managers. YMMV is always the case. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4AF4C6A86 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:31:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BFF8C6A82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:30:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21990-01-65 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:30:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A4AAC6A80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1HHWYqH021701 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:32:35 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:30:32 +0200 To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> Message-ID: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:30:31 +0200 In-Reply-To: <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Feb 2005 17:30:32.0504 (UTC) FILETIME=[61D99380:01C51516] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > So what we do now? > How it need look this new gui? > As library or as server? > Skined or most simple and fast? > Control library + window maker or all in one? > Or just improve libcontrol and stop on this... > how about no new gui the old one ain't smellin' yet From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19F6BC67F2 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:44:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6063316E4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:43:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16247-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B15831722 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 15:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so313312rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:43:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=phpFr4MdKKnWuoUnpvM8cD7eDJC67w+D1zMcM5lLi1n6Peqpj4gi1cdlCXe/AOayhzy60UUOitkfZ2LJoy9DbvwIClu4LoJGcLpQK2bGnQShTfBshx8fsu5lc2yGGEH3uGHyhDnmzVsUwKFmu+cCVdkEyWpyo/muy7JNgxDKPUw= Received: by 10.11.98.24 with SMTP id v24mr170661cwb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:43:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:43:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105021712435e29ed1c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:43:27 +0200 From: McLone To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <015201c5152d$a8249ad0$26400454@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <015201c5152d$a8249ad0$26400454@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:17:06 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > > Show at least one GUI which need 100 page manual... > X11 w/o toolkit and WM? You must be kiddin'. *unuseable* -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 18 11:01:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 18 11:01:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1845BC6C15 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:27:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFAF4C6943 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21990-01-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:27:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDA57C6A2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:27:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.10] (port=1122 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D1pQY-000ER2-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:27:00 +0300 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:15:50 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu So what we do now? How it need look this new gui? As library or as server? Skined or most simple and fast? Control library + window maker or all in one? Or just improve libcontrol and stop on this... -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54187BDCE for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:54:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D8E7551 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:53:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11509-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 250D5542 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:53:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.27] (port=1037 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D2ARg-000387-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:53:34 +0300 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:50:04 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1031003078.20050218175004@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <1102259578.20050218150447@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Tiit Friday, February 18, 2005, 3:18:41 PM, you wrote: TL> Console != typescript, not even close. TL>> A typescript system is like a user-programmable GUI except you don't TL>> have to program it! Give it a try. Oops! Sorry, not fully understand english, what meaning typescript in your post? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CAF1C67E8 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30CE463C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08104-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from brmea-mail-4.sun.com (brmea-mail-4.Sun.COM [192.18.98.36]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC2FC63C24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfbaymail1sca.SFBay.Sun.COM ([129.145.154.35]) by brmea-mail-4.sun.com (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j1I78wKw026537 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:08:59 -0700 (MST) Received: from submarine.sfbay.sun.com (submarine.SFBay.Sun.COM [129.146.78.138]) by sfbaymail1sca.SFBay.Sun.COM (8.12.10+Sun/8.12.10/ENSMAIL, v2.2) with ESMTP id j1I78wjg021771 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:08:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (from rs76089@localhost) by submarine.sfbay.sun.com (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j1I78wU03920 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:08:58 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:08:58 -0800 From: Roman Shaposhnick To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] viewing (more) png images in p9 Message-ID: <20050218070857.GB3910@submarine> References: <20050217025119.GA28632@submarine> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, Feb 16, 2005 at 08:13:55PM -0700, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > care to share ? > > #plan9@irc.freenode.org > > it's where the fun is ??? there's no source there... just the talk... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43976C6B19 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:00:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 854A5C6775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:00:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21454-01-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:00:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E98B0C6740 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:00:01 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1IHSje21759 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:28:45 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1I51DJ17886 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:01:13 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <11ecd59550d99998dd6dc36cc4d9a8ca@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:51:25 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> [answer 3] >> plan 9 is intended to be used as a networked system. laptops >> are second-class citizens. >> > > hmm, this just sounds like another argument against using plan 9. Not really. Laptops are a poor solution to the problem of information ownership and, on the reverse side, information sharing. So is the disked workstation; for that matter, the entire "personal computer" idea. Plan 9 does not propose to solve the problem, but addresses it much better than all other conventional approaches. You've forgotten the sanity in the early Plan 9 papers and have (no offence intended) been swept along by the commoditisation of computing resources. Consider the COO of laptops, specially when lost or stolen, then replace the laptop with an authentication device that gives you access to any computing terminal anywhere, where Plan 9 provides the computing and file services your access device authenticates you to. Even Microsoft Passport aspired to such a model, but they could not pull off what Plan 9 does by default. ++L PS: the above may be a little murky, but I need to beat a dealine and Ron's remark deserve a more positive reply. I'm sure Ron will catch my meaning. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2762863F94 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:50:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4439363C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:50:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15053-02-10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:50:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E846B63C1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:50:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: From: C H Forsyth Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:53:12 +0000 To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>i agree that it would be great to have a list of interesting problems >>to solve, but i'm not sure we could actually figure out beforehand >>which solutions are the best ones or even which are complete flops. i think that might be taken as a definition of an `interesting problem' (or more accurately, an `interesting solution' to a perceived problem). a friend of mine worked for a time for a famous computer scientist, who produced many interesting ideas. paraphrasing a bit, my friend said that half-way through an implementation, there were usually two results: ``this is brilliant!'', or ``why am i here??''. he said it was rarely possible even to guess which would result beforehand. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D99963ED8 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:12:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BB7D663D4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:12:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08097-03-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:12:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93A9163D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:12:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:10:27 +0900 In-Reply-To: <9c2013c293e670c04339d7ef48bf74a8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Although take a rest by using web browse is a usual play to me, too.=E2= =98=BA > However, this is not a serious problem, if we think the computer for so= mething > work. However, if it doesn't make any problem, it's not bad to have v= irtual > desktops in Plan 9, I agree. When I wrote this, I was reading "why Europa has strike-slip fault things= paper", and failed to concentrate myself. After had a lunch and joyful playing tal= ks, I rethinked "hide" operation must be enough for this purpose. Is there any other re= ason why we should have virtual desktop for Plan 9? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24204C6854 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:57:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 689C563DD4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:56:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18167-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.polymtl.ca (smtp.polymtl.ca [132.207.4.11]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA47963DC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [172.16.0.53] ([67.120.114.18]) by smtp.polymtl.ca (8.13.0/8.13.0) with ESMTP id j1I9uQiB008525 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:56:28 -0500 Message-ID: <4215BBCC.1050005@polymtl.ca> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 01:56:28 -0800 From: Nicolas Beauchesne User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Poly-FromMTA: ([67.120.114.18]) at Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:56:25 +0000 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Nicolas.beauchesne@polymtl.ca, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I had the same problem with Vmware like a month ago... Try to strip down the vmware machine to it's bare essential, no audio, usb, etc. for the install, putting them back after the install. Nick Ronald G. Minnich wrote: >ok, my friend is booting plan 9 in vmware 4.5.2 using the vmware CD from >the web page. > >It is hanging right after it prints >dev B0 port 1F0 blah blh > > >anything we should be looking for? Has anyone tried this on this vmware? > >ron > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:25:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:25:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29FC5C6C20 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:15:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 378D5C6AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:14:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18285-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:14:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E1D6C6AF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:14:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id E265966B8C; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:14:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:14:46 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Message-ID: <20050218221446.GV77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 09:36:18PM +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf > > looks like a project! yes, it is, and as i said in a previous message, it is a project i am working on. if others wish to pitch in, i am more than happy to accept help, and phk has offered code review assistance, as well; phk would really like to see gbde implemented on other platforms. -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 026D2C6B22 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:37:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEF3AC6AB9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:36:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18111-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:36:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41876C6AF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:36:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 21:36:18 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf looks like a project! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED854C6BB0 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:10:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73FE663C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:09:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15206-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:09:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7912C69F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:09:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IL9iB5019850 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:09:44 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IL9ff5015330; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:09:43 -0700 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:09:41 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <11ecd59550d99998dd6dc36cc4d9a8ca@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: References: <11ecd59550d99998dd6dc36cc4d9a8ca@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > PS: the above may be a little murky, but I need to beat a dealine and > Ron's remark deserve a more positive reply. I'm sure Ron will catch my > meaning. I catch your meaning, and I agree that I'm probably wrong. But I still worry about the disconnected laptop case, because I take my laptop to many places where network access is just not possible, and then bring it out again. So my network access in the laptop case is available maybe 20% of my working day and will always remain so. Ah well, too little time to write this in a comprehensible way, I take your meaning and Russ's meaning and the meaning of the other good notes that got sent to me w.r.t. this issue. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7653C6B3B for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:36:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0874DC67C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:35:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15206-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:35:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from bee.hiwaay.net (bee.hiwaay.net [216.180.54.11]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71A4EC6864 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:35:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from bee.hiwaay.net (bee.hiwaay.net [216.180.54.11]) by bee.hiwaay.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j1ILZo2H1451374 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:35:51 -0600 (CST) Received: (from krs@localhost) by bee.hiwaay.net (8.13.3/8.13.3/DefSubmit) id j1ILZo5b1452085 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:35:50 -0600 (CST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:35:50 -0600 From: Karl Sackett To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: <20050218213550.GA1442802@hiwaay.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Life with plan9port X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm using plan9port for my daily work and I've picked up a lot from the threads on tips and rio extensions. But I tend to use the plan9port tools and applications as I would use Linux and X tools and apps, and I know I'm missing out on what plan9port is capable of. For starters, how should I set up lib/profile and my X startup scripts? Presently I only set $path and $font and define a few functions in lib/profile. My .xsession file starts plumber then execs rio. What else can I do? What other servers should I start? -- Karl Sackett K4KRS krs@hiwaay.net "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross." Sinclair Lewis From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5AC9C6B7C for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:54:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DEE0C68C5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00350-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED531C6896 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0f57322cacb80f7c319565aeb7cfae61@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:53:09 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <2c7c3234b8871252e4dde821152d96a2@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > have you compared the speed against raw TCP? this may sound silly, but the only way i could find to compare against raw tcp is via hget: % time fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.01s 2.90r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.02s 4.16r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.01u 0.02s 4.07r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.00s 2.83r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz > /dev/null 0.01u 0.00s 2.49r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.00s 2.43r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.01s 3.14r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.01u 0.02s 2.34r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz short of writing something small, of course :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75F13C6A88 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:36:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C43ABC6926 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:35:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01125-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:35:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0963BC682D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:35:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2c7c3234b8871252e4dde821152d96a2@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:35:04 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > attached is the same idea for plan9, done by Aki Nyrhinen (with a > little help from me integrating it with the official plan9 cp). it > speeds up copy from sources up to tenfold in some occasions. has > reasonable speed locally. have you compared the speed against raw TCP? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7752FC6ACE for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:54:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE7F4C6896 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01550-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B5C8C6891 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:52:51 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > it should be straightforward to adapt the line drawing algorithm > to put down alpha-blended grey. that would be nice. given that a pixel with alpha notionally represents a partially filled area, might it would make sense to change the interface so that you can specify lengths smaller than integer pixels? if you're using alpha blending, a line that's half a pixel in radius is quite a reasonable thing, for example. > you don't need to accelerate everything, just the common stuff. > the obscured window case you describe is an important one > that should be handled better. i'd love to see that happen. > it's not so much the lack of acceleration as the copying to > backing store and back. i think it has to copy to backing store. i think maybe the underlying problem is that the backing store is in main memory, not video memory. given that video cards these days tend to have lots of memory, maybe it would be possible to allocate some off-screen images in video memory, thus making them accessible to current acceleration routines. i know virtually nothing about vid cards, so this might easily be impossible; just a thought. from a plan 9 point of view, maybe one could make the unused portion of the vid memory another memory pool from which memdraw could choose to allocate? > there have been at least two attempts to do this. the early > brazil kernels maintained state in the Chans and tried to reestablish > them, but my understanding is that the code never really worked > right, and eventually it got taken out. i wrote a user-level file > server for 9P1 that redialed as necessary to keep the connection > running without any help from the kernel. it worked very well > but i never updated it for 9P2000. it's not a big program. i've got an inferno program that does something similar. the problem i have with it is to do with non-idempotent 9p requests. e.g. i send a Tcreate and the server goes down. has the file been created or not? should the intermediate agent resend the request or not after it has connected. as far as i can see, you can't do this in general without some kind of application knowledge. but maybe there's a cunning way of doing it. the first classic example i encountered of this was when i sent a "reboot" message through such a connection. the kernel rebooted immediately (not sending the reply), and as soon as the server came back up again, it resent the request, causing another reboot, and on and on... oh yes, here's another one for the pot: change screen resolution dynamically. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76775C6C0E for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:24:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8C74C6AEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:23:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18009-01-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:23:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E914AC68E1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:23:56 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id r35so488809rna for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:56 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=lKwgUY04s8286Mfzpr3KnY0xGe5L9Ej80EL9Yh4ZvKk0hybdcz2+d4Rwkmtc3xQq985Bk4C4KTpVB/ByyTVclSh3SfvFEmhDgYM3n0zgdZclOB8Dd7a/Ee//fStkFfRBL00nYV8AVg9wJausy2nZQA2Ws5iXtYV/xW9y4iGiu0k= Received: by 10.11.98.23 with SMTP id v23mr269493cwb; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:55 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105021813232aeca471@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 23:23:55 +0200 From: McLone To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <9c2013c293e670c04339d7ef48bf74a8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <9c2013c293e670c04339d7ef48bf74a8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:50:13 +0900, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > We just need a mouse operation to expand/shrink one window etc. In *box i bind mousewheel[s] or buttons 4-5 on window borders/title for that. Highly useful. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4E7031E7B for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:49:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E7E163CF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:48:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26879-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F5C93176B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:48:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1I4mUCI009442 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:48:31 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1I4mUVE011384; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:48:30 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:48:30 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Russ Cox wrote: > [answer 3] > plan 9 is intended to be used as a networked system. laptops > are second-class citizens. > hmm, this just sounds like another argument against using plan 9. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAF5CC681B for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:43:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BBA363D16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:42:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08104-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:42:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtpq2.home.nl (smtpq2.home.nl [213.51.128.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AEC163C1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:42:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from [213.51.128.134] (port=41150 helo=smtp3.home.nl) by smtpq2.home.nl with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1D22mf-0001JI-Mu for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:42:41 +0100 Received: from cc740438-a.deven1.ov.home.nl ([82.72.18.239]:33339 helo=192.168.1.104) by smtp3.home.nl with esmtp (Exim 4.30) id 1D22me-00075i-5a for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:42:40 +0100 Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell From: "Devon H. O'Dell" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain Organization: SiteTronics Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:42:39 +0100 Message-Id: <1108712559.3950.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.0.2 (2.0.2-3) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-AtHome-MailScanner-Information: Please contact support@home.nl for more information X-AtHome-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 2005-02-17 at 15:36 -0700, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > ok, my friend is booting plan 9 in vmware 4.5.2 using the vmware CD from > the web page. > > It is hanging right after it prints > dev B0 port 1F0 blah blh > > > anything we should be looking for? Has anyone tried this on this vmware? > > ron Yes. You need to remove ALL devices from the virtual machine other than the HD, NIC and CD-ROM. (In fact, you might even need to remove the virtual CD-ROM now that I think of it). Once you're done, you should only have the HD, RAM and NIC in the VM, I think. Good luck :) --Devon From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A5896C6A82 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:28:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43E9DC6763 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:27:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25140-01-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:27:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9B7463F14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:27:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:27:47 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-gbvzhqivtjxcxxmnfnamirvvye" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-gbvzhqivtjxcxxmnfnamirvvye Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NOTE: i originally sent this message (successfuly, according to plan9.ucalgary's mail server) but since it took so long i'll just assume some filter decided fcp.c was spam. i've gzipped it now. sorry if you get double copies. andrey --- original message follows --- > if you want to experiment, i've attached a version of the Inferno > cp(1) called "streamcp" that uses this technique to try to speed up > file transfer; it allows you to specify the number of concurrent reads > and writes. attached is the same idea for plan9, done by Aki Nyrhinen (with a little help from me integrating it with the official plan9 cp). it speeds up copy from sources up to tenfold in some occasions. has reasonable speed locally. i heard ioproc is even faster. % time cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.02s 19.91r cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.03s 20.35r cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.03s 19.93r cp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.01s 4.36r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.00s 5.31r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.04s 5.36r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null --upas-gbvzhqivtjxcxxmnfnamirvvye Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; 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Sat Feb 19 13:57:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC532C6A43 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:50:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 01068C6A7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:49:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04888-04-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:49:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D19CEC6A3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so509842wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:43 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=rZdG+UplJZEc7T8ukZbA7yf/MTlT3RibMKvZS+q0ReakuzHkb7BQW3Y0bsRKKb4zVJgnKDzcSjLyx7keBU3X2lMcsHS8YYaLMQlVkPZ/2ar17x1xSbV0nvfuwnDF/D8Aly7xs8rgEtF5z434iTsW5HrurZow1q7Etqh3dGeQBgQ= Received: by 10.54.30.36 with SMTP id d36mr16831wrd; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.18.24 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3e1162e60502181149dac62fe@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:43 -0800 From: David Leimbach To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > To prevent this you either need to prevent someone from booting > (ie. bios password and hope they dont go through the trouble > of yanking the drive or resetting the bios) or you need to > protect the disk (after all thats probably what they want to > get at after they log in, not network access or the gui). > Something like: > > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf > > would address this nicely. For those who don't want to chase > down the paper, it's an encrypted disk format used by the > FreeBSD group. > Isn't it actually a block-level encryption rather than a filesystem implementation? Dave > Tim N. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1682C63625 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67448C2FF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-03-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F622C2FB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.29] (port=1057 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D27vM-000MYf-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:12:02 +0300 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:04:47 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1102259578.20050218150447@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Tiit, Friday, February 18, 2005, 2:15:53 PM, you wrote: TL> You have libcontrol. ok, how much program you write with it? Where list boxes in this library? Does it maintained? TL> But what I've discovered - after moving to Plan 9 - is that a text-based TL> user interface is intrinsically more powerful than a mostly grahpic one. TL> A typescript system is like a user-programmable GUI except you don't TL> have to program it! Give it a try. In some case yes, and all OS have console, and many user use it (including me), but gui most intuitive and simples -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF21FC6B9B for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:13:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C599C63DFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:12:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09592-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:12:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3512D63A9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:12:29 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <105ad9921fee22aab9e7df5e0b9fe0f6@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:50:25 +0000 In-Reply-To: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>given that a pixel with alpha notionally represents a partially filled >>area, might it would make sense to change the interface so that you it's really transparency (or opacity), not partial filling (of an area). the whole area is filled, but with something more or less transparent/opaque. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3B7BC6A39 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:06:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C458163D72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14255-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 668CDBDBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <64708bcddabb98a1a609ba1a64b9ae29@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:04:01 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-cydzeuoeftrrfgegfbeinzidlj" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-cydzeuoeftrrfgegfbeinzidlj Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > sure. you could imagine adding a stream message to > start some number of reads, but maybe it's enough to > define that streaming style servers allow the client to > queue multiple read messages and respond in order. > > you can already do that for file transfers by using the > offset field appropriately. i tried that, and it didn't seem to speed things up much. regardless of the number of concurrent reads, it was still much slower than streaming TCP. i couldn't say why though - i just measured it across a slow trans-atlantic connection. if you want to experiment, i've attached a version of the Inferno cp(1) called "streamcp" that uses this technique to try to speed up file transfer; it allows you to specify the number of concurrent reads and writes. perhaps someone that knows something about TCP might be able to say why this technique can't use more of the available bandwidth? it'd be great if it could... --upas-cydzeuoeftrrfgegfbeinzidlj Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=streamcp.b.gz Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 H4sIAIwRFkIAA6VYW2/bOBZ+tn7FqYu20sT2psViu5DjAEHSwfSh00G2QB8yeZAlOhYiU16R jpud5r/vuZASZTtJuwu0jkTy3L9zocrVulIrpS2cr6dRVOq82hQKhubeTFbDaTTAhxT+dW+m 3V7RZFvebFey5qa/0KisKMpGWLiXFC7lAeWcr1NY1cWmUtFf0aDUpU0HCx3rskqhUQu4QBHj 0/NaW/XNjgD536VQlcZCvQBjm1LfJNPoATkZW6imESpUc3z668U0wpW6MZDO4BiPLIo8hXyZ aSKOg4OjkAr5RRuT3ag4IZ0MrS7WKMnGImMEQ95P/7SogcpW+RpMk4NF7ZT9Uw+T6SNkAcHV +BI0OUQ15hrfvoLeNqV1b801c5xMJoB+Urmtm3vHuMlKg45dZOgiVgM9+0ABK+3Puc0ZBzOo 6qwg68UDf5x9+Y0MYKVxVywpq0KZ+B05Z4DsyKVMdobP+L8lK9GztD+bAWqTAAo57IscI59n WtdWGL1CeL1q0MhRx4/s7Rk8x4MCF8LTA0Eq3zSmvFMuxgPvU3r3HqXnt1PWe3zKjiKHJH7F KCvxxvhwZJprCc+6qXMXG3kMo/wjZ3vx4+htl2WlII7rtSWtWD4+x0kCL9AA8VeeocF0gl7e XL6B2Sk+dKbNAD0ptAp/Y3bTm6/tOW/24XONP9f5Ttwz+MVtMIVLAVp/YFeXi7jV4ATewvfv nYPxPYn2CEOK0x0KfE/IPMxJFP8jSYk4WmdbDSvJoRgpR7J99uXzp4/nHz+P2owatYISwQkF HJy/6Tl20c8ZyEpzinTwzdGid2RRa0w0KIxNXe7gwUXdQOxjeDcFS/FDxNPTDGwFlsiRBt+W BVjiENe3I8JDQmScFMZmNsZDpI2tcYt28BgxG7+F168h5upZYy19LcZefLr4eJkkoa6n8I6O vmAOz6TcKwNAOZf1CguqJUr0so2rp0u0koPjAEOm5WtkwInUEqsKSTmo5JwpeYH97j3jguCW RVFmLIrTG7KN0V0t2xHMMRl0tlJ+mU0fsKzDBFR2eqgliIkKiQPcyRi9jO/tYVJCekXyiA+w xLaaGI+DxD9QLWWjhWtluhDb+lbp8j9IhRH4GxYB3G09UhnxR8VyjWClMtwr7abRYFgy2ojl hO3zElF1tSVt0rCe17cp5fyU0IrHi9RhhnstW+moAocQRo9mpBsceaZTD1Y0JIQqauHdhSA9 8QVrmzUaVYjloKBuKAUdoUVEgi22qcNTYQ4gu88Qi+gRDKE0IWCHe9xE2aKvrEOlU9ZnFIEG Bf+7LCbrzC6pURVF99oeKNSd26Onbtner5XfoOfDCme6APInO5feGwV2qcCQ77GZqn0bzKJo QVOvlZaQ8+vnyw9nF94WOhd214POd52V+MDTgSgCsTmWT6tiTiMR/PXy45cPhAOOlFeh+AkV hGenBEVlT4m8Xt+TYbhNPx7sCaN/dUuVpuiQT6owzhP+JeAfsiJ0nntmiMF3+F+NWWW3qsNh YFRoEuLMDyf8eiw5HJrYG1M7e4O64uzqly/fMLl+eV6h5GMRPN8spDM12f1Vr0VeU5ed31vl W9h0KlY3rfuohQpzZLPTYVkWt4Iu+Q87jOsmEC/cOgDBnq9IZ8d2RlNQsH/sJTJ3bupx0SrX 8NjUPK8IEfYUaWG4p8iDVFzf3Xbn5n6gKEbuWuMHaXe58X97k3F79P+Yjnt8n5+Q8yxfKvBg +P387Py3D4wCb1aLRO4Sg0J9ww1/Z+oq66GRBV4C3grQsZkta811DYS8X3bFUFqJsWweqPmz 2R6aXOVMexJ2JpdhGEGPI2+ADLUP0c9MI4UJOybGpuEB0Q0YtPJUW9zri4/WkjcWiPBQXuR4 aSv1RoVp8UinDLz2g2PTA/CMxmVP3BRMYUFXnM32e6LvirzX9cSuK8pG1xM789tegDWQ22Lb 17WtobRGVQsXy5797ABuDpSNvkoSJQ8r3UCG3us1KW/oX4fod076jN851bUbXOk6DiU8Y4Dz 91BS7AP/WTfU5IYMt5aqeWrMsQwCEioqYSf7Z/P+/fvp4CX8Wn4DQvrvVlRwXZPMZTKGy5iv aS3LWGm0UdF1iW1pfGnhSzJ7oq02558//XF2/iXxjaOUCgElwl3jn6MjMZb1c3yvymsygUEk WrexUxM3ZwrA1aP4dugmHi56QsrOadFsFA5MKknCpGOxUkLajl3V9RrdtNHFsGUQYqQVs6Mo SfWQoaK6xBc3J0koZFR5CWd3dVmwGIN4AZvpm0oVQDzw+porM4F40dQrKDaTeRJJPcZaj8Xt H3+fYkFdbVD4XMG63iIYsD7bbR1xEU+lhu/WbtNN+OwF/sIWbnTThMnumBJjwRyv6PsAXTB9 qr+ORSHEybUEOuYC6AinkL+YcfHMpXLmPJLgrquSuQQ0DnnOZri/N2DjAVc0aFemarzD8jrV GF5Vd+Eo8DZoaE9qjrrxVTpt9d6ZxTxC+penJ+7M3Hg5+HJLPDqSmY5hYJ6cTKVh7JQKs3OL inpjCI99rk9iDjC8ot5EVPj2ozdVVUjfduf5uOMuM5NIZCWevrG58rTdaU3Pz7bBJ5kf+cDK w5vBOzE7iUqpxp96Y7sSW2rG3WFe8xJdzZQ7X4iQxXNkbQrREOyKWb+Wla6aRf6DE1VF+qYX o1IjIBkdXUeG6zt0PKwyoafhr39x3PYYRsXJGN2WTOxxOOUzaigOHXAWO6MGYact6b22aWtO cTo/qZS+sUtarWkNfSAjtVNF0yKdH0OdwKnsJ24kwN0TXnHhki80FBq5gJAVNUcCdPcFqfs0 s3fS8QnO1vTpIRDRduQ9/wZhafnyxxZWeUT/3MecpyLDCNmjFUIEchjqx5B8GH0CjCdp+tBj mKPVaX99FyXoNT0PwYKa7YIFI0WfMOnWh+bOOUz04od+Pf/lXXjxG+gWVGu57ZEkvlCRrNoD TCMgHBg6v3HTk1heHaf6WuIo4mhNp9fhWNVPgp/1j3dFINS5gVMq8EPkLlJrd0XkGZgscp4R sx6i/wJ8XrfC6BoAAA== --upas-cydzeuoeftrrfgegfbeinzidlj-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2757C6B1D for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:00:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E8302C6AAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:59:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06459-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B7E6C6AA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 74E3F66B95; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:50 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Message-ID: <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <3e1162e60502181149dac62fe@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3e1162e60502181149dac62fe@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 11:49:43AM -0800, David Leimbach wrote: > > To prevent this you either need to prevent someone from booting > > (ie. bios password and hope they dont go through the trouble > > of yanking the drive or resetting the bios) or you need to > > protect the disk (after all thats probably what they want to > > get at after they log in, not network access or the gui). > > Something like: > > > > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf > > > > would address this nicely. For those who don't want to chase > > down the paper, it's an encrypted disk format used by the > > FreeBSD group. > > > > Isn't it actually a block-level encryption rather than a filesystem > implementation? yes. that's exactly what it is. how is that not useful in this case? -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55FCDC6AB2 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:55:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2064163AF4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:54:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06459-01-89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:54:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A63E63AC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:54:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0ab6a921fcbc154ac8df87a475f6037c@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:32:20 +0000 In-Reply-To: <5eb33c612e76a028607ef83642fef691@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu there's a qualifying conditional at the start of that sentence and as with a few early papers it's a rather complex description for something that becomes less elaborate with a more abstract interpretation, even when the computations are exactly the same! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AAFDC68DC for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:05:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E6CA63DBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11508-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9B5763D72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:04:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:03:58 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ohtyciofnxprdfazcsxvxdkspd" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ohtyciofnxprdfazcsxvxdkspd Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > sure. you could imagine adding a stream message to > start some number of reads, but maybe it's enough to > define that streaming style servers allow the client to > queue multiple read messages and respond in order. > > you can already do that for file transfers by using the > offset field appropriately. i tried that, and it didn't seem to speed things up much. regardless of the number of concurrent reads, it was still much slower than streaming TCP. i couldn't say why though - i just measured it across a slow trans-atlantic connection. if you want to experiment, i've attached a version of the Inferno cp(1) called "streamcp" that uses this technique to try to speed up file transfer; it allows you to specify the number of concurrent reads and writes. perhaps someone that knows something about TCP might be able to say why this technique can't use more of the available bandwidth? it'd be great if it could... --upas-ohtyciofnxprdfazcsxvxdkspd Content-Type: application/octet-stream Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=streamcp.b.gz Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 H4sIAIwRFkIAA6VYW2/bOBZ+tn7FqYu20sT2psViu5DjAEHSwfSh00G2QB8yeZAlOhYiU16R jpud5r/vuZASZTtJuwu0jkTy3L9zocrVulIrpS2cr6dRVOq82hQKhubeTFbDaTTAhxT+dW+m 3V7RZFvebFey5qa/0KisKMpGWLiXFC7lAeWcr1NY1cWmUtFf0aDUpU0HCx3rskqhUQu4QBHj 0/NaW/XNjgD536VQlcZCvQBjm1LfJNPoATkZW6imESpUc3z668U0wpW6MZDO4BiPLIo8hXyZ aSKOg4OjkAr5RRuT3ag4IZ0MrS7WKMnGImMEQ95P/7SogcpW+RpMk4NF7ZT9Uw+T6SNkAcHV +BI0OUQ15hrfvoLeNqV1b801c5xMJoB+Urmtm3vHuMlKg45dZOgiVgM9+0ABK+3Puc0ZBzOo 6qwg68UDf5x9+Y0MYKVxVywpq0KZ+B05Z4DsyKVMdobP+L8lK9GztD+bAWqTAAo57IscI59n WtdWGL1CeL1q0MhRx4/s7Rk8x4MCF8LTA0Eq3zSmvFMuxgPvU3r3HqXnt1PWe3zKjiKHJH7F KCvxxvhwZJprCc+6qXMXG3kMo/wjZ3vx4+htl2WlII7rtSWtWD4+x0kCL9AA8VeeocF0gl7e XL6B2Sk+dKbNAD0ptAp/Y3bTm6/tOW/24XONP9f5Ttwz+MVtMIVLAVp/YFeXi7jV4ATewvfv nYPxPYn2CEOK0x0KfE/IPMxJFP8jSYk4WmdbDSvJoRgpR7J99uXzp4/nHz+P2owatYISwQkF HJy/6Tl20c8ZyEpzinTwzdGid2RRa0w0KIxNXe7gwUXdQOxjeDcFS/FDxNPTDGwFlsiRBt+W BVjiENe3I8JDQmScFMZmNsZDpI2tcYt28BgxG7+F168h5upZYy19LcZefLr4eJkkoa6n8I6O vmAOz6TcKwNAOZf1CguqJUr0so2rp0u0koPjAEOm5WtkwInUEqsKSTmo5JwpeYH97j3jguCW RVFmLIrTG7KN0V0t2xHMMRl0tlJ+mU0fsKzDBFR2eqgliIkKiQPcyRi9jO/tYVJCekXyiA+w xLaaGI+DxD9QLWWjhWtluhDb+lbp8j9IhRH4GxYB3G09UhnxR8VyjWClMtwr7abRYFgy2ojl hO3zElF1tSVt0rCe17cp5fyU0IrHi9RhhnstW+moAocQRo9mpBsceaZTD1Y0JIQqauHdhSA9 8QVrmzUaVYjloKBuKAUdoUVEgi22qcNTYQ4gu88Qi+gRDKE0IWCHe9xE2aKvrEOlU9ZnFIEG Bf+7LCbrzC6pURVF99oeKNSd26Onbtner5XfoOfDCme6APInO5feGwV2qcCQ77GZqn0bzKJo QVOvlZaQ8+vnyw9nF94WOhd214POd52V+MDTgSgCsTmWT6tiTiMR/PXy45cPhAOOlFeh+AkV hGenBEVlT4m8Xt+TYbhNPx7sCaN/dUuVpuiQT6owzhP+JeAfsiJ0nntmiMF3+F+NWWW3qsNh YFRoEuLMDyf8eiw5HJrYG1M7e4O64uzqly/fMLl+eV6h5GMRPN8spDM12f1Vr0VeU5ed31vl W9h0KlY3rfuohQpzZLPTYVkWt4Iu+Q87jOsmEC/cOgDBnq9IZ8d2RlNQsH/sJTJ3bupx0SrX 8NjUPK8IEfYUaWG4p8iDVFzf3Xbn5n6gKEbuWuMHaXe58X97k3F79P+Yjnt8n5+Q8yxfKvBg +P387Py3D4wCb1aLRO4Sg0J9ww1/Z+oq66GRBV4C3grQsZkta811DYS8X3bFUFqJsWweqPmz 2R6aXOVMexJ2JpdhGEGPI2+ADLUP0c9MI4UJOybGpuEB0Q0YtPJUW9zri4/WkjcWiPBQXuR4 aSv1RoVp8UinDLz2g2PTA/CMxmVP3BRMYUFXnM32e6LvirzX9cSuK8pG1xM789tegDWQ22Lb 17WtobRGVQsXy5797ABuDpSNvkoSJQ8r3UCG3us1KW/oX4fod076jN851bUbXOk6DiU8Y4Dz 91BS7AP/WTfU5IYMt5aqeWrMsQwCEioqYSf7Z/P+/fvp4CX8Wn4DQvrvVlRwXZPMZTKGy5iv aS3LWGm0UdF1iW1pfGnhSzJ7oq02558//XF2/iXxjaOUCgElwl3jn6MjMZb1c3yvymsygUEk WrexUxM3ZwrA1aP4dugmHi56QsrOadFsFA5MKknCpGOxUkLajl3V9RrdtNHFsGUQYqQVs6Mo SfWQoaK6xBc3J0koZFR5CWd3dVmwGIN4AZvpm0oVQDzw+porM4F40dQrKDaTeRJJPcZaj8Xt H3+fYkFdbVD4XMG63iIYsD7bbR1xEU+lhu/WbtNN+OwF/sIWbnTThMnumBJjwRyv6PsAXTB9 qr+ORSHEybUEOuYC6AinkL+YcfHMpXLmPJLgrquSuQQ0DnnOZri/N2DjAVc0aFemarzD8jrV GF5Vd+Eo8DZoaE9qjrrxVTpt9d6ZxTxC+penJ+7M3Hg5+HJLPDqSmY5hYJ6cTKVh7JQKs3OL inpjCI99rk9iDjC8ot5EVPj2ozdVVUjfduf5uOMuM5NIZCWevrG58rTdaU3Pz7bBJ5kf+cDK w5vBOzE7iUqpxp96Y7sSW2rG3WFe8xJdzZQ7X4iQxXNkbQrREOyKWb+Wla6aRf6DE1VF+qYX o1IjIBkdXUeG6zt0PKwyoafhr39x3PYYRsXJGN2WTOxxOOUzaigOHXAWO6MGYact6b22aWtO cTo/qZS+sUtarWkNfSAjtVNF0yKdH0OdwKnsJ24kwN0TXnHhki80FBq5gJAVNUcCdPcFqfs0 s3fS8QnO1vTpIRDRduQ9/wZhafnyxxZWeUT/3MecpyLDCNmjFUIEchjqx5B8GH0CjCdp+tBj mKPVaX99FyXoNT0PwYKa7YIFI0WfMOnWh+bOOUz04od+Pf/lXXjxG+gWVGu57ZEkvlCRrNoD TCMgHBg6v3HTk1heHaf6WuIo4mhNp9fhWNVPgp/1j3dFINS5gVMq8EPkLlJrd0XkGZgscp4R sx6i/wJ8XrfC6BoAAA== --upas-ohtyciofnxprdfazcsxvxdkspd-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E94EC670D for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:13:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 813E463BFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:12:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28449-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:12:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B107363C22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:12:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:12:26 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <57be799e06e50bb191c61c752bd1d583@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i believe russ meant that on Plan 9 networks laptops are just keyboard/mouse/display interfaces and should never serve as standalone systems. they're meant to connect to a physically secure fs/auth servers, not serve those files themselves. clients, not servers. hence the second-rate citizenship. i move my laptop from home to school every day. it serves as a terminal to plan9.ucalgary.ca and the only plan9-related things it has are a couple of partitions -- 9fat and cfs (cache). none of my files are stored on it (except whatever is in cfs). it's as secure as anything else. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3482463F9B for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:58:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1176531E62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26879-01-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:58:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from outmail128153.authsmtp.com (outmail128153.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA79731E5B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:58:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (secure.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.25]) by punt-mx0.dmpriest.net.uk (8.12.11/8.12.11/Kp) with ESMTP id j1I4wNIH032728; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:58:23 GMT Received: from [192.168.0.100] (d66-183-189-46.bchsia.telus.net [66.183.189.46]) (authenticated bits=0) by squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (8.13.1/8.13.1/Kp) with ESMTP id j1I4wMIB091802; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 04:58:22 GMT (envelope-from plalonde@telus.net) In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <57be799e06e50bb191c61c752bd1d583@telus.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Paul Lalonde Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:58:21 -0800 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633132383739.squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk:Kp X-Powered-By: AuthSMTP - http://www.authsmtp.com - Authenticated SMTP Mail Relay X-Report-SPAM: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-Virus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system! X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Russ Cox X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Not to mention that laptops are an important class of networked devices. I rarely wind up with my laptop more than a few hours away from its next connection, and spend most of my days with my laptop wirelessly connected. My laptop isn't second class - it has become my principal machine. Useful would be an encrypted file system on my laptop with a USB-dongle auth server providing the key; something like a gumstix (www.gumstix.org) could run an auth server pretty easily. Paul On 17-Feb-05, at 8:48 PM, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > > > On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Russ Cox wrote: > >> [answer 3] >> plan 9 is intended to be used as a networked system. laptops >> are second-class citizens. >> > > hmm, this just sounds like another argument against using plan 9. > > ron > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4704DC6941 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:02:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFB2ABDBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11489-01-48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFD2C63E4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:07 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1IG3Aih014197 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:03:10 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:01:04 +0200 To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <1102259578.20050218150447@mail.ru> <1031003078.20050218175004@mail.ru> Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:01:03 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1031003078.20050218175004@mail.ru> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2005 16:01:04.0457 (UTC) FILETIME=[0CA85B90:01C515D3] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Oops! Sorry, not fully understand english, what meaning typescript in > your post? A typescript system is one, where any text on the screen is just that - text, and can be edited, etc. At the same time, any text on the screen is a potential command waiting to be executed. Acme is pretty much a definition of a typescript system. It has had Oberon (obviously) as one of its prime inspirations. It is amazing how powerful these things are. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40054C684B for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:56:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C38563D30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:56:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00144-01-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9152C63D26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:56:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.6] (port=1038 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D217a-000Ht4-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:56:11 +0300 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:35:16 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <211974718.20050218073516@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Ronald, Friday, February 18, 2005, 12:36:09 AM, you wrote: RGM> ok, my friend is booting plan 9 in vmware 4.5.2 using the vmware CD from RGM> the web page. RGM> It is hanging right after it prints RGM> dev B0 port 1F0 blah blh They use iso file or burned disk? I used both variant, and all it work (vmware 4.0.5)... It's very strange because previously often I get result as you describe? Previously I get this result when use cdrom on virtual machine and it's be empty. But in case of using cdrom drive from host system try set 'Legacy emulation' check box. -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C125AC6AC0 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:19:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E023C52D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:18:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29406-03-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:18:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAFB5C50E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:18:44 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1IDKleG010876 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:20:47 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:18:41 +0200 To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> <1102259578.20050218150447@mail.ru> Message-ID: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:18:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: <1102259578.20050218150447@mail.ru> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2005 13:18:41.0707 (UTC) FILETIME=[5D86AFB0:01C515BC] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > In some case yes, and all OS have console, and many user use it > (including me), but gui most intuitive and simples Console !=3D typescript, not even close. Think Acme (or Oberon). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 13:57:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 13:57:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CAD463EF7 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:18:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEDFD63D7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:17:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06522-02-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:17:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.197]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38B0063D3C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:17:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so293344wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:17:52 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Nw/PYGtJp5p7Pa0HzYRRs85YXNOqHqIgynP9Z83wcjxQG0oh02iCxFHI6HwVoellq8RXTjAS5edO2DlVBxu87UBQgVZ7Sq+BdiYPginuNImaloaANcZW6S3dOD9PjsZwzBziovdXu+86JH84CnNndmw5zckJv7+llNtmPAFLQvA= Received: by 10.54.17.6 with SMTP id 6mr128967wrq; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:17:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:17:52 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905021723172eee2d1f@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:17:52 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <9c2013c293e670c04339d7ef48bf74a8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Totally correct. Label and Hide are enough for me to cope with a few machines at once. Gee ... open a big window and cpu somewhere, run rio. Virtual desktop? Call it what you like. brucee On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:10:27 +0900, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > Although take a rest by using web browse is a usual play to me, too.=E2= =98=BA > > However, this is not a serious problem, if we think the computer for so= mething > > work. However, if it doesn't make any problem, it's not bad to have v= irtual > > desktops in Plan 9, I agree. >=20 > When I wrote this, I was reading "why Europa has strike-slip fault things= paper", and > failed to concentrate myself. After had a lunch and joyful playing tal= ks, I rethinked > "hide" operation must be enough for this purpose. Is there any other re= ason why > we should have virtual desktop for Plan 9? >=20 > Kenji >=20 > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F421EC6B20 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:22:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5958A63FE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:22:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01955-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:21:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C910363FD0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:21:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:21:35 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <757aedc53b1bcb951617d3cc6b4ebce9@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > This is why I'd like to see the key served from a smart dongle - A more > secure handshake model can be used, and the dongle typically lives > separated from the data. i agree a smart dongle is a good idea, but mainly because it can subvert dictionary attacks if someone gets direct access to the disk. if someone jumps in before you in the boot process, they can still ask your dongle for the relevant information to enable them to decrypt the data, so a secure boot is still necessary. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F02A5C6BB3 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:02:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 397E463E7D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:02:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20614-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:01:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACBAB63E4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:01:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id a36so516rnf for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:00:58 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=r5ZOOeU+HMZdefphGP17JCPQXirjSz/jAug8ik+9HCCT0/NU40oIQTnwkfLRIOyeKIXnbvGwUz7xohzPADBENW5g5ybvJ9X4pou1D8NdA+2wYKO1o9+RMECmM8zRz48MDeN9E7U0+4G5wpa7Uz5HHoyl+1jgnBZo/CCbeSkfUag= Received: by 10.38.75.37 with SMTP id x37mr31082rna; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:00:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:00:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:00:57 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Life with plan9port In-Reply-To: <20050218213550.GA1442802@hiwaay.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050218213550.GA1442802@hiwaay.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_54, J_CHICKENPOX_61, J_CHICKENPOX_62, RCVD_BY_IP, SPF_HELO_PASS, SPF_PASS X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a bunch of my startup files. It's the sh half, but I have similar stuff set up for rc. (I use bash on one machine and rc on another to force myself to keep plan9port working nicely with both.) Notice the setting of $BROWSER (see web(1)), $EDITOR, $GS_FONTPATH, $PAGER (see cat(1)), $secstore (used by factotum), $COREDIR (see core(1); most of my systems are set up to dump cores into /core/username). The complicated if at the end of .profile checks to see if I'm logging in on tty1, and if so starts factotum, ssh-agent, and X. It needs to set $NAMESPACE because X is not yet running. The .bashrc set +o emacs and set +o vi turn off (sic) emacs and vi line editing, so that bash runs in cooked mode, so I can edit my command lines with 9term. The script riostart, which has nothing to do with rio (it does on Plan 9!), starts my stats, acme, and firefox windows. Russ t23=; cat .profile PATH=$HOME/bin:$PATH:/usr/local/plan9/bin PLAN9=/usr/local/plan9 BROWSER=firefox CVS_RSH=ssh EDITOR=E GS_FONTPATH=$PLAN9/postscript/font H=`hostname | sed 's/\..*//'` MPAGE="-t -bLetter" PAGER=nobs PS1=$H'=; ' unset FCEDIT VISUAL font=/usr/local/plan9/font/lucm/unicode.9.font home=$HOME prompt="$H=; ^A " # for rc user=$USER secstore=swtch.com server=am export \ BROWSER\ CVS_RSH\ EDITOR\ FCEDIT\ GS_FONTPATH\ H\ MPAGE\ PAGER\ PATH\ PLAN9\ PS1\ VISUAL\ font\ home\ prompt\ user\ secstore\ ulimit -c unlimited if [ -d /core/rsc ]; then COREDIR=/core/rsc; export COREDIR fi . $HOME/.bashrc if [ "`/bin/ls -l /proc/self/fd/0 2>/dev/null | awk '{print $NF}'`" = '/dev/tty1' ] then # echo # echo Console login. NAMESPACE=/tmp/ns.`hostname` export NAMESPACE rm -rf $NAMESPACE; mkdir $NAMESPACE # echo ' name' space $NAMESPACE # echo Starting factotum. 9 factotum # echo Starting SSH agent. eval `9 ssh-agent -e` startx fi t23=; cat .bashrc _cd () { \cd "$@" && case "$TERM!$-" in linux!*) ;; *!*i*) awd esac } alias cd=_cd PS1=$H'=; ' export PS1 set +o emacs set +o vi set -a # autoexport [ -d $PLAN9 ] || . $HOME/.profile t23=; cat .xinitrc plumber riostart rio & sleeper t23=; cat bin/riostart #!/usr/local/plan9/bin/rc astats & sleep 2 # the funny acme comments are for restart switch(`{hostname}){ # acme case tux # acme acme -a -W 1592x1100@0,100 -l lib/acme.dump & case t23 * # acme acme -a -W 1392x942@0,100 -l lib/acme.dump & } # acme firefox & t23=; cat bin/sleeper #!/bin/sh while true do sleep 1000 done t23=; t23=; cat bin/restart #!/bin/sh grep $1 $HOME/bin/riostart | /usr/local/plan9/bin/rc t23=; cat bin/astats #!/bin/sh x=/usr/local/plan9/bin/auxstats l=lcs.mit.edu c=csail.mit.edu mach="tux.$c:$x amsterdam.$l:$x tears.$l:$x sweat.$l:$x" if [ `hostname` = t23 ] then mach="t23 $mach" fi stats -W 500x100@0,0 -lmisce $mach # stats -W 100x100@0,0 -lmisce t23=; From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82E6063FBA for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:45:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0D0963D36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08110-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:44:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (webhosting.rdsbv.ro [213.157.185.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 581F363D41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:44:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from webhosting.rdsbv.ro (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j1I7ijuL009325 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:44:45 +0200 Received: from localhost (util@localhost) by webhosting.rdsbv.ro (8.13.3/8.13.3/Submit) with ESMTP id j1I7ijNR009322 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:44:45 +0200 X-Authentication-Warning: webhosting.rdsbv.ro: util owned process doing -bs Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:44:45 +0200 (EET) From: "Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE" X-X-Sender: util@webhosting.rdsbv.ro To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell In-Reply-To: <1108712559.3950.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> Message-ID: References: <1108712559.3950.13.camel@localhost.localdomain> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > On Thu, 2005-02-17 at 15:36 -0700, Ronald G. Minnich wrote: >> ok, my friend is booting plan 9 in vmware 4.5.2 using the vmware CD from >> the web page. >> >> It is hanging right after it prints >> dev B0 port 1F0 blah blh >> >> >> anything we should be looking for? Has anyone tried this on this vmware? >> >> ron > > Yes. > > You need to remove ALL devices from the virtual machine other than the > HD, NIC and CD-ROM. (In fact, you might even need to remove the virtual > CD-ROM now that I think of it). Once you're done, you should only have > the HD, RAM and NIC in the VM, I think. > > Good luck :) I had the same problem (under wmware and qemu). When I removed the cdrom from vmware it worked. Under qemu I _added_ a cdrom and it worked. Hope it helps. --- Catalin(ux aka Dino) BOIE catab at deuroconsult.ro http://kernel.umbrella.ro/ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8708BC6870 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:04:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C794363E70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:04:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18170-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:04:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0A27963E6C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 06:04:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:04:15 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Plan 9 has a strong intrinsic > opposition to change; this is mostly good beacuse of obvious > reasons. But some experimentation would'nt hurt. I just can't see the Then just go ahead and experiment! These days we run what we call Plan B. That's an experiment on Plan 9, the system behaves differently and we're learning what we like of the system, and what we do not. In particular, what we like is that the system mounts resources automatically and that it makes it easy to adapt to changes. What we don't like is mostly that during the auth stage, a missbehaving fileserver may lock your system. Before this, we experimented with redirfs, which was a previous attempt to do this at user-level, and it didn't quite work, because not all files were automatically mounted and failover could fail :-), doing this in the kernel has simplified things a lot. Regarding the UIs, we have what we call omero (another experiment), it's a mixture of a window-toolkit and a file server, that handles all the graphics by its own. The application creates files to build its UI, and the fs takes care of the mouse and everything else. This allows you to replicate and move around UI components without placing the burden in the application. During the construction of omero we tried two nice experiments, one was mouse cooked mode, which I now consider as a mistake, after experimenting with it. The other, which I consider a big success, is defining the left control, start-button, left-alt as mouse 1, 2, and 3 buttons. We use the menu for composing (old alt), and capslock as control. This made it very nice to use 3-button interfaces (like acme and omero) in laptops. Probably sometime this year we'll consider both the system and omero stable enough to try and talk about how to bring this stuff into Plan 9, if anyone cares. Even if others consider that it's not worth placing this kind of stuff in Plan 9, some things might still be useful, like the mouse buttons thing. My point is that experimentation is a good thing, so go ahead. Of course it's perfectly nice for others to say `we won't use the resulting code', but that's why it's an experiment, isnt it? It may also be that those that refuse to use the resulting code might teach you a better way of doing it, which is even better. good luck PS: Sorry about the long mail :-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89BC3C69C7 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0DDF663F7C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:49:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16059-01-71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:48:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2769463ED4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:48:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.14] (port=1051 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D2BJH-000I53-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:48:56 +0300 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:37:04 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <763822640.20050218183704@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day In-Reply-To: References: <0345be3b46120cbf06bdff45601d5540@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In Acme type 'Indent ON' and then press middle mouse button on it to turn on auto indent -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87149C6ADE for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38373C68D9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25140-01-69 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1FCC8C68B3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:23:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:22:40 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <11ecd59550d99998dd6dc36cc4d9a8ca@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu lucio: > Not really. Laptops are a poor solution to the problem of information > ownership and, on the reverse side, information sharing. So is the > disked workstation; for that matter, the entire "personal computer" > idea. Plan 9 does not propose to solve the problem, but addresses it > much better than all other conventional approaches. i'm not sure i agree. if you can always contact your authentication and file servers, the current plan 9 model works fine, but i think the idea of universal global interconnect isn't realistic. firewalls are ubiquitous. network coverage is patchy (and probably always will be). i think it makes sense to carry your personal information near your person, even if you only carry a key that enables you to access your personal data on other systems. paul: > Useful would be an encrypted file system on my laptop with a USB-dongle > auth server providing the key; something like a gumstix > (www.gumstix.org) could run an auth server pretty easily. this would be a way forward. if your fs is encrypted, it doesn't matter who has hardware access to your machine, as long as only you have the key. the important thing is to make the boot process itself secure, so that nobody else can step in and subvert your key entry. russ: > i don't know what peer-to-peer means, but if we moved to > a public key model (which was the reason presotto created p9any) > and had the auth server just be a repository for public keys > (signed by bootes), then any amount of caching could happen. i'd like to see an authentication model along SDSI/SPKI lines, where entities can authenticate directly with one another without necessarily needing to talk to a third party auth server. the inferno model does this currently, but you can only authenticate with parties in the same domain. charles has done some work in this area for Inferno. it's highly applicable to plan 9 too. this way, me and my laptop are at the centre of my world. i can talk to anyone, and name chaining and SPKI tag rules mean that i can make useful deductions about what i should do on their behalf, even if their public key isn't known to me. i'd like to see the distinction between cpu server and terminal disappear. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F8F763E99 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:10:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98DFE63D4A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08097-03-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9999EC68B2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:09:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so292836wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:09:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=c5aIqLj/EoYwvRpPS1WixEWHopb6n1ZHdQtsdJUZWXgjPolKqZ1D/M1ALg8hJePLRjSHVMUWJyHMErSpq5C4zy/K+vIQXKh2Jz/ubxjk+TqCAFoa+fOO2Pk2YKvDTf7NluqQsS46CBojO3BvjWUqo+ChPiXPVdi98YoARAeISJY= Received: by 10.54.17.6 with SMTP id 6mr126569wrq; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:09:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:09:34 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d190502172309611473c1@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:09:34 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: FW: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <200502172231.HAA12789@tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Noel's a good bloke too, so give him a break. brucee From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 059F2C6714 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:45:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3B57C63EA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:45:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08104-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:45:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E079263FB5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 02:45:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9ddf10eced42d0f589a837aecb106cfb@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:45:19 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> i think it's realistic. a boot cd would get you the same access. >> if you get physical machine access, you win. typing a password >> to authenticate to the local system gives you the feeling of >> security, not actual security. > > yes, if I get physical acccess, I win. I'll just tear the thing to bits > and boot it with an ICE :-) I don't even care if I mark up the pretty > plastic. > Possession is 9/10th of security. The boot cd is the other 1/10th. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B9BBC685C for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:52:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 74EC063C27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23764-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:52:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E68963C38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:51:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9c2013c293e670c04339d7ef48bf74a8@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:50:13 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > well, you folks all seem to be able to fit all your windows tiled. I ju= st=20 > plain can't. I've to two 21" LCDs and with the CAD systems etc. I use=20 > there's no room at all to tile everything. It just doesn't work, hence = my=20 > need for multiple desktops and other such things.=20 I think you mean virtual multiple deskops judging from andrey's comment on this. To me, I 'm not so good to remember the image in my head, that kind of multiple desktops doesn't work well either. It works for me, only to ke= ep web browser in a virtual desktop, and another work for another desktop et= c. In this sense, I'm doing completely different things for each desktop, an= d=20 I'd be better to concentrate to use my brain only one for one thing at a = time. Although take a rest by using web browse is a usual play to me, too.=E2=98= =BA However, this is not a serious problem, if we think the computer for some= thing work. However, if it doesn't make any problem, it's not bad to have vir= tual desktops in Plan 9, I agree. If we need many windows (need not be a desktop, I believe), probably I'm doing one thing, and need to check multiple data at once. In this case, I'm sure tiling scheme can be used for this from my experience with marsv= . We just need a mouse operation to expand/shrink one window etc. If I want to see much larger data in a window, I believe I have to buy more big physical medeia.=E2=98=BA=20 On the other hand, multiple tiled window scheme has a big advantage that it can show us all the levels of possible operation in a desktop. This m= akes user easier to choose reasonable command from the windows. No deep hidden command which usually makes problem, and selling kindergarten like teaching book.=E2=98=BA How do you think of this? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B384C6AC4 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:17:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65F91B591 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:17:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20095-01-97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9ACFDB042 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:51467 "HELO kilgore") by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S366371AbVBRMRD (ORCPT ); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:17:03 -0500 Message-ID: <008701c515b3$c1e1d7e0$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:17:03 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > there were usually two results: ``this is brilliant!'', or > ``why am i here??''. an additional phrase often uttered is ''that's funny ...'' when some new insight is stumbled upon. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CC3FC6881 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:10:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A51663EE8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:09:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23916-02-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams013.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n13.valueweb.net [216.219.253.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4C82F63EE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:42251 "HELO kilgore") by ams013.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S362016AbVBRMJx (ORCPT ); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:09:53 -0500 Message-ID: <006501c515b2$c179bcb0$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <200502172231.HAA12789@tk3p108pos.tky.swissbank.com> <775b8d190502172309611473c1@mail.gmail.com> Subject: Re: FW: [9fans] Mouse chord patch for Unix sam Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:09:53 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Noel's a good bloke too, so give him a break. he sure is. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5433C6A68 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:01:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76E82B591 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:01:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04888-04-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:01:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB6F9C68E3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:01:09 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so620827rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:08 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ISQEg9ccMjWmz8mlFsTKHdoYfaIfx6aZM5lYvO74WG7dyISlng3yPYCvQxx+7gQKC8xaO9wjvwrU6fdYYXK+mJRnwvDzgFIj0uXsWgBKkHhdT1FyIhy7X1WqUsZ+GQmgK24ewk4CpjWNDnmtWY4eM2DxVpvMXmHboj/YrqRGe60= Received: by 10.38.89.15 with SMTP id m15mr216400rnb; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:01:08 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:01:08 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > the first classic example i encountered of this was when i sent a > "reboot" message through such a connection. the kernel rebooted > immediately (not sending the reply), and as soon as the server came > back up again, it resent the request, causing another reboot, and on > and on. works as documented! ;-) > oh yes, here's another one for the pot: > change screen resolution dynamically. i made this work once, but in the aborted plan9port for windows. it's not too hard. if someone wants to go after it i can dig up the code i was using. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC752C67E4 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:16:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3692B63F0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:16:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24176-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:15:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7478A63EE8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:15:57 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1ICHxJY009606 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:17:59 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:15:54 +0200 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:15:53 +0200 To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <1073199218.20050217075014@mail.ru> <1618372765.20050217191550@mail.ru> <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <524446187.20050217220020@mail.ru> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2005 12:15:54.0207 (UTC) FILETIME=[97EBCEF0:01C515B3] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Yes, with large monitors we can forget about window switching, but now > most of Plan 9 programs have only console version! When you want > create application with buttons, entryes, list boxes you need draw it > by self... You have libcontrol. But what I've discovered - after moving to Plan 9 - is that a text-based user interface is intrinsically more powerful than a mostly grahpic one. A typescript system is like a user-programmable GUI except you don't have to program it! Give it a try. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFCB3C6C05 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:51:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17D2BC69D4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:50:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15206-01-81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:50:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B264C6A0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:50:05 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id f1so1169rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:49:55 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=s++8fcnQJzK25OJBmKPigtVsR9Pfl1YRjoxky47yYezCfTt9DcO6Xok5triinzCHhMZyhvyDgKwHDIdVLDfaLjJqghD24WeXvKpXkEiWeG4bIp3QAHXIVr29K4PBfhXykDFWbLkFvK8xErc4m7C3euxH1vNSfaP0ciM3tf75K5o= Received: by 10.11.119.56 with SMTP id r56mr232644cwc; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:49:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:49:54 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb301050218134919949115@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 23:49:54 +0200 From: McLone To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <764e15834dcf9dbddc927eade3f6b8c5@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 18:52:51 +0000, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > maybe one could make the unused portion of the vid memory > another memory pool from which memdraw could choose to allocate? i even saw that one somewhere in linux patches, so it can be done. One can have memory disk in videoram, IIRC p.s. i strongly dislike linux's code - that one was really ugly. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 322C4C6AA3 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:58:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B47FC6838 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:57:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03295-01-70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69C32C6865 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:57:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IEva5P027047 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:57:36 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IEvZBl011880 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:57:36 -0700 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:57:35 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > clients, not servers. hence the second-rate citizenship. i move my > laptop from home to school every day. it serves as a terminal to > plan9.ucalgary.ca and the only plan9-related things it has are a couple > of partitions -- 9fat and cfs (cache). none of my files are stored on > it (except whatever is in cfs). it's as secure as anything else. it's a fine model, it's just not a universal model. I'm not convinced. But I'm wrong lots of times, so I'll leave it at that. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:30:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:30:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FB02C6AB4 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:06:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60ECAC68F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:05:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01955-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:05:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from outmail128153.authsmtp.com (outmail128153.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61D76C68FB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:05:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (secure.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.25]) by punt-mx0.dmpriest.net.uk (8.12.11/8.12.11/Kp) with ESMTP id j1IJ5SVW071652 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:05:28 GMT Received: from [192.168.0.100] (d66-183-189-46.bchsia.telus.net [66.183.189.46]) (authenticated bits=0) by squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (8.13.1/8.13.1/Kp) with ESMTP id j1IJ5R19017644 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:05:28 GMT (envelope-from plalonde@telus.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <757aedc53b1bcb951617d3cc6b4ebce9@telus.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Paul Lalonde Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:05:25 -0800 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633132383739.squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk:Kp X-Powered-By: AuthSMTP - http://www.authsmtp.com - Authenticated SMTP Mail Relay X-Report-SPAM: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-Virus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system! X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 18-Feb-05, at 10:22 AM, rog@vitanuova.com wrote: > this would be a way forward. if your fs is encrypted, it doesn't > matter who has hardware access to your machine, as long as only you > have the key. the important thing is to make the boot process itself > secure, so that nobody else can step in and subvert your key entry. > This is why I'd like to see the key served from a smart dongle - A more secure handshake model can be used, and the dongle typically lives separated from the data. In my case I already carry a USB-flash device with my keys (physical ones), and I'm much less likely to lose my laptop and my keys. If only I could lock my laptop data with the USB provided key. Now that cheap programmable dongles exist, this should be easy - the hardest part for Plan9 looks to be the USB stack... Paul From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E67FB31A31 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:23:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5C0931852 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:22:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24176-01-29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:22:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22E8931854 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:22:50 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1ICOr5S009732 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:24:53 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:22:48 +0200 To: Nicolas.beauchesne@polymtl.ca, "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell References: <4215BBCC.1050005@polymtl.ca> Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:22:47 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <4215BBCC.1050005@polymtl.ca> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2005 12:22:48.0254 (UTC) FILETIME=[8EB65DE0:01C515B4] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My =A22 worth: - The preinstalled image doesn't work under 4.5.2. - Installing works. - After install, remove the CD device and it boots, otherwise not*. - Other devices doesn't seem to be important. * I've done some debugging, but due to very limited time only got so far as to pinpoint it to the fact that no 9fat partition is found. It seems that the parttion search hangs somewhere indefinitely. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4C4263F65 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:29:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB34131E46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:29:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24595-02-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:29:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BEF33189C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 07:29:22 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1ICVOfH009890 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:31:24 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:29:19 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Message-ID: Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:29:19 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2005 12:29:19.0660 (UTC) FILETIME=[78022EC0:01C515B5] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > Then just go ahead and experiment! Perfectly sound advice, given an ideal universe. Alas, in a realistic universe, there a) are only 24 hrs in a day, of wich I'd like at least 8 use for sleep; b) is a little 3 year old girl I can't tell "sorry honey, no playing as of today, daddy likes plan 9 more now" I envy peope who actually have time to spare. P.S. Sorry for the rant. Feel free to disregard. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 93C5A63DB0 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:02:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4911231E67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:01:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26879-01-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:01:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8912531E62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 00:01:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1I51r25009687 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:01:53 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1I51quF012158; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:01:53 -0700 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 22:01:52 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 17 Feb 2005, Russ Cox wrote: > [answer 1] > i think it's realistic. a boot cd would get you the same access. > if you get physical machine access, you win. typing a password > to authenticate to the local system gives you the feeling of > security, not actual security. yes, if I get physical acccess, I win. I'll just tear the thing to bits and boot it with an ICE :-) I don't even care if I mark up the pretty plastic. And if you get access, you'll probably hit the jackpot much more than I will, and you probably won't even need to use a screwdriver. But if most schmoozes get physical access, they don't win. Most criminals being stupid schmoozes, I'm ok with protecting against them and not against the KGB. Everybody who has a null root password, based on the physical access argument, raise their hand. I don't buy this argument. > [answer 2] > you could just run the screen locker that rob wrote in termrc. makes sense to me. So why don't we do it? ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9658EC6B8D for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:43:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82CECC6A8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:42:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10495-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:42:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0E46C67BA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:42:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5eb33c612e76a028607ef83642fef691@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:42:25 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <105ad9921fee22aab9e7df5e0b9fe0f6@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > it's really transparency (or opacity), not partial filling (of an area)= . > the whole area is filled, but with something more or less transparent/o= paque. from the porter-duff paper: : If =CE=B1(a) and =CE=B1(b) represent subpixel areas covered by opaque g= eometric : objects, the overlap of objects within the pixel is quite arbitrary. : We know that object A divides the pixel into two subpixel areas of : ratio =CE=B1(a):1-=CE=B1(a). We know that object B divides the pixel i= nto two : subpixel areas of ratio =CE=B1(b):=CE=B1(1-b). The result of the assum= ption is : the same arithmetic as with semi-transparent objects and is summarised : in the following table: From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9FB2FC6BD2 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:47 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7B722C69F6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10495-01-66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BCBA4C68E7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7b0fb4286315f0fdb3f2ea3f2706f36b@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:05:50 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <4cd472f2defb9cd2d185aeda208dab6f@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > BTW, there's a bug in fcp; you need to malloc the > buffer separately inside each thread, otherwise > you get data corruption. you got old version of the code, sorry. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AF45C6916 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:35:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B1A8C68E7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:34:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01408-01-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:34:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 525A7C682D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:34:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1F9E13407 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:34:48 -1000 (HST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 09:34:48 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> I mean, turn it on, pick a random user name which is likely to work, and >> you're in with no password or anything. Am I the only one who thinks this >> is not so terrific? > > [answer 1] > i think it's realistic. a boot cd would get you the same access. > if you get physical machine access, you win. typing a password > to authenticate to the local system gives you the feeling of > security, not actual security. To prevent this you either need to prevent someone from booting (ie. bios password and hope they dont go through the trouble of yanking the drive or resetting the bios) or you need to protect the disk (after all thats probably what they want to get at after they log in, not network access or the gui). Something like: http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf would address this nicely. For those who don't want to chase down the paper, it's an encrypted disk format used by the FreeBSD group. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70A0AC6B75 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:07:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE32AC6A0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:07:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11263-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CCB41C6B78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 16:06:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7252c7a5f9fde8702a123a7e4efce78b@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 21:06:34 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <0ab6a921fcbc154ac8df87a475f6037c@terzarima.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > there's a qualifying conditional at the start of that sentence > and as with a few early papers it's a rather complex description > for something that becomes less elaborate with a more abstract interpretation, > even when the computations are exactly the same! actually, the next paragraph seems to unqualify the conditional: : The assumption is quite good for most mattes, though it can be : improved if we know that the coverage seldom overlaps (adjacent : segments of a continuous line) or always overlaps (repeated : application of a picture). For ease in presentation throughout this : paper, let us make this assumption and consider the alpha values as : representing subpixel coverage of opaque objects. i'd have thought this was rather a useful way of looking at things when we're talking about graphics primitives which might allow sub-pixel positioning of anchor points, but currently do not. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:47:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:47:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2A8EC6AE7 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:59:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41FBA63EF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10537-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:58:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8AEA163C60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 15:58:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4cd472f2defb9cd2d185aeda208dab6f@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:57:48 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <0f57322cacb80f7c319565aeb7cfae61@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-ibickxpskbmjtkvtyrykcigoye" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-ibickxpskbmjtkvtyrykcigoye Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i tried it myself: % for(i in 1 2 3 4){ time fcp sun.tgz /dev/null time cp sun.tgz /dev/null time hget http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108754619.nm555mqv7uc7rvvyye52p4zcaeeziq2d/sun.tgz > /dev/null } 0.00u 0.01s 12.09r fcp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.03s 30.37r cp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.03u 0.11s 11.93r hget http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108754619.nm555mqv7uc7rvvyye52p4zcaeeziq2d/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.04s 12.16r fcp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.00s 30.32r cp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.01u 0.06s 10.16r hget http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108754619.nm555mqv7uc7rvvyye52p4zcaeeziq2d/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.04s 12.46r fcp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.01s 30.24r cp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.08u 0.02s 9.71r hget http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108754619.nm555mqv7uc7rvvyye52p4zcaeeziq2d/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.01s 11.86r fcp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.03s 30.10r cp sun.tgz /dev/null 0.05u 0.07s 9.93r hget http://plan9.bell-labs.com/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108754619.nm555mqv7uc7rvvyye52p4zcaeeziq2d/sun.tgz overhead was averaging about 15% there. it seems it isn't nearly as bad as i remember, which is good! BTW, there's a bug in fcp; you need to malloc the buffer separately inside each thread, otherwise you get data corruption. --upas-ibickxpskbmjtkvtyrykcigoye Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by doppio; Fri Feb 18 18:57:15 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE29CC6AF2 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:54:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DEE0C68C5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00350-01-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED531C6896 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:53:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0f57322cacb80f7c319565aeb7cfae61@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:53:09 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <2c7c3234b8871252e4dde821152d96a2@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+rog=vitanuova.com@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+rog=vitanuova.com@cse.psu.edu > have you compared the speed against raw TCP? this may sound silly, but the only way i could find to compare against raw tcp is via hget: % time fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.01s 2.90r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.02s 4.16r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.01u 0.02s 4.07r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null 0.00u 0.00s 2.83r fcp /n/sources/extra/sun.tgz /dev/null % time hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz > /dev/null 0.01u 0.00s 2.49r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.00s 2.43r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.00u 0.01s 3.14r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz 0.01u 0.02s 2.34r hget http://204.178.31.2/magic/9down4e/compressed/1108752459/sun.tgz short of writing something small, of course :) --upas-ibickxpskbmjtkvtyrykcigoye-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:48:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:48:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12066C6889 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:13:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 124B7C686E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08868-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:12:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D81C3C6886 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:12:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IFCO8B029221 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:24 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1IFCNiY013019; Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:24 -0700 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:12:23 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] vmware hell In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <4215BBCC.1050005@polymtl.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Nicolas.beauchesne@polymtl.ca X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 18 Feb 2005, Tiit Lankots wrote: > My =C2=A22 worth: >=20 > - The preinstalled image doesn't work under 4.5.2. I'm just going to try to get my friend to use Xen. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 14:48:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 14:48:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6B90863F4E for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:22:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 584C663C3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:21:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23119-01-89 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:21:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6AE3963C3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:21:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so490157rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:21:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=EEELWAtsm1+PyUrYlfk0DtoXM2VIXTZER1TQQgwWJjBq6h+n6EF/fuQ7RE/lqk1R0p/RnGy9ddCsdFHumeXzYlo+gRCgYLqWnwOvI0Ec83ktls0G9dWGYHCHmRutlQeK++U3NWA99TexdwPCuhEEgrOw4ezBLUQ3FutlHXois0Q= Received: by 10.38.97.9 with SMTP id u9mr110842rnb; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:21:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 17 Feb 2005 20:21:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 23:21:49 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > isochronous/streaming data transfer over 9p: > > 9p is slow over wide area networks when streaming > data, due to the ping-pong nature of the data > transfer. can anything be done to help solve this? sure. you could imagine adding a stream message to start some number of reads, but maybe it's enough to define that streaming style servers allow the client to queue multiple read messages and respond in order. you can already do that for file transfers by using the offset field appropriately. it's less clear what the kernel interface for streaming would look like. > distributed authentication: > > the plan 9 authentication model relies on having an > on-line authentication server. as firewalls and > mobile devices continue to proliferate, might it be > worthwhile adding support for a peer-to-peer model be > more appropriate? i don't know what peer-to-peer means, but if we moved to a public key model (which was the reason presotto created p9any) and had the auth server just be a repository for public keys (signed by bootes), then any amount of caching could happen. > graphics: > > high-bandwidth bitmap access is slow. additionally, > even the existing hardware acceleration could be > leveraged more than it is (if any portion of a window > is obscured, then no h/w acceleration is used for that > window). is it conceivable to have a system where all > graphics operations are accelerated (as apple are > apparently to be doing with their next system), or > does the current architecture preclude this? you don't need to accelerate everything, just the common stuff. the obscured window case you describe is an important one that should be handled better. i'd love to see that happen. it's not so much the lack of acceleration as the copying to backing store and back. i'm less excited by high-bandwidth bitmap access, but it still shouldn't be hard. rob took rio out of the loop for exactly this reason -- talking to a local /dev/draw is just a single copy of the data from user space to the frame buffer. what's needed is a driving application. > graphics primitives: > > graphics drawn with the existing non-bitblt primitives > is not great (e.g. lots of jaggies on diagonal > lines). could implementing subpixel rendering help > matters here? it should be straightforward to adapt the line drawing algorithm to put down alpha-blended grey. that would be nice. > how can i continue to do work when a server goes down? > > aan can deal with a broken network connection, but say > someone reboots the fileserver? is there any way we > can incorporate some redundancy into the system, or > make it easier for a applications to recover? there have been at least two attempts to do this. the early brazil kernels maintained state in the Chans and tried to reestablish them, but my understanding is that the code never really worked right, and eventually it got taken out. i wrote a user-level file server for 9P1 that redialed as necessary to keep the connection running without any help from the kernel. it worked very well but i never updated it for 9P2000. it's not a big program. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 17:06:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 17:06:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5153CC6DBA for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 03:06:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24F0BC6BAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 03:05:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09287-01-43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 03:05:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 849F6C6BAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 03:05:34 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id a41so40974rng for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 00:05:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=JBTsB3sIFmQFo2FsLMTsNsbxiXXvwNkFlCFBKpuZb6Yhabl7Xcvc7Q02NnDRLm5PunXMZ+45wfcKLmoPiJ1fBBpazQKlmAHbWd97oMRbAiZAYHCYtxpQI6d4nuEqhPfPTbQSgbXAHsdJuh8D5Jw/9KxAIJUdg8iN3txCcLBwLPo= Received: by 10.11.98.17 with SMTP id v17mr296165cwb; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 00:05:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 00:05:33 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb301050219000557499860@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:05:33 +0200 From: McLone To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm to Xen In-Reply-To: <20050216135158.0f2d9553@garlic.apnic.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050216133041.691e8beb@garlic.apnic.net> <005501c513d8$fd887790$323e0454@kilgore> <20050216135158.0f2d9553@garlic.apnic.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:51:58 +1000, George Michaelson wrote: > infintive may well be ronfler, but the speech bubble seems to say > { ron .... rrrrrrrrron... ron.. ron.. } indeed. i've heard that. -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 18:16:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 18:16:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 78E40C6CC9 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 04:16:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1EF8CC6BAF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 04:16:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17234-02-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 04:16:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D22F3C6AC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 04:16:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so580609wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:16:01 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=qBXegfL3g2909FZknzvsn3C1JPzQMDcrJnE9VciEVF2aNz3oWWpSDsTECSzWZU+tjj2p5e8QXjOuSfprROqyAfm15pXmnYnj7pjWaV8LLc9uLGKstTIOT9JeIgUypfzr9qRhfUWFtAIpA+vOcylM1nzqb3fmXwFrtAiHC8ua7+k= Received: by 10.54.51.17 with SMTP id y17mr209292wry; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:16:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.18.24 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:15:59 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3e1162e60502190115563fbb0d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:15:59 -0800 From: David Leimbach To: cnielsen@pobox.com Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <3e1162e60502181149dac62fe@mail.gmail.com> <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:50 -0800, Christopher Nielsen wrote: > On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 11:49:43AM -0800, David Leimbach wrote: > > > To prevent this you either need to prevent someone from booting > > > (ie. bios password and hope they dont go through the trouble > > > of yanking the drive or resetting the bios) or you need to > > > protect the disk (after all thats probably what they want to > > > get at after they log in, not network access or the gui). > > > Something like: > > > > > > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf > > > > > > would address this nicely. For those who don't want to chase > > > down the paper, it's an encrypted disk format used by the > > > FreeBSD group. > > > > > > > Isn't it actually a block-level encryption rather than a filesystem > > implementation? > > yes. that's exactly what it is. how is that not useful in this > case? > > Why would you assume that I'd think it's not useful? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 19 20:31:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 19 20:31:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5607C6D58 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 06:31:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A69E8C6792 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 06:31:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23098-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 06:31:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAF8763EDD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 06:31:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EE6717140 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:31:01 -1000 (HST) Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:31:01 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] ultrasparc update X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Just a status report on the ultrasparc work. Progress has suffered a little due to other priorities, but its coming along. Some bugs have been squashed and some more devices supported. SCSI is working (although not wide-scsi yet). I have tested the system using a root mount from a file server as well as from the local disk (fossil/venti). The system is capable of rebuilding itself without incident in both cases. Remote access with cpu(1) and drawterm(1) work fine. The current code with instructions is at /n/sources/newsham/. A working plan9 machine is needed to build the sources and netboot the kernel (tftpd, rarpd, dhcpd). Any questions can be directed to me. Ultra2: Working The code is known to work on the ultra2 (or at least on my ultra2, I am not aware of others attempting it). Please let me know if you install it on your system, especially if you have any problems. - net boot only - one cpu (second cpu not engaged) - serial console (z8530) - 10/100 ethernet (hme) - scsi (feps/hme) - wide scsi not enabled yet - sunlabels not supported - real time clock (mk48t59) - nvram not supported Ultra1: Not working The ultra1 has a different ethernet controller (and scsi controller?) than the ultra2 and nobody has written a driver for it yet. The kernel is known to boot using a ramdisk only (if the unsupported drivers are disabled). I can provide some support if anyone works on writing drivers. - net boot - serial console (z8530) Other Ultras: Not working There have been no tests against any other platforms. Most newer ultra systems are PCI based and there is currently no PCI support in the kernel. I think the amount of code necessary to support PCI would be small. If anyone tests the code against other SBUS based systems I would like to hear about the results. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 03:39:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 03:39:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB3ACC6D01 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:39:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 25E4863EED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:38:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27245-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:38:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.67]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7D7D563E4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:38:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:38:14 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Brian L. Stuart" Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:37:53 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Drawterm and security X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I'm about to drive my fist through the monitor. I think I'm generally a fairly intelligent person and I generally understand the Plan9 paper on security, but I'm having a serious disconnect between that and how it's implemented in practice. Last night I was successfully connected between a Linux box and my Plan9 file/cpu server with drawterm. This morning I realized that I was unable to authenticate to sources from the fs/cpu server so started to try to fix my /lib/ndb/local to address the problem. Nothing seemed to work and worse yet, now drawterm is broken with the infamous "cannot authenticate with p9" message even when returning to the same /lib/ndb/local. What exactly are the necessary and sufficient conditions for making drawterm work and likewise for access to sources? auth/debug appears to be fine and /sys/log/auth also seems fine. I'm assuming that the auth=sources... line must be there. Does it break things to have additional auth=bootes and authdom=home in the section that describes the local net? factotum is the only piece of the current security system that hasn't seemed like black magic to me. Any wisdom is welcome. Even a recipe would be welcome at this point. Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 03:48:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 03:48:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4DB48C6D35 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:48:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB52863FEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:48:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27108-02-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:48:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3029563F45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:48:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <0857c7e34289332af716f9b0ef5a55c2@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:48:00 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Even a recipe would be welcome at this point. Ingredients: * 1 part Vodka * 1 part Tequila * 1 part Rum * 1 part Gin * 1 part Triple sec * 1 1/2 part Sour mix * 1 splash Coca-Cola Mixing instructions: Mix ingredients together over ice in a glass. Pour into shaker and give ONE brisk shake. Pour back into glass and make sure there is a touch of fizz at the top. Garnish with lemon. as for authentication, what do you mean by 'auth/debug is fine' exactly? is auth/keyfs running? what's the drawterm message? do you have factotum running? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 03:55:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 03:55:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D0222C6DFA for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:55:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2288C690B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:54:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27108-02-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:54:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4ECDC68D6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:54:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8e10ef025f295ae275886fa840d1bc1b@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:52:44 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=FORGED_RCVD_HELO, J_CHICKENPOX_46, J_CHICKENPOX_74, J_CHICKENPOX_82 X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu With drawterm, everything is running on the cpu, and drawterm is just 'exportfs'ing your local namespace (for things like keyboard, mouse, etc.) I'm guessing that YOUR factotum (your authentication agent) is not running. I've attached dt_factotum, which I got from geoff. You run it on the cpu (in you're drawterm session), once you've successfully drawterm'ed in. term% cat $home/bin/rc/dt_factotum #!/bin/rc if (! test -f /srv/factotum.$user) auth/factotum -s factotum.$user mount -b /srv/factotum.$user /mnt > I'm about to drive my fist through the monitor. I think > I'm generally a fairly intelligent person and I generally > understand the Plan9 paper on security, but I'm having > a serious disconnect between that and how it's implemented > in practice. Last night I was successfully connected between > a Linux box and my Plan9 file/cpu server with drawterm. > This morning I realized that I was unable to authenticate > to sources from the fs/cpu server so started to try to > fix my /lib/ndb/local to address the problem. Nothing > seemed to work and worse yet, now drawterm is broken with > the infamous "cannot authenticate with p9" message even when > returning to the same /lib/ndb/local. What exactly are the > necessary and sufficient conditions for making drawterm work > and likewise for access to sources? auth/debug appears to be > fine and /sys/log/auth also seems fine. I'm assuming that the > auth=sources... line must be there. Does it break things to > have additional auth=bootes and authdom=home in the section > that describes the local net? factotum is the only piece of > the current security system that hasn't seemed like black > magic to me. Any wisdom is welcome. Even a recipe would > be welcome at this point. > > Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 03:58:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 03:58:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09D9EC6CCB for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B4834C6B3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27108-02-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 35A95C6B33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so83611rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:58:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=PbhOcvkR9wgrfKbs97M6ZK6LTPSfFXgl4uNpv/wRHSC0tbeaGoXkcXyYQp+hy1F3cpp6WZ4Na/v86cs+rvsY6Pk7UANbwOzB7DTU4D3zHsCOzqo+00R9PmH0ZXNyJ76ZFODbHxQR5lrpCpoAtFMQw1U48KMkD+O56RRSFdS/e8A= Received: by 10.39.2.39 with SMTP id e39mr3718rni; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:58:14 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:58:14 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:14 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-Reply-To: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu After editing /lib/ndb/local (or any files in /lib/ndb), it is a good idea to do echo -n refresh >/net/cs to tell cs to reload the ndb files *now*. It will eventually notice that they have changed and reload them itself, but not necessarily immediately. That could well be the cause of your confusion and frustration. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:12:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:12:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B527C6D0A for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:12:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4F4B4C6B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:12:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01906-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:12:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB696C6B1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:12:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219191211.CHVL2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:12:11 -0500 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:52:44 -0800 . <8e10ef025f295ae275886fa840d1bc1b@9netics.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:11:50 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219191211.CHVL2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message <8e10ef025f295ae275886fa840d1bc1b@9netics.com>, Skip Tavakkolian wri tes: >With drawterm, everything is running on the cpu, and drawterm >is just 'exportfs'ing your local namespace (for things like keyboard, >mouse, etc.) I'm guessing that YOUR factotum (your authentication >agent) is not running. I've attached dt_factotum, which I >got from geoff. You run it on the cpu (in you're drawterm session), >once you've successfully drawterm'ed in. The problem is that I'm not getting that far. drawterm bails a few seconds after I enter the correct password. The file/cpu server does have a factotum running as user bootes. I get the same behavior whether I try to log in as either bootes or as myself. Still, I'll hang on the script. Looks like it will be useful when I do get successfully drawterm'ed in. Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:16:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:16:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 57EF8C6D87 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:16:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5806C6C97 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:16:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00872-01-45 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:16:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.73]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A2CA5C6C9D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:16:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219191607.CISA2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:16:07 -0500 To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:58:14 -0500 . Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:15:46 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219191607.CISA2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , Russ Cox writes: >After editing /lib/ndb/local (or any files in /lib/ndb), >it is a good idea to do > > echo -n refresh >/net/cs Thanks for the tip. I had been resorting to killing and restarting cs, and even frequent reboots. Are there any other processes that need to know if there are changes there? That had certainly been part of the frustration. I still feel like I'm editing /lib/ndb/local using a random walk, however. Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:21:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:21:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8932DC6D7D for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:21:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 384E1C6CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02949-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AEB76C6C91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so85354rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:20:22 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=OU/hmZvDprqGuiLxVJMmLqp8qyScNGbCfclqiCn/IwjsAzMWNFUkqao2fPGbZfbBVz/RGvNKXz7N8DzDmWOyav0XIyXUZTgibMccrH0auaDsl5zOMl0pA4r+Gh8IIOg4uEMGNM+8ORlBpzvCQbI5YRhXzoVCFiG/OM+lHsQwSPw= Received: by 10.38.126.33 with SMTP id y33mr472519rnc; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:20:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:20:22 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:22 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: "blstuart@bellsouth.net" , 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-Reply-To: <20050219191607.CISA2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219191607.CISA2148.imf25aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Thanks for the tip. I had been resorting to killing and > restarting cs, and even frequent reboots. Are there any > other processes that need to know if there are changes > there? You can echo -n refresh >/net/dns too, but you weren't changing DNS-related stuff. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:21:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:21:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A3F0C6CAD for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:21:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 06BA9C6CA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01906-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from outmail128153.authsmtp.com (outmail128153.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE3F6C6C9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (secure.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.25]) by punt-mx0.dmpriest.net.uk (8.12.11/8.12.11/Kp) with ESMTP id j1JJKLDO004445 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:20:21 GMT Received: from [192.168.0.100] (d66-183-189-46.bchsia.telus.net [66.183.189.46]) (authenticated bits=0) by squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (8.13.1/8.13.1/Kp) with ESMTP id j1JJKKUY040798 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:20:21 GMT (envelope-from plalonde@telus.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Paul Lalonde Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:20:18 -0800 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633132383739.squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk:Kp X-Powered-By: AuthSMTP - http://www.authsmtp.com - Authenticated SMTP Mail Relay X-Report-SPAM: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-Virus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system! X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Has anyone given any thoughts on how Venti might be affected by the recent weakening of the SHA-1 hash? I can see one exploit in which a different block is returned from a compromised venti server, that I accept because the fingerprint matches the requested fingerprint. The issue of turnaround time isn't really there as files live on Venti for a long time, and a compromised server could at its leisure find a collision for some block I'm submitting. The likelihood of such an exploit seems small, but should we be looking for a better Venti hash? Paul From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:27:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:27:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 729A1C6CFB for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:26:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 952BEC6B8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00872-01-66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:26:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B36CDC6B70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:26:16 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:26:05 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Has anyone given any thoughts on how Venti might be affected by the > recent weakening of the SHA-1 hash? > I can see one exploit in which a different block is returned from a > compromised venti server, that I accept because the fingerprint matches > the requested fingerprint. The issue of turnaround time isn't really > there as files live on Venti for a long time, and a compromised server > could at its leisure find a collision for some block I'm submitting. > The likelihood of such an exploit seems small, but should we be looking > for a better Venti hash? > > Paul things looked optimistic a few months ago: http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2004-August/037686.html http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2004-August/037695.html From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 04:36:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 04:36:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FC15C6CC2 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:36:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9230163E6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:35:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00872-01-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:35:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from outmail128153.authsmtp.com (outmail128153.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF646C6CCF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:35:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (secure.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.25]) by punt-mx0.dmpriest.net.uk (8.12.11/8.12.11/Kp) with ESMTP id j1JJZtLN004734 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:35:55 GMT Received: from [192.168.0.100] (d66-183-189-46.bchsia.telus.net [66.183.189.46]) (authenticated bits=0) by squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (8.13.1/8.13.1/Kp) with ESMTP id j1JJZsmX041001 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:35:54 GMT (envelope-from plalonde@telus.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <9006e346da4717eaae1f97188a21d77d@telus.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Paul Lalonde Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:35:53 -0800 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633132383739.squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk:Kp X-Powered-By: AuthSMTP - http://www.authsmtp.com - Authenticated SMTP Mail Relay X-Report-SPAM: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-Virus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system! X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 19-Feb-05, at 11:26 AM, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > things looked optimistic a few months ago: But the question is should we, not could we. The easy part is replacing the hash function. The ugly part is rebuilding existing venti arenas, particularly indexing data stored in other blocks; in practice this means a conversion tool for any tools that wrote to venti - vac, fossil, and I'm sure others. Paul From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 05:14:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 05:14:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD48BC6DCD for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:14:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7E23431782 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:14:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04480-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBE1D17B9E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:14:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57259172AE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:14:11 -1000 (HST) Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 10:14:11 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: <9006e346da4717eaae1f97188a21d77d@telus.net> Message-ID: References: <9006e346da4717eaae1f97188a21d77d@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > But the question is should we, not could we. The attacks I can think of: - attacker with access to venti anticipates a particular block will be stored in the future. He burns cycles and finds a collision and stores his corrupt block first. Later you store your block and when you fetch the file you stored one of the blocks is bad. - a malicious venti server targets some stored blocks and burns cycles to replace them with bad blocks. - a man-in-the-middle sees a block go buy and targets it for corruption. He burns cycles and finds a collision. Next time the block is requested he injects the bad block. All of this assumes the attacker gets to choose which block to cause a collision on. I havent followed the previous MD5 work, does anyone know if this is the case? If the attack is limited to just finding any two blocks that collide then neither of these attacks would be viable. In the case of SHA1 the scant information released so far indicates its still a 2^69 attack. That's a LOT of operations. It sounds to me like the need to switch from SHA1 is not pressing right now, especially since the details of the attack have not yet been published. What scares me a little though is that some people are recommending dropping the "collision-proof" requirements of hashes. If that were to happen I wonder what the implications would be for any hash-addressable storage systems. > Paul disclaimer: I'm a security guy, but definitely no crypto expert. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 05:16:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 05:16:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7624BC6D95 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:16:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 609EC31E8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:15:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02952-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:15:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F04ED31E7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:15:40 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so89472rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:15:38 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=g7juDGwwlx8tVgyaEABOMEJlt2WFA9+Lehk0Vy1ZBRc0vTIAZSoNTRT8/xaB5NyFmsUIfAshikaKPOOvF3QYJZhqkUybxc3gQL9GkjWV0FPXeo4OBUBCg1e33HK/pE45PkM6rD7LsMOYnkwyYhFgCvxkNJppza4EIfnpgmW896w= Received: by 10.38.78.71 with SMTP id a71mr33255rnb; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:15:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:15:38 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:15:38 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Conversion is made quite easy (compared to other systems I am familar with) because the blocks are tagged with their type (data, SHA1 hashes of data, SHA1 hashes of hashes of data) and the block tree is a standardized format used by all clients, so conversion can happen independent of the program that wrote the data. After converting the data, all the clients and the server would have to be rebuilt with the new hash function. It is not necessary to write a separate program to convert fossil data, vac data, etc. Some day it will be necessary to worry about this. It is not today. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 05:20:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 05:20:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A20CC6DF2 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:20:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9571A63B75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:20:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04483-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:20:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 791E463B60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:20:11 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so464934wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:20:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=AlRnVdWRdesXncJ965riQGuWCLRzjq1JzOcdXGxWtvsh+TLsHOuu5yiqVDoDTK/7QFeF3uRmxobVJUmcx76zg9nGCMy21KEnyzpiMB3y6blfsnXdb81vc9ETdPVRhZc1kT62we3lCDe/YryRpnyBJccNV+HIm1xgtIDX/HHG0jw= Received: by 10.54.19.29 with SMTP id 29mr31561wrs; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:20:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:20:10 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d19050219122073cac012@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 07:20:10 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <3e1162e60502190115563fbb0d@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <3e1162e60502181149dac62fe@mail.gmail.com> <20050218195950.GS77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <3e1162e60502190115563fbb0d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu oz-inferno has an encrypted filesystem (based on flashfs). the configuration and other local private stuff is intended to live on a usb-flash thingy (along with the executable and boot crap). i hope to release some of this stuff when i get some time off doing real work. brucee On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 01:15:59 -0800, David Leimbach wrote: > On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:50 -0800, Christopher Nielsen > wrote: > > On Fri, Feb 18, 2005 at 11:49:43AM -0800, David Leimbach wrote: > > > > To prevent this you either need to prevent someone from booting > > > > (ie. bios password and hope they dont go through the trouble > > > > of yanking the drive or resetting the bios) or you need to > > > > protect the disk (after all thats probably what they want to > > > > get at after they log in, not network access or the gui). > > > > Something like: > > > > > > > > http://phk.freebsd.dk/pubs/bsdcon-03.gbde.paper.pdf > > > > > > > > would address this nicely. For those who don't want to chase > > > > down the paper, it's an encrypted disk format used by the > > > > FreeBSD group. > > > > > > > > > > Isn't it actually a block-level encryption rather than a filesystem > > > implementation? > > > > yes. that's exactly what it is. how is that not useful in this > > case? > > > > > > Why would you assume that I'd think it's not useful? > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 05:25:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 05:25:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48F79C6E5A for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:25:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA32D63DD6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:24:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02952-01-87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:24:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 221C263BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:24:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219202443.DITT730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:24:43 -0500 To: Russ Cox , 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:20:22 -0500 . Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:24:22 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219202443.DITT730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , Russ Cox writes: >You can echo -n refresh >/net/dns too, but you weren't >changing DNS-related stuff. Cool. What about changes to authdom? Who uses authdom and how? In response to Andrey's questions (which I seem to have sent just to him instead of the list), my local file has the normal auth=sources... line and it also has an authdom=home in the section for my local network. I'm not quite sure what it means for both of them to be there. In fact, when I first set the system up, I commented out the auth=sources line. But today, I figured that was at the heart of my problem getting replica/pull to work. Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 05:35:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 05:35:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3CAFAC6DC7 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:35:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F302EC6AE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:34:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04521-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:34:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37108C6ADE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:34:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8245d261dcde8e675c88f697bcc86cfa@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 13:34:38 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <20050219202443.DITT730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.0 tagged_above=3.0 required=5.0 tests=J_CHICKENPOX_47, J_CHICKENPOX_53, J_CHICKENPOX_74 X-Spam-Level: *** X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > In message , Russ Cox writes: >>You can echo -n refresh >/net/dns too, but you weren't >>changing DNS-related stuff. > > Cool. What about changes to authdom? Who uses authdom > and how? In response to Andrey's questions (which I seem > to have sent just to him instead of the list), my local > file has the normal auth=sources... line and it also > has an authdom=home in the section for my local network. > I'm not quite sure what it means for both of them to be > there. In fact, when I first set the system up, I commented > out the auth=sources line. But today, I figured that was > at the heart of my problem getting replica/pull to work. > > Brian L. Stuart i don't seem to have received your message. i blame the university's email servers. for authdom= the only requirement that's really important is to make sure you've synchronized it with what cpu server user (bootes in most cases) thinks it's running in. i.e. when you boot it make sure your authdom= in nvram is the same as the authdom= entry in ndb for the network you're booting in: ipnet=ucalgary ip=136.159.220.0 ipmask=255.255.255.0 proto=tcp [...] authdom=plan9.ucalgary.ca when i invalidate the nvram (or change the password) i supply plan9.ucalgary.ca as the authdom on the next boot of the cpu server. andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 06:01:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 06:01:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F38D0C6E99 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:01:36 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E84DBC6E82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:01:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11530-02-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61BADC6E7F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:01:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219210107.DSND730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:01:07 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Brian L. Stuart" Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:48:00 -0700 . <0857c7e34289332af716f9b0ef5a55c2@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:00:46 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219210107.DSND730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Let's try this again. It didn't seem to get out before. In message <0857c7e34289332af716f9b0ef5a55c2@plan9.ucalgary.ca>, andrey mirtcho vski writes: >> Even a recipe would be welcome at this point. > >Ingredients: > > * 1 part Vodka > * 1 part Tequila > * 1 part Rum > * 1 part Gin > * 1 part Triple sec > * 1 1/2 part Sour mix > * 1 splash Coca-Cola Truely tempting. Well, I was going to repeat all the stuff I had tried to send before, but suddenly things are working for drawterm. The last step was to invalidate the nvram, reboot and reset all the passwords. I'm not sure how things got mangled, but drawterm is now working. replica/pull still isn't however. I definitely have the auth=sources line in /lib/ndb/local now. But even before factotum asks for a user and password, I'm getting: srv tcp!sources.cs.bell-labs.com: mount failed: authentication failed I get the same thing if I manually try to 9fs soruces. Any ideas on that one? Thanks to everyone for your help. The really frustrating part of all of the authentication stuff is that I don't seem to yet see the connections between fault symptoms and causes. I still don't know why wiping the nvram and resetting everything has made drawterm happy. Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 06:10:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 06:10:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 893F5C6E30 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:10:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 54FE7C6CAD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:09:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12852-01-47 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:09:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75922C6D1A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:09:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219210924.DUJY730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:09:24 -0500 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: "Brian L. Stuart" Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 11:00:57 -1000 (HST) . Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:09:02 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219210924.DUJY730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , Tim Newsham wr ites: >When you try to connect to sources (for example, you >do a replica/pull, or 9fs sources) it connects to the >machine and the machine asks you to authenticate to >the outside.plan9.bell-labs.com authdom. I almost literally heard the bell ring this time. So when I try to initiate an authentication, it's up to the server to tell me what authentication domain he wants to use. Then I look up to find a auth= autodom= entry so that I know who to talk to in order to do authenticate in that domain. So if I have an authdom=home entry in my local network section, then anyone who wants to connect to my server will be told to authenticate using the home domain. It's then up to the client to know what auth server to use. Somehow I never caught that part of it. I think I can now classify it as grey magic instead of black magic. I'm still fuzzy on some bits, but it's getting a little clearer. Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 07:26:41 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 07:26:41 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FB74C6EB2 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:26:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 64E23C6E27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:25:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18037-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:25:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95024C6E14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:25:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:51464 "HELO kilgore") by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S370612AbVBSWZu (ORCPT ); Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:25:50 -0500 Message-ID: <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org><9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:25:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu OTOH the reason 2DES was dumped for 3DES is that there is a theoretical, by fairly impractical, attack. i am not saying that we should worry about SHA-1 today, but we should be aware. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 07:43:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 07:43:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DB5CC8D for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:43:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D21DFC698C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:42:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19641-02-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:42:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 33379C6966 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:42:55 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so100306rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:42:54 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=FqzPezp4Q39O8drkxI3Fmb74/120CtBi38O0bVYb0WDMcZcuz14DRO5NaGfmtcyS0SehDBnSN1D/PavoYtSOuEoF7Y4wqhyv3PwIzz2KwRP2urQx1ss7C8Aa2uXwDcwoDtM/U6ylM5DF+R/IhlpK52Bf9/oh+sVNEeFSGdzV3Ds= Received: by 10.38.89.1 with SMTP id m1mr139673rnb; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:42:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 14:42:54 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:42:54 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-Reply-To: <20050219210924.DUJY730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219210924.DUJY730.imf22aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > >When you try to connect to sources (for example, you > >do a replica/pull, or 9fs sources) it connects to the > >machine and the machine asks you to authenticate to > >the outside.plan9.bell-labs.com authdom. > > I almost literally heard the bell ring this time. So > when I try to initiate an authentication, it's up to the > server to tell me what authentication domain he wants to > use. Then I look up to find a auth= autodom= entry so > that I know who to talk to in order to do authenticate > in that domain. So if I have an authdom=home entry in my > local network section, then anyone who wants to connect > to my server will be told to authenticate using the > home domain. It's then up to the client to know what > auth server to use. All this is true except that the choice of authdom=home does not come from your local network section. The choice of authdom comes from factotum, and it offers the client a list of possible domains. In particular, it offers any domain on a p9sk1 key that isn't marked with role=client. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 07:44:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 07:44:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5CF5C6E42 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AB951C698C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19641-02-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3217DC696F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mero.morphisms.net (mero.morphisms.net [66.93.84.246]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B79524FD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:34 -0500 (EST) Received: by mero.morphisms.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 4AE9842; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:44:34 -0500 From: William Josephson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploity Message-ID: <20050219224434.GB44386@mero.morphisms.net> References: <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-No-archive: yes X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, Feb 19, 2005 at 11:25:52PM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > OTOH the reason 2DES was dumped for 3DES is that there > is a theoretical, by fairly impractical, attack. To be more precise: 2DES doesn't buy you much over DES, while 3DES would appear to. -WJ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 07:48:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 07:48:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C680C6E0C for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:48:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF426C6CBB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:48:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19641-02-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:48:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5AFF6C6CAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:48:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:17929 "HELO kilgore") by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S377751AbVBSWsF (ORCPT ); Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:48:05 -0500 Message-ID: <01bb01c516d5$143f6030$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> <20050219224434.GB44386@mero.morphisms.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploity Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:48:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > To be more precise: 2DES doesn't buy you much over DES, > while 3DES would appear to. nope, there is a meet in the middle attack for 2DES and going to 3DES is trivial to implement. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 08:22:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 08:22:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F5AEC6E13 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:21:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B61E5C6E0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:21:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22768-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E6D3C6DF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:21:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so475478wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:21:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Qt4JFV0kwkGtnJi37dbRedM89puaNvYehbxLOIxM7fLkErkfFi1tuzh9BU/i4pvjX1NXpovwgP83fYcPdAR9jlMR8YDJZR4Q2mdgDJjHSgehKyPIyXMRtC88XURLGIS/owvJ7p+u6HZXW4W9tDggmZSF4rMLryXMonLfLBP7dxw= Received: by 10.54.19.29 with SMTP id 29mr82535wrs; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:21:16 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:21:16 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d19050219152164c1e976@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 10:21:16 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu from slashdot "Using a modified DES Cracker, for the small sum of up to $38M, SHA-1 can be broken in 56 hours, with current computing power." so there you go. brucee From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 08:39:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 08:39:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 031AFC6FDC for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:39:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 30FE1C6E39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:38:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24697-02-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:38:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.66]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3C960C6DE4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:38:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.172.85]) by imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050219233809.JSIC2073.imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 18:38:09 -0500 To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: "Brian L. Stuart" Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:42:54 -0500 . Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 17:37:48 -0600 Message-Id: <20050219233809.JSIC2073.imf18aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message , Russ Cox writes: >> I almost literally heard the bell ring this time. So >> when I try to initiate an authentication, it's up to the >> server to tell me what authentication domain he wants to >> use. Then I look up to find a auth= autodom= entry so >> that I know who to talk to in order to do authenticate >> in that domain. So if I have an authdom=home entry in my >> local network section, then anyone who wants to connect >> to my server will be told to authenticate using the >> home domain. It's then up to the client to know what >> auth server to use. > >All this is true except that the choice of authdom=home >does not come from your local network section. The choice >of authdom comes from factotum, and it offers the client >a list of possible domains. In particular, it offers any domain >on a p9sk1 key that isn't marked with role=client. That makes sense. So the putting auth= and authdom= into the local network section is to tell your clients the appropriate domain->server mapping for your network, right? It also raises the question, where does factotum get that first key so that he has a dom to send out- from nvram? Thanks, Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 10:00:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 10:00:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 459C2C6EEA for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:00:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EB97C6DCE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:00:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00672-01-67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86C97C6DC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14A9A133CC; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:00:12 -1000 (HST) Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 15:00:12 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: <775b8d19050219152164c1e976@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> <775b8d19050219152164c1e976@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > "Using a modified DES Cracker, for the small sum of up to $38M, SHA-1 > can be broken in 56 hours, with current computing power." > > so there you go. Well if slashdot said it, then who am I to argue? :) (How is this related to DES again?) > brucee Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 12:54:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 12:54:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 329A2C6F52 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:54:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1DE4C6EB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:53:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09196-02-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.193]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8DD4C6EAB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:53:26 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so663613wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:53:24 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=sdbF5myauEbISHD/EfYuAhVx3PRi/9H7ngbTLEIKSsGw8AmlCjwwd52wfDG20uGTpJe0oPBIK/rMv20OkFgRMDD71I6O0Ebs9sLb+k0K/oTRazez43yTntGUjmmJwVJY/4OqHy7AhnxjXJ9faR6r9hhw95L3hWRLl6wXCmTM/98= Received: by 10.54.37.57 with SMTP id k57mr115000wrk; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:53:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.13.33 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:53:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 22:53:23 -0500 From: Karl Magdsick To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: <775b8d19050219152164c1e976@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050219183814.GISZ2048.imf19aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> <9e8b82886fac51f78a70e17b6ba26813@telus.net> <01a701c516d1$f8df3200$1f587d50@kilgore> <775b8d19050219152164c1e976@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Karl Magdsick , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Note that the work factor is 2**69, being compared to 2**80 (birthday attack). In other words, SHA-1 is still believed to be weakly collision resistant. In other words, it still takes an attacker on the order of 2**160 operations to find a collision between two blocks if one of the blocks is pre-determined. Strong collision resistance implies weak collision resistance and you'd prefer a strongly collision resistant hash function. A demonstration that SHA-1 is not strongly collision resistant means researchers are closer to demonstrating that SHA-1 is not weakly collision resistant. However, for fossil, you only need weak collision resistance for most applications. If you're worried about an attacker being able to create one file and give it to you and being able to corrupt it later, then worry. This attack does not seem to have direct implications for most applications of fossil. The sky isn't falling. You'll probably want to start thinking about changing hash functions once other hash functions start getting more scrutiny as researchers start debating SHA-1 replacements. The SHA-2 family (SHA-224,SHA-256,SHA-384, and SHA-512) have structure similar to eachother, but perhaps different enough from SHA-1 to not be vulnerable. In any case, it would be brash to change hash functions any time soon. -Karl On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 10:21:16 +1100, Bruce Ellis wrote: > from slashdot > > "Using a modified DES Cracker, for the small sum of up to $38M, SHA-1 > can be broken in 56 hours, with current computing power." > > so there you go. > > brucee > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 20 13:25:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 20 13:25:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 20612C6F7D for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:24:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC32EC6E8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:24:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11354-02-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:24:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.207]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ED0F563F80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:24:21 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so665300wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:24:21 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=htxmyzNkFmgQCqnlFBO9/gUlAehgr5OHwKhcy/ozTCZ/05X8agphLUXEDSnTvgfmXwLVQFp0Uuzx++T4KGN+AjpfIMsIz7q7HaVMyVUnBxbQ+yZg5sH2Z8F6wwlb4QkaCIGHtIDSV9o1vBawJ+F/5lLVXU03X1o3tRACaNbQwDY= Received: by 10.54.51.55 with SMTP id y55mr90133wry; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:24:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.13.33 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2005 20:24:21 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 23:24:21 -0500 From: Karl Magdsick To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploit In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <9006e346da4717eaae1f97188a21d77d@telus.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Karl Magdsick , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > All of this assumes the attacker gets to choose which block > to cause a collision on. I havent followed the previous MD5 > work, does anyone know if this is the case? If the attack > is limited to just finding any two blocks that collide then > neither of these attacks would be viable. > > In the case of SHA1 the scant information released so far > indicates its still a 2^69 attack. That's a LOT of operations. It would appear that it is the latter type of attack, limited to only finding two random blocks that collide. (The expected work factor for this type of attack is 2**80 for an ideal 160-bit hash function.) As I remember, the SHA-0 attack required that the blocks were indentical except for the most significant bits of a few adjascent 32-bit (big-endian) words. The non-identical bits had to fit a very special relation (related to the GF2**16 primitive polynomial used in the SHA-0 block expansion function). The attack consisted of creating lots and lots of blocks fitting these properties and checking if any of them hashed to the same value. Supposedly, the SHA-1 break is related to the SHA-0 break, so it's mostly an academic problem for the time being. On the other hand, a collision with a work factor of 2**69 indicates weaknesses in SHA-1. Researchers will likely find better and better ways to exploit these weaknesses. They may also find ways of exploiting these weaknesses to break its weak collision resistance or its one-way properties. They've basically found a way to speed up bruit force by 2048 times, which isn't too bad. The main problem is that it's a bad omen. SHA-256, Tiger, and Whirlpool are probably the most likely candidates for SHA-1 replacements, maybe with truncated outputs. However, SHA-1 and MD-5 are the most scrutinized hash functions. These candidates may all have much more serious problems that are relatively easy to find. In particular, Whirlpool is related to Rijndael, which is vulnerable to XSLT attacks. It will likely be a while before there's a consensus on which hash should be used to replace SHA-1. -Karl From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 03:09:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 03:09:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 513F3C6F43 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:08:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21DEA63F70 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21970-01-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:07:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from holo.morphisms.net (holo.morphisms.net [66.93.84.55]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9E2863FAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:07:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mero.morphisms.net (mero.morphisms.net [66.93.84.246]) by holo.morphisms.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00D9A24FE1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:08:01 -0500 (EST) Received: by mero.morphisms.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id F2D6842; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:08:00 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:08:00 -0500 From: William Josephson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Venti security in view of SHA-1 exploity Message-ID: <20050220180800.GB47983@mero.morphisms.net> References: <20050219224434.GB44386@mero.morphisms.net> <01bb01c516d5$143f6030$1f587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <01bb01c516d5$143f6030$1f587d50@kilgore> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-No-archive: yes X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, Feb 19, 2005 at 11:48:06PM +0100, boyd, rounin wrote: > >To be more precise: 2DES doesn't buy you much over DES, > >while 3DES would appear to. > > nope, there is a meet in the middle attack for 2DES and going > to 3DES is trivial to implement. Actually, if you look at the numbers you will see that the meet in the middle attack makes 2DES roughly equivalent to DES, but that that is not the case for 3DES. -WJ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 03:11:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 03:11:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9583AC6F00 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:11:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86E8AC697D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:11:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22014-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:11:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4A971C697B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:11:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.96.32.71] ([155.239.127.80]) by meddle; Sun Feb 20 20:19:04 SAT 2005 X-warning: suspect envelope domain X-warning: suspect From: domain Message-ID: <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:14:32 +0200 From: Lucio De Re User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> In-Reply-To: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu rog@vitanuova.com wrote: >i'm not sure i agree. if you can always contact your authentication >and file servers, the current plan 9 model works fine, but i think the >idea of universal global interconnect isn't realistic. firewalls are >ubiquitous. network coverage is patchy (and probably always will be). > > > As I see it, network coverage has no alternative but to improve. In my opinion, there is growing pressure for mobile telephony networks to become more and more reliable and pervasiveness is already great and can only be extended. I speak from Africa, where cell phones have (I could be wrong, but I think it's true) overtaken landlines. I agree that firewalls and other obstacles exist, but they serve a need that Plan 9 already addresses in a much more sensible fashion. In other words, laptops are misused and the alternatives exist (I presume Plan 9 is one, Inferno another, there may be more) and will eventually be discovered. Call me an optimist, but all it takes is for some influential personality to discover a better way to do things and the entire fashion swings. For example, Mark Shuttleworth used to carry extremely valuable information in his laptop (I'm not sure I should reveal exactly what). Were he to discover a more secure way of doing the same today, he is sufficiently influential in South Africa to set at least a local trend. Here, between GPRS and G3, 'Net access over mobile phones is pretty good, at a premium. Certainly within the financial reach of a Mark Shuttleworth. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 03:25:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 03:25:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 986A4C6F7F for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:25:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4F74C6A2F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:24:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21970-01-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:24:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 479E2C6A25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:24:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:64012 "HELO kilgore") by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S380878AbVBTSYz (ORCPT ); Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:24:55 -0500 Message-ID: <023901c51779$7b8c4880$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 19:24:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > As I see it, network coverage has no alternative but to improve. GSM can improve to the point of being unusable. the mobile is constantly looking for the 30 strongest BTS's [cells] (some of this BTS/MTS stuff is cached in the SIM) and i've seen a case where it could see so many BTS's that it just didn't work. i was on a hill that overlooked a town. up on the hill [home] my mobile didn't work, but in town it did. this is all emperical data and a theory, but i had a coupla months to puzzle over it. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 03:30:36 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 03:30:36 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB2A8C6F2B for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:30:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89033C6912 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21303-02-23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:29:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from meddle.hq.iba.co.za (beam.iba.co.za [196.30.44.140]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 137F9C6A06 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from [192.96.32.71] ([155.239.127.80]) by meddle; Sun Feb 20 20:37:41 SAT 2005 X-warning: suspect envelope domain X-warning: suspect From: domain Message-ID: <4218D7E5.6060502@proxima.alt.za> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:33:09 +0200 From: Lucio De Re User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> <023901c51779$7b8c4880$1f587d50@kilgore> In-Reply-To: <023901c51779$7b8c4880$1f587d50@kilgore> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu boyd, rounin wrote: >> As I see it, network coverage has no alternative but to improve. > > > GSM can improve to the point of being unusable. the mobile is > constantly looking for the 30 strongest BTS's [cells] (some of > this BTS/MTS stuff is cached in the SIM) and i've seen a case > where it could see so many BTS's that it just didn't work. i > was on a hill that overlooked a town. up on the hill [home] > my mobile didn't work, but in town it did. > Granted. But I can't believe that that the network operators would intentionally cripple their network. Despite rog's reservations, I believe connectivity will improve. It is harder to have faith in it being the desired brand of connectivity, but VOIP shows that ingenuity overcomes the most severe restrictions. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 03:39:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 03:39:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 363ACC6F0B for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:38:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 56C36C6A48 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:37:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25023-01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0D58C6C91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:37:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.88.31] ([80.125.88.31]:8205 "HELO kilgore") by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S380948AbVBTShI (ORCPT ); Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:37:08 -0500 Message-ID: <024a01c5177b$3076de80$1f587d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za><023901c51779$7b8c4880$1f587d50@kilgore> <4218D7E5.6060502@proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 19:37:09 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Granted. But I can't believe that that the network operators would > intentionally cripple their network. my theory is that few people think or provide for end cases, whether it's one function or a system. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 05:37:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 05:37:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4837FC6FA1 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:36:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 98892C6EEE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:36:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05809-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:36:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4C3FC697F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so765714wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:36:06 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=DYhaQMWuAM0IUEiwMA0bid5UyZwfFXSSmkhG+DRzO8V1mECFxSoWEI9nIRwQmnCBKCXZq2+/22AEIDnRtuoktmKv9yaVK4/cNYBhT1RIW3r4MzKBrAe6ytYLnSf7Q3yctidxbZlqxFw/Aa65zqMQNey+bpd4G3AuY3TGNTs2J3o= Received: by 10.54.21.73 with SMTP id 73mr159381wru; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:36:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.7 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:36:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf505022012365b537404@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:36:05 -0500 From: Joel Salomon To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) In-Reply-To: <024a01c5177b$3076de80$1f587d50@kilgore> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> <023901c51779$7b8c4880$1f587d50@kilgore> <4218D7E5.6060502@proxima.alt.za> <024a01c5177b$3076de80$1f587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Joel Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 19:37:09 +0100, boyd, rounin wrote= : > my theory is that few people think or provide for end cases, > whether it's one function or a system. >=20 This sounded so crazy, I asked the professor who's teaching wireless communications here at Cooper. His reply: > > Professor: > > Just got this on the 9fans list, and I had to ask=E2=80=94is the scenar= io Boyd > > describes at all possible/probable? > >=20 > > --Joel > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > From: boyd, rounin etc. > >=20 > it's very possible; these protocols are very touchy and you could very we= ll > end up in ridiculous situations as they describe; i don't know enough abo= ut > the particulars of GSM per se to know if this PARTICULAR problem sounds > plausible or likely with many carriers but this is certainly typical of t= he > strange things that can happen >=20 > ff >=20 Well, now there's at least *one* future EE that *will* watch out for this nonsense... --Joel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 05:48:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 05:48:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A378C6A3F for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:48:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82727C69B1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:47:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05809-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:47:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2A9DC69CF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 15:47:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id a41so173971rng for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:47:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=FniRGNyjJX8XQvRfrdWXrKs2+UdEEtuoTEDkdFpfn7Tj5YmuyXsNnngI5Y/J39R20pAmaiXsxx8x7OsS+ytXtPI9dFOEmqBLM5aJyK0i38KFcLgR98XNg5ay7HmCNDLytlyuqhNK1y8YX0hf3wplJFmib7J5hvRFGTIMDSB8r3U= Received: by 10.11.98.17 with SMTP id v17mr352639cwb; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:47:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.98.37 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:47:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <451cb30105022012473f9bdf97@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 22:47:43 +0200 From: McLone To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Plan9 on qemu In-Reply-To: <20050207043721.CNMC2021.imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <20050207043721.CNMC2021.imf24aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: McLone , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 22:37:08 -0600, Brian L. Stuart wrote: > hang after the two A0 lines and before the kernel was loaded. > It seemed as if the loader couldn't find anything. However, > the loader in the CD image worked fine and the install was > successful. and here you umount/omit cdrom from qemu, right? > it would still boot the iso image. This led me to try > qemu -boot c -cdrom test.disk test.disk > and things worked fine. So if anyone else is seeing this > sort of hang, here's a trick that should hold us until This sort of thing happens in vmware5 also; if i remove [empty now] cdrom drive from VM's configuration, plan9 boots fine, tho graphic isn't redrawn. But graphic bug is another bug... -- wbr, |\ _,,,---,,_ dog bless ya! ` Zzz /,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ McLone at GMail dot com |,4- ) )-,_. ,\ ( `'-' net- and *BSD admin '---''(_/--' `-'\_) ...sorry for translit From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 06:05:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 06:05:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 40021C6FC3 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:04:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2179AC6F11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:04:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06018-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:04:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [216.240.55.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65327C6ECB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 16:04:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <768861808324482d426247e53d7045e3@collyer.net> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:04:25 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I use rio-in-rio all the time: use cpu to start a cpu-server window and run rio in it. Then each window swept there is automatically on the cpu server. A practice that I've found useful to keep track of unhidden windows is to make sure that each window's upper left corner remains visible (at least within its innermost rio) even when other windows obscure portions of the window in question. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 11:56:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 11:56:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0CEFC6FFF for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC641C6F62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28719-02-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD884C6AB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:54:16 +0900 In-Reply-To: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Regarding the UIs, > we have what we call omero (another experiment), it's a mixture of > a window-toolkit and a file server, that handles all the graphics by > its own. The application creates files to build its UI, and the fs takes > care of the mouse and everything else. This allows you to replicate > and move around UI components without placing the burden in the > application. How do you think that recent GUI programming style is too difficult to understand for non-computer science students. We need GUI only for user interface, and it should be very easy to deal with, and can be used from all of the languages without special enbedded portion of those tools. Once upon a time, programming was a fan for many scientists because it was not so difficult. They have to just care of the precisenenss of their own parts. Now a days, I think most of them are buying some commercial products and students don't know how to make it from scratch. It will soon make this world darker I fear. Does your Plan B help such? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 14:01:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 14:01:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29029B8AD for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:00:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B22EBC6EF7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:00:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15610-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:59:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A1B98C6EEB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1L4qZj26583 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:52:35 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1L4eNJ23741 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:40:23 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:13 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <024a01c5177b$3076de80$1f587d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > my theory is that few people think or provide for end cases, > whether it's one function or a system. Sounds like a good principle. Don't rely on end cases, you may not be catered for. But usually there is enough space further from the edges, if you're savvy. Vint Cerf et al certainly figured that one out OK. Although it may need repeating in the not too distant future. There Plan 9 has the edge with a nice, simple protocol. But maybe we ought to look at the edge cases here too, make sure they are accounted for. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 16:04:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 16:04:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F5F3C6F98 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:04:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 126CAC6802 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:03:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25971-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:03:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A01FC67E8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:03:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so582886wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:03:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=BZgo1tp73QBY+72DqV4heUq4NoQkpGfi/LdK1AmrPPMhGF4meLXlsZpkKG4u0JkUeAtHVqaT8EJGYFeoZOhmt35faKySoDhGo46G4lONdvOdFeOfx7uXg72srNmQBp125fQhVZQxUwNg+1uJdG03ESEy2EtLCxbWct1iUra0pyg= Received: by 10.54.17.10 with SMTP id 10mr288724wrq; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:03:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 23:03:29 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d19050220230337c8ae@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:03:29 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <024a01c5177b$3076de80$1f587d50@kilgore> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Gotta check those off-by-zero errors. Check the fortune file. brucee On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:13 +0200, lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > > my theory is that few people think or provide for end cases, > > whether it's one function or a system. > > Sounds like a good principle. Don't rely on end cases, you may not be > catered for. But usually there is enough space further from the > edges, if you're savvy. Vint Cerf et al certainly figured that one > out OK. Although it may need repeating in the not too distant future. > > There Plan 9 has the edge with a nice, simple protocol. But maybe we > ought to look at the edge cases here too, make sure they are accounted > for. > > ++L > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 16:12:47 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 16:12:47 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF9F9C7032 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:12:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DD82C6A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:12:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18766-02-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:12:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14019C697F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:12:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:10:23 +0900 In-Reply-To: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > i'd like to see the distinction between cpu server and terminal > disappear. Then, what is the difference between your new scheme and the present day unix scheme? I don't really understand your motivation to make it real... You mean all of direct democracy? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 16:27:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 16:27:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DCEEC6FC5 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:27:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFE33C6D05 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:26:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25971-01-74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:26:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39177C6C33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:26:48 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1L7Sxd1013074 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:29:00 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:26:45 +0200 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:26:44 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code References: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2005 07:26:45.0457 (UTC) FILETIME=[B27FE410:01C517E6] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> i'd like to see the distinction between cpu server and terminal >> disappear. > > Then, what is the difference between your new scheme and the > present day unix scheme? > > I don't really understand your motivation to make it real... > You mean all of direct democracy? Complete hegemony, for one. When every terminal is a (potential) cpu server - depending on its owner's whim - there will be a plethora of resources, just waiting to be used. It's somewhat like what P2P is to FTP. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 16:50:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 16:50:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D2C78C6F34 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:50:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3AA563D50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:50:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00040-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:49:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90C6F63D24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 02:49:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:48:14 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Complete hegemony, for one. When every terminal is a (potential) > cpu server - depending on its owner's whim - there will be a > plethora of resources, just waiting to be used. It's somewhat like > what P2P is to FTP. So, the unix caused chaos to maintain its system, that's the one of the most main motivation to produce Plan 9 system, I think. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 17:01:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 17:01:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05847C6C33 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:01:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60FE4C6B80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:00:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00359-01-43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:00:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F6D9C6A8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:00:30 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1L82Z2s013686 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:02:35 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:00:20 +0200 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:00:20 +0200 To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code References: From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2005 08:00:20.0582 (UTC) FILETIME=[639B9060:01C517EB] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > So, the unix caused chaos to maintain its system, that's the one of > the most main motivation to produce Plan 9 system, I think. It will be a completely different thing, locally- (vs centrally) organise= d =20 system. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 17:05:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 17:05:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97369C6F0A for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:05:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 26014C68D3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:04:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01698-01-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:04:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2769BC67D2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:04:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so586610wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:04:49 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=uB7Ql9z8sHTTlcoCmV9MSbGnYefL15ZzKOlqyvUjpdgFhAegSCHYlyXcIw92XyCBbzJvb0UQhq4AipnqwnsUXxMjThnTjYey9pexKa3DEz+pDyNfQh20O21UOPpYvvZJTyA5tds4yiJhVQPehouwRZCzoMK+Zv1rB1LC4rqPfQE= Received: by 10.54.17.10 with SMTP id 10mr305615wrq; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:04:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 00:04:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905022100046bbcc01e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 19:04:49 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu GUI is a term invented by people who sell them. i was very impressed in the mid 80's that my secretary at the labs totally embraced the mux/jim jerq that was put in front of her (maybe it was 56xx). (mux/mpx -> rio, jim -> sam). i knew the lads were on to a good thing. I think seeing a face when e-mail arrived made the entire building more efficient. e-mail was more efficient than a phone call. i don't think i ever called a co-worker in those days except for a "I'm really hungry, you said dinner was on". 20 years on i am using programs which i know are technically very goood and useful (i'll quote adobe audition). ok, i'll rant on. HST is gone so someone has to do it. audtion is quite useable - i've been doing a soundtrack with it, but open it up and you have half a dozen mysterious windows and even more click on menus up the top, many options being sub-menus and so forth. now if it was written in a different thread of software development then it would be a small window in rio with a small menu to open/save/etc. great, i choose "wave" from the menu and get to sweep out a wave window. just what i wanted. it has an appropriate menu. etc. i choose "multitrack" i get something more complex which will need very specific mouse interaction ... but plan9 has no problems with that. such windows need GUIs - dragging a selection on a wave, but it's kinda different huh? end of rant. brucee On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:54:16 +0900, Kenji Okamoto wrote: > > Regarding the UIs, > > we have what we call omero (another experiment), it's a mixture of > > a window-toolkit and a file server, that handles all the graphics by > > its own. The application creates files to build its UI, and the fs takes > > care of the mouse and everything else. This allows you to replicate > > and move around UI components without placing the burden in the > > application. > > How do you think that recent GUI programming style is too difficult > to understand for non-computer science students. We need GUI > only for user interface, and it should be very easy to deal with, and > can be used from all of the languages without special enbedded portion > of those tools. > > Once upon a time, programming was a fan for many scientists because > it was not so difficult. They have to just care of the precisenenss of > their own parts. Now a days, I think most of them are buying some > commercial products and students don't know how to make it from > scratch. It will soon make this world darker I fear. > > Does your Plan B help such? > > Kenji > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 17:25:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 17:25:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FBCDC6EFE for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:25:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A472AC697F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:24:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00359-01-81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:24:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE092C6975 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 03:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1L8QiQL014162 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:26:44 +0200 Received: from tiitl.aprote.com ([192.168.1.32]) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:24:29 +0200 To: "Bruce Ellis" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <775b8d1905022100046bbcc01e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:24:28 +0200 From: "Tiit Lankots" Organization: Aprote Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; charset=iso-8859-15 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905022100046bbcc01e@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Opera M2/7.54 (Win32, build 3865) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2005 08:24:29.0722 (UTC) FILETIME=[C35CC7A0:01C517EE] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > such windows need GUIs - dragging a selection on a wave, > but it's kinda different huh? GUI not necessarily means controls/widgets; sometimes the whole is bigger than the sum of components. Our society is literate, i.e., text-based, no matter how hard certain groups try to change this. Take a look around, basically every GUI has some textual info attached to an action that can be performed. Even in 100% graphic icons the mind has first to form a textual "token" before it can recognise what it is. The framing of a button is just syntactic sugar so that you -god forbid- would not actually have to think what's written there. In "all-text" systems there of course remains the problem how the user is supposed to pick active snippets from the general flow. Typescript systems have this one solved rather elegantly IMHO, by making everyhing active. The whole universe is your playground. Graphics should support text, not vice versa. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 19:09:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 19:09:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85088C7009 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:09:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D8A66C6FC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:08:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26715-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:08:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D88DC6FCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:08:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2a80c4ead707375776aafface7161272@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:08:20 +0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > When every terminal is a (potential) > cpu server Here's the rc script I use when I want my (laptop) terminal to act as a cpu (and drawterm) server. Of course it could be generalised to add more services. #!/bin/rc rfork ne auth/keyfs -p $home/lib/keys aux/listen1 -t tcp!*!ticket /bin/auth/authsrv & service=cpu aux/listen1 tcp!*!cpu /bin/cpu -O & service=cpu aux/listen1 tcp!*!ncpu /bin/cpu -R & From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 19:10:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 19:10:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BB23C7047 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:10:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE316C6FD7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:09:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12882-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:09:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout18.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.18]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DC80C6FC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050221100953.LXXY20856.mta10-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:09:53 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050221100953.QEHN13480.aamta04-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:09:53 +0000 Message-ID: <638ce24d360e68a03b793b59fb9b7b28@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:09:40 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Complete hegemony, for one. When every terminal is a (potential) > cpu server - depending on its owner's whim - there will be a > plethora of resources, just waiting to be used. It's somewhat like > what P2P is to FTP. I like this model, but I think we would need to be able to specify a namespace based on authdom, and a cpu % - Fair Share Scheduler anyone? Then here is the problem of resource discovery... -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 19:39:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 19:39:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B28AEC6F14 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:39:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF5A063E1B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:38:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26718-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:38:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E492663E67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 05:38:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:37:57 +0100 In-Reply-To: <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-iusaadurfqwbfekbgulzkcijrp" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-iusaadurfqwbfekbgulzkcijrp Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I don't think it does, if I understand what you said. Doing UIs with omero is a bit simpler than doing them with rio (same for acme). But it still requires programming. Also, we are using the oberon/acme style of interaction (although we got graphics as well). --upas-iusaadurfqwbfekbgulzkcijrp Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by aquamar; Mon Feb 21 03:56:28 MET 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6ADE1C6FB6 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DC641C6F62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28719-02-86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD884C6AB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 20 Feb 2005 21:56:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:54:16 +0900 In-Reply-To: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+nemo=lsub.org@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+nemo=lsub.org@cse.psu.edu > Regarding the UIs, > we have what we call omero (another experiment), it's a mixture of > a window-toolkit and a file server, that handles all the graphics by > its own. The application creates files to build its UI, and the fs takes > care of the mouse and everything else. This allows you to replicate > and move around UI components without placing the burden in the > application. How do you think that recent GUI programming style is too difficult to understand for non-computer science students. We need GUI only for user interface, and it should be very easy to deal with, and can be used from all of the languages without special enbedded portion of those tools. Once upon a time, programming was a fan for many scientists because it was not so difficult. They have to just care of the precisenenss of their own parts. Now a days, I think most of them are buying some commercial products and students don't know how to make it from scratch. It will soon make this world darker I fear. Does your Plan B help such? Kenji --upas-iusaadurfqwbfekbgulzkcijrp-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 20:31:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 20:31:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F6A1C70E5 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7F120C6E44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27540-01-53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from prunelle.tombob.com (82-41-227-30.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk [82.41.227.30]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A928AC6DE3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 06:30:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:30:12 +0000 From: Robert Raschke In-Reply-To: <8e10ef025f295ae275886fa840d1bc1b@9netics.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Skip Tavakkolian wrote: > term% cat $home/bin/rc/dt_factotum > #!/bin/rc > > if (! test -f /srv/factotum.$user) > auth/factotum -s factotum.$user > mount -b /srv/factotum.$user /mnt Hmm, all I do is start a plain auth/factotum in my profile when I recognise that I'm running a drawterm connection. What is the reason for ensuring an explicit service name? By default it doesn't announce a service, and if I understand correctly, the /mnt/factotum/ is going to be the correct one (i.e., not the one mounted by bootes) for the drawterm session. About the original problem of factotum not prompting for passwords, one of the issues I had in the early days was that factotum attempted to collect my password from the console. And that didn't work when I connected via drawterm. I got around that by starting fgui explicitly via 'window -hide auth/fgui' in my riostart script. Robby From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 21:16:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 21:16:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BBE4C6AF9 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:15:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A66A8C6A4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:15:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03903-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:15:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0C55CC6A43 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:15:22 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Gorka Guardiola Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 13:15:15 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Questions about libthread and setjmp X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I have some questions regarding the man pages of setjmp and the thread library implementation (the commentaries). In setjmp(2): The commentary "-2 leaves room for old pc and new pc in frame" in the setlabel definition (there is also a missing bracket in label[JMPBUFSP but that is another story). What does it mean?. I simply don't understand it. Maybe I am missing something... There is another strange commentary too in the same fashion. Probably for the same reason I don't understand the first one I don't understand this one. t->sched[JMPBUFSP] = (ulong)tos - 8; /* old PC and new PC */ Can anyone explain please?. G. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 23:10:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 23:10:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D3A8C7028 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:09:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D064AC6EEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:09:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00491-02-87 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A697CC69D7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:09:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.18] (port=1070 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D3EFO-000Nhn-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:09:16 +0300 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:01:42 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <775b8d1905022100046bbcc01e@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Tiit, Kenji, Nemo, and others TL> GUI not necessarily means controls/widgets; sometimes the whole is bigger TL> than the sum of components. Our society is literate, i.e., text-based, TL> no matter how hard certain groups try to change this. Take a look around, TL> basically every GUI has some textual info attached to an action that TL> can be performed. Even in 100% graphic icons the mind has first to TL> form a textual "token" before it can recognise what it is. IMHO text/language only represents thoughts, images most fastest way to recognize something, text one of images. If your say 'disk' only who known English (ok, this word in many languages sounds like 'disk' but it's only example) can understand you, but when you show 'disk' anyone understand you. If in Acme 'Get Put send' change to button you lose nothing. TL> The framing of a button is just syntactic sugar so that you -god forbid- would not TL> actually have to think what's written there. TL> In "all-text" systems there of course remains the problem how the user TL> is supposed to pick active snippets from the general flow. Typescript TL> systems have this one solved rather elegantly IMHO, by making everyhing TL> active. The whole universe is your playground. Plan 9 my first system with typescript system, and first impression was great, but now I see many things is missing (buttons, lists etc). Example: If I need cad system, how I can create it in typescript system? Or maybe you suggest type all command in console ;) KO> Once upon a time, programming was a fan for many scientists because KO> it was not so difficult. They have to just care of the precisenenss of KO> their own parts. Now a days, I think most of them are buying some KO> commercial products and students don't know how to make it from KO> scratch. It's good for people who 'write code', it's every time have work... I am sure 'programming user' is utopia... RO> It will soon make this world darker I fear. We can't stop this :-) nemo> Regarding the UIs, nemo> we have what we call omero (another experiment), it's a mixture of nemo> a window-toolkit and a file server, that handles all the graphics by nemo> its own. The application creates files to build its UI, and the fs takes nemo> care of the mouse and everything else. This allows you to replicate nemo> and move around UI components without placing the burden in the nemo> application. Can I see it? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 23:36:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 23:36:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6999C70B8 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:36:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9F974C6FF6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:35:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15079-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28E4FC6FD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:35:30 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:35:23 +0100 In-Reply-To: <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Can I see it? http://lsub.org/who/nemo/export/omero.gif What you see is done so it could work on Plan 9 as well, so I hope this is not too far off-topic ;-) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 21 23:38:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 21 23:38:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F3546C73F6 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:37:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C4FCC6FEF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:37:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15483-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:37:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BF3DCC6FEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 09:37:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <37d919a9f09e139b3cd51d97c6a12b9e@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Gorka Guardiola Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:36:47 +0100 In-Reply-To: <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Example: > If I need cad system, how I can create it in typescript system? > Or maybe you suggest type all command in console ;) Autocad started as a lisp interpreter I think and many professionals prefer the commands to the placing stuff with the mouse or at least combine both... G. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 00:21:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 00:21:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 31BB7C700F for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:21:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61B7BC679A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:21:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21953-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:21:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C809563D9C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1LFKub0023325 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:20:57 +0200 Received: from [192.168.1.32] ([192.168.1.32] unverified) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:20:56 +0200 Message-ID: <4219FC54.9070406@aprote.ee> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:20:52 +0200 From: Tiit Lankots User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <962b4a2fb58f2be0e8d55088767168d5@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <1831e14deca9e2a1e4c2c185f4979bcd@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> <775b8d1905022100046bbcc01e@mail.gmail.com> <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> In-Reply-To: <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2005 15:20:56.0418 (UTC) FILETIME=[F0980420:01C51828] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Example: > If I need cad system, how I can create it in typescript system? > Or maybe you suggest type all command in console ;) You don't have to confine yourself to text. I just think that text should be the primary medium. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 00:41:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 00:41:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B6C97C704D for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:41:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 10973C6A39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:41:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21912-01-72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:41:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.200]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88186C6A35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:41:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so299018rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:41:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=XCUEYWXvijumXkzsyp7wf+XfeKpJ5C11v3ze9p5qWfWAgjnaij8bOsp3nR8bz6iqn4Q6jMh/cXqUu4FV+3M0L02/YrouJi7vKBxjFiasNf8AIJdq0MuT/Odt8f8SqChRy4xpHydOoA2RFmzIEVlrALmJiXFpK9BpZZva1KbYTXI= Received: by 10.38.75.1 with SMTP id x1mr142808rna; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:41:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:41:06 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:41:06 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Questions about libthread and setjmp In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > t->sched[JMPBUFSP] = (ulong)tos - 8; /* old PC and new PC */ Taking this as a concrete example, the thread library is trying to make it look like launcher386(f, arg) called setjmp at the very beginning of its execution. If it had, the stack would look like: arg f pc of caller of launcher386 ("old pc") pc of caller of setjmp (== launcher386, "new pc") and the saved SP is the one pointing at the bottom of this stack. When longjmp comes along, it restores SP to the same place, writes the jmp_buf PC over the slot marked "pc of caller of setjmp" (in normal setjmp/longjmp use that memory word is no longer valid) and executes a return instruction, ending up at the beginning of launcher386 with f, arg as the arguments on the stack. Normal setjmp-produced stacks look a little different, because there is a pointer to the jump buffer, and perhaps then a stack frame full of local variables, between the two pcs. But here we are not returning to a function that has called setjmp. We are "returning" to the beginning of a function, so we want the stack to look like it does on entry, not like it does in the middle. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 00:55:29 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 00:55:29 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7BC06C7028 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:55:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 02745C6AAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:54:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21955-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:54:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17895C6AAA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:54:28 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so301451rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:54:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Fcm0TP5xgOWYktyxrvXC9dcnNngVPucpIGGfPwYegRmZU7u82gsiH/UCWhMdP2FKHZUPkswrqi8QkEeeElR+3EDZvOl4/UtLOeMk7dueVsjo5nhX3XqtLBe5HmjPnqxHubxDIlaHVau7btbk6mE3JEjk8KQ+WMHQRgkzSXE/sSA= Received: by 10.38.78.26 with SMTP id a26mr380454rnb; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:54:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:54:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:54:27 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code In-Reply-To: <53b78d28ce9ff18f6dc22cc280fc92ef@quintile.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <53b78d28ce9ff18f6dc22cc280fc92ef@quintile.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu For those who are interested in making plan9port work under Windows, I put out the code from my last attempt, pieces of which should be salvageable for use. Also in there is my /dev/draw that copes with screen resizes. See http://swtch.com/usr/local/plan9/9pm/README. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 02:00:32 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 02:00:32 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71EF6C7016 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:00:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8768EC6A4D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:59:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25999-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:59:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3EDA5C6A27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:59:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8307d1ad05dad27cc426f7dba2efffbc@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:59:18 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Call me an optimist, but all it takes is for some influential > personality to discover a better way to do things and the entire > fashion swings. you're an optimist! (a new technology has to be compatible with the old at some level otherwise it can't gain its initial toehold). i'm not convinced that plan 9 does away with the need for firewalls. and certainly many companies are not going to be getting rid of their firewalls in a hurry. when i'm visiting such a company and want to rendezvous with someone else via the local network, i should be able to do so securely without needing a connection to the outside world. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 04:21:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 04:21:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 36459C7063 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 14:20:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 834ECC6783 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 14:20:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15182-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 14:20:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (cpu.collyer.net [216.240.55.164]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77297C6771 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 14:20:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 11:20:03 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Drawterm and security In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > What is the reason for ensuring an explicit service name? As usual, one posts a service to permit (or at least encourage) sharing. In this case, one also wants to avoid a possible collision with an existing (bootes) /srv/factotum on a CPU server. By creating a /srv/factotum.$user at first login, it's then possible for later logins by $user to share the same factotum (by just mounting /srv/factotum.$user on /mnt). It does make one's profile (or at least my profile) a little messier, probing for suitable existing factota in /srv and /mnt/term/srv. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 07:01:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 07:01:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34A44C68AE for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5CB9BC682A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01908-01-46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C123C6746 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1LLjoU05964 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:45:50 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1LG2GJ24349 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:02:16 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <700cc765c1dd7da842f38406724bd476@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:52:03 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <37d919a9f09e139b3cd51d97c6a12b9e@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Autocad started as a lisp interpreter I think and many professionals prefer the > commands to the placing stuff with the mouse or at least combine both... Dotty (from graphviz) still operates on that principle. So it's not as if there is only one scheme of things. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 07:01:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 07:01:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1073C673D for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:01:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE93CC685A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27053-02-67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 867D2C6746 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 17:00:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1LLjpO05966; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:45:51 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1LGBDJ24376; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:11:13 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:01:00 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <394464515.20050221160142@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > IMHO text/language only represents thoughts, images most fastest way to recognize > something, text one of images. If your say 'disk' only who known English > (ok, this word in many languages sounds like 'disk' but it's only example) > can understand you, but when you show 'disk' anyone understand you. Try an icon for "beauty", or "intelligence". ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 08:39:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 08:39:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3103763E22 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:38:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8241263DB0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:38:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09789-01-95 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:38:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.145.152.240 (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 862513184D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:38:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <991d76cb3b0fe028c65b68c44569136f@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:37:37 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: <700cc765c1dd7da842f38406724bd476@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> Autocad started as a lisp interpreter I think and many professionals p= refer the >> commands to the placing stuff with the mouse or at least combine both.= .. >=20 > Dotty (from graphviz) still operates on that principle. So it's not > as if there is only one scheme of things. My preference for the whole gui approach would be to have it cleanly separated from the applications. Following /dev/draw's model, ideally a filesystem would enforce the GUI=E2=86=94application interface. A refinement (not a new idea either) is to tie the whole "chrome" filesystem to a language like tk/tcl; tcl or lisp/scheme would not be my choices. If the chrome could be cleanly detached from the underlying functions and could be changed easily, look-and-feel development could continue well past the time when it's functionality is complete. If someone wante= d eye-candy, he could develop it. Perhaps generalizing the interface is not possible and would require specialization to specific problem sets. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 08:50:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 08:50:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22E93C69E5 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:50:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BFBCD63F2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:50:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11834-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:50:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 03A8163F3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:50:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <9e6d41a8d13328b72f70d07a20505d70@vitanuova.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] writing code Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:49:54 +0000 From: rog@vitanuova.com In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > So, the unix caused chaos to maintain its system, that's the one of > the most main motivation to produce Plan 9 system, I think. a centrally administered authentication system should be possible, but i don't think it should be mandatory. is it perhaps the case that unix is chaos mainly because there's no coherent idea of identity? what does a numeric user id mean? what, for that matter, does a user name mean? maybe this is where the ideas in SDSI/SPKI can help (see http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2693.html). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 08:53:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 08:53:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1915E63F71 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:53:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BA3D163F3B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:52:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11484-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:52:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.194]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E88AD63F3D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so978452wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:52:33 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=gOKzFpOaP65s/H1R9UMpr8sw5xj9JXvqCf/yAfzRxD/eJk3hOTLK21HRuciYNkNp9tQ3kx5wWDfeJC2eR0pV0dOhOlTZyd2SnJhVkhWmrLpjwttJx5kmps3E50mlCwXgQbaz4z/oQWa8EIsmsYuK/04rLVGHQNW1Qp41sibSnOM= Received: by 10.54.27.7 with SMTP id a7mr170171wra; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:52:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.29.7 with HTTP; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 15:52:32 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7871fcf505022115527c178be0@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:52:32 -0500 From: Chesky Salomon To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <991d76cb3b0fe028c65b68c44569136f@9netics.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable References: <700cc765c1dd7da842f38406724bd476@proxima.alt.za> <991d76cb3b0fe028c65b68c44569136f@9netics.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Chesky Salomon , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 16:37:37 -0800, Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> wro= te: > My preference for the whole gui approach would be to have it cleanly > separated from the applications. Following /dev/draw's model, ideally > a filesystem would enforce the GUI=E2=86=94application interface. A > refinement (not a new idea either) is to tie the whole "chrome" > filesystem to a language like tk/tcl; tcl or lisp/scheme would not be > my choices. >=20 Searching the archives... On Fri, 6 Sep 2002 20:34:16 -0700, Russ Cox wrote: > 'How I ported the [Mozilla|Konqueror] > HTML rendering engine to plan9 and=20 > made it fit well with the rest of the system.' 2=C2=BD years from challenge to concept... ;-) --Joel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 10:16:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 10:16:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 317F7C6F4E for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DB49C69AE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16879-01-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97962C69AC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2e7956d0fc4673cd2ccaa1a057955f86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:23 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > http://lsub.org/who/nemo/export/omero.gif Hmm, it looks like same to our masv scheme, somewhat different looks though. I'm now stopping this line because it does not help us (not pro-programmer) from tieing too much tightly us to "GUI programming", too. GUI programming should be separated from main programming stream, I now think. It is because the main purpose of programming is not make GUI, which is just for user interface. Or most importantly, it should not add any of difficult things to programming, I believe. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 10:28:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 10:28:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0F0FBC6ACC for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:28:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 640A9C6885 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:28:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22047-03-58 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:28:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.145.152.240 (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 463BCC686A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:28:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:27:58 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: <7871fcf505022115527c178be0@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Something with finer graphics controls, more transparent and less obtuse than the Struts model. "or how to reimplement CICS for Plan9" >> My preference for the whole gui approach would be to have it cleanly >> separated from the applications. Following /dev/draw's model, ideally >> a filesystem would enforce the GUI=E2=86=94application interface. A >> refinement (not a new idea either) is to tie the whole "chrome" >> filesystem to a language like tk/tcl; tcl or lisp/scheme would not be >> my choices. >>=20 >=20 > Searching the archives... > On Fri, 6 Sep 2002 20:34:16 -0700, Russ Cox wrote: >> 'How I ported the [Mozilla|Konqueror] >> HTML rendering engine to plan9 and=20 >> made it fit well with the rest of the system.' >=20 > 2=C2=BD years from challenge to concept... ;-) >=20 > --Joel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 11:04:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 11:04:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5582C69A3 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:04:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5F262C6733 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:03:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25539-01-26 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:03:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1A20DC672B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:03:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <788552e48e12bd154bc24ad18437bcc7@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:04:09 +0900 In-Reply-To: <2e7956d0fc4673cd2ccaa1a057955f86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-szergfoqmngcrssfuvwwrpytmq" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-szergfoqmngcrssfuvwwrpytmq Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sorry, I forgot this. I'm not abusing you, nemo. Everyone should try what s/he believes it's nice. Fortunately, none knows what must be the best one in this case.=E2=98=BA After times of tries, we may find better one for Plan 9 which is the test base for new things, I believe. Kenji --upas-szergfoqmngcrssfuvwwrpytmq Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp ([192.168.1.3]) by diabase; Tue Feb 22 10:15:10 JST 2005 Received: from elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.103.2]) by granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.12.8/8.12.5) with ESMTP id j1M1OO6t001341 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:24:25 +0900 Received: from intrepid.gw.osakafu-u.ac.jp (intrepid.gw.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.248.13]) by elmo.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.9.3p2+/3.7W-04071317) with ESMTP id KAA07620 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from washington.gw.osakafu-u.ac.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by intrepid.gw.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j1M1GVi1012971 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:31 +0900 (JST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu (psuvax1.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.6]) by washington.gw.osakafu-u.ac.jp (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id j1M1GSqo018086 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1027FC69F0 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DB49C69AE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16879-01-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97962C69AC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:16:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <2e7956d0fc4673cd2ccaa1a057955f86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:23 +0900 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+okamoto=granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+okamoto=granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > http://lsub.org/who/nemo/export/omero.gif Hmm, it looks like same to our masv scheme, somewhat different looks though. I'm now stopping this line because it does not help us (not pro-programmer) from tieing too much tightly us to "GUI programming", too. GUI programming should be separated from main programming stream, I now think. It is because the main purpose of programming is not make GUI, which is just for user interface. Or most importantly, it should not add any of difficult things to programming, I believe. Kenji --upas-szergfoqmngcrssfuvwwrpytmq-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 13:00:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 13:00:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 39314C6EB7 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:59:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB036C69A1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:59:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00153-01-42 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:59:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D197C6997 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M3xRa9031624 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:59:27 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M3xQJO010341 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:59:26 -0700 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 20:59:26 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) In-Reply-To: <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: References: <362f4fdd6ec6448d050c7a0d78318c05@vitanuova.com> <4218D388.6060002@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 20 Feb 2005, Lucio De Re wrote: > I agree that firewalls and other obstacles exist, but they serve a need > that Plan 9 already addresses in a much more sensible fashion. In other > words, laptops are misused and the alternatives exist (I presume Plan 9 > is one, Inferno another, there may be more) and will eventually be > discovered. Call me an optimist, but all it takes is for some > influential personality to discover a better way to do things and the > entire fashion swings. you're missing the cases where for non-technical reasons you need to use a laptop but it CAN NOT be connected to any network for, say, the time you are in a certain building or at a certain site. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 13:12:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 13:12:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDB3CC6B51 for ; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:12:35 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D644C69EB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:12:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29142-02-51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70C6DC694A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:12:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M4C3Y8031927 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:12:03 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M4C222010929; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:12:02 -0700 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 21:12:02 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <37d919a9f09e139b3cd51d97c6a12b9e@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Message-ID: References: <37d919a9f09e139b3cd51d97c6a12b9e@plan9.escet.urjc.es> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, Gorka Guardiola wrote: > Autocad started as a lisp interpreter I think and many professionals > prefer the commands to the placing stuff with the mouse or at least > combine both... There's no universal rule. One of the nicest CAD systems I used was the Altera system, which let you easily intermix text and graphics symbols as you needed. You could create an include file from a graphics symbol, and you could easily create a graphics symbol from AHDL code. The worst systems are the ones that give you ONLY pictures or ONLY text. The one thing I've observed in the last xy years is that some people love those graphical systems and some people hate 'em. The most versatile people learn to use both text and graphical aspects of the tools -- which is why really good engineers like the Linux versions of the CAD tools as opposed to the Windows versions -- you get way more options with the Linux versions. For one thing, on Linux, you can shitcan all the various 'Wizards' and get in there with grep and sed and Makefiles and build a project. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 14:00:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 14:00:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9EC8BC6A40 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:00:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2CF02C69BF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:59:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04773-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:59:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 245F6C6903 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 23:59:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1M4exe21512 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 06:40:59 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1M4iYJ25653 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 06:44:34 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 06:34:54 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > you're missing the cases where for non-technical reasons you need to use a > laptop but it CAN NOT be connected to any network for, say, the time you > are in a certain building or at a certain site. But my point was that this is an artefact of current trends, not a necessary condition. It's not as if laptops have always been part of the computing landscape. If it's data you want, a USB drive is usually adequate, if it's computing cycles, you ought to be platform agnostic the way Plan 9 is. And, yes, I accept that the above is simplistic, but I submit it's not unrealistic. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 14:09:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 14:09:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CC092C6CFA for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:09:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3F568C69F7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:09:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02859-02-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 79ED9C69F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 00:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M599Op000727 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:09:09 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1M598SA013332; Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:09:08 -0700 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 22:09:08 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Second class citizenship (Was: writing code) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > But my point was that this is an artefact of current trends, not a > necessary condition. no. It's a requirement for many secure environments, for one thing. That's why it is not a technical issue. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 17:10:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 17:10:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 90CE463EB8 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:10:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 88E4A63E4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:10:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16940-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:10:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [82.149.227.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C598C50C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:10:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4886 invoked by uid 66); 22 Feb 2005 08:10:23 -0000 Received: (qmail 96166 invoked by uid 0); 22 Feb 2005 08:08:05 -0000 Received: from crn.mteege.de (192.168.153.15) by 0 with SMTP; 22 Feb 2005 08:08:05 -0000 Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:07:36 0000 From: Matthias Teege In-Reply-To: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> IMHO text/language only represents thoughts, images most fastest way to recognize >> something, text one of images. If your say 'disk' only who known English That is not true. Start your Mozilla, and move the cursor over some icon. If you wait some seconds, you'll get a long description of the icon. Why? Why do I need a description of an icon if it is the "fastest way to recognize"? The fundamental rule of user interfaces is adaption. A good interface must be monotone/consistent, modeless and there must be only one way to solve a problem. It must support adaption. It must be like Acme without a tagline (and with graffic and WYSIWYG support ;-)) A textual interface is the most user friendly today (textual != cli). Matthias From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 17:25:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 17:25:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 81192C673D for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:25:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 264FD63FA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:25:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16978-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:25:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from one.mteege.de (one.mteege.de [82.149.227.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44F8763FA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:25:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 5071 invoked by uid 66); 22 Feb 2005 08:25:26 -0000 Received: (qmail 96287 invoked by uid 0); 22 Feb 2005 08:22:04 -0000 Received: from crn.mteege.de (192.168.153.15) by 0 with SMTP; 22 Feb 2005 08:22:04 -0000 Message-ID: <5259360f611ce868d79efb651b342129@crn.mteege.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:21:36 0000 From: Matthias Teege In-Reply-To: <2e7956d0fc4673cd2ccaa1a057955f86@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > GUI programming should be separated from main programming stream, > I now think. It is because the main purpose of programming is not make Yes! > GUI, which is just for user interface. Or most importantly, it should not It is the interface to a human. It should be programmed by poeple who know how humans "work" and not from people who know how computers work. Matthias From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 19:27:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 19:27:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7C94C69B3 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:27:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FCAEB8BA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:27:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25852-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:27:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BF70B16F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:27:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Gorka Guardiola Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:26:59 +0100 In-Reply-To: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Try an icon for "beauty", or "intelligence". Interesting. And why do you need a button/tag with that on?. What exact program are you thinking on?. Just curious... G. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 19:42:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 19:42:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CE0A763B2E for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:42:22 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CB8D63ABF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:41:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25852-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:41:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout16.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.16]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9372563A9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 05:41:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222104147.FPTT8887.mta08-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:41:47 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222104147.CCML9818.aamta03-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:41:47 +0000 Message-ID: <90f89cb527846e62d7f3ad4e8cdbab22@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:12:02 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] tip o' the day X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Added a Tip o' the day page to the wiki with peoples contributions, I took the liberty of editing peoples text on occasion to make it clearer in the context of a list rather than an email thread. I haven't attributed them - if there where an argument Google knows. -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 22:55:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 22:55:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 38FA3C6788 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:55:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04A50C672A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:54:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05845-01-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:54:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3A8FC6706 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:54:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.14] (port=1107 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D3aUo-0007VN-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:54:40 +0300 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:52:44 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Matthias, Tuesday, February 22, 2005, 10:07:36 AM, you wrote: >>> IMHO text/language only represents thoughts, images most fastest way to recognize >>> something, text one of images. If your say 'disk' only who known English MT> That is not true. Start your Mozilla, and move the cursor over some MT> icon. If you wait some seconds, you'll get a long description of the MT> icon. Why? Why do I need a description of an icon if it is the MT> "fastest way to recognize"? But after reading description you known what mean this icon. This is like learn new language - you read word in dictionary once. Example: Long time (while I not read 'man acme' :) I can't understand what is 'Look', but if it have tool-tip i need just stop mouse over them... MT> The fundamental rule of user interfaces MT> is adaption. A good interface must be monotone/consistent, modeless MT> and there must be only one way to solve a problem. It must support MT> adaption. It must be like Acme without a tagline (and with graffic MT> and WYSIWYG support ;-)) That is right! MT> A textual interface is the most user friendly today (textual != cli). cli? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 23:00:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 23:00:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0A1EC67A7 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:00:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFEADC6736 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:00:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03428-01-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 87B61C672F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:00:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from [80.125.89.16] ([80.125.89.16]:8967 "HELO kilgore") by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S381751AbVBVOAJ (ORCPT ); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:00:09 -0500 Message-ID: <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Sergey Reva" , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:00:12 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > 'Look', but if it have tool-tip i need just stop mouse over them... tool-tips are definitive proof of the failure of a user interface design. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 23:11:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 23:11:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 09271C69F8 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:11:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E24B63AB8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:10:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05875-01-88 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:10:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from stub.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1095163B83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:10:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from board.home.davidashen.net (board.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.3]) by stub.davidashen.net (8.12.9p2/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j1MEDA8T073117 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:13:10 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Received: from [192.168.1.22] (pillow.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.22]) by board.home.davidashen.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1MEAQ68005637 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:10:26 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> References: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <30a9b092a03f85f9234ab0cf6bdcd521@davidashen.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: David Tolpin Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:10:28 +0400 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 22.02.2005, at 18:00, boyd, rounin wrote: >> 'Look', but if it have tool-tip i need just stop mouse over them... > > tool-tips are definitive proof of the failure of a user interface > design. man is like a tool-tip. It explains what a command does when it is not obvious for a casual user from the command's name. Just less convenient to reach. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 23:15:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 23:15:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EBC09C678E for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:15:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9CC4C6733 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:14:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07481-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:14:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8641963F0B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:14:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Charles Forsyth Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:09:59 +0000 In-Reply-To: <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>MT> "fastest way to recognize"? >But after reading description you known what mean this icon. >This is like learn new language - you read word in dictionary once. it is more like learning a new language that changes spelling and meaning with every person (application) you meet that speaks it. as the experience with international language-less signs suggests, it's hard to design images that convey messages with complete accuracy. it's worse when the conventions change (as part of international standardisation, for instance). that nasty looking green-and-yellow wire must surely be the live and dangerous one ... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Tue Feb 22 23:16:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Tue Feb 22 23:16:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C439FC67D6 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:16:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A97D863E8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:15:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05845-01-99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:15:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns.aprote.ee (ns.aprote.ee [80.235.78.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 08B56C670F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:15:44 -0500 (EST) Received: Message by Barricade ns.aprote.ee with ESMTP id j1MEFipA014992 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:15:45 +0200 Received: from [192.168.1.32] ([192.168.1.32] unverified) by black.aprote.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:15:42 +0200 Message-ID: <421B3E8C.6060409@aprote.ee> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:15:40 +0200 From: Tiit Lankots User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.5) Gecko/20041217 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> <30a9b092a03f85f9234ab0cf6bdcd521@davidashen.net> In-Reply-To: <30a9b092a03f85f9234ab0cf6bdcd521@davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2005 14:15:42.0379 (UTC) FILETIME=[FE0ECFB0:01C518E8] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> tool-tips are definitive proof of the failure of a user interface design. > > man is like a tool-tip. It explains what a command does when it is not > obvious for a casual user from the command's name. Just less convenient > to reach. You've just proven Boyd's point. If an explanation requires an explanation, don't you think that the orginial explanation is a failure? "What we seem to have here is a failure to communicate." From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 00:26:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 00:26:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 45785C67D3 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:26:43 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 44AB7C6767 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:26:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12083-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:25:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from stub.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8400C6775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:25:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from board.home.davidashen.net (board.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.3]) by stub.davidashen.net (8.12.9p2/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j1MFSc8T073279 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:28:38 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Received: from [192.168.1.22] (pillow.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.22]) by board.home.davidashen.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1MFPrYg005826 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:25:53 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <421B3E8C.6060409@aprote.ee> References: <50f22001212dc7ae033228973851dc17@proxima.alt.za> <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> <30a9b092a03f85f9234ab0cf6bdcd521@davidashen.net> <421B3E8C.6060409@aprote.ee> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <3d1597e890b8b5faa6ab617e32a57902@davidashen.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: David Tolpin Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:25:55 +0400 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 22.02.2005, at 18:15, Tiit Lankots wrote: >>> tool-tips are definitive proof of the failure of a user interface >>> design. >> man is like a tool-tip. It explains what a command does when it is >> not obvious for a casual user from the command's name. Just less >> convenient to reach. > > You've just proven Boyd's point. If an explanation requires an > explanation, don't you think that the orginial explanation is a > failure? "What we seem to have here is a failure to communicate." > I did not prove anyone's point. A symbol, whether textual or pictorial, is not an explanation of self. It is a name; a name needs an explanation. A tooltip is a good way to introduce an explanation; in particular when someone coming from a non-american-english environment trying to use an interface. It is also nice for people who use alternative signaling system for interaction, those visually impared do. They listen to the tooltip for the first time, and then attach a tone or a tune which they recognize easily to the icon or to the abbreviated name. David From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:06:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:06:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BA56C67DC for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:06:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CFFA2C67BD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:06:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00635-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:06:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from drax.ntdom.cupdx (drax.cu-portland.edu [65.170.220.179]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29084C67A9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:06:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from vargas.ntdom.cupdx ([65.170.220.154]) by drax.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:06:02 -0800 Received: from cellctl ([10.24.36.120]) by vargas.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:06:02 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:06:01 -0800 References: AAg/BJCAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf X-Mailer: Groupwise 6.5 Message-ID: <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> From: Ben Huntsman Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2005 18:06:02.0136 (UTC) FILETIME=[2B466180:01C51909] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I've got an idea: what about having "icons" be Egyptian... or better yet, = motion graphics of sign-language. That way, it'd be truly universal. har = har. Is it just me, or does this look like it's going to turn into a flame war = really quick? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:14:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:14:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4136E639B for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8FDE5C67BF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24116-02-50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (blacksheep.csh.rit.edu [129.21.60.6]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2D228C67BE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (147-72-109-23.isp.comcastbusiness.net [147.72.109.23]) by blacksheep.csh.rit.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F938922D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:13:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <421B7623.1000304@csh.rit.edu> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:12:51 -0500 From: George Gensure User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 0.8 (Windows/20040913) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development References: AAg/BJCAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> In-Reply-To: <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >yet, motion graphics of sign-language. That way, it'd be truly universal. har har. > > Sign language differs not just by spoken language, but also by country and region (ASL vs. BSL), with dialects changing often more starkly than does spoken and definitely than written language. Not exactly a universal solution. -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:17:09 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:17:09 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 001EBC6830 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:17:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5FF093186E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:16:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24116-02-54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:16:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from drax.ntdom.cupdx (drax.cu-portland.edu [65.170.220.179]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DA1C83186A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:16:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from vargas.ntdom.cupdx ([65.170.220.154]) by drax.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:38 -0800 Received: from cellctl ([10.24.36.120]) by vargas.ntdom.cupdx with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:37 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:16:37 -0800 References: AAQBCJCAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf X-Mailer: Groupwise 6.5 Message-ID: <20050222T101637Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> From: Ben Huntsman Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-OriginalArrivalTime: 22 Feb 2005 18:16:38.0143 (UTC) FILETIME=[A65D58F0:01C5190A] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Just a joke, my friend. I knew that. >>> George Gensure 2/22/2005 10:12:51 AM >>> >yet, motion graphics of sign-language. That way, it'd be truly universal.= har har. > =20 > Sign language differs not just by spoken language, but also by country=20 and region (ASL vs. BSL), with dialects changing often more starkly = than=20 does spoken and definitely than written language. Not exactly a=20 universal solution. -George From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:32:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:32:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7EA9463CF4 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:30:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DF1E63F8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:30:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03205-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 601E763D50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:29:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1MI1fK28921 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 20:01:41 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1MHvQJ26426 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:57:26 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <59ad7b59965c06c6aa510f4bbfc7e14c@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:47:43 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <01fd01c518e6$d4981ad0$10597d50@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> 'Look', but if it have tool-tip i need just stop mouse over them... > > tool-tips are definitive proof of the failure of a user interface design. Agreed, specially when they need to be available in zillions of alternative languages. I have the occasional laugh at StarOffice when it pops up unexpected German messages. I do have an old copy, but it makes a fine example. And of course you never know whether you'll get a tool-tip or not. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:32:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:32:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D6007C6C6E for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:31:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8104FC4C3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:30:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01188-01-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:30:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E7EAFC67CF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:30:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1MI1eU28919 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 20:01:40 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1MHhgJ26409 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:43:42 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:33:59 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Interesting. And why do you need a button/tag with that on?. What exact > program are you thinking on?. Just curious... I only thought of it later: what about "volume" or "intensity"? I was merely countering the suggestion that icons are better than words, where in my opinion words are far more powerful symbols than images, even though the latter are more descriptives. Different levels of abstraction, really. The more remote (abstract) the symbol, the firmer the supporting social convention has to be to support it. I take that (I'm no educated philosopher) to imply that fewer ambiguities are possible. Mathematics makes a nice extreme instance. ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 03:32:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 03:32:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D5ED3C6ABB for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:32:21 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2B87CC6E22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:31:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03093-02-82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:31:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34B44C6E11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:31:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <710b16816697f826b0a0f2883d47cc1a@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Brantley Coile Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:27:40 -0500 In-Reply-To: <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I've got an idea: what about having "icons" be Egyptian... or better yet, motion graphics of sign-language. That way, it'd be truly universal. har har. What do Chinese use as icon? Brantley From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 04:41:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 04:41:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF8F163F23 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:41:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DBE6B587 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:40:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10865-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:40:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from 9netics.com (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BB4363F18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:40:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:40:32 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> Interesting. And why do you need a button/tag with that on?. What exact >> program are you thinking on?. Just curious... > > I only thought of it later: what about "volume" or "intensity"? > > I was merely countering the suggestion that icons are better than > words, where in my opinion words are far more powerful symbols than > images, even though the latter are more descriptives. > > Different levels of abstraction, really. The more remote (abstract) > the symbol, the firmer the supporting social convention has to be to > support it. I take that (I'm no educated philosopher) to imply that > fewer ambiguities are possible. Mathematics makes a nice extreme > instance. I was thinking along the same lines, then I remembered something from Bill Bryson's latest book; he was talking about the chaotic notations and abbreviations that were used for elements before a Swedish scientist came up with a reasonable approach that became the standard. If it's standard, then everyone gets it. The most exact icon I've ever seen is the "bullet in the forehead" button in an early version of Inferno's debugger. I thought the blood dripping was a nice touch, removing any doubt. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 04:57:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 04:57:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9FA7C6A01 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:56:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EC484C68D5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:56:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12576-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:56:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EEC51C6919 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:56:02 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so803631wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:56:02 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=VOqLUCDA+mkHCHl2gY6OUtmmK+Jpdj3S5dAE/HupvkZd1q5T60Pxl4+kG3+Ckm39b7GxydarmaeZaMh6jWFLAnSt2DOvSdiKiT6yR3pnHdvZMWvv3oM42bC7ptzij3NtnTRqupOqk+Ai2US9uCxYnfie2JEpZTQwHMhWPhbFujE= Received: by 10.54.59.8 with SMTP id h8mr236431wra; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:56:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:56:00 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905022211565009956b@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:56:00 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I find the "oh my god, what does that wonderful icon mean!" and the phone calls involving talk like "yeah it's that kinda blue one with the squiggle on it" rather entertaining/demeaning. brucee From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 06:22:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 06:22:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D416C6A15 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:22:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F09B3C6841 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:22:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23435-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu (YERAH.FAC.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.191.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A80DCC683C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from PIPER.NECTAR.CS.CMU.EDU ([128.2.194.80]) by yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu id aa08770; 22 Feb 2005 16:21 EST From: Dave Eckhardt To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <1644.1109107295.1@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:21:35 -0500 Message-ID: <1645.1109107295@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Growing a venti X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu It seems as if the steps to add data arenas are: 1. Format them with fmtarenas 2. Append them to the arena list in venti.conf 3. fmtindex -a And the steps for adding index sections are: 1. Format with fmtisect 2. Add them to the list in venti.conf 3. fmtindex 4. buildindex I assume that fmtindex and buildindex need to be run with venti shut down... how do people usually do this? Boot against some other file server, such as a TIP9UG account? What size should be given to buildindex -B? More or less all of physical memory? Dave Eckhardt From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 08:49:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 08:49:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C7E7EC6A2A for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:48:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 451FEB00E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:47:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06334-01-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:47:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout15.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.15]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 274B5AFDA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:47:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta01-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222234743.PJSC1139.mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta01-winn.mailhost.ntl.com>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:47:43 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta01-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222234743.ZJMI1187.aamta01-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:47:43 +0000 Message-ID: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:47:40 +0000 To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I was merely countering the suggestion that icons are better than > words, where in my opinion words are far more powerful symbols than > images, even though the latter are more descriptives. Tis interesting that perceptually words are both symbols and text - in order to read at more than a couple of hundred words per min (roman script) you have to read words by pattern matching and much of that through peripheral vision. People rarely read the characters of a word unless its one they don't recognise. [aside: We could have a bizzar icon that pops up when you hover the mouse of Acme's Tag labels...] -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 08:55:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 08:55:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2DFEC68D0 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:55:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2670EBAA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:54:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 02030-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:54:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout15.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.15]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73575BAA1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:54:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222235455.QIKQ1139.mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:54:55 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050222235455.BXTE769.aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:54:55 +0000 Message-ID: <0393eb65eb223e5f9b91366aa91c2013@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:54:52 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Growing a venti In-Reply-To: <1645.1109107295@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu What you describe is what what I understand you should do. When I rebuilt my index I booted from cdrom; The ISO on sources can boot as an install CD or as a standalone live system. I didn't use the -B option to buildindex though it may have completed faster if I had. I wrote about my experiences in: /n/sources/steve/Venti-rescue.tbl http://www.quintile.net/Venti-rescue.html -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 09:15:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 09:15:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C43DC6788 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:14:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1363C670F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:14:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05920-01-49 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:14:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.vitanuova.com (unknown [213.146.155.10]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E2F6B63FEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:14:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <17786dcc66a6f2e971ae64486ef80c46@vitanuova.com> From: C H Forsyth Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:17:11 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >>The most exact icon I've ever seen is the "bullet in the forehead" >>button in an early version of Inferno's debugger. I thought the >>blood dripping was a nice touch, removing any doubt. absolutely! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 09:22:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 09:22:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E32A4C69AF for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:22:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68FDD63ADA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:22:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05920-01-67 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:22:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.monitorbm.co.nz (fs6.mbmnz.co.nz [203.167.201.38]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id AF0A5C17E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 16061 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2005 00:21:50 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mollywuppy.monitorbm.co.nz) (192.168.0.41) by mail.monitorbm.co.nz with SMTP; 23 Feb 2005 00:21:50 -0000 Message-Id: <6.0.2.0.0.20050223132112.01b9d720@pop.monitorbm.co.nz> X-Sender: andrew.simmons@monitorbm.co.nz@pop.monitorbm.co.nz X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.0.2.0 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 13:21:49 +1300 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: Andrew Simmons Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> References: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > >[aside: We could have a bizzar icon that pops up when >you hover the mouse of Acme's Tag labels...] Would this be bizarre enough? http://www.juergenspecht.com/documentations/?number=1&photo=39#photo From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 09:36:44 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 09:36:44 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83210C6A52 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:36:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3A463C6845 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:36:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07915-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:36:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BEC8663EC1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:36:03 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <0393eb65eb223e5f9b91366aa91c2013@quintile.net> References: <0393eb65eb223e5f9b91366aa91c2013@quintile.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <82cf3e4cdd0f807a80cf7dc93c2a0236@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:36:00 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] dosmnt X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, dosmnt does not work correctly. because term% echo /dev/sd*/dos* /dev/sdC0/dos /dev/sdC0/dos /dev/sdD0/dos /dev/sdD0/dos current codes are: term% cat /bin/dosmnt #!/bin/rc rfork e if(! ~ $#* 2){ echo 'usage: dosmnt N mntpt' >[1=2] exit usage } x=(`{echo /dev/sd??/dos*}) if(test $#x -lt $1){ echo 'not that many dos disks' >[1=2] exit usage } if(! test -f /srv/dos) dossrv >/dev/null [2]/dev/null mount -c /srv/dos $2 $x($1) term% The fix is to replace last line mount -c /srv/dos $2 $x($1) to g=$x(1) for(f in $x) if(! ~ $f $g) g=($g $f) mount -c /srv/dos $2 $g($1) Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 09:46:59 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 09:46:59 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77992C69CA for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:46:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E3E94C695F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:46:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12681-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:46:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id A8A7AC695E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:46:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 49593 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2005 00:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 23 Feb 2005 00:46:04 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 23 Feb 2005 00:46:04 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1N0k3q31345; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:46:03 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <85aebf4b92667d42c14dc9795648a4fe@orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] tip o' the day From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:45:49 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu having read steve's venti recovery page posted on another thread, i feel this should go into the tips. To get the last valid venti archive score: fossil/last /dev/sdC0/fossil -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 13:31:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 13:31:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D49263BE4 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:30:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 70E7BC6A55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:29:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25985-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:29:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85881C6A46 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:29:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1N4Chl15785 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:12:43 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1N48hJ27671 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:08:44 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:59:01 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > [aside: We could have a bizzar icon that pops up when > you hover the mouse of Acme's Tag labels...] ROFL! Now, that's thinking "outside the box"! ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 13:31:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 13:31:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14381C6EE7 for ; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:31:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60897B8EE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:30:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20749-02-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:30:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17CA8C6AED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:30:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1N4CjU15788 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:12:45 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1N3vTJ27657 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:57:29 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:47:46 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I was thinking along the same lines, then I remembered something > from Bill Bryson's latest book; he was talking about the chaotic notations > and abbreviations that were used for elements before a > Swedish scientist came up with a reasonable approach that became > the standard. If it's standard, then everyone gets it. Talk about going around in circles. But Bill Bryson vs Andy Tanenbaum is a rather neat stand-off. My Tanenbaum literature is presently hidden, so I can't check the number of n's in his surname :-( ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 14:56:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 14:56:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3ED1CC6AFE for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:56:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E484C6ABB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:55:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29408-02-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:55:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.176]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9064C6AAE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:55:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.206] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1D3pUg-00037l-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:55:30 +0100 Received: from [220.226.37.13] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1D3pUe-0000Qh-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:55:29 +0100 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:25:19 +0530 From: Martin C.Atkins To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Message-Id: <20050223112519.33204e17.martin_ml@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: References: <1114846546.20050222155244@mail.ru> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:36ac05c78f2d71fdd8502b36d47d3e88 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 14:09:59 +0000 Charles Forsyth wrote: >.. > that nasty looking green-and-yellow wire > must surely be the live and dangerous one ... Especially since yellow is nature's warning colour (examine a handy bee). Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin_ml@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 15:04:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 15:04:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FF84C6B53 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:04:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0EB4BC6ADE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:04:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00699-01-44 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:03:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.173]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46CA5C6AD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:03:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from [212.227.126.161] (helo=mrelayng.kundenserver.de) by moutng.kundenserver.de with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1D3pcq-0001gb-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:03:56 +0100 Received: from [220.226.37.13] (helo=agni) by mrelayng.kundenserver.de with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #1) id 1D3pcl-0007Fq-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:03:54 +0100 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:33:45 +0530 From: Martin C.Atkins To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Message-Id: <20050223113345.5981654d.martin_ml@parvat.com> In-Reply-To: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> References: <532123d5e931250550b7c6296ac3d1e5@quintile.net> Organization: Parvat Infotech (Private) Limited X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 0.7.4claws (GTK+ 1.2.10; i386-debian-linux-gnu) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: kundenserver.de abuse@kundenserver.de auth:36ac05c78f2d71fdd8502b36d47d3e88 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Tue, 22 Feb 2005 23:47:40 +0000 "Steve Simon" wrote: > Tis interesting that perceptually words are both symbols and > text - in order to read at more than a couple of hundred words > per min (roman script) you have to read words by pattern matching > and much of that through peripheral vision. People rarely read > the characters of a word unless its one they don't recognise. Strange you should say that. I saw an article earlier in the week that suggested that most of the success of "speed reading" courses is to train people to do word-by-word pattern recognition. The unstated conclusion would be that such courses are not so effective for people who already read that way! I wonder if people who read that way are also, on average, less good at crossword puzzles/scrabble/etc? (Or have to learn these as a separate skill?) Martin -- Martin C. Atkins martin_ml@parvat.com Parvat Infotech Private Limited http://www.parvat.com{/,/martin} From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 15:26:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 15:26:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4E8BC6B35 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:26:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9023E63DD9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:25:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01534-01-38 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:25:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96E8563DD5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 01:25:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.21] (port=1038 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D3pxt-000MTG-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:25:42 +0300 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:25:17 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1623052343.20050223082517@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> References: AAg/BJCAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Ben, Tuesday, February 22, 2005, 8:06:01 PM, you wrote: BH> I've got an idea: what about having "icons" be Egyptian... or BH> better yet, motion graphics of sign-language. That way, it'd be BH> truly universal. har har. Maybe future people say: 'Ben Huntsman - great programmer of 21 century, which first suggest use motion graphics, which we use nowadays...' ;-) BH> Is it just me, or does this look like it's going to turn into a flame war really quick? It's right, we need stop that! I found frame(2) useful for writing gui (typescript) program, I try it... I sure we not need any changes in Acme or other program, we just need new program and toolkit for it's creation (maybe frame(2)/libcontrol)... As result I can say I change my opinion in some part... It's Plan 9 style and this great! The End? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 16:23:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 16:23:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 317ACC6DC3 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:23:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A68A7C6AA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:22:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05389-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:22:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.tiscali.cz (stateless1.tiscali.cz [213.235.135.70]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A8C58C6A91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:22:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from [147.231.139.42] by mail.tiscali.cz with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:22:33 +0100 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:22:33 +0100 Message-ID: <421B357F00001D71@stateless1.tiscali.cz> From: tapique@tiscali.cz To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: Evolving rio / GUI development X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > as the experience with international language-less signs suggests, it's= hard to > design images that convey messages with complete accuracy. in windoze, i often tend to click on superficially similar icon getting me somewhere else... its annoying, at least for me. Q: why did mankind ab= andon hieroglyphs - because they invented alphabet... > It must be like Acme without a tagline (and with graffic and WYSIWYG su= pport ;-)) > A textual interface is the most user friendly today (textual !=3D cli).= Absolutely! Acme+rio could be just fine for the time being..... IMHO ++pac -------------------------- Pos=EDlejte SMS p=F8es internet zdarma a bez reklamy. Pouze s TISCALI. V=EDce na http://www.tiscali.cz From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 17:31:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 17:31:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 696FFC6AF7 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:30:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CAB98C6845 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:30:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07155-01-100 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:30:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E9B8C6844 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:30:09 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <34c15e24d394e7af3c6e121f3ab608f5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 17:28:20 +0900 In-Reply-To: <1623052343.20050223082517@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I found frame(2) useful for writing gui (typescript) program, I try it... > I sure we not need any changes in Acme or other program, we just need > new program and toolkit for it's creation (maybe frame(2)/libcontrol)... > As result I can say I change my opinion in some part... > It's Plan 9 style and this great! > > The End? Is this a black joke? Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 19:30:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 19:30:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 851FDC6B5D for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:30:27 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id ACEC3C6748 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:29:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09615-03-81 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:29:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E1D6363E11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:29:43 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so691851rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:29:43 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ttxulVC1WhuUpyYNB/oOawyCSjx4JWbVe4s/RevWT0Wvs2j/mYJ7iXBiNVsNW9gCIDlEjMO5mh6XEbzii5UpF5cs17yE1RJelkeLND05GjlF7WJ+mK3heC60cFooGYarlB6W1EhTFw1DZcXW2Ulcn11HMOojvbwezecw4zL30lE= Received: by 10.38.88.43 with SMTP id l43mr130101rnb; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:29:43 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.15.43 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 02:29:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:29:43 +0100 From: To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <17786dcc66a6f2e971ae64486ef80c46@vitanuova.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <17786dcc66a6f2e971ae64486ef80c46@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: fgergo@gmail.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 00:17:11 +0000, C H Forsyth wrote: > >>The most exact icon I've ever seen is the "bullet in the forehead" > >>button in an early version of Inferno's debugger. I thought the > >>blood dripping was a nice touch, removing any doubt. > > absolutely! Any chance of putting it and the others back into wm/deb. I suppose it is from version 0.1. I only have 0.2, but it already had different icons. They are not that expressive. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 20:23:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 20:23:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8071DC6824 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:23:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6E278C6829 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:22:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17301-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:22:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B68CC67A1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 06:22:25 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so74360wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:22:25 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ucPnUfwuY0CgzLz4xEv/QfvHGzWT7JYtDAPYzsppGrqsA4Ob3DVEsCzXtaIsaytIA1grU46EBX3b3s8SX2LoFcKiW/GhD1l3gjRuCEQ9JknAKxbtMUjxlpczEWdRZ13q1HtTUxatRsBx4457dSoYFpbZTk5pjmasII5PdM5a4II= Received: by 10.54.19.75 with SMTP id 75mr126441wrs; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:22:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 03:22:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905022303221b3db99b@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:22:24 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: fgergo@gmail.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <17786dcc66a6f2e971ae64486ef80c46@vitanuova.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu they are in the original distribution. and then someone who didn't even know how to run emu decided they were politically incorrect. the originals are much better than the VC inspired things that appeared. tho i think someone had a laugh if you examine them closely. i have a smiley "kill thread" t-shirt. brucee > Any chance of putting it and the others back into wm/deb. > I suppose it is from version 0.1. I only have 0.2, but it already had > different icons. They are not that expressive. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 21:11:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 21:11:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BD8B6C6B06 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:10:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F9F1C6A0C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:10:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20161-01-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:10:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C158C69AF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:10:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.12] (port=1037 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D3vLJ-0006zk-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 15:10:14 +0300 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:09:46 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <60732718.20050223140946@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <1623052343.20050223082517@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Kenji Wednesday, February 23, 2005, 10:28:20 AM, you wrote: KO> Is this a black joke? Not understand you... please explain... what you mean? Maybe you can't understand my English... sorry... -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 22:18:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 22:18:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 77267C6B4F for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:41 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AA48763E16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23182-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2423D63D54 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.197]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id DF30A2FED7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:08 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 1so44291rny for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:17:03 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=jyeE10IBjyBX99dkkOozDZ65JAFbUex1EWI7h9lajiTJYNDKHPZhpSeiatAXhmhOtVIc2MPme/lwl3IoCv2vW2YaSRZ3gKzVNcOHcVmRD5vuTX1jG/JwNzvsEChOlHC1aJE+JxEOMT4YP5Eflc+xjEKwokZFhMERinUnEmhTfME= Received: by 10.11.119.47 with SMTP id r47mr51868cwc; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:17:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.117.70 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:17:03 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:17:03 -0500 From: Rob Pike To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Rob Pike , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > If it's standard, then everyone gets it. C++ is standard. I don't get it. -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 22:20:26 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 22:20:26 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 34CA4C6B2A for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:20:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D491B63E30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22939-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from nanionic.dat.escet.urjc.es (gsyc106.dat.escet.urjc.es [193.147.71.106]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 543FA63E9A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> To: robpike@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Gorka Guardiola Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:19:43 +0100 In-Reply-To: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> If it's standard, then everyone gets it. > > C++ is standard. I don't get it. > > -rob Are you standard?. G. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 22:40:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 22:40:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A4949613E for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:40:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DB1BBC6964 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:39:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26393-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:39:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 237B3C691F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:39:45 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so87457wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:39:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Hktgb2x3hPpB8TA+IfBCvx04zP7jrwHV3PLDo8jECgCQWnHj1mnHAwMaVucvXA4p1e9LFYvigmrkItD2xrjhuZChne9P5dxc2RYsTyEwKlF0YZmYkGLolysToiZhUbZHRD1VAoYckppLMfT2miBrwH8+Ep/SDyrJWB8YWa8Y49Y= Received: by 10.54.19.75 with SMTP id 75mr194847wrs; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:39:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 05:39:44 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:39:44 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu rob is a derived class. fortunately he chooses his friends wisely. i've been C++ing a bit lately (don't blame me). i just can't wait to see what features are needed for the next standard. brucee On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:19:43 +0100, Gorka Guardiola wrote: > >> If it's standard, then everyone gets it. > > > > C++ is standard. I don't get it. > > > > -rob > > Are you standard?. > G. > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 22:46:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 22:46:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C0BE063C1B for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:46:34 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7827062F8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:46:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23182-01-73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:46:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B092EB044 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:46:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: bruce.ellis@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Brantley Coile Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:43:44 -0500 In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu C = 89; print("%d\n", C++); What's the deal? I still get 89? Now, if the name had been ++C I would've looked at it. :) Brantley > rob is a derived class. fortunately he chooses his friends wisely. > i've been C++ing a bit lately (don't blame me). i just can't wait > to see what features are needed for the next standard. > > brucee > > On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:19:43 +0100, Gorka Guardiola wrote: >> >> If it's standard, then everyone gets it. >> > >> > C++ is standard. I don't get it. >> > >> > -rob >> >> Are you standard?. > >> G. >> >> From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Wed Feb 23 23:39:24 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Wed Feb 23 23:39:24 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16AFFC6E0B for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:38:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0D2CD63E7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:38:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28319-01-78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:38:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ensa.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (ensa.cpsc.ucalgary.ca [136.159.2.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6A00263E28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:38:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (imgw1 [136.159.5.9]) by ensa.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1NEYnTC001930 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:34:49 -0700 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j1NEYm4o016379 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:34:48 -0700 Received: from imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (imgw1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 16286-04 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:34:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from fbsd (fbsd [136.159.7.68]) by imgw1.cpsc.ucalgary.ca (8.13.3/8.13.3) with ESMTP id j1NEYmKq016373 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:34:48 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:34:45 -0700 (MST) From: andrey mirtchovski To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <34c15e24d394e7af3c6e121f3ab608f5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> Message-ID: References: <34c15e24d394e7af3c6e121f3ab608f5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cpsc.ucalgary.ca X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> The End? > > Is this a black joke? > I think Sergey meant to say "I like the Plan 9 way now, we can end the discussion". From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 00:22:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 00:22:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D5B8C6CD0 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:22:06 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9838063AF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:21:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04456-01-76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:21:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E6AD63ABE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:21:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NFLU4E013621 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:21:30 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NFLTD4005137; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:21:29 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:21:29 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <1623052343.20050223082517@mail.ru> Message-ID: References: AAg/BJCAAAgDAaTsLseeeKUMOBBGyNdf <20050222T100601Z_FFB700000000@mail2.cu-portland.edu> <1623052343.20050223082517@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu you have not lived until you've seen 4 year olds who can barely do their ABCs navigate all the windows icons such as "open file", "close file", etc. Imprinting. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 00:32:48 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 00:32:48 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1E456C6B89 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:32:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0004763C76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:31:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04533-01-92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:31:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7251F63D22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:31:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NFVPr2015899 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:31:25 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NFVOBs005961; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:31:25 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:31:24 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 24 Feb 2005, Bruce Ellis wrote: > rob is a derived class. fortunately he chooses his friends wisely. > i've been C++ing a bit lately (don't blame me). i just can't wait > to see what features are needed for the next standard. static dynamic virtual casts ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 00:46:02 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 00:46:02 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6484163F51 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:45:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A055063E36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:45:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04644-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (neuromancer.cse.psu.edu [130.203.4.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18EF463DFC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.204]) by neuromancer.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server (Backup MX)) with ESMTP id C978B2FED9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:45:04 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 1so65275rny for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:44:04 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=WHmAudg9Ii97d9s0Y8t9udJ1a0/k2jd+m4Zbzv8CtADlJu69fifPW6bKG/li7A5HvDNs3VN+zHNqh3ww26tTPGPe12QxJdY3/7Xh0Rk8bzk9kiFDjCby26mF6tKhshGGk2m96dTyWWtKBY2T4n2yPrR1AmTFBA2TPvF58e06J4U= Received: by 10.11.119.2 with SMTP id r2mr65833cwc; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:37:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.117.70 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:37:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:37:24 -0500 From: Rob Pike To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Rob Pike , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu public: volatile friend boyd; -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 00:55:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 00:55:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1F53E63AA3 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:54:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF485C269 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:53:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07264-01-40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:53:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.204]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55A2063FA7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:53:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so104329wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:53:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=bCx0b6KMLqgnVy6Y9iaI5/QbU8zLaVStPA17dkdtXcDnPdcVqfom12ui6I9P/XGQKBM/lN48THMXTSnLDOMG5/NfgpCo5aXehKfsyAHNEDJd2z19qjyhQcDySZj6FAsidygqYEXZukixAKfj7tm7vzJlV6q31ScO/O9VJ7B4zkM= Received: by 10.54.59.11 with SMTP id h11mr120019wra; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:53:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 07:53:25 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d19050223075311c9e0e2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 02:53:25 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Rob Pike , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Indeed perhaps the best aspect of C++ coding is embedding puns in the code Haven't had this much fun since COBOL. - virtual pure brucee On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 10:37:24 -0500, Rob Pike wrote: > public: volatile friend boyd; > > -rob From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 01:07:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 01:07:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FA88C6CDD for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:07:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF06663DE9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:07:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07107-01-100 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:06:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E1D663E8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:06:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NG6uu3024188 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:06:57 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1NG6u4Q009122; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:06:56 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:06:56 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <775b8d19050223075311c9e0e2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> <775b8d19050223075311c9e0e2@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: Rob Pike X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 24 Feb 2005, Bruce Ellis wrote: > Indeed perhaps the best aspect of C++ coding is embedding > puns in the code Haven't had this much fun since COBOL. blast. We need a PERFORM verb. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 01:19:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 01:19:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E09FBC6A8B for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:18:58 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0223A63FE8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:18:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10567-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3DFCA63E37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:18:19 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so107635wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:18 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Qept3isqsYQiAldr/7O3rPgBGmjQ6oXpFsovLJIk90MIdA6fOZ4swKeWqXnNDjtJP/44eNSDn7YB9aKwaZEKmJr6BHPKvP47ODZNVaIUfcMpnwCbOxUK9IUeJ88dK+j93iOanzhWBcNwfuWWJTuWvluC+1mcsfW7biJY1NclWq0= Received: by 10.54.59.8 with SMTP id h8mr92819wra; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:12 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:18:12 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d1905022308181e98db0c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 03:18:12 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> <775b8d19050223075311c9e0e2@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu what about the lonely "try" keyword? what if all you need is a "penalty goal". this is getting silly, back to work. brucee On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:06:56 -0700 (MST), Ronald G. Minnich wrote: > > > On Thu, 24 Feb 2005, Bruce Ellis wrote: > > > Indeed perhaps the best aspect of C++ coding is embedding > > puns in the code Haven't had this much fun since COBOL. > > blast. We need a PERFORM verb. > > ron > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 01:20:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 01:20:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B5ABC682C for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:20:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFF1AC6773 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10567-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:19:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.199]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 401D4C67D1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:19:59 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so1302553wra for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:58 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=CUjmFDhMTmDBUAAXPnCxpPwszrfDv0BCScDUYJEMN6znZFarrfaepCs0ICNtON3xvconGNs1f8wLMajQ0WKub+G5n8k5vsUw5yqwYKv6YFBoiFnE9J3zKI705zUiwOTzICONGfk4nJTyS0/aug8k7NrsAtZ5qzqtEQkpjyp9ZUw= Received: by 10.54.37.57 with SMTP id k57mr32467wrk; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.18.24 with HTTP; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3e1162e60502230819428032f5@mail.gmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 08:19:57 -0800 From: David Leimbach To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <7359f049050223051738e718f3@mail.gmail.com> <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> <775b8d1905022305394e994527@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: David Leimbach , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:39:44 +1100, Bruce Ellis wrote: > rob is a derived class. fortunately he chooses his friends wisely. > i've been C++ing a bit lately (don't blame me). i just can't wait > to see what features are needed for the next standard. > Fixed width integer types? :) I've been ripping off software from boost to generate them at compile time using template metaprogramming junk. It works on LP32 and LP64 systems so far that I've tested but it'd just be nicer if the standard would specify types There is a really decent book on dealing with a bunch of C++ annoyances [if you must] called Imperfect C++ that lists a bunch of problems and workarounds. Dave > brucee > > On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 14:19:43 +0100, Gorka Guardiola wrote: > > >> If it's standard, then everyone gets it. > > > > > > C++ is standard. I don't get it. > > > > > > -rob > > > > Are you standard?. > > > G. > > > > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 01:39:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 01:39:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 41C20C6CB7 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:39:24 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EB91263E75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:38:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10567-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:38:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.145.152.240 (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A46B763E07 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:38:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7cbdeb4ff5063334dabd958320ac6ae9@9netics.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 09:37:46 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: <7359f04905022307375329d50d@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu class brucee : { real friend class brucej; } From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 01:52:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 01:52:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9BED0C6ADF for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:51:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4BAFFC6964 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:51:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14884-03-11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:51:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8CC74C69CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:51:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <938d65e03742c0a7bba2192e7f71bdc3@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 16:50:38 +0000 In-Reply-To: <3e1162e60502230819428032f5@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Fixed width integer types? :) Actually quite a useful feature for hardware compilation (i.e. when the output of the compiler is a VHDL chip description). For example, see http://www.sle.sharp.co.uk/research/scd/bach.htm From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 02:04:21 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 02:04:21 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D30EC6AD8 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:04:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 61E3CC74E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:03:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 19089-01-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:03:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD1D260FA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:03:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.9] (port=1037 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D3zut-000IUH-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:03:16 +0300 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:03:00 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <771779265.20050223190300@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: References: <34c15e24d394e7af3c6e121f3ab608f5@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Andrey and others Wednesday, February 23, 2005, 4:34:45 PM, you wrote: >>> The End? am> I think Sergey meant to say "I like the Plan 9 way now, we can end the am> discussion". Yes, like that... This is 'The End' for me in this thread, because this thread not produce any 'reasonable output'... The End of End ;-) -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 09:12:42 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 09:12:42 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E5574C6AD8 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:12:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2A0EDC689F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:11:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25826-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:11:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from anvil.com (wonderwall.anvil.co.uk [194.193.52.253]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 22512C689A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:11:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by anvil.com (Postfix, from userid 27) id 1E3707100; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:12:44 +0000 (GMT) Received: from mother.anvil.com (mother [192.168.4.4]) by anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07BE07096 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:12:44 +0000 (GMT) Received: from [IPv6:::1] (rothko [192.168.4.66]) by mother.anvil.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7B7A17270 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:08:53 +0000 (GMT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> References: <627059e81b43bd5362e0b8237ed9841d@plan9.escet.urjc.es> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Dave Lukes Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:11:08 +0000 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Yes, de facto:-). On 23 Feb 2005, at 13:19, Gorka Guardiola wrote: >>> If it's standard, then everyone gets it. >> >> C++ is standard. I don't get it. >> >> -rob > > > Are you standard?. > > G. > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 10:05:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 10:05:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF4A163EE4 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:05:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 89D6C63A8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:04:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29410-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:04:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp (granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp [157.16.101.69]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CF15A639BF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:04:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <45d1ceed1eca3f760a467a798e3fef4e@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development From: Kenji Okamoto Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 10:04:57 +0900 In-Reply-To: <60732718.20050223140946@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > KO> Is this a black joke? > Not understand you... please explain... what you mean? I've been feeling negative sense from your posts here, and finaly you wrote it, then, I responded such. Now, I suppose it was my miss-understanding. If you are Rob/Russ/Jim/Dave whom we know are contributors of Plan 9, and write sometime negative, it'll never happen though, then, I can accept it sincerely. However, ... this is the real point I responded such. Kenji From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 12:43:19 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 12:43:19 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC22E63E2C for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:42:56 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 855E763B18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:42:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17207-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:42:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CBC163B15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:42:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1O3g8eN006880 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:42:08 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1O3g7I3003833 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:42:08 -0700 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:42:07 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] PikeOS (fwd) X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Rob? ron ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 23:27:29 +0000 From: Bin Ren Reply-To: bin.ren@cl.cam.ac.uk To: Goetz Bock , xen-devel@lists.sourceforge.net Subject: Re: [Xen-devel] PikeOS Looks like quite similar to Jaluna: http://www.jaluna.com/ - Bin On Wed, 23 Feb 2005 23:56:40 +0100, Goetz Bock wrote: > Hi all, > > according to the German IT news magazin c't the German company Sysgo has > today presented a realtime capable operating system that allows you to > partition existing hardware calles PikeOS. It's upposed to work on x86, > PowerPC, ARM/XScale. > > http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/56743 (German only) > > I did not (yet) have the time to read the web page, but according to the > news article you can run a realtime OS and Linux simultanosely on the > same hardware. > And PikeOS is ready for certification for realtime/military use. > > http://www.pikeos.de/index.php?id=343&L=1 > > Maybe anyone has heared of it, or finds this interesting. > > Looks like there the virtualisation of PC like hardware is realy gaining > momentum. > -- > /"\ Goetz Bock at blacknet dot de -- secure mobile Linux everNETting > \ / (c) 2004 Creative Commons, Attribution-ShareAlike 2.0 de > X [ 1. Use descriptive subjects - 2. Edit a reply for brevity - ] > / \ [ 3. Reply to the list - 4. Read the archive *before* you post ] > > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide > Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users. > Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. > http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=6595&alloc_id=14396&op=click > _______________________________________________ > Xen-devel mailing list > Xen-devel@lists.sourceforge.net > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/xen-devel > -- Every act of creation is first of all an act of destruction. - Pablo Picasso ------------------------------------------------------- SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users. Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. http://ads.osdn.com/?ad_id=6595&alloc_id=14396&op=click _______________________________________________ Xen-devel mailing list Xen-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/xen-devel From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 12:53:36 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 12:53:36 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 637DF63D21 for ; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:53:33 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AAA8B63A09 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:53:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22384-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:52:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDFC06397E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Wed, 23 Feb 2005 22:52:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] PikeOS (fwd) Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 20:52:56 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Rob? > > ron > pikeos.de has a section in english: http://www.pikeos.de/index.php?id=338&L=1 certifiable microkernel sounds like a diagnose, (not to belittle any of their efforts!) andrey From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Thu Feb 24 14:50:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Thu Feb 24 14:50:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3FF5063A98 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:50:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EF53B639E1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:50:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24475-02-79 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:50:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C91E6639DB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 00:50:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.2] (port=1038 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D4Bsz-000EOr-00; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 08:50:06 +0300 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:49:23 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <562911984.20050224074923@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, Kenji Okamoto Subject: Re: [9fans] Evolving rio / GUI development In-Reply-To: <0ff543a65f3c8fa9dab0a6a07def2f3a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> References: <60732718.20050223140946@mail.ru> <0ff543a65f3c8fa9dab0a6a07def2f3a@granite.cias.osakafu-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Kenji Thursday, February 24, 2005, 3:04:57 AM, you wrote: KO> I've been feeling negative sense from your posts here, and finaly KO> you wrote it, then, I responded such. 8-| negative? I don't want to change rio... maybe only add some (little, as ALT-TAB) stuff... I found textual interface useful too, but I am sure others type of interfaces (user) can live in Plan 9 too. Creating libcontrol proved this... but it need to be improved... or porting libtk... libframe is like toolkit for creating textual interfaces, and I say: I try it... KO> Now, I suppose it was my miss-understanding. I try writing more carefully, and this not happen again... -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 13:50:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 13:50:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B63263EE1 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:59:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B1C2631914 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:58:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17126-01-76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:58:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 29EDD31904 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:58:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1OEwGTS022228 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:58:16 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1OEwFqQ008358 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:58:16 -0700 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:58:15 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] PikeOS (fwd) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Wed, 23 Feb 2005, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > certifiable microkernel sounds like a diagnose, (not to belittle any of > their efforts!) no, there's an ISO standard for microkernels. It's 15,000 pages long. OK, I stole the joke from one I heard used to make the rounds in Moscos in Soviet days. "Did you hear about the new Soviet microprocessor? It's the largest in the world!" ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 13:51:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 13:51:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD2D1C675F for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 14:48:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E206663A73 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 14:47:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18792-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 14:47:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFE2C63A5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 14:47:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1OJlXAh032606 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:47:33 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1OJlWbL001281 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:47:32 -0700 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:47:32 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] too good to miss X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu ron ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 11:39:48 -0800 From: Roland Dreier To: Libor Michalek Cc: openib-general@openib.org Subject: Re: [openib-general] Re: ANNOUNCE: First usable version ofuserspace verbs Just for kicks, I compiled this code for ia64 and sparc64: struct foo { int a; }; struct bar { int b; } __attribute__((packed)); int c(struct foo *x) { return x->a; } int d(struct bar *x) { return x->b; } The ia64 assembly for d() does not look pretty: 0000000000000000 : 0: 0a 10 00 18 00 21 [MMI] mov r2=r12;; 6: 00 00 09 30 23 00 st8 [r2]=r32 c: 00 00 04 00 nop.i 0x0 10: 0b 70 00 04 18 10 [MMI] ld8 r14=[r2];; 16: e0 00 38 20 20 00 ld4 r14=[r14] 1c: 00 00 04 00 nop.i 0x0;; 20: 11 40 00 1c 00 21 [MIB] mov r8=r14 26: c0 00 08 00 42 80 mov r12=r2 2c: 08 00 84 00 br.ret.sptk.many b0;; 0000000000000030 : 30: 0a 10 00 18 00 21 [MMI] mov r2=r12;; 36: 00 00 09 30 23 00 st8 [r2]=r32 3c: 00 00 04 00 nop.i 0x0 40: 0b 78 00 04 18 10 [MMI] ld8 r15=[r2];; 46: 00 01 3c 00 20 c0 ld1 r16=[r15] 4c: 11 78 00 84 adds r14=1,r15;; 50: 0b 70 00 1c 00 10 [MMI] ld1 r14=[r14];; 56: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.m 0x0 5c: e1 b8 dd 53 shl r14=r14,8;; 60: 0d 80 40 1c 0e 20 [MFI] or r16=r16,r14 66: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.f 0x0 6c: 21 78 00 84 adds r14=2,r15;; 70: 0b 70 00 1c 00 10 [MMI] ld1 r14=[r14];; 76: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.m 0x0 7c: e1 78 bd 53 shl r14=r14,16;; 80: 0d 80 40 1c 0e 20 [MFI] or r16=r16,r14 86: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.f 0x0 8c: 31 78 00 84 adds r14=3,r15;; 90: 0b 70 00 1c 00 10 [MMI] ld1 r14=[r14];; 96: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.m 0x0 9c: e1 38 9d 53 shl r14=r14,24;; a0: 0b 70 40 1c 0e 20 [MMI] or r14=r16,r14;; a6: 00 00 00 02 00 c0 nop.m 0x0 ac: e1 f8 7c 53 shl r14=r14,32;; b0: 02 00 00 00 01 00 [MII] nop.m 0x0 b6: e0 08 3a 3e 29 00 shr r14=r14,32;; bc: 01 70 00 84 mov r8=r14 c0: 1d 60 00 04 00 21 [MFB] mov r12=r2 c6: 00 00 00 02 00 80 nop.f 0x0 cc: 08 00 84 00 br.ret.sptk.many b0;; On sparc64, d() looks similarly terrible: 0000000000000000 : 0: 9d e3 bf 40 save %sp, -192, %sp 4: f0 77 a8 7f stx %i0, [ %fp + 0x87f ] 8: c2 5f a8 7f ldx [ %fp + 0x87f ], %g1 c: c2 00 40 00 ld [ %g1 ], %g1 10: 83 38 60 00 sra %g1, 0, %g1 14: b0 10 00 01 mov %g1, %i0 18: 81 cf e0 08 rett %i7 + 8 1c: 01 00 00 00 nop 0000000000000020 : 20: 9d e3 bf 40 save %sp, -192, %sp 24: f0 77 a8 7f stx %i0, [ %fp + 0x87f ] 28: c4 5f a8 7f ldx [ %fp + 0x87f ], %g2 2c: c2 08 80 00 ldub [ %g2 ], %g1 30: 82 08 60 ff and %g1, 0xff, %g1 34: 87 28 70 18 sllx %g1, 0x18, %g3 38: c2 08 a0 01 ldub [ %g2 + 1 ], %g1 3c: 82 08 60 ff and %g1, 0xff, %g1 40: 83 28 70 10 sllx %g1, 0x10, %g1 44: 86 10 40 03 or %g1, %g3, %g3 48: c2 08 a0 02 ldub [ %g2 + 2 ], %g1 4c: 82 08 60 ff and %g1, 0xff, %g1 50: 83 28 70 08 sllx %g1, 8, %g1 54: 86 10 40 03 or %g1, %g3, %g3 58: c2 08 a0 03 ldub [ %g2 + 3 ], %g1 5c: 82 08 60 ff and %g1, 0xff, %g1 60: 82 10 40 03 or %g1, %g3, %g1 64: 83 28 70 20 sllx %g1, 0x20, %g1 68: 83 38 70 20 srax %g1, 0x20, %g1 6c: 83 38 60 00 sra %g1, 0, %g1 70: b0 10 00 01 mov %g1, %i0 74: 81 cf e0 08 rett %i7 + 8 78: 01 00 00 00 nop _______________________________________________ openib-general mailing list openib-general@openib.org http://openib.org/mailman/listinfo/openib-general To unsubscribe, please visit http://openib.org/mailman/listinfo/openib-general From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 14:24:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 14:24:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3AC3F63F26 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:28:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91A0963DC7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20617-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from biscayne-one-station.mit.edu (BISCAYNE-ONE-STATION.MIT.EDU [18.7.7.80]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD20963B21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (OUTGOING-AUTH.MIT.EDU [18.7.22.103]) by biscayne-one-station.mit.edu (8.12.4/8.9.2) with ESMTP id j1OKQi9S010427 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from [18.245.3.202] (TERAFLOP.MIT.EDU [18.245.3.202]) (authenticated bits=0) (User authenticated as alikat@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.12.4/8.12.4) with ESMTP id j1OKQb0Z002457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <421E3878.7000807@mit.edu> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:26:32 -0500 From: Ali Mashtizadeh User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Re: [Xen-devel] PikeOS (fwd) References: In-Reply-To: X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.6.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------enigFF296E430376B812D29EC696" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.42 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 2440 and 3156) --------------enigFF296E430376B812D29EC696 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ronald G. Minnich wrote: 
On Wed, 23 Feb 2005, andrey mirtchovski wrote:

  
certifiable microkernel sounds like a diagnose, (not t=
o belittle any of
their efforts!)
    

no, there's an ISO standard for microkernels. It's 15,000 pages long.

OK, I stole the joke from one I heard used to make the rounds in
Moscos in Soviet days.

"Did you hear about the new Soviet microprocessor? It's the largest in
the world!"

ron
I wonder if it anything they make works check out what they sent me when I asked who certified it.
http://www.mashtiza= deh.net/pikeoscert.jpg

--
Ali Mashtizadeh Signature
Ali Masht= izadeh
=D8=B9=D9= =84=DB=8C =D9=85=D8=B4=D8=AA=DB=8C =D8=B2=D8=A7=D8=AF=D9=87
--------------enigFF296E430376B812D29EC696 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.2.5 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFCHjh8AWqMgz4HqFwRAiQHAKCwK+uio1uZnNGfKA1ihku75GdDSwCfU2Wi X/jGCEUeGdUowKm1bn0lkuw= =H7OE -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------enigFF296E430376B812D29EC696-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 14:57:34 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 14:57:34 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 04134C6AB1 for ; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:38:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19B5763DB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:37:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08090-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B971863B82 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so441728rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:37:20 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Z5odDrn7HNvlN+QjqwptTBZsQpkeS3CKJDVa+E/OJIK2KxABIxWaPF1jCdq6Ky2OUwmCsPSP5azjQaoVuznXe2pktVVBt3cgRZD+KJBuFkf2uFprpqtLqdyyVHDnArBGIJemqTZfgxxAyz4aE8oMoG2aKgukiq4aU6JqZzE8UNo= Received: by 10.38.88.35 with SMTP id l35mr70168rnb; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:37:20 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Thu, 24 Feb 2005 15:37:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:37:20 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt In-Reply-To: <82cf3e4cdd0f807a80cf7dc93c2a0236@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <0393eb65eb223e5f9b91366aa91c2013@quintile.net> <82cf3e4cdd0f807a80cf7dc93c2a0236@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > The fix is to replace last line the real fix is not to bind '#S' onto /dev twice. but i changed dosmnt anyway. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 16:39:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 16:39:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19572C6897 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:39:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4FED363B1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:39:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14757-01-33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:39:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 489BE63A98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:39:04 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: <0393eb65eb223e5f9b91366aa91c2013@quintile.net> <82cf3e4cdd0f807a80cf7dc93c2a0236@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <3a4a7964611d90df75355aa48b96283b@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:38:41 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, > the real fix is not to bind '#S' onto /dev twice. I agree. But why Kernel shows same things twice? Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 16:59:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 16:59:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1D251C6906 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:59:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD4E9C6721 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:58:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14276-01-75 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 5296563FDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 02:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 89561 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1P7wPq207299; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:58:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:58:03 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Mailman-Copy: yes Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > > the real fix is not to bind '#S' onto /dev twice. > But why Kernel shows same things twice? This thread might be helpful: http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2003-March/023167.html -- From orthanc.cc.titech.ac.jp!nashi Fri Feb 25 17:05:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp ([131.112.125.31]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 17:05:08 JST 2005 Received: (qmail 89562 invoked from network); 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 25 Feb 2005 07:58:27 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1P7wPq207299; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:58:25 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:58:03 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > the real fix is not to bind '#S' onto /dev twice. > But why Kernel shows same things twice? This thread might be helpful: http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2003-March/023167.html -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 18:12:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 18:12:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D527C6A00 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 04:12:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A585EC67E0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 04:11:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18672-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 04:11:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A29BCC67BA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 04:11:34 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <393fe65d3f471e10af9133fd7390bc60@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 18:11:30 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, >>> the real fix is not to bind '#S' onto /dev twice. >> But why Kernel shows same things twice? > > This thread might be helpful: > http://lists.cse.psu.edu/archives/9fans/2003-March/023167.html > Thanks. Great help! In the article Russ says: > Ls tells the truth! I see no value in causing it to lie. I agree completely ! Ls should show as kernel told ls. Therefore the problem is not in ls. Kernel shows ghosts -- just my impression. Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 19:41:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 19:41:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8756F63992 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:41:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BF89C01C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23426-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E7A7C019 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:33 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <393fe65d3f471e10af9133fd7390bc60@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> References: <393fe65d3f471e10af9133fd7390bc60@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <1d7da70b9aac8ec0df2c333c9c69d300@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 19:40:26 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, I said: > Kernel shows ghosts -- just my impression. I considered the problem. My conclusion is: /dev is a virtual place. therefore dosmnt should be fixed as bellow: simply replace x=(`{echo /dev/sd??/dos*}) to x=(`{echo '#S'^/sd??/dos*}) Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 19:50:46 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 19:50:46 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7AFBC68B8 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:50:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 468CA63E66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:49:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22257-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:49:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62DC363E15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:49:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <538e9df394efe748ec9d6d3011f46711@terzarima.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt From: Charles Forsyth Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:42:48 +0000 In-Reply-To: <1d7da70b9aac8ec0df2c333c9c69d300@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-qjrmuvmtqmzfwrziutzyowvvdm" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-qjrmuvmtqmzfwrziutzyowvvdm Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit you might have imported devices from somewhere else to the local /dev generally it's best to avoid using # names unless it's essentially to know you're dealing with a local thing. --upas-qjrmuvmtqmzfwrziutzyowvvdm Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by lavoro; Fri Feb 25 10:41:17 GMT 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 014C5C68D9 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:41:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BF89C01C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23426-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4E7A7C019 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 05:40:33 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <393fe65d3f471e10af9133fd7390bc60@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> References: <393fe65d3f471e10af9133fd7390bc60@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <1d7da70b9aac8ec0df2c333c9c69d300@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 19:40:26 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+forsyth=terzarima.net@cse.psu.edu Hello, I said: > Kernel shows ghosts -- just my impression. I considered the problem. My conclusion is: /dev is a virtual place. therefore dosmnt should be fixed as bellow: simply replace x=(`{echo /dev/sd??/dos*}) to x=(`{echo '#S'^/sd??/dos*}) Kenji Arisawa --upas-qjrmuvmtqmzfwrziutzyowvvdm-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 20:03:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 20:03:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DF232C6944 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 06:03:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE88C63E71 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 06:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22257-01-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 06:02:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mtaout3.012.net.il (mtaout3.012.net.il [84.95.2.7]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2CDA63E0A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 06:02:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from skeeve.com ([80.179.113.222]) by i_mtaout3.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2004.12) with ESMTP id <0ICG00K4ES0WXDC0@i_mtaout3.012.net.il> for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:02:57 +0200 (IST) Received: from skeeve.com (skeeve [127.0.0.1]) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1PB2WZb005911 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:02:32 +0200 Received: (from arnold@localhost) by skeeve.com (8.12.11/8.12.11/Submit) id j1PB2VTH005910 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:02:31 +0200 Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 13:02:31 +0200 From: Aharon Robbins Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Message-id: <200502251102.j1PB2VTH005910@skeeve.com> Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Maybe use sort -u to remove duplicates? Arnold From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Fri Feb 25 21:50:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Fri Feb 25 21:50:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B236C69A0 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:49:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C27F7C695D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:49:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26769-02-84 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:49:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ar.aichi-u.ac.jp (ar.aichi-u.ac.jp [202.250.160.40]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E129C6950 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:49:05 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <538e9df394efe748ec9d6d3011f46711@terzarima.net> References: <538e9df394efe748ec9d6d3011f46711@terzarima.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <0feda421584b91edc23040f574664800@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: arisawa@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 21:49:02 +0900 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, > you might have imported devices from somewhere else > to the local /dev we have this problem... term% cpu -h hera hera% ls -l /dev .... d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdC0 d-r-xr-xr-x S 0 bootes bootes 0 Dec 28 14:07 /dev/sdC0 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdC0 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdC1 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdC1 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdD0 d-r-xr-xr-x S 0 bootes bootes 0 Dec 28 14:07 /dev/sdD0 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdD0 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdD1 d-r-xr-xr-x M 8967 arisawa arisawa 0 Feb 16 12:57 /dev/sdD1 ... hera% we see mixed devices. what do we expect by hera% c: or by hera% d: ? Kenji Arisawa From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 00:52:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 00:52:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 230DDC6A45 for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:51:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CA30C6812 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:51:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10204-01-98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:51:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F00ECC67BA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:51:10 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so45757rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:51:10 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=tQxpZPVnMi9Q3f/p/Ef1GqMJgczXqL3hBnNsn2CIdJ1M/L2RnCGXTzD2UZx/a38dvB9w5q3pZcxI1kD1pcrAfZn4KRJzIKeE4EEakFTruMJuBWjkXKLDfzuzoXNGVvbkn7eEsQA4XmVyBuY91LPoS2tG+YwpIhVSAU6kqWmKBM0= Received: by 10.38.181.32 with SMTP id d32mr10419rnf; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:51:09 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 07:51:09 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:51:09 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] dosmnt In-Reply-To: <0feda421584b91edc23040f574664800@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <538e9df394efe748ec9d6d3011f46711@terzarima.net> <0feda421584b91edc23040f574664800@ar.aichi-u.ac.jp> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu ls /dev/sd*/dos | uniq gives you a list of dos partitions. the first is c:, the second is d:, etc. russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 13:01:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 13:01:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6EA2FC6BCF for ; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 23:00:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9A7AC6924 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:59:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11151-02-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C008C6961 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:59:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 22:59:49 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] some recent updates X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Here's a brief explanantion of some of the recent updates to the core system, for the 3 of you out there still running a native system. 8c -H5 flag produces an ELF format header understood by the Plan 9 libmach and by Grub ?c -. flag suppress the default include file search order for include files enclosed by '"' 9load understand the -H5 format of 8c wavelan accept keys in hex format ethervt6102.c replacement for etherrhine which tries to recover better from errors and tries to optimise packet copies --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 19:00:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 19:00:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0A56C6BEE for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 04:59:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 71C8963D36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 04:58:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06484-01-60 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 04:58:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from gau.lava.net (gau.lava.net [64.65.64.28]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A76CE63C83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 04:58:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by gau.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A9D6171CF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Fri, 25 Feb 2005 23:58:50 -1000 (HST) Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 23:58:50 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> Message-ID: References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > 8c -H5 flag > produces an ELF format header understood by the Plan 9 > libmach and by Grub Sounds like there's a story here. Is Grub going to be a supported boot method? > --jim Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 21:17:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 21:17:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4B880C6B41 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:17:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD5D2C6721 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10228-02-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:16:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0BBD763FDF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:16:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:16:22 +0000 In-Reply-To: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > ethervt6102.c > replacement for etherrhine which tries to recover better > from errors and tries to optimise packet copies Does this mean that vt6102-based adapters are a good choice in a Plan 9 machine? It's time I replaced my last remaining 10mb/s card. -- Richard From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 22:43:55 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 22:43:55 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AD65C6BE3 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:43:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6C46DC6B1E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:42:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 20300-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:42:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8155C6AD1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:42:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500 In-Reply-To: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > for the 3 of you out there still running > a native system. Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? We are here at Coraid. Multiple CPU servers, terminals, and drawterm, two Ken FS systems. Brantley From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sat Feb 26 23:54:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sat Feb 26 23:54:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 28760C6BB0 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:54:25 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6203BC6B4F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:53:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24308-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:53:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (outside.cs.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 75131C6B4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:53:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:53:44 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat Feb 26 07:17:42 EST 2005, 9fans@hamnavoe.com wrote: > > ethervt6102.c > > replacement for etherrhine which tries to recover better > > from errors and tries to optimise packet copies > > Does this mean that vt6102-based adapters are a good choice in > a Plan 9 machine? It's time I replaced my last remaining 10mb/s > card. > > -- Richard not my first choice, they still require more copying that other adapters. i'm not sure what's out there in the low-end add-in card market. the realtek 8169 works ok but i've only seen those cards in japan. --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 00:06:04 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 00:06:04 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A3632C6C09 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:05:52 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69099C6B27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:05:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25628-01-17 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:05:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.195]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D04FDC6B55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:05:18 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so512167rnz for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:05:18 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=Fxbdbd5Yp0RN9gRRp/sZba3mdRobpMGHlqUCxnyVPt9cXg6pQIaZPpqD5/4zUbkyOFXufBmYXrGmpAZ3Nu1lBT43c6v4pKKhjMMeq+XO7kkEdF6ewHHoy2Zqgcas8raayLerxLZNFLTlgrdTeYFFvBrn+9cIFDwl8QAVmkcAGP0= Received: by 10.38.206.31 with SMTP id d31mr351858rng; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:05:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.8.56 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:05:15 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:05:15 +0900 From: Vester Thacker To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Vester Thacker , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > > for the 3 of you out there still running > > a native system. > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? 1. Brantley 2. Vester Thacker 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi 4. -vester From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 00:22:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 00:22:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 12358C6B9E for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:21:59 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA4EAC6B37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:21:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26820-01-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:21:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.203]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3BEA3C6B11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:21:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so559185wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:21:19 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=e8mTbmXgIREr1SFxBVzAeBkuKoaAwY/18+g8eK62JaoF8f+LE9rZnpmquUxObpEuoPtbfoeEvq26jmdekdZ2oPnhXkS1G/RXuwrUz73gUIhwrve4tQ8sOXITtbJesxEU4C3TgqMldfqR9jSakDJ1H5uTCpXN74RKHXj1o3NOFL4= Received: by 10.54.29.20 with SMTP id c20mr71292wrc; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:21:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.57.42 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:21:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:21:19 -0600 From: Eric Van Hensbergen To: Vester Thacker , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eric Van Hensbergen , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:05:15 +0900, Vester Thacker wrote: > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > > > for the 3 of you out there still running > > > a native system. > > > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi 4. Eric Van Hensbegren (couple of stand-alone thinkpads and a auth/cpu/fs at work with another machine allocated for an auth/cpu/fs at home) -- (of course I'm still using adapters I had while at Bell Labs (and took with me)). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 00:24:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 00:24:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CDD34C6BC2 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:24:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 50351C6B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:23:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26358-01-34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:23:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9C4FFC6B5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:23:33 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 2765966B93; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:23:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:23:30 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: Vester Thacker , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Message-ID: <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, Feb 27, 2005 at 12:05:15AM +0900, Vester Thacker wrote: > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > > > for the 3 of you out there still running > > > a native system. > > > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi 4. Christopher Nielsen (.75TB venti+fossil fileserver, cpu servers, thinkpad terminal) -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 00:26:08 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 00:26:08 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DD829C6B71 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:26:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 97B0AC6B66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:25:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26358-01-37 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:25:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.foobarbaz.net (cassie.foobarbaz.net [216.218.196.232]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82AEAC6B5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:25:31 -0500 (EST) Received: by mail.foobarbaz.net (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 1131266B93; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:25:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:25:29 -0800 From: Christopher Nielsen To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Message-ID: <20050226152529.GH77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.3i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: cnielsen@pobox.com, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, Feb 26, 2005 at 07:23:30AM -0800, Christopher Nielsen wrote: > On Sun, Feb 27, 2005 at 12:05:15AM +0900, Vester Thacker wrote: > > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: > > > > for the 3 of you out there still running > > > > a native system. > > > > > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > > > 1. Brantley > > 2. Vester Thacker > > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi > 4. Christopher Nielsen (.75TB venti+fossil fileserver, cpu servers, thinkpad terminal) i forgot to list the auth server. :-) -- Christopher Nielsen "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 00:35:11 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 00:35:11 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 345A0C6BB4 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:35:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CACC0318C0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:34:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26820-01-51 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:34:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9E9731878 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:34:34 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so197032rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:34:29 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=rJjow26aPi6g3FPkJyVX7QoS/GsgmJJNiF2US7g0H8jlMcpUyaZon7qfEnSSXXEtBLczDAMyhACcvvvws9+PAe/7Z7KGdTSvbFOjAX8PMx/E0txYjTTNLK6jtt5l+thtfodQMe3ccsf6S4NphNME/RpCpAQKKJJJrY5TRB6GXzA= Received: by 10.38.99.75 with SMTP id w75mr136825rnb; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:34:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 07:34:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:34:28 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <20050226152529.GH77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <20050226152529.GH77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I still run a native Plan 9 system. It's a 233MHz P2 with 1G of ram and 0.5TB of disk. It runs kfs and venti just fine (I never got around to converting it to fossil -- it's mainly a venti server these days), though eventually I should buy a faster processor. A few months ago I got Venti to the point where the 10Mbps 3C590 ethernet card was a speed bottleneck and I had to replace it with a 100Mbps card. Russ From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 01:01:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 01:01:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9D136C6CFF for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:00:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 55277C6BC0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23731-02-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:00:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7A4EFC6BC5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:00:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1QFgln03191; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:42:47 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1QFWXb00450; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:32:33 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> To: vester.thacker@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:22:40 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? 1. Brantley 2. Vester Thacker 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi 4. Lucio From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 01:04:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 01:04:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 367A4C6C4B for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:04:38 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AFD8AC6BD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:04:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27471-01-2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:04:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from alchar.org (alchar.org [66.92.236.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 1AEC2C6BC2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:04:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 22226 invoked by uid 100); 26 Feb 2005 16:04:08 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:04:08 -0500 From: Kris Van Hees To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Message-ID: <20050226160408.GJ1918@alchar.org> References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <20050226152529.GH77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.1i X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I still run a single-system Plan9 installation, though it has been rather idle lately due to other work taking my time. Some minor work was going on on the system to try to get it to talk to an existing AFS fileserver infrastructure, but then it seemed more interesting to see about converting the fileservers to something like venti+fossil and have the other systems talk to that. That hasn't happened yet either, though. So for now, it's mainly collecting dust when I am not pulling updates from the lab system, or reading email. Kris From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 01:12:05 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 01:12:05 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 19FDBC6C2A for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83BF4C6B2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24192-02-76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2707C6B29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGBKFG029487 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:20 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGBJtd004914 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:19 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:19 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: Message-ID: References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Fri, 25 Feb 2005, Tim Newsham wrote: > Sounds like there's a story here. Is Grub going to be a supported boot > method? I have no idea about plans, but this does make it easier to boot plan 9 from linuxbios. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 01:12:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 01:12:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1E2CC6C13 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:12:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B706C6C2A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27471-01-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A9208C6B29 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:11:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGBj9v029496 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:45 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGBjA9004929 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:45 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:44 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> Message-ID: References: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, 26 Feb 2005, Brantley Coile wrote: > We are here at Coraid. Multiple CPU servers, terminals, and drawterm, > two Ken FS systems. we here at LANL. ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 01:21:10 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 01:21:10 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 457C8C6C61 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:21:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5E0FC6B8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27471-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BBE5C6B4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGKStb029615 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:28 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGKRvN005291; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:27 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:27 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: References: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi > 4. Lucio wiki page entry? ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:12:35 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:12:35 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EDFCCC6C34 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:12:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B674AC6BEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:11:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03391-01-34 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from outmail128153.authsmtp.com (outmail128153.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.153]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3543BC6BED for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (secure.authsmtp.com [62.13.128.25]) by punt-mx0.dmpriest.net.uk (8.12.11/8.12.11/Kp) with ESMTP id j1QHBPdx074753 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:11:26 GMT Received: from [192.168.0.100] (d66-183-189-46.bchsia.telus.net [66.183.189.46]) (authenticated bits=0) by squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk (8.13.1/8.13.1/Kp) with ESMTP id j1QHBOcS097203 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:11:25 GMT (envelope-from plalonde@telus.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <20050226160408.GJ1918@alchar.org> References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <20050226152529.GH77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> <20050226160408.GJ1918@alchar.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <7a0574748f2980a98a977265c6b52832@telus.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Paul Lalonde Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:11:22 -0800 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Authentic-SMTP: 61633132383739.squirrel.dmpriest.net.uk:Kp X-Powered-By: AuthSMTP - http://www.authsmtp.com - Authenticated SMTP Mail Relay X-Report-SPAM: If SPAM / abuse - report it at: http://www.authsmtp.com/abuse X-Virus-Status: No virus detected - but ensure you scan with your own anti-virus system! X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I keep a native plan9 machine around serving venti, mostly. And to remind myself how fast a real operating system compared to the dogs I'm forced to use at work and for web browsing. If only all my compilers could be that fast :-( Paul On 26-Feb-05, at 8:04 AM, Kris Van Hees wrote: > I still run a single-system Plan9 installation, though it has been > rather idle > lately due to other work taking my time. Some minor work was going on > on the > system to try to get it to talk to an existing AFS fileserver > infrastructure, > but then it seemed more interesting to see about converting the > fileservers > to something like venti+fossil and have the other systems talk to > that. That > hasn't happened yet either, though. > > So for now, it's mainly collecting dust when I am not pulling updates > from the > lab system, or reading email. > > Kris > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:21:25 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:21:25 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 60D0CC6CB7 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:21:10 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 218B6C6BA9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05702-01-21 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:20:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F1199C6B92 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:20:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:20:30 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <7a0574748f2980a98a977265c6b52832@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu plan9.ucalgary.ca is still very native. it even has more than one user logged in from time to time :) From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:39:15 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:39:15 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 16BF9C6D3B for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:38:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B3CBFC6AE7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:37:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06687-01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:37:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from dhcppc0 (unknown [80.239.96.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1AC59C6AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:37:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <610c28b9474b3570a8b23b7af2c0e112@smtp.songnetworks.no> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:37:31 +0000 From: noselasd@asgaard.homelinux.org In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile wrote: >> > for the 3 of you out there still running >> > a native system. >>=20 >> Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? >=20 > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi 4. Nils O. Sel=C3=A5sdal From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:39:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:39:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7AD80C6C09 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:39:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E6729C6AFD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:39:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06800-01 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:39:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx1.mail.ru (mx1.mail.ru [194.67.23.121]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DFD1BC6B28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:39:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.157] (port=1180 helo=pc) by mx1.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D55uJ-000GE7-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 20:39:13 +0300 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:37:30 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <17224107765.20050226193730@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] realloc X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans I use realloc to increase buffer, and 3-5 cucle of resizing work fine, but others produce this: corrupt tail magic0 pool sbrkmem block 38178 hdr 0a110c09 00000020 00001429 00000000 00640064 00640064 tail 0a110c09 00000020 00001429 00000000 00640064 00640064 | ef100064 00000020 user data 64 00 64 00 64 00 64 00 | 64 00 10 ef 20 00 00 00 panic: pool panic 8.out 2318: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0000375b What useful information I can get from this? What meaning of fields in this output? -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:43:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:43:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEA2DC6C78 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:43:23 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2F86EC6AFF for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:42:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05702-01-62 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 51FE9C6AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:42:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <849557e2ada2cb3b4cfd3f34e3047809@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:42:21 +0000 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > the realtek 8169 works ok but i've only seen those > cards in japan. What about the rtl8139? - I don't really need GB speeds. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:44:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:44:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 05C0AC6BEC for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:44:29 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62368C6AE6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:44:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 06800-01-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:44:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.145.152.240 (unknown [64.91.109.37]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 66269C6B3A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:44:00 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:43:55 -0800 From: Skip Tavakkolian <9nut@9netics.com> In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu 9Netics installations run kenfs+cpu/auth (one set for .com and another for .net) We use drawterm and Plan9 term running on VMWare. >> for the 3 of you out there still running >> a native system. > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > We are here at Coraid. Multiple CPU servers, terminals, and drawterm, > two Ken FS systems. > > Brantley From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:57:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:57:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2EBE1C6BC4 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:57:12 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1CCB5C6BC6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:56:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07767-01-10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:56:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from dhcppc0 (unknown [80.239.96.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1ABFCC6BB4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:56:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:46:25 +0000 From: noselasd@asgaard.homelinux.org In-Reply-To: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > ethervt6102.c > replacement for etherrhine which tries to recover better > from errors and tries to optimise packet copies Thanks for this. I was annoyed by iprint("etherrhine: unhandled irq(s)...= =20 quite so often and a hosed network thereafter. Not experienced any strange things so far with the ethervt6102 -- Nils O. Sel=C3=A5sdal nos@utel.no/noselasd@asgaard.homelinux.org From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 02:59:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 02:59:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 739FBC6BF6 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:59:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B4A5C6BD3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:58:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07767-01-16 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.mail.ru (mx2.mail.ru [194.67.23.122]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1554EC6BCB for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 12:58:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from [217.117.76.1] (port=1187 helo=pc) by mx2.mail.ru with esmtp id 1D56Cv-000OL2-00 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 20:58:26 +0300 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:58:54 +0200 From: Sergey Reva X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.6) CD5BF9353B3B7091 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <6325392234.20050226195854@mail.ru> To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] realloc In-Reply-To: <17224107765.20050226193730@mail.ru> References: <17224107765.20050226193730@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam: Not detected X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello Fans And also (sometimes): 2726.1 dsize >= getdsize(b): assertion failed 8.out 2726: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x00003735 but generated by msize (which called before realloc): abort()+0x0 /sys/src/libc/9sys/abort.c:6 _threadassert(s=0x1d6fa)+0x79 /sys/src/libthread/debug.c:50 _assert(s=0x1d6fa)+0x17 /sys/src/libc/port/_assert.c:11 poolmsize(p=0x1a5b8,v=0x3d730)+0x150 /sys/src/libc/port/pool.c:1356 msize(v=0x3d738)+0x1c /sys/src/libc/port/malloc.c:271 insrune(del=0x0,r=0x77)+0x8c /usr/rlab/????/main.c:96 threadmain()+0x27b /usr/rlab/????/main.c:146 mainlauncher(arg=0x22b48)+0x18 /sys/src/libthread/main.c:56 launcher386(arg=0x22b48,f=0xdd54)+0x10 /sys/src/libthread/386.c:10 0xfefefefe ?file?:0 -- http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 03:06:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 03:06:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C79F5C6C42 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:06:03 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A56F76397D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:05:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 07767-01-40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:05:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from lavoro.terzarima.net (spc1-york1-5-0-cust142.seac.broadband.ntl.com [80.0.45.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1903962CEC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:05:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7f6e9fe7eedd64765ba7e4c7ae6cd662@terzarima.net> From: Charles Forsyth Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 18:05:28 +0000 To: rs_rlab@mail.ru, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] realloc In-Reply-To: <6325392234.20050226195854@mail.ru> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu normally it would be a fair assumption that you are scribbling over the heap. apart from the obvious ways of doing so (off by some, etc.) since you're using threads, you might also check that you don't put too much data on a thread's stack (they don't grow and the default might be fairly modest). From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 03:34:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 03:34:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4ACA2C6C9D for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:34:18 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 824FFC6BBC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:33:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10377-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:33:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from babingka.lava.net (babingka.lava.net [64.65.64.26]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DE6D7C6B6D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:33:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from malasada.lava.net (malasada.lava.net [64.65.64.17]) by babingka.lava.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A87B9133E6; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:33:42 -1000 (HST) Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:33:42 -1000 (HST) From: Tim Newsham To: Vester Thacker , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi > 4. I run: 1. vmware - my primary platform, because my laptop is my fastest machine. 2. xen - my file and cpu server. 3. ultra2 - in development, mostly testing. 3. dell dimension - older slower system but has supported ethernet and video - useful for net booting as a terminal. Tim N. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 03:45:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 03:45:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E927C6B9E for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:45:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 96633C6B86 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:44:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11509-01-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:44:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DBED6C6846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 13:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 69so580034wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:44:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=BM1hF9oNjZBbMAQLyFawqPoJVqsOMp6H//aW9BQ6bkcgVWOL/I29tIC2JV1vVFltC1Dk9szQsO8QNfwPn5cXPhhy5pN6Vf1CYfJOT1SdrB2sCwN7JotBnf4ivk89B67ImqxyBo/Ob7wHUpN0ZTYWaWTV/Hu7d4loTa7s35Pu09Q= Received: by 10.54.2.77 with SMTP id 77mr196782wrb; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:44:30 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.39.60 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:44:30 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 10:44:30 -0800 From: Micah Stetson To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: micah@stetsonnet.org, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I've got one cpu/fs/auth server (dodo.stetsonnet.org) and a thinkpad that sometimes gets the luxury of booting plan9 Micah From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 04:19:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 04:19:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 18A7BC6C6E for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:19:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C519C6BBA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:18:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12712-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:18:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.192]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D00DEC6BBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:18:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so216259rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:18:19 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=PxY2ZzVKUqbI+AT5nwP8InSPKSl2+XhAMI60tgX/3Vwu9/kt4FDbBXWGr2SZF6AtURZABlZKdQgcHocDyIQgmW5AtWVkuUmDMQhS9XT9/VbAT1OFfB5tD2TgRzjPjLLxGHzUswcvcdmaTCCpHP5HSfotwMhSrGEPrIoQ89c1hb0= Received: by 10.38.15.73 with SMTP id 73mr226202rno; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:18:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:18:18 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:18:18 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Sergey Reva , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] realloc In-Reply-To: <17224107765.20050226193730@mail.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <17224107765.20050226193730@mail.ru> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu you scribbled past the end of the buffer with an extra 0064. the ef100064 should be more like ef1000be. look in the archives for the explanation of these dumps that i gave a week ago in the tip o' the day thread. your other problems may well go away once you fix this. russ On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:37:30 +0200, Sergey Reva wrote: > Hello Fans > > I use realloc to increase buffer, and 3-5 cucle of resizing work fine, > but others produce this: > > corrupt tail magic0 > pool sbrkmem block 38178 > hdr 0a110c09 00000020 00001429 00000000 00640064 00640064 > tail 0a110c09 00000020 00001429 00000000 00640064 00640064 | ef100064 00000020 > user data 64 00 64 00 64 00 64 00 | 64 00 10 ef 20 00 00 00 > panic: pool panic > 8.out 2318: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x0000375b > > What useful information I can get from this? What meaning of fields in this > output? > -- > http://rs-rlab.narod.ru mailto:rs_rlab@mail.ru > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 04:22:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 04:22:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CD860C6CA4 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FF70C6BD2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12712-01-36 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (plan9.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C1CF2C6BC8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:17 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <81f4060d28802d1f90bc27610d57b6a5@plan9.bell-labs.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:21:07 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <849557e2ada2cb3b4cfd3f34e3047809@hamnavoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat Feb 26 12:43:35 EST 2005, 9fans@hamnavoe.com wrote: > > the realtek 8169 works ok but i've only seen those > > cards in japan. > > What about the rtl8139? - I don't really need GB speeds. the plain 8139 has copying issues too. the 8139c+ is, however, like the 8169 and has decent buffer management. it would be a very small amount of work to make the 8169 driver handle the 8139c+ as well (the default mode of operation for the 8139c+ is compatible with the plain 8139). at the prices we're talking about, getting the gigabit capable 8169 will not break the bank. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 04:46:12 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 04:46:12 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B3FDC6C21 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:46:09 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 95AEFC6BAC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:45:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13578-01-68 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:45:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 14234C6B8A for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:45:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:45:09 +0000 In-Reply-To: <81f4060d28802d1f90bc27610d57b6a5@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> > the realtek 8169 works ok but i've only seen those >> > cards in japan. >> >> What about the rtl8139? - I don't really need GB speeds. > > ...at the prices we're talking > about, getting the gigabit capable 8169 will not break the > bank. It will when you add on the price of the flight to Japan ... From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 04:48:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 04:48:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9445EC6C53 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:48:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91CD7C6BDE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:47:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16030-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:47:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from wproxy.gmail.com (wproxy.gmail.com [64.233.184.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0B60DC6BCD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:47:38 -0500 (EST) Received: by wproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 36so504059wri for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:47:38 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=gRcdaa6yExvgfWV2zVeebLE3pu/d52hyV07qi/mxhQ0bTP5biTjVD69JzNUTYOUtyfiBHnYSGNc7ENYbsVi5b6yu94FlR6/jvCv1pdqgmkw7TMTr4OR+Mh2Fyl0kv2rMkp20P9XZfayHoUOrGtH+jHAJHMwNpLW4cqFIBSfVWto= Received: by 10.54.59.11 with SMTP id h11mr98456wra; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:47:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.54.19.77 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:47:37 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <775b8d190502261147104a2e2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:47:37 +1100 From: Bruce Ellis To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <81f4060d28802d1f90bc27610d57b6a5@plan9.bell-labs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <849557e2ada2cb3b4cfd3f34e3047809@hamnavoe.com> <81f4060d28802d1f90bc27610d57b6a5@plan9.bell-labs.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Bruce Ellis , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu i recall that ozzie has a native plan9 machine. he likes "the space bunny" and he did ask sharon "did this really come from outer space". then the brats commandeered the astronaut chair so we never got to see him use acme. brucee From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 04:58:27 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 04:58:27 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DEE3AC6CE6 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:58:14 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 414D1C6C27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:57:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12712-01-99 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:57:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B78F9C6C23 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:57:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <833bca488c1f991ff1d779132686783e@hamnavoe.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:57:10 +0000 In-Reply-To: <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? on an elderly dual PPro (daily work), a ThinkPad (when travelling or working in client's office), an ipEngine (tiny PowerPC network appliance), and various others for occasional experiments. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 05:07:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 05:07:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C6F8C6C7E for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:06:55 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CA53C6C27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:06:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 16034-01-15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:06:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk (hamnavoe.gotadsl.co.uk [213.208.117.150]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 83305C6895 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:06:19 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 20:05:49 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > the realtek 8169 works ok but i've only seen those > > cards in japan. OK, www.scan.co.uk appears to have a USRobotics rtl8169 card for =C2=A311.50 - that should do. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:08:37 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:08:37 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E6A7C6CB2 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:07:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AF6526363 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:07:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21459-02-9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:06:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 65F35C8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:06:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <672ccd350b18f518931532bf5722c193@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:05:17 -0500 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dxhxsemktwkagzlyxqafgkkziu" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dxhxsemktwkagzlyxqafgkkziu Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit By the way, can someone point me to the explination of how to update wiki pages? I want to add myself to the community list. --upas-dxhxsemktwkagzlyxqafgkkziu Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by coraid.com; Sat Feb 26 11:20:55 EST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0802C6BE3 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5E0FC6B8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 27471-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2BBE5C6B4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 11:20:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGKStb029615 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:28 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1QGKRvN005291; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:27 -0700 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 09:20:27 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> Message-ID: References: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? > > 1. Brantley > 2. Vester Thacker > 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi > 4. Lucio wiki page entry? ron --upas-dxhxsemktwkagzlyxqafgkkziu-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:26:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:26:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D871863FBB for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:26:02 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D2DD31EA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23647-01-4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from dhcppc0 (unknown [80.239.96.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B2C531E91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:15:24 +0000 From: noselasd@asgaard.homelinux.org In-Reply-To: <672ccd350b18f518931532bf5722c193@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > By the way, can someone point me to the > explination of how to update wiki pages? > I want to add myself to the community list. start with peeking at /acme/wiki/guide From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:33:53 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:33:53 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1747BC68BD for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7F3FC68D2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:32:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23647-02-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:32:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F214AC68CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:32:56 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <67c044ad88c5ecfb6c2a3ee16d0bdb5b@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:27:30 -0500 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-bpgpqhwvkljsopjezudbhjleyf" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-bpgpqhwvkljsopjezudbhjleyf Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Did that. I got the page and make changes and b2'ed Put. I got a copy of the page on wiki syntax. Should I logon in some way? --upas-bpgpqhwvkljsopjezudbhjleyf Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by coraid.com; Sat Feb 26 16:25:50 EST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 616766398B for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:50 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5D2DD31EA2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23647-01-4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from dhcppc0 (unknown [80.239.96.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B2C531E91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:25:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:15:24 +0000 From: noselasd@asgaard.homelinux.org In-Reply-To: <672ccd350b18f518931532bf5722c193@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu > By the way, can someone point me to the > explination of how to update wiki pages? > I want to add myself to the community list. start with peeking at /acme/wiki/guide --upas-bpgpqhwvkljsopjezudbhjleyf-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:34:31 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:34:31 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 07D9FC6A5B for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:34:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69804C68EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25924-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 457A2C6A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42d2bf6e3472d22c674c549703421670@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:33:22 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <672ccd350b18f518931532bf5722c193@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > By the way, can someone point me to the > explination of how to update wiki pages? > I want to add myself to the community list. the guide file and this script work for me: plan9% cat /bin/wiki #!/bin/rc echo 'Local srv net!plan9.bell-labs.com!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki' echo 'Wiki /mnt/wiki' plan9% middle click 'wiki', then do the commands one by one... '9fs wiki' can be substituted for the first like. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:42:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:42:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2C58DC6B6F for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:41:30 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 765A8B012 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:40:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25924-01-20 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:40:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9B728AF9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:40:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:40:47 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <67c044ad88c5ecfb6c2a3ee16d0bdb5b@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Did that. I got the page and make changes and b2'ed Put. I got a > copy of the page on wiki syntax. Should I logon in some way? no, it worked -- the update should appear on the web. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:43:51 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:43:51 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C693C31806 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:43:48 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2926B31718 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:42:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 26075-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:42:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7925D31717 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:42:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4d0bf799280e441b100937dd006b5175@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:37:47 -0500 In-Reply-To: <42d2bf6e3472d22c674c549703421670@plan9.ucalgary.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-dgqcmlrfpwsyncxeezyfpususe" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-dgqcmlrfpwsyncxeezyfpususe Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks all. Looks like it worked for me after all! Guess I was just confused--as usual. Brantley --upas-dgqcmlrfpwsyncxeezyfpususe Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by coraid.com; Sat Feb 26 16:34:18 EST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0660C68DF for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:34:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 69804C68EC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25924-01-5 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 457A2C6A33 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:33:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <42d2bf6e3472d22c674c549703421670@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 14:33:22 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <672ccd350b18f518931532bf5722c193@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+brantley=coraid.com@cse.psu.edu > By the way, can someone point me to the > explination of how to update wiki pages? > I want to add myself to the community list. the guide file and this script work for me: plan9% cat /bin/wiki #!/bin/rc echo 'Local srv net!plan9.bell-labs.com!wiki wiki /mnt/wiki' echo 'Wiki /mnt/wiki' plan9% middle click 'wiki', then do the commands one by one... '9fs wiki' can be substituted for the first like. --upas-dgqcmlrfpwsyncxeezyfpususe-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:44:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:44:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 32E3E318EE for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:44:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 84C1E3188F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:43:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25924-01-24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu (YERAH.FAC.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.191.162]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 0324331880 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:43:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from PIPER.NECTAR.CS.CMU.EDU ([128.2.194.80]) by yerah.fac.cs.cmu.edu id aa13302; 26 Feb 2005 16:43 EST From: Dave Eckhardt Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-ID: <16361.1109454186.1@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:43:06 -0500 Message-ID: <16362.1109454186@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? Carnegie Mellon University CS. Right now one CPU server, one auth/fossil/venti, mixture of drawterm and some dual-boot PCs. "Community" is five daily/weekly users plus some explorers. Is anybody using dual- or quad-processor rack-mount hardware as a CPU server? Care to recommend a configuration which "just works"? Dave Eckhardt From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 06:46:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 06:46:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1523F318B6 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:46:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 037253171B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:46:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 25020-02-13 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:45:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from stub.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9142BBFA4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:45:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from board.home.davidashen.net (board.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.3]) by stub.davidashen.net (8.12.9p2/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j1QLmR8T084111 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 01:48:27 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Received: from [192.168.1.22] (pillow.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.22]) by board.home.davidashen.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1QLjWKF017665 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 01:45:32 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <525f783009f9e46a38cee0dca2fad5b3@davidashen.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: David Tolpin Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 01:45:31 +0400 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 27.02.2005, at 1:40, andrey mirtchovski wrote: >> Did that. I got the page and make changes and b2'ed Put. I got a >> copy of the page on wiki syntax. Should I logon in some way? > > no, it worked -- the update should appear on the web. This is a bug in the wiki code, as far as I remember (the code intends to return you to the page you have been editing, but instead brings back page #0). I had posted the patch and it had been updated (a year ago), but probably wasn't applied to the plan9 wiki. David From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 09:25:43 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 09:25:43 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D347DC6CA6 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:25:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 21779C6C24 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:24:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03956-01-41 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:24:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 747B6C6B30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:24:46 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 40so531589rnz for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:24:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=ng0xx14vyk53qr+0JemV9VRJo1gsReY3BYb4OyG95TL4MuD3C2HhTueL389eRWIpxK0oCssxsSo+xlpTOgaz0G7uaGVZdo1kkQpJ9ZW5u3hwzr3poDozdZtpf1amoVjca0hGqy0vm3ll3LotjJ4jDmNatwJmiBQo7UmWPD6pyKI= Received: by 10.38.206.4 with SMTP id d4mr184466rng; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:24:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.8.56 with HTTP; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 16:24:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32a656c205022616244ff9c288@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 09:24:40 +0900 From: Vester Thacker To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <81f4060d28802d1f90bc27610d57b6a5@plan9.bell-labs.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Vester Thacker , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:45:09 +0000, Richard Miller <9fans@hamnavoe.com> wrote: > > It will when you add on the price of the flight to Japan ... To save you the hassle, just tell me what you need and I'll send it to you. All costs paid by requesters. :-) -vester yamato, japan From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 11:35:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 11:35:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6389DC6C9A for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:35:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67044C69AC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:34:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04685-03-14 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:34:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (outside.cs.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9323C69A2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:34:38 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3dbb38c37a8fac7f24e0c7dff3f521b0@plan9.bell-labs.com> Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:34:35 -0500 From: jmk@plan9.bell-labs.com To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sat Feb 26 04:59:52 EST 2005, newsham@lava.net wrote: > > 8c -H5 flag > > produces an ELF format header understood by the Plan 9 > > libmach and by Grub > > Sounds like there's a story here. Is Grub going to be a > supported boot method? > > > --jim > > Tim N. I'm undecided. I was doing some prep work for the AMD64 port and thinking about how to boot it and thought using Grub might save me some effort. It won't really, Grub and 9load are products of parallel evolution ending in the same train wreck. But I'll probably add in the remaining bits to poke around in the multiboot info Grub leaves around and finish it off. What you have now lets you boot a Plan 9 kernel but it has no config info usually left by 9load. --jim From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 12:01:13 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 12:01:13 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8E9C363F2A for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:01:08 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6720363B28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 04685-03-57 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B9D3063B15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:00:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f16cda7dcce880d65f7939c23d62fe2@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 18:59:57 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I've got a collection of old machines. There are two Ken-fs machines: the production one uses 64-bit sizes, etc. with an HP 160FX WORM jukebox plus a bunch of IDE and SCSI disks; the other uses 32-bit sizes, mostly to confirm that the 32-bit code still works. The number of CPU servers varies, but always includes at least one dual-processor Pentium II. The main fs and cpu servers have Gbe cards and are connected to a small Gbe switch. There's one ordinary terminal and one laptop; drawterm is used rarely and usually from afar. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 12:35:54 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 12:35:54 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9A0C8C6C7E for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:35:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A0E9CC6B53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:35:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15203-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:35:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from picoworks.com (unknown [63.105.17.87]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD9FEC6B4C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:35:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 19:35:07 -0800 From: pat@picoworks.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? Pat Hacker (venti+fossil+cpu server on via epia 800), terminal & drawterm Used for daily work and mail server for picoworks.com. Plan 9, Acme and guide files sure make a nice customizable environment for program development; an added plus, no garish colors or ugly icons. Pat From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 13:01:39 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 13:01:39 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3900DC6D69 for ; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:00:54 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 840E1C6B12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:00:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15203-01-59 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:59:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 76A47C69F4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 22:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1R3gfW20945 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:42:41 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1R3Olb01914 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:24:47 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <6507af3fa8f7084ec3856299fed7ee4c@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:14:53 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <3dbb38c37a8fac7f24e0c7dff3f521b0@plan9.bell-labs.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > But I'll probably add in the remaining bits to poke around in the > multiboot info Grub leaves around and finish it off. What you have > now lets you boot a Plan 9 kernel but it has no config info usually > left by 9load. Does grub checksum the configuration information? A magic number and (optional but useful) checksum would allow one to select the correct kernel boot. The checksum would add confidence without needing to be show stopper. Which reminds me, is there a CRC-16 function (I'm sure I encountered one in second edition many years ago) lurking somewhere that would save me re-inventing it (I need it to model some HDLC operations)? If not, I'm sure with a bit of effort I can submit one, which library would be most appropriate? ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 14:02:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 14:02:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1930EC6D37 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:02:20 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B2FAAC6B85 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:01:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22525-02 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 00:00:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A14AEC6B53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:59:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1R4h4i21391 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:43:04 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1R4XQb01982 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:33:26 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: <7b2414e9a96e83b27507e75d75511916@proxima.alt.za> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 06:23:32 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <8f16cda7dcce880d65f7939c23d62fe2@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="upas-tlocvvvkolcoxntveeolqcnkfi" X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --upas-tlocvvvkolcoxntveeolqcnkfi Content-Disposition: inline Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I've got a collection of old machines. There are two Ken-fs machines: > the production one uses 64-bit sizes, etc. with an HP 160FX WORM > jukebox plus a bunch of IDE and SCSI disks; the other uses 32-bit > sizes, mostly to confirm that the 32-bit code still works. A bit like me. I forget the individual server characteristics, but in Kestell (my office in a small, predominantly agricultural village) I have . a small 4ed AUTH server (386-class, I keep having to remember not to blow it by running floating-point applications such as AWK on it), with my secstore on its local disk . an IDE Ken-FS in production use, Fossil/Venti which gets updated frequently but is seldom actively used, . a 4ed CPU server largely for incoming e-mail, . my original 2ed fileserver upgraded to run 4ed Ken-FS and serving 2ed and 3ed (in various states of disrepair) to no one in particular because . the 2ed CPU/AUTH server isn't much use without a 2ed graphics terminal. So I seldom run up the 2ed hardware, although occasionally it is worth doing. . My desktop runs off the IDE Ken-FS and when in Cape Town is use Vncviewer to access . the CPU/AUTH/Fossil (no Venti) server permanently on my main client's network. Connectivity between Kestell and Cape Town is poor at best, so the two network only exchange information when I manually persuade them to. In the picture, the rack on the right holds, from top to bottom, the 386 AUTH server, the 2ed/3ed file server, the 2ed CPU/AUTH server, a Netware 3.11 server, 2 unconnected CD-ROM jukeboxes, and the WinNT Terminal Server. At the bottom on the left, from left to right are the 4ed CPU server, the Fossil/Venti server, the IDE-FS and the NetBSD server. The two SONY magneto-optical drives have both failed (I'm sure it's the SCSI-to-ESDI interface that died, sadly) and I have very little hope of resurrecting them. ++L --upas-tlocvvvkolcoxntveeolqcnkfi Content-Type: image/jpeg Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=kestellNOC.jpg Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 /9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAgEASABIAAD/7QFcUGhvdG9zaG9wIDMuMAA4QklNA+0AAAAAABAASAAA AAEAAgBIAAAAAQACOEJJTQPzAAAAAAAIAAAAAAAAAAE4QklNJxAAAAAAAAoAAQAAAAAAAAAC OEJJTQP1AAAAAABIAC9mZgABAGxmZgAGAAAAAAABAC9mZgABAKGZmgAGAAAAAAABADIAAAAB AFoAAAAGAAAAAAABADUAAAABAC0AAAAGAAAAAAABOEJJTQQAAAAAAAACAAA4QklNBAIAAAAA AAIAADhCSU0PoAAAAAAAFkdERW8AAAAAAAB/At8BfwLfAQAAAABQSFVUCDUAAAAAAEQAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAFBIVVQINAAAAAAABAAAAAA4QklNBAYAAAAAAAcAAgAAAAEBAP/+ACdGaWxl IHdyaXR0ZW4gYnkgQWRvYmUgUGhvdG9zaG9wqCA0LjAA/+4ADkFkb2JlAGSAAAAAAf/bAIQA CAYGBgYGCAYGCAwIBwgMDgoICAoOEA0NDg0NEBEMDAwMDAwRDAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMDAwMDAwM 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PTbrt74XElqUO4qcHadCj3Cq/wBnkoI+nJCA2lKxdsTIj6QOn2uS3urt6RId/DxH0Ya2XlHU 7ggvHwWoqx8PbJ5pltZ20aiJBR960w4jK0qp2NDQ5aNTjhtjgLHWW996nDkl6pzoHoP1pLov lHT7VA0iB5eoJ7e2H5s1X7KjbpQZl6k1o3b2rgkS7AePXBPNKRom/Lu9zOGGEeQ87PMoF4Gq SemwP34iSwp2pSuGTqN96VwJIm2wyGx3PwZX0UVk4sB0HSmLGYnbtSmB2Xah3NOnvjTsaDp0 J8OmI8z5J5i0R6gAr36VxJmJqOmN5gAjwO5+WZXUk13HX6MFjet66rz5H3tg9Cd8aW28fAZm YDYdPD6cTJ74nl023XzHxaeQHYVqMTduQpSvvmL8zXpXKIIJ2ABrv92HatvJAtDT26uhoNzh TPp7VNBXrh4XGU1OHDqRj1Il1+YWQ6gsPntCGKsvTvhfNZLWtPuyYywAncAkeOFNxahfs7jt hAsVE70UVfN//9k= --upas-tlocvvvkolcoxntveeolqcnkfi-- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 16:51:00 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 16:51:00 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EFFBCC6DDD for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:50:31 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2AC87C6D2D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:49:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28504-02-50 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:49:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4CE54C6D11 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 02:49:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <5e3708bfd42aa5091f36f90a849ecf15@collyer.net> To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 23:49:46 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: <6507af3fa8f7084ec3856299fed7ee4c@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu There's a 32-bit CRC function: ; lookman crc man 2 flate # flate(2) ; sig mkcrctab blockcrc ulong *mkcrctab(ulong poly) ulong blockcrc(ulong *tab, ulong crc, void *buf, int n) but it's also possible that some command has a 16-bit CRC function within it. Is there any particular advantage to using a 16-bit (rather than 32-bit) CRC, now that 16-bit machines are rare? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 19:15:33 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 19:15:33 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AD11DC6D5E for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:15:16 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7ADE6C6B8D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:14:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11311-01-74 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:14:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.cs.bell-labs.com (outside.cs.bell-labs.com [204.178.31.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B08C1C6B6F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:14:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.a2000.nl ([24.132.230.104]) by plan9; Sun Feb 27 05:14:13 EST 2005 Message-ID: <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:14:05 +0100 From: Sape Mullender In-Reply-To: <16362.1109454186@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? I run a stand alone 9pcf in Amsterdam and 9pccpuf in New Jersey. I also have Plan 9 on two laptops, one in use by my wife. I also have Plan 9 on an old iPaq. In New Jersey I use drawterm to get to Plan 9. Sape From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 19:31:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 19:31:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 865C3C6CCF for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:31:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C5F50C2B2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11762-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from giggle.iba.co.za (giggle.iba.co.za [196.30.44.142]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9716363E7E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from root@localhost) by giggle.iba.co.za (8.11.7/9.0.2) with UUCP id j1RACmX24333 for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:12:48 +0200 (SAST) Received: from huddle.proxima.alt.za (foible.proxima.alt.za [192.96.32.72]) by myrtle.proxima.alt.za (8.11.3nb1/8.11.5) with ESMTP id j1R9n9b02254 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:49:09 +0200 (SAST) Message-ID: To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Organization: Proxima Research & Development X-Mailer: Plan 9 ACME/Mail Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:39:15 +0200 From: lucio@proxima.alt.za In-Reply-To: <7b2414e9a96e83b27507e75d75511916@proxima.alt.za> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: lucio@proxima.alt.za, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > . an IDE Ken-FS in production use, Fossil/Venti which gets > updated frequently but is seldom actively used, Oops, I missed a point when editing: . an IDE Ken-FS in production use, . Fossil/Venti which gets updated frequently but is seldom actively used, ++L From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 21:53:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 21:53:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 4D038C6E4B for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:53:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DAE11C6D5F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:52:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 18964-01-53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:52:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com (smtpout15.mailhost.ntl.com [212.250.162.15]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D4FA0C6D5E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:52:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com ([212.250.162.8]) by mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050227125231.QURZ1139.mta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:52:31 +0000 Received: from felix.quintile.net ([81.96.207.141]) by aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com with ESMTP id <20050227125231.WKG769.aamta05-winn.mailhost.ntl.com@felix.quintile.net> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:52:31 +0000 Message-ID: <0b45a5629904cc47f7b142c52cabdc0d@quintile.net> From: "Steve Simon" Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:52:28 +0000 To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I have a Dual PIII 650 cpu/fs/auth server at home (felix.quintile.net), a PII 400 laptop which dual boots NT4 (for surfing) and plan9 as a terminal, and a P4 1.6G standalone terminal at work - This will be netbooted from a PII 450 server when I get round to it. -Steve From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Sun Feb 27 22:32:40 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Sun Feb 27 22:32:40 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5B85BC515 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:31:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 502536371 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:30:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 24499-01-4 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:30:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B5F91F1D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:30:35 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so280776rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:35 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=V9O6W0k2W0yiQKkwc+sMt13ui0K5PDGXwsFDZmShFxjrmt05HYEk0K80OY2JwIkXw+8WP081WpTeNX8spztUw2SeDOqlfzsE7zfuK1VwQp5MrqP46JREODqf67wD8rPjmiJJR44sHwVpd2VjfFQ38XSV4ODiAM8xkzvq18wB6vM= Received: by 10.38.79.24 with SMTP id c24mr315098rnb; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:34 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 05:30:34 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:30:34 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <525f783009f9e46a38cee0dca2fad5b3@davidashen.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <525f783009f9e46a38cee0dca2fad5b3@davidashen.net> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu I thought I finally fixed this a month ago. Have you updated recently? Russ On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 01:45:31 +0400, David Tolpin wrote: > > On 27.02.2005, at 1:40, andrey mirtchovski wrote: > > >> Did that. I got the page and make changes and b2'ed Put. I got a > >> copy of the page on wiki syntax. Should I logon in some way? > > > > no, it worked -- the update should appear on the web. > > This is a bug in the wiki code, as far as I remember (the code intends > to return you to the page you have been editing, but instead brings > back page #0). I had posted the patch and it had been updated (a year > ago), but probably wasn't applied to the plan9 wiki. > > David > > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 00:39:28 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 00:39:28 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1475CC6FCB for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:39:05 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 46626C6E8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01029-01-30 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:38:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (bay102-f26.bay102.hotmail.com [64.4.61.36]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9278C6E93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:38:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:38:00 -0800 Message-ID: Received: from 64.4.61.208 by by102fd.bay102.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 15:37:04 GMT X-Originating-IP: [64.4.61.208] X-Originating-Email: [jonfeero_13@hotmail.com] X-Sender: jonfeero_13@hotmail.com From: "Jon F" To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:37:04 -0400 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; format=flowed X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Feb 2005 15:38:00.0824 (UTC) FILETIME=[51AA7780:01C51CE2] X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Access a file on CDROM X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu

How do you execute a file that is located on a CDROM drive,
I tried and got a Premission denided message. I made a Raw Data cd with the file I want to use,
I just can't figure out the commands to execute it:

/dev/sdD0/data
Premission denied

-- Some help with this would be great, thanks!

From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 00:50:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 00:50:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 85833C6EDC for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:50:13 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 021DF63FCC for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:49:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29088-02-39 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:49:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.198]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9DA6963FCA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:49:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id y7so290276rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:49:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=GCla0L042MapL2T3tL+jcZCXnQNXGToRMQJOnAP1zJGAyXNq0tVRYsvSSMWf0fivgz2ybvYta0Dpc/DtnqlWabj6FaoaxLcuOB/R26pgZdhIXLwrCvhbc1dosslvdh71Nycf1Iq/yn92WAF2DNtWik96kEztiD+xZXYRJz9OMOI= Received: by 10.38.79.42 with SMTP id c42mr24177rnb; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:49:35 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.38.104.41 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 07:49:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:49:35 -0500 From: Russ Cox To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] Access a file on CDROM In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Russ Cox , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu cp /dev/sdC0/data /tmp/x; chmod +x /tmp/x; /tmp/x you might get away with chmod +x /dev/sdC0/data; /dev/sdC0/data. russ On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:37:04 -0400, Jon F wrote: > > > How do you execute a file that is located on a CDROM drive, > I tried and got a Premission denided message. I made a Raw Data cd with the > file I want to use, > I just can't figure out the commands to execute it: > > > > > /dev/sdD0/data > Premission denied > > -- Some help with this would be great, thanks! > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 00:58:52 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 00:58:52 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C3723C6EFD for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:58:42 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 91534C6775 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:58:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 29088-02-53 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:58:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from stub.davidashen.net (unknown [217.113.20.247]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EE8AEC6AB6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 10:58:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from board.home.davidashen.net (board.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.3]) by stub.davidashen.net (8.12.9p2/8.12.8) with ESMTP id j1RG0t8T085695; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:00:55 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Received: from [192.168.1.22] (pillow.home.davidashen.net [192.168.1.22]) by board.home.davidashen.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j1RFvwwm019343; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:57:58 +0400 (AMT) (envelope-from dvd@davidashen.net) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: References: <525f783009f9e46a38cee0dca2fad5b3@davidashen.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <57a566f5f098265a323a8db333e71380@davidashen.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: David Tolpin Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:57:57 +0400 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, Russ Cox X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On 27.02.2005, at 17:30, Russ Cox wrote: > I thought I finally fixed this a month ago. > Have you updated recently? > > This is not me; the plan9 wiki in bell-labs still has the bug. If you edit and commit a page, you'll be brought to the syntax page instead of one you edited (that's what the original poster complained about). David From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 01:05:49 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 01:05:49 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 753ABC6E96 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:05:40 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C9981C6E78 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:05:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 01027-01-64 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:05:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5C6F8C6E7B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:05:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: russcox@gmail.com, 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:02:25 -0500 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I thought I finally fixed this a month ago. > Have you updated recently? > > Russ I haven't done a pull recently. I'll update the wiki. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 01:11:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 01:11:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9667C6F71 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:11:44 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D3D28C6E90 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:11:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 03626-01-7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:11:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from coraid.com (ns1.coraid.com [65.14.39.133]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5A013C6E8E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:11:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8c534ae5637031930c0e389608c272b9@coraid.com> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: Brantley Coile Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 11:09:51 -0500 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > I haven't done a pull recently. > I'll update the wiki. copied new /n/sources/plan9/acme/wiki/src/wiki.c that was modified on Jan 18. Works great now. Thanks. I don't pull stuff as often as I should. One gets friendly with the bugs one knows. Brantley From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 02:34:50 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 02:34:50 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3E9CBC6EE7 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:34:32 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2FA98C6E98 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 05790-01-28 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from plain.rackshack.net (unknown [207.44.192.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CB66AC6E80 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:33:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from www.infernopark.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by plain.rackshack.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id j1RMtWYa004865 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:55:32 -0600 Received: from 24.6.25.223 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:55:32 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <1280.24.6.25.223.1109544932.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> In-Reply-To: <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> References: <16362.1109454186@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:55:32 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: vdharani@infernopark.com To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? I have a PC with PII, ~628MB RAM, 80GB IDE running plan9 with auth/fs/cpu configuration. It runs with kfs and I have also configured venti. I use drawterm, plan 9 term to connect to the server. I also have a T23 with Pentium, 1GB RAM, ~50GB disk that dual boots Win 2000 and plan 9. I use fossil under Plan 9. I am yet to make it do auth/fs/cpu and set up venti. thanks dharani From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 02:38:18 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 02:38:18 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D1BF7C6FC5 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:37:37 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D9693C6EB3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:37:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09698-01-6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:37:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from plain.rackshack.net (unknown [207.44.192.47]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7CEE5C6EB1 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:37:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from www.infernopark.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by plain.rackshack.net (8.12.10/8.12.10) with SMTP id j1RMwnYa004893 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:58:49 -0600 Received: from 24.6.25.223 (SquirrelMail authenticated user vdharani@infernopark.com) by www.infernopark.com with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:58:49 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <1281.24.6.25.223.1109545129.squirrel@www.infernopark.com> In-Reply-To: <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> References: <16362.1109454186@piper.nectar.cs.cmu.edu> <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:58:49 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: vdharani@infernopark.com To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 X-Priority: 3 Importance: Normal X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >> Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? i dont know if anyone in vitanuova has mentioned but i am sure they have = a bunch of machines running plan 9. thanks dharani From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 03:55:06 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 03:55:06 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4730C6F0B for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:54:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8F2EDC6DF8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 13246-03-10 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:54:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from imf20aec.mail.bellsouth.net (imf20aec.mail.bellsouth.net [205.152.59.68]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B08BFC6DF2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:54:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from p1.stuart.org ([208.63.190.243]) by imf20aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.06.11 201-253-122-130-111-20040605) with ESMTP id <20050227185401.GGRQ1995.imf20aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:54:01 -0500 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> From: blstuart@bellsouth.net Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-reply-to: Your message of Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500 . <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 12:53:32 -0600 Message-Id: <20050227185401.GGRQ1995.imf20aec.mail.bellsouth.net@p1.stuart.org> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu In message <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com>, Brantley Coile writes : >> for the 3 of you out there still running >> a native system. > >Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? I'm running a file server and a couple of stand-alone terminals. Still trying to carve out enough time to set up the network I really want. Of course that means I have to get the Alpha port working on my Digital Server 5300 and the time for that isn't going to crop up anytime soon. Brian L. Stuart From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 06:20:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 06:20:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F2458C6DEE for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:20:11 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 62B5B63E93 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:19:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 23327-01-35 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:19:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from aquamar.escet.urjc.es (plan9.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.205]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B197563E8B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 16:19:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from 80.26.99.12 ([80.26.99.12]) by aquamar; Sun Feb 27 22:19:34 MET 2005 X-warning: suspect envelope domain X-warning: suspect From: domain Message-ID: <002a01c51d12$0eec2120$0200000a@urjc1> From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Gorka_Guardiola_M=FAzquiz?= To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <1c81991e8cc9be6e36b893f921a3b9c2@proxima.alt.za> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:19:42 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Here we are. We run native systems for the servers and some terminals. We run vmware for the laptops. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: ; "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2005 5:20 PM Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates > > > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 lucio@proxima.alt.za wrote: > >> > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? >> >> 1. Brantley >> 2. Vester Thacker >> 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi >> 4. Lucio > > wiki page entry? > > ron > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 07:58:07 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 07:58:07 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 24A54C671C for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 17:58:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5E626B173 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 17:57:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00832-01-12 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 17:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams004.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n04.valueweb.net [216.219.253.138]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 789B4B06F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 17:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from [62.166.230.82] ([62.166.230.82]:62472 "HELO kilgore") by ams004.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S369050AbVB0W5X (ORCPT ); Sun, 27 Feb 2005 17:57:23 -0500 Message-ID: <004601c51d1f$b4eb7a50$9b012a0a@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:57:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] FOSDEM 2005 X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu http://www.insultant.net/be/FOSDEM2005 -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 08:02:22 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 08:02:22 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6FCCDC6DEE for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:02:19 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E831FC6CBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:01:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 00832-01-22 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams006.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n06.valueweb.net [216.219.253.152]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5BC09C6CA0 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:01:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from [62.166.230.82] ([62.166.230.82]:265 "HELO kilgore") by ams006.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S365740AbVB0XBn (ORCPT ); Sun, 27 Feb 2005 18:01:43 -0500 Message-ID: <004d01c51d20$5021f990$9b012a0a@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:01:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] Re: FOSDEM 2005 X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu http://www.insultant.net/be/FOSDEM2005 andrey told my MUA screwed up the URL. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 11:04:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 11:04:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9E7F7C69A9 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:04:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id A7350C691B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:03:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11993-01-3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:03:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from corpus-callosum.com (corpus-callosum.com [205.234.142.161]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 447D8C6914 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:03:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.8] (ns1.corpus-callosum.com [69.215.39.41]) by corpus-callosum.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FCF6209A89; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:04:00 -0600 (CST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v619.2) In-Reply-To: <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> <32a656c2050226070543afbf72@mail.gmail.com> <20050226152330.GG77074@cassie.foobarbaz.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Jeff Sickel Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:04:01 -0600 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu>, cnielsen@pobox.com X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.619.2) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Would you mind telling me what hardware you've got for the venti+fossil fileserver? I've budgeted for a new hardware purchase and want to make sure I'm lining up with something that runs venti well. jas On Feb 26, 2005, at 9:23 AM, Christopher Nielsen wrote: > On Sun, Feb 27, 2005 at 12:05:15AM +0900, Vester Thacker wrote: >> On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500, Brantley Coile >> wrote: >>>> for the 3 of you out there still running >>>> a native system. >>> >>> Just for the record, how many people are still running native >>> systems? >> >> 1. Brantley >> 2. Vester Thacker >> 3. YAMANASHI Takeshi > 4. Christopher Nielsen (.75TB venti+fossil fileserver, cpu servers, > thinkpad terminal) > > -- > Christopher Nielsen > "They who can give up essential liberty for temporary > safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --Benjamin Franklin > From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 11:22:23 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 11:22:23 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 58B88C6985 for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:22:15 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id F0EAF63F9F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:21:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 12011-01-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:21:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx2.net.titech.ac.jp (mx2.net.titech.ac.jp [131.112.125.31]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with SMTP id 9385163F66 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 21:21:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 68342 invoked from network); 28 Feb 2005 02:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO vc2.net.titech.ac.jp) (131.112.125.36) by mx2.net.titech.ac.jp with SMTP; 28 Feb 2005 02:21:40 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO o.cc.titech.ac.jp) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 28 Feb 2005 02:21:40 -0000 Received: from valinore.titech.ac.jp by mail-o.cc.titech.ac.jp (8.11.3/1.1.10.5/20Feb97-0455PM) id j1S2Leq374194; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:21:40 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: YAMANASHI Takeshi <9.nashi@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 11:21:21 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Is anybody using dual- or quad-processor rack-mount hardware as a CPU server? I used to run diskless cpu servers on NEC Express 5800/420La Blade Servers. It was a dual Pentium III 1.4GHz on a blade with 3 fast ether. 6 blades can be installed in a 3U high, 19 inch rack mountable chassi. They just worked including PXE booting from an existing Plan 9 file/cpu server. -- From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 12:45:38 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 12:45:38 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E0618C6A0D for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:45:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E4AEA63F2E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:44:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14827-02-18 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:44:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.202]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BB7663F72 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:44:50 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id f1so1422787rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:44:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:references; b=sZ8vx5CyAQFqsPzGWWlmjU9sVxVXLKny5V4bA2foyKGj5Z841g5k/PJUlJuXKEOth8/HCrbvSG/UF0kbbGoBTYdiOuFOiQEnofy+KFG3hobM3UfqwqjgjqHw8ag6hfC9bYY2tlNK51+kGp5UiTdNn4GlNd4t9fK9SblLztKHuMQ= Received: by 10.11.122.22 with SMTP id u22mr165941cwc; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:44:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.122.1 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 19:44:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32d987d5050227194459e013cc@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:44:49 -0300 From: Federico Benavento To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit References: <271e333c01d0bea1dbc713abae54f8b6@plan9.bell-labs.com> <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Federico Benavento , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? A standalone pcf -- Federico G. Benavent From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 12:50:14 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 12:50:14 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C8FBFC6A4C for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:50:04 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id DCA78C6965 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 17301-02-15 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 3D7F9C694B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1S3nLB0032255 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:49:22 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1S3nLYO022439 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:49:21 -0700 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:49:21 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> Message-ID: References: <43def30b32ba1bc3e88fc467fe202993@huygens.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 27 Feb 2005, Sape Mullender wrote: > have Plan 9 on an old iPaq. any ipaqs out there that work? ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 12:58:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 12:58:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id CBB3A3173C for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:58:07 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 0E52FAFEA for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:57:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 15346-02-32 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:57:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from rwcrmhc13.comcast.net (rwcrmhc13.comcast.net [204.127.198.39]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id D442663E9 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:57:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (pcp0011253259pcs.arnysm01.nj.comcast.net[68.36.149.208]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc13) with ESMTP id <2005022803572301500kusboe>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 03:57:23 +0000 Message-ID: <422296A4.50007@comcast.net> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:57:24 -0500 From: John DeGood User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Windows/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] FOSDEM 2005 References: <004601c51d1f$b4eb7a50$9b012a0a@kilgore> In-Reply-To: <004601c51d1f$b4eb7a50$9b012a0a@kilgore> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: nu3e@arrl.net, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Big Willy...plumber? http://www.insultant.net/be/FOSDEM2005/pages/DSC00685.html From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 13:45:20 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 13:45:20 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EA305C6B0D for ; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:45:01 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 43F2CC69A3 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:44:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 22743-01-8 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:44:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from collyer.net (xtc.collyer.net [216.240.55.168]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6D014C69A2 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 23:44:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8ef2c82d8e90bc8101e80ad4e840dcd2@collyer.net> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 20:44:28 -0800 From: geoff@collyer.net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu My ipaq works, for small values of `work', when I bother to use it. The problem is that its only connectivity is via wi-fi, which I just don't find usable for sustained sessions while wandering around in arbitrary places; it's like trying to run a diskless Sun through two gateways (the kind that often dropped back-to-back packets [Proteon?]) to its server, circa 1986. Sometimes it works and sometimes it just mysteriously and annoyingly goes away. Plus the screen really is just too tiny to do anything serious. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 14:01:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 14:01:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 869F2C6DE7 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:01:26 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 1DDEDC6901 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:00:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21944-01-61 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:00:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (mailwasher.lanl.gov [192.65.95.54]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86E26C690C for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:00:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ccs-mail.lanl.gov (ccs-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.4.126]) by mailwasher-b.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1S50eEZ002867 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:00:40 -0700 Received: from enigma.lanl.gov (enigma.lanl.gov [128.165.250.185]) by ccs-mail.lanl.gov (8.12.11/8.12.11/(ccn-5)) with ESMTP id j1S50dYT024816 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:00:39 -0700 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:00:39 -0700 (MST) From: "Ronald G. Minnich" To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-Reply-To: <8ef2c82d8e90bc8101e80ad4e840dcd2@collyer.net> Message-ID: References: <8ef2c82d8e90bc8101e80ad4e840dcd2@collyer.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-PMX-Version: 4.7.0.111621 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 geoff@collyer.net wrote: > Plus the screen really is just too tiny to do anything serious. I wanted to fill a backpack with them, who cares about the screen. Oh well, I'm trying one of these now: http://www.embeddedx86.com/epc/ts7200-spec-h.html ron From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 14:08:01 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 14:08:01 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BED60C6C28 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:51 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 138E263F40 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21907-01-83 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams002.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n02.valueweb.net [216.219.253.98]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 8C28E63E0D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from [62.166.230.82] ([62.166.230.82]:52749 "HELO kilgore") by ams002.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S380274AbVB1FHE (ORCPT ); Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:07:04 -0500 Message-ID: <009801c51d53$5a038b80$9b012a0a@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: , "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <004601c51d1f$b4eb7a50$9b012a0a@kilgore> <422296A4.50007@comcast.net> Subject: Re: [9fans] FOSDEM 2005 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 06:07:06 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Cc: X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Big Willy...plumber? > > http://www.insultant.net/be/FOSDEM2005/pages/DSC00685.html dunno, but it's thermochromatic [it starts off black]. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 14:12:30 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 14:12:30 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id E026FC6C34 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:12:17 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 82CF563F4E for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:11:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21944-01-77 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:11:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from plan9.ucalgary.ca (plan9.ucalgary.ca [136.159.220.110]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id BC922C68A7 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:11:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <7fa0af99fead0246965e93482d1eab0f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] FOSDEM 2005 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 22:11:36 -0700 From: andrey mirtchovski In-Reply-To: <009801c51d53$5a038b80$9b012a0a@kilgore> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > dunno, but it's thermochromatic [it starts off black]. ewww! From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 14:20:17 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 14:20:17 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 9775CC6B16 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:19:53 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 68CA2C692D for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:19:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 21944-01-91 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:19:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ams003.ftl.affinity.com (lvs00-fl-n03.valueweb.net [216.219.253.136]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id AC554C6942 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:19:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from [62.166.230.82] ([62.166.230.82]:3342 "HELO kilgore") by ams003.ftl.affinity.com with SMTP id S414603AbVB1FTK (ORCPT ); Mon, 28 Feb 2005 00:19:10 -0500 Message-ID: <00b101c51d55$0b0cc8a0$9b012a0a@kilgore> From: "boyd, rounin" To: "Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs" <9fans@cse.psu.edu> References: <7fa0af99fead0246965e93482d1eab0f@plan9.ucalgary.ca> Subject: Re: [9fans] FOSDEM 2005 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 06:19:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu >> dunno, but it's thermochromatic [it starts off black]. have to give a true record of the 'events'. bruxelles is a weird place. we [i] ordered pizza tonight for 8 of us. do they speak french? no. bloody flemish, so i had to resort to english and the guy liked turning 1 into 2 and 2 into 3. it was freaky. -- MGRS 31U DQ 52572 12604 From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 18:27:16 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 18:27:16 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6DEEEC6B8F for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:26:57 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 48054C6892 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:26:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 11817-02-27 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:26:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from sargazos.escet.urjc.es (sargazos.escet.urjc.es [212.128.4.206]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 11897C6891 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:26:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates From: "Fco. J. Ballesteros" Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 10:26:19 +0100 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu A plain PC with 4 IDE disks. Runs fine. > Would you mind telling me what hardware you've got for the venti+fossil > fileserver? From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 18:57:56 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 18:57:56 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 379C2C686E for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:57:46 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 86DA3C67C6 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:57:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 09539-03-25 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:57:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.tal.de (s05.tal.de [81.92.0.8]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 73261C67CD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 04:57:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from voidness.de (unknown [82.139.199.253]) by smtp.tal.de (SMTP.TAL.DE) with ESMTP id 46075820CE for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 10:57:01 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <8292db0551c925534bf42b40d3729661@voidness.de> To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Heiko Dudzus Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 10:56:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] spurious index entries X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Sometimes in the last weeks I get log messages on the venti+fossil fileserver saying: could not write super block; waiting 10 seconds blistAlloc: called on clean block However, the system stays operational. My first idea was to do a checkindex. Then I get a lot of these messages: spurious entry in index for score=; found 6 entries expected 5 bad bucket found=396084: unknown error spurious entry in index for score= type=13 bad bucket found=396959: unknown error spurious entry in index for score= type=13 This sounds alarming. What does that mean, in fact? Are archived data corrupted? Is it likely to be just a hard disk error? Heiko From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 19:41:45 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 19:41:45 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id B985DC68F6 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 05:41:28 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5785763E76 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 05:40:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 28969-01-19 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 05:40:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (rproxy.gmail.com [64.233.170.201]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 17B3863EBD for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 05:40:49 -0500 (EST) Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id f1so1489697rne for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:40:49 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=kJknyGlsvGSPas65Qiu3N+UfbSslYDijW3ZuU8smbtuhFF8T8lpywjS/O1k0EvLQkvlKALKDFCDlyzOmcotzd3LGFIoHgonsmuq6Fo39KAWHvSM/uIq63qbG01Ty6VJ+kMSkLnq2vqbVSx9kA39w3znRqp4vOYgNy+OS1Zsz844= Received: by 10.11.98.40 with SMTP id v40mr174114cwb; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:40:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.11.122.1 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 02:40:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <32d987d505022802404b475bfa@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 07:40:49 -0300 From: Federico Benavento To: 9fans <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] openssl port X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Federico Benavento , Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu http://www.tip9ug.jp/who/fgb/ thanks tip9ug.jp for the web space. -- Federico G. Benavento From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 22:15:58 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 22:15:58 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id C6351C68C3 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:15:49 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id EADC7C6846 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:15:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 08799-01-31 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:15:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from ciao.gmane.org (main.gmane.org [80.91.229.2]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 37144C6821 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:15:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from root by ciao.gmane.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1D5kfK-00011o-Qu for 9fans@cse.psu.edu; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:10:26 +0100 Received: from ip503c91d7.speed.planet.nl ([80.60.145.215]) by main.gmane.org with esmtp (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:10:26 +0100 Received: from jasper by ip503c91d7.speed.planet.nl with local (Gmexim 0.1 (Debian)) id 1AlnuQ-0007hv-00 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:10:26 +0100 X-Injected-Via-Gmane: http://gmane.org/ To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu From: Jasper Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:09:30 +0100 Lines: 9 Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org X-Gmane-NNTP-Posting-Host: ip503c91d7.speed.planet.nl User-Agent: Debian Thunderbird 1.0 (X11/20050116) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en X-Enigmail-Version: 0.89.0.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime X-Gmane-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-Gmane-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: gcopg-9fans@m.gmane.org X-MailScanner-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu Subject: [9fans] What shells are available? X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: jasper@nedlinux.nl, Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Hello, I have been following the development of Plan9 for some time now, but I was wondering what shells are being supported? I mean can I still use csh or (pd)ksh when I make the switch to Plan9? And what GNU software is supported except for GCC? Thank you in advance, Jasper Lievisse Adriaanse. From cse.psu.edu!9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp Mon Feb 28 22:35:03 JST 2005 remote from ar Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([130.203.4.6]) by ar; Mon Feb 28 22:35:03 JST 2005 Received: from psuvax1.cse.psu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 80C58C67A0 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:35:00 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Delivered-To: 9fans@cse.psu.edu Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 7C187C677F for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:34:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cse.psu.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (psuvax1 [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 10181-01-55 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:34:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from denhaag.ewi.utwente.nl (denhaag.ewi.utwente.nl [130.89.10.11]) by mail.cse.psu.edu (CSE Mail Server) with ESMTP id 6BDDEC677B for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 08:34:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeus.cs.utwente.nl (zeus.ewi.utwente.nl [130.89.10.12]) by denhaag.ewi.utwente.nl (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j1SDY1l0008536 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:34:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (zamenhof.ewi.utwente.nl [130.89.13.77]) by zeus.cs.utwente.nl (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j1SDY18X001334 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:34:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (belinfan@localhost) by zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.10.2) with SMTP id j1SDY1T26092 for <9fans@cse.psu.edu>; Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:34:01 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <200502281334.j1SDY1T26092@zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl> X-Authentication-Warning: zamenhof.cs.utwente.nl: belinfan@localhost didn't use HELO protocol To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> Subject: Re: [9fans] some recent updates In-reply-to: Your message of "Sat, 26 Feb 2005 08:37:31 -0500." <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> References: <25c2e6b0238e4103e9e4b0adb04f9706@coraid.com> From: Axel Belinfante X-Organisation: University of Twente, Department of Computer Science, Formal Methods and Tools Group, PO Box 217, NL-7500 AE Enschede, The Netherlands X-Phone: +31 53 4893774 X-Telefax: +31 53 4893247 X-Face: 3YGZY^_!}k]>-k'9$LK?8GXbi?vs=2v*ut, /8z, z!(QNBk_>~:~"MJ_%i`sLLqGN, DGbkT@ N\jhX/jNLTz2hO_R"*RF(%bRvk+M, iU7SvVJtC*\B6Ud<7~`MGMp7rCI6LVp=%k=HE?-UCV?[p\$R? mI\n2/!#3/wZZsa[m7d;PKWiuH6'~ Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 14:34:01 +0100 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.44 X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at cse.psu.edu X-BeenThere: 9fans@cse.psu.edu X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans@cse.psu.edu> List-Id: Fans of the OS Plan 9 from Bell Labs <9fans.cse.psu.edu> List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu Errors-To: 9fans-bounces+arisawa=ar.aichi-u.ac.jp@cse.psu.edu > Just for the record, how many people are still running native systems? at work (plan9.cs.utwente.nl), three old 333Mhz machines for kenfs, auth/kfs/secstore/consolefs, runs venti (venti not much used yet) cpu/web server/tcp trampoline for kenfs/terminal (music, sokoban) and (not used much more) coffee availability monitor (plan 9 incarnation of http://wwwhome.cs.utwente.nl/~slurp/). it has a removable disk with fossil for music - more music from various local disks via u9fs. to listen to music I drawterm in from the sun on my desk, I get sound bytes via drawterm to a wrapper program that passes them on to the sun /dev/audio a laptop that occasionally boots plan 9 and takes root either from local kfs or from kenfs (via wavelan, until real-soon-now the current relative open accces is closed, then 802.1X will be the only way to get in :-( ) an ultra1 that has succeded to boot a ramdisk-only version of newsham's work over the net, but, to be useful, needs ``port'' of the 2ed lance ethernet driver to 4ed. at home another laptop, a bitsy, and several pc's that can boot plan 9. one of them I used for a while as home music machine with only a kernel locally, taking root fs and music via cable modem from work (over aan(8)). (still waiting for that very-affordable no-moving-parts low-power-consumption (to have always on), and/or quickly-booting little machine to use as cpu/juke/terminal at home...) Axel.